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4AN051SS? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGRESS 

SECOND  SESSION 
PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  15 


Printed  for  the  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 


DEC  12 
myEfmY  of  aumis. 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 

WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


StJBCOMMITTEE  ON  S.  ReS.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMBS  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


II 


CONTENTS. 


Statement  of —  Page. 

John  G.  Bryson   2097 

Charles  Boeschenstein   2108 

Fred  W.  Upham  (resumed)   2125 

E.  H.  Moore   2217 

Charles  K.  Mavity   2233 

Clarence  W.  Lee   2246 

E.  H.  Moore  (resumed)   2261 

Clarence  W.  Lee  (resumed)   2266 


ni 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


FRIDAY,  SEPTEMBER  10,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Chicago^  III. 

The  subcommittee  met,  pursuant  to  adjournment,  at  9.30  o'clock 
a.  m.  in  room  603,  Federal  Building,  Senator  AVilliam  S.  Kenyon 
presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman),  Eeed,  Pomerene,  and  Edge. 

The  Chairman.  Are  any  of  the  witnesses  here  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  John  G.  Bryson,  Brazil,  Ind. 

The  Chairman.  Ifou  have  come  all  the  way  from  Texas? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  We  Avill  put  you  on,  then. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  JOHN"  G.  BRYSON. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  full  name,  Mr.  Bryson  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  John  G.  Bryson. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  business? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  am  in  the  oil  business. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Brazil,  Ind. 

Senator  Spencer.  Where  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Brazil,  Ind. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  come  all  the  way  from  Texas  in  re- 
sponse to  our  subpoena,  have  you  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  are  you  connected  with  the  ways  and  means 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  In  what  capacity? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  am  chairman  of  the  Indiana  committee. 

The  Chairman.  And  who  appointed  you  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  the  State  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  The  State  chairman? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  mean  the  chairman  of  the  Kepublican 
State  central  committee? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  what  did  the  national  committee  have  to 
do  with  it? 

Senator  Spencer.  He  means  the  national  committee. 

2097 


2098 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Are  you  right  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  was  called  over  to  Indianapolis  by  the  State 
chairman  and  asked  to  take  this  job. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  he  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Mr.  Wasmuth. 
The  Chairman.  Who? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Mr.  Wasmutli. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  communication  with  the  offices 
of  the  national  committee  here  in  Chicago  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  came  here  in  March  and  met  Mr.  Upham. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  had  then  been  appointed,  as  I  under- 
stand it. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  did  you  talk  it  over  with  Mr.  Upham  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  he  just  told  me  what  they  would  like  to  have  me 
raise  down  there. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  it? 
Mr.  Bryson.  $100,000. 

The  CiiAiRaiAN.  Did  you  have  quotas  furnished  to  you  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  No.   He  just  said,  "  The  national  committee  wants  to 
raise  $100,000." 

Senator  Spencer.  In  Indiana? 
Mr.  Bryson.  In  Indiana:  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  did  you  try  and  organize  the  State  to  raise 
$100,000? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  you  organize  it? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  just  made  an  organization  of  the  fellows  all 
over  the  State,  you  know,  to  help  raise  this  fund,  like  we  had  always 
done  in  the  past,  having  a  finance  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  do  it  by  districts  or  by  counties? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  organized  by  districts  and  by  counties  both. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  anything  to  do  with  the  county  or- 
ganizations ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  do  not  understand  just  what  you  mean  by  that. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  mean  this:  We  have  had  evidence  here, 
for  instance,  that  in  Michigan  they  had  districts,  and  then  the  dis- 
tricts took  up  the  question  of  county  organization.  Now,  did  you  in 
your  capacity  have  anything  to  do  with  the  county  organizations  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  no.  I  made  a  district  organization,  and  £lien 
they  made  their  ow^n  organizations. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  we  want  to  get  at. 

Mr.  Bryson.  That  is  the  way  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  how  were  your  district  organizations 
formed? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Y\^hy,  we  just  made  district  chairmen,  like  we  do  for 
each  congressional  district  in  Indiana. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  say  "  we,"  who  do  you  mean? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Why,  myself,  and  possibly  the  State  chairman. 
Senator  Spencer.  The  Indiana  people? 

Mr.  Bryson.  elust  the  Indiana  people.  There  was  nobody  from 
the  national  committee  there. 

The  Chairman.  No  one  from  the  national  committee? 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN"  EXPENSES. 


2099 


Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir.  We  went  back  home  just  to  collect  this 
money. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  certain  assessments  for  the  dis- 
tricts, or  quotas  for  the  districts,  of  $100,000  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  have  you  any  papers  showing  that? 

Mr.  Bryson.  What  the  quota  was  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  for  the  different  districts. 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir ;  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Or  for  the  different  counties? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir ;  I  did  not  go  down  to  the  county  unit.  That 
was  left  for  the  district  meetings. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  ever  have  a  quota  on  paper  for  the 
districts  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  now,  where  is  that?    That  is  what  we  want. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  expect  that  is  at  Indianapolis,  at  the  head- 
quarters. 

The  Chairman.  We  wanted  you  to  bring  your  papers  with  you, 
Mr.  Bryson. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  did  not  understand.  There  was  no  descrip- 
tion of  the  paper.  I  brought  what  we  were  to  raise,  and  who  gave 
it,  and  all  about  it,  and  I  supposed  that  was  what  you  wanted. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  take  the  $100,000  and  divide  that  up  to 
make  the  quotas  for  the  districts,  or  did  you  in  making  your  quotas 
double  the  amount  ?    Did  you  aim  at  more  than  the  $100,000  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  AVell,  you  see,  under  this  finance  committee  we  ex- 
pected to  raise  our  State  fund  along  at  the  same  time. 

The  Chairman.  With  the  $100,000? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  was  the  State  fund  to  be  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  were  just  going  to  raise  all  we  could. 

The  Chairman.  There  was  no  limit  to  it  at  all? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Whatever  was  necessary  to  carry  on  the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  in  making  the  quotas  for  the  districts,  did 
you  include  what  you  were  going  to  raise  for  the  State  as  well  as  the 
national  committee? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  could  you  do  that  if  you  had  no  limit  on  the 
State  amount? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  set  an  amount,  but  we  did  not  think  we 
would  ever  get  that  amount. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  we  want,  the  amount  you  set  in  the 
different  districts. 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  can  not  give  it  to  you  offhand. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Give  it  to  us  approximately. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  approximate  it? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  think,  approximately  $200,000. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  that  is  for  the  State  campaign? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Then  the  $100,000  for  the  national  made  $300,000? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  apportion  to  the  different  districts  on  the 
basis  of  $300,000,  to  cover  State  and  Nation? 


2100 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  no;  we  did  not  on  any  particular  basis.  We 
took  it  on  what  districts  we  thought  were  better  able  to  raise  it  than 
other  districts  were. 

The  Chatriman.  Well,  can  you  not  give  us  any  idea  

Senator  Pomerene.  That  does  not  quite  answer  your  question, 
Senator,  if  you  will  pardon  me  ?  Senator  Kenyon's  question  was  as 
to  whether  or  not  you  sought  to  raise  $300,000  in  the  State  for  these 
purposes — that  is  national  and  State. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  we  wanted  to  raise  $300,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  now,  that  was  the  amount  of  money  you 
actually  wanted  to  get. 


The  Chairman.  Now,  in  making  your  quotas  to  get  that  money 
m  the  different  districts,  did  3^ou  put  your  quotas  above  what  would 
produce  that  amount  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  You  did? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  above  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  do  not  know  just  what  the  total  w^as.  We 
just  sort  of  sized  up  each  district  by  what  we  thought  we  could  get, 
whether  it  Avas  a  Republican  or  a  Democrtic  district. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  when  you  made  your  quota,  did  you  expect 
to  get  the  quota  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  did  not  think  we  could  get  it ;  no. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  would  have  gotten  it  if  you  could,  would 
you? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  How  much  have  you  turned  in  up  to  date,  cash? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  have  raised  a  little  under  $39,000  to  date, 
for  all  purposes. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  I  want  to  finish  with  this  plan  and  see  if 
we  can  get  that.  Can  you  not  furnish  us  with  anything  showing  the 
quotas  that  you  had  for  the  different  districts?  Can  you  send  that 
to  us  from  Indianapolis? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  I  can  send  that  to  you. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  that  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Oh,  we  have  it  there ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  that  complete  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  And  it  is  the  balance  that  you  are  driving  for? 
Mr.  Bryson.  We  have  raised  a  little  under  $39,000  for  both  national 
and  State. 

The  Chairman.  How  much? 

Mr.  Bryson.  A  little  under  $39,000.   I  have  the  exact  figures  here. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  they?  Before  you  get  to  that,  I  want 
to  make  it  clear  about  this  other  matter.  If  you  had  raised  all  that 
you  put  in  your  quota,  hoAV  much  would  you  have  raised  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Whatever  the  total  is  of  that? 

The  Chairman.  But  I  want  to  know  what  that  is. 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  will  send  it  to  you. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  not  give  it  to  us  now^  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No  ;  I  can  not  give  it  to  you. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2101 


The  Chairman.  Can  you  not  estimate  it  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  much  over  $300,000? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  do  not  know.  Now,  I  will  tell  you  why  I  am  just 
a  little  unfamiliar  with  this,  and  maybe  you  will  understand.  I 
went  on  my  vacation  on  the  1st  of  July  and  came  back  on  the  30th 
day  of  August,  and  on  the  30tli  day  of  August,  at  noon,  I  went  to 
Texas,  and  started  back  on  your  subpoena  yesterday;  so  I  have  been 
out  of  touch  with  this  thing  for  eight  or  nine  weeks;  so  that  is  one 
reason  why  I  am  not  familiar  just  oifhand  with  these  figures. 

The  Chairman.  Of  the  $39,000,  then,  that  has  been  collected,  is 
that  up  to  noAv  or  up  to  the  time  you  left  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Xo,  sir ;  this  report  is  up  to  September  4. 

The  Chairman.  September  4? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  largest  contribution? 
Mr.  Bryson.  $2,000. 
The  Chairman.  $2,000? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  before  or  after  the  $1,000  limit? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  it  was  on  March  10. 

The  Chairman.  How  does  that  happen — March  10  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  It  was  on  March  10. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  that  was  before  the  limit  of  $1,000  was 
put  on.   Who  is  that  from  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  William  Irwin. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Who? 
Mr.  Bryson.  William  IrAvin. 

The  Chairman.  Does  this  $39,000  include  the  pledges? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Pledges  and  cash? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  This  $2,000,  was  that  from  a  newspaper  man? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Sir? 

The  Chairman.  I  say,  was  that  $2,000  from  a  newspaper  man? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir ;  he  is  a  banker  at  Columbus,  Ind. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  have  noticed  that  the  newspaper  men 
usually  have  two  or  three  thousand  to  give  away  without  much  dif- 
ficulty. Now,  what  proportion  of  the  $39,000  is  cash  and  what 
proportion  pledges? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Now,  the  total,  the  exact  amount  to  both  National 
and  State,  is  $38,942. 

The  Chairman.  Has  that  all  been  sent  in  to  the  national  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir ;  $32,770  of  that  is  cash. 
The  Chairman.  And  the  rest  pledges? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  do  you  not  send  your  money  in  to  the 
national  committee? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No.  In  Indiana,  when  we  joined  our  drive  together, 
we  had  a  double  card  on  account  of  our  law  there. 

The  Chairman.  How  do  you  do  in  Indiana? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  have  a  card,  and  when  we  would  ask  for 
a  contribution,  or  if  a  person  wanted  to  give  a  contribution,  one 


2102 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


of  the  cards  was  payable  to  Upham  and  one  is  payable  to  Fred 
Gardner,  who  is  treasurer  of  our  State  committee,  in  order  to  con- 
form with  our  law  down  there. 

The  Chairman.  What  law  do  you  refer  to  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  they  have  a  corrupt-practice  law  in  Indiana 
there,  and  all  contributions  must  go  to  the  State  committee  that  are 
for  the  State  committee,  you  know. 

The  Chairman.  Direct? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Direct ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  you  have  your  pledge  for  the  State  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  also  the  national  committee. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  On  what  proportion  is  that  divided — 2  to  1? 

Mr.  Bryson.  W^ell,  no.  If  a  man  pledges  to  the  State  committee 
and  signs  that  card  for  the  pledge,  why,  all  that  is  given  to  the  State 
committee. 

The  Chairman.  None  of  that  goes  to  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir.  And  the  other  pledge  is  made  on  the  na- 
tional committee  card. 

The  Chairman.  So  there  is  no  division.  Is  there  anything  fur- 
ther? 

Senator  Edge.  I  want  to  ask  you  this  question:  This  quota  of 
$300,000,  was  that  a  quota  made  before  the  convention — before  the 
June  convention  in  Chicago? 

Mr.  Bryson.  The  national  convention? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  in  other  words,  it  was  a  quota  that  contem- 
plated the  original  quota  as  made  up  by  the  national  committee;  is 
that  correct — the  quota  that  was  made  up  by  the  national  committee 
months  ago. 

Mr.  Bryson.  The  only  time  I  ever  met  the  national  committee  or 
Mr.  Upham  was  in  March,  when  he  asked  us  to  try  to  raise  him 
$100,000  in  the  State  of  Indiana.  That  is  all  the  connection  Ave  have 
had  with  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  That  was  in  March? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  and  I  have  never  seen  him  since. 

Senator  Edge.  How  much  of  this  $39,000,  approximately,  was  col- 
lected before  the  national  convention? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  that  will  be  pretty  hard  to  tell. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  half  of  it  collected  before  the  national  conven- 
tion? 

Mr.  Bryson.  That  went  just  to  the  national  committee? 
Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  that  went  to  the  national  committee. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  should  think  that  would  be  about  right,  or 
maybe  a  little  more  than  half  of  it. 

Senator  Edge.  A  little  more  than  half? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge  (continuing).  Of  that,  $39,000  was  collected  and 
remitted  to  the  national  committee  before  the  convention  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  I  should  think  about  half  of  it. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2103 


Senator  Edge.  That  is  all  I  want  to  ask. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  as  one  who  has  practical  knowledge 
of  political  operations,  whether  this  money  is  raised  for  the  national 
committee  or  for  the  State  committee,  you  recognize  it  as  a  fact  that 
whatever  money  is  raised  for  the  national  committee  will  benefit 
your  State  organization  in  the  State  campaign,  and  whatever  money 
is  raised  or  expended  for  the  State  organization  will  benefit  the  na- 
tional campaign,  do  you  not  ?    That  is  right,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Oh,  yes ;  to  a  certain  extent. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  Now,  I  wish  you  could  give  us  a  little 
bit  more  definite  idea,  if  you  can — and  I  recognize  that  you  have  not 
got  3^our  papers  with  you.  You  say  that  you  started  out  here  to 
raise  for  the  national  committee  $100,000  and  for  the  State  committee 
$200,000. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  your  general  plan  you  increased  this 
amount  somewhat.  Now,  give  us  your  best  memory  as  to  what  the 
total  was  that  jou  sought  to  raise  and  gave  out  to  your  organization 
that  you  wanted  to  raise. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  we  did  not  give  that  quota  out  with  any  idea 
that  we  w^ould  CA^er  raise  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  understand  what  your  position  is  about 
it,  but  you  gave  it  out  

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes;  because  we  can  not  raise  that  much  money  in 
Indiana.  • 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  say,  we  can  not  raise  that  much  money  in  Indiana. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  there  mav  be  differences  of  opinion  as  to 
that. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  what  was  the  amount,  now?  You  told 
your  district  organizations,  perhaps,  or  others  that  were  interested 
in  this  same  enterprise,  that  you  wanted  to  raise  a  certain  amount  in 
the  State.   Now,  what  was  that  amount? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Why,  I  could  not  giA^e  you  the  exact  amount.  We 
can  send  you  that  paper,  howcA^er. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  I  knoAv  you  Avill. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  did  you  double  the  $300,000? 
Mr.  Bryson.  No  ;  I  do  not  think  it  Avill  total  that  much. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Avould  it  add  50  per  cent  to  the  $300,000? 
Mr.  Bryson.  It  might. 
Senator  Pomerene.  ScA^enty-fiA^e  per  cent? 
Mr.  Bryson.  No  ;  it  might  add  50  per  cent. 
Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  your  best  judgment  now? 
Mr.  Bryson.  That  is  my  best  judgment,  until  I  send  you  the  paper. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  I  understand  any  statement  you 
make  noAV  is  subject  to  correction. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  your  best  judgment  is  now,  as  chairman  of 
the  Indiana  ways  and  means  committee,  that  you  sought  to  raise  ap- 
proximately $450,000? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  AA^e  kncAv  Ave  could  not  raise  it.  We  just  simply 
gave  them  something  to  shoot  at. 


2104 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  know ;  but  they  are  shooting,  all  right. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Not  so  fast. 

Senator  Reed.  Why  did  you  put  your  mark  so  high  that  you  knew 
they  could  not  raise  it?  Now,  what  is  the  sense  in  that — starting  out 
to  do  something  you  know  you  can  not  do  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  probably  the  reason  for  that  is  there  are  some 
districts  that  are  better  able  to  raise  than  others,  and  we  did  not  want 
to  make  it  so  that  there  was  nothing  to  do.  Some  are  Democratic 
districts  and  some  are  Republican  districts. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Republican  districts — here  at  the  present 
time  they  are  all  Republican  districts  in  Indiana,  are  they  not? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well-  

Senator  Pomerene.  You  got  a  solid  Republican  delegation,  did  you 
not? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  understand  that  there  is  nobody  counts  them  all  in 
the  Republican  districts. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  Bryson.  There  is  nobody  counts  them  all  in  the  Republican 
districts. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  hope  you  are  right.  Now,  at  the  same 
time,  Mr.  Bryson,  that  you  Avere  raising  this  money  for  the  State 
and  national  purposes  you  knew,  of  course,  that  an  effort  would  be 
made  to  raise  additional  funds  for  each  of  the  local  county  cam- 
paigns, did  you  not? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  that  has  always  been  the  scheme. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  has  always  been  the  scheme  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  you  ha\^e  been  pretty  active  in 
Indiana  politics  for  a  good  many  years,  have  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  have  been  a  member  of  the  State  central  committee 
for  10  3^ears. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  10  years  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  you  have,  generally  speaking,  a  pretty 
good  knowledge  of  political  operations  within  the  State  of  Indiana? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  fairly  good. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Plow  much  money  do  you  think  would  be  raised 
in  the  counties  and  county  funds  for  county  purposes  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  For  local  purposes  ? 
Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that? 
Mr.  Bryson.  I  say,  for  local  purposes? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  for  local  purposes, 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  could  not  answer  that,  for  this  reason,  that 
in  the  local  organization  they  always  have  a  local  finance  committee. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes? 

Mr.  Bryson.  And  they  will  go  out,  and  one  county  will  probably 
raise  a  little  more  money,  owing  to  how  the  fight  is. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Bryson.  And  how  keen  it  is ;  and  their  chances  to  elect  a  county 
ticket,  and  so  on ;  so  that  that  varies  greatly  in  the  counties,  as  to  their 
chances. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2105 


Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  think  that  is  a  correct  statement  of  the 
situation,  and  it  often  depends  upon  the  importance  of  the  county 
ticket,  or  local  ticket. 

Mr.  Bryson.  You  are  exactly  right. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  the  men  you  have  got  on  it,  whether  there 
is  a  probability  of  electing  them,  etc.  AW  of  those  things  affect  the 
local  treasury  as  well  as  the  situation  generally,  do  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  now,  as  compared  with  the  amount  which 
you  sought  to  raise  for  State  and  National  purposes,  would  the 
amount  raised  in  all  of  the  counties  for  county  purposees  equal  the 
amount  which  would  be  raised,  or  which  you  sought  to  raise  for 
State  or  National  purposes  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  take  it  your  question  means,  would  $600,000  be 
raised ;  is  that  the  idea  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  No  ;  I  did  not  have  that  in  mind.  Perhaps  my 
question  was  a  little  indefinite.  Assuming,  now.  that  you  are  seeking 
to  raise  $450,000.^ 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  say  you  sought  to  raise  $300,000,  and  you 
thought  you  would  expand  those  quotas  so  as  to  make  it,  according  to 
your  best  judgment  now,  $450,000.  Now,  then,  make  your  compari- 
son first  with  the  $450,000.  How  much  do  you  think  would  be  raised 
in  the  counties  for  county  purposes  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  these  reports  of  whatever  was  raised  in  the 
counties  in  past  campaigns  have  never  been  reported  to  the  State 
organization,  and  it  would  be  the  rankest  kind  of  a  guess,  because  it 
it  a  local  record  which  has  not  been  reported  to  the  State  finance  com- 
mittee. I  would  only  be  familiar  with  probably  my  own  home 
county. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  your  own  county  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Clay  County. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Cla}^  County.  Brazil  is  the  county  seat  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  how  much  do  you  ordinarily  raise  in 
Clay  County? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Oh,  $300  or  $400. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  how  much  under  this — under  your  plan 
for  State  and  national  campaign  funds — was  allotted  to  Clay  County  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  do  not  know  just  exactly  how  the  district  chairman 
of  the  fifth  district  divided  up  among  the  six  counties.  I  am  not 
familiar  with  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  many  counties  are  there  in  your  State  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Ninety-two. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  are  92  counties? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  is  Brazil  an  average  county  in  popula- 
tion  

Mr.  Bryson.  Brazil? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or,  I  mean,  Clay  County. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  let  me  see.  We  have  a  population  of  about 
32,000  in  the  county.  I  do  not  know  whether  that  is  an  average 
countjT^  or  not. 


2106 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  What  was  your  population  in  the  State? 
Mr.  Bryson.  I  do  not  know  at  this  time.   I  have  not  seen  it. 
Senator  Pomerene.  What  was  it  10  years  ago? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  I  can  not  tell  you. 

Senator  Po:vikrene.  Let  me  see.  1  think  I  can  give  it  to  vou  here; 
2,700,876.  Well,  now,  of  this  $100,000  that  was  to  go  to  the  national 
committee,  w^as  any  part  of  that  to  come  back  to  the  State  organiza- 
tion? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  any  part  of  the  $200,000  which  you 
sought  to  raise  for  State  purposes  to  go  to  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  Bryson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  any  part  of  it  to  go  back  to  the  county 
organizations  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  any  part  of  it  to  go  to  each  of  the  several 
congressional  districts  in  the  State  ? 
Mr.  Bryson.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  you  have  your  county  organiza- 
tions—I mean  county  committees,  as  we  call  them  in  Ohio. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  suppose  you  call  them  the  same  thing,  do 
you,  in  Indiana  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir ;  county  committees. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  do  you  have  a  committee  for  each  con- 
gressional district  to  look  after  the  congressional  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  our  district  committees  are  composed  of  the 
county  chairmen  of  the  district,  the  different  counties. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No  

Mr.  Bryson.  That  is  our  district  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  see  if  I  understand  you  correctly,  or 
if  you  understand  me.  You  have  spoken  of  your  selecting  a  ways 
and  means  committee  for  each  district.  As  I  recall  your  testimony, 
you  said  that  you  appointed  the  chairman  for  each  congressional 
district. 

Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir.  ^ 
Senator  Pomerene.  And  then  you  depended  upon  them  to  get  the 
other  members  of  the  committee. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  In  their  districts. 
Mr.  Bryson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Noav,  then,  did  you  have  a  congressional  cam- 
paign committee  for  each  congressional  district  in  addition  to  your 
ways  and  means  committee  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  Well,  the  State  organization  in  Indiana — each  what 
is  known  as  the  congressional  district  committee  in  Indiana,  is  com- 
posed of  the  county  chairmen  that  make  up  the  congressional  district. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  that  is, your  policy? 

Mr.  Bryson.  That  is  our  policy.  And  those  men  elect  a  district 
chairman,  or  a  member  of  the  State  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So,  then,  as  I  understand  you^  of  this  fund 
that  was  raised,  assuming  that  it  Avas,  $100,000  for  the  national  com- 
mittee would  go  to  the  national  treasury  and  be  expended  by  the 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2107 


direction  of  the  national  committee,  and  the  $200,000  would  go  to  the 
State  committee  to  be  expended  by  it  ;  and  then  each  of  the  county 
committees  would  have  their  own  funds,  which  they  would  collect 
and  disburse. 

Mr.  Brysox.  Yes,  sir.  . 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  Now,  are  you  able  to  tell  this  committee 
how  it  could  get  information  as  to  the  amount  of  those  expenditures 
in  each  of  those  counties,  and  the  amount  of  funds  they  would  raise  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  I  do  not  think  it  would  be  possible  at  this  time. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  would  it  be  at  any  time  later? 

Mr.  Brysox.  Yes,  sir.  I  think  that  after  the  election  is  over — 
under  our  law  each  treasurer  of  the  county  committee  must  file  with 
the  county  clerk  of  his  county  the  amount  of  money  received,  and  his 
expenditures  in  the  campaign. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  "Well,  now,  I  am  glad  you  said  that,  because  I 
perhaps  misunderstood  your  testimony  a  little  while  ago.  I  under- 
stood you  to  say  that  there  were  no  reports  filed. 

Mr.  Bryson.  In  Indiana  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes. 

Mr.  Brysox.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  By  the  county  committees? 
Mr.  Brysox.  Well,  not  with  the  State  organization,  as  to  the 
amount  of  money  they  raise. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  Oh,  I  see. 

Mr.  Brysox.  There  is  no  connection.  They  represent  •  a  local 
finance  committee,  and  that  is  what  they  will  have. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Well,  I  am  glad  we  cleared  that  up. 

Mr.  Brysox.  But  expenditures  of  what  we  call  the  organization 
moneys — after  the  election  is  over  they  must  file  under  our  corrupt 
practice  act  with  the  county  clerk  of  their  respective  counties  their 
receipts  and  expenditures  for  the  campaign. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  see. 

Mr.  Brysox.  And  they  must  do  it  within  a  certain  period  of  time. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Now,  let  me  ask  you  further,  under  your  cor- 
rupt practice  act,  suppose  that  two  or  three  or  four  or  half  a  dozen  or 
more  men  would  get  together  to  raise  additional  funds,  outside  of 
the  local  county  organization,  the  regular  political  organization. 
Suppose  they  would  get  together  because  they  had  some  special  in- 
terest in  the  election,  in  one  form  or  another,  and  they  would  collect, 
funds,  and  this  committee  was  not  recognized  as  the  regular  political 
organization  of  the  party.  Would  such  a  committee  be  required  to 
make  a  report  under  your  law  ? 

Mr.  Brysox.  Let  me  see  if  I  understand  you.  You  mean  if  two  or 
three  individuals  should  go  out  together  and  just  raise  a  fund  in 
order  to  help  put  over  some  candidate,  or  something  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes ;  or  the  entire  ticket. 

Mr.  Brysox.  Separate  from  the  organization? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes. 

Mr.  Brysox.  No;  there  would  not  be  any  quota.    The  only  thing 
the  organization  accounts  for  is  the  money  they  hold,  naturally. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes. 

Mr.  Brysox.  And  not  what  some  individual  does  on  the  outside. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  Oh,  then,  under  your  corrupt  practices  act  it 
would  be  possible  for  local  committees,  or  individuals,  not  recognized 


2108 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


as  a  part  of  the  regular  political  organization  of  your  party,  to  raise 
any  sum  of  money  without  making  any  report  of  it  ? 

Mr.  Bkyson.  Well,  they  could  raise  it,  but  they  would  have  to  ex- 
pend it  outside  of  the  organization. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  know,  but  assume  they  did  that. 

Mr.  Bryson.  And  that  would  be  a  most  unusual  thing  to  do,  how- 
ever.   I  do  not  know  of  a  case  of  its  being  done,  ever  in  that  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  not  the  "  blocks  of  five  "  campaign  con- 
ducted that  way  some  years  ago  in  your  State  ? 

Mr.  Bryson.  That  was  before  my  time  in  politics,  if  it  was. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  suspect  it  was  before  your  activities. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  too  young  to  remember  much  about 
that.  Now,  send  your  quota  list  to  my  office  in  Washington,  will 
you,  Mr.  Bryson? 

Mr.  Bryson.  All  right.    Shall  I  remain  here  any  longer  ? 

The  Chairman.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Chairman,  does  that  include  the  quota  of 
moneys  raised,  and  the  whole  thing? 
The  Chairman.  We  have  that  here. 
Senator  Pomerene.  All  right. 
(Witness  excused.  ) 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Boeschenstein. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CHARLES  BOESCHENSTEIN. 

(The  witness  was  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Boeschenstein,  have  you  given  your  name  to 
the  reporters  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Charles  Boeschenstein. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  a  member  of  the  Democratic  national 
committee  from  the  State  of  Illinois  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  been  such  member  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Eight  years. 
The  Chairman.  Eight  years? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  anything  to  do  w^ith  raising  the 
finances  of  the  Democratic  State  or  National  committee  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  sometimes  help  out  both. 
The  Chairman.  Help  out  both  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes. 
The  Chairman.  Are  you  doing  that  this  year  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  What  kind  of  an  organization  have  you  in  Illi- 
nois for  raising  money  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  At  the  present  time  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  None. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  are  doing  it,  are  you  not? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  am  just  starting  it. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  just  starting  it? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  start  on  your  own  initiative? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2109 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  no  one  ask  you  to  start  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHEXSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  a  pure  volunteer? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  AVell,  how  did  you  happen  to  start  without  any- 
body asking  you  to  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  It  has  been  customary  in  Illinois  for  the 
national  committeeman  to  furnish  the  funds  for  the  campaign  in 
Illinois  as  far  as  they  w^ere  able — as  far  as  he  was  able — and  the  funds 
are  secured  by  sending  out  letters  and  securing  contributions. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  that  is  the  process  of  raising  mone}^  in  Illi- 
nois? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Ycs,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  national  committeeman  raises  it  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  national  committeeman  raises  the  money. 
The  Chairman.  And  he  has  full  authority  to  raise  it,  has  he  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Ycs,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  limit  to  the  amount  of  contributions — 
as  to  size? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  size  of  the  contributions? 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  The  sky  is  the  limit  with  you,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  you  have  answered  the  question  for  me ; 
but  that  is  all  right. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  seemed  to  hesitate  so  long  about  it  I 
thought  I  would  help  you  out. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.   Well,  there  is  a  limit. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  limit? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  IJsually  the  ability  of  the  man  who  con- 
tributes. 

The  Chairman.  The  ability  of  the  man  to  pay  is  the  only  limit  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  mean  the  ability  or  the  willingness  ? 

^fr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  ability  and  the  willingness,  both.  I 
think  that  is  a  good  correction. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  then,  there  is  no  limit.  You  place  no  limit 
on  the  amount. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  get  all  you  can. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  men  in  the  different  counties  raising 
money  under  you  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  We  have  not  up  to  the  present  time. 
The  Chairman.  Do  you  expect  to  do  that  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  know  what  we  may  do.  I  have  not 
determined. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  not  any  financial  plan  fixed  up  yet? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Oh,  yes. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  what  is  it? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  we  expect  to  send  out  letters ;  to  secure 
names  of  Democrats  and  send  them  letters  asking  for  contributions; 

182774— 20— PT  15  2 


2110 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


and  in  connection  with  that,  as  an  auxiliary  organization,  we  expect 
to  appoint  a  chairman  in  these  different  counties  and  cities. 
The  Chairman.  In  each  county  and  city? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  would  not  say  in  each  county;  in  as  many 
as  we  can  yet,  you  know.  In  some  counties  in  Illinois  the  Democrats 
can  not  get  any  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  In  some  counties  there  are  not  two  Democrats — 
is  that  it? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  not  two  of  them  who  are  willing  to 
work. 

The  Chairman.  No  two  who  are  willing  to  work? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  But  wherever  you  can  find  a  Democrat  you  are 
going  to  have  a  committeee  and  make  him  chairman  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  if  he  can  find  another  Democrat  in  the 
county,  they  are  going  to  form  an  organization. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  And  raise  money? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  if  he  can  find  another  Democrat  in  the 
county,  they  are  going  to  ask  them  to  contribute  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  are  going  ahead  that  way  and  raise  all 
the  money  you  can,  are  you  not  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  hope  to  raise  a  large  sum,  do  you  not? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  feel  a  little  discouraged  about  it  this  year, 
do  you  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes ;  I  am  not  at  all  confident  about  raising 
a  large  sum. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  not  at  all  confident  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  any  liquor  organization  in  the 
State  of  Illinois  raising  any  money  for  the  campaign  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir ;  positively  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  any  in  the  United  States  

Senator  PoMERENE  (interposing).  What  is  the  answer? 
The  Chairman.  He  says  positively  none. 
Mr.  BoE.ecHENSTEiN.  I  sav  uo ;  absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  anything  al;>out  the  Association 
Opposed  to  National  Prohibition? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Or  its  operations  in  the  country  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  had  anything  to  do  with  it  at  all? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  of  such  an  institution? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  the  name  of  that  organization  ? 

The  Chairman.  The  Association  Opposed  to  National  Prohibition. 
Now,  do  you  know  about  any  clubs  in  Illinois  engaged  in  raising 
money  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2111 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  I  do  not  know  of  anybody  in  Illinois 
that  is  engaged  in  raising  money  for  the  Democratic  campaign,  ex- 
cepting myself,  at  the  present  time. 

The  Chairman.  Excepting  yourself? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Ycs ;  and  somer  men  who  are  associated 
with  me. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  they? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Or  who  will  be. 
The  Chairman.  Who  are  the}^? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  sent  out  some  letters  and  telegrams  several 
da^^s  ago  asking  men  to  cooperate  with  me.  I  have  not  received  any 
replies  to  date. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  did  you  send  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Twenty. 

The  Chairman.  Twenty. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir.    I  expect  to  send  more. 
The  Chairman.  And  none  of  them  have  replied? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Not  up  to  the  present  time. 
The  Chairman.  Things  seem  to  be  in  prettv  bad  condition  in 
Illinois? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  One  would  judge  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Can  you  not  get  some  Y.  M.  C.  A.  secretaries 
to  help  along  in  the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  have  been  wondering  if  I  could  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Upham  might  loan  you  a  few. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  have  been  talking  to  him  about  it  this 
morning. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  it  seems  to  be  a  pretty  good  plan. 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  The}'  know  how  to  get  the  money,  and  we 
do  not. 

The  Chairman.  These  20  men  to  whom  3^011  have  wired,  do  you 
expect  to  form  some  sort  of  an  organization  with  them  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No  ;  I  appoint  these  men.  I  send  a  telegram 
to  a  man  and  appoint  him  as  chairman  of  the  finance  committee  of 
his  district. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  he  has  authority? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein,  He  has  authority  to  appoint  subcommittees? 
The  C/HAiinrAN.  Yes. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  And  they  pass  the  hat. 
The  Chairman.  They  pass  the  hat? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  you  say  "  district,''  do  you  mean  con- 
gressional district? 

Mr.  BoENSCHENSTEiN.  No ;  I  mean  the  city  district.  For  instance, 
in  Danville,  111.,  I  appointed  Mr.  Eliot  chairman  for  the  Danville 
district.   That  means  the  Danville  city  district. 

The  Chairman.  Just  the  city  of  Danville  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  The  city  of  Danville  and  surrounding  terri- 
tory. 

The  Chairman.  Yes.   And  then  he  appoints  his  assistants  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  He  appoints  a  a  subcommittee. 
The  Chairman.  He  appoints  a  subcommittee  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes. 


2112 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGNS  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  And  you  do  that  all  over  the  State,  wherever  you 
can. 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Wliercvcr  I  can ;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Now,  do  you  fix  any  amount  or  request  him  to 
raise  any  amount  for  his  district  or  county  ?   Any  quota,  I  mean  ? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Anything  I  can  get. 
The  Chairman.  Anj^thing  you  can  get  ? 
Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Ycs ;  50  cents,  $1,  or  $5. 
The  Chairman.  Oh,  you  take  more  than  $1, 1  suppose. 
Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Why,  they  do  not  often  run  very  high. 
The  Chairman.  They  do  not  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEIN.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  raise  the  contributions  in  1916  in  Illinois? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  helped  raise  them. 

The  Chairman.  And  in  1912  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  helped  raise  them. 

The  Chairman.  They  ran  a  little  higher  than  $1  in  some  instances 
then,  did  they  not? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Ycs,  a  few. 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  But  not  a  great  many. 

The  Chairman.  Some  gentlemen  who  were  afterwards  made  am- 
bassadors gave  rather  heavily,  did  they  not  ? 
Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  do  not  know. 
The  Chairman.  In  Illinois,  I  mean. 
Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Did  Mr.  Jones  only  give  $1,  Thomas  D.  Jones? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  No ;  I  think  he  did  a  little  bit  better. 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  So  you  do  not  mean  to  tell  us  that  you  are 
just  getting  dollar  contributions,  do  you? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  say  that  the  number  of  contributors  who 
give  a  large  amount  is  not  very  numerous. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  probably  true  in  both  parties.  But  let 
us  get  away  from  the  idea  that  all  of  the  sanctity  is  in  one  party. 
,  You  are  trying  to  raise  all  the  money  you  can  from  the  Democrats 
in  Illinois  for  the  campaign,  and  the  Republicans  are  doing  the  same 
thing.  Is  that  not  the  situation  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  would  not  make  that  statement  so  broad. 
You  know  there  is  a  distinction.  Senator,  between  

The  Chairman.  Well,  then,  you  are  not  trying  to  raise  all  you  can, 
is  that  it? 

•  Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  am  tr^dng  to  raise  a  reasonable  amount. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  What  do  you  mean  by  "  all  we  can  get "  ? 

The  Chairman.  You  have  told  us  that  there  was  no  limit  to  the 
amount,  and  I  understood  you  to  say  that  you  were  trying  to  raise  all 
you  could. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Well,  the  fact  of  the  matter  is  that  when  we 
raise  all  we  can  get,  we  usually  have  bareh^^  enough  to  pay  our  neces- 
sary expenditures. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  you  raise  in  1916  for  the  State? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  In  the  western  headquarters  altogether? 

The  Chairman.  No;  from  the  State  of  Illinois. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2113 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  I  could  not  tell  you  offhand.  I  do  not 
know  that.  I  think  the  western  headquarters  spent  something  like 
$350,000  or  $360,000. 

The  Chairman.  I  asked  you  as  to  the  State  of  Illinois.  Can  you 
give  me  that  information? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  could  not  give  you  that ;  no. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  give  ihe  any  estimate  of  the  amount  you 
spent  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  In  the  State? 
The  Chairman.  Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  State  was  not  separated  from  the  na- 
tional committee — in  the  contributions. 

The  Chairman.  Can  3^011  give  me — if  you  can  not  do  that,  can  you 
give  me  the  amount  raised  in  the  State  of  Illinois  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  You  mean  the  amount  spent  in  the  State 
campaign  ? 

The  Chairman.  The  amount  raised  in  the  State  of  Illinois  for  the 
State  and  National  campaigns. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  could  not  do  that. 
The  Chairman.  You  can  not  do  that? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Somc  of  the  contribiitions  from  Illinois  were 
given  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  They  were  given  in  New  York? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  raise  money  in  Illinois  at  that  time  out- 
side of  what  the  national  committee  raised? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  They  raised  it  all? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  is,  the  money  was  raised  for  both  the 
National  campaign  and  the  State  campaign.  It  was  divided  be- 
tween— the  money  was  equally  divided  between  the  two.  The  State 
committee  got  half  and  the  national  committee  got  half  of  the  money 
that  I  raised. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  raised  in  the  cities?  What  was  done 
with  that  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  In  the  cities? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  What  do  you  mean  by  that  ? 
The  Chairman.  Like  Danville,  for  instance. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  We  do  not  raise  money  that  way. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No.    We  raised  money  four  years  ago  en- 
tirely by  letter. 

The  Chairman.  Entirely  by  letter? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Then  you-  

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Pardou  me. 

The  Chairman.  Go  ahead. 
^  Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  We  sent  out  letters  and  asked  for  contribu- 
tions. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  solicitors — men  soliciting  through 
the  State? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  We  tried  that. 


2114 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  And  you  can  not  give  us  now  any  estimate  of 
what  you  raised  in  Illinois  in  1916  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  think  I  can. 
The  Chairman.  How  is  that  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  Say,  I  can  not. 
The  Chairman.  You  can  not  do  that? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  you  have  commenced  sending  out  letters 
this  year,  have  you  not  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  mailing  list? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Ycs,  sir.  I  have  not  lists  now,  though.  We 
are  making  up  a  new  list.   We  had  a  list. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  making  up  a  new  list  now? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  say  you  had  a  list? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  furnish  any  of  j^our  lists  to  Mr.  Jamie- 
son  for  his  plan? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Xo,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  furnish  you  any  names  for  your  lists? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Xot  siuce  four  years  ago. 
The  Chairman.  He  did  furnish  you  some,  though,  four  years 
ago  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  AA^itli  some  names ;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Have  you — you  heard  from  Mr.  Jamieson  about 
his  plan,  did  you  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  not  get  any  correspondence  from  him? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  list  of  all  Federal  officeholders  in  the 
State? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir;  I  never  saw  one. 
The  Chairman.  A  list  of  postmasters? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  been  sending  letters  out  to  postmasters, 
have  you  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  suspcct  I  havc. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  expect  to  keep  on  sending  them  to  them, 
do  you  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir;  not  when  I  find  out  that  they  are 
postmasters. 

The  Chairman.  Not  when  you  find  out  that  they  are  postmasters  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  now,  we  had  testimony  here  of  some  letters 
sent  to  Mr.  Coffman,  at  Augusta,  111. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  is  possible. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  reason  we  asked  you  to  come  here. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  It  is  possible  I  sent  them. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  postmaster  there. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  did  not  know  that. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  knoAv  that  he  is  postmaster? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 


PKESiDE Initial  campaign  expenses. 


2115 


The  Chairman.  Noav,  look  at  this  envelope — well,  I  will  ask  you 
first  to  look  at  the  letter  and  the  enA' elope. 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  state  whether  or  not  you  sent  that  letter. 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  1  seiit  the  envelope  and  sent  the  letter. 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  That  is,  I  did  not  do  it,  but  I  had  it  done. 
The  Chairman.  You  had  it  done? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  you  assume  responsibility  for  the  sig- 
nature, whether  it  is  yours  or  not  ? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  those  are  the  general  kind  of  letters  that  you 
are  sending  over  the  State  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  \  es,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  you  notice  on  this  letter,  "  Deliver  at  home 
address  only." 

Mr,  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  With  a  rubber  stamp. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman,  Why  is  that  put  on  there  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  is  a  circular  letter,  and  in  order  to 
secure  attention  to  the  letter,  I  frequently  put  on  a  special  delivery 
stamp,  and  ask  that  the  letter  be  delivered  at  the  home  address. 

The  Chairman,  Do  3^ou  do  that  to  anyone  but  Federal  officials? 

Mr,  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  let  us  see.  You  put  that  on  so  it  will  re- 
ceive special  attention, 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Here  are  four  other  letters.  Look  at  those,  will 
you,  and  see  if  you  sent  those  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  They  look  familiar,  but  I  will  look  at  them. 
Did  you  read  these  letters  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes,  sir.  They  are  good  letters.  We  put  them 
into  the  record, 

Mr,  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  think  so;  I  think  they  are  poor 
letters. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  they  are  poor  letters. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN,  Ycs,  sir.  What  is  the  matter  with  the  letters  ? 
The  Chairman,  Well,  the  question  is  just  whether  you  sent  the 
letters. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Ycs,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  all  your  letters  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman,  Well,  is  this  first  one  more  important  than  the 
others  ? 

Mr.  .BoESCHENSTEiN,  I  beg  your  pardon? 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  particular  letter  any  more  important  than 
those  others  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Then  why  did  you  want  special  attention  given  to 
this  particular  letter  ?  Why  did  you  not  put  "  Deliver  at  home  ad- 
dress only  "  on  these  other  letters,  if  you  w^anted  special  attention  ? 


2116 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Simply  "because  we  probably  sent  some  letters 
to  the  party  and  received  no  reply,  and  then  used  the  other  method. 
We  do  not  always  put  on  a  special  delivery  stamp,  but  occasionally 
we  do. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  the  one  that  has  the  special  delivery  stamp 
on  is  dated  March  4.  You  sent  one  of  April  1  after  that,  and  put  no 
special  rubber  stamp  on  that. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes ;  that  is  correct. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  if  the  reason  was  that  you  had  not  heard 
from  the  man,  why  did  you  not  put  it  on  the  subsequent  letters  the 
same  as  that  one  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  you  know  these  letters  are  follow-ups. 
We  send  a  letter,  and  then  we  send  another  letter,  and  another  letter 
and  another  letter.  The  only  way  to  get  money  is  to  keep  at  it 
persistently. 

The  Chairman.  Here  are  five  letters. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  pretty  persistent  about  it. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  not,  however,  what  I  am  asking  you  about. 
Now,  let  us  not  beat  around  the  bush,  either  one  of  us,  about  this. 
You  knew  it  was  against  the  law  to  solicit  funds  from  Federal  offi- 
cials  

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (continuing).  In  Federal  buildings. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  had  a  rubber  stamp  prepared  to  send  it  on 
to  their  homes  and  thought  possibly  that  might  not  be  a  violation  of 
the  law. 

(No  response.) 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  read  any  of  Mr.  J amieson's  testimony  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  About  sending  to  the  homes  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir ;  I  have  not  followed  the  testimony  at 

all. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  you  not  write  this  on  instead  of  stamp- 
ing it  on  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  It  would  be  too  much  work. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  you  have  so  many  of  them  that  it  would  be 
too  much  work  to  write  it  on  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  but  one  dozen  is  work,  is  it  not  ? 

The  Chairman.  A  dozen  is  work  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  As  many  as  a  dozen  is  work. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  had  a  rubber  stamp  to  make  it  easy  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  only  put  the  rubber  stamp  on  when  you 
were  writing  to  Federal  officials  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  is  not  so. 
The  Chairman.  It  that  not  so  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  produce  a  single  envelope  where  you  have 
put  that  on  unless  it  is  addressed  to  a  Federal  official  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  have  the  envelopes.  I  do  not  keep 
the  letters.  The  letters  are  not  returned  to  me. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2117 


The  Chairman.  And  do  you  .tell  this  committee  now  that  you  put 
that  on  letters  that  were  not  addressed  to  Federal  officials  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  In  the  past,  emphatically ;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  in  what  has  been  going  on  now  ? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  produce  a  single  envelope  showing  that? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Well,  how  am  I  going  to  get  the  envelopes  ? 

The  Chairman.  Can  3^011  tell  us  the  name  of  any  person  who  is  not 
a  Federal  official— — 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  can  tell  you  that  some  time  ago,  in  the  elec- 
tion four  3^ears  ago,  I  sent  a  letter  to  the  bankers  in  Illinois,  Missouri, 
Wisconsin,  and  some  other  States,  in  connection  with  the  election,  and 
I  put  that  stamp  on  every  one,  as  I  recall  it,  and  put  a  special-delivery 
stamp  on  every  one. 

The  Chairman.  That  they  should  go  to  their  houses  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  That  was  not  the  point.  You  know  that  is 
not  the  point. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  let  us  get  the  point. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  It  does  not  follow  that  they  must  go  to  their 
houses ;  but  a  letter  with  a  special-delivery  stamp  on^  and  a  stamp  of 
that  kind — it  insures  attention  to  the  letter,  whereas  a  letter  simply 
with  a  printed  letterhead  or  an  envelope  with  a  printed  letter  in,  will 
not  secure  attention. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  have  the  registry  stamp  on  it,  and  the  man 
has  to  sign  for  it,  does  that  not  secure  attention  without  any  state- 
ment  

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes ;  but  it  delays  the  delivery. 

The  Chairman.  It  does  what? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  It  delays  delivery. 

The  Chairman.  Delays  delivery? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes;  and  this  looks  more  businesslike. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  does  the  rubber  stamp  help  the  delivery 
any? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No ;  but  the  special-delivery  stamp  does. 
The  Chairman.  You  had  a  special-delivery  stamp  on  this  letter? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  get  it  to  the  man  all  right,  would 
it  not? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  why  did  you  want  it  delivered  only  at  his 
home  address? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  So  the  man  would  get  it  personally.  Even  a 
special-delivery  letter  sometimes — a  special-delivery  stamp  sometimes 
does  not  insure  the  delivery  of  the  letter  to  the  person. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  you  not  have  somebody  take  the  letter, 
if  you  were  so  afraid  of  that,  and  carry  it  to  him  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Oh,  well,  that  is  too  much  work. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  put  on  there  because  if  it  was  delivered  to 
him  in  the  Federal  building  it  would  be  a  violation  of  law,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  tell  us  that? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  that  in  your  mind  at  all? 


2118 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Not  at  all,  sir. 
*  The  Chairman.  If  you  put  "  confidential "  on  it,  would  not  that 
secure  better  attention?    Somebody  has  testified  here  that  they  put 
"  confidential "  on  in  order  that  the  person  would  read  the  letter. 

(No  response.) 

The  Chairman.  Now,  is  it  or  is  it  not  true  that  you  are  trying  to 
secure  funds  from  Federal  officials  throughout  the  State? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Positively  not. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  not? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  harm  in  Federal  officials  contributing 
to  a  campaign  fund? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  see  any  harm,  except  that  it  is 
against  the  law. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  against  the  law  for  a  Federal  official  to 
contribute  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  but  it  is  against  the  law  to  solicit,  and 
it  is  too  much  work  to  go  after. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  the  only  postmaster  in  the  State  of  Illinois 
you  have  written  to  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  SUSpCCt  UOt. 

The  Chairman.  And  have  you  put  a  rubber  stamp  on  the  other 
letters  to  postmasters  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 
The  Chairman.  You  intended  to,  did  you  not? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Somc  of  them ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  want  them  to  get  them  in  the 
building  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  say  that. 
The  Chairman.  What? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  did  not  care  where  they  got  them. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  care  whether  they  got  them  in  the 
post-office  building  or  not  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  A  letter  soliciting  funds  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  do  not  care  where  they  get  the  letter. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  care  where  they  get  the  letter? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No.  I  do  not  know,  in  the  first  place,  that 
the  man  that  this  letter  is  addressed  to  is  a  postmaster.  I  did  not 
know  that  this  man  is  a  postmaster  until  you  told  me  so. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  know  that  he  is? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir.    I  know  now,  since  you  have  told  us. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  that  has  been  the  evidence  here.  That  is 
all  I  know. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  is  all  right. 

The  Chairman.  Maybe  he  is  not.  ^ 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  know  that  he  is. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  try  to  find  out  whether  a  man  is  a 
postmaster  or  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Well,  as  a  general  rule,  postmasters  under  a 
Democratic  administration  are  pretty  strong  Democrats,  and  under 
a  Republican  administration  pretty  active  Republicans,  are  they  not? 

Senator  Reed.  Not  since  the  Wilson  civil  service. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPEITSES. 


2119 


Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  That  does  not  apply  to  Illinois,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  That  does  not  apply  to  Illinois? 

Mr.  BoEscHExsTEiN.  No.  Fully  half  of  the  postmasters  in  Illinois 
are  Republicans. 

The  Chairman.  How  many? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  About  half  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Half  of  them  are  Republicans  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  do  you  really  mean  that  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  really  mean  it.    I  know  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  mean  it  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  mean  it,  and  I  know  it. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  do  you  solicit  funds  from  them? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  No  ,*  we  do  not  solicit  funds  from  any  post- 
master, knowing  the  man  to  be  a  postmaster. 

The  Chairman.  What  about  other  Federal  officials?  Do  you  send 
any  letters  to  district  attorneys? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Or  marshals? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  They  do  not  contribute? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  No,  sir — yes;  they  do  contribute. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  if  3^011  have  so  few  postmasters  in  Illinois 
and  so  many  Democrats  in  office,  and  you  do  not  solicit  from  those 
in  office,  how  in  the  world  do  you  raise  any  funds? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  know  how  we  get  it,  but  we  manage 
to  get  by  sometimes. 

The  Chairman.  You  manage  to  get  by? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  can  not  tell  us  how  much  ? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  It  is  by  keeping  everlastingly  at  it  that  we 
get  enough  money  to  pay  the  rent  and  furniture  expenses. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  not  gotten  your  heavy  contributions  yet? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Your  conception  of  a  campaign  fund  and 
mine  do  not  seem  to  agree,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  Your  idea  of  what  a  campaign  fund  is  or 
ought  to  be,  and  mine  do  not  agree. 

The  Chairman.  AVell,  maybe  they  do  now.   Let  us  see. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  How  is  that? 

The  Chairman.  I  say,  maybe  they  do.  I  am  not  for  big  campaign 
funds. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  It  may  be  a  surprise  to  you  to  know  that  in 
Illinois  last  year  in  the  State  campaign  we  spent  less  than  $10,000. 

The  Chairman.  No  ;  nothing  would  surprise  us  about  Illinois. 

Senator  Edge.  How  many  did  you  elect  in  the  way  of  State  officers 
last  year? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  beg  your  pardon? 

Senator  Edge.  I  say,  what  did  you  elect  in  the  way  of  State  officers 
last  year? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  We  did  not  elect  any.  It  is  the  conclusion, 
then,  that  if  you  spend  a  big  amount  of  money,  you  can  elect  the 
officers?   Is  that  the  theory  of  getting  up  these  campaign  funds? 


2120 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  the  theory  of  the  question,  at  least. 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  How  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  say,  that  is  the  theory  of  the  question. 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Apparently  it  is. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  have  had  some  rather  substantial  con- 
tributions from  Illinois  in  times  gone  by,  have  you  not?  Is  Mr. 
Crane  from  Illinois? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  he  gave  in  1912  and  1916  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  What  is  the  point  of  that  question  ? 
The  Chairman.  Well,  just  answer  the  question. 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  How  is  that? 

The  Chairman.  Just  answer  the  question.  The  point  will  be  dis- 
covered later,  perhaps. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Why,  Mr.  Crane — ask  the  question  again. 
The  Chairman.  Bead  the  question,  please. 
(Question  read  as  above  recorded.) 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  Mr.  Jones  gave? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No. 

The  Chairman,  Do  you  know  that  he  gave  somewhere  around 
$15,000  or  $20,000? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  did  not  know  that. 

The  Chairman.  Did  Jones  when  he  gave  in  those  3^ears  turn  the 
money  over  to  you  or  turn  it  in  somewhere  else  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  national  committeeman  in  1912? 


The  Chairman.  And  in  1916? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  And  you  do  not  know  that? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  think  possibly  he  made  that  contribution 
in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  that?   To  you,  you  say?  . 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  say  I  think  possibly  he  may  have  made 
that  contribution  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  hear  you  yet.    In  New  York? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  think — 1  am  under  the  impression  that  he 
made  that  contribution  in  New  York. 

The  Cpiairman.  Well,  he  made  more  than  one  contribution,  did 
he  not? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  can  not  recall  that. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  Mr.  Jones's  business  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  do  not  know  that  he  has  any  business.  I 
do  not  know  much  about  him. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Who  is  that? 
The  Chairman.  Jones.   Is  he  in  the  zinc  business  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  What  about  Mr.  Crane?  How  much  did  he  con- 
tribute in  those  years? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  do  not  know.  I  can  not  recall  any  of  those 
contributions. 

The  Chairi^ian.  He  is  a  citizen  of  Illinois,  is  he  not? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2121 


Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Cpiairman.  Have  you  many  Democrj^ts  like  Mr.  Crane? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir.  ^  _ 

The  Chairman.  He  contributed,  in  1912,  $40,000.  That  was  not 
so  hard  to  get  along  with,  was  it? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  No.  I  wish  he  would  come  back  and  con- 
tribute another  $40,000. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  he  has  an  ambassadorship  now,  has  he  not? 
Maybe  he  will.  And  R.  T.  Crane,  jr.  He  seems  to  be  another.  Do 
you  know  how  much  he  contributed? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  it  go  to  you  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  recall. 

The  Chairman.  In  1912,  that  is. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  recall  that. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  $5,000.  Thomas  D.  Jones  contributed 
that  year  $10,000  and  David  B.  Jones,  of  Chicago,  $10,000.  So  there 
is  $65,000  from  three  or  four  gentlemen.  You  really  do  not  have 
such  a  hard  time  after  all,  do  you,  coupled  with  the  postmasters  and 
the  Federal  officials  ? 

(No  response.) 

The  Chairman.  But  the  truth  of  it  is  that  both  parties  raise  prac- 
tically all  the  money  they  can  and  spend  it  in  elections  in  the  State 
of  Illinois? 

(No  response.) 

The  Chairinian.  Well,  that  is  all. 

Senator  Spencer.  Mr.  Boeschenstein,  those  contributions  that  Mr. 
Crane,  Mr.  Jones,  and  others  made,  I  understood  you  to  say,  did 
not  come  to  3^ou  personally? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  are  there  other  agencies  collecting  besides 
you  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  usually  appoint  a  finance  committee  for  Chi- 
cago, and  this  finance  committee  selects  a  chairman,  and  the  finance 
committee  here  cooperates  with  us  at  headquarters  in  collecting 
money.    Now,  there  are  people  in  every  community  who  prefer  to 

§ive  their  contributions  to  New  York  to  giving  them  in  their  own 
tate.    Mr.  Crane,  Mr.  Jones,  and  others  preferred  to  give  them  to 
New  York,  and  therefore  we  did  not  get  those  contributions. 

Senator  Spencer.  AYell,  then,  would  there  be  three  avenues  of  col- 
lection in  your  party  in  Illinois  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Oh,  no,  no. 
Senator  Spencer.  Hoav  would  that  be,  then  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  It  is  practically  one,  as  the  reports  show ;  the 
Federal  reports  show  the  amounts  contributed  and  the  contributois. 

Senator  Spencer.  Some  of  those  amounts  come  to  you  directly,  or 
through  you — through  your  efforts? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes.  Some  of  them  are  paid  at  the  western 
headquarters  to  our  cashier.  I  do  not  receive  any  money,  and  never 
handle  any  money. 

Senator  Spencer.  But  your  cashier  is  under  you  ? 

Mr,  Boeschenstein.  The  cashier  is  under  the  chairman  and  my- 
self. 


2122 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Spencer.  Under  the  chairman  and  yourself  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  now,  what  comes  through  the  finance  com- 
mittee, you  consider  that  as  part  of  your  collections  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  money  that  comes  through  the  finance 
committee  is  considered  as  a  part  of  the  collection  of  the  bureau. 
Understand,  a  bureau  is  organized  here — a  finance  bureau.  We  se- 
lect a  cashier  or  custodian  of  the  money  and  a  director,  and  then  we 
get  a  bookkeeper  and  one  or  two  stenographers.  Now,  these  people 
have  charge  of  the  finance  bureau.  They  look  after  the  finances.  We 
are  merely  supernumeraries. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  that  finance  bureau  is  a  part  of  your  organi- 
zation here  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  It  is  a  part  of  my  organization,  and  also  a 
part  of  the  national  organization. 

Senator  Spencer.  Exactly.  But  those  who  contribute  directly  to 
New  York,  or  through  New  York — that  does  not  go  through  your 
finance  bureau  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  So  that  there  would  be  two  methods  of  contrib- 
uting, as  you  say.  Some  would  prefer  to  contribute  directly  to  New 
York. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  And  some  here. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  some  contribute  through  your  finance  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  But  the  report  made  to  the  Govermnent 
shows  those  contributions. 

Senator  Spencer.  Both  of  them  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Mr.  Boeschenstein,  did  you  say  you  had  no  list 
of  postmasters  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No. 

Senator  Spencer.  To  whom  you  sent  these  letters  ? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  These  letters  are  dated  in  J anuary  

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer  (continuing).  February,  March,  and  April? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Of  1920? 

Mr.  Boescpienstein.  Yes. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is,  of  this  year. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes  ,sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Had  you  commenced  your  financial  campaign 
as  far  back  as  that  ?  ^ 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  When  did  you  commence  it? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  We  figured  in  January  and  February,  in  the 
early  part  of  the  year,  that  we  wanted  to  get  out  a  bulletin.  We  had 
been  getting  out  a  bulletin  in  Illinois  for  years,  and  we  had  been  get- 
ting out  plate  matter  for  the  newspapers,  and  we  figured  then  that 
we  would  inaugurate  a  campaign  and  raise  enough  money  in  order 
to  support  this  campaign.  You  know,  the  money  for  these  purposes— 
that  is,  usually  it  is — the  money  for  these  purposes  is  contributed 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2123 


by  passing  the  hat,  and  we  figured  that  if  we  could  get  contributions 
of  several  thousand  dollars,  we  would  start  our  bulletin,  a  good  deal 
like  some  other  States  have,  and  get  out  this  plate  matter. 
Senator  Spencer.  I  see. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  And  that  was  the  reason  for  these  letters. 
Xow,  that  was  not  very  successful.  The  responses  were  very  few. 
Then,  I  gave  it  up.  After  Mr.  Sullivan's  death  I  figured  then  that 
we  ought  to  revive  the  thing,  and  we  started  in  to  try  to  get  the 
money  to  put  this  thing  on  its  feet,  and,  of  course,  we  had  the 
primary  expenses  and  the  other  expense  that  the  State  committee  had, 
and  part  of  this  money  went  to  the  State  committee  for  their  expenses. 

Senator  Spencer.  What  business  are  you  in,  Mr.  Boeschenstein  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  am  president  of  the  Edwardsville  National 
Bank. 

Senator  Spencer.  What? 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  President  of  a  bank. 
Senator  Spencer.  President  of  a  bank ;  a  banker. 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Be  good  enough  to  tell  me  this,  Mr.  Boeschen- 
stein :  If  you  had  no  list  of  postmasters,  if  you  did  not  send  these 
letters  to  postmasters  as  postmasters,  how  did  it  happen  that  these 
letters  to  Mr.  Coffman,  who  is  a  Kepublican,  but  a  postmaster,  hap- 
pened to  be  sent  to  him  ? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  I  can  explain  this  one  in  this  way;  that 
happens  frequently — or,  pardon  me.  That  happens  every  once  in  a 
while,  and  that  comes  about  in  this  way :  We  send  letters  to  known 
Democrats,  of  different  localities,  and  in  those  letters  we  ask  them  to 
suggest  to  us  names  of  others  whom  they  think  should  contribute 
to  the  campaign.  The  chances  are  that  somebody — whoever  it  was — 
in  that  county  or  in  that  district  furnished  us  this  name.  It  has  hap- 
pened before,  that  once  in  a  while  we  wake  up  the  wrong  passenger, 
and  find  that  we  have  sent  a  letter  to  a  Eepublican,  and  he  sends  us 
back  a  roast  instead  of  a  contribution. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  probably  means  that  your  local  corre- 
spondent, in  the  county  where  this  Mr.  Coffman  lives,  evidently 
thought  that  a  man  who  was  occupying  his  position  

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  That  a  man  who  held  a  postmastership  ought 
to  put  up? 

Senator  Spencer.  Yes ;  and  sent  you  his  name. 
Mr.  Boeschenstein.  And,  if  you  ask  me  what  I  personally  think 
about  it,  I  think  he  ought  to  or  he  ought  to  get  out. 
Senator  Spencer.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  if  the  Republicans  should  be  successful 
at  the  coming  election,  they  will  get  out? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein  (continuing).  And  I  am  in  favor  of  throwing 
every  one  of  them  out. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  better  get  them  ready.  Now,  you  say  you 
pass  the  hat? 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  I  called  you  attention  to  some  of  your  contribu- 
tors of  1912,  which  you  spoke  about  having  such  diffiuclty,  but  I  see 
I  omitted  some. 

Mr.  Boeschenstein.  Would  you  niind  if  I  saw  that  list?  Maybe 
I  can  give  you  some  information. 


2124 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Well,  I  will  call  your  attention  to  it.  Mr.  Pea- 
body,  of  Chicago? 

Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chaikman.  $6,450.    Did  that  come  through  you? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  I  think  it  did;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Is  that  the  coal  man  here  ? 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  bclieve  he  has  some  connection  with  some 
coal  companies  here. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  in  the  coal  business  ? 
Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  coal  barons  are  not  all  in  the  Republican 
Party,  then. 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  think  he  is  a  partner  of  Fred  Upham. 
The  Chairman.  He  is  a  partner  of  Upham's.    John  Barton 
Payne  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  $15,000. 

Mr.  BOESCHENSTEIN.  I  think  that  came  through  me. 
The  Chairman.  Did  that  come  through  you  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Sullivan,  $5,000.    He  is  dead  now. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir.    That  came  through  me. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  B.  M.  Winston,  $10,000. 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  That  came  through  me,  I  think. 
The  Chairman.  That  came  through  you? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Pardou  me,  now.  It  came  through  our  com- 
mittee. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  then,  refreshing  your  memory,  do  you 
know  whether  the  Crane  one  came  through  you  ? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Or  the  Jones  one? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  do  not  think  it  did. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  interrupt  to  ask  a  question  right  there, 
please;  just  to  clear  up  something  that  was  suggested.  When  you 
say  "  our  committee,"  do  you  mean  the  national  Democratic  commit- 
tee or  do  you  mean  this  bureau  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN,  It  was  paid  through  the  bureau,  at  the  na- 
tional headquarters. 

The  Chairman.  Through  the  bureau  at  national  headquarters? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  true  of  the  Jones  subscriptions? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  I  am  inclined  to  think  the  Jones  sub- 
scription was  paid  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  It  came  through  you,  you  say? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No ;  paid  in  New  York,  I  think,  the  Jones 
subscription. 

The  .Chairman.  Oh. 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  think  the  Crane  and  Jones  subscriptions 
were  made  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  had  the  use  of  the  money  out  here? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Or  we  got  some  other  money  in  place  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  So  here  are  eight  gentlemen  in  Illinois,  eight 
Illinois  Democrats  in  1912,  who  gave,  as  I  figure  it,  $106,000. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2125 


Mr.  BoEscHENSTEiN.  That  is  about  the  amount  that  my  congres- 
sional district  is  expected  this  year  to  contribute  to  the  Republican 
campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

^Ir.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chair3iax.  How  many  of  these  gentlemen  secured  positions? 
^fr.  BoESCHENSTETN.  I  do  uot  kuow  that.    I  did  not  appoint  any- 
body.   I  could  not? 

The  Chairman.  You  can  not? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  I  could  not. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  recommend  any  of  them  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  were  to  ])ass  tlie  hat  to  tliose  who  are  still 
left,  you  would  get  a  little  more  than  the  $1  subscriptions  you  talk 
about,  probably.   That  is  all.   I  am  much  obliged  to  you,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Did  you  give  your  address  here  for  the 
record  ? 

Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  EclwardsA^lle,  111. 
The  Chairman.  Edwardsville? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  are  president  of  what  bank? 
Mr.  BoESCHENSTEiN.  The  Edwardsville  National  Bank. 
Senator  Pomerene.  All  right. 
(Witness  excused.) 

FURTHER  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  FRED  W.  UPHAM. 

(The  witness,  previously  sworn,  was  recalled  and  further  testified.) 
The  Chair^ian.  You  have  been  sworn  once,  have  you  not,  Mr. 
Upham  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have.  Now,  I  was  asked  by  this  committee  to  bring 
in  mv  statement  from  January  1,  1919,  to  the  time  we  closed  our 
books,  June  12,  1920. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  wait.   This  runs  from  where  to  where? 

Mr.  Upham.  My  statement  really  runs  from  December  1.  You 
asked  me  from  January  1. . 

The  Chairman.  December? 

Mr.  Upham.  1918 ;  because  that  is  when  we  started  our  new  books, 
after  the  congressional  election. 
The  Chairman.  Up  to  what  time  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Up  to  June  12. 
The  Chairman.  1920? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  I  was  on  the  stand  the  other  day  and  made  a 
full  statement  of  all  receipts  [ind  expenditures  from  June  14  to  Au- 
gust 26,  which  was  just  a  few  days  up  to  the  last  accounting  date  I 
had,  up  to  the  time  I  was  called.  From  December  1,  1918,  to  June  12, 
1920 — these  figures  were  given  in  Mr.  Hays's  statement  the  other  day, 
as  your  record  will  show,  all  of  these  figures. 

Senator  Pomerene.  June  12,  1920? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  the  contributions  to  the  national  committee  Tvere 
$1,365,897.49.  The  contributions  to  the  State  committees  where  a 
joint  arrangement  was  had  with  them  were  $469,456.21.  There  -'^vf^. 
18.518  contributors. 

Senator  Spencer.  How  many? 

182774— 20— PT  15  3 


2126 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  Eighteen  thousand  five  hundred  and  fifteen.  The  av- 
erage is  $99.13.  I  have  had  a  complete  copy  made  of  every  subscrip- 
tion. 

The  Chairman.  You  present  that  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  I  present  that. 

(The  document  was  marked  "  Upham's  Exhibit  A,"  of  September 
10, 1920,  and  appears  in  the  record  at  p.  — .) 

Mr.  Upham.  In  that  copy  you  will  find  that  there  are  39  subscrib- 
ers, totaling  $108,000,  or  an  average  of  $2,769.23,  that  are  over  

Senator  Pomerene.  That  first  figure  again,  please. 

Mr.  Upham.  There  are  39  subscribers. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  Totaling  $108,000,  or  an  average  of  $2,769.13,  that 
contributed  over  $1,000.   There  was  one  subscription  of  $9,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Who  was  that? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  do  not  remember  the  man's  name.  He  was  a  man 
from  Colorado.   The  record  will  show. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  this  record  will  show? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  this  record  will  show  Avho  it  is.  It  was  a  man 
I  have  never  heard  of  before.   He  understood,  so  I  heard,  that  

The  Chairman.  Have  you  not  testified  to  all  this  before  ? 

Mr:  Upham.  No  ;  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  All  right,  then.   Go  ahead. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  never  testified  to  this. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  did  not  testify  to  that  at  all. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  never  testified  to  a  thing  before  the  conven- 
tion. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  not  testified  to  anything  before  the  con- 
vention ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Not  a  thing. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  now,  that  is  all  right.   Go  ahead. 

Mr.  Upham.  The  statement  I  made  the  other  day  was  starting  with 
June  14,  and  at  the  top  of  the  paper  I  handed  over,  Senator,  it  showed 
that  it  was  from  June  14  to  August  6  very  clearly 

The  Chairman.  And  this  shows  the  date  previous  to  that? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  do  not  think  Senator  Reed  quite  understood  it.  He 
told  me  afterwards  he  understood  my  statement  at  that  time  was  a 
complete  statement ;  but  I  do  not  see  how  there  could  have  been  any 
misunderstanding  about  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  had  in  mind  to  ask  you  about  that,  and  I 
overlooked  it  when  you  were  on  the  stand. 

Mr.  Uhpam.  Yes. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  who  was  it  that  testified  to  that  preconven- 
tion  amount,  Mr.  Upham  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  This  part  is  all  in  Hays's  testimony. 
Senator  Spencer.  Hays's  testimony? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  Hays,  when  he  was  on  the  stand,  testified  to  the 
amount  that  was  received.  He  did  not  go  into  detail,  of  course ;  he 
did  not  give  the  subscription  list,  and  he  did  not  give  the  cash  count  ; 
but  he  did  give  the  12,000  contributors  and  the  8  that  were  over 
$1,000, 1  remember  distinctly.   He  testified  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  Right  there,  before  you  get  away  from  that:  At 
the  time  you  opened  your  new  books,  concerning  which  you  testified 
before,  how  much  of  this  money  was  left  ?  I  think  we  have  that,  but 
I  would  like  to  get  it  again  to  make  certain. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2127 


Mr.  Upham.  $296,000,  with  $100,000  of  debts,  which  made  $196,000 
net. 

The  Chairman.  $196,000  net? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  spent  all  of  this  except  $196,000? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  sir.    That  is.  at  the  time  we  closed  the  books 
June  12. 

The  Chairman.  Xow,  here  is  a  summary  of  these  subscriptions  by 
States,  showing  what  went  to  the  national  committee  and  what  went 
to  the  State  committees  of  that  $1,800,000. 

(The  document  was  marked  "  Upham's  Exhibit  B,"  of  Sept.  10, 
1920,  and  is  attached  hereto:) 

Upham's  Exhibit  B. 

Dcceiuher  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920. 

Contributions  to  Republican  national  committee  $1,  365,  897.  49 

Contributions  to  State  campaign  committees  where  joint  ar- 
rangement is  had  with  them   469,  456.  21 

Total  J   1,  835,  353.  70 

Eighteen  thousand  five  hundred  and  fifteen  contributors;  average,  $99.13. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Let  me  understand  you,  Mr.  Upham. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  You  mean  by  that  answer,  the  statement  you 
have  made,  to  apply  to  contributions  and  disbursements  prior  to 
June  14,  1920? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  specifyino:  from  the  list  right  now. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  understand. 

The  Chairmax^.  Your  testimon}^  is  all  confined  to  that  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir.  You  have  my  testimony,  now,  from  June 
14  on,  already  in  the  record.  Xow,  I  will  submit  also  the  finance 
statem.ent,  as  of  that  period,  showing  that  on  December  1,  1918,  we 
had  cash  on  hand.  $43,000. 

(The  document  was  marked  "  Upham's  Exhibit  C,"  of  Sept. 
10,  1920,  and  is  attached  hereto.) 

Upham's  Exhibit  C. 
Statement  of  cash  receipts  and  disbursements,  December  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920. 
Dec.  1,  1918 : 

Cash  on  hand  and  working  funds   $43,  048. 17 

Contributions  received  for  national  committee-  1,  365,  897.  49 
Contributions  received  for  States  where  joint 

working  arrangement  is  had  with  them   469,  456.  21 

Received  on  loans   335,  000.  00 

Miscellaneous  receipts,  interest,  refunds,  etc__  8,  777.  60 

Total  receipts  $2,  222,  179.  47 

Disbursements — 

Returned  to  States   469,  456.  21 

Repayment  of  loan,  prior  campaign   50,  000.  00 

Repayment  of  loans   235,  000.  00 

Publicity,  speakers,  headquarters,  and  gen- 
eral expense  1, 171. 101.  99 

Total   disbursements   1,925,558.20 

June  12,  1920 : 

Cash  on  hand  and  working  funds   296,  621.  27 

Loans  remaining  unpaid   100,  000,  00 


2128 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upha.m.  You  will  find  on  the  other  side  that  we  owed  $50,000, 
so  we  were  really  $7,000  to  the  "  red/'  That  was  pretty  close.  Here 
IS  the  amount  of  contributions  received,  as  I  have  fust  read;  the 
amount  of  loans;  the  amount  that  was  repaid  on  loans;  and  the 
amount  the  national  committee  had  expended. 

000      Chairman.  What  is  this  item,  "  Repayment  of  loans,  $235,- 

Mr.  Upham.  Money  that  had  been— it  shows  that  I  borrowed  

The  Chairman.  $335,000? 

Mr.  UiHAM.  $335,000. 

The  Chairt^ian.  And  you  paid  $100,000? 

Mr.  ITpHAiNr.  I  paid  all  but  $100,000.  There  were  loans  remaining, 
now,  when  we  opened  the  books,  of  $100,000  unpaid. 

The  Chairman.  I  would  like  to  ask  you,  Mr.  Upham :  In  a  gen- 
eral way^  these  disbursements  for  postage,  speakers,  headquarters, 
etc.,  $1,171,101.99— what  does  that  cover?  It  seems  to  me  a  large 
item. 

Mr.  ITpHAM.  Of  course,  Mr.  Hays  can  answer  that  better  than  I 
can.  It  covered  all  the  expenses  of  the  national  committee  from  De- 
cember 1  until  June  12;  that  is,  covering  a  period — that  would  be 
January,  February,  March,  April,  May — it  would  be  eighteen  and  a 
half  months. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  there  was  no  campaign  on. 

Mr.  Upham.  There  was  with  Will  Hays. 

The  Chairman.  Always  a  campaign? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  all  the  time. 

The  Chairman.  Getting  ready? 

Mr.  Upham.  He  had  headquarters,  active  headquarters,  in  active 
operation,  at  Washington,  New  York,  Chicago,  and  at  San  Francisco 
all  during  that  time. 

The  Chairman.  A  year  before  the  convention? 

Mr.  UiHAM.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  had  speakers  out  through  the  country? 

Mr.  Upham.  We  had  what  w^as  known  as  the  Chautauqua  bureau. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  Chautauqua  bureau? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  think  those  were  speakers  that  were  sent  out  to 
Chautauqua  meetings  throughout  the  country. 

The  Chairman.  Paid  for  by  the  Republican  national  committee? 

Mr.  Upham.  Paid  for  by  the  Republican  national  committee,  to 
spread  Republican  doctrine. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  let  me  see;  did  you  have  an  arrangement 
with  the  Chautauqua  bureau  to  furnish  Chautauqua  speakers  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  did  not.  I  am  only  the  treasurer,  and  I  made  no 
such  arrangement. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  do  you  know  that  there  was  such  an  ar- 
rangement ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  know  that  I  paid  the  money  out  for  it. 
The  Chairman.  You  paid  out  money  for  speakers? 
Mr.  Upham.  No;  I  paid  it  out  to  the  bureau.   These  matters  were 
all  budgeted. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  that,  now.  Suppose  somebody  was  go- 
ing out  to  address  a  Chautauqua,  to  have  Republican  days.  The  ex- 
penses of  that  speaker,  and  his  compensation,  were  taken  care  of  by 
the  national  committee? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2129 


Mr.  Upham.  Taken  care  of  through  Dr.  Ellis,  who  is  at  the  head 
of  the  Chautauqua  bureau. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Doctor  who? 

Mr.  Upham.  Dr.  Ellis.  My  only  contact  was  with  Dr.  Ellis.  I 
had  nothing  to  do  with  the  selection  or  the  appointment  of  men.  I 
have  all  of  the  vouchers,  because  he  had  to  furnish  me,  as  every  one 
else  did,  with  a  voucher  for  every  dollar  spent. 

The  Chaieman.  Well,  this  bureau  took  care  of  the  payment  of 
tliese  men  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir.  It  is  carried  on  the  books  as  ^  Chautauqua 
bureau.'' 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  hoAv  many  were  out  in  the  Chau- 
tauqua work? 

Mr.  I^PHAM.  I  have  no  idea ;  none  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  Did  they  have  Democratic  days  at  these  Chau- 
tauquas,  too? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  understand  so.  Now,  shall  I  go  on  with  my  state- 
ment? 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  go  ahead. 

Mr.  Upha^i.  I  have  really  finished  with  what  you  asked  me  for  on 
that,  but  if  I  may — of  course,  I  am  simply  a  plain  business  treasurer, 
and  lam  not  making  any  apologies  for  the  vvay  I  run  my  office.  We 
knoAv  what  we  are  doing  every  day  of  the  week.  1  have  got  as  good 
an  auditor  as  there  is  in  the  country,  because  he  is  the  auditor  of  the 
company  of  which  I  am  the  president,  the  Consumers'  Co.  I  bor- 
rowed him  for  the  time  being,  without  salary,  to  keep  what  we  call — or 
to  raise  the  red  flag  any  time  when  we  are  getting  to  a  danger  point 
on  expenditures  on  any  budgeted  item. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  vou  assume  the  entire  responsibilitv  for 
the  

Mr.  Upham.  I  do,  and  proud  of  it.  I  think  when  the  Democratic 
Party  reorganizes  their  finance  department  on  proper  lines  they  will 
adopt  our  system.  I  believe  to-day  that  as  a  business  man  T  could 
get  the  job  from  the  Democratic  national  committee  of  running  their 
finances.  I  know  when  the  party  wants  to  get  a  convention  for  Chi- 
cago they  always  select  me  chairman  of  the  committee  and  send  me 
down  to  try  to  get  it  for  them. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  seem  to  jienerally  <x^t  them  for  Chicago? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  haA^e  secured  ^xe  of  them.  T  have  been  chairman  of 
the  committee  for  20  years. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  chairman  of  the  finance  committee  at 
every  one  of  those  conventions  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  The  next  one  goes  to  Atlantic  City,  does  it  not? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  not  talked  with  my  friend  Reed  yet.  He  may 
want  it  in  Kansas  City. 

Senator  Edge.  You  feel  very  friendly,  then,  do  you  not? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  Cleveland  has  got  some  claim. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  do  not  think  I  had  better  commit  myself  to-day. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  gentlemen,  let  us  cut  out  the  persiflage  and 
go  ahead. 

Senator  Spencer.  Mr.  Upham,  was  any  of  the  preconvention  fund, 
the  fund  which  you  have  described  as  having  been  raised  between 


2130 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


December  1,  1918,  and  June  12,  1920— was  any  of  that  fund  except 
the  $296,000,  against  which  there  was  a  debt  of  $100,000,  available 
for  future  use,  or  was  it  all  spent  by  June  14? 

Mr.  Upham.  Every  dollar  spent,  and  I  have  vouchers  for  every 
expenditure. 

Senator  Spencer.  Some  witness  said,  or  it  was  intimated  here, 
that  a  large  part  of  that  fund,  or  some  of  it,  had  ben  loaned  out  and 
was  available  for  future  use.   Is  that  the  fact? 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  the  loans  were  made  after  June  14,  when  we 
started  our  campaign. 

Senator  Spencer.  In  other  words,  all  of  the  money  that  you  raised 
before  June  14,  1920,  was  spent  before  June  14,  1920,  except  the 
$296,000  to  which  you  referred,  with  $100,000  indebtedness  against 
it ;  that  is  right,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  Now,  if  I  can  make  a  plain  business  statement 
of  this  quota  and  budget  business  

The  Chairman.  Go  ahead  and  do  it. 

Senator  Edge.  I  was  just  going  to  ask  for  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  Just  as  I  would  make  it  to  a  board  of  directors  to  a 
business  house ;  I  would  like  to  do  that. 

The  Chairman.  Go  right  ahead  and  do  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  Now,  early  in  1919 — or,  first,  let  me  say  that  I  am 
the  treasurer,  and  I  am  responsible  for  what  is  done,  and  no  man  in 
America  has  fixed  a  quota  for  any  State  but  Fred  Upham.  I  fixed 
the  quotas.  I  am  the  treasurer  of  a  committee  elected  by  the  national 
committee  and  not  appointed  by  Mr.  Hays  at  all.  I  was  elected  the 
same  time  that  he  was  elected. 

Early  in  1919  I  made  up  a  quota  of  States  that  I  submitted  to  this 
committee — which  was  sworn  to — which  totaled  about  $4,800,000. 
That  was  early  in  1918,  as  I  say.  Those  quotas  were  passed  out  to 
the  States.  We  collected  up  to  the  time  of  the  convention  $1,800,000, 
as  I  have  shown  there;  $1,300,000  of  that  applied  on  this  quota.  The 
$500,000  to  the  States  did  not  apply  on  this  quota  at  all.  So  that 
when  we  come  down  to  the  time  when  the  committee  made  up  its 
budget,  we  had  raised,  of  the  quota  of  $4,800,000,  $1,300,000  and 
spent  it.  We  had  on  hand  on  June  14  $196,000,  but  the  budget  was 
not  made  up  until  the  1st  of  July.  That  is  why  I  got  on  my  feet 
the  other  day  to  say  that  the  money  that  was  spent  between  June  14 
and  July  1  is  not  in  the  budget.  We  expended  during  those  davs, 
June  14  and  July  1,  $168,000,  or  practically  $170,000.  So  we  had 
$196,000,  and  that  left  us  $26,000  or  $28,000,  really,  in  net  money  at 
the  time  the  budget  was  made  up;  and  the  budget  is  the  time  the 
national  campaign  started.  Now,  on  July  1  the  national  committee 
handed  to  the  treasurer  a  budget  of  $3,079,000,  and  my  job  is  to  raise 
that  $3,079,000,  From  June  14  to  August  26,  as  was  shown  in  my 
testimony  the  other  day,  I  had  raised  for  the  national  committee,  or 
my  organization  had,  $600,000.  I  am  just  using  the  large  figures, 
so  that  it  is  easy  to  get  at. 

Senator  Spencer.  Round  numbers? 

Mr.  Upham.  Round  numbers;  and  had  raised  and  sent  to  the 
States  $400,000.  It  was  $390,000  and  some  odd  thousand,  but  I  put 
it  at  $400,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is,  in  addition  to  the  others? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2131 


Mr.  Upham.  Xo.    This  is  from  June  14  to  August  26.    In  the  first 
$1,000,000— my  stcatement  showed  $1,017,000. 
Senator  Spencer.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  Of  that  first  $1,000,000  the  national  committee  got 
$600,000  and  the  States  got  $400,000.  Since  that  time— that  is,  since 
this  date,  when  I  testified  the  other  da^^ — up  until  now  we  have  col- 
lected $250,000  more,  right  up  to  the  minute,  now;  that  is,  up  to 
yesterda3\ 

Senator  Pomerene.  Give  me  that  again.    You  collected  

Mr.  Upham.  $250,000  additional.  I  have  not  separated  that  as  to 
National  and  State,  but  it  is  the  same  proportion;  so  that  we  have 
raised  $1,250,000  since  the  convention.  Now,  I  have  got  $850,000, 
IDractically,  raised  for  the  national  committee  already  on  their  $3,079,- 
000.  I  have  got  practicallv  that,  so  that  I  have  got  to  raise  yet  for 
the  national  committee  $2a50,000,  with  that  $850,000,  which  it  is, 
roughly— $600,000  and  $250,000— on  the  $3,000,000.  I  have  raised 
already  for  the  States  and  paid  back,  as  my  statement  shows, 
$400,000.  I  estimated  raising  the  balance  of  this  money  that  the 
States  will  raise  for  themselves,  under  the  system  that  I  have  spread 
out,  $800,000. 

Senator  Edge.  While  you  get  the  balance  of  the  $3,000,000  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  For  the  national.  All  I  am  aiming  at,  and  all  I  am 
going  to  get,  is  the  $3,000,000.  I  am  using  the  figure  $3,000,000  in- 
stead of  $3,079,000,  but  you  understand  the  budget  is  $3,079,000.  I 
have  raised  already  for  the  States  $400,000,  and  in  raising  this  $2,- 
150,000  under  the  system  as  it  is  working,  the  States'  share  under  the 
arrangement  I  have  made  with  them  will  be  practically  $800,000.  So 
that  if  you  want  to  get  at  the  total  of  what  I  have  to  do — now,  I  have 
nothing  to  do  with  what  a  State  does  after  they  get  through  raising 
the  national  amount  in  connection  with  me.  When  they  get  through 
with  that  I  will  quit.  What  the  States  does  after  that  I  have  no  con- 
trol over.  I  have  no  control  over  what  the  State  does,  where  our 
arrangement  is  that  we  are  to  get  100  per  cent  of  what  is  raised.  That 
means  that  they  are  going  to  raise  their  own  money.  I  can  only  testify 
as  to  what  I  do.  Now,  the  money  I  will  handle — I  will  handle  three 
loans  for  the  budget  of  the  Republican  national  committee.  There 
will  pass  through  my  hands  $1,200,000  for  the  States  when  I  get 
through,  and  there  will  pass  through  my  hands  to  the  senatorial  com- 
commitee — that  is,  I  have  engaged  to  loan  them  $200,000,  which  will 
be  paid  back,  but  which  will  be  spent  for  the  campaign  

Senator  Pomerene.  For  Senators? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  and  I  am  under  contract  to  raise  for  the  con- 
gressional committee — that  is,  to  loan  the  congressional  committee 
$400,000. 

Senator  Spencer.  Will  that  be  paid  back? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  will  be  paid  back.  That  will  be  spent  for  the 
campaign.  It  will  pass  through  my  hands.  I  am  only  testifying  as 
treasurer  of  the  Eepublican  national  committee.  It  will  pass  through 
my  hands — including  the  senatorial  and  the  congressional — because 
if  we  loan  them  money,  they  have  got  to  pay  it  back.  But  they  pay 
us  to  help  elect  a  President  of  the  United  States  just  the  same.  The 
total  that  will  pass  through  my  hands  for  the  national  committee's 
use  will  be  $3,000,000.    For  the  States  it  will  be  $1,200,000  in  this 


2132 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPxUGN  EXPENSES. 


campaign ;  not  counting  anythino^  that  has  hap])ened  before  the  con- 
vention, you  understand.  Senator  Pomerene;  $200,000  for  the  sena- 
torial and  $400,000  for  the  congressional,  or  a  total  of  $4,800,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  $4,800,000? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  covers  the  congressional? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  senatorial  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  since  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Since  the  convention;  yes,  sir.  That  is  really  since 
the  budget  was  made  up. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Since  July  1  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  Of  course,'  there  was  $400,000 — well,  there  was 
very  little  raised  between  the  14th  day  of  June  and  the  1st  day  of 
July,  when  the  budget  was  made;  so  you  might  as  well  say  every- 
thing has  been  since  the  convention. 

Now,  I  would  like  to  say  this,  as  to  this  circular,  or  whatever  it  is 
called.  Form  101 :  Form  101  was  brought  out  by  my  telling  Mr. 
Blair,  either  during  the  convention  or  a  little  before  the  convention, 
that  when  we  started  the  campaign  after  the  convention  I  hoped  the 
lid  would  be  raised,  and  I  did,  and  I  advocated  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  hoped  the  lid  would  be  raised? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is,  I  hoped  that  the  $1,000  limit  would  be  raised 
to  a  higher  amount.  My  recommendation  was  $10,000.  He  pre- 
pared 101.  I  took  Mr.  Blair  to  New  York  with  me.  I  met  with 
the  finance  committee  of  the  Republican  national  committee.  Pres- 
ent at  that  committee  were  Chairman  Hays,  John  W.  Weeks,  Charles 
Hilles,  Tobe  Hert,  of  Kentucky,  and  your  man  from  Ohio,  Senator — 
Daugherty. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Harry  Daugherty? 

Mr.  Upham.  Harry  Daugherty,  Col.  William  Boyce  Thompson, 
and  myself.  Mr.  Blair  was  not  present  at  the  meeting.  I  advocated 
strongly  that  the  limit  be  raised  to  $10,000,  but  I  was  voted  down  by 
quite  a  large  majority.  Two  days  after  that  Col.  Thompson  was  in 
Washington  and  had  an  interview  with  the  candidate.  The  candi- 
date then  gave  to  the  Associated  Press  his  views  in  the  matter,  in 
which  he  stated  that  he  had  instructed  the  treasurer's  department  of 
the  Republican  national  committee  not  to  accept  any  contributions 
in  his  campaign  of  more  than  $1,000,  unless,  if  the  system  was 
changed,  the  public  be  notified  in  advance.  Of  course,  I  was  in 
favor.  Senator,  you  understand,  if  we  raised  the  limit,  of  making  it 
public,  ju'st  as  public  as  it  could  be,  and  stating  just  exactly  what 
we  were  going  to  do. 

Senator  Pot^ierene.  I  do  not  understand  your  statement,  really. 
Did  you  say  that  Mr.  Hays  or  Mr.  Thompson  had  given  out  that 
statement  that  way? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  said  the  candidate. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  the  candidate? 

Mr.  Upham.  The  candidate — Senator  Harding. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  was  Senator  Harding? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  This  meeting  in  New  York  was  about  the  26th 
or  27th  of  June.    He  gave  that  out  the  next  day  after  our  meeting. 


PKESIDEJ^TTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2133 


I  went  out  of  the  room  after  the  meeting,  after  the  plan — Upham's 
plan,  you  might  call  it,  if  you  want  to — had  been  disposed  of.  I 
did  not  draw  it  and  there  are  a  lot  of  things  I  would  not  have  writ- 
ten in  it,  that  I  think  are  not  what  they  should  be;  but,  anyway,  I 
went  out  of  that  room  and  I  told  Mr.  Blair  that  the  plan  of  cam- 
paign would  be  restricted  to  $1,000,  and  told  him  to  wire  his  men  in 

Chicago  not  to  send  out  the  plan.    Now,  I  have  never  considered  

The  Chairman.  About  when  w^as  that? 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  that  was  the  25th  or  26th  of  June — along  in 
there. 

The  Chairman.  Of  June? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  just  approximate  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  an  envelope  in  my  files  showing  the  exact  date, 
by  newspaper  clippings.    I  can  tell  you  the  exact  date. 
The  Chairman.  Was  it  before  July  6? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  absolutely.  Now,  I  have  never  seen  the  quota 
of  cities  and  I  have  never  drawn  a  quota  of  cities.  I  was  at  that 
luncheon  at  the  Union  League  Club.  No  quota  of  cities  was  submit- 
ted there.  That  plan  102  was  not  read  at  that  meeting  while  I  was 
there,  and  I  was  there  all  the  time. 

The  Chairman.  Plan  101,  you  mean? 
r.  UpHA^ki.  No ;  I  mean  102. 

The  Chairman.  The  substitute  for  101? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir;  101  was  dead  and  buried,  as  far  as  I  know. 
Senator  Pomerene.  At  what  meeting  do  you  mean? 
Mr.  Upham.  The  meeting  at  the  Union  League  Club. 
Senator  Pomerene.  The  so-called  Tower  Room  meeting? 
Mr.  Ui  HAM.  Yes.    It  was  in  what  is  known  as  the  Tower  Room — 
not  called  that  from' any  comparison  with  the  Tower  of  London. 
The  Chairman.  There  Avere  no  princes  there  and  no  executioners? 
Mr.  Upham.  No.    These  were  Y.  M.  C.  A.  w^orkers. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  let  us  go  on. 

Mr.  Upham.  This  plan  was  gotten  up  with  the  idea  of  making  the 
treasurer  work,  I  should  judge. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  it  was  a  success? 

Mr.  Upham.  Because  my  job  as  treasurer  would  be  the  easiest  job 
in  the  world  to  do  if  I  could  do  it  as  previous  treasurers  have  done. 
I  could  raise  this  money,  this  $3,000,000  for  the  national  committee, 
with  a  ver}^  few  days'  work.  But  Ave  have  gone  at  it  and  have  gotten 
over  37,000  subscriptions.  The  East  has  always  paid  the  bills  of  both 
parties.  Noaa-,  up  to  yesterday,  on  the  money  collected,  this  $1,249,- 
054,  the  East  has  only  contributed  $4-lS.()()(),  wlrile  the  farmers  out 
here  and  your  farmers  in  Ohio  and  oui's  in  Illinois  and  a  lot  of  tliem 
in  California  and  all  the  other  States  out  here  have  contributed 
$811,0v)0,  which,  I  think,  proves  that  this  system  decentralizes  the 
thing  and  takes  the  i)ower  aAvay  from  Wall  Street  that  we  haA^e  all 
been  Avorrying  about. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  complete  the  statement  you  desired  to 
make? 

Mr.  Upha:\i.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  questions? 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  no  questions. 


2134 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ITpHAM.  I  have  not  tried  to  talk  in  a  partisan  Avay.  I  have 
tried  to  make  just  a  plain  business  statement. 

Senator  PoMEKENE.  I  think  you  have  expressed  yourself  very 
clearly.  Now,  Mr.  Upham,  let  us  see  if  we  understand  one  another 
with  regard  to  the  funds  raised.  Up  to  the  closing  of  your  books — 
well,  from  December  1,  1918,  up  to  the  closing  of  your  books  June 
12,  1920  

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  total  receipts  were  $1,835,353.70? 
Mr.  Upham.  Treated  here  as  $1,800,000. 
Senator  Pomeeene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  $1,300,000  for  the  national  committee  and  $500,000  to 
the  States. 

Senator  Pomerene.  .  Yes ;  I  understood  you  to  state  that  you  were 
speaking  in  round  numbers. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  since  that  time  you  have  arranged  a 
quota  of  $3,071,000? 
Mr.  Upham.  $3,079,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  $3,079,000  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is,  the  national  committee  arranged  that. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  I  understand  that. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  is  in  addition  to  the  amount  which 
was  raised  and  expended  prior  to  J une  12  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  It  has  nothing  whatever  to  do  with  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  it  is  in  addition  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely.    That  money  went  over  the  dam. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Upham.  It  has  been  raised  and  spent. 

Senator  Pomerene,  Yes,  sir.  Now,  in  addition  to  that,  you  ex- 
pect to  raise  certain  funds  for  the  States  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  under  contract  to  do  it.  That  is,  we  have  joint 
arrangements,  all  of  which  I  have  testified  to  before. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  amount  is  $1,200,000? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is  w^hat  I  estimated  it  at.  I  have  gotten  in 
$400,000  already,  and  to  produce  the  rest.  I  estimate  we  will  get 
$800,000.    That  is  an  honest  statement. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  know,  but  I  want  to  get  the  statement  in  my 
own  way,  if  I  can. 

Mr.  Upham.  All  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  $1,200,000  is  in  addition  to  the 
$3,079,000? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  then  there  is  the  further  sum  of  $200,000 
for  the  senatorial  committee. 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is,  that  I  am  under  obligations  to  loan  them, 
and  they  promise  to  repay. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.    But  it  will  go  into  the  campaign  

Mr.  Upham.  Into  the  campaign,  whether  it  goes  through  me  or 
them. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  that  is  not  included  in  the  quota  of 
$3,079,000,  is  it? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2135 


Mr.  Upham.  No,  sir ;  no,  sir ;  not  a  penny  of  it. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Very  well.    Then  you  have  also  arranged  a 
loan  to  the  congressional  committee,  of  which  Dr.  Fess  is  chairman  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Of  $400,000? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  is  not  included  in  the  $3,079,000? 
Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  your  total  receipts  as  you  contemplate 
raising-  them  are  the  $1,835,353.70,  plus  what? 

Mr.  Upham.  No,  no.    That  was  before  the  convention. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understand  that.  I  am  getting  the  total 
amount  raised. 

Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  us  not  misunderstand  each  other,  and  we 
will  not,  when  I  get  through  with  this. 

Mr.  Upham.  You  are  trying  to  make  me  out  a  good  collector,  I 
see  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  sure  you  are  a  good  collector,  and  I  do 
not  need  any  proof  on  that  subject.  Now,  please  read  my  question, 
as  far  as  I  went. 

(Question  read  as  above  recorded.) 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  just  change  that  so  that  it  will  be  per- 
fectly clear.  I  will  ask  this  :  So  that  the  total  receipts  of  the  national 
committee  since  December  1,  1918,  will  be — now,  then,  that  one  mil- 
lion eight  hundred  and  thirty  thousand  and  odd  dollars? 

Mr.  Upham.  You  should  say  National  and  State  to  be  clear. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  well,  sir. 

Mr.  Upham.  $1,300,000  National  and  $500,000  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  Change  that  again.  I  want  to  get  that  in 
my  own  Avay,  and  there  will  be  no  trouble  between  you  and  me. 

Mr.  Upham.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  read  my  question  again,  please. 
(Question  read  as  above  recorded.) 

Senator  Pomerene.  Strike  that  out  and  let  me  put  my  question 
in  my  own  way,  and  not  be  interrupted,  and  I  think  we  will  get 
this  right. 

Mr.  Upham.  All  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  the  total  receipts  of  the  national  com- 
mittee since  December  1,  1918,  according  to  your  present  plans, 
raised  by  the  national  committee  for  National  and  State  purposes, 
will  be  $1,835,353.70,  plus  the  national  budget  of  $3,079,000— I  will 
put  those  in  exact  figures- — plus  $1,200,000  to  be  raised  for  the 
States  through  the  auspices  of  the  national  committee,  plus  $200,000 
for  the  senatorial  committee,  plus  $400,000  for  the  congressional 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely  correct;  from  December  1,  1918. 
Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  right  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  we  have  got  that  complete? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes ;  we  agree. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  Mr.  Upham,  you  this  morning 
have  been  very  frank  in  your  statement  about  the  monej^s  which  will 


2136 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAKiX  EXPENSES. 


be  raise(l  in  several  States  by  State  or  other  organizations  for  the 
benefit  of  the  Eepnblican  campaign  in  these  several  States.  And,  as 
I  understand  3^ou,  your  committee  is  not  in  any  wise  interfering 
with  any  financial  or  political  activities  on  the  part  of  the  respective 
State  organizations  in  any  of  these  States? 

Mr.  Upham.  We  have  charge  where  we  have  a  joint  arrangement. 
Where  we  have  no  joint  arrangement  the  States  are  paddling  their 
own  canoe  absolutely,  so  far  as  the  State  funds  are  concerned.  After 
we  raise  the  national  budget  we  will  discontinue  in  every  State 
raising  money  for  the  National  committee  or  for  a  State  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is,  you  mean  by  that  

Mr.  Upham.  If  a  State  committee  wants  to  go  on,  Senator,  it  is 
not  in  my  power,  as  treasurer  of  tlie  national  committee,  to  stop 
them. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Certainly. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  mean  that  your  nati(mal  committee 
will  suspend  its  financial  operation  in  the  collection  of  funds  after 
you  have  raised  the  amount  to  wliich  T  have  referred  in  a  previous 
question  ? 

Mr.  ITpiiA:.!.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  bej^ond  that  3^ou  assume  no  control  what- 
soever or  responsibilitv  for  anvthing  that  tlie  State  committee  shall 
do? 

Mr.  Upham.  For  themselves. 
Senator  Pomerene.  For  themselves? 
Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Poivierene.  And  if  your  representatives  are  going  to  othei 
States  and  are  thereby  increasing  quotas  so  as  to  raise  a  larger  sum 
of  money,  you  personally  deny  any  personal  responsibility  for  it? 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  I  will  answer  this  question  in  this  way :  I  don't 
knoAV  of  any  of  my  men  who  are  trying  to  exceed  the  budget  that  I 
gave  them.  I  think  that  they  have  increased  the  figures  in  the  hope 
of  getting  the  amount  I  have  asked  them  for. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  know,  but  now,  Mr.  Upham,  you  have 
})een  pretty  frank  this  morning  

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  going  to  be  frank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  you  are  

Mr.  IJpH  VTM.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene  (continuing).  And  you  haxe  been  pretty  well 
convinced  by  the  testimony  that  you  have  heard  here  during  the  last 
three  days  that  in  the  State  of  Ohio  they  are,  in  fact,  trying  to  raise 
a  much  larger  sum  than  the  quota  prescribed  for  the  State  by  the 
national  committee  for  National  and  State  purposes,  which  was 
$650,000. 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  the  total  raised  in  Ohio  up  to  the  26th  of — was 
$369,000. 

Senator  Poi^ierene.  Now,  answer  my  question. 
Mr.  Upham.  Well,  I  Avanted  to  show'you  how  I  got  it  figiu'ed  out  in 
my  own  mind. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Please  answer  my  question  as  I  put  it.  and  if 
you  desire  to  make  any  explanation  I  will  grant  you  that  privilege. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2137 


that  is  yours,  and  I  would  not  deprive  you  of  it.  Now  I  will  lun  e  the 
(|uestion  read  to  .you.   Please  read  the  question. 

Mr.  Fpham.  Yes;  I  would  like  to  have  it  read. 

(Question  read  by  the  reported  as  follows:) 

Senator  Pomekene.  And  yon  have  been  pretty  well  convinced  by  the  testimony 
that  yon  have  heard  here  during  the  last  three  days  that  in  the  State  of  Ohio 
they  are,  in  fact,  trying  to  raise  a  much  larger  sum  than  the  quota  prescribed  for 
the  State  by  the  national  committee  for  National  and  State  purposes,  which  was 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  you  can  answer  that  yes  or  no. 

Mr.  X"pha:m.  The  ({uota-  

Senator  Pomerene.  And  then  go  on  with  your  explanation. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes.  The  quota  as  read  by  Kelley  and  testified  to  on 
yesterday — if  he  collected  all  the  money  that  he  has  spread  in  Ohio 
he  would  collect  a  million  and  a  quarter  dollars,  Avouldn't  he  ?  And 
T  have  only  asked  him  for  $650,000. 

Senator 'Po.MEKEXK.  Yes:  $1,800,000. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  Now,  Mr.  Kelley  is  your  representative? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Fred  Miller  is  your  representative  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes:  and  Mr.  Wolfe. 
Senatoi-  Pomekexe.  Mr.  Wolfe  is  your  representative? 
Mr.  I'pham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  this  Mr.  Protzman? 
Mr.  Upha:m.  AYell,  I  would  call  him  Kelley's  representative. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Kelley's  representative? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes:  because  he  reports  to  Kelley. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes:  and  you  heard  the  testimony  as  to  their 
activities  in  Ohio  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  didn't  hear  Mr.  Protzman's  testimony. 
Senator  Pomerene.  No  ;  he  has  not  testified. 
Mr.  Upham.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  you  have  heard  their  activities  testified 
about? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  you  also  know  that  in  the  State  of 
Michigan  practically  the  same  course  has  been  pursued,  and  the  rep- 
resentatives of  your  committee,  for  some  purpose  or  other,  have 
increased  the  quota  to  be  raised  in  the  State  of  Michigan  for  national 
and  State  purposes  by  at  least  50  per  cent  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  on  paper.  I  doubt  very  much  if  Michigan 
raises  the  quota  assigned  by  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  know,  but  

Mr.  Upham  (interposing).  I  doubt  it  very  much.  I  think  Ohio 
will  raise  it,  and  they  may  go  on  and  increase  it  for  their  own  pur- 
poses. I  don't  know.  They  won't  give  me  any  more  money,  because 
I  won't  take  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  know  nothing  about  the  conditions 
in  the  seven  States  in  the  eastern  territory  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  certainly  do.  I  am  treasurer  of  the  committee. 
I  will  testify  to  anything  you  want  to  know  there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  didn't  you  or  somebody  testify  that  in 
seven  States  in  the  East  Mr.  Blaine  was  the  treasurer? 


2138 


PRESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  yes ;  but  you  understand,  Senator,  that  Mr.  Blaine 
is  my  subordinate. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  he  is? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Then  he  is  

Mr.  Upham  (interposing).  Yes;  I  am  responsible.  But  I  made 
the  comparison  between  those  seven  wealthy  States  and  the  Western 
States,  when  I  say  that  up  to  date  $438,000  came  from  sources  where 
the  money  usually  came  from,  while  we  raised  $811,000  out  in  this 
neck  of  the  woods. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  but  there  are  two  months  of  the  cam- 
paign yet  left,  or  about  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  responsible  for  what  is  done  in  those  States,  just 
the  same.  I  am  the  treasurer  of  the  committee,  and  the  money  is. 
all  coming  to  me.  The  moneys  that  go  into  New  York,  Senator — 
you  want  to  understand  the  system  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Certainly  I  want  to  understand  the  system. 

Mr.  Upham.  The  moneys  that  go  into  New  York  are  deposited  in 
a  New  York  bank,  and  they  are  reported  to  me  the  next  day,  and  the 
only  record  of  those  contributions  is  kept  here  in  Chicago  in  my 
office. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  All  that  they  did  was  to  turn  the  money  into  the 
bank  and  send  me  the  list. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  but  now,  Mr.  Upham  

Mr.  Upham  (interposing).  All  the  payments  are  made  to  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  but  wait  a  minute  now  until  we  get 
this  cleared  up.  I  think  we  will  understand  one  another  without 
any  trouble.  You  have  just  testified  to  your  hearing  some  rather 
convincing  statements  here  about  certain  of  your  men  joining  with 
certain  other  Republican  campaign  officials  in  other  States  and  their 
activities  in  raising  more  funds  than  were  contained  in  your  original 
quota. 

Mr.  Upham.  Because  they  asked  for  more  money. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  And  you  are  now  disclaiming  any  re- 
sponsibility for  that  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  said  positively  that  I  will  not  accept  from  any 
of  these  States  more  than  they  are  quotaed  for. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  know.  Well,  "  yes  "  answers  my  ques- 
tion. 

Mr.  Upham.  All  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  you  don't  mean  to  say  that  that 
same  condition  may  not  prevail  in  the  seven  States  in  that  eastern 
division  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  It  looks  very  doubtful  to  me. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Well  

Mr.  Upham.  We  quotaed  Connecticut  for  $150,000,  as  I  remember 
it.  Maybe  $75,000.  And  they  have  raised  $1,100. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  Mr.  Upham  

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  not  very  much  worried  about  Connecticut  ex- 
ceeding the  quota. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  all  know,  for  instance  New  York's  abiliity 
to  raise  funds,  whether  for  the  one  party  or  the  other. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2139 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  New  York  has  done  pretty  well  up  to  date. 
They  raised  $727,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVell,  that  is  not  answering  my  question,  and 
I  think  you  are  not  fair  with  me,  Mr.  Upham. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  want  to  be  fair. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  interject  your  answers  before  I  finish  my 
questions. 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  I  will  slow  up.  I  want  to  be  fair  with  you. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  knew  you  w^ould. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  want  to  be  just  as  courteous  to  you  as  you  are  to  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  want  to  try  to  be,  and  I  don't  think  we  will 
have  any  trouble. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene  is  always  courteous. 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  I  am  sometimes  not  always  in  the  coal  business, 
but  I  will  try  to  be  here. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  welL  we  will  get  along  very  nicely.  Now 
if  these  attempts  have  been  made  to  raise  more  money  in  Ohio  and 
Michigan  than  was  included  in  the  quotas,  about  wdiich  you  have  tes- 
tified, and  for  which  you  are  responsible  in  the  making,  that  same  rule 
may  be  followed  in  the  State  of  New  York,  may  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  each  of  the  States  of  the  Union  ?  I  say 
it  may  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  No  ;  because  I  know  of  a  lot  of  States  that  have  not 
done  it  that  way. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  know,  but  they  may  do  it,  nevertheless, 
in  the  future  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  yes ;  there  is  nothing  to  prevent  

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Upham  (continuing) .  The  State  committee  of  any  State  asking 
for  double  the  amount  I  ask  them  to  get,  in  the  hopes  of  getting  wdiat 
I  ask. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  a"nd  if  New  York,  or  the  people  there  who 
are  intensely  interested  in  the  election  of  Eepublican  presidential 
electors,  shall  be  of  the  opinion  that  they  ought  to  raise  for  that 
campaign  more  money  than  is  included  in  your  quota,  you  are  not  in- 
terfering with  it  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  would  not  interfere. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  would  not  have  anything  to  do  with  it. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  know  that. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  know  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is,  provided — as  I  understand  that  the  elector, 
under  some  ruling,  is  a  State  officer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  he  is. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  so  I  understand. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes,  sir ;  he  is  a  State  officer. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  asked  ^ew  York  for  a  certain  amount  for  the 
national  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  know  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  am  not  going  to  take  any  more  from  New  York. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  but  Mr.  Upham,  let  us  be  frank  with 
one  another  about  this. 


2140 


IMIKSIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  New  York  

^Senator  Po:vierexe.  Yes;  what  I  am  seeking  to  show  is  this,  and  1 

know  that  you  will  agree  with  me,  Mr.  Upham  

Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene  (continuing).  That  while  you  have  set  your 

limits  

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene  (continuing).  You,  as  a  frank  business  man, 
a  nian  of  public  affairs,  etc.,  know  that  that  is  not  necessarily  the 
limit  which  will  be  placed  upon  the  receipts  or  disbursements  which 
may  be  made  through  the  State  political  machinery  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Upham.  You  are  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now  I  think  we  understand  each  other  per- 
fectly. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  Mr.  Upham,  you  handed  in  here  this 
statement  of  the  receipts  of  the  committee. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Of  the  committee  ? 
Mr.  Upham.  Before  the  convention. 

Senator  Pomerene.  From  December  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  and  that 
purports  to  give  the  names  of  the  contributors,  show  the  amounts 
of  their  contributions,  their  post-office  addresses,  and  these  are  classi- 
fied by  States. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  think  they  are. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  told  my  audit  department  to  prepare  that  list.  I 
believe  that  is  an  honest  list.   I  will  swear  that  I  believe  it  is  honest. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is  all  that  I  can  do.  T  did  not  prepare  it  my- 
self, you  understand  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  But  you  have  not  in  this  exhibit  in- 
cluded all  of  the  totals  for  each  of  the  States  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  How  do  you  mean? 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is,  you  have  not  cast  up  the  amount  which 
was  raised  in  Arizona,  and  each  of  the  States  ? 

Mr.  Uppiam.  Well,  but  you  have  a  separate  statement  here. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  it  here  ?  [Indicating  statement.] 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes ;  that  is  the  total  as  given  there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now\  another  matter.  When  did  Mr.  Hays 
begin  his  activities  as  chairman  of  the  committee? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  think  about  an  hour  after  he  was  elected  he  tele- 
phoned me.  I  had  not  been  able  to  get  away  from  St.  Louis  when  he 
telephoned  me  and  wanted  to  know  if  1  could  not  start  to  raise  some 
rfioney. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  we  all  admit  he  has  been  reasonably 
active. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  w^hat  was  the  date  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Why,  it  Avas  some  time  in  February,  1918.  He  was 
not  at  the— I  was  in  attendance  at  the  meeting  of  the  national  com- 
mittee at  St.  Louis. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2141 


Senator  Pomerene.  February,  1918  ? 

^Ir.  Upham.  February,  1918.  And  Mr.  Hays  was  elected  chair- 
man. Cornelius  Bliss  had  resigned  as  treasurer,  and  I  was  the  west- 
ern treasurer,  and  I  was  elected  treasurer  of  the  committee.  While 
I  was  western  treasurer  I  was  a  subordinate  and  reported  to  Mr. 
Bliss.  Mr.  Blaine  is  the  eastern  treasurer,  and  is  my  subordinate, 
and  reports  to  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  immediately  after  his  election,  which  was 
within  an  hour's  time,  he  began  to  devise  ways  and  means  to  raise 
funds  Avith  the  vieAv  to  advancing  the  prospects  for  the  election  of  the 
presidential  ticket  this  fall  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  no;  what  he  said  to  me  was  that  we  had  a  real 
man's  job  on  our  hands  in  electing  a  House  and  Senate  last  fall. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  wlien  did  you  begin  the  campaign  then  for  the 
presidential  election  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  should  say  that  all  of  it  was  building  up  to  the  elec- 
tion of  a  President,  from  as  soon  as  we  finished  up  the  job  of  electing 
a  Senate  and  a  House. 

Senator  Potvierene.  Well,  you  have  been  staying  on  the  job  ever 
since  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  you  show  here  tliat  contributions — 
among  your  receipts — contributions  received  for  States  where  joint 
working  arrangement  is  had,  $469,456.21. 

Mr.  UpHA^kL.  That  was  all  returned. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  let  us  understand  that  a  little  more 
clearly.  Did  you  return  to  each  State  the  amount  which  was  raised 
in  that  State  for  that  purpose,  and  nothing  more? 

Mr.  Upham.  My  statement  shows  there  exactly  w^hat  was  returned. 
I  think  you  will  find  some  in  red  where  Ave  deliA^ered  

Senator  Po:\eerene.  Oh ;  I  haven't  had  time  to  go  oA^er  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  Does  it  shoAV  red  figures  there  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes:  it  does. 

]Mr.  I  tham.  Well,  in  red  is  Avhere  the  fellow  overdreAV  his  account, 
in  banking  terms. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  did  you  return  to  any  of  these  other 
States  more  money  than  you  collected  in  those  States? 

]\ir.  I'pHAM.  No,  sir.  The  red  figures  shoAv  Avhere  they  got  more 
mone}'  than  the}^  Avere  entitled  to. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  well.  Noav,  you  liaA^e  one  item  here 
among  your  disbursements  for  publicity,  speakers,  headquarters,  and 
generaf  expenses,  $1,171,101.99.  In  other  words,  that  sum  is  ex- 
pended, so  far  as  this  statement  shows,  for  four  s]:)ecific  purposes. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Poi^ierene.  First,  publicity. 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  of  course,  "  general  expenses  "  is  a  pretty  broad 
item. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  realize  that. 
Mr.  Upham.  Y^es. 

Senator  Poivierene.  But  I  haA^e  not  finished  my  question. 
Mr.  Upham.  Very  Avell,  Senator. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Second,  speakers;  third,  headquarters;  and 
fourth,  general  expenses. 

1 82774— 20— I'T  lo  4 


2142 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Poimerene.  What  did  you  inckide  under  the  title  "  pub- 
licity "  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  anything  the  chairman  told  me  to.  I  don't 
know.  I  was  asked  a  moment  ago  about  speakers.  Well,  publicity — 
any  of  these  documents  that  were  sent  out  by  the  national  com- 
mittee, a  great  many  thousand,  hundreds  of  thousands,  I  suppose. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  then,  the  only  knowledge  you  have  on 
that  subject  

Mr.  Upham.  None  of  my  speeches  were  sent  out.  I  didn't  make 
any. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  think  you  are  a  pretty  good  speaker. 
So  far  as  your  knowledge  goes,  then — I  am  speaking  generally,  of 
course — you  only  know  what  these  vouchers  show? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  is  all  I  know.  I  have  a  voucher  for  every  ex- 
penditure. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  they  would  come  to  you  with  the  O.  K., 
I  take  it,  of  Mr.  Hays? 

Mr.  Upham.  Or  the  head  of  a  department. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Or  the  what  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Or  the  head  of  a  department.  Mr.  Scott  Bone  would 
have  to  O.  K.  the  publicity  items. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes;  and  when  it  came  you  issued  the  check? 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  again,  you  include  in  this  item  expendi- 
tures for  speakers. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  don't  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVhat  was  the  amount  expended  for  speakers? 
Mr.  Upham.  I  couldn't  tell  you. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  was  the  character  of  these  speakers?' 

Mr.  Upham.  Of  course,  I  have  nothing  to  do  with  the  management 
of  the  party's  affairs.  I  do  know  that  we  w^ould  carry  an  account 
called  the  Chautauqua  account,  which  I  understand  is  to  pay  speak- 
ers to  attend  Chautauqua  meetings  and  spread  Eepublican  gospel. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  can  furnish  to  this  committee,  I 
take  it,  the  .amount  of  money  which  was  expended  for  speaking 
through  the  Chautauqua  circles? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  names  of  your  speakers  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  No,  sir;  oh,  well,  the  only  thing  I  could  do  would  be 
to  go  through  the  vouchers  and  get  the— we  do  not  keep  a  list.  The 
treasurer's  department  has  an  account.   You  would  have  to  

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  has  the  list  of  these  speakers? 

Mr.  Upham.  Mr.  Ellis ;  Dr.  Ellis. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  who  makes  the  arrangement  with  the  dif- 
ferent Chautauqua  circles? 

Mr.  Upham.  That  I  could  not  tell  you. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  the  furnishing  of  these  speakers? 

Mr.  Upham.  It  is  under  the  direction  of  Dr.  Ellis. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  how  many  of  these  speakers  were  there? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  no  idea  in  the  world. 

Senator  Poj^ierene.  Well,  can  you  give  us  now  the  amount  which 
you  expended  for  Chautauqua  speakers  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2143 


Mr.  Upham.  I  can  get  the  amount  in  a  very  few  minutes,  by  tele- 
phone, if  you  would  like  to  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  will  ask  you  to  remember  that  and 
furnish  it  a  little  later,  if  you  will,  please. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  I  will  make  a  memorandum  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  did  you  begin  your  propaganda- through 
Chautauqua  circles,  Mr.  Upham  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  don't  know.  I  had  nothing  whatever  to  do  with  it 
excepting  paying  the  bills. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  the  public  informed  that  the  expenses 
of  these  speakers  were  being  paid;  that  is,  the  expenses  and  salaries 
of  these  speakers  were  being  paid  by  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  don't  know.  That  is  not  part  of  my  job,  and  I 
really  don't  know.  If  I  did  know,  I  would  tell  you.  Senator.  I  have 
been  pretty  busy  in  another  department. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  Imow  you  are  a  busy  man. 

The  Chahiman.  You  don't  make  any  Chautauqua  speeches  your- 
self 

Mr.  Upham.  Xo,  sir ;  and  I  haven't  listened  to  any. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  no  knowledge  that  the  audiences 
which  were  addressed  by  these  speakers  were  advised  in  advance  that 
they  were  being  provided  by  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  could  not  know  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Haj^s,  I  believe,  issued  letters  to  Republi- 
cans urging  them  to  get  Republican  orators  and  Republican  speakers 
to  get  assignments  for  themselves  in  the  Chautauqua  circles,  did 
he  not  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Not  to  my  knowledge.  He  did  if  he  thought  it  was 
a  good  thing. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Why,  of  course  he  would. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  couldn't  have  done  any  raising  of  money  if  I  had 
tried  to  follow  Will  Hays. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Upham,  there  have  been  some  prominent 
Democrats  on  the  Chautauqua  platform  in  the  last  few  years? 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  not  paid  by  the  Democratic  treasurer.  I 
think  they  would  not  have  gotten  their  fees  if  they  had  had  to  depend 
upon  the  national  treasurer. 

Mr.  Upham.  All  I  have  got.  Senator,  is  a  voucher  for  every  dollar 
I  have  spent. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  sure  you  have. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  think  you  believe  I  am  a  good  enough  business  man 
for  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  sure  you  are. 

Mr.  Upham.  And  my  accounts  are  audited  just  the  same  as  the 
accounts  of  the  Consumers'  Co.  Anybody  that  handles  money  for 
me  is  under  a  heavy  bond,  too,  by  a  bonding  company.  I  don't  bond 
myself ;  I  can  trust  the  treasurer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  sure  you  are  entirely  protected.  I  wish 
you  would  give  me  a  statement  of  the  amount  of  the  proportion  of 
this  $1,171,101.99  which  was  expended  for  publicity. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  will  do  that.    Publicity  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  I  will  also  ask  you  to  state  the  amount 
that  was  expended  for  speakers. 


2144 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  I  have  got  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  amount  for  headquarters. 
Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  amount  which  is  designated  here  as 
general  expenses."  And  if  your  books  show — of  course,  I  will  not 
ask  you  to  go  over  your  A^ouchers,  but  if,  under  your  method  of  book- 
keeping, that  is  subdivided  in  some  way,  I  wish  you  would  give  us 
the  subheads.  And  when  it  comes  to  the  matter  of  speakers,  if  your 
books  will  show  the  amount  which  was  paid  by  way  of  expense  and 
the  amount  which  was  paid  by  way  of  salary.  I  would  like  you  to 
show  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  It  would  not  show  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  well.   I  won't  ask  you  to  show  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  The  onh^  way  we  could  get  at  that  would  be  to  take 
up  the  vouchers,  which  would  be  a  pretty  big  job. 

Senator  Pomerene.  T  won't  ask  you  to  do  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  have  got  a  voucher  for  every  dollar  that  was  ex- 
pended. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  Those  vouchers  are  filed  by  dates,  and  not  by  de- 
partments.  I  have  a  voucher  for  every  dollar  expended. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  my  questions  thus  far  as  to  these 
several  items  of  expense  embrace  the  period  from  December  1,  1919, 
up  to  June  12,  1920. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  will  you  give  me  the  same  figures  on 
those  same  subjects  since  that' date — June  12.  No;  that  is  not  right, 
is  it? 

Mr.  Upha^i.  Do  you  want  

Senator  Pomerene.  You  did  as  to  receipts,  but  you  give  it  before 
as  to  the  expenditures? 

Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  no ;  I  have  never  given  any.  Is  that  fair  to  ask 
for  during  the  campaign,  as  to  what  we  have  spent  for  speakers  or 
publicity  in  this  campaign  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  yes ;  sure. 

Mr.  Upham.  Well,  I  am  just  asking  you.  I  am  a  plain  business 
man. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  are  authorized  to  go  into  that.  We  are 
not  asking  anything  that  we  are  not  authorized  to  go  into.  We  can 
go  into  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  mean,  is  that  fair  politics — that  is  all. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Why  not  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  This  other,  which  is  before  the  time  of  the  convention, 
leading  up  to  the  convention,  that  is  not  the  campaign :  but  here  we 
are  in  the  midst  of  the  campaign.  It  seems  to  me  we  have  given  the 
enemy  a  lot  of  information. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  can  get  it  from  the  other  side  just 
as  Avell ;  and,  so  far  as  they  are  concerned,  you  are  welcome  to  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  You  understand,  I  am  going  to  do  what  you  gentle- 
men ask  me  to  do ;  but  I  am  talking  as  man  to  man. 

Mr.  Moore.  Senator,  I  don't -want  to  be  impertinent,  but  I  would 
just  like  to  make  this  suggestion :  I  don't  believe  it  is  fair.  Now,  we 
have  raised  very  little  money,  ourselves;  of  course,  we  haven't  done 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2145 

much  of  that — not  anywhere  near  as  much  as  they  have — but  1  don't 
believe,  as  Mr.  Upham  says,  that  it  is  fair  to  the  Republican  Party 
to  ask  him  to  tell  that. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  We  are  treating  both  sides  alike,  and  I,  as  a 
member  of  the  committee,  ask  him  for  it.  T  may  be  overruled  in  my 
request,  but  I  am  asking  for  it. 

Mr.  TJpHAM.  I  will  bring  it. 

The  CHAimiAN.  It  is  a  question  for  the  committee.  If  you  say  to 
Senator  Pomerene  that  you  won't  do  it— if  he  tliinks  it  is  fair,  we  will 
put  it  up  to  him. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  will  bring  him  anything  he  asks  me  for,  but  I  was 
just  expressing  this  question  as  between  man  and  man. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  The  question  has  just  been  raised  here  as  to 
whether  we  have  the  right  to  do  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  not  by  me;  I  didn't  raise  that  question.  Senator. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  This  resolution  under  which  we  are  acting  is 
very  comprehensive. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  no  question  about  that. 

Mr.  Upham.  You  don't  understand  that  I  raised  that  (|uestion, 
do  you.  Senator  ? 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Xo;  but  you  put  the  ([uestion  as  to  whether  it 
was  fair. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  I  am  not  asking  you  anything  that  we  can  not 
ask  of  the  other  side.  I  have  no  apologies  to  make  for  the  compre- 
hensiveness of  this  resolution. 

Mr.  I^pham.  Well,  if  this  conniiittee  asks  me  for  ever}^  voucher  and 
every  receipt,  I  will  bring  it. 

Senator  Pomeeenk.  Very  well.    I  will  abide  by  the  result. 

Mr.  I>ham.  I  have  tried  to  be  as  frank  as  I  know  how. 

The  Chaieman.  AA'hat  is  the  question? 

Mr.  Upham.  There  is  no  question.  He  has  asked  me  to  produce 
this,  and  we  are  both  agreed  that  I  am  to  produce  it,  so,  as  far  as  I 
am  concerned  

The  Chaieman.  That  is,  to  produce  what? 

Senator  Pomeeene.  The  items  of  publicity,  speakers,  headquarters, 
and  general  expenses. 

The  Chaieman.  Do  you  mean  as  he  has  expended  it  here? 
Senator  Pomeeene.  Yes ;  since  June  12,  1920. 

The  Chaieman.  What  is  there  about  that,  Mr.  Upham,  that  is 
particularly  unfair?  He  doesn't  ask  you  for  specific  details,  but  ]ust 
the  amount. 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  he  has  asked  for  how  much  the  committee  has 
spent  for  publicity  since  it  has  started  this  campaign,  and  how  much 
the  committee  has  spent  for  headquarters  since  it  has  started  this 
campaign,  and  how  much  it  has  spent  for  speakers.  Now,  I  should 
think  it  would  be  quite  valuable  to  the  enemy  to  know  just  how  far 
we  have  gone  on  that  matter.  I  think  Will  IJays  would  like  to  know 
just  what  the  Democratic  plan  is,  and  how  much  they  have  spent. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Well,  let  me  say  to  you,  Mr.  Upham :  Perhaps 
I  have  got  a  different  idea  of  this  matter  of  public  politics  than  some. 
In  my  judgment  if  any  speaker  is  going  out  in  the  Republican  cause, 
or  the  Democratic  cause,  at  so  much  per  diem,  his  hearers  have  got  a 
right  to  know  that  fact. 


2146 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Upham.  Well,  you  know  why  I  asked  the  question? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Why,  of  course,  I  know  why  you  asked  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  asked  it  as  one  gentleman  asks  another. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  recognize  that,  and  I  am  not  finding  any  fault 
with  you  personally  in  the  matter. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes;  I  am  the  bookkeeper  and  the  collector — that 
is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  have  not  asked  for  the  details,  although 
I  could  go  on  and  ask  that  if  I  wished.  But  I  will  leave  that  for 
the  committee  to  determine. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  I  see  no  objection  to  him  giving  that.  Will 
you  give  him  that  general  information  that  he  asks,  Mr.  Upham,  if 
you  have  it? 

Mr.  Upham.  Very  well ;  I  will  give  it  to  him. 

Senator  Spencer.  It  is  perfectly  within  our  poAver  to  ask  for  that. 
Mr.  Upham.  Oh,  yes;  it  is  within  your  power  to  ask  for  that. 
Senator  Spencer.  Yes ;  it  is  within  our  power  to  ask  for  that. 
Mr.  Upham.  Of  course,  it  has  all  got  to  be  filed  some  time  any- 
way. 

Senator  Spencer.  Yes. 

Mr.  Upham.  I  filed  at  the  end  of  the  congressional  campaign  a 
report  of  every  dollar  which  was  received,  who  it  was  received  from, 
and  every  voucher  issued,  and  who  it  was  issued  to. 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  ask  you  a  question  in  connection  

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  let  me  ask  a  question.  I  am  about 
through.  I  recognize  the  fact  that  a  good  many  of  these  speakers  can 
not  afford  to  pay  their  expenses,  etc.,  and  I  find  no  fault  with  that, 
but  when  they  are  paid  for  their  services  the  public  ought  to  know  it. 

Mr.  Upham.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Upham. 
Senator  Reed.  There  are  some  exhibits. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Upham,  just  one  moment.  I  don't  believe 
these  exhibits  which  you  presented  have  been  formally  entered  in  the 
record.  Let  the  record  show  this :  I  offer  for  the  record  the  itemized 
statement  of  the  contributions  from  December  1,  1918,  to  June  12, 
1920,  which  has  been  presented  by  Mr.  Upham,  as  Upham  Exhibit  A 
of  this  date. 

(Upham  Exhibit  A  is  attached  hereto.) 

Upham  Exhibit  A  of  September  10,  1920. 

Contributions  to  Republican  national  committee,  Jan.  1,  1919,  to 

June  12,  1920  $1,  342,  422.  49 

Also  including:  contributions  for  State  committees  where  joint 
working  arrangement  is  had  with  them,  Jan.  1,  1919,  to  June 
12,    1920   469,  456.  21 

[Note. — By  order  of  the  committee,  the  names  of  all  contributors  less  than 
$100  were  not  printed. — Printing  Clerk.] 

RepuUican  national  committee — Treasurer's  offlce — Detailed  statement  of  re- 
ceipts. 

ARKANSAS. 

Mar.  2,  1920: 

C.  H.  Harding.  Fort  Smith 

K.  B.  Campbell,  Helena  

C.  C.  Gunnels,  Little  Rock 


$100.  00 
125.  00 
100.  00 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2147 

Mar.  2,  1920— Continued. 

A.  C.  Remmel,  Little  Rock   $100.  00 

H.  L.  Remmel,  Little  Rock  •     500.  00 

Jacob  Shaiil,  Marlanna   100.00 

A.  W.  Campbell,  Scotts   100.  00 

A.  J.  Russell,  Berryville   100.  00 

T.  S.  Grayson,  Magnolia   100.00 

O.  C.  Harris,  Morrillton   100.00 

J.  H.  Butler,  Van  Buren   100.00 

A.  A.  Tindall,  Stuttgart   100.00 

Oak  H.  Rhodes   250,00 

Mar.  20,  1920  : 

J.  K.  Jones,  Harrison   100.00 

R.  L.  Granger,  Harrison   100.00 

John  I.  AVorthington,  Harrison   100.  00 

Dr.  J.  L.  Sims,  Harrison   100.  00 

H.  C.  Wade,  Batesville,  Independence  County   100.00 

Apr.  1.  1920: 

Cos.  Altenbert,  Little  Rock   100.00 

G.  E.  Owen,  Conway,  Faulkner  County   100.00 

R.  E.  Lee  Wilson,  Wilson   100.00 

Apr.  3,  1920: 

T.  J.  Sharum,  Walnut  Ridge   100.  00 

W.  J.  Jefferies,  Clarendon   100.  00 

Frank  AVeldin,  Piggott   173.75 

Apr.  16,  1920: 

Charles  N.  Rix,  Hot  Springs   125.  00 

Apr.  24,  1920 : 

J.  C.  Russell,  Berryville  (various  small  sums)   145.50 

F.  W.  Tucker,  Clover  Bend   100.  00 

Luxor  Lumber  Co..  Luxor   117.  50 

R.  W.  Fullerton,  Warren   100.  00 

J.  A.  Purdue,  Pine  Bluff   100.00 

Benjamin  Emmons,  Brinkley   100.  00 

W.  W.  Moore,  Jasper   200.  00 

George  L.  Mallory,  Little  Rock   100.  00 

Guy  W.  Caron,  Little  Rock   100.  00 

R.  Carnahan,  Pine  Bluff   100.  00 

May  1,  1920 : 

C.  W.  Gates,  Fordyce   250.00 

E.  W.  Gates.  Crossett   100.  00 

B.  F.  Thompson,  Little  Rock   100.  00 

J.  F.  Butler,  Warren   100.  00 

O.  O.  Axley,  Warren   100.00 

W.  D.  Foster,  Gravette   100.  00 

Robert  E.  Fuhr,  Paragould   150.00 

H.  C.  Wade,  Batesville   112.50 

W.  S.  Hubble,  Newport   312.50 

E.  B.  Ray,  Carlisle   275.  00 

R.  B.  Campbell,  Helena   375.  00 

C.  R.  French,  Harrisburg   180.  00 

V.  W.  Jackson.  Russellville   145.00 

Lincoln  Republican  League,  Little  Rock   500.  00 

B.  F.  Campbell,  Fayetteville   200.00 

O.  J.  Harkey,  Ola   400.  00 

C.  N.  Rix,  Hot  Springs   125.  00 

May  8,  1920 : 

H.  B.  Allen  Sickle,  Stuttgart   100.00 

Charles  T.  Abeles,  Little  Rock  1   100.  00 

June  6,  1920 : 

D.  F.  Taylor  and  S.  E.  Simonson,  Osceola   121.  00 

H.  L.  Remmel,  Newport   100.00 

A.  C.  Rfemmel,  Little  Rock   200.  00 

J.  A.  Ginocchio,  Little  Rock   200.  00 


2148  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

CALIFORNIA. 

Mixr.  2,  1920: 

G.  A.  Huffaker,  Van  Nuys   $100.00 

W.  P.  Whitsett,  Van  Nuys   100.  QQ 

O.  B.  Hnble,  Vim 'Nuys   100.00 

Lewis  E.  Bliss,  Van  Nuys   100.  00 

F.  J.  Dottentlialer,  Van  Nuys   100.  00 

A.  J.  Crookshank,  Santa  Ana   12.5.  00 

Dr.  C.  D.  Ball,  Santa  Ana   100.  00 

George  I-  Cochran.  Los  Angeles,  Cor.  6th  &  Olive   250.  00 

.John  B.  Miller,  Los  Angeles,  Edison  Electrical  Co   250.  00 

Mar.  8,  1920: 

H.  .Tevne,  6th  &  Broadway.  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

•    Loren  D.  Sale,  381  S.  Ardmore  St.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

S.  Edwin  Sullivan,  1769  El  Cerrito  PL,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

L.  Schiff,  434  Lorraine  Blvd.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

'  Mrs.  Rose  W.  Baruch.  1407  S.  Figuero  St.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

I>r.  Wi'Jter  Lindley,  Los  Angeles,  1414  S.  Hope  St   100.00 

Jos.  F.  Sartori.  Los  Angeles,  Securitv  Trust  &  Sav.  Bank   3(X).  00 

Mar.  9,  1920: 

Thomas  Maclay,  D  &  6th  Sts.,  Petaluma   100.  00 

H.  B.  Highbee,  758  D  Street,  Petaluma   100.  00 

J.  W.  Elder,  A.  &  6th  Sts..  Petaluma   100.  00 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

Dr.  AValter  Lindley,- 1414  S.  Hope  St.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

Jos.  F.  Sartori,  Security  Trust  &  Sav.  Bk..  Los  Angeles   300.  00 

John  H.  Rosseter,  San  Francisco   1,  250.  00 

Mrs.  ,Tohn  H.  Rosseter.  San  Francisco   1,  250.  00 

Wm.  C.  Van  Antwerp,  San  Francisco   1.000.00 

Mar.  18,  1920: 

M.  Elsasser.  626  Security  Bldg.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

W.  J.  Pearson,  620  Haas  Bldg.,  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

J.  G.  Bullock.  7th  &  Bdwy.,  Los  Angeles   KK).  00 

Mar.  23,  1920: 

Mr.  Daniel  (;.  Jacknian.  Hobart  Bldg.,  San  Francisco  (also  25 

Broad  St.,  New  York  Cit.v  )   1,000.00 

R.  J.  Hnnna.  Standard  Oil  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.  (K) 

H.  M.  Storey,  Standard  Oil  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

K.  R.  Kingsbury,  Standard  Oil  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

Sidney  M.  Ehrnian,  713  Nevada  Bank  Bldg.,  San  Froncisco   500.  00 

A.  Mack,  350  Mi  ls  Bldg.,  San  Francisco  -  100.00 

E.  J.  Pringle.  Mills  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

.     Leopold  Michels,  740  iMission  St.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

Oscar  Sutro,  Standard  Oil  Building,  San  Francisco   100.00 

John  S.  Cravens,  Los  Angeles  City   250.  00 

H.  J.  Evans,  Monrovia   100.00 

James  Irvine,  Tustin   250.  fMl 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

Richard  Heimann,  584  Mission  St.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

C.  W.  Smith,  35  Second  St.,  San  Francisco   200.  00 

C.  F.  Michaels,  42  First  St.,  San  Francisco   200.  00 

J.  J.  Mack,  351  Mills  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

E.  C.  Voorhies,  Humboldt  Bk.  B  dg.,  San  Francisco   100.  O'J 

J.  C.  Van  Eck,  343  Sansome  St.,  San  Francisco   250.  00 

H.  D.  Loveland,  Flood  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   350.  00 

E.  F.  Hutton,  409  California  St.,  San  Francisco  i   100.  00 

Grover  A.  IMagnin.  care  of  I.  Magnin  &  Co.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

Apr.  1,  1920: 

J.  G.  Hittinger,  Mission  Rd.  &  Haskell,  San  Fernando   100.  00 

F.  M.  AVrigiit,  San  Fernando   100.00 

Apr.  6,  1920: 

Benjamin  H.  Dibblee,  800  IMontgomery  St.  ,San  Francisco   100.00 

Messrs.  Girvin  &  INlillers,  Kohl  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

Apr.  13,  1920: 

W.  J.  Lorino-,  (^rockei-  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

Apr.  14,  1920: 

R.  J.  Taussig,  1521  Van  Ness  Ave.,  San  Francisco   2oO.  00 

Benjamin  Harwood,  Torrance   100.  00 


It- 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2149 

Apr.  19,  1920: 

Louis  Monteagle,  San  Francisco   $1,000.00 

C.  Frederick  Kohl,  Koli:  Bklg:.,  San  Francisco  '   100.  00 

Sutro  &  Co.,  410  Montgomery  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  Oa 

W.  G.  Aldenhagen,  444.  Market  St.,  San  Francisco   250.  00 

William  Kaufmann.  the  Emporium   100.00 

Apr.  21.  1920: 

E.  B.  Noble,  ITtli  &  Mississippi  St.,  San  Francisco   200.  00 

Warren  K.  Porter,  Sharon  Bldg.,  San  Francisco   100.00 

May  3,  1920 : 

C.  A.  Kimble,  Han  ford   .500.  00 

IMay  4,  1920 : 

Morris  Stulsaft.  647  Mission  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

H.  T.  Lally,  2nd  &  Tehama  Sts.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

R.  W.  Kinney,  586  Howard  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

Francis  J.  Baker.  599  Mission  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

Andrew  Dalziel,  556  Mission  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

Henry  Morris,  6th  &  Bluxome  Sts.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

C.  W.  Weld,  2nd  &.  Brannan  Sts.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

Alfred     Alexis  Ehrman,  2.30  California  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

G.  M.  Whitaker,  615  4th  St.,  San  Francisco   100.  00 

May  11,  1920: 

Thos.  Flint,  Hollister   101.50 

G.  H.  Umbsen,  2384  Pacific  Ave..  San  Francisco   500.  00 

K.  M.  Tobin,  Hibernia  Bank,  San  Francisco   250.00 

W.  A.  S.  Foster,  Willits   200.  00 

Mav  26.  1920 : 

J.  K.  Knowland,  Oakland   250.  00 

June  8,  1920: 

H.  W.  Frank,  437  So.  Spring  St.,  Los  Angeles   125.  00 

COLORADO. 

Mar.  27,  1920: 

Henry  McAllister,  jr.,  420  Equitable  Bldg.,  Denver   250.00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

C.   S.  Morey.   Sugar  Bldg.,   Denver   1,000.00 

Apr.  17,  1920: 

S.  N.  Hicks,  Bost(m  Bldg.,  Denver   500.00 

W.  H.  Leonard,  18th  &  Blake  Sts.,  Denver   500.00 

Apr.  27,  1920 : 

AV.  A.  Hover,  14th  &  Lawrence  Sts.,  Denver   250.00 

William  V.  Hodges,  14th  &  Lawi-ence  Sts.,  Denwr   250.  00 

Apr.  30,  1920 : 

Richard  Wensley,  18th  &  Blake  Sts.,  Denver   125.  00 

A.  D.  Lewis.  Denver   250.  00 

^fav  3.  1920: 

John  Evans,  Denver   250.00 

H.  Pvalph  Antonides,  509  1st  Nat.  Bank,  Denver   250.  00 

W.  Octave  Chanute,  Denver   100.  00 

Arthur  H.  Bosworth,  Denver   100.  00 

Gregg  Whitehead  &  Co.,  Denver   100.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

Buckeley  Wells,  Denver,  201  14th  St   1,  200.  00 

May  14,  1920 : 

C.  M.  MacNeill,  Colorado  Springs   9,000.00 

Mrs.  C.  M.  MacNeill,  Colorado  Springs   1,  000.  00 

May  19,  1920 : 

A.  E.  Carlton,  Colorado  Springs   5,000.00 

May  22,  1920 : 

J.  C.  Burger,  Denver,  Hamilton  Nat.  Bank   125.  00 

May  27,  1920 : 

C.  S.  Morey,  Denver   1,000.00 

Chas.  Boettcher,  Denver   1,000.00 

W.  L.  Petrikin,  Denver   1,000.00 

M.  D.  Thatcher,  Pueblo   1,000.00 

Horace  Havemeyer,  Denver,  129  Front  St.,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 


2150 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  28,  1920 : 

L.  Mack  Willcox,  Denver,  900  Penn  St   $500  00 

June  7,  1920 : 

Oliver  H.  Shoup,  Colorado  Springs,  Exchange  Nat'l  Bank   1,  000.  00 

FLORIDA. 

May  21,  1920 : 

W.  H.  Nortlmp,  Pensacola,  American  National  Bank   100.00 

P.  P.  Miller,  DeFuniak  Springs,  Cawtlion  State  Bank   100.  00 

GEOEGIA. 

Feb.  21,  1920 : 

0.  W.  McClure,  Atlanta,  65  Whitehall  St   100.  00 

J.  W.  Martin,  Atlanta,  132  Asliby  St.  W.  E   100.  00 

D.  O.  Newton,  Claxton   125.  00 

Feb.  28,  1920 : 

D.  C.  Sorrels,  Monroe   100.00 

Mar.  13,  1920 : 

Chas.  J.  Moore,  Atlanta,  Central  Bldg  ,   100.  00 

Apr.  3,  1920: 

,T.  T.  Johnson,  Athens   101  00 

May  22,  1920 : 

H.  G.  Hastings,  Atlanta   .500.  00 

G.  E.  Ricker,  Fitzgerald   100.  00 

C.  W.  McClure,  Atlanta   100.00 

May  28,  1920  : 

R.  N.  Berrien,  Atlanta,  4th  Nat.  Bank  Bldg   250.  00 

IDAHO. 

Apr.  17,  1920 : 

C.  C.  Wilson,  Idaho  Falls   100.00 

Apr.  19,  1920 : 

Alma  Hanson,  Teton  County   138. 10 

Apr.  24,  1920 : 

F.  R.  Gooding,  Gooding   250.00 

John  Thomas,  Gooding   100.  00 

INDIANA. 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

A.  PI.  Beardsley,  Elkhart   250.  00 

Apr.  27,  1920 : 

William  G.  Irwin,  Columbus   1,  000.  00 

May  8,  1920 : 

J.  R.  Johnson,  Hartford  City   100.  00 

B.  A.  VanWinlde,  Hartford  City   200.  00 

May  14,  1920 : 

A.  C.  Crimmel,  Hartford  City   100.  00 

IOWA. 

Mar.  6,  1920 : 

L.  D.  Collins,  Knoxville   250.00 

F.  P.  Woodrufe,  Knoxville   100.  00 

W.  O.  Finkbine,  703  Fleming  Bldg.,  Des  Moines   250.  00 

Trust  Thompson,  205  Hubbell  Bldg.,  Des  Moines   100.  00 

Mar.  15,  1920: 

Wm.  O.  Harbach,  Des  Moines,  300  So.  5th  St   100.  00 

Geo.  C.  Hargrove,  Des  Moines,  4th  &  New  York  Ave   100.  00 

W.  G.  Vander  Ploeg,  Knoxville,  Marion  Co   100.  00 

Jas.  B.  Weaver,  Des  Moines,  417  C.  N.  B.  Bldg   100.  00 

Mar.  22,  1920 : 

J.  L.  Sheuerman,  Des  Moines,  Polk  Co_-_   100.  00 

W.  P.  Adams,  Sac  City,  Sac  Co   2,  000.  00 

Mar.  26,  1920 : 

Donald  D.  McCall,  Perry,  1716  Willis  Ave   100.  00 

H.  M.  &  W.  H.  Pattee,  Perry,  First  National  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGI^  EXPENSES.  2151 

INIar.  29,  1920 : 

G.  D.  Ellyson,  Des  Moines,  1019  High  St   $100.00 

M.  G.  Linn,  Des  Moines.  8th  &  Locust   100.  00 

C.  S.  Brads'haw,  Des  Moines,  3700  Cottage  Grove  Ave   100.  00 

John  P.  Wallace,  Des  Moines,  H.  P.  Station   100.  00 

A.  L.  Hager,  Des  Moines,  C.  N.  B.  Bldg   100.  00 

S.  M.  Leach.  Atlel   100.  00 

Charles  Rhinehart,  Dallas  Center   100.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920 : 

Charles  H.  Martin,  Des  Moines   125.  00 

Alex  Fitzluigh,  Des  Moines   100.  00 

A.  O.  Hughe,  Des  Moines   250.  00 

Apr.  5,  1920 : 

Frank  P.  Flvnn.  Peoples  Savings  Bank,  Des  Moines   125.  00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

L.  H.  Kurtz,  Des  Moines  '.   125.00 

Apr.  17,  1920 : 

John  F.  Griffin,  Des  Moines,  7th  &  Grand  Ave   100.  00 

Apr.  26,  1920: 

O.  C.  Perrin.  Greene   100.00 

C.  W.  Soesbe,  Greene  ^   100.  00 

H.  W.  Wilhelms,  Parksburg   100.00 

J.  H.  Blair,  Des  Moines,  Iowa  Natl   100.00 

Harry  Blackburn.  Des  Moines,  3601  Grand  Ave   100.  00 

Clyde  E.  Brenton,  Des  Moines   100.  00 

John  A.  Cavanagh,  Des  Moines,  315  37th  St   2.50.  00 

Charles  R.  Cownie,  Des  Moines   250.  00 

N.  Frankel,  Des  Moines   100.00 

John  H.  Hogan,  Des  Moines,  3203  Ingersoll   250.  00 

Homer  A.  Miller,  Des  Moines   100.  00 

George  E.  Pearsall,  Des  Moines   100.  Ou 

F.  C.  Waterbury,  Des  Moines   100.  00 

John  A.  Fleming.  Des  Moines,  Fleming  Bldg    100.  (X) 

R.  J.  Fleming,  Des  Moines,  Fleming  Bldg   100.00 

Stanhope  Fleming,  Des  Moines,  Fleming  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  28.  1920: 

AV.  E.  Brice,  Mason  City,  510  1st  Nat'l  Bank   250.  00 

May  7,  1920: 

F.  E.  &  B.  C.  Keeler,  Mason  City,  19  W.  State   500.  00 

F.  C.  Hubbell.  Des  Moines,  Hubbell  Bldg   250.00 

May  10,  1920: 

W.  E.  Pearsall  (the  Utica  Co.),  Des  Moines   125.00 

May  14,  1920: 

W.  A.  Pollock,  Zearing   100.  00 

May  22,  1920 : 

C.  M.  Rich,  1221  Grand  Ave.,  Keokuk   250.  00 

June  5,  1920: 

C.  H.  McNider,  Mason  City,  1st  Natl.  Bank  of  M.  C   1,  000.  00 

E.  H.  Hoyt,  Manchester   150.00 

S.  W.  Klaus,  Earlville   150.00 

A.  D.  Long,  Manchester   100.00 

L.  Matthews,  Manchester   100.00 

June  10,  1920: 

F.  J.  Camp,  Des  Moines,  330  SW.  5th  St   100.  00 

M.  Rosenfield,  Des  Moines   150.00 

T.  I.  Stoner,  Des  Moines,  810  Walnut  St   100.  00 

ILLINOIS    (COOK  COUNTY). 

Mar.  1,  1920 : 

Frederick  R.  Vaux,  319  W.  Ontario  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

J.  A.  MacLenn,  1732  North  Kolmar  Ave.,  Chicago   100.00 

H.  Stillson  Hart,  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   100.00 

Edward  F.  Carry,  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   1,  2.50.  00 

Egbert  H.  Gold,  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

J.  J.  McCarthy,  535  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   125.  00 

D.  A.  Crawford.  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   150.  00 

F.  R.  Spear.  Railway  Exchange  Bldg.,  Chicago   100.  00 


2152 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mar  1,  1920— Coiitiimed. 

H.  M.  Byllesby,  208  S.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago  $1,  000.  00 

Robert  F.  Carr,  332  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Cliicago   250.  00 

George  R.  Carr,  332  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.00 

Chas.  H.  Worcester,  19  S.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Robert  J.  Thorne,  Montgomery  Ward  Co.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Conrad  H.  Oppenluisen,  11  S.  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   750.  00 

L.  S.  Tiffany,  125  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

S.  T.  A.  Loftis,  108  N.  State  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mil  r.  2,  1920  : 

F.  G.  Thearle,  31  N.  State  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

.1.  W.  Clark,  32  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Aimer  Coe,  105  N.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

C.  W.  Sherman,  208  So.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Joy  Morton,  80  E.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   1.  000.  00 

D.  A.  Rnggio,  2607  Flournoy  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Carl  Bauer,  2839  Logan  Blvd.,  Chicago   100.  00 

O.  Gullicksen,  2119  Churchill  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

A.  Arthur  Zangerle,  4650  Beacon  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

N.  M.  Green,  1500  N.  Halsted  St..  Chicago   100.  00 

Arial  ^Teinrath,  10  S.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Wan-en  Wright,  4100  Fillmore  St.,  Chicago   500.00 

James  C.  Cox,  Chicago   5,  000.  00 

Mar.  11,  1920 : 

Charles  F.  Greene,  338  South  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

W.  C.  Peacock,  State  and  Adams  St..  Chicago   250.  00 

Charles  H.  Thorne,  120  Mi<  higan  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Mar.  6.  1920 : 

L.  L.  Valentine.  A.  E.  Seaver.  1727  Sedg-\vick  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

Joe  Rusnak,  2654  W.  North  Ave..  (Miicago   100.00 

Mar.  15.  1920: 

Chas.  C.  Shepard,  care  Ingalls-Shepard  Forg.  Co.,  Harvey   200.  00 

F.  Baackes,  4932  Lake  Park  Ave.,  (liicago   100.00 

Mar.  18,  1920: 

S.  M.  Evans,  Eauie-Picher  Lead  C^o.,  208  S.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago.  250.00 
Thos.  S.  Brown,  jr..  Eagle-Picher  Lead  Co.,  208  S.  La  Salle  St.. 

Chicago  -  1   250.00 

().  S.  Pichei-,  208  S.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   500.00 

T.  S.  Fauntlerov.  :\I()line  Malleable  Iron  Co.,  St.  Charles   200.00 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

Albert  G.  Welch,  McConuick  Bldg..  Chicago   250.00 

Henry  Schott,  Montgomery  W^ard  &  Co.,  Chicago   500.  00 

O.  C.  S.  Olsen,  2527  Moffat  St.,  Chicago   lOO  00 

Louis  Manheimer,  31  N.  State  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  18,  1920: 

G.  A.  Soden,  910  S.  iVIichigan  Ave..  Chicago   100.  00 

Oscar  Heineman,  2701  Armitage  Ave..  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

G.  F.  Pushman.  16  So.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   100.00 

A.  B.  Dick,  736  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago___   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  20,  1920: 

.1.  W.  Embree,  3500  S.  Racine  Ave.,  Chicago   2,  000.  00 

A.  Harris,  35tli  &  Iron  St.,  Chicago   2.  000.  00 

David  Strauss,  1105  W.  35th  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  22,  1920: 

T  AV.  Robinson.  208  South  La  Sale  St.,  Chicago   300.00 

Geo.  G.  Thorpe,  208  South  La  Salle  St..  Chicago   200.  00 

A.  F.  Shiverick,  care  of  Tobev  Furniture  Co.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Wm.  F.  Juergens,  108  North  State  St.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Mar.  23.  1920:  ^ 

Ernst  Hollatz,  3061  Augusta  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  25.  1920 : 

R.  M.  Eastman.  406  W.  Superior  St.,  Chicago   ^' 

D.  F.  Keller,  732  Sherman  St.,  Chicago   lOO.  00 

William  Sleepeck,  418  S.  Market  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Bert  L.  White,  1215  Fullerton  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

F.  Edson  White,  208  South  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Arthur  Meeker,  208  South  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   1,000.00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2153 

Mar.  25,  1920— Continiietl. 

R.  J.  Dunham.  208  South  La  Salle  St..  Chicago  $1,  000.  00 

J.  Ogtlen  Arniour,  208  South  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  W.  Arniour,  208  South  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

R.  P.  Lamout,  332  South  P.Iichigau  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

G.  E.  Scott,  332  South  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

R.  H.  Ripley,  332  South  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Mar.  27,  1920: 

Sig.  C.  Fish,  1906  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Alex.  H.  Revell,  141  South  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   200.00 

William  A.  Eaton,  841  W.  22nd  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  29,  1920 : 

Suman  R.  Wing,  326  W.  Madison  Ave..  Chicago   100.  00 

James  R.  Baker,  326  W.  Madison  Ave.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Arthur  A.  Burrows.  625-326  W.  Madison  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

George  E.  Keiser,  326  W\  Madison  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

John  Q.  Syme,  326  W.  Madison  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  30,  1920: 

Holabird  &  Roche,  104  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   150.  00 

D.  H.  Burnham.  209  So.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   150.00 

Herbert  Simpleton,  2501  S.  Dearborn  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

W.  S.  Rothschild,  208  W.  Sigel  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

R.  G.  Olson,  .5816  So.  Lowe  Ave.,  Chicago   100.00 

H.  C.  Niemann.  1801  N.  Rockwell  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Apr.  2,  1920 : 

A.  R.  Marriott,  (Uiicago   100.00 

Col.  Abel  Davis,  Chicago   100.00 

H.  B.  Rllev,  Chicago   100.00 

H.  W.  Allen,  110  No.  Peoria  St..  Chicago   250.00 

Api-.  5,  1920 : 

J.  W.  Forsinger,  .31  N.  Slate  St..  Chicago   100.00 

Oliver  M.  Burton,  2024  S.  Racine  Ave.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

.L  E.  Clenny,  Chicago   1,000.00 

.John  T.  Hardin,  Chicacro   1,000.00 

Ai>r.  5,  1920 : 

Clifford  B.  Ross,  1321  Thorndale  Ave..  Chicago   1(X).  00 

Leo  Straus,  1507  Conway  Bldg.,  Chicago   150.00 

W.  A.  Alexander,  Corn  Exch.  Bk.  Bldg.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Marsh  &  McLennan,  Chicag(   250.00 

Apr.  6,  1920: 

H.  H.  Hitchcock.  39  South  La  Salle  St..  Chicago   500.00 

Apr.  9,  1920 : 

Name  lost    100.00 

Geo.  M.  McFedries,  236  So.  Robey  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Geo.  M.  Seaman,  208  So.  La  Salle  St..  Chicago   1,000.00 

E.  .L  Buffington.  208  So.  LaSalle  St.,  (Miicago   500.  00 

Apr.  12, 1920 : 

D.  W.  Baird,  1026  W.  22nd  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

.lohn  R.  Morron,  1.34  South  LaSalle  St.,  (niicago   500.00 

Geo.  D.  Wolf,  7  So.  Dearborn  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

.L  Porter  .Toplin.  122  So.  Michigan  Blvd.,  Chicago   100.00 

Apr.  14, 1920 : 

.Tas.  P.  Soper.  2204  Loomis  St.,  Chicago   250.  0;> 

F.  E.  Bartelme.  2350  Laflin  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Geo.  .L  Fanisworth,  80  E.  .Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   500.00 

Apr.  17, 1920 : 

Ernest  Feiiske,  1666  :\[cHenry  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

G.  H.  .Jones.  1105  1st  Natl.  Bk.  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Arthur  Root,  713  Ivenesaw  Tei-race.  Chicago   100.  00 

Joseph  L.  Strauss,  22nd  and  Calumet  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Geo.  A.  Poole,  85  W.  Harrison  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

A.  .L  Brock,  619  S.  LaSalle  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Fred  Fi.scher.  400  No.  May  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Maurice  L.  Horner,  .571  W.  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  W.  Embree,  3500  So.  Racine  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

G.  C.  Hixon,  717  Monroe  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

L.  E.  Yauer.  175  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago  :   100.00 


2154 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Apr.  20,  1920 : 

Arthur  Young,  105  So.  LaSalle  St.,  Chicago   $100.  00 

A.  D.  Dornian,  1295  Jefferson  St.,  Chicago   125.  00 

J.  A.  Roesch,  jr.,  129  So.  Jefferson  St.,  Chicago   125.  00 

D.  R.  Hoffman,  129  So.  Jefferson  St.,  Chicago   125.  00 

F.  W.  Walters,  129  So.  Jefferson  St.,  Cliicago   125.  00 

Charles  G.  Stevens,  33  So.  Jefferson  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  R.  Curran,  127  North  Peoria  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mandel  Lowenstine,  127  North  Peoria  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Chas.  Heggie,  644  Sheridan  Road,  Chicago   100.  00 

W.  S.  Leeds,  2305  So.  Halsted  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920: 

Samuel  B.  Steele,  151  W.  So.  Water  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Edward  L.  Wedeles,  151  W.  So.  Water  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Hiram  McCullough,  39  South  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

E.  M.  Adams,  38  So.  Dearborn  St.,  Chicago   -250.  00 

Apr.  23,  1920 : 

C.  R.  Whitworth,  10  So.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

B.  F.  Rieman,  2427  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   100.00 

Thomas  J.  Hay,  2519  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   125.  00 

S.  Shmalhauser,  2448  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  Pauiman,  2420  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   125.  00 

John  E.  Beebe,  5333  Wayne  Av^nuie,  .Chicago   1,  000.  00 

D.  W.  Buchanan,  1114  McCormick  Bldg.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Gordon  Buchanan,  1114  McCormick  Bldg.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

George  B.  Llarrington,  325  Fullerton  Parkway,  Chicago   500.00 

A.  B.  McLaren,  2017  Fisher  Bldg.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Apr.  25,  1920 : 

H.  H.  Taylor,  1215  Old  Colony  Bldg.,  Chicago   500.00 

J.  K.  Bering,  1914  McCormick  Bldg.,  Chicago   500.  00 

G.  F.  Stahmer,  704  N.  4th  Ave.,  Maywood   300.  00 

Joe  P.  Rend,  633  McCormick  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Lewis  Overholt,  1506  Fisher  Bldg.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Paul  LI.  Manz,  4015  Ravenswood  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

L.  E.  Block,  1105  First  Natl.  Bk.  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Apr.  27,  1920 : 

Edv/ard  E.  Gore,  53  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   100.00 

John  R.  Schofield,  430  AV.  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Edward  Sheeliy,  430  W.  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Marvin  B.  Pool,  430  W.  Randolph  St.,  Chiciigo   275.  00 

Charles  E.  Butler,  430  AV.  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   100.  OJ 

Frank  S.  Cunningham,  430  W\  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   275.  00 

Edward  B.  Butler,  430  W.  Randolph  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Wm.  A.  Ii-vine,  5864  Magnolia  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  H.  Dion,  Loomis  &  22nd  St.,-  Chicago   150.  00 

F.  De.  Anguera,  1101  Conway  Bldg.,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  H.  Hettler,  2601  Elston  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

L.  E.  Rollow,  341  E.  130th  PL,  Chicago   100.  00 

F.  H.     A.  C.  Howes,  545  W.  71st  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

S.  J.  DeVries,  842  W.  47th  Place,  Chicago,^   100.  00 

V.  F.  Mashek,  2201  S.  Laflin  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Edward  L.  Thornton,  2315  Elston  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

L.  B.  Lesh,  140  So.  Dearborn  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Theo.  Fathauer,  1428  Cherry  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  F.  Brand,  2415  Barry  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Wood  Beal,  1750  McCormick  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Chas.  W.  Tegtmeyer,  1800  So.  Canal  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

John  J.  Schillo,  1560  Kingsbury  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Hej-man  Paepcke,  Conway  Building,  Chicago   1,  500.  00 

C.  B.  Willey,  2558  So.  Robey  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

O.  F.  Crane,  913  W.  22nd  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

David  G.  Maxwell,  44th  St.  &  Racine  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

B.  F.  Masters,  2279  So.  Union  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Wm.  Nussbaum,  2119  W.  48th  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

W.  F.  Kurz,  13.59  No.  Branch  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

A.  K.  INIaxwell,  2200  So.  Morgan  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2155 

Apr.  27,  1920— Continued. 

C.  F.  Gooclwillie,  22nd  St.  &  Racine  Ave.,  Cliicago   $100.  00 

Frank  J.  Burns,  700  W.  Chicago  Ave.,  Chicago   300.  00 

Francis  Beidler,  20  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   250.  00 

John  Claney,  2424  So.  Laflin  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

J.  H.  Touclistone,  22nd  &  Canal  Streets,  Chicago   100.  00 

Gardner  &  Carton,  76  West  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Nathan  William  MacChesney,  30  No.  La  Salle  St.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Adelor  J.  Petit,  76  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Charles  Aaron,  76  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Michael  Gess,  76  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Thaddeus  O.  Bunch,  113  West  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Chapman  Cutler  &  Parker,  111  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Apr.  29,  1920  : 

A.  G.  Frost  &  F.  J.  Winslow,  1662-  53  W.  Jackson  Blvd   100.  00 

Robert  O.  Law,  633  Plymouth  Ct..  Chicago   250.  00 

J.  F.  Schurch,  122  So.  Michigan  Blvd.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Martin  Beck,  122  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Ezra  J.  Warner,  600  West  Erie  St.,  Chicago   300.  00 

William  F.  Bode,  314  N.  Clark  St.,  Chicago   250.  00 

May  3,  1920  : 

C.  A.  Bickett.  1260  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   500.  00 

Charles  I.  Pierce,  1221  Peoples  Gas  Bldg.,  Chicago   500.  00 

D.  E.  McMillan,  2422  Orrington  Ave.,  Evans   125.  00 

J.  P.  McMillan,  1720  Asbury  Ave.,  Evanston   125.  00 

Lorin  W.  Jones,  925  Foster  Ave.,  Chicago   200.  00 

L.  Komanski,  37  W.  Van  Buren  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

John  M.  Dilhivou,  715  Old  Colony  Bldg.,  Chicago   500.  00 

J.  P.  McParland,  22nd  &  Laflin  Streets,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  J.  Bryant,  1241  So.  State  St.,  Chicago   150.  00 

Albert  Nason,  1380  Old  Colony  Bldg.,  Chicago   250.  00 

May  5,  1920 : 

A.  R.  Barnes,  1100  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Dyreuforth,  Lee  Chritton  &  Wiles,  1508  Marquette  Bldg   100.  00 

May  7,  1920 : 

Bruce  MacLeish,  300  West  Adams  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Aibert  E.  Hedstiom.  310  Weslev  Ave.,  Oak  Park   100.  00 

John  T.  Pirie,  300  West  Adams  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

John  W.  Scott,  300  West  Adams  St.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Reuben  H.  Donnelley,  731  Plymouth  Ct.,  Chicago   500.  00 

Thos.  E.  Finnegan,  332  South  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

H.  G.  Elfborg,  150  No.  Market  St.,  Chicago   200.  00 

W.  S.  Cummings,  332  South  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

George  E.  Van  Hagen,  80  E.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

J.  R.  Histed,  1615  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago  ^   125.  00 

W.  J.  Carney,  76  W.  Monroe  St.,  Chicago  ^   250.  00 

H.  B.  Clow,  538  So.  Clark  St.,  Chicago   350.  00 

A.  McNally,  538  So.  Clark  St.,  Chicago   350.  00 

Gustav  Hessert,  538  So.  Clark  St.,  Chicago   300.  00 

Thomas  E.  Donnelley,  731  Plymouth  Court,  Chicago   500.  00 

May  10,  1920: 

C.  R.  Da.shiell,  2412  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Cha.s.  W.  Higley,  175  W.  Jackson  Blvd..  (Uiicago   100.00 

P.  D.  Block,  1105  First  Nat.  Bk.  Bldg.,  (  'liicago  ^   250.  00 

May  11,  1920: 

Oscar  B.  McGlasson,  251  E.  Grand  Ave.,  Chicago   200.00 

C.  R.  Fuller,  245  So.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

E.  H.  Uhl,  329  So.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Aibert  N.  Page.  25  E.  Jackson  Blvd   250.  00 

Frank  Story,  317  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

A.  G.  Gulbransen,  3232  W.  Chicago  Ave.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Chas.  Smith,  1872  Clybourne  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Otto  Schulz,  711  Milwaukee  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  C.  Dickinson.  323  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

C.  N.  Kimball,  308  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   658.  72 

Geo.  W.  Dowling,  301  S.  Wabash  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 


2156 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  14.  1920: 

B.  A.  Eckliart,  1300  Carroll  Ave.,  Chicago  $1,  000.  00 

A.  H.  Stringe,  2739  W.  Chicago  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

C.  A.  Normann,  454  Armour  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

A.  E.  Pyott,  328  N.  Sangamon  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  M.  Hopkins,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   750.  00 

P.  M.  Elliott,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   750.  00 

W.  W.  Darrow,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

W.  M.  Ryan,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   1,000.00 

W.  H.  Croft,  80  E.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   .500.  00 

Mav  18,  1920: 

Wm.  E.  Bletsch,  614  W.  Austin  Ave.,  Chicago   100.00 

Chas.  Counsehuan,  112  AV.  Adams  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Lester  Carter     Co.,  209  S.  LaSalle  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Hornblower  &  Weeks,  37  S.  LaSalle,  Chicago   100.  00 

Marshall  Field,  112  W.  Adams  St.,  Chicago   1.000.00 

May  19,  1920 : 

W.  P.  Murphy,  20  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   500.  00 

May  21,  1920 : 

John  W.  Gary,  208  S.  LaSalle  St.,  Chicago   3,000.00 

L.  M.  Yiles,  80  E.  .lackson  Blvd.,  Chicago   500.  00 


May  22,  1920 : 

Louis  F.  Normast,  1015  N.  Halsted  St.,  Chicago  

M.  P.  Rutledge,  223  W.  S.  Water  St.,  Chicago  

Lawrence  Cuneo,  1350  N.  LaSalle  St.,  Chicago  

Andrew  Cuneo,  1364  W.  State  St.,  Chicago  

A.  F.  Murmann,  3929  Addison  St.,  Chicago  

H.  E.  Thornburgh,  4803  Sheridan  Rd.,  Chicago  

F.  Wm.  Morf,  4210  Greenview  Ave.,  Chicago  

L.  B.  Kilbourne,  70  Scott  St.,  Chicago  

C.  K.  Knickerbocker,  332  So.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago  

P.  H.  Joyce,  20  W.  Jackson  Blvd.,  Chicago  

F.  L.  Whitcomb,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago——  

Ward  W.  Willits,  319  W.  Ontario  St.,  Chicago  

May  25,  1920 : 


Max  Hart,  36  S.  Franklin  St.,  Chicago   1,  500.  00 

M.  W.  Cresap,  36  S.  Franklin  St.,  Chicago   250  00 

Alex  M.  Levy,  36  S.  Franklin  St.,  Chicago   2.50.  00 

M.  Marx,  36  S.  Franklin  St.,  Chicago   750.  00 

Sara  H.  Schaffiier,  36  S.  Franklin  St.,  Chicago   750.  00 

Harry  Hart,  36  S,  Franklin  St..  Chicago   1,500.00 

C.  A.  Weaver,  2943  Washington  Blvd.,  (^hicago   200.  00 

E.  P.  Gridley,  6707  Newgard  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  S.  Hall,  1058  N.  Shore  Ave.,  Chicago  .   100.  00 

L.  F.  McCullough,  421  N.  Oak  Park  Ave.,  Oak  Park   100.  00 

Thos.  F.  Smith,  6121  Sheridan  Road,  Chicago   100.  00 

Francis  W.  Bard,  212  West  Illinois  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

May  26,  1920 : 

B.  S.  Adams,  41  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   270.  00 

John  Burnham,  41  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   375.  00 

Chas.  H.  Scholle.  121  South  Wabash  Avenue,  Chicago   100.  00 

J.  Ellis  Slater,  320  Melrose  Avenue.  Kenilworth  — —  100.00 

Frank  E.  Wagner,  4427  Washington  Boulevard,  Chicago   100.00 

F.  E.  Nellis,  jr..  Ill  AA'est  South  Water  Street,  Chicago   200.  00 

Wm.  L.  Wagner.  147  North  Menard  A^■enue,  Chicago'   100.  00 

W.  F.  Priebe.  52S  North  Grove  Avenue.  Oak  Park   100.  00 

Frank  Cuneo,  4849  Slieridan  Road,  Chicago   300.  00 

E.  P.  Waud,  332  South  Michigan  Avenue,  Chicago   100.  00 

F.  C.  Letts.  Peoples  Gas  Building,  Chicago   2.  .500.  00 


May  28,  1920 : 

John  M.  Smyth.  701  West  Madison  Street,  Chicago  

Irving  T.  H;u  tz,  208  South  La  Salle  Street.  Chicago  

Augustus  A.  Carpenter,  80  East  Jackson  Boulevard,  Chicago  

Kneeland  Ball,  6408  Harvard  Avenue,  Chicago  

J.  M.  Taft,  1405  West  Thirty-seventh  Street,  Chicago  


100.  00 
100.00 
100.  00 
100.  00 
100.  00 
100.  00 
200.  00 
300.  00 
250.  00 
500.  00 
500.  00 
500.  00 


200.  00 
500.  00 
200.  00 
10(\  OD 
200.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2157 


June  1,  1920 : 

Paul  E.  Faust,  Tribune  Building,  Chicago   $100.  00 

Emil  C.  Wetten,  108  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

W.  F.  Renshaw,  122  South  Michigan  Avenue,  Chicago   100.  00 

June  2,  1920 : 

Joseph  Weissenbach,  1630  Tribune  Building,  Chicago   500.  00 

Frank  G.  Heilman,  4339  North  Kildare  Avenue,  Chicago   100.  00 

Geo.  B.  Sloan,  414  Augusta  Street,  Oak  Park   100.  00 

E,  A.  Aaron,  72  West  South  Water  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

June  3,  1920  : 

Albert  T.  Bacon,  208  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

Chas.  F.  Harding,  137  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

Imbrie  &  Co.,  208  South  La  Salle  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

Harry  D.  Oppenheimer,  1016  West  Thirty-sixth  Street,  Chicago—  250.  00 

John  B.  Lord,  80  East  Jackson  Boulevard,  Chicago   500.  00 

June  4,  1920 : 

W.  C.  Shurtleff,  540  West  Randolph  Street,  Chicago   100.  00 

H.  A.  Huskey,  37  West  Van  Buren  Street,  Chicago   250.  00 

W.  P.  Worth.  37  West  Van  Buren  Street,  Chicago   250.  00 

Frank  H.  Woods,  910  Fisher  Building,  Chicago   500.  00 

Mar.  1,  1920: 

Mrs.  Joseph  J.  Wentworth,  1240  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Watson  Blair,  720  Rush  St.,  Chicago   100.00 

Mrs.  W.  V.  Kelley,  1550  N.  State  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  William  H.  Mitchell,  1200  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  F.  H.  Rawson,  1550  N.  State  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Sam  I.  Allerton,  1315  Astor  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Philip  D.  Armour,  2115  Prairie  Ave.,  Chicago   200.  00 

Mrs.  W.  J.  Chalmers,  1100  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Miss  Clara  A.  Cudahy,  1501  N.  State  Parkway,  Chicago   100.  00 

Miss  Mary  T.  Cudahy,  1501  N.  State  Parkway,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Robert  P.  Lnmont,  1722  Judson  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Sarah  L.  McCormick,  660  Rush  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Arthur  Meeker,  3030  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago  .   100.  00 

Mrs.  A.  A.  Sprague,  1130  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago____   100.  00 

Mr.  Norman  Williams,  199  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  O.  R.  Barnett,  684  Greenleaf  Ave.,  Glencoe   100.  00 

F.  H.  Harmon,  Glencoe   100.00 

Mrs.  Charles  W.  Hess,  Glencoe   100.00 

Mrs.  Agnes  C.  Allerton,  1315  Astor  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Potter  Palmer,  1050  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  2,  1920: 

National  Ship  of  States,  2703  Warren  Ave.,  Chicago   104.  30 

Mrs.  Grace  V.  A.  Peabody,  936  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  William  Ross,  3033  Sheridan  Road,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  6,  3920: 

Mrs.  Robert  McGann,  230  E.  Pearson  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Frank  D.  Stout,  3150  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   500.  00 

Mar.  15,  1920 : 

Mrs.  A.  D.  Lasker,  15  West  Burton  PI.,  Chicago   1, 000. 00 

Mrs.  Arthur  Ryerson,  2700  Lake  View  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  13,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Burton,  999  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   250.  00 

Mar.  22  1920 : 

Mrs.  John  J.  Borland,  2616  Prairie  Ave.,  Chicago   200. 00 

Mrs.  Marshall  Field,  1200  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Stanley  Field,  1550  N.  State  Parkway,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mar.  26,  1920 : 

Mrs.  George  W.  Dixon,  Chicago,  1250  Lake  Shore  Drive   100.  00 

Mrs.  G.  Herbert  Jones,  Chicago,  Blackstone  Hotel   100.  00 

Mrs.  Geo.  M.  Reynolds,  Chicago,  1444  Lake  Shore  Drive   100.  00 

Mrs.  Frank  Smith,  Dwight___   100.  00 

Mar.  29,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Samuel  Insull,  Chicago,  1100  Lake  Shore  Drive   200.  00 

Mrs.  George  M.  Reynolds,  Chicago,  1444  Lake  Shore  Drive   150.  00 


182774— 20— PT  15 


 5 


2158 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mar.  30,  1920 : 

Mrs.  W.  F.  Goodspeed,  Chicago,  200  E.  Pearson  St   $100.  OO 

Apr.  1,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Robert  H.  McCormick,  Chicago,  25  East  Erie  St   1.  000.  00 

Mrs.  George  M.  Reynolds,  Chicago,  1444  Lalve  Shore  Drive   100.  00- 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

Mrs.  William  R.  Linn,  Chicago,  1415  Astor  St   .500.  OO 

Apr.  9,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Charles  F.  Spalding,  Chicago,  1300  Astor  St   100.  00 

Apr.  12,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Warren  C.  Fairbanks,- Chicago,  66  Cedar  St   100.  00) 

Catherine  H.  Mcllvane,  Chicago,  112  Belleviie  Place   100.00 

Apr.  16,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Russell  Tyson,  Chicago,  20  E.  Goethe  St   100.  00 

Apr.  23,  1920: 

Mrs.  William  Wrigley,  Chicago,  2466  Lake  View  Ave   500.00 

Mrs.  Virginia  A.  Shayne,  Chicago,  103  Belleviie  PI   132.  51 

Miss  LiUian  Cook,  Chicago,  4910  Magnolia  Ave   357.  39 

Apr.  25,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Fred  W.  Upham,  Chicago,  2344  Lincoln  Park  West   500.  00 

Apr.  30,  1920: 

Mrs.  Homer  L.  Dixon,  Chicago,  2410  Lake  View  Ave   100.  00 

Mrs.  E.  R.  Graham,  Chicago,  1326  Astor  St   100.  OO 

May  1,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Jacob  Bauer,  Chicago,  30  Cedar  St   500.  00 

May  5,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Levy  Mayer,  Chicago,  Blackstone  Hotel   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  G.  A.  McKinlock,  Chicago,  999  Lake  Shore  Drive   500.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Roy  McWilliams,  Chicago,  199  Lake  Shore  Drive   100.  00' 

May  11,  1920 : 

Mrs.  George  W.  Dixon,  Chicago,  1250  Lake  Shore  Drive   348.  25 

May  14,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Milton  Yondorf,  233  Fairview  Ave.,  Glencoe   125.  OO 

May  19,  1920 : 

Mrs.  John  W.  Gary,  Hubbard  Woods   2,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Julius  Rosenwald,  4901  Ellis  Ave.,  Chicago   500.  00 

May  21,  1920 : 

Mrs.  William  R.  Linn,  1415  Astor  St.,  Chicago   500.  00 

May  25,  1920 : 

Mrs.  S.  S.  Stratton,  1214  Astor  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  George  P.  Braiin,  jr.,  1221  Astor  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  J.  McGregor  Adams,  Highland  Park,  Chicago   500.  00 

Mrs.  G.  A.  McKinlock,  999  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   500.  00 

June  2,  1920 : 

Mrs.  N.  Jacobson,  621  W.  Madison  St.,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Walter  S.  Brewster,  Lake  Forest   250.  00 

Mrs.  G.  A.  Soden,  5122  Woodlawn  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

June  4,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Bertha  Montgomery,  3412  S.  State  St.,  Chicago   637.  34 

Mrs.  W.  H.  Pinkney,  4710  N.  Winchester  Ave.,  Chicago   143.  05 

Mrs.  A.  N.  Marquis,  947  Lawrence  Ave.,  Chicago   999.  00 

June  7,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Charles  A.  Chapin,  920  N.  Michigan  Ave.,  Chicago   250.  00 

Mrs.  Bertha  E.  Leitch,  1458  Edgewater  Ave.,  Chicago   481.  79 

Mrs.  Louis  F.  Swift,  1200  Lake  Shore  Drive,  Chicago   100.  00 

Mrs.  Josephine  C.  Bentley,  4750  Kenwood  Ave.,  Chicago   155.  00 

Mrs.  Myrtle  Blacklidge,  6123  Indiana  Ave.,  Chicago   170.  00 

Mrs.  D.  Harry  Hammer,  3903  Lake  Park  Ave.,  Chicago   100.  00 

June  8,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Joseph  B.  Long,  48  Bank  St.,  Chicago   150.  00 

Mrs.  Walter  S.  Brewster,  Lake  Forest   100.00 

Mrs.  John  S.  Barnes,  Rockford   239.94 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2159 

June  10,  1920 : 

Sidney  Winsor  Worthy,  Chicago,  140  S.  Dearborn  St   $100.  00 

R.  H.  Parlvinson,  Chicago,  140  S.  Dearborn  St   100.  00 

Charles  Weinfeld,  Chicago,  39  S.  La  Salle  St   100.  00 

Daniel  J.  Schuyler,  jr.,  Chicago,  39  S.  La  Salle  St   100.  00 

M.  F.  Peltier,  Chicago,  332  S.  Michigan  Ave   100.  00 

Heman  Gifford,  Chicago,  105  S.  La  Salle  St   100.  00 

Herman  Paepcke,  Chicago,  111  W.  Washington  St   1,000.00 

Joseph  H.  Defrees,  Chicago,  105  S.  La  Salle  St   250.  00 

O.  O.  Krabol,  Chicago,  1758  N.  Maplewood  Ave   100.  00 

W.  G.  Howard,  Chicago,  229  N.  Wells  St.____   100.  00 

O.  G.  Gillman,  Chicago,  212  N.  Wells  St   100.  00 

E.  P.  Miller,  Chicago,  7737  East  Lake  Tr   200.  00 

G.  D.  Allman,  Chicago,  520  Washington  Blvd   250.  00 

G.  W.  Randall,  Chicago,  221  W.  S.  Water  St   100.  00 

E.  W.  Sproul,  Chicago,  39th  &  S.  Robey  St   200.  00 

Frank  H.  Woods,  Chicago,  910  Fisher  Bldg   500.  00 

Mar.  4,  1920: 

Andrew  Russel,  1109  Mound  Ave.,  Jacksonville   500.  00 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

Walter  S.  Dickey,  Macomb   100.00 

Frank  O.  Lowden,  Oregon   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  19,  1920: 

Frank  L.  Smith,  Dwight   500.  00 

D.  S.  Myers,  311  Grove  St.,  Pontiac   100.  00 

A.  M.  Legg,  Court  &  Cleary  St.,  Pontiac   100.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920: 

F.  E.  Tyson,  Danville   100.  00 

W.  C.  Rankin,  Danville   100.  00 

Apr.  26,  1920 : 

H.  G.  Herget,  615  Park  Ave.,  Pekin   100.  00 

Apr.  28,  1920 : 

H.  E.  Halliday,  2908  Washington  Ave.,  Cairo   200.  00 

H.  W.  Klee,  2514  Park  Ave.,  Cairo   100.  00 

O.  B.  Hastings,  3103  Washington  Ave.,  Cairo   100.  00 

May  1,  1920: 

Col.  S.  O.  Tripp,  1005  So.  4th  St.,  Springfield   150.  00 

E.  W.  Wilson,  Pekin   100.00 

May  7,  1920: 

J.  P.  Schuh,  Washington  Ave.,  Cairo   100.  00 

May  10,  1920: 

Henry  Elliott,  11  Kingsbury  PI.,  St.  Louis   250.00 

W.  H.  Elliott,  5023  Westminister  PL,  E.  St.  Louis   250.  00 

May  15,  1920 : 

George  R.  Peek,  Moline  Plow  Co.,  Moline   250.  00 

Mar.  14,  1920: 

Clarence  Griggs,  Ottawa   100.  00 

May  22,  1920: 

John  McQueen,  Kirkland   100.00 

R.  Ainsworth,  822  17th  Street,  Moline   100.  00 

C.  L.  Desaulniers,  Moline   100.  00 

A.  E.  Hageboeck,  2719  15th  Street,  Moline   100.  00 

May  24,  1920: 

F.  A.  Butler,  Hinsdale   125.00 

G.  A.  Dayton,  West  Chicago   100.  00 

C.  A.  Franzen,  Bensenville   100.  00 

Warren  B.  Thayer,  605  Garfield  Ave.,  Rockford   100.  00 

W.  A.  Forbes,  Rockford  Malleable  Iron  Works,  Rockford   150.  00 

A.  T.  Barnes,  Rockford   125.00 

J.  S.  Barnes,  Rockford   125.00 

C.  J.  Lundberg,  N.  2nd  St.,  Rockford   100.  00 

F.  G.  Hogland,  918  N.  2nd  St.,  Rockford   250.  00 

William  Johnson,  903  4th  Ave.,  Rockford   100.  00 

V.  M.  Johnson,  615  Garfield  Ave.,  Rockford   250.  00 

James  McKinney,  Aledo   100.  00 

James  A.  Wells,  Aledo  .   100.00 


2160 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  27,  1920 : 

Dwight  Deere  Wiman,  817  11th  Ave.,  Moline   $100.  00 

May  28,  1920: 

O.  F.  Gonklin,  1.^15  Mound  Ave.,  Jacksonville   100.  00 

E.  N.  Monroe,  4tli  &  Oak  Street,  Quincy   100.  00 

Neal  E.  Monroe,  1469  Main  St.,  Quincy   100.  00 

R.  R.  Meents,  Aslikum   100.  00 

June  1,  1920: 

H.  J.  Johnston,  1015  Ohio  St.,  Cairo   200.  00 

AValter  H.  Wood,  611  Ohio  St.,  Cairo   200.  00 

G.  R.  Arsthorp,  411  7th  St.,  Cairo   250.  00 

E.  J.  Stuhbins  Ohio  St.,  Cairo   100.00 

W.  A.  Rosenfield,  Safety  Bldg.,  Rock  Island   150.  00 

L.  H.  Clark,  Rockford   100.00 

June  2,  1920: 

Laurence  Bros.,  Sterling   250.  00 

J.  W.  Martin,  Sterling   100.00 

D.  L.  Martin,  Sterling   100.00 

Paul  Dillon  (paid  in  cash),  Sterling   100.00 

H.  C.  Allen,  Lyndon   150.  00 

June  3,  1920: 

Colonel  John  Lamber,  Joliet   1,  000.  00 

AVait  Talcott,  839  North  Main  St.,  Rockford   100.  00 

C.  S.  Brantingham,  1201  National  Ave.,  Rockford   100.  00 

E.  P.  Lathrop,  114  North  Church  St.,  Rockford   '  200.  00 

L.  C.  Blanding,  608  10th  Ave.,  Moline   200.  00 

R.  O.  Buchanan,  Bridgeport   100.00 

T.  L.  Andrews,  1414  S.  12th  St.,  Lawrenceville   100.  00 

June  4,  1920 : 

George  E.  Keys,  817  So.  7th  Street,  Springfield   100.  00 

June  7,  1920: 

G.  H.  Lane,  Alton,  Illini  Hotel   100.  00 

W.  M.  Sauvage,  Alton   100.00 

Lafayette  Young,  Alton   100.00 

J.  G.  Sackermann,  17th  and  Brady,  East  St.  Louis   100.00 

G.  G.  Keith,  17th  and  Brady,  East  St.  Louis   100.00 

June  8,  1920: 

H.  F.  Scarborough,  Pay  son   100.  00 

James  E.  Adams,  3  Wells  Bldg.,  Quincy   100.  00 

Charles  Andrews,  1811  Elen  St.,  Rockford——   100.00 

June  10,  1920: 

George  M.  Wright,  Danville,  733  East  Cleveland   100.  00 

O  P.  Yeager,  Danville,  131  Walnut   100.  00 

H  A.  Swallow,  Danville   100.00 

F.  E.  Butcher,  Danville,  2204  No.  Vermilion   100.  00 

George  Wells,  Quincy,  3  W^ells  Bldg   100.  00 

KANSAS. 

Mar.  1,  1920 : 

B.  E.  La  Dow,  Fredonia,  135  So.  5th  St  ^   $100.  00 

Ben  S.  Paulen,  Fredonia,  415  Eleventh  St   100.  00 

William  D.  Pratt,  Fredonia   100.  00 

W.  S.  Dickey,  Kansas  City,  Mo.,  N.  Y.  Life  Bldg.  (credit  Kansas)  _  125.  00 
Mar.  2,  1920: 

L.  T.  Sunderland,  Chanute   100.  00 

J.  J.  Campbell,  Pittsburg,  425^  N.  Broadway   100.  00 

A.  B.  Keller,  Pittsburg,  613  W.  3rd  St   100.  00 

Clarence  R.  Aten,  Dodge  City   100.  00 

L.  J.  Pettijohn,  Topeka   100.  00 

J.  C.  Denious,  Dodge  City   :   100.  00 

H.  P.  McCaustland,  Bucklin   100.00 

E.  W.  Moore,  Spearville   100.00 

H.  L.  Baker,  La  Crosse__-   105.  00 

Walter  Grundv,  Hutchinson  (Boxonte  Hotel)   100.00 

H.  A.  Martens,  Buhler   100.00 

E.  A.  Mowrev,  Hutchinson,  801  Rorabaugh  Bldg   100.  00 

John  M.  Starr,  Hutchinson,  16  Third  St.  W   00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES.  2161 

Mar.  2,  1920— Continued. 

J.  C.  Petro,  Hutchinson,  201  E.  12th  St   $100.  00 

George  E.  Gano.  Hutchinson,  528  Ave.  A.  E   100.  00 

J.  E.  Damon.  Hutchinson,  610  Rorahaugh  W.  Bd   100.  00 

Fred  F.  Burns,  Hutchinson,  Cousolid.  Flour  M   100.  00 

E.  E.  &  J.  W.  Shive,  Turon  _*   100.  00 

V.  M.  Wiley,  Hutchinson,  Rorahaugh  W.  Bd   100.  00 

H.  K.  McLeod,  Hutchinson,  500  Ave.  A  East   100.  00 

C.  F.  Spencer.  Pittsburg,  Globe  Bldg   250.  00 

W.  W.  Patterson.  Pittsburg.  406  W.  Euclid   250.  00 

Ira  Clemens,  Pittsburg.  607  W.  Euclid   125.  00 

J.  Luther  Taylor,  Pittsburg,  706  W.  Euclid   125.  00 

A.  H.  Schlanger,  Pittsburg,  Globe  Bldg   100.  00 

H.  L.  Baker,  La  Crosse   100.  00 

C.  A.  Smith,  Independence,  618  W.  Maple  St   100.  00 

Andrew  Benson.  Independence,  607  N.  8th  St   100.  00 

E.  S.  Rea,  Colfeyville,  710  Elm  St   100.  00 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

Riley  W.  MacGregor.  Medicine  Lodge___   500.00 

R.  C.  Gafford.  Minneapolis   100.  00 

B.  F.  Arnold,  Coldwater   100.  00 

P.  H.  Thornton,  Coldwater   100.00 

F.  S.  Butts.  Protection   100.  00 

P.  H.  Halleck.  Abilene   235.00 

Mar.  19,  1920: 

C.  W.  Dingman.  Clay  Center   100.  00 

A.  M.  Breese,  Cottonwood  Falls   100.  00 

J.  C.  Peck,  Concordia   411.  50 

C.  R.  Potter.  Clyde   112.  50 

C.  P.  Baxter,  Chanute   100.  00 

H.  H.  Motter,  Olathe   125.  00 

W.  B.  Strang,  Overland  Park   100.  00 

Albert  R.  Jones,  Mission  Hills   100.  00 

H.  E.  Suderman,  Newton,  201  S.  Pine  St   100.  00 

John  C.  Nicholson,  Newton,  713^  Main  Street   100.  00 

O.  :\Ioorehead.  Newton.  311  W.  Broadway   100.  00 

O.  W.  Roff,  Newton,  801  Plum  St   100.  00 

J.  T.  Axtell,  Newton,  221  E.  Broadway   100.  00 

C.  R.  Comes,  Wellington,  Lincoln  &  A  St   100.  00 

W.  W.  Schwinn,  Wellington,  507  N.  A.  St   100.  00 

D.  E.  Dunne.  Wichita,  119  N.  Market  St   100.  00 

J.  H.  Stewart,  Wichita.  101  W.  Douglass   100.  00 

C.  Q.  Chandler,  Wichita,  Cor.  Main  &  Douglass   100.  00 

W.  E.  Brown,  Wichita,  1103  N.  Topeka  Ave   200.  00 

Fred  B.  Stanley,  Wichita,  Scliweiter  Bldg   300.  00 

J.  C.  Fisher,  Wichita,  H.  G.  Dry  Goods  Co   100.  00 

C.  M.  Jackman,  Wichita,  care  of  Kansas  Milling  Co   100.  00 

J.  W.  Craig.  Wichita,  105  Broadview   100.  00 

L.  H.  Powell.  Wichita,  L.  H.  Powell  &  Co   100.  00 

A.  S.  Parks,  Wichita,  care  of  United  Sash  &  Door  Co   100.  00 

L.  C.  Kelley,  Wichita   200.00 

J.  B.  Hupp,  Wichita,  Sedgwick  Bldg   200.  00 

F.  A.  Amsden.  Wichita,  Beacon  Bldg   100.00 

H.  V.  Wheeler.  Wichita,  215  E.  Douglass   100.  00 

E.  E.  Bovle.  Wichita   2CR).  00 

Richard  M.  Gray,  Wichita,  Hotel  Lassen   100.  00 

R.  G.  Kirkwood,  Wichita.  Beacon  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  A.  Tickers,  Wichita,  Bitting  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  D.  Bowersock,  Lawrence   200.  00 

W.  A.  Stuart,  Lawrence,  936  Kentuckv  St   100.  00 

Mar.  23.  1920: 

E.  C.  Sweet,  Minneapolis   100.00 

Henry  Diegel.  Atchi.^on,  412  Kansas  Ave   100.  00 

R.  W.  Ramsav.  Atchison,  605  Commercial  St   100.  00 

Roy  Seaton,  Atchison,  514  S.  5th  St   100.  00 

F.  E.  Harwi.  Atchison,  9th  &  Commercial  St   100.  00 

W.  J.  Bailey.  Atchison,  602  Commercial  St   100.  00 


2162 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mar.  23,  1920— Continued. 

H.  W.  Miichnic,  Atchison,  3rd  &  Park  Sts   $100.  00 

W.  A.  &  J.  W.  Blair,  Atcliison,  300  S.  4th  St   100.  00 

Wm.  Carlisle,  Atchison,  105  N.  4th  St   100.  00 

Lukens  Bros.,  Atchison,  818  Main  St   100.  00 

H.  W.  Jacobs,  Atchison,  520  Woodlawn   100.  00 

J.  H.  Engstrom,  Wichita,  318  W.  Douglas  Ave   100.  00 

L.  E.  Arnold,  Wichita,  care  of  Arnold  Auto  Co   100.  00 

Howard  E.  Case,  Wichita   100.  00 

A.  O.  Rorabaugh,  Wichita,  1616  Park  Place   100.  00 

J.  C.  O.  Morse,  Wichita   100.00 

Apr.  17,  1920: 

H.  A.  Auerbach,  Topeka,  709  Kansas  Ave   100.  00 

Apr.  29,  1920: 

Jno.  B.  Nicholson,  Topeka,  care  of  Kaw  Milling  Co   200.  00 

A.  Fassler,  Topeka,  care  of  Willis  Norton  &  Co   200.  00 

D.  G.  Page,  Topeka,  care  of  Thos.  Page  Mill.  Co   200.  00 

Apr.  23.  1920 : 

Horace  L.  Hall,  Topeka   100.00 

May  4.  1920 : 

W.  A.  White,  Emporia   150.00 

May  11,  1920: 

M.  Delaney,  Waterville   100.00 

INIay  27,  1920 : 

J.  B.  Adams,  El  Dorado   1,  000.  00 

Peder  Paulson,  Whitewater  ;   100.00 

W.  Y.  Lathrop,  Burns   150.  00 

F.  P.  Knox,  El  Dorado   100.00 

Guy  C.  Glascock,  Hutchinson   100.  00 

June  7,  1920 : 

A.  W.  Beck,  Tola   100.  00 

Thomas  H.  Bowlus,  lola   100.  00 

F.  J.  Horton,  Tola   100.  00 

George  F.  Richardson,  Westmorland   300.  00 

C.  F.  Mensing,  Leavenworth   100.  00 

Samuel  H.  Wilson,  Leavenworth   100.  00 

H.  R.  Willson,  Leavenworth   100.00 

H.  J.  Helmers,  jr.,  Leavenworth   100.  00 

B.  F.  INIcLean,  Wichita   200.00 

J.  P.  Campbell,  Wichita   100.00 

Mar.  3,  1920 : 

Walter  E.  AVilson,  Washington   100.00 

A.  W.  Swayze,  Ellsworth   100.  00 

Thomas  G.  O'Donnell,  Ellsworth   100.00 

J.  W.  Metz,  Wichita   100.00 

Claudius  C.  Stanley,  AVichita   100.00 

O.  B.  Gufler,  Topeka   200.00 

KENTUCKY. 

Mar.  9.  1920 : 

W.  A.  Thomason,  R.  F.  D.  No.  1.  Paris   100.  00 

D.  O.  Burke,  Bradfordsville   130.00 

Mar.  12,  1920 : 

William  M.  Robb,  R.  F.  D.,  Winchester   100.  00 

Mar.  15,  1920: 

Richard  C.  Stoll,  605  First  City  Natl.  Bk.,  Lexington   100.  00 

Rex  G.  Carpenter,  Lexington   100.  00 

H.  Giovaunoli,  Lexington  Leader,  Lexington   100.  00 

Thomas  C.  INIcDowell,  832  E.  Main  &  Hanover  Ave.,  Lexington__  100.  00 

.John  G.  Stoll,  219  West  Short  St.,  Lexington   100.  00 

Mar.  19,  1920: 

James  B.  Hall,  R.  F.  D.  No.  3,  Lexington   100.  00 

Mar.  24,  1920: 

George  H.  Laib,  2307  Bonnycastle,  Louisville   100.  00 

F.  D.  Sampson.  Barbourville   100.00 

Sawyer  A.  Smith,  Barbourville   100.00 

J.  D.  Tuggle,  Barbourville   100.00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2163 


Mar.  29,  1920: 

George  C.  Atkinson,  Earlington   $100.  00 

Apr.  5,  1920 : 

Sam  Collins,  Whitesburg   100.00 

Apr.  13,  1920 : 

M.  F.  Harris,  Irvine   200.00 

Clarence  Miller,  Irvine   200.00 

James  Wallace,  Irvine   100.00 

Apr.  30,  1920 : 

Joseph  Burge,  490  West  Main  St.,  Louisville   100.  00 

May  6,  1920 : 

R.  B.  Martin,  Cromwell   285.00 

E.  S.  Kirk,  the  State  Natl.  Bk.,  Maysville   100.  00 

Horace  J.  Cochran,  Maysville   100.  00 

Charles  R.  Long,  jr.,  630  East  Main  St.,  Louisville   500.  00 

Nicholas  County  Republican  executive  committee,  Wyatt  Inska, 

Carlisle   100.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

J.  C.  Richardson,  Middleboro   100.  00 

T.  J.  Asher,  Pineville   150.00 

F.  D.  Hart,  jr.,  Middlesboro   100.00 

May  22,  1920  : 

Leonard  G.  Cox,  Lexington   100.  00 

May  24,  1920 : 

H.  H.  Smith,  Hindman   200.00 

Fr^nk  Hudson,  Lexington   100.  00 

June  1,  1920 : 

Lawson  Reno,  Owensboro   100.  00 

S.  Speed,  Speed  Bldg.,  Louisville   500.  00 

F.  M.  Sackett,  315  Guthrie  St.,  Louisville   500.00 

June  2,  1920 : 

Thruston  Ballard.  Ballard  Mills,  Louisville   500.00 

William  Hayburn,  Belknap  Hdw.  &  Mfg.  Co.,  Louisville   1,  000.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

A.  D.  Allen,  care  of  Mengel  Co.,  Louisville   300.  00 

LOUISIANA. 

Mar.  1,  1920 : 

P.  H.  DeJoie,  M.  D.,  New  Orleans,  1131  Dufossat   100.  00 

Mar.  25,  1920 : 

Wm.  Edenborn,  New  Orleans   500.00 

Apr.  15.  1920 : 

E.  J.  Thilborger,  New  Orleans,  912  Canal  Bank  Bldg   4,  000.  00 

E.  J.  Caire,  St.  James   50O  00 

Herbert  Wadsworth,  New  Orleans,  Marine  Bank  Bldg   275.  00 

R.  L.  Baker,  Napoleonville   100. 00 

F.  Dugas,  Paincourtville   125.00 

Stephen  C.  Munson,  Napoleonville   250.  00 

E.  J.  Rodrigue,  Paincourtville   125.00 

Dave  J.  Foret,  Lockport  1   250.00 

C.  W.  Gheens,  Lockport   100.00 

J.  C.  Rousseau,  Lockport   100.00 

Gonzalo  Abaunza,  New  Orleans,  Whitney-Central  Bldg   250.  00 

Gonzalo  Abaunza,  New  Orleans,  Whitney-Central  Bldg   250.  00 

Pearl  Wight,  New  Orleans,  Whitney-Central  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

G.  S.  Orme.  New  Orleans,  209  N.  Peters  St   200.  00 

E.  L.  Jahncke,  New  Orleans,  817  Howard  Ave   250.  00 

Rufus  E.  Foster,  New  Orleans,  U.  S.  Postoffice  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

Edw.  G.  Schlieder,  New  Orleans,  717  Bienville  St—..   1,  000.  00 

J.  &  E.  Burgieres,  New  Orleans,  818  Perdido  St   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  Godchaux,  New  Orleans,  Godchaux  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

Fred.  W.  Salmen,  New  Orleans,  Whitney-Central  Bldg   500.  00 

S.  Odenheimer,  New  Orleans,  care  of  Lane  Mills   100.  00 

S.  French,  New  Orleans,  care  of  Woodward  Wight  Co   250.  00 

Geo.  Ross  Murrell,  Whitecastle   500.  00 

E.  F.  Dickinson,  Mathews   100.00 


2164 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Apr.  15,  1920— Continued. 

C.  S.  Mathews.  New  Orleans,  Hibernia  Bldg   $750.00 

Walter  Libby,  New  Orleans,  1402  Whitney-Central  Building   250.  00 

E.  A.  Pharr,  Oliver   100.  00 

Victor  Loisel,  St.  James,  P.  O  1   250.  00 

Apr.  23,  1920 : 

J.  S.  Thomson,  Lake  Charles   200.  00 

G.  B.  Howes,  Jeanerette   100. 00 

R.  H.  Dow^nman,  New  Orleans,  Hibernia  Bldg   825.  00 

June  10,  1920 : 

C.  L.  Wallace,  New  Orleans   100.00 

Geo.  W.  DeRussy,  New  Orleans   100.  00 

E.  G.  Robichaux.  Thibodaux   100.00 

Leonce  J.  LeBlanc,  Paincourtville   100.00 

A.  E.  Winkler,  Klotzville   100.00 

Henderson  Iron  Wks.,  Shreveport   200.  00 

T.  J.  Freeman,  New  Orleans   200.  00 

Clarence  C,  Barton.  Napoleonville   200.00 

E.  T.  Dugas,  Paincourtville   250.00 

O.  A.  Bourg,  New  Orleans   250.00 

Robt.  E.  LeBlanc,  Paincourtville   400.00 

Clarence  Ellerbe,  box  591,  Shreveport   250.00 

S.  H.  Balinger,  Shreveport   250.00 

S.  H.  Balinger,  Shreveport   250.  00 


MICHIGAN. 

Mar.  1,  1920: 

J.  W.  Fordney,  Saginaw   $1,  000.  00 

Clark  L.  Ring,  Saginaw   1,000.00 

A.  T.  Ferrell,  Saginaw   500.00 

D.  D.  Aitkin,  Flint   100.00 

Leonard  Freeman,  Flint,  714  Beach   300.00 

R.  H.  Collins,  Detroit,  Cadillac  Motor  Co   1,  000.  00 

Wilfred  C.  Leland,  Detroit,  2230  Dime  Bank  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

R.  B.  Jackson,  Detroit,  Hudson  Motor  Car  Co   1,  000.  00 

Henry  M.  Leland,  Detroit,  2984  W.  Grand  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

J.  H.  Romick,  Detroit   1,000.00 

Charles  B.  Warren.  Detroit,  900  Union  Trust  Bldg   500.  00 

Gilbert  W.  Lee,  Detroit,  care  of  Lee  &  Cady   250.  00 

Mar.  4,  1920: 

James  Inglis,  Detroit,  care  of  Amer.  Blower  Co   500.  00 

D.  M.  Ferry,  Detroit,  care  of  D.  M.  Ferrv  &  Co   500.  00 

Frank  J.  Flecker,  Detroit,  915  Union  Trust  Bldg   500.00 

James  T.  McMillan,  Detroit,  804  Union  Trust  Bldg   1,000.00 

Edwin  Denbv,  Detroit.  1405  Dime  Bank  Bldg   500.00 

James  Couzens,  Detroit,  2239  Dime  Bank  Bldg   1,000.00 

Mar.  6,  1920: 

Mr.  S.  D.  Young,  Grand  Rapids,  333  Fountain  St   500.  00 

Mar.  8,  1920: 

Wm.  H.  Gav,  Grand  Rapids,  422  Fulton  St   500.  00 

M.  R.  Bissell,  ji'-,  Grand  Rapids,  210  Erie  St   500.  00 

Albert  Stickley,  Grand  Rapids,  care  of  Stickley  Furn.  Co   500.  00 

John  W.  Blodgett,  Grand  Rapids,  Grand  Rapids  Trust  Co   500.  00 

Delos  A.  Blodgett,  Grand  Rapids,  Lakewood   250.  00 

O.  B.  Wilmarth,  Grand  Rapids,  544  Jefferson  Ave   250.  00 

Robert  E.  Shanahan,  Grand  Rapids,  439  Fulton  St   250.  00 

Wm.  Jack.  Grand  Rapids,  care  of  Amer.  Box  Bd.  Co   100.  00 

Normand  McClave,  Grand  Rapids,  430  Madison  Avenue   100.  00 

D.  H.  Brown,  Grand  Rapids,  36  College  Avenue,  Northeast   100.  00 

Fenton  R.  McCreerv,  Flint,  526  Beach  Street   250.  00 

Gleen  R.  Jackson,  Flint,  514  p]ast  Third  Street   100.  00 

W.  H.  Wallace,  Snginaw,  Eddy  Building   1,000.00 

Arthur  D.  Eddy,  Saginaw,  Eddy  Building   1.  000.  00 

George  B.  Morlev,  Saginaw,  316  North  Washington  West   1,  000.  00 

Arnold  Boutell,  Saginaw,  W.  S   JOO.  00 

Alex  Dow,  Detroit,  18  Washington  Avenue  — —  500.  00 

Arthur  C.  Wood,  Detroit,  16  Gratiot  Street   300.  00 

Howard  E.  Coffin,  Detroit,  care  of  Hudson  Motor  Car  Co   oOO.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2165 

March  15,  1920  : 

Herman  Liindon,  Lewiston   $300.  00 

Lem  W.  Bo  wen,  Detroit   250.  00 

J.  B.  Ford,  Detroit.  1622  Ford  Building   1,000.00 

Truman  H.  Newberry,  Detroit,  Ford  Building   1,  000.  00 

March  22,  1920 : 

Lewis  H.  Jones,  Detroit,  95  Clark  Avenue   500.  00 

James  S.  Holden,  Detroit,  500  Holeden  Building   200.  00 

John  Trix,  Detroit.  American  Injector  Co   200.  00 

Governor  Albert  E.  Sleeper,  Bad  Axe   250.  00 

M.  A.  Guest,  Grand  Rapids,  220  Benjamin  Avenue   100.  00 

F.  M.  Deane,  Grand  Rapids,  210  Erie  Street   250.  00 

March  30,  1920: 

A.  C.  Wells,  Menominee,  State  Street   100.  00 

J.  M.  Thompson,  Menominee,  Main  Street   100.  00 

C.  1.  Cook,  Menominee,  310  Main  Street   150.  00 

M.  B.  Llovd,  Menominee,  Ogden  Avenue   100.  00 

J.  W.  Wells,  Menominee,  Main  Street   250.  00 

Geo.  W.  McCormick,  Menominee,  1711  State  Street   150.  00 

F.  A.  Spice,  Menominee,  109  Ogden  Avenue   100.  00 

Fred  M.  Prescott,  Menominee,  320  Main  Street   150.00 

Hal  H.  Smith,  Detroit,  1122  Ford  Bldg   500.  00 

Maj.  Walter  C.  Piper,  Detroit,  400  Holden  Bldg   250.  00 

Guy  W.  Rouse.  Grand  Rapids,  cor.  Island  &  Ottawa   500.  00 

C.  S.  Dexter,  Grand  Rapids,  1661  Monroe  Ave   250.  00 

William  Judson,  Grand  Rapids,  Judson  Grocers  Co   100.  00 

Robert  Oakman,  Detroit,  512  Union  Trust  Bldg   500.00 

F.  J.  Weiss,  Flint,  1002  N.  Saginaw   250.  00 

A.  B.  C.  Hardy,  Flint,  923  E.  Keansley  St   100.  00 

S.  S.  Stewart,  Flint,  830  Avon   200.  00 

Apr.  2,  1920 : 

F.  Stuart  Foote,  Grand  Rapids   500.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920 : 

Edward  A.  Loveley,  Detroit,  200  Peter  Smith  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  3,  1920 : 

Leo  C.  Harmon.  Manistique   100.  00 

A.  M.  Chesbrough,  Thompson   100.  00 

R.  E.  MacLean,  Wells,  27  Main  St   100.  00 

C.  W.  Kates,  Wells,  31  Main  St   100.  00 

C.  G.  Edgar,  Detroit   300.00 

Coleman  Vaughan,  Lansing  .   100.  00 

J.  C.  Kirkpatrick,  Escanaba,  328  Fifth  St   200.00 

H.  M.  Reade,  Escanaba,  705  Fifty  Ave.  So   100.00 

T.  M.  Judgson,  Escanaba,  528  Seventh  St   100.  00 

M.  J.  Ryan,  Escanaba,  623  So.  Eighth  St   100,  00 

William  Borifas,  Escanaba,  750  Mich.  Ave   100.  00 

M.  K.  Bissell,  Escanaba,  604  Mich.  Ave   100.  00 

W.  R.  Smith,  Escanaba,  316  Harrison  Ave   100.  00 

Jas.  R.  Andrews,  Escanaba,  720  Lake  Shore  Drive   100.  00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

James  E.  Davidson,  Bay  City   500.  00 

C.  C.  Johnson,  Grand  Rapids,  411  Crescent  St   100.  00 

Apr.  13,  1920 : 

Fred  E.  Lee,  Dowagiac   500.00 

E.  W.  Atwood,  Flint   125.00 

Apr.  14,  1920 : 

John  S.  Haggerty,  Detroit,  1815  Dime  Bank  Bldg   500.  00 

John  D.  Mackay,  Detroit,  1805  Dime  Bank  Bldg   125.  00 

George  W.  Cook,  Flint,  218  E.  Court  St   100.  00 

C.  C.  Jenks,  Detroit,  care  of  Security  Trust  Co   200.  00 

Ernst  Kern,  Detroit,  care  of  Ernst  Kern  &  Co   100.  00 

April  20, 1920 : 

Harry  Widdecombe,  Grand  Rapids,  care  of  John  Widdecombe  Co_  300.  00 

J.  Boyd  Pantlind,  Grand  Rapids,  College  Ave   100.  00 

E.  A.  Summer,  Detroit,  126  Jefferson  Ave   250.  00 

J.  Hampton  Hoult,  Grand  Rapids   250.00 

Albert  Kahn,  Detroit   125.  00 


2166 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


April  21, 1920 : 

C.  H.  Barre,  Hillsdale   $100  00 

April  24, 1920 : 

J.  M.  McPherson,  Howell   100.  00 

R.  Bruce  McPherson,  Howell   100  00 

April  27, 1920 : 

H.  H.  Basset,  Flint   100.  00 

R.  H.  Scott,  Lansing  ,   1,000.*  00 

Sherman  Depew,  Detroit   100.  00 

April  28, 1920 : 

W.  W.  Mountain,  Flint   100  00 

May  3, 1920 : 

Clarence  O.  Hetchler,  Flint   250.00 

Otto  P.  Grafe,  Flint   100.  00 

May  13, 1920  : 

R.  E.  Olds,  Lansing   900.00 

Geo.  H.  McVannel,  Flint,  526  E.  5th  St   100.  00 

H.  B.  Sherman,  Battle  Creek  1   250.  00 

Charles  Austin,  Battle  Creek,  care  of  Old  Natl.  Bank   200.  00 

H.  C.  Hawks,  Battle  Creek   200.  00 

W.  S.  Butterfield,  Battle  Creek,  Citv  Bank  Bldg   200.  00 

C.  E.  Kolb,  Battle  Creek,  31  Garrison   10 ).  00 

James  Turner,  Detroit,  2104  Dime  Bank  Bldg   500.  00 

William  D.  Thompson,  Detroit,  1203  Ford  Bldg   500.  00 

Geo.  E.  Sheldrick,  Detroit,  435  Marlborough  Ave   250.  00 

R.  Adlington  Newman,  Detroit,  1718  Ford  Bldg   250.  00 

Benjamin  S.  Warren,  Detroit,  1203  Ford  Bldg   500.  00 

Allen  F.  Edwards,  Detroit,  Interurban  Bldg   250.  00 

Walter  E.  Parker,  Detroit,  668  Penobscot  Bldg   100.  00 

William  Hatton,  Grand  Haven,  Sheldon  Terrace   100.00 

Lloyd  M.  Richardson,  Saginaw   250.  00 

May  14,  1920 : 

C.  M.  Roehm,  Detroit,  91  W.  Woodbridge   125.  00 

May  18,  1920 : 

E.  C.  Van  Husan,  Detroit,  1813  Dime  Bank  Bid   100.  00 

H.  D.  Sholden,  Detroit,  1840  Penobscot  Bid   500.  00 

Frederic  W.  Dennis.  Detroit,  1740  Penobscot  Bid   125.  00 

J.  D.  Dort,  Flint,  1740  Penobscot  Bid   250.  00 

May  25,  1920 : 

Milo  D.  Campbell,  Coldwater,  53  E.  Chicago   100.  00 

George  C.  Craver,  Wells,  care  of  Delta  Chemical  Co   100.  00 

J.  P.  Bierhang,  Escanaba,  706  Wisconsin  Ave   300.00 

F.  K.  Berry,  Battle  Creek   150.  00 

Arthur  B.  Williams,  Battle  Creek,  care  of  Postum  Oreal  Co   200.  00 

Harry  E.  Burt.  Battle  Creek,  143  Frelinghuisen   100.  00 

E.  L.  Branson,  Battle  Creek,  81  Garrison  Ave   100.  00 

Frederick  K.  Sterns,  Detroit.  395  Burns  Ave   250.00 

W.  A.  C.  Miller,  Detroit,  1080  Vinewood  Ave   500.  00 

J.  B.  Schlotman,  Detroit.  501  Owen  Bldg   250.00 

E.  D.  Speck,  Detroit,  1620  Ford  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  A.  Curtis,  Detroit,  1617  Ford  Bldg   500.00 

E.  L.  Ford.  Detroit,  1622  Ford  Bldg   500.00 

M.  B.  McMillan,  Detroit,  2216  Dime  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 

Alanson  S.  Brooks,  Detroit,  Dime  Bank  Bldg   250.  00 

Murrav  W.  Sales,  Detroit,  76  Jefferson  Ave   500.00 

A.  H.  Schmidt.  Detroit,  138  Monroe  Ave   100.  00 

Edward  J.  Schmidt,  Detroit,  138  Monroe  Ave   100.  00 

Arthur  McGraw,  Detroit,  1012  Hammond  Bldg   100.  00 

May  25.  1920: 

Fred  M.  Warner,  Farmington   500.  00 

June  28,  1920: 

Charles  R.  Sligh,  Grand  Rapids,  Sligh  Furn.  Co   250. 

June  1.  1920: 

D.  E.  Bates,  Lansing,  720  Plymouth  St   100.  00 


u 

PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2167 

June  3,  1920: 

H.  V.  Book,  Detroit,  care  of  Book  Estate,  Book  Bldg   $325.  00 

T.  P.  Book,  Detroit,  care  of  Book  Estate,  Book  Bldg   325.  00 

J.  B.  Book,  Detroit,  care  of  Book  Estate,  Book  Bldg   350.  00 

W.  H.  Jennings,  Detroit,  85  Porter  St   100.  00 

George  W.  Edwards,  Detroit,  18  Woodward  Ave   100.  00 

George  M.  Clark,  Bad  Axe   125.00 

G.  G.  Scranton,  Harbor  Beach   150.  00 

George  J.  Jenks,  Harbor  Beach   150.  00 

Bela  W.  Jenks,  Harbor  Beach   100.  00 

Robert  M.  Jenks,  Harbor  Beach   100.00 

James  B.  Peter,  Saginaw,  536  Mallard  St   100.  00 

H.  T.  Wickes,  Saginaw,  care  of  Wickes  Boiler  Co   250.  00 

W.  J.  Wickes,  Saginaw,  care  of  Wickes  Boiler  Co   250.  00 

J.  E.  French,  Niles,  501  Main  Street   200.  00 

Francis  J.  Plym,  Niles   200.00 

W.  H.  Parkin,  Niles.  602  Main  St   200.  00 

Henry  M.  Towar,  Niles,  1101  S.  Third  St   100.  00 

H.  W.  Alden,  Detroit,  21  Edison  Ave   250.  00 

Julian  Krolik,  Detroit,  240  E.  Jelferson  Ave   100.  00 

Phillip  H.  Gray,  Plymouth,  915  Hammond  Bldg   1, 000.  00 

Paul  R.  Gray,  Plymouth,  915  Hammond  Bldg-,   1,  000.  00 

Maud  Ledyard  von  Ketteler,  Grosse  Pointe,  259  Lake  Shore  Rd—  100.  00 

Mrs.  Russell  A.  Alger,  Grosse  Pointe,  32  Lake  Shore  Rd   100.  00 

J.  S.  Moroton,  Benton  Harbor,  501  Territorial  Rd   100.  00 

R.  C.  Eisley,  Benton  Harbor,  546  Columbus  Ave   100.  00 

James  P.  Dixon,  Benton  Harbor   100.00 

Russ  D.  Jenks,  St.  Clair,  115  S.  Riverside  Ave   100.  00 

Hon.  Burt  D.  Cady,  Port  Huron   100.  00 

Hon.  Franklin  Moore,  St.  Clair,  722  Riverside  Ave   100.  00 

Herbert  H.  Dow,  Midland   300.  00 

J.  S.  Gilmore,  Kalamazoo,  516  South  Street   100.  00 

Cliarles  A.  Blaney,  Kalamazoo,  303  Douglass  Ave   150.  00 

Hale  P.  Kauffer,  Kalamazoo,  323  Sonth  Rose  St   100.  00 

Donald  C.  Osborn,  Kalamazoo,  308  Press  Bldg   200.  00 

Joseph  E.  Brown,  Kalamazoo,  1040  W.  Main  St   100.  00 

C.  A.  Peck,  Kalamazoo,  400  Peck  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  B.  Connable,  Kalamazoo,  400  Peck  Bldg   .100.00 

H.  S.  Humphery,  Kalamazoo,  140  Carmel  St   100.  00 

L.  H.  Thullen,  Grand  Rapids.  528  Terrace   200.  00 

Frank  B.  Leland,  Detroit,  206  Griswold  St   500.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

George  H.  Boyd,  Saginaw,  care  of  Booth  &  Boyd  Lumber  Co   100.  00 

Peter  Corcoran,  Saginaw   100.  00 

J.  F.  Walton,  Sturgis   100.  00 

C.  W.  Kirsch,  Sturgis   100.  00 

E.  J.  Dayton,  Detroit,  334  University  PL,  Grosse  Pointe   100.  00 

E.  H.  Bingham,  Detroit,  Solvav  Process  Co   500.  00 

Wm.  J.  Gray,  Detroit,  870  E.  Jefferson  Ave   500.00 

Harry  J.  Fox,  Detroit,  Central  Saving  Bank   100.  00 

Lawrence  D.  Buhl,  Detroit,  Buhl  Stamping  Co   1,  000.  00 

A.  E.  Curtenius,  Kalamazoo,  435  Stuart  Ave   100.  00 

Louis  P.  Simon,  Kalamazoo   100.  00 

June  7,  1920: 

John  Jeffers,  Saginaw   100.00 

F.  D.  Ewen,  Saginaw,  302  N.  Jefferson   100.  00 

Fred  Buck,  Saginaw,  855  Owen  St   125.00 

W.  C.  Cornwell,  Saginaw   100.  00 

E.  Carrington,  Saginaw,  care  of  Mershcm  Eddy  Parker  Co   100.00 

C.  C.  Davidson,  Iron  Mountain   500.  00 

William  Kelly,  Vulcan  1  150.  00 

M.  J.  Fox,  Iron  Mountain   150.00 

C.  E.  Nelson,  Three  Rivers   100.00 

June  8,  1920: 

Standish  Backus,  Detroit,  Burroughs  Adding  Mach   500.  00 

Joseph  Boyer,  Detroit,  637  Woodward  Ave   1,  000.  00 


2168 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


MINNESOTA. 

Mar.  15,  1920: 

Theodore  Scluilze,  St.  Paul   $1,000.00 

Apr.  10,  1920: 

Earl  Savage,  Minneapolis   150.  00 

MISSISSIPPI. 

May  25,  1920: 

L.  E.  O  dham,  Oxford   100.00 

M.  J.  Mulvihill,  Vicksburg   500.00 

J.  S.  Niles,  Kosciusko   250.00 

A.  M.  Storer,  Kosciusko   100.00 

E.  E.  Hindman,  Jackson   100.00 

E.  F.  Brennan,  jr.,  Brookhaven   100.  00 

M.  H.  Daily,  Coldwater   100.00 

MISSOURI. 

Mar.  6,  1920: 

Irvin  R.  Kirkwood,  Kansas  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  W.  Armour,  Kansas  City   1,000.00 

E.  D.  Nims,  St.  Louis   500.00 

Theodore  Gary,  Kansas  City   500.00 

Robert  J.  Flick,  Kansas  City   500.00 

W.  I.  Diffenderffer,  Lebanon   250.  00 

Chas.  S.  Keith,  Kansas  City   500.00 

H.  L.  Gary,  Kansas  City   250.  00 

A.  F.  Adams,  Kansas  City   250.  00 

Joseph  J.  Heim,  Kansas  City   500.  00 

A.  C.  Jobes,  Kansas  City   250.  00 

Wallace  J.  Ferry,  Kansas  City   250.  00 

Clive  G.  Shaw,  Missouri  City   100.00 

I.  A.  Vant,  South  St.  Joseph   1,  000.  00 

William  Volker,  Kansas  City   1,  000.  00 

Kate  McM.  Dickey  (Mrs.  Walter  S.),  Kansas  City   500.00 

Mar.  27,  1920: 

Theron  E.  Catlin,  St.  Louis,  Security  Bklg   250.00 

Aniedee  N.  Cole,  St.  Louis,  Railway  Exchange  Bldg-   125.  00 

Joseph  D.  Bascom,  St.  Louis,  805  No.  Main  St   250.  00- 

Mar.  31,  1920 : 

W.  K.  Bixby,  St.  Louis   500.  00 

P.  G.  Walton,  Kansas  City  —  250.00 

John  H.  Bovard,  Kansas  City   200.00 

Apr.  2,  1920 : 

M.  Kotany,  St.  Louis   100.00 

Jno.  F.  Queeny,  St.  Louis   250.00 

Jaccard,  W.  M.  &  E.  A.,  Kansas  City   750.  00 

Apr.  5,  1920 : 

Houston,  Fible  &  Co.,  Kansas  City   500.  00 

Irvin  R.  Kirkwood,  Kansas  City   1,000.00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

Edward  Mallinckrodt,  St.  Louis   500.00 

Apr.  12,  1920 : 

Bessie  Barker  Bruegeeman,  St.  Louis--^   1,000.00 

Apr.  28,  1920 : 

F.  V.  Hammar,  St.  Louis,  Ry.  Exch.  Bldg   100.  00 

May  6, 1920 : 

W.  C.  Henning,  St.  Louis,  5909  Kennerly  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Harry  J.  Leschen,  St.  Louis,  5909  Kennerly  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Jacob  L.  Babler,  St.  Louis,  International  Ins.  Co   500.  00 

C.  M.  Skinner,  St.  Louis,  306-308  W.  4th  St   500.  00 

W.  K.  Stanard,  St.  Louis,  Pierce  Bldg   500.  00 

C.  E.  Ross,  St.  Louis.  21st  &  Locust  St   500.  00 

A.  C.  Brown,  St.  Louis,  12th  cSi  Washington  Ave   500.  00 

H.  Cohn,  St.  Louis,  0212  Waterman  Ave   500.  00 

Fred  L.  Westerbeck,  St.  Louis,  128  Madison  St   300.  00 

Wm.  Lvthman,  St.  Louis,  foot  of  Angelica  St   250.  00 

Thos.  H.  Qright,  St.  Louis,  33  Westmoreland  PI   250.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2169 

May  6.  192<3 — Continued. 

John  Staunch,  St.  Louis,  3144  W.  Broadway   $250.  00 

Wni.  L.  Neikamp,  St.  Louis,  1230  W.  Main  St   250.  00 

Charles  E.  Thomas,  St.  Louis.  Hall  &  Angelrodt   250.  00 

E.  T.  Stanard.  St.  Louis,  4512  \Y.  Pine  St   250.  00 

O.  S.  Tilton,  Pierce  Bldg   250.  00 

C.  D.  Johnson,  St.  Louis,  3080  Hawthorne  PI   250.  00 

Fred  Krey,  St.  Louis,  21st  &  Bremer  Ave   250.  00 

Chas.  E.  Kimball,  St.  Louis,  1015  Federal  Res-erve   250.  00 

Wm.  Lewin,  St.  Louis,  23  Branch  St   200.  00 

Jno.  A.  Leschen,  St.  Louis.  20  Kingsbury  PI   200.  00 

Frank  W.  Feuerbacker.  St.  Louis,  159  Miller  St   200.  00 

H.  E.  Schultz,  jr..  St.  Louis,  3136  Grand  Ave   200.  00 

Henry  Luedinghaus,  St.  Louis,  1721  Broadway   200.  00 

Jos.  Mathes,  St.  Louis.  3120  N.  Broadway   200.00 

Louis  H.  Waltke,  St.  Louis',  2nd  &  E.  Grand  Ave   200.  00 

Arthur  Thatcher,  St.  Louis.  900  Security  Bldg   200.  00 

Alfred  Clifford,  St.  Louis,  Security  Bldg   200.  00 

Wm.  L.  Boeckler,  St.  Louis,  3600  N.  Flail  St   200.  00 

Henry  A.  Boeckler,  St.  Louis,  3600  N.  Hall  St   200.  00  • 

Stewart  McDonald,  St.  Louis,  24  Washington  Terrace   200.  00 

R.  W.  Shapleigh,  St.  Louis.  305  Washington  Ave   200.  00 

Geo.  E.  W.  Luehrman,  St.  Louis,  150  Carrol   150.  00 

F.  E.  Nulsen.  St  Louis,  727  Boatman's  Bk.  Bldg   150.  00 

Thos.  W.  Gerland,  St.  Louis,  409  Broadway   125.  00 

J.  A.  Berninghaus.  6343  Pershing  Ave   125.  00 

W.  O.  Schock,  St.  Louis,  415  Pine  St   125.  00 

Chas.  W.  Whitelaw.  St.  Louis   100.  00 

L.  G.  Blackmer,  St.  Louis,  1026  Boatman's  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  E.  Blackmer,  St.  Louis,  13  Maple  St   100.  00 

E.  L.  Blackmer,  St.  Louis,  1026  Boatmen's  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

F.  H.  Kriesmann,  St.  Louis,  4362  :McPherson  Ave   100.  00 

H.  G.  Mudd,  St.  Louis,  Humbolt  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  C.  Moon,  St.  Louis,  3843  Pine   100.  00 

John  A.  Meisel,  St.  Louis,  910  Washington  Ave   100.  00 

Louis  Boeger,  St.  Louis,  N.  St.  Louis  Sav.  Tr.  Co   100.  00 

J.  Henry  Conrades,  jr.,  St.  Louis,  1942  N.  2nd  St   100.  00 

F.  A.  Luyties,  St.  Louis,  4200  Laclede  Ave   100.  00 

Edward  Hidden,  St.  Louis,  3663  Lindell  Ave   100.00 

G  .V.  Brecht,  St.  Louis,  1201  Cass  Ave   100.  00 

Thos.  S.  Lytle,  St.  Louis,  406  Rialto  Bldg   100.  00 

Geo.  C.  R.  Wagoner,  St.  Louis,  3621  Olive  St   100.  00 

Jr.  J.  Stocke,  St.  Louis   100.  00 

L.  Stockstrom,  St.  Louis.  Hawthorne  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  Howard  Thompkins,  St.  Louis,  306  N.  2nd  St   100.00 

H.  W.  Geller,  St.  Louis,  412  N.  4th  St   100.  00 

Chas.  F.  Joy,  St.  Louis,  City  Hall   100.00 

Julius  C.  Birge,  St.  Louis,  Ames  Shovel  &  Tool  Co   100.  00 

Albert  Blair,  St.  Louis,  Pierce  Bhlg   100  00 

Joseph  M.  Bryson,  St.  Louis,  Railway  Exch   100.  00 

Albert  T.  Perkins,  St.  Louis,  4906  Argyle  Av6   100  00 

J.  W.  Scudder,  St.  Louis,  501  Clard  Ave   100.  00 

Geo.  T.  Riddle,  St.  Louis,  Franklin  Bank   100.  00 

Julian  Simon,  St.  Louis,  Shapleigh  Hdw.  Co   100.  00 

J.  B.  Shapleigh,  Humbolt  Bldg   100.  00 

Thomas  Connors,  St.  Louis,  2507  N.  Broadway   100.  00 

R.  S.  Niedringhaus,  St.  Louis,  Broadway  and  Benton   100.  00 

O.  E.  Niedringhaus,  St.  Louis,  4647  Pershing  Ave   100.  00 

Henry  E.  Pank,  St.  Louis,  5374  Delmar  Ave   100.  00 

A.  H.  Haeseler,  St.  Louis,  621  Weinwright  Bldg   100.00 

Chas.  Wunderlick,  St.  Louis,  821  (Uinton  St   100.  00 

Martin  Lammert,  St.  Louis,  4490  Lindell  Blvd   100.  00 

Robt.  S.  Brcfokings,  St.  Louis,  6510  Ellenwood  Ave   100.  00 

Harry  B.  Wallace,  St.  Louis,  4776  Pershing  Ave   100.  00 

A.  C.  Luekiug,  St.  Louis,  16th  and  Washington   100.  00 

Adolph  M.  Diez,  St.  Louis.  828  W.  Broadway   100.  00 

Fred  Meyer,  St.  Louis,  Main  &  Brooklvn   100*.  00 

R.  L.  Dutton,  St.  Louis,  102  Merchants  St   100.  00 


2170 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  6,  1920— Continued. 

C.  J.  Hartnian,  JSt.  Lonis,  2000  N.  SecondSt   $100.  (K) 

C.  R.  Burkbart,  St.  Louis   100  00 

J.  W.  Jarboe,  St.  Louis,  1900  N.  19tli  St   lOo!  00 

W.  A.  Meletio,  St.  Louis,  414  Franklin  Ave   100.00 

Fred  (J.  Lake,  St.  Louis,  care  of  Nugents   100.  00 

A.  p].  Winkeniej^er,  St.  Louis,  1101  N.  5th  St   100.  00 

Robt.  Meyer,  St.  Louis,  32.52  Longfellow  Road   100.  00 

Ben  Harris,  St.  Louis,  28  So.  2nd  St   100.  00 

Marcus  Harris,  St.  Louis,  28  S.  2nd  St   100  00 

A.  H.  Reller,  St.  Louis,  3600  W.  Broadway  j   lOO.  00 

Geo.  E.  Hibbard,  St.  Louis,  3125  N.  Broadway   100.  00 

Frank  Haggenjoz,  St.  Louis,  601  Red  Bud  Ave   100.  00 

J.  T.  Rombaur,  St.  Louis,  3638  Flora   100.00 

C.  N.  Whitehead,  St.  Louis,  1506  Ry.  Exch   100.  00 

Harry  Troll,  St.  Louis,  1506  Ry.  Exch   100.  00 

Louis  Alt,  St.  Louis,  2nd  and  Olive   100.  00 

J.  B.  Wolff,  St.  Louis,  Broadway  and  Washington   100.  00  " 

R.  C.  Frampton,  St.  Louis,  3301  Locust  St   100.  00 

S.  E.  Hoffman,  St.  Louis,  4450  Westminster  PI   100.  00 

Walter  H.  Petring,  St.  Louis,  1001  Spruce  St   100.  00 

Geo.  H.  Perring,  St.  Louis,  1001  Spruce  St   100.  00 

Chas.  S.  Brown,  St.  Louis,  1913  N.  Broadway   lOf).  00 

W.  G.  Elson,  St.  Louis,  325  Locust   100.  00 

W.  Arthur  Stickney,  St.  Louis,  412  Olive  St   100.  00 

H.  S.  Albrecht,  St.  Louis,  712  N.  2nd  St   100.  00 

O.  E.  Buder,  St.  Louis,  700  Times  Bldg   100.  00 

Geo.  F.  Tower,  jr.,  St.  Louis,  27  Vandeventer  PI   100.  00 

Ed  Elson,  St.  Louis,  4th  and  Locust   100.  00 

T.  Rubenstein.  St.  Louis,  901  Lucas  Ave   100.  00 

P.  R.  Blackmer,  St.  Louis,  1026  Boatmens  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

C.  A.  Doolittle,  St.  Louis,  Boatmens  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

C.  L.  Wliittemore,  St.  Louis,  926  Pierce  Bldg   100.  00 

Oscar  Herf,  St.  Louis,  929  Pierce  Bldg   100.  00 

Anderson  Gratz,  St.  Louis,  1012  Rialto  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

T.  O.  Maloney,  St.  Louis,  7th  and  Hickory   300.  00 

W.  G.  Yantis,  St.  Louis,  5077  Westminster  PI   100.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

Clinton  H.  Crane,  New  York,  N.  Y.,  61  Broadway   500.  00 

W.  M.  Klenk,  St.  Louis   100.  00 

John  J.  O'Fallon,  St.  Louis   500.  00 

May  11,  1920: 

Louis  B.  Woodward,  St.  Louis   250.  00 

H.  S.  Gardner,  St.  Louis   250.  00 

Walter  B.  Woodward,  St.  Louis   250.  (M> 

Wm.  H.  Gregg,  St.  Louis   100.00 

J.  H.  Howe,  St.  Louis,  319  S.  4th  St   100.  Ot* 

F.  G.  &  W^m.  E.  A.  Christmann,  St.  Louis,  3750  N.  ^nd  St   100.  00 

Sol  A.  Rothschild,  St.  Louis,  1100  Washington  Ave   100.  00 

S.  I.  Rothschild,  1100  Washington  Ave   100.00 

Chas.  F.  Bates,  St.  Louis,  4325  Westminster  PI   100.  00 

Hy  Mueller,  St.  Louis,  3630  Humphrey   100.  00 

May  13,  1920 : 

A.  T.  Goldsmith,  St.  Louis,  100  S.  Conunercial   100.  00 

Louis  A.  Hoerr,  St.  Louis,  705  Olive  St   125.  00 

C.  R.  D.  Meier,  St.  Louis,  care  of  Heine  Safety  Boiler   250.  00 

May  16,  1920 : 

Charles  E.  Bascom,  St.  Louis,  805  Main  St.   250.  00 

John  D.  Filley,  St.  Louis,  40  W.  Moreland  St   125.  00 

O.  H.  Peckham,  St.  Louis,  4382  Westminster   125.00 

Jos.  D.  Bascom,  St.  Louis,  809  Main  St   250.  00 

Wm.  Bagnell,  St.  Louis,  727  Title  Garnt.  Bldg   250.  00 

O.  G.  Stark,  St.  Louis,  4058  Flora  Blvd   100.  00 

Walter  R.  Medart,  St.  Louis,  Potomac  &  DeKalb   250.  00 

A.  A.  Fuererbacher,  St.  Louis,  159  Miller  St   100.00 

J.  F.  Downing,  St.  Louis,  care  of  New  England  Nat.  Bk   .500.  00 

Arthur  L.  Broderick,  St.  Louis,  805  N.  Main   250.  00 

John  K.  Broderick,  St.  Louis,  805  N.  Main  St   250.  00 


4 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2171 

Mav  18,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Cornelia  R.  Luedinghaus,  St.  Louis,  32  Gast  Place   $100.  00 

May  19,  1920 : 

P.  D.  C.  Ball,  St.  Louis   250.00 

May  25,  1920 : 

Harry  J.  Steinbreder,  St.  Louis,  Fulton  Iron  Works   100.  00 

May  28,  1920 : 

George  V.  Hagerty,  St.  Louis,  Hotel  Chatham   1, 000.  00 

F.  E.  Codding,  St.  Louis,  Wellston  Post  Office   100.  00 

June  1,  1920 : 

M.  A.  Dickey,  Kansas  City,  care  of  W.  S.  Dickey   500.  00 

K.  McM.  Dickey,  Kansas  City,  care  of  W.  S.  Dickey   500.  00 

George  Warren  Brown,  St.  Louis,  307  Advertising  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

June  2,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Josephine  Halsell,  Kansas  City,  1601  W.  57th  St   125.  00 

Mrs.  Irwin  Kirkwood,  Kansas  City,  4520  Kenwood   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  C.  A.  Braley,  Kansas  City,  1405  Dunford  Circle   500.  00 

June  7,  1920 : 

J.  D.  Rankin,  Tarkio   100.  00 

Esther  R.  Giffen,  Tarkio   100.  00 

W.  D.  Rankin,  Tarkio   1,  000.  00 

J.  E.  Travis,  Tarkio   100.  00 

J.  B.  Shaum,  Tarkio   100.00 

John  A.  Rankin,  sr.,  Tarkio   100.  00 

L.  C.  Hamilton,  St.  Joseph,  1600  Ashland  Blvd   500.  00 

June  8,  1920 : 

George  E.  Nicholson,  Kansas  City,  820  Com.  Bldg   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  H.  Thwing,  Kansas  City,  642  E.  36th  St   250.  00 

June  10,  1920 : 

Helen  Davis,  St.  Louis,  Mo.,  16  Portland  Place   500.  00 

June  11,  1920: 

T.  W.  Harkless,  Lamar   100.00 

Benjamin  Davis,  Lamar   100.  00 

A.  A.  Tibbe,  Washington   100.00 

Daniel  Haid,  jr.,  Berger   100.  00 

J.  W.  Hanna,  Tarkio   100.00 

J.  A.  Christensen,  Tarkio   100.  00 

R.  S.  Harvey,  Eldon   100.00 

Thomas  J.  Franks,  Joplin   100.00 

A.  E.  Spencer,  .Joplin   100.00 

George  W.  Moore,  Joplin   100.  00 

MONTANA. 

May  28,  1920: 

F.  M.  Wall,  Roundup   100.00 

J.  E.  Edwards,  Forsyth   100.00 

J.  B.  Ghose,  317  East  Commercial  Ave.,  Anaconda   100.  00 

C.  H.  McLeod,  324  East  Front  St.,  Missoula   250.  00 

Charles  R.  Leonard  Buttee,  St.  Ignatius,  Daly  Bk.  &  Tr.  Co.  Bldg_  100.  00 
June  7,  1920: 

N.  B.  Holter,  Helena,  the  Holter  Co   100.  00 

T.  B.  Miller,  Helena,  802  Benton  Ave   100.  00 

C.  B.  Power,  Helena,  642  Dearborn   100.00 

Dr.  O.  M.  Lanstrmn,  Helena,  802  Madison   150.00 

T.  A.  Marlow,  Helena,  626  Harrison  Ave   250.  00. 

C.  W.  Goodale,  Butte,  Hennessy  Bldg   100.  00 

Frank  Eliel,  Dillou___   100.00 

NEBRASKA. 

Mar.  4,  1920: 

Walter  W.  Head,  Omaha,  %  Omaha  National  Bank   250.  00 

John  F.  Stout,  Omaha,  Omaha  National  Bank  Building   250.  00 

N.  B.  Updike,  Omaha,  Grain  Exchange   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  25,  1920: 

Frank  B.  Johnson,  Om-aha   500.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

J.  E.  Davidson,  Omaha   500.00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

Arthur  C.  Smith,  Omaha,  %  M.  E.  Smith  &  Co   500.  00 


2172 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Apr.  21,  1920: 

Walter  A.  Head,  Omaha   $250.00 

May  15,  1920 : 

N.  B.  Updike,  Omaha,  Grain  Exchange   1,000.00 

J.  L.  Brandeis  &  Sons,  Omaha,  Brandei.s  Stores   1,  000.  00 

George  A.  Roberts,  Omaha,  230  Graw  Ex   1,  000.  00 

F.  H.  Davis  and  C.  T.,  Omaha   250.  00 

Konntze,  Omaha,  1st  Nafl  Bl£   .500.  00 

J.  E.  Davidson,  Omaha,  Nebrasl^a  Power  Co   500.  00 

Arthur  C.  Smith,  Omalia,  1303  Perli  Ave   500.  00 

John  F.  Stout,  Omaha,  524  Omjiha  Nat.  Banli  Building   250.  00 

F.  B.  Johnson,  Omaha,  Omaha  Printing  Co   500.  00 

E.  R.  Guerney,  Omaha,  Lion  Bonding  Co   250.  00 

Charles  Stuart,  Lincoln,  .522  Terminal  Building   250.  00 

NEW  MEXICO. 

Mar.  25,  1920 : 

W.  A.  Hawkins,  El  Paso,  Tex.,  E.  P.  &  S.  W.  Bldg   250.  00 

C.  T.  Brown,  Socorro   100.  00 

J.  M.  Raynolds,  Albuquerque,  318  S.  High  St   500.  00 

H.  O.  Bursum,  Socorro   500.00 

Charles  Springer,  Cimarron   500.  00 

G.  E.  Bruce,  Albuquerque   500.00 

W.  D.  Murray,  Silver  City   250.  00 

Victor  Culberson,  Silver  City   250.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

Edward  Sargent,  Chama   250.00 

Apr.  6,  1920: 

J.  Van  Houten,  Raton   500.  00 

Gregory  Page,  Albuquerque  ^   500.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920: 

E.  A.  Cahoon,  Roswell   500.00 

Apr.  28,  1920 : 

H.  W.  Kelly,  East  Las  Vegas   250.  00 

May  12,  1920: 

Louis  Ilfeld,  Albuquerque,  Copper  Ave   100.  00 

J.  M.  Sully,  Santa  Rita   500.00 

May  25,  1920 : 

S.  B.  Davis,  Las  Vegas   200.  00 

June  1,  1920 : 

Gregory  Page,  Gallup  1   150.  00 

Louis  C.  Ilfeld,  Las  Vegas  —  500.  00 

May  22,  1920: 

T.  H.  O'Brien,  Douglas,  Ariz   300.  00 

NORTH  CAROLINA. 

Mar.  6,  1920 : 

E.  A.  Smith,  Kings  Mountain   500.  00 

Mar.  23,  1920: 

John  C.  Pass,  Roxboro   100.00 

J.  Elwood  Cox,  High  Point   200.00 

Apr.  19,  1920 : 

Stuart  W.  Cramer,  Charlotte   1.000.00 

May  3,  1920 : 

R.  M.  Miller,  jr.,  Charlotte   100.00 

May  14,  1920 : 

W.  S.  Lee,  Charlotte   250.00 

June  3,  1920 : 

C.  C.  Robbins,  High  Point   150.00 

NORTH  DAKOTA. 

June  1,  1920 : 

Gunder  Olson,  Grafton   1,  501.  75 

R.  S.  Lewis,  Fargo   875.00 

Judge  N.  C.  Young,  Fargo   875.  00 

Treadwell  Twitchell,  Fargo   875.00 

B.  F.  Spaulding,  Fargo   873.25 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2173 

NEW  YORK. 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

F.  B.  Wiborg,  New  York   $500.00 

Apr.  12,  1920 : 

George  W.  Hill,  New  York,  111  Fifth  Ave   1,  000.  00 

OHIO. 

June  10,  1920 : 

Albert  A.  Schiichert,  Tole<lo,  Mich,  and  Orange  Sts   250.  00 

Charles  L.  Casev,  Cambridge,  617  No.  7th  St   100.  00 

John  R.  Hall,  Quaker  City   100.  00 

Hugo  Stein.  Cincinnati,  Pugh  Bldg   500.  00 

J.  Stacy  Hill,  Cincinnati,  Walnut  St   100.  00 

Allison  Bishopric,  Cincinnati,  Winton  Place   100.  00 

L.  B.  Cahill,  Cincinnati   500.00 

June  11,  1920 : 

Wm.  Cook  Rogers,  Piqua  L   200.00 

Mar.  1,  1920 : 

W.  D.  Brickell.  Columbus,  Ruggers  Bldg   500.00 

B.  G.  Dawes,  Columbus,  840  E.  Broad  St   1,  000.  00 

S.  Edwin  Smith,  Columbus,  110  W.  Long  St   1,  000.  00 

Monroe  Rosenthal,  Columbus,  P.  O.  Box  446   500.  00 

Eugene  Rosenthal,  Columbus,  P.  O.  Box  446   500.  00 

D.  A.  Rizer,  Columbus,  P.  O.  Box  446   500.  00 

Mar.  2,  1920 : 

J.  J.  Burchenal,  Cincinnati,  Gwynne  Bldg   500.  00 

A.  J.  Jones,  Cincinnati,  Acme  INIch.  Tool  Co   250.  00 

Harry  L.  Laws,  Cincinnati,  1st  Nat.  Bk.  Bldg   500.  00 

F.  D.  Lawrence,  Cincinnati,  219  W.  4th  St   100.  00 

Leland  G.  Banning,  Cincinnati,  1801  1st  Nat.  Bk.  Bd   500.00 

L.  A.  Ault,  Cincinnati,  Elmhurst  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  9,  1920 : 

Albert  Scholl,  Chillicothe,  18  W.  Main  St   100.00 

J.  D.  Steele,  Xenia,  Galloway  St   200.  00 

Geo.  R.  Kelly,  Xenia,  2nd  St   100.  00 

George  Little,  Xenia,  Kind  Street   200.  00 

Mar.  12,  1920 : 

J.  C.  Campbell,  Columbus,  Nat'l  Bk.  of  Comm   800.  00 

Mrs.  John  G.  Battelle,  Columbus,  662  E.  Town  St   ,  500.  00 

H.  W.  McMunn,  Pittsburgh,  330  Mel  wood  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Malcolm  Jennings,  Columbus,  772  Franklin  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  15,  1920 : 

C.  H.  &  C.  R.  Lindenberg,  Columbus   250.  00 

F.  W.  Crawford,  Columbus,  52  West  Gay  St   500.  00 

S.  C.  Bush,  Columbus,  Buckeye  Steel  Cast   500.  00 

Carl  J.  Hoster,  Columbus,  the  Hoster  Realty  Co   1,  000.  00 

George  J.  Hoster,  Columbus,  the  Hoster  Realty  Co   1,  000.  00 

Emil  W.  Hoster,  Columbus,  the  Hoster  Realty  Co   1,  000.  00 

Louis  W.  Hoster,  Columbus,  the  Hoster  Realty  Co   1,  000.  00 

Carl  L.  Hoster,  Columbus,  the  Hoster  Realty  Co   1,  000.  00 

R.  L.  Wolfe,  Columbus,  714  E.  Broad  St   500.  00 

Edgar  T.  Wolfe,  Columbus.  714  E.  Broad  St   500.  00 

Arthur  C.  Johnson,  Columbus,  227  Preston  Rd   500.  00 

B.  C.  Hommon,  Columbus,  1646  Bryden  Rd   500.  00 

Ralph  Hirsch.  Bexlev   500.00 

Chas.  H.  Garrish,  Columbus,  1789  N.  4th  St   500.  00 

Geo.  Fowler,  Columbus,  380  Kendall  Place   500.  00 

A.  E.  Campbell,  Columbus,  883  Whittier  St   500.  00 

Paul  Eisele,  Columbus,  624  S.  18th  St   500.  00 

Harvey  R.  Young,  Columbus,  1905  Indianaola  Ave   500.  00 

John  G.  Deshler,  Columbus,  901  Hayden  Bldg   500.  00 

R.  S.  Warner,  Columbus,  8  E.  Broad  St   500.  00 

Harry  F.  West,  Columbus,  1214  Madison  Ave   500.  00 

T.  P.  Linn,  Columbus,  79  S.  Monroe  Ave   500.  00 

Charles  M.  Wing,  Columbus,  New  1st  Nat'l  Bk.  Bldg   400.  00 

Henry  C.  Werner,  Columbus,  New  1st  Nat'l  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

182774— 20— PT  15  6 


2174 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mar.  19,  1920 : 

J.  H.  Frantz,  Columbus,  box  1381   $500.  00 

Gordon  Battelle,  Columbus,  Huntington  Bk.  Bd   500.  00 

J.  M.  Beatty,  Columbus,  36  N.  Monroe  Ave   500.  00 

F.  W.  Schumacher,  Columbus,  750  East  Broad  St   250.  00 

T.  L.  Stein,  Columbus,  Ohio  Nat'l  Bank   500.  00 

F.  A.  Miller,  Columbus,  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.  00 

Herbert  E.  Patterson,  Columbus,  1573  Inglis  Ave   500.00 

J.  Elmer  Jones,  Columbus,  1125  Lincoln  Road   500.  00 

Chas.  L.  Ims,  Columbus,  402  Fairwood  Ave   500.  00 

E.  E.  Lerch,  Columbus,  care  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.  00 

Williams  Brooks,  Columbus,  care  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.  00 

John  E.  Lerch,  Columbus,  care  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.00 

W.  A.  Miller,  Columbus,  care  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.  00 

Frank  J.  Kaufman,  Columbus,  123  E.  Broad  St   500.  00 

Herman  J.  Kaufman,  Columbus,  H.  C.  Godman  Co   500.  00 

Mar.  22,  1920 : 

J.  P.  Davis,  Columbus,  Long  and  Third  Sts   250.  00 

J.  F.  Stone,  Columbus   500.00 

H.  Willoughby,  Columbus,  Long  and  Third  Sts   250.00 

W.  W.  Ross,  Columbus,  Long  and  Third  Sts   500.  00 

W.  K.  Ballantyne,  Cincinnati   100.  00 

Mar.  23,  1920 : 

Rud  K.  Hynicka,  Cincinnati,  Wiggins  Block   1,000.00 

J.  J.  Rowe,  Cincinnati,  2347  Madison  Rd   1,  000.  00 

J.  C.  Mayer,  Cincinnati,  J.  C.  Mayer  Co   100.  00 

Eli  Winkler,  Cincinnati   500.00 

A.  H.  Thomas,  Columbus,  Lincoln  Hotel   100.  00 

Mar.  25,  1920 : 

E.  W.  Edwards,  Cincinnati   1,000.00 

B.  W.  Campbell,  Cincinnati,  622  Broadway   500.  00 

Mar.  27,  1920 : 

Robert  H.  Doepke,  Cincinnati   500.  00 

J.  J.  Jennings,  Columbus   500.00 

Richard  P.  Ernst,  Cincinnati,  1st  Nat.  Bk.  Bldg   100.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

Simon  Lazarus,  Columbus,  High  &  Town  St   1,  000.  00 

Fred  Lazarus,  jr.,  Columbus,  High  &  Town  St   1,  000.  00 

Robert  Lazarus,  Columbus,  High  &  Town  St   1,  000.  00 

Jeffrey  Lazarus,  Columbus,  High  &  Town  St   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  W.  Gillette,  Columbus,  High  &  Town  St  —  1,  000.  00 

Harry  L.  Law,  Cincinnati   100.  00 

J.  C.  Miller,  Columbus   500.  00 

Apr.  1.  1920 : 

I.  J.  Cooper,  Cincinnati   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  5,  1920 : 

F.  V.  Knauss,  Portsmouth,  836  8th  St  ,   100.  00 

W.  H.  Stackhouse,  Springfield,  care  French  «&  Hecht   1,  000.  00 

H.  C.  Downey,  Springfield,  care  W.  C.  Downey  Co   100.  00 

A.  L.  Kelly,  Springfield   1,  000.  00 

H.  V.  Bretney,  Springfield,  care  H.  V.  Bretney  Co   250.  00 

Jas.  L.  Geddes,  Springfield,  East  High  Street   1, 000.  00 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

F.  R.  Huntington,  Columbus   500.00 

Apr.  9,  1920 : 

John  W.  Milburn,  Cincinnati,  care  H.  Seinsheimer  Co   500.  00 

Mrs.  W.  T.  Simpson,  Cincinnati,  1750  Cedarville   100.  00 

Frank  H.  Simpson,  Cincinnati,  2101  Union  Cent.  Bldg   100.  00 

Michael  Dumler,  Cincinnati,  2103  Union  Cent.  Bldg   100.  00 

M.  T.  Watts,  Cincinnati,  Citizens  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 

Justin  A.  Rollman,  Cincinnati,  5th  &  Vine  St   100.  00 

L.  R.  Minster,  Cincinnati,  5th  &  Vine  St   100.  00 

Henry  Rollman,  Cincinnati,  5th  &  Vine  St   100.  00 

Apr.  12,  1920 : 

J.  B.  Cartmell,  Cincinnati,  First  Nat'l  Bank   250.  00 

R.  S.  Warner,  Columbus,  8  E.  Broad  St   500.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2175 

Apr.  13,  1920: 

Herbert  I.  Cbauner,  Cincinnati   $250.  00 

Apr.  14,  1920 : 

H.  G.  French,  Cincinnati   250.00 

Apr.  20,  1920 : 

B.  J,  Kroger,  Cincinnati   500.  00 

George  A.  Sawyer,  Cincinnati   100.  00 

Mary  C.  Emery,  Cincinnati,  414  Walnut  St   500.  00 

G.  &  M.  S.  Roberts,  Columbus,  921  Mt.  .Vernon  Ave   100.  00 

J.  E.  Galvin,  Lima   1,  000.  00 

Glen  C.  Webb,  Lima,  56  Public  Square   100.  00 

A.  J.  Dunn,  Lima,  601  Savings  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920 : 

Charles  W.  Montgomery,  Newark,  106  Granville  St   250.  00 

C.  L.,  W.  A.  &  L.  E.  Bauer,  Springfield,  Sheridan  Ave   500.  00 

E.  N.  Lupfer,  Springfield,  1660  E.  High  St   500.  00 

John  Weckham,  Springfield,  2021  E.  High  St   500.  00 

Carl  Krippendorf,  Cincinnati,  622  Sycamore  St   250.  00 

Julius  G.  Lamson,  Toledo,  2056  Scottwood  Ave   250,  00 

F.  C.  Johnson,  Springfield   1,  000.  00 

B.  J.  Westcott,  Springfield   1,  000.  00 

T.  W.  Ludlow,  Springfield   250.00 

R.  E.  Field,  Cincinnati   100.00 

Apr.  23,  1920: 

John  S.  James,  Columbus,  Outlook  Bldg   250.  00 

J.  K.  Williams,  Springfield   500.00 

A.  B.  &  Allen  A.  Nolte,  Springfield   100.  00 

W.  B.  Sisson,  Columbus,  505  Commercial  Bldg   100.  00 

R.  S.  McVeigh,  Cincinnati,  Rose  Hill  Apartments   100.  00 

Walter  A.  Jones,  Columbus,  415  Outlook  Bldg   500.  00 

Apr.  26,  1920: 

John  G.  Holters,  Cincinnati,  2.531  Cook  St   250.  00 

Geo.  H.  Thompson,  Columbus,  236  15th  Ave   250.  00 

George  B.  Wilson,  Cincinnati,  Globe  Soap  Co   175.  00 

R.  L.  Higley,  Cincinnati,  Globe  Soap  Co   125.00 

W.  G.  Bouche,  Cincinnati   125.  00 

Archil)ald  Cami)bell,  Cincinnati   125.  00 

Apr.  28,  1920 : 

Roe  Emerson,  Newark,  106  Hudson  Ave   100.  00 

Beazell  &  Chatfield,  Cincinnati,  518  Union  Cent.  Bldg   125.  00 

April  30,  1920 : 

Ralph  H.  Thatcher,  Springfield   100.00 

May  1,  1920 : 

E.  B.  &  E.  T.  Mitchell,  Lima   500.  00 

W.  L.  Parmenter,  Lima   100.00 

M.  P.  Colt,  Lima   250.00 

John  R.  Hastings,  Lima   1,000.00 

F.  G.  W^right,  Lima  1   1,000.00 

Henry  Deisel,  sr.,  Lima,  312  S.  Coe  St   500.  00 

Wm.  J.  Wemmer,  Lima,  616  W.  Market   500.  00 

R.  J.  Plate,  Lima   .500.00 

H.  G.  Wemmer,  Lima   500.00 

May  4.  1920 : 

H.  G.  Root,  Springfield   500.  00 

May  12,  1920 : 

Simon  Labold,  Portsmouth,  633  Fourth  St   100.  00 

AV.  G.  Wilson,  Cleveland  •   .500.00 

Geo.  Puchta,  Cincinnati   700.00 

D.  ^^\  Singlet(m,  Columbus   .500.00 

Robert  H.  Bentley,  Youngstown,  718  Wick  Ave   1,  000.  00 

.John  A.  Logan,  Youngstown,  Gloam  Lodge   500.  00 

May  14,1920: 

E.  B.  Allen,  Cleveland,  7609  Euclid  Ave   100.  00 

Edward  Ford,  Toledo,  2205  Collingwood  Ave   1.000.00 

Geo.  R.  Ford,  Toledo,  Parkwood  Ave   1,  000.  00 

Frank  Collins,  Toledo,  National  Supplv  Co   1,  000.  00 

O.  S.  Wilcox,  Toledo,  210-216  W\ater  St   500.  00 


2176 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  14,  1920— Continued. 

R.  A.  Hartley,  Toledo,  Washington  &  Ontario   $500.  00 

W.  C.  Longnecker,  Toledo,  Bronson  Place   100.00 

J.  T.  Kaufman,  Toledo,  care  Ohio  Steel  Foundry  Co   1,  000.  00 

May  15,  1920 : 

Levi  F.  York,  Portsmouth,  1609  Jackson  Avenue   250.  00 

G.  E.  Carlyle,  Portsmouth,  1312  Second  Street   100.  00 

May  18,  1920: 

W.  S.  Stearns,  Wyoming,  320  Reilly  Road   750.  00 

Lloyd  Baker,  Cincinnati,  Union  Trust  Building   200.  00 

May  19,  1920: 

W.  L.  Truesdell,  Columbus,  Columbus  Dental  Manufacturing  Co__  100.  00 

Andrew  Glass,  Portsmouth,  1635  Jackson  Avenue   250.  00 

C;  E.  Bunting,  Toledo,  314  Winthrop   500.  00 

J.  W.  Bunting,  Toledo,  3263  Collingwood  Avenue   500.  00 

W.  W.  Knight,  Toledo,  2215  Collingwood  Avenue   1,  000.  00 

Dan  Searles,  Toledo.  Dorr  Street  Road   250.  00 

H.  M.  Garlick,  Youngstown,  First  National  Bank   500,  00 

A.  E.  Adams,  Youngstown,  First  National  Bank   250.  00 

May  21,  1920 : 

James  W.  Corrigan,  Wickliffe   1,  000.  00 

A.  G.  Bean,  Elyria,  The  General  Phonograph  Manufacturing  Co   500.  00 

J.  A.  Linn,  Springfield   250.  00 

May  22,  1920 : 

T.  W.  Pearsall,  Bel  la  ire   250.  00 

Martin  V.  Kelley,  Toledo,  Second  National  Bank  Building   500.  00 

Marshall  Sheppey,  Toledo,  641  West  Woodruff  Avenue   500.  00 

W.  I.  Webb.  Toledo,  Ohio  Building   500.  00 

Geo.  M.  Jones,  Toledo,  Ohio  Building   500.  00 

H.  W.  Suydam,  Toledo,  Milburn  Wagon  Co   1,  000.  00 

H.  T.  Bradner,  Cleveland,  6210  Carnegie  Avenue   300.  00 

May  24,  1920 : 

C.  A.  Peckham,  Toledo,  416  West  Bancroft  Street   500.  00 

Henry  Theobald,  Toledo,  Toledo  Scale  Co   500.  00 

F.  L.  Baumgardner,  Toledo,  2015  Parkwood  Avenue   500.  00 

Robert  J.  West,  Toledo,  620  Madison  Avenue   100.  00 

Geo.  B.  Storer,  Toledo,  2249  Glenwood  Avenue   500.  00 

May  25,  1920 : 

J.  B.  Kennedy,  Youngstown.  270  Madison  Ave   250.  00 

John  Tod,  YoungstoAvn,  513  Stambaugh  Bldg   500.00 

George  F.  Alderdice,  Youngstown,  833  Pennsylvania  Avenue   250.  00 

James  H.  Grose,  Youngstown,  645  Bryson  St   250.  00 

Edward  L.  Ford,  Youngstown.  547  Wick  Ave   500.  00 

Fred  Tod,  Youngstown,  278  Broadway   500.00 

Mav  26,  1920: 

John  B  .Swift,  Cincinnati,  1030  Broadway   250.  00 

K.  L.  Allen,  Cleveland,  9925  Lake  Shore  Blvd   100.00 

Mav  28,  1920: 

Chas.  S.  Burge,  Toledo,  2447  Scottwood   250.00 

D.  M.  Mason,  Kent,  167  No.  Prospect   125.00 

O.  M.  Mason,  Kent.  Mason  Tire  &  Rubber  Co   250.  00 

C.  L.  LaBoiteaux,  Cincinnati,  1st  Natl  Bk  Bldg   125.  00 

June  1,  1920: 

M.  Y.  Cooper,  Cincinnati,  Union  Trust  Bldg   100.00 

H.  E.  Freeman,  Springfield,  So.  Greenmount  Ave   500.  00 

G.  R.  Kittle,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Ohio  Malleable  Iron  Co   250.  00 

J.  M.  Kittle,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Ohio  Malleable  Iron  Co   250.  00 

G.  R.  Lucas,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   250.  00 

W.  A.  Grieves.  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   250.  00 

M.  D.  .Teffrev,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 

Jos.  F.  Dierdorff,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 

J.  G.  Ogden,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 

C.  W.  Miller,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 

S.  B.  Belden,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   1,  000.  00 

R.  H.  Jeffrev,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  INIfg  Co   500.  00 

J.  W.  Jeffrev,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 

J.  A.  Jeffrey,  Columbus,  care  of  the  Jeffrey  Mfg  Co   500.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2177 

June  2,  1920 : 

A.  L.  Garford,  Elyria,  509  Washington  Ave   $500.  00 

S.  W.  Henson,  Elyria,  152  Harrison  St   100.  00 

J.  Warner,  Youngstown,  542  Wick  Ave   1,  000.  00 

John  T.  Harrington,  Youngstown,  678  Wick  Ave   1,  000.  00 

A.  N.  Flora,  Warren,  186  Park  Ave   1,  000.  00 

H.  W.  Grant,  Youngstown,  222  N.  Heights   100.  00 

M.  E.  Dennison,  l^oungstown,  1st  Natl.  Bank   100.  00 

R.  P.  Hartshorn,  Youngstown,  1st  Natl.  Bank   100.  00 

W.  J.  Roberts,  Youngstown,  290  Lora  Ave   100.  00 

R.  E.  Cornelius,  Youngstown,  Mahoning  Natl.  Bank   200.  00 

June  3,  1920 : 

F.  A.  Miller,  Columbus,  Arlington   500.00 

R.  H.  Reidenbaugh,  Columbus,  959  Mt.  Pleasant  Ave   500.  00 

C.  N.  Replogle,  Columbus,  913  Bryden  Rd   500.  00 

H.  H.  Timken,  Canton   500.00 

W.  R.  Timken,  Canton   500.00 

June  5,  1920 : 

Frank  Komminsk,  Lima,  S.  Cole  St   125.  00 

Arthur  J.  Bennett,  Cambridge   100.  00 

J.  G.  Tufford,  Elyria,  347  Third  St   1,000.00 

E.  P.  Jones,  Elyria,  405  Park  Ave   200.  00 

D.  S.  Troxel,  Elyria,  235  Washington  Ave   100.  00 

June  8,  1920 : 

C.  F.  McGilvray,  Springfield,  No.  Limestone  St   500.  00 

W.  J.  Myers,  Springfield,  Robbins  &  Myers  Co   500.  00 

Warren  A.  Myers,  Springfield,  N.  Fountain   500.  00 

C.  E.  Davis,  Springfield,  180  N.  3rd  St   500.  00 

OKLAHOMA. 

June  10,  1920 : 

H.  B.  Gutileus,  Tulsa   100.00 

C.  F.  Farren,  Tulsa   500.00 

John  H.  Markham,  jr.,  Tulsa   1,  000.  00 

J.  B.  Foster,  Tulsa   1,  500.  00 

Geo.  S.  Bole,  Tulsa,  1718  S.  Cheyenne  Ave   200.00 

Mar.  2,  1920 : 

Frank  Phillips,  Bartlesville,  1107  Cherokee   500.00 

Mar.  6,  1920 : 

G.  W.  Seibold,  Muskogee   100.00 

Mar.  18,  1920 : 

W.  G.  Skelly,  Tulsa   2,  500.  00 

Clint  Moore,  Tulsa   1,000.00 

Mar.  23,  1920 : 

Roy  M.  Johnson,  Ardmore   500.  00 

Mar.  29,  1920: 

.John  P.  Cook,  Okmulgee   250.00 

Harlan  Read,  Okmulgee   250.00 

William  P.  Morton,  Okmulgee   100.00 

W.  W.  Jennings,  Okmulgee   100.00 

R.  McFarlin,  Tulsa   1,250.00 

J.  A.  Chapman,  Tulsa   1,  250.  00 

Apr.  1,  1920 : 

E.  Constantine,  jr.,  Tulsa,  1409  S.  Boulder___   1,000.00 

Apr.  5,  1920 : 

John  Embrey,  Oklahoma  City,  Liberty  Nat'l  Bank  Bldg   250.  00 

John  Fields,  Oklahoma  City,  H  S.  Robinson   100.  00 

G.  G.  Gohlberg,  Oklahoma  City,  411  W.  14th  St   100.  00 

J.  H.  Bellis,  Cushing   100.  00 

M.  N.  Schriver,  Tulsa,  416  World  Bldg   100.  00 

L.  G.  Bradstreet,  Tulsa   100.  00 

Apr.  9,  1920: 

.L  Garfield  Buell,  Tulsa   100.00 

H.  L.  Fitzgerald,  Tulsa,  1511  S.  Denver   100.  00 

P.  G.  McKeon,  Tulsa   100.00 


2178 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Apr.  12,  1920 : 

W.  T.  Hales,  Oklahoma  City   $500.  00 

E.  L.  Aureliiis,  Oklahoma  City   250.  00 

Grant  R.  McCiillough,  Tulsa   1.000.00 

M.  M.  Travis,  Tulsa   1,  OOO.  00 

Apr.  13,  1920: 

H.  E.  Alton,  Enid   500.00 

H.  H.  Champlin,  Enid   500.  00 

C.  E.  Strouvelle,  Tulsa   100.00 

Apr.  21,  1920 : 

R.  M.  McFarlin,  Tulsa,  Box  268   1,  250.  00 

Apr.  26,  1920  : 

P.  E.  McGee,  Union  National  Bank.  Tulsa   250.  00 

Apr.  27,  1920 : 

J.  R.  Cottingham,  Oklahoma  City   100.00 

John  W.  Shartel,  Oklahoma  City   100.  00 

Apr.  28,  1920 : 

E.  W.  Sinclair,  Tulsa,  Exchange  Nat.  Bk   750.  00 

F.  J.  Bradford,  Tulsa.  937  Kennedy  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  30,  1920: 

Waite  Phillips,  Tulsa,  1st  Nat.  Bank  Bl   1,  500.  00 

May  5,  1920: 

H.  G.  Barnard,  Tulsa,  504  Drew  Bldg   250.  00 

May  6,  1920: 

H.  F.  Wilcox,  Tulsa,  305  New  Wright  Bldg.   100.  00 

May  11,  1920: 

Alva  J.  Niles,  Tulsa,  Security  Bldg   100.00 

G.  G.  Gillette,  Tulsa,  503  E.  18th   250.  00 

Charles  F.  Noble,  Tulsa,  1727  S.  Cheyenne   500.  00 

-   Thomas  Chestnut,  Tulsa,  Exch.  Nat  Bank  Bldg   2,  500.  00 

Tliomas  K.  Smith,  Tulsa,  17th  and  Carson   2,  500.  00 

W.  E.  Templeman,  Tulsa,  818  Kennedy  Bldg   100.  00 

James  A.  Veasey,  Tulsa,  1802  S.  Cheyenne   100.  00 

E.  F.  Black,  Tulsa,  5061  Rockford   100.  00 

H.  H.  McFann,  Tulsa,  637  Mayo  Bldg   100.  00 

S.  A.  Orcutt,  Tulsa,  414  Securities  State  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 

Earl  G.  Hastings,  Tulsa,  516  E.  Buena  Vista   100.  00 

Lawrence  K.  Cone,  Tulsa,  1410  S.  Boulder   100.  00 

W.  A.  Reynolds,  Tulsa,  Box  1251   100.00 

Steinberg  Bros.,  Tulsa,  206  S.  Main   100.  00 

John  B.  Brown,  Tulsa,  633  N.  Denver   100.  00 

J.  H.  Simmons,  Tulsa,  Box  29   250.  00 

Leo.  Lindlow,  Tulsa,  201  Unity  Bldg   100.  00 

Carl  Pleasant,  Tulsa,  204  Danields  Bldg   125.  00 

W.  F.  Stahl,  Tulsa,  Box  1854   100.  00 

D.  D.  Wertzberger,  Tulsa,  462  Mayo  Bldg   150.  00 

James  Pantazales,  Lafayette  Cafe,  Tulsa   100.  00 

May  14,  1920 : 

A.  L.  Welsh,  Oklahoma  City,  109  N.  Harvey   250.  00 

Geo.  B.  Keeler,  Bartlesville   125.  00 

A.  J.  Biddison,  Tulsa,  206  N.  Tacoma   100.  00 

Wilham  S.  Cochran,  Tulsa,  514  Wright  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  M.  Gloyd,  Oklahoma  City   200.00 

Mav  19,  1920 : 

J.  R.  Si  vails.  Bartlesville   100.  00 

Joe  A.  Bartles,  Dewey   100.00 

June  2,  1920 : 

M.  V.  Foster,  Bartlesville   1,  000.  00 

OREGON. 

April  2,  1920: 

Philip  Buehner,  Portland,  1509  Yeon  Building   250.  00 

A.  L.  Mills,  Portland,  First  Nat'l  Bank   250.  00 

B.  C.  Ball.  Portland,  482  Harrison  St   100.00 

Edward  Elirman,  Portland,  74  Fifth  St.,  No   100.  00 

L.  A.  Lewis,  Portland,  Care  of  Allen  &  Lewis   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2179 

April  2,  1920— Continued. 

W.  B.  Aver,  Portland,  185  19th  St,  No  $1,  000.  00 

F.  H.  Ransom,  Portland,  21  St.  North  Front  St   100.  00 

M.  F.  Henderson,  Portland,  21  St.  North  Front  St   100.  00 

Edw.  Cookingham,  Portland,  Lall  &  Tilton  Bank   100.  00 

R.  B.  Wilcox,  Portland,  1202  Wilcox  Bldg   100.  00 

M.  W.  Ladd,  Portland,  P.  O.  Box  790   100.  00 

F.  C.  Knapp,  Portland,  Peninsula  Lbr.  Co   1,  000.  00 

M.  H.  Insley,  Portland   125.00 

Homer  V.  Carpenter,  Portland   125.  00 

Geo.  M.  Duncan,  Portland,  Duncan  Lbr.  Co   100.  00 

J.  C.  &  H.  B.  Ainsworth,  Portland,  U.  S.  National  Bank   200.  00 

A.  S.  Benson,  Portland,  Yeon  Building   100.00 

John  B.  Yeon,  Portland.  Yeon  Building   100.  00 

Henry  L.  Corbett,  Portland,  Corbett  Building   1,000.00 

T.  A.  McCann,  chairman  for  Deschutes  County,  Bend,  Des- 
chutes Co   165.  00 

M.  A.  Moody,  chairman  for  Wasco  Co.,  The  Dalles,  Wasco  Co   400.  00 

Jay  H.  Dobbin,  chairman  for  Wallowa  County,  W^allowa,  Wal- 
lowa Co   200.00 

April  10,  1920: 

A.  J.  Johnson,  chairman  for  Benton  County,  Cervallis,  Ben- 
ton Co   200.00 

Thomas  D.  Honeyman,  Portland.  Park  &  Glisan  St   100.  00 

Walter  M.  Cook,  Portland,  436  E.  18th  No   100.  00 

R.  S.  Howard,  Portland,  Ladd  &  Tilton  Bank   100.  00 

Isaac  D.  Hunt,  Portland,  R.  F.  D.  Newberg   100.  00 

E.  S.  Collins,  Portland,  877  Westover  Road   100.  00 

W.  M.  Macphail,  Portland,  705  Journal  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  17,  1920: 

Ed  E.  Kiddle,  for  Union  County,  La  Grande   200.  00 

Ben  Selhng,  Portland,  4th  &  Morrison   100.  00 

E.  G.  Shevlin,  Portland   100.  00 

Otto  Ketteubach,  Portland   500.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920: 

C.  F.  Adams,  Portland   125.  00 

Daniel  Kern,  Portland   100.  00 

Apr.  24,  1920: 

W.  L.  Thompson,  Pendleton   100.  00 

F.  C.  Curl,  Pendleton   100.  00 

George  L.  and  J.  A.  McPherson,  Portland,  Spalding  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  28,  1920: 

John  L.  Etheridg^,  Portland   125.  00 

May  1,  1920: 

George  W.  Bates,  Portland,  Geo.  W.  Bates  &  Co   100.  00 

J.  E.  Dunne,  Portland,  816  Gasco  Bldg   100.  00 

P.  W.  Lewis,  Portland,  Ames-Harris-Neville   125.  00 

A.  M.  Work,  Portland,  Portland-Damascus  Milk  Co   100.  00 

W.  S.  Bowers  for  Baker  Co.,  Portland   100.  00 

May  8,  1920 : 

D.  E.  Yeran  for  Lane  County,  Eugene   665.  00 

Emery  Olmstead,  Portland,  N.  W.  Nat'l  Bank   100.  00 

George  W.  Joseph,  Portland,  Corbett  Bldg   200.  00 

F.  J.  Cobbs,  Portland,  588  Montgomery  Drive   100.  00 

W.  P.  Dickey,  Portland,  Portland  Cattle  Loan  Co   100.  00 

Mav  26,  1920 : 

M.  G.  Woodard,  Silverton   100.00 

C.  A.  Morden.  Portland,  %  the  Oregonian   250.00 

Amandee  M.  Smith,  Portland,  401  Columbia  Bldg   100.00 

I.  C.  Sanford,  Portland,  Northern  Grain  &  Warehouse  Co   200.  00 

C.  H.  Wheeler,  Portland,  1506  Yeon  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  S.  Kerry,  Kerry,  Kerry  Lbr.  V.  Co   100.00 

TENNESSEE. 

Apr.  6,  1920 : 

Z.  C.  Patten,  St.  Elmo   1,000.00 


2180 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


TEXAS. 

Mar.  4,  1920 : 

Robert  W.  Humphreys,  Liberty   $100.  OO 

Dr.  E.  P.  Wilmot,  Austin   lOO.  00 

Mar.  22,  1920: 

Ed.  McCartliy,  Galveston,  Ed.  McCarthy  &  Co   125.00 

Mar.  25,  1920: 

S.  J.  Freudenthal,  El  Paso,  1117  Los  Angeles   100.  00 

J.  J.  Longwell,  El  Paso   100.  00 

U.  S.  Stewart,  El  Paso,  City  Natl.  Bank   100.  00 

James  G.  McNary,  El  Paso,  First  Natl.  Banli   500.  00 

Apr.  1,  1920 : 

R.  B.  Creager,  Brownsville   100.00 

J.  G.  McGrady,  El  Paso,  511  1st  Natl.  Bank   150.  00 

John  A.  Hill,  Harlingen   100.00 

C.  K.  McDowell,  San  Antonio,  431  Gunter  Bldg   100.  00 

Apr.  19,  1920 : 

Geo.  W.  Breckenridge,  Washington  Heights,  San  Antonio   500.  00 

Apr.  21,  1920 : 

C.  M.  Bassett,  El  Paso   1,  OOO.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

J.  M.  Singleton,  Jefferson   100.  00 

UTAH. 

Apr.  15,  1920 : 

W.  H.  Wattis,  Ogden   500.00 

Chas.  R.  Mabey,  Bountiful   100.  00 

Albert  Smith,  Salt  Lake  City,  96  Virginia  St   100.  00 

George  T.  Odell,  Salt  Lake  City,  Hotel  Utah   200.  00 

W.  D.  Riter,  Salt  Lake  City,  Walker  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 

W.  D.  Riter,  Salt  Lake  City.  Walker  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 

Ben  C.  Rich,  Salt  Lake  City,  Newhouse  Bldg   250.  00 

W.  S.  McCornick,  Salt  Lake  City,  McCornick  Bank   250.00 

Clarence  Bamberger,  Salt  Lake  City,  163  S.  Main  St   169.45 

John  H.  Seely,  Mount  Pleasant   100.00 

Apr.  16,  1920 : 

E.  O.  J.  Hanke,  Hotel  Utah,  Salt  Lake  City   250.  00 

Herbert  S.  Auerbach,  230  Brooks  Arcade,  Salt  Lake  City   200.  Oa 

De  Witt  Knox,  1267  2nd  Ave.,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

J.  E.  Jennings,  425  E.  So.  Temple  St.,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

Albert  Smitb,  Virginia  Ave.,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

Apr.  19,  1920 : 

Joseph  Lippman,  Walker  Bank  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City   250.  00 

C.  W.  Nibley,  Bishop's  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City   300.  00 

C.  W.  Nibley,  Bishop's  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City   700.  00 

Preston  Nibley,  322  Ness  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City   500.  00 

Herbert  E.  Smyth,  Judge  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City,  for  former  com- 
mittee  529. 2a 

May  11,  1920 : 

J.  C.  Lynch,  1167  E.  S.  Temple,  Salt  Lake  City   200.  00 

George  G.  Knox,  Alta  Club,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

G.  W.  Lambourne,  89  C  St.,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

May  14,  1920: 

A.  D.  McMullen,  115  So.  West  Temple  St.,  Salt  Lake  City   100.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

Ernest  R.  Wooley,  3538  Highland  Drive,  Salt  Lake  City   500.  00 

June  8,  1920 : 

L.  F.  Rains,  621  Newhouse  Bldg.,  Salt  Lake  City  '  2.50.  00 

VIRGINIA. 

Mar.  22,  1920: 

W.  R.  Davis,  Rocky  Mount,  1st  Nat.  Bank   100.  00 

David  W.  Flickner,  Roanoke,  1st  National  Bank   500.00 

P.  D.  Bain,  Norfolk,  Citizens  Bank  of  Norfolk   250.  00 

R.  A.  Pretlow,  Franklin,  Merchants  &  Farmers  Bank   150.  00 

H.  Beson,  Norfolk,  Citizens  Natl.  Bk   500  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2181 

Mar.  22.  1920— Continued. 

¥.  Roid,  Norfolk,  Norfolk  National  Bank   $500.  00 

O.  R.  Copps,  Norfolk,  Citizens  National  Bank   100.  00 

Henry  W.  Anderson,  Richmond,  Old  Dominion  Trust  Co   1,  000.  00 

Jacquelin  P.  Taylor,  Richmond,  Old  Dominion  Trust  Co   1,  000.  00 

Harry  L.  Lowenberg,  Norfolk,  c/o  D.  H.  Goodman  Corp   250.00 

D.  H.  Goodman,  Norfolk,  c/o  D.  H.  Goodman  Corp   250.  00 

Mar.  24,  1920 : 

Wm.  Sloane,  Norfolk   500.  00 

J.  T.  Woodley,  Norfolk   350.  00 

Jas.  C.  Beale,  Southampton   250.  00 

Hugh  W.  Davis,  Norfolk   100.  00 

Otto  Wells,  Norfolk   12.5.  00 

W.  Barnhart.  Norfolk   350.00 

Charles  F.  Taylor,  Suffolk   250.  00 

A.  Obicy,  Suffolk   250.  00 

George  W.  Roper.  Norfolk   100.  00 

H.  R.  Kar,  Norfolk   150.00 

F.  S.  Royster,  Norfolk   1.50.00 

A.  M.  Brong,  Norfolk   200.00 

Warwick  Machine  Co.,  Newport  News   200.  00 

Mar.  31,  1920 : 

John  L.  Roper,  Norfolk   500.  00 

Samuel  Adams,  Albemarle  County   1,  000.  00 

May  26,  1920 : 

John  B.  Kimberly,  Fortress  Monroe   500.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

R.  K.  Harwood,  Newport  News  1_  100.  00 

C.  K.  Weaver,  Newport  News   100.00 

D.  S.  Jones,  Newport  News   100.00 

J.  W.  Robinson,  Newport  News   100.00 

J.  N.  Shannahan,  Hampton   100.00 

E.  F.  Peck,  Hampton   100.00 

WASHINGTON. 

June  2,  1920 : 

F.  S.  Lang,  Seattle,  2756  —  St.  So   100.  00 

Julius  Lang,  Seattle,  Western  &  Madison   100.  00 

N.  H.  Latimer,  Seattle,  New  York  Bldg   250.  00 

Charles  H.  Lilly,  Seattle,  1647  W.  Hanford   100.  00 

J.  D.  Lowman,  Seattle,  Columbia  &  1st   100.00 

Judge  Mcintosh,  Olympia   200.00 

J.  A.  McEachern,  Seattle,  Colman  Bldg   100.00 

J.  W.  Maxwell,  Seattle,  Marion  Bldg   100.00 

R.  D.  Merrill,  Seattle,  White  Bldg   200.  00 

W.  B.  Nettleton,  Seattle,  Schwager  &  Nettleton   100.  00 

Prescott  Oakes,  Seattle,  White  Bldg   250.00 

R.  H.  Parsons,  Seattle,  Stuart  Bldg   250.  00 

Chas.  R.  Peabody,  Seattle,  Securities  Bldg   200.  00 

Wm.  D.  Perkins,  Seattle,  Alaska  Bldg   100.  00 

G.  M.  Pratt,  Seattle,  916  E.  Pike  St   200.  00 

Albert  J.  Rhodes,  Seattle,  Arcade  Bldg   250.  00 

W.  L.  Rhodes,  Seattle,  Arcade  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  N.  Shaw,  Seattle,  1016  Western  Ave   100.  00 

P.  P.  Spelger,  Seattle,  Arcade  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  B.  Stewart,  Seattle,  Stewart  &  Holmes   200.  00 

C.  D.  Stimson,  Seattle,  Securities  Bldg   500.  00 

C.  W.  Stimson,  Seattle,  Securities  Bldg   100.  00 

E.  A.  Stuart,  Seattle,  Stuart  Bldg   500.  00 

George  W.  Trimble,  Seattle,-3814  E.  John  St   250.00 

Edward  T.  Verd,  Seattle,  3201  Fremont  St   100.  00 

Frank  Walter,  Seattle,  Central  Bldg   100.  00 

David  Whitcomb,  Seattle,  Arcade  Bldg   250.  00 

Clarence  Wiley,  Seattle,  Todd  Dry  Docks   150.00 

Agnes  H.  Anderson,  Seattle,  1219  Alaska  Bldg   250.  00 

A.  V.  Ankeny,  Seattle,  Seattle  Nat.  Bank   100.  00 


2182  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

June  2,  1920— Continued. 

M.  A.  Arnold,  Seattle,  Ist  Nat.  Bank   $100.00 

Thomas  Burke,  Seattle,  Burke  Bldg   150.  00 

W.  L.  Bilger,  Seattle,  Seattle  Hdw.  Co   100.  00 

C.  H.  Black,  Seattle,  Seattle  Hdw.  Co   100.  00 

C.  H.  Black,  jr.,  Seattle,  Seattle  Hdw.  Co   100.00 

J.  C.  Black,  Seattle,  Black  Mfg.  Co   100.  00 

W.  M.  Bolcom,  Seattle,  Bolcom  Canal  Lbr.  Co   500.  00 

C.  Rogers  Brown,  Seattle,  Hoge  Bldg   300.  00 

A.  S.  Burwell,  Seattle,  Seattle  Hdw.  Co   100.  00 

T.  P.  Christian,  Seattle,  Annette  Island  Pack.  Co   100.  00 

George  J.  Danz,  Seattle,  Hohus  Steel  &  Equipment  Co   150.  00 

J.  A.  Duncan,  Seattle,  Duncan  &  Sons   100.00 

W.  L.  Eaton,  Seattle,  E.  Pike  &  Brdway   100.  00 

Nathan  Eckstein,  Seattle,  Schwabacher  Bros.  &  Co   100.  00 

Mar.  1,  1920: 

M.  A.  Arno:d,  Seattle,  First  National  Bank   100.  00 

C.  E.  Anderson,  Seattle,  Wester  Dry  Goods  Co   200.  00 

Geo.  Albers,  Seattle,  Artie  Bldg   100.  00 

Mrs.  Agnes  E.  Anderson,  Seattle,  718  Minor  Ave   250.00 

Edgar  Ames,  Seattle,  Hoge  Bldg   100.  00 

E.  G.  Ames,  Seattle,  Walker  Bldg   700.  00 

W.  M.  Bolcom,  Seattle,  Ft.  12th  West   100.  00 

F.  H.  Bexter,  Seattle,  Column  Bldg   100.00 

B.  C.  Beck,  Seattle,  Bon  Marche   100.  00 

M.  F.  Backns,  Seatt.e,  Nat.  Bank  of  Commerce   250.  00 

J.  E.  Bratnober,  Seattle,  Henry  Bldg   150.  00 

G.  I.  C.  Barton,  Seattle,  Spokane  &  W.  Waterway   200.  00 

Jos.  Bordesux,  Seattle,  811  14th  No____   150.  00 

Thos.  Burke,  Seattle,  Burke  Bld^   100.  00 

C.  Rogers  Brown,  Seattle,  Hoge  Bldg   200.00 

Lyman  Bouney,  Seattle,  Broadway  &  Olive  Sts   100.  00 

J.  R.  Brewster,  Seattle,  Smith  Bldg   100.  00 

Thos.  Bordeaux,  Seattle,  Alaska  Bldg   100.00 

W.  E.  Boeing,  Seatt.e,  Hoge  Bldg   250.  00 

Alex.  Bailee,  Seattle,  Stuart  Bldg_   200.00 

Dr.  A.  I.  Bouffuler,  Seattle,  White  Bldg   100.  00 

J.  S.  Chillberg,  Seattle,  Alaska  Bldg   100.  00 

Edw.  Cunningham,  Seattle,  Pacific  Net  &  Twine  Co   100.  00 

Wm'.  Calvert,  Seattle,  Stacy  &  E.  Waterway   100.  00 

Jas.  H.  Deveuve,  Seattle,  White  Bldg   150.  00 

Duthie,  J.  F.,  Seattle,  Duthie  Shipyards   500.  00 

R.  M.  Ryer,  Seattle,  Central  Bldg   100.  00 

A.  H.  Daugherty,  Seattle,  Henry  Bldg   100.  00 

Geo.  Donworth,  Seattle,  Hoge  Bldg   100.  00 

T.  A.  Davies,  Seattle,  Column  Bldg   100.  00 

John  W.  Eddy,  Seattle,  Smith  Bldg   500.  00 

A.  S.  Eldridge,  Seattle,  802  E.  Pike  St   250.  00 

Victor  H.  Effendahl,  Seattle,  Smith  Bldg   250.  00 

John  E'rickson,  Seattle,  8241  Whatcom  Ave   100.  00 

A.  G.  M.  Eraser,  Seattle,  Fraser-Paterson   100.  00 

G.  W.  Fisher,  Seattle,  Fisher  Bros.,  Grocery  —  100.  00 

J.  P.  Fox,  Seattle,  601  Myrtle  St   100.  00 

Gerald  Frink,  Seattle,  %  Wash.  Iron  Works   100.  00 

E.  1.  Garrett,  Seattle,  318  1st  St   200.  00 

James  T.  Griffith,  Seattle,  Burke  Bldg   100.  00 

Joshue  Green,  Seattle,  Colman  Block   100.  00 

James  D.  Hoge,  Seattle,  Hoge  Bldg   500.  00 

C.  L.  Hibbard.  Seattle,  1210  Western  Ave   100.  00 

James  Henry,  Seattle,  822  Western  Ave   100.  00 

Albert  Hansen,  Seattle,  Leary  Bldg   100.  00 

H.  C.  Henry,  Seattle,  Northern  Life  Bldg   300.  00 

J.  T.  Hodge,  Seattle,  Smith  Bldg   100.  00 

Erie  Johnson,  Seattle.  W.  Lander  &  E.  Whatcom   100.  00 

F.  W.  Keen,  Seattle,  American  Bank  Bldg   100.  00 


u 

PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2188 

WEST  VIRGINIA. 

Mar.  18,  1920: 

J.  C.  Brady,  Wheeling   $100.  00 

H.  C.  Ogden,  Wheeling   100.00 

George  A.  Laiighlin,  Wheeling   100.  00 

J.  I\r.  Sanders,  Moiindsville   100.  00 

Godfrey  L.  Cabot,  Boston,  Mass.  (credit  W.  Va.)   1,000.00 

H.  B.  Curtis,  Clarksburg   1,  000.  00 

E.  R.  Smith,  Huntington   500.  00 

Howard  N.  Eavenson,  Garv   100.00 

T.  E.  Houston,  Elkhorn   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  23,  1920: 

H.  E.  Field,  Wheeling   100.00 

Mar.  30,  1920: 

E.  T.  Weir,  AVeirtcn   500.  00 

W.  H.  Abott,  Wheeling  *   100.  00 

W^m.  Banfield,  Follansbee   150.  00 

D.  A.  Burt,  Wellsburg   100.  00 

B.  G.  Follansbee,  Follansbee  :  250.  00 

Wm.  U.  Follansbee,  Follansbee   250.  00 

A.  S.  List,  AVheeling   200.00 

Alex.  Glass,  Wheeling   200.00 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

A.  S.  List,  Wheeling   200.  00 

Apr.  1,  1920: 

Otto  Schenk,  Wheeling   100.00 

Apr.  9,  1920: 

W.  H.  Koch,  Wheeling   100.  00 

Apr.  21,  19:>0: 

W.  H.  Cunningham,  Huntington   250.  00 

Apr.  23,  1920 : 

D.  C.  Schonthal,  Huntington   250.  00 

H.  A.  Zeller,  Huntington   250.00 

Apr.  28,  1920: 

W.  F.  Hite,  Huntington   250.00 

May  6,  1920: 

Standard  Ultramarine  Co.,  Huntington   250.  00 

May  8,  1920 : 

John  Laing,  Charleston   500.  00 

May  18,  1920: 

Thos.  Carr,  Grafton   100.  00 

May  19,  1920: 

B.  Randolph  Biss,  Williamson   330.00 

May  22,  1920: 

Jo.  L.  Kenner,  Morgantown   100.  00 

May  25,  1920: 

T.  L.  Felts,  Bluefield   200.00 

May  26,  1920: 

J.  H,  Slocum,  care  of  Springs,  Inc.,  White  Sulphur  Springs   100.  00 

WISCONSIN. 

Apr.  26,  1920 : 

H.  C.  Humphrey,  Appleton,  686  Union   $100.  00 

May  22,  1920 : 

Edw.  H.  Schwartzburgh,  Milwaukee,  135  26th  St   500.  00 

Alfred  J.  Kieckhefer,  Milwaukee,  540  Terrace  Ave   500.  00 

S.  S.  Cramer,  Milwaukee,  3310  Wells   100.  00 

Wm.  F.  Kinseila,  Milwaukee,  Hi  Mount  &  Washington  Bv   125.  00 

E.  W.  Krueger,  Milwaukee,  2720  McKinley  Bv   125.  00 

Wm.  O.  Goodrich,  Milwaukee,  30  &  Hopkins   100.  00 

R.  G.  Hayssen,  Milwaukee,  737  Lake  Drive   150.  00 

May  25,  1920 : 

Wm.  Fox,  Milwaukee   1,  000.  00 

June  1,  1920: 

C.  C.  Yawkey,  Wausau   500.  00 

Rudolf  Hokanson,  Milwaukee,  985  Summit  Ave   100.  00 


2184 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


June  2,  1920 : 

E.  P.  Hixon,  La  Crosse  __— _  $1,000.00 

E.  J.  Harvey,  Racine,  Harvey  Sirring  Forging  Co   1(X).  0(> 

F.  J.  Kidd,  Racine,  1439  Junction  Ave  -   100.  00 

O.  W.  Jolmson,  Racine,  817  Main  St   250.  00 

W.  S.  Osborn,  Racine,  1440  Main  St   100.  00 

Herbert  F.  Jolin.s-on,  Racine,  S.  C.  Jolmson  «S:  Co   200.  00 

Wm.  Mitcliell  Lewis,  Racine   100.00 

Win.  Hilker,  Racine,  Hilker-Wieclier  Mfg.  Co   100.  00 

June  3,  102O : 

O.  E.  Morgan,  Sliawano   100.00 

Senator  A.  Kucliuk,  Sliawano   100.  00 

June  5,  1920 : 

Wm.  H.  Horlick,  Racine   250.  00 

H.  M.  Wallis,  Racine   250.  00 

E.  J.  Kearney,  Wauwatosa  I   1,000.00 

June  7,  1920 : 

W.  E.  Stoppenbacli,  Sliawano   100.00 

D.  Lightbody,  Mattoon   100.00 

E.  E.  Hemingway,  Mattoon   100.  00 

E.  O.  Brown,  Rinelander   200.00 

W.  E.  Brown,  Rhinelander   200.00 

A.  W.  Brown,  Rhinelander   200.00 

Henry  C.  Hanke,  Rhinelander   400.00 

W.  H.  Alford,  Kenosha,  711  Durkee   150.  00 

George  H.  Allen,  Kenosha,  488  Prairie  Ave   100.  00 

Robert  S.  Cooper,  Kenosha   100.00 

W.  J.  Frost,  Kenosha,  615  Durkee  Ave   100.  00 

Lynn  T.  Hannaclis,  Kenosha,  568  Park  Ave   100.  00 

Roger  N.  Kimball,  Kenosha,  560  Durkee  Ave   100.  00 

C.  W.  Nash,  Kenosha,  521  Durkee  Ave   500.  00 

E.  C.  Thiers,  Kenosha,  426  Park  Ave   100.  00 

Frank  L.  Wells,  Kenosha,  616  Park  Ave   100.  00 

George  S.  Whyte,  Kenosha   100.00 

C.  P.  Voorhis,  Kenosha,  567  Durkee  Ave   175.  00 

J.  T.  W^ilson,  Kenosha,  177  Deming   175.  00 

Z.  G.  Simmons,  Kenosha   2,  500.  00 

H.  W.  Marsh,  Milwaukee,  885  Summit  Ave   100.  00 

H.  Harnischfeger,  Milwaukee,  3416  Grand  Ave   250.  00 

Paul  E.  Thomas,  Wauwatosa,  447  Wauwatosa  Ave   100.  00 

R.  H.  Hackney,  Wauwatosa,  1719  Grand  Ave   250.00 

Ira  R.  Smith,  Wauwatosa,  4650  Woodlawn  Ct   100.  00 

Robert  F.  Goodman,  Marinette   500.  00 

Fred  Vogel,  Milwaukee,  583  Cass   500.  00 

H.  M.  Thompson,  Milwaukee,  226  Grand  Ave   1,000.00 

Walter  Kasten,  Milwaukee,  1570  Lake  Drive   100.  00 

WYOMING. 

Mar.  12,  1920: 

John  W.  Hays,  Rock  Springs   1.  000.  00 

Patrick  Sullivan,  Casper   1,000.00 

B.  B.  Brooks,  Casper   1,  000.  00 

E.  J.  Sullivan,  Basin   1,000.00 

Harry  P.  Hynds,  Cheyenne   1,000.00 

Herman  B.  Gates,  Worland   1,000.00 

J.  L.  Baird,  Newcastle   1,000.00 

H.  O.  Barber,  Lander   1.000.00 

Frank  G.  Curtis,  Casper    500.00 

R.  G.  Tyler,  Casper   oOO.  00 

G.  R.  Hagens,  Casper   -^00.  00 

Peter  Kooi,  Sheridan   -^00.  00 

MISCELLANEOUS. 

Jan.  20,  1919 :  _ 

Daniel  G.  Reid,  New  York  City   000.  00 

W^m.  M.  Calder,  New  York  City   wO.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2185 

Jan.  22.  1919: 

S.  R.  Guggenheim,  New  York  City  $1,  000.  00 

Lewis  E.  Pierson,  New  Yovk  City   1,  000.  00 

C.  A.  Coffin,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Murry  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  24,  1919: 

G.  E.  Tripp.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  29,  1919: 

Aldred  &  Co..  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

^Vm.  B.  Thompson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  4,  1919: 

Wm.  H.  Nicliols,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Feb.  7.  1919: 

Jas.  H.  Ralph.  New  York  City   1,000.00 

R.  Livingston  Beeckman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Sherwood  Aldrich,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  14,  1919: 

Edw.  H.  Chirk,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  19.  1919: 

Daniel  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

May  1,  1919: 

John  N.  Steele,  New  York  City   200.  00 

iVhiy  .-),  1919: 

P.  A.  Rockefeller,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

May  7,  1919: 

Chas.  A.  Ralph,  New  York  City   500.00 

May  9.  1919: 

Jas.  H.  McClement.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

May  15,  1919: 

Ambrose  Monell.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  M.  Chapin,  Bernardsville,  N.  Y   500.00 

C.  M.  MacNeill,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Frederick  Leopold,  New  York  City   250.00 

M.  L.  Requa,  New  York  Citv   1,000.00 

H.  F.  Sinclair,  New  York  City   2,000.00 

J.  F.  Farrell,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

May  16,  1919 : 

Henry  Krumb,  New  York  City   500.00 

May  20,  1919 : 

O.  J.  McConnell,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Henry  E.  Dodge,  New  York  City   100.  00 

J.  P.  Stevens,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

May  21,  1919 : 

Walter  H.  Filor,  New  York  City   1,  000.00 

J.  F.  Alvord.  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Walter  H.  Aldridge,  New  York  City   500.  00 

John  K.  MacGowan,  New  York  City   200.  00 

A.  B.  Perry,  New  York  City   200.  00 

May  22,  1919 : 

Jos.  Clendenin,  New  York  City   250.00 

Thomas  Cochran,  New  York   1,000.00 

May  26,  1919 : 

Geo.  F.  Baker,  New  York   1,000.00 

Chas.  Hayden,  New  York   1,000.00 

Daniel  C.  Jackling,  New  York   1,000.00 

John  N.  Willys,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  F.  Ayer,  New  York   100.  00 

Elisha  Walker,  New  York   1,000.00 

May  27,  1919 : 

A.  L.  Scheuer,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Ridley  Watts,  New  York   1,000.00 

J.  E.  Thompson,  New  York   500.  00 


2186 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  28,  1919  : 

E.  H.  Gary,  New  York   $1,000.00 

Percy  M.  Chandler,  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

E.  A.  8.  Clarke,  New  York   200.  00 

John  A.  Topping,  New  York   500.  00 

J.  Leonard  Replogle,  New  York   1,000.00 

May  31,  1919 : 

-  F.  F.  Fitzpatrick,  New  York   1,000.00 

James  McLean,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

W.  H.  Woodin,  New  York   1,000.00 

Wm.  H.  Moore,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

John  C.  Duncan,  New  York   500,  00 

June  3,  1919 : 

Pauline  Morton  Sabin,  Shinnecock  Hills,  L.  I  ^   1,  000.  00 

Samuel  P.  Colt,  New  York   1,000.00 

Tracy  S.  Lewis,  Beacon  Falls,  Conn   1,  000.  00 

John  J.  Watson,  New  York   1,000.00 

Geo.  A.  Gaston,  New  York   1,000.00 

June  5,  1919 : 

Adam  K.  Luke,  New  York   1,000.00 

John  G.  Luke,  New  York   1,000.00 

David  L.  Luke,  New  York   1,000.00 

June  7,  1919 : 

James  H.  McGraw,  New  York,  and  Chas.  Clifton,  Buffalo,  N.  Y.-_  1,  000.  00 
June  10,  1919 : 

Clarence  H.  Mackay,  New  York   1,000.00 

Bertram  H.  Borden,  New  York   1,000.00 

E.  G.  Grace,  Bethlehem,  Pa   1,000.00 

A.  D.  Juilliard  &  Co.,  New  York   1,000.00 

Francis  J.  Oakes,  New  York   250.  00 

Joseph  K.  Cass,  New  York   1,000.00 

Thomas  Luke,  New  York   1,000.00 

E.  C.  Converse,  New  York   1,000.00 

June  11,  1919 : 

W.  C.  Durant,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

A.  B.  Ashforth,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

June  17,  1919 : 

C.  M.  Schwab,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Nathan  Weiss,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

A.  L.  Sylvester,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

June  18.  1919 : 

M.  L.  Morgenthau,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  A.  Peabody,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

F.  M.  Kirby,  Wilkes-Barre,  Pa__:   1,  000.  00 

June  19,  1919 : 

Gana  Dunn,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.00 

Stephen  Birch,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

June  20, 1919 : 

E.        Sinclair,  Tulsa,  Okla   500.00 

E.  Clarence  Jones,  Saratoga  Springs,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

June  21,  1919 : 

Wm.  C.  Potter,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

June  23,  1919 : 

Theo.  N.  Vail,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  D.  Guthrie,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.00 

Dwight  W.  Morrow,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  D.  Pratt,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

J.  R.  O'Neil,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

W.  T.  Posey,  New  York,  N.  Y___   500.  00 

M.  Schinasi,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

J.  B.  Duke,  New  York,  N.  Y_^   1,  000,  00 

L.  Toro,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.00 

D.  A.  Schulte,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

J.  Parker,  New  York,  N.  Y   1.000.00 

Percival  S.  Hill,  New  York,  N.  Y   1.  000.  00 

Joseph  De  Wyckoff,  Ramsey.  N.  J   500.  00 

Henry  Lockhart,  Jr.,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2187 

June  23,  1919— Continued. 

C.  A.  Daniel,  Philadelphia,  Pa   $300.00 

E.  H.  Broadwell,  Chicopee  Falls,  Mass   100.  00 

June  25,  1919 : 

A.  B.  Leach,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Francis  L.  Hine,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

A.  G.  Paine,  Jr.,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  W.  Hill,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

June  26,  1919 : 

Vincent  Astor,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

George  J.  Whelan,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Elliott  Averett,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

June  30,  1919: 

Frederick  K.  Rupprecht,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

C.  A.  Gordon,  New  York,  N.  Y   250.  00 

William  A.  Luke,  Covington,  Va   1,  000  .00 

Hugh  J.  Chisholm,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

L.  M.  Bickford,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

J.  E.  Tufts,  New  York,  N.  Y   250.  00 

J.  Peterson,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

H.  S.  Collins,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

J.  B.  Cobb,  New  York  ,N.  Y  _'   1,  000.  00 

John  F.  Whelan,  New  York,  N.  Y   250.  00 

July  1,  1919: 

R.  M.  C.  Glen,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Anthony  Schneider,  New  York,  N.  Y   1, 000.  00 

July  2,  1919 : 

W.  S.  Benson,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

R.  D.  Benson,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

L.  E.  Whicher,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Robert  M.  Thompson,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Charles  A.  Whelan,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

July  5,  1919: 

W.  Hinckel  Smith,  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,000.00 

K.  R.  Rabbitt,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Charles  A.  Terry,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

W.  H.  O'Brien,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

John  Conley,  New  York,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Edward  Wies,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

July  7,  1919 : 

William  E.  Corey,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.00 

Hunter  S.  Marston,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Cornelius  N.  Bliss,  jr.,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

July  8,  1919 : 

A.  N.  Burbank,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

J.  M.  Hansen,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

July  10,  1919: 

Ludwig  Vogelstein,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

J.  R.  Van  Dyck,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Samuel  T.  Peters,  New  York  aty   1,  000.00 

J.  S.  Coffin,  New  York  City   500.  00 

,       H.  F.  Ball,  New  York  City   500.  00 

I      Geo.  L.  Bourne,  New  York  City   500.  00 

I      Henry  J.  Davis,  New  York  City   500.00 

I      LeGrand  Parish,  Mountain  View,  N.  J   500.  00 

I      Saml.  G.  Allen,  New  York  City   500.00 

W.  G.  Pearce,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Jo.s.  B.  Terbell,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Chas.  Harris,  New  York  City   250.00 

Lee  Deutsch,  New  York  City   250.  00 

G.  M.  Basford,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Alex  Turner,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Matthew  Andrews,  Cleveland,  Ohio   500.  00 

L.  C.  Hanna,  Cleveland,  Ohio   500.00 

H.  M.  Hanna,  Cleveland,  Ohio   500.  00 

J.  C.  Davies,  Johnstown,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

W.  A.  Thomas,  Youngstown,  Ohio   500.00 

W.  H.  Child.s,  New  York  City  i   1,  000.  00 


2188 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


July  11,  1919 : 

J.  G.  White,  New  York  City   $1,  000.  00 

A.  H.  Wiggins,  New  Yorli  City   1,  OiX).  00 

E.  R.  Tinker,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Eugene  V.  R.  Tliayer,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

C.  J.  Schmidlapp,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

G.  M.  Dahl,  New  York  City   .500.  00 

S.  H,  Miller,  New  York  City   1.000.00 

July  16,  1919 : 

Thomas  H.  Mathias.  Buffalo,  N.  Y   .500.00 

C.  F.  Downa,  Buffalo,  N,  Y   500.  00 

Percy  H.  Johnston,  New  York  City   2.50.  00 

Edward  S.  Harkness,  New  York  Citv   1.000.00 

July  21.  1919 : 

G.  W.  Brown,  New  York  City   100.00 

Lucian  G.  Brown,  New  York  City   100.  00 

W.  H.  Coyle,  New  York  City   100.  00 

F.  N.  Foote,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Samuel  D.  Rosenfelt,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

C.  L.  Winey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Lyman  D.  Smith,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Walter  J.  Fahy,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Frank  C.  Munson.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

F.  A.  Chappell.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Paul  Moore,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Charles  H.  Blair,  New  York  City   200.00 

Albert  R.  Gallatin,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Geora:e  P.  Smith,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

July  23,  1919 : 

Dunlevy  Milbank,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

B.  F.  Jones,  jr.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa___.   1,000.  00 

C.  H.  McCullough.  jr.,  Buffalo,  N.  Y   500.  00 

July  26,  1919 : 

Philip  P.  Getty,  Yonkers,  N.  Y____   500.  00 

Fellowes  Davis,  New  York  City   500.  00 

August  4,  1919 : 

R.  L.  Agassiz,  New  York  City   500.  00 

J.  E.  Rousnuiniere,  New  York  City   500.00 

Homer  E.  Sawyer,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Chas.  J.  Graliam,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Horace  Havemeyer,  New  York  City  - —  1,  000.  00 

E.  R.  Kemp.  Tulsa,  Okla   500.00 

C.  K.  McCormick,  New  York  City   500.  00 

I.  Townsend  Burden,  New  York  City   lOQ.  00 

August  11,  1919 : 

Seelev  W.  Mudd,  Los  Angeles,  Calif   1 .  <M)0.  00 

J.  S.  Cosden,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Walter  Douglas,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Frank  J.  Lanalian,  Pittsburgh.  Pa   1.  000.  00 

Harrv  R.  Jones,  Canton.  Ohio    1,000.00 

Daniel  P.  Morse,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Morris  Rosenwasser.  Long  Island  City,  N.  Y  ^  1.  000.  00 

Irving  W.  Fisher,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Leonard  W.  Bates,  New  York  City    500.00 

Edward  C.  Thayer,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

Daniel  T.  Merritt,  Now  York  City   100.  00 

Charles  W.  Terhume,  New  York  City   2oO.  00 

Isidor  Goodman,  New  Y<n-k  City   200.  00 

Fi-ank  S.  Flagg,  New  York  City   200.00 

Aug.  19,  1919:  ' 

J.  S.  Alexander,  New  York  City  

H.  P.  Howell,  New  York  City   1-5.  00 

Auv:.  25,  1919  : 

H.  P  Davison,  New  York  City   I  CO').  <M1 

Herman  W.  Hoops,  New  York  City   1-  0<^>0.  00 

Sept.  8,  1919: 

Seward  Prosser,  Englewood.  N.  J   1.000  00 

Estate  of  (\aroline  P.  Ream,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 


1 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2189 


Sept.  5,  1919: 

Stephen  C.  Millett,  New  York  City   $1,000.00 

Sept.  12.  1919 : 

Edith  Baker,  Locust  Valley,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Sept.  20,  1919 : 

Edward  E.  Arnold.  Providence,  R.  I  1   1,  000.  00 

James  Wright,  New  York  City   110.  00 

Sept.  22,  1919 : 

William  H.  Todd,  New  York  City  :   1,  000.  00 

Warren  Cruikshank,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

W.  H.  Goadbyt  Co.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Sept.  24,  1919 : 

August  Heckscher,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Sept.  29,  1919 : 

John  T.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1, 000.  00 

Ruth  Baker  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  W.  Trippe,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Wm.  J.  Palmer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

John  J.  Gillies,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Geo.  M.  Woolsey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Oct.  3,  1919 : 

Jas.  C.  Stewart,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

H.  B.  Slaybaugh,  New  York  City  1   100.  00 

Oct.  4,  1919 : 

Henry  Heide,  jr.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  6,  1919 : 

Windsor  T.  White,  Cleveland,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

P.  T.  Dodge,  New  York  City   250.  00 

S.  A.  Powell  &  Co.,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Oct.  8,  1919  : 

Thomas  W.  Slocum,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  E.  Sampson,  Ne\v  Yoi-k  Citv   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  9,  1919 : 

Robert  D.  Carter,  New  York  City   500.  00 

David  Helier,  New  York  City-__i   500.  00 

Oct.  10,  1919 : 

Charles  Clifton,  Buffalo,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  1],  1919: 

C.  D.  W.  Halsey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Spencer  Turner,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Lincoln  Grant,  New  York  City   250.  00 

L.  J.  Drake,  New  York  City   500.  00 

C.  A.  Braman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  14.  ]9]9: 

Wm.  H.  Porter,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

S.  F.  Dribben,  New  York  City   750.  00 

Oct.  15,  1919 : 

Wm.  M.  Wood,  Boston,  Mass   4,  000.  00 

T.  Jefferson  Coolidge,  Boston,  Mass   4,000.00 

Walter  C.  Baylies,  Boston.  INlass   500.  00 

Francis  W.  Fabyan,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

A.  J.  Pierce,  jr..  New  Bedford,  Mass   500.  00 

Robert  F.  Her  rick,  Milton,  Mass   200.  00 

John  E.  Nelson,  Chicago,  111   300.  00 

Oct.  16,  1919 : 

S.  E.  Mitchell,  New  York  :   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  17,  1919 : 

B.  F.  Bailey,  New  York   250.  00 

Oct.  18,  1919 : 

Ira  Richards,  jr.,  New  York   150.  00 

Clarkson  Runyon,  jr..  New  York   150.  00 

W.  S.  Peters,  New  York   100.  00 

Chas.  F.  Samson,  New  York   175.  00 

Chas.  H.  Thieriot,  New  York   200.  00 

George  P.  Mellick,  New  York   300.  00 

Jay  F.  Carlisle,  New  York  1   400.  00 

G.  I.  Hud.son  &  Co.,  New  York   1,  000.  00 


182774— 20— PT 15  7 


2190 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Oct.  20,  1919 : 

T.  F.  Manville,  New  York   $1,  000.  00 

Clarence  E.  Chapman,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  23,  1919 : 

Charles  M.  Thayer,  Worcester,  Mass   500.  00 

Geo.  Sumner  Barton,  Worcester,  Mass   500.  00 

M.  J.  Whittall,  Worcester,  Mass   500.00 

Albert  F.  Bemis,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

Frank  S.  Webster,  Boston,  Mass   500.00 

William  Endicott,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

John  W.  Farwell,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

Wm.  H.  Mertz,  Brookline,  Mass   500.  00 

Oct.  22,  1919 : 

George  F.  Baker,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Clarence  M.  Guggenheimer,  New  York   750.  OO 

Oct.  24,  1919 : 

William  Iselin  &  Co.,  New  York  i   1,000.  00 

Oct.  25,  1919 : 

Malcomb  D.  Whitman,  New  York   500.  00 

Oct.  27,  1919 : 

W.  D.  Breaker,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Charles  M.  Brooks,  New^  York   250.  00 

Oct.  31,  1919 : 

Andrew  Adie,  Brookline,  Mass   3,  000.  00 

Ernest  B,  Dane,  Boston,  Mass   3,000.00 

Wallace  L.  Pierce,  Milton,  Mass   500.00 

N.  H.  Stone,  Milton,  Mass   500.00 

Estate  of  Frank  Hopewell,  Newton,  Mass   650.  00 

Frank  B.  Hopewell,  Newton,  Mass   500.  00 

W^m.  P.  Underbill,  Newton,  Mass   500.  00 

James  Clemens,  Arlington,  Mass   500.  00 

E.  F.  Sherburne,  Lexington,  Mass   500.  00 

Chas.  F.  Ayer,  trustee,  Boston,  Mass   200.  00 

Frederick  Ayer,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Oct.  29  1919 : 

*  Arthur  P.  Williams,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  31,  1919 : 

Andrew  H.  Brown,  New  York  City   100.00 

Nov.  5,  1919 : 

C.  C.  Dula,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  L.  Juhring,  Brookline,  Mass   250.  00 

Nov.  6,  1919 : 

Mrs.  E.  H.  Gary,  New  York   200.  00 

F.  C.  Swan,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.00 

Nov.  7,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Michael  Dreicer,  Lake  Success,  L.  I   100.  00 

H.  B.  Thayer,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Nov.  10,  1919 : 

Walter  W.  De  Bevoise,  Brooklyn   100.  00 

Bernard  Karp,  New  York   100.00 

Bobert  P.  Marshall  &  Co.,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Nov.  11,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Whitelaw  Reid,  New  York   500.  00 

Mrs.  Ambrose  Nonell,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Nov.  12,  1919 : 

Stephen  Baker,  New  York   250.  00 

Frank  P.  Frazier,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Nov.  14,  1919 : 

E.  F.  Huttoii,  New  York  .   1,000.00 

Nov.  15,  1919 : 

John  D.  Rockefeller,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

John  D.  Rockefeller,  Jr.,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Nov.  21,  1919 : 

A.  L.  North,  New  Y^ork   250.00 

Hamilton  Carartt,  Detroit,  Mich   500.00 

Nov.  22,  1919 : 

J.  Lichten stein,  New  York   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2191 

Nov.  24,  1919 : 

Kemp,  Day  &  Co.,  New  York   $100.00 

William  Whitman,  Boston   500.00 

Daniel  G.  Wing,  Boston   500.00 

Dr.  W.  Sturgis  Bigelow,  Boston   500.  00 

Adams  &  Leland,  Boston   500.  00 

Edward  A.  Clark,  Boston   500.  00 

James  Dean,  Boston   500.  00 

Henry  N.   Sweet   Boston   500.00 

Browne  «&  Howe,  Boston   750.  00 

J.  Koshland  &  Co.,  Boston   750.  00 

Willey  Francis  &  Co.,  Boston   750.00 

Ralph  Hornblower,  Boston   250.00 

Williams  &  Co.,  Boston   250.00 

Thomas  A.  Crimmins,  Boston   250.  00 

Dupes  &  Meadows,  Boston   250.  00 

S.  E.  Hecht  &  Co.,  Boston   250.  00 

Edwin  S.  Webster,   Boston   250. 00 

Charles  E.  Riley,  Boston   250.00 

Ernest  S.  Howes,  Boston   250.00 

Herbert  M.  Sears,  Boston   500.  00 

Frank  L.  Howes,  Boston   250.00 

Alvah  Crocker,  Fitchburg,  Mass   250.00 

George  C.  Lee,  Boston   500. 00 

Henry  Hornblower,  Boston   250.  00 

Walter  H.  Langshaw,  New  Bedford,  Mass   500.  00 

Mrs.  David  Dows,  New  York  City   100.  OO 

November,  25,  1919 : 

Mrs.  A.  Graham  Miles,  New  York  City   500.  00 

December  1,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Peter  Larson,  New  oYrk  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  W.  K.  Vanderbilt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  George  Henry  Warren,  New  York  City   100.  OO 

Mrs.  Geo.  O.  Knapp,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  Otto  Kahn,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Henry  L.  Warwell,  New  York  City   500.00 

December  2,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Daniel  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

H.  B.  Walker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

December  3,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Coleman  Du  Pont,  New  York  City   2,  000.  00 

F.  V.  Du  Pont,  Wilmington,  Del   500.  00 

December  4,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Edw.  Harkness,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

December  5.  1919. 

H.  W.  Cannon,  New  York  City   100.00 

December  6,  1919 : 

Mrs.  John  Magee,  New  York  City   .500.00 

Mrs.  Jas.  R.  Sheffield,  New  York  City   200.  00 

December  8,  1919 : 

Duncan  Ellsworth,  New  York  City  :   100.  00 

Mrs.  Duncan  Ellsworth,  New  York  City   100.  00 

E.  H.  Arnold,  New  York  City   250.00 

J.  M.  McNiece  &  Co.,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Walter  J.  Townsend  &  Co.,  New  York  City   100.  OO 

Dec.  11,  1919 : 

Farley.  Harvey  &  Co,  Foston,  INIass   150.  OO 

John  A.  Ordway,  Boston.  Mass   150.00 

Charles  L.  Harding,  Boston,  Mass   150.00 

J.  M.  Prendergast,  Boston,  Mass   100.  OO 

Frank  W.  Remick,  Boston,  Mass   200.  00 

Franklin  Dexter,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Gordon  Dexter,  Boston,  Mass   100.00 

I.  Tucker  Burr,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Thomas  B.  Gannett,  Boston,  Mass   150.00 

Dewey,  Gould  &  Co.,  Boston,  Mass   200.  00 


2192 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Dec.  11,  1919— Continued. 

Charles  W.  Ryder,  Boston,  Mass   $100.00 

George  W.  Brown,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Stuart  W.  AVebb,  Boston,  Mass   lOo!  00 

Francis  R.  Hart,  Boston,  Mass   15o!  00 

Gordon  Abbott,  Boston,  Mass   150.00 

Leslie  Langill,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

S.  M  .Weld,  Boston,  Mass   150.00 

Courtenay  Guild.  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Nelson  Curtis,  Boston,  Z^Iass   100.  00 

Edwin  U.  Curtis,  Boston,  Mass   400.  00 

Costello.  C.  Converse,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

George  P.  Gardner,  Boston,  Mass   1(K).  00 

Chas.  E.  Cotting,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Robt.  Aniory,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Chas.  L.  Crehore,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00" 

AVallace  F.  Robinson,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Daniel  W.  F'arnsworth,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Augustus  Hemenway,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Chas.  F.  Adams,  Boston,  Mass   100.00 

Geo.  H.  Swift,  Boston,  Mass  ^   100.  00 

IManger  &  Avery,  Boston,  Mass   750.  00 

William  E.  Jones,  Boston,  Mass   .500.  00 

Eiseman  Bi-os.,  Boston,  Mass   400.00 

Rosenthal  Bros.,  Boston,  Mass   400.  00 

Hills  &  Nichols,  Boston,  Mass   400.  00 

Chas.  F.  Cross  &  Co.,  Boston,  Mass   300.  00 

Elroy  AV.  Houghton,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Jacob  H.  AA^ood     Co.,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Howard  At  wood,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

W.  M.  Marston,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

John  P.  Reynolds,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Stephen  M.  AA'eld  &  Co..  Boston,  Mass   1,000.00 

Jeremiah  AA  illiams  &  Co.,  Boston,  IMass   250.  00 

Studley  &  Emery,  Boston,  Mass   450.  00 

Henry  Hornblovrer,  Boston,  Mass   250.00 

L.  Q.  AA'hite,  Boston,  Mass   500.00 

Henry  L.  Lapham.  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

Bertram  H.  &  Howard  S.  Borden,  Boston,  Mass   1,  000.  00 

H.  M.  Cole,  Boston,  Mass   250.00 

Edwin  S.  AA^enster,  Boston,  Mass   250.00 

Chas.  E.  Riley,  Boston,  Mass   250.00 

J.  R.  Lesson,  Boston,  Mass   250.00 

Carl  K.  Bacon,  Boston,  Mass   250.  00 

Philip  L.  Reed,  Boston,  Mass   250.  00 

Lucius  J.  Knowles,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

George  Upton,  Boston,  INIass   750.  00 

S.  AA' .  Bridges,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Sev.ard  AA^  Jones,  Boston,  Mass   200.00 

Walter  H.  Paige,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.  00 

John  Neild,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.  00 

Frank  S.  AVilcox,  New  Bedford,  INIass   100.  00 

John  Strongman.  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.  00 

James  Thompson,  New  Bedford,  Mass   400.  00 

C.  O.  Dexter,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.  00 

F.  H.  McDevitt,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.00 

William  O.  Devoll,  New  Bedford,  Mass   200.00 

John  Sullivan,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.00 

C.  M.  Holmes,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.00 

C.  M.  Holmes,  New  Bedford.  Mass   100.  00 

Henry  Y.  Tiffany,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.00 

C.  S.  Kelley,  jr.,  New  Bedford,  Mass   100.  00 

A.  AV.  Forbes,  New  Bedford,  Mass   200.00 

A.  R.  Sharp,  New  Bedford,  INIass   500.00 

A.  S.  Mason,  New  Bedford,  Mass   400.0^ 

Dec.  10,  1919: 

H.  C.  Haskins,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Phillips  Phoenix.  New  York  City   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2193 

Dec.  11,  1919: 

Mrs.  John  Henry  Hammond,  New  York  City   $1,  000.  00 

^Irs.  J.  H.  Prentice,  New  York  City   100.00 

:Nrrs.  Paul  D.  Cravnth,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Malcolm  D.  Whitman,  New  York  City_^   500.  00 

Mrs.  .Jiio.  D.  Ptockefeller,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Henry  Seligman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Dec.  12,  1919: 

Mrs.  Clias.  D.  Wetmore,  New  York  City   2o0.  00 

Louis  Runkel,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Dec.  15.  1919: 

Fritz  Lindenmeyer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Gustave  Lindenmeyer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Jonathan  Bulkley,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Dec.  16,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Geo.  D.  Cross,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  G.  E.  Kissel,  New  Jersey   100.  00 

Mrs.  W.  H.  Truesdale,  New  York  Citv   100.  00 

Dec.  18,  1919: 

Mrs.  J.  P.  Grace,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  Felix  Warburg,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

:\[rs.  Walter  B.  James,  New  York  City   250.  00 

N.  E.  Drake,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   .500.  00 

F.  S.  Vreeland,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   5(X).  00 

Hinry  Minners,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y  ^  100.  00 

F.  H.  Bennett,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Dec.  22,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Oliver  G.  Jennings,  New  York  Citv   200.  00 

William  Mitchell,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

:Mrs.  Henry  W.  De  Forest,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Jonathan  Bulkley,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Frederick  Moss,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  AVhitney  Warren,  New  York  City  •   2.50.  00 

Mrs.  Anson  Burchard,  New  York  City  .   200.  00 

Mrs.  Chas.  E.  Miller,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Odgen  Mills,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Whitelaw  Reid,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Dec.  23,  1919 : 

Mrs.  George  S.  Brewster,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Mary  C.  Alexander,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  C.  Hallam  Keep,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  W.  R.  Tinken,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Dec.  24,  1919: 

Mrs.  Walter  G.  Oakman,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  S.  R.  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Miss  Flora  Whitney,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Stuart  Duncan,  New  York  Citv   100.  00 

A.  Kingslev  Macomber,  HoUister,  Calif   1,000.00 

Dec.  26,  1919 : 

Mrs.  Richard  M.  Hoe,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Theodore  Schulze,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  F.  Thompson,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  J.  B.  Duke,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Dominick  &  Dominick,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Dec.  30,  1919 : 

Miss  Barbara  Whitney,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  W.  Vanderbilt,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  William  Hay  ward,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Clarence  M.  Hyde,  New  York  City   100.  00 

O.  J.  McConnell,  New  York  Citv   500.  00 

Dec.  31,  1919 : 

W.  F.  Etherington,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Jan.  2,  1920: 

Mrs.  Goodhue  Livingston,  New  York  City   400.  00 

Mrs.  Alvin  W.  Krech,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Fred  H.  Betts,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  EUery  S.  James,  New  York  City   100.  00 


2194 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


•  Jan.  2,  1920— Continued. 

Mrs.  Russell  Hpadley,  New  York  City   $100.  00 

Mrs.  Helen  A.  Hoadley,  New  York  City   ]00.  00 

Ernest  R.  Ackerman,  Plainfield,  N.  J   1,  000.  00 

H.  P.  Howell,  New  York  City   125.  00 

Mrs.  Edward  Van  Ingen,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  A.  Read,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  P.  A.  Valentine,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Walter  B.  Jennings,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Tudver,  Hayes  &  Bartholomew,  Boston,  Mass   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Charles  MacNeill,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Tiffany  Richardson,  New  York  Citv   100.  00 

Jan.  3,  1920 : 

Guy  E.  Tripp,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

E.  B.  Schley,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  W.  D.  Sloane,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  B.  Thompson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00  . 

Mrs.  Harry  Sinclair,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Fred  Pratt,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Jan.  5,  1920 : 

J.  S.  Alexander,  New  York  City   500.00 

H.  S.  Shonnard,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

H.  H.  Raymond,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

F.  D.  M.  Strachan,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

B.  B.  Vander  Veer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Lewis  E.  Pierson.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

C.  F.  Bliss,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

C.  N.  Bliss,  jr.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Samuel  P.  Colt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

John  D.  Rockefeller,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

John  D.  Rockefeller,  jr.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  7,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Jas.  A.  Burden,  jr..  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  H.  P.  Bingham,  New  York  City   100.  00 

H.  B.  Thayer,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  8,  1920: 

George  Blumenthal,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  9,  1920: 

Mrs.  Mary  W.  Harriman,  New  York  City   2,  000.  00 

Mrs.  C.  C.  Tegethoff,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Miss  Corbel i a  Landon,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  Chas.  Lawrence,  Bayshore,  L.  I   200.00 

Mrs.  Francis  M.  Wolcott,  Colony  Club,  N.  Y   200.00 

Mrs.  Paul  Dougherty,  New  York  City   200.  00 

MrvS.  Jas.  Rogerson,  New  York  City   200.00 

Mrs.  E.  A.  Harriman,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  S.  B.  Brigham,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  W.  G.  Lyle,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  C.  C.  Rumsey,  Glen  Head,  L.  I   000.  00 

Mrs.  R.  Penn  Smith,  jr..  New  York  City   600.  00 

Mrs.  Geo.  D.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  McDougall  Hawkes,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  John  T.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Miss  Helen  C.  Frick,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Chas.  E.  Hughes,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  C.  A.  Coffin,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Ogden  L.  Mills,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Howard  T'hipps,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Henry  C.  Phipps,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Jan.  10,  1920 : 

.    Mrs.  Geo.  Blumenthal,  New  York  City   100.00 

A.  C.  Clark,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  W\  W.  Aldrich;  New  York  City   200.  00 

Edwin  S.  Schenck,  New  York  City   250.  00 

J.  R.  McClement,  New  York  City   1, 000.  00 

Mrs.  N.  I.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2195 

Jan.  12,  1920 : 

Wm.  J.  Burns,  New  York  City   $1,  000.  00 

Malcolm  D.  Whitman,  New  York  City   500.  00 

J.  P.  Stevens,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  13,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Roy  A.  Rainey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Jan.  15.  1920 : 

Mrs.  B.  S.  Prentice,  New  York  City  i   500.  00 

Mrs.  Peter  B.  Wvckoff,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  O.  Iselin,  Westbury,  L.  I   500.00 

Jan.  16,  1920 : 

Col.  Wm.  B.  Thompson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

B.  F.  Bailey,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Jan.  17,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Henry  Clews,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  W.  Phelps,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  John  Markle,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Jan.  20,  1920 : 

Mrs.  John  Morron,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Jas.  G.  Blaine,  New  York  City   •  100.00 

Mrs.  W.  Emlen  Roosevelt,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mrs.  John  H.  Criesel,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Jan.  21,  1920 : 

Mr.  Frederick  B.  Piatt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mr.  Herbert  L.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mr.  John  T.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.00' 

Harold  I.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  W.  K.  Vanderbilt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Eleanor  J.  King.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Republican  League  of  Massachusetts,  Boston,  Mass   20,000.00 

Mr.  John  Willys,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

E.  C.  Converse,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

N.  E.  Drake,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Chas.  F.  Ayer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

D.  A.  Schulto,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

H.  E.  Dodge,  New  York  City   100.  00 

John  Conley,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Wm.  E.  Corey,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  22,  1920 : 

W.  D.  Breaker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Ridley  Watts,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Francis  L.  Hine,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

J.  F.  Farrell,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  H.  Nichols,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

J.  Parker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

R.  L.  Agassiz,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Chas.  E.  Sampson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

W.  H.  Aldridge,  New  York  City   500.  00 

F.  F.  Fitzpatrick,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  23,  1920 : 

Warren  Cruikshank,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

W.  S.  Mowris,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Frank  G.  Kennedy,  Philadelphia,  Pa   500.  00 

-John  J.  Watson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  P.  Jenks,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Leopold  Frederick,  New  York  City   250.  00 

G.  P.  Smith,  New  York  Citv  ^  1,  000.  00 

A.  R.  Gallatin,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Chas.  H.  Blair,  New  York  City   200.  00 

E.  H.  Gary,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

C.  A.  Braman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  M.  Chapin,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  24,  1920 : 

C.  L.  Dimon,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

E.  L.  Adams,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  Louise  T.  Lord,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  W.  Allen,  New  York  City   500.00 

Miss  Ruth  V.  Twombly,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 


2196  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Jan.  24,  1920— Continued. 

Mrs.  Reginald  Barclay,  New  York  City   $500. 00 

S.  Hinman  Bii-d,  New  York  City   100.00 

Mrs.  Hugh  D.  Auchincloss,  New  Yoi-k  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  Herbert  L.  Satterlee,  New  York  City   500.  00 

(Jlarence  H.  Mackay,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

J.  Leonard  Replogle,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

J.  F.  Alvord,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  26,  1920 : 

Ambrose  Monell,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

•Thos.  W.  Slocum,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

A.  B.  Murtha,  New  York  City   150.00 

Wm.  D.  Guthrie,  New  York,  N.  Y   500.00 

Jan.  27,  1920: 

Michael  Dreicer,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Mary  B.  Rogers,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

Geo.  J.  Whelan,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Joshua  Cosden,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

Jan.  28,  1920: 

Mr.  S.  R.  Guggenheim,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  H.  Moore,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Martin  Egan,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  H.  Porter,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  J.  K.  Aldred,  New  York.  N.  Y   2-50.00 

Mrs.  Reeve  Schley,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  .Joseph  E.  Davis,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.00 

Mrs.  Edwin  C.  Jameson,  New  York,  N.  Y   200.  00 

Mrs.  James  Barclay,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.00 

Mrs.  George  B.  French,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Charles  E.  Mitchell,  New  Y(irk,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Benedict  J.  Greenhut,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.00 

Mr.  Otis  H.  Cutler.  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mr.  Henry  P.  Davison,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

Jan.  29,  1920: 

Mrs.  Wm.  Ross  Proctor,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

J.  B.  Cobb,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Charles  A.  Terry,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

L.  J.  Robertson,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

E.  W.  Sinclair,  Tulsa,  Okla     500.00 

Joseph  Clendenin,  New  York,  N.  Y   2.50.  00 

Andrew  Fletcher,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Hamilton  F.  Kean,  Elizabeth,  N.  J   1,  000.  00 

Aldred  &  Co,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

F.  M.  Kirby,  Wilkes  Barre,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Charles  T.  Hubbs,  New  York,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Jan.  31,  1920: 

Mrs.  E.  J.  Steiner,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

M.  Friedsam,  New  York,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

B.  G.  Grace,  South  Bethlehem,  Pa   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Eliha  Chauncey,  South  Bethlehem,  Pa   300.00 

Charles  M.  Schwab,  South  Bethlehem,  Pa   1,000.00 

Percival  R.  Lowe,  South  Bethlehem,  Pa   200.  00 

Feb.  2,  1920: 

W.  E.  Frow,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

W.  A.  Nash,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

R.  D.  Brown,  New  York  City   100.  00 

D.  B.  Sherer,  New  York  City   100.  00 

F.  T.  Martin,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Feb.  3,  1920: 

E.  Clarence  .Tones,  New  York  City__   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  H.  Flinn,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,  000.  00 

H.  S.  Collins,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Thomas  Cochran,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Ogden  Mills,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Eiiot  Wadsworth,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Francis  McN.  Bacon.  New  York  City   100,  00 

Mrs.  Paul  G.  Morton,  New  York  City    100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2197 

Feb.  4.  1920: 

O.  B.  Perry,  New  York  City   $200.  00 

W.  H  .Perkins,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

G.  W.  McGarrali,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

L.  Toro,  New  York  City   500.  00 

John  K.  MacGowan,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Feb.  6.  1920: 

Robert  M.  Thompson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Charles  E.  O'Hara.  New  York  City   250.  00 

E.  F.  Colladay,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  P.  Frazier,  New  York  City   ,  100.  00 

Feb.  9,  1920: 

J.  Louis  Schaefer,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

George  AVhitney,  Westbury,  L.  I   1,  000.  00 

C.  R.  Petri.  Westbury,  L.  I   100.  00 

C.  A.  Coffin,  Westbury,  L.  I   1.  GOO.  00 

Ricliard  A.  Monks,  Westbury,  L.  I   200.  00 

Everett  B.  Sweezy,  Westbury,  L.  I   125.  00 

Francis  D.  Bartwo.  W^estbury,  L.  I   125.  00 

Feb.  10,  1920: 

Edward  Perry  Townsend,  Ngw  York  City   100.  00 

C.  A.  W^impfheimer,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

H.  H.  Powell,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Edward  Townsend,  New  York  City   1,000  00 

John  McHugh,  New  York  City   5  00.  00 

Mrs.  Henry  O.  Hoyt,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  J.  B.  A.  Fosburgh,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Feb.  11.  1920 : 

Lady  Joseph  Duveen,  New  York  City—   500.  00 

Leopold  Demuth,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Charles  D.  Norton,  New  York  City  ^   250.  00 

Feb.  13,  1920 : 

Joseph  Edward  Thompson,  New  York   500.  00 

George  F.  Baker,  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Theo.  F.  Merseles,  New  York   500.  00 

Feb.  14,  1920: 

Mrs.  Harry  Payne  Whitney.  New  York   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Michael  Gavin,  New  York   2~)i).  00 

Mrs.  Cornelius  Bliss,  jr.,  New  York   100.  00 

Mrs.  John  W^illys,  New  York   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Daniel  Tenney,  New  York     100.  00 

Feb.  16,  1920: 

Republican  League  of  Massachusetts,  Boston,  Mass   5,  000.  00 

D.  B.  Wentz,  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

E.  C.  Lufkin,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Ellis  Weinwright,  Palm  Beach,  Fla   500.00 

Feb.  17,  1920: 

John  R.  Morron,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  Barbour,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Feb.  18,  1920: 

George  M.  Clark,  New  York  City__:   100.  00 

A.  V.  Ostrom,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Feb.  20,  1920: 

Mrs.  Chas.  Auchincloss,  New  York  Citv   500.  00 

C.  W.  Barron,  New  York  City   1,  0(K).  00 

Mrs.  E.  N.  Potter,  jr..  New  York  Citv   100.  00 

Cha.s.  E.  Rushmore,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jas.  Wright,  New  York  City   100.  00 

F.  A.  Vanderlip,  New  York  Citv   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  21,  1920: 

T.  L.  Townsend,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

J.  E.  Mayfield,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

E.  C.  Graham,  Washington,  D.  C   800.  00 

Geo.  S.  Dearborn,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Louis  E.  Stoddard,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Miss  Katherine  Mackay,  New  York  City   100.  00 


2198 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Feb.  26,  1920: 

Henry  Krurab,  New  York  City   $500.  00 

Prank  C.  Munson,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  Jas.  Mabon,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Fred'k  S.  Peck,  Providence,  11.  1  •   1  000  00 

Feb.  27,  1920: 

E.  P.  Swenson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  Hamlin  Childs,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

A.  M.  White,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Jolm  J.  Knox^  New  York  City   100.  00 

Chas.  A.  Stone,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Otto  H.  Kahn,  New  York  Citv   1,  000  00 

Feb.  28,  1920: 

Messmore  Kendall,  New  York  City_   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  1,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Peter  Larson,  New  York  City   500.  00  ' 

W.  C.  Burant,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  4,  1920 : 

William  W.  Williams,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Paul  Morton,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Lizzie  P.  Bliss,  New  York  City   500.  00 

J.  H.  Schoonmaker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

H.  K.  Twitchell,  New  York  City   250.  00 

William  L.  Fish,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Walter  Scott,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  8,  1920: 

Anson  W.  Burchard,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  H.  Harding,  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,000.00 

J.  M.  Hansen,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Mar.  9,  1920 : 

J.  II.  Williston,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mar.  11,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Wortham  Hames,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Edward  M.  Weld,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

John  Hays  Hammond,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  Goadby  Loew,  New  York  City  ^   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  13,  1920 : 

Minor  C.  Keith,  New  York  City   100.  00 

C.  F.  Sturhahn,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Raymond  E.  Jones,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Geo.  Zabriskie,  New  York  City   100.00 

Mar.  16,  1920 : 

Mrs.  William  Fahnestock,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Grayson  Murphy,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  Charles  Norton,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Henry  P.  Fletcher,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mar.  17,  1920: 

Granville  F.  Dailey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Mc  C.  Beard,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Franklin  Remington,  New  Y^ork  City   500.  00 

Mar.  18,  1920 : 

T.  A.  Gillespie,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Felix  N.  Warburg,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

William  P.  Jackson,  Salisbury,  Md   500.00 

Mar.  23,  1920 : 

Wm.  D.  Judson,  New  York  City   250.  00 

W.  H.  Woodin,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  W.  H.  Nichols,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mar.  25,  1920 : 

E.  R.  Kemp,  Tulsa,  Okla   500.  00 

Christian  Bahnsen,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jos.  B.  Seaman,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Stephen  Birch,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Chas.  Havden,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Mar.  29,  1920 : 

H.  Content  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

A.  L.  Scheuer,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2199 

Mar.  31,  1920: 

T.  F.  Maiiville,  New  York  City   $1.  000.  00 

Dwight  W.  Morrow.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Frederick  H.  Brooke,  Wasliington,  D.  C   350.  00 

Mrs.  DeLancey  Kouiitse,  New  Yorl^  City   500.  00 

Charles  Edgar,  Essex  Falls,  N.  J   1,  000.00 

Apr.  1.  1920: 

Frank  W.  Holmes,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Lucius  R.  Eastman,  New-  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Murrv  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  3.  1920: 

Samuel  S.  Blood,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Jacquelin  &  DeCoppet.  New  York  City   250.  00 

Mrs.  Eugene  Van  R.  Thayer.  New  York  City   200.  00 

John  McE.  Bowman.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Edward  , M.  Dulin,  Washington,  D.  O   100.00 

Frank  L.  Wagner,  Washington,  D.  C   200.  00 

Frederic  D.  McKenney,  Washington,  D.  C   250.  00 

F.  AV.  McKenzie,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

Julius  Garfinkle  &  Co.,  Washington,  D.  C   500.  00 

Samuel  J.  Prescott,  Washington,  D.  C   1,  000.  00 

Samuel  P.  Colt,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Frederick  L.  Jenckes.  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Edward  E.  Arnold,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

J.  J.  Bodell,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Isaac  B.  Merriman,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  C.  Breed,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Henry  H.  Abbott,  New  York  City   250.00 

Geo.  W.  Morgan,  New  York  Citv   250.  00 

Charles  C.  Lloyd,  New  York  City   200.  00 

S.  T.  Hubbard,  jr.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

AValter  Jennings,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Sherwood  Aldrich,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Percival  S.  Hill,  New  York  Citv   1,  000.  00 

E.  P.  Cronkhite,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

E.  E.  Smather.  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Isaac  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   500.  00 

E.  H.  Steiger,  Milwaukee,  Wis   250.  00 

Mrs.  Paul  Morton.  New  York  City   100.  00 

Apr.  4,  1920: 

Henry  B.  Sharpe,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

.Tames  R.  McColl,  Providnece,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Percy  M.  Chandler,  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,000.00 

W.  Hinckle  Smith.  Philadelphia,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Windsor  T.  White,  Cleveland,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  12,  1920: 

Edward  F.  Atkins,  Belmont,  Mass   1.  000.  00 

John  L.  Saltonstall,  Beverly,  Mass   1,  000.  00 

Jesse  P.  Lyman,  Boston,  Mass  .   750.  00 

Lawrence  Minat,  Boston,  Mass   250.  00 

Charles  F.  Ayer,  Boston.  Mass   175.  00 

Richard  S.  Russell,  Bo.ston.  Mass   100.00 

Edward  C.  .Tohnson,  Boston,  ]\Lass   200.  00 

Geo.  Wigglesworth,  INIilton,  Mass   250.  00 

J.  E.  Stanton,  Jr.,  New  Bedford,  Mass   500.  00 

Fred  T.  Loy,  Springfield,  Mass   250.  00 

David  H.  Fanning.  Worcester,  Mass  -   250.  00 

H.  W.  Goddard.  Worcester,  Mass   250.00 

Geo.  H.  Lumb,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   500.00 

Joseph  E.  Fletcher,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

AVebster  Knight,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

John  S.  Holbrook.  Providence,  R.  I   1.  000.  00 

Samuel  M.  Nicholson,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

John  Johnston,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

.Tames  C.  Potter,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

LeRoy  Fales,  Pawtucket.  R.  I   500.00 


2200 


PRESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Apr.  12,  1920— Continued. 

Albert  A.  Jenks,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   $500.  00 

Edward  E.  Leonard,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

B.  C.  Chace,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Eugene  Jackson.  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

C.  Prescott  Kniglit,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Lyman  B.  Goff,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Apr.  13,  1920: 

De  Lancey  Kountze,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Leo  D.  Greenfield,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Tucker,  Anthony  &  Co.,  New  Yoi-k  City   500.  00 

Gangler  &  Fransicli,  New  York  City   150.  00 

Walter  H.  Filor,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Jeremiah  Milbank,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  D.  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  OO 

Geo.  D.  Pratt,  jr..  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

Sherman  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Nicholas  Murray  Butler,  New^  York  City   100.  00 

J.  S.  Auerbach,  New  York  City   500.  OO 

A.  L.  Auerbach,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Apr.  14,  1920: 

Geo.  F.  Baker,  jr..  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Daniel  Guggenheim,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Thomas  H.  Frothingham,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Apr.  16,  1920: 

Stephen  O.  Metcalf,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Thomas  A.  Howell,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Miss  Marie  L.  Willard,  Rochester,  N.  Y   100.  00 

George  Eastman,  Rochester,  N.  Y   2,  000.  00 

Clarence  E.  Chapman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Lyman  D.  Smith,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

M.  L.  Morgenthau,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  19,  1920 : 

Richard  A.  Strong,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

S.  B.  Chapin  &  Co.,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Albert  R.  Fish,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Joseph  R.  Dilworth,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Juiien  T.  Da  vies,  New  York  Citv   150.  00 

Apr.  20,  1920 : 

A.  N.  Laventhal,  New  York  City   100.  00 

F.  S.  Vreeland,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.00 

H.  C.  Turner,  New  York  Citv   100.  OO 

Bertram  H.  Borden,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Howard  S.  Bordon,  New  York  City   2,  000.  00 

Theodore  F.  Whitmarsh,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

John  Sanford,  Amsterdam,  N.  Y   1.  000.  00 

Apr.  22,  1920 : 

E.  W.  Eager,  New  York  City   150.  00 

Apr.  23,  1920 : 

R.  J.  Caldwell,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Wm.  R.  Simons,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Apr.  24,  1920 : 

F.  Jarrigeon,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

Antonin  Chapel,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

Herman  Basch,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

J.  E.  Sicterley,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Hiram  W.  Siblev,  Rochester,  N.  Y   1.000.00 

Mrs.  Hiram  W.  Sibley,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Apr.  27,  1920 : 

Alfred  M.  Coats,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Joseph  Ott,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,  OOO  00 

John  F.  Street,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   lOO  00 

D.  G.  Dery,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

■  Mrs.  Herbert  Pratt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Philip  L.  Schell,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Rufus  W.  Scott  Co.,  New  York  City   1,000.00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2201 

Apr.  28.  1920 : 

Mrs.  Courtlandt  D.  Barnes,  New  York  City   $100.  00 

Jules  S.  Bache,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Micliael  F.  Phelan,  New  York  City   100.  00 

E.  D.  Pouch,  New  York  City   100.00 

J.  Adolph  Mollenhaiier,  Brooldyn,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

Apr.  30,  1920 : 

George  M.  Pynclion,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  AValter  Mavnard,  New  York  City   100.  00 

May  3,  1920 : 

J.  H.  Thompson,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Alfred  P.  Boehm,  New  York  Citv   1,  000.  00 

George  W.  Foster,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

M.  S.  Kemmerer,  New  York  Citv   1,  000.  00 

Sol.  Wexler.  New  York  City  :   1,  000.  00 

Hon.  N.  y.  Y.  Franchott,  Clean,  N.  Y   750.  00 

Walter  B.  Johnson,  New  York  City   100.00 

F.  R.  Whitten,  New  York  City   100.00 

Edwin  C.  Johnson.  New  York  City   200.00 

Franklin  Johnson,  New  York  Citv   200.00 

May  4,  1920: 

Robert  C.  Kerr,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Lawrence  Marx,  New  York  Citv   250.00. 

W.  W.  Barbour,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Frank  A.  Harden,  New  York  City   250.  00 

A.  L.  Sylvester,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

W.  C.  Teagle,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Walter  J.  Fahy,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

D.  L.  Goff:,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Darius  Goff,  Pawtuckett,  R.  I   1,000.00 

J.  F.  Syme,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

John  Lawson,  Central  Falls,  R.  I   500.  00 

May  5,  1920: 

Mrs.  Fredk.  C.  Brown,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Henrv  W.  T.  jNLali  &  Co.,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Ethan  Allen,  New  York  City   500.  00 

May  6,  1920: 

Mrs.  William  Hamlin  C^hilds,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   .   500.  00 

IMrs.  James  Howell  Post,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Eustis  L.  Hopkins,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Anthony  Schneider,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

E.  J.  Steer,  New  York  City   200.00 

James  H.  Mc(4raw,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

William  B.  Schiller.  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Andrew  K.  Jencks,  Providence,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Chas.  O.  Read,  Pawtucket,  R.  I   1,000.00 

Kenneth  F.  Wood,  Providence,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

Edward  E.  Woolley,  Woonsocket,  R.  I   1,  000.  00 

William  B.  MacColl,  Providence,  R.  I   750.  00 

E.  C.  Bucklin,  Providence,  R.  I   100.  00 

Geo.  H.  Cahoone,  Providence,  R.  I   200. 00 

May  7,  1920: 

C.  Ledyard  Blaire,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

1.  Townsend  Burden,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  Wm-.  G.  Rockefeller,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  J.  H.  Thompson,  Mount  Vernon,  N.  Y   950.  00 

John  Hood,  New  York  City   250.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

Henry  Chalfant,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

D.  S.  Mackay  &  Co.,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Ranald  H.  MacDonald,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Colby  M.  Chester,  Jr.,  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

May  8,  1920 : 

James  A.  Harden,  New  York  City   2.50.  00 

J.  D.  Clarke,  New  York  City   100.  00 

G.  A.  Adams,  New  York  City   500.  00 


2202 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  8,  1920— Continued. 

John  Reisenweber,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   $100.  00 

Wm.  G.  Broadway,  New  York  City   250.  00 

W.  S.  Prankard,  New  Y^ork  City   100.  00 

Isidore  Gelbtrunk,  New  York  City   100.  00 

H.  &  W.  H.  Lewis,  New  York  City     500.  00 

H.  M.  Stoclvton  &  Co,  New  York  City   250.  00 

W.  H.  Duval,  New  Y^ork  City   500.  00 

Wm.  Stroud  &  Co.,  New  Y'^ork  City   100.  00 

May  10,  1920 : 

Byron  S.  Adams  &  W.  J.  Eynon,  Washington,  D.  C   150.  00 

Frank  J.  Hogan,  Washington,  D.  C   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  Ramsay,  Washington,  D.  C   100.00 

Theodore  W.  Noyes,  Washington,  D.  C  ^   500.  00 

.  May  11,  1920  : 

Mrs.  Fletcher  D.  Proctor,  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00  - 

Edward  H.  Everett,  Bennington,  Vt   500.  00 

Emily  Proctor  Eggleston,  Proctor,  Vt   500.  00 

Albert  Keller,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Victor  Norawetz,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Eugene  Grace,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Paul  Gottheil,  New  York  City  ,   100.  00 

Thompson  Smith,  Lewiston,  Me   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  C.  Perkins,  Southampton,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  George  O.  Knapp,  New  York  City   200.  00 

W.  W.  Warner,  New  York  City   200.00 

Thomas  L.  Foulkes,  New  York  City   100.  00 

May  12,  1920 : 

Howard  Atwood,  Bolton,  Mass   200.00 

Still  man  F.  Kellery,  Cambridge,  Mass   100.  00 

Geo.  E.  Davis,  Nortli  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

Geo.  B.  Kunhardt,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

Moses  T.  Stevens,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

John  H.  Stone,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

Geo.  H.  Simonds,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

Granville  E.  Foss,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

Fred  W.  Steele,  North  Andover,  Mass   100.  00 

J.  W.  Coe,  Holden,  Mass   250.00 

Cecil  Q.  Adams,  Wellesley,  Mass   100.00 

E.  F.  Jones,  Worcester,  Mass   100.  00 

N.  C.  G.  Bell,  Worcester,  Mass   100.  00 

Edgar  Reed,  Worcester,  Mass   100.  00 

John  E.  White,  Worcester,  Mass   300.  00 

Block,  Maloney  &  Co.,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

W.  Emlen  Roosevelt,  New  York'  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  H.  Fairlield  Osborn,  New  York  City   100.  00 

May  14, 1920 : 

I»aul  (Juenther,  Dover,  N.  J   1.000.00 

Walter  W.  Taylor,  Montclair,  N.  J  .   250.  00 

Mrs.  Edmond  S.  Twining,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Thos.  L.  Leeming.  Brooklvn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Alvah  Miller,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

Fisher  &  Kennedy,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

E.  I.  Goodrich,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Jos.  H.  Em-ery,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Thos.  W.  Davis,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   250.  00 

David  C.  Waring,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1(X>.  00 

E.  M.  Townsend  &  Co.,  New  York  (pity,  N.  Y   250  00 

Bacon  &  Co.,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mr.  and  Mrs.  Mortimer  L.  Scliitf,  New  Y^n-k  City,  N.  Y^   2,  000.  00 

Wm.  J.  Battey,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

T.  B.  Yuille,  New  York  City,  N.  Y  .   500.00 

Mav  17, 1920: 

Wm.  P.  Palmer,  New  York  City,  N.  Y__-   1,  0(K).  00 

Geo.  H.  Clapp,  Seewickley,  Pa   1,000.00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2203 

May  15, 1920: 

A.  L.  Robertson,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   $1,  000.  00 

M.  T.  Richardson,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   500.  00 

James  Sliewan,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Frank  L.  Avery,  Ridgewoocl,  N.  J   100.  OO 

May  IS,  1920* 

C.  J.  Obermeyer,  Brooldyn,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Robt.  T.  Francis,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Henry  C.  Martin,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   250.  00- 

Edward  C.  B  um,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

John  A.  Eclvert,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Henry  M.  Wells,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Herman  Stutzer,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   10<).  00 

Fredk.  Vietor  &  Aclielis,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,000.00 

L.  F.  Dommerich  &  Co.,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Charles  R.  Rushmore,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  OO 

Moreau  Delano,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   500.  00 

May  19,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Wm.  Kissam,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Albert  Cohen,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  OO 

Ludwig  Nissen,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Mrs.  Fairfax  Landstreet,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Fritz  Achelis,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Stephen  Valentine,  Brooldyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Walter  Bliss,  Bernardville,  N.  J   100.  00 

Charles  McKnight,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,  000.  00 

A.  F.  Carpenter,  Rome,  N.  Y   860.  00 

May  22,  1920 : 

J.  M.  Hansen,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

W.  S.  Mitchell,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.  OO 

J.  H.  Moore,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Lewis  A.  Park,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Thomas  Morrison,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

J.  H.  Park,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

H.  C.  McEldowney,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Gordon  &  Smith,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Louis  Brown,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Sol.  Rosenblum,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.00 

C.  D.  Marshall,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  OO 

H.  H.  McCIintic,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

W.  J.  Patterson,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

Jas.  L.  Stuart,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   U)0.  00 

R.  H.  Boggs,  Pittsburgh.  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Jas.  D.  Callery,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  OO 

Harry  C.  Graham,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

William  L.  Monro,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

William  Price,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

D.  S.  Zimmerman,  Somerset,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

J.  Barlow  Cullum,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

W.  J.  Johnson,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

Nathaniel  Holmes,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  OO 

W.  N.  Ballard,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

J.  R.  McCune,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  OO 

C.  D.  Armstrong,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Norwood  Johnston,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

"H.  L.  Mason,  jr.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

J.  B.  Shea,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000  00 

A.  E.  Sixsmith,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

H.  M.  Johnson,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1.  000.  00 

Leon  Falk,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  OO 

Maurice  Falk,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

J.  H.  Reed,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Frank  J.  Lanahan,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Roy  A.  Hunt,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000  00 

Arthur  V.  Davis.  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

F.  W.  Howell,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  OO 

William  Flinn,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 


2204 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


May  22,  1920— Continued. 

J.  D.  Lyon,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   $1,000.00 

E.  M.  Byers,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

J.  Frederick  Byers,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

W.  Harry  Brown,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Geo.  W.  Crawford,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,000.00 

J.  C.  Trees,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Alvah  K.  Lawrie,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

S.  A.  Pickering,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

B.  Thaw,   Pittsburgh,   Pa   100.  GO* 

William  McConway,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

William   McConway,   Jr.,   Pittsburgh,   Pa   500. 00| 

A.  W.  Mellon,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Howard  Heinz,  Pittsbu]-gh,  Pa   500.  00 

R.  B.  Mellon,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

G.  W.  Malone,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

C.  B.  Ferree,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00  ' 

E.  W.  Mudge,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

B.  F.  Jones,  Jr.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Lucv  Lippitt,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

G.  M.  Laughlin.  Jr.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

Alice  Jones  Willock,  Sewickley  Heights,  Pa   1,000.00 

Henry  Laughlin,  Philadelphia,  Pa   2,000.00 

H.  H.  Laughlin,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Elizabeth  M.  Home,  Sewickley  Heights,  Pa   1,000.00 

Mrs.  A.  Laughlin,  Jr.,  Pittsburgh.  Pa   1,000.00 

Henry  Chalfant,  trustee,  Pittsburgh,  Pa____   1,000.00 

Charles  M.  Swift,  Ferrisburg,  Vt   500.00 

Mrs.  Anson  McCook  Beard,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   250.  00 

S.  G.  Mortimer.  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   200.  00 

L.  S.  Morris,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   250.00 

G.  G.  Mason,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   100.  00 

J.  E.  Davis,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   100.  00 

William  F.  Velter,  Highland  Mills,  N.  Y   100.  00 

R.  Talbot,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   100.00 

William  Crawford,  Monroe,  N.  Y   100.00 

R.  Delafield,  Tuxedo,  N.  Y   100.00 

Horace  N.  Stevens,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Gilbert  G.  Thorne,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Converse,  Stanton  &  Co.,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   200.  00 

E.  P.  Lea,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Sidney  Bernheimer  &  Co.,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Wilham  C.  Potter,  New  York  City,  N.  Y____   250.  00 

May  24,  1920 : 

Miss  Frances  E.  White,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  H.  F.  Noyes,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Mrs.  Edward  C.  Blum,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Julius  Fleischmann,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Clarence  Dillon.  New  York  City   1.  000.  00 

T.  W.  Friend,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

C.  W.  Friend,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

May  25,  1920 : 

Theo.  H.  Lamprecht,  New  York  City   100.  00 

C.  K.  McCornick,  New  York  City   500.  00 

Charles  A.  Schiereu,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Richard  Young,  New  York  City   1,000.00 

Jacob  Bartscherer,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.  00 

P.  W.  Rouss,  New  York  Citv   250.  00 

E.  W.  Seabrey,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Behrend  &  Rothschild,  New  York  Citv   100.  00 

Mrs.  William  Ambrose  Tavlor,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Edward  H.  Rathbun,  Woonsocket,  R.  I   300.  00 

Wilham  C.  Dart,  Providence,  R.  I   100.  00 

Harry  R.  Milner,  Westerly,  R.  I   500.  00 

Mrs.  H.  S.  Shonnard,  Ovster  Bav,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Colgate  Hoyt,  Oyster  Bay,  N.  Y   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2205 

May  26,  1920: 

Richard  C.  Boiuly,  New  York  City   $350.  00 

A.  S.  Haiglit  &  Co.,  New  York  City   100.  00 

H.  Ilichter's  Sons,  New  York  City   100.  00 

H.  M.  Swetlancl,  New  York  City   350.  00 

W.  H.  Taylor,  New  York  City   350.  00 

Chas.  G.  Pliillips,  New  York  City   300.  00 

Lawrence  B.  Elliman,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Roggen  Brothers  &  Company,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Mrs.  H.  C.  Phipps,  Roslyn,  L.  I   150.  00 

Mrs.  Watson  Webb,  Woodbury,  L.  I   100.  00 

Mrs.  Otto  Kalm,  Woodbury,  L.  I   100.  00 

Miss  Maude  A.  K.  Wetmore,  Newport,  R.  I   250.  00 

May  27,  1920 : 

John  J.  Miller,  New  York  City   250.  00 

Logan  &  Bryan,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

C.  J.  Bill  wilier,  jr..  New  York  City   500.  00 

Mrs.  John  J.  McCook,  Tuxedo  Park,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Hon.  Guy  P.  Gannett,  Augusta,  Me   1,  000.  00 

Hon.  Blaine  S.  Viles,  Augusta,  Me   1,  000.  00 

May  28,  1920: 

E.  W.  Pargnsy,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

Wm.  Larimer  Jones,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

A.  Overholt  &  Co.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

J.  J.  Kennedy,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

G.  R.  Nutty,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

J.  W.  Williams,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

Wesley  A.  Looney,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

F.  A.  Leovy,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

George  H.  Taber,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

W.  L.  Mellon,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

W.  V.  Hartmann,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

AVm.  P.  Snyder,  jr.,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Geo.  L.  CoUord,  Pittsburgh,  Pa  i   1,000.00 

H.  N.  Trimble,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

Henry  Oliver   Rea,   I'ittsburgh,  Pa   2,000.00 

Edith  Anne  Rea,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,  000.  00 

Edith  Oliver  Rea,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,  000.  00 

D.  L.  Gillespie,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

E.  R.  Crawford,  McKeesport,  Pa   2,  000.  00 

O.  H.  Babcock,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

F.  R.  Babcock,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

E.  V.  Babcock,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

W.  H.  Harding,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

A.  C.  Opperman.  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

A.  R.  Hamilton,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,  000.  00 

A.  K.  Rabe,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   ■  500.00 

P.  M.  Framptou,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

A.  A.  Willson,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

E.  H.  Stoner,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.00 

J.  L.  Kendall,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.  00 

E.  A.  Bowles,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.00 

A.  J.  Diebold,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.00 

Wm.  Smearbaugh-H.  E.  Kelly,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.  00 

A.  A.  Germain,  IMttsburgh,  Pa   250.  00 

C.  F.  Ross,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.  00 

Chas.  Bruckman,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.00 

J.  N.  Wollett,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   150.00 

\Y.  H.  Wilhams,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   150.  00 

Walter  E.  Ahlers,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   150.  00 

Wm.  Simons  and  Harry  C.  Simons,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   150.  00 

J.   B.   Montgomery,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.00 

Jos.  W.  Cottrell,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

J.  T.  Parsons,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

James  J.  Munn,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

Geo.  S.  Davison,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 


182774— 20— FT  15  8 


2206  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

May  28,  1920— Continued. 

Bernon  S.  Prentice,  New  Yorlv  City   $1,  000.  00 

A.  C.  Bedford,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  Ambrose  Clark,  Westbury,  Long  Island   500.  00 

Mrs.  Chester  A.  Braman,  New  York  City   100.  00 

Paul  M.  Warburg,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Elen  H.  Hooker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

May  30,  1920 : 

F.  P.  Knowles,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

Tucker  Anthony  Co.,  Boston,  Mass   500.  00 

N.  F.  Ayer,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

W.  C.  Chick,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

J.  E.  Fuller,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

C.  A.  More,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

W.  B.  Henderson,  Boston,  Mass   125.  00 

J.  F.  McElwain,  Boston,  Mass   250.  00 

G.  E.  Keith,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

H.  L.  Burrage,  Boston,  Mass   125.  00  ' 

H.  K.  Simonds,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

A.  G.  Simonds,  Boston,  Mass   100.00 

G.  K.  Simonds,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

G.  F.  S.  Singleton,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

J.  F.  Ray,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

T.  P.  King,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

W.  H.  Carter,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

H.  A.  Carter,  Boston,  Mass   100.  OO 

Jno.  W.  Weeks,  Boston,  Mass   5,  000.  00 

E.  D.  Stetson,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

W.  Ames,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

L.  A.  Frothingham,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

F.  L.  Ames,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

A.  W.  Damon,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

G.  C.  Tait,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

W.  H.  McClench,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

F.  L.  Batchelder,  Boston,  Mass   125.  00 

J.  E.  Bradley,  Boston,  Mass   125.00 

G.  A.  Bigelow,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

F.  H.  Daniels,  Boston,  Mass   100.00 

P.  A.  Drury,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

C.  H.  Norton,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

J.  P.  Shattuck,  Boston,  Mass  :   100.  00 

H.  G.  Stoddard,  Boston,  Mass   375, 00 

C.  G.  Stratton,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

M.  S.  Wright,  Boston,  Mass   100.  00 

G.  F.  Fuller,  Boston,  Mass   150.  00 

Jas.  Logan,  Boston,  Mass   125.  00 

J.  H.  Higgins,  Boston,  Mass   200.  00 

June  1,  1920 : 

George  W.  Dickerman,  New  York  City   100.  00 

William  Graupner,  New  York  City   100.  00 

John  H.  Love,  New  York  City   lOO  00 

Mrs.  Elon  H.  Hooker,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  F.  H.  Ives,  New  York  City   200.  00 

Mr.  and  Mrs.  J.  Merwin,  Hancock,  N.  Y   100.  00 

Randall  H.  Hagner  &  Co.,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

E.  F.  Bishop,  Honolulu   1,  000.  00 

R.  Shingle,  Honolulu   1,000.00 

E.  D.  Tenney,  Plonolulu   1,000.00 

W.  F.  Dillingham,  Honolulu   1,000.00 

J.  Waterhouse,  Honolulu   1,000.00 

G.  R.  Carter,  Honolulu   1,000.00 

W.  F.  Frear,  Honolulu   lOO  00 

John  Guild,  Honolulu    100.00 

A.  Gartlev,  Honolulu   500.  00 

F.  C.  Atiierton,  Honolulu   250.00 

J.  R.  Gait,  Honolulu   lOO  00 

M.  F.  Prosser,  Honolulu   100. 00 


PRESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2207 

June  1,  1920— Continued. 

J.  D.  Mclnerny,  Honolulu-   $12.").  00 

W.  H.  Molnerijy,  Honoliilu   125.  00 

C.  H.  Cooke,  Honolulu   500.  00 

A.  W.  T.  Bottomley,  Honolulu   1,000.00 

J.  L.  Cockburn,  Honolulu   .500.  00 

E.  H.  Wodehouse,  Honolulu   500.00 

A.  G.  M.  Robertson,  Honolulu   100.  00 

R.  A.  Cooke,  Honolulu   500.  00 

Henrv  Holmes,  Honolulu   100.  00 

B.  L.  Marx.  Honolulu   100.00 

June  2,  1920 : 

J.  Philip  Herrnum,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

Peter  A.  Doury,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 

Cuno  H.  Rudolph,  Washington,  D.  C   1,000.00 

Harry  Wardman,  Washington,  D.  C   1,000.00 

Donald  Woodward,  V\^ashington,  D.  C   200.  00 

H.  W.  De  Forest,  Laurelton,  N.  Y   100.  00 

F.  C.  Swan,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.00 

Ralph  Crews,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Frank  A.  Munsey,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

E.  M.  Treat,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   500.00 

Irwin  B.  Laughlin,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   2,000.00 

Mrs.  Eliz  L.  Phillips,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   1,000.00 

H.  W.  Croft,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   100.  00 

June  3,  1920: 

Col.  W.  E.  Fowler,  Washington,  D.  C   1,  000.  00 

Alexander  Wolf,  Washington,  D.  C   100.00 

James  A.  Cobb,  Washington,  D.  C  '   100.00 

William  A.  Hill,  Washington,  D.  C   150.00 

Mrs.  Harold  Walker,  W\ashington,  D.  C   200.  00 

Mrs.  Larz  Anderson,  Washington  D.  C   300.  00 

Mrs.  Alexander  Rogers,  Washington.  D.  C   100.  00 

Mi.ss  Amaryllis  Gillett,  Washington,  D.  C   500.  00 

Wm.  A.  Prendergast,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.  00 

B.  H.  Tobey,  New  York  City   100.00 

Mrs.  Lewis  E.  Pierson,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   100.00 

Eberhard  Faber,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Robert  Tod,  Syosset,  N.  Y   100.  00 

June  4.  1920 : 

Otto  M.  Eidlits,  New  York  Citv   1,000.00 

S.  D.  Peyser.  New  York  City   100.  00 

Charles  A.  Rice,  Lihue,  Kauai,  Hawaii   500.  00 

G.  N.  Wilcox,  Lihue.  Kauai,  Hawaii   500.  00 

Wm.  Hyde  Rice,  Lihue,  Kauai,  Hawaii   500.  00 

A.  J.  Campbell,  Honolulu   100.00 

June  5,  1920 : 

Ludwig  Vogelstein,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

H.  D.  Roosen,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Lafayette  B.  Gleason,  New  York  Citv   200.  00 

J.  Wm.  Clark,  Newark,  N.  J   1,000.00 

June  7.  1920 : 

James  C.  Cropsey,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y   300.  00 

B.  W.  Lemmon,  Pittsburgh,  Pa   250.00 

June  8,  1920  : 

E.  A.  S.  Clarke,  New  York  City   250.00 

June  9,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Elbert  H.  Gary,  Brookville,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Jan.  17,  1919: 

Walter  S.  Dickey,  Kansas  Citv,  Mo   250.  00 

Jan.  23,  1919 : 

J.  J.  McGraw,  Ponca  City,  Okla   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  27,  1919: 

Jas.  A.  Patten,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  29,  1919 : 

Peter  Norbeck,  Pierre,  S.  Dak   500.  00 

Thos.  W.  Smith,  Washington,  D.  C   100.  00 


2208 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Jan.  81,  1919 : 

Philil)  Wri.aley,  Chicago,  111   $1,  000.  00 

William  Wrigley,  jr.,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

xVda  E.  AVrigley,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  4,  1919: 

Goo.  M.  Reynolds,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Feb.  6,  1919 : 

G.  E.  Haskell,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Feb.  10,  1919 : 

F.  N.  HofCstot,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   500.  00 

Feb.  18,  1919: 

Julius  Regenstein,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

R.  M.  Eastman,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Oscar  Heineman,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  19,  1919: 

Chas.  D.  Norton,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

Mar.  .5.  1919: 

W.  K.  Dana,  Westbrook,  Me   400.  00 

Mar.  13,  1919 : 

D.  W.  Buchanan,  Chicago  111   1.000.00 

J.  K.  Bering,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  14,  1919 : 

H.  M.  Byllesby,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Mar.  17,  1919 : 

C.  M.  Moderwell.  Chicago,  111   500.00 

AVm.  V.  Kelley,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

C.  H.  Worcester,  Chicago,  111   500.00 

W.  H.  Howe,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

E.  A.  Cudahy,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Thos.  Creigh,  Chicago,  111   500.00 

Albert  B.  Dick,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Mar.  18,  1919: 

Walter  S.  Dickey,  Kansas  City,  Mo   750.  00 

La  Verne  Noyes,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Hon.  Lawrence  C.  Phipps,  Denver,  Colo   1,  000.  00 

Hon.  Hubert  Work,  Pueblo,  Colo   1.  000.  00 

Mar.  20,  1919 : 

Robt.  J.  Thorne,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Henry  Schott,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Apr.  4,  1919: 

Alfred  H.  Mulliken,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Apr.  10,  1919 : 

Geo.  F.  Porter.  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Apr.  11,  1919: 

Edwnrd  B.  Butler,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Apr.  28,  1919 : 

Cbas.  H.  Hulburd,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Apr.  18.  1919 : 

A.  T.  Naugle,  Chicago,  111   200.  00 

Wilbur  L.  Lafean,  Chicago,  111  -   100.00 

Apr.  21,  1919: 

C.  H.  Thorne,  Chicago,  111   500.00 

May  2.  1919 : 

Albert  W.  Harris,  Chicago.  Ill   1,000.00 

May  7,  1919 : 

Geo.  F.  Griffin,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

May  10,  1919: 

F.  Edson  White.  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Arthur  I\reeker,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Chas.  W.  Armour,  Chicago,  Hll   1,000.00 

J.  Ogden  Armour,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

R.  J.  Dunham,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

C.  W.  Sherman,  Chicago,  III   1,000.00 

Geo.  M.  Seaman,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

May  12,  1919 : 

C.  S.  Morey,  Denver,  Colo   1,000.00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2209 

IShv  IT,  1919 : 

11.  T.  Crane,  jr.,  Chicago,  111  $1,  000.  00 

May  22,  1919  : 

AV.  H.  McCiirdy,  Evansville,  Iiid  1  83a.  07 

S.  L.  May,  Evansville,  ^Ind   838.  88 

Joseph  Graham,  Evansville,  Ind   IGO.  50^ 

Ray  Graham,  Evansville.  Ind   IGG.  50 

Alfred  L.  Baker,  Chicago,  111   188.83 

Theodore  Schulze,  St.  Paul,  Minn   1,  000.  00- 

Ivlay  24,  1919 : 

Charles  G.  Dawes,  Chieag-o,  111   1.000.00 

Joy  Morton,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

R.  P.  Lamont,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

R.  H.  Ripley,  Chicago,  111   150.00 

Edward  F.  Carry,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.00 

May  20,  1920 : 

L.  H.  Bigelow,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

Geo.  D.  Jones,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

D.  R.  Seaman,  Chicago,  111   200.  00 

Julius  Rosenwald,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  OO 

May  26, 1919: 

Ernest  R.  Graham.  Chicago,  111   1.  000.  OO 

Mav  29,  1919: 

B.  A.  Eckhart,  Chicago.  Ill   1,  000.  00 

June  4, 1919 : 

A.  K.  Macomber,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Myrtle  H.  Macomber,  New  York  City   1.  000.  OO 

J.  W.  Embree,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  OO 

June  5, 1919 : 

Wm.  H.  Crocker,  San  Francisco,  Calif  ,   1,000.00 

Mrs.  Wm.  H.  Crocker,  Burlingams,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

R.  S.  Moore,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1.  000.  00 

Mrs.  Florence  Moore,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

June  6, 1919 : 

]\Irs.  Grace  G.  Vanderbilt,  New  York  City   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  C.  A'an  Antwerp,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

June  9,  1919 : 

Robert  T.  Lincoln,  Chicago.  Ill   500.  00 

June  10, 1919 : 

Charles  E.  Perkins,  Chicago,  111   500  m 

June  13, 1919 : 

Mrs.  Malcolm  D.  Whitman,  San  Francisco,  Calif   500. 

C.  Templeton  Crocker.  San  Francisco,  Calif   500.  Offc 

June  14, 1919 : 

Herbert  Fleishhacker,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1.  000.  OO 

E.  M.  Wilson,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1.  DOd  f\c* 

June  16, 1919 : 

Rufus  C.  Dawes,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  OO 

Clint  Moore,  Tulsa.  Okla   1,000.00 

Frank  Phillips,  Bartlesville,  Okla   1,  000.  OO 

Geo.  T.  Cameron,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,. 000.  00 

Comyn,  Mackall  &  Co..  San  Francisco,  Calif   1.  000.  OO 

Ellis  Wainwright,  San  Francisco,  Calif   500.  OO 

June  17,  1919 : 

James  Irvine,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1.  000.  OO 

Stanlev  Dollars,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  OO 

W.  P.  Roth,  San  Francisco,  Calif   500.  OO 

June  IS,  1919 : 

.  Walter  G.  Filer,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  OO 

June  20. 1919 : 

Mrs.  Vv'.  G.  Irwin,  San  Francisco,  Calif   L  000.  OO 

June  23,  1919 : 

Mrs.  E.  H.  G.  Slater,  W^ashington,  D.  C   1,000.00 

Miss  Helen  V.  Crocker,  San  Mateo  County,  Calif   1,  OOO  00 

Joseph  D.  Grant,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,000.00 

W.  H.  McFadden,  Ponca  City,  Okla   1,  000.  00 


2210 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


June  25,  1919 : 

J.  D.  Spreckels,  San  Francisco,  Calif  $1,  000.  00 

A.  B.  Spreckels,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,000.00 

July  1,  1919 : 

Eliot  Wadsworth,  Washington,  D.  C   500.  00 

July  2,  1919: 

Robt.  R.  McCormick,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

July  11,  1919 : 

A.  W.  Leonard,  Tulsa,  Okla   250.00 

Harry  H.  Heasley,  Tulsa,  Okla   250.  00 

James  L.  Flood,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

July  12,  1919 : 

H.  V.  Foster,  Bartlesville,  Okla   1,000.00 

July  14,  1919 : 

Louis  F.  Monteagle,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

July  23,  1919 : 

A.  K.  Macomber,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  Myrtle  H.  Macomber,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   1,  000.  00 

R.  M.  McFarlin,  Tulsa,  Okla   1,000.00 

E.  R.  Perry,  Tulsa,  Okla   100.00 

Aug.  9,  1919 : 

Edw.  Hines,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Edgar  A.  Bancroft,  Chicago.  Ill   500.  00 

Aug.  12,  1919: 

John  H.  Rosseter,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,000.00 

John  Barneson,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  John  Barneson,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

J.  Leslie  Barneson,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

Aug.  14,  1919 : 

Allan  M.  Clement,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

John  F.  L.  Curtis,  Highland  Park,  111   500.  00 

E.  W.  Decker,  Minneapolis,  Minn   500.  00 

Aug.  19,  1919: 

John  G.  Shedd,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Sept.  17,  1919: 

Henry  F.  Woodard,  Washington,  D.  C   250.  00 

Sept.  29,  1919: 

Chas.  E.  Lewis,  Minneapolis,  Minn   500.  00 

Todd  W.  Lewis,  Minneapolis,  Minn  :   500.  00 

L.  S.  Allen,  Minneapolis,  Minn   100.  00 

John  S.  Pillsburv.  Minneapolis,  Minn   1,  000.  00 

D.  S.  Culver,  St.  Paul,  Minn   500.  00 

K.  C.  Schuyler,  Denver,  Colo   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  6,  1919: 

Hovey  C.  Clarke,  Minneapolis,  Minn   500.00 

Chas.  E.  Lewis,  Minneapolis,  Minn    500.  00 

E.  C.  Cooke,  Minneapolis,  Minn   200.  00 

Oct.  14,  1919: 

E.  L.  Carpenter,  Minneapolis,  Minn   1,  000.  00 

Oct.  15,  1919: 

Redtield  Proctor,  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Miss  Marv  H.  Proctor,  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Miss  Emily  Dutton  Proctor.  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Miss  Fredrika  G.  Holden,  Proctor,  Vt   500.00 

Oct.  16,  1919: 

W.  K.  Dana,  W^stbrook,  Me   200.  00 

Arthur  R.  Rogers,  Minneapolis,  Minn   100.  00 

Oct.  20,  1919 :      ^  nn 

Chester  H.  Searcy,  Louisville,  Ky   1,  tuu.  uu 

A.  T.  Hert,  Louisville,  Ky   000.  00 

Clarence  Miller,  Louisville,  Ky   1,  000.  00 

Col.  Chauncey  Dewey,  Manhattan,  Kans   100.00 

Oct.  30,  1919 :  ^ 

R.  K.  Le  Blond.  Cincinnati.  Ohio   1,000.00 

F.  A.  Geier,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1-  O^O-  00 

W.  C.  Procter,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1.  2^0.  OOj 

Eli  Winkler,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   oOO.  ^ 

J.  J.  Burchenal,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   JOO. 

B.  H.  Kroger,  Cincinnati,  Ohio  '-   »00. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2211 

Oct.  30,  1919— Continued. 

B.  W.  Campbell,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   $500.00 

M.  E.  Johnston,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   2.  500.  00 

J.  E.  Proctor,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   2,  500.  00 

August  Tuechter,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Arthur  R.  Morgan,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   2.50.00 

John  Omwake,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

A.  P.  Streitman.  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Adolph  C.  Weiss,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

B.  S.  Armstrong,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

B.  B.  Quillan,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   2.50.00 

E.  H.  Lunken,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.00 

Roger  K.  Rogan,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Herbert  G.  French,  Cincinnati  Ohio   250.00 

W.  H.  Mullins.  Salem,  Ohio   1,000.00 

W.  W.  Ross,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.00 

C.  E.  Davis,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Nov.  4  1919: 

F.  H.  Stoltze,  Minneapolis  Minn   500.  00 

Nov.  25,  1919: 

Walter  S.  Dickey,  Kansas  City,  Mo   1,000.00 

H.  W.  Nichols,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   200.  00 

Nov.  26,  1919: 

W.  K.  Dana,  Westbrook,  Me   500.  00 

Nov.  29,  1919: 

J.  W.  Perry,  Kansas  City,  Mo   1.000.00 

Dec.  9,  1919 : 

A.  H.  Turrittin,  Minneapolis,  Minn   100.  00 

Dec.  15,  1919: 

Christopher  R.  Corning,  New  York  City,  N.  Y   250.  00 

Dec.  19,  1919 : 

W.  S.  McLucas,  Kansas  City,  Mo   500.  00 

E.  F.  Swinnev,  Kansas  City,  Mo   500.  00 

G.  M.  &  L.  C.  Smith,  Kansas  City,  Mo   500.  00 

Dec.  20,  1919 : 

Frederick  M.  Alger,  Detroit.  Mich   1,  000.  00 

Dec.  23,  1919 : 

Gebbard  .Taeger,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

Foster  Copeland,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

W.  A.  Miller,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

F.  A.  Miller,  Columbus.  Ohio   500.  00 

E.  S.  Pettigrew,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

E.  E.  Lerch,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

S.  P.  Bush,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.00 

S.  P.  Bush,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.00 

A.  Brenholte,  Columbus.  Ohio   250.  00 

.Tas.  L.  Hamill,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.00 

.T.  S.  Bracken,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.00 

.Tohn  W.  Kaufman,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Jan.  2,  1920 : 

R.  T.  Crane,  jr.,  Chicago,  111   1,000.00 

Jan.  5,  1920 : 

Edward  Hines,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Robert  Allerton,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Horace  E.  Dodge,  Detroit,  Mich   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  9,  1920 : 

Geo.  F.  Porter,  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  12,  1920 : 

E.  R.  Jackson,  Plymouth,  N.  C   150.  00 

Jas.  L.  Hamill,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.00 

Jan.  1.5,  1920: 

B.  S.  Pearsall,  Elgin,  111   200.00 

G.  O.  Forbes,  Rockford,  111   100.00 

F.  H.  Croul,  Detroit,  Mich   20O.  00 

Frank  G.  Ryan,  Detroit,  Mich   100.00 

J.  D.  Spreckles,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

A.  B.  Spreckles,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

Wm.  H.  Murphy,  Detroit,  Mich   250.  00 


2212  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Jan.  19,  1920: 

Edw.  Whitaker,  St.  Louis,  Mo   $500.00 

Hovey  G.  Clarke,  Minneapolis,  Minn   .500.00 

W.  T.  Beatty,  Chicago,  111   .500.  00 

Henry  Blun,  Savannah,  Ga   .500.  00 

Henry  B.  Joy,  Detroit,  Mich   .500.00 

Mrs.  Henry  B.  Joy,  Detroit,  Mich   .500.  00 

Jan.  21,  1920 : 

A.  D.  Morton,  Bartlesville,  Okla   250.00 

Jan.  22,  1920 : 

Dwight  F.  Davis,  St.  Louis,  Mo   500.  00 

Benj.  Gratz,  St.  Louis,  Mo   500.  00 

O.  L.  Garrison,  St.  Louis,  Mo   500.  00 

W.  H.  Lee.  St.  Louis,  Mo   500.  00 

Judson  S.  Bemis,  St.  Louis,  Mo   250.  00 

M.  L.  Wilkinson,  St.  Louis,  Mo   125.  00  ' 

John  D.  Filley,  St.  Louis,  Mo   250.  00 

A.  L.  Shapleigh,  St.  Louis,  Mo   500.  00 

Jan.  23,  1920 : 

J.  E.  Cameron,  Kingstown,  N.  C   100.  00 

Robert  Lassiter,  Charlotte,  N.  C   500.  00 

C.  J.  Harris,  Dillsboro,  N.  C   1,  000.  00 

C.  B.  Chapman,  Asheville,  N.  C   1,  000.00 

David  H.  Blair,  Winston,  N.  C   200.  00 

Jan.  26,  1920: 

D.  E.  Felt,  Chicago,  111   2,500.00 

Jas.  McNaughton,  Calumet,  Mich   1,  000.  00 

J.  H.  Rice,  Houghton,  Mich   1,  000.  00 

Jan.  27,  1920 : 

B.  F.  Unthank,  Winchester,  Ky   100.00 

H.  S.  Bush,  Winchester,  Ky   100.  00 

H.  G.  Garrett,  Winchester,  Ky   100.  00 

Hon.  Emile  Kuntz,  New  Orleans,  La   250.00 

J.  S.  Thomson,  Lake  Charles,  La   100.00 

Walter  L.  Cohen,  New  Orleans,  La   125.  00 

Dr.  D.  A.  Lines,  New  Orleans,  La   125.  00 

Wm.  H.  Crocker,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  W^m.  H.  Crocker,  Burlingame,  Cfalif   1,000.00 

A.  K.  Macomber,  San  Francisco,  Calif   2,  000.  00 

Mrs.  A.  K.  Macomber,  San  Francisco,  Calif   2,  000.  00 

Jan.  30,  1920: 

John  S.  Miller,  Chicago,  111   250.  00 

Mortimer  R.  Proctor,  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Theodore  N.  Vail,  Lyndonville,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Mrs.  M.  R.  S.  Vail,  Lyndonville,  Vt   1.  000.  00 

Mrs.  A.  A.  Marstei's,  Lyndonville,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Charles  Adamson,  Cedartown,  Ga   500.  00 

Rov  D.  Chapin,  Detroit,  Mich   500.  00 

David  C.  Whitney,  Detroit,  Mich  ;   .500.  00 

Emory  W.  Clark,  Detroit,  Mich   500.  00 

Feb.  2.  1920 : 

Isham,  Lincoln  &  Beale,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Mrs.  Julius  Rosenwald,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

L.  D.  Richards,  Fremont,  Nebr   300.00 

A.  R.  Demory,  Detroit,  Mich  -   100.  00 

J.  H.  Hardwick,  Winchester,  Ky   100.  00 

Frank  B.  Russell,  Louisville,  Ky   100.  00 

W.  W.  Gurley,  Chicago,  111   200.  00 

Feb.  3,  1920: 

Silas  H.  Strawn,  Chicago,  111   500.  00 

Feb.  4,  1920: 

Geo.  T.  Guernsey,  Independence,  Kans   250.  00 

W.  S.  Fitzpatrick,  Independence,  Kans   250.  00 

A.  W.  Shulthis,  Independence,  Kans   250.  00 

C.  E.  Roth,  Independence,  Kans   100.  00 

W.  J.  Bovaird,  Independence,  Kans   100.  00 

Herbert  Cavaness,  Ohanute,  Kans   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2213 

Feb.  4.  1920— Continued. 

W.  F.  Allen,  Clianiite.  Kans   $100.  00 

H.  H.  McCall,  Chanute,  Kans   100.  00 

J.  W.  Finley,  Chanute,  Kans   100.  00 

Milo  T.  .Jones,  Chanute,  Kans   100.  00 

AV.  W.  Watson,  Saiina,  Kans   100.  00 

L.  G.  Gottschlck,  Saiina,  Kans   100.  00 

Fred  H.  Quincy.  Saiina,  Kans  ^-   100.00 

J.  B.  Smith,  Saiina,  Kans   100.00 

J.  S.  Hargett,  Saiina,  Kans   100.  00 

G.  A.  Rogers,  Abilene.  Kans   100.  00 

Feb.  5,  1920 : 

Geo.  T.  Cameron,  San  Francisco,  Calif   1,000.00 

Feb.  6,  1920: 

L.  B.  Kuppenheimer.  Chicago,  111   1,  000.  00 

Miss  Emely  Button  Proctor,  Proctor,  Vt   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  7,  1920 : 

F.  O.  Schoedinger,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Peter  Norbeck,  Pieree,  S.  Dak   509.  00 

Feb.  9,  1920 : 

W.  F.  Brown.  Toledo,  Ohio   1,000.00 

M.  Gallagher,  Cleveland,  Ohio   1,000.00 

Milton  Adler.  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Stanley  W.  Allen,  Glendale,  Ohio   275.  00 

Wm.  Alms,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Wm.  Harvey  Anderson,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

H.  H.  Heiner,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.00 

C.  A.  Bickett,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

W.  G.  Bouchi,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   125.  00 

J.  S.  Bracken,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

A.  Brenholtz,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

Robert  M.  Burton,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   850.  00 

S.  P.  Bush,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Archibald  Campbell,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   125.  00 

M.  Carlisle,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

J.  Wallace  Carrol,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

John  Christensen,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

J.  R.  Clark,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

M.  Y.  Cooper,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Foster  Copeland,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

G.  D.  Crabbs,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

R.  B.  Crabbs,  Cincinnati.  Ohio   300.  00 

E.  O.  Dana,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   225.00 

E.  B.  Danson,  Glendale,  Ohio   350.  00 

H.  M.  Daugherty,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

J.  P.  Davis,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

John  A.  Devere,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Douglas,  John,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   200.  00 

Dreses,  Henry,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   325.  00 

Egan,  Thomas  P.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   2.50.  00 

Feltes,  G.  H.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.00 

Gibbs.  Edwin  C,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Hamill,  James  L.,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Harrison,  C.  L.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Higgins,  Chas.,  Columbus,  Ohio   100.00 

Higiey,  R.  L.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   12.5.  00 

Hobart,  James  C,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   200.  00 

Hoefinghoff,  Arthur  C,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Holden,  R.  A.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Hughes,  W.  R.,  Norwood,  Ohio   100.  00 

Jaeger.  G..  Columbus,  Ohio   2.50.  00 

James,  .John  S.,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

Johnson,  Edgar  W.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Jones,  A.  J.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Jones,  David  C,  Wyoming,  Ohio   1.075.  00 

Kaufman,  John  W.,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

LaRue,  W.  S.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   200.00 

Lawrence.  F.  D..  CincinnatL  Ohio   100.  00 


2214  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Feb.  9,  1920— Continued. 

Laws,  Harry  L.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   $100.00 

Lercli,  E.  E.,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

Leynian,  H.  S.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

Llppincott,  J.  T.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.00 

Littleford,  John  S.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   270.  00 

McCaw,  W.  E.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   300.  00 

March,  P.  G.,  Cincinnati,  Oliio   250.  00 

Meacham,  D.  B.,  Cincinnati,  Oliio   600.00 

Menke,  Fred  J.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   150.  00 

Merlvel,  Louis  J.,  Merisel,  Albert  A.,  and  Merkel,  Henry  W.,  Cin- 
cinnati,  Ohio   150.  00 

Merkel,  Louis  J.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Miller,  W.  A.,  and  Miller,  F.  A.,  Columbus,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

Moeller,  W.  J.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   200.00 

Morgan,  Arthur  R.,  Norwood,  Ohio   250.  00 

Oberhelman,  J.  A.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

Onwake,  John,  Norwood,  Ohio   750.  00 

Parlington,  Chas.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Pettigrew,  E.  S.,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.00 

Pollak,  Maurice  E.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

Pollock,  J  ,K.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Poston,  E.  M.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Procter,  Wm.  C,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1,  000.  00 

Puchts,  Geo.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   300.00 

Quilleu,  B.  B.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   1,000.00 

Richardson,  J.  M.,  Lockland,  Ohio   300.00 

Richardson,  Paul,  Lockland,  Ohio   200.  00 

Richardson,  W.  H.,  Lockland,  Ohio   250.  00 

Roberts,  G.,  &  M.  S.,  Columbus,  Ohio   100.  00 

Smith-Leonard  S.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   850.  00 

Stanley,  E.  B.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   850.  00 

Stearn,  Wm.  S.,  Lockland,  Ohio   200.  00 

Swift,  John  B.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.00 

Thomson,  Peter,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

Tuechter,  Aug.  H.,  Chicinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

Ilihlein,  Julius,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.00 

Walker,  Geo.  D.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Weber,  Louis  B.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Weiss,  Adolph  C,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Willoughby,  H.,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.00 

Wilson,  Geo.  B.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   175.00 

Winders,  Wilber,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   100.  00 

Wolfe.  Arthur  D.,  Columbus,  Ohio   250.  00 

Marz,  Henry,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   500.  00 

Armstrong,  B.  S.,  Cincinnati,  Ohio   250.  00 

Feb.  10,  1920 : 

Mrs.  Edward  L.  Ryerson,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

R.  A.  Gideens,  Coushatta,  La   100.00 

Thomas  H.  Underwood,  New  Orleans,  La   125.  00 

George  D.  Roper,  Rockford,  111   500.  00 

Mrs.  Jacob  Baur,  Chicago.  Ill   500.  00 

P.  G.  Reid,  Chicago,  111   100.00 

B.  A.  Gayman,  Chicago,  111   150.00 

Wm.  N.  Pelouze,  Chicago,  111   200.00 

Feb.  12,  1920: 

Mrs.  Robert  J.  Burdette,  Pasadena,  Calif   200.  00 

Feb.  13,  1920 : 

S.  C.  Clover,  Tulsa,  Okla   100.00 

Feb.  14,  1920: 

C.  A.  Lee,  Salina,  Kans   100.  00 

J.  H.  Cavanaugh.  Dighton,  Kans   100.  00 

A.  O.  Edmonds,  Liberal.  Kans   100.  00 

Thad  C.  Carver,  Pratt,  Kans   100.00 

J.  E.  Whitman,  Preston,  Kans   100.  00 

H.  S.  Gregory,  Pratt,  Kans   100.  00 

H.  E.  Schrack,  Pratt.  Kans   100.  00 

A.  A.  Cochran,  Pratt,  Kans   100.  00 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2215 

Feb.  16,  1920: 

W.  E.  BaiT,  Nowata,  Okla   $100.  00 

L.  A.  Kevs,  No^yata,  Okla   100.  00 

Frank  Phillips.  Bartlesville,  Olda   500.00 

John  F.  Hadley,  Tulsa,  Okla   250.00 

Eugene  Lawson.  Nowata,  Okla   250.  00 

Frank  A.  Reed,  Tulsa,  Okla   250.  00 

John  M.  Clover,  Tulsa,  Okla   250.00 

P.  S.  Powell,  Nowata,  Okla   100.  00 

Feb.  18,  1920 : 

M.  T.  McEldowney,  Winchester,  Ky   100.  00 

D.  H.  Siggins,  Coffeyville,  Kans   100.00 

D.  H.  Clark,  Savannah,  Ga   125.  00 

C.  W.  Parker,  Alberton,  Ga   100.  00 

Butz,  Von  Ammon  &  Marx,  Chicago,  111   250.  00 

Henry  A.  Klein,  Chicago,  111   150.  00 

H.  D.  Bu.sh.  Covington,  Ga   200.00 

H.  F.  McCall,  New  Ulysses   100.  00 

J.  S.  Mabon,  Miami,  Okla   125.  00 

Mrs.  Charles  B.  Pike,  Lake  Forest,  111   100.  00 

Mrs.  Fred  W.  Upham,  Chicago,  111   500.00 

Mrs.  C^has.  N.  Strotz,  North  Winnetka,  III   100.  00 

Fred  A.  Poor,  Cliicago,  111   250.00 

J.  Parker  Go  wing,  Chicago,  111   100.  00 

Feb.  19,  1920: 

J.  R.  Poste,  Columbus,  Ohio   500.  00 

Mrs.  J.  McGregor  Adams  Highland  Park,  111   500.  00 

Mrs.  H.  M.  Byllesby,  Chicago.  Ill   100.  00 

Mrs.  Richard  T.  Crane,  jr.,  Chicago,  111   250.  00 

Mrs.  John  F.  L.  Curtis,  Highland  Park,  111   100.  00 

Mrs.  Edward  Hines,  Evanston,  111   1,  000.  00 

Feb.  18,  1920: 

Felix  AVeller,  Chicago,  111   200.  00 

Chas.  Piez,  Chicago,  1)1   500.00 

Gertrude  S.  Keeler,  Grand  Rapids,  Mich   100.  00 

L.  A.  Cornelius,  Grand  Rapids,  Mich   100.  00 

Lewis  H.  Withey,  Grand  Rapids,  Mich   100.  00 

Wm.  Judson,  Grand  Rapids,  Mich   100.  00 

Henrv  T.  Stanton,  Grand  Rapids,  Mich   100.  00 

Feb.  28,  1920 : 

L.  L.  Jenkins,  Asheville,  N.  C   1,  000.  00 

L.  C.  Wagener,  Statesville,  N.  C   100.  00 

J.  M.  Morehead,  Charlotte,  N.  C   1,000.00 

F.  A.  Linney,  Boone,  N.  C   100.00 

George  H.  Brown.  Statesville,  N.  C   150.  00 

John  M.  Sharpe,  Statesville,  N.  C   100.  00 

Geo.  B.  Hiss,  Charlotte,  N.  C   1,  000.  00 

A.  J.  Draper,  Charlotte,  N.  C   1,  000.  00 

W.  G.  Boyd,  Wilson's  Mills,  N.  C   100.  00 

J.  J.  Jenkins,  Siler  City,  N.  C   100.  00 

W.  H.  Cox,  Laurinburg,  N.  C   100.  00 

E.  R.  Jackson,  Plymouth,  N.  C   150.  00 

G.  W.  Hargis.  Pawhuska,  Okla   100.00 


Senator  Pomerene.  Also  the  summary  of  disbursements  from  De- 
cember 1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920,  also  furnished  by  Mr.  Upham;  and 
from  June  14,  1920,  to  August  26,  1920. 

(Upham  Exhibits  "  D  "  and  "  E  "  are  attached  hereto.) 

Upham  Exhibit  D. 

Republican  National  Committee — Disbursements  Dec.  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920. 


Headquarters  expense   $818.  668. 15 

Speakers'  bureau   2,  815.  06 

Chautauqua   11,  496.  24 

Publicity    29,625.35 

General  expense   308,  497. 19 


1, 171, 101.99 


2216 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Upham  Exhiiut  K. 

Rcpiihlican  National  Comviittce — DUhursenients  June  I'l,  1920,  to  Aug.  26,  1920. 

Headquarters  expense  .  $164,453.39 

8i)eakerfc^'  bureau   14. 173.  78 

Publicity    317,  317.35 

General  expense   343,  993.  04 


839,  937.  56 


Senator  Pomerene.  Also  statement  furnished  by  him  showing  the 
contributions  from  December  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920,  by  States,  and 
giving  the  amounts;  what  does  this  mean,  collected  for  the  State? 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  for  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Pomekene.  For  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  Upham.  For  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  giving  the  amount  contributed  for  the 
national  committee  and  for  the  State  committees  in  separate  columns. 
That  will  be  marked  "  Upham  Exhibit  F." 

(Upham  Exhibit  F  is  attached  hereto.) 

Upham  Exhibit  P. 

RcpuhUcan  national  committee — Contrihutions,  Dec.  1,  1918,  to  June  12,  1920. 


Alabama. 
Arkansas . 
Arizona . . 


California  

Colorado  

Connecticut  

Delaware  

District  of  Columbia. 

Florida  

Georgia  

Hawaii  

Idaho  

Illinois  

Indiana  

Iowa  

Kansas  

Kentucky  

Louisiana  

Maine  


Maryland  

Massachusetts. 

Michigan  

Minnesota  

Mississippi  

Missouri  

Montana  

Nebraska  

Nevada  


New  Jersey  

New  Mexico  

New  York  

North  Carolina . 
North  Dakota . . 

Ohio  

QXlahoma  

Oregon  

Pennsylvania . . 
Rhode  Islaii'd. . 
South  Carolina. 
South  Dakota. . 

Tennessee  

Texas  

Utah  

Vermont  

Virginia  

Washington  

West  Virginia. . 

Wisconsin  

Wyoming  


To  national 
committee. 


1 

214 


T. 
466: 
A. 
4. 
94! 

3s; 

15! 

11?; 

35, 

1, 
1, 
1, 
1, 

11, 
^, 

17, 


,  691.  64 
,  340.  43 
280.  42 
,067.  66 
,  759.  67 
356.  23 
500.  00 
,525.00 
3S3.  28 
727.  83 
575.  00 
224. 1.6 
254. 80 
635.  57 
40^.  68 
748.  53 
972.  59 
160.  65 
100.  00 
500. 00 
835.  00 
680.  02 
081.  91 
521.  70 
951.  47 
392. 02 
982. 18 
tl2.01 
400.  00 
288.  88 
416.  30 
248.  74 
993.  73 
580.  67 
276.  46 
312. 12 
921.  00 
465.  00 
120.  28 
453.  63 
1A8.  95 
053.  91 
250.  64 
025.  00 
196.  6: 
758.  27 
234.  81 
141.77 
887.  99 


1,365,897.49  469,456.21 


To  States. 


$1, 691.  64 
7, 198. 92 
280.  42 
25, 349.  84 
2, 170.  33 
718.  77 


100.  00 
76.  72 
659.  42 


2, 328. 42 
49,990.  30 
U,683.  57 
15, 148.  78 
7,931.77 
6, 009.  96 
3,616.35 


15, 000.  00 
38, 750.  00 
21,936.  28 
1,658.09 
38.30 
49, 689.  53 
3, 188.  98 
8, 643.  82 
112.01 


135.  70 
35, 358.  20 
9,  568.  76 
31.27 
84,414.  33 
S,  664.  04 
2,193.11 


76.  72 
2,691.13 
2, 285.  70 
3, 865.  84 
7. 656. 36 


19, 324. 17 
2,241.73 
4,  580. 19 

12, 304.  73 
112.01 


Total. 


S23,  539.  35 


66, 417.  50 
29,930.00 

1,075.00 
500.  00 
12,625.00 
460.  00 

4, 387.  25 
12,  575. 00 

3,  552.  5S 
264, 245.  iO 

3,048.00 
19,  551.  46 
47, 680.  30 
18,982.55 
21,777.  00 

4, 100.  00 
500.  00 
95^  585. 00 
78, 616.  30 

9,740.  00 

1,560.  00 
62, 641. 00 

6,  581. 00 

9, 626.  00 


8, 400.  00 
7, 422.  58 
501,774.  50 
13, 817.  50 
5,025. 00 
178,995. 00 
46,940.50 
17,  505.  23 
117, 921.00 
35, 465. 00 
197.  00 
1, 237.  50 
1, 116.  75 
4,919.  75 
8, 907.  00 
11,025.00 
13, 127.  50 
20,000.  00 
10,815.00 
-  21,446.50 
10, 000.  00 


1,  835,353.  70 


PE7^:SIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2217 


Mr.  MooKE,  So  that  there  may  be  no  misunderstanding  between 
lis,  I  would  like  to  know  as  to  whether  this  amount  includes  simply 
pledges  and  cash  collected;  that  might  be  stated.  I  think  Mr. 
Course}^  is  an  employee  of  the  committee— I  don't  want  to  have  any 
mi  su  nder  st  a  ndi  n  g — — 

Mr.  Upham.  I  don't  know  Mr.  Coursey.  There  is  no  account  of 
l^ledges  in  this  statement.  I  gave  my  pledge  statement  in  my  previ- 
ous testimony,  showing  all  pledges  on  hand  August  26. 

The  Chairman.  AYell,  this  amount  covers  the  pledges? 

Mr.  IJpHAivr.  Oh,  no;  not  at  all.  The  pledges  are  not  cash  until 
they  are  cashed. 

The  Chairman.  But  v\  ait  a  minute.  The  amount  you  are  trying 
to  raise  covers  pledges? 

Mr.  Upham.  Absolutely;  the  pledges  were  turned  into  cash. 

Mr.  Moore.  That  was  the  amount  that  was  turned  in. 

The  Chairman.  So  it  does  not  cover  the  pledges. 

Mr.  Upham.  No;  you  have  a  record  of  the  pledges  by  States  in 
my  previous  statement,  which  I  put  in  the  record  the  other  day. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  Mr.  Coursey,  you  don't  know  him  ? 

Mr.  Upham.  I  don't  know  him ;  I  don't  know  who  he  is ;  there  are 
a  great  many  of  these  men  that  Mr.  Blair  named  the  other  day  that 
I  don't  know.  Now,  I  notice  here  a  statement  of  the  record  that  is 
given  out  to  the  newspaper  men :  One  of  the  reporters  gave  this  to 
me,  and  in  this  I  am  made  to  say  that  early  in  1919  I  made  up  quotas 
of  cities  that  I  have  submitted.  Now,  I  did  not  testify  to  that.  I 
am  misquoted  there.    I  said  States. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  in  the  record? 

Mr.  Upham.  It  says  cities ;  the  record  says,  or  quotes  me  as  saying, 
that  I  said  cities. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  the  statement  in  the  record,  as  you  produced 
it,  that  you  made  quotas  for  cities,  you  say  is  not  correct;  that  you 
did  not  say  that? 

Mr.  Upham.  No  ;  I  said  early  in  1919  I  made  up  quotas  of  States. 
This  says  that  I  made  up  quotas  of  cities.  That  is  the  way  it  reads. 
My  testimony  w^as  that  I  made  up  quotas  of  States  that  I  submitted 
to  this  committee.  I  did  not  submit  any  quotas  of  cities;  I  don't 
know  anything  about  any  quotas  of  cities. 

The  (^HATRMAN.  Tliat  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  E.  H.  MOOEE— Eesumed. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  we  did  not  intend  to  keep  you  waiting 
so  long  when  we  excused  you  the  other  day,  l)ut  you  have  been  very 
kind  about  it. 

Mr.  Moore.  All  right ;  I  am  perfectly  willing. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  get  through  with  you  as  soon  as  w^e  can. 

Mr.  Moore.  Now,  I  want  to  say  this,  if  you  please:  I  made  a  re- 
mark to  the  committee  that  I  thought  that  that  question  which  was 
I  asked  by  Senator  Pomerene  of  Mr.  Upham  was  not  quite  fair  to  the 
I^epublicans.  Senator  Pomerene  seems  to  think  I  was  censuring 
him.  He,  in  replying,  said  that  the  people  have  the  right  to  know 
if  any  speakers  are  paid.    The  question  Avas  not  asked  to  show  as  to 


2218 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


the  speakers  how  much  they  were  paid,  but  only  asked  to  show  the 
Republican's  total,  the  amount  of  the  budget  for  each  thing,  and  I 
thought  we  were  not — in  other  words,  we  are  not  wanting  the  best  of 
it  in  this  investigation.  We  simply  charge  that  there  Avas  an  at- 
tempt  

The  Chairman.  Well,  if  you  made  him  feel  badly,  he  Avill  get 
over  it  in  time. 

Mr.  Moore.  My  idea  was  not  to  make  the  Republicans  disclose 

their  plans,  but  simply  to  shoAV  

Senator  Spencer.  We  Avant  to  go  on. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  ask  you  two  or  three  questions,  Mr.  Moore. 
Mr.  Moore.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  I  Avant  to  ask  you  a  little  bit  about  the  Democrats 
this  time. 

Mr.  Moore.  I  Avill  tell  you  anything  I  knoAV,  and  be  glad  to.  There 
isn't  much  to  tell  this  year ;  that  is,  as  far  as  I  knoAV. 

The  Chairman.  We  Avant  to  find  out  Avhat  the  Democrats,  as  Avell 
as  the  Republicans,  are  doing  in  the  AA^ay  of  raising  money.  Do  you 
knoAv  of  any  general  plan  that  has  been  adopted  for  thp  raising  of 
money  this  year  by  the  Democrats  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  There  was  no  plan  adopted.  Senator,  up  to  the  time  I 
left  NeAv  York,  or  a  Aveek  ago  Tuesday.  I  knoAv  exactly  wdiat  Avas  in 
the  treasury  at  that  time ;  there  Avas  S14,000. 

The  Chairman.  $14,000? 

Mr.  MooRE.  At  that  time. 

The  Chairman.  But  of  course  you  are  Avorking  on  some  financial 
plan? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  understand  so;  yes,  I  suppose  the  ordinary  financial 
plan  of  raising  money. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  not  a  member  of  the  committee,  I  know. 
Mr.  MooRE.  That  is  right. 

The  Chairman.  But  I  thought  you  were  familiar  with  it. 

Mr.  Moore.  That  plan  is  still  to  be  Avorked  out.  No,  I  resigned 
from  the  committee  this  year  to  give  way  to  Mr.  White,  so  he  might 
be  elected  chairman.   That  was  after  the  convention. 

The  Chairman.  The  general  plan  of  the  finance  committee  we  Avill 
secure  from  whom  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Why,  I  suppose  Mr.  Marsh,  as  so'on  as  it  is  completed, 
or  from  the  chairman  of  the  finance  committee,  Mr.  Gerard. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Gerard  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  He  has  just  been  appointed? 
Mr.  MooRE.  He  has  just  been  appointed. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  that  Avork  as  to  financing,  and  the  plan 
of  financing  has  really  just  begun? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  sir.  I  have  no  doubt  that  he  will  have  got  an 
idea,  and  probably  perfected  the  idea  by  this  time.  It  has  been  a 
w^eek  now.  It  ought  to  have  been  done  before. 

The  Chairman.  From  Mr.  Gerard? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  other  organizations  that  are  raising 
any  money  for  the  democratic  campaign  fund,  outside  of  the  com- 
mittee itself? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2219 


Mr.  Moore.  Absolutely  none,  to  my  knowledge,  outside  of  the  na- 
tional committee,  the  national  organization. 
The  Chairman.  And  the  State  committees  ? 
Mr.  MooRE.  And  its  subcommittees. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  what  is  the  Association  Opposed  to  National 
Prohibition  ?   Is  that  taking  any  part  on  either  side  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Senator,  I  never  heard  of  any  such  association  in  my 
life  until  my  attention  was  called  to  an  interview  by  Wayne  Wheeler, 
one  of  the  Kepublican  heads  of  the  Anti- Saloon  League,  which  is  a 
Kepublican  organization. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  that  the  Anti-Saloon  League  is  a  Republi- 
can organization  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  and  as  far  as  this  organization  is  concerned  

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Bryan  is  quite  a  prominent  member  of  it, 
isn't  he  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No ;  he  is  quite  a  prominent  employee  of  it. 
The  Chairman.  He  is  quite  a  prominent  employe  of  it, 
Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  not  a  Republican? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No;  I  don't  understand  that  he  is.  I  never  heard  of 
it  until  then,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  You  never  heard  of  it  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  never  heard  of  its  name  even  until  Walker  Buell, 
correspondent  of  the  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer  in  Washington,  about 
a  month  before  the  convention  called  my  attention  to  an  interview 
with  Wayne  Wheeler  in  which  some  organization — you  will  have  to 
give  me  the  name  of  it ;  I  don't  even  know  its  name. 

The  Chairman.  Association  Opposed  to  National  Prohibition. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Association  Opposed  to  National  Prohibition;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Which  seems  to  have  been  incorporated  under  the 
laws  of  the  State  of  New  York  on  April  1,  1919. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes.  If  there  is  such  an  organization,  it  evidently  is 
some  money-raising  scheme.  And  in  this  interview  Wayne  Wheeler 
quoted  a  prospectus  in  which  they  named — or  in  which  they  gave 
their  tentative  ideas  of  having  somebody  look  after  their  organiza- 
tion for  them  in  the  State,  and  Rud.  K.  Hynicka,  the  Republican 
national  committeeman  of  Ohio,  and  myself,  the  Democratic  na- 
tional committeeman,  one  or  the  other,  as  I  recall  Mr.  Buell's  reading 
it  to  me,  was  named. 

The  Chairman.  Both  of  them  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No ;  one  or  the  other. 

The  Chairman.  Both  of  them,  it  seems  to  me. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  was  it  ? 

The  Chairman.  If  you  are  speaking  of  an  interview,  I  don't  know. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  am  using  the  prospectus.  I  never  heard  of  it.  I 
never  received  any  communication  from  them.  I  never  heard  of  any 
such  organization  before  or  since,  excepting  one  time,  and  that  was 
that  time  when  this  man  from  the  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer,  Mr. 
Buell,  called  my  attention  to  it,  to  the  fact  that  there  was  such  an 
organization,  he  understood,  and  that  I  was  to  have  charge  of  it. 
I  suppose  he  got  it  from  this  interview  of  Wheeler's.  And  he 
wanted  to  know  if  he  could  get  the  advertising  of  this  organization^ 
and  I  told  him  that  I  had  never  heard  of  it,  and  I  didn't  know  any- 
thing about  it. 


2220 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman,  Then  the  use  of  your  name,  Mr.  Moore,  it  being 
sent  out,  is  entirely  unauthorized  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes.  And  I  suppose  it  is  a  money-making  scheme,  if 
they  have  used  the  name  of  Rud.  K.  Hynicka,  who  is  a  Republican, 
and  the  Republican  national  committeeman,  and  my  name,  for  we 
have  always  been  opposed  to  prohibition,  and  I  suppose  they  used 
our  names  because  we  were  not  supposed  to  be  very  clry,  either  of  us. 

The  Chairman.  And  they  use  your  name,  Edward  H.  Moore, 
Youngstow^n,  and  it  says  here  "  that  he,  with  the  possible  assistance 
of  Rud.  Hynicka,  of  Cincinnati." 

Mr.  Moore.  He  is  the  Republican  national  committeeman  from 
Ohio,  I  suppose,  or  he  was.  I  don't  know  whether  he  is  now  or  not. 
Is  he,  Mr.  Upham? 

The  Chairman.  Well,  in  this  prospectus  they  say — but  if  you  have 
not  seen  the  prospectus,  Mr.  Moore  

Mr.  MooRE.  That  is  all  I  know  about  it.  Senator.  I  have  told  you 
everything  T.  know  about  it.   I  have  told  you  all  I  know  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  And  they  say :  "  The  machinery  is  ready  to  be 
started.  Before  a  wheel  can  turn  the  managing  director  must  know 
that  there  is  at  least  $200,000  in  the  treasury." 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  now,  as  I  say,  I  never  heard  of  it  before,  and  you 
will  believe  me  when  I  say  that  I  never  heard  of  it  except  in  that  con- 
nection that  I  mentioned.  I  think  it  is  probably  a  money-raising 
scheme  for  the  promoters  of  it,  like  there  are  thousands  of  them 
in  the  country,  as  you  know^,  and  as  every  newspaper  man  in  the 
country  knows. 

The  Chairman.  They  say,  "  Among  the  speakers  whom  the  asso- 
ciation hopes  to  send  out  are  the  following:  W.  Bourke  Cockran; 
former  United  States  Senator  Joseph  W.  Bailey  of  Texas;  the 
honorable  Bainbridge  Colby  of  New  York."  You  know  nothing 
about  that  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No,  sir,  not  a  thin^g.  If  I  did  I  would  tell  you.  I 
don't  know  anything  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  I  know  you  would  tell  us.  What  is  the  Forward 
Looking  Association  of  Ohio? 

Mr.  Moore.  Never  heard  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  never  heard  of  it  ? 

Mr.  MooRE,  I  never  heard  of  it.   No,  I  never  heard  of  it,  Senator. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Never? 
Mr.  MooRE.  Never  heard  of  it. 

The  Ci-iAiRMAN.  Well,  you  don't  claim  to  be  looking  backward  all 
the  time,  in  Ohio  ?  Who  is  the  Secretary  of  State  ? 
Mr.  MooRE.  Now  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 
Mr.  MooRE.  Judge  Smith. 

The  Chairman.  Harvey  C.  Smith?  ^ 
Mr.  MooRE.  Harvey  C.  Smith. 
The  Chairman.  Harvey  Smith. 

Mr.  MooRE.  He  is  a  Republican,  and  renominated  on  the  Repub- 
lican ticket.   A  very  excellent  gentleman. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  M.  H.  Sloman? 
Mr.  MooRE.  Never  heard  of  him. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  never  heard  of  the  Forward  Looking  As-  | 
sociatioii  of  Ohio  ?  I 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2221 


Mr.  Moore.  Never.  After  you  get  through  with  that  paper  will  it 
be  too  much  trouble  for  you  to  let  me  see  it  ? 

The  Chairman.  Not  at  all.  It  seems  to  have  related  to  the  elec- 
tion in  Ohio  in  1916,  I  should  judge;  an  association  of  men  to  for- 
ward the  the  election  of  Governor  Cox. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  I  never  heard  of  it,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  One  of  the  contributors  is  George  F.  Burba. 

Mr.  Moore.  George  F.  Burba  is  now  dead.  He  was  the  editor  of 
the  Columbus  Dispatch. 

The  Chairman.  The  Columbus  Dispatch? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  sir,  that  is  one  of  the  Wolfe  newspapers. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  his  secretary  

Mr.  MooRE.  He  was  secretary  of  Governor  Cox  from  1912  to  1914. 

The  Chairman.  George  Ozias. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  never  head  of  him. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  is  a  lawyer  at  Dayton,  Ohio. 

Mr.  MooRE.  What  is  that? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Dayton,  Ohio. 

The  Chairman.  George  Schantz,  of  Dayton? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Shantz,  of  Dayton? 

The  Chairman.  Yes,  S-h-a-n-t-z. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  be  glad  to  show  it  to  you,  Mr.  Moore  (hand- 
ing paper  to  Mr.  Moore). 
Mr.  Moore.  That  is  1916. 
The  Chairman.  1916? 
Mr.  Moore.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  in  reference  to  the  1916  campaign? 

Mr.  Moore.  Did  it  also  use  my  name  ? 

The  Chairman.  No  ;  it  did  not  use  your  name. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  1  don't  Imow  it  then.  There  are  so  many  of 
those  things  that  I  don't  know  about  them  all.  I  never  heard  any- 
thing about  that,  never  heard  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  don't  know  as  it  is  really  material.  Mr.  Hays 
on  the  stand  the  other  day  produced  a  letter  from  a  gentleman  whom 
we  }iave  been  trying  to  get  here  as  a  witness,  but  have  not  succeeded. 
We  will,  though,  before  we  get  through. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Who  is  he,  Senator?   Perhaps  I  could  

The  Chairman.  He  is  from  New  Jersey. 

Mr.  MooRE.  AVell,  I  don't  know  anything  about  New  Jersey.  Sena- 
tor Edge  would  know  more  about  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  know  the  gentleman.  He  seems  to  be  very  elusive 
and  evasive  for  some  reason  or  other. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  you  were  not  here,  Mr.  Moore,  when  that 
letter  was  placed  in  the  record. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  that  that  twenty-five  

The  Chairman.  That  is  that  liquor  letter. 

Mr.  Moore.  Mr.  Carroll? 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Carroll. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes ;  that  is  what  they  say,  I  know. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  heard  of  him  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  except  I  saw  that  in  the  testimony. 

The  Chairman.  You  did? 


182774— 20— PT  15  9 


2222 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Moore.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  know  of  any  effort  of  that  kind  being 
made  by  the  liquor  interests  of  New  Jersey? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No ;  I  naturally  would  not,  because  it  does  not  appear 
to  be  a  national  matter.   It  is  for  their  State. 

The  Chairman.  That  illustrates,  of  course,  what  can  be  done  in 
this  question  of  campaign  expenditures  in  different  States. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Absolutely. 

The  Chairman.  In  different  organizations. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Absolutely,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  Away  from  all  national  committees. 
Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  that  going  to  be  regulated?    Have  you 
given  that  any  thought,  Mr.  Moore  ? 
Mr.  MooRE.  Sir? 

The  Chairman.  How  are  you  going  to  stop  that?    Now,  I  don't 
refer  to  this  particular  instance. 
Mr.  MooRE.  I  understand. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  can  have  organizations  in  the  State  help- 
ing along  with  the  work,  organizations  that  are  not  compelled  to 
make  any  reports  of  their  expenditures. 

Mr.  MooRE.  The  only  way  you  can  do  it  would  be  when  the  elec- 
tions are  of  a  national  character,  and  it  can  only  refer  to  such  an 
election  as  one  in  which  Senators  or  Congressmen  are  elected. 

The  Chairman.  That  could  not  refer  to  a  presidential  election, 
could  it,  because  you  are  electing  electors  who  are  State  officers.  That 
is  doubtful. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  are  you  going  to  stop  the  raising  of  money  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  don't  know.  Senator,  but  it  is  worth  trying  to  see  if 
it  can  be  done. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  it  is  not  worth  trying  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  It  is  worth  trying.  As  I  recall  it  in  that  case  it  refers 
to  the  State  matter,  and  asked  for  a  contribution  of  $25,  or  some- 
thing of  that  kind. 

Senator  Edge.  If  we  can  get  Mr.  Carroll  I  wish  we  would  do  so. 
I  think  it  was  a  national  association,  not  a  State  association. 

Mr.  Moore.  I  think  not;  but  at  any  rate  I  want  to  say. we  received 
no  such  money  that  I  know,  and  we  never  have  been  authorized  by 
our  committee,  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Carroll  is  the  president.  I  think  it  is  New 
J  ersey . 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  I  had  that  impression.  I  can't  answer  that 
myself. 

Senator  Spencer.  Is  that  name  Mr.  George  T.  Carroll  ?  : 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  don't  remember  that ;  when  he  spoke  of  it  I  remem- 
bered there  Avas  a  Mr.  Carroll.    I  never  heard  of  him  before. 

Senator  Spencer.  The  president  of  the  New  Jersey  Federation  of 
Liquor  Interests.  I  hold  in  my  hand  a  copy  of  Justice,  which  is 
the  liquor  dealers'  publication,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  never  heard  of  that. 

Senator  Spencer.  You  never  heard  of  that.  Which  speaks  of  the 
National  Retail  Liquor  Dealers'  Association  of  America,  president 
George  T.  Carroll,  Elizabeth,  N.  J. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2223 


Mr.  Moore.  Yes;  but  that  has  nothing  to  do  with  the  national 
Democratic  committee.  It  is  their  association,  and  if  you  will  read 
the  letter,  it  appears  to  refer  to  the  election  in  New  Jersey. 

Senator  Spencer.  I  thought  it  referred  to  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Of  course  I  know  nothing.  Senator,  except  what  you 
know. 

The  Chairman.  It  refers  to  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox  to  the  presi- 
denc}^ 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes ;  but  also  if  yow  go  on  you  Avill  see  that  it  refers  to 
the  election  in  the  State. 

The  Chairman.  In  this  letter  it  states :  "  The  organized  liquor 
trade  of  New  Jersey  has  set  out  to  do  its  part  toward  the  election  of 
James  M.  Cox  as  the  next  President  of  the  United  States,  and  it 
becomes  my  duty  to  call  upon  you  to  help,", Now,  it  would  appear 
evident  from  the  letter  that  Mr.  Carroll,  whether  he  has  any  au- 
thority or  not — we  have  not  been  able  to  discover — is  engaged  in  an 
effort  to  help  in  the  election  of  Gov.  Cox. 

Mr.  Moore.  In  that  State ;  it  appears  so,  if  the  letter  is  correct. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  The  Ohio  Liquor  License  League  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  don't  know.    I  never  belonged  to  it. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  ever  heard  of  it  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  don't  know  whether  I  ever  heard  of  the  Ohio  Liquor 
License  League.    There  have  been  various  leagues. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  Nicholas  Dutle,  the  secretary  of  the 
Ohio  Liquor  League  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes ;  I  know  Nicholas  Dutle. 

The  Chairman.  He  was  general  secretary  of  the  Ohio  Liquor 
License  League  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Nicholas  Dutle ;  yes. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  what  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Well,  that  I  don't  think  is  in  existence  now.  That  was 
during  the  time  that  we  had  a  license  laAV  in  Ohio.  We  passed  a 
license  law  in  Ohio  in  1913,  Senator,  a  very  stringent  license  law, 
and  in  order  to  see  that  the  various  members  of  this  league  complied 
with  the  law,  and  to  perpetuate  the  license  system,  which  the  liquor 
dealers  thought  Avould  be  the  ultimate  advantage  of  their  business, 
because  it  put  it  on  a  much  more  respectable  plane,  a  much  more  law- 
abiding  plane  than  it  had  ever  been  before,  they  organized  this  league. 
I  don't  think  they  called  it  the  license  league ;  I  thought  they  called 
it  the  liquor  league.  But  I  know  a  league  that  Mr.  Dutle  was  secre- 
tary of. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  that  is  the  Ohio  Liquor  License  League  of 
the  State  of  Ohio. 

Mr.  Moore.  The  Ohio  Liquor  License  League. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  that  is  in  existence  now  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  don't  think  so,  Senator.  I  have  heard  nothing  of 
it.  You  see,  our  State  went  dry  before  the  country  went  dry ;  that  is, 
it  voted  State  prohibition  in  1918,  wasn't  that  right.  Senator? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  MooRE.  And  of  course  that  ended  the  license  system,  on  May 
26,  1919,  so  I  don't  think  that  is  in  existence  at  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  prior  to  that  time  there  was  a  State 
liquor  license  commission? 


2224 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Moore.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  State  liquor  license  commission 
designated  to  whom  licenses  could  be  issued  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  not  the  State,  Senator,  you  don't  mean.  The  State 
liquor  license  commission  appointed  county  license  commissioners, 
and  appeals  were  taken  from  them  to  this  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Did  this  Ohio  Liquor  License  League  contribute 
to  the  Cox  campaign? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  don't  know. 

The  Chairman.  I  call  your  attention  to  this  because  of  the  fact 
that  the  statement  is  made  that  Gov.  Cox  said  that  none  of  those 
organizations,  no  liquor  interests  contributed  to  his  campaign. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  to  the  best  of  my  knowledge,  I  don't  know 
whether  they  did. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  a  certified  copy  of  the  report.  They  all 
have  to  file  reports  with  the  Secretary  of  State,  do  they  not,  any 
contributors  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes;  any  that  take  any  active  part  in  poltical  cam- 
paigns have  to  file  reports. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  a  certified  copy  of  the  statement  filed  by 
that  organization,  the  Ohio  Liquor  License  League  of  the  State  of 
Ohio.   I  don't  consider  it  of  great  importance. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  year? 

The  Chairman.  1916,  showing  contributions  to  the  campaign  for 
governor.   I  will  put  that  in  the  record. 

(The  statement  of  the  Ohio  Liquor  License  League  of  the  State  of 
Ohio  was  marked  "  Moore  Exhibit  A,  of  September  10,  1920,"  and  is 
attached  hereto.) 

Moore  Exhibit  A  of  (September  10,  1920. 

STATEjMENT  of  the  OHIO  LIQUOR  LICENSE  LEAGUE  OF  THE  STATE  OF  OHIO. 

Tlie  unclersij2;ned  respectfully  states  that  he  is  the  general  secretary  of  the 
Ohio  Liquor  League  of  the  State  of  Ohio,  whose  office  is  in  the  city  of  Dayton 
therein. 

That  the  following  statement  contains  the  full  amount  of  all  money  by  him 
expended,  together  with  the  dale  of  each  expenditure,  the  name  of  the  person 
to  whom  and  the  purpose  for  which  the  same  was  paid  in  connection  with  the 
candidacy  of  James  M.  Cox  for  governor  of  Ohio  at  the  general  election  on  the 
7th  day  of  November,  1910 : 

That  the  amount  of  money  wns  contributed  from  the  treasury  of  the  said 
Ohio  Liquor  League,  a  permanent  dues-paying  organization  with  a  member- 
ship of  approximately  twenty-five  hundr(Ht  (2,500)  members  in  good  standing, 
whose  annual  dues  are  three  dollars  ($3.00)  per  r.nnum  per  member. 

Total  amount  received,  .^1,474.52;  total  amount  paid  out,  $1,474.52;  balance 
on  hand,  nothing, 

November  4,  1916. 

?siTATE  OF  Ohio, 

Montgomery  County,  ss: 
I,  Nicholas  Dutle,  being  duly  sworn,  depose  and  say  that  I  am  the  general 
secretary  of  the  Ohio  Liquor  League  of  the  State  of  Ohio  and  that  the  fore- 
going is' a  full  and  true  statement  or  account  of  all  contributions  made  by  said 
Ohio  Liquor  League  and  the  disposition  tliereof  nvade  by  me  for  them. 

(Signed)  Nicholas  Dutle. 

Sworn  to  before  me  and  signed  in  my  presence  this  the  14th  day  of  November, 
A.  D.  1916. 

Geo.  W.  Ozius, 
Notary  Public  in  afid  for  Montfjomcry  County,  Ohio. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2225 


United  States  of  America, 

tit  ate  of  Ohio, 
Office  of  the  Secretary  of  iitate. 

I,  Harvey  C.  Smilh,  seci-etary  of  state  of  the  State  of  Ohio,  do  hereby  certify 
that  the  foregoing  is  a  true  and  correct  copy  of  the  statement  of  tlie  Oliio 
Liquor  License  lieague  of  the  State  of  Ohio,  as  filed  in  the  office  of  tlie  secretary 
of  state  of  the  State  of  Ohio  on  the  16th  day  of  November,  A.  D.  1916. 

Witness  my  hand  and  official  seal  at  Columbus,  Ohio,  this  6th  day  of  Sep- 
tember, A.  D.  1920. 

Harvey  C.  Smith, 

Secretary  of  State. 

Mr.  Moore.  Oh,  I  imagine  this  is  an  expense  account  of  this  man. 
It  is  only  $1,474,  I  notice,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Let  me  see  that. 

Mr.  MooRE.  It  appears  to  be  a  certified  copy  of  some  secretary ; 
the  amount  is  only  $1,474. 

The  Chairman.  The  difficulty  of  putting  

Mr.  MooRE.  You  understand.  Senator — so  I  can  explain  what  that 
probably  is — the  License  League  was  favorable  to  the  candidacy 
of  Gov.  Cox.  Gov.  Willis,  who  was  running  against  him,  was  a 
i^rohibitionist,  and  naturally  this  secretary  would  travel  around  the 
State,  and  I  imagine  that  would  be  the  account  of  his  expenses,  his 
expense  account  traveling  around  the  State  to  work.  But  there  was 
no  contribution  to  the  Democratic  campaign  fund  of  any  kind. 

Senator  Eeed.  When  was  this  money  spent? 

Mr.  MooRE.  1916. 

The  Chairman.  1916. 

Mr.  MooRE.  In  Ohio. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  what  has  it  got  to  do  with  this  ? 

The  Chairman.  It  hasn't  very  much  to  do  with  it.  The  letter 
that  was  put  in  by  Mr.  Hays  drew  forth  a  reply  from  Gov.  Cox, 
and  this  is  really  bearing  on  the  controversy  between  Mr.  Hays  and 
Mr.  Cox  in  the  newspapers.  It  is  about  as  material  as  a  lot  of 
things  we  have  had  before  us. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  inquired  to  find  out. 

Mr.  Moore.  You  understand  my  explanation.  Senator,  that  the 
licensees — the  believers  in  the  license  laws,  were  favorable,  naturally, 
to  the  candidacy  of  Gov.  Cox  rather  than  that  of  a  prohibitionist,  in 
1916. 

Senator  Edge.  It  might  be  considered  a  lead,  Mr.  Chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Now  this  illustrates  the  trouble  with  telegrams, 
which  you,  as  a  lawyer,  know.  You  have  read  from  telegrams 
coming  from  the  West  the  other  day. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  said  to  you,  Senator,  that  that  was  not  done  as 
proving  anything. 

The  Chairman.  No. 

Mr.  Moore.  But  simply  I  gave  them  to  you  as  leads. 

The  Chairman.  Now  I  submit  to  you,  as  a  fair  man,  without 
trying  to  put  them  in  the  record,  telegrams  that  I  have  received.  I 
don't  want  to  use  telegrams  if  I  can  help  it.  But  they  contradict  to 
some  extent  statements  of  your  telegrams  about  Spokane  [handing 
telegrams  to  Mr.  Moore]. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  I  think  those  telegrams,  perhaps,  ought  to 
go  into  the  record. 


2226 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Were  the  others  put  in? 

The  Chairman.  Well,  Mr.  Moore  read  the  others  in.  That  was 
as  to  the  quota  of  Spokane.  Now  this  is  a  denial,  and  a  setting  out 
of  what  the  quota  is. 

Mr.  Moore.  Senator  Kenyon,  you  will  recall  that  in  reading  these 
telegrams  I  also  called  your  attention  to  a  letter  in  which  the  writer 
said  that  he  had  in  his  possession  a  letter  from  the  representative 
of  the  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  to  be  sent  you. 

Mr.  MooRE.  And  he  gave  a  statement  of  quotas,  that  was  attached, 
a  copy  of  the  quotas  that  was  attached  to  the  letter,  and  he  said 
that  he  was  Avilling  to  be  subpoenaed  and  produce  the  letter.  I  know 
nothing  about  the  truth  of  it,  except  he  said  that  there  was  $220,000 
assessed  on  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  I  understood  the  letter  was  to  be  sent  to  you. 

Mr.  Moore.  No,  not  that  one. 

The  Chairman.  Not  that  one.  Well,  there  is  the  trouble  w^e  get 
into.  One  man  telegraphs  one  thing  and  another  telegraphs  an- 
other. If  we  take  the  telegrams  we  have  got  to  bring  the  witnesses, 
and  it  is  a  long  way  to  bring  them,  and  an  expensive  proposition. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  is  there  any  obligation  to  receiving  answers? 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  object? 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  statement  has  been  made  that  they  were 
simply  offered  as  a  lead,  and  if  so,  I  see  no  objection  to  introducing 
those  for  the  same  purpose. 

Mr.  Moore.  This  shoAvs  that  there  was  a  quota;  there  is  just  a  dif- 
ference as  to  the  amount. 

The  Chairman.  Just  a  difference  as  to  the  amount? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Just  a  difference  as  to  the  amount.  It  says  it  has 
been  reduced  there  to  $17,000. 

The  Chairman.  Without  establishing  this  as  a  precedent  

Senator  Keed.  Let  me  see  that,  please. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  :  And  in  view  of  the  telegrams  Mr. 
Moore  has  read  from,  we  will  put  these  in.  I  am  not  in  favor  of 
the  policy  of  putting  in  telegrams. 

Mr.  MooRE.  You  understand,  Senator,  that  I  don't  contend  that 
any  of  these  statements  I  receive  are  true.  If  there  is  a  statement 
contained  in  a  letter  from  a  Kepublican  committeeman,  I  suppose 
that  is? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  you  are  the  vehicle  for  all  the 
Democratic  leads,  as  some  of  us  seem  to  be  the  vehicle  for  other 
leads. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  hardly  think  I  am  for  all  of  them. 
Senator  Edge.  They  all  pick  on  you. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  think  the  public  is  interested  in  knowing  whether 
there  is  a  very,  very  large  fund  being  raised,  and  I  offer  to  the 
committee  only  such  of  the  matters  that  I  have  which  from  their 
authorship  I  suppose  to  be  true.  I  do  not  offer  the  other  things. 
I  have  got  a  large  quantity  of  it  that  I  have  thrown  in  the  waste 
basket.  .  ■ 

The  Chairman.  I  Avill  put  in  the  record  this  telegram  received 
from  Thaddeus  S.  Lane,  chairman  Spokane  County  ways  and  means, 
committee,  dated  Spokane,  Wash.,  September  9.  i 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2227 


(The  telegram  is  as  follows:) 

Spokane,  Wash.,  September  9,  1920. 

Senator  William  S.  Kenyon, 

Chairman  Senate  Investigating  Committee,  Chicago,  III. 
The  Associated  Press  this  morning  reports  Edmond  H.  Moore,  as  personal 
representative  of  Gov.  Fox  repeating  to  your  committee  tlie  claim  of  Gov. 
Cox  that  Spokane  was  assessed  $50,000  for  Republican  campaign  purposes.  I 
am  chairman  Spokane  County  ways  and  means  committee  under  date  February 
27,  1920.  I  received  letter  from  the  Republican  State  ways  and  means  commit- 
tee in  which  it  is  stated  "  You  will  notice  that  your  quota  was  $20,000  but  has 
been  reduced  to  $17,000,  of  which  amount  Mr.  Coman  has  remitted  $5,950. 
Coman  was  my  predecessor.  A  total  of  $14,000  has  been  subscribed  and  col- 
lected. This  is  made  up  of  a  large  number  of  individual  subscriptions,  the 
largest  being  $500  under  directions  of  State  committee  This  amount  has  been 
divided  as  follows :  For  Spokane  County,  25  per  cent  and  balance  to  Stale  and 
National  committee.   No  other  quota  or  instructions  have  been  received  by  me." 

Thaddeus  S.  Lane, 
Chainnaa  Spokane  County  Ways  and  Means  Committee. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  do  you  know  anything — and  I  don't 
suppose  you  do,  but  I  will  ask  you — about  propaganda  around  the 
country  on  the  Democratic  side,  as  well  as  the  Eepublican,  Avith  refer- 
ence to  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  have  no  doubt  we  have  propaganda  out  on  the 
League  of  Nations,  just  as  the  Republicans  have. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  I  have  had  sent  me  since  we  have  been  here 
a  number  of  little  books  called  "  A  Golden  Date." 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  never  heard  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Which  seems  to  be  a  propaganda  for  the  League 
of  Nations ;  mostly  editorials  from  the  St.  Louis  Globe-Democrat. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  sending  them  ? 
The  Chairman.  They  are  being  sent  around  the  country. 
Mr.  MooRE.  Is  the  Globe-Democrat  a  Republican  paper? 
The  Chairman.  I  think  it  is. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Is  that  in  favor  of  the  League  or  against  the  League? 
The  Chairman.  In  favor  of  the  League. 
Mr.  Moore.  I  have  never  seen  that. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  sending  it  out  ? 

The  Chairman.  I  don't  know  that.  Half  a  dozen  have  been  sent 
to  me. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  nothing  on  the  document  itself  to  show 
what  it  is. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  it  says  where  you  can  get  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  there  is  nothing  on  the  document  itself  show- 
ing who  is  responsible  for  it. 

The  Chairman.  Charles  F.  Haanel,  707-709-711  Pine  Street,  St. 
Louis,  Mo.,  seems  to  be  the  author.  You  have  no  knowledge  of  who 
would  be  sending  out  syndicated  articles  that  appear  in  the  papers 
concerning  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  haven't  seen  any.  Senator.  I  didn't  know  that  there 
were  any  out. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  have  had  sent  to  me  here  as  chairman  of 
this  committee  a  letter  inclosing  an  article  by  Dr.  Frank  Crane  on 
the  League  of  Nations. 

Mr.  MooRE.  No,  sir,  I  have  not  seen  that. 

The  Chairman.  That  seems  to  be  all  over  the  country.  Have  you 
seen  that  article,  or  any  of  those  articles? 


2228 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Moore.  I  have  never  seen  them. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  there  is  any  propaganda — 
or  do  you  know  any  one  that  is  financing  any  of  that  matter? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  don't  think — I  am  positive  that  our  committee  is 
not,  and  I  don't  know  of  any  others. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace? 

Mr.  MooRE.  That  Mr.  Taft  is  the  head  of? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Moore.  The  League  to  Enforce  Peace  ? 

The  Chairman.  The  League  to  Enforce  Peace  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Mr.  Taft  is  the  head  of  that  League. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  who  the  treasurer  is  of  that  League, 
Mr.  Moore,  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  You  would  have  to  ask  Mr.  Taft.  I  don't  know  any- 
thing about  that  League,  except  what  I  have  seen  in  the  news- 
papers; I  know  just  what  you  know.  I  only  know  that  ex-President 
Taft  is  the  head  of  it,  judging  by  what  I  see  in  the  newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Spencer.  Mr.  Moore,  as  I  gather  your  testimony — I  didn't 
hear  the  first  of  it  distinctly — you  have  no  connection  with  the  Asso- 
ciation Opposed  to  National  Prohibition? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  never  heard  of  it,  Senator,  except  through  Walker 
Buell.  I  am  a  pretty  busy  man,  and  don't  read  the  newspapers  as 
often  as  I  ought  to,  and  while  the  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer  is  in  my 
section,  I  did  not  see  the  communication  that  Walker  had  sent  down, 
his  interview  with  Wayne  Wheeier  in  Washington. 

When  I  was  m  Washington,  about  a  month  before  the  convention, 
Walker  called  my  attention  to  it.  I  guess  you  know  Mr.  Buell — he 
is  a  ver}'^  high-class  man.  But  he  asked  me  about  it,  and  I  told  him 
that  I  had  never  heard  of  it,  and  he  went  on  to  tell  me  what  it  was. 

Senator  Spencer.  In  their  publications  they  put  your  name  in 
"  Edward  H.  Moore,  Youngstown." 

Mr.  MooRE.  No;  they  did  not. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is  the  way  it  appears  

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  they  did  not.  Not  according  to  the  way  Walker 
said.  This  is  their  tentative  list  of  the  fellows  they  are  going  to 
have  to  run  their  organization ;  in  other  words,  they  put  it  in  to  get 
the  money  out  of  the  suckers ;  to  get  the  money  out  of  the  suckers 
they  give  a  list  of  well-known  men  in  the  various  States  that  they 
think  are  going  to  have  to  look  after  their  interests  in  their  particu- 
lar State. 

Senator  Spencer.  No;  they  make  it  positive.  Here  is  what  it 
says :  "  New  York,  managed  from  headquarters ;  Massachusetts, 
Erank  C.  Hall,  Hotel  Somerset,"  and  then  follows  a  number  of 
States,  and  among  them  is    Ohio,  EdAvard  H.  Moore,  Youngstown." 

Mr.  Moore.  Let  me  see  that. 

(Senator  Spencer  handed  Mr,  Moore  a  document  headed,  "Associa- 
tion Opposed  to  National  Prohibition.") 

Senator  Spencer.  And  that  is  really  entirely  unauthorized? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Why,  Senator,  you  were  not  fair  with  me.  I  thought 
Mr.  Buell  would  not  lie  to  me. 

Senator  Spencer.  Read  it. 

Mr.  Moore.  I  didn't  think  Mr.  Buell  would  tell  me  what  was  not 
true.    It  says,  "After  consultation  with  prominent  men  of  many 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES, 


2229 


States,  the  managing  directors  selected  the  following  tentative  list  of 
leaders  in  their  respective  States,"  and  I  was  held  out,  of  course,  as 
the  tentative  leader  in  my  State. 

The  Chairman.  As  a  well-known  prohibitionist. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes;  as  a  well-known  proliibitionist,  with  the  reverse 
English,  Senator. 

Senator  Spencer.  But  you  really  know  nothing  about  it  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  never  really  heard  of  it  before,  and  know  nothing 
about  it.  Nobody  ever  talked  with  me  of  the  organization.  You 
know  how  it  is,  sometimes  friends  of  yours — not  friends,  or  they 
wouldn't  do  it — but  alleged  friends  of  yours  or  acquaintances,  will 
invite  you  to  luncheon — I  know  they  do  it  to  prominent  statesmen  in 
Washington — and  they  will  arrange  it  so  that  they  will  be  seen  in 
company  with  a  prominent  man,  and  then  they  will  sell  you  to 
some  sucker  Avho  comes  along  and  has  seen  them,  when,  as  a  matter 
of  fact,  the  person  who  does  that  has  only  a  speaking  acquaintance 
with  the  prominent  man. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  comes  from  being  prominent. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes ;  that  is  what  comes  from  being  prominent. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  has  no  connection  with  the  Mahoning 
County  antiprohibition  committee,  has  it? 

Mr.  Moore.  Now,  Senator,  I  am  not  running  for  President,  but  I 
will  be  glad  to  answer. 

Senator  Spencer.  Answer  the  question;  we  will  be  glad  to  fin- 
ish up. 

Mr.  MooRE.  No;  the  Mahoning  County  antiprohibition  committee 
was  a  committee  that  was  organized — you  know  we  used  to  have  every 
two  years  a  fight  in  our  State,  in  every  county  in  the  State,  on  the 
wet  and  dry  question ;  we  used  to  have  a  county  local  option  law,  and 
it  was  finally  repealed  in  1914,  either  1913  or  1914. 

Senator  Spencer.  Just  ansAver  my  question.  That  has  no  connec- 
tion with  the  Mahoning  County  antiprohibition  committee? 

Mr.  Moore.  Oh,  Senator,  you  know  it  has  not. 

Senator  Spencer.  I  am  asking  you  if  it  has. 

Mr.  Moore.  No.  If  you  don't  know,  I  will  answer  you  frankly. 
It  has  not. 

Senator  Spencer.  It  has  no  connection  with  it,  and  is  not  a  con- 
tinuance of  it? 
Mr.  MooRE.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  right  there,  whatever  you  know  about  that 
county,  does  it  show  that  campaigning  was  pretty  expensive  ? 

Senator  Spencer.  Yes;  that  shows  a  large  amount. 

Mr.  MooRE.  On  both  sides;  yes.  Senator,  on  both  sides.  I  think 
they  spent  ten  or  twelve  thousand  dollars  each  side  for  advertising. 

The  Chairman.  What  year? 

Mr.  MooRE.  1914. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  the  object  of  this? 
Senator  Spencer.  I  am  not  going  into  this.    It  is  the  witness  who 
is  continuing  it. 

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  Senator  Kenyon  

Senator  Pomerene.  If  it  has  any  connection  with  the  presidential 
campaign  let  us  go  into  it. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  getting  along  nicely.  I  assume  respon- 
sibility for  it.    I  did  not  intend  to  go  into  it. 


2230 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  want  to  be  offensive,  but  I  am  just  asking 
you  for  the  reason  for  going  into  this.  I  want  to  know  the  reason. 
If  there  is  a  connection,  going  back  into  1914,  in  some  local  campaign, 
with  the  present.    I  just  wondered,  that  was  all. 

The  Chairman.  There  isn't  very  much. 

Senator  Spencer.  Mr.  Moore,  did  your  relationship  

Mr.  Moore.  Senator,  would  it  be  out  of  the  way  for  me  to  make  a 
statement:  I  hope  these  questions  that  are  directed  to  me  are  not 
asked  with  the  idea  of  injecting  into  this  campaign  a  wet  and  dry 
issue.  I  think  the  fact  that  I  have  always  been  a  very  strong  opponent 
of  prohibition  should  have  nothing  more  to  do  with  the  national 
campaign  than  that  George  White,  the  chairman,  has  always  been 
for  prohibition,  and  voted  for  it  in  Congress. 

Senator  Edge.  You  get  them  coming  and  going. 

Mr.  Moore.  Well,  I  don't  know  about  that.  I  notice,  Senator,  that 
in  this  list  that  I  glanced  at,  that  there  were  five  of  the  Horsters  of 
the  Horster  Brewing  Co.  contributing  to  the  Republican  campaign 
Now,  in  Ohio  we  don't  consider  the  wet  and  dry  question  a  Republican 
or  Democratic  issue.    It  is  a  local  issue. 

Senator  Spencer.  What  list  do  you  refer  to? 

Mr.  MooRE.  In  this  list  of  contributions  to  the  Republican  national 
committee  that  was  here  yesterday. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  it  was  offered  in  evidence  yesterday? 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes,  sir.  In  Ohio  Ave  never  considered  the  wet  and 
dry  question  a  political  issue.  The  wets  are  Republicans  and  the 
drys  are  Republicans,  and  vice  versa. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  if  there  are  some  separate  organiza- 
tions who  are  raising  money  to  contribute  to  political  campaigns  

Mr.  Moore.  You  ought  to  know  it. 

The  Chairman  (continuing). — We  ought  to  know  it. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  If  either  the  Anti-Saloon  League  is  raising  money 
for  such  purpose  or  the  Anti-Prohibitionists  are  raising  money  for 
such  purposes,  we  want  to  knoAV  it. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes.  Now  the  Anti-Saloon  League  was  raising  $27,- 
000,000,  I  understand — I  don't  know  whether  they  are, — whether  

The  Chairman.  And  I  suppose  the  liquor  interests  are  raising 
great  sums? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  they  are  each  raising  money  for  their  own  pur- 
poses ;  not  for  political  purposes. 

Senator  Spencer.  The  letter  from  George  T.  Carroll,  president, 
under  date  of  July  22,  1920,  whose  office  is  849  Broad  Street,  Newark, 
N.  J.,  with  a  heading  in  a  hand  pointing  to  that  address  (849 
Broad  Street)  :  "  Help  Elect  Men  Who  will  Kill  Prohibition,"  I 
understood  you  to  say  that  your  impression  was  that  that  was  a 
New  Jersey  matter,  local  in  its  character. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Apparently,  from  the  tenor  of  the  letter.  I  know 
nothing  about  it,  except  what  I  gather  from  the  tenor  of  the  letter. 
I  know  this,  however,  that  it  has  no  possible  connection  with  the 
National  Committee.  We  know  nothing  about  it.  I  never  heard 
of  it. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2231 


Senator  Spencer.  I  will  read  you  but  a  single  sentence  from  the 
letter : 

The  nomination  of  Governor  Cox  of  Ohio  for  the  presidency  by  the  Demo- 
crats is  a  big  victory  for  our  interests,  and  it  can  be  attributed  to  a  great 
degree  to  the  activity  of  our  trade  organizations  here  in  New  Jersey  and  through- 
out the  nation. 

It  would  look  more  than  local,  wouldn't  it? 

Mr.  Moore.  If  you  go  on  and  read  it — that  statement  is  there — but 
you  know  that  before  the  campaign  no  liquor  dealers  or  no  liquor 
interests  contributed  one  penny  to  Governor  Cox's  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  And  Senator,  you  don't  claim  that  because  some 
man  wrote  a  letter,  somebody  that  you  don't  even  know,  and  he  put  a 
statement  like  that  in,  that  you  can  read  that  statement  here  in  the 
record  and  that  it  becomes  evidence  of  a  fact  ? 

Senator  Spencer.  Xo,  it  is  not  evidence.  What  I  am  trying  to 
find  out  is  whether  it  is  true,  and  whether  this  witness  knows  as  to 
whether  it  is  true  or  not,  that  either  the  New  Jersey  liquor  interests, 
of  which  Mr.  George  T.  Carroll  is  the  president,  or  the  National 
Retail  Liquor  Dealers'  Association  of  America,  of  which  the  same 
George  T.  Carroll,  of  Elizabeth,  is  president — as  to  whether  those 
organizations  are  directly  contributing  to  the  nomination  or  election 
of  Governor  Cox  as  president. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  know  they  did  not  directly  or  indirectly  contribute, 
they  or  any  other  organization,  and  I  am  very  certain — I  am  not 
the  treasurer,  but  I  am  very  certain  that  in  no  wise  are  they  to  the 
national.    I  know  they  did  not  to  the  other. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Poi\rERENE.  And  you  were  the  general  manager  of  Gov. 
Cox  prior  to  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes;  and  I  think  I  know  as  much  about  it  as  any- 
body else,  as  any  man  could. 

Senator  Edge.  You  made  a  remark  a  few  minutes  ago,  if  I  got 
it  correctly,  that  in  Ohio  the  liquor  interests  or  liquor  business,  or 
something  to  that  effect,  were  in  no  way  affected  with  politics. 

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  I  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  your  exact  statement? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Both  the  Anti-Saloon  League  and  the  liquor  interests 
have  been  in  Ohio,  as  every  other  State  in  the  Nation,  very  active.  I 
said  in  Ohio  the  leading  Democrats  and  the  leading  Republicans, 
and  the  rank  and  file  of  the  Democrats  and  the  rank  and  file  of  the 
Republicans,  did  not  consider  the  prohibition  question  a  partisan 
issue,  and  as  evidencing  that  I  called  attention  to  the  fact  that  for 
instance  the  chairman  of  our  party  is  an  Ohio  Democrat  who  was 
a  Member  of  Congress  and  voted  for  prohibition,  and  that  I  am  an 
antiprohibition  man,  and  on  the  other  hand,  that  many  of  your 
contributions,  for  instance,  come  from  men  connected  with  the 
liquor  interests.  For  instance,  Rud  Hynicka,  appears  in  your  list 
of  contributions  that  is  filed  here,  is  a  contributor  for  $1,000.  That 
is  what  I  said,  'Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Moore,  there  isn't  any  question  in  the  world 
that  men  interested  in  the  liquor  business  are  members  of  both 
political  parties,  but  again  I  repeat,  and  I  think  if  you  go  back  to 


2232 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


the  record  you  will  find  that  my  interpretation  is  entirely  justified, 
that  you  gave  an  impression  that  the  liquor  question  was  not  an 
issue  in  Ohio. 

Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  I  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  course,  members  of  both  parties  are  interested 
in  each  side  of  the  question. 

Mr.  Moore.  I  want  to  go  further  than  that,  and  say  that  so  far 
as  any  party  platform  is  concerned,  the  Republicans  in  Ohio  in 
1914  and  1916,  if  I  recall  correctly,  and  in  1918— surely  in  1914—1 
no;  I  don't  think  in  1914,  but  in  1916  and  1918,  my  recollection  is 
that  the  State  platform  of  the  Republican  Party — about  that  I  may 
be  mistaken — declared  for  prohibition;  but  I  say  this,  that  the 
Democratic  Party  never,  in  the  State  of  Ohio,  in  the  last  25  years, 
since  I  have  been  active  in  politics,  30  years,  35  years,  to  be  morej 
exact,  has  had  a  plank  on  that  question.  J 

Senator  Edge.  They  have  not  had  a  plank  ?  I 

Mr.  Moore.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  But  does  that  keep  them  from  being  interested  in 
certain  candidates  that  may  favor  their  interest? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Oh,  not  the  liquor  interests;  I  am  talking  about  the 
Democrat  Party. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  that  keep  the  liquor  interests  from  being  in- 
terested in  the  election  or  defeat  of  certain  candidates  for  office  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  No,  sir,  they  always  have  been  interested  in  that,  just 
as  the  Anti-Saloon  League  has  been,  everywhere. 

Senator  Edge.  I  didn't  think  they  had  come  to  the  time  when  they 
would  keep  out  of  politics,  because  I  had  not  heard  of  any  State  that 
has  reached  the  millennium  and  could  keep  the  liquor  question  out  of 
politics. 

Mr.  MooRE.  No,  both  the  Anti -Saloon  League  and  the  liquor  in- 
terests were  very  active  in  the  party;  the  Anti-Saloon  League  has 
always  supported  the  Republican  party. 

Senator  Spencer.  Can  you  give  us  any  information,  Mr.  Moore,  as 
to  whether  the  statement  in  this  letter  that  "  It  is  now  up  to  our 
trade  organizations  " — that  is  the  National  Retail  Liquor  Dealers' 
Association — "  to  stand  unitedly  behind  the  ticket  of  Cox  and  Roosc- 
A^elt  and  roll  up  such  a  majorit}^  as  will  show  convincingly  that  the 
public  will  is  in  our  favor" — as  to  whether  any  such  plan,  as  far 
as  you  know,  is  noAV  in  operation? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No  sir,  no  more  than  I  would  know  that  

Senator  Spencer.  Well — go  on. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  know  there  is  no  connection  of  ourselves  with  them,  a 

Senator  Spencer.  And  so  far  as  you  knoAv  in  regard  to  the  nomina-» 
tion  of  Gov.  Cox,  it  is  not  true  that  the  nomination     can  be  at-« 
tributed  to  a  great  degree  to  the  activity  of  our  trade  organizations" 
here  in  New  Jersey  and  throughout  the  nation,"  and  by  "trade  or- 
ganization "  they  mean  the  liquor  dealers  association. 

Mr.  MooRE.  So  far  as  I  know,  I  know  that  is  not  true,  because  I 
know  they  were  supporting  Gov.  Edwards  for  President. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  one  thing  I  want  to  ask  Mr.  Moore. 
Mr.  MooRE.  And  I  think  Senator  Edge  knows  that. 
The  Chairman.  The  time  you  were  before  the  committee  before 
we  tried  to  get,  under  the  resolution  of  the  Senate,  from  all  the 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGIT  EXPENSES. 


2233 


difFerent  managers,  the  expenses,  and  you  could  only  give  them,  of 
course,  from  each  manager  up  to  that  time. 
Mr.  Moore.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now  just  to  complete  our  record,  so  we  can  make 
a  proper  report  to  the  Senate,  if  you  will  furnish  the  committee 
a  further  statement,  a  completed  statement  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  can  do  it  roughly  now  

The  Chairman.  Complete  it. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  can  not  do  it  until  Mr.  Morris,  the  governor's  sec- 
retary, returns  with  the  governor  from  the  West.  Approximately 
between  forty  and  fifty  thousand  dollars.  I  think  I  showed  over 
$40,000. 

The  Chairman.  More  than  you  reported  before  ? 
Mr.  MooRE.  No ;  all  told. 
The  Chairman.  You  will  furnish  that  to  us  ? 
Mr.  MooRE.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  give  them  to  us  at  your  leisure? 
Mr.  Moore.  Yes;  I  will  do  that  when  Mr.  Morris  returns.    I  had 
these  other  matters  that  I  wanted  to  present. 
Senator  Reed.  I  must  get  away  right  away. 
Mr.  MooRE.  I  have  some  matters  to  present. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  if  you  have  any  special  matters  to 
bring  up,  very  well.  But  we  don't  want  to  go  over  any  names  that 
have  already  been  presented. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  have  some  documents  that  came  from  the  Republi- 
can committee  that  I  would  like  to  go  in,  as  I  come  to  them,  and  the 
others  will  be  names.  I  won't  spend  any  time  on  this,  however.  I 
will  hand  the  telegrams  to  you,  and  not  spend  time  reading  them. 
I  will  just  give  them  to  you  so  as  to  give  you  the  information  that 
I  have. 

The  Chairman.  Very  well.  We  Avill  now  adjourn  until  2.30  this 
afternoon. 

(Thereupon,  at  1  o'clock  p.  m.,  an  adjournment  was  taken  until 
2.30  o'clock  p.  m.  of  the  same  day,  Friday,  Sept.  10,  1920.) 

AFTER  RECESS. 

The  subcommittee  met,  pursuant  to  adjournment,  at  2.30  p.  m.,  Fri- 
day, September  10,  1920,  in  room  603  Federal  Building,  Chicago,  111., 
Senator  William  S.  Kenyon  presiding. 

Present:  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman).  Spencer,  Pomerene,  and 
Reed. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Mavity. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CHARLES  K.  MAVITY. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Give  your  name  to  the  reporter,  Mr.  Mavity. 

Mr.  Mavity.  Charles  K.  Mavity. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home,  Mr,  Mavity? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Elhvood,  Ind. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  connected  with  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 


2234 


PRESIDENTIAX,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  In  what  capacity? 

Mr.  Mavity.  At  the  present  time  I  am  director  of  the  ways  and 
means  campaign  in  Iowa. 
The  Chairman.  In  Iowa? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes. 

The  Chairivian.  What  Avas  the  quota  for  Iowa  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  The  national  quota  for  Iowa  Avas  $75,000. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  not  have  any  trouble  raising  that  in 
Iowa,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  think  not. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  raised  in  Iowa  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  believe  it  is  approximately  $52,000. 
The  Chairman.  Noav,  Mr.  McNider  

Senator  Pomerene.  I  did  not  get  that — $52,000,  and  Avhat  else? 

Mr.  Mavity.  $52,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Has  been  raised  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Raised  in  loAva ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  McNider,  Avho  Avas  on  the  stand,  financial 

director  for  Iowa  

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (continuing).  Or  chairman  of  the  Avays  and  means 

committee  

Mr.  Mavity.  Chairman. 

The  Chairman  (continuing).  Said  the  amount  Avas  $75,000,  and 
it  was  subsequently  raised  to  $200,000,  as  I  understand  it. 

Mr.  Mavity.  He  said  the  national  quota  Avas  $75,000,  as  given  by 
the  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Mavity.  And  in  their  organization  there  he  authorized  local 
quotas  aggregating  $200,000. 

The  Chairman.  In  addition  to  the  $75,000? 
Mr.  Mavity.  No. 
The  Chairman.  Including  it? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Including  the  $75,000. 

The  Chairman.  To  cover  the  State  campaign  and  the  national 
campaign  ? 

Mr.  Maaity.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  did  you,  as  a  representative  of  the  national 
committee,  make  any  suggestion  as  to  raising  the  quota  in  Iowa? 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir.  The  quotas  in  Iowa  were  fixed  before  I  went 
there.   I  have  only  been  in  loAva  since  the  2d  of  August. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  just  why  are  they  picking  on  loAva  in  this 
matter ;  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  am  sure  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  will  turn  you  over  to  the  gentleman  from 
Ohio  and  see  if  he  can  find  out. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  they  have  a  lot  of  fat,  sleek  stock  out 
there,  haA^e  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  It  is  a  great  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course  it  is  a  great  State,  and  they  haA^e 
a  great  Senator  from  that  great  State. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  that  is  admitted !  But  let  us  get  on  to  some- 
thing else. 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2235 


Senator  Pomeeexe.  Mr.  Mavity,  you  have  been  in  loTra  since 
about  the  1st  of  August ;  that  is  right,  is  it  not  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  And   you  are   out  there  representing  Mr. 
Upham  in  the  raising  of  these  funds  ? 
^Ir.  Mavitt.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  Are  you  a  Y.  M.  C.  A.  man,  too? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  am  not. 

The  Chaiemax.  Are  3-ou  a  minister's  son? 

^Ir.  Mavity.  I  am  not. 

The  Chaiemax.  What  was  3'our  special  virtue  that  gave  you  entree 
into  this  select  society  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  am  a  former  newspaiDer  man. 
The  Chaiemax.  That  is  good. 

Senator  Po^ieeexe.  AVell.  that  is  getting  away  from  the  Y.  M. 
C.  A.  business.  Who  advised  you  that  the  quota  for  Iowa  was  to 
be  $75,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  told  that  in  the  Chicago  office  before  I  started 
for  Iowa — before  I  started  to  Iowa. 
Senator  Pomeeexe.  By  whom  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  By  Mr.  Owen. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  Was  that  at  this  famous  luncheon  in  the  Tower 
Eoom  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  attended  no  luncheon  in  the  Tower  Eoom. 
Senator  Pomeeexe.  At  that  time  you  were  not  of  the  elect,  I 
suppose  ? 

Mr.  MA^^TY.  I  was  not  invited. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  Well.  now.  when  Mr.  Owen  told  you  of  this 
$75,000,  you  understood,  did  you,  that  that  was  for  the  exclusive 
use  of  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Of  the  national  committee ;  yes.  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  And  at  that  time  was  there  any  arrangement, 
so  far  as  you  know,  for  the  raising  of  a  joint  fund  for  the  national 
and  State  campaigns  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  told  that  there  was  a  joint  campaign  in  Iowa. 
At  the  same  time  that  we  were  raising  $75,000  for  the  national  cam- 
paign, we  were  trying  to  raise  $50,000  for  the  State  campaign. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  That  would  make  $125,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  That  would  make  8125,000;  yes.  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  And  then  after  you  got  into  conference  with 
Mr.  McXider.  that  was  raised  to  $200,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  quotas  were  fixed  and  announced  before  I  ever 
got  to  Iowa. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  Did  I  understand  you?  Did  you  not  say  a 
moment  ago  that  Mr.  McXider  had  raised  this  to  $200,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  He  testified  the  other  day  that  he  had  authorized 
quotas  aggregating  $200,000. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  Oh.  I  see.  Well,  you  do  not  mean  to  be  under- 
stood as  takincf  issue  with  him  on  that  amount,  do  you? 

Mr.  Mavity^  Xot  at  all. 

Senator  Pomeeexe.  So  that  we  can  accept  it  as  a  fixed  fact  that 
$200,000  is  in  process  of  being  raised  in  the  State  of  Iowa  for 
national  and  State  campaigns? 


2236 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mavity.  We  are  not  raising  $200,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  What  are  you  raising? 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  are  trying  to  raise  $75,000  for  the  national,  and 
$50,000  for  the  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  but  Mr.  McNider  says  $200,000. 
Mr.  Mavity.  He  said  that  was  the  quota. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  wish  you  would  explain  that  a  little  • 
more  clearly.    How  do  you  distinguish  between  the  quota  and  the 
amount  you  are  actually  raising? 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  quota  is  the  target  at  which  we  shoot. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  aim  to  hit  it  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  very  seldom  do. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  aim  to  hit  it,  or  do  you  put  up  something  - 
you  do  not  intend  to  hit,  and  aim  at  something  you  do  not  intend  to 
hit? 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  know  we  will  not  hit  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  suppose  you  do  hit  it.    What  are  you 
going  to  do  with  the  extra  money? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  could  not  answer  as  to  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  had  no  plan  with  regard  to  the  dis- 
position of  the  surplus,  if  a  surplus  is  raised  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Over  and  above  the  $125,000? 
Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  you  have  a  suspicion  as  to  what  you  will 
do  with  it,  have  you  not? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  have  nothing  to  do  with  that  at  all. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Who  would  have? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  suppose  that  would  be  up  to  the  national  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.    You  have  not  heard  of  any  plan  to  re- 
fund, have  you,  any  part  of  that? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  have  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No.  Now,  give  us  some  notion  about  the  plan 
of  your  organization.  Perhaps  we  can  shorten  the  inquiry  a  little 
by  directing  your  attention  to  the  matter  in  mind.  Did  you  pursue 
the  same  plan  that  has  been  pursued  in  other  States  here,  to  have  a 
chairman  of  the  wa3^s  and  means  committee  in  each  of  the  congres- 
sional districts  of  Iowa? 

Mr.  Mavity.  There  had  been  those  committees  appointed,  those 
chairmen  appointed,  yes,  when  I  reached  Iowa. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  there  are  10  congressional  districts  in 
Iowa  ? 

The  Chairman.  Eleven. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Eleven  congressional  districts? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  got  your  list  of  chairmen  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  It  is  in  evidence,  introduced  by  Mr.  McNider.  ^ 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  you  are  right  about  that,  and  I  will  I 

not  to  go  into  it  any  further.  I 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes.  I 
Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  have  you  a  statement  as  to  the  amount! 

of  collections  or  contributions  which  have  been  made  thus  far  ?  J 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2237 

^    Mr.  Mavity.  I  had  that,  and  Mr.  McNideh  introduced  it  when  he 
was  on  the  stand  the  other  day,  the  full  amount. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  far  as  you  know,  that  was  a  correct  state- 
ment ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  It  was;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Up  to  what  date? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  think  I  have  a  memorandum  

Senator  Pomeeene.  Well,  I  have  not  got  it  very  accurately.  Your 
account  goes  up  to  what  date,  Mr.  Mavity? 

Mi\  jNIavity.  I  thought  I  had  a  memorandum  of  it  here.  I  judge 
it  was  to  about  September  4. 

Senator  Pot^ieeene.  Well,  that  has  been  gone  -into  pretty  fully, 
and  I  will  not  pursue  that  any  further.  You  are  still  continuing 
your  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes ;  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Prior  to  the  beginning  of  your  work  in  Iowa, 
where  were  you  located  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  in  West  Virginia. 

(Senator  Pomeeene.  Did  you  have  charge  of  that  campaign? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  had  charge  of  the  campaign;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomeeene.  And  what  was  your  official  designation? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  known  in  West  Virginia  as  executiA^e  secretary 
or  director  of  the  campaign. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Well,  your  duties  in  West  Virginia  were  prac- 
tically the  same  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Practically  the  same, 
ft    Senator  Pomeeene.  As  your  duties  in  Iowa  ? 
K    Mr.- Mavity.  Yes. 

9    Senator  Pomeeene.  And  how  long  had  you  been  in  West  Virginia  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  in  West  Virginia  from  January  1  up  to  the 
time  I  went  to  Iowa. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  And  that  was  about  August  1  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  And  by  the  way,  what  salary  were  you  get- 
ting? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  was  getting  $100  a  week. 
Senator  Pomeeene.  Where  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  West  Virginia. 
Senator  Pomeeene.  In  AVest  Virginia  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  And  they  raised  you  out  here  in  Iowa  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  got  $125  in  Iowa. 

The  Chaieman.  Is  it  harder  work  raising  money  in  Iowa  than 
in  West  Virginia  ? 

Senator  Pomeeene.  I  think  this  gentleman  could  raise  money  any- 
where. 

The  Chaieman.  Send  him  to  Ohio. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  No  ;  I  think  you  have  pretty  well  milked  Ohio 
by  this  time.  At  least  you  have  got  the  cream.  Now,  tell  us  the 
plan  of  your  organization  in  West  Virginia. 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  plan  of  the  organization  in  West  Virginia  was 
to  have  a  State  chairman  of  the  ways  and  means  committee. 

The  Chaieman.  Who  was  he? 


182774— 20— PT  15  10 


2238 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mavity.  Mr.  T.  E.  Houston. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Go  ahead. 

Mr.  Mavity.  Then  we  had  chairmen;  a  chairman  in  each  one  of 
the  six  districts. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  got  their  names  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  have  their  names  here ;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Give  them  to  us,  please. 
Mr.  Mavity.  Shall  I  file  them? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  read  them  off  and  hand  your  memo- 
randum to  the  reporter. 

Mr.  Mavity.  First  district  

Senator  Pomerene.  And  if  you  have  the  addresses  give  them  at 
the  same  time. 

Mr.  Mavity.  First  district,  J.  M.  Sanders,  Moundsville;  second  dis- 
trict, William  E.  Glasscock,  Morgantown;  third  district,  Harry  B. 
Curtin,  Clarksburg;  fourth  district,  Taylor  Vinson,  Huntington; 
fifth  district,  D.  J.  F.  Strouther,  Welch;  sixth  district,  Joseph  H. 
Gaines,  Charleston. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  knoAv  the  secretary  of  state  of  the  State 
of  West  Virginia? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or  the  auditor  of  the  State,  perhaps  it  was, 
Mr.  Darst. 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  do  not  know  Mr.  Darst ;  no. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  what  was  the  quota  for  West  Yir^ 
ginia  as  fixed  by  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  quota  for  West  Virginia  was  $40,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  that  for  national,  or  national  and  -State 
purposes  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  That  was  for  national  alone. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  afterwards  did  you  have  some  arrange^ 
ment  about  the  amount  of  funds  that  were  to  be  raised  for  State  pur- 
poses in  West  Virginia? 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  not  confer  with  some  of  the  Republi-  ji 
can  leaders  in  West  Virginia  as  to  the  amount  that  should  be  raised?  f 
Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  what  amount  they  have  at- 
tempted to  raise  for  State  purposes? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  do  not.   I  never  heard. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  began  your  activities  there  about 
January  1,  1920? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  were  you  there  constantly  for  a  period  of 
nearly  eight  months? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  do  I  understand  that  you  took  no  part 
whatsoever  in  the  raising  of  funds  for  the  State  campaign  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Absolutely  none. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Not  even  in  the  preliminary  arrangements  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  None  whatever;  no.  I  had  nothing  to  do  with  the 
State  campaign  at  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Avere  they  conducting  these  two  cam- 
paigns  then — one  for  State  purposes  and  one  for  national  purposes? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2239 


Mr.  Mayity.  Presumably  they  were ;  but  I  know  absolutely  nothing 
about  their  State  campaign. 

Senator  Pomekene.  Well,  now,  how  much  did  you  raise  in  West 
Virginia — in  money  and  pledges? 

Mr.  Mayity.  Well,  according  to  the  statement  here  in  the  office, 
which  I  think  was  made  a  matter  of  record  this  morning,  we  had 
raised  on  our  national  quota  something  like  $22,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Up  to  Avhat  date? 

Mr.  Mayity.  That  was  up  to  July  28,  if  I  remember  correctly. 
Senator  Pomerene.  How  much  has  been  raised  since  ? 
Mr.  Mayity.  I  could  not  tell  you. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  do  we  understand  one  another? 
This  $22,000,  I  take  it,  is  the  amount  that  was  raised  under  your 
direction,  or  while  you  were  in  control  of  the  State  ? 

Mr.  Mayity.  Yes,  sir.  There  has  been  nobody  w^orking  in  West 
Virginia  since  I  was  there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVell,  now,  was  that  the  cash  paid  in,  or  the 
amount  of  contributions? 

Mr.  Mayity.  I  belie  Ye  that  that  is  the  cash. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  what  is  the  amount  of  contributions  up 
to  any  date,  of  which  you  may  have  knowledge? 

Mr.  Mayity.  Well,  I  checked  up — the  last  time  I  did  that,  I  be- 
licYe,  was  on  July  20.  I  checked  up  on  the  subscriptions,  cash  and 
pledges,  and  they  showed  $21,714. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVill  you  let  me  see  your  memorandum,  please  ? 

Mr.  Mayity.  Certainly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  you  sav  the  quota  for  West  Virginia  Avas 
$40,000? 

Mr.  Mayity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  revise  that? 

Mr.  Mayity.  I  revised  the  quota  for  campaign  purposes;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Up  or  down? 
Mr.  Mayity.  Up. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  hand  me  a  memorandum,  which  I  will  ask 
you  have  marked  "  Mavity's  Exhibit  No.  1." 

(The  document  was  marked  "  Mavity's  Exhibit  No.  1,"  and  is 
attached  hereto.) 


Mavity  Exhibit  No.  1. 


July  20,  1920. 


District. 


First  (Wheeling)  

Second  f  Morganto^^^l) 
Third  (Clarksburg)..., 
Fourth  (Huntington). 

Fifth  (Welch)  

Sixth  (Charleston)  

Logan  County  

Total  


Quota. 


$12,000 
4,000 
6,000 
8,000 
12,000 
12,000 
1,500 


55,500 


Amount 
subscribed. 


$8,240 
1,105 
4,439 
3, 250 
1,730 
2,950 


21,714 


Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  this  purports  to  be  a  memorandum  of 
date  of  July  20,  1920,  and  gives  the  quota  for  each  district  in  one 
column. 

Mr.  Mayity.  Yes,  sir. 


2240 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  As  revised  by  you;  am  I  right? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes — well,  not  by  me  solely.    I  did  that  in  consulta- 
tion with  the  chairman. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  under  your  direction? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  wdth  your  approval? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  also  the  amount  subscribed  in  another 
column  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  All  of  this  by  districts? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  the  first  district,  where  Wheeling — the, 
quota  was  $12,000,  and  you  subscribed  $8,240.    That  is  right,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  That  was  right  on  that  date ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  second  district,  MorgantoAvn;  quota 
$4,000,  and  you  subscribed  $1,105?  Third  district,  Clarksburg; 
quota,  $6,000;  amount  subscribed,  $439.  Fourth  district,  Huntington ; 
quota,  $8,000;  amount  subscribed,  $3,250.  Fifth  district,  Welch- 
is  that  right,  Welch  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  Welch  district,  or  Bluefield  district ;  either  one. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Welch  or  Bluefield  district;  quota,  $12,000; 
amount  subscribed,  $1,730.  Sixth  district,  Charleston ;  quota,  $12,000 ; 
amount  subscribed,  $2,950.  Logan  County ;  quota,  $1,500 ;  no  amount 
subscribed.  What  

Mr.  Mavity.  We  have  not  received  anything  from  Logan  County. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No  ;  but,  perhaps,  my  question  was  not  clear. 

Mr.  Mavity.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  are  six  congressional  districts. 
Mr.  Mavity.  Oh,  I  can  explain  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  have  Logan  County  here  separate  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Logan  County  belongs  to  the  fifth  district,  but  it 
sets  in  the  mountains  and  is  accessible  only  through  Huntington.  It 
is  not  accessible  from  Welch  or  Bluefield,  or  that  country  down 
there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  it  was  accessible  to  the  national  Republi- 
can committee,  was  it  not? 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir.    We  found  too  many  Democrats  down  there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  are  still  expected  to  raise  $1,500 
there.  Now,  that  makes  the  total  quotas,  does  it,  of  $55,500,  when 
the  national  committee's  quota  was  $40,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  $40,000 ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  of  that  you  had  raised  $21,714? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  you  have  been  pretty  active  politically 
for  a  long  time,  have  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  have  always  taken  an  interest  in  politics;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Where  is  your  home  State  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Indiana. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  you  are  familiar  with  the  high  cost 
of  politics  there.    Now,  out  of  the  abundance  of  your  experience, 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2241 


won't  you  please  suggest  to  us  how  much  mone}^  in  your  judgment 
would  be  required  for  the  State  campaign  in  West  Virginia? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  could  not  answer  that  question,  Senator. 

Mr.  PoMERENE.  Well,  you  know  Mr.  Darst  pretty  well,  do  you  ? 

^Ir.  Mavity.  I  never  have  met  Mr.  Darst.' 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  who  he  is  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  know  who  he  is;  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.,  And  3^ou  know  he  is  prett}^  active? 

Mr.  ]\Iavity.  Yes ;  I  know  he  was  very  active. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  know,  do  you  not,  that  before  this 
committee,  at  one  of  its  sittings  in  Washington,  he  said  that  $100,000 
would  be  a  very  moderate  sum  for  the  campaign  for  the  nomination 
in  ^yest  Virginia  alone? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  never  heard  him  quoted  to  that  effect. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  if  it  requires  $40,000  to  make  up  the 
purse  of  the  national  expenses  which  West  Virginia  ought  to  pay, 
how  much  do  you  think  it  Avould  require  for  the  West  Virginia  cam- 
paign ? 

Mr.  ^Iavity.  I  could  not  answer  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  been  active  in  any  other  section  of 
the  country? 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  Indiana  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Xo,  sir. 

Mr.  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  ask— or,  wait  a  moment. 
Did  you  have  county  chairmen  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  after  you  selected  your  district  chairman, 
they  chose  the  county  chairman,  did  they  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  They  selected  the  county  chairman ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are  familiar  with  the  Wheeling  Register, 
are  you  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  have  been  handed  what  purports  to  be  a  copy 
of  the  issue  of  Sunday,  August  29,  1920.  There  seems  to  be  printed 
here  a  letter  addressed  by  you  to  some  one — the  addressee's  name  be- 
ing omitted — under  date  of  April  24,  1920.  AVill  you  look  at  that, 
and  see  whether  you  wrote  it  ?, 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  my  letter. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Will  you  read  it,  please  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  It  was  addressed — the  letter  Avas  addressed  to  W".  W. 
Irvfin,  postmaster  at  Wheeling. 
Senator  Pomerene.  At  Wheeling? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  is  on  the  letterhead  "  Republican  national 
committee ;  Will  H.  Hays,  chairman ;  Fred  W.  Upham,  treasurer.'' 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  that  a  circular  letter  you  were  sending 
out? 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir.  It  was  a  letter  I  sent  out  to  a  number  of 
Wheeling  men  whose  names  were  given  me  by  Mr.  Paxton. 

Senator  Po^merene.  Oh.  You  knew  Mr. 'irwin  before  that  time, 
did  you  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  did  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  know  he  was  postmaster? 


2242 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mavity.  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  Kepublican  or  Democrat  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  A  Democrat. 

The  Chairman.  They  raised  your  salary  after  you  sent  that  letter 
to  a  Democratic  postmaster? 

Senator  Pomerene.  See  here,  are  you  seeking  to  collect  Govern- 
ment funds  from  our  Democratic  postmasters? 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  know. 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  can  explain  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  that  an  index  of  what  you  are  going  to  do 
after  election  if  successful  ? 

The  Chairman.  "  Shake  not  your  gory  locks  at  me." 

Senator  Spencer.  The  witness  wanted  to  make  an  explanation. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  just  one  moment.  This  says  that  you 
had  at  this  particular  time  10  subscriptions  in  West  Virginia  of 
$1,000  each;  is  that  right? 

Mr.  Mavity.  That  was  based  on  reports  that  I  had  received  from 
workers  and  chairmen  in  the  field. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  18  at  $500? 

Mr.  Mavity.  On  the  check  up  we  found  we  did  not  have  that 
many ;  we  lost  two  by  death. 

Senator  Pomerene.  With  that  exception,  however,  it  was  correct? 

Mr.  Mavity.  The  amount  was  virtually  correct;  we  virtually  had 
that  amount,  or  the  equivalent  of  that  amount,  at  that  time. 

Senator  Spencer.  What  explanation  were  you  going  to  make  about 
that,  Mr.  Mavity? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Mr.  Paxton,  who  was  a  Avitness  here  the  other  day, 
had  attempted  to  collect  some  money  in  Wheeling,  and  he  had  not 
been  very  successful.  The  men  were  giving  in  very  small  amounts. 
He  asked  me  to  write  a  letter  that  would  make  it  clear  to  them  that 
this  campaign  of  ours  was  not  a  part  of  the  State  campaign.  I  wrote 
the  letter  and  submitted  it  to  him.  He  submitted  it  to  Mr.  Ogden, 
and  some  others  at  Wheeling;  and  I  sent  the  letter  out  then  to  a 
selected  list.  In  the  city  of  Wheeling  there  are  two  gentlemen  of 
some  prominence,  by  the  name  of  Irwin.  One  is  W.  W.  Irwin,  the 
postmaster,  and  the  other  is  W.  B.  Irwin,  a  manufacturer,  I  believe. 
Mr.  Paxton,  or  else  his  stenographer,  made  a  mistake  and  gave  me 
the  name  of  W.  W.  Irwin,  ancl  I  sent  the  letter  to  the  postmaster  at 
Wheeling. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  put  a  rubber  stamp  on  it  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  did  not,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Saying  "  Deliver  at  home  "  ?  ^ 

Mr.  Mavity.  No,  sir.  There  is  the  story,  as  published  in  the  Cin- 
cinnati Inquirer,  Senator  [producing  newspaper]. 

Senator  Spencer.  Then  you  never  intended  to  send  the  letter  to 
the  postmaster?  ( 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  did  not.  Senator. 

Senator  Spencer.  It  was  intended  to  be  sent  to  the  other  man  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  It  was  intended  for  the  other.    It  was  Mr.  Paxton's 
mistake. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  the  fact  is  you  intended  to  get  the  $1,000 
if  you  could  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Well,  not  from  a  postmaster. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2243 


The  Chairman.  How  much  did  the  postmaster  send  back  to  you  in 
money  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Here  is  Mr.  Paxton's  letter,  or  his  memorandum, 
there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  this  your  explanation,  Mr.  Mavity — this 
thing  you  have  handed  me? 

Mr.  Mavity.  That  was  sent  to  me,  mailed  to  me.  I  do  not  know 
who  mailed  it  to  me.  Somebody  mailed  it  to  me.  It  is  an  article 
from  the  Cincinnati  Inquirer.  Mr.  Paxton  told  me  the  same  thing 
when  he  was  here  the  other  day. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  is  simply  an  explanation  made  by  some 
newspaper  man? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Some  newspaper  correspondent ;  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  I  have  not  read  it,  but  it  includes  the 
letter  Avhich  I  have  just  read  into  the  record. 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  do  you  want  to  keep  it? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Oh,  not  particularly. 
Senator  Reed.  AVhen  did  you  leave  West  Virginia? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  left  West  Virginia  on  July  28. 

Senator  Reed.  From  the  time  that  you  wrote  this  letter  until  the 
date  you  have  given,  you  spent  your  time  in  West  Virginia  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  In  West  Virginia;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  that  letter  was  written  on  the  19th  of  April, 
was  it.? 

Mr.  Mavity.  On  the  19th  of  April ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  stayed  there  until  July  

Mr.  Mavity.  July  28. 

Senator  Reed.  About  three  months? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Three  months. 

Senator  Reed.  On  the  19th  of  April  you  had  $18,000  raised,  did 
you  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Approximately. 

Senator  Reed.  How? 

Mr.  Mavity.  ^Approximately. 

Senator  Reed.  And  on  July  7,  when  you  left,  you  only  had 
$21,000?. 

Mr.  Mavity.  $21,000,  according  to  the  check  on  July  20,  when  we 
checked  it — when  we  made  that  check  up. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  You  spent  all  that  time  doAvn  there,  and  only 
raised  that  additional  $2,000,  or  about  $2,000  or  $3,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  had  a  great  deal  of  trouble  dowm  there ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  sent  you  to  Iowa  and  raised  your  salary  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  had  raised  the  schedule  of  the  national 
committee,  or  the  quota  that  the  national  committee  had  assigned  to 
West  Virginia,  had  you  not?    I  mean,  you  raised  the  amount. 

Mr.  Mavity.  We  did;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  the  increase  in  West  Virginia?  I  did 
not  hear  quite  all  of  this.   I  may  be  tracking  over  a  little  of  it. 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  believe  there  was  an  overplus  there  of  about  $15,000. 

Senator  Reed.  You  raised  the  national  committee's  assessment — 
I  will  call  it  that,  or  quota,  which  was  $40,000 — you  aimed  to  raise 
all  of  the  $40,000? 


2244 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mavity.  All  of  the  $40,000. 

Senator  Reed.  And  accordingly  you  put  the  quota  at  $55,000? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  believe  it  was  approximately  $55,000;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  out  in  Iowa — or,  first,  the  $40,000  which  was 
the  quota  assigned  by  the  national  committee,  w^as  iDoosted  enough  by 
the  national  committee  so  that  they  calculated  to  get  the  whole  sum, 
was  it  not?  You  have  heard  that  testimony,  and  you  know  that  is 
the  method? 

(No  response.) 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  put  that  in  another  way. 

Mr.  Mavity.  They  were  asking  $40,000 ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  The  national  committee  started  to  raise  $3,000,000 
plus,  and  they  fixed  a  schedule  of  quotas  which  aggregate  between 
five  and  six  million  dollars,  thus  swelling  the  amount  it — the  com- 
mittee— expects  by  swelling  the  quotas,  and  then  that  swollen  quota 
which  has  already  been  increased  enough  to  make  up  for  the  short- 
age, you  again  increased;  and  then  having  increased  it,  you  figure 
that  you  are  going  to  raise  the  total  quota  assessed  upon  the  State 
by  the  national  committee.   That  is  the  method,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Your  sentence  is  quite  complex  to  me,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  will  make  it  in  a  number  of  short  sen- 
tences. You  understand  that  the  national  committee  desired  to  raise 
a  given  sum  of  money,  and  arranged  quotas  for  each  of  the  States? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  When  it  arranged  quotas  for  each  of  the  States, 
it  increased  each  quota  by  a  considerable  percentage,  so  that  they 
could  make  allowance  for  a  failure  to  come  up  to  the  quota  as 
assigned  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  suppose  it  did;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  then  that  fixed  the  total  amount  that  they 
expected  from  the  States.  That  was  the  situation  as  to  that  step, 
was  it  not,  Mr.  Mavity? 

Mr.  Mavity.  Well,  they  certainly  would  increase  their  quotas ;  yes, 
if  they  expected  to  get  the  amount  they  needed.  i 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  they  did  do  that;  that  was  your  understand-! 
ing,  was  it  not  ?  I 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  am  not  sure  about  that ;  I  do  not  know.  ' 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  heard  testimony  here,  have  you  not, 
that  while  they  only  expected  to  raise  $3,000,000  plus,  their  quotas i 
actually  aggregate,  I  should  say,  between  five  and  six  million  dollars  ?f 

Mr.  Mavity.  Well,  that  is  a  matter  of  record,  is  it  not,  Senator? 

Senator  Reed,  Yes.  But  I  am  asking  you  that  as  a  basis  for 
another  question,  that  is  all.  Now,  assuming  that  to  be  the  case,  and 
the  quota  which  you  received  then  was  collected,  if  it  was  raised, 
and  if  all  the  other  States  raised  a  similar  quota  to  the  full  amount, 
it  would  have  given  to  the  national  committee  five  or  six  million 
dollars  instead  of  the  smaller  sum  of  $3,000,000,  would  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Mavitv.  If  it  is  a  matter  of  fact,  as  you  sa^^  it  is. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  say,  assuming  that  to  be  true.   It  is  proven 
to  be  true. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  that  is  not  exactly  right,  is  it? 
Senator  Reed.  Now  you  take  that  quota,  that  swollen  quota  of  the 
national  committee,  and  you  swell  it  up  so  that  you  figure  that  you 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2245 


will  collect  the  entire  quota  that  they  assign  to  your  State,  do  you 
not? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  had  absolutely  nothing  to  do  with  the  national 
quota. 

Senator  Reed.  But  5^ou  took  their  quota  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  took  their  quota ;  3^es,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  And  you  increased  it  ? 
Mr.  Mavity.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  you  figured  that  3^011  would  raise  the  en- 
tire amount  of  their  quota  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  So  I  could  get  $40,000  in  West  Virginia ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  if  the  method  I  have  indicated  was  em- 
plo3^ed,  and  $40,000  was  the  proportion  assigned  to  that  State,  based 
upon  the  five  to  six  million  dollar  quotas  of  the  national  committee, 
instead  of  getting  $3,000,000,  they  would  get  $5,000,000  plus;  that  is 
the  way  it  Avorks  out,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  do  not  see  that  there  is  any  answer  coming  from  me. 

Senator  RrED.  All  right. 

Mr.  Mavity.  Because  you  are  making  the  statement  yourself. 
Senator  Reed.  Very  well.    But  I  thought  you  were  on  here  as  a 
sort  of  expert  in  these  financial  matters. 
Mr.  Mavity.  Oh,  I  am  not  an  expert. 
Senator  Reed.  And  I  wanted  to  get  your  deductions. 
Mr.  Mavity.  I  am  not  an  expert. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  how  that  works  out,  because  I  want  to 
get  your  opinion  about  this.  The  quota  of  the  national  committee, 
as  published  by  them  for  the  State  of  Ohio,  and  which  made  allow- 
ance for  the  shrinkage,  was  $650,000.  The  quota  actually  fixed  by 
the  money  diggers  for  that  State  was  $1,300,000,  or  a  total  of  100  per 
cent  increase  over  the  already  swollen  quota  fixed  by  the  national 
committee.  The  quota  for  Michigan,  fixed  by  the  national  com- 
mittee, was  $250,000.  The  quota  fixed  by  the  money  diggers  was 
$3,888,000,  a  per  cent  increase  of  55.  The  national  committee's  quota 
for  Indiana  w^as  $300',000.  The  quota  as  actually  fixed  by  the  money 
diggers  was  $450,000,  an  increase  of  50  per  cent.  The  national  com- 
mittee quota  for  Iowa  was  $75,000.  The  quota  as  actually  fixed  by 
the  money  diggers  was  $200,000,  or  an  increase  of  166  per  cent. 
Giving  an  average  increase  for  those  four  States  of  93  per  cent. 

If  that  ^3  per  cent  was  applied  to  all  the  States  by  the  money 
diggers,  the  real  quota,  instead  of  being  $4,800,000,  which  was  Mr. 
Upham's  figure,  would  actually  be  $9,264,000 — the  real  amount  of 
money  raised,  I  mean,  and  not  the  real  quota.  Now,  that  is  the  fact, 
is  it  not,  and  that  is  the  way  this  process  which  you  were  engaged  in 
working  out,  does  work  out.   Is  that  not  true,  Mr.  Mavity  ? 

Mr.  Mavity.  I  could  not  answer  your  question. 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well.    I  think  that  is  all  I  want  to  ask  you. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Witness. 

(Witness  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Lee. 


2246 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CLARENCE  W.  LEE. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Spencer. 
Senator  Spencer.  What  is  your  full  name  ? 
•  Mr.  Lee.  Clarence  W.  Lee. 
Senator  Spencer.  Where  is  your  home,  Mr.  Lee  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Sound  Beach,  Conn. 

Senator  Spencer.  You  are  now  connected  with  the  national  ways 
and  means  committee  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir ;  with  Mr.  Upham's  office. 

Senator  Spencer.  In  what  capacity? 

Mr.  Lee.  Treasurer's  office,  as  divisional  director. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  first  name  again,  please,  Mr.  Lee? 

Mr.  Lee.  Clarence  W. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  remind  you,  this  is  Mr.  Lee,  from  Ohio. 
Senator  Spencer.  Sound  Beach,  Conn.,  he  said. 
Mr.  Lee.  Senator,  I  was  born  in  Ohio. 
Senator  Spencer.  You  were  born  in  Ohio  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  You  are  in  the  treasurer's  office  as  divisional  

Mr.  Lee.  As  divisional  director ;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Spencer.  Do  you  have  a  certain  division  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir;  23  States. 
Senator  Spencer.  What  are  those  States? 

Mr.  Lee.  In  New  England,  Massachusetts,  Maine,  New  Hampshire, 
and  Vermont.  Starting  in  the  South  with  Virginia,  North  and 
South  Carolina,  and  Florida,  Georgia,  Alabama,  Mississippi,  Louisi- 
ana, Arkansas,  and  Tennessee.  In  the  Pacific  division  of  the  West, 
the  nine  States  of  the  Western  division,  Washington,  Oregon,  Cali- 
fornia  

Senator  Pomerene.  Give  me  those  Pacific  States  again. 
Mr.  Lee.  Washington,  Oregon,  California,  and  Arizona. 
Senator  Spencer.  Arizona?  ^ 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes;  and  Idaho,  Montana,  Utah,  Nevada,  and  Wyoming.  Ij 
Senator  Pomerene.  Utah,  Nevada,  and  Wyoming?  Ml 
Mr.  Lee.  And  Wyoming;  yes,  sir.  Ml 
Senator  Spencer.  What  had  been  your  occupation  before  you  came  V 
to  the  treasurer's  office  ?  fl 

Mr.  Lee.  I  have  been  identified  in  a  general  way  with  various 
organizations  since  the  beginning  of  the  war — I  mean,  since  the 
beginning  of  the  World  War — in  general  financial  campaign  work. 
Senator  Spencer.  With  what  organizations? 

Mr.  Lee.  Previously,  in  special  work  with  the  Red  Cross  and  the 
Y.  M.  C.  A.,  on  simply  special  campaigns,  but  for  over  a  year  and  a 
half  with  the  War  Camp  Community  Service,  first  in  the  organiza- 
tion work  connected  with  headquarters,  in  which  I  had  charge  of  26 
States  in  the  preliminary  set-up,  and  then  the  united  war- work  cam- 
paign in  New  York,  in  charge  of  the  industrial  division;  and  I 
assumed  Mr.  Blair's  place  as  financial  director  then  of  the  new 
organization.  Community  Service,  Incorporated,  which  was  an  out- 
growth of  the  War  Camp  Community  Service,  on  March  15,  1919. 

Senator  Spencer.  Then,  you  have  had  experience  in  the  raising  of 
money  with  the  community  war-work  drives  and  the  Community 
Service  drives? 

II 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2247 


Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  the  Red  Cross  drives  also  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  Was  the  general  plan  of  those  drives  similar  to 
the  plan  that  you  are  following  in  connection  with  this  political 
campaign  drive  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  almost  identical. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Lee,  you  are  regional  director,  I  think  you 
call  yourself? 

Senator  Spencer.  Divisional  director. 
Mr.  Lee.  Divisional  director  is  the  title. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Divisional  director? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  has  been  called  regional  director  here,  because  the  whole 
country  has  been  divided  into  seven  zones,  and  then  boiled  clown  into 
two  distinct  groups. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  director  in  each  of  those  zones  was 
called  regional  director? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  modified  the  plan,  and  now  you  have 
charge  of  the  States  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  Owen  and  myself  represent  the  entire  country,  under 
Mr.  Blair. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  activities,  I  take  it,  have  been  largely 
with  the  reorganization  of  these  various  States,  or  the  subdivisions 
thereof,  for  financial  purposes? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir,  working  from  headquarters,  not  in  the  field. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVorking  from  headquarters. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Here  in  Chicago? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir.  I  haA^e  not  been  in  the  field  at  all,  with  the  excep- 
tion of  before  the  convention. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  your  headquarters  have  been  here  in 
Chicago  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  They  have  been  here  permanently,  yes,  sir,  since  the  mid- 
dle of  July — or  June. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  in  the  State  of  Massachusetts,  I  wish  you 
would  tell  the  committee  of  your  activities  in  that  State;  what  you 
have  done  in  regard  to  organization,  raising  funds,  etc. 

Mr.  Lee.  Massachusetts  has  not  been  set  up  in  this  way  until  July 
of  this  year,  at  which  time  Senator  Weeks,  who  was  the  chairman  for 
the  four  States  of  which  I  mentioned  the  names — Maine,  New  Hamp- 
shire, Vermont,  and  Massachusetts — asked  us  to  carry  out  our  plan  in 
one  or  two  of  the  centers. of  Massachusetts.  It  has  not  been  set  up,  as 
you  have  heard,  with  reference  to  some  of  these  other  States,  because 
the  State  central  committee  had  had  an  organization,  a  financial  or- 
ganization, that  had  been  working  since  during  the  Gov.  Coolidge 
campaign  a  year  ago.  So  that  metropolitan  Boston,  with  a  little  spe- 
cial work  at  Springfield  and  also  Pittsburgh,  have  been  practically 
the  only  centers  that  have  been  touched  in  the  State.  Metropolitan 
Boston,  comprised,  outside  of  the  smaller  districts,  thinking  in  terms, 
not  of  Suffolk,  Norfolk,  etc.,  but  municipalities — about  38  mu- 
nicipalities— and  that  was  set  up  under  a  general  campaign  plan,  dif- 
ferent in  some  ways,  owing  to  the  location  and  the  nature  of  their 


2248 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


work,  and  the  campaign  was  inaugurated  upon  August  26,  and  it  is 
still  being  conducted. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  are  you  familiar  with  the  quota 
which  was  assigned  to  the  State  of  Massachusetts  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  entire  quota,  as  I  remember  it,  for  the  State  of  Mas- 
sachusetts, that  was  assigned  by  Mr.  Upham,  was  $350,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  was  that  for  the  joint  national  and  State 
campaign  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  That  was  not  for  the  joint  national  and  State  campaign. 
That  was  for  the  national  

Senator  Pomerene.  That  was  for  the  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  That  was  for  the  national  committee ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  what  amount  was  to  be  raised  for  the  State 
campaign  in  Massachusetts  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know.  We  have  nothing  whatever  to  do  with 
that — only  in  helping  out  in  the  metropolitan  district. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  $350,000,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  oh,  no. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  your  quota,  is  it  not  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  That  is  the  State  quota. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  perhaps  I  have  misunderstood  you, 
Mr.  Lee. 

Mr.  Lee.  The  State  quota  that  has  been  referred  to  for  Massachu- 
setts is  $350,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.    And  you  said  to  me  that  that  was  for 
the  national  committee,  did  you  not  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  for  its  purposes  alone  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  For  its  purposes  alone. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  the  $350,000,  then,  is  not  to  be  par- 
ticipated in  by  the  State  itself? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  understand  not ;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  can  you  tell  the  committee  how 
much  money  was  to  be  raised  by  the  State  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know. 
Senator  Pomerene.  For  State  purposes. 

Mr.  Lee.  That  is  Senator  Weeks's  matter,  his  own  set-up,  anJi  I 
do  not  know  what  their  plan  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  any  event,  there  is  nothing  in  your  arrange- 
ment with  the  State  committee,  or  the  State  authorities,  which  would 
authorize  you  to  limit  the  amount  to  be  raised  above  $350,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  you  "are  speaking  of  the  national  committee  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.    Now,  in  the  State  of  Maine  

Mr.  Lee.  The  State  of  Maine's  quota  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Lee.  $30,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  was  that  for  State  or  national  purposes? 
Mr.  Lee.  That  was  for  national  purposes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  again,  you  had  no  authority — that  is,  this 
$30,000  had  no  reference  to  the  needs  of  the  State? 
Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  was  not  to  be  used  in  the  State  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir,  not  in  the  least. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2249 


Senator  Pomeeene.  And  then,  New  Hampshire,  what  was  that 
quota  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  $15,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  was  for  national  purposes,  also  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Vermont? 

Mr.  Lee.  $10,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  .  That  also  was  for  national  purposes  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes,  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  then,  in  the  raising  of  the  funds  for 
national  purposes,  after  these  quotas  were  submitted,  were  they  ex- 
panded by  any  of  the  local  committees,  with  the  aicl  or  knowledge 
of  the  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir.    It  was  not  necessary  in  those  States  to  do  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  was  not  necessary  in  those  States  to  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir.  While  we  have  not  received  full  returns,  prac-  ' 
tically,  the  pledges — I  think  something  like  $20,000  for  Maine — the 
pledges  have  been  made,  and  were  made  within  three  w^eeks'  time. 
In  fact,  we  had  the  State  director  in  Maine  for  three  weeks,  and  he 
has  been  taken  out  of  Maine,  but  we  expect  them  to  come  through 
with  their  balance,  which  their  State  chairman  has  promised. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  us  take  these  other  States.    North  Caro- 
lina.   What  was  the  quota  there? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  quota  in  North  Carolina  was  $5,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  was  for  national  purposes  alone? 

Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes,  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  South  Carolina? 

Mr.  Lee.  South  Carolina,  $10,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Also  for  national  purposes? 

Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Georgia? 

Mr.   Lee.  $10,000— no,   Georgia,   $25,000.    I   was   thinking  of 
Florida. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  national  purposes  only? 
Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes  only,  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Florida  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  $10,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  national  purposes? 

Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Alabama? 

Mr.  Lee.  $25,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mississippi? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mississippi,  $5,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  also  for  national  purposes? 

Mr.  Lee.  National  purposes,  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Louisiana? 

Mr.  Lee.  $25,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Arkansas? 

Mr.  Lee.  $25,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Tennessee? 

Mr.  Lee.  $10,000  for  Tennessee. 


2250 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Washington? 
Mr.  Lee.  Washington,  $60,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Oregon? 
Mr.  Lee.  $25,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  California? 
Mr.  Lee.  $200,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oregon — no,  I  asked  you  for  that. 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Arizona  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  $15,000  for  Arizona,  I  believe.    I  am  not  quite  sure  of 
that.   It  is  either  $15,000  or  $20,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Idaho? 
Mr.  Lee.  Idaho,  $15,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Montana? 
Mr.  Lee.  Montana,  $10,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Utah? 

Mr.  Lee.  Utah,  I  am  not  quite  sure  whether  it  was  $20,000  or 
'  $25,000.   Those  totals  are  right  in  Mr.  Upham's  figures  there. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Nevada? 
Mr.  Lee.  Nevada,  $10,000. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Wyoming? 

Mr.  Lee.  Wyoming,  $10,000.  I  may  be  just  a  little  bit  in  error  on 
that.  I  am  just  taking  that  from  memory,  that  is  all,  without  check- 
ing them. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understand. 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  Upham's  totals,  I  think,  are  the  same.  They  are 
the  same. 

Senator  Pomerene.  They  are  all  of  them  for  national  purposes 
alone  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  Lee.  For  the  national  committee. 
Senator  Pomerene.  In  every  one  of  those  States  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  arrangement  was  made  in  all  of  those 
States  

Mr.  Lee.  There  is  some  arrangement  that  Mr.  Upham  or  the 
treasurer's  office  had  with  some  of  those  States  for  the  return  of 
funds  for  State  purposes  upon  those  quotas,  which  varies. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  any  of  those  States  was  any  limitation 
placed  upon  the  amount  w^hich  was  to  be  raised  in  the  State  for  State 
purposes  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  limitation.  We  had,  and  have,  no  control  over  the 
States. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  in  any  of  these  States  other  than  the 
New  England  States  about  which  you  have  testified,  was  there  any 
expansion  of  the  quota  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Why,  only  in  a  nominal  way,  because  most  of  those  fig- 
ures are  moderate.  The  Massachusetts  quota  is  a  very  moderate 
quota,  considering  the  total;  and  California.  There  was  an  expan- 
sion of  the  quota  in  California,  because  California  was  set  upon  the 
county  plan,  the  entire  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  was  the  expansion  there? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2251 


Mr.  Lee.  I  imagine,  upon  the  final,  probably,  upon  a  15  or  20  per 
cent  basis.  I  am  not  as  familiar  with  the  northern  counties  as  I  was 
with  the  southern  counties. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Here  in  the  State  of  Ohio  they  are  doubling 
the  quota.  In  Michigan  they  are  adding  at  least  50  per  cent  to  it. 
In  West  Virginia,  probably  30  or  35  per  cent.  And  in  several  of 
these  other  States,  substantial  increases.  Now,  why  is  there  such  a 
varying  quantity,  when  it  comes  to  the  expansion  of  the  quotas,  if 
this  expansion  is  necessary  for  the  purpose  of  opening  the  purse 
strings  of  the  subscribers? 

Mr.  Lee.  Senator,  that  is  a  campaign  expedient,  on  the  quota 
proposition,  and  I  think  that  possibly  the  committee  have  been  con- 
fused in  thinking  in  terms  of  quotas,  and  not  in  terms  of  actual  cash 
returned.  Of  course,  two  or  three  of  the  witnesses  have  been  talking 
about  shooting  at  the  moon,  and  getting  down  to  a  real  basis,  but 
in  the  readjustment  of  the  county  quotas,  and  getting  at  the  mental 
attitude  of  these  men,  they  want  to  make  a  success  of  their  proposi- 
tion. Another  thing :  There  is  a  factor  that  has  to  be  considered,  a 
safety  factor,  which  is  considered  in  all  campaigns,  all  financial 
campaigns,  and  that  is  why  there  is  a  percentage  of  increase  in  your 
quotas. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now  

Mr.  Lee.  But  bear  in  mind  that  quotas  do  not  represent  money  in 
hand. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No  ;  I  know  that. 

Mr.  Lee.  And  many  of  our  States  have  been  closed  at  less  figures 
than  our  quotas. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  and  on  the  other  hand,  Mr.  Lee,  the  quota 
does  not  mix  the  amount  which  may  be  collected ;  it  may  be  above  the 
quota  as  well  as  below  the  quota. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  in  some  instances,  but  I  think  you  will  find  in  the 
ratio,  and  in  the  percentage,  either  by  States  or  by  counties — Mr. 
Kelley  spoke  of  that,  and  called  attention  to  that — only  51  counties 
that  you  will  balance  up;  and  if  we  can  raise  our  fund  as  it  stands 
to-day,  we  will  be  thoroughly  and  perfectly  satisfied. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  Mr.  Lee,  while  here  were  different 
plans  for  different  States  

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  variations  all  balance. 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene  (continuing).  At  the  end  of  the  completed  ar- 
rangement, in  any  State  or  any  district,  the  refrain  was  "  but  get 
the  money." 

Mr.  Lee.  Absolutely.  We  have  had  to  drive  our  men  right  straight 
down  the  line,  not  only  our  men,  but  w^e  have  had  to  drive  the  com- 
mittees right  straight  down  the  line. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  anything  to  do  with  the  expendi- 
ture of  this  money? 

Mr.  Lee.  Not  a  particle,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  in  the  quotas  which  you  have  given  here 
for  these  several  States,  were  they  intended  to  include  the  money 
which  was  raised  prior  to  June  12,  1920? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 


2252 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  as  well  as  since?  - 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir.  That  quota  covers  the  whole  period,  your  whole 
period.  I  think  that  that  is  the  one  reason  why  you  have  got  what 
you  have  in  the  consideration  of  the  factors  here,  where  your  whole 
quota  covered  your  entire  period. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  am  not  so  clear  about  that  since  Mr. 
Upham  was  on  the  stand.  In  a  number  of  these  States — I  have 
looked  very  casually  at  your  exhibits — this  quota  was  almost  en- 
tirely raised  before  the  convention,  and  I  have  in  mind  at  this 
moment  Arkansas. 

Mr.  Lee.  All  right,  and  there  has  no  work  been  done  in  Arkansas 
since  the  convention.  Now,  we  have  stopped  the  work  in  many  of 
the  States  where  the  quota  has  been  raised,  and  we  have  stopped 
work  in  many  of  the  States  where  the  quota  has  not  been  raised. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  have  kept  on  raising  money  where 
the  raising  was  good? 

Mr.  Lee.  Where  the  raising  was  good ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  of  course,  there  is  no  guaranty  that  these 
quotas  may  not  be  raised  in  the  future  if  the  needs  of  the  campaign 
require  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  You  are  talking  of  the  national  committee;  that  is,  you 
are  talking  of  the  quotas  

Senator  Pomerene.  My  question  was  broad,  and  it  covered  either 
national  or  State. 

Mr.  Lee.  Of  course,  we  have  not  any  control  over  the  State  quotas, 
only  in  the  combination  campaign. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  Mr.  Lee,  just  in  a  word:  In  all  your 
active  work  in  connection  with  the  raising  of  these  funds,  there  has 
been  no  attempt  to  place  any  restriction  on  the  amount  of  money 
which  may  be  raised  under  the  auspices  of  the  State  organization  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  have  not — the  national  Eepublican  ways  and  means 
committee  has  had  no  power  over  the  State  organizations. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  they  have  never  attempted  to  exercise 
any? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  have  combined  with  them,  and  have  been  practically 

the  only  directing  agency  

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes? 

Mr.  Lee.  For  the  raising  of  the  State  fund,  with  practical  control 
in  most  of  the  States  with  the  exception  of  the  southern  States. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  if  they  succeed  in  raising  more  money 
than  is  contemplated  by  the  national  quota  

Mr.  Lee.  For  State  purposes? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Lee.  We  have  not  any  control  over  that,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  if  they  do  raise  it  neither  you  nor  Mr. 
Hays  are  going  to  scold  the  local  committee  very  much,  are  you? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  is  not  in  our  power  to  do  that,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  same  is  true  as  to  the  county  or- 
ganizations in  the  several  States ;  is  that  not  true  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  They  are  practically  autonomous  within  their  counties, 
and  under  the  State  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  have  no  control  over  the  county  organizations ;  no,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  No.  And  you  do  not  seek  to  exercise  it  ? 


I  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2253 

JVIr.  Lee.  We  have  control  over  our  county  and  State  Avays  and 
mejins  committees. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes. 

Mr.  Lee.  But  not  of  the  campaign  committee. 

Senator  Pomekene.  And  in  any  State,  if  any  set  of  distinguished 
gentlemen,  for  what  they  regard  to  be  the  public  good,  should  see 
fit  to  act  independently  of  the  National  and  State  committees,  they 
could  do  that,  too,  could  they  not,  in  the  raising  of  funds  or  ex- 
pending them? 

Mr.  Lee.  They  could  raise  funds,  but  they  could  not  expend  them 
through  our  national  treasurer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No,  no,  not  through  your  national  treasurer, 
but  they  could  expend  them  themselves  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Of  course,  we  do  not  have  any  control  over  that.  That 
is  an  American  citizen's  own  proposition. 

Senator  Pomerene.  They  could  do  that  by  way  of  advertising, 
by  way  of  furnishing  speakers,  and  in  the  countless  ways  wdiich 
are  familiar  to  the  public,  in  an  attempt  to  influence  public  opinion  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  That  could  be  done,  of  course,  with  any  political 
party  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  Democrats  as  well  as  Republicans? 
Mr.  Lee.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  Farmer-Labor  Party? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  If  some  man  wants  to  take  his  team  and  go  out 
and  Avork  all  day  for  the  Democratic  or  Republican  Party,  there 
really  is  not  any  way  of  stopping  him  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  understand  there  is  a  campaign  fund  up  here  in  the 
Northwest  noAv  

The  Chairman.  You  say  there  is  a  campaign  fund? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  understand  so.    I  do  not  know  positively. 

The  Chairman.  Of  what? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  have  heard  $4,000,000. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  heard  $4,000,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  heard  that  the  Non-Partisan  League  got  a  $4,000,000 
campaign  fund. 

The  Chairman.  The  Non-Partisan  League? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  have  not  any  more  idea  of  it  than  that.  It  Avas  just 
simply  a  report. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  their  treasurer,  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  Of  course,  we  do  not  Avant  rumors,  but  if  you 
can  give  us  any  leads  in  that  direction  

Mr.  Lee.  I  have  not  any  leads  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  have  understood  they  had  a  campaign 
fund  of  $4,000,000? 
Mr.  Lee.   I  ha\^e  heard  so. 

The  Chairman.  Where  are  their  headquarters  ? 
182774— 20— PT  15  11 


2254 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Lee.  I  have  not  any  idea.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  the 
organization  personally,  because  I  have  been  in  the  Middle  West 
only  a  short  time. 

The  Chairman.  You  get  that  from  matters  you  hear  in  traveling 
around  the  country? 

Mr.  Lee,  I  have  not  been  through  that  country,  no,  but  I  heard 
it  some  place. 

Senator  Spencer.  The  only  quotas  you  fix  are  State  quotas,  are 
they  not? 

Mr.  Lee.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Spencer.  You  have  nothing  to  do  with  the  city  or  county 
quotas  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  When  you  make  an  estimate  of  what  you  think 
you  ought  to  get  from  a  State,  the  State  can  raise  it  as  they  like 
among  the  counties  and  cities.    You  have  no  connection  with  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  No;  no  connection  with  that. 

Senator  Spencer.  Of  course,  as  Senator  Pomerene  indicated,  in  a 
local  situation  any  city  or  county  could  raise  for  the  city  or  county 
purposes  aii}^  amount  it  liked? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  If  Phoenix,  Ariz.,  wanted  to  raise  $10,000,000 
for  city  matters,  there  would  be  nothing  in  the  world  you  could  do 
to  prevent  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  If  Wyoming  wanted  to  raise  $100,000,000  for  a 
State  campaign,  you  could  not  prevent  it  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  No.  sir. 

Senator  Spencer.  But  you  have  a  definite  quota  for  the  Kepub- 
lican  national  campaign,  and  that  quota  is  $3,079,000? 
Mr.  Lee.  As  against  a  definite  budget. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  quota,  I  say,  is  $3,079,000  for  the  Repub- 
lican national  campaign? 

Mr.  Lee.  You  are  speaking  of  budget.    That  is  your  budget. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  when  that  budget  is  raised,  your  work  is 
through  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Our  work  is  through. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  the  witness  has  not  said  that.  Senator. 
The  Chairman.  If  Tammany  Hall  had  raised  $10,000,000  to  use  in 
the  New  York  campaign,  would  there  be  any  way  of  stopping  them  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  Should  there  not  be  some  way  of  stopping  these 
different  organizations  from  raising  large  sums  of  money  to  use  in 
a  national  campaign?  How  are  you  ever  going  to  get  an  effective 
corrupt-practice  act  unless  some  method  is  devised  to  stop  that  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  that  power  rests  with  the  Government. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  do  you  see  any  way? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  see  any  way. 

Senator  Spencer.  Because,  of  course,  an  amount  that  is  raised  by 
Phoenix,  Ariz.,  or  by  Tammany  Hall  in  New  York,  in  a  sense  af- 
fects your  presidential  campaign.  While  it  is  local  money,  raised  in 
a  local  campaign,  the  election  occurs  at  the  same  time  and  the  activi- 
ties have  a  direct  reference  to  the  presidential  activities.  Do  you 
see  any  way  to  prevent  the  raising  of  local  moneys? 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2255 


Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  There  could  be  some  method,  could  there  not,  by 
which  the  use  of  money,  except  through  regularly  authorized  com- 
mittees, could  be  prohibited,  could  there  not? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know  that ;  I  am  not  enough  of  a  lawyer  to  tell 
about  that. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  we  are  trying  to  find  some  remedy. 
Mr.  Lee.  Some  remedy ;  yes.    I  think  it  is  essential. 
The  Chair3ian.  What? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  it  is  essential,  and  would  be  a  healthy  thing  for 
the  Nation. 

Senator  Spencer.  Keally,  the  only  check  in  communities  is  what 
experience  teaches  that  communities  do  and  what  the  individual 
interest  of  party  partisans  upon  one  side  or  the  other  in  that  com- 
munity warrants  them  in  giving;  is  that  not  right? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Lee,  I  was  not  here  when  you  began  your  testi- 
mony, and  I  may  ask  you  some  questions  that  w^ere  asked  before; 
but  if  I  do  it,  I  do  not  do  it  intentionally.  Where  is  your  jurisdiction 
now? 

Mr.  Lee.  In  23  States,  as  divisional  director,  with  headquarters 
here  in  Chicago. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  they  embrace  Tennessee? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  your  man  in  Tennessee? 
Mr.  Lee.  You  mean  the  State  chairnum?    C.  H.  Houston  is  the 
State  chairman,  with  headquarters  at  Chattanooga. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  Mr.  Garrison? 

Mr.  Lee.  F.  H.  Garrison — he  came  with  the  organization  early 
in  July,  and  I  think  at  Nashville — he  was  assigned  to  Memphis  for 
a  little  Avhile,  and  then  he  went  into  Alabama  as  State  director  for 
Alabama. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  when  was  he  at  Memphis? 
Mr.  Lee.  Along  about  the  middle  or  latter  part  of  July,  or  a  little 
later  on. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  did  he  stay  there  before  going  to  Nash- 
ville? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  was  only  there  a  week,  I  think,  or  10  days,  or  some- 
thing of  that  kind.    He  was  a  man  who  was  traveling  around. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  did  he  stay  in  Nashville? 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  he  had  been  in  Nashville — I  think  he  was  located 
in  Nashville,  and  was  doing  special  work  there  before  he  came 
with  us. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  was  he  doing  special  work  for  the  national 
committee  in  gathering  this  money? 

Mr.  Lee.  No.  He  started — he  was  starting  in  with  the  setting  up 
of  the  organization  there,  or  the  committee — not  the  organization — 
such  as  we  have  been  thinking  and  talking  about  in  terms  here,  and 
then  he  was  sent  over  to  Memphis,  and  finally  from  Memphis  to 
Birmingham. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  who  is  in  Knoxville? 

Senator  Lee.  Tennessee  was  in  charge  of  C.  F.  Taylor,  for  a  short 
time,  as  State  director.    He  was  given  a  special  traveling  commis- 


I 


.2256 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


sion  to  start  with.  He  was  the  man  AA'ho  was  mentioned  by  Mr. 
McClure  yesterday  or  the  day  before. 

Senator  Reed.  C.  F.  Taylor  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes, 

Senator  Reed.  Who  has  Chattanooga? 

Mr.  Lee.  And  he  has  charge  of  that,  and  under  him  was  a  Mr. 
MacCormac. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  who  has  Chattanooga? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr,  MacCormac  has,  under  Mr.  Houston,  Chattanooga 
and  Knoxville,  and  he  is  now  at  the  present  time  cleaning  up  the 
Avork  in  Tennessee  as  State  director.  The  other  men  have  been 
taken  out  of  the  region. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  somebody  else  been  sent  in  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  man  by  the  name  of  Patten  working 
now  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Patten? 

Senator  Reed.  R.  E.  Patten. 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  such  a  man  working  for  the  national 
committee  or  in  connection  with  this  compaign  fund? 

Mr.  Lee.  Not  to  my  knowledge.  He  is  not  connected  with  the 
treasurer's  office. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  did  you  have  a  man  named  Patchell? 

Mr.  Lee.  No;  your  leads  are  very  wrong  there.  Mr.  Patchell 
is  in  New  York.   J.  J.  Patchell  is  

Senator  Reed.  Well,  that  may  be  wrong. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  But  I. am  asking  you  a  question. 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  such  a  man  working  for  the  committee? 
Mr.  Lee.  J.  J.  Patchell,  under  Col.  Thompson,  of  New  York  City. 
Senator  Reed.  If  you  are  trying  to  figure  out  what  I  have  got 
before  me,  your  leads  may  be  wrong,  too. 
Mr.  Lee.  That  is  all  right. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  a  man  named  Morton  MacCormac? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  he  is  in  Tennessee,  is  he  not? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  is  in  Tennessee  now ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  how  long  ago  was  he  sent  there? 

Mr.  Lee.  When  did  he  go  there  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  remember  the  exact  date,  but  sometime  in  July, 
Senator,  I  think. 

Senator  Reed.  He  went  to  Chattanooga  about  the  19th  day  of 
July ;  did  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir — I  do  not  know  about  whether  it  was  the  19th 
or  not,  but  sometime  in  July.    I  do  not  remember  the  exact  date. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  possibly  that.  And  he  left  there  about  the 
21st,  did  he  not? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  had  been  in  the  field,  and  had  been  movmg  back 
and  forth  day  after  day  between  two  or  three  centers,  sometimes  in 
Chattanooga,  sometimes  in  Knoxville,  and  sometimes  in  Nashville. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2257 


Senator  Reed.  Xow,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  Tennessee  had  been  di- 
vided into  how  many  districts? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  has  l3een  divided  into — well,  not  in  the  way  of  dis- 
tricts. It  has  been  divided  into  coimt}^  organizations.  Mr.  Houston 
has  divided  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  but  have  you  not  districted  it?  Of  course, 
you  have  got  county  organizations. 

Mr.  Lee.  County  organizations. 

Senator  Reed.  You  ordinarily  have  four  districts,  do  you  not? 
Mr.  Lee.  Xo. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  ordinarily;  I  mean  in  this  case. 
Mr.  Lee.  No;  not  in  the  way  of  districts.   We  have  men  assigned 
to  centers. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right. 

Mr.  Lee.  MacCormac  is  in  Chattanooga  and  Knoxville,  as  head- 
quarters, taking  care  of  eastern  Tennessee  

Senator  Reed.  Yes  ? 

Mr.  Lee  (continuing) .  And  Memphis — thinking  in  terms  of  cities ; 
taking,  care  of  western  Tennessee. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  So  that  these  two  men  covered  the  four  cities 
of  Chattanooga,  Knoxville,  Nashville,  and  Memphis? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes.  Garrison  was  in  there  for  a  few  days,  but  went 
out  of  there,  and  there  was  another  man  in  there  for  two  or  three 


to  a  town,  and  calling  together  a  number  of  prominent  Republican 
business  men?    Was  that  their  method  of  organizing? 

Mr.  Lee.  On  the  general  plan,  but  not  on  the  intensive  plan  that 
has  been  presented  here. 

Senator  Reed.  On  a  general  plan  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Just  simply  a  small  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  I  believe  you  have  already  said  that  in  addi- 
tion to  Morton  MacCormac,  you  had  two  other  men  in  Tennessee. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  but  they  were  in  for  two  or  three  daj^s,  helping  with 
the  work  Avhere  the  other  people  had  been  stopped;  they  were  just 
in  and  out  of  there  for  two  or  three  days. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  3^ou  know  how  much  they  undertook  to  raise 
in  Knoxville  ? 

(Xo  response.) 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  was  $10,000,  was  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  yes,  sir,  approximately  that ;  $10,000  or  $12,000. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  Knoxville  had  been  assessed,  and  that  was 
Knoxville's  quota? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  had  been  assessed  by  Mr.  Houston,  State  chairman; 
yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  jour 
agent  there  undertook  to  collect  more  than  that,  to  raise  more  than 
that,  increasing  their  quota  to  $15,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  is  still  in  Knoxville,  and  his  work  is  not  completed  3^et. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  still  there  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 


Senator  Reed.  But  the  quota  that  he  has  assigned  to  that  city  is 
$15,000? 


days. 


sy  follow  the  method  of  going 


2258 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Lee.  Not  that  he  has  assigned.   Mr.  Houston  assigned  it. 
Senator  Keed.  Well,  it  is  $15,000,  is  it  not? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  understand  it  is ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  What  is  the  name  of  the  man  you  just  mentioned? 
Houston  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Houston.  Mr.  Houston  lives  in  Chattanooga,  and  he  is 
the  State  chairman  of  the  Tennessee  ways  and  means  committee. 

Senator  Eeed.  Now,  do  you  know  what  the  population  of  Knox- 
ville  is  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  could  not  tell  you,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  Do  you  know  what  its  population  is  as  compared 
with  Chattanooga? 
Mr.  Lee.  No. 

Senator  Keed.  Or  Memphis,  I  mean,  as  to  which  is  the  larger? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  think  probably  Memphis  is  the  larger  city,  yes. 
Senator  Keed.  Memphis  is  larger  than  Knoxville? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Keed.  Very  well.   And  this  gentleman  is  still  down  there, 
Mr.  MacCormac? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  Trying  to  raise  money? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  Now,  I  have  spoken  to  you  about  the  quotas  for 
Knoxville.    Do  you  know  what  the  quota  is  for  Memphis? 
Mr.  Lee.  Well,  my  recollection  is  that  it  was  $10,000. 
Senator  Keed.  $10,000  from  Memphis  to  be  raised? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  But  how  do  you  know  what  the  quota  is?  This 
$10,000  is  the  amount  you  expect  to  get  there  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Keed.  But  what  is  the  quota  assigned  there  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Their  method — they  are  not  fixing  any  terms,  especially 
in  the  Southern  States. 

Senator  Keed.  $10,000  for  Knoxville,  and  $10,000  for  Memphis? 
Do  you  not  think  you  are  mistaken  about  that?  Is  not  Memphis 
larger  than  Knoxville? 

Mr.  Lee.  No. 

Senator  Keed.  Knoxville  was  $15,000  and  Memphis  $10,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  Knoxville  was  $15,000  and  Chattanooga  $15,000, 
and  Nashville  either  $10,000  or  $15,000,  and  Memphis  $10,000.^  That 
is  the  outside — that  is,  thinking  in  terms.  Mr.  Houston  is  thinking 
in  those  terms. 

Senator  Keed.  Well,  you  have  $50,000  for  the  State  of  Tennessee  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  I  think  it  was  turned  in  here  at  $10,000. 

Mr.  Lee.  All  right,  but  I  said  $10,000  for  the  national  fund.  That 
is  Tennessee's  quota. 

Senator  Keed.  Tennessee's  quota  for  the  national  fund? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir.  They  are  raising  their  State  fund  there.  That 
is  a  combination  fund. 

Senator  Keed.  But  the  quota  that  these  four  men  of  yours  are  try- 
ing to  collect  is  $60,000  from  the  four  cities  ? 

Mv.  Lee.  I  think  it  may  be  $100,000,  with  the  other  counties  prob- 
ably— counting  in  the  counties. 


PRESIDEIirTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2259 


Senator  Eeed.  $100,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes;  but  that  is  State  money.  We  have  nothing  to  do 
with  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  But  the  men  that  the  national  committee  sends  down 
there  are  staying  there  and  helping  to  raise  the  whole  $100,000? 

^Ir.  Lee.  All  right.  That  is  under  the  State  plan,  and  under  the 
arrangement  with  Mr.  Upham. 

Senator  Keed.  Now,  what  is  the  arrangement  as  to  the  division  of 
the  total  amount  of  money  raised  in  that  State? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  imagine  that  all  that  money  goes  back  into  the  State  for 
State  purposes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  imagine  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know  that.   Mr.  Upham  can  tell  you. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  we  are  to  understand,  are  we,  that  the  national 
committee  goes  into  a  State,  undertakes  the  organization  and  the 
work  of  raising  $100,000,  and  only  takes  $10,000  for  itself,  and  turns 
the  other  $90,000  over  to  the  State  organization?  That  is  the  way 
we  are  to  understand  it,  is  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  Whatever  it  is.  You  found  the  division  in  the  other 
States  that  our  men  have  been  in,  aiding  the  State  committee  for  the 
State  fund. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  the  amount  of  it  is  this,  that  your  organiza- 
tion goes  into  Tennessee,  organizes  the  State,  raises  $100,000,  and 
$10,000  of  it  goes  to  the  national  committee,  and  $90,000  of  it  goes  to 
the  State  committee,  and  then  you  make  a  joint  fight  down  there  to 
carry  Tennessee. 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  I  do  not  know  anything  about  the  political  end  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  anything  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  the  $100,000  particularly. 
I  said  it  might  be  $100,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  been  making  the  same  effort  in  some  other 
Southern  States  to  get  some  money? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  sent  your  man  down  to  Birmingham,  did  you 
not? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  did  jon  tell  him  to  get  down  in  Bir- 
mingham ? 

Mr.  Lee.  $25,000. 

Senator  Reed.  In  that  one  city? 

Mr.  Lee.  That  is  the  Alabama  quota,  which  we  concentrated  on 
Birmingham  for. 

Senator  Reed.  There  are  other  cities  in  Alabama,  are  there  not  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  They  are  too  far  South  for  an  attempt  to  get  Republican 
money. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  a  man  named  McPike  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  do  not  know  him  personally,  no ;  but  he  is  one  of  our 
western  men.   He  is  temporarily  in  California. 
Senator  Reed.  Southern  California? 

Mr.  Lee.  Southern  California,  with  headquarters  at  San  Diego. 
Senator  Reed.  He  was  there  about  the  16th  of  August,  was  he  not? 


2260 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Lp]E.  Approximately,  I  think.  I  think  he  has  been  off  of  our 
pay  loll  for  three  Aveeks  or  so. 

Senator  Keed.  You  wrote  to  him  about  that  time,  did  3^ou  not  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Possibly  I  corresponded  with  him  a  few  times. 

Senator  Reed.  VVliere  do  you  keep  the  copies  of  the  letters  that 
you  Avrite? 

Mr.  Lee.  Copies  of  letters,  T  think,  should  be  in  our  files. 
Senator  Keed.  Please  get  me  that  letter,  or  that  copy. 
Mr.  Lee.  I  might  have  written  him  several  letters.    I  do  not  re- 
member exactly. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  get  me  the  copy  of  the  letter  of  about  that 

date,  in  which  you  cliscussecl  the  question  of  

Mr.  Lee.  About  August  16  ? 
Senator  Reed.  About  that  date. 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  In  which  you  discussed  the  fact  that  recent  events 
had  thrown  your  plan  for  California  into  the  discard.  That  is  not 
the  exact  language,  but  that  is  the  idea.  You  remember  that  letter, 
do  you  not? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  I  would  not  remember  it.  I  am  handling  23  States, 
through  telegrams  and  correspondence  every  day. 

Senator  Reed.  You  remember,  do  you  not,  writing  about  the  con- 
gressional investigation?  How? 

Mr.  Lee.  Not  particularly;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  particularly? 

Mr.  Lee.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  do  you  remember  it  generally? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  not  even  in  a  general  way ;  I  do  not  remember  what 
I  wrote  him  about  that.    I  will  be  glad  to  get  that. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  all  of  the  letters  you  wrote  him  during  the 
month  of  August. 

Mr.  Lee.  I  will  be  very  glad  to  furnish  them  to  you. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  will  it  take  you  to  go  over  and  get  them  ? 

The  Chairman.  He  can  bring  them  in  in  the  morning. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  can  3^011  not  put  another  witness  on? 

The  Chairman.  Is  Mr.  Woodford  here,  of  Cleveland?  Appar- 
ently he  is  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  Mr.  Lee,  please  bring  in  that  correspondence. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  will  it  take  you  to  go  through  the  cor- 
respondence file,  and  find  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  will  have  to  call  for  the  filing  clerk  to  go  into  that. 
In  fact,  I  will  have  to  call  for  the  file  and  go  through  it  myself, 
because  I  could  not  depend  upon  the  filing  clerk  there  for  something 
special  in  there. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  phone  over  and  ask  the  filing  clerk  to 
find  these  particular  letters,  and  then  go  on  with  the  testimony  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  can  do  that. 

Senator  Reed.  This  is  the  principal  thing  I  am  on.  I  do  not  in- 
tend to  go  over  the  other  ground  again.  Get  me  a  letter  of  July  27, 
addressed  to  a  man  named  Garrison. 

Mr.  Lee.  I  have  got  a  copy  of  that  right  here,  if  you  want  it.  Is 
this  one  of  the  copies  you  refer  to  [indicating]  ? 

The  Chairman.  Maybe  you  have  the  other  letter  that  the  Senator 
wants,  too.  i 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2261 


Mr.  Lee.  No,  that  extract  was  not  published  in  the  paper.  I  could 
have  had  it  here  just  as  well  as  not*  of  course. 

Senator  Reed.  You  brought  that  one  because  it  had  been  pub- 
lished in  the  paper? 

Mr.  Lee.  Because  

Senator  Reed.  Because  it  was  already  known  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Already  known  

Senator  Reed.  Well,  bring  us  some  of  those  that  are  not  already 
J^nown. 

Mr.  Lee.  All  right. 

The  Chaieman.  Do  you  know  the  date  of  the  letter  he  wants? 
Mr.  Lee.  August  16. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  they  are  all  letters  you  wrote  to  that  gentle- 
man during  the  month  of  August. 
Mr.  Lee.  All  right. 
Senator  Reed.  That  is  what  I  want. 
Mr.  Lee.  All  right. 

Senator  Reed.  And  I  think  with  those  I  will  be  ready  to  ask  just 
a  few  questions.  I  su£rgest  that  you  get  them,  because  I  can  not 
examine  about  letters  that  are  not  here. 

The  Chairman.  And  will  you  conclude,  then? 

Senator  Reed.  So  far  as  I  know  now,  that  is  my  intention. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Lee,  do  you  suppose  you  can  get  those  within 
20  minutes  or  half  an  hour? 

Mr.  Lee.  Oh,  easily. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  do  that,  then. 

(Witness  temporarily  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  Now,  is  Mr.  Woodford  here?  Are  there  any  other 
witnesses  here  who  have  been  subpoenaed,  who  have  not  been  heard? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  am  ready  to  go  on  again,  Mr.  Chairman,  any  time 
the  committee  wants, 

FURTHER  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  EDMOND  H.  MOORE. 

The  Avitness,  previously  sworn,  was  recalled. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  Avhile  we  are  willing  to  hear  from  you,  we 
do  not  want  to  hear  speeches. 

Mr.  MooRE.  If  you  will  not  ask  me  anything  that  calls  for  a 
jpeech,  you  will  notice  I  will  not  give  you  any,  because  I  did  not  this 
morning,  and  you  did  not  call  for  any. 

The  Chatrinian.  Well,  if  you  have  telegrams,  and  matters  of  that 
kind,  that  suggest  leads,  give  them  to  the  committee. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  will  simply  call  your  attention  to  them,  so  that  the 
record  will  show  what  telegrams  they  are,  without  reading  them, 
or  anything  of  that  kind.   I  will  be  very  glad  to  do  that. 

The  Chairman.  In  other  words,  let  us  keep  as  close  as  we  can  to 
the  rides  of  evidence.  We  can  not  keep  to  them  entirely,  but  let  us 
do  the  best  we  can. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  will  be  very  glad  to.  I  think  that  is  an  excellent 
sugirestion. 

Senator  Reed.  How  lone:  will  that  continue  to  last,  now? 
The  Chairman,  Well,  it  will  last  until  to-morrew  night. 
Mr.  MooRE.  First,  Senator,  is  a  letter — if  I  may  just  have  the 
letter  back — from  the  United  States  district  attorney  in  Arkansas 


2262 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


calling  attention  to  the  newspaper  reports  showing  that  $83,000 
was  collected  in  Arkansas. 

The  Chairman.  What  does  our  testimony  show  on  that?  I  think 
it  shows  $32,000. 

Mr.  Moore.  No,  between  $25,000  and  $30,000.  I  am  just  calling  at- 
tention to  that,  because  the  quota  that  was  named,  in  Mr.  Upham's 
statement,  I  think  it  was,  was  something  like  $15,000. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  I  have  letters  that  have  been  sent  to 
me  about — — 

Mr.  MooRE  (interrupting).  This  gives  the  dates  of  the  newspapers. 
The  Chairman.  Let  me  finish. 
Mr.  Moore.  Yes. 

The  Chairman  (continuing).  And  I  will  bd  very  glad  to  show  them 
to  you  privately,  from  Texas  and  other  States,  about  large  con- 
tributions to  the  Democrats,  but  they  are  simply  letters. 

Mr.  Moore.  Well,  I  am  calling  your  attention  to  suggestions  here, 
so  as  to  get  the  facts. 

Senator  Reed.  Noav,  stick  to  the  rules  of  evidence,  gentlemen. 

The  Chairman.  You  want  to  do  that  now,  do  you  ? 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  what  you  announced. 

The  Chairman.  All  right,  we  will  do  that  now,  and  see  where  we 
will  get. 

Mr.  Moore.  Now,  here  is  one  on  Tennessee,  but  I  understand  that 
Mr.  Lee  agreed  that  the  quotas  there  are  as  they  are  stated  here. 
This  is  on  that,  Senator,  if  you  desire  to  call  anybody.  There  is  a 
quota,  and  here  is  the  statement.  Now,  I  want  to  see  what  the 
Seattle  quota  was.  Perhaps  there  is  no  difference. 

The  Chairman.  Spokane? 

Mr.  ^.iOORE.  Spokane  was  $20,000  in  there.  The  whole  amount  was 
$224,000,  as  shown,  in  the  State,  but  Spokane  was  $20,000,  and 
the  telegram  said  it  had  been  reduced  to  $17,000,  so  I  do  not  believe 
there  is  much  difference  about  that. 

The  Chairman,  xlardlv  enough  to  warrant  bringing  anybody  from 
Spokane. 

Mr.  MooRE.  No.  Here  is  a  telegram  from  Florida,  claiming  it 
is  two  and  a  half  times  the  amount  stated.  Here  are  the  authori- 
ties there,  pretty  reputable  gentlemen. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  somebody  in  Tennessee  telegraphing  about 
Florida?  ... 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  sir,  but  it  is  the  Commercial  Appeal,  the  biggest 
newspaper  in  that  section. 

The  Chairman.  W^ell,  that  does  not  make  it  any  mOre  truthful 
than  if  it  were  a  small  paper. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  but  it  gives  you  the  name  of  a  man  from  whom 
you  can  find  out,  Mr.  Cohn,  who  appears  to  be  a  paid  agent  of  the 
committee  in  that  section,  that  is  all.  I  desire  simply  to  suggest 
the  name  of  Mr.  Cohn  to  the  committee,  if  you  desire  to  call  him. 

The  Chairman.  Of  where  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  You  Avill  have  to  find  out  from  the  national  committee. 
He  is  the  man  who  has  been  working-  in  Florida. 

The  Chairman.  Kohn,  K-o-h-n? 

Mr.  MooRE.  No,  C-o-h-n.  '  - 

Senator  Spencer.  You  siiggest  the  name  of  a  man  in  Florida, 
which  was  given  to  you  by  a  man  in  Tennessee,  and  all  you  know 


PRESIDE^^TIAL  CAMPAIGlSr  EXPENSES. 


2268 


about  the  man  in  Florida  is  that  his  name  is  given  to  you,  and  his 
residence,  and  his  initials  you  want  us  to  get  from  the  national  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  because  you  are  investigating.  The  man  I  spoke 
of  is  a  man  in  Tennessee,  Mr.  Mahoney,  of  the  Commercial  Appeal, 
whom  everybody  knows  to  be  a  man  of  high  repute.  Of  course,  I 
do  not  i^now  

The  Chairman.  You  see,  if  Senator  Reed  insists  on  the  strict  rules 
of  evidence,  we  can  not  pav  an^^  attention  to  that. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  am  not  asking  you  to  pay  any  attention  to  it,  except 
as  a  suggestion  that  you  may  investigate,  to  show  that  the  increase  in 
quotas  has  been  continued  throughout  the  United  States.  In  view  of 
the  number  of  subscriptions  to  which  my  attention  has  been  called, 
from  Hawaii,  I  will  have  to  present — it  has  not  reached  me  yet — the 
Republican  Star  Bulletin,  a  Republican  newspaper  of  Honolulu,  in 
which  this  telegram  from  Mr.  Wilson,  of  Honolulu,  says — this  cable- 
gram— that  they  have  set  their  quota  at  $100,000,  as  stated  in  the 
Honolulu  Star  Bulletin  of  June  25,  a  Republican  newspaper-.  I 
think  that  Avould  be  sufficient  authority  to  investigate,  if  there  would 
be  any  question  about  Honolulu,  which  I  notice  is  not  stated. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  the  committee  ought  to  go  to  Hono- 
lulu? 

Mr.  Moore.  No,  but  you  are  investigating  this  

Senator  Reed.  No,  they  ought  to  do  it  right  here. 

Mr.  Moore.  May  I  suggest  that  you  are  investigating  these  tre- 
mendous funds  talked  of. 

The  Chairman.  Have  we  some  quota  for  Honolulu? 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  think  we  have,  but  there  are  numerous  sub- 
scriptions. 

Mr.  MooRE.  From  Hawaii? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  Nobody  out  there  subscribed  less  than  $100, 
as  near  as  I  can  figure  it  out.  I  suggest  we  ought  to  get  from  the 
national  committee  that  information,  if  that  is  true. 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  I  think  that  can  be  done. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Now,  I  called  the  attention  of  the  committee  the  other 
day  to  a  telegram  from  a  gentleman  in  South  Dakota,  who  said  that 
the  quota,  in  place  of  being  $7,500,  as  stated  by  Mr.  Upham — and  I 
looked,  so  I  might  not  misquote  him ;  I  verified  the  newspaper  state- 
ment by  going  to  his  testimony — in  place  of  being  $7,500,  it  was 
$25,000. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say,  instead  of  being  $7,500,  it  was  $25,000? 

Mr.  MooRE.  In  place  of  being  $7,500,  it  was  $25,000,  in  South 
Dakota.  I  offer  that  as  testimony. 

1  he  Chairman.  Do  you  say  as  a  lawyer  that  that  is  testimony? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  think  so.  This  says,  "  Republican  national  com- 
mittee; O.  W.  Coursey,  special  representative  of  the  treasurer; 
Mitchell,  S.^  Dak." 

Senator  Spencer.  What  are  you  reading  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  A  letter. 

Senator  Spencer.  To  whom? 

Mr.  Moore.  Addressed  to  Hon.  G.  H.  Harvey,  county  chairman, 
Fort  Pierre,  S.  Dak.  It  is  headed  "  Confidential.  Republican  national 
committee;  O.  W.  Coursey,  special  representative  of  the  treasurer." 


2264 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


And  it  is  signed,  Senator.  It  is  not  a  typewritten  signature.  It  is  a 
written  signature,  which  says  that  the  quota  is  $25,000,  and  it  is 
addressed  as  a  confidential  letter. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  think,  if  that  is  this  gentleman's  signature, 
it  would  be  testimony,  and  would  be  admissible. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes. 

Senator  Spencer.  If  that  gentleman  is  an  officer ;  yes. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Well,  I  can  only  judge  by  the  internal  evidence  it  bears. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  that  is  prima  facie  evidence. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  put  it  in  the  record. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Read  it,  so  that  we  will  get  it  all. 

(Letter  read  by  Senator  Pomerene  is  attached  hereto.) 

[Confidential.  Republican  National  Committee.  Will  H.  Hays,  chairman  ;  Clarence  B. 
Miller,  secretary  ;  Fred  W.  Upham,  treasurer  ;  Reeves  Schley,  eastern  treasurer  ;  O.  W. 
Coursey,  special  representative  of  the  treasury.] 

Mitchell,  S.  Dak.,  July  2J,  1920. 

Hon  G.  H.  Harvey, 

County  Chairman,  Fort  Pierre,  8.  Dak. 
Deapv  Sir  :  The  nntioiial  jiiul  State  Reiniblicaii  committees  are  putting  on  a 
joint  campaign  in  South  Dakota  to  raise  $25,000.    We  need  the  money  by  Au- 
gust 1. 

Please  see  your  leading  republicans,  including  republican  bankers,  through- 
out your  county  at  once,  and  secure  their  subscriptions. 

Find  herewith  some  subscription  cards.  See  that  all  checks  are  made  pay- 
able to  Fred  W.  Upham,  and  be  sure  to  have  a  card  filled  out  and  attached  to 
each  check. 

Hoping  that  you  will  give  this  matter  preference  over  everything  for  the  next 
few  days,  and  awaiting  your  early  reply,  I  am. 
Yours,  truly, 

(Signed)  O.  W.  Coursey, 

Special  Representative  of  the  Treasurer. 

O.  W.  C. :  B. 

Senator  Keed.  Down  in  the  left-hand  corner  are  the  initials  "  O. 
W.  C:  B.";  then  "  enc."  I  suppose  the  "  O.  W.  C."  is  the  dictator 
and  "  B."  is  the  stenographer.  If  there  is  any  question  about  it  we 
should  get  "  B." 

The  Chairman.  Just  a  minute.  This  is  the  joint  campaign,  the 
letter  States.  Now,  *what  was  the  quota  for  South  Dakota  for 
the  national  committee? 

Mr.  MooRE.  $7,500. 

The  Chairman.  A¥ell,  was  that  a  joint  matter,  do  you  understand, 
or  that  that  was  just  the  national  committee? 

Mr.  MooRE.  That  was  just  the  national  committee.  Mr.  Upham 
didn't  give  it  as  one  of  the  States  that  has  a  joint ;  but  they  may  have 
had  a  joint. 

The. Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  this  seems  to  be  the  joint  campaign  fori 
the  State  and  national.  J 
Mr.  MooRE.  It  might  be.  J 
The  Chairman.  It  would  not  be  inconsistent  ?  1 
Mr.  MooRE.  It  might  be.  | 
Senator  Reed.  Except  it  changes — and  I  am  not  saying  this  now 
to  criticise  Mr.  Upham — but  if  Mr.  Upham  did  not  include  this  as 
one  of  the  States  in  which  a  joint  fund  should  be  raised,  it  now  ap- 
pears that  it  ought  to  be  classified  as  one  of  those  States,  and  that  the 
total  amount  to  be  raised  is  $25,000,  of  which,  as  far  as  we  have  any 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2265 


evidence,  ST.500  would  2:0  to  the  national  committee,  and  the  balance 
would  go  to  the  State.    Xow  it  changes  the  situation  in  that  regard. 

The  Chairmax.  Well.  I  will  have  to  look  at  his  evidence  to  see. 

Mr.  ^looRE.  Here  are  some  telegrams.  Senator,  that  under  the  rules 
are  not  proper  for  me  to  read. 

The  Chairman,  Let  us  have  them. 

Mr.  ^fooRE.  If  they  are  correct,  then  it  is  a  very  important  matter 
for  you  to  investigate;  from  very  prominent  gentlemen  in  California, 
tending  to  show  subscribing  in  large  amounts,  dividing  up  the  sub- 
scriptions. 

The  Chair3ian.  We  will  keep  these  telegrams,  unless  you  want 
them. 

Mr.  Moore.  I  would  like  the  telegrams.  If  you  will  take  the  names 
so  that  you  will  have  them  for  the  purpose  of  further  investigation 
and  then  let  me  have  the  telegrams. 

Senator  Edge.  We  can  have  coj^ies  of  them  made  and  then  have 
the  telegrams  returned  to  you. 

Mr.  ]\IooRE.  I  would  like  to  investigate  that.  Gov.  Stephens  is 
in  the  East.  And  you  can  investigate  Mr.  Dockweiler's  statement. 
It  appears  in  the  Los  Angeles  Times  and  also  in  the  Examiner, 
which  is  the  Hearst  paper.  The  files  of  the  Hearst  papers  here  will 
show  whether  that  statement  was  correct  or  not.  And  if  it  was  it 
might  be  worth  while  to  subpoena  Gov.  Stephens  before  he  returns 
to  the  West. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  is  it  possible  for  3^ou  to  have  copies 
of  these  telegrams  made  and  sent  to  us? 

Mr.  ^Ioore.  Yes,  sir;  I  will  be  very  glad  to  do  that.  Xow.  if  you 
will  continue  your  examination — here  are  two  statements  relative 
to  the  quotas  for  Bloomington. 

Senator  Eeed.  What  was  it.  Mr.  ^loore  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  Here  are  two  statements  relative  to  the  quotas  for 
Bloomington — that  is.  McLean  County,  rather — which  has  a  popula- 
tion of  about  70,000,  and  has  a  quota  that  is  said  to  be  30,000.  And 
Alton's  quota  is  said  to  be  20,000.  And  it  says  that  the  meeting  was 
held  at  Mineral  Springs  Hotel,  at  which  the  amount  was  raised. 
Mr.  William  L.  Sauvage  had  charge  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  it  was  promised  that  there  would  be 
sent  to  us  the  quotas  for  each  of  the  counties. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  anything  else  ? 

^Ir.  ^looRE.  Yes:  the  list,  as  I  have  it,  gives  no  quota  for  Xew 
Mexico.  This  claim  from  the  State  chairman  there  is  that  Ralph 
Twitchell  of  Santa  Fe  has  been  appointed  by  the  Republican  na- 
tional committee  as  finance  representative  for  Xew  Mexico:  that 
the  quota  is  $10,000.  and  that  he  has  been  appointed  to  collect  it. 
That  may  or  may  not  be  true. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  will  you  furnish  us  with  a  copy  of  that 
telegram  ? 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Whose  jurisdiction  is  that  under? 

Mr.  Moore.  That  is  under  Mr.  Lee.  He  perhaps  can  tell  us  about 
that  when  he  comes  in. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  let  us  have  the  telegram  and  then  we  will 
ask  him  about  that  when  he  comes  on  the  stand. 


2266 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  I  asked  him  about  New  Mexico. 
The  Chairman.  These  telegrams  do  not  go  into  the  record. 
Senator  Pomerene.  No;  he  has  not  got  charge  of  New  Mexico. 
Mr.  Moore.  Who— Ralph  Twitchell? 
Senator  Pomerene.  No  ;  Mr.  Lee. 
Mr.  Moore.  No  ;  he  has  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  haven't  got  any  memorandum  of  him. 

Mr.  Moore.  Here  is  a  news  item — telegraphic  communication, 
appearing  in  the  Manchester  Union — with  which  I  guess .  you  are 
familiar,  giving  the  name  of  the  representative  who  charged  that 
the  amount  was  $75,000  in  New  Hampshire  in  place  of  $5,000,  as  it 
was  in  the  list. 

Senator  Spencer.  Sent  as  a  newspaper  clipping? 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes;  giving  the  agent  of  the  Republican  Party — and 
it  is  a  Republican  newspaper — and  it  gives  the  report  of  the  Repub- 
lican convention,  in  which  the  agent  stated  it  was  $75,000. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  putting  this  into  the  record  as  a  state- 
ment of  fact,  doing  something  that  we  said  

Mr.  MooRE.  I  am  just  calling  attention  to  the  article,  and  I  am 
giving  the  authority  for  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  should  hand  it  to  us.  It  ought  not  to  go  into 
the  record  until  we  decide  what  to  do  with  it. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Is  Kansas  under  Mr.  Lee's  jurisdiction? 

Senator  Spencer.  No. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  you  waiting  for  ? 

Mr.  Moore.  I  am  comparing  what  Mr.  Lee  has  testified  to.  Has 
he  returned  ?  If  I  am  not  mistaken,  Mr.  Lee  testified  that  Memphis 
was  $10,000,  Nashville  $10;000,  and  Knoxville,  Tenn.,  was  $15,000. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  was  out  then. 

Senator  Spencer.  I  didn't  take  the  amounts,  but  Tennessee  was 
in  his  district. 

Mr.  Moore.  Yes ;  Tennessee.  I  think  he  testified  to  that.  That  is 
all,  save  one  circular  letter  that  I  am  looking  for,  before  Mr.  Lee 
returns.  Might  I  ask  your  stenographers  to  copy  these  telegrams 
and  then  have  them  returned  to  me  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  but  they  are  not  to  go  into  the  record. 

Mr.  MooRE.  I  would  be  very  glad  to  have  them  go  in  the  record, 
but  that  would  be  violating  the  rules. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Moore,  Mr.  Lee  is  here  now.  We  will  have 
him  take  the  stand.   Mr.  Lee. 

Mr.  MooRE.  Yes.  I  have  a  letter,  a  circular  letter,  that  I  want  to 
submit  to  you  later. 

(Witness  excused.)  ; 

FURTHEE  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  C.  W.  LEE. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  find  the  letter  I  asked  you  to  get?  ^ 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Will  you  let  me  see  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir.  This  is  all  the  correspondence  of  H.  G.  McPike  | 
in  our  files. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  produced  here  the  copy  of  a  letter  of 
August  25,  which  you  wrote  to  Mr.  H.  G.  McPike? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2267 


Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  desire  to  read  it  in  evidence  [reading]  : 

August  23,  1920. 

Mr.  H.  G.  McPiKE, 

1521  Wehster  Street,  Oakland,  Calif. 

Xo^Y,  I  will  stop  long  enough  to  ask  you  who  Mr.  McPike  was, 
Mr!  Lee? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  McPike  was  one  of  the  field  directors  connected  with 
the  southern  California  division,  and  he  was  practically  only  in  our 
employ  about  three  weeks,  and  part  of  that  time,  was  assigned  to  San 
Diego  County,  with  San  Diego  as  the  headquarters. 

Senator  Reed.  He  Avas  in  your  employ  on  August  23,  when  you 
wrote  him  this  letter? 

Mr.  Lee.  That  was  his  home,  in  Oakland,  Calif.,  and  he  had  re- 
turned from — he  had  been  ordered  from  the  field,  and  closed  his  • 
work  in  San  Diego,  and  had  gone  home. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  continue  reading  the  letter : 

My  Dear  Mr.  McPike  :  I  want  to  acknowledge  receipt  of  your  faYOr  of  August 
17,  coYering  memorandunis  of  your  expense  account  and  inclosing  stenographic 
fees  for  $9  under  date  of  August  16.  I  am  checking  up  the  balance  of  the  ex- 
pense account  and  will  send  it  through  to  the  accounting  department  for  payment. 

You  nnist  realize  that  in  the  conduct  of  a  l)ig  national  campaign,  congressional 
Investigation  is  made,  one  phase  of  which  is  already  under  \\ay,  and  it  is  essen- 
tial to  haA'e  Youchei's  properly  executed  for  all  expenditures.  A  small  memo- 
i-andum  from  field  directors  is  not  sufiicient.  However,  I  think  I  have  straight- 
ened your  account  out  all  right  and  passed  it  on  with  my  O.  K. 

I  note  the  statement  that  San  Diego  is  sendnig  $7,000  in  tY'o  or  three  install- 
ments, which  is  approximately  50  per  cent  of  the  quota  levied  against  the 
county,  and  that  no  part  of  this  is  to  be  returned  to  the  county.  A  memorandum 
has  been  sent  througli  to  the  auditor  general  covering  this  matter,  although  at 
this  time  we  haA  e  not  received  any  remittance  from  th.at  county. 

Wf'  hiive  all  hoped  that  the  poi)uhir  campaign  would  be  continued  during  Sep- 
tember and  October,  but  certain  matters  came  up  in  the  national  committee  where- 
by all  our  plans  along  popular  lines  have  been  thrown  in  the  discard.  This  has 
meant  a  quick  retrenchment  of  our  field  personnel  for  which  all  of  us  regret, 
but  drastic  measures  had  to  be  taken  at  this  time. 

I  want  to  take  this  opportunity  of  thanking  you  for  the  work  you  have  done 
for  the  treasurer's  office,  and  hope  all  your  undertakings  in  the  future  will  be 
successful. 

With  best  v/ishes  for  your  continued  success,  I  am, 
Yours,  very  truly, 

 ,  Divisional  Director. 

P.  S. — We  will  keep  in  touch  with  G.  A.  Davidson,  president  Southern  Trust 
&  Commerce  Bank.  I  know  Mr.  Davidson  personally,  and  if  he  does  not  come 
through  quickly,  will  send  him  a  wire. 

C.  W.  Lee. 

Now,  there  are  two  matters  referred  to  in  this  letter  about  which 
I  want  to  ask  a  question  or  two.  I  am  quoting :  "  We  have  all 
hoped  that  the  popular  campaign  would  be  continued  during  Sep- 
tember and  October."   What  was  that  popular  campaign? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  Blair  referred  to  it  yesterday,  and  you  wdll  find  it 
in  his  testimony. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  who? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  Blair.  It  is  in  his  testimony,  if  you  will  remember, 
on  carrying  out  the  popular  idea  of  working,  of  organizing  clear 
down  to  the  precinct,  which  was  thrown  into  the  discard. 

Senator  Reed.  And  that  was  to  be  intensified — according  to  this 
circular  that  was  to  be  gotten  into  full  force  along  early  in  Sep- 
tember ? 


2268 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Lee.  It  would  be.  That  is,  in  the  organization  plans  of  it; 
yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  And  when  was  it  you  were  notified  that  that 
l^lan  w^as  thrown  in  the  discard?  How  long  before  you  wrote  this 
letter  of  August  23  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  I  should  imagine,  possibly,  between  the  10th  and 
15th  of  August. 

Senator  Keed.  Could  you  fix  that  a  little  more  accurately? 

Mr.  Lee.  No;  I  don't  think  so,  Senator,  because  it  was — a  series 
of  conferences  was  held  over  a  period  of  time  on  that,  in  which  the 
organization  plan  developed,  and  which-  was  presented  to  the  na- 
tional committee  in  New  York  later  on. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  present  at  these  conferences;  this  series 
of  conferences? 

Mr.  Lee.  Why,  our  headquarters  staff. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  who  constitutes  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  Mr.  Blair,  probably,  part  of  the  time;  Mr.  Owen; 
Mr.  Thomson;  Mr.  McKeand,  who  has  been  referred  to  here;  Mr. 
Quarles. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  were  the  meetings  held? 

Mr.  Lee.  At  headquarters  here. 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  the  first  one  held? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  couldn't  tell  you  that.  Some  time  the  latter  part  of 
July  or  early  in  August. 

Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  finally  determine  that  the  plan 
would  be  abandoned?  ^ 

Mr.  Lee.  That  was  the  determination  reached  by  the  national  com- 
mittee in  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  When? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  had  two  meetings ;  I  think  one  in  New  York  and  one 
at  Chicago. 

Senator  Reed.  When  w^as  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  Some  time,  I  think,  between  August  10  and  15 ;  some 
time  or  other. 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  the  conclusion  finally  announced,  so 
that  you  got  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  imagine.  Senator,  about  the  15th  of  August.  It  may 
have  been  a  little  bit  later  than  that,  because — it  must  have  been  a 
little  later  than  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  any  way  that  you  can  fix  that  definitely  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  can  by  reference  to  our  files,  or,  probably,  if  I  can  ask 
one  or  two  of  my  associates  in  a  general  way.  My  correspondence 
would  not  carrj^  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Now^  what  was  the  thing — what  were  the  certain 
matters  which  came  up  in  the  national  committee  whereby  "  all  our 
plans  along  popular  lines  had  been  thrown  into  the  discard."  What 
w^ere  those  matters? 

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  Blair,  who  is  closer  in  touch  with  that  than  I  am, 
could  possibly  tell  you.  I  am  not  in  touch  with  the  committee  as 
such,  yoii  see. 

Senator  Reed.  Blair  would  carry  that? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  spoke  of  that  and  gave  you  the  outline  of  it  in  his 
testimony. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSED. 


2269 


Senator  Reed.  Well,  Mr.  Blair  did  not  tell  us  the  plan  was 
abandoned. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir.    Yes ;  he  was  very,  very  definite  in  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  Well,  at  least  I  am  very  sure  he  did  not  tell  us  why 
it  had  been  abandoned. 

Mr.  Lej.  Well,  he  told  you  about  certain  reasons.  He  told  of  the 
matter^  t\iat  '>Secause  he  could  not  have  the  release  upon  the  seven 
Eastern  States. 

Senator  Reed.  Because  he  couldn't  have  the  release  

Mr.  Lee.  The  release  of  the  seven  Eastern  States,  because  Col. 
Thompson  would  not  release  seven  Eastern  States  the  popular  plan 
idea  was  abandoned  from  those  headquarters. 

Senator  Reed.  I  remember  he  did  make  such  a  statement  as  that. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  But  I  can  not  understand  from  that  statement  why 
the  plan  should  not  have  been  carried  on  in  the  other  States. 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  you  interrogated  him  on  that  very  point,  several 
times,  why  it  could  not  be  done  in  the  several  States,  or  the  25 
States. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you,  in  your  capacity  here  as  one  of  the 
workers,  did  not  see  any  reason  why  you  could  not  go  on  in  your  ter- 
ritory ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes;  a  very  definite  reason,  because  from  a  campaign 
standpoint  it  would  be  perfect  folly  to  do  it  without  making  it  a 
nation-wide  movement  in  these  Southern  States. 

Senator  Reed.  Why  would  it  be  impossible  to  carry  it  on  in  the 
State  of  California,  although  there  might  be  a  different  plan  in  New 
York  and  Delaware? 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  the  State  of  California  has  been  set  up  in  a  semi- 
intensive  way,  clear  down  to  the  townships,  and  they  have  been  work- 
ing there ;  they  have  had  paper  committees  since  the  1st  of  January. 

Senator  Reed.  Why  wouldn't  it  be  possible  to  carry  it  on  in  any 
one  of  the  Western  States,  or  Central  States,  although  they  might 
have  a  different  plan  in  New  York  and  Delaware  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Because  this  was  not  along  the  line  of  a  budget-pro- 
ducing campaign.  That  was  along  the  line  of  a  propaganda  cam- 
paign, with  sufficient  funds  that  would  carry  through  to  prac- 
tically pay  for  the  expenses  of  the  campaign ;  in  other  words,  if  you 
would  think  of  it  in  terms  of  the  dollar  basis. 

Senator  Reed.  Weren't  you  going  to  raise  money  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes;  raise  money. 

Senator  Reed.  All  these  circulars  

Mr.  Lee.  The  raising  of  money  was  an  incident,  a  tying  in  with 
what  might  be  termed  the  publicity  or  propaganda  plan. 

Senator  Reed.  All  these  circulars,  all  this  literature,  every  refer- 
ence we  have  to  it,  is  a  reference  to  it  as  a  money-raising  device,  and 
it  was  put  in  the  money-raising  department,  not  in  the  propaganda 
department.  Now,  isn't  it  a  fact  that  you  pulled  in  your  horns  and 
abandoned  this  intense  campaign  that  you  had  planned,  just  about 
the  time  you  learned  that  the  investigation  was  going  on,  and  there 
began  to  be  criticism  of  the  vast  fund  that  was  to  be  collected? 

Mr.  Lee.  Nothing  whatever  to  do  with  it. 

Senator  Reed,  Didn't  it  happen  just  about  the  same  time? 

182774— 20— PT  15  12 


2270 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Lee.  Well,  I  don't  remember  the  date  of  your  investigation, 
but  that  never  entered  our  minds;  in  fact  I  never  thought  of  it,  I 
never  heard  it  discussed. 

Senator  Reed.  Isn't  this  the  excuse,  that  you  couldn't  conduct  a 
campaign  in  California  because  you  were  not  permitted  to  conduct 
one  in  Delaware,  a  mere  fiction  

Mr.  Lee.  No. 

Senator  Reed  (continuing).  That  was  set  up  by  somebody,  not  by 
you,  of  course,  as  the  reason? 
Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Anyway,  the  action  was  not  taken  until  after  the 
Cox  charges  had  been  made,  was  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  When  were  the  Cox  charges  made?  I  don't  remember 
the  date. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  the  author  of  this  letter,  aren't  you,  which  I 
hand  you  [handing  Mr.  Lee  a  carbon  copy  of  letter  of  July  23,  1920, 
to  Mr.  F.  A.  Garrison]  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  was  written  to  Garrison,  who  was  your  agent 
in  Tennessee  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir;  Memphis,  at  that  time. 
Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  read  that  into  the  record : 

Republican  National  Committee, 
Teeasukee's  Office,  111  West  Washington  Steeet — 

And  it  has  the  names  also  of  Mr.  Hays,  Mr.  Miller,  Mr.  TJpham, 
Mr.  Schley,  and  Harry  M.  Blair,  assistant  to  the  treasurer — 

Chicago,  July  23,  1920. 

Mr,  F.  A.  Gareison, 

Hotel  Chisca,  Memphis,  Tenn. 
My  Deae  Me.  Gaerison — 

You  may  want  to  listen  to  this  letter.  Senator  [addressing  the 
chairman] — 

As  I  wired  you  in  answer  to  yonr  recent  letters,  I  have  tried  to  follow  out 
your  suggestions  regarding  the  division  of  the  State.  No  word  as  yet  has  been 
received  from  Taylor  in  reference  to  the  situation  in  eastern  Tennessee,  but  I 
am  looking  for  a  wire  later  on  in  the  day. 

I  have  been  wondering  if  you  will  get  any  reaction  from  the  paragraph  in 
Senator  Harding's  speech  of  acceptance,  which  covers  the  enfranchisement  of 
the  Negro.  We,  of  course,  do  not  want  to  discuss  this  phase  of  the  situation, 
but  I  would  like  to  be  advised  if  this  stirs  up  any  antagonistic  sentiments  in 
the  Southern  States.  This  is  a  paragraph  intended  as  a  sop  to  the  voters  of  the 
central  western  industrial  States.  I  think  you  will  be  able  to  clean  up  Memphis 
and  Madison  County  in  a  very  few  days.  Our  response  to  the  present  type 
of  campaign  all  over  the  country  is  splendid  and  an  organization  is  being 
effected  that  shows  that  the  States  and  cities  are  cooperating  in  good  shape. 

Keep  an  eye  on  Birmingham,  because  there  is  where  the  real  money  lies, 
and  we  do  not  want  to  lose  sight  of  the  fact  that  if  we  are  going  to  secure  this 
money,  we  must  establish  a  small  organization  there  very  soon. 

Did  you  ever  get  a  report  about  the  reaction? 
Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  that  fell  very  dead,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  authorized  to  speak  for  Senator  Hard- 
ing? 

Mr.  Lee.  Not  in  the  least.  That  was  simply  a  personal  paragraph 
to  a  field  man  in  a  personal  letter. 

Senator  Reed.  What  you  were  interested  in  was  getting  the  money, 
and  you  were  a  little  fearful  that  this  speech  of  Senator  Harding's 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2271 


about  the  Negro  might  alienate  the  affection  of  some  southern  pros- 
pects, weren't  you,  and  therefore  you  

Mr.  Lee.  Mr.  McCkire  had  told  you  the  story  on  the  Georgia  situa- 
tion here  the  other  day. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  reason  I  am  introducing  it,  because  I 
assumed  that  you  thought  it  might  injure  your  money-getting  chances. 
Now,  did  it  injure  them,  or  did  you  get  the  money? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  the  Georgia  situation — we  didn't  get  the  money ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  getting  it,  though,  aren't  you  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir;  v>e  have  stopped  our  work  in  Birmingham. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  when  did  you  stop  in  Birmingham  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  stopped  two  weeks  ago. 

Senator  Reed.  Why  did  you  stop  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Simply  because  it  w^as  not  producing,  and  we  pull  men 
right  quickly  out  of  a  field,  especially  a  southern  field,  if  it  is  not 
producing. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  the  Negro  question  

Mr.  Lee.  Not  in  the  least. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  the  Negro  cause  cut  any  figure? 
Mr.  Lee.  Not  in  the  least. 
I    Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 

i  Senator  Spencer.  A¥hat  is  the  date  of  your  letter  to  McPike;  do 
you  remember? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  don't  remember  the  date  of  it. 
I    Senator  Spencer.  Just  look  at  the  letter.    Senator  Reed  has  it. 
I    Mr.  Lee.  August  23. 

P  Senator  Spencer.  Do  you  remember  how  long  before  the  date  of 
that  letter  the  plan  had  been  abandoned? 

Mr.  Lee.  Why,  I  should  say  10  days  or  so.  You  see,  McPike  was 
a  field  man,  and  I  was  familiar  with  San  Diego,  and  in  one  or  two 
instances  because  of  that  I  took  it  up  with  him  by  wire,  and  this  is 
closing  his  account. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is,  then,  the  plan  had  been  abandoned  at 
least  10  days  before  that  letter? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Spencer.  Perhaps  longer? 
Mr.  Lee.  Perhaps  longer. 

Senator  Spencer.  And  then  it  even  did  antedate  the  time  of  Gov. 
Cox's  so-called  charges,  didn't  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  they  had  nothing  whatever  to  do  with  that. 

Senator  Spencer.  They  w^ere  made,  I  think,  first  on  August  17; 
I  think  about  that  some  time. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Spencer.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  There  are  two  telegrams  here  that  I  want  to  read  in 
evidence ;  they  Avere  introduced  by  Mr.  Lee.  This  one  is  a  copy  of  a 
telegram.   It  is  dated  Chicago,  111.,  August  6,  1920. 

H.  G.  McPike, 

Hotel  St.  Ja?nes,  San  Diego,  Calif.: 
Am  now  coverin.e:  Pacilic  States  from  my  desk.    PersoDally  interviewed  .John 
D.  Spreckles  and  group  of  San  Diego  business  men  in  May,  so  understand 
'   conditions  there.   Have  you  set  up  your  committee  and  are  they  working?  That 
money  should  come  through  quickly.    Advise  by  wire  progress  and  exact  con- 
ditions. 

C.  W.  Lee,  Divisional  Director. 


2272 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


You  had  seen  Mr.  John  D.  Spreckles,  as  this  telegram  states? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  About  money? 

Mr.  Lee.  About  raising  San  Diego's  quota ;  yes  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  undertake  the  work  ?   Interest  himself  in  it  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Why,  just  in  a  nominal  way;  he  turned  it  over  to  Mr. 
G.  A.  Davidson ;  you  read  his  name,  G.  A.  Davidson, 

Senator  Reed.  Did  the  money  come  through  quickly? 

Mr.  Lee.  Why,  we  have  had  about  $5,000  from  there;  $5,300; 
something  like  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Lee.  Their  whole  total  was  $7,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Now  to  that  you  got  this  answer  from  McPike, 
did  you  not— or  else  your  telegram  was  in  answer  to  this — I  don't 
know  which: 

San  Diego,  Calif.,  August  6,  1920. 

C.  W.  Lee, 

111  West  Washington  Street,  Chicago,  III: 
Delay  here  caused  by  Spreckles  absence  first  two  weeks.  Conmiittee  of  14 
now  formed  and  all  working-.  Spreckles  again  out  of  town  for  week.  Luncheon 
of  100  Monday.  Hope  to  finish  then.  Five  thousand  reported  so  far.  Most 
people  here  not  willing  support  national  committee.  Will  secure  full  quota,  but 
will  take  a  little  longer. 

H.  G.  McPiKE, 
Special  Representative. 

That  is  the  telegram  that  you  answered? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  answer  is  on  top;  you  read  the  answer  first,  that  is 
all. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  I  read  the  answer  first.    Then  there  is  an- 
other telegram  of  August  7  addressed  to  you : 

Spreckles  would  not  make  donation  until  after  he  returns  from  San  Francisco 
next  week.  Can  not  start  money,  as  he  has  same  locked  up  until  return.  Will 
furnish  next  week,  but  not  until  latter  part. 

1  guess  that  is  "  finish  next  week."  a 
Mr.  Lee.  Probably.  ^ 
Senator  Reed.  Now,  that  was  dated  the  7th  of  August.   Of  course 
that  week  is  passed.   Have  they  finished  up  the  quota  for  that  town? 
Mr.  Lee.  Oh,  yes;  that  has  been  finished. 
Senator  Reed.  You  have  got  the  full  quota? 

Mr.  Lee.  We  haven't  had  the  full  quota,  but  they  have  practicalb 
completed  it;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  They  have? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Spreckles  came  back  and  came  across,  and  thai 
finished  it  up? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  imagine  he  gave  a  subscription  for  a  thousand  dollars^ 
but  I  have  not  seen  it.   If  he  did  it  it  is  in  the  record. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  Mr.  Lee,  have  you  had  anything  to  do  in  an^ 
way  with  collections  in  Honolulu,  the  getting  of  money  from  Honon 
lulu? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  has  had  charge  of  that?    The  Hawaiiai 
Islands  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  don't  know.    The  Hawaiian  Islands  are  on  our  list^ 
but  I  don't  know.   They  never  came  up. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2273 


Senator  Keed.  You  know  there  are  a  large  number  of  subscrip- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  noticed  on  our  financial  sheets  that  we  have  had  some 
returns  from  there. 

Senator  Eeed.  Did  you  have  in  your  quota  sheet  the  Hawaiian 
Islands  indicated? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  don't  remember  whether  they  are  indicated  or  not. 
They  are  not  on  this  quota  sheet ;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  quota  sheet  there? 

Mr.  Lee.  This  is  a  copy  of  Mr.  Upham's  quota  sheet,  the  same 
as  you  have. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  that  he  just  gave  us? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  The  Hawaiian  Islands  are  not  on  there? 
Mr.  Lee.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  So  whatever  you  got  from  the  Hawaiian  Islands 
would  have  to  be  added  to  that,  wouldn't  it  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  it  would. 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  would  be  getting  a  pretty  large  number 
of  thousand  dollar  subscriptions  there? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  record  shows  there.  My  impression  is  that  there 
are  fifteen  or  twenty  thousand  dollars  there. 

Senator  Reed.  Most  of  the  large  sugar  men  out  there  contributed  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  haven't  the  least  idea.    I  haven't  seen  that  list. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  a  quota  sheet  handed  to  you  from 
these  Western  States? 

Mr.  Lee.  Those  quotas  have  all  been  established  before  I  took 
charge  of  the  Western  States. 

Senator  Reed.  And  therefore  you  were  given  a  sheet,  Averen't  you  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Xo  ;  I  was  not  given  a  sheet  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  weren't  you  given  a  list,  a  statement  of  what 
the  quota  was  from  each  State? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  from  our  records,  but  there  is  no  question  of  the 
sheet ;  in  fact,  I  haven't  seen  the  quota  sheet. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  in  what  form  was  it  then  in  the  record?  Was 
it  in  a  book? 

Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  we  have — our  files  show  the  quotas  of  each  State  in 
the  State  file,  with  certain  memorandums  there  that  carry  out  the 
history  of  the  j)rogress  of  the  campaign,  and  my  first  information  for 
the  other  States,  with  the  exception  of  California,  with  which  I  w^as 
fairly  familiar,  with  southern  California,  that  I  had  in  my  head, 
was  from  those  records,  they  were  on  those  records  there.  /: 

Senator  Reed.  Very  Well.  Now,  what  was  the  quota  of  Cali- 
fornia ?  /? 

Mr.  Lee.  $200,000.  f 

Senator  Reed.  $200,000.    What  was  the  quota  for  SanTrancisco  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  San  Francisco  as  such  had  no  special  quota,  as  near  as  I 
can  remember.  I  was  not  familiar  with  the  division  of  counties  of 
northern  California.    I  Avas  in  southern  California  for  a  short  time. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  the  whole  State  was  $200,000,? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  whole  State  was  $200,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  raised  afterwards? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  has  not  been  raised. 


2274 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Eeed.  Was  it  to  be  raised  by  the  local  men  up  there  like 
the  other  quotas  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  but  it  has  not  been  raised  yet. 

Senator  Eeed.  But  I  mean  was  the  amount  raised,  was  it  boosted  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes;  they  took  their  State  quotas  just  the  same  as  you 
have  heard  here,  on  down  the  line. 

Senator  Keed.  They  took  their  State  quotas  and  boosted  them? 
Mr.  Lee.  They  took  their  State  quotas  and  boosted  them ;  yes. 
Senator  Reed.  Now,  what  did  they  finally  boost  them  to  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  I  think  about  double. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  among  other  places  where  you  have  some  one 
specially  assigned,  is  in  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  he  is  closing  up  his  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  quota  he  has  fixed  for  San  Fran- 
cisco ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No.    I  think  he  has  spotted  it  at  $100,000. 
Senator  Reed.  San  Francisco  and  Oakland  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  San  Francisco  and  Oakland;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  another  man  down  in  Los  Angeles? 
Mr.  Lee.  We  have  another  man  down  in  Los  Angeles. 
Senator  Reed.  In  Los  Angeles  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  He  is  director  for  southern  California,  handling  the 
whole  

Senator  Reed.  Noav,  I  will  use  you  term  "  spotted."  He  has 
spotted  your  quota  for  Los  Angeles  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Los  Angeles  County  was  spotted  at  $75,000;  the  whole  of 
soutliern  California  at  $115,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  Los  Angeles  at  $75,000  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  And  the  balance  for  southern  California. 

Senator  Reed.  And  San  Francisco  at  $100,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Which  is  within  $25,000  of  the  total  amount  fixed 
for  the  whole  State  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Now  southern  California,  outside  of  Los  Angeles, 
is  on  the  boosted  quota  fixed  at  $115,000? 

Mr.  Lee.  No;  that  is  all  of  southern  California,  outside  of  Los 
Angeles,  is  $115,000  to  $120,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Haven't  they  been  boosting  it  down  there,  the  local 
men? 

Mr.  Lee.  They  have  not  been  boosting,  because  it  has  been  a  good, 
stiff,  hard  campaigning  job,  and  they  have  been  at  it  since  January. 

Senator  Reed.  They  "  raised  "  their  quotas,  just  like  they  did  in  the 
cities,  didn't  they  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  A  few  of  the  counties  have  cleaned  up  very  nicely. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  using  the  term  in  the  sense  of  "boosting." 
When  I  say  "  raised  "  their  quota,  I  don't  mean  collected  the  money,  I 
mean  raised  the  size  of  the  quota. 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes ;  the  Republican  central  committee  for  southern  Cali- 
fornia made  its  own  estimates  on  the  counties,  and  carried  them  right 
through  down  the  line,  the  same  process  that  has  been  explained  here 
a  dozen  times. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  they  follow  this  process  of  boosting  the 
estimate  ? 


PKESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2275 


Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  sir,  for  what  they  expected  to  get. 
Senator  Reed.  And  trying  to  raise  the  full  quota  that  you  all  had 
assigned  to  California  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  And  as  much  more  as  they  could  get  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think,  Senator,  it  is  a  question  of  the  law  of  averages. 
It  has  not  been  brought  out  here  quite  fully  enough,  that  there  are 
a  number  of  States  where  the  campaigns  for  funds  have  been  closed, 
where  they  have  fallen  short  of  their  quotas  that  have  been  assigned 
to  them  by  Mr.  Upham,  and  that  in  other  States  where  they  would 
go  over  their  quotas  that  would  help  make  up,  under  the  law  of  aver- 
ages, the  whole  balance  of  what  we  are  trying  to  get. 

Senator  Reed.  But  there  is  not  a  single  State  where  they  are  not 
still  trying  to  raise  money  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  There  are  some? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes,  quite  a  number  of  them.  Washington  has  stopped. 
Oregon  has  stopped.  Utah  has  stopped.  Idaho  has  stopped. 
Wyoming  has  stopped.  The  only  Western  States  that  are  running 
now  are  Arizona  and  California. 

Senator  Reed.  Now  the  Western  States  that  stopped,  how  near  did 
they  come  to  their  quotas  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Oregon's  quota  was  $25,000 ;  they  raised  $21,000.  Wash- 
ington's quota  was  $60,000;  they  have  raised  $30,000.  We  hope  to 
get  the  full  quota  for  Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly. 

Mr.  Lee.  All  right.  Idaho's  quota  was  $15,000;  they  have  raised 
less  than  $5,000,  and  they  have  stopped. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  hope  to  get  the  balance  of  it  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  No  ;  we  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Isn't  there  a  committee  now  in  existence  in  that 
State  still  trying  to  get  money  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  sir;  they  have  not  been  trying  to  get  money. 

Senator  Reed.  Whether  it  is  from  your  organization  or  the  State 
organization  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  The  State  organization  may  be  trying  to  get  money  for 
their  own  State  campaign,  over  which  we  have  no  control. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.   There  is  $10,000  lost. 

Mr.  Lee.  Utah  has  stopped. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  did  you  raise  there? 

Mr.  Lee.  Something  like  $11,000. 

Senator  Reed.  And  how  much  was  their  quota? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  it  was  twenty-one  or  twenty-five  thousand  dol- 
lars. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right. 

Mr.  Lee.  Arizona  is  the  only  State  that  is  operating  now,  and 

they  did  not  start  until  

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  assess  them  very  much? 
Mr.  Lee.  No;  $15,000,  I  think. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  this  law  of  averages  when  you  apply  it  to 
these  small  States,  does  not  cut  much  figure,  does  it  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  No.  But  there  are  some  of  the  larger  States  that  are 
not  operating,  too. 


2276 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Well,  have  you  withdrawn  from  any  one  of  the 
large  States? 

Mr.  Lee.  There  is  no  work  in  Minnesota. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  matter  with  Minnesota? 

Mr,  Lee.  Mr.  Blair  told  you  and  Mr.  Upham  told  you  that  there 
are  some  internal  matters  that  are  going  to  make  it  not  possible  to 
go  into  the  State ;  that  is  all.  You  see,  we  can  not  go  and  force  our- 
selves upon  them.  We  can  not  do  that.  And  we  have  not  been 
able  to  force  ourselves  on  the  States. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  the  quota  assigned  to  Minnesota  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  $50,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  get  anything  at  all  from  Minnesota? 

Mr.  Lee.  No,  I  don't  think — nominally  nothing.  Maybe  a  few 
hundred  dollars,  or  something  like  that. 

Senator  Reed.  I  wish  you  would  tell  me  what  the  trouble  is  up 
there,  and  what  kept  you  out  of  the  whole  State  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  don't  think  I  could  go  into  the  history  of  it  very  well, 
only  I  know  we  have  not  been  able  to  operate  in  Minnesota. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  what  other  large  State? 

Mr.  Lee.  Of  course  the  Southern  States  are  only  in  a  nominal  way, 
but  they  have  all  been  cut  down.  For  instance,  on  this  quota  sheet 
there  will  be  twenty  to  twenty-two  thousand  dollars  shy  in  Alabama. 

Senator  Spencer.  Did  you  stop  work  in  Alabama  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes.  And  in  Georgia  we  had  practically  $6,000.  We 
won't  get  any  more  out  of  it.   That  makes  another  $20,000. 

Senator  Reed.  The  statement  says  that  there  is  $11,000  down  there 
of  good  money. 

Mr.  Lee.  Where  is  it  ?  Your  statement  shows  there  is  only  $6,000 
that  has  come  in ;  there  is  ten  or  eleven  thousand  dollars  in  pledges 
there  which  can  not  be  collected. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  stopped  working  in  Georgia  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  The  statement  was  made  that  they  were  good,  up- 
right men  that  you  selected  down  there  to  get  the  money. 
Mr.  Lee.  McClure  

Senator  Reed.  That  they  are  nearly  all  good. 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  I  hope  so.  Very  well,  I  hope  they  are. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  are  extending  then,  on  the  other  hand,  into 
other  States  that  you  did  not  have  quotas  for,  and  you  are  getting 
money  from  them  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  Where? 

Senator  Reed.  New  Mexico. 

Mr.  Lee.  New  Mexico  had  a  quota. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  it? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  so.  "  To  the  State,  $10,000  " ;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  Was  it  quotaed  at  $10,000  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  was  not  quotaed  in  this  line,  no,  but  over  there  it  was. 
Senator  Reed.  But  you  didn't  get  any  money  from  them  ? 
Mr.  Lee.  Very  little. 

Senator  Reed.  We  won't  go  into  an  argument  on  that. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  is  it  in  the  quota  ? 

Mr.  Lee.  It  is  on  this  side,  the  $10,000  to  the  State,  but  it  was  not 
considered  as  a  quota.  d 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2277 


Senator  Reed.  They  were  going  to  send  money  to  the  State,  and  they 
have  been  getting  money  from  the  State ;  that  is  the  difference. 

Senator  Spencek.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  was  there  any  money  gotten 
from  Hawaii,  from  Honolulu? 

Mr.  Lee.  I  think  there  are  some  few  thousand  dollars. 

Senator  Spencer.  Now,  I  notice  these  two  books  which  appear  to  be 
the  collections  up  to  a  few  days  ago.  I  see  nothing  from  Honolulu 
or  Hawaii. 

Senator  Reed.  Now  you  are  mistaken.  Senator.  I  have  found  item 
after  item. 

Senator  Spencer.  Well,  let  us  find  them. 
Mr.  Lee.  Well,  it  is  on  your  record. 

Senator  Spencer.  If  you  have  got  them  they  are  there ;  they  are  on 
these  two  books. 

Mr.  Lee.  Well,  I  am  not  familiar. 

Senator  Spencer.  Senator,  did  you  find  it  in  any  one  of  those  two 
books  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  have  seen  it ;  I  don't  know  how  long  it  will 
take  me  to  find  it. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  let  us  get  through  with  this  witness.  Are 
you  through  with  him.  Senator  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  We  will  adjourn  until  9.30  to-morrow  morning. 
(Thereupon,  at  6  p.  m.  Friday,  September  10,  1920,  an  adjourn- 
ment was  taken  until  9.30  a.  m.  Saturday,  September  11, 1920.) 


X 


1% 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PKIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGKESS 

SECOND  SESSION 
PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  16 


Printed  for  th  e  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 


THE  UBRAHY  OF  THE 
DEC  12  1331 
UNIVERSITY  OF  iLUNOi: 


182774 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


•  r 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  R-EED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb,  ClerJc. 


StTBCOMMITTEE  ON  S.  RES.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMBS  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


II 


CONTENTS. 


Page. 

Statement  of — 

Frederick  Courtenay  Barber   2270 

Caleb  Enix   2288 

Miss  Eunice  Coyne   2292 

Miss  Jessie  Barchard   2308 

Frederick  Courtenay  Barber  (resumed)   2310 


m 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


SATURDAY,  SEPTEMBER  11,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Chicago^  III. 

The  subcommittee  met,  pursuant  to  adjournment,  at  9.30  o'clock 
a.  m.,  in  room  603,  Federal  Building,  Senator  William  S.  Kenyon, 
presiding. 

Present:  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman),  Reed,  and  Pomerene. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  FREDERICK  COURTENAY  BARBER. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Give  your  full  name  to  the  reporter. 

Mr.  Barber.  Frederick  Courtenay  Barber. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  connected  with  the  Republican  organiza- 
tion in  some  way  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Director  of  the  Chicago  financial  campaign. 
The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  brought  here  for  this  particular  pur- 
pose ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  had  experience  in  these  campaign 
drives  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Over  60  campaigns. 
The  Chairman.  Of  what  kinds? 

Mr.  Barber.  Fund  raising,  some  for  philanthropic  purposes,  some 
for  civic  purposes,  some  for  commercial  purposes. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  just  what  has  been  your  work  here? 

Mr.  Barber.  First,  organizing  a  volunteer  corps  to  solicit  subscrip- 
tions in  Chicago  and  Cook  County.  Also  superintending  the  com- 
pilation and  revision  of  a  card  index  list  of  probable  contributors, 
making  suggestions  in  regard  to  every  detail  of  the  campaign  as  a 
whole.  There  is  a  great  mass  of  detail,  sir,  which  naturally  heads 
up  in  myself. 

The  Chairman.  Senator  Reed. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  names  have  you  on  this  card  index  list  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  My  best  estimate,  sir,  would  be  about  25,000.  That 
may  be  a  few  thousand  out  of  the  way. 

Senator  Reed.  When  you  got  up  this  card  index  list  did  you  mark 
on  the  amount  the  prospect  was  supposed  to  give? 

Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir;  as  a  director  of  financial  campaigns,  I  con- 
sider that  as  very  bad  psychology. 

2279 


2280 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPEXSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Bad  what? 

Mr.  Barber.  Bad  psychology  to  do  that,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  what  has  piitting  on  a  man's  card  the  amount 
you  think  he  will  give  got  to  do  with  psychology? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  sir,  it  savors  of  indicating  to  a  man  Avhat  he 
shall  give. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  you  mean  if  you  went  in  and  carried  it  in  to 
him,  gave  it  to  him. 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  he  often  sees  it,  Senator,  he  very  often  calls 
for  it,  and  if  he  does,  why  the  amount  would  be  shown  on  it  and  he 
would  see  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Now  tell  us  as  to  your  organization. 
Mr.  Barber.  As  to  its  make-up,  sir,  and  all  that  sort  of  thing? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes.    I  don't  mean  the  personal  plan  of  organiza- 
tion. 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  there  are  seven  divisions  of  volunteer  workers, 
five  of  what  I  call  the  front  line  divisions,  because  they  are  the  ones 
which  operate  more  strictly  in  accordance  with  the  card  index  list. 
There  are  others  

Senator  Reed.  What  do  the  other  two  do  that  are  not  in  the  front 
line? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  two  others  are  to  get  the  smaller  subscriptions, 
and  by  reason  of  the  fact  that  they  will  be  seeing  a  great  many 
people,  ranging  anywhere  from  $1  to  $10  as  prospects,  it  is  not  prac- 
ticable to  equip  them  with  prospect  cards.  It  would  run  into  hun- 
dreds of  thousands,  perhaps,  if  we  tried  to  do  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  got  seven  divisions? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  a  man  at  the  head  of  each  of  those.  Have 
you  divided  the  town  into  seven  divisions  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir;  I  did  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  divide  the  prospect  cards  among  these  seven 
divisions? 

Mr.  Barber.  My  method,  sir,  is  to  have  a  business  m.eeting  which' 
we  hold  on  Wednesday  night,  at  which  this  card  index  list  is  sub- 
mitted to  the  front  line  divisions,  and  each  volunteer  worker  chooses 
for  himself  the  names  of  the  prospects  whom  he  wishes  to  approach. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  But  I  want  to  get  at  what  you  mean  by 
seven  divisions? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.  The  division  in  our  campaign,  I  should  say 
that  the  seven  divisions  must  be  averaging  about  70  men  a  division. 
Some  of  them  run  as  high  as  120  men,  and  some  run  as  low  as  per- 
haps 30  men. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  you  have  approximately  500  men? 

Mr.  Barber.  We  have  approximately  500  men,  at  the  latest  report. 

Senator  Reed.  To  aid  you  in  the  campaign.  Now  each  of  these 
divisions  has  a  captain,  has  it? 

Mr.  Barber.  Each  division,  sir,  has  a  chairman,  a  division  chair- 
man. 

Senator  Reed.  Each  division  has  a  division  chairman.    And  then 

that  division  chairman  has  under  him  

Mr.  Barber.  Team  captains. 

Senator  Ref>d.  A  lot  of  teams,  with  team  captains? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2281 


Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  How  many  teams  now  will  you  have  out  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  think  there  are  about  45  or  50,  sir.  The  organiza- 
tion is  slightly  fluid,  and  changes  a  little  from  day  to  day.  But  i 
should  say  approximately^  45  to  50  teams. 

Senator  Reed.  Forty-five  to  50  teams  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  f^ot  of  those  names  on  cards  approxi- 
mately 30,000  did  you  say,  Mr.  Barber  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  think  25,000  would  be  a  nearer  estimate,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Twenty-five  thousand.  And  these  cards  are  sup- 
posed to  contain  the  names  of  these  contributors  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Of  persons  who,  in  my  opinion,  are  the  larger  pros- 
pects ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  do  you  think  they  would  average  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  sir,  to  attain  success,  the  average  at  the  end  of 
the  campaign  should  be  at  least  $50  per  man,  in  a  campaign  of  this 
size. 

Senator  Reed.  When  this  list  of  cards  is  arranged,  then  do  you 
have  it  passed  around,  and  do  the  team  captains  have  the  right  to 
make  selections  in  order,  alternating  with  each  other  in  some  way  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes.  not  only  the  team  captains,  but  also  the  members 
of  the  teams. 

Senator  Reed.  And  also  the  members  of  the  teams? 
Mr.  Barber.  Each  man  for  himself. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  in  that  way  3^ou  make  a  sort  of  an  equitable 
division  between  the  teams  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir,  as  closely  as  possible;  as  nearly  as  possible. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  before  you  do  that,  do  you  take  out  a  list  of 
every  large  or  promising  prospect  and  turn  that  over  to  some  other 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  If  this  were  a  campaign,  sir,  without  any  maximum 
limit  that  would  be  done,  for  the  purpose  of  getting  the  largest  con- 
tributions, but  in  this  campaign,  since  we  have  a  thousand-dollar 
maximum  limit,  the  preferred  list  has  been  compiled  simply  because 
it  consists  of  men  who  should  be  approached  by  some  older  man  than 
perhaps  the  average  age  of  the  team  workers. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  there  is  a  preferred  list,  then,  and  you  turn 
that  over  to  older  men,  although  there  is  a  limit? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  but  it  is  preferred  only  as  to  the  men  who  should 
approach  those  prospects. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  from  the  money  point  of  view,  as  it  would  be  in 
an  ordinary  campaign  which  had  no  limit. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  men  have  you  crot  on  your  preferred  list  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  My  best  estimate,  sir,  would  be  about  700  to  800. 

Senator  Reed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  doesn't  that  list  of  700  to  800 
embrace  principally  the  capitalists  of  Chicago,  who  are  Republicans? 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  as  capitalists,  but  as  business  men. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  understand,  not  as  capitalists ;  you  don't  go 
after  them  as  capitalists. 

Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Nor  as  Methodists  nor  as  Baptists;  but  you  go  to 
them  because  they  are  men  of  large  means  ? 


2282 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Barbek.  Because  they  are  men  who  could  make  a  thousand- 
dollar  contribution  reasonably. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  how  many  men  are  there  on  that  preferred 
list  who  could  make  a  $1,000  contribution  reasonably? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  there  are,  I  estimate,  from  TOO  to  800  names, 
and  I  hope  that  our  classification  has  been  sufficiently  accurate  that 
at  least  50  per  cent  of  those  names  would  be  correctly  estimated  as 
being  $1,000  possibilities.  Of  course  not  all  those  who  can  give  do 
give. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  make  an  estimate — is  there  any  kind 
of  a  paper  anywhere  with  the  sums  marked  on  it  that  you  think  you 
ought  to  get  from  various  men? 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  as  to  any  particular  man.  I  hope  that  the  men 
on  that  preferred  list  may  be  regarded  as  $1,000  prospects,  but  with 
that  exception,  sir,  there  is  no  assessment  or  estimate  of  amounts  to 
be  obtained  from  anybody.   They  are  just  in  a  general  class. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  not  classified  these  men  so  that  the  solici- 
tor who  goes  around  has  an  idea  given  to  him  of  about  how  much 
the  man  ought  to  give? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  always  tell  the  volunteer  workers.  Senator,  that 
they  will  get  better  results  if  they  consult  their  own  fellow  team 
members,  or  perhaps  go  a  little  higher  up  and  consult  the  division 
chairman  in  arriving  at  an  estimate  of  what  would  be  a  reasonable 
sum  to  expect  from  a  man. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  have  they  done  that  ^ 

Mr.  Barber.  I  hope  they  have,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  do  you  know  the  aggregate  of  the  amounts 
that  they  have  thus  arrived  at? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  of  course  they  have  all  been  instructed,  sir,  that 
$1,000  is  the  maximum. 

Senator  Reed.  No;  I  don't  mean  that.  Of  course  $1,000  is  the 
maximum,  but  A  B  is  a  man  engaged  in  a  certain  business,  and  is 
supposed  to  have  a  certain  standing  or  financial  ability,  and  these 
team  captains  consult  with  each  other  or  team  members,  and  in 
order  to  know  about  what  they  ought  to  try  and  get  from  him  they 
arrive  at  a  sum  in  their  own  minds. 

Mr.  Barber.  They  should  do  so  in  order  to  be  effect Ia'c  volunteer 
workers. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  the  aggregate  of  that  is  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir.   That  would  not  be  reported  to  me. 
Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  seven  divisions  and  50 — how  many 
teams  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  should  say,  sir,  about  45  to  50. 

Senator  Reed.  Forty-five  to  50  teams.  How  many  members  in  the 
team? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  teams  should  have,  unless  there  has  been  some 
falling  off  in  the  last  24  hours,  they  should  have  a  minimum  of  10 
members  each,  but  some  of  them  run  from  10  to  12  or  13  members, 
in  fact  1  is  14. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  list  of  your  team  captains? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  but  not  with  me.   It  is  in  my  office. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  are  at  the  head;  that  is,  you  are  the 
organizer  ? 


m  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2283 

"  Mr.  Barber.  Well,  the  executive  committee  chairman  is  the  titular 
■  liead ;  I  am  the  organizer. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  who  is  the  executive  committee  head? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  executive  committee  head  is  Mr.  Charles  Piez. 

Senator  Eeed.  Mr.  Charles  Piez  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  other  officers  are  there?  Plow  many  men  are 
there  of  the  executive  committee  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  My  last  count  showed  about  25.  I  think  a  few  have 
been  added  in  the  last  day  or  so,  sir.  Possibly  as  high  as  30  by  this 
time. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  list  of  those  men  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir;  but — well,  sir,  I  didn't  know  that  you  would 
want  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  haven't  got  it  with  you  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  under  this  committee,  then,  in  order  to  get 
the  organization  in  a  word,  there  are  approximately  50  teams  with 
their  captains,  50  teams  of  from  10  to  15  members  each? 

Mr.  Barber.  With  this  slight  correction,  sir,  that  the  executive 
committee  itself  ranks  as  one  of  those  seven  divisions,  and  is  not 
subdivided  into  teams. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  is  the  executive  committee  the  body  that 
takes  this  cream  list,  I  will  call  it,  this  list  of  men  that  you  want  to 
be  approached  by  older  men  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  It  goes  over  that  list,  sir.  and  the  names  of  prospects, 
prospects  who,  in  that  committee's  opinion,  should  be  approached  by 
older  men,  probably  will  be  approached  by  members  of  the  executive 
committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly. 

Mr.  Barber.  But  that  committee,  sir,  also  will  exercise  its  right  to 
let  some  of  those  names  go  to  the  team  captains  and  teams. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  But,  in  a  general  way,  the  plan  is  that 
the  executive  committee  itself  is  goinsf  to  approach  this  list  that  I 
will  call,  for  want  of  a  better  name,  "  Cream  list "? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  if  you  will  permit  me,  sir,  to  correct  that  and 
say  that  in  this  particular  campaign  it  is  stretching  it  a  little  to  call 
that  a  cream  list. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  is  a  list  of  men  that  you  said  every  one  of 
whom  were  able  to  give  $1,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  hope  they  are ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  So  it  would  be  a  pretty  good  sort  of  a  list ;  if  it  is 
not  cream,  it  is  at  least  half-and-half. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  I  should  say  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  the  executive  committee  consists  of  how  many 
men,  did  you  say — 25  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Twenty-five  to  thirty. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.    I  will  ask  you  to  bring  us  the  names  of  the 
executive  committee,  of  all  the  teams,  of  the  team  captains. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  file  it  here  before  the  day  is  over,  if  you 
please,  sir. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 


2284 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  You  will  do  that  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  certainly. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it,  now,  that  secured  your  services?  Who 
asked  you  to  come  here  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  first  attempt  to  get  me  was  a  telegram  from  Mr. 
Henry  E.  Owen,  running  something  in  this  way :  ''Are  you  available " 
for  a  campaign  ?  " 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Toward  the  end  of  June. 

Senator  Reed.  This  year  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes;  when  I  was  in  Raleigh — Raleigh,  N.  C. 

Senator  Reed.  Available  for  a  campaign  to  do  what  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  In  Chicago,  and  for  the  Republican  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  a  Republican  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  replied  that  you  were  available? 

Mr.  Barher.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  the  telegram? 

Mr.  Barber.  x-Vlmost  certainly  -well,  it  is  absolutely  certainly  in 
one  of  my  files.  Xow  Vn  hether  that  particular  file  has  been  brought 
to  Chicago  by  my  secretary  1  should  not  like  to  commit  myself  as 
saying,  but  I  am  almost  sure  it  is,  sir,  here  in  Chicago,  so  I  shall  be 
very  glad  to  bring  it  if  you  wish  to  see  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  have  had  other  letters  and  telegrams,  I 
suppose  ? 

Mr.  Barijer.  I  furtlier  got-  -either  a  telegram  or  telephone  mes- 
sage asking  me  to  meet  Mr.  Blair  in  New  York.    I  think  in  my — I 
now  recall  that  in  my  rei>ly  to  Mr.  Owen  I  asked  if  it  was  desired 
that  I  should  come  to  Chicago  for  a  conference,  and  I  believe  that 
that  was  the  first  idea,  and  then  it  turned  out  that  Mr.  Blair  prob- 
ably would  be  in  New  York,  and  it  was  a  little  more  convenient  for 
me  to  run  up  to  New  York  from  Raleigh  than  to  come  to  Chicago. 
Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  see  Mr.  Blair?  ^ 
Mr.  Barber.  Almost  the  end  of  June.  ■ 
Senator  Reed.  Of  this  year?  m 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.  I 
Senator  Reed.  Hov/  'much  money  did  he  tell  you  at  that  time  they 
intended  to  try  and  raise  in  Cook  County? 
Mr.  Barber'.  $500,000. 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  it  reduced  from  $700,000  in  Cook  County 
to  $500,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  have  never  known  of  any  reduction  from  $700,000 
to  $500,000  for  Cook  County.  The  only  ^official  objective  that  has 
come  within  my  knowledge  has  been  the  $500,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Wouldn't  you  from  your  experience  regard  it  as 
rather  ridiculous,  if  you  were  going  to  proceed  on  an  equitable  basis, 
to  assess  $400,000  to  Cleveland,  Ohio,  and  only  $500,000  to  Cook 
County,  111.? 

Mr.  Barber.  There  would  be  so  many  elements.  Senator,  entering 
into  that  consideration,  that  it  would  be  very  hard  for  me  to  answer 
that  as  a  hypothetical  question.  I  am  afraid,  sir,  that  I  would  have 
to  know  all  the  facts  before  I  could  give  you  an  intelligent  opinion 
of  it. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2285 


Senator  Eeed.  Well,  let  us  take  into  consideration  the  fact  of  the 
population  and  of  wealth.   Just  let  it  go  at  that. 

Mr.  Barbek.  I  beo^  your  pardon,  sir,  is  that  a  question? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  The  best  answer  I  can  make  to  that  is  that  populr.- 
tion  is  only  one  of  quite  a  number  of  factors. 
Senator  Reed.  I  said  population  and  wealth. 

Mr.  Barber.  Population  and  wealth— well,  if  you  adhere  strictly 

to  population  

Senator  Reed.  I  said  population  and  wealth. 

Mr.  Barber.  Oh,  I  beg  your  pardon,  sir.  I  didn't  hear  distinctly. 
Senator  Reed.  Yes:  population  and  wealth. 

^Ir.  Barber.  I  dcm't  know  the  comparative  wealth  as  between  Chi- 
cago and  Cle\'eland,  I  will  be  frank  to  say.   I  don't  know  that. 

Senator  Reed.  You  know  it  well  enough  to  know  that  Chicago 
would  naturally  give  about  five  or  six  times  what  Cleveland  would': 
don't  you  know  that  i 

yiv.  Barber.  T  have  never  had  a  campaign  in  Cleveland,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  well  

yh'.  Barber.  I  am  sorry  that  T  would  have  to  give  you  just  a  guess 
on  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh.  I  thought  I  could  get  an  answer  to  that  ques- 
tion. Xever  mind.  It  is  immaterial.  You  never  heard  the  amount 
$700,000  even  mentioned  for  Chicago,  did  you  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  have,  sir,  heard  it  mentioned. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  did  you  hear  it  mentioned? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  can't  remember,  sir,  with  any  degree  of  certainty 
which  Avould  Avarrant  me  in — — 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  heard  it  mentioned  around  Republican 
headquarters  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Doubtless:  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  When  ? 

Mr.  Bari^er.  It  seems. to  me  rather  early  in  July. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  did  you  talk  with  up  at  the  Republican  head- 
quarters ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Oh,  almost  everybody  there  at  one  time  or  another. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  whenever  you  talked  about  the  $700,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  best  understanding  I  had  was  that  $700,000. 
when  I  did  hear  it  mentioned,  was  for  a  larger  territory  than  Cook 
County. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much? 

Mr.  Barber.  Whether  the  whole  State,  sir,  I  am  not  able  to  say. 
Senator  Reed.  Well,  that  was  the  best  understanding ;  but  you  did 
hear  $700,000  talked  about  for  Cook  County,  didn't  you? 
Mr.  Barber.  I  think  so.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.   It  was  talked  about  a  good  deal,  wasn't  it  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  It  Avas  put  in  the  papers,  wasn't  it,  by  authorized 
statements  going  right  out  from  headquarters? 

The  Chairmax.  Well,  have  you  anything  here  to  show  as  to 
whether  authorized  statements  were  put  out  ? 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  what  I  am  trying  to  get  at,  sir,  if  he  does 
know. 


2286 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


'Mr.  Barber.  I  don't  know,  sir,  definitely,  if  this  is  the  answer,  that 
an  authorized  statement  mentioning  $700,000  issued  from  anybody 
in  headquarters.   I  don't  know  anything  about  that. 

Senator  Reed.  You  don't  know  it  definitely.  You  put  a  good  deal 
of  emphasis  on  "  know."   Now,  tell  us  what  you  know  about  that. 

Mr.  Barber.  I  heard  $700,000  mentioned  casually  once,  perhaps 
twice. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  by  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  am  sorry,  sir ;  I  am  trying  hard  to  remember,  but  I 
can  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Blair? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  can  not  say ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Owen? 

The  Chairman.  Well,  do  you  say  you  can  not  remember  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  I  would  not  say  definitely. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  idea  of  getting  

Senator  Reed.  I  am  trying  to  refresh  his  recollection. 
Mr.  Barber.  You  see,  I  have  had  a  great  many  talks  in  the  last 
couple  of  months,  and  been  pretty  busy,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  do  you  expect  this  campaign  to  last  here? 
Mr.  Barber.  One  week,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  in  that  length  of  time  do  you  expect  to  raise 
this  sum  of  money  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  suppose  you  go  over  that  sum  of  money  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Then  the  instructions  would  have  to  come  to  me  from 
some  one  in  higher  authority  than  myself  as  to  what  to  do. 
Senator  Reed.  You  have  had  team  meetings,  have  you  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  are  going  to  go  out  from  day  to  day  and 
canvass,  and  then  come  in  and  have  dinners  and  report,  is  that  the 
plan? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  this  committee  to  report  also,  this  executive  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir:  this  committee  reported  yesterday  with  the 
others. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  do  they  report  with  the  others  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  there  are  tAvo  teams  that  are  to  go  out  on  tlie 
smaller  prospects ;  how  many  men  are  there  on  those  teams  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Their  organization  has  not  yet  been  completed. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  are  there  on  those  teams?  What  is 
your  plan  on  that  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  plan  of  Division  F,  which  is  to  cover  Chicago 
and  Oak  Park,  is  for  a  division  chairman,  three  cit}^  district  chair- 
men covering  the  north,  west,  and  south  sides,  a  ward  captain,  at 
least  one  ward  captain,  in  each  ward,  and  at  least  two  lieutenants  in 
each  precinct.    Now,  people  who  

Senator  Reed.  How  many  people  will  that  make  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  People  who  know  Chicago  better  than  I  do  tell  nie 
that  we  will  need  2,200  men.  | 

Senator  Reed.  Exactlv.  Thank  vou,  I  am  glad  we  found  thes^ 
2,200.    We  had  500  a  moment  ago.   '  I 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2287 


Mr.  Barber.  Well,  sir,  that  was  the  front-line  division.  You  are 
asking  about  team  organization.  This  is  not  a  team  organization. 
Division  F  is  somewhat  different  from  a  team  organization. 

Senator  Eeed.  Well,  2,200  men  and  500  men :  That  is  2,700  men. 

Now,  \^'hat  is  the  plan  of  organization,  then  ?  You  say  it  is  not  to  be 
done  by  teams.  As  to  these  two  teams  that  are  to  go  out  generally, 
how  do  they  meet,  and  how  are  the}^  organized  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  They  have  had  a  few  organization  meetings,  and 
Division  F  has  gone  as  far  as  organizing,  so  my  assistant  has  re- 
ported to  me,  most  of  its  ward  captains. 

Senator  Reed.  And  then  how  about  its  precinct  captains? 

Mr.  Barber.  They  may  have  a  few  precinct  men,  sir,  but  they 
ha^e  not  gone  very  far  along.  That  division,  I  neglected  to  explain, 
will  most  likely  not  swing  into  line  as  early  as  the  others. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  the  others  are  going  to  swing  into  line  when  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  The  others,  the  front-line  divisions,  have  swung  into 
line. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes,  and  they  are  to  complete  their  work  in  a  week? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  but  we  don't  count  Saturdays  and  Sundays  when 
we  say  a  week. 

Senator  Reed.  You  don't  count  Saturdays  and  Sundays  when  you 
say  a  week,  but  that  will  all  be  over  in  one  week  from  to-day,  be- 
cause they  have  been  at  work  one  day. 

Mr.  Barber.  AVell,  we  call  seven  business  days  a  week. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  will  all  be  over  by  Monday. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  we  expect  it  will  be. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  the  other  crowd  and  that  crowd,  this  front-line 
crowd,  they  are  to  get  $500,000  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir;  not  them;  no  sir;  thev  are  not  to  get  the 
whole  $500,000. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  are  they  to  get  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  No  exact  allotment  has  been  made  in  that  case. 

Senator  Reed.  When  are  the  other  men  to  begin  work,  when  are 
they  to  begin  to  organize? 

Mr.  Barber.  Toward  the  end  of  this  campaign,  sir. 

t-  Senator  Reed.  Toward  the  end  of  the  national  campaign? 
Mr.  Barber.  Toward  the  end  of  the  national  campaign — no,  not 
this  national  campaign;  the  end  of  the  first  campaign;  not  this  na- 
tional campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  They  are  to  begin  about  a  week  from  to-day. 
Mr.  Barber.  About,  sir    May  I  explain  that  they  are  to  begin 
about  the  time  when  the  cards  are  exhausted,  so  they  will  not  con- 
flict with  the  front  line  divisions  which  are  operated  with  the  card 
index  system. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  Now  are  you  sure  that  nobody  up  at 
your  headquarters  has  put  down  on  a  piece  of  paper  somewhere  the 
amounts  that  are  expected  to  be  gotten,  or  that  it  is  hoped  to  get, 
or  that  you  think  you  ought  to  get  from  each  of  these  prospects  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  If  they  have  done  so,  sir,  they  have  ignored  my  sug- 
gestions. I  have  requested  that  nothing  of  that  sort  be  done.  I 
would  consider  it  a  good  way  to  affront  a  prospect. 

Senator  Reed.  I  don't  mean  that  they  would  necessarily  take  it 
and  tell  the  prospect;  "We  have  got  you  down  for  $1,000,"  but 


2288 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


whether  for  the  information  of  your  men,  you  have  not  put  down 
on  a  piece  of  paper  the  fact  that  Prospect  A'is  able  to  pay  $1,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  excuse  me,  sir;  the  data  about  the  prospect, 
what  we  call  the  prospect  card will  be  found  on  one  side  of  the 
card.  On  the  other  side  is  the  pledge.  Now  to  sign  the  pledge  the 
man  must  necessarily  take  into  his  hand  the  card  bearing  liis  name 
and  address. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  put  it  on  a  card.  But  I  am  asking  you 
if  there  isn't  any  other  paper  or  papers. 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  to  my  knowledge,  and  if  there  is  a  paper  of  that 
kind  it  is  a  distinct  violation  of  my  method. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all  I  want  to  ask  you  now. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  have  a  question.  I  want  to  know  about  if 
there  is  a  fund  to  be  raised  by  the  ladies. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  anything  about  a  fund  that  was  to  be 
raised  by  the  ladies? 

Mr.  Barber  I  have  heard  that  there  is  a  fund,  but  I  know  nothing 
except  that. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  in  addition  to  the  amount  that  you  were  to 
raise,  whatever  it  is? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  haven't  heard  where  it  Avas  to  be  raised. 

Senator  Reed.  But  it  is  not  counted  in  as  a  part  of  your  money 
that  you  are  to  raise? 

Mr.  Barber.  Even  that  has  not  been  told  to  me.  It  may  be  that 
the  chairman  Avill  decide  to  do  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.    Now  you  haA^e  all  of  Cook  County? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  haA^e  all  of  Cook  County  in  your  jurisdiction? 
Any  of  the  other  cities  of  Illinois? 
Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 
(Witness  excused.) 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  haA^e  Mr.  Enix,  if  he  is  here. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CALEB  ENIX. 

Tlie  witness  Avas  duly  SAVorn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  GiA^e  your  name  to  the  reporter.  a 
Mr.  Enix.  Caleb  Enix.  J 
The  Chairman.  Senator  Reed.  I 
Senator  Reed.  W^hat  is  your  occupation  or  profession.  1 
Mr.  Enix.  I  am  chief  copy  editor  of  the  Chicago  Daily  NeAVS.  I 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Enix.  I  am  chief  copy  editor  of  the  Chicago  Daily  NeAvs,  part 
of  the  time  assistant  city  editor,  part  of  the  time  acting  city  editor ; 
about  three  jobs. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  your  paper  receiA^e  an  authorized  statement 
from  the  Republican  headquarters  Avith  reference  to  the  sum  of 
money  that  it  Avas  proposed  to  raise  in  the  city  of  Chicago  ? 

Mr.  Enix.  We  received  several  statements. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  am  going  to  ask  you  the  question  direct 
Avhether  you  receiA^ed  a  statement  to  be  printed.  Avhich  named  $750,000 
as  the  amount  to  be  raised  in  Cook  County? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2289 


Mr.  Exix.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  receive  it. 
Mr.  Exix.   Yes,  I  received  it. 
Senator  Keed.  Where  did  you  see  it  first? 
Mr.  Exix.  I  saw  it  on  my  desk  in  the  Daily  News  office. 
Senator  Reed.  Was  it  on  the  letterhead  of  the  Republican  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Exix.  Yes,  sir ;  the  Republican  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  the  paper  ? 

Mr.  Exix.  Sir? 

The  Chairmax.  Where  is  it? 

Mr.  Exix.  The  paper? 

The  Chairmax.  The  original  paper. 

Mr.  Exix.  Why,  it  was  cut  up  and  rewritten,  and  fixed  up  a  little 
bit  to  keep  it  from  reading  like  the  other  papers. 

Senator  Reed.  It  was  cut  up  and  rewritten  and  put  in  your  paper  ? 

Mr.  Exix.  The  introductory  paragraph,  which  we  call  the  ''lead" 
was  rewritten  for  verbiage. 

Senator  Reed.  For  what  ? 

Mr.  Exix.  Just  for  verbiage,  just  to  change  the  verbiage.  The 
introductory  paragraph  was  reAvritten  for  that  purpose. 

Senator  Reed.  f)id  you  print  that  article  then  in  your  paper. 
Mr.  Exix.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  bring  with  you  the  copy  of  the  article,  Mr. 
Enix. 

Mr.  Exix.  No,  sir ;  I  could  not  find  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Just  a  moment,  please.  I  want  to  clear  up  a 
matter.  In  your  answer  to  a  previous  question  by  Senator  Reed  I 
understood  you  referred  to  $750,000.  That  is,  the  question  Avas  so 
framed  that  his  ansAver  would  indicate  that  it  Avas  $750,000.  Now, 
I  Avant  to  knoAV  Avhether  it  Avas  $750,000  or  $700,000?  Noav,  the 
witness'  ansAver  Avas  such  that  I  am  in  doubt  as  to  Avhich  it  Avas. 

Mr.  Exix.  $700,000. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  $700,000. 

Senator  Reed.  About  when  Avas  that? 

Mr.  Exix.  That  Avas  the  early  part  of  August. 

Senator  Reed.  Noav,  you  saAA^  the  article,  the  paper  itself  that  came 
from  the  Republican  national  committee? 
Mr.  Exix.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  it  on  the  letterhead  of  the  Republican  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Exix.  It  Avas  not  on  the  letterhead  of  the  Republican  national 
committee ;  no,  sir,  but  the  envelope  had  that  name  on  it. 
Senator  Reed.  The  envelope? 

Mr.  Exix.  Yes.  It  was  written  on  this  "  flimsy  "  paper  that  they 
use  in  their  publicity  work,  but  it  comes  in  envelopes  with  the  name 
printed  on  the  euA^elope. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  In  other  words,  one  of  those  sheets  that  is 
used  generally  for  manifolding  purposes? 

Mr.  Exix.   Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  received  other  articles,  Mr.  Enix,  that 
have  come  from  them  for  publication? 
Mr.  Exix.  Oh,  many  of  them. 


2290 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  And  this  came  in  this  same  way  as  many  other 
articles  did  ? 
Mr.  Enix.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  who  brought  it  there? 

Mr.  Enix.  No;  I  don't  know  whether  it  was  delivered  by  a. mes- 
senger, or  whether  it  came  from  the  City  Press  automatic  tube. 

The  Chairman,  Do  you  know  whether  some  of  your  reporters 
brought  it  in? 

Mr.  Enix.  No  ;  I  don't  know  whether  any  of  our  reporters  brought 
it  in,  because  it  was  placed  on  my  desk.  I  was  acting  city  editor  at 
that  time,  and  it  was  placed  on  my  desk  probably  by  an  office  boy, 
or  the  information  bureau  man,  just  as  it  is  every  day,  all  that  copy. 

The  Chairman.  Just  what  did  it  say? 

Mr.  Enix.  It  said  that  it  was  announced  that  day,  I  believe,  or 
anyway,  it  said  that  a  certain  number  of  teams  were  going  out  to 
raise  $700,000,  the  quota  for  Cook  County,  and  told  about  how  soon 
they  were  going  to  put  it  over  the  top,  and  that  sort  of  thing.  I  don't 
remember  exactly  the  whole  thing. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  days  was  that? 

Mr.  Enix.  Six  or  eight  weeks  ago. 

The  Chairman.  Six  or  eight  weeks  ago? 

Mr.  Enix.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  connected  with  the  Chicago  Daily  News 
now  ? 

Mr.  Enix.   Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  same  position? 

Mr.  Enix.   Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  that  was  published  in  the  paper? 
Mr.  Enix.   Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  did  not  apparently  appear  to  be  a  secret, 
sinister  matter  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Enix.  Oh,  no ;  not  at  all. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  that  same  article,  or  the 
substance  of  that  same  article,  appeared  in  other  Chicago  papers 
about  that  time  ? 

Mr.  Enix.  Well,  I  believe  the  Tribune  had  it  the  next  morning, 
but  I  am  not  positive  about  it.  I  read  it  some  place  else,  but  I  am  not 
certain  which  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Thank  you,  Mr.  Enix.  If  you  run  across  that 
article  in  your  paper  will  you  kindly  send  it  to  us ;  if  you  can  not 
give  us  the  file,  will  you  kindly  send  us  a  copy  of  the  article  ? 

Mr.  Enix.  I  can  send  you  a  copy.  I  can  get  a  copy  at  Washing- 
ton Street.   There  is  a  place  at  175  West  Washington  Street. 

The  Chairman.  Send  it  in  if  you  can  get  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  remember  the  date? 

Mr.  Enix.  I  think  it  was  August  11. 

Senator  Reed.  Well  now,  I  am  asking  you :  You  do  keep  files  of 
your  paper,  do  you  not? 
Mr.  Enix.  Yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2291 


Senator  Reed.  If  you  don't  find  an  extra  printed  copy,  will  you 
be  so  kind  as  to  have  a  stenographer  copy  the  article  from  your 
paper  and  send  it  to  us,  giving  us  the  date  of  the  paper. 

Mr.  Exix.  Do  you  want  it  to-day  ? 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  that? 

Mr.  Enix.  Do  you  want  me  to  get  it  for  you  to-day  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  w^e  would  like  to  have  it,  if  you  can  get  it 
conveniently.  If  you  can  not  get  it,  send  it  to  Senator  Kenyon  or 
to  myself. 

Mr.  E^iix.  Are  you  going  to  be  in  session  all  day? 
The  Chairman,  ^o,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  We  will  be  in  session  so  long  as  the  Chairman's 
patience  lasts. 

The  Chairmax.  The  chairman  is  going  to  leave  at  1.40 ;  you  v/ ill 
have  to  be  here  before  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  Ave  will  get  along.  Senator  Pomerene,  you 
and  I,  fine. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  of  these  other  Chicago  witnesses 
here  ?   There  were  a  few  others  attempted  to  be  secured. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  here  representing  the  national  committee 
this  morning? 

The  Chairman.  I  don't  know  as  there  is  anybody.  Do  you  want 
any  more  witnesses? 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  a  carbon  copy  of  this  article.  They  un- 
doubtedly have  it. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  have  asked  this  witness,  Mr.  Enix,  to 
produce  this  article.   Why  isn't  that  sufficient? 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  want  it  to  come  from  headquarters.  I  don't 
want 'it  to  be  disputed.   Now  we  asked  another  witness  to  be  here. 

The  Chairman.  AVell,  one  Avitness  Ave  did  not  secure,  that  is  Mr. 
Wrigley ;  he  is  up  at  a  lake. 

Senator  Reed.  No,  we  asked  for  the  local  man  who  is  here  with 
Mr.  Barber ;  the  local  man  here  in  Chicago  who  was  the  head  of  this 
moA'ement  with  this  expert  that  has  testified  here  this  morning. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  that  ? 
^    Senator  Reed.  Charles  Piez. 
m    The  Chairman.  Is  Mr.  Piez  here? 
I    (No  response.) 

The  Chairman.  Well,  we  will  go  ahead,    is  Mr.  Woodford  of 
CleA^eland  here? 
^   Senator  Pomerene.  Is  Mr.  Woodford  of  Cleveland  here? 


f    Senator  Pomerene.  Has  he  been  here  ?   Does  some  one  knoAV  ? 
'    Senator  Reed.  Where  is  the  Avitness  that  just  left  the  stand? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Enix? 

Senator  Reed.  No,  not  Mr.  Enix,  the  other  gentleman,  the  expert 
from  New  York. 
The  Chairman.  Barber? 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Barber.  Has  he  gone?  Has  Mr.  Barber  left 
the  room? 

Mr.  Bailiff.  Mr.  Barber  has  gone  after  his  papers. 

182774— 20— PT  16  2 


2292 


PKESIDENTIAIi  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  He  has  gone  after  the  papers  you  asked  him  for, 
Senator.  Is  Mr.  Carroll  here?  The  gentleman  from  New  Jersey 
that  we  have  been  trying  to  get  for  three  or  four  days? 

(No  response.) 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  send  out  and  get  Mr.  Piez.  He  was  sub- 
poenaed, wasn't  he  ? 

The  Chairman.  I  don't  know  whether  he  was  or  not. 

Senator  Reed.  We  asked  for  him  yesterday,  and  I  think  you  had 
him  subpoenaed. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  I  asked  Mr.  Hunt  to  subpoena  him.  I 
gave  him  the  list. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  we  should  get  him. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  we  are  not  going  to  subpoena  any  more  wit- 
nesses. 

Senator  Reed.  But  I  want  that  particular  witness.  We  will  never 
get  him  again  if  we  don't  get  him  now. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  if  you  can  get  him  this  morning.  There  are 
a  couple  of  witnesses  here  from  South  Dakota. 

Senator  Pomerene.  All  right,  get  them,  and  have  the  subpoena 
issued  immediately  for  Mr.  Piez. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  some  witnesses  from  South  Dakota? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  let  us  go  ahead  with  them. 

The  Chairman.  Is  Miss  Coyne,  of  South  Dakota,  here? 

TESTIMONY  OF  MISS  EUNICE  COYNE. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Give  your  name  to  the  reporter,  please. 

Miss  Coyne.  Eunice  Coyne. 

The  Chairman.  How  do  you  spell  your  name  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  E-u-n-i-c-e  C-o-y-n-e. 

The  Chairman.  Your  address? 

Miss  Coyne.  Aberdeen,  S.  Dak. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  lived  in  Aberdeen,  Miss 
Coyne  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Why,  Aberdeen  has  been  my  home  at  times  since  1908^, 
but  I  have  been  there  steadily  since  1913. 

Senator  Reed.  I  can't  hear  a  single  thing  that  you  say.  Miss  Coyne. 
I  will  have  to  come  a  little  nearer. 

Miss  Coyne.  That  is  too  bad. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Where  did  you  sa}^  you  have  been  steadily 
since  1913? 

Miss  Coyne.  In  Aberdeen,  S.  Dak. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  not  speak  a  little  louder,  please? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  will  try,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Does  it  frighten  you  to  have  Senator  Reed  sit  up 
there? 

Miss  Coyne.  No.  ^ 
Senator  Reed.  Not  a  bit.    I  really  want  to  hear. 
The  Chairman.  Are  you  a  reporter  on  a  newspaper? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir;  I  am  on  the  Aberdeen  Daily  News. 
The  Chairman.  Have  you  anything  to  do  with  the  Aberdeen  Daily 
American  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2293 


Miss  CoYXE.  Yes,  sir;  the  papers  are  run  in  unison,  and  often 
stories  I  write  for  the  Aberdeen  Dail}^  News  appear  in  the  American. 

The  Chairman.  Xow,  I  don't  know  any  thing-  about  your  testi- 
mony, but  I  have  been  handed  this  Aberdeen  Daily  American  Avith 
reference  to  the  "bhickjack''  letter  and  a  story  by  you. 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Xoaa^  this  paper  sets  out  the  folloAA^ng : 
Saturday,  September  4.  1920 — 

And  this  is  AAdiat  I  Avant  to  ask  you  about.  This  is  AA^th  reference 
to  the    blackjack  "  letter — 

Below  iy  a  verbatiiri  copy  of  the  letter,  sijiiied  by  E.  M.  Waterl)iiry,  of  Ceuter- 
A'ille,  Avho  says  he  is  acting  for  Clarence  H.  Mee,  member  of  the  State  Democratic 
connnittee  for  Turner  County,  and  said  by  Waterbiiry  to  be  chairman  of  the 
budget  committee,  which  letter  was  addressed  to  Miss  Marion  Armatront  

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

828  South  Third  Street,  and  received  iit  her  home. 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  knoAA^  her? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  she  here  to-day? 

Miss  Coyne.  Xo,  sir ;  she  is  not. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

Miss  Armatrout  is  employed  in  tlie  Internal  Revenue  Oflice  in  Aberdeen,  and 
classed  as  a  stenographer. 

Do  you  knoAA'  that  of  A'Our  OAvn  knoAvledge? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

She  is  under  civil  service. 

Do  you  knoAY  that  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  knoAV  she  is  employed  there,  do  you? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  understand  that  she  is  employed  there,  and  that 
recently  they  all  became  ciA^l-service  employees.  That  is  not  ab- 
solutely  

Senator  Pomerene.  When? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  can  not  giA^e  you  the  date. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  it  is  your  understanding  of  it  that  she  is  in 
the  ciA'il  service  ? 
^liss  Coyne.  Yes. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

The  c()i)y.  with  the  aflidavit  of  Miss  Eunice  Coyne — 

That  is  you  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

i-eporter  for  The  Morning  American,  that  it  is  a  correct  copy  of  the  Armatrout 
letter,  follows. 

^liss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 
Tlie  Chairman.  Did  you  see  this  letter? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 


2294 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGIs^  EXPEN'SES. 


The  Chairmax.  Did  you  cop}^  it? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  copied  it  as  I  saw  it;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  the  original  of  that  letter? 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  that  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  The  original  of  that  letter  is,  I  believe,  in  the  hands 
of  Marion  Armatrout.  When  I  asked  for  it  they  refused  to  give  it 
to  me. 

Senator  Eeed.  Who  refused? 

Miss  Coyne.  Miss  Armatrout's  mother. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  copied  the  letter  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (continuing  reading)  : 

August  31.  1920. 

The  Democratic  national  committee  are  I'aisin^-  in  this  State  a  fund  for 
campaign  expenses,  and  those  who  are  partaking  in  the  benefits  of  ofiice  are 
asked  to  assist. 

You  are  cordially  requested  to  arrange  this  matter  by  calling  at  the  Sherman 
Hotel,  room  213,  during  the  next  three  days. 

E.  M.  Waterbt'ry. 

The  Chairman.  You  copied  that  letter  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

I  hereby  swear  that  the  above  letter  is  a  verbatim  copy  of  a  letter  addressed 
to  Miss  Marion  Armatrout,  323  South  Third  Street,  which  I  saw  and  copied  this 
3d  day  of  September,  1920. 

Eunice  Coyne. 

Witnesses : 

R.  E.  Mur.Lis, 
Albert  Klabe. 

M.  F.  Bowler, 

Notary  Public. 

My  commission  expires  June  9,  1923. 

Was  that  a  correct  copy  of  that  letter  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir ;  as  I  saw  it. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  then,  did  you  start  in  as  a  newspaper  re- 
porter to  investigate  that  matter  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  The  story  came  to  me  at  noon,  and  my  first  impres- 
sion of  it  was  indignation,  but  later  I  worked  on  it  as  a  news- 
paper reporter ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  This  Miss  Marion  Armatrout  is  a  friend  of  yours  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman,  and  you  say  you  were  indignant  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Well,  the  girls,  when  they  first  told  me  of  the  letter,] 
they  told  me  of  this  request  for  funds. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  you  say  "  they."  Who  were  they  ?  | 

Miss  Coyne.  The  girls.  The  first  girls  that  told  me  of  that  letter' 
were  Miss  Lida  Young  and  Marion  Kennedy. 

The  Chairman.  Now  let  us  get  this  :  Miss  Licla  Young  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Miss  Lida  Young. 

The  Chairman.  And  Marion  what? 

Miss  Coyne.  Marion  Kennedy. 

The  Chairman.  Marion  Kennedy  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  where  was  Miss  Lida  Young  working? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGI^  EXPENSES. 


2295 


Miss  Coyne.  She  is  an  employee — both  girls  are  employees  of  the 
internal-revemie  office. 

The  Chairman.  Both  girls  are  employees  of  the  internal-revenue 
office  at  Aberdeen  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Of  the  internal- revenue  office  at  Aberdeen. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  what  salaries  they  draw  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Lida  draws,  I  know,  $120. 

The  Chairman.  $120  a  month.  Do  you  know  whether  she  sup- 
ports anybody  on  that — her  mother  or  anybody  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  know ;  no. 

The  Chairman.  What  about  Marion  Kennedy  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Marion  Kennedy  I  had  just  met  when  she  told  me 
of  the  letter.  I  don't  know  her  very  well. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  she  is  drawing? 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  I  do  not.  I  had  heard  later  in  the  afternoon  that 
a  greater  portion  of  the  girls  of  the  office,  in  fact  most  of  them,  were 
getting  $120. 

The  Chairman.  Xow,  these  girls  also  received  a  letter  similar  to 
this  one  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  They  did  later. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  do  you  know  of  other  girls  working  .there 
who  received  these  letters  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir,  I  do. 
The  Chairman.  How  many  others? 

Miss  Coyne.  In  the  evening,  in  an  attempt  to  get  a  letter  I  called 
on  several  of  the  girls.   Among  them  were  Miss  bigrid  Holland. 
The  Chairman.  Is  she  an  emploj^ee  of  the  Government  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Civil  service  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Internal  revenue  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Were  all  of  these,  now,  that  you  are  going  to 
si)eak  of  employed  by  the  internal  revenue  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes.  And  Miss  Jessie  Barchard. 
The  Chairman.  What  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Miss  Jessie  Barchard. 
The  Chairman.  Where  does  she  live  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  She  lives  in  Aberdeen  also. 
The  Chairman.  She  is  here,  isn't  she  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  believe  so ;  yes. 
The  Chairman.  Any  others? 
Miss  Coyne.  Any  others  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  I  called  on  a  Miss  Grace  Curtis,  and  I  called  on  a 
Miss  Ruth  Kelly. 

The  Chairman.  Still  employees  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir.  Oh,  that  was  the  list  of  girls  that  I  per- 
sonally talked  to. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Chairman,  let  me  interrupt  you  to  ask  if  you 
can  not  have  Mr.  Blair  called  by  telephone  and  ask  him  to  come 
back  a  moment  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  We  have  no  secretary  now.  But  we  will 
have  it  done.   Now,  Miss  Coyne,  you  said  Miss  Ruth  Kelly? 


2296 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  Mr.  Blair  to  come,  and  I  want  him  to  bring 
a  cop3^  of  the  article  which  was  sent  out  to  the  newspapers  outlining 
the  amount  of  money  and  telling  the  story  of  the  campaign  that  wa*s 
to  be  made  in  Chicago  here— the  one  Mr.  Enix  referred  to. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  supposed  to  be  written  in  August. 

Senator  Reed.  Supposed  to  be  written  in  August;  yes.  I  want  a 
copy  of  that  from  the  publicity  department. 

The  Chairt^ian.  And  if  he  has  any  papers  also  referring  to  these 
letters  in  South  Dakota  written  to  working  girls,  let  him  bring  tliem. 

Senator  Reed.  And  if  he  isn't  there,  ask  Mr.  Quarles,  of  the  pub- 
licity department,  to  come. 

The  Chairman.  Which  do  you  prefer,  letters  sent  to  working 
girls  or  to  millionaires  ?  Are  there  any  more  now  of  those  working 
girls  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  That  I  talked  to  that  told  me  personally  that  they 
had  letters  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  not  that  evening. 

The  Chairman.  So  there  seemed  to  be  a  general  receipt  of  these 
letters  b}^  the  girl  employees  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  revenue  bureau  there  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  They  gave  me  the  impression  that  they  had  all 
received  them,  or  were  to  receive  them. 

The  Chairivian.  Now,  did  they  come — do  you  know  

Senator  Reed.  Wait  a  moment.    "  Or  were  to  receive  them  ?  " 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir — a  part  of  them — this  happened  on  Friday, 
and  a  part  of  them  had  not  received  their  letters  up  to  that  date. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  did  they  receive  them  later,  do  you  know? 

Miss  Coyne.  A  few  of  the  girls  who  had  not  received  their  let- 
ters on  Friday  I  learned  later  had  received  their  letters. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  either  Friday  or  later  they  all  received 
their  letters? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir ;  I  believe  so. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  many  girls  were  working 
there? 

Miss  Coyne.  Are  working  there? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  I  can  not  tell  you  how  many.    There  are  a  num- 
ber; that  is,  upward  of  ^25,  I  believe. 
Senator  Pomerene.  How  many? 

The  Chairman.  How  many?  4 

Miss  Coyne.  Two  hundred  and  twenty-five,  approximately ;  in  see- 
ing them  in  the  office ;  that  is  my  idea  that  there  are  that  many. 

The  Chairman.  Two  hundred  and  twenty-five.  How  many  did 
you  talk  with  ?    And  who  did  you  talk  with  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  talked  Avith  Lida  Young. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  I  wanted — go  ahead. 

Miss  Coyne.  Marion  Kennedy,  Jessie  Barchard,  Bertha  Dunne, 
Sigrid  Holland. 

The  Chairman.  Grace  Curtis? 
Miss  Coyne.  Grace  Curtis. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSE? 


2297 


The  Chairman.  Ruth  Kelly? 
Miss  Coyne.  Ruth  Kelly. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  remember  any  others  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Dorothy  Smith,  and  she  also  received  a  letter.    I  heg 
your  pardon,  she  is  another  one  that  told  me  of  having  received  a 
letter. 

The  Chairman.  You  don't  know  whether  the  other  girls  received 
letters  or  not,  do  you? 

Miss  Coyne.  The  girls — one  of  the  girls  mentioned  to  me  that  they 
would  all  receive  letters. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  how  did  she  knoAv  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  She  had  evidently  been  informed — she  didn't  tell  me 
this,  but  her  mother  told  me  that  some  one  had  told  her,  an  officer 
of  the  office  there,  and  there  was  some  mix-up  as  to  postage  of  these 
letters  that  I  believe  delayed  the  delivery  of  several  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Were  any  of  them  special  delivery  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  blieve  so. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  was  there  any  list  of  the  girls  so  that  some 
of  them  were  put  down  as  better  prospects  than  others  ?  Were  some 
of  these  girls  richer  than  the  others,  do  you  know  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  know. 

The  Chairman.  Or  was  there  a  "  cream  list "  of  these  girls,  those 
who  could  best  afford  to  pay,  or  those  who  could  not  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  don't  know  whether  some  of  them  received 
the  letters  and  some  of  them  did  not  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Well,  Mr.  Kenj^on,  it  is  my  impression  that  the  girls 
who  did  receive  their  letters  received  their  letters  with  1  cent  due 
on  them. 

The  Chairman.  They  had  even  to  pay  the  postage  in  getting  duns 
from  the  Democrats,  did  they  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Part  of  them;  the  letters  Avere  delivered  to  their 
homes,  as  I  understand  it. 

The  Chairman.  Delivered  to  their  homes.  That  Avas  to  evade  the 
law,  I  suppose  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  And  to  Miss  Sigrid  Holland — oh,  it  was  in  conversa- 
tion with  Sigrid  Holland  and  Jessie  Barchard;  they  told  me  that  J. 
Walter  Mee  instructed  Mr.  Waterbury  that  if  he  would  address  them 
to  "  city  "  they  would  reach  them,  and  I  believe  their  registered  ad- 
dress at  the  post  office  would  be  their  home  address,  and  that  was  hoAv 
they  were  delivered  to  them. 

The  Chairivian.  Do  you  knoAv  whether  these  girls  called  at  the 
Sherman  Hotel,  room  213,  during  the  next  few  days,  in  response  to 
Mr.  Waterbury's  letter? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  have  the  information  from  Miss  Lida  Young  and 
Miss  Jessie  Barchard  that  13  girls  called  at  4.30  Friday  evening  at 
room  213,  Sherman  Hotel. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  the  ''ToAver"  room  of  the  Sherman 
Hotel? 

Miss  Coyne.  No.    We  haA^e  three  floors. 

The  Chairman.  You  don't  call  it  that.    Thirteen  girls  called  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Thirteen  girls  called. 
The  Chairman.  All  employees? 


2298 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Coyne.  All  employees.    They  went  up  in  a  group  of  girls. 
During  the  afternoon  they  formed  this  party. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  who  is  Mr.  Waterbury,  do  you  know  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Mr.  Waterbury? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  In  the  afternoon  I  talked  to  Mr.  Waterbur3^ 

The  Chairman.  You  did? 

Miss  Coyne,  l  es. 

The  Chairman.  About  this  letter? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  who  is  he? 

The  Chairman.  VVell,  she  was  probably  going  to  find  out  who  he 
was. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  didn't  mean  to  interrupt,  but  I  just  wanted 
to  know  who  he  was. 
The  Chairman,  (to  on. 

Miss  Coyne.  He  is  from  Centerville,  C-e-n-t-e-r-y-i-l-l-e. 

Senator  Pomerene.  His  first  name  I  didn't  get. 

Miss  Coyne.  Mr.  Waterbury's  first  name  is  E.  M.  And  I  called 
him — in  my  conversation  with  the  girls  early  in  the  afternoon — I 
thought  perhaps  there  would  be  a  story  of  the  establishment  of 
Democratic  headquarters  in  Aberdeen  of  his  visit,  for  they  referred 
to  this  room  in  the  hotel  as  the  "  headquarters,"  while  I  later  under- 
stood it  was  just  Mr.  Waterbury's  apartment — and  i  called  Mr. 
Waterbury,  and  Mr.  Waterbury  denied  to  make  any  statement  as 
to  the  establishment  of  headquarters,  but  told  me  he  was  there  on 
Democratic  business. 

The  Chairman.  Who  did  he  say  he  represented  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  He  didn't  tell  me  who  he  represented.  Lida  later 
said  that  he  told  the  girls  on  their  visit  to  the  room  he  represented 
Mr.  Mee,  a  Clarence  Mee,  also  of  Centerville.  ] 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  didn't  get  that  last  name.  J 

Miss  Coyne.  M-e-e.  ^ 

The  Chairman.  You  were  told  that  Mr.  W aterbury  told  the  girls 
that  he  represented  Clarence  Mee? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  he  represented  Clarence  Mee? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Represented  Clarence  Mee.  Who  is  he,  a  member 
of  the  State  Democratic  Party? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  believe  he  told  these  srirls  that  he  was  chairman  of 
the  Democratic  budget  committee  of  the  State. 

Ihe  Chairman.  Mee  was? 

Miss  Coyne.  Mee ;  Clarence  H. 

The  Chairman.  AVell,  did  the  Democrats  have  a  financial  agent 
in  the  State  and  an  organization  up  there  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  know. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  what  did  you  find  out  that  Mr.  Waterbury  . 
wanted  of  these  girls?    Was  it  to  raise  their  salaries?  | 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  he  didn't  mention  about  salaries  to  them.  I 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  want  ?  " 

^liss  Coyne.  My  information  on  their  visit  to  the  room  at  the  Sher- 
man Hotel  is  based  on  the  conversational  testimony  of  Lida  Young 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2299 


and  Miss  Jessie  Barchard  and  Sigrid  Holland.  Lida  at  dinner  told 
me  of  their  visit  and  said  that  it  didn't  last  for  any  length  of  time. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  Well,  now,  let  me  suggest :  I  don't  know  that 
I  am  going  to  interpose  an  objection,  but  of  course  the  Senator  real- 
izes that  that  is  not  the  way  to  get  at  

The  Chairman.  Oh,  that  is  true,  but  we  have  tried  to  bring  here 
some  of  these  young  Avomen  

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  understand  some  of  these  other  young 
ladies  are  here  now,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  Some  of  these  other  young  ladies  are  here ;  I  think 
two  of  them  are  here. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  we  can  ask  them. 

The  Chairman.  But  I  think  this  is  as  proper  as  a  good  deal  of 
the  testimony  we  have  had  in  this  hearing. 

Senator  Reed.  It  probably  involves  as  much  as  $25  or  $30. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  that  ? 

Senator  Reed.  I  say  it  probably  involves  as  much  as  $25  or  $30. 
The  Chairman.  $25  or  $30  from  poor  working  girls  is  equal  to 
$1,000  from  these  people  you  have  been  asking  about. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  not  equal  from  its  political  effect,  is  it? 
The  Chairman.  It  is  worse  in  its  infamy. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  I  agree  with  you.  Senator,  that  in  any  way 
to  levy  a  political  assessment  upon  a  girl  working  for  the  Govern- 
ment is  absolutely  inexcusable. 

The  Chairman.  I  knew  you  would. 

Miss  Coyne.  I  should  say. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  can  be  no  question  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  Go  on  with  your  story. 

Miss  Coyne.  Where  do  you  want  me  to  proceed  from? 

The  Chairman.  Proceed  from  the  point  where  you  stopped. 

Miss  Coyne.  Perhaps  they  can  tell  me  where  I  stopped. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Tell  the  way  you  got  your  information;  what 
this  other  young  lady  told  you ;  this  young  lady  Lida ;  what  she 
told  you  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  tell  what  she  told  you. 
Miss  Coyne.  Lida  ? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  That  the  visit  was  short  and  that  eight  girls  left 
the  room  after  Mr.  Waterbury's  talk,  while  five  remained  and  wrote 
checks,  subscribing  toward  this  budget. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  was  wanted  in  the  checks? 

Miss  Coyne.  $40. 

The  Chairman.  $40.    Did  they  tell  you  it  was  any  particular 
amount  of  their  salary;  any  assessment  on  their  salary? 
Miss  Coyne.  No. 

The  Chairman.  He  just  fixed  it,  he  fixed  the  amount  for  them, 
did  he? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Senator,  make  that  clear.   I  assume  she  means 
$40  for  each  check  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  No;  not  for  each  check.    A  lot  of  them  wrote  post- 
dated checks ;  but  $40  for  each  person. 
The  Chairman.  $40  for  each  person? 


2300 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Coyne,  $40  for  each  person. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  if  they  didn't  have  $40  then  for  the  subscrip- 
tion, what  did  they  do  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  They  post-dated  their  checks ;  Miss  Lida  Young  post- 
dated a  check  for  October  1  and  a  second  check  for  November  1. 

The  Chairman.  Did  any  of  the  others  post-date  their  checks? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  believe  that  Miss  Jessie  Barchard  also  did. 

Senator  Reed.  May  I  ask  a  question  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  this  man  who  made  this  assess- 
ment is  in  the  Government  employ  in  any  way  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Mr.  Waterbury? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  Personally  I  didn't  learn,  but  I  believe  that  another 
reporter  working  on  the  paper  learned  that  he  was  not. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Was  not,  you  say? 

Miss  Coyne.  That  he  was  not  an  employee  of  the  Government. 
The  Chairman.  He   was,   as   you  understand   it,  representing 

Mr.   

Miss  Coyne.  Mee. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Clarence  H.  Mee  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  remember  the  second  initial. 

The  Chairman.  Member  of  the  State  Democratic  committee? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  let  me  ask  again :  Was  this  Clarence  H.  Mee  in 
the  Government  employ ;  do  you  know  about  that  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  am  not  acquainted  with  him. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  talk  to  any  of  the  higher  officers  of  the 
revenue  service  there  about  this  matter?   Mr.  Young,  for  instance? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir,  I  talked  to  Mr.  Young. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Young  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  He  is  the  chief  clerk  of  the  internal  revenue  office. 

Senator  Pomerene.  His  first  name,  please  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  William  Young. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  your  talk  with  him  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  My  talk  with  him  was  with  reference  to  the  establish- 
ment of  headquarters  in  the  Sherman  Hotel.  He  gave  me  the  name  of 
Mr.  Waterbury  and  said  that  Democratic  business  was  being  trans- 
acted there. 

The  Chairman.  Where  was  he  at  the  time  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Mr.  Young? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Miss  Coyne.  In  his  office. 

The  Chairman.  At  the  Federal  Building? 

Miss  Coyne.  At  the  internal-revenue  office. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  internal  revenue  collector  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  J.  Walter  Mee. 

The  Chairman.  J.  Walter  Mee? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  any  relation  to  C.  H.  Mee  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  He  is  the  son. 
The  Chairman.  He  is  the  son. 

Senator  Reed.  So  the  father  of  the  revenue  collector  is  out  engaged 
in  this  delectable  business? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2301 


Miss  Coyne.  I  understand  so ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  story.  And  Mr.  Mee,  the  son  of  the 
father,  who  is  running  this  affair,  is  the  one  who  told  you  that  the 
Democratic  business  was  being  transacted  at  the  Sherman  Hotel  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Xo,  it  was  his  chief  clerk  that  told  me  that. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  T  mean  to  sa^^  that  the  chief  clerk  did. 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  There  seemed  to  be  a  complete  understanding  of 
where  the  business  ay  as  to  go  on  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir.  There  was  some  secrecy  in  reference  to  it 
in  the  early  part  of  the  afternoon.  A  Mr.  Edward  McBride,  whose 
title  is  chief  of  the  field  deputies  of  the  internal-revenue  office,  re- 
fused to  make  any  statement,  and  denied  that  there  was  any  Demo- 
cratic business  going  on  in  the  city. 

The  Chairman.  Did  vou  see  him  later  after  the  matter  became 
public?  ^  ^  . 

Miss  Coyne.  Xo. 

The  Chairman.  Do  jou  know  whether  Waterbury  had  any  card, 
when  these  girls  went  to  the  room,  on  which  was  stated  the  amount 
the}^  were  to  subscribe  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Xo,  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  he  had  any  cards  of  any 
kind  ?   I  see  you  say  in  your  article — 

Mr.  Waterbury,  according  to  one  of  the  youii^-  women,  o]»ene(l  his  appeal  " 
by  sayini?  that  he  h.-id  come  here  as  a  representative  of  Mr.  Mee  to  cover  Aber- 
deen in  the  interests  of  the  campaijjn  fund  of  the  Democratic  party. 

Tlien  the  courteous  Mr.  Waterbury  pulled  all  tlie  cards  out  of  liis  hands 
and  told  tlie  younj>-  women,  one  of  tliem  said,  that  this  is  a  political  proposition. 

Do  you  mean  laying  the  cards  on  the  table  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes ;  that  is  just  a  slang  phrase. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  I  wasn't  familiar  with  the  game  enough  to 
knoAV  that. 

The  'f^'ivU  declared  afterwards  that  they  had  had  no  doubt  but  that  it  was  a 
political  proposition. 

Mr,  Waterbury,  according  to  the  .uirls,  told  them  that  this  was  a  purely 
' ' volu n t a  ry  con t r i b u t i on , " 

You  understood  that  he  said  that  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  Yes. 

Tlie  Chairman  (continuing)  : 

But  in  the  next  breath,  the  girls  say,  he  informed  them  that  their  jobs  tle- 
pend  on  the  political  status  of  the  country. 

You  understand  that  that  is  what  he  said  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  understand  that  that  is  what  he  said. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  some  of  these  girls  told  you? 

Miss  Coyne.  That  is  what  Miss  Lida  Young  told  me. 

The  Chairman.  Before  they  contributed? 

Miss  Coyne.  Xo,  that  was  during  his  appeal. 

The  Chairman.  During  his  appeal.  Tell  us  about  these  girls, 
whether  they  are  girls  who  can  easily  afford  to  give  this  money? 
Are  they  girls  in  good  financial  circumstances,  so  that  this  is  no  hard- 
ship on  them  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  In  my  personal  experience  with  the  living  expenses 
of  Aberdeen,  and  my  knowledge  of  these  girls,  as  friends,  the  greater 


2302 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


part  of  them  do  not  live  at  home;  there  are  several  of  them  Avhose 
home  is  in  Minneapolis. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  girls  without  any  property  of  their 
own? 

Miss  Coyne.  I  believe  so,  yes. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  working  girls? 

Miss  Coyne.  They  are  working  girls.  Eentals  and  eating  is  high 
in  Aberdeen,  and  I  don't  believe  that  they  coidd  alTord  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  want  to  get  the  date  fixed  about  this  exactly, 
so  I  will  refer  to  this  paper  again.  "  September  4."  Do  you  know 
whether  that  Avas  the  day  that  Gov.  Cox,  according  to  this  paper, 
was  making  his  speech  in  Michigan  ?    I  see  the  paper  sa^^s : 

While  Democrats  of  South  Dakota  were  busy  blackjacking  "  $40  eacli  I'rom 
.$120-a-month  girl  clerks  in  the  internal  revenue  office  in  Aberdeen — 

1  am  only  quoting  from  this  just  to  fix  the  date,  just  to  be  sure 
of  it— 

Gov.  James  Cox,  of  Ohio,  Democratic  presidential  candidate,  was  reiterating 
charges,  of  which  no  evidence  could  be  found  by  the  Senatorial  Investigating 
Connnittee  in  Chicago,  that  there  was  a  Republican  "plot  to  l)uy  the  presi- 
dency," etc. 

Do  you  remember  that  this  v/as  the  same  date  that  the  Governot 
was  making  that  kind  of  a  speech  ? 

Miss  Coyne.  No  ;  I  am  not  familiar. 

The  Chairman.  I  thought  that  would  fix  the  date. 

Senator  Reed.  I  hope  you  will  explain  that  term  ''blackjack'-  to 
Senator  Kenyon,  so  he  will  get  its  meaning. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  explain  it.  I  want  you  to  explain  Avhat  you 
mean  by  "blackjack"  letter. 

Miss  Coyne.  "Blackjack"  is  not  my  word.  It  is  a  new  news- 
paper word  for  

The  Chairman.  Blackmail? 

Miss  Coyne.  It  is  a  new  newspaper  word  for  blackmail,  as  I 
understand  it.    That  is  the  word  of  my  editor. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  word  of  your  editor.  You  Avould  use 
a  stronger  word  if  you  could  have  thought  of  it,  I  suppose.  If  there 
is  any  word  that  is  too  strong  to  be  used  for  this,  I  don't  know  it, 
and  I  don't  think  the  English  language  contains  it.  Anything  more 
you  can  tell  us  about  this?  Do  you  know  whether  this  process  has 
been  carried  on  in  other  States?    Have  you  followed  it  up  at  all? 

Miss  Coyne.  No,  sir;  I  have  not.  It  was  purely  a  local  stoiy 
with  me. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  realized  the  story  value  of  it,  of  course, 
and  so  followed  it  up  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  avIio  of  these  girls  are  here  ? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  just  now  saw  Miss  Jessie  Barchard. 
The  Chairman.  Are  any  of  the  others  here? 
Miss  Coyne.  I  don't  know. 

The  Chairman.  Any  examination  of  this  young  lady  ? 

Senator  Reed.  No  ;  that  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  Miss  Barchard. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2303 


TESTIMONY  OF  MISS  JESSIE  BARCHARD. 

The  witness  was  sworn  by  the  Chairman. 

The  Chairman,  Please  give  your  name  to  the  reporter.  - 

Miss  Barchard.  Jessie  Barchard. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home,  Miss  Barchard  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Minneapolis. 
The  Chahjman.  Minneapolis? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Will  you  speak  a  little  louder,  please? 
The  Chairman.  Where  are  you  working  now  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  In  Aberdeen,  in  the  revenue  office. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  under  civil  service? 

Miss  Barchard.  Why,  we  never  took  the  examination,  but  after 
we  had  worked  there  over  a  year,  we  automatically  became  civil 
service. 

The  Chairman.  What? 

Miss  Barchard.  We  became  civiL  service. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  civil  service  now? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  3^ou  been  working  for  the  Gov- 
ernment ? 

Miss  Barchard.  About  one  year  and  eight  months. 
The  Chairman.  Were  you  subpoenaed  to  come  here  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir;  I  just  had  a  telegram. 
The  Chairman.  Or  did  you  come  on  a  telegram  from  the  Sergeant 
at  Arms? 

Miss  Barchard.  On  a  telegram.    I  just  got  the  telegram. 

The  Chairman.  What? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  just  got  the  telegram. 

The  Chairman.  From  the  Sergeant  at  Arms,  saying  that  he  had  a 
subpoena  for  you  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  just  requesting  me  to  come  here. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  advised  not  to  come  by  anybody? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  advise  him  you  would  not  come  without 
a  subpoena  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir;  I  did  not.  Nothing  was  said  to  anyone 
at  all  like  that. 

The  Chairman.  You  came  on  his  telegram  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  been  working  at  Aberdeen? 
Miss  Barchard.  Since  a  year  ago  last  February. 
The  Chairman.  And  in  what  capacity  are  you  working?  Are 
you  a  stenographer  or  a  clerk? 

Miss  Barchard.  Calculator  operator. 
The  Chairman.  What? 
Miss  Barchard.  Calculator  operator. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Calculator  operator? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  does  Marion  Kennedy  do  there  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  She  is  a  stenographer. 

The  Chairman.  AVhat  is  her  salary,  do  you  know  ? 


2304 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Barciiari).  $120  a  month. 

The  Chairman.  And  what  is  your  sahiry? 

Miss  Barchard.  The  same. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  knoAv  Miss  Sigrid  Holhind? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes.  sir. 

The  Chairjian.  What  is  her  salary? 

Miss  Barchard.  The  same. 

The  Chairman.  And  Miss  Jessie  Barchard? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  her  work? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  am  Miss  Barchard. 

The  Chairman.  I  be*::  your  pardon.    Miss  Grace  Curtis? 

Miss  Barchard.  She  is  a  calcidator  operator. 

The  Chairman.  y\^hat  is  her  salary? 

Miss  Barchard.  $120. 

The  Chairman.  Miss  Ruth  Kelly? 

Miss  Barchard.  Stenoojrapher. 

The  CnAiRiSiAN.  The  same  salary? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  Edith  Smith? 

Miss  Barchard.  Steno<rrapher. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  other  yoimo-  ladies  are  Avorking  there? 

Miss  Barchard.  There  are  about  30  altogether,  I  imagine. 

Senator  Pomerene.  About  hoAv  many? 

The  Chairman.  About  30? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir ;  about  30. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  a  Federal  building  there? 

Miss  Barchard.  What  is  that? 

The  Chairman.  A  Federal  building? 

Miss  Barchard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Where  do  3^ou  work? 

Miss  Barchard.  In  the  Citizens  Bank  Building. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  collector's  office  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  who  is  the  collector  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Mr.  Mee. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  read  this  story  in  the  Aberdeen  paper 
concerning  the  "  black  jack  "  or  blackmail  letters? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  receive  one  of  those  letters? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes;  I  did. 

The  Chairman.  Have  3^011  that  letter  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  have  it,  but  it  is  torn  up. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  it,  but  it  is  torn  up  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  irive  us  the  torn  up  letter,  the  torn  up  pieces 
of  it. 

Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  believe  I  have  it. 
The  Chairman.  When  did  you  tear  it  up  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Oh,  shortly  after  I  got  it.  I  got  it  on  a  Wednes- 
day. 

The  Chairman.  You  got  it  Avhen? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  got  it  on  a  Wednesday. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2305 


The  Chairman.  Wednesday  of  last  Aveek? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  tear  it  up  before  you  Avere  requested  to 
come  here  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  anybody  advise  you  to  tear  it  up  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Xo.    I  was  just  going  to  throw  it  away.    I  have 
not  got  it  with  me. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  have  it,  and  maybe  we  can  put  it  together. 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  have  it  with  me. 
The  Chairman.  You  have  not  got  it  with  you  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  if  you  haven't  it,  is  the  copy  that  is  in  the 
paper  that  I  read  to  Miss  Young,  or  Miss  Coyne,  correct? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  you  do  after  you  secured  this  letter? 
Did  you  go  to  the  Sherman  Hotel  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  Avent  there  Friday  evening. 
The  Chairman.  Friday  evening? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  other  girls  with  you? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  there  were  a  fcAv. 

The  Chairman.  How  many? 

Miss  Barchard.  Around  a  dozen,  I  imagine. 

The  Chairman.  A  dozen? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  they  all  have  letters  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Not  all  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Hoav  did  those  Avho  did  not  have  letters  happen 
to  go  there  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  We  all  Avent  along  together,  just  to  talk  to  Mr. 
A\'aterbury. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  had  letters? 
Miss  Barchard.  1  could  not  say. 

The  Chairman.  But  a  number  of  them  did,  did  they  not? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  got  up  to  that  room,  Avhat  happened? 
Miss  Barchard.  Why,  I  just  talked  to  Mr.  Waterbury. 
The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say? 

Miss  Barchard.  Why,  he  just  Avanted  to  knoAA-  if  Ave  came  up  there 
and  wanted  to  contribute. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  tell  him  that  you  had  received  the  letters? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  remember  if  anything  Avas  said  about  the 
letters  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  the  purpose  seemed  to  be  clearly  understood 
as  to  Avhy  you  were  there  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  There  was  no  trouble  about  that.  * 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say  about  contributions  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Why,  Ave  talked  it  OA^er,  and  Ave  girls  decided  that 
we  Avould  give  the  $40. 

The  Chairman.  That  they  should  each  give  $40? 


2306 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  fix  that  as  the  amount  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Why,  he  mentioned  it ;  yes. 
The  Chairman.  And  you  all  agreed  to  that,  did  you? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  any  of  you  tell  him  that  it  would  be  a  hard- 
ship, that  it  was  too  much  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  did  not  hear  any  one. 

The  Chairman.  I  see  this  story  says  that  the  rumor  around  the 
office  was  that  it  would  be  $50  from  each  girl  when  they  got  up  to 
Democratic  headquarters. 

Miss  Barchard.  1  did  not  hear  anything  like  that. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  hear  anything  like  that? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  But  how  did  you  reach  the  sum  of  $40?  Why 
was  it  not  $80,  or  why  was  it  not  $20  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  could  not  say. 
The  Chairman.  You  could  not  say  that? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say  about  your  jobs  depending  on  it? 
Miss  Barchard.  Not  a  thing.    Nothing  was  said  about  our  jobs 
at  all. 

The  Chairman.  Nothing  was  said  about  jobs? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say  about  the  necessity  of  raising 
this  money  for  the  Democratic  campaign  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Nothing  was  said  like  that.  They  were  just 
taking  

The  Chairman.  Well,  did  vou  understand  what  you  were  giving 
it  for? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  What  for? 

Miss  Barchard.  For  the  Democratic  campaign,  to  help  in  the 
campaign  expense. 

The  Chairman.  There  was  not  any  mistake  about  that,  was  there  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  known  Mr.  Waterbury  before? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir.  | 
The  Chairman.  Did  he  say  anything  to  you  about  traveling! 
around  the  State  to  other  places  ?  1 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  But  it  was  just  a  polite  and  gentlemanly  request 
to  pay  $40. 

Miss  Barchard.  Not  really  a  request.  It  was  just  more  of  a  sug- 
gestion. 

The  Chairman.  A  suggestion? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  fell  in  with  the  suggestion? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  pay  it  in  checks  there  at  the  time? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  did. 

The  Chair]\[an.  You  gave  him  a  check  for  $40  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No  ;  I  gave  him  two  checks. 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2307 


The  Chairman.  Now,  just  what  did  you  give  him  in  the  way  of 
checks  i 

Miss  Barchard.  Two  $20  checks. 
The  Chairman.  Two  $20  checks? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Payable  when? 

Miss  Barchard.  The  1st  of  September  and  the  1st  of  October. 

The  Chairman.  The  1st  of  September  and  the  1st  of  October.  Has 
the  September  one  been  paid? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  suppose  so.   I  have  not  got  my  checks  yet. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  October  one,  of  course,  that  is  not  paid. 
Have  you  any  sources  of  income  besides  your  salary  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  the  money  that  you  paid  to  him  for  the 
Democratic  fund  comes  out  of  your  salary  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  receive  the  letter  requesting  you  to  call, 
in  the  office  where  you  were  w^orking? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Was  it  sent  to  your  home  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  it  have  a  special  delivery  stamp  on  it? 
Miss  Barchard.  No  ;  it  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  Did  it  have  a  stamp  on  it,  "  Deliver  at  home,"  a 
rubber  stamp  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Nothing ;  only  my  address  and  a  1-cent  stamp,  and 
it  was  unsealed. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  any  of  these  girls  got  the 
letters  at  the  places  where  they  were  working  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  think  they  did. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  not  think  they  did? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  he  get  your  names? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  know. 
The  Chairman.  Did  he  have  a  list  of  names  ithere  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  did  not  see  it. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  ask  the  girls  what  their  names  were? 
Miss  Barchard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Did  all  of  these  12  girls  give  checks  for  S40  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Not  all  of  them ;  no. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  of  them? 

Miss  Barchard.  Six ;  about  six  of  us,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  What? 

Miss  Barchard.  About  six  of  us. 

The  Chairman.  Six  of  you.  And  about  how  many  were  there 
altogether? 

Miss  Barchard.  About  a  dozen. 
The  Chairman.  About  a  dozen? 
Miss  Barchard.  Or  more. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  why  did  not  those  other  girls  give  checks? 
Miss  Barchard.  Oh,  perhaps  they  did  not  want  to.    I  could  not 
say.    I  did  not  speak  to  any  of  them  about  it. 

182774— 20— PT  16  3 


2308 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  What  is  the  politics,  do  you  know,  of  these  differ- 
ent girls  ?    Are  they  Republicans  or  Democrats  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  know. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  that? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  your  politics?  Or  have  you  not  decided 
yet? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  am  a  Democrat. 
The  Chairman.  What? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  am  a  Democrat. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  a  Democrat? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  now  that  you  were  not  advised  by  lawyers 
that  you  did  not  have  to  come  down  on  the  notice  sent  you  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Why,  I  received  the  telegram  Thursday  evening, 
but  I  could  not  get  ready. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  did  not  hear  that  last. 

Miss  Barchard.  I  say,  I  received  the  telegram  Thursday  evening, 
and  I  telegraphed  Senator  Kenyon  and  waited  to  hear  from  him  ;  and 
in  the  afternoon  Chief  Walker  sent  down  an  officer  and  told  them 
that  I  had  to  come. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  not  receive  my  reply  to  your  telegram  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  I  replied  to  your  telegram  at  once. 
Miss  Barchard.  I  did  not  get  a  word. 
The  Chairman,  You  have  not  received  it  yet? 
Miss  Barchard.  Not  yet. 

The  Chairman.  It  must  have  gone  by  Burleson's  mail.  Then  you 
say  an  officer  came  and  told  you  you  must  come  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  was  not  at  home  at  the  time,  but  he  told  my 
folks  that. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  in  Minneapolis  at  the  time? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  not  lawyers  come  to  you  and  tell  you  that 
you  need  not  come  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  this  officer  interfere  in  it  at  all  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  Why,  through  Mr.  Walker. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Through  whom? 

Miss  Barchard.  Through  Mr.  Walker,  the  chief  of  police. 
The  Chairman.  What  did  the  chief  of  police  have  to  do  with  it  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  we  were  advised — I  will  be  perfectly  frank 
about  it — that  you  had  been  told  by  lawyers  that  you  need  not  come. 
Miss  Barchard.  Indeed,  no. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  perfectly  true ;  you  did  not  have  to  come 
on  the  message,  but  you  could  have  been  subpoenaed.  We  have  been 
getting  witnesses  that  way,  the  Sergeant  at  Arms  wiring  that  he  has  a 
subpoena.    But  there  is  nothing  to  that. 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  the  chief  of  police  a  Republican  or  Demo- 
crat? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  could  not  say. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2309 


The  Chairman.  Did  you  ever  read  this  article  of  Miss  Coyne? 
Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  "  Eventually  all  of  the  girls  got  their  letters,  or 
were  told  about  them."    I  suppose  that  is  true,  is  it  not  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  could  not  say. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  it  spread  around  the  office  pretty  rapidly 
among  these  girls  that  this  kind  of  letters  were  bein^  sent  out,  did 
it  not  ?  to  5 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  "  So  frightened  were  they  over  the  pros- 
pects of  losing  that  $120  monthly  that  several  of  them  did  not  wait 
with  the  letters,  but  went  with  the  others  to  room  213  in  the  Sherman 
Hotel,  and  paid  up." 

Miss  Barchard.  I  do  not  think  there  was  anyone  afraid  they 
would  lose  their  positions. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  think  they  were  afraid  of  losino-  their 
jobs?  ^ 

Miss  Barchard.  No,  indeed  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  the  girls  there  all  contributed  out  of 
their  enthusiasm  to  the  Democratic  cause  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  think  that? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  do. 

The  Chairman.  They  were  all  Democrats,  were  they  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir,  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  All  of  those  girls  were  Democrats  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  The  12  girls  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  From  what  they  said. 

The  Chairman.  So  this  is  just  a  spontaneous  outburst  of  enthu- 
siasm ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Evidently. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  suggestions  made  up  in  room  213 
of  what  they  would  do  with  the  money  when  they  got  it  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  told  you  these  were  purely  voluntary  contri- 
butions ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  did  not  say  a  word  about  jobs,  or  coming 

across  ? 

Miss  Barchard.  Not  a  thing. 
The  Chairman.  Not  a  thing? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Or  anything  about,  "  If  Cox  were  not  elected  they 
would  lost  their  jobs  " — nothing  at  all  of  that  kind? 

Miss  Barchard.  Nothing  at  all  like  that  was  said. 

The  Chairman.  And  he  said  merely  to  give  what  they  could 
afford  to  give. 

Miss  Barchard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Yes.   But  he  said  $40  was  the  amount. 
Miss  Barchard.  Well,  he  did  not  really  insist  on  that  amount. 
We  could  have  given  just  anything  we  wanted. 
The  Chairman.  How  did  they  all  happen  to  give  $40  ? 


2310 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Barchard.  I  suppose  because  one  girl  gave  $40  first. 
The  Chairman.  Just  because  somebody  started  it  at  $40? 
Miss  Barchard.  I  suppose  that  was  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  would  like  to  ask  you  if  any  of  these  other 
girls  are  here  ?  There  was  one  other  Ave  asked  to  come. 
Miss  Barchard.  Who  was  it,  do  you  know  ? 

The  Chairman.  We  asked  two  besides  you.  Do  you  know  whether 
any  of  them  are  here  ?   You  would  probably  know  them. 
Miss  Barchard.  I  have  not  seen  any  of  the  others ;  no,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  You  have  not  seen  any  of  the  others  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  When  did  you  get  here? 
Miss  Barchard.  Just  this  morning. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 

Miss  Barchard.  The  girl  that  was  in  the  city  with  me,  Miss 
Holland,  did  not  hear  a  thing. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  she  come  down  on  this  ? 
Miss  Barchard.  No,  sir;  she  did  not  come. 

The  Chairman.  No,  there  was  another  one,  but  I  do  not  remem- 
ber her  name. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  any  of  these  other  young  ladies  come 
down  to  Chicago? 

Miss  Barchard.  I  have  not  seen  any  of  them ;  no,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  We  asked  for  three ;  we  asked  them  to  send  three. 

Miss  Barchard.  I  was  in  Minneapolis.   I  came  from  home. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all ;  thank  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  Mr.  Barber. 

FURTHER  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  FREDERICK  COURTENAY  BARBER. 

The  witness,  previously  sworn,  was  recalled. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Barber,  you  handed  me  a  moment  ago  this 
paper,  which  purports  to  contain  a  list  of  the  teams  of  the  division 
organization. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  and  the  team  captains.  i 
Senator  Reed.  But  it  does  not  contain  a  list  of  the  executive  com- 
mittee, does  it? 

Mr.  Barber.  Only  the  chairman — or,  yes,  sir;  they  ought  to  have 
two  or  three  names  on  there  of  men  who  are  on  the  executive  com- 
mittee. Mr,  Merrick's  name  is  on  there.  He  is  on  the  executive  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Reed.  But  there  is  no  list  of  the  executive  committee 
itself. 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  there,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  now,  you  told  me  a  moment  ago  in  conversa- 
tion that  you  had  a  list  of  all  of  those  members,  and  that  it  would 
take  some  time  to  copy  it,  and  I  said  to  you  that  you  could  copy  it 
and  send  it  to  the  committee. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  will  you  also  send  at  that  time  the  names  of 
the  executive  committee — or  have  you  them  now? 
Mr.  Barber.  They  are  right  here,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2311 


Senator  Eeed.  I  will  just  read  them  into  the  record. 

Mr.  Barber.  These  names  represent — these  men  also  are  in  Divi- 
sion A.   The  two  terms  are  interchangeable. 

Senator  Keed.  Division  A  of  the  executive  committee  is  composed 
of  the  following  men : 

Frank  C.  Letts,  122  South  Michigan  Avenue;  James  A.  Patten,  111  West 
Jackson  Boulevard ;  E.  F.  Carry,  80  East  Jackson  Boulevard ;  Charles  W,  Folds, 
208  South  La  Salle  Street;  H.  M.  Bylle.sby,  208  South  La  Salle  Street;  James 
Simpson,  Marshall  Field  &  Co.,  219  West  Adams  Street ;  Joseph  Feuchtwanger, 
921  West  Thirty-first  Street;  B.  A.  Eckhart,  1300  Carroll  Avenue;  Charles  G. 
Dawes,  president  Central  Trust  Co.  of  Illinois,  125  AVest  Monroe  Street ;  Cliarles 
M.  Seaman,  208  South  La  Salle  Street;  Albert  H.  Loeb,  vice  president.  Sears, 
Roebuck  &  Co.,  Arthington  and  Homan  Avenue;  Col.  Nathan  W.  MacChesney 
(MacChesney  &  Becker),  30  North  La  Salle  Street;  George  F.  Porter,  1610 
First  National  Bank  Building;  A.  Sheldon  Clarke,  vice  president  Sinclair  Re- 
fining Co.,  Ill  West  Washington  Street;  William  E.  Kier,  vice  president  of 
Ex.  commanding  divisions,  B,  E,  F. 

Senator  Reed.  What  does  that  mean  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Vice  president  of  executive  committee,  in  general  com- 
mand of  divisions,  B,  E,  and  F. 

Senator  Eeed.  His  address  is  538  South  Clark  Street.  Now,  I 
notice  there  is  in  pencil  opposite  each  of  these  names  the  letters  O.  K. 
Who  put  those  on? 

Mr.  Barber.  Probably  the  secretary,  who  verified  the  accuracy  of 
the  names,  and  verified  the  fact  that  those  gentlemen  actually  had 
consented  to  serve. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it,  now,  picked  those  men? 

Mr.  Barber.  Some  by  Mr.  Upham,  some  by  Mr.  Piez,  and  then 
in  turn  some  of  these  picked  by  Mr.  Upham  and  Mr.  Piez  would 
suggest  others.  It  grew  in  that  way,  sir,  one  man  suggesting  another. 

Senator  Reed.  So  this  selection  is  in  accordance  with  the  rule  that 
has  been  heretofore  announced,  of  being  carefully  handpicked. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.    I  always  hand  pick  my  men  where  I  can. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  Now,  the  list  of  division  captains  can  be 
printed. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

(The  document  was  marked  "  Barber's  Exhibit  1,"  and  is  attached 
hereto. ) 

Barber  Exhibit  1. 

Chicago  financial  campaign  ivays  and  means  committee  of  Repuhlican  national 

committee. 

[Fred  W.  Upham,  general  chairman  ;  Charles  Piez    chairman  of  exocutive  committee ; 
Frederick  Courtenay  Barber,  director.    Daily  report,  Sept.  ■ — ,  1920.] 

SUMMARY. 

Grand  total  previously  reported  $ 

to-day's  report. 

Division  A  $ 

Division  B  

Division  C  

Division  D  

Division  E  

Division  F  

Division  G  


Total  for  the  day- 
Grand  total  to  date. 


2312 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


day's  report  in  detail. 

Division  A — Harry  A.  Merrick,  chairman: 

Total  for  Division  A  

Division  B — Elmer  Stevens,  chairman : 

Team  11,  Charles  A.  Nowak,  captain  

Team  12,  Earl  Walker,  captain  

Team  13,  Charles  S.  Dewey,  captain  

Team  14,  John  P.  Hovland,  captain  

Team  15,  Frank  D.  Chase,  captain  

Team  16,  Charles  G.  Stevens,  captain  

Team  17,  E.  K.  Orr,  captain  

Team  18,  Frank  A.  Mitchell,  captain  

Team  19,  A.  Clement  Wild,  captain  

Team  20,  Col.  Horatio  B.  Hackett,  captain  


Total  for  Division  B  

Division  C — George  A.  Paddock,  chairman : 

Team  21,  Col.  Rol)t.  Isham  Randolph,  captain. 

Team  22,  Charles  F.  Hough,  captain  

Team  23,  Rodney  C.  Glover,  captain  

Team  24,  H.  J.  Armstrong,  captain  

Team  25,  Carl  T.  Murray,  captain  

Team  26,  Harold  Ambler,  captain  

Team  27,  Cyril  L.  Ward,  captain  

Team  28,  Allan  T.  Gilbert,  captain  

Team  29,  Fritz  Ernst,  captain  

Team  30,  Robert  E.  James,  captain  

Team  3,  Frank  T.  Milchrist,  captain  

Team  4,  Harold  H.  Egan,  captain  


Total  for  Division  C  

Division  D — Robert  McCormick  Adams,  chairman : 

Team  31,  Roger  V.  Flory,  captain  

Team  32,  William  E.  Kier,  captain  

Team  33,  Paul  A.  Westburg,  captain  

Team  34,  August  Wicklund,  captain  

Team  35,  Edwin  K.  Hoover,  captain  

Team  36,  F.  M.  Smith,  captain  

Team  37,  Benjamin  A.  Turner,  captain  

Team  38,  Cyrus  G.  Hill,  captain  

Team  39,  V.  B.  Mayo,  captain  

Team  40,  Lloyd  Maxwell,  captain  


Total  for  Division  D  

Division  E — Farley  Hopkins,  chairman : 

Team  41,  Joseph  D.  Irose,  captain  

Team  42,  Lawrence  Williams,  captain  

Team  43,  Valentine  C.  Bartlett,  captain  

Team  44,  Frederick  West,  captain  

Team  45,  William  Brace,  captain  .  

Team  46,  James  G.  Skidmore,  captain  j. 

Team  47,  Clinton  B.  Amarous,  captain  

Team  48,  J.  Raymond  Garden,  captain  

Team  49,  James  W.  Harnack,  captain  

Team  7,  Edgar  F.  Gates,  captain  

Team  8,  Frank  R.  Colbert,  captain  


Total  for  Division  E  

Division  F — Robert  W.  Dunn,  chairman : 

Total  for  Division  F  

Division  G — Edward  J.  Green,  chairman  : 

Total  for  Division  G  

Senator  Reed.  Now,  3^011  stated  to  me — I  will  hand  this  list  to  the 
reporter — that  you  wanted  to  make  some  explanation  of  your  testi- 
mony in  regard  to  a  matter  you  had  not  been  entirely  clear  on  this 
morning. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2313 


Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.  I  remember  that  the  $700,000  amount  was 
mentioned  to  me  by  several  persons.  It  is  \ery  ordinary  experience 
on  my  part,  if  I  come  to  a  town  to  raise  a  definite  sum,  either  the  men 
I  meet  do  not  think  I  can  do  it  at  all,  or  they  think  I  can  raise  several 
times  as  much ;  so  it  is  not  uncommon  for  a  man  to  say,  "  Well,  if  you 
can  get  a  half  a  million,  why  not  make  it  a  million,  or  two  or  three?" 
These  men,  of  course,  are  thorns  in  my  side.  I  wished  particularly, 
sir,  to  get  in  this  correction,  that  I  recall  seeing  at  some  time  in  the 
past  few  weeks,  in  printed  form— whether  on  a  memorandum  sheet, 
printer's  proof,  or  letterhead,  I  can  not  be  sure — the  amount  $700,000, 
Avhich  I  immediately  in  person  corrected  to  $500,000. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  saw  that  up  at  headquarters,  did  you? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  in  the  headquarters. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  had  these  talks  about  $700,000  with  men 
connected  with  headquarters  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  do  you  remember  wdiether  you  talked  to  the 
treasurer  about  that  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  had  these  talks  before  you  saw  this  paper, 
or  afterwards  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Probably  some  both  before  and  after. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  read  the  Chicago  paper  since  you  have 
been  here,  I  suppose,  in  a  general  way? 

Mr.  Barber.  Only  intermittently.  Senator.  I  have  been  so  very 
much  rushed  with  the  preparation  for  the  campaign,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  But  do  you  remember  seeing  this  article 
in  the  Chicago  News  of  August  11,  which  I  hand  you? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.  That  was  undoubtedly  an  error  on  the  part 
of  somebody  in  my  department,  or  else  some  one  taking  a  mere  casual 
discussion  for  granted  as  a  settled  official  matter. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  there  had  been,  then,  a  discussion  of  $700,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  there  had. 

Senator  Reed.  And  somebody  sent  dow^n  to  the  newspaper  a  state- 
ment of  $700,000  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Either  that,  or  talked  to  the  reporter  about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  Well,  this  is  the  article  referred  to  by  one  of 
the  witnesses  as  having  been  sent  down,  and  then  modified  only  as  to 
phraseology  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all.  I  put  in  evidence  now  the  article  re- 
ferred to  this  morning,  which  I  noAv  have.  Oh,  by  the  way,  you  have 
40  teams;  that  is,  you  started  to  organize  40  teams. 

Mr.  Barber.  I  think  we  have  about  45  or  50,  sir.  If  you  will  let  me 
take  a  moment  to  count  I  can  tell  you  exactly. 

Senator  Reed.  Well  

Mr.  Barber.  The  number  would  be  nearer  45  than  50,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Yes  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  There  are  one  or  two  teams  that  have  been  established 
since  this  was  printed. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  started  out  to  raise  40  teams,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  originally  hoped  to  have  50,  but  I  had  to  let  that 
come  down  to  the  present  number. 


2314 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Well,  now,  on  August  11  joii  had  gotten  down  to 
40.   Now  you  have  increased  a  little  bit. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir;  it  has  increased. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  this  part  of  the  article  written  on  August  11 
was  correct: 

Forty  teams  of  ardent  Republicans,  eacli  with  a  plea  that  is  expected  to 
loosen  the  purse  string  of  many  a  Chicagoan,  will  be  turned  loose  upon  Chicago 
and  (look  ('.(mnty  within  the  next  few  days  in  an  effort  to  secure  $700,000  for 
campaign  purpos(^s. 

Mr.  Barber.  The  number  is  correct  as  to  the  number  of  teams.  •  - 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  Forty  was  contemplated  at  that  time ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  had  heard  the  $700,000  mentioned  around 
headquarters? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir;  but  it  had  not  been  made  official. 

Senator  Reed.  It  had  not  been  made  official;  but  about  that  time 
trouble  commenced  over  campaign  disclosures,  and  after  some  fur- 
ther consultation  you  announced  $500,000? 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  in  connection  with  anything  such  as  you  have 
related,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  not  in  connection  with  it,  but  at  about  the 
same  time. 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  have  in  my  own  mind  never  departed  from 
$500,000  as  being  the  objective,  because  that  was  the  amount  I  came 
here  to  raise.  Therefore,  I  would  not  pay  much  attention  to  what 
somebody  else  said. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  fix  that  amount,  or  did  somebody  else 
fix  it? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  fixed  it  in  the  long  run.  When  they  talk  of 
large  amounts,  I  let  them  rave  on,  but  I  fix  the  objective  which  I 
think  can  be  attained. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it  talked  about  the  large  amounts  that  you 
allowed  to  rave  on? 

Mr.  Barber.  Oh,  various  men. 

Senator  Reed.  Tell  us  some  of  them. 

Mr.  Barber.  Some  team  captains. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  talking  about  before  you  came  here. 
Mr.  Barber.  Oh,  before  I  came  here? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  would  not  know  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  mean  who  talked  to  you  ?  Who  were  these 
men  around  headquarters  who  talked  to  you?  They  were  not  team 
captains. 

Mr.  Barber.  Volunteer  workers  and  team  captains  do  come  into 
headquarters. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  but  these  men  who  talked  to  you  at  headquar- 
ters about  the  $700,000,  you  do  not  mean  that  they  were  team  cap- 
tains, do  you? 

Mr.  Barber.  Some  of  them  were.  Some  of  them  probably  also 
were  directors  from  other  States  who  would  come  in  and  talk. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  directors  from  other  States  came  and  dis- 
cussed Chicago?  Were  some  of  them  the  men  at  headquarters  who 
are  running  this  campaign? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2315 


Mr.  Barber.  Xo,  sir ;  because  I  am  running  the  campaign. 
Senator  Reed.  I  mean  by  running  the  campaign  the  national  cam- 
pai2;n. 

Mr.  Barber.  I  should  not  be  surprised  if  at  least  one  of  them  might 
have  been. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  who  was  that  one? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  can  not  be  absolutely  sure,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  give  us  your  best  recollection. 

Mr.  Barber.  Why,  I  have  no  doubt  that  I  have  discussed  with  Mr. 
Owen,  probably,  as  being  the  divisional  director  of  the  Central  West, 
various  amounts  in  connection  w^th  Chicago. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  Did  you  ever  discuss  the  amounts  with  Mr. 
Upham  I 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir.  That  is  to  say,  there  was  not  an  awful  lot 
of  discussion  about  it.  Mr.  Upham  would  say  something,  and  I  would 
listen,  and  not  contradict  him,  all  the  time  having  my  own  plan  in 
mind. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  now,  while  you  kept  in  your  own  mind  what 
jou  were  going  to  raise,  what  did  Mr.  Upham  say  about  what  you 
were  to  raise? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  Mr.  Upham  is  not  an  easy  man  to  contradict, 
and  I  used  to  find  that  the  easiest  way  with  him,  sir,  was  to  let  him 
express  his  opinion,  and  go  ahead  with  my  own  plan. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  ask  you  about  going  ahead  with  your  own 
plan,  and  I  did  not  criticise  you.  I  am  trying  to  get  at  what  these 
gentlemen  had  in  mind.  Mr.  Upham  discussed  $700,000  with  you, 
did  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Mr.  Upham  in  some  talk  with  me  mentioned  $700,000, 
but  I  could  not  be  sure,  Senator,  whether  he  said  that  for  Illinois  or 
for  Cook  County.  I  declare,  sir,  I  could  not  be  sure  of  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  see  if  I  can  refresh  your  recollection  from 
■  this  article. 
This  Slim — 

That  is,  $700,000— 

I  "has  been  fixed  as  Ciii('a,i;o"s  share  toward  the  expenses  of  the  campaign  to  make 
Harding-  President,  and  the  method  of  securing  the  fund  is  in  accordance  with 
the  plans  outlined  by  Fred  W,  Upham,  treasurer  of  the  Republican  national 
committee.  "  We  could  raise  the  fund  in  24  hours,"  said  Mr.  Upham  this  morn- 
ing, "  by  seeing  a  few  rich  men,  but  we  wish  this  fund  to  be  subscribed  by  the 
mass  of  Republican  voters  and  not  by  a  few  persons  who  may  have  axes  *- 
to  grind." 

Xow,  does  that  refresh  your  recollection,  that  Mr.  Upham  did  dis- 
cuss the  $700,000  with  you? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  he  did  not  say  anything  like  that,  if  he  men- 
tioned $700,000  in  my  hearing.  You  see,  I  always  looked  to  Mr.  Piez 
as  being  the  actual  head  of  my  campaign,  Mr.  Upham  being,  so  far 
as  Chicago  is  concerned,  only  the  titular  head,  as  a  courtesy  to  him. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  Mr.  Piez,  as  chairman  of  the  executive  committee,  is 
the  real  generalissimo  in  my  eyes. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  where  is  your  generalissimo  to-day,  and  where 
are  your  teams? 

Mr.  Barber.  Why,  the  teams — those  of  them  that  are  in  Chicago 
are  doubtless  out  getting  subscriptions. 


2316 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Yes? 

Mr.  Barber.  We  do  not  rally  on  Saturday  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  but  I  was  asking  you  whether  it  was  not  a 
fact  that  your  team  captains  and  your  teams  have  gone  on  an  excur- 
sion to-day? 

Mr.  Barber.  Some  of  them  have,  sir ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Quite  a  very  large  number  of  them,  was  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  their  expenses  all  paid? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  know  nothing  about  that,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  is  that  excursion  headed  for? 

Mr.  Barber.  Marion. 

Senator  Reed.  Marion,  Ohio? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Piez  is  with  them? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  hope  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it  got  up  the  scheme  of  taking  them  down 
there? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  was  informed  that  several  hundred  business  men 
were  going  to  Marion  to  meet  Senator  Harding.  I  was  informed  that 
some  of  these  men  would  be  my  workers.  Naturally  I  do  not  wonder 
that  they  have  gone.  I  thought  it  was  a  good  plan  for  those  workers 
to  meet  the  man  who  is  at  the  head  of  the  ticket.  Now,  sir,  as  to 
who  got  it  up,  I  declare  I  can  not  tell  you  truthfully.  I  might  make 
a  guess,  but  it  would  be  only  a  guess. 

Senator  Reed.  Whom  did  you  understand  got  it  up  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  suppose  the  national  committee  might  have  at 
least  sanctioned  it,  tacitly,  or  it  could  not  have  gone  on,  unless  these 
men  got  it  up  themselves. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  Mr.  Piez,  who  is  the  generalissimo,  went  and 
a  lot  of  the  army  went  too  ? 


Senator  Reed.  Some  of  the  first  line  and  some  of  the  second  line? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well.  Now,  I  want  to  read  in  the  record  this 
whole  article : 

One  thousand  dollars  donation  is  limit.  The  limit  to  the  size  of  the  sub- 
scription is  $1,000,  and  the  bars  have  been  put  up  against  contributions  from 
corporations.  As  soon  as '  the  drive  gets  under  way,  it  is  the  plan  to  secure 
$100,000  each  day,  so  that  one  week's  effort  will  put  Chicago  over  the  top. 

Is  that  the  plan? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  we  won't  be  trying  for  $100,000  a  day,  sir.  If 
we  get  during  the  first  few  days  around  $40,000  or  $50,000  a  day  it 
will  be  a  healthy  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  expect  to  make  it  average  $100,000  a  day? 

Mr.  Barber.  No,  sir ;  not  that  much  now. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  now  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  $500,000  

Senator  Reed.  Since  you  ha^  e  been  reduced  to  $500,000. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  But  if  it  was  $700,000  you  would  expect  it  to  aver- 
age $100,000  a  day,  which  the  article  states  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  If  this  article  had  been  the  official  plan ;  yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2317 


Senator  Reed.  Well,  if  it  was  sent  down  from  headquarters  to  the 
press  as  the  official  plan,  you  would  not  want  to  say  that  it  was  not 
the  official  plan,  would  you  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Oh  yes,  sir.  I  have  turned  down  and  reversed  many 
things  that  have  come  to  me  from  above. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  speaking  of  your  official  plan.  You  are 
an  emplo3'ee,  of  course. 

Mr.  Barber.  No;  pardon  me.  I  make  a  contract  with  my  clients 
for  the  carrying  out  of  a  certain  undertaking.  I  am  never  employed 
by  anybody. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  when  you  make  a  contract  you  make  a  con- 
tract to  do  a  certain  thing. 
Mr.  Barber.  In  my  own  way. 
Senator  Reed.  In  your  own  Avay  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  what  do  you  get  as  compensation? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  am  taking  for  this  a  very  much  reduced  com- 
pensation, $600  a  week. 

Senator  Reed.  And  any  commissions  and  perquisites  on  the  side? 

Mr.  Barber.  Xo  commissions,  sir.  My  hotel  expenses  are  paid. 
My  traveling  expenses  from  Xew  York  

•Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  make  that  contract  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  In  the  last  few  days  of  June. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  it  in  writing? 

Mr.  Barber.  Just  a  memorandum;  just  a  letter  making  memoran- 
dum of  an  oral  contract. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  have  you  got  that  letter? 

Mr.  Barber.  My  secretary  was  not  at  the  office  when  I  went  over 
to  get  this  paper,  sir.  If  she  is  back  she  must  have  that  letter  in  my 
traveling  file ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  expect  her  back  this  morning,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Would  you  telephone  over  and  get  us  that  letter? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  have  it  sent  over  right  away. 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir ;  certainly. 

Senator  Reed.  Xow,  I  Avill  continue  reading : 

Four  divisions  of  volunteer  worl^ers,  each  having  10  teams,  totaling  400 
persons,  are  now  being  organized  so  that  they  can  unlimber  their  heavy  artil- 
lery and  make  Chicagoans  shell  out.  One  division  which  will  he  watched  with 
unusual  interest  is  division  D,  composed  of  "  first  voters  " — young  men  and 
women  who  have  never  heretofore  balloted  for  a  presidential  candidate. 

Is  that  correct  about  division  D  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  As  nearly  as  possible,  sir.    They  never  before  bal- 
loted in  Chicago,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Very  well. 

Mr.  Barber.  There  may  have  been  one  or  two  men  who  voted  else- 
where. 

Senator  Reed.  But  that  was  the  plan  for  division  D  ? 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir;  we  hoped  to  have  it  100  per  cent  that  way, 
but  probably  have  got  it  about  90  per  cent. 
Senator  Reed.  I  am  continuing  reading : 

Tbe  executive  committee  working  with  Mr.  Upham  in  planning  the  drive  is 
headed  by  Charles  Piez  as  chairman.   The  other  connnitteemen  are — 

That  is  correct,  is  it,  with  Mr.  Charles  Piez  as  chairman  ? 


2318 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Rp:ed  (reading)  : 

The  other  committeemen  are:  Ivan  O.  Ackiey,  W.  T.  Beatty,  H.  M.  Byllesby, 
E.  F.  Carry,  Gen.  Charles  G.  Dawes,  J.  K.  Dering,  B.  A.  Eckiiart,  C.  W.  Folds, 
Joseph  Feuchtwanger,  Col.  R.  P.  Lamont,  A.  D.  Lasker,  Frank  C.  Letts,  Donald 
McLennan,  J.  W,  O'Leary,  James  A.  Patton,  James  Simpson,  George  M.  Sea- 
man, B.  E.  Sunny,  Elmer  Stevens,  H.  A.  Wheeler,  William  Wrigley,  jr. 

That  was  the  committee  as  made  up  at  one  time,  was  it  not? 
Mr.  Barber,  ^es,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  the  whole  article  seems  to  meet  w^ith  your 
approval,  except  that  you  say  you  had  $500,000  in  your  mind,  but 
that  you  had  heard  $700,000  discussed  around  headquarters? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  I  thank  you.  After  the  drive  is  completed  in 
Chicago,  do  you  expect  to  continue  other  drives  in  other  cities  for 
the  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Not  for  the  committee ;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  for  whom? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  I  must  get  back  to  my  own  business.  I  have 
made  a  sacrifice  of  $15,000  or  $20,000  in  doing  this  work,  and  I  must 
get  back  and  make  some  money,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  have  you  been  here  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  have  been  here  since  the  5th  of  July. 

Senator  Reed.  And  gotten  $600  a  week  and  yet  sacrificed  about 
$20,000. 

Mr.  Barber.  If  this  had  been  a  commercial  campaign,  sir,  my 
fee  would  have  been  $2,000  a  week,  plus  expenses. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  do  you  think  a  Senator  ought  to  get  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  1  think  a  Senator  enjoys  such  dignity,  sir,  that  it  can 
not  be  measured  in  money. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  that  is  true,  provided  he  conducts  himself 
in  a  proper  and  dignified  manner.  Now,  you  do  not  expect,  when 
you  say  a  commercial  campaign — what  kind  of  campaigns  have  you 
been  in,  I  will  ask  you  first  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Well,  sir,  for  example,  it  is  very  likely  that  ni}^  next 
campaign  will  be  to  raise  $3,000,000  for  a  hotel  in  a  large  city.  Now, 
for  that  my  retainer  will  be  a  minimum  of  $10,000  and  my  compensa- 
tion will  be  a  minimum  of  $2,000  a  week,  plus  expenses. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barber.  It  is  pretty  hard  work,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  That  is  what  you  are  going  to  do. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  But  have  you  been  engaged  in  any  Red  Cross 
drives  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  Only  as  a  volunteer.  I  never  accepted  any  money 
for  any  of  the  war  work  which  I  did.  - 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  glad  to  know  that,  very  glad  to  know  that.  ' 
Now,  will  you  please  telephone  immediately  to  see  if  you  can  get 
us  this  letter  that  contains  the  memorandum  of  your  contract? 

Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  let  us  have  it,  if  possible,  before  we  adjourn. 
I  would  like  to  have  it. 
Mr.  Barber.  Yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2319 


Senator  Keed.  And  I  would  thank  you  to  stay  here  until  you 
get  it. 

Mr.  Barber,  les,  sir. 
(Witness  excused.) 

The  Chairman.  Now,  these  other  articles  are  going  in.  I  will  put 
in  the  article  Miss- Coyne  referred  to. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  do  not  object  to  it,  but  

The  Chairman.  You  have  been  putting  them  in. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  object  to  that,  but  I  call  your  attention 
to  this  distinction :  The  article  I  put  in  this  morning  the  newspaper 
man  swore  was  an  article  that  was  sent  down  from  headquarters, 
and  the  only  change  in  it  was  as  to  phraseology.  That  is  very  dif- 
ferent from  the  statements  that  might  have  gone  in  from  this  young 
lady.  But  I  do  not  object  to  this  one.  I  simply  do  not  just  want 
my  act  to  be  taken  as  a  precedent. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  have  put  them  in  here  when  you  should 
not  have  done  it  a  good  many  times. 

Senator  Reed.  I  proved  my  article  in  a  manner  that  would  have 
admitted  it  in  a  court  of  justice,  but  I  do  not  object  to  this  one 
going  in.  I  agree  with  you  that  the  assessment  of  these  ladies  is 
outrageous,  but  it  would  not  buy  a  Presidency. 

The  Chairman.  If  they  had  enough  of  them  to  assess,  it  might. 

(The  article  referred  to  is  as  follows:) 

[From  Aberdeen  (S.  Dak.)  American,  Sept.  4,  1920.] 

Miss  Coyne  Tells  Story  of  Expose — Casual  Gonveksation  Leads  to  Uncover- 
ing Democratic  "  Blackjack  "  Scheme — Revenue  Employees  Visit  Demo- 
cratic Agent — Waterbury  Very  Cordial  in  Explanation  of  Amount  to  be 
Contributed. 

At  noon  Friday  I  happened  on  m  story  that  seems  to  impress  this  section  of 
the  country  as  a  supreme  blackjack  act. 

Two  employees  of  the  internal-revenue  otlice,  reputed  to  be  earning  the 
general  wage  of  the  Aberdeen  offices,  $120  a  month,  stopped  me  and  asked  that 
I  assist  them  in  finding  a  position  'that  they  could  care  for  in  evening  hours, 
that  they  might  increase  their  budget  to  cover  a  new  expense  account. 

The  conversation  led  to  a  disclosure  of  a  political  story  in  which  these  girls 
figured.  AVhile  Lida  Young  and  Marion  Kennedy,  the  girls  to  whom  I  was 
speaking,  did  not  receive  letters  from  the  Democratic  committee,  other  girls 
of  the  office  did  and  they  were  given  to  understand  that  a  mimeographed  copy 
of  the  letter  was  mailed  to  each  girl  in  the  department,  and  theirs  had  not 
arrived,  through  a  mistake  in  posting  the  letters. 

EXPECTED  to  PAY  $5  0. 

The  general  rumor  about  the  offices  was  that  a  fund  of  $50  would  be  asked  of 
each  girl  when  they  went  to  the  Denrocratic  headquarters,  which  they  under- 
stood was  established  at  the  Sherman  Hotel. 

Recognizing  that  perhaps  a  local  story  might  be  developed  that  the  Democrats 
of  Aberdeen  had  started  the  fall  campaign  and  were  organizing  and  were 
perhaps  enlisting  members  and  funds  to  the  club,  I  went  to  Edward  McBride, 
chief  of  the  deputy  collectors  of  the  internal-revenue  offices  and  known  in 
Aberdeen  as  an  active  worker  in  the  Democratic  party. 

M 'bride  very  silent. 

He  claimed  to  have  no  knowledge  of  any  activities  of  the  Democratic  Party. 
His  statement  did  not  satisfy  me,  and  I  called  the  Sherman  Hotel,  where  the 
girls  were  told  to  go,  and  asked  for  the  Democratic  headquarters.  The  tele- 
plione  operatoi-  did  not  know  of  such  :ui  address  in  the  hotel,  and  as  I  had 
not  learned  tlie  name  of  the  man  in  cliai-ge.  slie  could  do  nothing  for  me. 


2320  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


William  Young,  chief  clerk  of  the  Aberdeen  revenue  office,  is  another  ac- 
quaintance in  the  revenue  offices,  and  I  called  him  and  put  a  point-blank  ques- 
tion as  to  who  was  in  charge  of  the  Democratic  office  at  the  Sherman  Hotel. 
He  answered  that  Mr.  Waterbury,  father  of  Bryan  G.  Waterbury,  of  the  revenue 
offices,  was  in  the  city  and  was  working  for  a  short  time  for  the  party. 

I  called  Mr.  Waterbury  and  asked  him  about  the  report.  He  admitted  work- 
ing for  the  Democratic  Party,  but  declined  to  make  any  formal  statement  of 
his  work  here.  He  denied  that  he  was  organizing  a  local  club  and  said  that 
this  work  would  come  through  the  State  offices  at  Sioux  Falls. 

MEETS  MISS  YOUNG. 

I  met  Miss  Lida  Young  again  and  asked  her  definitely  what  the  letter  the 
girls  were  receiving  said.  She  repeated  that  part  she  could  remember.  Her 
words  were,  "  There  is  a  Democratic  campaign  going  on  in  the  Nation  and  you 
are  reminded  of  it.  Headquarters  have  been  established  at  Sherman  Hotel, 
and  you  are  asked  to  call  at  room  213." 

This  letter  was  signed  by  E.  M.  Waterbury,  was  the  positive  statement  of 
Lida  in  an  argument  over  his  initials.  The  girls  were  of  the  impression  that 
"  We  will  probably  have  to  dig  up  $50  to  the  campaign  fund  to  hold  our  jobs," 
as  one  of  them  stated. 

Lida  promised  to  go  to  dinner  with  me  at  5.30,  following  her  visit  at  the 
Sherman  Hotel,  room  213. 

As  she  told  of  the  letter  she  mentioned  that  one  of  the  missives  was  at  the 
home  of  Marion  Armatrout. 

While  Marion  was  still  at  work,  I  went  to  her  home  and  obtained  the  letter 
from  her  mother,  copied  it  word  for  word,  and  returned  to  the  office,  where  I 
tiled  an  affidavit  that  the  copy  of  the  letter  was  correct  and  was  just  as  I  had 
seen  it. 

TELL  STORY  AT  DINNER. 

At  dinner  Lida  told  of  going  to  the  Sherman  Hotel  with  13  of  the  girls  from 
the  office.  She  said  they  were  not  detained  much  over  two  minutes,  and  that 
Mr.  Waterbury  was  very  cordial  and  put  the  matter  to  them  fully  in  a  few 
words.  Eight  of  the  girls  left  the  room  after  his  explanation  while  the  remain- 
ing five  filled  out  checks  for  the  amount  he  mentioned  and  the  amount  they 
knew  Miss  Ruth  Kelly  had  given  in  the  afternoon. 

According  to  three  of  the  girls  to  whom  I  have  talked,  Mr.  Waterbury  allowed 
them  the  privilege  of  paying  for  the  fund  in  two  payments  of  $20  each.  Several 
of  the  girls,  including  Lida,  gave  post-dated  checks,  payable  on  October  1  and 
November  1. 

Lida  told  of  the  girls  who  gave  to  the  fund — Sigrid  Holland,  Jessie  Barchard, 
Selma  Schleunes,  Marion  Kennedy,  and  herself — and  later  Misses  Holland  and 
Barchard  listed  the  same  girls. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  Mr.  Barber,  what  are  the  chances?  Is  this 
letter  going  to  be  here  ? 

Mr.  Barber.  I  have  not  yet  heard,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  we  will  let  you  put  it  in  the  record  later. 
We  will  let  you  furnish  it  to  us. 

Mr.  Barber.  I  just  got  word,  sir,  about  5  minutes  ago,  to  my  secre- 
tary and  instructed  her  to  go  through  the  files  and  bring  it  right 
over  here.  I  expect  it  in  any  minute,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  we  will  let  you  put  it  into  the  record  when 
it  comes.   Now,  have  you  anj^thing  further.  Senator  Reed? 

Senator  Reed.  Did  that  letter  come  ? 

The  Chairman.  No.  It  will  be  here,  though,  and  it  can  be  put  into 
the  record  later. 

Mr.  Barber.  It  will  be  if  it  is  over  in  that  file,  sir.  If  not,  I  will 
search  my  room  as  soon  as  I  get  back  to  my  hotel. 

The  Chairman.  Very  well.  That  can  be  furnished  later.  This 
committee  is  adjourned,  to  meet  later  at  the  call  of  the  Chair. 

(And  thereupon,  at  12.08  p.  m.,  the  committee  adjourned,  subject 
to  the  call  of  the  Chair.)  A 


m  LiBKAHY  CF  THE 
DEC  12  1331 

UNiVEESlTY  CF  ILLINOIS. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PKIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGEESS 

SECOND  SESSION 

PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
•  IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  17 


Printed  for  the  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 

THt  UBRABY  Of  Tiic 

DEC  12  1931 
UNIVERSITY  OF  ILLINOIS. 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S.  KBNYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C,  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


StJBCOMMITTEE  ON  S.  ReS.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMES  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


II 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


WEDNESDAY,  SEPTEMBER  22,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Washington^  D.  C. 
The  subcommittee  met  at  10.30  o'clock  a.  m.  in  Room  426,  Senate 
Office  Building,  AVashington,  D.  C,  Senator  William  S.  Kenyon 
presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman) ,  Edge,  Reed,  and  Pomerene. 
TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  JAMES  W.  GERARD. 

(The  witness  was  dul}^  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  I  suppose  it  will  not  be  necessary  to  ask  any  pre- 
liminary questions.   Everybody  knows  you,  Mr.  Gerard. 

Are  you  connected  in  any  way  now,  Mr.  Gerard,  with  any  com- 
mittee receiving  money  for  the  Democratic  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  position? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Chairman  of  the  finance  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Tell  us  just  what  that  committee  is. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  received  a  telegram  from  Gov.  Cox  asking  me  to 
see  Senator  Harrison  and,  if  possible,  to  comply  with  the  request 
that  he  would  make.  Senator  Harrison  asked  me  to  become  chair- 
man of  the  finance  committee  and  assist  them  in  raising  funds. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  ago  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  that  was  immediately  before  Labor  Day, 
probably  the  4th  or  5th  of  September. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  members  are  there  of  this  committee 
and  how  is  it  constituted  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  T  then  asked  a  number  of  gentlemen  to  assist  me. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  in  your  hands  the  formation  of  the 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  committee  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  John  G.  A,gar,  a  lawyer  in  Xew  York;  Allen  A. 
Ryan:  Charles  B.  Alexander;  John  B.  Stanchfield;  Morgan  J. 
O'Brien:  Thomas  L.  Chadbourne;  William  Church  Osborn;  R. 
Thornton  Wilson:  Frank  M.  Patterson:  Frank  I.  Crocker;  George 
Gordon  Battle;  Mrs.  Daniel  O'Day;  Gordon  Auchincloss;  Percy 
Straus;  Paul  Fuller,  jr. — I  think  that  comprises  all  those  who  have 
accepted. 

The  Chairman.  Were  others  invited  ? 

2321 


2322 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  Others  were  invited,  a  few  others.  Mr.  Nathan 
Straus  I  have  not  yet  heard  from.  I  think  that  is  all  that  I  can 
recall.    Those  are  the  ones  that  have  been  invited  and  accepted. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  not  invited  Mr.  Bernard  Baruch? 
How  did  you  overlook  him  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  asked  him  if  he  wanted  to  serve,  and  he  said  he  did 
not  care  to  serve. 

The  Chairman.  So  he  was  invif  ed  and  declined  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Does  he  hold  any  position  with  your  committee, 
an  officer  or  otherwise  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir ;  none  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  give  us,  Mr.  Gerard,  the  address  of 
these  various  persons.    We  would  like  to  have  them  for  the  record. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  I  can  give  you  the  addresses.  They 
are  all  in  New  York  except  Mrs.  O'Day,  who  lives  at  Rye. 

The  Chairman.  Thej  are  all  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Gerard.  All  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  Is  the  main  financial  committee  to  raise  funds  for 
the  campaign? 

Mr.  Gerard.  As  you  see,  it  is  an  informal  method  of  doing  it.  I 
have  also  telegraphed  to  various  people  throughout  the  country,  in 
other  States. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  committees  in  other  States? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  endeavoring  to  form  an  organization  in  each 
State  to  form  committees  and  to  ask  the  people  in  the  different 
States  through  the  country  to  assist  in  forming  organizations  in 
order  to  raise  money.  That  is  being  done  partly  by  me,  partly  tele- 
graphing and  obtaining  names  of  prominent  Democrats  who  would 
undertake  the  work,  and  partly  by  Mr.  Jamieson,  who  is  a  regular 
employee  of  the  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Jamieson  works  in  conjunction  with  you,  or 
under  you? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  working,  you  might  say,  independently. 
The  Chairman.  Your  organization  is  raising  funds  independently 
of  the  Jamieson  organization? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  plan  to  have  an  organization  in  every  State 
in  the  Union  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  trying  to  get  people  to  say  that  the}^  will  collect 
funds  for  the  Democratic  Party  in  each  State. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  limit  on  the  amount  to  be  collected 
from  any  individuals? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  take  any  amount  you  can  get? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  will  take  any  amount  I  can  get. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  give  us  the  names,  in  some  of  the  States, 
of  those  who  are  doing  the  work?  Take  the  State  of  Indiana,  for 
instance. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  not  a  list  of  the  ones  who  accepted  yet,  be- 
cause Ave  have  not  heard  from  everybody  yet. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  list  of  those  you  have  asked  to  accept? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  I  have  that ;  no. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2323 


The  Chairman.  You  say  you  can  not  furnish  us  with  a  list  of  those 
you  have  asked  to  serve? 

Mr.  Gekard.  I  suppose  I  can ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  do  that? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes.  • 

The  Chairman.  Give  us  some  of  the  names.  Take  the  States  of 
Indiana,  for  instance,  and  Illinois. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes;  I  have  my  list  here  of  the  ones  that  have  been 
asked  and  have  accepted. 

The  Chairman.  I  wish  you  would  read  those  and  tell  us  who  the 
different  ones  are  as  you  go  along. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  can  not  tell  you  who  they  are.  The  names  were  all 
given  me  in  the  headquarters.  I  sent  telegrams  to  them.  I  have  not 
the  faintest  idea  who  they  are. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  any  of  them? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  know  Mr,  Dockweiler,  of  California.  I  think  he  is 
national  committeeman. 

The  Chairman.  These  are  merely  names,  then,  furnished  you  at  the 
national  headquarters  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Suggestions  made  by  different  people  there.  I  then 
sent  them  telegrams  asking  them  if  they  would  act  and  in  turn  form 
committees  in  the  different  States. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  Avords,  they  are  State  chairmen  under  you  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  care  whether  they  are  under  me  or  inde- 
pendent, as  long  as  they  can  get  some  money. 

Senator  Edge.  Ihey  are  part  of  your  organization,  are  they  not? 

Mr.  Gerard.  They  Avill  simply  collect  the  money  and  send  it  in  to 
the  treasurer. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  requesting  them  to  act  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Certainly;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  to  raise  all  the  mone}^  they  can? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  I  suppose  if  they  raise  $15,000,000  vou  will  take  it  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  $15,000,000?  No.  'Fifteen  million  dollars  would  be  a 
sum  so  large  as  to  shock  the  public  conscience. 

The  Chairman.  You  would  not  take  that  ? 

Mr.  (terard.  No  ;  because  it  would  mean  the  defeat  of  the  party. 

The  Chairman.  Would  you  take  $5,000,000  if  you  could  get  it? 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  is  a  very  difficult  thing  to  state  the  line  between  a 
legitimate  amount  and  

The  Chairman.  No  ;  but  if  they  sent  in  $5,000,000,  are  you  going 
to  return  some  of  it? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  $5,000,000  Avould  be  too  large  a  sum  for  a  na- 
tional campaign.    It  would  cast  suspicion  on  the  whole  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Just  what  will  you  return?  Suppose  you  get 
$4,000,000? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  that  is  too  much. 

The  Chairman.  Three  million? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  three  million  is  too  large  a  sum. 
The  Chairman.  $2,000,000? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  $2,000,000  would  be  ample  for  the  campaign. 
I  would  be  very  thankful  if  I  can  get  a  million. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  gotten  already  ? 


2324 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  $128,000.  I  have  the  exact  figures  for  you 
here. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  if  you  get  over  $2,000,000  you  will  feel  like 
returning  it? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  should;  yes;  personally. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  the  Democratic  Party 
had  four  years  ago? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No;  I  had  other  things  on  hand  four  years  ago.  I 
was  not  watching  the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Eight  years  ago? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  how  much  they  had.  I  Avas  a  judge 
then. 

The  Chairman.  You  contributed? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  was  a  judge  in  our  supreme  court. 

The  Chairman.  You  contributed  to  the  campaign  quite  heavily  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  contributed ;  I  have  forgotten  how  much. 

The  Chairman.  $40,000? 

I- It.  Gf.rard.  Nothing  like  that.  I  remember  giving  $13,000  in  one 
check,  and  I  think  I  gave  some  conlributions  afterwards — probably 
$5,000  more. 

The  Chairman.  If  $2,500,000  was  used  eight  years  ago  or  four 
years  ago,  do  you  think  $2,000,000  would  be  ample  now  to  ca-rry  on 
the  campaign,  with  the  increased  cost  of  everything? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  it  would  probably  cost  more,  but  I  think  two 
million  should  be  ample  to  carry  on  a  campaign  for  the  legitimate 
expenses  of  a  national  campaign.  You  could  spend  more,  and  you 
could  spend  more  legitimately.  It  is  just  a  question  in  my  mind 
where  you  reach  the  point  as  to  where  the  money  is  influencing  the 
electors. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  a  question  we  will  want  to  talk  with  you 
about  later,  probably. 

(The  list  furnished  by  the  witness,  headed  "Members  of  Demo- 
cratic national  finance  committee,"  was  marked  "  Gerard  Exhibit 
No.  1,"  and  is  as  follows :) 

Gerakd  Exhibit  No.  1. 

members  of  democratic  national  finance  committee. 

Alabama  :  W.  T.  Sanders,  Athens. 
Arizona :  James  S.  Douglas,  Phoenix. 
Arkansas:  Lloyd  England,  Little  Rock. 
California :  Isadore  B.  Dockweiler,  Los  Angeles. 
Connecticut:  Frank  Sumner,  Hartford. 
District  of  Columbia :  R.  N.  Harper,  Washington. 
Florida :  Arthur  Y.  Milam,  Jacksonville. 
Georgia  :  Hollis  N.  Randolph,  Atlanta. 
Idaho:  M.  Alexander,  Boise. 

Kansas :  William  M.  Price,  Lyon  County  State  Bank,  Emporia. 

Louisiana:  Thomas  O.  Harris,  Shreveport. 

Maine:  D.  J.  McGillicuddy,  Lewiston. 

Massachusetts,  Marcus  Coolidge,  Fitchburg. 

Michigan:  W.  F.  Connelly,  Detroit. 

Minnesota:  Fred  E.  Wheaton,  Minneapolis. 

Mississippi :  Ben  G.  Humphreys,  Greenville. 

Missouri :  Judge  D.  L.  Taylor,  St.  Louis. 

Montana :  George  L.  Ramsey,  Helena. 

Nebraska :  E.  E.  Howell,  217  South  Fourteenth  Street,  Omaha. 


PKESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2325 


Nevada:  George  B.  Thatcher,  Nevada. 

North  Dakota  :  William  K.  Pottorfield,  Fargo. 

Ohio :  J.  J.  Whitacre,  Canton. 

Oklahoma :  R.  W.  Dick,  Oklahoma  City. 

Oregon  :  Dr.  C.  J.  Smith,  Portland. 

Rhode  Island :  Thomas  H.  Donahue,  Providence. 

South  Carolina :  Gen.  Wilie  Jones,  Columbia. 

South  Dakota ;  James  Mee,  Cent<?rville. 

Tennessee:  T.  R.  Preston,  Chattanooga. 

Texas:  J.  A.  Kemp,  Wichita  Falls. 

Virginia :  Fred  W.  Scott,  Richmond. 

W^ashington :  Arthur  A.  Lewis,  Seattle. 

Wyoming:  P.  J.  Quealy,  Kemmerer. 

The  Chairman.  These  names,  however,  in  the  list  you  have  fur- 
nished us,  marked  "  Gerard  Exhibit  No.  1,"  are  the  names  of  gentle- 
men in  various  States  to  whom  you  have  wired  to  form  an  organiza- 
tion for  the  raising  of  campaign  funds? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  place  no  limit  upon  the  amount  they  shall 
raise  or  the  amount  of  individual  subscriptions  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  these  men  to  go  ahead  in  the  States  and 
get  up  such  an  organization  as  to  them  may  seem  wise  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  organization  you  have  suggested  independent 
of  the  Democratic  central  committee  in  those  various  States  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  that  Jamieson  might  act — Oh  !  You  mean  the 
central  committee  of  the  State  itself? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes ;  independent  of  that. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  your  organization  is  distinct  and 
independent  from  that  of  the  regular  Democratic  State  committee  in 
the  various  States  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  is  independent,  as  far  as  the  money  received 
is  concerned,  from  the  Jamieson  organization  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  To  a  certain  extent,  yes.  It  might  be  that  he  Avould 
telegraph  to  the  same  people  that  I  would. 

The  Chairman.  But  Jamieson  goes  on  with  his  organization  raising 
all  the  money  he  can  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  go  on  Avith  your  organization  raising  ail 
the  money  you  can? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes.  .  , 

The  Chairman.  And,  so  far  as  you  know,  the  State  central  com- 
mittees go  ahead  and  raise  all  the  money  they  can  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  nothing  in  your  plan  to  stop  it  ? 
I     Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

^     The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Allen  A.  Ryan,  of  your  committee  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  the  proprietor — I  believe  he  owns  all  the  stock 
of  the  Stutz  Motor  Co.,  and  is  the  principal  stockholder  of  the  Con- 
tinental Candy  Co.  You  might  know  him  as  the  man  who  has  been 
fighting  the  New  York  Stock  Exchange. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  related  to  the  Ryan  of  Virginia  ? 


2326 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  his  son. 

The  Chairman.  Has  he  made  a  personal  contribution? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Not  yet ;  I  expect  him  to. 
The  Chairman.  Charles  B.  Alexander;  who  is  he? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Charles  B.  Alexander  is  a  retired  lawyer  in  New 
York. 

The  Chairman.  Not  practicing  now? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  practicing  now.  He  was  a  member  of  the  firm 
of  Alexander  &  Green  some  time  ago. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  connected  with  one  of  the  large  life  insur- 
ance companies? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  his  firm  Avas  attorney  for  the  Equitable  Life, 
but  he  has  not  practiced  law  for  a  number  of  years. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  about  his  other  connections  with 
what  are  commonly  termed  "  big  business  "  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not.   I  know  that  his  wife  is  quite  rich. 

The  Chairman.  Is  his  wdfe  a  stockholder  in  some  of  these  concerns 
mentioned  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir ;  I  think  she  has  money  invested  in  some  se- 
curities. 

The  Chairman.  John  B.  Stanchfield — he  is  a  lawyer  in  New  York? 
Mr.  Gerard.  He  ran  at  one  time  for  governor  on  the  Democratic 
ticket. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  his  office? 
Mr.  Gerard.  120  Broadway. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  j^our  office  in  New  York,  Mr.  Gerard? 
Mr.  Gerard.  46  Cedar  Street. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  O'Brien  was  formerly  in  the  supreme  court? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir.  In  fact,  I  succeeded  him  as  a  judge  in  the 
New  York  supreme  court. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Chadbourne;  Avhat  is  his  business? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawyer  at  14  Wall  Street. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  his  business  connections ;  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Why,  I  do  not  know  of  any  particular  business  con- 
nections that  he  has.  I  know  he  is  a  lawyer.  He  is  a  personal  friend 
of  mine.  You  might  say  that  all  members  of  the  committee  are  per- 
sonal friends  of  mine. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Chadbourne  was  instrumental  in  collecting 
money  in  the  Hylan  campaign,  was  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know.   On  which  side  ? 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  remember — anti-Hylan. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  was  contributing  to  the  Hjdan  side,  so  it  squares 
it  up. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Chadbourne  has  been  quite  active  as  an  attor- 
ney for  large  financial  institutions? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  of  any. 

The  Chairman.  A  man  of  very  large  means  himself? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  he  is  fairly  Avell  off. 
'  The  Chairman.  Has  he  been  a  heavy  contributor  to  the  Democratic 
campaign  fund? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  he  contributed  $10,000  in  1916. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  William  Church  Osborn — who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  has  been  prominent  in  the  up- State  Democracy, 
as  we  call  it  in  New  York,  usually  opposed  to  the  Tammanj^  Hall 
end,  as  the  down- State  Democracy  is  called. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2327 


The  Chairman.  Are  you  a  member  of  Tammany  Hall  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  a  member,  and  always  have  been  of  the  regular 
Democratic  organization  of  the  city  of  New  York,  which  is  popularly 
called  Tammany  Hall,  because  it  usually  held  its  conventions  in  a 
building  called  Tammany  Hall;  but  it  is  just  the  same  as  the  regular 
Democratic  organization  of  any  State. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Osborn  is  one  who  has  been  opposed  to  Tam- 
many Hall? 

Mi\  Gerard.  He  has  been  opjDosed  to  those  who  were  in  the  leader- 
ship of  the  XcAV  York  City  end  of  it,  as  a  rule. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  not  a  separate  organization  for  raising 
money  in  Tamman}^  Hall? 

Mi\  Gerard.  You  mean  separate  from  the  regular  democracy? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Oh,  yes;  alwa^^s  has  been.    In  fact,  I  was  at  one 
time  chairman  of  the  campaign  committee  there. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  chairman  of  it  now  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea.    I  think  Mr.  Loft. 
The  Chairman.  AVhat  is  his  first  name? 

Mr.  Gerard.  George  W.  Loft.    He  is  a  manufacturer  in  New 


The  Chairman.  Is  Tammany  Hall  raising  any  money  for  the  cam- 
paign inclependenth^  of  your  committee? 

Mr.  Gerard.  You  mean  the  regular  Democratic  organization  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  suppose  so :  yes.    I  am  quite  sure. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  amount? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  used  to  help  the  national  campaign  as 
well  as  the  State  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  helps  the  Democratic  ticket. 

The  Chairman.  But  what  I  am  trying  to  get  at  is  this :  Does  the 
organization  make  contributions  as  an  organization  to  the  national 
campaign  ? 


The  Chairman.  You  expect  them  to  do  it,  do  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know.  I  haA^e  not  any  idea.  I  have  not 
thought  about  it.   I  do  not  think  they  did  in  1916. 

Senator  Eeed.  That  is  a  good  suggestion,  Senator. 

The  Chair:\[an.  You  have  some  hopeful  prospects  from  Tammany 
Hall? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  they  contributed  in  1916.  They  may 
have,  but  I  did  not  see  it. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  money  they  raised  in 
1916  to  carry  on  the  State  campaign;  to  assist? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  they  raised  this  year  for 
their  State  campaign?   Do  you  know  anything  about  any  budget? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  no  limit  to  what  they  may  raise,  of 
course,  as  far  as  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  The  limit  is  that  nearly  all  the  Democrats  are  poor 


York. 


people. 


2328 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  You  are  a  sample  of  that,  I  suppose  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  not  so  rich. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Chadbourne  and  Mr.  Baruch  

Mr.  Gerard.  That  is  all  rumor.  Thank  Heaven,  we  have  got  a  few 
in  the  Democratic  Party  that  have  money. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  them  to  "  cough  up  "  pretty  liberally 
this  year,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  They  are  as  scarce  as  "  hen's  teeth." 

The  Chairman.  They  seem  to  be.  What  is  the  matter  with  this 
Democratic  fund?  You  do  not  seem  to  find  that  you  have  much 
money. 

Mr.  Gerard.  The  Democratic  Party  is  a  party  of  the  working  man 
and  the  humble. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  true  in  Maine? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  not  been  in  Maine  in  10  years. 

Senator  Edge.  .How  about  that  1916  campaign?  Have  you  lost 
those  willing  givers  since  then? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Oh,  not  so  many. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Cleveland  Dodge  contributed  pretty  liberally- 
then. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  a  little  something  from  him,  I  sup- 
pose ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  would  like  to  get  a  contribution  from  him. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Jones;  you  expect  something  from  him? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Who  is  Jones? 
The  Chairman.  Of  Chicago. 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  him. 

The  Chairman.  He  contributed  very  liberally  and  was  appointed 
to  some  Federal  position. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  never  heard  of  him.  I  went  to  see  Mr.  Dodge, 
whom  I  know  personally,  the  other  day,  but  he  was  out.  I  shall  go 
to  see  him  again. 

The  Chairman.  There  does  not  seem  to  be  so  much  enthusiasm 
about  contributing  this  year. 

Mr.  Gerard.  This  year  over  other  years? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know.    I  was  not  collecting  other  years. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Frank  I  Crocker;  what  is  his  business? 
Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawyer. 
The  Chairman.  What  does  he  do  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  A  general  practicing  lawyer.  ''Bl 

The  Chairman.  I  want  to  ask  you  about  Mr.  Chadbourne.  He  is 
connected  with  the  Midvale  Steel  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  to  my  knowledge.  He  is  a  personal  friend  of 
mine.  I  do  not  know  what  companies  he  is  attorney  for  except  one 
where  I  am  making  a  loan  on  a  building  that  he  is  selling. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  anything  about  his  steel  connec- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir.  I  think  he  has  some  connection  with  the 
Marlin-Rockwell  Co.  I  think  tliey  manufacture  ball  bearings.  He 
has  some  connection  with  them.  Whether  he  is  their  attorney  or  not 
I  do  not  know. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2329 


The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  R.  Thornton  Wilson? 
Mr.  Gerard.  A  young  man  in  New  York,  a  banker. 
The  Chairman.  What  bank  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  A  private  bank,  R.  T.  Wilson  &  Co.  His  grandfather 
was  a  distinguished  banker  in  New  York,  a  private  banker. 

The  Chairman.  What  other  business  connections  does  he  have ;  do 
you  know  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  None,  to  my  knowledge. 

The  Chairinian.  Frank  M.  Patterson? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawyer. 

The  Chairman.  George  Gordon  Battle  is  a  lawyer  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawyer.   He  is  a  brother-in-law  of  ex-Senator 
O'Gorman,  in  general  practice. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Auchincloss  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawyer.   He  is  a  son-in-law  of  Col.  House. 
The  Chairman.  Oh.    He  is  a  son-in-hiAv  of  Col.  House.    He  was 
in  the  State  Department  during  the  war  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Assisted  in  the  negotiations  at  Paris  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  That  I  do  not  know.  I  do  not  know  whether  an}^- 
body  assisted  there. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  not  there  yourself? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  I  was  not  there. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  business  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  AVhose? 

The  Chairman.  Auchincloss's. 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  lawj^er. 

The  Chairman.  Does  he  practice  generally? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  practices  generally,  I  believe. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  special  attorney  for  any  large  concerns? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  to  my  knowledge ;  I  do  not  think  so.  I  think  he 
just  has  a  general  practice. 

The  Chairman.  Paul  Fuller,  jr.? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  member  of  the  firm  of  Coudert  Bros. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  their  business? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Lawyers. 

The  Chairman.  Nathan  Straus? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  in  business  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  business  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  A  department  store  there.  I  do  not  know  whether 
he  has  any  connection  with  it  now  or  not.  Percy  Straus,  who  ac- 
cepted as  a  member  of  the  committee,  is  of  the  same  family. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  interrupt.   Are  they  bankers,  too  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  tried,  I  suppose,  to  get  the  men  whom  you 
felt  would  be  influential  in  raising  money  in  New  York  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  tried  to  get  Democrats  who  possibly  had  influence 
among  those  who  had  money  in  the  business  world. 

The  Chairman.  The  purpose  of  the  committee,  of  course,  is  to 
raise  money. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Absolutely;  certainly. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  no  apologies  to  make  for  that? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  the  slightest.   I  do  not  think  I  should  have. 


2330 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES, 


The  Chairman.  You  tried  to  get  men  who  were  in  touch  with  the 
sources  of  wealth? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Exactly. 

The  Chairman.  So  they  could  make  the  proper  touch.  And  you 
think  you  have  a  pretty  representative  committee  that  can  raise  a 
pretty  substantial  sum  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  so  far  as  I  have  gone.  I  do  not  see  any  signs  of 
raising  any. 

The  Chairman.  After  this  committee  adjourns,  do  you  not  think 
you  may  have  better  success  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  We  are  not  going  to  adjourn. 

The  Chairman.  I  mean  temporarily  adjourn.  I  understand  that 
Mr.  Marsh  sent  a  statement  to  the  committee.  I  have  not  seen  it  yet.- 
Have  you  that  statement  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  You  asked  me  in  your  telegram  for  a  statement  of 
expenditures  and  receipts.  As  you  see,  I  have  simply  come  in  at  the 
eleventh  hour,  or  at  a  quarter  to  12,  you  might  say,  to  try  to  raise 
mone}^  for  the  Democratic  Party.  I  have  nothing  to  do  Avith  keeping 
tab  on  the  total  receipts  or  on  the  expenditures;  but  I  asked  Mr. 
Marsh  to  give  me  that  statement. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  let  us  have  it,  please  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Certainly.  This  is  the  last  date  [indicating].  It  is 
by  dates,  and  this  is  the  last  date  [handing  a  book  to  the  chairman]. 

The  Chairman.  What  does  this  book  you  present  purport  to 
show  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  purports  to  show  the  receipts  of  all  contributions 
received  by  the  national  Democratic  committee  from  any  source. 
The  Chairman.  From  when? 

Mr.  Gerard.  From  the  time  that  they  went  into  operation.  I  be- 
lieve that  there  were  $652  turned  over  to  them  by  the  preceding  or- 
ganization, you  might  say. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  remember  when  that  was? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  suppose  in  July. 

The  Chairman.  This  shovv^s  all  the  receipts  from  that  time — 
July  5  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  so  informed  by  the  treasurer  and  the  cashier. 
As  I  say,  I  do  not  keep  the  receipts. 

The  Chairman.  But  this  purports  to  show  that  up  to  September 
21,  as  you  understand? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes^  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  does  that  total  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  you  will  find  it  totaled  here.  I  did  not  total 
it;  but  the  total  given 'in  this  book  is  $128,821.89.  That  is  up  to 
yesterday  afternoon. 

The  Chairman.  The  lost  item  seems  to  be  Mr.  Baruch  coming  to 
the  rescue  with  $5,000. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  more  $5,000  items? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Oh,  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  appear  here  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  They  appear  there.  Alexander  gave  $5,000;  Mr. 
Doheny  gave  $5,000 ;  August  Belmont  gave  $5,000. 


PKESIDEIsTTIAL  CAMPAIGN"  EXPENSES. 


2331 


The  Chairman.  Who  is  August  Behnont?    Is  he  a  banker? 
Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  hereditary  Democrat. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  one  of  these  poor  Democrats  that  you  men- 
tioned ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  he  has  as  much  money  as  he  had. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  before  he  gave  this  contribution. 
Senator  Edge.  What  is  his  business? 
Mr.  Gerard.  August  Belmont  &  Co.,  private  bankers. 
Senator  Edge.  Where  is  their  office  in  New  York? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  it  is  on  Nassau  Street.    I  am  not  sure.  It 
used  to  be. 

The  Chairman.  Joseph  E.  Willard,  New  York.  Who  is  he?  He 
gave  $5,000. 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  the  ambassador  to  Spain.  I  think  he  is  from 
Virginia. 

The  Chairman.  I  thought  it  was  Virginia.  It  is  shown  as  New 
York. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  is  Mr.  Doheny  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Doheny  was  a  candidate  for  Vice  President  at  San 
Francisco,  among  others. 

Senator  Edge.  I  know ;  but  what  is  his  business  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  in  the  oil  business. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  down  here  ? 

Senator  Edge.  AVhat  is  the  name  of  his  corporation  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  not  sure,  but  I  think  it  is  the  Mexican  Petro- 
leum Co.  or  Mexican  Oil  Co.  or  some  name  like  that. 

Senator  Edge.  And  he  gave  how  much  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  he  is  down  for  $5,000.  It  is  there  in  that  book. 
The  Chairman.  Does  this  Mr.  Willard  own  the  Willard  Hotel 
here?   He  ought  to  be  able  to  give  more  than  $5,000. 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  so,  too. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Alexander  gives  $4,000. 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  gave  another  thousand.  I  sent  him  a  hurry  call 
so  as  to  pay  the  rent. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Doheny,  of  New  York,  $5,000.  Is  his  home  in 
New  York  or  in  California? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  lives  at  the  Plaza  Hotel  temporarily,  in  New 
York,  but  I  know  he  has  a  house  in  Los  Angeles. 

The  Chairman.  E.  L.  Doheny,  again,  $1,500.  He  seems  to  have 
given  $5,000  and  $1,500,  which  is  $6,500. 

Mr.  Gerard.  $6,500 ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  His  oil  interests  are  in  Mexico,  are  they? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir.  I  think  he  may  have  some  in  California: 
I  do  not  know.  It  seems  to  me  I  remember  some  one  pointing  out  an 
oil  well  near  Los  Angeles  and  saying  that  that  was  one  of  his  wells. 
I  do  not  really  know  the  details  of  his  business. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  he  not  an  officer  of  the  Mexican  Petroleum  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  August  Belmont,  $5,000 ;  is  that  the  only  subscrip- 
tion from  the  Belmont  family? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  postmasters  in  here?  Or  does  the 
J amieson  organization  take  care  of  that  ? 


2332 


?KESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  I  gave  directions  that  no  public  officer  was  to  be 
asked  for  money. 

The  Chairman.  I  see  that  Mr.  Koper  is  down  here  for  $500. 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  president  of  a  company  in  New  York.  He  is  not 
an  office  holder. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Shouse.  Is  he  not  an  officer  ?  He  is  Assistant 
Secretary  of  the  Treasury,  is  he  not? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  never  heard  of  him.  I  suppose  his  money  would  be 
accepted  if  he  came  and  gave  it  voluntarily. 

The  Chairman.  I  did  not  know  whether  you  were  willing  to  take 
it  from  him. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  against  asking  them. 

The  Chairman.  That  does  not  apply  to  ambassadors?  Mr.  Wil- 
lard,  for  instance. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Nobody  has  asked  him  for  money.  He  sent  it  in 
voluntarily. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  any  reason  why  an  ambassador 
should  not  make  a  donation  if  he  wanted  to  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Not  the  slightest.  They  are  members  of  the  party 
and  are  interested  in  tlie  success  of  the  party.  I  contributed  in  1916^ 
when  I  was  an  ambassador. 

The  Chairman.  I  see  that  Mr.  McAdoo  contributes  a  thousand  dol- 
lars.   Is  that  since  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  That  is  since  the  convention. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  August  17. 

Mr.  Gerard.  There  is  one  contribution  that  I  could  not  find  there- 
Some  one  said  Mr.  Baker,  the  Secretary  of  War,  had  sent  a  con- 
tribution. 

The  Chairman.  It  does  not  appear  here. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  was  looking  for  it.  It  may  be  there.  It  was  $50.  I 
have  not  seen  it.   Some  Senator  mentioned  it. 
Senator  Reed.  He  wants  to  win  this  war. 

The  Chairman.  I  see  you  have  here,  "August  12,  Iowa  Democratic 
Club,  $5,000."   Do  you  know  what  that  is? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir ;  I  did  not  have  anything  to  do  with  it. 

The  Chairman.  Who  could  enlighten  us  as  to  what  comprises  that 
item — what  those  donations  are? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  Marsh. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Marsh  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  Marsh  comes  from  Iowa. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  did  you  assume  your  duties  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  About  the  6th  or  7th  of  September. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  before  that — August  12.  I  was  interested  in 
knowing  where  those  subscriptions  came  from. 

Senator  Edge.  You  had  nothing  to  do  with  it  before  September  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No;  nothing  at  all.  I  was  tr3dng  to  enjoy  life  before 
then. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  find  the  Baker  contribution.  It  must  be 
a  mistake. 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  may  be  a  false  report. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect,  Mr.  Gerard,  to  go  ahead  and  place 
every  dollar  of  donations  in  this  book  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  That  is.  what  the  treasurer  is  doing. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


233.3 


The  Chairman.  Oh,  Mr,  Marsh  is  handling  that  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  Marsh  gave  me  that  book  and  told  me  it  was  a 
correct  report.   I  do  not  know  myself,  personally. 

The  Chairman.  If  Mr.  Marsh  says  it  is,  it  is.  So  the  committee 
could  at  any  time  secure  this  book  to  see  what  contributions  have 
been  received? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Certainly,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  made  any  budget  of  any  kind  for  the 
campaign  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No;  I  have  nothing  to  do  with  the  expenditures, 
either. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  tell  us  nothing  about  them  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  understood  that  they  expected  to  spend  about 
$225,000  or  $215,000  on  publicity.  Gov.  Cox's  special  train  would 
cost  $100,000,  and  I  think  Senator  Harrison  wants  about  $100,000 
to  send  speakers  out.  Franklin  Roosevelt  has  expenses.  I  think  his 
expenses  have  been  over  $10,000  up  to  date. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  understand  this.  I  have  always  paid  my 
expenses. 

Senator  Edge.  So  have  I. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  never  run  for  Vice  President. 

Senator  Reed.  There  seems  to  be  some  rule  to  apply  Avhen  you  get 
upstairs  that  does  not  apply  in  the  basement. 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  was  understood  that  he  would  make  a  contribution 
of  $5,000. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  Mr.  Roosevelt's  office — in  New  York  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  knoAv.  He  is  in  law  partnership  there  with 
a  gentleman  named  Emmett. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  where  his  office  is  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No.  •  My  impression  is  that  it  is  52  Wall  Street. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  RooseA^elt  has  an  office  in  Wall  Street? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Wall  Street  is  not  such  a  terrible  street. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  heard  so  much  about  the  Republicans 
being  controlled  from  Wall  Street.  Is  it  possible  that  the  vice  presi- 
dential candidate  has  an  office  in  Wall  Street? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  am  not  sure. 

The  Chairman.  You  Avould  not  want  to  say  that  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  would  not  Avant  to  SAvear  to  it. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Gerard,  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  ask  you 
about  your  organization,  but  I  would  like  to  ask  you  this  question: 
I  take  it  from  what  a^ou  say  that  you  are  opposed  to  the  expenditure 
of  enormous  sums  in  campaigns  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  given  any  thought  to  how  that  could  be 
regulated;  Avhat  avouIcI  be  proper  regulation? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  Senator.  I  have  thought  about  the  matter  quite 
seriously,  because  I  Avent  in  the  primary  campaign  in  South  Dakota 
and  I  there  saAv  the  enormous  sums  that  Avere  being  spent  by  Wood 
and  LoAvden,  so  that  Senator  Johnson  and  Senator  Poindexter  did 
not  have  much  chance,  oAving  to  the  amount  of  money,  and  I  was 
trying  to  think  of  some  variation,  some  system ;  but  to  my  mind,  if 
you  do  aAvay  with  the  use  of  money  in  campaigns  you  are  then  going 
to  put  the  elections  of  the  country  in  the  hands  of  the  owners  of 
newspapers.   That  is  the  only  chance. 


2334 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  You  think  there  must  be  considerable  amounts 
expended  for  publicity  outside  of  newspapers? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Absolutely.  Otherwise  you  hand  over  the  country  to 
the  people  that  own  the  newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  It  seems  only  possible  for  people  who  own  news- 
papers to  run  for  President  now.  So  perhaps  we  have  approached 
that  condition  already. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Perhaps  we  are  approaching  it. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  speak  of  being  in  South  Dakota,  where 
you  observed  the  use  of  large  sums  of  money,  in  what  way  did  that 
money  seem  to  be  used? 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  was  used  perfectly  legitimately. 

The  Chairman.  How  was  it  used? 

Mr.  Gerard.  In  publicity,  in  the  hire  of  headquarters  in  the  dif- 
ferent towns,  and  the  enormous  number  of  workers  going  through 
the  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Were  the  workers  paid? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  they  were. 
The  Chairman.  You  were  there  personally? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  saw  these  workers  through  the  State? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir.  I  talked  to  quite  a  number  of  them.  I 
met  them  in  hotels.  I  did  not  have  any  serious  opposition  there.  I 
made  a  short  tour,  speaking  in  a  number  of  towns,  and  of  course  in 
the  hotels  I  would  meet  the  people  who  were  working  for  the  differ- 
ent candidates,  and  I  saw  other  parties,  and  was  told  about  the  meet- 
ings they  had  had  the  night  before,  and  so  on  and  so  forth. 

The  Chairman.  Were  billboard  campaigns  carried  on  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Oh,  yes ;  I  think  so.  There  was  a  blizzard  going  on 
while  I  w\as  there,  so  I  did  not  notice  much  when  I  Avas  out  of  doors. 
But  I  saw  pictures  around  in  rooms  in  the  principal  hotels  in  differ- 
ent tow^ns. 

The  Chairman.  Did  your  experience  in  conducting  the  campaign 
of  your  own  or  from  what  you  observed  in  South  Dakota  give  you 
any  fair  kind  of  an  estimate  of  what  you  believe  the  campaign  cost? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  imagine  that  Wood  and  LoAvden  must  have  spent  at 
least  $125,000  apiece  in  South  Dakota. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  really  think  that  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  say  so  just  as  a  guess,  of  course.  I  do  not  believe 
that  any  candidate  running  independently  or  running  in  the  pri- 
maries could  go  into  any  State  and  make  a  campaign  of  any  kind, 
providing  he  had  an  opponent  who  amounted  to  anything,  without 
spending  at  least  four  or  five  thousand  dollars.  And  if  you  multiply 
that  by  48  States  you  have  got  a  considerable  sum. 

The  Chairman.  I  was  asking  you  about  South  Dakota ;  what  you 
saw  there. 

Mr.  Gerard.  South  Dakota  has  an  extraordinary  law.  It  may  be 
that  that  law  will  become  a  model  

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  this  straight.  I  think  you  misunder- 
stood me.  You  gave  it  as  your  opinion  that  that  amount  was  spent  in 
the  whole  United  States? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  in  South  Dakota,  alone. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  asking  you  how  that  could  have  been  done 
in  South  Dakota. 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAZNIPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2335 


Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  one  of  them — I  have  forgotten  which  one, 
because  it  did  not  really  interest  me  vitally — I  think  some  one  told 
me  that  one  or  the  other  of  those  candidates  had  70  paid  workers  in 
the  State.  Of  course,  you  could  see  the  advertising.  It  cost  money 
to  hire  bands  and  halls  and  for  traveling  expenses  of  all  the  speakers, 
and  so  on. 

The  Chairman.  How  are  you  going  to  get  the  issue  to  the  people 
without  extensive  publicity? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  say  I  do  not  think  you  can.  It  is  just  a  question 
of  a  very  vague  line  as  to  where  the  line  is  between  what  is  a  legiti- 
mate amount  to  spend  and  what  is  an  illegitimate  amount.  It  is 
only  public  sentiment  itself  that  can  decide  that  question.  I  say  I 
think  it  is  necessary  to  have  expenses  in  campaigns,  because  if  you 
don't  you  are  then  handing  the  country  over  to  the  people  who  own 
newspapers,  and  people  will  spend  enormous  sums  of  money  then  by 
buying  newspapers.  If  you.  for  instance.  Senator,  had  a  primary 
campaign  in  Iowa  and  were  not  allowed  to  spend  an}^  money  at  all, 
and  your  opponent  could  control  all  the  newspapers  of  the  State,  3^ou 
would  not  have  much  chance.  That  is  why  it  is  necessary,  probalDly, 
to  continue  this  system,  out  of  mere  necessity. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  there  should  be  no  limit  placed  by  law 
on  the  amount  to  be  expended  in  the  States  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes;  I  think  you  should  place  a  limit.  We  have 
limits  in  the  State  of  New  York,  the  only  amount  joii  can  spend  

The  Chairman.  What,  for  instance?    Take  the  governor. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  the  governor  is  allowed  $10,000.  That  is  only 
my  recollection.  On  the  other  hand,  I  think  the  judges  may  spend 
any  amount. 

The  Chairman.  What  would  it  cost  you  to  get  a  piece  of  mail  to 
everv  voter  in  the  State  of  Xew  York?  It  would  be  more  than 
$10,000.  would  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Certainly  it  would  cost  more  than  that.  It  is  very 
difficult ;  the  whole  question  is. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  why  I  am  asking  3^our  views. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  say  that  I  am  rather  inclined  to  allow  unlimited  ex- 
penditures from  the  fact  that  it  might  happen  that  you,  or  Senator 
Heed,  for  instance,  might  be  running  and  your  opponent  might  go 
in  and  buy  up  every  newspaper  in  the  State;  and  if  you  were  not 
allowed  to  spend  money,  what  chance  would  you  have  ? 

Senator  Edge.  There  are  just  a  few  questions  I  would  like  to  ask 
you,  Mr.  Gerard,  to  get  clear,  in  my  own  mind,  this  system. 

The  money  collected  through  your  organization  in  the  various 
States,  as  I  understand  it,  is  forwarded  to  you,  or  to  the  treasurer  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Sometimes  they  send  it  to  me,  and  sometimes  to  the 
treasurer.  If  it  is  sent  to  me  and  the  check  drawn  to  my  order,  I 
simply  indorse  it  to  the  treasurer's  order  and  send  it  to  him,  asking 
him  to  send  a  receipt. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  the  Jamison  organization,  as  I  understand  it, 
in  Washington,  is  entirely  distinct  from  your  organization? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  you  have  already  testified  that  your  organi- 
zation is  entirely  distinct  from  any  regular  party  organization  that 
may  exist  there  in  the  State  ? 


2336 


PRESIDEI^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Geeard.  I  think  so.   In  some  States  they  may  combine  it. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  as  I  understand  it,  you  now  have 
three  distinct  collection  agencies  raising  funds  for  the  national  cam- 
paign ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  there  are  more  than  two,  you  might 
say.  I  do  not  know  whether  the  people  who  collected  money  for  the 
State  would  be  held  as  spending  money  for  the  national  campaign. 
They  are  spending  it  for  the  success  of  the  Democratic  Party,  cer- 
tainly. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  any  arrangement  with  any  States,  or  do 
you  contemplate  making  any  whereby  you  will  return  any  percentage 
of  5^our  receipts  to  the  State  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  one  State  chairman  in  talking  about  raising 
money  said  he  hoped  I  would  send  all  the  money  I  raised  back  to  him, 
and  I  said  I  hoped  I  would  be  able  to  do  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  it  your  intention,  when  the  fund  is  raised,  to  remit 
back  to  States  or  to  send  it  through  the  national  headquarters? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  if  it  was  sent  in  by  a  State  organization  I 
would  endeavor,  if  possible,  to  remit  nearly  all  of  it,  or  all  of  it,  back 
to  that  State.  It  would  depend  on  circumstances.  We  have  very 
heavy  charges.  We  are  spending  $7,000  or  $8,000  a  week.  We  have 
the  tour  of  Roosevelt  and  the  tour  of  Cox-  

Senator  Edge.  You  are  supposed  to  finance  those  tours  ?  j 

Mr.  Gerard.  Apparently.  J 

Senator  Edge.  That  is,  your  organization  ?  \ 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  As  I  understand,  you  have  nothing  whatever  to 
do  with  any  budget  that  may  have  been  prepared  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No ;  nothing. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  if  conditions  got  better 
than  you  seem  to  anticipate,  you  would  refuse  money  above  a  certain 
amount  that  happened  to  come  to  you,  sending  it  to  the  national 
treasurer  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Personally  I  should ;  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Wliat  would  you  do  with  the  money  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  would  send  it  back. 

Senator  Edge.  After  you  received  it?  You  must  haA^e  some  defi- 
nite thought  about  that,  the  way  you  answered  the  question. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  not  had  any  definite  thought  about  it,  because 
the  possibility  of  raising  such  a  sum  of  money  in  the  Democratic 
Party  has  seemed  more  than  improbable. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  the  maximum  sum  that  you  will  receive? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  contemplated  your  asking  some  questions  of  that 
kind;  so  I  decided  that  anything  near  $2,000,000  would  be  a  fair 
amount  to  spend  on  the  campaign,  although,  as  I  say,  I  would  be 
extremely  thankful  if  we  got  a  million  or  $800,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Anything  you  receive  over  $2,000,000  you  would 
return  directly  to  the  source  from  which  it  came  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  would  be  inclined  to. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  just  Avhat  I  am  trying  to  find  out. 
Senator  Reed.  It  is  about  as  probable  as  that  the  Apostle  Paul 
would  come  down  and  take  charge  of  the  Republican  campaign. 
Mr.  Gerard.  Just  about. 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2387 


Senator  Edge.  Would  you  not  send  any  mone}'  that  you  received 
to  the  national  treasurer,  Mr.  Marsh  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir:  certainly.  I  just  told  you  that  any  check  I 
received  I  would  simply  indorse  over  to  him. 

Senator  Edge.  Whether  it  was  under  $2,000,000  or  over  $2,000,000? 

]Mr.  Gerard.  If  it  ever  got  by  any  remote  possibility  to  such  a 
point  I  think  I  would  then  go  and  insist  that  we  had  raised  money 
enough. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  of  any  sinister  influence  that  is  being 
used  to  raise  Eepublican  funds  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Xo. 
Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  Just  one  or  two  things,  Mr.  Gerard.  In  going 
around  to  raise  money  I  suppose  you  have  had  conferences  with 
different  gentlemen  in  Xew  York? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  invited  these  gentlemen  whose  names  I  have 
given  you  to  lunch  with  me  in  Xew  York  and  have  had  lunches  and 
talked  over  the  possibility  of  getting  money. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  had  a  number  of  those  lunches  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Three  or  four. 

The  Chairman.  Was  Mr.  Lamont,  of  Morgan  &  Co.,  present  at 
any  of  those  lunches  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Xo,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  talked  the  matter  over  with  him? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Xo,  sir ;  I  think  he  is  a  ReiDublican — in  fact,  I  know 
he  is. 

The  Chairman.  A  Eepublican? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  the  owner  of  a  paper  in  Xew  York,  is  he 
not? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  supposed  to  be  the  owner  of  the  Evening  Post, 
and  one  of  the  trustees  and  editors  of  the  Post  told  me  that  Lamont 
had  handed  the  management  of  the  paper  over  to  the  editors  and  told 
them  to  define  their  own  policy. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  he  is  the  owner  of  the  paper,  or  one  of 
the  papers? 

^Ir.  Gerard.  He  has  been  reported  to  us  

The  Chairman.  He  determines  its  policies? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  think  so.  As  this  gentleman  told  me — he 
was  a  trustee  and  one  of  the  editors — Mr.  Lamont  had  handed  over 
the  control  of  the  paper  to  the  editors  and  trustees  and  told  them  to 
determine  the  policy. 

The  Chairman.  While  he  is  a  Republican,  the  paper  is  supporting 
Mr.  Cox? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  had  no  talk  with  Mr.  Lamont  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Xo  none  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  He  has  been  at  none  of  your  lunches  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Xo:  none  whatever.   In  fact,  I  am  quite  sure  I  have 
not  seen  him  for  months. 

The  Chairman.  When  did  he  buy  that  paper  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  before  the  League  of  Nations  fight  was  on  ? 


2338 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  so. 

Tlie  Chairman.  It  is  a  very  strong  paper  for  the  League  of  Na- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  is  supporting  Mr.  Cox  on  that  theory  now? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Oh,  yes.  I  think  that  the  editors  of  that  paper  were 
taking  that  line  long  before  Mr.  Lamont  appeared  as  the  purchaser, 
and  he  allowed  them  to  continue  that  policy.  I  drive  in  Central 
Park  quite  often  with  one  of  the  editors,  and  he  told  me.  That  is 
how  I  happen  to  know  smoething  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  They  could  not  continue  without  Mr.  Lamont 
allowing  them  to  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  He  might  decide  it  was  best  for  the  paper  to  allow  it 
to  be  managed  as  an  independent  organ  in  the  same  way  it  had  been 
managed  for  j^ears. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  expect  any  contributions  from  Lamont 
before  you  get  through  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  I  have  no  reason  to  expect  contributions. 

The  Chair:\[an.  Who  were  some  of  the  other  gentlemen  at  your 
lunches  ?   Was  Mr.  Baruch  there  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Chadbourne  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  Chadbourne  was  at  one  lunch. 

The  Chairman.  Did  Mr.  Baruch  attend  any  of  your  lunches  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  talk  with  him  about  this  $5,000  subscrip- 
tion? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  w^as  walking  past  the  Ritz  Hotel,  and  I  met  a  young 
woman,  and  she  said,  "  You  better  go  inside.  Mr.  Baruch  is  having 
lunch  with  Mr.  Marsh ;  you  may  be  able  to  get  some  money."  I  went 
inside,  and  Mr.  Baruch  said  he  had  decided  to  contribute  $5,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  do  you  hold  your  lunches,  Mr.  Gerard? 

Mr.  Gerard.  In  the  club  of  which  I  am  a  member,  at  120  Broad- 
way. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  a  bankers'  club  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  head  of  that  club  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea. 
The  Chairman.  Are  you  one  of  the  members  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  where  the  lunches  are  held  and  where 
you  discuss  financial  conditions  and  the  raising  of  funds  for  the 
Democratic  Party? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir ;  in  a  private  room. 

The  Chairman.  Has  Mr.  Jamison  been  at  am^  of  these  lunches?  I 
Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir.  I 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Marsh?  | 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  These  are  distinctly  New  York  affairs,  thesei 
lunches,  are  they?  d 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes,  sir.  ^ 
The  Chairman.  Is  each  one  of  these  gentlemen,  whom  you  have 
mentioned  on  the  committee  expected  to  raise  money  in  New  York? 


1 


t  PRESIDE I^-TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2339 

Mr.  Gerard.  A  very  few  of  them  have  any  influence  at  all  outside 
of  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  So  it  is  largely  a  New  York  committee,  with 
branches  through  the  country? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  employed  any  people  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Your  committee? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  solicitors? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No;  I  am  against  having  solicitors  paid  or  given  a 
commission,  or  anything  of  that  kind. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  depository  for  your  money  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Mr.  Marsh,  as  I  say,  does  that. 
The  Chair^ian.  Do  you  know  what  bank? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  he  deposits  in  the  Harriman  National  Bank. 
The  Chairman.  Is  your  committee  financing  any  plans  for  books 
to  be  issued  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  seen  this  book  or  this  article  on  "  Uncle 
Sam  of  Sunny  Eidge  "  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge." 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  had  an  invitation  to  go  to  its  first  performance  next 
Sunday  night. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  on  the  stage  now  or  in  the  movies  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know ;  but  I  received  an  invitation  to  attend 
what  I  think  is  the  first  performance. 

The  Chairman.  AVhat  is  the  performance  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  it  is  a  movie. 

The  Chairman.  It  has  been  staged  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir;  I  think  it  is  a  movie. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  paying  for  that  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  who  pays  for  the  book  and  the  in- 
sertion in  the  papers  of  the  articles  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  to  be  put  on  the  stage  all  over  the  country, 
in  the  movies  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  a  select  few  who  are  to  be  invited  to  the 
first  performance? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know.  I  get  invitations  to  all  sorts  of  things 
in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  Who  sent  you  this  invitation? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  just  who. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  expect  to  go? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes.  I  received  a  card  saying,  "  Do  you  want  any 
seats  for  this  performance  ?  "  I  think  it  said  the  first  performance 
of  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge." 

The  Chairman.  Are  the  seats  free  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  they  are  at  this  performance.    We  are  in- 
vited to  it. 


2340 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Where  is  it  to  be  held  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  In  some  theater.  I  think,  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  On  Saturday  night  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  it  is  Saturday.  I  told  my  secretary  to  write 
back  and  ask  for  three  seats. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  a  corrupt  practice  act  in  New  York,  re- 
quiring a  statement  of  who  pays  for  political  propaganda  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  We  have  a  State  corrupt  practice  act,  but  I  do  not 
know  how  far  it  goes.   I  have  not  had  occasion  to  examine  it  lately. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Gerard,  do  you  not  know  who  is  pajdng  for 
this  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Eidge  "? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  anybody  who  can  tell  us  who  is 
paying  for  it? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  your  committee  financing  it  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  IS^o,  sir. 

rhe  Chairman.  Is  it  the  idea  to  have  it  all  over  the  country 
financed  by  somebody  and  the  people  not  know  who  is  doing  it? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it.  I  heard  somebody 
talk  about  it  the  other  day,  but  who  it  was  1  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  see  the  statement  by  Senator  Harrison, 
that  that  book  was  being  paid  for  by  Mr.  Baruch? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Which  book? 

The  Chairman.  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge." 
Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir ;  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  not  give  us  any  light  on  that  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  about  a  book  by  George  Creel  on 
The  War,  the  World,  and  Wilson? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Somebody  presented  me  with  a  copy  of  it  the  other 
day.    I  have  not  read  it  yet. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  heard  a  great  deal  about  Mr.  Barnes's 
book.  Now  we  Avould  like  to  find  out  something  about  this  Creel 
book.    Who  is  financing  it  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  happened  to  be  riding  with  Creel  the  other  day 
and  he  told  me  he  was  making  money  out  of  it.  His  publishers  had 
not  sold  as  many  copies  as  he  thought  they  should  and  he  had  taken 
it  by  himself  and  sold  $40,000  worth  and  was  making  a  good  thing 
out  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  To  whom  had  he  sold  the  book — to  the  Democratic 
Party? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  to  the  public.  He  said  he  had  sent  out  circulars. 
He  told  me  he  thought  the  publishers  were  slow  in  their  methods 
and  that  by  taking  it  up  in  his  own  way  he  had  sold  this  large  num- 
ber of  copies. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  done  that  by  his  own  personal  solici- 
tation? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Sure.  \ 
The  Chairman.  The  Democratic  Party  had  nothing  to  do  with  it? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir;  I  never  heard  of  their  having  anything  to  do 
with  it.    It  is  his  oAvn  book  and  his  own  enterprise.  4 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2341 


The  Chaikmax.  Did  you  ever  receive  a  circular  about  this  book 
from  the  subscription  bureau  of  the  Democratic  national  committee, 
signed  by  Pat  Harrison  ?  * 

Mr.  Gerard.  The  Creel  book? 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  Maybe,  if  you  have  forgotten  it,  this  will 
refresh  your  recollection. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  never  read  circulars,  Senator.  I  get  about  50  a  day. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  read  circulars  about  a  book  by  Georg-e 
Creel: 

My  Deae  Coworker  :  Tbe  War,  the  World,  and  Wilson,"  by  George  Creel, 
has  just  been  published.  It  gives  a  ringing  answer  to  every  lie,  misrepresenta- 
tion, and  misunderstanding  that  is  being  used  in  the  Republican  attack,  and 
constitutes  a  campaign  document  of  singular  power  and  value. 

Does  that  recall  it  to  you  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

In  stirring  dramatic  sequence,  Mr.  Creel  analyzes  the  personality  of  Woodrow 
Wilson,  and  considers  in  detail  our  period  of  neutrality  and  the  march  of 
events  that  forced  America  into  the  war. 

He  explains  why  the  President  refused  to  have  a  coalition  cabinet,  but 
points  out  the  amazing  lack  of  partisanship  that  gave  America  a  coalition 
administration ;  he  tells  why  Roosevelt  was  not  permitted  to  go  to  France, 
giving  the  famous  White  House  interview  virtually  word  for  word,  and  also 
sets  forth  every  fact  in  the  case  of  Leonard  Wood  

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  I  will  have  to  read  it. 

The  Chairman.  It  certainly  is  going  to  be  an  interesting  book. 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  a  copy  of  the  book  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  Yes ;  one  of  the  editors  of  the  New  York  World  gave 
it  to  me. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  the  book  here  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  I  do  not  travel  with  it. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  the  book  is  on  the  market  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  buy  it  at  bookstores  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  From  what  Creel  said. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  the  price  of  this  book  ? 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea. 

The  Chairiman.  I  notice  single  copies  of  this  book  are  $2,  five 
copies,  $9,  and  ten  copies,  $17. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  that  would  be  enough. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  seem  to  be  reasonable.  [Eeading:] 

A  chapter  on  "  Power  and  the  glory  is  a  complete  summary  of  America's 
war  preparation  and  w^ar  achievement ;  another  relates  the  causes  that  decided 
the  President  to  go  to  Paris ;  the  peace  conference  is  followed  through  from 
beginning  to  end,  and  there  is  shown  the  play  of  intrigue  in  America  as  well  as 
in  Paris,  the  clash  of  personalities  and  the  battle  of  selfish  interests.  At  every 
point  he  proves  his  assertion  that  the  President  "  without  help  from  a  single 
source,  betrayed  at  home  and  ambushed  abroad,  ringed  about  with  foes  and 
deserted  by  a  w^ord  returned  to  its  selfish  personal  preoccupation,"  fought  and 
won. 

Mr.  Creel  enters  into  the  Irish  question  thoroughly  

Mr.  Gerard.  He  is  a  brave  man. 

The  Chairman.  I  understood  you  to  say  that  circulars  were  sent 
out  by  Creel.   Did  he  tell  you  he  was  sending  out  circulars  ? 


2342 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Gerard.  He  told  me  so. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  he  wrote  this? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chair3ian  (reading)  : 

Mr.  Creel  enters  into  the  Irish  question  thoroughly,  makes  the  Shantung 
question  stand  crystal  clear  and  straightens  out  the  Adriatic  tangle- 
That  is  really  quite  an  accomj^lishment. 
Mr.  Gerard.  I  think  so. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

he  takes  up  the  14  points,  one  by  one,  and  proves  that  they  were  not  ignored ; 
he  analyzes  the  covenant  of  the  League  of  Nations,  article  by  article,  smashing 
Republican  lies  and  informing  honest  ignorance. 

For  the  first  time  the  reparation  clauses  of  the  peace  treaty  are  treated  in  a 
manner  tliat  makes  them  simple,  and  there  is  plain  showing  of  what  Germany 
must  pay  both  in  money  and  in  coal. 

Step  by  step,  stab  by  stab,  Mr.  Creel  follows  the  Republican  majority's  con- 
spiracy of  hate,  showing  just  how  the  treaty  was  killed. 

If  the  Democratic  national  conmiittee  had  the  money  we  would  place  The 
AVar,  the  World,  and  Wilson  in  the  hands  of  every  voter,  so  convincing 
and  unanswerable  do  we  consider  it.  The  same  financial  reason  keeps  us  from 
sending  a  copy  of  the  book  to  every  speaker  on  our  lists,  for  it  is  not  only 
information  but  inspiration. 

Arrangements  have  been  made  by  Mr.  Creel,  however,  by  which  private  parties 
will  purchase  the  book  in  quantity,  and  send  it  post  paid  at  less  than  the  retail 
price.    We  urge  you,  as  a  Democrat  and  American,  and  particularly  as  one  who 
will  ^peak  during  the  campaign,  to  fill  out  the  inclosed  card.    Buy  one  copy 
,    at  least — and  as  many  more  as  you  can  afford. 
Cordially  and  sincerely, 

Pat  Harbison. 

Mr.  Gerard.  "  Cordially  and  sincerely  "  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes ;  "  Pat  Harrison." 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  the  modesty  of  the  statement  suggests  its 
author. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  not  Mr.  Creel  abroad  during  all  the  negotia- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  who  was  abroad.  I  had  nothing  to  do 
with  any  foreign  aifairs. 

The  Chairman.  He  had  charge  of  the  publicity  bureau  here  in 
Washington  that  expended  some  $8,000,000. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  sent  out  by  the  Duffy  Distributing  Co.,  505 
Fifth  Avenue,  New  York  City.    Do  you  know  anything  about  that? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  no  idea.  I  suppose  it  may  be  his  OAvn  enter- 
prise.   I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  about  that? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No ;  I  never  heard  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  had  before  us,  and  you  may  have  seen 
statements  concerning  a  book  published  by  Mr.  Barnes,  the  claim 
being  made  that  it  was  Republican  propaganda.  If  private  parties 
furnish  the  money  to  circulate  this  book  as  campaign  matter,  nothing 
would  appear  in  any  record  to  show  who  contributed  that  money, 
and  it  w^ould  not  be  recorded  in  any  way  as  campaign  expenditures? 

Mr.  Gerard.  If  Creel  sold  a  book  personally? 

The  Chairman.  Suppose  you,  for  instance,  became  tremendously 
interested  in  this  book,  as  you  read  it,  and  subscribed  fifteen  to  twenty 
thousand  dollars  to  send  it  out  to  private  parties.  Nothing  would 
appear  anywhere  about  that  contribution? 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2343 


Mr.  Geeard.  I  understand  that  Barnes's  book  is  a  sort  of  Tov/n 
Topics,  giving  him  a  dotation,  for  instance. 

Senator  Edge.  You  did  not  get  an  answer  to  your  question,  Mr. 
Chairman,  if  3^ou  want  to  get  it  clear  on  the  record. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  it  is  a  matter  of  argument. 

Does  not  this  same  thing  apply  to  the  screen  production  of  Uncle 
Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge  ?   You  have  no  record  of  that  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  understand  what  the  story  is  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  attend  it  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes.  I  can  tell  you  afterwards. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  just  one  little  point  that  I  want  to  get  clear. 

You  have  emphasized  several  times  tjie  difficulty  in  raising  money 
this  year;  the  Democrats  are  all  so  poor.  To  what  do  you  attribute 
the  difference  between  1920  and  1916?  Why  should  your  responses 
be  less  in  proportion,  with  all  the  organization  you  have  described 
this  year  as  compared  with  four  j^ears  ago  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  The  organization,  I  think,  is  something  of  very  recent 
date — too  recent  to  be  effective.  I  imagine  that  in  1916  they  had 
commenced  the  organization  at  a  much  earlier  date. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  course,  you  are  aw^are  that  there  has  been  an 
organization  in  Washington,  running  continuously,  are  you  not? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes ;  I  have  subscribed  to  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  of  course,  it  Avas  organized  in  one  way  or 
another.  The  party  has  been  organized  to  solicit  funds  in  one  way 
or  another. 

Mr.  Gerard.  Yes ;  I  think  they  have. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  I  come  back  to  my  question :  To  what  do  you 
assign  vour  frequent  statement  that  vou  have  little  hope  to  raise  even 
$2,000,000  this  year? 

Mr.  Gerard.  Because  Harding  was  nominated  by  the  big  interests ; 
that  is  the  reason. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  those  big  interests  any  more  representativ  e  of 
active  business  than  the  names  you  have  given  as  the  members  of 
your  finance  committee — Eyan  and  others? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  have  given  you  the  names  of  a  very  few  people. 
The  people  who  are  interested  in  Republican  success  who  are  in  what 
is  known  as  the  big  interests  are  almost  without  number. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  it  is  a  question  of  numbers  rather  than  any 
hesitation  on  your  part  to  have  more,  if  you  can  get  them,  on  your 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  It  is  a  question  of  numbers  which,  in  this  case,  prob- 
ably depends  upon  the  known  pliability  of  your  candidate. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  think  it  is  a  subject  for  discussion  at  all, 
especially  in  view  of  the  corrupt  charges  that  we  are  trying  to  inves- 
tigate. I  think  you  have  already  answered  the  question  that  you 
knew  of  no  sinister  influence  being  used. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  do  not  know  of  any  sinister  influence  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  you  can  not  give  us  any  information  as  to 
what  we  are  now  

Mr.  Gerard.  You  keep  on  asking  me  for  it.  I  will  give  you  my 
best  opinion. 


2344 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  You  have  no  knowledge  of  it,  as  a  matter  of  fact  ? 
Mr.  Gekard.  No,  sir.   You  asked  my  opinion  and  I  gave  it  to  you. 
Senator  Edge.  We  do  not  want  opinions;  we  want  facts. 
Mr.  Gerard.  You  had  the  fact  before. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  you  were  asking  especially  for  opinions — 
whether  he  could  suggest  any  reason  or  give  any  reason. 

Mr.  Gerard.  That  is  why  I  was  answering  in  that  way. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  the  witness  was  answering  in  a  responsive 
way. 

Senator  Edge.  Og  course,  those  general  inferences  are  very  easil}^ 
secured  from  either  source.    I  think  that  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  had  some  letters  showing  the  liquor  in- 
terests engaged  in  raising  some  money  for  the  Cox  campaign. 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  hope  not.    I  am  a  "dry." 

The  Chairman.  You  know  nothing  about  it  ? 

Mr.  Gerard.  I  know  nothing  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  questions,  Senator  Pomerene? 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  not. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  very  much  obliged  to  you,  Mr.  Gerard. 
Mr.  Gerard.  Do  you  want  me  again  ? 

The  Chairman.  Not  until  later  in  the  campaign.  Could  you  have 
copied  for  us  all  subscriptions  over  $100 — over  a  hundred  or  inclusive 
of  a  hundred  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  give  the  total  number. 

The  Chairman.  Take  a  hundred  and  up,  and  please  furnish  us 
with  a  list. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  suggest  $50  and  up. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  COL.  WILLIAM  BOYCE  THOMPSON. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  b}^  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  I  believe  you  are  called  colonel  as  a  mark  of 
distinction  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Sometimes  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  Please  give  the  committee  your  name  in  full. 

Col.  Thompson.  William  Boyce  Thompson. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  official  position? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  chairman  of -the  ways  and  means  committee 
of  the  Republican  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  ways  and  means  committee?  How 
was  it  organized  ?    What  is  its  function  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  In  January  of  1919  the  committee  was  formed, 
partially  out  of  the  national  committee  and  from  outsiders,  and  this 
was  the  committee  of  which  I  was  selected  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  elected  by  the  committee  or  appointed 
bv  the  national  chairman*?    Did  vou  form  this  committee? 

'^Col.  Thompson.  No;  I  did  not.  I  think  I  was  appointed  by  the 
chairman. 

The  Chairman.  The  national  chairman  i 

Col.  Thoivcpson.  The  national  chairman.    Do  you  want  me  to  give 
you  a  list  of  the  members  of  this  committee? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  is  the  ways  and  means  committee? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN"  EXPENSES. 


2345 


Col.  Tho3ipson.  The  ways  and  means  committee  of  the  Republican 
national  committee.  William  Boyce  Thompson,  Senator  John  W. 
Weeks,  William  Cooper  Procter,  T.  Coleman  du  Pont,  William  H. 
Crocker,  James  J.  McCraw,  and  later  Congressman  C.  V.  Slemp  and 
Mrs.  John  T.  Pratt.   Mrs.  John  T.  Pratt  was  made  vice  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  your  waj^s  and  means  committee? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  ways  and  means  committee,  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Colonel,  the  names  you  have  given  us  constitute 
the  Avays  and  means  committee  of  which  you  are  chairman? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  auxiliary  organizations? 
Col.  Thompson.  We  have ;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  In  the  various  States  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  In  practically  all  the  States ;  I  think  all  the  States 
now.  We  have  a  man  chairman  and  a  woman  vice  chairman  in  each 
State. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  the  purpose  and  function  of  this  ways 
and  means  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  purpose  is  to  organize  for  giving  or  col- 
lecting. 

The  Chairman.  Does  it  have  anything  to  do  with  expenditures  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Nothing  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  Our  record  was  not  quite  clear  at  Chicago, 
whether  the  moneys  that  were  raised,  for  instance,  in  the  East  all 
passed  through  Mr.  Upham's  hands,  or  whether  they  came  to  you. 

Col.  Thompson.  No  money  comes  to  me  at  all.  It  either  goes  out 
directly  to  Mr.  Upham  or  is  deposited  to  his  credit. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask  you  a  question  right  there.  A 
statement  was  made  that  Mr.  James  G.  Blaine  was  the  assistant 
treasurer. 

Col.  Thompson.  He  is  the  eastern  treasurer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  want  to  get  this  accurately.  Do  the  sums 
which  you  collect  go  to  Mr.  Blaine  as  assistant  treasurer  and  are  they 
then  remitted  to  Mr.  Upham,  or  do  they  go  direct  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  the}^  are  deposited  in  the  bank  to  the 
credit  of  the  national  committee.  Those  are  subject  to  check  by  Mr. 
Upham  or  Mr.  Blaine.  That  is  the  way  I  understand  it.  It  is  all 
one  fund. 

Senator  Reed.  They  are  subject  to  check  by  Mr.  Blaine  just  as 
they  would  be  by  Mr.  Upham,  as  you  understand  it? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  think  Mr.  Blaine  signs  any  checks  unless 
authorized  by  Mr.  Upham,  but  that  is  a  matter  of  detail  of  which 
Mr.  Upham  can  speak. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  order  to  make  this  perfectly  clear,  you  have 
certain  funds  here  which  are  deposited  in  a  bank.  Which  bank  is 
that? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  they  are  using  the  Chase  National  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene,  Is  an  account  kept  in  Chicago  by  the  treasurer 
there  of  the  moneys  which  you  collect  here  in  your  territory — the 
eastern  territory? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  collect  the  money ;  the  treasurer  collects 
the  money;  but  the  money  which  is  collected  here  is  deposited  to 
the  credit  of  Mr.  Upham  in  a  New  York  bank. 


2346 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  what  I  am  trjdng  to  get  at  is  this:  Is 
the  account  in  Chicago  a  complete  account  of  all  funds  collected  there 
and  of  all  funds  collected  under  your  auspices  or  direction  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  if  Ave  were  to  have  an  account  of  the 
funds  collected  here  in  your  territory,  that  would  not  be  in  addition 
to  the  sum  total  of  funds  shown  by  the  books  of  Mr.  Upham,  but 
would  be  a  part  of  them  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  would  be ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  Avhen  Mr.  Upham  presents  a  statement  of 
the  funds  collected,  that  covers  New  York  and  Chicago? 
Col.  Thompson.  Everything. 

The  Chau^man.  Colonel,  do  you  have  anything  to  do  with  the 
plans  under  which  the  money  is  collected,  this  decentralization  plan  ? 
Do  you  have  anything  to  do  with  that  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  had  something  to  do  with  getting  the  chairmen, 
in  A^arious  State. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  Avorking  under  any  budget? 

Col.  Thompson.  We-  haA^e  a  sort  of  a  tentative  budget  that  was 
established  some  time  ago. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  had  testimony  before  us  about  a  budget. 
I  do  not  remember  the  exact  amount.  Do  you  have  anything  to  do 
with  the  congressional  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  much. 

The  Chairman.  Or  the  senatorial  committee  ?  Can  you  tell  us  any- 
thing about  what  you  propose  to  raise  under  this  plan,  or  do  you 
have  anything  to  do  with  that  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  would  be  more  in  Mr.  Upham's  field. 

The  Chairman.  If  Mr.  Upham  laid  down  a  budget  before  us  of 
the  amount  raised,  you  Avould  have  nothing  to  do  with  that,  but  he 
would  be  the  one  who  would  have  charge  of  that  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  He  keeps  all  the  records. 

The  Chairman.  You  just  follow  the  ways  and  means  of  raising  it? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  plans  are  you  pursuing  to  raise  it  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Well,  I  told  you  about  appointing  chairmen  in 
all  States. 

The  Chairmx\n.  I  think  Ave  have  a  list  of  the  chairmen  of  the 
States. 

Col.  Thompson.  You  have  a  list,  I  think,  of  all  chairmen. 

The  Chairman.  If  Ave  haA-e  not,  you  could  supply  us  Avith  a  list  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  do  not  think  Ave  haA^e  a  list  for  all  the  States,, 
but  I  am  not  clear  as  to  that. 

Col.  Thompson.  Some  of  the  States  have  changed.  Mr.  Upham's 
organization  would  give  you  the  W^estern  States  more  fully.  I  haA^e 
the  chairmen  of  the  States  of  Connecticut,  Delaware,  Maryland,^ 
New  Jersey,  New  York,  Pennsylvania,  Rhode  Island,  and  the  Dis- 
trict of  Columbia. 

The  Chairman.  Give  us  those. 

Col.  Thompson.  In  Connecticut  William  H.  Putnam,  of  Hartford, 
is  chairman.  In  the  District  of  Columbia  William  T.  Galliher,  of 
Washington,  is  chairman  and  Mrs.  Harold  Walker  is  vice  chairman. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2347 


or  corresponding  secretar}^  I  think  the}^  call  her.  In  Delaware  Charles 
Warner  is  chairman.  In  Maryland  Albert  G.  Towers  is  chairman. 
In  XcAY  Jersey  E.  P.  Earle  is  chairman  and  Mrs.  Lewis  S.  Thompson 
is  vice  chairman.  In  Xe  w  York  Lewis  E.  Pearson  is  chairman.  That 
is  divided  into  two  sections — tor  up  State  William  J.  Tiilly,  of 
Corning,  is  chairman,  and  Mrs.  C.  D.  Barnes,  of  New  York  City,  is 
vice  chairman :  in  Greater  New  York  J.  P.  Stevens  is  chairman  and 
Mrs.  Thomas  Morton  Sabins  is  vice  chairman.  In  Pennsylvania  Wil- 
liam H.  Folwell  is  chairman  and  Mrs.  George  Horace  Lorimer  is  vice 
chairman.  In  Ehode  Island  Frederick  S.  Peck  is  chairman  and  Miss 
Maude  Wetmore  is  vice  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  the  duties  of  these  various  chairmen? 

Col.  Thompson.  They  are  supposed  to  get  workers,  decentralize 
their  work,  appoint  county  chairmen  and  district  chairmen. 

The  Chairman.  How  would  they  know  as  to  the  amounts  which 
you  are  to  raise?  Would  they  get  that  from  Mr.  Upham  or  from 
you  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  They  would  get  it  from  Mr.  LTpham.  They  might 
get  it  from  the  eastern  chairman  or  the  eastern  treasurer. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  anything  to  do  with  these  various 
quotas  of  States? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  comes  from  Mr.  Upham. 

The  Chairman.  I  might  as  well  ask  you.  Colonel,  about  the  con- 
nections of  these  different  members  of  your  committee  in  a  general 
way.   What  are  their  financial  connections  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  To  tell  3^ou  the  truth,  I  do  not  knoAv. 

The  Chairman.  I  mean  your  main  committee. 

Col.  Thompson.  Well,  you  know  Senator  Weeks;  you  know  Wil- 
liam Cooper  Procter,  the  soap  man. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  had  him  before  us. 

Col.  Thompson.  You  know  Col.  du  Pont,  the  hotel  man,  who  owns 
the  Waldorf-Astoria;  you  know^  William  H.  Crocker,  of  San  Fran- 
cisco: also  Jim  McGraw,  of  Concord  Cit}^,  who  is  an  old-fashioned 
fellow  down  there — a  big  tall  fellow. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  from  Oklahoma? 

Col.  Thompson.  From  Ponca  City,  Okla.,  I  think;  yes.  And 
Congressman  Slemp  you  all  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  picked  the  men,  I  assume,  just  as  Mr.  Gerard 
said  he  did? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  it  was  the  idea  to  get  men  from  all  over 
the  country;  Senator  Weeks  from  New  England,  Senator  Procter 
from  the  Central  States. 

The  Chairman.  "  Senator  "  Procter,  did  you  say? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  should  have  said  Col.  Procter;  du  Pont  from 
around  New  York  and  Delaware  and  the  East ;  Crocker  of  San  Fran- 
cisco ;  and  McGraw  of  the  Middle  West.   It  was  a  geographical  list. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  seen  charges  made  that  Wall  Street  was 
trying  to  control  the  situation  so  far  as  the  public  was  concerned  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  a  Wall  Street  committee  you  have  here  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Not  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  the  people  whose  names  Mr.  Gerard 
has  given  us,  the  members  of  his  committee  ? 


2348 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  Unfortunately,  I  was  not  here  when  he  testified. 
My  judgment  was  that  if  there  was  any  New  York  committee  they 
had  the  New  York  committee ;  we  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Just  following  that  question:  Yourself  and  CoL 
Du  Pont  are  the  only  New  Yorkers  on  the  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Well,  Mrs.  Pratt  would  be  called  a  New  Yorker. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Col.  du  Pont  resides  in  Dela- 
ware, does  he  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  former  Senator  du  Pont  ? 
Senator  Edge.  No  :  it  is  Col.  du  Pont. 
Col.  Thompson.  He  is  the  hotel  man  in  New  York. 
Senator  Edge.  He  also  has  a  hotel  in  Wilmington,  Del.,  has  he  not, 
the  Du  Pont? 

Senator  Reed.  He  has  some  other  interests  than  hotels,  has  he  not  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Possibly. 

Senator  Reed.  How  about  the  powder  interests? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  understood  that  he  sold  out  his  poAvder  interests. 

Senator  Reed.  When? 

Col.  Thompson.  Sometime  before  we  got  into  the  war. 

The  Chairman.  There  Avas  more  money  in  the  hotel  business. 

Senator  Reed.  You  think  he  is  entirely  out  of  that  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes;  he  sold  his  powder  interests  a  long  time 
ago — three  or  four  years  ago. 

Senator  Reed.  The  du  Pont  family,  however,  are  the  largest  powder 
makers  in  the  world  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes ;  but  they  fight  light  cats  and  dogs,  they  tell 
me,  too. 

Senator  Edge.  They  are  on  the  other  side. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  is  generally  reported  that  he  is  in  favor  of 
war,  so  they  may  carry  it  out  locally.  I  do  not  know. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  at  the  beginning  of  the  World  War  Col. 
du  Pont  sold  out  his  powder  interests. 

Senator  Reed.  Colonel,  Senator  Kenyon  has  asked  you  about  your 
organization,  but  nobody  has  asked  you  what  you  are  doing.  Are  you 
trying  to  raise  any  money  through  this  organization  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  are,  undoubtedly. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  raised  any? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  have  spent  more  than  we  raised. 

Senator  Reed.  Up  to  this  time? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  In  what  did  you  spend  it  ? 

Col.  Tpiompson.  You  have  got  the  wrong  chairman  to  ask  that, 
because  I  have  nothing  to  do  with  the  expenditures. 

Senator  Reed.  You  mean  the  committee  has  expended  it,  the 
national  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  But  I  am  asking  you  how  much  you  raised. 
Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  that.   No  money  passes  through 
my  hands  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  Colonel,  of  course,  you  are  not  a  dead  cock 
in  the  pit  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 


PRESIDE I^^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2349 


Senator  Eeed.  You  are  running  this  thing.  Now,  tell  us  about  it. 
What  are  j^ou  doing,  anyhow,  to  raise  money,  and  how  much  money 
have  you  got,  and  what  arrangement  are  you  makino^  to  get  it  ? 

Col.  THOMrsoN.  As  I  told  you,  I  function  in  this  by  organizing 
so  as  to  get  a  large  number  of  agencies  through  which  contributions 
can  be  made.  It  was  my  belief.  Senator,  that  if  you  carry  your 
organization  far  enough  in  all  political  parties  there  will  be  enough 
that  want  to  give,  so  that  it  will  not  be  necessary  to  accept  a  large 
sum  from  any  one  individual. 

Senator  Keed.  I  understand  that  that  is  the  slogan  that  has  been 
adopted.  That  makes  it  necessary  that  this  organization  when  it  is 
created  shall  function,  does  it  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  And  the  head  of  that  organization  is  supposed  to 
see  that  it  does  function,  keep  punching  it  up,  and  keep  track  of  it, 
and  urge  it  on  to  activity,  etc.,  is  he  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  been  doing  that,  liave  you  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  been  doing  it  up  to  the  first  of  the  year, 
or  a  little  after  the  first  of  the  year,  or  say  up  until  February.  I 
was  doing  that  nationally.  I  found  that  it  was  a  little  more  of  a  job 
than  I  wanted,  and  since  then  I  have  been  confining  myself  to  these 
particular  States. 

Senator  Eeed.  When  you  were  running  the  matter  nationally — 
that  is,  when  you  were  undertaking  this  branch  of  it  nationally — 
what  was  your  plan  then  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  same  as  it  is  now;  that  is,  to  finance  the 
Eepublican  Party  by  small  contributions. 

Senator  Eeed.  Exactly;  but  that  is  not  what  I  meant  by  my 
question. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  sorry  I  am  dull  on  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  Perhaps  my  question  was  a  dull  question.  You 
say  3^ou  had  the  same  plan  then  that  you  have  now.  That  plan  was 
to  have  a  finance  committee  or  a  ways  and  means  committee  in  each 
State,  was  it? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Eeed.  And  each  of  them  Avas  to  organize  the  State  in 
which  it  was  located,  running  clear  down  to  a  county  organization? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Eeed,  And  they  were  to  solicit  funds.  Now,  up  to  the 
time  you  left  had  they  employed  these  Y.  M.  C.  A.  Christians  and 
these  hired  patriots  w^ho  raised  our  war  funds  for  $10,000  a  year 
and  similar  things?   Had  you  employed  that  force? 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  that  did  not  come  under  me.  Mr.  Upham 
took  charge  of  the  western  territory. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  am  speaking  of  the  time  when  you  had  charge 
of  the  whole  country. 

Col.  Tpiompson.  No. 
•   Senator  Eeed.  You  had  not  gotten  to  that  point? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  had  not  gotten  up  to  that  point ;  no. 

Senator  Eeed.  Well,  you  did  raise,  though,  a  considerable  sum 
of  money,  did  you  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 


2350 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  About  $1,800,000? 

Col.  Thompson.  Well,  Mr.  Upham  will  give  you  that  exactly. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  that  was  approximately  the  figure  that  he 
gave.  When  was  it  that  you  divided  the  territory  and  vou  took  the 
seven  Eastern  States  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  would  say  that  it  was  along  in  Februar}^ — some- 
where along  in  there. 

Senator  Reed.  Up  to  that  time  these  hired  workers  that  were  sent 
over  the  country  had  not  been  employed  at  all?  Or  did  you  have 
some  hired  workers? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  think  that  they  had  any  hired  workers. 
Mr.  Patchell  came  with  me  before  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Give  his  full  name. 

Col.  Thoinepson.  But  do  not  fhrow  too  many  slams  at  these  Young 
Men's  Christian  Associations,  Senator,  because  they  have  been  doing 
great  Avork  during  this  war. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  speaking  of  the  fellows  who  paraded  them- 
selves as  patriots,  who  had  to  get  into  the  war,  and  whom  we  after- 
wards discovered  were  in  for  very  large  salaries. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  of  any  of  those  who  have  been 
employed.  The  only  man  I  have  employed  is  Maj.  James  J.  Patchell. 
Maj.  Patchell  entered  the  officers'  training  camp  in  1917,  and  after 
service  in  France  was  honorably  discharged  as  a  major  in  1919. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  I  have  said  nothing  about  Maj.  Patchell, 
but  I  have  been  talking  about  this  other  scheme. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  wanted  to  say  that  Maj.  Patchell  is,  perhaps, 
getting  $400  a  month,  and  my  feeling  is  that  he  is  doing  a  patriotic 
duty  in  giving  his  time  to  this  work,  and  in  any  other  occupation 
he  would  receive  a  good  deal  more  money.  I  wanted  to  say  this  in 
justice  to  Maj.  Patchell. 

Senator  Reed.  Had  this  scheme  evolved  a  plan  of  driveis  in  the 
cities,  getting  in  a  cit}^  a  list  of  thirty  or  forty  thousand,  or  three 
thousand,  or  whatever  it  might  be,  of  prospects  and  dividing  the 
propects  among  teams  and  having  the  teams  go  out  and  solicit  these 
men? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  had  none  of  them. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  plan  that  has  been  adopted  in  the 
western  headquarters  and  which  applies  to  the  entire  country  except 
to  your  seven  States.  Was  it  suggested  to  you  that  that  plan  be 
employed  in  the  Eastern  States,  and  did  3^ou  turn  it  doAvn  as  an 
unworthy  plan? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  did  not  turn  it  down  as  an  unworthy  plan. 
Senator  Reed.  You  turned  it  clown  as  a  practical  plan  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  But  I  thought  it  was  a  better  plan  in  more  thickly 
populated  districts  where  you  could  not  find  enough  workers  that 
would  take  care  of  it  without  salary. 

Senator  Reed.  You  preferred,  then,  in  these  eastern  cities  a  plan 
which  you  had,  which  was  to  call  upon  the  political  workers? 
Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  to  call  upon  various  Republican  citizens- 
Senator  Reed.  Well,  3^ou  would  use  the  words  "  political  work- 
ers? " 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  try  to  get  men  who  are 
active  in  the  Avork  of  the  party  to  go  out  and  raise  these  moneys,  and 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2351 


there  is  nothing  wrong  about  it  if  you  do.    I  just  want  to  get  the 
facts.   You  do  that  or  you  do  not  do  that.   I  did  not  get  your  answer. 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  And  employ,  I  presume,  as  far  as  you  can,  the  State 
political  organizations? 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  we  have  tried  to  go  outside  of  the  State  or- 
ganization and  get  new  men,  interest  new  people. 

Senator  Eeed.  Very  well.  Then  you  do  not  raise  your  money 
through  the  State  organization  of  New  York  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  the  political  organization. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  go  outside  and  try  to  organize  and  get  men 
Avho  are  so  situated  that  they  can  go  out  and  successfully  get  the 
funds  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  And  give  a  portion  of  their  time  to  raising  funds. 

Senator  Eeed.  Therefore,  the  State  organization  of  New  York  is 
at  full  liberty  to  go  out  and  raise  funds  for  its  purpose  in  the  State 
of  New  York? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  are  giving  the  State  organization  20  per  cent 
of  the  funds  that  we  raise  in  the  State  of  New  York,  by  agreement. 

Senator  Eeed.  But  are  they  at  liberty  to  go  out  and  raise  funds,  or 
do  they  work  with  you? 

Col.  Thompson.  Up  to  date  we  have  been  able  to  take  care  of  their 
expenses.  If  the  20  per  cent  does  not  take  care  of  the  State  expenses 
they  would  be  at  perfect  liberty  to  go  out  and  raise  their  own  funds. 

Senator  Eeed.  After  that? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Eeed.  Up  to  this  time  you  have  contributed,  then,  to  the 
State  organization  of  New  York.  Is  that  true  of  all  the  seven  States 
in  your  district? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Eeed.  Of  what  State  is  it  true? 

Col.  Thompson.  Connecticut  has  not  given  us  any  money  yet. 

Senator  Eeed.  Well,  have  you  given  them  any? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  have  not  given  them  any. 

Senator  Eeed.  They  are  conducting  the  campaign  there  through 
their  State  organization,  are  they? 

Col.  Thompson.  They  have  built  up  an  organization.  We  have  an 
organization  in  Connecticut.  We  allow  these  chairmen  to  work  it 
out  in  each  State  as  they  see  best. 

Senator  Eeed.  AVhen  you  say  Connecticut  has  not  given  you  any- 
thing, you  mean  you  have  had  no  contributions  from  the  State  of 
Connecticut  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  To  amount  to  anything. 

Senator  PomepvEne.  When  you  say  the  chairman,  you  mean  the 
State  chairman  of  the  ways  and  means  committee,  and  not  the  chair- 
man of  the  State  organization? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  our  chairman.  We  expect  to  receive  money, 
however,  from  Connecticut. 

Senator  Eeed.  Go  back  to  the  State  of  New  York. 

Col.  Thompson.  There  we  have  a  combination  of  State  and  na- 
tional. In  New  Jersey  they  have  a  combination  of  State  and  na- 
tional.   In  Delaware  all  national.   In  Pennsylvania  it  is  just  barely 


182774— 20— PT  17 


■  3 


2352 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


getting  started;  I  can  not  tell  you  how  they  Avill  work  out  yet.  In 
Maryland  we  get  a  little  money  from  them ;  not  much. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  combination  there  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  it  is  just  national.  Here  in  the  District 
of  Colimibia  it  is  national. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  Rhode  Island  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  In  Rhode  Island  it  is  just  national. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  in  all  of  these  States  where  the  funds  you 
have  described  as  national,  of  course,  the  State  committee,  the  State 
organization,  is  at  liberty  to  go  and  raise  its  own  funds  to  conduct 
its  own  State  campaign  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  But  we  can  not  regulate  the  States. 

Senator  Reed,  You  could  not,  of  course,  anywhere  except  b}^  agree- 
ment. You  mean  by  this  term  "  national  "  that  the  national  com- 
mittee is  collecting  for  its  own  purposes,  getting  money  in  those 
States  for  its  own  purposes,  and  has  no  agreement  to  divide  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  it. 

Senator  Reed.  And  where  you  speak  of  the  State  and  national 
there  is  an  agreement  to  divide  on  some  basis  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  In  New  York  the  State  gets  20  per  cent? 

Col.  Thompson.  In  New  York  the  State  gets  20  per  cent;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  percentage  in  New  Jersey? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  give  you  this  exactly,  but  I  will  give 
you  about  what  it  is.  I  think  we  get  60  per  cent  in  New  York  and 
the  county  and  the  State  get  40. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  anything  to  do  with  the  county  divi- 
sion? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  think  you  said  just  what  you  meant,  but 

if  you  did  not  we  will  get  it  straight.    The  State  gets  40  per  cent 

and  then  the  county  

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  think  they  have  some  arrangement  worked 

out  with  their  organization.  j 
Senator  Reed.  Themselves  ?  I 
Col.  Thompson.  Themselves.  I 
Senator  Reed.  But  did  the  national  committee  get  60  per  cent  ?  I 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  I 
Senator  Reed.  In  Delaware  there  is  no  division  ?  I 
Col.  Thompson.  No.  •  I 
Senator  Reed.  Penns^dvania  you  have  not  yet  organized  ?  I 
Col.  Thoivipson.  I  can  not  tell  you  Avhether  they  have  organized  I 

with  the  State  committee.  They  have  just  started  work  there.  I 
Senator  Reed.  Who  can  tell  us  about  that?  I 
Col.  Thompson.  The  chairman  there.  I 
Senator  Reed.  In  Maryland  you  are  going  to  collect  a  fund  for  the  " 

national  committee,  and  the  State  committee,  the  State  organization, 

is  going  on  and  raise  whatever  fund  they  choose  ? 
Col.  Tpiompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  The  District  of  Columbia  is  a  national  fund  and,  of 
course,  there  is  no  local  fund  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  In  Rhode  Island  it  is  a  national  fund  and  the  State 
and  local  organizations  are  at  liberty  to  raise  money? 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2353 


Col.  Thompsox.  Yes :  we  can  not  control  them. 

Senator  Keed.  Let  us  go  back  to  the  State  of  Xew  York.  You  have 
turned  over  to  the  State  organization  of  XeAv  York  enough  funds  for 
its  functioning  up  to  the  present  time.  How  much  have  you  given 
them  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  think  Mr.  Upham  showed  you,  but  I  do  not 
believe  we  have  given  them  any  money  since  then,  and  my  impres- 
sion is  they  have  alread}^  received  about  $50,000. 

Senator  Keed.  Have  you  any  estimate  from  that  State  committee 
as  to  what  funds  they  will  need? 

Col.  Thompsox.  Xo:  not  yet. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  had  any  talks  about  it  at  all? 
Col.  Thompsox.  I  think  they  have  been  making  up  budgets. 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  any  conception  as  to  the  size  of  it  ? 
Col.  Thompsox.  It  is  a  large  State. 

Senator  Reed.  What  about  the  fund  ?  I  was  asking  about  the 
fund. 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  can  not  tell  exactly  about  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  tell  us  what  you  have  been  talking  about, 
the  amounts  that  have  been  talked  over  tentatively? 

Col.  Thompsox.  They  have  just  had  a  treasurer  that  is  function- 
ing in  Xew  York  now.  The  treasurer  has  been  changed.  The  old 
treasurer  has  been  in  Europe  and  I  do  not  know  whether  they  have 
another  one  yet.  That  is  one  of  the  things  I  think  that  those  people 
should  work  out  now. 

Senator  Reed.  Haven't  you  had  any  talks  with  anybody  what- 
ever about  the  size  of  that  fund  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  have  an  understanding  with  them  that  they 
were  to  get  20  per  cent,  and  that  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  With  whom  did  you  have  that  understanding? 

Col.  Thompsox.  The  State  chairman,  I  think,  of  the  national 
ways  and  means  committee  had  it  with  the  State  chairman  of  the 
State  committee.  Understand,  Senator,  I  leave  these  things  with 
various  chairmen  to  work  out  with  the  States  as  they  best  can  work 
them  out. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  it  that  can  tell  us  about  that  ? 
Col.  Thompsox.  Lewis  E.  Pearson. 
Senator  Reed.  Is  he  in  Xew  York  now? 

Col.  Thompsox.  He  is  in  X^ew  York  now,  and  the  eastern  treasurer 
is  also  working  on  these  things,  giving  all  his  time,  and  I  would  say 
that  i^erhaps  he  would  be  better  to  give  you  this  information — James 
G.  Blaine,  jr. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  the  quota  you  are  asking  for  in  Xew  York, 
Senator  Reed  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Xo:  I  am  not  asking  for  the  quota.  I  am  asking 
what  amount  of  money  the  State  organization  in  Xew  York  has  set 
or  indicated  tentatively  or  otherwise  that  they  will  require  for  use 
in  the  State  of  Xew  York. 

Col.  Thompsox.  That  would  not  be  any  business  of  mine  anyway. 
Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  I  can  not  see  how  you  can  arrive  at  the  fact  that  20 
j^er  cent  of  the  fund  you  contemplated  raising  would  take  care  of 
Xew  York  until  you  know  Avhat  X^ew  York  needs  to  take  care  of  it. 


2354 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  I  think  they  have  already  made  up  their  minds 
that  40  per  cent  will  not. 

Senator  Reed.  But  some  one  at  one  time  made  up  his  mind  that 
20  per  cent  would,  and  that  is  what  I  am  trying  to  get  at.  I  think 
that  you  as  a  business  man,  if  you  sat  down  to  arrange  the  collection 
of  a  fund  and  the  distribution  of  20  per  cent  of  it  to  take  care  of  a 
State,  would  naturally  ask  how  much  they  needed. 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  If  you  took  20  per  cent  of  Mr.  Upham's 
figures  and  added  on  the  State,  it  would  figure  perhaps  $300,000  or 
$350,000.  I  doubt  whether  $350,000  would  take  care  of  iSew  York 
State, 

Senator  Eeed.  We  know  it  would  not. 

Col.  Thompson.  If  you  want  to  know  what  it  was  four  years  ago, 
I  think  the  State  fund  of  New  York  amounted  to  $450,000. 
Senator  Eeed.  All  told  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  All  told. 
.  Senator  Pomerene.  Four  years  ago  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  You  mean  that  20  per  cent  of  the  tentative  quota 
for  New  York  Avould  amount  to  something  like  $350,000.  Is  that 
what  you  are  giving  us  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  imagine  something  like  that,  I  have  not  paid 
a  great  deal  of  attention  to  these  quotas.  When  you  talk  about  New 
York  and  New  Jerse}^  and  Connecticut,  they  dovetail  in  pretty 
closely. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  anything  to  do  with  fixing  the  quota 
in  New  York  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No.  ^ 

Senator  Reed.  Did  your  State  chairman  have  anything  to  do  with 
making  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  quota  for  New  York? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  I  mean  the  State  chairman  of  the  State  ways 
and  means  committee. 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  think  you  will  find  that  that  all  comes  from 
Mr.  Upham. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  it  is  not  true  that  Mr.  Upham  consults  with 
the  local  bodies  and  that  the  local  bodies  practically  fix  the  quota  for 
a  State,  and  that  Mr.  Upham  then  approves  it  ?    Is  that  true  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  you  w^ill  find  it  this  way,  that  Mr.  Upham 
has  set  certain  quotas,  and  some  of  the  States  may  have  thought  that 
those  quotas  are  too  much  and  some  of  the  States  may  have  thought 
that  they  Avere  too  small. 

Senator  Reed.  But  primarily  Mr.  Upham  was  the  man  to  fix  the 
quota. 

Col.  Thompson.  We  are  only  helping  Mr.  Upham. 
Senator  Reed.  I  thought  that  was  the  situation.    What  was  the 
quota  Mr.  Upham  fixed  for  New  York  City  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  You  mean  New  York  State  ? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  New  York  State. 
Col.  Thompson.  $1,600,000. 

Senator  Reed.  You  started  out  to  try  to  raise  that  amount  of 
money? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2355 


Senator  Pomerexe.  Allow  me  to  make  this  suggestion  there,  so  we 
may  get  the  view  of  the  Ayitness  about  it.  As  I  recall,  Mr.  Upham 
said  there  were  two  special  arrangements  made  for  cities,  one  New 
York  City  and  one  Chicago.  When  you  fixed  the  amount  as  $1,600,000 
did  3^ou  mean  New  York  State  outside  of  the  city  of  New  York  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  New  York  State  as  a  whole. 

Senator  Pqaiekene.  Incluciing  New  Yorlv  City? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Keed.  Has  there  been  any  special  arrangement  made  about 
New  York  City? 

CoJ.  Thompson.  How  do  you  mean? 

Senator  Reed.  For  the  raising  of  money. 

Col.  Thompson.  Nothing  any  more  than  with  the  State. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  we  may  understand  it,  I  am  going  to  repeat 
what  Senator  Pomerene  stated  in  ]iis  question.  The  testimony  has 
been  that  there  were  tv\'o  cities  in  the  United  States  which  were  taken 
out  of  the  general  rule,  that  the  general  rule  was  that  an  amount  of 
money  was  allocated  to  the  State  to  be  raised  by  the  State,  and  the 
campaigns  were  to  be  conchicted  through  the  instrumental it}^  of  the 
State  organizations,  by  which  I  am  always  meaning  the  ways  and 
means  committees  similar  to  yours,  and  that  those  two  cities — Chi- 
cago and  New  York — were  to  be  treated  as  separate  units.  What 
about  that,  as  far  as  New  York  City  is  concerned? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  have  a  chairman  for  New  York  City — that  is, 
for  the  metropolitan  district  of  Greater  New  York — and  a  chairman 
for  the  State  outside  of  Greater  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  chairman  for  the  city  of  New  York  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  For  the  city  of  New  York  the  chairman  is  J,  P. 
Stephens. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  business  and  where  can  he  be  found? 

Col.  Thompson.  He  is  vrorking  up  in  New  York.  I  can  get  his 
address;  he  is  there  in  New  York.  He  is  in  the  dry  goods  trade  or 
a  dealer  in  cloth,  or  something  like  that,  or  ^^'orks  for  some  such 
dealer. 

Senator  Reed.  What  has  he  done  toward  preparing  an  organiza- 
tion to  collect  this  money  in  New  York  City  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  He  has  been  at  Avork  forming  various  borough 
organizations  and  various  other  committees,  much  on  the  Red  Cross 
lines,  to  decentralize  it. 

The  Chairman.  Does  it  appear  that  as  to  this  $1,600,000  for  New 
^  ork  City  there  has  been  any  allotment  of  the  proportion  to  be 
raised  in  New  York  City? 

Col.  Thompson.  We  figured  out  that  all  of  it  should  be  raised  in 
New  York  City.  You  should  add  on  the  State;  for  the  State  and 
nationally,  I  think,  about  $600,000  should  come  from  outside  of 
(jreater  New  York  and  the  balance  from  New  York  City. 

The  Chairman.  That  is,  $1,000,000  in  Greater  NeAv  York? 

Col.  Tpiompson.  Well,  it  would  be  close  on  to '$1,500,000  by  the 
time  you  added  on  the  State's  quota — about  $1,400,000. 

Senator  Reed.  When  you  say  the  State  quota  

Col.  Thompson.  State  percentage. 

Senator  Reed.  You  mean  the  percentage  which  goes  to  the  State? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 


2356 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  So  the  amount  of  money  you  are  to  spend  for  the 
national  committee  is  a  net  amount  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  national  committee  receives  all  of  the  money. 

Senator  Ivep:d.  Exactly,  but  let  me  <2:et  at  it  in  another  way.  Mr. 
Upliam  gave  you  a  quota  for  New  York  State  which  was  $1,600,000. 
You  have  an  agreement  with  the  State  organization  of  Xew  York 
to  give  them  20  per  cent  of  what  you  raise  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Eeed,  You  are  to  raise  a  sum  of  money,  then,  sufficient  so 
that  after  you  have  paid  NeAv  York  its  20  per  cent  you  still  have 
$1,6()(),()00  left  for  the  national  committee? 

Col.  Tho]\!Pson.  That  is  it.  ■ 

Senator  Keed.  That  means  that  you  would  have  to  raise  through 
•this  organization  in  the  State  of  New  York,  if  you  carry  vour  plan 
to  fruition,  $1,600,000  plus  20  per  cent  of  $1,600,000,  which  would 
be  $1,920,000? 

Col.  Thompson.  You  have  to  figure  that  back  from  the  original. 
Call  it  $2,000,000  rough. 

Senator  Keed.  Ai)proximately  $2,000,000  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  After  that  has  all  been  done,  if  the  State  organiza- 
tion does  not  feel  that  it  has  enough  or  if  the  organization  in  the  city 
of  New  York  does  not  feel  that  it  has  enough  or  if  the  organization 
in  any  of  the  counties  of  the  State  of  New  York  feels  that  if  it  does 
not  have  enough  money,  they  are  at  liberty  to  go  on  and  raise  other 
money  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  say  they  have  the  same  liberties  that  you  would 
have.  If  you  had  not  gotten  enough  money  for  your  campaign  in 
Missouri,  some  of  your  friends  might  help  you  out  getting  it. 

Senator  Reed.  That  would  depend  exactly  on  the  arrangement 
that  had  been  made,  and  I  am  speaking  of  the  arrangement.  They 
Avould  have  to  help  me  out  if  I  ran  very  far  on  money. 

Col.  Thoimpson.  Let  me  tell  you  it  is  dead  hard  to  collect  money 
this  year  where  we  limit  them  to  $1,000.  It  is  no  easy  job,  Senator. 
We  think  Ave  are  doing  a  very  righteous  thing. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  limitation  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes;  in  the  limitation. 

Senator  Edge.  For  a  righteous  cause? 

Col.  Thompson.  Never  a  more  righteous  cause. 

Senator  Reed.  I  understand  the  fellows  on  both  sides  Avill  solmenly 
swear  they  are  dead  right  and  that  they  are  all  Avorking  for  God 
and  morality  and  the  good  of  humanity. 

The  Chairman.  And  dead  broke. 

Senator  Reed.  No  ;  they  do  not  admit  that,  but  they  do  not  admit 
any  large  sum.  I  think  Ave  can  have  the  question  determined,  how- 
ever. 

Col-  Thompson.  They  have  had  a  lot  of  pretty  cheap  talk  from  a 
lot  of  people.  > 

Senator  Reed.  I  expect  that  is  so. 

Col.  Thompson.  About  raising  slush  funds,  for  Avhich  there  is  no 
foundation. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  let  us  not  get  into  an  argument  about  that.  I 
liaA^e  refrained  from  expressing  unj  opinion. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2857 


Col.  TiioMrs;ox.  It  is  barroom  politics,  and  you  know  it  as  well  as 
I  know  it. 

Senator  Iveed.  Well,  now,  let  iis  see.  Since  you  insist  upon  it.  let 
us  see.  You  raised  $1,800,000  before  you  even  nominated  your  candi- 
date, did  you  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Mr.  Upham  gave  you  the  figures. 

Senator  Reed.  That  amount  was  raised  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Keed.  You  then  made  a  budget  to  spend  $3,000,000  more? 
Col.  Thompson.  That  is  it. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  $-l:,800,000.  It  was  not  $3,000,000;  it  was 
$3,000,000  and  some  hundred  thousand  dollars  in  addition? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  that  ought  to  be  cut  down  a  little  bit. 

Senator  Reed.  Approximately  $5,000,000.  In  order  to  raise  the 
$3,000,000  the  national  committee  or  Mr.  Upham  made  a  budget  of 
approximately  $6,000,000,  an  allocation  or  quota  of  approximately 
$6,000,000,  and  allocated  that  out  to  the  various  States.  Then,  as  far 
as  the  testimony  goes,  the  State  organizations  proceeded  to  substan- 
tially double  the  allocation  to  their  States,  which,  if  it  was  carried 
out  throughout  the  Union,  would  mean  $12,000,000  that  they  had 
staited  in  to  raise. 

Col.  Thozvipson.  It  would  take  a  mathematician  to  work  that  out. 
That  is  bunk  stuff. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  not  doubled  that? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  pure  bunk  stuff. 

Senator  Reed.  No ;  it  is  not,  if  you  are  going  to  have  an  argument, 
because  your  witnesses  from  your  committee  and  your  representa- 
tives have  sworn  to  it  in  State  after  State  of  the  Union. 

Col.  Thompson.  But  when  you  come  to  see  who  is  collecting 
Democratic  money  

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  looking  at  the  Democratic  end  of  it.  You 
insisted  on  this  argument  and  I  am  going  to  complete  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  ought  to  divide  the  time. 

Col.  Thompson.  Give  me  part  of  it.  You  are  making  a  speech  in 
here. 

Senator  Reed.  You  made  one  and  you  thrust  it  in,  although  I  asked 
you  to  keep  it  out.  You  said  it  was  all  bunk.  If  that  plan  was 
carried  out  in  the  other  States,  it  w^ould  show  they  are  attempting  to  * 
raise  $12,000,000  in  order  to  raise  the  $6,000,000  quota  for  them,  and 
if  you  get  the  $6,000,000  plus  the  $1,800,000  already  collected,  you 
would  have  $7,800,000  of  this  money.  That  is  just  the  plan  that  has 
been  developed  thus  far  until  we  get  down  to  you.  What  are  you 
going  to  do  in  the  seven  States  of  the  East  is  what  I  am  proj)osing  to 
inquire  about.  You  are  talking  about  bunk.  There  may  be  some  on 
both  sides  in  this  case. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  there  is  quite  a  lot. 

Senator  Reed.  For  instance,  when  you  talk  about  bunk,  when  they 
start  to  raise  $400,000  in  the  city  of  Cleveland  after  having  allocated 
to  the  entire  State  $400,000,  it  has  the  appearance  of  something  be- 
sides bunk. 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes? 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  come  back  to  New  York  and  get  down  gently 
to  earth. 


2358 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  Yes,  but  you  said  you  would  give  me  a  chance. 
Senator  Keed.  Go  ahead ;  you  shall  have  it. 

Col.  Thomson.  Your  candidate  has  been  talking  about  $30,000,- 
000  

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  talking  about  him. 
Col.  Thompson.  Which  is  all  rot. 
Senator  Reed.  All  right. 

Col.  Thompson.  All  the  national  committee  expects  to  raise  is 
$3,000,000  and  they  hope  to  raise  that  by  not  a  man  giving  over 
$1,000.  Look  around  and  see  who  is  attacking  this  thing.  It  is  the 
men  who  have  large  sums  of  money.  Take  your  committee  working 
in  New  York  and  the  big  Democratic  money  givers  there ;  w^here  do 
they  come  from?  They  come  from  right  around  the  financial  center 
and  very  near  Wall  Street,  too,  I  will  tell  you.  Take  Baruch  and  take 
Chadbourne  at  No.  14  Wall  Street. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  what  about  Chadbourne? 

Col.  Thompson.  He  is  a  good  fellow ;  a  fine  fellow. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  Avrong  with  him? 

Col.  Thompson.  There  is  nothing  wrong  with  him.  He  is  per- 
fectly all  right. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  not  true  that  Mr.  Roosevelt,  the  Vice  Presi- 
dential candidate,  has  an  office  in  Wall  Street? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes;  he  has  an  office  at  No.  54  Wall  Street.  Un- 
termyer  has  an  office  on  Wall  Street — though  I  think  he  has  moved 
over  on  Broadway.    Baruch's  office  overlooks  Wall  Street. 

Senator  Edge.  What  about  Belmont  and  Ryan? 

Col.  Thompson.  They  are  all  doAvn  there  in  Wall  Street. 

Senator  EdCxE.  Then  there  is  not  a  monopoly  of  Wall  Street  in 
this  particular  campaign  on  one  side? 

Col.  Thompson.  No.  We  have  not  even  a  Wall  Street  committee. 
The  Democrats  have  the  Wall  Street  committee  this  year,  and  don't 
you  think  your  Democratic  candidate  is  a  stranger  to  Wall  Street, 
either. 

The  Chairman.  What  about  it? 
Senator  Edge.  He  has  been  in  Wall  Street,  has  he  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  That  felloAV  got  his  millions,  too,  and  got  most  of 
them  down  around  Wall  Street.   He  is  a  man  who  can  afford  to  put 
*    up  the  entire  campaign  fund  if  they  want  him  to. 
The  Chairman.  Do  you  mean  the  candidate? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  candidates  and  these  big  men  that  have  been 
doing  a  great  deal  of  talking  about  big  money. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  interested  in  that,  for,  strange  as  it  may  ap- 
pear to  }ipn,  if  the  Democratic  Party  or  the  Democratic  organization 
has  got  anything  crooked  about  it  I  am  just  as  anxious  to  hear  it  as 
you  are  possibly  to  tell  it.  Of  course  I  start  with  the  assumption 
that  there  is  no'  big  money  at  all  concerned  in  the  Republican  cam- 
paign and  never  has  been.  Let  us  hear  about  the  Democrats  now. 
Let  us  know  about  their  wickedness,  and  let  us  know  about  Cox's 
wickedness,  since  you  have  started  on  it. 

Col.  Thompson.'  He  has  come  out  with  a  lot  of  cheap  barroom  talk 
about  our  trying  to  raise  $30,000,000,  when  they  only  propose  to 
raise  $3,000,000. 

Senator  Reed.  You  see,  I  do  not  agree  with  that  at  all.  You  pro- 
pose to  raise  a  great  deal  more  


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2359 


Col.  Thompson.  We  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  What  you  have  said  about  Gov.  Cox  and  Wall 
Street  is  rather  interesting. 

Senator  Reed.  I  Avaiit  to  come  to  that.  Do  you  know  how  Gov. 
Cox  made  his  money  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  understood  out  of  securities.  Ohio  Cities 
Gas,  I  think,  is  one  I  have  heard  about,  and  I  think  it  is  called  the 
Pure  Oil  Co.  now. 

Senator  Reed.  It  was  the  Ohio  Cities  Gas  Co.  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  a  company  making  gas  and  selling  it  to 
the  people,  or  natural  gas? 

Col.  Thompson.  1  think  it  was  a  natural  gas  combined  with  gas 
companies  in  various  cities. 

Senator  Reed.  .Do  you  know  how  much  stock  Gov.  Cox  owned  in  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No.   These  are  only  common  reports. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  that  he  ever  owned  a  dollar  in  it? 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  of  mv  own  knowledge.  It  is  just  a  little  bit 
more  than  his  $30,000,000  talk. 

Senator  Reed.  You  characterized  that  as  rot,  I  believe.  I  want 
to  be  polite,  and  I  know  you  do,  and  of  course  you  understand  the 
entire  impropriety  of  a  man  sitting  here  under  oath  and  making 
charges  that  he  can  not  substantiate. 

Col.  Thompson.  These  are  rumors  and  talk. 

Senator  Reed.  Rumors  have  no  business  at  this  table;  not  a  bit. 
They  particularly  have  no  business  upon  the  lips  of  a  man  who  has 
]ust  taken  a  solemn  oath.  You  have,  however,  made  the  charge  that 
Gov.  Cox  is  no  stranger  to  Wall  Street,  by  which  jou  plainly  meant 
to  intimate  that  he  was  a  dealer,  a  man  who  speculated  or  dealt  in 
^Yall  Street.  I  want  to  know  when  he  was  in  Wall  Street,  who  he 
dealt  with,  and  what  he  dealt  in.   I  want  you  to  tell  us. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  said  that  I  understood  that  he  had  been 
interested  in  securities  that  are  dealt  in  on  Wall  Street. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  yes.  Of  course,  if  a  man  happens  to  buy  a  rail- 
road bond  for  an  investment — I  do  not  know  that  he  ever  bought 
one — that  security  is  dealt  in  on  Wall  Street. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  say  that  is  any  crime. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  know  the  distinction  between  some  man 
buying  a  security  when  it  may  be  listed  upon  the  stock  exchange  and 
the  man  being  a  gentleman  engaged  in  the  game  of  speculation  in 
Wall  Street.  Do  you  mean  to  say  Gov.  Cox  has  ever  been  engaged 
in  that  game  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  say  that;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well ;  that  part  of  the  charge  has  been  cleared 
up.   Did  you  ever  know  him  to  make  a  crooked  dollar  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  did  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  know  of  him  ever  making  any  money 
b}^  speculation  in  the  world? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  heard  he  was  interested  in  various  com- 
panies outside  of  Ohio. 

Senator  Reed.  What  companies  are  they? 

Col.  Thompson.  This  Ohio  Cities  Gas  is  one  I  heard  of.  I  think 
that  is  called  the  Pure  Oil. 


2360 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Ej:ed.  You  do  not  know  how  much  stock  he  owns  in  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  When  he  OAvned  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Eeed.  Whether  he  owns  it  now  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  What  other  company  do  you  know  anything  about  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  any  more  than  in  a  general  way. 
Senator  Reed.  He  has  been  in  the  neAvspaper  business,  has  he  not, 
pretty  near  all  his  life  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Ri]ed.  And  built  up  some  successful  newspapers — that  is, 
a])parently  successful  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  do  you  not  think  you  ought  to 
withdraw  this  charge  you  have  made  that  he  is  acquainted  in  Wall 
Street,  he  is  known  in  Wall  Street,  with  the  intimation  that  he  is 
connected  with  big  money  ?  Don't  you  think  you  ought  to  withdraw 
that? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  understand  Mr.  Cox  is  worth  many  millions  of 
dollars. 

Senator  Reed.  It  does  not  make  any  difference  whether  he  is  worth 
a  dollar. 

Col.  Thompson.  And  he  lives  in  a  house  that  I  am  told  cost  perhaps 
half  a  million  dollars. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Cox  has  a  little  money,  I  think. 
Col.  Thompson.  And  I  do  not  think  it  is  

Senator  Reed.  Do  not  let  us  get  into  the  question  of  a  man's  pri- 
vate fortune  

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  nothing  against  Mr.  Cox  whatever.  I 
would  say  he  is  a  clean,  fine  man. 

Senator  Reed.  Thank  you  for  that.  I  am  not  talkijig  for  him  nor 
about  the  size  of  his  personal  fortune.  I  asked  you  if  you  did  not 
think  you  ought  to  withdraw  every  part  of  your  statement  which 
intimates  that  he  is  connected  and  tied  up  with  Wall  Street. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  did  not  say  he  was  tied  up  with  Wall  Street; 
I  said  he  knew  Wall  Street. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  know  it  in  a  way.  Everybody  knows  it  in 
a  way.  But  you  meant,  did  you  not,  to  intimate  that  he  knew  it  in 
an  intimate  way  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  your  inference,  not  mine. 

Senator  Reed.  Didn't  you  intend  that  inference? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  glad  you  did  not.  Then  you  do  not  mean  to 
infer  that  Mr.  Cox  was  entangled  in  any  way  with  Wall  Street  or 
with  Wall  Street  interests,  did  you? 

Col.  Thompson.  What  I  mean  to  say  

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  mean  to  say  what  I  have  said? 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  exactly  that ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  you  do  not  mean  exactly  that.  What  did 
you  mean? 

Col.  Thompson.  Put  it  the  way  you  put  it  again. 
Senator  Reed.  I  asked  you  whether  you  meant  to  say  that  Mr.  Cox 
was  in  any  Avay  entangled  with  Wall  Street  interests,  that  he  was 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2361 


concerned  in  Wall  Street's  ventures  and  business,  that  he  is  what  we 
call  a  "  bull  "  or  "  bear  "  on  the  rharket. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  would  not  call  him  a  bull  or  bear  on  the  market. 

Senator  Reed.  No;  nor  would  you  say  that  he  ever  speculated  a 
dollar  in  Wall  Street,  would  you  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Why,  I  have  heard  rumors  that  he  had,  but  1 
would  not  accuse  him  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  Avould  not  say  that  any  of  those  rumors  were 
true,  would  you  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  swear  to  it.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  No;  Do  you  know  anybody  that  will  swear  to  it? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  You  know  it  is  not  true,  do  you  not  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  What  else  do  you  know  bad  about  Cox? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  anvthing  particularly  bad  about 
Cox. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  ever  been  to  his  house  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  but  I  have  seen  pictures  of  it.    It  looks  pretty 
good  to  me. 

Senator  Reed.  A  very  decent  house  for  a  gentleman  to  live  in. 
Do  you  mean  to  say  that  a  shingle  on  the  roof  or  a  brick  in  the  Avail 
Avas  not  paid  for  Avith  lionest  money,  honestly  earned  by  an  honest 
man  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  sounds  good. 

Senator  Reed.  I  meant  for  it  to  sound  good.  Do  you  mean  to  say 
that? 

Col.  Thompson.  Why,  no.    No ;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  you  did  not.  I  think  you  just  let  your 
blood  get  in  your  head  and  said  something  you  did  not  mean. 

Col.  Thompson.  No:  you  got  excited.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  get  a  bit  excited.  It  makes  the  cold 
shiA^ers  run  doAvn  my  back  Avhen  I  hear  a  man  sAvear  that  a  man  is 
mixed  up  Avith  AYall  Street  Avhen  he  has  no  evidence  to  back  it. 

Col.  Thompson.  Do  yoii  think  it  is  any  crime  to  be  mixed  up  Avith 
Wall  Street,  Senator? 

Senator  Reed.  No,  sir;  but  you  knoAv  the  country  understands  by 
the  term  that  a  man  is  mixed  up  with  Wall  Street,  that  he  belongs 
to  the  class  of  men  AAdio  are  connected  Avith  Avhat  Ave  call  big  financial 
operations,  and  that  his  interests  are  Avith  money  and  not  Avith  the 
people.  You  knoAv  that,  and  that  is  Avhy  you  made  this  charge  in  the 
Avay  you  did. 

NoAv,  let  us  come  back  to  this  other  business.  Nobody  is  throAving 
any  rocks  at  Mr.  Harding  here,  and  I  want  to  say  he  is  a  very  fine, 
splendid  American  citizen.  Both  of  them  are.  They  are  both 
newspaper  men;  that  puts  them  aboA^e  suspicion. 

Col.  Thompson.  But  here.  Senator,  Cox  is  going  around  and  accus- 
ing Wall  Street  interests,  and,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  most  of  the  Wall 
Street  interests  as  far  as  I  knoAv — the  big  felloAVs  doAvn  there— Avant 
to  see  Cox  elected. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  Avhat  I  am  interested  in;  and  I  say  to  you 
in  perfect  sincerity  that  if  the  big  interests  of  New  York  are  inter- 
ested in  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox  I  Avant  to  knoAV  it  just  as  bad  as  you 
can  want  to  tell  it. 


2362 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  A  good  many  of  them.  Look  at  the  two  big 
financial  papers  in  New  York.  Who  are  they  for?  The  New  York 
World  and  the  New  York  Times. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  the  New  York  World  a  big  financial  paper? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes ;  I  should  say  that  next  to  the  Times  it  is  the 
largest  financial  paper  in  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  if  1  understand  what  you  mean  by 
"  financial  paper.''  Do  you  mean  to  say  it  is  just  a  large  and  wealthy 
paper,  or  do  you  mean  it  is  a  paper  that  supports  and  is  aligned 
with  big  money  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  mean  the  papers  that  are  mostly  read  by  people 
with  money. 

Senator  Reed.  And  that  is  caters  to  mone}^?  Would  vou  include 
that? 

Col.  Thompson.  Oh,  I  would  not  put  it  that  way.  They  are  big, 
fine,  honest  papers — Avonderful  papers.    The}^  are  both  for  Cox. 

Senator  Reed.  The  New  York  World  has  naturalh^  been  a  Demo- 
cratic paper  for  several  years,  has  it  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Well,  it  is  not  a  poor  man's  paper,  is  it  ? 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  know.  They  do  not  speak  flatteringly  of 
me,  so  I  am  going  to  pronounce  no  encomiums  on  them.  But  the 
New  York  Times  was  a  Republican  paper  generally,  Avas  it  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you.  I  knoAv  it  is  for  Mr.  Cox 
right  noAv. 

Senator  Reed.  It  has  been  a  great  League  of  Nations  paper  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAA'  anything  about  the  financial  interests 
back  of  that  paper  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  knoAA^  aa  ho  oaa^us  the  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  the  New  York  Post — that  has  some  financial 
backing  too,  has  it  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  That  is  one  of  the  smaller  papers;  it  does 
not  amount  to  much. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  backed  by  Mr.  Lamont? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  AA-hat  I  understand :  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAA^  about  Mr.  Lamont  making  a  public 
statement  that  the  paper  Avas  bought  for  the  purpose  of  booming  the 
League  of  Nations? 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  You  neA  er  heard  that  ? 

Col.  Tplompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Lament's  connection  Avith  the  house  of  Morgan 
is  AAdiat? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  belieA^e  he  is  one  of  the  partners  there. 

Senator  Reed.  He  also  AA^ent  to  Europe  as  one  of  the  financial  ad- 
Adsers  of  the  President,  did  he  not,  AAdien  the  peace  treaty  Avas  being 
negotiated  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  So  I  understand. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  acquainted  Avith  the  fact  that  it  Avas  Mr. 
Lamont  Avho  secured  the  copy  of  the  German  peace  treaty  Aveeks  be- 
fore, or  a  considerable  time  before  the  Senate  got  it,  and  turned  it 
OA' er  to  Mr.  DaA^idson  as  representatiA^e  of  the  Red  Cross,  Avho  in  turn 
turned  it  over  to  Mr.  Root,  Avho  Avas  the  representative  of  all  interna- 
tional virtues  ?   Do  you  knoAv  about  those  facts  ? 


PRESIDEXTI-\L  CAMPAIGX  EXPEXSES. 


2363 


Col.  Thompsox.  Why,  in  an  indistinct  way  I  remember  reading 
somethin<r  about  them  in  the  newspapers. 

Senator  Reed.  You  would  not  say  that  Mr.  Root  or  Mr.  Davidson 
or  Mr.  Lamont  was  supporting  Mr.  Cox  jiist  at  the  present  moment, 
would  you  ?    Or  are  they  i 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  am  not  sure,  but  I  think  they  are  supporting  Mr. 
Cox. 

The  Chairmax.  That  question  ought  to  be  clear.  He  includes  Mr. 
Root  in  that.  The  Xew  York  Post,  as  3^ou  understand  it,  is  support- 
ing Mr.  Cox  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  So  I  understand. 

The  Chairmax.  But  the  answer  you  have  given  would  indicate 
that  ^Ir.  Root  was  supj^orting  him. 

Col.  Thompsox.  Well,  you  Senators  are  bad  game  for  a  poor  fel- 
low like  me :  you  get  so  many  things  hooked  around  in  the  same  thing. 

Senator  Reed.  You  understand  this  paper,  owned  by  Mr.  Lamont, 
of  the  house  of  Morgan,  is  advocating  the  League  of  Xations  and  sup- 
porting Mr.  Cox  ( 

Col.  Thomisox.  I  believe  that  is  so;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  other  big  financial  interests  in  Xew  York  City 
have  lined  up  on  the  League  of  Nations  fight  or  with  the  Democratic 
Party,  either  one  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  would  like  to  see  that  list  that  you  spoke  to  me 
about  that  Mr.  Girard  gave  you. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  read  you  the  names. 

Senator  Edge  (handing  a  paper  to  the  witness).  I  have  the  list 
here. 

Col.  Thompsox  (referring  to  paper).  Well,  there  is  lots  of  money 
there.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  In  that  list  ? 
Col.  Thompsox.  Yes :  lots  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Suppose  we  just  average  it  up  with  your  list. 
About  how  would  they  average  up  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  Oh.  I  would  say  there  is  much  more  money  in 
this  list  than  there  is  in  my  list  when  you  add  on  a  few  more  names, 
like  ^Ir.  Untermeyer. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes :  if  you  add  on  a  few  more  names. 

Col.  Thompsox.  AVell.  Mr.  Untermeyer  has  come  out  in  an  article 
stating  tliat  the  rich  Democrats  will  have  to  get  together  and  de- 
prive themseh'es  and  raise  large  sums  of  money. 

Senator  Reed.  Sacrifice :  give  until  it  hurts,  etc.  ? 

Col.  Thompsox.  Yes:  exactly. 

Senator  Reed.  We  have  heard  those  terms.  Xow.  I  Avant  to  stick 
to  this  text  and  not  argue  which  is  the  worse. 

Col.  Thompsox.  I  think  it  is  all  right.  Senator.  These  are  good 
men.  I  am  not  finding  any  faidt.  There  is  just  this  bunk  that  they 
have  been  trying  to  put  over,  that  the  moneyed  interests  are  with 
one  side  and' not  with  the  other.  I  tell  you.  there  is  big  money  on 
both  sides. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  business.  Mr.  Thompson  ? 
Col.  Thompsox.  I  ha^e  retired  from  business. 
Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  have  some  interests? 
Col.  Thompsox.  I  have  some  interests:  yes. 


2364 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  What  are  yoii  interested  in? 

Col.  Thompson.  What  am  I  interested  in?  Wliat  I  am  doing,  and 
one  thing  and  another?  Wouki  you  like  to  know,  Senator?  When 
the  United  States  entered  the  war  I  withdrew  from'  business,  and 
since  then  have  devoted  all  my  time  to  war  activities  and  other  public 
work  which  I  believe  to  be  of  a  useful  character. 

Senator  Reed.  I  just  asked  you  where  your  financial  interests  lie 
now. 

Col.  Thompson.  You  asked  me  what  work  I  was  doing. 

Senator  Reed.  No  ;  I  rlid  not  ask  you  what  work  you  were  doing. 
I  asked  you  what  your  financial  interests  were. 

Col.  Thompson.  Do  you  wunt  to  learn  all  my  securities  ? 

Senator  Reed.  I  Avant  to  know  what  concerns  you  have  got  finan- 
cial interest  in,  since  you  have  raised  this  question. 

Col.  Thompson,  Well,  let  me  see.  Is  it  proper  for  me  to  give  a 
list  of  my  securities? 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  no. 

The  ChaipvMAN.  Are  you  connected  with  any  banks  or  railroads? 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  to  ask  all  about  your  private  busi- 
ness, Mr.  Thompson,  but  we  have  been  having  a  good  deal  of  talk 
here — — 

Col.  Thompson.  I  came  from  the  AVest.  I  am  interested  in  some 
western  copper  stock. 

Senator  Reed.  Which  companies? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  was  interested  in  Inspiration,  and  am  some 
to-day. 

Senator  Reed.  AVhere  is  that  located  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Out  in  Arizona. 
Senator  Reed.  What  others  ? 
.  Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  like  to  give  a  man  a  list  of  my  stock. 
Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  asking  for  a  list. 
Col.  Thompson.  I  own  some  bank  stocks  in  New  York. 
Senator  Reed.  What  banks? 
Col.  Thompson.  Some  in  the  Chase  Bank. 
Senator  Reed.  What  others? 

Col.  Thompson.  A  little  bit  of  stock  in  the  Irving  Bank. 

Senator  Reed.  The  City  Bank? 

Col.  Thompson.  None  in  the  City  Bank,  no. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  are  interested  in  something  besides  cop- 
per, are  you  not  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  got  some  Liberty  bonds. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  am  talking  about  interests  in  companies. 

Senator  Edge.  How  much  Liberty  bonds  have  you  got? 

Senator  Reed.  All  right,  if  you  w^ant  to  ask  him  that. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  a  few  hundred  thousand  dollars  in  Liberty 
bonds. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  challenging  the  patriotism  of  Col.  Thomp- 
son for  a  minute.  I  am  just  asking  what  companies  he  is  interested  in. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  interested  in  an  alkali  company,  and  I  have 
got  a  miscellaneous  lot  of  securities.  Texas  Gulf  Sulphur — I  am  in- 
terested in  a  sulphur  companv.  I  am  interested  in  Sinclair  Oil  a 
little  bit. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  about  that.    You  are  the  controlling 
stockholder  in  Sinclair  Oil  to-day,  are  you  not? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2365 


Col.  Thompson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  HaA^e  you  not  recently  acquired  a  large  block  of  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  some  stock  in  Sinclair  Oil. 

Senator  Keed.  But  is  it  not  true  that  you  to-day  own  or  control 
enough  of  the  stock  of  the  company  so  that  you  could  take  over  its 
management  if  you  wanted  to  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Oh,  absolutely  no. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  That  is  one  of  these  rumors  that  are 
afloat. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  proud  to  say  I  am  a  director  in  it,  Senator. 
I  believe  it  is  a  good  company. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  it  is.  Anything  that  can  crawl  up  and 
throttle  old  John  D.  Rockefeller's  companies  looks  good  to  me.  Of 
course,  he  has  not  any  interest  in  that. 

Col.  Thompson. •!{  ought  to  be  quite  a  competitor  to  Standard  Oil 
in  time. 

Senator  Reed.  What  other  companies? 

Col.  Thompson.  Another  oil  company,  prospecting  down  in  . 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  that  company  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  The  Oil  Issues  Co. 
Senator  Reed.  AVhat  is  that? 
Col.  Thompson.  That  is  a  sort  of  private  concern. 
Senator  Reed.  A  sort  of  holding  company  ? 
Mr.  Thompson.  Yes;  or  leasing. 
Senator  Reed.  Exploiting  the  field  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes ;  producing  oil  down  below  there. 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  interests  in  Texas  Oil  ? 
Col.  Tho:v[pson.  None  in  Texas  Oil :  no. 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  any  in  Mexico? 
Col.  Tho:mpson.  Sinclair  is  interested  somewhat  in  Mexico. 
Senator  Reed.  Pretty  heavily  interested,  is  it  not  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Quite  a  lot  of  oil  down  there;  yes.    They  have 
quite  an  interest  doAvn  there. 

Senator  Reed.  AVhat  other  companies? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  whether  I  have  any  Ohio  Cities 
Oas :  I  do  not  believe  I  have  now.  I  used  to  have  some.  I  think  that 
is  called  the  Pure  Oil  now. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  not  the  same  one  that  Mr.  Cox  is  in,  is  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  sanie  one,  I  understand,  that  Mr.  Cox  is  in, 
Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  You  and  Mr.  Cox  are  partners,  aren't  you? 

Col.  Thompson.  Kind  of  brothers  in  some  respects. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Since  you  are  in  it,  he  can  not  be  such  a  bad 
fellow  because  he  is  in  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  never  said  that  Cox  was  a  bad  fellow,  but 
I  resent  his  putting  up  this  bull  stuff. 

Senator  Reed.  He  raised  the  ante  too  high  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  He  multiplied  it  by  about  10,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Xo  ;  he  did  not.    AA"e  won't  argue  that. 

Col.  Thompson.  He  multiplied  it  by  10. 

Senator  Reed.  We  won't  argue  that  question  just  noAv.  Let  us 
stick  to  the  evidence. 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes;  but  you  Avere  asking  me  Avhat  I  was  doing. 
I  Avould  be  glad  to  tell  you. 


2366 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  I  have  not  asked  you  what  you  have  been  doing  at 
all.  I  am  just  asking  what  you  are  interested  in.  You  can  get  that 
speech  in  later  on. 

The  Chairman.  You  Avill  have  an  opportunity  to  present  that. 

Col.  Thompson.  The  Senator  agreed  when  he  made  that  speech 
that  he  would  give  me  a  chance. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  have  made  it.  Let  us  continue  on  this 
thing  and  see  what  else  you  are  interested  in  financially. 

Col.  Thompson.  Financially? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  I  Avill  have  to  send  and  get  a  list. 
Senator  Reed.  I  mean  your  principal  interests.    Have  you  any 
interests  in  steel  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Any  in  railroads?  * 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  I  am  too  wise  for  that — oh,  yes;  I  have.  I 
take  that  back.  I  am  president  of  a  little  railroad  down  in  Arizona. 
.  It  is  only  30  miles  long. 

Senator  Reed.  Senator  Stevens  forgot  a  railroad  and  a  steamship 
line  when  he  was  telling  us  about  his  money. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  as  wide  as  the  other  roads  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  think  it  is  only  22  inches  wide. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  is  that  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Down  in  Arizona.  It  connects  the  Magma  mines 
at  Superior  with  the  railroad.  And  I  am  also  interested  in  the 
Magma  copper  mine  in  Arizona. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  another  copper  mine.  Now,  can  you  think 
of  any  others? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  I  have  a  little  stock  in  Dodge  Bros, 
there  in  Chicago. 

Senator  Reed.  What  are  the}^? 

Col.  Thompson.  Well,  I  think  the  Ohio  Cities  Gas. 

Senator  Kenyon.  Is  Cox  in  that,  too  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  whether  he  is  a  stockholder  in  that 
or  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  think  of  anj^thing  else? 

Col.  Thompson.  Let  me  see,  Senator.  Oh,  I  have  miscellaneous  in- 
vestments. As  I  told  you,  I  went  out  of  business  when  Ave  went  into 
the  war,  so  I  have  not  been  as  aggressive  of  late  years  as  I  had  been 
before.  I  have  been  devoting  my  time  more  to  other  things. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  interested  in  what  you  are  devoting  your 
time  to.  I  am  just  asking  if  you  can  think  of  another  copper  mine 
or  two,  or  a  railroad  or  something  like  that,  that  is  slipping  your 
memory  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  you  have  spoken  about  the  people  that  are  in- 
terested in  Mr.  Cox's  campaign — financiers.  Have  you  got  a  list  of 
your  New  York  subscribers  to  the  Republican  campaign  fund  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  not ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  there  is  a  chairman  in  New  York,  and  he  has 
divided  the  toAvn  in  some  way,  allocated  the  work  in  some  way? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Chairman,  Senator  Pomerene  suggests  that  as 
it  is  now  a  quarter  past  1  we  might  adjourn  for  lunch. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2367 


(Thereupon,  at  1.15  o'clock  p.  m.,  a  recess  was  taken  until  2.30 
o'clock  p.  m.) 

AFTERNOON  SESSION. 

The  subcommittee  reassembled  at  the  expiration  of  the  recess. 

Present :  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman) ,  Edge,  Reed,  and  Pomerene. 

William  Boyce  Thompson,  the  witness  under  examination  when  the 
recess  was  taken,  resumed  the  stand  and  testified  further  as  follows : 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  talking  before  recess  of  the  large  moneyed 
interests  who  were  bafck  of  the  Democratic  campaign.  You  spoke 
of  the  New  York  World  and  the  New  York  Times.  Do  you  know 
anything  about  the  control  of  the  New  York  Times  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not ;  no.  I  would  say  that  you  can  get  that 
from  the  New  York  Times  people. 

Senator  Reed.  You  had  mentioned  it,  and  therefore  I  thought  per- 
haps you  kneAv. 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  whether  the  New  York  Times  is 
connected  in  any  way  Avith  big  money  except  as  the  corporation  may 
or  may  not  be  a  wealthy  corporation? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  is  the  paper  that  most  of  the  people  with  big- 
money  read.   It  gives  them  the  kind  of  news — — 

Senator  Reed.  You  figure  that  it  has  a  leaning  toward  

Col.  Thompson.  I  would  say  it  is  a  'vevy  conservative  paper ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  specify  any  other  individuals  or  corpora- 
tions included  in  the  general  term  "  big  mone}^  "  ?  That  is,  giving 
support  to  the  Democratic  ticket  or  the  Democratic  fund  in  New 
York? 

Col.  Thompson.  No.  In  particular,  I  Avas  just  looking  over  this 
list.  It  kind  of  looks  like  the  Mitchell  campaign  list— $3,000,000,  or 
whateA'er  it  Avas — the  list  that  Ambassador  Gerard  gaA^e  you. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  what  do  you  mean  by  that? 

Col.  Thompson.  As  I  understand,  about  the  same  committee  that 
collected  the  Mitchell  fund  there  in  NeAv  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  a  man  on  that  committee  that  collected  the 
Mitchell  fund  except  the  one  man,  Mr.  Chadbourne,  that  you 
knoAv  of? 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  positively. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  still  interested  in  having  you  tell  us  AA-ho  these 
interests  are,  Avhat  these  interests  are,  Avho  these  individuals  are  that 
you  class  as  big  money,  that  you  say  are  back  of  the  Cox  campaign. 
I  am  particularly  interested  in  that,  because  if  an  international  finan- 
cier has  been  contributing  to  this  League  of  Nations  fund,  and  you 
knoAv  about  it,  I  want  to  find  out.  You  see,  you  and  I  have  a  com- 
mon interest  now.  I  am  approaching  you.  as  a  brother  and  asking 
you  to  please  give  me  some  light  on  this  question  if  you  can. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  wish  I  could  give  you  more  light,  Senator;  but 
it  seems  to  me  

Senator  Reed.  You  just  made  a  kind  of  a  loose  statement,  did  you 
not.  Colonel? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  know  that  the  New  York  Times  is  backing  Cox. 
I  know  that  the  NeAV  York  AYorld  is  backing  Cox. 

182774— 20— PT  17  4 


2368 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Then  there  are  some  papers  backing  Harding? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Equally  large  and  potential  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  In  fact,  the  majority  of  New  York  papers  are 
backing  Harding  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  there  are  quite  a  number  of  them  

Senator  Reed.  The  majority  of  the  big  papers  all  over  the  United 
States  are  backing  him. 

Col.  Thompson.  You  were  talking  about  the  big  money  papers  in 
New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  I  am  talking  about  them.  That  is  as  far  as 
you  can  go  into  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  as  far  as  I  can  go  into  it. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  We  have  pursued  the  road  to  the 
squirrel  path  and  run  up  a  tree,  and  I  guess  we  might  as  well  stop 
on  that  tree. 

The  Chairman.  Excuse  me.  Has  the  New  York  Post  been  a 
Republican  paper? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  has  been  an  independent  paper  for  some  time. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  the}^  came  out  immediately 
for  Cox  after  the  convention  or  wdiether  they  waited  to  see  the  posi- 
tion Harding  took  on  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  thay  waited  until  the  position  that  he  took. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  remember  an  editorial  of  that  kind? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes,  sir;  I  remember  reading  an  editorial. 

The  Chairman.  And  after  his  position  they  came  out  for  Cox  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Put  this  in  the  record,  that  I  had  inquiries  made 
at  the  Post  Office  Department  as  to  the  registered  ownership  of  the 
New  York  Post,  and  the  records,  as  reported  to  me,  show  that  the 
Post  was  owned  by  a  corporation,  and  that  all  of  the  stock  of  the 
corporation  is  owned  by  Mr.  Lamont.  I  do  not  think  it  is  necessary 
to  send  down  and  get  that. 

The  Chairman.  Before  you  get  awa;/  from  that :  Do  you  know 
whether  any  of  the  stock  of  any  of  these  papers  is  ow^ned  abroad? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  seems  to  me  on  this  League  of  Nations  it  would 
be  well  enough  for  your  committee  to  find  that  out.   It  is  vital. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  of  any  of  those  papers,  since  we  are 
discussing  papers,  that  are  English  owned? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  anything  about  this  paper  called 
"Life"? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  see  it  in  a  barber  shop  once  in  a  while. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course  I  mean  its  OAvnership ;  not  the  place  it  is 
deposited.  That  might  lead  us  into  various  places.  But  do  you 
know^  whether  it  is  owned  by  English  interests,  British  interests? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  I  gues  you  do  not  know  about  those  things. 

Now,  I  want  to  come  back  to  the  organization,  very  brie%.  You 
have  not  had  anything  to  do  wdth  the  details  of  the  organizing 
of  the  committees^  in  New  York  City  to  raise  money  locally ;  that  is 
turned  over  to  the  chairman  of  the  local  committee  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2369 


Col.  Thompson.  The  local  committee.  I  try  to  keep  out  of  all  of 
the  States  and  get  the  people  whose  responsibility  it  is  to  do  the 
work  to  do  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  traveled  in  any  of  these  States,  going 
about  to  help  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Very  little. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  much  money  has  been  raised  in 
the  State  of  Delaware,  or  pledged? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  now.  I  know  up  until  a  few 
weeks  ago  there  had  been  very,  very  little. 

Senator  Reed,  Well,  of  course,  a  few  weeks  ago  carries  us  back 
a  good  deal  of  time  in  a  campaign. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  think  there  is  very  much  yet.  They 
expect  the  Delaw^are  and  Connecticut  money,  and  those  States  to 
function  now  in  the  next  week  or  two,  and  to  have  the  money  come  in. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  had  any  consultations  with  politicians 
down  there  in  regard  to  raising  money  at  the  last  end  of  the  cam- 
paign ? 

Col.  Thompson.  None  whatever. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  arrangement  about  underwriting  any 
deficiency  that  may  occur  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  There  has  been  none. 
Senator  Reed.  No  talk  of  that  kind  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No. 
Senator  Reed.  By  anybody  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  ever  had  anything  to  do,  directly  or  in- 
directly, by  yourself  or  through  another,  with  dealing  for  the  sup- 
port of  foreign  language  newspapers  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  I  indirectly  am  interested  in  some*  foreign 
language  advertising  agency  in  New  York  that  I  bought  into  two 
or  three  years  ago.  I  do  not  know  just  who  ow^ns  it.  It  is  a  com- 
pany which  I  was  in. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  in  it  yet? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am,  but  paying  no  attention  to  it. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  that  company  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  sorry  that  I  can  not  give  you  the  name  of  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Do  you  think  you  can  think  of  it,  Colonel,  after 
^  teflection  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes ;  it  will  come  to  my  mind.  If  not,  I  will  hunt 
it  up. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  is  it  located  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  office  is  located  somewhere  in  New  York.  I 
have  never  been  to  the  office  of  the  company. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  its  manager? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  that. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  the  president  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  that. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  its  capital  stock? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  that. 
Senator  Reed.  Has  it  ever  declared  any  dividends  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  It  has  not,  that  I  know  of. 
The  Chairman.  You  remember  that  ? 


2370 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  I  remember  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  got  into  it  how  long  ago  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  A  year  or  two  ago. 

Senator  Eeed.  When  did  you  commence  to  take  an  interest  in  this 
campaign — about  that  same  time? 

Col.  Thompson.  Oh,  I  have  been  interested  as  a  Republican  for  a 
long,  long  time. 

Senator  Keed.  You  control  this  advertising  concern.  That  is,  it 
is  a  concern  that  gathers  up  advertising  to  put  in  foreign-language 
newspapers.   Is  that  its  business? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  It  was  bought  up  at  the  close  of  the  war  in 
one  of  these  Americanization  schemes  where  schools  were  started, 
and  it  was  thought  to  be  a  bad  influence,  and  it  was  picked  up  at  that 
time. 

Senator  Reed.  AVhat  kind  of  schools  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Schools  in  factories  and  one  thing  and  another. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  quite  get  that. 

Col.  Thompson.  They  were  educational  schools. 

Senator  Reed.  To  educate  foreigners  to  become  Americans? 

Col.  Thompson.  American  citizens ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  it  thought  that  the  foreign -language  news- 
papers were  a  bad  influence?  Was  that  the  idea?  And  you  wanted 
to  control  the  advertising  to  control  them? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  it  was  thought  that  the  man  was  under 
grave  suspicion,  or  something.  I  can  not  give  you  all  of  that.  I 
will  look  that  up  and  give  it  to  you  accurately  if  you  Avould  like. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  but  I  do  not  quite  get  your  meaning.  There 
were  schools  being  held  in  this  country  for  the  purpose  of  educating 
the  foreigner  to  be  a  good  American  citizen.  You  were  in  harmony 
with  that,  of  course  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Reed.  I  can  not  understand  why  the  organization  of  a  con- 
cern that  had  to  do  with  advertisements  could  have  anything  to  do 
with  this  educational  matter.    Will  you  make  that  real  plain  to  me  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  seems  to  me  one  of  the  stories  that  I  heard 
was  that  some  of  the  foreign-language  newspapers  were  getting  their 
ads  through  these  schools.  One  was  spoken  of  out  in  Denver,  I 
believe,  where  20.  or  30  per  cent  of  their  ads  were  German  steam- 
ship ads,  or  something  like  that. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  thought  that  the  advertising,  coming  from 
German  steamship  companies  and  things  of  that  kind,  might  in- 
fluence the  editorial  policy  of  the  paper? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  mean  that  was  just  one  of  the  

Senator  Reed.  One  of  the  considerations? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  one  of  the  things  that  came  up  in  their  meet- 
ings that  were  held  at  that  time. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  not  tell  me  what  advertising  had  to  do 
with  the  Americanization  of  foreign  voters? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you  much  about  it.  I  can  not  give 
you  very  much  on  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  a  Fannie  Kellar? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  liave  met  her. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  talk  with  her  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2371 


Col.  Thompson.  Oh,  not  for  a  year. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  fix  any  time.  You  have  talked  with  her. 
When  Avas  the  last  time  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  about  a  year  ago  or  more. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  a  talk  about  some  financial  arrange- 
ments with  her  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Financial  arrangements? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Col.  Thompson.  Not  in  particular. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  talk  questions  that  involved  finance  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  talk  to  her  about  purchasing  any  interest 
in  the  American  Association  of  Foreign  Language  newspapers  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  the  name  that  you  wanted.  I  could  not 
think  of  it.  The  last  time  I  talked  with  her  she  wanted  an  option  on 
some  stock  that  I  was  interested  indirectly  in. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  talk  about  $50,000  at  that  time? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  what  the  price  was. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  she  purchasing  from  you  or  was  she  going 
to  purchase  for  you  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  she  was  going  to  purchase  from  me,  or  wanted 
me  to  get  a  certain  block  of  stock  for  her. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh.   She  wanted  you  to  get  a  block  of  stock  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  To  get  an  option  on  it  so  that  this  other  associa- 
tion that  she  was  interested  in  could  CA^entually  own  all  the  stock  in 
this  company. 

Senator  Reed.  And  thus  control  what? — the  advertising,  or  control 
the  policy  of  the  paper  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  The  advertising,  and  I  think  some  general  great 
big  scheme  which  she  had. 

Senator  Reed.  In  plain  language,  this  was  what  it  meant,  was  it 
not,  that  if  you  Avould  get  control  of  the  advertising  you  could,  in- 
fluence the  policies  of  these  papers  and  make  them  support  or  lead 
them  to  support  Avhat  you  regarded  as  good  American  principles. 
That  Avas  the  idea,  Avas  it  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  I  think  the  first  meeting  that  I  attended — 
there  Avas  CleA^eland  Dodge  and  a  lot  of  people  I  think  fairly  close 
to  the  administration  in  this  movement. 

Senator  Reed.  You  said  that  she  Avanted  to  get  enough  of  this  stock 
so  that  she  could  control  and  operate  it  Avith  some  other  company  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  This  other  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  That  other  organization  that  you  refer  to  

Col.  Thompson.  That  was  this  school  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that,  putting  it  in  brief  language,  the  plan 
was  to  get  control  of  an  organization  that  controlled  adA^ertise- 
ments  in  foreign  neAvspapers  and  through  that  control  to  in  turn 
control  the  policy  of  those  papers  so  that  they  Avould  become  coop- 
erative agencies  Avith  the  organization  that  Avas  trjdng  to  Ameri- 
canize foreigners? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  something  like  that. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  about  the  plan  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  And  she  talked  to  you  about  getting  $50,000  Avorth 
of  the  stock  ? 


2372 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  whether  it  was  $50,000  worth  or 
not,  but  a  substantial  block  of  stock. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  your  stock  or  was  it  stock  that  you  were 
to  get? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  was  stock  that  I  either  owned  or  was  owned 
by  some  affiliated  company  with  me  or  some  of  my  family.  I  can 
also  tell  you  whether  I  own  that  stock  or  not,  personally.  I  do  not 
think  I  do.  I  was  a  director  for  a  while  and  resigned.  They  wanted 
me  to  put  more  money  in  it  and  I  Avould  not  put  more  money  in  it. 
I  told  her  I  would  gladly  sell  the  stock. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  have  not  sold  it  yet  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  else  is  in  this  company  with  you?  You  must 
have  a  considerable  interest. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  Coleman  du  Pont  is  in  it,  and  gives  more 
or  less  attention  to  it.    I  do  not.    I  have  never  been  to  a  meeting. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  talk  with  him  about  why  he  was  in  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  may  have. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  3^ou  think  Cleveland  Dodge  is  in  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  did  not  say  that.  I  said  I  think  it  started 
Avith  this  other  movement. 

Senator  Reed.  But  before  the  other  movement  started — that  is, 
before  the  movement  to  Americanize  foreigners  started — this  adver- 
tising agency  existed,  and  you  and  Coleman  du  Pont  

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  did  not  buy  into  it  until  after. 

Senator  Reed.  After  what? 

Col.  Thompson.  After  this  other  patriotic  work  was  started. 

Senator  Reed.  I  see.    Could  you  fix  the  time  when  you  bought  in  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No;  I  could  look  that  up,  but  I  could  not  fix  it 
now.  I  should  say  it  is  over  a  year  ago.  Perhaps  it  was  tAVO  years 
ago  or  over. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  that  is  important,  whether  it  is  a  year  or 
two  years.    You  can  fix  the  time? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  Avould  say  it  Avas  over  a  year  ago,  but  perhaps 
nearer  tAvo  years  ago. 

Senator  E[eed.  You  did  not  yourself  happen  to  go  into  that  agency  ? 
Somebody  got  you  to  go  in? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  happened  to  get  into  lots  of  things  to  help  out 
along  about  that  time. 

Senator  Reed.  I  say,  you  did  not  happen  to  get  it.  Somebody 
presented  it  to  you.  That  is  what  I  mean.  I  do  not  mean  that  you 
did  anything  Avrong  in  the  matter. 

Col.  Thompson.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it  that  asked  you  to  go  into  this  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Miss  Kellar. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  your  negotiations  Avith 
Miss  Kellar  were  mostly  in  connection  Avith  obtaining  a  block  of 
stock?  *  ^  . 

Col.  Thompson.  Or  a  closely  affiliated  interest,  and  I  was  put  m 
as  a  director.  When  I  found  that  out  I  resigned,  because  I  did  not 
Avant  to  bother  with  it.  ' 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  the  closely  affiliated  interest  that  may 
have  gotten  the  stock  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGI^  EXPENSES. 


2373 


Col.  Thompson.  Some  company  that  I  am  interested  in  bought 
the  stock.  I  am  not  sure  whether  it  came  into  a  company  or  myself. 
As  I  told  you  before,  I  will  gladly  look  that  up  and  let  you  know 
exactly  who  owns  that  stock. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  can  not  recall  yet  who  is  the  president  or  man- 
ager of  that  advertising  company  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  The  advertising  company  placed  very  large  orders 
for  advertising,  did  it  not? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know  any  details  about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  can  not  give  me  the  names  of  anybody  that  can 
give  that  to  me.    Where  does  this  Miss  Kellar  live  ? 
•  Col.  Thompson.  She  lives  in  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  tell  us  how  we  can  find  her  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  imagine  if  you  got  the  address  of  the  foreign 
language  press  

Senator  Reed.  Has  she  any  business  that  she  pursues  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  she  has  been  working  on  this  Americani- 
zation movement  and  was  working  under  the  administration. 

Senator  Reed.  Under  the  administration? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  believe  so.    She  had  some  position. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  this  organization,  this  Ger- 
man-language newspaper  

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  it  is  all  languages ;  not  particularly  Ger- 
man. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  mean  German ;  I  meant  foreign  languages. 
Do  you  Know  whether  that  association  ever  had  received  any  moneys 
from  foreign  governments  coming  from  foreign  sources  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  feel  sure  it  has  not  since  I  had  anything  to  do 
with  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  mean  the  association  that  you  are  dealing 
with ;  I  mean  the  papers. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  anything  about  that.  You  spoke 
of  having  been  concerned  in  other  campaigns.  Do  you  mean  na- 
tionally, or  only  concerned  in  State  campaigns  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  mean  I  have  alwaj^s  had  an  interest  in  my  party. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  this  advertising  organization  place  contracts 
with  foreign  newspapers  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you  that.  I  know  very  little  about 
it.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  I  wish  you  would  tell  us  somebody  that  can  tell  us  • 
about  what  it  has  been  doing. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  imagine  Col.  du  Pont,  or  some  one  around  him. 

Senator  Reed.  You  think  Col.  du  Pont  could  tell  us  the  manager 
of  the  company  or  the  president  or  the  responsible  man  in  it? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  Mr.  George  Sylvester  Veerick? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  he  is  in  the  employ  of  the 
Republican  committee  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  this  advertising  company  has 
placed  advertisements  in  Mr.  Veerick's  newspaper? 


2374 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  We  would  have  to  get  that  Avith  some  one  connected 
with  the  company  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  that  is  all  for  the  jDresent. 

The  Chairman.  Col.  Thompson,  you  started  to  make  a  little 
speech,  but  Avere  interrupted  by  Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  give  you 
an  opportunity  to  make  that  speech.  We  do  not  want  to  cut  off  an}^ 
speeches. 

Col.  Thompson.  This  is  what  I  started  to  say  when  I  Avas  inter 
rupted:  He  asked  me  my  activities  and  Avhat  my  business  was  and 
what  I  Avas  doing. 

When  the  United  States  entered  the  war  I  Avitlidrew  from  busi- 
ness, and  since  then  have  devoted  all  of  my  time  to  war  activities  and 
other  public  Avork  that  I  believed  to  be  of  a  useful  character. 

This  Avork  has  been  A^aried.  I  was  chairman  of  the  Westchester 
County  commission  of  general  safety  in  the  early  months  of  the 
Avar  and  head  of  one  of  the  Ncaa'  York  City  Red  (3ross  teams  Avhich 
gave  a  good  account  of  itself.  In  June,  1917,  at  the  request  of  the 
chairman  of  the  American  Red  Cross  Avar  council  I  Avent  to  Russia, 
and  for  several  months  Avas  the  head  of  the  Red  Cross  mission  there. 
On  my  return  I  became  chairman  of  the  corporation  division  of  the 
second  Red  Cross  drive,  and  Avas  glad  to  report  the  raising  of 
approximately  $25,000,000  from  the  corporations  having  otfices  in 
Greater  NeAv  York. 

Recognizing  the  need  of  keeping  the  boys  at  the  front  in  touch 
Avith  home,  I  established'  the  liome-neAvspaper  service,  sending  at  my 
expense  home  ncAvspapers  to  8,000  boys  Avho  had  enlisted  from  my 
OAvn  count3\  Westchester.  Subsequently  I  expanded  this  Avork  to  a 
national  scale,  and  until  the  close  of  the  Avar  Avas  head  of  an  associa- 
tion Avhich  had  the  cooperation  of  over  4,000  neAVspapers  throughout 
the  country  in  keeping  the  fighters  happy  Avith  ncAvs  from  home. 

PreAdous  to  our  entering  the  Avar  I  established  the  Rocky  Moun- 
tain Club  Fund  for  Relief  in  Belgium,  of  Avhich  the  late  Col.  Roose- 
A^elt  Avas  chairman  and  I  Avas  treasurer.  I  gaA^e  substantially  to  this 
fund  and  paid  all  the  expenses  of  administration. 

The  Chairman.  Hoav  much  did  that  amoimt  to? 

Col.  Tno:MPS()N.  I  gaA^e  $100,000  to  the  fund,  and  I  think  I  paid 
about  $30,000  of  administration  expenses. 

It  Avas  in  the  course  of  this  Avork  that  I  had  the  opportunity  to  come 
to  knoAv  Col.  RooseA^elt  Avell,  and  the  admiration  and  affection  Avhich 
I  learned  then  to  feel  for  him  made  me  not  only  Avilling  but  eager 
after  his  untimely  death  to  undertake  the  honorable  task  of  directing 
the  affairs  of  the  Roosca  elt  Memorial  Association. 

Tavo  Aveeks  ago  I  turned  over  to  the  incorporated  society,  which 
did  me  the  honor  to  elect  me  president,  approximately  $1,700,000  of 
Liberty  bonds,  representing  the  contributions  from  over  2,000,000 
people  in  memory  of  our  great  American. 

Lately  I  have  been  giving  a  lot  of  my  time  to  the  Thompson  In- 
stitute of  Plant  Research,  a  farm  and  research  company  Avhich  I 
have  founded  and  Avhich  I  expect,  Avhen  perfected,  to  pass  on  to  the 
State  endoAved  as  to  the  cost  of  its  operation.  It  Avill  bear  the  same 
relation  to  plant  life  that  the  Rockefeller  Institute  does  to  human 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2375 


life  in  the  study  and  prevention  of  disease,  and  will  in  time,  I  hope, 
increase  the  yield  of  the  farmers,  who  are  the  producers,  and  conse- 
quently, therefore,  benefit  the  people  at  large,  who  are  the  consumers. 

The  work  on  Avhich  I  am  now  engaged  as  chairman  of  the  ways 
and  means  committee  of  the  Eepublican  national  committee  I  believe 
to  be  not  less  useful,  necessary,  or  patriotic  than  any  other  work  I 
may  have  done  of  a  public  nature. 

Decentralized  collecting  of  campaign  funds — do  you  realize  what 
that  means  ?  It  means  that  each  member  or  wellwisher  of  the  Repub- 
lican Party  shall  be  given  an  opportunity  to  contribute  financially 
to  the  success  of  his  part}^ 

More  important  still,  it  means  that  the  leaders  of  the  party  or- 
ganizations shall  be  able  to  avoid  large  contributions  and  whatever 
obligations,  if  any,  swh  contributions  might  in  certain  cases  entail. 

All  of  the  political  parties  in  former  years  were  financed  by  large 
contributions  from  a  comparatively  small  group  of  men.  It  is  our 
hope  that  the  Eepublican  national  committee  this  year  will  be  able 
to  continue  to  operate  on  exactly  the  opposite  basis,  and  be  financed 
by  small  contributions  from  a  large  number  of  men  and  women. 
This  is  a  righteous  thing  to  do  and  can  well  be  copied  in  the  future 
by  all  political  parties. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  statement  you  wanted  to  make? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes ;  when  Senator  Reed  asked  me  the  question. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  ask  the  question,  but  that  is  all  right. 

Col.  Thompson.  You  wanted  to  know  vrhat  I  Avas  doing. 

Senator  Reed.  No:  I  did  not.  Tasked  what  financial  institutions 
you  were  interested  in.    But  do  not  let  us  spend  any  time  on  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  what  the  quota  is  for  the  State 
of  Massachusetts? 

Col.  Thompson.  $175,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  has  charge  of  the  raising  of  that  fund  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  think  that  they  report  directly  to  Chicago. 
Senator  AVeeks,  I  think,  is  looking  after  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  there  a  separate  fund  for  Boston? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  how  this  is  distributed  through- 
out the  State? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Poinierene.  You  do  not  know  whether  or  not  there  was  a 
quota  arranged  for  each  county  in  the  State? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Poaierene.  Who  can  give  us  the  details  of  that  informa- 
tion? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  should  say  that  Senator  Weeks  could  give  you 
that,  or  Mr.  Upham,  or  the  State  ways  and  means  man. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  whether  or  not  this  quota  was 
furnished  to  Massachusetts? 

Col.  Thompson.  You  will  have  to  ask  Mr.  Upham,  who  has  been 
before  the  committee.  I  would  say  he  is  the  best  man,  or  the  national 
ways  and  means  committee  man  of  Massachusetts. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Our  information  was  there  were  seven  States 
in  the  East. 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  not  included  among  them. 


2376 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGI^  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Yes ;  I  think  it  was. 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  there  were  Connecticut,  District  of  Columbia, 
Maryland,  New  Jersey,  New  York  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  You  might  be  right  about  that; 
I  believe  you  are.  Who  is  chairman  of  the  ways  and  means  com- 
mittee of  Massachusetts? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  give  you  the  names  from  an  old  list  that  I 
have,  if  it  has  not  been  changed.  It  shows  Senator  John  W.  Weeks 
as  the  chairman  and  Mrs.  Nathaniel  Thayer  as  vice  chairman;  but 
you  had  better  depend  upon  the  list  which  Mr.  Upham  will  give  you 
for  those  States. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  not  sure  that  he  gave  those  States,  and 
yet  I  have  not  the  record  here.  Let  us  go  to  another  State — Con- 
necticut.   Who  is  chairman  there  of  the  ways  and  means  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  William  H.  Putnam. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  quota  for 
that  State  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  $75,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  how  that  was  distributed  over 
the  State? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not.  I  think  they  expected  to  raise  it  all 
over  the  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  this  $75,000  to  be  for  the  national  com- 
mittee alone? 

Col.  Thompson.  For  the  national  committee  alone ;  yes. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  kn"ow  w^hat  they  were  seeking  to  raise 
for  the  State  or  for  the  counties  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  think  Mr.  Putnam  could  give  us  that 
information  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  that  your  judgment  ? 

CoL  Thompson.  Yes ;  I  should  say  that  he  could  tell  you  whether 
he  is  working  in  conjunction  with  the  State  committee  or  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  other  words,  you  think  that  would  be  the 
best  source  of  information  for  this  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  any  notion  as  to  th6  amount  they 
were  to  raise  in  the  State  for  State  purposes  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  None  whatever. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Or  county  purposes  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  No,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Now  Ehode  Island. 

Col.  Thompson.  We  have  in  Ehode  Island  Frederick  F.  Peck  as 
chairman  and  Miss  Maude  Wetmore  as  vice  chairman. 

Senator  Pomerene.  She  is  the  daughter  of  former  Senator  Wet- 
more,  is  she  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  vou  know  what  the  quota  was  for  that 
State? 
Col.  Thompson.  $75,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  was  that  to  be  distributed? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2377 


Senator  Pomerene.  You  think  Mr.  Peck  could  give  us  that  in- 
formation ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  New  York  you  have  gone  over  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 
•  Senator  Pomerene.  Better  take  Pennsylvania. 

Col.  Thompson.  William  H.  Folwell,  of  Philadelphia,  is  chairman, 
and  Mrs.  George  Horace  Lorimer  is  vice  chairman. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  is  she? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  can  not  tell  you. 

Senator  Pomerene,  What  was  the  quota  for  that  State? 

Col.  Thompson.  $375,000  is  the  quota  for  that  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  for  the  national  committee? 

Col.  Thompson.  For  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  much  for  the  State  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you.  I  do  not  know  what  arrange- 
ments they  are  making. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVhat  is  the  reason  for  having  New  York  State 
furnish  $1,600,000  and  Pennsylvania,  the  second  largest  State,  only 
^375,000? 

Col.  Thompson.  1  could  not  give  you  exactly  that.  It  was  worked 
out  in  some  way  according  to  their  gifts  to  the  Ked  Cross  campaign 
or  something.  'Ihere  was  some  basis  that  they  worked  out  as  being 
a  just  quota. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  help  to  work  that  out  as  a  member  of 
the  ways  and  means  committee  ?  Were  these  estimates  for  the  vari- 
ous States  submitted  to  your  ways  and  means  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  '1  hat  was  Mr.  Upham's  work,  and  we  were  to  help 
him  get  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  change  it  in  any  way,  or  did  you  sim- 
ply approve  in  a  perfunctory  way  that  which  he  had  done? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  the  State  of  Maryland,  what  is  the  quota  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  do  not  think  they  have  been  put  down  for  any 
particular  quota? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  any  information  as  to  what  they 
were  seeking  to  raise  for  the  State  campaign  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  No  ;  I  have  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  give  us  the  name  of  the  chairman  of 
that  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Albert  G.  Towers. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  his  address — Baltimore? 

Col.  Thompson.  Baltimore. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Delaware  you  gave  as  Charles  Warner,  I  be- 
lieve ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  was  the  quota  for  Delaware  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  $30,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  a  list  of  these  various  committees 
and  their  chairmen? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Will  you  put  those  in  the  record  as  part  of  your 
testimony  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Certainly. 


2378 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Col,  Thompson  Exhibit  No.  1. 
chatkmen  and  vice  chairmen  of  region  no.  2. 
Connecticut:  William  H.  Putnam,  Hartford. 

District  of  Columbia :  William  T.  Galliher,  Washington,  D.  C. ;  Mrs.  Harold 
Walker,  corresponding  secretary,  1721  H  Street,  AVasliington,  D.  C. 
Delaware:  Cbarles  Warner,  Wilmington. 
Maryland :  Albert  G.  Towers,  Baltimore. 

New  Jersey  :  E.  P.  Earle,  Montclair  ;  Mrs.  Lewis  S.  Thompson,  Red  Bank. 
New  York :  Lewis  E.  Pierson,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y. 

New  York,  up  State:  Senator  William  J.  Tully,  Corning;  Mrs.  C.  D.  Barnes,. 
New  York  City. 

New  York  City :  J.  P.  Stevens  and  Mrs.  Pauline  Morton  Sabin. 

Pennsylvania:  William  H.  Folwell,  625  Chestnut  Street,  Philadelphia;  Mrs. 
George  Horace  Lorimer,  Wyncote. 

Rhode  Island :  I'rederick  S.  Peck,  Providence ;  ]Miss  Maude  Wetmore,  New- 
port. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all  I  care  to  inquire  now. 

The  Chairman.  Colonel,  Mr.  Upham  has  testified  before  the  com- 
mittee substantially  that  when  the  budget  was  reached,  that  would 
end  it  and  there  would  be  no  more  solicitation  of  funds.  Is  that  your 
understanding  of  it  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  my  understanding  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  to  say,  Mr.  Upham's  statement  was 
that  there  would  be  no  more  solicitation  of  funds  so  far  as  his  com- 
mittee was  concerned.  That  is  what  you  understood  it  to  be,  and  you 
did  not  mean  by  your  answer  to  Senator  Kenyon's  question  to  say 
that  the  State  committees  and  the  county  committees  can  not  or  will 
not  go  ahead  and  raise  any  other  funds  that  they  may  deem  proper  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  not  for  national  use. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No,  no. 

Col.  Thompson.  We  have  no  control  over  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  for  the  State  campaign  and  for  the  county 
campaign,  and  as  a  practical  man  who  has  had  a  good  deal  of  ex- 
perience in  politics,  you  know,  of  course,  that  any  funds  that  are 
raised  in  a  State  for  a  State  campaign  will  redound  to  the  benefit 
of  the  party  for  which  the  fund  was  raised. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  should  hope  so ;  jes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  county  committee  the  same  way? 
Col.  Thompson.  I  should  hope  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  as  a  matter  of  fact  when  wx  have  placed 
before  us  the  budget  and  quota  that  is  raised  for  the  national  com- 
mittee purposes,  that  does  not  mean  that  there  may  not  be  additional 
funds  raised  by  the  State  committee  for  State  campaign  or  by  the 
county  or  district  committees  for  county  or  district  campaigns. 

Col.  Thompson.  That  is  true. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  applies  to  all  parties? 
Col.  Thompson.  That  is  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  when  we  put  before  the  public  the  fact 
that  $8,079,000  is  to  be  raised  as  a  national  budget,  that  does  not  mean 
by  any  means  that  larger  sums  may  or  may  not  be  raised. 

*^  Col.  Thompson.  I  imagine  a  sheriff  running  for  office  down  in 
Oklahoma  may  raise  his  own  funds. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Certainly;  and  that  applies  to  both  parties. 

Col.  Thompson.  Of  course  it  does. 

Senator  Edge.  And  that  is  entirely  outside  of  your  ways  and  means 
committee  activities,  as  I  understand  it  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2379 


Col.  Thompson.  Absolutely. 

The  Chairman.  Of  course,  my  question  may  not  have  been  clear, 
but  I  intended  it  to  apply  to  your  work  as  a  committee. 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Of  course,  Senator  Pomerene  says  you  might  not 
stop  raising  funds.  That  will  apply  to  the  Democrats  and  all  others 
as  well  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  if  Mr.  Roosevelt  has  already  spent  $10,000  as 
a  candidate  for  Vice  President,  probabl}^  the  Democrats  will  have  to 
raise  more  money  if  he  keeps  on. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  made  any  allocation  to  the  various 
cities  or  counties  other  than  Xew  York — you  or  your  committee  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  committeee  does  not  do  that.  I  thought  I  tolcl 
you  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  you  did,  since  you  speak  of  it. 
Col.  Thompson.  My  polic}-  has  been  to  put  it  up  to  the  chairman 
of  each  State. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  then  you  leave  all  the  details  to  him? 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  do  you  make  any  suggestions  to  them  or 
submit  a  tentative  plan  of  quota  for  each  of  the  counties? 

Col.  Thompson.  Oh,  no.  That  is  up  to  them.  I  am  really  trying 
to  do  what  you  are  tr^dng  to  do — to  have  this  great,  big  work  carried 
on  in  a  fine  sort  of  way. 

Senator  Edge.  Col.  Thompson,  have  you  always  insisted,  so  far  as 
your  personal  vote  or  view  is  concerned,  that  the  limit  should  be 
$1,000? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  haA^e.  I  think  Ave  ought  to  try  it  out.  GiA^e  it  a 
trial ;  giA^e  it  a  chance ;  giA^e  the  Republicans  an  opportunity  to  come 
in  and  support  their  party,  and  enough  of  them  Avill  come  in ;  it  can 
be  done  on  small  money,  but  it  can  only  be  done  by  organization  so 
as  to  give  them  an  opportunity  to  giA^e. 

Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  approA-e  of  these  contributions  that  haA^e 
been  discussed  to-day  of  $5,000  from  Mr.  Baruch  and  other  people 
whose  names  haA^e  been  read? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  it  Avould  be  better  if  political  money  could 
be  raised  in  smaller  amounts;  but  if  it  can  not  be  raised  in  smaller 
amounts,  it  is  necessary  for  both  parties  to  put  their  case  before  the 
people,  and  they  Avant  to  put  it  before  the  people  if  they  can  do  it  on 
the  small  amount :  but  if  they  can  not,  they  Avill  have  to  do  it  Avith 
large  amounts. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  apparently.  Col.  Thompson.  We  are 
A'ery  much  obliged  to  you. 

Col.  Thompson.  I  have  here  all  the  documents  I  haA^e  put  out. 
Here  is  my  plan  [indicating].  It  is  better  Republican  stuff  than 
it  is  Democratic.    Lots  of  people  think  that  is  good  stuff. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  think  that  need  go  in  the  record.  ' 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  circular  or  other  form  letters  that 
you  haA^e  been  sending  out  soliciting  contributions? 

Col.  Thompson.  It  comes  in  three  statements  that  I  put  out — 
one  of  February  18  in  Avhich  I  address  the  Avays  and  means  com- 
mittee, one  of  January  29,  and  one  at  the  meeting  in  Chicago  on  June 


2380 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


7.  After  Senator  Harding  was  nominated,  on  June  25,  I  gave  out 
this  statement,  which  is  O.  K'd  by  Mr.  Harding. 

The  Chairman.  You  refer  to  statements  O.  K'd  by  Senator  Hard- 
ing. You  submitted  this  plan  of  limitation  of  $1,000  to  Senator 
Harding? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  did. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  indorsed  by  him? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  then  gave  out  this  statement? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes.  I  wanted  to  thoroughly  try  out  to  see  if  the 
money  could  not  be  raised  in  small  amounts. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  satisfied  with  this  plan,  that  it  will  work 
all  right? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  am  not  sure  yet.  Money  has  not  been  coming- 
in  any  too  good. 

The  Chairman.  It  seems  to  have  gone  all  right  in  Maine. 
Col.  Thompson.  The  votes  are  coming. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Were  you  connected  with  any  campaigns  prior 
to  this  in  the  way  of  raising  money  ? 
Col.  Thompson.  Officially,  no. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  of  your  own  knowledge  approxi- 
mately how  much  money  has  been  raised  through  the  general  ways 
and  means  organization  since  the  report  Ave  had  in  Chicago  of  about 
$1,200,000,  about  tAvo  weeks  ago? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  think  perhaps  a  couple  hundred  thousand  dol- 
lars more,  but  I  am  only  guessing.  I  know  they  are  very  hard  up 
and  thought  they  would  have  to  borroAv  some  more  money. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  the  actual  cash  collections  on  ac- 
count of  the  $3,000,000  budget  is  less  than  $1,500,000  up  to  the  present 
time? 

Col.  Thompson.  Just  about  that.  Of  course  it  would  be  better  to 
get  that  right  from  Mr.  Upham. 

Senator  Edge.  That  would  leave  another  $1,500,000  to  collect  in 
the  next  five  weeks? 

Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Without  considering  the  States?  m 
Col.  Thompson.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  arrangements  have  been  made  to  borrow 
money  ? 

Col.  Thompson.  None  that  I  knoAV  of.  I  just  said  they  thought 
they  might  have  to  borrow  some  more. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  signed  the  note  for  what  was  borrowed? 

Col.  Thompson.  I  could  not  tell  you  that,  but  I  imagine  Mr. 
Upham  has. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all.  Colonel ;  thank  you  very  much. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CHAELES  F.  McDONALD. 

(The  witness  Avas  duly  SAVorn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Your  name  is  Charles  F.  McDonald? 

Mr.  McDonald.  It  is. 

The  Chairman.  You  live  in  New  Jersey  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2381 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  do. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  chairman  of  the  Democratic  State  central 
committee  of  New  J ersey  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  been  chairman? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Two  years  and  a  half. 
The  Chairman.  AVhat  is  your  business  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  am  a  retired  cigar  manufacturer  and  county 
collector. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  your  arrangements  in  the  State  of  New 
Jersey  for  raising  money  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  By  writing  letters  to  contribute. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  any  financial  committee  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Does  your  State  central  committee  have  any 
agency  for  collecting  money? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Any  plan  for  collecting  money  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  writes  the  letters  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  do. 

The  Chairman.  You  write  the  letters  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  list  prepared  for  that  pur- 
pose? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  kind  of  looked  over  the  ground  myself. 
The  Chairman.  And  made  up  the  list  yourself  ? 
Mr-  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  make  up  a  list,  write  the  letters,  and  collect 
the  money? 

Mr-  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  the  whole  thing  in  this  money  raising? 

Mr-  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  any  help  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  In  the  office  ? 

The  Chairman.  No;  in  the  way  of  committees  of  men  helping 
you. 

Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir ;  I  have  the  speaker's  committee  and  things 
of  that  sort,  and  a  secretary. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  your  own  secretary  ? 
Mr-  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  letters  have  you  sent  out  for  money? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Twenty.   I  just  started  last  week. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  the  only  organization  you  have  as  a 
State  organization? 
Mr-  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  money  that  you  raised  as  the  State  com- 
mittee used  for  the  State  campaign? 

Mr.  McDonald.  To  pay  my  expenses  and  the  State  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Does  the  national  committee  furnish  you  any 
money  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Not  very  recently. 

The  Chairman.  When  was  the  last  remittance  you  had  from 
them  ? 


2382 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  McDonald.  I  think  when  _you  [indicating  Senator  Edge]  ran 
for  Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  Two  years  ago? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  is,  Avhen  Senator  Edge  ran  for  office  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  collected  for  your  State  cam- 
paign ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Less  than  $1,000. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  carrying  on  an  active  campaign  on  that 
$1,000? 

Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir ;  but  I  propose  to  get  all  I  can. 
The  Chairman.  You  expect  to  get  all  the  money  you  can? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  you  have  some  pretty  good-looking 
prospects  for  money  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  don't  know.  There  are  a  number  of  tightwads, 
too. 

The  Chairman.  Are  the  liquor  interests  contributing  anything? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir;  they  never  have  since  I  have  been  chair- 
man. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  any  liquor  organization  in  New 
Jersey  collecting  money  for  the  campaign? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  of  any  at  all  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir ;  only  I  read  something  in  the  paper,  but 
there  is  nothing  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  not  working  with  you  or  under  you  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  ever  conducted  a  campaign  in  New 
Jersey  before  this  one  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Two  years  ago  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  money  did  you  raise  at  that  time  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Five  hundred  dollars  from  the  national  com- 
mittee and  probably  raised  four  or  five  thousand  myself. 

The  Chairman.  You  conducted  the  campaign  on  about  $12,000  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Less  than  that,  for  the  reason  that  I  did  not  get 
the  national  money  quick  enough  to  use. 

The  Chairman.  Do  the  counties  raise  money  to  carry  on  the 
county  campaigns  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  imagine  they  do.  The  loAver  part  of  our  State  is 
solidly  Republican,  and,  of  course,  they  have  to  be  helped  as  far  as 
challenges  and  organization  are  concerned.  In  the  northern  part  of 
the  State  I  think  the  counties  look  after  themselves. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  how  much  money  they  raise? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Edge.  All  the  money  you  raise,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  is  for 
your  State  headquarters? 

Mr.  McDonald.  That  is  it  principally,  because  I  do  not  raise  much. 

The  Chairman.  Speakers  are  sent  in  by  the  national  committee, 
are  they? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2383 


Mr.  McDoxALD.  Yes,  sir ;  and  oftentimes  we  have  to  pay  them  out' 
of  that  fund  I  raised. 

Senator  Eeed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Mr.  McDonald,  if  the  party 
has  a  decent  chance  and  a  decent  candidate,  they  do  not  need  a  great 
big  lot  of  money,  do  they  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  do  not  a<rree  with  you.  Senator. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  was  wonderin^j  how  you  got  along  so  well  in 
that  State  campaign  on  $12,000.  I  thought  you  were  going  to  be  a 
shining  example  of  success  on  pure  merit  without  any  money  attached 
to  it. 

Mr.  McDonald.  Senator  Eeed,  of  course  I  suppose  the  counties 
about  which  Senator  Kenyon  asked  me  can  raise  their  own  funds. 
Twelve  thousand  dollars  can  not  go  very  far. 

Senator  Eeed.  That  is  what  I  mean.  The  central  organization  does 
not  need  a  great  big  lot  of  money  if  it  has  an  active  personnel 
through  the  county  committees. 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  do  not  think  so. 

Senator  EdCxE.  What  about  last  June  in  Gov.  EdAvards's  campaign? 
What  did  you  raise  in  that  campaign  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Only  about  $3,000,  or  somewhere  in  that  neigh- 
borhood. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  all  the  expenses  of  that  campaign  were  raised 
by  the  counties,  were  they  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  imagine  so.  Gov.  Edwards  had  his  own  man- 
ager and  I  practically  last  year  was  only  an  adjunct. 

Senator  Edge.  Only  an  annex? 

Mr.  McDonald.  I  was  injured  and  in  the  hospital  and  could  not 
get  out. 

Senator  Edge.  Oh,  yes;  I  had  forgotten  that.  Then  you  really 
know  nothing  about  last  fall's  campaign. 

Mr.  McDonald.  Only  just  from  my  standpoint. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  long  have  you  been  in  charge  of  the  State 
committee  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Two  and  one-half  years. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  any  arrangement  with  the  national  com- 
mittee or  national  finance  organization  that  we  heard  of  this  morn- 
ing about  raising  any  percentage  of  the  money  collected  over  in  New 
Jersey  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  not  any  understanding  with  them  at  all? 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  But  you  expect  to  apply  to  them  for  money  ? 
Mr.  McDonald.  We  can  apply,  but  I  have  always  been  very  un- 
successful. 

Senator  Edge.  Except  when  I  ran  for  the  Senate  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  That  is  the  only  time  that  we  ever  got  anything 
in  a  good  while.  I  guess  they  got  the  idea  that  we  can  kiss  them  in 
the  voting  in  New  Jersey. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  raise  all  the  money  you  can? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  no  limit  on  contributions  ? 

Mr.  McDonald.  Not  the  slightest. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  1.  N.  Heller? 

182774— 20— PT  17  5 


2384 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGlNr  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  McDonald.  Where  is  he  located? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Said  to  be  at  849  Broad  Street.  Newark. 
Mr.  McDonald.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not  know  him. 

The  Chairman.  That  seems  to  be  all;  we  are  very  much  obliged 
to  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  EDWAED  C.  STOKES. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  State  your  full  name  to  the  committee. 

Mr.  Stokes.  Edward  C.  Stokes. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  residence? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Trenton.  N.  J. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  formerly  governor  of  New  Jersey? 
Mr.  Stokes.  I  was  at  one  time. 
The  Chairman.  In  what  years? 
Mr.  Stokes.  1905  to  1908. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  chairman  of  the  Republican  State  central 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  you  doing  in  the  way  of  raising  money 
in  New  Jersey  independent  of  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Nothing  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  The  entire  amount  is  being  raised  by  the  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  That  is  the  agreement  and  understanding. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  the  quota  that  New  Jersey  is  supposed  to 
raise  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  think  the  objective  is  about  $300,000.   I  do  not  know 
that  officially. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  quota  ? 
Mr.  Stokes.  About  $300,000. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  that  has  been  raised? 
Mr.  Stokes.  The  last  report  I  got,  $74,500. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  that  is  to  come  to  the  State  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Forty  per  cent  comes  to  the  State  committee,  of  which 
8  per  cent  goes  to  the  State  committee  and  32  per  cent  to  the  county 
committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  have  that  again.  You  were  giving 
the  percentage  which  went  to  the  national  committee,  and  I  did  not 
clearly  understand  it. 

Mr.  Stokes.  The  national  committee  takes  60  per  cent,  leaving  - 
40  per  cent  to  the  State,  Avhich  is  divided  as  follows :  Thirty-two  per 
cent  of  the  tc«tal  amount  goes  to  the  count}^  committees  and  8  per  cent 
to  the  State  committee. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  the  amount  determined  that  goes  to  a 
county  committee?  Here  is  a  populous  county  and  here  is  a  sparsely 
settled  county.   Who  divides  it  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  That  goes  through  the  national  committee.    I  have 
nothing  to  do  Avith  that. 

The  Chairman.  They  appoi-tion  it  to  the  counties  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2385 


Mr.  Stokes.  Yes. 

The  CiiAiKMAX.  This  is  an  arrangement  you  make  with  the  na- 
tional committee  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  That  is  right. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  has  been  received  in  the  State? 
Mr.  Stokes.  By  Avhom  ? 

The  Cpiairman.  By  the  counties  and  by  the  State  central  com- 
mittee. 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  can  not  answer  for  the  counties.  The  last  report  I 
had  they  had  received  nothing.  I  do  not  know  that  they  may  not 
have  received  something  in  the  last  Aveek  or  two. 

The  Chair^^ian.  How  much  has  the  State  central  committee  re- 
ceived ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  We  have  received  $5,900  from  the  national  committee. 
The  Chairman.  That  is,  practically  your  total  8  per  cent  has  been 
collected  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  That  was  8  per  cent  of  the  amount  raised  at  that  time. 
The  Chairman.  You  have  received  your  full  amount? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  whether  the  counties  have  or 
not? 

Mr.  Stokes.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  raised  about  $75,000? 
Mr.  Stokes.  $74,500  is  the  statement  I  have. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  8  per  cent  of  the  figures  you  are  giving 
here  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  As  of  what  date? 

Mr.  Stokes.  September  2 — a  letter  written  to  me  by  Mr.  Ham- 
mond, treasurer  of  the  national  ways  and  means  committee  of  New 
Jersey. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  effort  being  made  by  the  State  cen- 
tral committee  to  raise  a  fund  outside  of  the  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Absolutely  not.  We  are  barred  from  that  under  an 
agreement.  We  are  not  to  make  any  solicitation  whatever,  and  we 
have  not  done  so. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  expect  to  do  so  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  have  no  intention.  Unless  they  do  not  do  better 
than  they  are  we  may  have  to  raise  a  little  to  pay  our  bills. 

The  Chairman.  But  if  they  raise  their  full  amount,  do  you  pro- 
pose to  raise  any  more  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  That  will  carry  us  through,  then. 

The  Chairman.  In  general,  what  are  your  State  expenses  ?  What 
do  you  have  expenses  for  besides  maintaining  headquarters  and 
literature  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  The  law  regulates  us  very  strictly.  Practically  the 
State  committee  can  do  nothing  but  maintain  headquarters  and  ad- 
vertise and  make  contributions  of  $10  for  each  polling  precinct  in 
the  State. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  polling  precincts  have  you? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Two  thousand  and  fourteen,  I  think — a  little  over 
2,000. 

Senator  Keed.  What  is  that  $10  for? 


2386 


PRESIDE is^TIAL  CAMPAIGI^'  EXPEXSES. 


Mr.  Stokes.  That  is  for  manning  the  polls.  That  is  the  reo-ular 
statutory  law.  ° 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  man  the  polls  in  a  precinct  for  $10  unless 
you  do  it  by  volunteers,  by  men  who  give  their  time  ? 
_  Mr.  Stokes.  Practically  no ;  but  that  is  all  the  law  permits  us  to  do. 
ihe  other  committees  may  do  more,  but  we  are  allowed  to  contribute 
to  each  county  committee  from  the  State  committee  $10  under  the 
law  in  that  place. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  the  local  committee  might  increase  the 
stipend  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  If  they  see  fit,  within  the  legal  regulation.  They  are 
allowed  to  spend  so  much  for  each  candidate. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  it  a  pretty  good  law  in  your  opinion  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  It  is  a  very  strict  law.  It  is  a  good  law  in  the  fact 
that  it  has  practically  stopped  corruption. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  sense  in  which  I  was  asking  the  ques- 
tion. 

Mr.  Stokes.  Yes.  I  think  that  is  a  fair  statement  to  make ;  that  it 
has  stopped  corruption. 

The  Chairmax.  You  have  heard  Mr.  McDonald's  statement  as  to 
the  Democratic  fund  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  did  not  catch  his  statement ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  the  main  thought  of  the  committee  in  sub- 
poenaing you  and  Mr.  McDonald  as  chairmen,  respectively,  of  the 
tAvo  party  central  committees  of  a  representative  State  was  to  get  as 
clearly  as  we  could  your  intention  so  far  as  separate  funds  were 
concerned.  It  has  been  brought  out  several  times  and  fairly  correctly 
that  there  was  no  limitation  to  what  a  State  committee  might  do 
excepting  State  law  after  the  national  ways  and  means  committee 
completed  its  Avork.  As  I  understand  your  testimony,  if  the  ways 
and  means  committee  turned  over  to  NeAV  Jersey  the  40  per  cent  of 
an  approximate  quota  of  $300,000  that  you  have  mentioned,  would 
there  be  any  effort  of  any  kind  on  the  part  of  the  State  committee  to 
raise  any  additional  money  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  No;  there  would  not.  That  would  be  ample  in  this 
campaign. 

Senator  Edge.  New  Jersey  is  generally  looked  upon  as  one  of  the 
States  that  usually  has  a  fight,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Stokes.  It  is  not  a  certain  State  at  all.   It  is  a  fighting  State. 
Senator  Edge.  The  present  governor  is  a  Democrat  ? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  of  the  method  that  is  being  employed 
to  raise  this  quota  for  the  national  committee  ? 
Mr.  Stokes.  In  a  general  way ;  yes. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  method  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  They  appoint  a  man  for  the  State.  That  is  entirely 
outside  of  myself;  I  am  not  consulted  as  to  who  he  may  be.  He 
then  appoints  his  county  agents.  I  have  not  been  consulted  as  to 
county  agents  and  have  not  selected  one  of  them.  They  gather 
around  them  their  friends  or  circle,  and  then  they  try  to  raise  some 
money. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2387 


Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  they  have  an  arrangement  by 
which  they  say  to  a  certain  county  or  to  a  certain  city,  "  It  is  your 
duty  to  raise  so  much  money,"  or  "  Your  quota  is  so  much  "  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  do  not  know  any  more  about  that  than  you  do — 
that  is,  what  I  hear  by  rumor  or  see  in  the  papers.  That  works  out 
i:)ractically  this  way,  that  naturally  as  a  business  proposition  you 
try  to  raise  so  much  from  a  certain  center,  if  they  feel  that  center 
could  do  it,  and  there  are  other  centers  where  they  volunteer  to  raise 
so  much. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  it  in  you  State  that  has  charge  of  the  actual 
raising  of  the  money  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Representing  the  national  committee? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Stokes.  Mr.  E.  P.  Earle. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  heard  of  any  effort  to  organize  teams  and 
to  haA'e  captains  over  them  and  to  start  out  like  they  used  to  sell 
bonds  with  what  they  call  a  drive  in  order  to  get  money  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Xo,  sir ;  I  have  not,  but  I  think  that  would  be  a  prac- 
tical way. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  heard  of  that? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Xo. 

Senator  Reed.  You  gave  us  the  name  of  the  man  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Yes.  That  might  be  the  w^ay.  I  do  not  want  to 
avoid  the  question,  but  that  is  not  my  part  of  the  work  and  I  am  not 
bothering  with  that  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  I  know;  you  are  perfectly  frank  and  I  understand 
your  situation,  I  think,  perfectly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  described  yourself  as  chairman  of 
the  State  central  committee. 

Mr.  Stokes.  We  just  call  it  the  State  committee.  The  word  "  cen- 
tral "  is  not  in  our  vocabulary  in  New  Jersey. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  the  point  to  Avhich  I  was  going  to 
address  my  question.  Your  State  committee,  then,  has  active  charge 
of  the  campaign  work  in  the  State,  has  it  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  It  has  what  I  would  call  the  supervisory  charge.  We 
lay  out  the  strategy  of  the  campaign  and  we  plan  the  speaking  cam- 
paign, but  the  actual,  real  practical  work  is  done  by  our  county  com- 
mittees. Our  committees.  Senator,  are  all  organized  under  a  law — 
that  is,  the  statute  of  New  Jersey  provides  for  the  selection  or  elec- 
tion, if  you  wan  to  so  call  it,  of  all  our  committees,  both  the  county 
and  the  State  committees.  A  member  of  the  State  committee  is 
selected  at  the  primary  every  three  years  and  holds  for  three  years. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  many  of  the  States  they  have  not  only 
State  central  committees,  but  they  have  the  State  executive  committee, 
that  has  a  more  immediate  charge  of  the  campaign.  That  practice 
does  not  prevail  in  your  State? 

Mr.  Stokes.  It  does  not.  Under  our  law,  which  is  very  strict,  all 
the  campaign  management,  so  far  as  any  distribution  or  any  use  of 
money  is  concerned,  must  be  under  State  or  county  committees.  I 
do  not  thing  under  our  law  that  you  or  Senator  Reed  or  Senator 
Kenyon  could  go  up  there  and  get  up  a  meeting  and  hire  a  band  and 
hire  a  hall  and  pay  for  it  without  being  amenable  to  punishment. 


2388 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  system  in  your  State  as  to  paying  any- 
body for  making  speeches  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  I  never  got  any  pay  for  my  speeches,  and  I  never 
pay  anybody  if  I  can  possibly  avoid  it.  Once  in  a  while  there  are 
some  gentlemen  who  insist  upon  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  made  any  arrangements  for  paid  speakers 
in  this  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  Xo,  sir ;  not  one.  There  is  not  a  paid  speaker  on  my 
list. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  a  financial  statement  setting  forth  the 
money  received  from  the  ways  and  means  committee  ? 
Mr.  Stokes.  I  have. 

Senator  Edge.  Will  you  let  us  put  that  in  the  record  ? 
Mr.  Stokes.  Certainly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  mean  money  received  by  the  State  com- 
mittee ? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes.  I  notice  here  a  complete  detail,  which  would 
give  the  story  of  how  the  pro  rata  was  being  returned  to  the  State.' 
We  would  like  to  have  these  in  the  record. 

Senator  Reed.  If  they  are  not  self-explanatory— that  is,  if  you 
have  not  the  appropriate  language  at  the  head  to  tell  just  what  each 
is — would  you  tell  us  what  each  is  and  put  them  in  the  record  in 
order  ? 

Mr.  Stokes.  The  first  is  a  letter  from  the  treasurer  of  the  Republi- 
can national  ways  and  means  committee  in  New  Jersey,  dated  Sep- 
tember 2,  1920,  and  reading  as  folloAvs : 

New  .Jersey  Repuhlican  State  Committee, 
Trenton  and  Newark,  N.  J.,  September  2,  1920. 

Hon.  E.  (\  Stokes. 

MccJianics'  National  Bank,  Trenton,  N.  J. 
My  DEx\r  Gov.  Stokes  :  As  treasurer  of  the  Republican  national  ways  and 
means  committee  on  New  Jersey,  I  report  tlie  following  total  collections  from 
the  State,  of  which  the  national  committee  is  entitled  to  60  per  cent,  the 
counties  32  per  cent,  and  the  State  connnittee  8  per  cent :  Total  amount  of 
collections  received,  $74,500. 


Entitled. 

Received. 

$44,700 
23,840 
5,960 

$43,501 

County  committees  

State  committee  

5,900 

Total  

74,500 

49,40 

The  amount  charged  to  the  State  conuuittee  includes  the  inclosed  check  for 
$3,000,  I  having  previously  forwarded  to  you  $2,900.  This  is  the  best  I  can  do 
at  present,  but  I  would  suggest  that  some  arrangements  be  immediately  m«ade 
through  the  various  county  connnittees  whereby  the  expense  of  running  the 
State  campaign  can  be  met. 

I  return  from  Newport  on  September  8  and  will  be  glad  to  take  this  matter 
up  with  you  at  that  time. 
Sincerely  yours, 

O.  H.  Hammond, 
Treasurer  Rcpuhliean  Xational  Ways  and 

Means  Committee  in  Xeic  Jersey. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2389 


I  do  not  know  exactly  what  the  committee  might  want,  but  here  is 
a  statement  of  receipts  for  the  national  campaign  : 

National  caiiipaign  of  1920  from  May  18,  1920. 


Receipts  : 

Coutributions  to  Sept.  20   $6,  000.  00 

Bond  sales   237.  80 

Siistainiug  membershiDS   8.  00 

  $6,  245.  80 

Expenditures : 

Salaries   1,  740.  00 

Limclies   220.  50 

Stamps   135.  30 

Telephone  and  telegraph   310.  70 

Woman's  headquarters   589. 10 

Traveling   190.  32 

Interest  on  notes   151.  10 

Newspapers   4.  00 

Post-ofRce  box   4.00 

League  of  Republican  Clubs   100.  00 

Printing   13.  74 

Stationery   105. 13 

Band    135.00 


3,  698.  89 

Cash  balance   2,  546.  91 

  6,245.80 


Trenton,  N.  J.,  September  20,  1920. 

That  includes  a  hundred- dollar  voluntary  contribution  from  a 
friend  of  mine.  Under  the  old  plan  of  campaign  which  we  organized 
last  year  those  contributions  came  in,  making  a  total  of  $6,245.80.  The 
expenditures  are  all  itemized.  The  interests  on  the  notes  shows  that 
the  State  committee  is  in  debt ;  1  guess  they  all  were ;  in  the  campaign 
of  191G  the}^  ran  away  behind.   I  was  not  the  manager  then. 

The  Chairman.  That  seems  to  be  all,  Governor.  The  committee 
are  very  much  obliged  to  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WILLIAM  BARNES. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.)  ■ 

The  Chairmax.  VVill  you  state  your  name  to  the  committee? 

Mr.  -Barnes.  A\  illiam  Barnes. 

The  Chairman,  i  our  home  is  Albany,  N.  Y.  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  AVhat  is  your  business  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Publisher. 

The  Chairman.  At  our  hearing  in  Chicago  there  was  evidence  pre- 
sented as  to  a  certain  book,  Republicanism  of  1920,  and  statements 
with  reference  to  certain  gentlemen  purporting  to  be  underwriting 
that  book,  and  some  question  was  raised  about  it  that  you  have  prob- 
ably seen  in  the  press.  There  were  photographic  records  showing 
the  signature  by  certain  gentlemen  apparently  underwriting  the  book. 
Can  you  tell  us  about  those  subscription  blanks  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  a  subscription  blank  here  [indicating] .  and  I 
think  that  is  what  you  w:ant.  i  did  not  quite  understand  this  tele- 
gram which  I  received  from  the  sergeant  at  arms,  saying  to  bring 


2390 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


all  documents,  correspondence,  or  Avhat  not,  in  relation  to  contribu- 
tions to  the  campaign.  Inasmuch  as  I  have  no  relation  to  any  cam- 
paign, I  did  not  have  any,  and  yet  1  am  perfectly  willing  to  do  any- 
thing I  can  to  interest  the  committee  perhaps.  I  fancy  this  [indi- 
cating] is  the  one  you  Avant. 

The  Chairman  (after  examining  the  paper).  No;  this  is  not  what 
we  want.  What  we  want  is  a  paper  saying  "  Being  interested  in  mili- 
tant Eepublicanism,  we,  the  undersigned,  subscribe,"  etc. 

Mr.  Barnes.  There  was  not  any  such  thing  as  that.  I  think  per- 
haps it  wwld  be  Avell  for  me  to  make  a  statement,  because  I  think 
that  will  elucidate  the  matter  more  easily  than  it  would  for  you 
to  enter  upon  a  subject  with  a  lack  of  information. 

The  Chairman.  Then  just  go  ahead  in  your  own  way  and  explain. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  sold  a  controlling  interest  or  practically  control- 
ling interest  to  the  Albany  Journal  in  the  fall  of  1916,  retaining  an 
interest  and  remaining  as  editor,  but  in  iio  way  connected  with  the 
management  of  the  property.  In  March,  1918,  the  management  of 
the  property  entered  upon  a  contract  for  the  publication  of  what 
has  eventually  become  this  book,  which  was  a  well-known  proposi- 
tion of  advertising  in  a  book.  They  thought  it  would  be  interesting 
and  rather  profitable  to  the  company  to  get  out  such  a  book,  and 
that  was  done. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  started  when? 

Mr.  Barnes.  March,  1918.  The  contract  was  made  at  that  time 
with  Mr.  E.  P.  Young,  of  New  York,  a  solicitor  for  newspaper  pub- 
lication of  home  numbers,  one  of  my  own  paper,  one  of  the  New 
York  World  that  I  happen  to  recall,  and  I  think  a  paper  in  Daven- 
port. It  has  been  his  business  for  many  years  to  get  up  newspaper 
publications  of  that  chai'acter.  At  any  rate,  this  contract  was  made. 
I  had  no  knowledge  of  it  being  made. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  do  you  mean  by  new^spaper  publication  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  mean  special  editions.  That  is  a  regular  business 
that  some  people  engage  in.  There  are  plenty  of  people  that  want 
a  special  edition  of  a  newspaper  on  its  fiftieth  or  one  hundredth  anni- 
versary.   That  is  Mr.  Young's  business. 

The  management  of  the  Journal  made  this  contract  with  him  to 
publish  a  book,  and  they  were  to  sell  pages  at  so  much  a  page  for 
the  publication,  and  for  commercial  purposes  as  you  well  might  un- 
derstand. The  manager,  Mr.  Quayle,  asked  whether  I  would  write 
a  mileograph  for  the  book.  I  did  not  exactlj^  agree,  but  possibly  I 
did  at  any  rate.  The  thin,g  went  along  for  a  long  time  and  I  was 
very  much  engaged  in  other  matters  until  the  spring  of  1919,  I 
think,  when  I  found  that  I  was  not  entirely  satisfied  with  Mr.  Quayle 
and  we  parted  company.  I  bought  him  out  and  again  assumed  the 
management  of  the  property. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  of  the  paper  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Of  the  paper,  carrying  with  it  the  contract  which  had 
been  made  in  1918  with  Mr.  Young.  Mr.  Young  has  conducted  an 
office  and  gone  on  with  his  solicitation.  There  are  two  blanks  that 
he  had  been  using  for  purposes  of  solicitation,  both  for  pages  and 
for  advertising,  and  for  help  and  solicitation  for  its  publication. 

I  think  what  you  have  in  mind  is  this  matter  which  he  also 
gave  me  at  the  time  I  got  the  subpoena,  which  I  had  never  seen  and 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2391 


had  no  idea  of.  I  assume  it  is  a  perfectly  regular  proposal  when 
anybody  is  engaged  in  an  enterprise  of  this  character.  I  think  that 
is  what  you  mean,  Mr.  Chairman,  if  you  will  look  at  the  first  page 
[handing  paper  to  the  chairman].  That  w^as  evidently  a  document 
that  the  solicitors  use  as  they  w^ent  to  see  people  to  get  them  to  sub- 
scribe either  for  the  publication  or  for  advertising  in  the  book. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  that  is  it ;  yes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  will  finish  my  statement,  if  I  may  do  so. 

The  Chairman.  Certainly. 

Mr.  Barnes.  As  I  say,  we  then  took  the  matter  up,  and  it  seemed 
that  it  was  important,  if  such  a  publication  should  be  made,  that 
it  Avould  be  worthy,  meritorious,  and  useful,  and  in  every  way  I 
have  endeavored  to  bring  that  about  by  interesting  articles,  by  pub- 
lication of  the  Declaration  of  Independence,  the  Constitution,  and 
various  other  American  documents  in  such  form  that  they  can  be 
read,  in  large  type,  on  fine  paper,  and  easily  accessible,  together 
with  the  records,  of  course,  coming  up  to  this  campaign  and  includ- 
ing the  speeches  of  the  candidates  for  President  and  Vice  President, 
as  well  as  the  platforms,  together  with  various  other  statistical  infor- 
mation which  can  be  found  by  examination  of  the  book  by  the  com- 
mittee or  anybody  else. 

The  Chairman.  This  paper  which  3^011  hand  me  is  what  we 
wanted  in  part.    There  was,  however,  another  one. 

Mr.  Barnes.  You  see  this  matter  was  published  evidently  because 
some  solicitor  had  some  quarrel  with  Mr.  Young  and  went  to  the 
World  and  thought  he  had  a  great  political  story,  and  published  it, 
and  naturally  the  World  thought  the}^  could  make  something  out 
of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Did  it  have  anything  to  do  with  the  national  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Not  at  all,  except  Mr.  Hays  wrote  a  letter  a  couple 
years  ago  saying  it  would  be  a  good  idea  if  we  got  up  such  a  thing. 
The  Chairman.  Did  they  contribute  anything  to  it  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  entirely  an  enterprise  of  your  paper? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  contract  was  made,  of  course,  by  my  own  man. 
He  made  the  contract  with  Mr.  Young  to  go  ahead  with  this  work. 
Mr.  Quayle  made  the  contract,  and  I  succeeded  to  it  as  his  successor. 

The  Chairman.  The  book  Avas  to  be  gotten  out  in  time  for  this 
campaign? 

Mr.  Barnes.  We  expected  to  get  it  out  last  winter ;  but  I  observed 
when  I  took  back  the  management  that  there  was  no  contract  made  for 
its  publication,  and  that  the  people  who  had  supposed  they  were  going 
to  make  its  publication  said  it  was  impossible  to  print  anything.  I 
have  been  unable  now  even  to  get  the  paper.  I  have  only  200  copies 
up  to  date,  when  the  book  was  promised  October  1.  Of  course,  it  was 
my  hope  that  the  book  would  be  out  just  as  soon  as  the  candidates 
were  notified,  putting  their  speeches  in  the  book. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  anything  in  the  arrangement  providing 
for  the  underwriting  of  any  campaign  fund  by  the  gentlemen  who 
signed  these  things  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No;  not  at  all.  It  is  purely  an  enterprise  of  the 
newspaper  management  to  do  what  they  considered  to  be  a  good  thing 
and  at  the  same  time  to  make  a  profit. 


2392 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  You  sent  a  copy  of  the  book  to  the  committee? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes ;  when  I  saw  the  matter  was  coming  on. 

The  Chairman.  The  book  is  here  for  use  of  the  members  of  the 
committee,  if  they  desire  to  examine  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  any  part  of  the  income  received  from  this  go 
to  the  national  committee,  directly  or  indirectly? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No,  sir ;  not  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  Is  the  book  sold  on  the  market  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  think  I  can  get  any.  I  think  possibl}^  they 
could  sell  them,  but  I  can  not  print  them.  I  expected  to  get  out 
about  2.000.  I  am  going  to  distribute  as  many  as  I  can  to  various 
libraries,  etc.    I  have  had  a  great  demand  for  them. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  distribute  these  free? 

jNlr.  Barnes.  Largely.  Of  course,  there  is  a  very  large  number 
that  Avill  be  free.  That  will  depend  on  the  judgment  of  my  manage- 
ment.   We  are  going  to  sell,  if  we  can. 

•Senator  Pomerene.  You  sent  one  copy  free  to  this  committee? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes.  I  think  it  is  a  very  interesting  book.  It  has 
interesting  articles  on  all  the  Presidents  and  is  gotten  together  in 
such  form  that  it  is  readily  accessible  for  reference. 

The  Chairman.  The  only  point  we  have  anything  to  do  with  is 
to  get  relation  to  the  campaign? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  it  will  be  distributed  free  to  libraries. 
Who  pays  for  that  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  people  wdio  subscribe.  Some  people  have  put 
an  advertisement  in  and  some  have  not.  It  has  been  at  the  option 
of  the  individuals. 

The  Chairman.  These  are  to  be  sent  to  libraries,  you  say? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  The  subscribers  have  subscribed  and  will  get  a 
book? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes;  they  get  a  copy  of  the  book  as  part  of  the  sub- 
scription. 

The  Chairman.  What  about  free  circulation  of  the  book? 

Mr.  Barnes.  We  can  make  up  the  list  as  we  see  fit.  I  have  sent 
it  to  members  of  the  national  Republican  committee,  and  chairmen 
of  various  State  committees  and  members  of  the  United  States 
Senate.    I  can  not  remember  all  of  them.    I  have  sent  them  to  Re- 

Sublican  newspapers,  large  dailies  throughout  the  country.  The 
ew  York  Public  Library  asked  for  one  and  Harvard  College  sent 
w^ord  they  wanted  one.  I  shall  send  them  one.  I  do  not  expect  we 
will  have  any  for  commercial  sale,  because  we  can  not  print  them. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  circulate  them  among  the  libra- 
ries free  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly,  if  we  get  it  printed. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  you  pay  for  those  yourself? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes.  It  is  a  pure  pusiness  proposition.  Tlie  money 
is  turned  into  the  Journal  Co.,  and  the  Journal  Co.  pays  the  man- 
agement, Mr.  Young,  who  has  done  the  work  of  getting  up  the  book 
and  raising  the  subscriptions  and  who  has  seen  about  the  printing. 
We  do  not  even  know  yet  what  it  will  cost  us. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  an  expensive  book. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2393 


Mr.  Bae>7es.  Very.  That  was  our  object  in  makin*^  it — so  it  would 
be  a  matter  not  for  just  one  campaign — for  reference  purposes  and 
a  vahiable  work.  We  are  trying  to  make  the  work  as  good  as 
possible.  I  was  quite  surprised  to  see  that  am^body  should  consider 
it  Avas  in  any  sense  of  the  word  a  subterfuge,  because  I  do  not  think 
-any  one  of  any  experience  with  me  would  suppose  I  would  indulge 
in  subterfuges.  An^Tthing  I  do  for  the  Republican  Party  I  w^ould  do 
openly  and  gladly,  to  the  extent  of  my  abilit}^  or  work  or  funds. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  rather  news  to  you  to  find  out  this  was  one 
of  the  sinister  influences  in  the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Of  course  the  World  printed  the  story,  and  of  course 
it  must  have  been  given  away  by  a  solicitor  who  had  a  quarrel  in 
some  way. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  any  reason  to  keep  it  a  secret? 

Mr.  Barnes.  There  was  no  reason  to  keep  it  secret  or  open,  any 
more  than  you  would  a  transaction  of  any  business.  You  may 
readily  realize  that  solicitors  for  this  kind  of  work  do  not  always 
agree  as  to  the  value  of  their  services  with  the  person  who  employs 
them.  Somebody  must  have  given  the  record. 

Senator  Edge.  What  record?    What  did  they  give  away? 

Mr.  Barnes.  They  did  not  give  anything  away.  They  evidently 
broke  into  a  desk  and  took  the  names  of  the  subscribers,  or  else  some 
person  knew  the  names  of  all  of  them  and  gave  them  to  the  World. 

Senator  Edge.  The  names  of  your  subscribers  were  no  particular 
secrets,  were  they  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No  secret  any  more  than  that  a  thing  that  is  not 
public  is  secret.  A  secret  is  something  purposely  secret.  When  I 
sell  a  man  a  hundred  barrels  of  flour  I  do  not  publish  an  advertise- 
ment about  it. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  what  I  want  to  find  out.  The  record  can 
not  tell  a  story  unless  you  tell  it  for  the  record. 

The  Chairman.  Some  one  seems  to  have  been  sufficiently  inter- 
ested in  it  to  have  photographed  these  subscriptions. 

Mr.  Barnes.  That  is  the  way  these  men  do.  You  go  to  a  man  and 
subscribe  and  he  signs  "John  Smith,"  and  then  it  is  photographed, 
and  the  solicitor  in  going  to  you  says,  "Mr.  John  Smith,  who  is  a 
friend  of  yours,  had  subscribed.  Don't  you  think  you  would  like 
to  subscribe?  "  That  is  purely  a  photographic  method  of  solicita- 
tion. It  is  assumed  everybody  is  intelligent  enough  to  know  in 
making  a  subscription  whether  he  desires  to  do  so  or  not.  We  have 
to  assume  that  in  life. 

Senator  Edge.  When  your  solicitors  made  their  solicitation,  they 
naturally  went  to  Republicans  who  had  money  and  whom  they 
thought  could  afford  to  subscribe  in  that  way.  did  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  Was  the  book  to  be  helpful  in  harmonizing  and 
solidifying  the  Republican  Party? 
Mr.  Barnes.  It  seems  to  have  been. 

The  Chairman.  I  see  you  have  articles  by  and  pictures  of  Mr. 
Taft  and  Hiram  Johnson  both  in  this  book. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Both  on  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  articles  on  the  League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No  ;  it  did  not  seem  to  me  it  was  necessary. 


2394 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Has  the  Albany  Evening  Journal  previously  pub- 
lished what  are  generally  known  in  the  profession  as  special  editions? 

Mr.  Barnes.  We  published  one  when  we  went  into  our  new  build- 
ing in  1918. 

Senator  Edge.  I  mean  political  specials. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  The  whole  thing  about  this  book  is  sort  of  tempest 
in  a  tea  pot.  Is  there  any  sinister  connection  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  not  to  be  the  one  to  declare  that,  because  I  am 
the  person  under  suspicion. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Barnes,  I  notice  this  contract  of  subscrip- 
tion reads : 

Hon.  William  Barnes, 

Editor  Repvhlicanistn  of  1920, 

29  East  Forty-eighth  Street,  New  York  Citij. 
Dear  Sir:  We.  the  undersigned,  are  glad  to  subscribe  to  the  publication  of 
your  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920." 

The  Republican  Party  stands  for  the  best  interests  of  the  Nation  and  it  is 
imperative  that  the  party  be  returned  to  power,  to  which  we  pledge  our  support 
and  cooperation. 

At  the  head  of  this  are  the  words  also,  "  Published  in  behalf  of  a 
victorious  1920."  The  names  of  some  of  the  subscribers  are  William 
H.  Taft,  Elihu  Root,  Chauncey  M.  Depew,  Charles  E.  Hughes,  Nicho- 
las Murray  Butler,  J.  W.  WadsAvorth,  William  Bo^^de  Thompson,  etc. 
This  contains  the  language,  "  are  glad  to  subscribe  to  the  publication 
of  your  book."  Just  what  does  that  mean?  Are  they  subscribing  for 
a  copy  of  the  book  or  subscribing  a  given  amount  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  know.  As  I  said  before,  that  is  evidently  a 
solicitor's  method  of  combining  names  by  photographic  process  upon 
one  sheet.  These  men  never  signed  that  in  that  order. 

The  Chairman.  They  did  not  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly  not,  sir.  That  is  evident  on  its  face  that 
they  did  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  they  sign  the  agreement  or  statement  of 
which  this  is  a  copy  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  know.  I  never  heard  of  it  until  I  saw  it 
the  other  day.  The  only  thing  about  it  is  this,  that  I  assume  that 
Avhen  they  went  around  with  a  dumxmy  the}^  may  have  asked  Mr. 
Taft  or  Mr.  Hughes  to  sign  this  letter  one  of  the  gentlemen  wrote 
in  relation  to  the  book  and  then  coupled  them  together  for  the 
purpose  of  using  it  for  the  purpose  of  solicitation. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understand  that  is  what  may  be  done,  but 
what  I  am  trying  to  get  at  is  this,  and  let  me  put  the  question  to 
you  accurately  as  it  occurs  to  me.  Here  on  the  face  of  it  they  appear 
to  be  subscribing  to  the  publication  of  your  book. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Subscribing  in  the  sense  of  advocating  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  it  does  not  say  so. 

Mr.  Barnes.  What  does  the  Avord  "subscribe"  mean?  You  sub- 
scribe to  a  covenant,  for  instance  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  says  "  subscribe  to  the  publication,"  and 
then  says,  "  We  pledge  our  support  and  cooperation."  Do  jou 
understand  there  is  any  financial  obligation  on  the  part  of  an}^  of 
these  men  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly  not. 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIG^s^  EXPENSES. 


2395 


Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  understand  that  they  are  subscribing 
for  one  or  more  copies  of  this  book  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Not  at  all;  not  even  that. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Do  you  expect  to  have  any  benefit  from  these 
gentlemen  other  than  what  their  names  might  carry  as  indorsing  the 
proposition  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Where  do  you  get  the  money  with  which  to 
jDublish  this  very  expensive  book? 
i        Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  told  you.    They  go  with  these  subscription 
blanks  and  a  man  subscribes  $5,  $10,  $100,  or  he  takes  one  or  two  or 
three  pages,  and  that  is  his  indorsement  of  the  whole. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  notice  there  is  a  likeness  of  Senator  Penrose 
and  some  other  prominent  gentlemen  in  the  party.  Did  they  pay  a 
given  amount  for  those? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  can  not  say  in  regard  to  any  particular  case. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  that  the  general  proposition  or  general 
purpose  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  purpose  is  that  these  solicitors  conducting  cam- 
paigns to  raise  money  for  the  publication  of  this  book,  making  their 
profit  for  themselves  for  their  work  and  for  the  company  which 
employs  them.  I  am  using  every  endeavor,  in  view  of  the  fact  that 
this  work  was  begun  under  auspices  not  my  own,  to  make  an  accept- 
able book.  It  seems  to  me  perfectly  clear,  everything  in  relation  to  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  have  not  looked  at  the  book  yet.  I  judge 
from  glancing  at  it  Avhile  other  members  of  the  committee  are  scan- 
ning the  pages  that  there  are  biographical  sketches  of  these  men. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Some,  and  some  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  they  paying  for  those? 

Mr.  Barnes.  A  man  makes  a  contract  with  a  journal  company  as 
he  sees  fit. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  is  a  sketch  of  his  life  or  an  engraving  

Mr.  Barnes.  Possibly. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  A  sketch  of  his  life  or  an  engraving  was  in- 
serted, and  that  was  done  for  a  consideration  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Certainh^    It  is  advertising. 

Senator  Edge.  As  I  understand  it,  originally  it  was  simply  a  part 
of  the  solicitor's  plan  to  go  to  a  prospect  and  sav,  "  These  men  indorse 
the  book." 

Mr.  Barnes.  Exactly ;  and  if  the  man  did  not  wish  to  do  it,  he  did 
not  need  to  do  it.  There  was  no  compulsion.  He  is  his  own  master. 

Senator  Edge.  Having  these  signatures  photographed,  your  solic- 
itors would  go  to  a  man  they  hoped  to  sell  a  page  of  advertising  to  at 
a  given  price? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Exactly. 

Senator  Edge.  And  the  advertising  consisted  of  cuts  or  sketches  of 
the  man's  life?    Is  that  the  type  of  advertising? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Some  of  it.  A  good  many  men  will  say,  "  I  am  very 
pleased  to  subscribe,  but  I  do  not  care  to  have  my  picture  printed." 
They  would  say,  "  I  think  it  is  a  very  good  thing.  I  see  what  you  are 
getting  up  and  believe  it  is  a  good  thing  to  do." 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  did  have  subscriptions  outside  of  those  who 
have  sketches  or  pictures  in  the  book? 


2396 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Barnes.  Yes ;  there  were  two  styles  of  contract.  I  have  shown 
you  those. 

Senator  Keed.  The  two  styles  are  these  : 

You  are  hereby  authorized  to  publish  our  or  my  representation,  as  sliown  by 
dunnny,  in  your  forthcomins'  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920  "  as  soon  as 

compiled,  for  which  I  or  we  subscribe  for  the  space  of  and  extra 

copies  of  books  at  $20  per  copy,  and  herewith  hand  you  check  drawn  to  the 
order  of  the  Journal  Co.  to  the  amount  of  dollars. 

That  was  the  ordinary  subscription  of  a  man  who  w^as  inserting  a 
report  about  himself  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  suppose  so. 
Senator  Reed.  The  other  form  : 

The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  dollars  toward  the  expense  of" 

publication  and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of 
1920,"  and  herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  .Journal  Co.  in 
payment  of  same. 

That  was  the  form  where  a  man  subscribed  to  the  enterprise? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Exactly. 

Senator  Eeed.  There  was  a  form  of  contract  introduced  in  evi- 
dence which  varies  someAvhat  from  this,  and  to  that  form  there 
was  appended  these  names  which  you  have  produced  of  distinguished 
Republicans,  and  then  there  were  some  other  names.  Have  you  ever 
seen  those  original  subscription  lists?  You  know,  do  you  not,  that 
some  men  were  down  on  these  lists  for  $2,500  apiece  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Just  a  moment.  Senator.  I  want  to  be  perfectly  sure 
in  regard  to  the  subject  of  this  inquiry.  If  I  sell  advertising  space 
in  my  newspapers  for  $500  or  $1,000  a  page,  is  it  within  the  scope  of 
this  committee's  powders  to  ask  me  my  advertising  rates  ?  If  it  is,  all 
right.   But  it  is  not  connected  with  this  inquiry. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  asking  you  that. 

Mr.  Barnes.  They  might  have  put  $10,000  in  that  book.  It  is  ex-^ 
actly  the  same  thing.   It  is  a  part  of  my  business. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  asking  you  that  quesion  at  present. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  simply  asking  the  chairman. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  produced  here  two  forms  which  you  saj 
were  the  forms  that  w^ere  employed  to  get  these  subscriptions.  Was 
there  not  another  form  different  in  its  wording  from  these  two  forms 
that  you  have  produced,  and  have  you  not  on  those  forms  the  subscrip- 
tions of  men  wdth  the  amounts  of  money  set  opposite  their  names  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  want  to  ask  the  chairman  a  question.  I  have  openly 
declared  what  this  business  is.  It  is  in  no  sense  a  matter  of  investiga- 
tion for  the  campaign  Avhatsoever ;  and  if  the  committee  holds  that 
it  has  a  perfect  right  to  investigate  the  charges  which  I  make  for  the 
sale  of  advertising  space  in  my  newspaper  or  book,  or  any  other  mat- 
ter, I  am  willing  to  answer.  I  do  not  want  to  raise  the  issue,  but  I 
want  it  distinctly  understood  in  advance  that  if  I  answer  questions 
in  regard  to  my  own  private  affairs  or  if  I  should  be  asked  to  furnish 
lists  of  my  securities  I  would  consider  that  it  was  not  within  the  pur- 
view of  the  committee  to  ask  me  that.  I  am  not  connected  with  the 
Republican  campaign;  I  am  not  a  member  of  any  Republican  com- 
mittee or  in  any  relation  with  the  campaign,  and  if  some  one  sub- 
scribed $5,000,  or  $10,000,  or  $20,000  to  help  me  publish  a  book  of 
that  nature  or  others,  which  has  occurred  in  my  lifetime,  I  do  not 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPEXSES. 


2397 


consider  it  is  a  matter  of  any  interest  unless  some  legislation  should  be 
enacted  to  prevent  some  sort  of  evil. 

I  do  not  know,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  the  amounts  of  these  contribu- 
tions. If  the  committee  thinks  that  under  its  rights  granted  to  it  by 
the  Senate  it  can  subpoena  my  office  to  produce  all  of  the  subscrip- 
tions of  individuals  made  for  this  book  I  should  like  to  have  that 
matter  taken  up  with  the  committee  and  a  vote  cast  upon  it  as  to 
whether  this  should  be  delivered.  I  am  perfectly  willing  to  deliver 
it  if  the  conmiittee  commands  it.  I  see  no  reason  v\diy  I  should 
answer  the  question  in  relation  to  one  and  not  to  all.  If  you  want 
them  you  can  have  them. 

Senator  Eeed.  AVell,  I  would  like  to  see  them.  then. 

Mr.  Baexes.  If  your  committee  feels  that  it  is  your  duty  and  your 
idea  of  American  citizenship,  well  and  good.  You  know  that  it  is 
not  related  to  this  campaign. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  do  not  want  to  argue  the  question  at  all.  Mr. 
Barnes,  but  I  want  to  state  my  viewpoint. 

Contracts  have  been  produced  in  evidence  which  are  clearly  sus- 
ceptible of  construction  that  this  money  goes  to  the  Republican  cam- 
paign: that  it  is  in  furtherance  of  the  Republican  campaign.  It  is 
about  those  contracts  that  I  am  asking.    I  have  not  asked  you  

Mr.  Barxes.  For  instance  

Senator  Reed.  Just  a  moment.  I  have  not  asked  you  to  produce 
your  contract  with  AVilliam  H.  Taft  for  the  space  that  he  is  allotted 
in  this  book,  if  you  have  a  contract  with  him:  or  with  Mr.  Root  or 
with  Senator  Borah,  or  any  of  those  men.  I  am  asking  you  whether 
there  was  not  another  form  of  contract  than  the  ones  that  have  been 
produced  here  and  if  that  contract  did  not  contain  the  names  of 
gentlemen  with  the  sums  of  money  put  opposite  their  names. 

Mr.  Barxes.  Let  us  put  the  questions  one  at  a  time.  I  can  answer 
either  one.  I  asked  Mr.  Young  to  give  me  his  forms  of  contract  and 
he  gave  me  those  two. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  coarse,  a  man  whose  name  is  not  even  mentioned 
in  this  book  is  not  payinof  for  advertising,  is  he?  He  is  paying  to 
hel])  circulate  the  book.    That  is  what  he  is  doing,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Barxes.  Well  

Senator  Reed.  Yes.  If  you  have  papers  containing  the  lists  of 
names  signed  to  a  contract  or  a  declaration  that  they  are  doing  this 
for  the  puri^ose  of  aiding  in  the  Republican  campaign,  and  this  com- 
mittee is  sitting  here  for  the  purpose  of  ascertaining  the  moneys  that 
are  being  expended  in  this  campaign,  you  would  not  challenge  that 
as  beino-  not  within  the  purview  of  this  committee's  authority  ? 

Mr.  Barxes.  Certainly,  if  it  be  true:  but  I  do  not  believe  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  asking  you  to  i^roduce  contracts  that  contain 
these  lists  of  names  of  subscribers  who  are  not  merely  subscribing 
to  your  book  but  are  subscribing  to  an  enterprise  to  put  this  book 
out  as  part  of  the  Republican  campaign.  That  is  what  I  am  asking 
for :  and  those  contracts  are  in  existence,  because  I  have  seen  photo- 
graphic copies  of  them. 

Mr.  Barxes.  I  do  not  believe  there  are  any  photographic  copies  of 
anything  except  these  two. 

Senator  Reed.  I  haA'e  seen  the  contracts. 

Mr.  Barxes.  Xo  :  I  think  you  will  find  the  Xew  York  AYoiid  has 
taken  this  and  put  that  on  here  


2398 


PRESIDEJ^^TIAL  CAMPAJGA^  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  If  the  New  York  World  has  been  <Tuilty  of  that 
subterfuge,  I  want  to  know  that. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  charge  it.  I  only  meant  to  say  that  I  am 
periectly  certain  that  I  told  Mr.  Young  to  give  me  all  the  forms  of 
contract  to  bring  over  here,  and  that  he  did  not  give  me  any  others 
that  he  had.  *^ 

Senator  Eeed.  We  are  in  this  unfortunate  situation,  Mr.  Barnes 
as  you  have  heard  it  stated.  The  record  that  was  made  up  by  the 
reporter  at  Chicago,  and  which  I  think  has  attached  to  it  these  pho- 
tographic copies,  is  in  the  hands  of  the  Public  Printer.  Will  you 
not  leave  those  forms  for  the  reporter  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  ask  for  a  ruling  on  that. 

Senator  Heed.  No;  I  mean  these  forms  [indicating]. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  going  to  ask  for  a  ruling. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  alreadv  produced  them.  You  will  o-et 
the  ruling  if  you  Avant  it.  The  photographic  copies  are  either'^in 
the  possession  of  the  reporter  v/ho  took  the  testimony  or  attached  to 
the  transcript  of  the  evidence  which  is  now  in  the  hands  of  the  Public 
Printer  and  which  we  can  not  get  hold  of  until  to-morrow  morning. 
So  I  think  we  will  have  to  ask  Mr.  Barnes  to  remain  here,  as  much 
as  I  dislike  to  disoblige  him,  until  we  can  show  him  these  copies,  in 
view  of  his  statement. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  you  ought  to  see  those  copies,  Mr.  Barnes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Where  are  they  now? 

The  Chairman.  In  the  hands  of  the  Public  Printer. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Could  you  get  me  an  order  to  look  at  them  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  will  have  them  here  in  the  morning. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  we  will  have  to  ask  you  to  remain  over. 
We  regret  to  do  it. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  sorry. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  sorry,  too. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  can  not  understand  what  they  can  be,  because  there 
is  no  such  thing.  The  solicitors  used  this  form,  naturally.  They 
want  to  get  business,  and  these  people  sign  either  this  one  contract 
or  the  other. 

Senator  Reed.  Those  contracts  have  been  introduced. 

The  Chairman.  What  objection  have  you,  Mr.  Barnes? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  objection  is  that  I  was  subpoenaed  to  produce 
evidence  in  relation  to  the  campaign,  and  if  I  should  present  these  I 
would  apparently  indicate  that,  in  my  mind,  they  are  in  relation  to 
the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  no;  that  is  for  the  committee  to  determine. 

Mr.  Barnes.  If  I  have  it  understood  on  the  record  that  they  have 
no  relation  to  the  campaign  

The  Chairman.  Photographic  copies  are  in  the  record  now. 

Senator  Reed.  The  truth  is  that  the  subpoena  was  made  out  along 
with  othei's  and  it  followed  the  form  of  other  subpoenas.  It  should 
have  been  to  produce  books  and  papers  relating  to  this  inquiry,  and 
the  committee  would  have  had  to  rule,  under  your  objection,  whether 
it  had  jurisdiction.  I  fully  agree  to  the  proposition  that  the  com- 
mittee ought  not  to  try  to  go  into  a  man's  private  business. 

Mr.  Barnes.  If  there  is  any  money  contributed  in  this  way  that 
has  gone  into  the  campaign,  except  the  fact  that  we  consider  it  is  not 


PRESIDEXTIiyL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2399 


harmful  to  the  party  to  have  this  thing  done  in  this  form,  of  course, 
it  is  subject  to  inquiry. 

The  Chairmax.  The  point  is  simply  this,  that  the  claim  has  been 
made  that  this  book  is  published  by  contributions  of  certain  gen- 
tlemen. 

Mr.  Barxes.  For  the  purpose  of  soliciting  contributions? 

The  Chairmax.  No  ;  not  at  all.  It  is  circulated  free  to  the  public. 
We  want  to  find  out  the  amount  of  money  expended ;  that  is,  a  cam- 
paign expenditure  

Senator  Pomerexe.  In  other  words,  this  is  a  method  of  publicity 
for  the  benefit  of  the  party.  That  is  the  theory  upon  which  it  is 
done,  and  there  can  not  be  any  question  about  our  right  to  inquire 
into  it. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  not  going  into  your  private  affairs. 

(The  contracts  referred  to  were  received  in  evidence,  marked 
"  Barnes  Exhibit  Xo.  1 "  and  "  Barnes  Exhibit  No.  2,"  and  are  as 
follows :) 

Barnes  Exhibit  No.  1. 
Original.  Pay  by  check  only. 

The  Albany  Evening  Journal. 
(New  York  office:  1721-23  Tribune  Building,  New  York  City.) 

New  York,  1920. 

The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  —  ■  dollars  toward  the  expense  of 

pul)lication  and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of 
1920,"  and  herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.,  in 
payment  of  same. 
All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

Name :  . 

Address:  -. 

Receipt.  -  Pay  by  check  only. 

 ,  1920. 

Received  of  ,    dollars  toward  the  expense  of  publication 

and  circulation  of  our  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920." 

The  Albany  Evening  Journal. 
By     ,  Rejjrescntative. 

Make  check  to  the  .Journal  Co, 


Barnes  Exhibit  No.  2. 

[No  extra  charge  for  photogravure  plates — One  free  copy  of  book  to  each  subscriber.] 

Original.  Pay  by  check  only. 

The  A^lbany  Evening  Journal. 

(New  York  Office:  1721-23  Tribune  Building,  New  York  City.) 

New  York,  ,  7.92^?. 

You  are  hereby  authorized  to  publish  our  or  my  representation,  as  shown  by 
dummy,  in  your  forthcoming  book,  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920,"  as  soon  as 

compiled,  for  which  I  or  we  subscribe  for  the  space  of  — ■  and  extra 

copies  of  book,  at  $20  per  copy,  and  herewith  hand  you  check  drawn  to  the 
order  of  the  Journal  Co.  to  the  amount  of  dollars. 

It  is  part  of  this  contract  that  no  agreement  or  understanding  exists  except 
that  which  is  specified  on  both  original  and  duplicate;  that  it  can  not  be  can- 

182774— 20— PT  17  6 


2400 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


celed ;  that  no  indivKliial  writeiip  is  given  in  addition  to  space  subscribed  and 
that  neglect  to  furnish  copy  gives  the  publisher  the  right  to  use  business  card 
of  the  signer. 

All  checks  v>'ill  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

Total  $  .  Name  , 

Accepted  for  the  Journal   .  Address  . 

R^C'fipt.  Pay  by  check  only. 

 ,  1920. 

Received  of  ,    dollars  for  space  of    in  our  forth- 

coming book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920." 

The  Albany  Evening  Journal, 

By  ,  Representative. 

All  checks  should  be  made  payable  to  the  Journal  Co. 

Senator  Edge.  Let  me  ask  a  question  to  see  if  I  can  clear  it  up 
in  my  own  mind,  at  least. 

Any  money  received  from  subscriptions  on  either  of  these  forms 
goes  alone  to  the  promoter  of  the  Albany  Journal  Co.  ?  No  part  of 
it  ooes  to  the  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  the  only  political  interest  in  your  publishing 
this  book,  so  far  as  our  committee  would  be  concerned,  would  be  the 
argument  of  this  book  going  out  to  the  public  in  the  interests  of  the 
Eepublican  Party  as  a  donation  ?    Is  that  your  view  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Why,  yes,  sir;  I  suppose  so.  I  told  Mr.  Young  to 
stop  soliciting  as  soon  as  the  national  convention  Avas  over,  but  I 
believe  he  did  solicit  sums,  and  they  were  accepted  in  Albany  by  the 
company,  but  very  little.  In  other  words,  I  wanted  to  close  the  inci- 
dent w^ith  the  nomination. 

Senator  Reed.  It  was  then  distinctly  a  piece  of  campaign  litera- 
ture—so distinctly  one  that  you  wanted  to  close  it  after  the  nomina- 
tions and  cut  it  out  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  Avas  very  much  afraid  that  it  might  be  complicated 
in  the  very  particular  w^ay  it  has  come  before  this  committee,  that  if 
w^e  had  anybody  soliciting  after  the  nomination  the  person  to  whom 
he  went  might  say,  "Well,  I  thought  this  was  the  national  com- 
mittee," ancl  it  would  become  confused  between  us  and  the  national 
committee.  I  did  not  care  to  be  in  that  particular  jam,  and  I  said, 
"We  will  close  out  at  the  close  of  the  nomination." 

Senator  Reed.  You  thought  it  was  so  much  like  political  propa- 
ganda conducted  by  a  national  committee  that  you  would  have  to  be 
pretty  careful  or  you  would  get  mixed  up  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Oh,  I  would  not  put  it  that  way.  That  is  not  true. 
In  fact,  I  was  speaking  to  the  person  who  was  soliciting.  I  would 
not  care  to  have  anybody  contribute  to  an  enterprise  in  w^hich  I  was 
engaged  thinking  he  was  doing  it  for  any  other  purpose. 

Senator  Edge.  It  was  started  as  a  business  enterprise  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Purel}^ 

Senator  Edge.  And  if  it  should  be  of  benefit  to  the  interests  of  the 
Republican  Party,  you  would  have  no  objection  to  that  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  differentiate  it  in  any  w^ay  from  the  publi- 
cation of  a  Republican  newspaper  that  may  be  contributed  to  by 
various  prominent  Republicans  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  never  thought  about  it,  that  it  came  within  the  pur- 
view^ of  the  statute  in  relation  to  campaign  contributions,  when  we 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN^  EXPENSES. 


2401 


began  the  proposition  the  middle  of  1918.  I  mean  it  did  not  occur 
to  me — the  thought  did  not  even  happen  to  come  into  m}^  mind. 

The  Chairmax.  Have  you  seen  anything  of  this  book,  the  prices 
of  which  have  been  set  forth  in  a  pamphlet,  The  War.  the  World,  and 
Wilson,  by  George  Creel  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No  ;  I  heard  Mr.  Gerard's  testimony. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  much  difference  in  sending  that  out  or 
this  out?  That  is  just  as  much  propaganda,  of  course,  as  this  would 
be.   You  have  not  seen  that  book,  have  you,  the  Creel  book  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No.  sir. 

The  Chaikman.  Do  you  know  how  it  compares  in  size  with  this  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Let  me  ask  you  this:  Of  course,  your  book 
does  not  show  that  any  of  these  articles  or  steel  engravings,  or  what- 
ever kind  of  engravings  they  are,  were  in  fact  paid  for  as  advertising 
matter  ? 

Mr.  Barxes.  They  do  not  show  it  on  their  face. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  in  soliciting  for  subscriptions  to  the 
book  were  your  subscribers  advised  that  they  were  in  part  paid  for 
in  that  way  ? 

Mr.  Barxes.  I  can  not  tell  you  what  another  man  said  to  another. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  There  is  nothing  in  your  literature  which 
would  indicate  to  the  subscriber  that  these  contributions  were  paid 
for  in  that  way? 

Mr.  Barxes.  I  should  think  not. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Mr.  Barnes,  as  a  publisher,  in 
publishing  biographical  sketches,  did  you  ever  hear  of  one  that  had 
the  mark  of  advertising,  or  any  mark  at  all  which  would  designate 
it  to  the  reader  ? 

Mr.  Barxes.  I  did  not  know  from  the  Senator's  question  but  pos- 
sibly a  law  had  been  passed  making  it  a  criminal  offense  if  it  is  not 
done.    It  is  hard  to  keep  up  with  them. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Xo;  I  was  trjdng  to  find  out  how  the  matter 
was  conducted.    That  is  all. 

Mr.  Barxes.  I  think  it  was  conducted  in  a  natural,  human-nature 
way. 

The  Chairmax.  We  will  ask  you  to  return  again  to-morrow  morn- 
ing, Mr.  Barnes. 

Mr.  Barxes.  Can  you  give  me  some  definite  hour. 

The  Chairmax.  At  10.30  in  the  morning.  We  can  make  it  half  an 
hour  earlier,  if  you  wish. 

Mr.  Barxes.  No  :  I  do  not  want  you  to  do  that. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  GEORGE  T.  CARROLL. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairmax.  Will  you  give  your  name  to  the  reporter? 

Mr.  Carroll.  George  T.  Carroll. 

The  Chairmax.  Where  do  you  live? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Elizabeth,  N.  J. 

The  Chairmax.  What  is  your  business? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Retail  liquor  dealer. 


2402 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Are  you  president  of  one  of  the  national  organ- 
izations— I  do  not  know  its  name? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  name  of  that  organization? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  am  president  of  the  National  Eetail  Liquor 
Dealers'  Association  of  America. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  also  an  officer  in  the  State  organization 
of  New  Jersey? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  am  president  of  the  Federated  Liquor  Industry  of 
New  Jersey. 

The  Chairman.  The  Federated  Liquor  Industry? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How^  big  an  organization  is  this  National  Retail 
Liquor  Dealers'  Association? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  is  composed  at  the  present  time  of  representatives 
of  five  States. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  the  States? 

l-'r.  Cai?r  LL.  Massachusetts,  Rhode  Island,  New  Jersey,  New 
York,  and  Wisconsin — did  I  say  Illinois? 
The  Chairman.  No. 
Mr.  Carroll.  Illinois,  then. 

The  Chairman.  Six  States.  How  does  it  happen  that  it  does  not 
extend  into  the  other  States? 

Mr.  Cariioll.  It  did  extend  to  the  other  States,  Senator,  but  for 
some  reason  or  another  they  did  not  respond  to  the  call  of  the  last 
convention. 

Tlio  Chairman.  AA^here  did  you  hold  the  convention? 
Mr.  Carroll.  In  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  States  Avere  in  it  before  this  lack  of 
response  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  believe  nine. 

The  Chairman.  Did  it  never  extend  over  more  than  nine  States? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Not  in  my  time. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  been  president  ? 

Mr.  Carholl.  Fourteen  months. 

The  Chairman.  AVho  was  your  predecessor? 

Mr,  Carroll.  AVilliam  Seckel,  of  Cleveland. 

The  Chairman.  In  these  six  States  that  you  mentioned  how  large 
a  membership  have  you? 

Mr.  Carroll.  You  mean  ^^hat  membership  in  each  State  the  or- 
ganization has  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  CARiiOLL.  I  could  not  answer  that — only  for  one  State. 

Tlie  Chairman.  You  have  a  separate  organization  in  each  State? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  extend  into  the  counties  ?  • 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Into  the  States  and  into  the  townships? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  only  answer  as  to  one  State? 
Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  all ;  that  is  New  Jersey. 

The  Chairman.  AYho  is  at  the  head  of  the  association  in  Massa- 
chusetts ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2403 


Mr.  Carroll.  Richard  McGillicuddy. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  an  Irishman? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Where  does  he  live? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Boston. 

The  Chair^vian.  Who  in  Rhode  Island? 

Mr.  Carroll.  William  ^laines. 

The  Chair3ian.  Where  does  he  live? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Providence,  R.  I. 

The  Chairman.  Who  in  Illinois? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  think  Robert  J.  Halle. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  address? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Chicago. 

The  Chairman.  In  Xew  Jersey  do  you  have  some  one  under  you  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  AYho? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Albert  Illinger. 

The  Chairman.  And  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Charles  Hussey. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  address? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  do  not  know  his  address. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  Illinger's  address  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  East  Rutherford,  N.  J. 

The  Chairman.  And  in  Wisconsin  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  William  Gleason. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  address? 

Mr.  Carroll.  AYaukegan. 

The  Chairman.  In  each  one  of  these  States  they  have  a  distinct 
organization  reporting  to  you  as  the  national  chairman  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Well,  the  only  time  they  report  to  me  is  at  our 
national  convention,  once  a  year. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  all  the  association  does — hold  a  convention 
once  a  year  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir — pardon  me;  we  have  conferences  between 
when  deemed  necessary  to  call  same. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  publish  a  newspaper? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  name  of  the  newspaper  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  It  is  called  "  Beverages."    It  is  handled  by  the 
national  secretary. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  paper  sent  only  to  paid  subscribers? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  could  not  answer  that  question. 

Senator  Reed.  All  that  is  left  is  the  name,  is  it  not? 

The  Chairman.  How  many  copies  of  that  are  printed  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  not  any  idea,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Has  it  a  large  circulation  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  could  not  say  the  circulation  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Who  could  tell  that? 

Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  his  individual  paper. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  supported  in  any  way  by  your  organization? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  is  your  organization  supported  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  By  per  capita  tax  from  each  Sta**)  association. 


2404 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Is  that  a  per  capita  tax  on  all  the  people  of  the 
State? 

Mr.  Carroll.  On  each  member. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  per  capita  tax  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  $1  per  member. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  members  have  you? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  could  not  answer  that  question. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  approximately? 

Mr.  Carroll.  In  the  neighborhood  of  about  4,000.  Of  course, 
that  is  just  a  guess ;  I  have  not  any  idea. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  other  sources  of  revenue  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Reed.  $1  a  year? 

Mr.  Carroll.  A  dollar  a  year  per  member. 

The  Chairman.  And  in  the  State  of  New  Jersey  

Mr.  Carroll.  Pardon  me.  Each  State  association  pays  $100  a 
year  for  dues. 

The  Chairman.  They  pay  it  to  whom  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  To  our  national  secretary. 

The  Chairman.  Are  those  all  the  sources  of  revenue  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  anything  from  the  paper  in  advertise- 
ments ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  contributions? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Take  the  State  of  New  Jersey,  with  which  you  are 
familiar — you  are  not  familiar  with  the  other  States  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir;  I  am  not  familiar  with  them. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  method  of  organizing  in  New  Jer- 
sey ?    Do  you  have  a  State  chairman  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  have  a  State  president  and  a  State  organizer; 

The  Chairman.  The  State  president  you  have  given  us  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chair^uan.  Who  is  the  State  organizer? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Joseph  H.  Buckridge. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  business  of  the  organizer? 

Mr.  Carroll.  He  publishes  a  paper  called  "  Justice." 

The  Chairman.  That  is  supported  by  

Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  supported  by  the  members. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  in  addition  to  the  money  you  said  yon  re- 
ceived ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  any  copies  of  that  paper  with  you  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  circulated  onl}^  in  New  Jersey  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  That  is  printed  in  New  Jersey,  but  sent  

Senator  Edge.  All  over  the  country? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  many  copies  are  sent  around 
New  Jersey? 

Mr.  Carroll.  All  I  know  is  that  each  of  the  members  connected 
with  the  State  association  gets  a  copy  of  it,  paid  by  the  local  associ- 
ation. 


PEESIDEN-TIAL  CAMPAIG^T  EXPEl^SES. 


2405 


The  Chairman.  You  have  local  organizations  in  each  county? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir.    In  some  counties,  several. 
The  Chairman.  You  have  them  in  the  different  towns? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  local  organizations  did  you  have  in 
the  State  of  New  Jersey? 

Mr.  Carroll.  At  the  present  time  we  have  in  the  neighborhood  of 
36,  I  think  it  is,  or  35. 

The  Chairman.  Thirty-six  local  organizations? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  largest  one? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  believe  the  Hudson  County  organization. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  of  a  membership  does  that  have? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  not  any  idea. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  no  idea  of  the  membership  throughout 
the  State? 

Mr.  Carroll.  At  the  present  time  there  is  probably  about  in  the 
neighborhood  of  1,500. 

The  Chairman.  Are  these  1,500  men  who  are  in  the  business  now? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir;  some  are  out  of  the  business,  but  maintain 
their  membership. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  a  good  many  of  them  in  the  business 
now? 

Mr.  Carroll,  Yes,  sir;  quite  a  number. 

The  Chairman.  Is  the  prohibitory  law  in  force  in  New  Jersey  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  believe  so. 

The  Chairman.  How  do  they  happen  to  be  in  the  business,  then  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  beg  your  pardon? 

The  Chairman.  How  do  they  happen  to  be  in  the  business  of  buy- 
ing and  selling  liquor  ? 

Mr.  Carroll-  They  handle  this  one-half  of  1  per  cent  "  near  beer  " 
and  several  beverages. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  have  permits? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  is  not  necessary  to  have  permits  for  that. 

The  Chairman.  Not  for  that  percentage  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  But  have  you  among  your  membership  many  w^ho 
have  permits? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  do  not  know  of  any. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  of  any? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  many  permits  have  been  issued 
in  the  State  of  New  Jersey? 
Mr.  Carroll-  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  We  had  in  evidence  in  Chicago  a  letter  supposed 
to  have  been  written  by  you  to  Cabain  Bros.,  elated  July  22,  1920. 
Did  you  write  that  letter?    You  have  seen  it  in  the  paper? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  saw  it  in  the  paper,  but  I  did  not  write  the  letter. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  signed  the  letter? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  was  signed  with  a  rubber  stamp  in  my  office. 

The  Chairman.  It  was  authorized  by  you  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 


2406 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  The  letter  states : 
Cabain  Bros. 

Dear  Sir  and  Brother  :  Tlie  organized  liquor  trade  of  New  Jers'ey  has  set  out 
to  do  its  part  toward  the  election  of  James  M.  Cox  as  the  next  President  of  the 
United  States,  and  it  becomes  my  duty  to  call  upon  you  to  help.  JNIore  than 
that,  we  are  going  to  fight  as  we  never  fought  before  to  keep  the  hirelings  of 
the  Anti-Saloon  League  out  of  office;  to  elect  Congressmen  in  the  12  congres- 
sional districts  of  the  State  who  will  vote  to  amend  the  Volstead  Ast  so  as  to 
permit  the  sale  of  light  wine  and  beer ;  to  elect  assemblymen  and  State  senators 
w^ho  will  keep  New  Jersey  from  ratifying  the  eighteenth  amendment  and  pre- 
vent the  passage  of  any  law  concurring  in  the  Volstead  Act  in  its  present  form. 

The  nomination  of  Gov.  Cox,  of  Ohio,  for  the  Presidency  by  the  Democrats  is 
a  big  victory  for  our  interests,  and  it  can  be  attributed  to  a  great  degree  to 
the  activity  of  our  trade  organizations  here  in  New  Jersey  and  throughout  the 
Nation. 

What  did  3^our  trade  organizations  do  toAvard  the  nomination  of 
Gov.  Cox? 

Mr.  Carroll.  They  did  not  do  anything. 
Senator  Edge.  Who  were  they  for  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  They  were  not  for  either. 
Senator  Edge.  What  do  you  mean  by  that  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  never  mentioned  either  one  or  indorsed  either 
one,  either  Mr.  Hardino;  or  Mr.  Cox. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  the  nomination.  Did  they  do  anything  for 
the  nomination? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

Gov.  Cox  is  a  pronounced  "  wet "  and  he  can  be  relied  upon  to  approve  an 
amendment  to  the  Volstead  Act  as  suggested  above.  It  is  now  up  to  our  trade 
organizations  to  stand  unitedly  behind  the  ticket  of  Cox  and  Roosevelt  and  roll 
up  such  a  majority  as  will  show  convincingly  that  the  public  well  is  in  our 
favor.   Are  you  going  to  help?   Of  course  you  are. 

Did  you  talk  this  over  with  whoever  sent  it  out  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Our  State  organizer  who  is  the — now  you  are  chang- 
ing from  the  retail  association  to  the  Federated  Liquor  Industry. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  you  are  right.   We  will  turn  now  to  that. 

This  letter  was  sent  out  by  the  secretary  of  the  Federated  Liquor 
Dealers'  Association,  not  by  the  Retail  Liquor  Association  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.     o,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  president  of  both  of  them  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  work  antagonistically  to  one  another? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  They  work  togther? 

Mr.  Carroll.  As  a  rule ;  yes. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

The  recent  decision  of  the  United  States  Supreme  Court  has  thrown  the 
question  of  prohibition  squnrely  into  politics.  It  is  the  vital  issue  in  the  cam- 
paign that  is  now  under  way.  The  prohibitionists  tried  to  keep  the  ques- 
tion out  of  the  campaign.  They  feared  the  vote  of  an  outraged  and  indignant 
public.  It  is  up  to  us— members  of  the  organized  liquor  trade— to  force  the 
fight.   That  is  just  what  we  are  doing. 

"\Ve  have  issued  the  challenge.  The  Anti-Saloon  League  is  forced  to  fight. 
It  has  made  an  appeal  for  a  $30,000  fund  to  elect  dry  Congressmen. 

Have  you  seen  that  appeal? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Only  as  it  was  told  me  by  the  State  organizer. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2407 


The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  whether  it  is  true  or  not  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

There  is  no  question  about  the  Anti-Saloon  League's  ability  to  raise  the 
amount  asked.    How  much  can  we  raise? 

We  must  have  money  at  once  to  carry  on  the  work  that  we  have  planned.  Do 
not  think  for  a  moment  that  there  is  plenty  of  time  to  give  between  now  and 
election.  The  fall  will  be  too  late.  Money  must  be  had  immediately  if  we  are 
to  maintain  our  headquarters  and  continue  the  propaganda  that  is  necessary  in 
the  drive  to  win  public  opinion.   This  is  the  second  appeal  that  I  have  sent  you. 

HaA'e  you  a  copy  of  the  first  appeal? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  please  produce  it? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  These  are  form  letters,  are  they  not,  Mr.  Carroll? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Your  first  appeal  was  sent  out  before  the  conven- 
tion? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  This  was  marked  "  confidential."   Why  was  that? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No  particular  reason. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

.Just  rec-all  what  we  have  accomplished :  We  elected  Gov.  Edwards,  a  Dem- 
ocrat, in  a  Republican  State ;  we  elected  a  "  safe  "  legislature  that  not  only 
refused  to  ratify  the  eighteenth  amendment  but  passed  a  3.50  beer  bill  in  order 
to  make  the  State's  court  fight  possible. 

Is  that  organization  the  organization  that  elected  Gov.  Edwards? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  could  not  say  that,  but  we  did  everything  we  could 
for  the  election  of  Gov.  Edwards. 

The  Chairman.  That  is,  worked  through  your  different  organiza- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Through  the  different  locals  connected  with  our 
State  association. 

The  Chairman.  Is  not  that  the  same  kind  of  fight  that  you  are 
calling  on  them  to  make  now  for  Gov.  Cox  in  the  second  appeal  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  said  that  letter  Avas  O.  K'd  by  me  over  the  phone. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  can  answer  that  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes;  practically  the  same.  Mr.  Cox's  name  was  not 
mentioned  at  the  conference  with  the  officials  of  the  Federation  of 
Liquor  Industries.  The.  only  conference  we  had  was  for  a  liberal 
Congress  irrespective  of  their  politics. 

The  Chairman.  Was  this  read  to  you  over  the  phone  about  Gov. 
Cox? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  O.  K'd  it? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Oh,  pardon  me;  not  that  paragraph.  I  do  not  re- 
meml>er  that  paragraph  being  read.  I  regret,  for  two  reasons,  that 
that  paragraph  was  inserted.  One  reason  is  that  the  association  as 
a  body  did  not  know  of  it ;  and  the  second  reason  is  that  Gov.  Cox,  or 
his  manager,  or  the  Democratic  national  committee,  knew  nothing 
about  it,  good,  bad,  or  indifferent. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  it  happen,  then,  that  in  Justice — 
that  is  your  paper — Orange,  N.  J.,  Thursday,  July  4,  1920,  you  have 
the  article,  "Cox  big  wet  victory.  Our  next  President  Gov.  James 
M.  Cox."   Did  you  have  anything  to  do  with  that  article  ? 


2408 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir ;  not  a  thing. 

The  Chairman.  So,  wherever  anything  appears  about  Gov.  Cox 
and  the  wets  helping  him  you  disclaim  any  responsibility  for  that  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  just  happened  to  get  in? 
Mr.  Carroll.  It  was  put  in  there  by  the  man  that  prepared  the 
matter. 

The  Chairman.  With  your  O.  K.  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  intended  that  the  local  organization 
should  go  ahead  and  do  the  same  work  under  your  second  appeal  as 
you  stated  had  been  done  in  the  first,  for  Gov.  Edwards? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Work  for  a  liberal  Congress  is  what  they  had  been 
advised  to  do. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  care  anything  about  the  President;  it 
is  just  Congress? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  did  not  figure  on  the  President. 
The  Chairman.  You  do  not  figure  on  that  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  your  paper.  Justice,  figure  on  the  President? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  seems  so,  by  the  article. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  not  a  surprise  to  you,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Not  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  money  have  you  raised  in  3?'our  organi- 
zation for  this  work? 

Mr.  Carroll.  $2,400~in  the  neighborhood  of  $2,500.  It  is  a  little 
bit  less  than  that. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  done  by  letter  writing? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir;  all  those  letters. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  that  money  paid  to  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  The  checks  came  in  to  our  former  treasurer,  Mr. 
I.  N.  Heller,  who  resigned  in  the  early  part  of  July,  and  I  assumed 
the  temporary  treasurership  myself.  The  checks  were  made  payable 
to  the  Federated  Liquor  Industry  and  some  to  myself  as  president. 

The  Chairman.  Were  those  checks  all  from  New  Jersey? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  extend  the  work  outside  of  New  Jerse}^  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Your  checks  are  not  all  in  yet,  are  they? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir — pardon  me.  You  mean  what  we  are  ex- 
pecting to  raise  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  could  not  answer  that. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  to  raise  more  money  than  that  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  If  anything  comes  in  response  to  that  second  letter 
it  will  be  accepted. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  second  appeals  did  you  send  out  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  In  the  neighborhood  of  fifteen  hundred. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  checks  did  you  get  back  from  those 
fifteen  hundred  letters? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Checks  amounting  to  in  the  neighborhood  of  $953. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  receive  any  letters  from  the  other  fifteen 
hundred,  or  do  you  still  expect  them  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2409 


Mr.  Caeroll.  In  the  first  letter  the  checks  came  in  to  Mr.  Heller. 
The  Chairman.  I  am  asking  about  the  checks  that  came  in  the 
second  time. 

Mr.  Carroll.  A  little  over  $900  received  from  the  second  one. 
The  Chairman.  What  about  the  balance  ? 

Mr.  Carroll,  We  do  not  know  whether  any  more  is  coming. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  solicitors  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Out  soliciting  money? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  send  any  literature  through  your  Retail 
Liquor  Dealers'  Association  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  In  the  State  ? 
The  Chairman.  No  ;  in  the  Nation. 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  send  anything  out  since  the  convention? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir ;  not  a  thing. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  more  literature  there  bearing  on 
this  question? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  letters  showing  the  checks  received  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  produce  two  or  three  of  those? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  a  typewritten  list  of  all  the  money  re- 
ceived ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No;  not  all  of  it — since  I  became  treasurer  

Senator  Edge.  Let  us  have  that. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  did  you  raise  for  the  Edwards  cam- 
paign ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  did  not  raise  any  money  for  the  Edwards  cam- 
paign. 

The  Chairman.  To  whom  did  you  turn  this  money  over? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  pay  the  bills  out  of  it  

The  Chairman.  Do  you  turn  any  of  it  over  to  the  national  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Or  the  State  committee  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  just  use  it  to  carry  on  your  own  campaign? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Propaganda  work. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  to  go  on  and  raise  what  you  can  and 
€arry  on  what  propaganda  you  can  in  New  Jersey  in  this  election? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  circulate  your  paper? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  suppose  that  paper  

Senator  Edge.  That  is  a  separate  proposition  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  have  nothing  to  do  with  it  at  all.  That  is  the 
organizer's  paper. 

The  Chairman.  But  it  is  the  official  organ  of  the  wholesale  and 
retail  liquor  dealers  of  New  Jersey? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  has  been  adopted  as  the  official  organ. 

The  Chairman.  This  paper.  Justice,  with  a  picture  of  Cox  as  the 
next  President — how  much  is  that  circulated  in  New  Jersey? 


2410 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Carroll.  Just  to  the  members.  There  are  no  special  subscrip- 
tions for  it. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  a  free  matter  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No.   They  pay  $2,  by  each  local  

The  Chairman.  Each  local  lodge  pays  $2  per  member? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  where  do  they  send  that  money? 
Mr.  Carroll.  It  goes  to  the  organizer. 
Senator  Pomerene.  How  often  is  it  printed  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Semimonthly. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  a  circulation  does  that  have  out- 
side of  the  State  of  New  Jersey  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  do  not  know  of  any. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  give  us  copies,  if  you  have  them,  of  that 
paper  since  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  not  got  them  with  me.    I  can  get  them  for 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  send  them  to  us,  if  it  is  not  too  much 
trouble  for  you  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  Avould  have  to  wait  until  I  get  back  home.  Do  jo\jl 
want  a  copy  since  our  State  convention  ? 

The  Chairman.  No;  since  the  national  convention. 
Mr.  Carroll.  In  New  York? 

The  Chairman.  It  is  not  as  important,  of  course,  as  your  conven- 
tion :  but  I  am  speaking  of  the  one  held  in  San  Francisco.  Will  you 
do  that? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir.    Send  it  direct  to  you.  Senator  ? 
The  Chairman.  I  think  so.    There  is  one  thing  more  that  I  want 
to  ask  you.    What  is  the  name  of  your  Wisconsin  agent? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Mr.  Gleason. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  his  address  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Waukegan. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  in  Illinois,  is  it  not  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No  ;  that  is  in  Wisconsin. 

Senator  Edge.  Drawing  your  attention  to  that  paragraph  in  A^our 
letter  that  you  apparently  did  not  censor  

The  recent  decision  of  the  United  States  Supreme  Court  has  thrown  the 
question  of  prohibition  squarely  into  politics — 

You  believe  that  to  be  correct, 'do  you  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Well,  I  O.  K'd  the  letter  with  it  in  there. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  believe  that  prohibition  is  in  politics  now? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  ought  to  put  tlie  men  in  the  business  into  politics. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  do  not  agree  with  Gov.  Cox's  statement 
that  has  been  printed  recently  that  the  prohibition  question  is  as  dead 
as  slavery  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not  believe  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  think  the  members  that  you  are  asking  for 
money  to  help  Mr.  Cox's  campaign  Avill  be  in  sympathy  with  that 
statement? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  is  not  for  Mr.  Cox's  campaign;  it  is  to  elect  a  lib- 
eral Congress.  There  may  be  a  possible  chance  of  modifying  the 
A^olstead  measure. 

Senator  Edge.  Your  letter  is  headed,  "  Liquor  dealers  ask  for 
funds  to  aid  Candidate  Cox  as  a  pronounced  '  wet.'  " 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2411 


Mr.  Carroll.  As  I  said,  Senator,  that  is  a  paragraph  that  I  do 
not  remember  having  heard  read  

Senator  Edge.  You  seem  to  question  the  connection  between  this 
paper — Justice — and  your  activities.  I  understood  you  to  say  that 
Mr.  Buckridge  was  your  official  State  organizer? 

Mr.  Carroll.  And  State  secretary  of  the  Xew  Jersey  liquor  dealers. 

Senator  Edge.  Also  State  secretary  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  And  he  is  the  publisher  of  Justice  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see  on  your  list  of  expenditures  here  that  Mr. 
Buckridge's  name  appears  frequently.  Here  is  one  item,  "J.  H. 
Buckridge,  15  per  cent  commission,  $89.85."   What  is  that  for  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  For  collections  of  these  checks  that  came  in. 

Senator  Edge.  He  gets  paid  a  commission  for  collecting  the  money 
to  elect  a  liberal  Congress.  He  is  not  interested  in  the  election  of 
€ox.    Is  that  it?  ^ 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Buckridge  again:  two  months'  sahay,  I  sup- 
pose? 

jNIr.  Carroll.  He  gets  $500  a  year. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  for  organizing  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir ;  as  State  organizer — no ;  pardon  me — as  sec- 
retary of  the  Federated  Liquor  Industry. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Mr.  Buckridge  and  Justice  are 
Tery  closely  and  directly  connected  with  your  movement  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  would  not  in  any  way  question  that  headline 
in  the  July  4  issue  of  Justice :  "  Cox  a  big  wet  victory."  Is  that  your 
view  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Well,  he  put  it  in  there.   He  did  not  put  it  in  with 
the  sanction  of  the  liquor  industry  or  the  Retail  Dealers'  Association. 
Senator  Edge.  He  was  secretary  of  your  association  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir;  not  then. 
Senator  Edge.  He  is  organizer  of  your  association? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you,  from  your  contact  with  the  liquor  dealers 
of  New  Jersey,  believe  that  that  reflects  their  view  that  it  is  a  wet 
victory  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Well,  they  seem  to  think,  the  dealers  in  the  State  of 
New  Jersey,  since  the  nomination,  that  Gov.  Cox  would  be  the  more 
liberal  of  the  two. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  heard  any  expressions  since  the  statement 
of  Gov.  Cox,  if  correct,  that  he  considers  the  issue  is  as  dead  as 
slaver}^  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

Senator' Edge.  That  has  not  brought  forth  any  comment? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Only  just  in  informal  talks. 

Senator  Edge.  What  seems  to  be  their  view  about  that? 

Senator  Reed.  Are  we  not  going  pretty  far  afield? 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  care.  I  thought  we  perhaps  would  like  to 
enlarge  on  it.   You  need  not  answer  it  if  you  do  not  want  to. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  object  to  it,  of  course,  but  we  are  here 
investigating  campaign  funds,  and  you  are  asking  for  the  vicAvs  of 


2412 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


some  saloon  keeper  doAvn  in  NeAV  Jersey  as  to  whether  Cox  is  more 
liberal  than  Harding,  in  order  that  he  may  follow  them  and  see 
which  drinks  the  most  whisky.  I  do  not  mean  to  say  either  of  them 
do  drink. 

Senator  Edge.  This  money  that  you  have  asked  for — how  do  you 
spend  it  in  New  Jersey,  to  aid  the  congressional  campaign  or  the  Cox 
campaign?   Have  you  any  of  the  literature  that  you  have  prepared? 

Mr.  Carroll.  There  Avas  some  matter  we  had  used  in  former 
campaigns. 

Senator  Edge.  I  would  rather  see  some  that  you  have  used  in  this 
campaign,  if  you  have  any. 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir;  we  have  not  yet. 
The  Chairman.  Are  you  working  on  some? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Our  organizer  told  me  he  was  working  on  some, 
but  only  letters. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  samples  of  Avhat  you  are  going  to 
send  out  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir;  none  prepared  yet. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  been  asked  by  the  president  of  the  federa- 
tion or  the  president  of  the  national  association  or  any  representative 
of  the  Democratic  Party  to  desist  from  your  work  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  There  has  not  been  any  complaint  made,  then,  of 
the  propaganda  that  you  are  preparing  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  apparently  accepted  as  a  part  of  the  campaign, 
as  far  as  you  knoAV  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  not  heard  anything  to  the  contrary. 

Senator  Edge.  It  has  been  pretty  liberally  published  that  you  are 
engaged  in  this  

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  any  evidence  that  that  has  been 
accepted  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  was  asking  him. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  asking  you. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  not  necessary  to  have  any. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No.  You  recognize  the  fact,  do  you  not,  that 
that  is  a  very  unfair  question  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  see  any  reason  in  the  world  why  the  rela- 
tion it  bears  directly  to  the  campaign  of  Gov.  Cox  should  not  be 
brought  out.  I  do  not  see  why  I  should  not  directly  ask  the  ques- 
tion whether  in  any  way  he  lias  been  associated  with  the  national 
committee,  just  as  you  asked  or  just  as  it  was  asked  frequently  in 
Chicago  when  representatives  of  various  allied  organizations  were 
brought  before  us,  as  to  whether  that  had  any  connection  with  the 
national  committee.  I  am  asking  this  witness  whether  he  has  heard 
in  any  way,  either  directly  or  indirectly,  from  the  national  committee 
asking  him  to  desist  in  his  work. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  not  what  I  was  objecting  to.  It  was 
your  statement  that  because  there  was  not  anything  of  the  kind, 
therefore  they  were  approving  it. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  put  it  in  another  way  if  you  object  to  it,  so 
that  the  record  can  be  perfectly  clear.  « 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2413 


Have  you  heard  from  any  official  of  the  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee directing  you  to  desist  from  this  propaganda  in  the  interests 
of  the  Democratic  candidate  ? 

Mr.  Caeroll.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  that  satisfy  you  ? 

Senator  Eeed.  Have  you  heard  of  any  effort  on  the  part  of  the  Re- 
publican committee  to  stop  George  Sylvester  Veerick  advocating  the 
election  of  the  Republican  ticket  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  George  Sylvester  Veerick  ?  Have  you  ever 
heard  of  him  before  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  In  Justice  I  notice — 

WET  PLANK  LEFT  OUT  BECAUSE  OF  FIGHT  ON  LEAGUE  WILSON  FEARED  ANTAGONIZ- 
ING DEYS   AND   THAT   LEAGUE   OF    NATIONS   ISSUE    MIGHT    SUFFER  MAJORITY  OF 

PARTY  WERE  AGAINST  PROHIBITION. 

That  a  wet  plank  in  the  Democratic  platform  was  sacrificed  for  political  ex- 
pediency at  the  direction  of  President  Wilson  was  made  known  by  Senator 
Glass,  chairman  of  the  resolutions  committee  of  the  convention  who  explained 
why  he  and  other  administration  leaders  counseled  silence  on  the  liquor  question. 

That  was  done.  Senator  Glass  said,  so  that  nothing  should  be  permitted  to 
cloud  the  issue  nearest  President  Wilson's  heart — the  League  of  Nations. 

The  President  wished  the  league  issue  to  be  sharply  drawn  against  the  Repub- 
licans, and  wanted  it  made  the  outstanding  feature  of  the  platform. 

Do  you  know  anything  about  that  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  Mr.  James  R.  Nugent,  who  is  men- 
tioned in  this  article  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Slightly  acquainted  with  him. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  had  any  conference  with  him  since  the 
convention  in  San  Francisco? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  was  one  of  the  delegates  from  New  Jersey  and 
on  the  platform  resolutions  committee? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  read  of  his  being  there. 

The  Chairman.  I  notice  again  in  this  article — it  possibly  has  not 
met  3^our  eye — speaking  of  Cox  : 

His  election  to  the  I*residency  of  the  United  States  will  be  the  crowning  vic- 
tory in  the  people's  war  against  prohibition.  Gov.  Gox  is  an  enemy  of  prohibi- 
tion. He  is  opposed  to  its  un-American  principle.  This  fact  was  well  known 
when  he  was  nominated,  which  makes  his  triumph  the  greater. 

Do  you  subscribe  to  that  doctrine  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  That  has  gone  out  without  your  approval? 
Mr.  Carroll.  We  have  nothing  to  do  with  that. 
The  Chairman.  Nothing  to  do  with  the  paper  at  all  ? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  give  us  any  idea  of  the  amount  of  money 
that  you  expect  to  raise  to  carry  on  the  kind  of  campaign  you  are 
carrying  on? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  have  not  any  idea  at  all. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  raise  all  you  can? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  is  about  at  the  limit  now,  I  imagine,  sir,  because 
contributions  are  coming  in  very  slowly. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  have  you  raised? 


2414 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Carroll.  Less  than  $2,500. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  not  stopping  in  your  efforts  to  raise  the 
money  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  have  not  sent  any  further  literature. 
The  Chairman.  But  you  expect  to? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  expect  to  raise  all  the  money  you  can 
and  carry  on  as  active  a  campaign  as  you  can? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Well,  I  think  that  there  will  be  no  more  letters  go 
out  for  any  funds. 

The  Chair^^ian.  There  will  be  no  more  letters  go  out? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No  more  requests. 

The  Chairman.  There  will  be  some  solicitors  go  out? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir ;  we  do  not  send  solicitors. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  not  going  to  quit  the  work?    You  have 
not  become  discouraged? 

Mr.  Carroll.  We  never  get  discouraged. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  will  keep  right  on  up  to  election  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir;  we  expect  to. 

Senator  Edge.  What  does  this  15  per  cent  commission  mean,  if 
you  do  not  pay  for  subscribers  ?  Fifteen  per  cent  commission  to  Mr. 
Buckridge  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  He  gets  15  per  cent  of  all  donations  that  come  in. 
Senator  Edge.  He  is  a  solicitor,  is  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  I  thought  probably  ths  Senator  had  reference  to 
other  solicitors,  he  being  the  State  secretary. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  in  addition  to  his  salary  as  State  secretary  ? 
Mr.  Carroll,  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Keed.  Did  you  ever  hear  of  any  political  committee  ob- 
jecting to  any  body  of  citizens  voting  their  ticket? 
Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  In  your  experience  in  the  liquor  business  do  you 
find  that  the  consumption  of  liquor  is  regulated  by  party  lines  or 
alignments  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  Is  it  your  opinion  as  an  expert  on  this  question  that 
there  is  occasionally  a  Republican  who  takes  a  drink  and  intends  to 
vote  for  Harding? 

Mr.  Carroll.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  association  has  raised  about  $2,000,  and  that 
is  about  all  you  think  you  are  going  to  raise,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  It  does  not  look  very  encouraging,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  The  money  is  not  coming  in  much  faster  than  the 
percentage  of  alcohol  in  this  beer  that  we  are  drinking  nowadays? 

Mr.  Carroll.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  coming  in  about  as  fast  as  the  Democratic 
campaign  fund. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  there  been  any  other  organization  operating 
over  in  your  State  on  the  other  side  of  this  liquor  question — temper- 
ance organizations  that  have  been  at  work  and  that  have  had 
societies  ? 

Mr.  Carroll.  The  Anti- Saloon  League  is  continuously  working 
there,  in  the  State  of  New  Jerse.y. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOM:\nTTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PEHILEGES  AND  ELECTIOJS'S 
UJslTED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGRESS 

SECOND  SESSION 
PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  IN^'ESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PAKT  18 


Printed  for  the  use  of  the  Committee  on  Priv-ilegea  and  Elections 

DEC  1" 


I' 2774 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E,  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb^  Clerk. 


Subcommittee  on  S.  Res.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMES  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb.  Clerk. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


THURSDAY,  SEPTEMBER  23,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Washington^  D.  C. 
The  subcommittee  met,  pursuant  to  adjournment,  at  10.30  o'clock 
a.  m. 

Present:  Senator  Kenyon  (chairman),  iDclge,  Keed,  and  Pomerene. 

ADDITIONAL  STATEMENT  OF  MR.  WILLIAM  BARNES. 

Senator  Reed.  When  we  excused  Mr.  Barnes  yesterday  one  of  the 
purposes  was  to  get  photostatic  copies  of  certain  subscriptions  to 
Mr.  Barnes's  book.  The  photostatic  copies  have  been  mislaid,  pre- 
sumptively by  the  reporter  at  Chicago,  but  we  have  in  his  transcript 
the  language  of  the  instrument,  and,  at  least,  a  partial  list  of  the 
subscribers. 

I  make  that  statement  so  that  the  witness  may  understand  why 
the  photostatic  capies  are  not  produced.  I  think  they  Avill  un- 
doubtedly be  found.   I  presume  the  reporter  has  them. 

Now,  Mr.  Barnes,  I  call  you  attention  to  the  langua^*e  on  page 
1471  of  the  printed  copy  of  these  hearings,  which  is  as  follows : 

The  Albany  Evening  Journal, 
New  York  City,  N.  Y.,  January  20, 1920. 
The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $1,000  for  tlie  expense  and  publica- 
tion and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920," 
and  herewith  tenders  check  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.  in  payment 
of  same. 

All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

That  is  the  form  of  the  subscription  blank.  Such  blanks  were  in 
circulation,  were  they  not? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Well,  the  two  blanks  that  I  left  here  yesterday,  1 
think,  were  identical  with  this. 

Senator  Reed.  The  other  paper,  and  the  paper  upon  which  a  large 
number  of  names,  as  appears  in  this  instrument,  were  signed,  contains 
this  heading.  I  am  reading  from  page  1470  of  the  document  just 
referred  to : 

We,  the  undersigned,  appreciate  the  necessity  of  restoring  to  power  the  Re- 
publican Party  and  approve  the  widespread  distribution  of  militant  Republican 
propaganda  under  the  direction  of  Hon.  William  Barnes.  To  that  end  we  here- 
with pledge  our  moral  and  financial  support. 

Was  not  such  a  paper  as  that  circulated? 
Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  never  seen  it  before. 


2419 


2420 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Eeed.  Did  you  see  the  list  of  subscribers  who  signed  some 
kind  of  a  paper? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Xo. 

Senator  Eeed.  Have  you  never  examined  the  list  of  men  who  signed 
for  certain  sums  of  money  for  your  book? 
Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  never  seen  any  of  those  names? 

Mr.  Barnes.  AVhat  do  you  mean  by  "  seen  the  names,"  exactly? 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  not  got  them  on  your  books  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  not  been  connected  with  this  work  except  as 
a  contract  with  Mr.  Young.    I  have  not  seen  the  details  of  it  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  about  the  contract  with  Mr.  Young  that 
you  speak  of.  You  can  tell  me  again  who  Mr.  Young  is,  because  it 
has  slipped  my  memory. 

Mr.  Barnes.  He  is  in  the  business  of  getting  up  books^  

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  full  name  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Edgar  Pennington. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  in  the  business  of  getting  out  books? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Anniversary  books,  and  things  of  that  kind. 
Senator  Reed.  Where  is  he  located  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Montclair,  N.  J. 
Senator  Reed.  Where  is  his  office  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  In  the  Tribune  Building. 
Senator  Reed.  In  New  York  City  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  I  understand  that  you  simply  furnished  the 
manuscript  for  this  book  and  then  Mr.  Young  undertook  the  work 
of  securing  subscribers,  raising  the  money,  etc.  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  thought  I  explained  that  yesterday.  The  Journal 
Co.  

Senator  Reed.  It  is  indistinct  in  my  mind. 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  Journal  Co.  made  a  contract  with  Mr.  Young 
that  he  would  go  ahead  and  raise  sufficient  money,  whatever  he  could, 
in  relation  to  this  book.  The  Journal  Co.  was  to  publish  it,  etc.  It 
is  a  very  simple  proposition.  I  have  not  been  connected  with  the 
matter  except  as  I  am  officially  connected  now  as  the  president  of 
the  Journal  Co. 

Senator  Reed.  You  wrote  the  book,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No  ;  I  did  not.  Mr.  Hendrick  is  the  editor. 

Senator  Reed.  Who? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Frank  Hendrick. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  called  the  Barnes  book,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  not  responsible  for  what  people  may  say. 

Senator  Reed.  You  allowed  your  name  to  be  connected  with  the 
issue  of  it,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Allowed  my  name  to  be  connected  with  the  issue 
of  it? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly.  I  was  president  of  the  Journal  Co.  I 
made  a  contract  with  Mr.  Young,  and  I  am  in  that  sense  responsible, 
of  course. 

Senator  Reed.  What  I  want  to  know  is  whether  you  simply  got 
a  sum  of  money  for  doing  the  printing  and  these  other  people  made 
all  of  the  contracts  and  got  all  the  money  they  could  get,  or  all 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2421 


the  money  they  did  get,  and  kept  what  was  not  coming  to  you 
under  your  contract  for  the  printing.   AVhat  is  that  arrangement? 

Mr.  Bakxes.  It  states  here  on  page  1471,  does  it  not,  check  pay- 
able to  the  Journal  Co. 

Senator  Eeed.  Very  well.  Then,  what  did  Mr.  Young  get  out 
of  it? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Well,  of  course,  I  will  answer  that  question  if  the 
committee  thinks  I  ought  to ;  he,  of  course,  got  a  commission. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  his  percentage? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Is  that  important,  what  percentage  we  paid  him? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  it  is  important.  We  might  as  well  quit  fenc- 
ing about  this  matter. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  am  not  fencing.    If  you  think  it  is  important  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  The  whole  thing  is  important.  I 
want  to  know  what  this  deal  was.  It  has  been  charged  that  this  was 
a  means  of  aiding  the  Republican  national  campaign,  and  therefore 
we  want  to  know  about  it.    AYe  are  investigating  that  campaign. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  just  want  to  be  clear,  you  know.  Senator,  as  to  what 
questions  I  should  answer  and  what  I  should  not  answer.  I  am  per- 
fectly read}'  to  answer  it,  but  I  do  not  think  that  I  should  explain 
matters  of  that  kind.  I  am  perfectly  willing  to  say  he  got  25  per 
cent  or  30  per  cent  or  40  per  cent  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  What  did  he  get? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  want  to  ask  the  chairman  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  The  chairman  really  has  not  any  more  to  say 
about  it  than  anybod}^  else. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  want  advice ;  that  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  The  committee  have  taken  up  that  question  this 
morning  

Mr.  Barnes  (interposing).  I  would  like  to  know  what  your  de- 
cision is. 

The  Chairman.  We,  of  course,  do  not  want  to  go  into  your  private 
matters  at  all,  but  this  whole  transaction,  we  feel,  is  a  proper  matter 
to  be  shown.  As  to  questions  that  do  relate  to  your  private  matters 
you  have  a  right  to  raise  your  objection,  but  we  feel  that  this  ques- 
tion is  entirely  proper. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  feel  this  way,  that  I  do  not  Avant  to  stand  on  any 
right  that  I  believe  I  have,  because  I  do  not  wish  to  complicate  or  to 
attempt  to  say  anything  that  might  be  interpreted  as  disguising 
anything,  but  I  can  not  see  how  it  is  pertinent.  I  will,  however, 
answer  the  question  for  that  reason,  and  for  no  other,  because  I  do 
not  wish  to  put  the  man  whom  I  made  a  contract  with  in  regard  to 
a  business  matter  in  the  position  of  explaining  every  detail  of  it. 
I  will  do  it  under  that  understanding. 

The  Chairman.  The  questions  will  only  be  general. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Fifty  per  cent  he  received,  and  45  per  cent  in  Albany. 
Fifty  per  cent  elsewhere. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  get  that. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Fifty  per  cent  it  is,  in  Albany,  and  55  per  cent  else- 
where. 

Senator  Reed.  He  went  out  and  made  solicitations  and  got  con- 
tracts. Did  the  Journal  Co.  then  undertake  the  preparation  of  the 
manuscript  through  its  agents  ? 


2422 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Barnes.  Who  prepared  the  manuscripts  and  took  charge  of 
its  publication? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 
Mr.  Barnes.  Mr.  Hendrick. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  did  he  get  his  compensation  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  From  the  Journal  Co. 

Senator  Reed.  The  solicitor  got  50  and  55  per  cent — 55  per  cent 
outside  of  Albany.  Who  paid  for  the  expense,  whatever  it  was,  of 
preparing  the  manuscript  of  the  book?   Was  that  the  Journal  Co. ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly. 

Senator  Reed.  These  original  subscription  lists,  then,  or  contracts, 
are  they  on  file  Avith  the  Journal  Co.  or  are  they  on  file  with  Mr. 
Young  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  know  they  are  on  file  with  Mr.  Young.  I  do  not 
know  anything  further — that  is,  I  presume  that  they  are;  I  can  not 
swear  to  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  yourself  have  never  seen  them,  and  your  your- 
self do  not  know  who  subscribed  the  sums  of  money  that  went  to  the 
payment  of  the  expenses  of  getting  out  this  book? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

sSenator  Reed.  Have  you  ever  seen  the  lists  or  any  of  the  lists  of 
subscribers  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  How  did  you  ascertain  that  the  Journal  Co.  was 
going  to  get  enough  money  to  pay  it  for  the  work  of  getting  out  this 
book  unless  you  saw  the  subscriptions  or  knew  something  about  them  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  It  was  a  business  enterprise.  I  will  venture  to  say 
that  in  a  business  enterprise  you  do  not  know  whether  you  are  going 
to  make  a  success  or  not  before  you  begin. 

Senator  Reed.  But  I  venture  to  say  that  before  I  would  produce  a 
book  that  cost  as  much  money  as  this,  I  would  know  whether  the 
money  was  there  to  pay  for  it  or  not ;  and  I  would  venture  the  guess 
that  you  are  just  that  kind  of  a  man  yourself,  Mr.  Barnes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  thing  is  very  simple.  A  prospectus  was  put  out 
in  relation  to  the  book  and,  of  course,  the  compan}^  went  ahead  and 
made  a  contract  for  its  publication. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  How  much  money  was  your  company  to 
get  out  of  it  for  its  work  of  getting  out  the  book  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  You  have  got  hold  of  it  from  the  wrong  end,  Sen- 
ator. 

Senator  Reed.  No  ;  I  have  not.  You  have  gotten  hold  of  it  from  the 
wrong  end.  I  do  not  care  whether  the  original  arrangement  was  that 
you  were  to  get  a  certain  number  of  thousands  of  dollars  or  whether 
you  went  in  and  took  a  chance  on  whether  yon  were  going  to  get  any- 
thing. What  I  want  to  know  is  whether,  before  you  got  down  to  the 
printing  of  this  book,  you  ascertained  how  much  money  you  were 
going  to  get,  or  approximately,  or  if  you  had  enough  money  to  pay 
for  the  printing  of  the  book. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  know  how  much  money  was  at  hand  at  the 
time  that  the  contract  was  made. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  money  haA^e  you  been  paid? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Do  you  think  that  is  a  proper  question  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Certainly  I  do. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2423 


Mr.  Barnes.  I  think  I  will  have  to  have  that  sent  in.  I  can  not 
answer  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Chairman,  I  do  not  w^ant  to  object  to  Senator 
Eeed's  questions  if  they  are  leading  up  to  something  that  perhaps  is 
not  entirely  clear  now,  but  I  want  to  draw  attention  simply  to  the 
fact  that  Mr.  Barnes  has,  under  oath,  testified  that  no  portion  of  this 
income  is  to  go  to  the  national  committee,  and  therefore  is  it  incum- 
bent upon  us  to  endeavor  to  find  out  whether  he  did  or  did  not  make 
a  financial  or  cash  profit  ?  As  I  understand,  the  reason  that  we  felt 
entirely  justified  unanimously  in  investigating  this  matter  was  that 
it  is  Republican  propaganda;  but  so  far  as  the  actual  cash  profit  is 
concerned  he  has  under  oath  stated  that  it  in  no  way,  directly  or 
indirectly,  went  to  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  we  had  an  agreement  on  that  this  morn- 
ing in  our  conference. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  to  change  that  at  all,  so  far  as  the 
books  being  campaign  propaganda  is  concerned.  I  thoroughly  agree 
with  that.   But  I  am  referring  to  the  actual  profits. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  know  where  these  moneys  went,  because  I 
do  not  know  up  to  this  date  whether  any  part  of  them  went  to  the 
Republican  national  committee  or  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Yesterday,  under  oath,  he  said  they  did  not,  directly 
or  indirectl}'. 

Senator  Reed.  I  understand  that  he  said  that,  but  just  now  he  said 
that  he  only  gets  half  the  money.  I  am  trying  to  find  out  how  much 
money  was  collected.  He  states  that  he  could  not  tell  me  the  amount 
of  the  subscriptions.  Then  he  certainly  can  tell  me  the  amount  of 
money  he  got :  and  when  I  find  out  the  amount  of  money  that  he  got 
I  will  then  follow  it  up  and  find  out  how  much  the  other  fellow  got, 
and  follow  that  and  see  whether  any  part  of  it  w^ent  to  the  national 
committee  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  much  has  been  received,  Mr. 
Barnes  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No.  If  these  figures  are  to  be  given,  I  would  much 
prefer  to  have  them  absolute. 

The  Chairman.  What  we  would  like  to  have  is  the  subscribers  and 
the  amounts. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  will  have  a  complete  list  sent  of  the  whole  matter, 
if  that  is  Avhat  you  want.  I  want  to  make  it  perfectly  clear  to  the 
committee  in  relation  to  the  matter  that  this  enterprise  was  started 
two  years  ago.  Mr.  Young  received  his  commission  of  50  per  cent. 
He  turned  in  his  checks  as  they  were  made,  to  the  Journal  Co.  They 
went  to  the  J ournal  Co.  at  Albany.  They  were  checked  up  in  regular 
course  of  business  and  he  was  sent  his  money.  He  paid  his  solicitors, 
his  own  expenses,  and  he  has  been  two  years  at  it.  He  has  been  doing 
this  for  two  years  and  has  engaged  in  no  other  pursuit.  I  do  not  knoAv 
whether  he  has  made  a  great  deal  of  money.  The  money  goes,  of 
course,  to  the  Journal  Co.  Every  check  is  made  payable  to  them, 
except  that  on  one  or  tw^o  occasions  checks  were  made  payable  to  me, 
which  I  indorsed  to  the  company  so  that  the  record  would  be  com- 
plete. Every  record  is  there  of  every  subscriber  or  amount,  and  the 
money  of  course  was  paid  over  to  him,  his  50  per  cent,  and  the  Journal 
Co.  has  to  pay  all  the  expenses  of  getting  up  the  book,  which  is  a 


2424 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


great  deal.  We  do  not  know  how  much  it  will  be.  It  is  extremely 
difficult  to  get  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  Will  you  say  now,  Mr.  Barnes,  that  you  will  send  us 
a  complete  list  of  all  the  subscribers  and  all  moneys  that  have  been 
received  for  this  book,  with  a  statement  showing  the  amount  that 
Avent  to  the  Journal  Co.  and  the  amount  that  went  to  Mr.  Young  or 
Mr.  Young's  company? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Of  course  the  total  amount  goes  to  the  Journal  Co. 
first.    That  is  what  I  was  trying  to  say. 

Senator  Reed.  I  mean  the  amount  left  to  the  Journal  Co. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  could  not  sa}^  that,  because  I  do  not  know  what 
the  expenses  are  going  to  be. 

Senator  Reed.  I  mean  the  gross  amount. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  understand. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  make  this  statement,  so  that  you  can  get 
it.  You  say  you  will  send  us  a  complete  list  of  the  subscribers  and 
the  moneys  that  have  been  received  for  this  book,  together  with  the 
statement  of  the  amount  of  that  money  which  was  turned  back  to  Mx, 
Young  or  Mr.  Young's  company  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  will  send  us  that,  will  you  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly,  under  the  orders  of  the  committee.  ' 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  wanted  it  distinctly  so  understood,  because  that  is  , 
the  only  way  in  which  I  can  justify  myself  to  the  subscribers. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  that  the  order  of  the  committee  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  that  is  the  order  of  the  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Read  me  what  I  asked  for.   I  want  to  see  if  I  have 
covered  it. 

(The  reporter  read  Senator  Reed's  previous  question  as  above 
recorded.) 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  the  amount  from  each  subscriber  and  the 
source  of  all  of  the  money,  Avhether  it  is  from  the  subscriber  or 
whether  it  comes  in  under  some  other  name  or  title,  and  the  name 
of  the  party  paying  the  money.  That  is  what  we  want.  When  can 
Ave  have  that,  Mr.  Barnes  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  will  telegraph  the  Journal  Co.  immediately  and  have 
it  sent. 

Senator  Reed.  It  then  can  be  here  Avithin  

Mr.  Barnes.  I  suppose  it  would  take  tAvo  days. 

Senator  Reed.  By  to-morrow  morning,  perhaps? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No.  To-day  is  Thursday.  If  they  got  a  telegram 
now  they  ought  to  get  it  in  the  mail  to-morrow  easily  enough.  It 
comprises  some  600  names,  I  believe. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  Did  you  ever  have  any  consultation 
yourself,  or  did  any  of  your  agents  have  any  consultation,  with  Mr. 
Hays  in  regard  to  this  book  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  never  did ;  but  I  think  Mr.  Young  did. 

Senator  Reed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Mr.  Young  carried  with  him, 
did  he  not,  the  official  indorsement  of  this  enterprise  by  Mr.  Hays? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  can  not  testify  to  Avliat  Mr.  Young  did.  I  am  under 
the  impression  that  Mr.  Hays  wrote  a  letter  a  couple  of  years  ago 
about  the  "  dummy,"  but  I  am  not  quite  sure.  I  think  that  he  must 
haA^e. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAKJN  EXPENSES. 


2425 


Senator  Reed.  Will  3^011  produce  that  dummy  that  was  used  for 
subscription  purposes  ? " 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly,  if  you  want  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  it  here  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Will  you  wire  and  get  that  also  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  It  will  save  our  sending  for  Mr.  Young  if  you  will 
get  it. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  Mr.  Young,  Mr.  Barnes? 
Mr.  Barnes.  He  lives  at  Monclair,  N.  J.,  and  has  the  office  I  testi- 
fied. 

Senator  Reed.  By  a  dummy,"  as  I  understand  you,  you  mean  a 
prospectus  of  a  book,  showing  the  character  of  its  binding,  and  so 
forth,  and  in  a  general  way  shoAving  something  that  will  represent 
the  book  in  its  form  and  size,  and  so  forth,  which  the  agents  carry 
about  from  place  to  place  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  thank  you  if  you  will  get  that.  With  that  • 
information*  I  have  no  more  questions  to  ask. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  wanted  to  make  a  suggestion  in  regard  to 
this.  Mr.  Barnes  seems  to  feel  that  we  are  inquiring  into  a  personal 
enterprise.    I  want  to  call  his  attention  to  one  or  two  matters  here. 

A  statement  was  made  by  Mr.  Barnes  on  yesterday  that  the  com- 
mittee got  no  part  of  this  fund.  This  subscription  list  which  was 
introduced  contains  this  statement: 

We,  the  iindersi^jned,  appreciate  the  necessity  of  restoring  to  power  the  Re- 
publican Party  and  approve  the  widespread  distribution  of  militant  propaganda 
under  the  direction  of  Hon.  William  Barnes.  To  that  end  we  herewith  pledge 
our  moral  and  tinancial  support. 

That  indicates  on  its  face  that  it  is  political  propaganda  and  not  a 
personal  enterprise. 

The  subscription  which  is  given  here  on  page  1470  says : 
The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $200  toward  the  expense  of  publica- 
tion and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920," 
and  herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.,  in  payment 
of  same. 

Later  on,  on  page  1471,  appears  the  following: 

New  Yoek  City,  N.  Y.,  January  20,  1920. 
The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $1,000  for  the  expense  and  publication 
and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920."  and 
herewith  tenders  clieck  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.  in  payment  of 
same. 

Signed  by  John  D.  Rockefeller. 

That  same  subscription  here  is  signed  by  other  representative  Re- 
publicans— all  of  w^hich  seems  to  indicate  that  this  was  a  political 
enterprise  and  not  a  personal  enterprise.  For  that  reason  it  becomes 
very  important  that  this  committee  should  investigate  and  have  the 
exact  facts.  It  is  not  with  a  view  of  getting  into  your  personal  affairs 
at  all.  More  than  that,  there  is  another  fact  which  indicates  clearly 
that  it  is  a  political  matter,  because  of  your  statement  of  yesterday 
which  was  to  the  effect  that  you  did  not  publish  the  book  until  after 
you  got  the  speeches  of  acceptance  in  it. 


* 


2426 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


So  I  think  you  ought  to  see  that  the  committee  is  not  going  beyond 
its  jurisdiction  when  it  takes  up  a  subject  of  this  kind. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  want  to  put  into  the  record  with  reference  to  page 
1470  that  I  do  not  know  anything  about  this  paragraph.  I  never  saw 
it  and  it  is  not  on  this  matter  which  I  left  here  yesterday. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask,  for  the  benefit  of  the  committee, 
who  has  custody  of  these  varous  papers,  etc.,  connected  Avith  the 
Journal  Co.? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  quite  know  Avhat  you  mean. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  whose  charge  would  these  papers  be,  re- 
lating to  this  business  venture  or  political  venture  or  whatever  it  is  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  business  manager  of  the  Journal,  of  course. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Robert  D.  Waters. 

Senator  Pomerene.  At  Albany? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  given  us  Mr.  Young's  address? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all  I  care  to  inquire  into. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Did  the  stenographer  get  my  statement  in  regard  to 
page  1470  ?  Because  I  have  never  seen  that  before,  and  I  do  not  know 
what  it  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  never  seen  these  

Mr.  Barnes.  Oh,  yes ;  I  left  those  here  yesterday. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  answered  before  I  completed  my 
question.  Have  you  ever  seen  these  thousand-dollar  subscriptions 
which  are  referred  to  on  page  1471  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  seen  the  blanks. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  did  not  bring  one  of  those  with  you.  did 
you? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes ;  I  did ;  I  left  them  here  yesterday,  two  of  them. 
And  in  that  connection  last  night  you  may  recall  that  there  was  a 
discussion  about  a  third  form  of  contract,  and  I  would  like  to  put  in 
evidence  Mr.  Young's  telegram,  to  whom  I  wired  last  night.  Slay  I 
read  this,  Mr.  Chairman? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Barnes  (reading)  : 

William  Barnes,  New  Willard  Hotel. 

No  other  contracts  other  than  the  contract  T  gave  you  were  used  or  author- 
ized. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  going  to  object  to  reading  that  in  as  not  being 
evidence,  because  we  have  seen  photostatic  copies  of  the  contract; 
and  if  Mr.  Young  is  going  to  make  a  statement  of  that  kind  through 
a  telegram,  he  Avill  have  to  come  here  and  make  it  under  oath,  so  far 
as  I  am  concerned. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  Avould  like  to  see  that  cleared  up.  I  do  not  believe 
there  is  any  such  thing. 

Senator  Beed.  You  said  j^esterday  they  might  have  taken  these 
contracts  and  changed  them  and  photographed  them.  I  sav  asfain 
that  if  the  ^Vorld  Co.  did  that  

Mr.  Barnes.  I  would  like  to  know  it,  Senator,  myself. 

Senator  Reed.  So  would  I. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2427 


Mr.  Barnes.  When  were  these  photostatic  copies  to  be  here,  may 
I  ask? 

Senator  Eeed.  We  just  made  this  discovery.  We  supposed  they 
were  with  the  printer. 

Mr.  Barnes.  You  have  not  got  them  at  all  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Undoubtedly  the  stenographer  who  took  the  evi- 
dence and  made  up  the  record  in  Chicago  must  have  them.  I  have 
no  doubt  they  will  be  found. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  should  be  very  much  obliged  if  I  could  see  them. 

Senator  Eeed.  We  will  try  to  get  them. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  believe  there  has  been  a  fraud  perpetrated  on  some- 
body. 

I  am  to  send  in  a  complete  list  of  the  subscribers  by  name  and  the 
amounts  paid  to  the  Journal  Co.,  and  the  amount  of  commission  paid 
to  Mr.  Young? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Pomerene.  Let  us  have  no  misunderstanding  there.  By  the 
word  "  subscription  "  or  "  subscribers "  we  mean  particularly  those 
who  have  subscribed  funds  toward  this  enterprise. 

Mr.  Barnes.  That  is  what  I  say — the  name  of  each  person,  and  the 
amount. 

Senator  Reed.  My  statement  covered  it ;  but  lest  there  should  be 
any  mistake  let  me  repeat. 

I  want  every  dollar  that  went  into  this  enterprise  and  every  pledge 
of  every  dollar  from  any  source  whatsoever;  the  name  of  the  man 
who  gave  it,  and  the  amount  he  gave,  and  the  kind  of  contract  he 
signed,  if  there  is  any  difference  in  the  forms  of  contract.  In  other 
words,  we  Avant  the  record  here,  Mr.  Barnes. 

Mr.  Barnes.  All  right,  sir;  I  will  be  very  glad  to  give  it. 

The  Chairman.  Did  smj  part  of  this  money  go  to  the  Republican 
national  committee,  directly  or  indirectly? 

Mr.  Barnes.  None. 

The  Chairman.  None  at  all? 

Mr.  Barnes.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  what  Mr.  Young  did  with  his 
part  of  it,  do  you? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  do  not  knoAv.  I  know  very  well  what  he  did  with 
it ;  he  lived  on  it  for  two  years  and  paid  his  solicitors,  and  paid  his 
rent,  telephone,  and  so  on. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Young  really  knows  more  about  it  than  you  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  suppose  he  does.   He  knows  the  details  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  The  amount  that  went  to  the  Journal  Co.  the  Jour- 
nal Co.  kept  for  itself  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  What  is  that  ? 

Senator  Reed.  The  Journal  kept  for  itself  all  that  it  did  not  turn 
over  to  Mr.  Young  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Certainly.  But  in  the  sense,  of  course,  that  we  have 
got  to  pay  the  expenses  of  publication  

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  I  understand  that.  You  have  gotten  out  how 
many  books  to  date  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  really  can  not  answer  that. 

Senator  Reed.  About  how  many? 

Mr.  Barnes.  They  were  promised  500.  I  do  not  know  whether 
they  were  delivered. 


2428 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  How  many  are  ordered  ? 
Mr.  Barnes.  Fifteen  hundred,  so  far. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  the  book  will  have  largely  lost  its  im- 
mediate usefulness  when  the  campaign  is  over  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.. Well,  I  do  not  know.   It  is  a  pretty  good  book. 

Senator  Reed.  Opinions  might  differ  about  that.  But  it  is  largely 
taken  up  with  political  propaganda  for  this  campaign.  It  might  be 
of  use  in  others. 

The  point  I  am  making  is  this,  that  if  there  are  only  fifteen  hun- 
dred ordered  I  think  we  may  safely  assume  that  that  is  all  that 
are  going  to  be  offered. 

Mr.  Barnes.  Of  course,  I  want  it  distinctly  understood  for  my 
OAvn  benefit  that  it  is  absolutely  impossible  to  get  the  work  done. 
I  had  hoped  to  order  a  good  many,  but  I  can  not  get  the  paper 
nor  get  the  work  done.   The  book  was  expected  to  be  out  in  July. 

The  Chairman.  I  would  like  to  have  it  made  perfectly  clear 
about  the  signatures. 

On  this  form  appear  the  names  of  Mr.  Taft,  Mr.  Root,  Mr.  Depew, 
Mr.  Hughes,  and  others.  Did  a  number  of  men  sign  a  statement 
of  that  kind,  or  is  this  taken  from  the  different  signatures  and 
the  different  pledges  and  made  up  in  that  form?  I  do  not  think  it 
is  entirely  clear. 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  went  to  Mr.  Hendrick  and  said,  "  Do  you  know 
anything  about  this  pledge  business  they  have  been  talking  about 
in  Chicago  ?  "  He  said,  "  I  do  not  know.  I  Avill  go  down  and  see 
what  they  have  done  down  there."  He  brought  this  back.  I  do  not 
know  how  they  got  them  or  anything  about  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Barnes,  the  subscription  lists  which  we  saw 
photostatic  copies  of  contain  these  names  and  many  others,  and 
contain  set  opposite  the  names  the  amount  of  the  subscription,  with 
a  different  heading.  Is  it  not  a  fact  that  in  order  to  help  the 
agent  these  papers  were  prepared  and  those  names  photographed 
on  simply  as  indorsers? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  suppose  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  the  amount  opposite  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  They  are  to  get  business.   That  is  what  they  are  for. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is,  with  the  amount  of  the  subscription 
set  opposite? 

Senator  Edge.  A  number  of  these  men  did  not  subscribe  any 
amount,  as  I  understand  it.  They  simply  indorsed  the  work.  Is 
that  not  correct  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  think  so ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Barnes. 

I  will  call  Dr.  Claxton. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  PHILANDER  P.  CLAXTON. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Doctor,  we  want  to  inquire  a  little  about  charges 
of  propaganda  in  some  of  your  publications. 

Mr.  Claxton.  What  are  the  charges,  Mr.  Chairman  ? 

The  Chairman.  It  has  been  called  to  our  attention,  or  to  my  at- 
tention, at  least,  by  an  editorial  in  the  Cinnati  Times  Star  of  recent 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2429 


date  in  which  particular  attention  is  called  to  the  publication  known 
as  School  Life,  issued  by  your  department. 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  Bureau  of  Education. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  the  Commissioner  of  Education? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes,  sir;  the  Commissioner  of  Education,  Depart- 
ment of  the  Interior. 

The  Chairman.  For  how  many  years  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Since  Jul}",  1911. 

The  Chaieman.  In  School  Life  appears  this  editorial — appar- 
ently an  editorial — with  relation  to  Gov.  Cox  and  his  interest  in 
education.  That  is  the  particular  editorial  to  which  I  call  your 
attention  first. 

Mr.  Claxton.  Mr.  Chairman,  School  Life  is  issued  and  has  been 
issued  for  about  two  years  by  the  Bureau  of  Education  for  tw^o 
.  purposes :  First,  to  give  to  school  officers.  State,  county,  and  local, 
and  to  some  extent  to  school-teachers,  information  in  regard  to  edu- 
cation throughout  the  world.  Into  it  goes  summaries  of  larger  pub- 
lications of  the  bureau,  such  information  as  is  very  valuable,  w^e  think, 
but  not  of  sufficient  importance  to  be  put  into  these  large  bulletins, 
and  we  believe  that  it  is  good  for  school  officers  to  know  what  is  going 
an  in  education  elsewhere. 

Second,  for  the  purpose  of  promoting  what  we  think  to  be  desir- 
able tendencies  in  education  for  propaganda  of  a  certain  kind. 

Within  the  last  year  there  has  been  a  very  great  shortage  of 
teachers  due  to  lack  of  money.  The  cost  of  living  and  wages  in 
other  lines  of  life  and  occupations  have  increased  100  per  cent  or 
more,  but,  as  Ave  knoAv,  the  salaries  of  teachers  have  increased  on  an 
average  of  less  than  45  per  cent,  probably.  As  a  result  there  were 
larger  numbers  of  schools  without  teachers  

The  Chairman.  Really,  that  is  very  interesting,  but  

Mr.  Claxton.  It  does  have  to  do  with  it.  May  I  make  that  state- 
ment? 

The  Chairman.  Certainly. 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  has  to  do  w^ith  it.  A  great  many  schools  were 
without  teachers,  and  therefore  the  Bureau  of  Education  undertook 
to  make  a  Nation-wide  campaign  for  the  improvement  of  schools 
and  for  more  money,  and  held  in  May  or  June — in  May,  I  believe — 
here  in  Washington — what  we  called  a  national  citizens'  conference 
on  education — not  of  teachers,  not  of  eductors  primarily,  but  citi- 
zens. Out  of  that  has  grown  a  number  of  State  campaigns,  and  all 
over  the  country  efforts  are  being  made  to  get  larger  appropriations 
for  the  schools.  We  haA^e  learned — I  have,  I  am  sure,  long  ago — 
that  that  can  be  done  by  putting  before  the  masses  of  laj^men,  not 
teachers,  primarily,  what  is  done,  what  is  said  or  what  is  thought 
of  education  and  educational  movements,  the  needs  for  schools  pre- 
sented by  lawmen,  and  especially  by  those  whom  the  people  look 
to  as  their  leaders.  For  that  reason,  this  year,  after  that  conference 
was  held,  and  the  conventions  were  held,  School  Life  undertook  to 
put  impartially  

The  Chairman.  School  Service,  too.  Is  there  a  school  paper  called 
that? 

Mr.  Claxton.  No;  that  was  discontinued.  That  was  conducted 
during  the  war. 

The  Chairman.  By  your  department? 


2430 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Claxtox.  No;  not  primarily.  It  started  in  the  so-called  Creel 
committee.  After  that  was  discontinued  it  came  to  the  Bureau  of 
Education  with  an  allotment  to  be  continued  for  the  remainder 
of  that  year  and  was  discontinued  at  the  end  of  the  year. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  was  that  allotment  that  came  over  to 
continue  Mr.  Creel's  eductional  activities? 

The  Chairman.  This  particular  one  of  School  Service. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  was  going  to  make  that  statement;  $150,000,  al- 
together, came  for  several  purposes. 

The  Chairman.  For  School  Service? 

Mr.  Claxton.  School  Service,  approximately  $75,000 — about  $70,- 
000.    That  has  nothing  to  do  with  this. 

Senator  Reed.  What  I  want  to  know  is  how  much  came  over  to 
continue  the  work  of  the  Creel  bureau  ?    Was  that  $150,000  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  There  came  in  definitely  to  continue  the  work  of  . 
the  Creel  bureau  and  for  educational  extension,  which  Avas  another 
form  of  work  from  what  was  done  in  Creel's  bureau,  and  was  allotted 
by  the  President  for  the  continuation  of  School  Service  another 
$150,000.  It  cost  about  $70,000  to  continue  for  the  rest  of  the  year 
School  Service,  and  it  w^as  then  discontinued. 

Senator  Reed.  W^as  School  Service  a  Creel  activity  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  School  Service  was  published  by  the  Creel  bureau. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  going  to  take  up  School  Service,  Senator. 
I  have  some  copies  of  it  here.  I  would  like  to  finish  this  and  go  to 
School  Service.    How  many  copies  of  School  Life  are  published? 

Mr.  Claxton.  About  40,000;  twice  a  month. 

The  Chairman.  Where  do  they  go  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  They  go  to  school  officers — State,  county,  and  local — 
to  principals  of  high  schools,  and  to  some  teachers. 
The  Chairman.  Forty  thousand? 
Mr.  Claxton.  About  40,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  was  going  to  ask  the  date  of  this  particular 
issue  to  which  you  referred  originally  in  your  first  questions. 
The  Chairman.  September  1,  1920. 
Mr.  Claxton.  September  1 ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  articles  from  other  men  or  as  to 
other  men  

Mr.  Claxton.  I  was  going  to  make  that  statement,  Mr.  Chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Maybe  Ave  Avill  get  along  faster  if  I  ask  you  the 
questions.    What  other  men? 

Mr.  Claxton.  First,  there  Avas  a  statement  in  the  July  1  issue. 
There  Avas  contained  an  extract  from  the  Republican  platform  on 
education.   It  is  on  page  10  of  that  issue. 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  see  that,  please. 

Mr.  Claxton.  On  August  15  there  were  extracts  pertaining  to  edu- 
cation, taken  from  the  Democratic  platform  and  from  the  Repub- 
lican platform. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  date  of  that? 

Mr.  Claxton.  August  15.  In  the  same  issue  are  letters,  complete 
or  partly  complete,  from  Senator  Harding,  from  Gov.  Cox,  from 
Roosevelt,  and  from  Gov.  Coolidge.  Those  letters  Avere  written  to  me 
at  the  time  of  this  conference  to  which  I  referred. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  date  of  the  publication? 

Mr.  Claxton.  This  is  August  15. 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2431 


The  Chairman.  May  I  look  at  it  ? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  Yes,  sir :  these  letters  were  written  to  me.  with  the 
exception  of  the  one  from  Mr.  Roosevelt,  at  the  time  of  the  confer- 
ence. These  gentlemen,  members  of  the  Senate  and  others,  were 
invited  to  this  conference,  some  of  them  to  participate  in  it,  and  they 
were  asked,  if  they  could  not  attend,  to  write  letters  to  be  published 
to  help  forward  this  campaign  for  the  improvement  of  the  schools. 
Senator  Harding  wrote  a  letter,  which  is  here;  Gov.  Cox  wrote  a 
letter  

The  Chairman.  That  is  August  15  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  letter  was  not  August  15 ;  that  is  the  issue. 

The  Chairman.  You  set  out  on  this  page  the  Harding  and  Cox 
letters  and  the  Roosevelt  and  Coolidge  letters  side  by  side  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  did,  yes.  Then  in  that  same  issue  is  a  summary 
of  a  speech  by  Congressman  Simeon  D.  Fess,  which  was  made  at  Salt 
Lake  City.  It  has  reference  to  the  same  thing — education  for  patri- 
otic citizens.   He  made  a  plea  for  the  better  support  of  the  schools. 

On  page  6  of  that  same  number,  Mr.  Chairman,  are  extracts  from 
the  platforms  of  the  Democratic  Party  in  Tennessee,  the  Republican 
Party  of  the  same  State,  and  a  pronouncement  of  the  Federation  of 
Labor  and  the  so-called  platform  of  the  league  of  women  voters,  be- 
cause Tennessee  is  in  a  group  of  States  that  are  more  or  less  back- 
ward in  education,  for  reasons  that  we  know,  and  are  making  great 
efforts  to  improve  their  condition.  It  was  believed  that  this,  going 
to  persons  in  those  States  who  are  particularly  interested  in  this, 
would  be  helpful  to  show  them  the  stand  that  the  State  of  Tennessee 
is  taking. 

That  is  page  6. 

On  page  11  of  the  same  number  is  an  extract  from  a  letter  by  Edwin 
P.  Morrow,  governor  of  Kentuck3%  because  Kentucky  is  making  a 
great  effort :  and  he  makes  a  plea  here  for  

The  Chairman.  You  set  forth  a  number  of  govei*iiors  on  page  11  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes,  sir;  and  on  page  11  there  are  letters  from 
governors  that  were  received  at  that  particular  time  I  referred  to. 
AVhen  these  letters  were  asked  for  they  were  told  that  they  Avould  be 
read — as  most  of  them  were — at  the  conference  and  would  afterwards 
be  published  in  some  form.  We  are  now  in  the  process  of  getting 
out  the  proceedings  of  that  conference  as  a  kind  of  campaign  for 
education. 

The  Chairman.  Was  the  September  1  issue  the  next  one  after 
August  15  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  September  1  issue  would  be  the  next  one  after 
August  15. 

The  Chairman.  Up  to  that  time  you  had  apparently  been  setting 
forth  all  parties  and  all  positions  very  fairly. 
Mr.  Claxton.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  The  article  with  relation  to  Gov.  Cox  seems  to  be 
an  editorial  on  September  1.  Have  you  any  editorial  with  reference 
to  Senator  Harding's  views? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  have  not.  • 

The  Chairman.  How  did  that  happen? 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  happened  in  this  way.  It  was  my  purpose,  hav- 
ing set  forth  these,  to  not  put  forth  any  more.  It  is  a  rule  or  under- 
stood in  the  office  that  all  copy  coming  into  School  Life  should  go  to 


2432 


PRESIDEN-TIAL  CAMPAIGIvr  EXPENSES. 


the  Commissioner  of  Education.  We  lost  our  editor  about  the  1st  of 
June — — 

The  Chairman  (interposing).  Now,  Mr.  Claxton  

Mr.  Claxton.  One  minute. 

The  Chairman.  We  want  to  get  a  chance  once  in  a  while.  We 
afe  willing  to  give  you  two-thirds  of  the  time,  but  we  do  want  to 
ask  a  question  once  in  a  while.  Are  you  through  about  the  loss  of 
the  editor? 

Mr.  Claxton.  You  asked  how  this  got  in. 

Senator  Reed.  How  what  got  in? 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  read  the  article  first  and  see  Avhat  there 
is  to  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  referring  to  the  editorial? 
The  Chairman.  The  editorial  on  page  8  of  the  issue  of  September 
i,  which  says : 

Gov.  James  M.  Cox,  in  his  speecli  accepting  the  nomination  as  Democratic 
candidate  for  the  Presidency,  emphasized  the  need  of  awakened  interest  in 
education.  He  stated  that  the  depleted  ranl^s  of  the  school-teachers  demand 
action  to  provide  increased  pay,  and  that  the  existence  of  five  and  one-half 
millions  of  illiterates,  1,600,000  of  whom  are  foreign  horn,  proves  the  need  of 
greater  opportunity  for  education. 

Any  encroachment  on  local  control  by  the  Federal  Government  was  con- 
demned because  of  the  danger  to  State  and  community  initiative.  The  study  by 
the  Central  Government  of  the  progress  of  education  and  the  stimulation  of 
public  interest  in  the  subject  received  his  hearty  indorsement. 

In  a  recent  letter  to  the  Commissioner  of  Elducation,  Gov.  Cox  wrote: 
"You 'may  rest  assured  that  my  interest  in  the  cause  of  education  will  never 
lag." 

Did  you  not  have  similar  statements  from  Senator  Harding? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  the  letter  of  Senator  Harding  which 
you  published  on  August  15,  together  with  that  of  Gov.  Cox? 
Mr.  Claxton.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How^  does  it  happen  you  took  one  of  them  and 
commented  on  it  favorably  and  yet  said  nothing  about  the  other  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  May  I  answer  first  your  first  question?  The  first 
question  was  how  that  got  in.  I  was  going  to  state  it  was  my  pur- 
pose that  no  other  matter,  at  least  at  that  time,  should  go  in  School 
Life.  The  new  editor  was  on  his  vacation  and  his  assistant  had  not 
understood,  apparently,  that  all  matter  in  School  Life  should  be 
referred  first  to  the  commissioner.  In  my  absence  it  came  to  the 
chief  clerk,  and  the  chief  clerk  ordered  its  printing,  approved  it, 
and  it  went  down  to  the  Printing  Office.  I  came  back  and  asked 
for  the  copy,  and  she  said  it  had  gone  to  the  Printing  Office,  and 
brought  page  proofs.  I  immediately  said,  "There  is  an  article  that 
ought  not  to  go  in.  Will  you  not  see  that  it  is  held  up  and  t-aken  out 
before  it  is  printed  " ;  but  she  found  that  it  was  already  printed.  I 
asked  the  editor  about  it  when  he  returned,  and  he  said  he  was  wholly 
without  any  desire  or  thought  of  partisan  propaganda,  but  that  he 
searched  through  Mr.  Harding's  letter  or  speech  of  acceptance  and 
found  nothing  at  all  in  regard  to  it  that  he  could  use.  I  have  not 
read  it  recently,  I  think;  I  did  read  it  when  it  came  out,  and  he 
had  put  that  in.  The  chiefly  objectionable  part  is  the  quotation 
from  a  letter  to  me  which  was  a  personal  one. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2433 


The  Chairman.  Of  course,  the  editorial  was  calculated  to  arouse 
interest  among  school-teachers  in  the  Cox  campaign. 

Mr.  Claxton.  For  that  reason  also — that  is,  in  the  individual. 
School  Life  is  wholly  nonpartisan  or  could  not  be  for  either  side. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  we  will  try  to  keep  it  that  way.  Coming- 
back  to  National  School  Service  

Senator  Reed.  May  I  ask  a  question  about  this  before  you  leave 
School  Life  ?  You  spoke  of  Senator  Harding's  letter  and  said  there 
was  not  anything  so  favorable  as  in  Gov.  Cox's  letter. 

Mr.  Claxton.  No  ;  in  his  speech  of  acceptance. 

Senator  Reed.  But  here  is  his  letter,  in  which  he  says : 

One  can  only  feel  amazement  that  we  have  been  so  tardy  in  coming  to  a 
realization  of  the  scant  consideration  given  to  the  teachers  in  the  American 
public  schools.  AVe  have  been  remiss  in  understanding  the  limitless  possibilities 
of  our  public-school  work. 

Then  he  calls  attention  to  the  fact  that  he  has  asked  to  have  Span- 
ish taught  in  the  public  schools. 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  was  merely  a  good  letter. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  course,  you  differentiate  betAveen  Senator  Hard- 
ing's speech  of  acceptance  and  his  letter? 
Mr.  Claxton.  Yes. 

Senator  EdCxE.  This  editorial  in  the  last  paragraph  refers  particu- 
larly to  "  a  recent  letter  received  by  the  Commissioner  of  Education," 
so  therefore  this  letter  would  certainl}^  be  properly  referred  to  and 
commented  on,  of  Gov.  Cox,  leaving  out  the  speeches  of  acceptance. 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  letter  there  is  from  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  And  that  letter  is  from  Senator  Harding? 

Mr.  Claxton.  That  letter  came  to  me  at  the  time  of  the  conference 
in  May  at  the  same  time  a  telegram  came  from  Gov.  Cox,  and  the 
two  were  printed  side  by  side. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that;  but  you  refer  in  this  editorial 
not  to  the  speeches  of  acceptance  of  either  candidate — you  do  refer 
to  candidate  Cox — but  you  then  refer  to  a  recent  letter  received  from 
Gov.  Cox. 

Mr.  Claxton.  That  Avas  one  of  the  reasons  Avhy  I  objected  Avhen  I 
found  it  Avas  in ;  but  it  was  impossible  to  take  it  out.  The  letter  Avas 
a  personal  letter  written  to  me  and  was  in  a  personal  file.  The  editor, 
who  has  access  to  the  files  to  see  what  there  is  of  importance  that 
might  be  valuable,  found  that.  I  haA^e  said  in  my  statement  that 
knoAving  of  his  interest  in  education  that  aa^c  are  the  educators  Avould 
expect  that  he  Avould  faA^or  the  promotion  of  schools. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  now  pass  to  the  National  School  Service 
matter.  You  say  that  came  OA^er  to  you  from  the  Creel  bureau  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes;  about  November,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  Of  what  year? 

Mr.  Claxton.  NoA^ember  or  December,  after  the  armistice  in  1918. 
The  Chairman.  Hoav  long  did  you  continue  the  publication  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  Continued  it  until  May. 
The  Chairman.  You  had  $150,000  for  that? 

Mr.  Claxton.  No  ;  $150,000  for  that  and  the  Educational  Extension 
Service  and  Community  Organization. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  it  Avas  deA^oted  to  the  National 
School  Service? 


182774— 20— PT  18  2 


2434 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Claxtox.  I  think  about  $70,000 
The  Chairman.  About  one-half  of  it? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes.    It  continued,  however,  under  the  same  group, 
of  editors  that  they  had  while  it  was  with  the  Creel  bureau. 
The  Chairman.  Who  were  they? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  think  Dr.  Bagley  was  the  chief  one.  I  do  not 
remember  them  all. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Searson? 

Mr.  Claxton.  He  was  the  managing  editor  here.  Then,  there  was 
a  group  of  Dr.  Bagley,  of  Columbia  University,  and  others,  who  made 
up  an  advisory  committee. 

The  Chairman.  How  was  School  Service  circulated  ?  Did  that  go 
to  the  teachers  of  the  country? 

Mr.  Claxton.  School  Service  went  to  approximately  650,000  teach- 
ers. There  was  a  list,  which  they  made  up  from  a  list  which  we 
had  in  the  bureau,  of  all  schoolhouses  in  the  United  States  and  practi- 
cally the  number  of  teachers  in  each  one. 

The  Chairman.  Who  else  did  it  go  to? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Probably  to  a  number  of  State  and  county  school 
officers. 

The  Chairman.  What  would  you  say  as  to  the  volume  of  its  edi- 
tion? 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  was  about  650,000. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  a  weekly  publication? 

Mr.  Claxton.  T^vice  a  month,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  seen  the  report  of  the  Joint  Committee 
on  Printing  as  to  some  of  these  matters  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not  know  that  I  have. 

The  Chairman.  For  the  year  ending  March  1,  1920,  Senate  Docu- 
ment 265.  I  want  to  read  a  little  of  it  as  preliminary  to  some  ques- 
tions on  this  National  School  Service. 

Mr.  Claxton.  Very  well. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  from  the  report  of  the  Joint  Committee  on 
Printing,  page  15 : 

For  example,  the  committee  found  that  an  et¥ort  was  being  made  to  fill  Gov- 
ernment periodicals  with  articles  in  support  of  the  League  of  Nations  as  pro- 
posed at  Versailles.  These  articles  were  appearing  with  such  regularity  as  to 
attract  the  attention  of  the  committee  and  others,  while  no  articles  were  being 
printed  on  the  other  side  of  the  controversy.  The  proleague  propaganda  even 
went  so  far  as  to  print  a  partisan  proleague  address  by  the  Secretary  of  War 
in  a  naval  training  station  paper  in  which  was  also  conspicuously  printed  the 
following  indorsement  by  the  commandant  of  the  station  : 

"  I  have  read  Secretary  of  War  Baker's  address  and  recommend  it  for  reading 
by  every  man  in  the  Navy." 

Again,  on  page  26 : 

But  the  underlying  purpose  of  the  National  School  Service — 

And  that  is  the  paper  we  are  now  referring  to — 

seems  to  have  been  to  convert  the  teachers  of  the  country  to  the  idea  of  a 
League  of  Nations  and  to  urge  them  to  teach  that  doctrine  to  their  school  chil- 
dren. This  was  boldly  stated  in  the  issue  of  May  1,  1919,  under  the  heading, 
"  War  lessons  the  schools  should  continue  to  teach,"  where,  among  the  10  les- 
sons listed,  was  that  of  "  Cultivation  of  the  League  of  Nations  attitude  of  mind 
for  all."  An  editorial  in  the  same  issue  also  contained  the  significant  comment 
that  "Against  the  narrow  and  selfish  type  of  nationalism  the  Great  War  has 
been  fought  and  won,"  with  the  concluding  statement  that  "  It  is  this  spirit  that 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2435 


will  dominate  the  American  pnblic  school  and  determine  its  policies  and  prac- 
tices." 

►Still  another  interesting  item  in  the  same  issue  of  the  National  School  Service 
was  the  announcement  that  when  the  Creel  committee  ceased  to  function  it 
turned  over  the  distribution  of  its  publications  to  the  World  Peace  Foundation, 
of  Boston,  which  would  continue  to  supply  the  schools  and  colleges  with  the 
Creel  propaganda. 

Do  you  know  anything  about  that? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not  know  what  became  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  call  joiir  attention  to  National  School  Service, 
issue  of  May  1,  1919.  Was  it  then  being  conducted  by  your  depart- 
ment ? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  Yes. 

The  Chairmax.  On  page  4  is  an  article  covering  half  a  page  on  the 
League  of  Nations. 

Senator  Keed.  Upon  which  side? 

The  Chairmax.  They  are  all  on  one  side. 

Senator  Reed.  On  which  side? 

The  Chairmax.  For  the  League  of  Nations.  This  is  headed, 
"  The  League  of  Nations — Official  summary  of  the  text  of  the  pro- 
posed League  of  Nations  as  issued  from  Paris."  In  the  editorial  of 
that  date  headed  "  The  new  problem  "  was  this  statement : 

Against  the  nai'row  and  selfish  tj-pe  of  nationalism  the  Great  War  has  been 
fought  and  won. 

Then  on  page  9  it  is  said : 

War  lessons  the  schools  should  continue  to  teach.  First,  the  study  of  the 
history  of  the  Great  AVar.    Second,  the  study  and  practice  of  thrift. 

Then  there  are  others  on  down  to  No.  10.  No.  10  is,  "  Cultivation 
of  the  League  of  Nations  attitude  of  mind  for  all."  That  went  out 
to  600,000  school  teachers  in  the  United  States  ? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  suppose  so. 

The  Chairmax.  As  Government  expense:' 

Mr.  Claxtox.  Probably  in  that  month  not  quite  so  many:  but  it 
makes  no  difference,  because  the  schools  were  closed  and  it  was  cut 
down  to  some  extent,  I  think. 

The  Chairmax^.  On  page  16  I  notice  the  statement : 

AVhen  the  domestic  activities  of  the  Committee  on  Public  Information  ceased 
the  remaining  stock  of  its  valuable  war  publications  was  turned  over  to  tlie 
Comimttee  on  Education  and  Special  Training  of  the  AVar  Department.  These 
publications  are  now  distributed  by  the  World  Peace  Foundation,  40  Mount 
Vernon  Street,  Boston. 

Do  you  know  who  are  the  officers  of  that  Peace  Foundation  ? 
Mr.  Claxtox.  No;  I  do  not.   Edwin  D.  Meade  was  connected  with 
it.  and  I  belicA^e  David  Starr  Jordan  was  connected  Avith  it. 
The  Chatr^iax.  Did  they  continue  to  publish  it  ? 
Mr.  Claxtox.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  Avas  the  second  man  you  mentioned  ? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  belieA^e  David  Starr  Jordan  Avas  connected  Avith  it. 

The  Chairmax.  This  says,  further: 

While  the  supply  lasts  high  schools,  normal  schools,  colleges,  and  universi- 
ties may  obtain  these  publications  for  free  distribution  to  students  of  history 
and  current  events  by  paying  carriage  charges.  These  publications  are  dis- 
tributed in  quantities  only,  and  should  be  ordered  at  once  by  those  wishing 
their  students  to  study  the  best  available  authentic  war  publications. 


2436 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  follows  a  list  of  booklets  published  by  the  World  Peace  Foun- 
dation. Was  this  propaganda  for  the  League  of  Nations  carried  on 
through  this  publication  constantly? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  am  sorry  that  I  must  say  that  I  do  not  know  the 
character  of  that  paper  as  I  should,  and  can  not  answer  your  ques- 
tions quite  so  definitely.  The  appropriation  for  that  or  the  allot- 
ment was  made  to  the  Secretary  of  the  Interior. 

The  CiiAiR^rAN.  That  is,  the  allotment  was  made  by  the  President? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  By  tlie  President  to  the  Secretary  of  the  Interior, 
with  the  understanding  that  School  Service  should  continue.  There 
was  already  an  editorial  staff.  They  moved  their  offices  down  to  the 
Interior  Building.  My  offices,  the  Bureau  of  Education,  are  in  the 
Pension  Office  Building.  There  was  not  room  for  them  in  the  Inte- 
rior Building.  The  Secretary  put  this  whole  matter  very  largely 
under  the  direction  of  Mr.  Herbert  Kaufman,  who  was  at  that  time 
an  assistant  to  the  Secretary,  I  think. 

The  Chairmax.  Did  he  have  anything  to  do  with  it? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  do  not  know  to  what  extent.  He  complained  that 
matter  was  not  always  submitted  to  him  and  that  he  was  unable  to  do 
with  it  just  as  he  would  like.  But  it  did  not  come  definiteh^  and  regu- 
larly, let  me  say,  into  the  hands  of  the  Commissioner  of  Education. 
The  material  w  as  not  submitted  to  me. 

The  whole  purpose,  as  I  understand,  of  School  Service,  while  it  was 
continued  by  the  Creel  committee  and  afterwards  when  it  came  to  the 
Secretary  of  the  Interior,  was  to  give  to  teachers  and  through  them  to 
students  throughout  the  country,  pupils  in  the  school,  information  in 
regard  to  the  war.  I  understood  that  to  be  the  purpose,  and  from 
time  to  time  summaries  of  what  had  taken  place,  and  I  suppose  that 
the  editor  of  it.  Dr.  Bagley,  I  think,  reviewed  the  editorial  matter. 
I  suppose  his  purpose  was  to  set  forth  what  had  taken  place  at  Paris. 

The  Chair :m AX.  Do  you  know  about  other  Government  publica- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairmax.  Whether  they  contained  like  propaganda. 

Mr.  Claxtox.  I  do  not  know  of  any.  I  am  sure,  so  far  as  the 
Bureau  of  Education  was  concerned,  that  it  was  not  its  purpose  to 
support  any  propaganda  for  anything  except  education. 

Senator  Eeed.  Has  this  publication  that  contains  this  propaganda 
in  regard  to  the  League  of  Nations  been  discontinued? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  That  was  discontinued  in  May,  1919. 

Senator  Reed.  Why? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  There  was  no  further  allotment  for  it.  I  have  be- 
lieved it  would  be  good  if  there  were  such  a  thing  to  go  to  the  teach- 
ers and  the  schools. 

Senator  Eeed.  Containing  these  arguments? 

Mr.  Claxtox.  Not  containing  any  argument,  but  just  a  good  news 
service. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  matter  with  the  teachers  reading  the 
public  newspapers  ? 

Mr.  Cj.axtox.  They  do  not  always  get  just  the  facts. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  they  not  intelligent  enough  to  glean  the  facts 
out  of  the  public  new^spapers  the  same  as  other  people? 

Mr.  Claxtox,  I  should  think  so ;  but  this  would  give  a  better  sum- 
mary of  it. 


PKESIDENTIAL 


CAMPAIGN 


EXPENSES. 


2437 


The  Chairman.  They  would  take  this  as  the  Government's  posi- 
tion on  everything? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not  know  whether  they  would  or  not.  I  am 
sure  the  Government  would  not,  under  my  administration  in  the 
bureau,  regularly  take  any  side  on  any  question. 

The  Chairman.  What  does  No.  10  mean,  "  Cultivation  of  the 
League  of  Nations  attitude  of  mind  for  all "  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  suj^pose  it  means  what  it  says. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  think  the  language  is  very  clear. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  hrid  not  seen  that,  I  think,  at  all.  I  do  not  believe 
I  ever  savr  that. 

Senator  Edge.  If  I  may  ask  a  question  just  a  little  apart  from  the 
investigation,  you  made  the  statement  a  moment  ago  that  you  thought 
it  would  be  of  great  service  to  teachers  to  continue  it.  In  the  interest 
of  overlapping — we  are  all  interested  in  Government  service  being 
improved — don't  you  think  such  publications  should  be  consolidated  f 
Do  you  think  it  wise  for  the  Government  to  continue  the  two  pub- 
lications of  quite  similar  import  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  What  two  ? 

Senator  Edge.  The  publication  known  as  School  Life  and  the 
publication  known  as  School  Service. 

Mr.  Claxton.  This  is  not  at  all  intended  for  children.  It  is  not 
intended  to  give  information  about  governmental  affairs,  but  the 
news  of  the  world.  It  is  only  an  educational  matter  for  school 
officers  and  to  some  extent  school-teachers. 

Senator  Edge.  One  of  the  Aveaknesses  of  the  Government  system  is 
the  lack  of  concentration,  and  I  am  simply  bringing  it  up,  a  little 
apart  from  our  investigation,  that  as  the  head  of  an  important 
bureau,  if  each  subject  is  important — and  perhaps  it  is;  I  do  not 
question  that — do  3^ou  not  think  the}^  could  be  combined,  and  thus 
the  Government  expense  to  some  extent  be  decreased  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not  think  so,  because  it  would  make  it  twice 
as  much,  and  it  would  not  get  a  large  amount  of  matter  to  people 
who  had  already  a  supply  elsewhere. 

Senator  Edge.  That  seems  to  be  the  prevailing  opinion  among 
Government  officials. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  believe  that  School  Service,  started  for  the  sake 
of  helping  forAvard  the  interests  of  the  war,  was  a  good  publication. 

The  Chairmax.  Are  you  familiar  with  other  Government  publica- 
tions that  have  been  used  for  propaganda  on  various  things  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  am  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  knoAV  anything  about  the  Official  Bulletin 
that  was  issued  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  saw  that  rather  regularly. 

The  Chairman.  You  saw  it  rather  irregularly? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Eegularly.  It  came  to  my  office  but  it  was  not 
always  read. 

The  Chairman.  I  notice  in  this  report  of  the  Joint  Committee 
on  Printing  this  statement : 

When  it  became  evident  to  Creel  and  Rochester  that  the  Bulletin  was  not 
to  be  continued  as  a  governmental  organ,  there  seems  to  have  been  a  deliberate 
effort  to  loot  this  $600,000  a  year  publication. 

Do  you  know  what  that  was  costing  the  Government  ? 


2438 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not ;  I  have  no  knowledge  except  what  I  have 
seen. 

The  Chairman.  The  statement  continues : 

A  ^ai'.g  of  safe  blowers  could  liurdly  have  createLl  more  havoc  in  a  country 
bank  than  did  these  Government  employees  in  the  office  of  the  Official  Bulletin 
when  the  final  word  was  given  that  Uncle  Sam  had  refused  to  continue  as  their 
benevolent  paymaster. 

You  do  not  know  much  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Claxtcx.  No  connection  with  it  at  alL 

The  Chaiijman.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  Great  Lakes 
Bulletin,  which  was  issued  at  Government  expense  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not. 

The  Chaikman.  I  notice  in  the  Great  Lakes  Bulletin  of  May  12, 
1919,  an  address  delivered  by  Secretary  of  War  Xewton  Baker  before 
the  League  of  Nations  mass  meeting,  held  in  Tremont  Temple,  Bos- 
ton, Mass.,  as  to  which  Rear  Admiral  Frederick  B.  Bassett  states: 

I  have  read  Secretary  of  War  Baker's  address  and  reconnnend  it  for  reading 
by  every  man  in  the  Navy. 

Do  you  know  hoAv  many  people  that  went  to  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  have  not  any  idea. 

The  Chairman.  The  Great  Lakes  Bulletin  was  published  at  public 
expense  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  anything  about  that  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Who  could  tell  us  about  that  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  suppose  the  editor. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  the  editor  ? 
Mr.  Claxton.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  The  editor  is  Leo  Fisher.  Again  the  Great  Lakes 
Bulletin  of  Monday,  May  19,  1919,  sets  out  in  full  an  extract  from  an 
address  on  the  League  of  Nations  by  Josephus  Daniels,  Secretary  of 
the  Navy.    Do  you  know  anything  about  these  publications? 

Mr.  Claxton.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  It  seems  there  were  a  great  many  bulletins  being 
issued  by  the  Government  in  Avhich  propaganda  was  going  out  for 
the  League  of  Nations,  and  one  of  them  was  in  your  department  evi- 
dently— the  National  School  Service  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes;  in  the  way  I  said.  I  suppose  I  am  officially 
responsible,  but  I  never  have  been  able  to  assume  full  responsibility 
because  of  the  way  in  which  that  came,  and  it  was  not  definitely 
organized  in  the  bureau. 

The  Chairman.  You  might  have  the  excuse  too  that  all  the  other 
bureaus  nearly  were  doing  the  same  thing. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  am  making  no  excuse. 

Senator  Reed.  I  notice  you  do  say  Avith  regard  to  this  one  article 
that  you  regretted  it  being  in  the  paper.  You  therefore  recognize 
that  it  is  not  a  proper  thing  to  take  Government  money  and  use  it 
for  propaganda  upon  disputed  political  questions. 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  was  not  intended  to  be  political  propaganda  at  all, 
so  the  editor  who  wrote  it  assured  me. 

Senator  Reed.  You  recognize  that? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  fully  do ;  yes,  sir. 


PPvESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2439 


Senator  Reed.  You  try  to  avoid  it  in  your  publication  ? 
Mr.  Claxtox.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  spoke  about  excerpts  from  larger  publications ; 
that  is,  that  jou  had  condensed  matter  from  larger  publications? 
What  are  those  larger  publications  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  Bureau  of  Education  published  annually  a 
report  of  about  200  pages  and  biannuall}^  a  summary  or  survey  of 
education  in  the  United  States  and  the  world  for  our  use,  and  in 
addition  to  that  it  publishes  about  60  bulletins  a  year  on  various 
subjects,  sometimes  reports  or  surveys  of  school  systems  in  States  or 
cities. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Educational? 
'  Mr.  Claxton.  Always  educational.    We  are  permitted  to  publish 
them  in  editions  of  not  more  than  12,500.    It  will  sometimes  take 
more  than  that  to  meet  the  individual  wants  of  the  public,  and  so 
we  republish  them  in  summarized  form. 

Senator  Reed.  You  spoke  about  .money  being  allotted  by  the 
President  for  these  publications.   What  fund  does  that  come  out  of  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  For  the  national  security  and  defense. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  then  a  part  of  his  war  fund? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Part  of  the  war  fund. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  part  of  a  hundred  million  dollars  put 
in  the  President's  hands  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Was  it  $100,000,000  or  $50,000,000?  Whatever  the 
amount  was ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  this  Creel  publication  that  has  been  re- 
ferred to,  which  finally  was  turned  over  to  your  management  and 
which  Avas  then  discontinued,  was  supported  out  of  the  $100,000,000 
which  Congress  gave  the  President  for  a  war  emergency,  and  there 
never  was  an  appropriation  by  Congress  definitely  for  the  particular 
publication. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  suppose  that  was  considered  as  a  war  emergency ; 
that  by  publishing  that  and  sending  it  to  the  teachers  and  schools 
it  was  helpful.  It  w^as  filled  with  suggestions  or  statements  about 
Liberty  loans,  the  Red  Cross,  or  something  of  that  kind. 

Senator  Reed.  But  the  Congress  did  not  appropriate  money  for 
the  particular  purpose.  It  gave  the  President  a  lump  sum  which 
he  used? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Which  he  used  at  his  discretion. 

Senator  Reed.  I  just  wanted  to  exonerate  Congress  from  any  part 
in  that  procedure;  that  is  all.  You  spoke  about  a  meeting  or  con- 
ference being  held  here  in  Washington.  Who  composed  the  confer- 
ence— that  is,  what  class  of  people? 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  was  made  up  of  tw^o  or  three  classes  of  people. 
First,  of  prominent  educators  throughout  the  country,  presidents  of 
universities,  of  colleges,  of  normal  schools,  State  and  county  super- 
intendents of  schools  and  city  superintendents.  Then  we  had  gover- 
nors; there  were  four  of  five  governors  of  States  here.  All  were 
invited.  Members  of  Congress  were  there  and  two  at  least  addressed 
the  conference.  The  British  ambassador  appeared  and  the  repre- 
sentative of  the  French  embassy ;  but  very  largely,  chiefly,  about  two- 
thirds  probably  of  all  the  persons  present  were  citizens,  laymen.  I 
asked  the  governor  of  each  State  to  give  me  the  names  or  to  appoint 
prominent  citizens  to  attend  the  conference. 


2440 


PEESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN-  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Who  called  this  conference  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  commissioner  of  education. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  any  expense  connected  with  it  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  No,  sir ;  except  the  printing  finally  of  the  report  of 
the  proceedings  of  the  conference. 

Senator  Reed.  That  was  printed  by  the  Government  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  That  will  be  printed  by  the  Government. 

Senator  Reed.  By  what  authority  was  the  conference  called? 

Mr.  Claxton.  By  the  authority  which  the  Commissioner  of  Edu- 
cation has  to  call  such  a  conference. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  he  given  any  definite  authority  to  call  a  con- 
ference of  people  from  all  over  the  United  States;  and  if  so,  where 
is  the  law  for  it  ? 

Mr."  Claxton.  The  act  creating  the  Bureau  of  Education  re- 
quired that  the  Commissioner  of  Education  shall  assist  the  States 
in  establishing  and  mxaintaining  efficient  schools  or  systems  of  edu- 
cation and  otherwise  to  promote  the  cause  of  education. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  proceeding  under  that  general  clause? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Under  that  general  clause. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  you  printed  the  proceedings  of  this  gath- 
ering ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  of  a  book  did  that  make  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  It  is  not  printed  yet.  It  is  just  ready  for  the 
printer.  It  Avill  make  probably  100  pages  or  less. 

Senator  Reed.  There  was  no  one's  expenses  paid  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  No  one's  expenses  were  paid.  There  was  an  ex- 
pense for  a  hall,  which  the  Secretary  of  the  Interior  and  I  together 
shared. 

Senator  Reed.  The  whole  expense  was  not  large  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  The  whole  expense,  so_  far  as  the  bureau  was  con- 
cerned, nothing  except  the  work  of  the  stenographers  and  the  mail- 
ing clerks  in  the  office  and  the  stationery  and  the  printing. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  of  these  reports  will  you  send  out  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  We  are  permitted  to  send  only  12,500  copies. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  there  any  speeches  made  there  at  this  meet- 
ing that  dealt  with  any  of  the  political  or  semipolitical  subjects  of 
the  day  outside  of  purely  educational  matters  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  think  none  at  all.  I  do  not  remember  any.  It 
will  be  edited  out  if  there  should  be. 

Senator  Reed.  As  I  understand  you,  the  policy  you  are  trying  to 
pursue,  and  that  you  have  pursued  where  the  matter,  has  come  under 
your  personal  direction,  is  that  of  confining  yourselves  absolutely  to 
educational  matters  ? 

Mr.  Claxton.  That  is  the  charter  of  the  bureau,  and  I  have  always 
taken  it  for  granted  that  all  parties  are  equally  interested. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  believe  this  is  a  fair  question  to  put  to  you. 
I  assume  that  w^hen  this  editorial  was  printed  what  you  or  your  edi- 
tor had  chiefly  in  mind  was  the  cause  of  education  and  not  propa- 
ganda for  or  against  any  particular  candidate. 

Mr.  Claxton.  I  think  absolutely  so,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  Senator  Harding  had  written  a  letter  bear- 
ing on  that  same  subject,  it  probably  would  have  been  treated  in 
substance  the  same  way  ? 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2441 


Mr.  Claxton.  Oh,  just  as  readily,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Just  as  readily? 
Mr.  Claxton.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  observe  that  in  this  issue,  where  the  letters 
of  Senator  Harding  and  Gov.  Cox  are  printed,  Senator  Harding's 
letter  appears  in  the  first  column.  Were  you  tr^dng  to  show  him  any 
favoritism  by  reason  of  that  fact? 

Mr.  Claxton.  On  the  other  side  Mr.  Roosevelt's  letter  appears  in 
the  first  column. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  to  make  a  long 
story  short,  it  was  the  interest  of  education  and  not  the  interest  it 
bore  against  either  candidate  that  suggested  the  publication  of  these 
articles  or  editorials? 

Mr.  Claxton.  Altogether,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all.  We  are  very  much  obliged  to  you, 
Mr.  Claxton. 

(Witness  excused.) 

FURTHER  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WILLIAM  BARNES. 

At  this  point  Mr.  Barnes  informally  made  the  following  statement : 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  have  just  called  up  my  office,  and  they  tell  me  over 
the  telephone  that  the  total  amount  received  was  $73,675. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  mean  that  that  was  the  amount  re- 
ceived for  the  account  of  the  Journal  Publishing  Co.? 

Mr.  Barnes.  The  total  amount. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  did  not  include  the  50  or  55  per  cent 
which  went  to  Mr.  Young? 

Mr.  Barnes.  That  comes  out  of  it. 
Senator  Pomerene.  It  includes  that? 

Mr.  Barnes.  Yes.  Of  course  that  is  not  accurate,  possibly;  I  got 
that  over  the  telephone. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  understand. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  ALMERICO  ZAPPONE. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

Senator  Edge.  Will  you  give  the  committee  your  full  name  and 
official  connection? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Almerico  Zappone.  I  am  chief  of  the  Division  of 
Accounts  and  disbursing  clerk  of  the  Department  of  Agriculture. 

Senator  Edge.  Under  your  direction,  as  I  understand  it,  come  all 
vouchers  of  the  various  officials  of  the  departments,  vouchers  for  their 
expense  accounts,  etc.  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  What  position  does  Mr.  Harrison  occupy  in  the  De- 
partment of  Agriculture  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  His  title  is  assistant  to  the  Secretary. 
Senator  Edge.  What  is  his  first  name  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  Floyd  K.  Harrison. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  in  your  possession  the  vouchers  covering 
Mr.  Harrison's  activities  during  J uly  and  August  of  this  year  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  I  have. 

Senator  Edge.  W^ill  you  let  me  have  those  ? 


2442 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAiMPAIGA^  EXPEi^SES. 


Mr.  Zappone.  Certainly. 

Senator  Edge.  I  might  say  for  the  record  that  we  are  investigating 
various  sources  of  expenditure,  and  I  simply  want  to  find  out  through 
the  witness  if  there  is  any  merit  in  the  suggestion  that  this  employee, 
during  the  time  that  I  have  referred  to,  was  away  from  the  business 
of  the  department  upon  Government  expense  directly  connected  with 
political  activity.  I  thought  I  would  anticipate  any  objection  that 
might  arise. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  always  glad  to  get  evidence  in,  not  to  keep 
it  out. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  did  Mr.  Harrison  go  during  July,  1920? 

Mr.  Zappone.  It  appears  from  his  account  that  he  left  Washington 
on  June  18.  The  first  large  city  that  he  stopped  at  was  Chicago. 
From  there  he  went  to  Des  Moines,  Iowa,  and  from  there  to  San 
Francisco,  Calif. 

Senator  Edge.  What  date  did  he  reach  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Zappone.  He  reached  San  Francisco  on  June  25,  at  8  p.  m. 

Senator  Edge.  How  long  did  he  remain  in  San  Francisco  according 
to  the  records? 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  date  of  the  Democratic  national 
convention  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  J une  28. 

Mr.  Zappone.  He  seems  to  have  been  in  San  Francisco  from  June 
25  to  July  9. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  date,  do  you  recall,  of  the  Democratic 
national  convention  in  San  Francisco  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  I  can  not  answer  that. 
Senator  Reed.  Nobody  knows. 

The  Chairman.  The  Senator  from  Missouri  ought  to  know. 
Senator  Reed.  I  have  been  tr3dng  to  forget. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  I  infer,  Senator  Reed,  that  it  is  already  ancient 
history  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  no. 

The  Chairman.  Can  we  not  agree  on  the  date  of  the  Democratic 
convention  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  make  the  statement  for  the  record  that  it  was 
June  28.  According  to  the  records  Mr.  Harrison  left  San  Francisco 
on  July  9.   That  is  correct,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes;  or  probably  July  8. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see  by  the  item  here  that  he  has  charged  his  board 
in  San  Francisco,  June  30,  per  diem,  8^  days,  at  $1  per  day.  Is  that 
correct  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  covers  the  previous  8 J  days  up  to  June  30. 
Senator  Edge.  Up  to  June  30? 
Mr.  Zappone.  Presumably. 

Senator  Edge.  How  could  he  possibly  do  that  when  he  did  not 
arrive  there  until  June  26  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  He  arrived  on  the  25th  of  June. 

Senator  Edge.  On  the  30th  he  charges  8J  days'  board. 

Mr.  Zappone.  You  see,  he  left  Washington' on  June  18,  and  that 
covers  the  intervening  period  from  the  time  he  left  Washington. 

Senator  Edge.  The  next  item  of  per  diem  is  July  11,  lOJ  days. 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes;  lOJ  days,  $i3.  That  is  covering  the  period  be- 
.tween  the  30th  of  June  and  the  11th  of  July. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGJST  EXPENSES. 


2443 


Senator  Edge.  That  would  then  cover  the  period  of  the  national 
convention  ? 

Mr.  Zappuxe.  Practicalh^  that  period.  The  convention  was  there 
iit  that  time. 

Senator  Reed.  While  it  may  cover  the  period  of  the  national  con- 
vention, do  vou  know  whether  this  gentleman  has  any  business 
there? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  going  to  ask  those  questions,  Senator  Reed. 
I  want  to  get  all  the  facts. 

Do  you  know  from  your  personal  connection  v>^ith  the  depart- 
ment just  what  business  this  gentleman,  Mr.  Harrison,  was  engaged 
in  at  San  Francisco,  so  far  as  departmental  activities  were  con- 
cerned ? 

Mr.  Zappoxe.  I  have  reason  to  believe  that  he  was  on  official  busi- 
ness. The  certificate  on  the  face  of  that  voucher  so  states,  and  I 
would  not  have  i^aid  the  voucher  if  I  had  thought  he  had  been  on 
any  other  kind  of  business. 

riie  Chairman.  It  was  just  a  coincidence  he  happened  to  be  there 
at  that  time  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes.  He  accompanied  the  Secretary  of  Agriculture 
in  both  a  secretarial  and  advisory  capacity. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  understand  that  the  Secretary  of  Agricul- 
ture was  out  there  looking  at  the  crops  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  know  that  he  was  having  numerous  conferences 
with  officials  of  the  Department  of  Agriculture. 

Senator  Reed.  At  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Both  at  San  Francisco  and  Portland  and  all  the 
cities  that  he  visited. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  there  quite  a  number  of  officials  of  the  De- 
partment of  Agriculture  that  were  out  there  for  these  consultations? 

Mr.  Zappoxe.  They  are  always  there.  They  are  permanently  sta- 
tioned there,  and  just  as  soon  as  any  official  of  the  department  arrives 
in  the  city  they  immediately  get  in  touch  with  him  and  they  discuss 
all  the  business  of  the  department.  It  is  just  like  if  you  are  attached 
to  a  commercial  concern  and  one  of  the  managers  or  head  men  visits 
your  city,  you  naturally  get  in  touch  with  him  and  get  all  the  in- 
formation from  headquarters  that  you  can. 

The  Chairman.  Who  Avere  the  people  that  had  the  consultations  or 
conferences  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Many  questions  were  taken  up  with  the  Secretary  at 
that  time  by  officials  of  the  department.  Many  problems  were  then 
under  discussion. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  they  settle  most  of  those  down  in  convention 
hall  or  did  they  meet  some  other  place? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That,  of  course,  I  can  not  answer.  My  work  is 
strictly  fiscal  work.  I  am  afraid  when  you  depart  from  that  you 
Avill  not  be  able  to  get  very  much  from  me,  because  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  the  Secretary  of  Agriculture  considered  at  that 
time  a  receptive  candidate  for  the  Presidency? 

Mr.  Zappone.  The  papers  so  stated. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  he  not  an  announced  candidate  for  the  Presi- 
dency ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Not  that  I  am  aware  of.  It  w^as  news  to  us  when  we 
saw  the  comments  in  the  papers  on  that  subject. 


2444  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  your  department  records  show  any  other  vouch- 
ers of  persons  or  any  other  clerks  or  attaches  of  the  department  at 
the  same  time  at  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  There  were  no  other  employees  in  the  Secretary's 
party  except  the  Secretary  and  his  assistant,  Mr.  Harrison. 

Senator  Edge.  No  stenographers? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Mr.  Harrison  performed  any  duty  of  that  kind  that 
might  be  necessary. 

Senator  Edge.  What  do  you  have  in  San  Francisco  directly  con- 
nected with  the  Department  of  Agriculture?  Have  you  a  branch 
station  of  any  kind  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  We  have  a  branch  weather  bureau  office,  we  have  a 
branch  office  of  the  Bureau  of  Animal  Industry,  a  branch  office  of 
the  Bureau  of  Chemistry,  a  branch  office  of  the  P'orestry  Service,  and 
I  think  also  of  the  Bureau  of  Entomology,  and  a  branch  office  of  the 
Bureau  of  Public  iioads.  All  the  large  bureaus  of  the  department  are 
represented  in  San  Francisco. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  there  not  a  bureau  there  that  has  special 
charge  of  grape  culture  and  citrus  fruit  dcA^elopment  also? 

Mr.  Zappone.  You  are  correct.  Senator.  That  is  the  Bureau  of 
Plant  Industry.   They  are  also  represented  there. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  your  records  show  that  Mr.  Harrison  previ- 
ously— and  if  so,  when — made  a  similar  trip  to  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Zappone.  So  far  as  I  can  recall,  that  is  the  first  trip  he  has 
made  to  San  Francisco. 

The  Chairman.  The  Democratic  convention  has  not  been  in  San 
Francisco  for  some  time. 

Senator  Edge.  These  departments  you  enumerate  in  great  number 
have  existed  there  for  some  time  previous  to  1920  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  For  some  years.  They  all  have  representatiA^es,  and 
I  haA^e  no  doubt  they  all  pay  their  respects  to  the  Secretary  and  con- 
sult him  on  official  business. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  though  I  do  not  Avant  to  make 
any  suggestion — in  my  laymen  method  of  trying  to  keep  within  the 
rules  of  CAddence  I  sometimes  disturb  my  colleague,  Senator  Reed — 
as  a  matter  of  fact,  do  you  in  your  judgment,  handling  the  details — 
and  I  ask  this  in  spite  of  the  fact  that  you  made  the  remark  a  moment 
ago  that  I  think  is  entirely  right,  that  3^ou  Avould  not  pay  this  bill 
unless  you  thought  it  Avas  on  official  service — handling  the  various 
papers  of  men  traveling  and  representing  the  department,  do  you 
feel  that  this  trip  at  this  particular  time  Avas  essential  to  and  in  the 
interest  of  the  official  Avork  of  the  Department  of  Agriculture  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  so.  Senator.  I  do  not  see  any  reason  why 
the  trip  could  not  have  been  timed  just  then  as  much  as  it  might 
have  been  made  later.  It  is  A^ery  necessary  that  officials  of  the  depart- 
ment make  these  trips  across  the  country.  They  have  to  keep  in  touch 
with  the  work,  and  that  is  the  only  way  it  can  be  done. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Senator  Edge,  in  view  of  your  suggestion  a 
moment  ago,  I  want  to  say  that  we  do  not  make  any  objection  to  it, 
but  the  question  is  a  perfectly  proper  one. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  very  glad  I  am  improAdng  as  a  cross-examiner. 

Then  in  your  judgment,  Mr.  Zappone,  you  think  it  was  purely 
accidental  that  Mr.  Harrison  and  Mr.  Meredith  together  arriA^ed  in 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2445 


San  Francisco  on  the  eve  of  the  Democratic  convention  and  left  a 
dav  or  two  afterwards? 

Mr.  Zappone.  The  trip  was  incidental  to  the  administrative  work 
of  the  department,  and  if  they  arrived  there  at  the  time  of  the 
convention  I  think  it  was  purely  by  accident. 

Senator  Edge.  But  the  Government  at  least  paid  the  expenses  of 
Mr.  Harrison  to  and  from  San  Francisco,  in  San  Francisco  for  the 
week  or  eight  days  that  he  was  there  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Mr.  Harrison's  expenses  were  so  paid.  The  ex- 
penses of  the  Secretary  of  Agriculture  

Senator  Edge  (interposing).  I  have  not  questioned  that.  I  am 
only  asking  about  Mr.  Harrison. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  notice  the  Secretary  accounts  were  not  so  charged 
at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  not  asked  anything  about  Secretary  Mere- 
dith. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  ask  for  my  information.  You  say  the  Sec- 
retary of  Agriculture  did  not  charge  his  expenses  when  he  went 
out  to  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Except  when  he  was  on  official  business. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  mean  at  the  time  of  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Some  of  the  items  of  expense  were  charged  by  the 
Secretary  and  some  were  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  charge  his  railroad  fare  out  there  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  There  are  breaks  in  the  account. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  his  accounts  here? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  have  just  one  part  of  his  accounts  here. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see  by  this  voucher  covering  the  expenses  of  the 
Secretary  of  Agriculture,  Mr.  Meredith,  that  in  San  Francisco  he 
charges  only  for  a  taxicab  to  meeting  department  employees  and  re- 
turn, and  hire  of  automobile  to  the  agricultural  college,  $13,  and  ferry 
fare.   Correct  me  if  I  am  wrong.   Those  are  the  only  items  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Those  seem  to  be  the  only  items  of  expense  in  San 
Francisco  by  the  Secretary. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  charge  there  his  fare  to  San  Francisco  and 
back? 

Senator  Edge.  No;  he  did  not. 
Senator  Reed.  But  his  secretary  did? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes.  July  8  left  San  Francisco  and  the  next  item 
of  railroad  fare  is  San  Francisco  to  Portland. 

Mr.  Zappone.  Mr.  Harrison  charged  that.  He  paid  for  that  in 
cash. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  haven't  you  heard  that  Mr. 
Harrison  spent  practically  all  his  time  in  San  Francisco  with  Mr. 
Meredith,  acting  as  his  secretary  in  his  headquarters  at  the  national 
Democratic  convention? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  likely  he  was  with  the  Secretary  all  the 
time  he  was  there,  but  according  to  the  voucher  and  the  oath  that 
he  has  subscribed  to  he  was  performing  official  public  business  during 
all  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Meredith  has  not  charged  for  his  board  and 
time  in  San  Francisco,  except  the  items  we  mentioned;  that  is  cor- 
rect, is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Apparently  so  from  this  voucher. 


2446 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Harrison  has  charged  for  his  per  diem  and 
various  other  expenses  during  the  same  period;  is  that  correct? 
Mr.  Zappone.  He  has. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  is  there  not  apparently  a  difference  in  the 
viewpoint  as  to  the  charges  Mr.  Meredith  makes  and  those  Mr. 
Harrison  makes,  although  Mr.  Harrison  you  assume  was  continually 
with  Mr.  Meredith. 

Mr.  Zappone.  And  performing  official  work  during  that  time. 
The  Secretary,  when  he  was  in  San  Francisco,  according  to  the  state- 
ment made  in  his  voucher  here,  interviewed  the  employees  of  the 
department,  and  he  also  visited  the  agricultural  college  at  Berkeley, 
Calif.  Because  he  did  not  submit  an  expense  account  does  not  mean 
to  say  that  he  was  not  engaged  on  official  work.  As  indicated  by 
the  voucher,  he  was  on  official  work,  and  therefore  Mr.  Harrison's 
trip  across  the  country  accompanying  the  Secretary  and  his  state- 
ment that  he  was  performing  a  public  duty  or  on  official  work  would 
seem  to  be  all  right. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact  Mr.  Meredith  considered  from 
his  own  voucher  felt  that  he  should  not  charge  the  Government  for 
his  fare  across  the  country  and  his  per  diem  in  San  Francisco,  and 
Mr.  Harrison,  accompanying  him,  and  in  his  continual  company^ 
thought  that  he  should.  Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  It  may  seem  so  on  the  face  of  the  paper,  but  I  do  not 
know  that  you  gentlemen  are  aware  of  the  fact  that  the  Secretar^^  is 
a  man  of  considerable  Avealth  and  oftentimes,  when  he  does  not  sub- 
mit any  expenses  at  all  that  another  man  traveling  on  official  business 
might  find  it  necessary  to  do  so.  That  is  the  only  answer  I  can  make 
to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  think,  based  on  your  long  experience  in  the 
department  and  having  expense  accounts  of  attaches  submitted  to 
you,  that  a  different  time  might  have  been  selected  to  go  to  California 
than  the  time  of  the  Democratic  national  convention  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  It  might  look  so  to  the  committee,  but  I  do  not  see 
any  real  connection  between  the  things.  The  fact  remains  that  this 
official  work  was  necessary  to  perform  as  official  work  and  it  so  hap- 
pened that  it  came  along  at  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  think  it  could  have  been  as  well  performed 
in  the  interest  of  the  taxpayers  with  the  convention  going  on  and  the 
chief  a  receptive  candidate  for  the  Presidency,  as  some  other  time? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  so.  I  can  only  ansAver  in  that  way. 

Senator  Eeed.  Do  you  know  whether  this  man  Harrison  spent  most 
of  his  time  at  the  Democratic  convention  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  asked  that  question. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  think  we  had  better  get  the  man  himself. 

Senator  Edge.  So  far  as  your  knowledge  is  concerned  it  was  purely 
a  coincidence  that  the  Democratic  convention  happened  at  the  time 
the  head  of  the  department  made  an  official  trip  to  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Purely  a  coincidence,  and  also  that  visits  to  these 
other  large  cities  that  appear  in  the  accounts  were  also  necessar}^  at 
that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  And  the  Government  paid  the  expenses  of  the  as- 
sistant to  the  Secretary  continually  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGJiT  EXPENSES. 


2447 


Mr.  Zappone.  It  did.  I  would  suggest  to  the  committee  that  if 
they  want  to  get  any  real  information  on  this  subject,  they  send  for 
the  Secretary  of  Agriculture.  He  alone  I  believe  could  answer  these 
many  questions  which  you  have  put  to  me.  I  can  pass  on  the  fiscal 
side  of  it  only. 

The  Chairman.  Do  men  such  as  Mr.  Harrison  travel  on  orders  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  no  railroad  fare  here  for  Harrison. 

Mr.  Zappone.  Oh,  yes.  There  is  a  Government  transportation  re- 
quest used.   I  think  perhaps  you  are  looking  at  the  wrong  account. 

The  Chairman.  That  traveling  was  on  orders  that  are  presented  to 
the  railroad  company  for  tickets  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes.  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Which  department  has  them  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  They  are  known  as  Government  transportation  re- 
quests. They  are  exchanged  for  tickets.  They  exchange  these  Gov- 
ernment transportation  requests  for  a  railroaj  ticket. 

The  Chairman.  The  first  order  was  through  to  San  Francisco  on 
June  17.   I  do  not  understand  this. 

Mr.  Zappqne.  That  is  correct.  That  is  the  ticket  to  San  Francisco. 

The  Chairman.  $131.56.   Is  that  a  round  trip  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Not  imless  it  says  so  there.  It  was  a  straight  ticket, 
and  then  as  they  came  back  they  stopped  at  some  other  places. 

The  Chairman.  lie  went  by  way  of  Chicago,  according  to  this, 
and  then  from  Chicago  to  Des  Moines  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  conferences  in  Chicago  that  you 
know  of? 

Mr.  Zappone.  None  that  I  know  of,  except  conferences  with  the  em- 
ployees of  the  department. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  anything  about  that  yourself? 

Mr.  Zappone.  No  ;  I  have  no  personal  knowledge. 

The  Chairman.  At  Des  Moines  was  there  any  meeting?  It  seems 
he  was  in  Des  Moines  for  one  and  three-quarters  days.  Was  there 
any  conference  there  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Except  with  the  employees  of  the  department.  I  do- 
not  know  personally. 

The  Chairman.  What  employees  at  Des  Moines  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Employees  of  our  permanent  station  there. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  they  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Practically  the  same  stations  that  I  indicated  in 
San  Francisco. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  us  have  the  record  clear.  I  take  it  your 
questions  relate  to  Harrison  and  not  to  the  Secretary  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  I  am  asking  about  Mr.  Harrison.  He  goes 
to  Des  Moines  and  spends  one  and  three-fourths  days.  You  say  that 
is  a  conference,  but  you  do  not  know  anything  about  that? 

Mr.  Zappone.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairiman.  Why  do  you  say  it  is  a  conference  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  say  it  is  a  conference  because  I  know  that  they 
confer  with  employees  of  the  department  at  each  and  every  one  of 
these  cities  that  they  visit. 

The  Chairman.  How  do  you  know  that? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Just  because  they  all  do  that. 


2448 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Just  because  they  all  do  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Just  who  did  they  confer  with  at  Des  Moines  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  I  could  not  teil  you. 

The  Chairman.  What  station  is  there  at  Des  Moines  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  There  is  an  a<2:ricultural  college  there. 

The  Chairman.  At  Des  Moines? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  has  it  been  there?  That  is  news  to  me. 
I  live  in  Iowa  and  I  have  not  heard  of  an  agricultural  college  at 
Des  Moines. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  am  trying  to  ansAver  your  question.  There  is  one 
at  Ames. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  to  Ames  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  No  ;  I  think  not. 

The  Chairman.  Or  did  they  bring  the  Ames  people  down  to  Des 
Moines  and  confer  with  them  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  I  can  not  answ^er. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  Mr.  Harrison  have  to  do  in  the  confer- 
ence with  the  people  at  Ames  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  did  not  say  he  visited  Ames. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  at  Des  Moines.  What  business  was  there  of 
the  Agricultural  Department  there? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  you  can  only  get  from  him. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  this  could  be  shortened  if  3^011  will  let  me 
ask  a  question. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  believe  it  can  be  shortened  if  you  star^ 
asking  questions. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  I  think  it  can.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  you  do  not 
know  a  single  thing  about  Avhat  any  of  these  men  did  on  any  of 
these  trips  except  what  is  shown  b}^  the  papers  you  produce  ?  Is  not 
that  true  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  is  practically  correct.  I  know  the  fiscal  side 
of  it.    I  made  that  statement  in  answer  to  previous  questions. 

Senator  Reed.  Clearly  all  these  opinions  the  witness  is  expressing 
as  to  what  these  men  were  doing  are  simply  guesses. 

The  Chairman.  I  want  to  find  out  about  this.  Here  are  eight  and 
one-half  days  in  San  Francisco  which  you  said  were  in  conference. 
With  whom  did  he  confer  at  those  conferences  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  said  he  was  conferring  with  employees  of  the 
department  there. 

The  Chairman.  For  eight  and  one-half  days?  What  was  the 
business  there  that  required  so  much  conference  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Senator,  the  eight  and  one-half  days  you  refer  to 
go  back  to  the  time  he  left  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  No;  he  arrived  out  there  at  8  p.  m.  on  June  25 
and  left  there  on  July  8,  according  to  this.  That  is  13  days:  that  is 
worse.  You  say  he  was  in  conference  there  and  I  want  to  know 
who  with? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  do  not  think  you  quite  understood  the  word.  I 
said  he  conferred  with  employees  of  our  department  there. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  employees  are  there  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  there  must  have  been  30  or  40  in  San  Fran- 
cisco. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2449 


The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  he  must  haA^e  conferred  with  them 
ail  to  take  up  that  much  time  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  feel  that  I  had  better  not  try  to  answer  that  ques- 
tion. 

The  Cpiairman.  I  thouofht  you  were  getting  into  deep  water  about 
these  conferences.   You  do  not  know  what  he  did,  do  you? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  do  not  know  about  the  conferences.  I  am  confi- 
dent that  he  conferred  with  employees  in  these  different  cities.  Every 
official  that  goes  out  from  our  department,  that  is  his  first  duty,  to 
get  in  touch  with  the  officials  in  the  cities  that  he  visits. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  ever  been  out  there  before  a  single  day  to 
confer  with  them  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Not  that  I  am  aware  of. 

The  Chairman.  Had  any  member  of  the  Department  of  Agricul- 
ture ever,  to  your  knowledge,  been  to  San  Francisco  to  confer  with 
these  gentlemen  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Quite  a  number  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  When? 

Mr.  Zappone.  They  are  constantly  going  through  the  country. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  asking  about  San  Francisco.   State  when. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  am  speaking  of  San  Francisco,  too.  I  can  only 
give  you  that  information  by  looking  up  the  records. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  any  of  them  went  out  there 
and  stayed  13  days  and  had  conferences  at  any  time? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  can  not  recall  any  now. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  there  to  keep  these  men  there  13  days? 
Of  course,  5^ou  do  not  know  anything  about  that. 

Mr.  Zappone.  Nothing  more  than  what  the  certificate  shows.  It 
was  on  the  certificate. 

The  Chairman.  You  rely  on  the  certificates? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Absolutely. 

The  Chairman.  You  said  something  about  other  departments  hap- 
pening to  be  out  there  at  that  time  for  conference. 
Mr.  Zappone.  No  ;  I  think  you  misunderstood  me. 
The  Chairman.  Probably  I  did. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  do  not  remember  making  such  a  statement.    I  said 
we  had  other  employees  of  our  department  there  in  San  Francisco. 
The  Chairman.  At  this  time? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Not  traveling.  We  have  permanent  employees,  and 
I  gave  the  bureaus  to  which  they  were  attached,  but  that  is  all  the 
statement  I  made. 

The  Chairman.  I  misunderstood  as  to  that. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  feel  that  you  have. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  other  departments  of  the 
Government  have  found  that  investigations  and  conferences  were 
needed  at  San  Francisco  about  that  time? 

Mr.  Zappone.  No;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  how  many  other  employees  of 
the  Government  went  across  the  continent  to  hold  conferences,  in 
other  departments? 

Mr.  Zappone.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  not  there  yourself? 
Mr.  Zappone.  I  was  not. 


182774— 20— PT  18  3 


2450 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  C  HAiRMAN.  What  is  the  total  bill,  including  railroad  fare  and 
all,  for  Mr.  Harrison? 

Mr.  Zappone.  In  round  numbers,  I  should  say  $300. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Harrison  is  really  a  very  active  man  in  the 
Department  of  Agriculture,  is  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  He  is  very  active.  He  assists  the  Secretary  in  an 
administrative  capacity  and  acts  as  sort  of  clearing  house. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  is  Mr.  Meredith's  campaign  representative — 
perhaps  he  did  not  have  a  manager,  but  who  turned  in  the  expense 
account  that  the  law  required? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  have  no  knowledge  of  that. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Meredith  was  an  active  candidate  for  Presi- 
dent and  had  headquarters  in  San  Francisco  and  had  delegates  in- 
structed for  him — Iowa,  for  instance — did  he  not? 

Mr.  Zappone.  That  is  all  information  to  me.  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  His  name  was  presented  to  the  convention  ? 

Mr.  Zappone.  His  name  apparently  was  presented  to  the  conven- 
tion, according  to  the  newspapers. 

Senator  Eeed.  Most  everybody's  name  was. 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  never  heard  of  his  having  headquarters  there 
at  all. 

The  Chairman.  Out  of  deference  to  Senator  Reed  we  will  not 
ask  any  questions  about  the  convention. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  a  single  thing  about  this  whole 
matter  except  what  is  in  the  vouchers,  do  you? 

Mr.  Zappone.  I  have  to  be  guided  entirely  by  the  facts  that  ap- 
pear in  these  certificates. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  statement  about  what  these  gentlemen  were 
doing  is  a  mere  matter  of  inference?  You  were  not  there  and  did 
not  see  them,  and  do  not  know  Avhat  they  were  doing? 

Mr.  Zappone.  Absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  To  your  mind  it  was  all  a  coincidence  ? 
Mr.  Zappone.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Reed.  This  witness  has  produced  these  vouchers  and  shows 
that  he  does  not  know  anything  else  about  the  matter,  but  I  think  you 
ought  to  get  the  gentleman  who  went  there  and  see  whether  he  spent 
his  time  at  headquarters  or  out  in  the  Botanical  Gardens,  and  whether 
he  was  investigating  air  currents  or  microbes. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  leave  that  for  the  public  to  judge. 

Senator  Reed.  You  leave  it  up  in  the  air  because  you  have  not 
proven  anything  yet.  I  am  not  satisfied  with  it.  I  want  this  man 
Harrison  brought  here  and  put  on  the  witness  stand.  If  he  went  at 
Government  expense  I  want  him  cashiered  and  dismissed  from  the 
service,  and  I  want  his  chief  to  be  put  out  in  the  same  way,  if  his 
chief  knew  about  and  permitted  it.  It  is  not  a  matter  to  be  left  at 
all.    If  this  was  done  by  one  man,  it  may  have  been  done  by  many. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  wait  until  we  get  through  with  these  co- 
incidences in  the  other  departments.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Zappone;  we 
are  very  much  obliged  to  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2451 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WILLIAM  BARNES— Recalled. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Barnes,  just  to  let  you  get  your  train,  we  have 
sent  over  to  the  Congressional  Library  and  obtained  a  copy  of  the 
New  York  World  of  August  21,  1920.  It  only  contains  the  subscrip- 
tion contract.  Look  at  them  and  see  if  those  are  not  the  same  as  3^ou 
produced  here  yesterday.  It  does  not  contain  this  general  contract 
we  have  been  discussing  and  which  you  say  might  have  been  changed. 

Mr.  Barnes  (after  examining  paper).  These  are  the  same  that  I 
produced  yesterday. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  so.  We  are  still  without  that  document, 
and  it  will  have  to  be  obtained. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  is  no  question  about  the  genuineness  of 
these  copies,  is  there? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  can  not  answer  that.   I  could  not  swear  to  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  your  best  judgment,  that  they  are 
genuine  ? 

Mr.  Barnes.  I  suppose  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  those  be  inserted  in  the  record  as  they  ap- 
pear in  the  New  York  AVorld. 

(The  documents  referred  to  appear  below.) 

Original.  Pay  by  check  only. 

[The  Albany  Eveninj?  Journal.    New  York  Office  :  1721-23  Tribune  Building,  New  York 

City.] 

The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $1,000  toward  exix^nse  of  publication 
and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book,  entitled,  "  Republicanism  of  1920,"  and 
herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.,  in  payment  of 
same. 

All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

H.  F.  Sinclair, 
120  Broadwoy,  Neto  York. 


Original.  .  Pay  by  check  only. 

[The  Albany  Evening  Journal.    New  York  Office  :  1721-23  Tribune  Building,  New  York 

City.] 

New  York,  June  24,  1920. 
The  undersignetl  subscribes  the  sum  of  $2,500  toward  the  expense  of  publica- 
tion and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled,  "  Republicanism  of  1920  "" 
and  herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  .Journal  Co.,  in  payment 
of  same. 

All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

J.  Leonard  Replogle, 
120  Broadway,  New  York. 

Original,  Pay  by  check  only. 

[The  Albany  Evening  Journal.    New  York  Office  :  1721-23  Tribune  Building,  New  York 

City.] 

New  York,  January  5,  1920. 
The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $1,500  toward  the  expense  of  publica- 
tion and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920," 
and  herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.,  in  payment 
of  same. 

All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail, 

John  D.  Rockefeller, 
By  Starr  J.  Murpin, 

26  Broad ivay,  New  York. 


2452 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Original.  Pay  by  check  only. 

[The  Albany  Evening  Journal.    New  York  Office  :  1721-2.3  Tribune  Building,  New  York 

City.] 

The  undersigned  subscribes  the  sum  of  $1,000  toward  expense  of  publication 
and  circulation  of  your  proposed  book,  entitled  "  Republicanism  of  1920."  and 
herewith  tenders  check,  drawn  to  the  order  of  the  Journal  Co.,  in  payment  of 
same. 

All  checks  will  be  promptly  acknowledged  by  mail. 

A.  MONELL, 

Tuxedo  Park,  Neiv  York. 

(Thereupon,  at  1  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  took  a  recess  until 
2.30  o'clock  p.  m.) 

AFTER  RECESS. 

The  subcommittee  met  at  2.30  o'clock  p.  m.,  pursuant  to  the  taking 
of  recess. 

TESTIMONY  OF  ME.  ROBERT  P.  SCRIPPS,  EDITORIAL  DIRECTOR 
OF  THE  SCRIPPS  NEWSPAPERS. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  kindly  give  your  full  name? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Robert  P.  Scripps. 

The  Chairman.  And  what  is  your  business  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Newspaper  business. 

The  Chairman.  Just  what  newspaper  business  are  you  in  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  am  editor  of  the  Scripps  newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  Tell  us  what  they  consist  of,  what  are  termed  the 
Scripps  newspapers. 

Mr.  Scripps.  Twenty-one  newspapers,  called  the  Scriips  news- 
papers. 

The  Chairman.  Published  in  the  principal  cities  of  the  United 
States  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes ;  some  of  the  principal  cities.  Some  of  the  towns 
-  are  not  so  large. 

The  Chairman.  About  what  is  the  daily  circulation? 

Mr.  Scripps.  A  million  and  a  quarter,  I  assume. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  the  editor,  you  say? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  am  the  editorial  director  of  these  newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  an  editor  for  each  one  of  the  papers? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  United  Press  Association? 

Mr.  Scripps.  The  United  Press  Association  is  a  wire  news  service. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  controlled  by  the  Scripps  papers  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  it  is  not.  The  controlling  stock  in  it  is  owned  by 
E.  W.  Scripps,  but  it  is  run  separately. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  that  clear  in  the  record.  E.  W.  Scripps 
is  your  father? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  James  Scripps  is  your  brother? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  all  three  of  you  are  interested  and  working 
with  these  papers? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2453 


The  Chairman.  You  own  the  majority  of  the  stock  in  the  United 
Press  Association? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  My  father  does. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  Newspaper  Enterprise  Association  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  It  is  a  corporation,  not  for  profit,  in  Ohio.  It  is  a 
seryice,  a  ne^ys  feature  and  pictorial  and  editorial  seryice  for  Scripps 
newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  owned  by  you  people,  too  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  It  is  owned  by  the  yarious  papers  which  are  members 
of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  what  is  called  the  X.  E.  A.  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  send  out  plate  matter  to  different  papers 
throughout  the  country  i 

Mr.  Scripps.  Xot  plate  matter.  AVe  send  out  news  matter,  printed 
matter,  such  as  the  sheets  you  haye  there,  and  mats  for  pictures — 
matrices  for  pictures. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  haye  you  been  in  your  present  position? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Since  early  in  1917. 

The  Chairman.  In  that  position  just  what  are  your  duties? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Well,  my  position  is  one  of  complete  responsibility 
for  the  editorial  conduct  of  these  newspapers  in  this  association. 

The  CH.y[RMAN.  In  the  matter  that  the  X.  E.  A.  sends  out  are 
editorials  sent  out  also  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  haye  anything  to  do  with  the  editorials? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  direct  them? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Can  any  editorials  go  in  there  without  your 
knowledge  and  consent  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes;  they  can  go  in  without  my  direct  knowledge 
or  consent. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  assume  the  responsibility  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  assume  the  responsibility  for  them,  and  I  am  re- 
sponsible for  the  judgment  of  the  man  who  passes  on  them. 

The  Chairman,  lake  one  of  these  pink  papers  sent  out  by  the 
JN .  E.  A.  How  many  papers  would  this  reach  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Besides  the  Scripps  newspapers,  those  pink  sheets 
are  now  being  sent  to,  I  think  it  is  about  70. 

The  Chairman.  Seyeaty  other  papers? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Throughout  the  United  States? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  furnished  free,  are  they  not? 
Mr.  Scripps.  They  are  furnished  as  part  of  the  X.  E.  A.  seryice  to 
such  papers  as  we  send  them  to. 

The  Chairman.  Are  they  furnished  only  to  the  X.  E.  A.  papers? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  They  pay  a  certain  amount  for  that  seryice  and 
receiye  these  sheets? 

Mr.  Scripps.  They  pay  for  the  X.  E.  A.  seryice,  and  this  is  sent 
out  as  a  part  of  the  N.  E.  A.  seryice. 


2454 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  When  they  make  a  payment  do  they  expect  to  get 
this,  or  is  this  sent  them  as  a  gratuity  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  This  is  sent  them  if  they  want  it. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  sent  to  other  papers  if  they  want  it  ? 

Mr.  SCRIPPS.  If  they  ask  for  it — not  to  other  papers  than  the 
clients. 

The  Chairman.  If  some  country  paper  wanted  some  of  these  pink 
sheets,  how  would  they  get  them  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  They  would  have  to  become  an  N.  E.  A.  client. 

The  Chairman.  And  that  entails  some  expense? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes;  it  entails  some  payment,  depending  on  the  size 
and  circulation  of  the  paper. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  circulated  these  pink  sheets  more  pro- 
fusely in  the  campaign  than  you  did  before  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  We  did  not  circulate  them  before  the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  this  started  since  the  campaign? 

Mr.  Scripps.  We  started  about  the  first  of  this  month ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  1st  of  September? 

Mr.  Scripps.  The  1st  of  September  I  mean ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  issues  have  there  been  of  these  pink 
sheets  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  They  have  been  issued  continuously  since  then.  They 
have  not  been  pink  all  the  time,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Is  it  issued  daily  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  think  they  have  been  issued  daily;  they  may  not 
have  been  regularly. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  any  significance  in  the  pink  color? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  that  is  just  for  convenience  in  handling  and  mail- 
ing them. 

The  Chairman.  You  write  letters  to  these  various  papers  instruct- 
ing them  as  to  their  policies  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes ;  to  the  Scripps  editors. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  I  mean.  Just  how  does  the  United 
Press,  which  you  have  spoken  of,  differ  from  the  N.  E.  A.? 

Mr.  Scripps.  The  United  Press  is  a  news  service  purely  and  simply. 
Senator  Reed.  A  wire  service  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  A  wire  service. 

Senator  Edge.  How  many  subscribers  are  there  to  that  service  ?  I 
do  not  want  to  interrupt  you. 

Mr.  Scripps.  In  the  United  Press  ?    I  could  not  say. 
Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  approximately  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  I  do  not — several  hundred.  I  do  not  know  how 
many. 

The  Chairman.  In  sending  out  the  pink  slips  to  the  N.  E.  A,  you 
are  carrying  on  a  propaganda  for  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox,  are  you 
not  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  receive  any  funds  from  the  Democratic 
national  committee  for  that  purpose  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  No. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  purely  a  voluntary  matter  so  far  as  the 
campaign  is  concerned  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Purely. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIG^^^  EXPENSES. 


2455 


The  Chairman.  You  are  working  as  hard  as  you  can,  and  3^0 ur 
father  and  brother,  for  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  this  is  your  method  of  helping  along? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  It  is  the  method ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  I  notice  in  pink  sheet  No.  1,  as  we  will  call  it,  an 
editorial  headed  "  The  unmentioned  issue."    Did  you  write  that  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  did  not  write  it ;  no. 
The  Chairman.  Who  wrote  it  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPs.  It  was  written  by  Mr.  N.  B.  Cochran,  of  the  Toledo 
News-Bee. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  one  of  the  editors? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  editorial  from  one  of  your  papers  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  believe  so ;  3^es,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  read  it  yourself? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  In  this  editorial  you  speak  of  the  contributions 
and  the  power  of  the  President  to  appoint  the  Federal  judges. 
[Keading :] 

With  one  notorious  exception,  President  Wilson  lias  appointed  progressive 
judges  to  the  Supreme  Court  bench.  By  so  doing  lie  offended  the  selfish  inter- 
ests, that  aim  to  control  the  Government  through  Federal  courts.  That  goes 
deeper  with  special  privilege  than  the  League  of  Nations  or  any  other  issue 
that  may  be  discussed  in  this  campaign. 

Vital  issues  are  sometimes  concealed  and  camouflaged  by  fake  issues  that 
enable  a  small  minority  to  divide  the  people  into  hostile  factions  and  then  get 
control  of  the  real  Government. 

There  is  nothing  involved  in  the  present  campaign  that  is  of  greater  impor- 
tance to  the  people  than  the  kind  of  Federal  judges  the  next  President  will 
appoint. 

You  thought  that  that  was  an  issue  that  had  not  been  mentioned  in 
the  campaign,  and  so  you  gave  it  prominence  in  that  way? 

Mr.  ScRiPPs.  I  thought  it  had  not  been  given  sufficient  prominence 
in  the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  notorious  exception  on  the  Supreme 
bench  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPFs.  Is  that  a  proper  question  for  me  to  answer,  Senator? 
The  Chairman.  I  did  not  think  it  was  not.   Do  you  object  to  an- 
swering it?   I  will  not  press  it  if  you  object  to  answering  it. 
Mr.  ScRipPs.  I  would  prefer  not  to. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  not  press  it.  I  think  perhaps  you  are  right. 
But  3^ou  feel  there  is  one  judge  on  the  Supreme  bench,  appointed  by 
President  Wilson,  who  is  not  the  kind  of  judge  you  refer  to  here? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

Members  of  the  Supreme  Court  are  appointed  by  the  President  and  confirmed 
by  the  Senate.  Now,  we  have  a  candidate  for  President  who  is  a  member  of  the 
senatorial  oligarchy  which  controlled  the  Republican  national  convention,  and 
who  was  hand-picked  by  the  oligarchy. 

Did  you  have  anything  to  do  with  writing  that? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  did  not  write  it. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  see  this  before  it  went  out  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  saw  it  before  it  went  out ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  stand  for  it* and  believe  it? 


2456 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScKipps.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  I  wish  we  could  find  out  Avhere  this  oligarchy  is. 
I  have  been  looking  around  for  it. 

The  Chairman.  Maybe  Mr.  Scripps  could  tell  us. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  constitutes  this  oligarchy  ? 

Mr.  Sgripps.  Well,  they  have  been  referred  to  in  the  press  numer- 
ous times.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  do  not  know.  You  can  not  lay  yourself 
open  to  contempt  by  speaking  of  the  United  States  Senate  in  any 
way  you  desire,  you  know. 

Mr.  ScRiTPS.  All  right.  I  refer,  and  I  think  most  neAvspaper  men 
who  have  referred  to  the  Senatorial  oligarchy,"  to  the  group  of 
Senators  such  as  Penrose,  Smoot,  Lodge,  and  others.  They  are  the 
outstanding  ones. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  the  others?  Let  us  get  all  this  oli- 
garchy in. 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  can  not  quote  the  names  of  the  entire  Senate,  Sen- 
ator. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  they  all  in  the  oligarchy  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  of  course,  they  are  not  all  in  the  oligarchy.  Sen- 
ator. That  is  a  general  phrase  that  has  been  used  right  along  in 
this  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  I  know  it  has. 

Mr.  Scripps.  And  it  refers  to  that  group  of  Senators. 
Senator  Reed.  Penrose,  Smoot,  and  Lodge  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  boss  the  Senate  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  They  are  presumed  to  boss  the  Senate ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  a  man  that  would  say  that  does  not  know 
anything  about  the  Senate. 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  do  not  believe  they  are  supposed  to  boss  the 
Senate  so  much  as  they  are  supposed  to  be  bosses  of  the  Republican 
Party. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  call  them  the  Republican  oligarchy,  for 
God's  sake ! 

The  Chairman.  You  intend  to. do  that,  do  you  not? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Do  what? 

The  Chairman.  Confine  it  to  the  Republican  Party.  You  are  not 
claiming  that  there  is  a  Democratic  oligarchy  in  the  Senate.  That 
is  at  the  other  end  of  the  Avenue. 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  have  not  claimed  it  so  far ;  no,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  But  that  is  what  you  mean  by  this  "  oligarchy 
■  that  you  refer  to  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Penrose,  Lodge,  and  Smoot  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  have  they  been  an  oligarchy  on?  An  oli- 
garchy is  supposed  to  do  something — to  run  something.  What  have 
they  been  running? 

Sir.  Scripps.  Now,  Senator,  I  do  not  want  to  make  a  speech  on 
this,  but  I  think  they  were  very  active  in  the  Republican  convention 
in  Chicago. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2457 


Senator  Reed.  No;  we  are  talking  about  the  Senate.  I  do  not 
know  anything  about  what  happened  down  there  among  those 
scamps  at  Chicago. 

The  Chairman.  To  say  nothing  of  San  Francisco  ? 

Senator  Heed.  I  could  not  get  into  either  one  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  pursue  that,  because  that  is  interesting. 
Just  what  have  they  been  running? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  They  have  been  leaders  in  the  Senate,  and  the  Repub- 
lican Party. 

Senator  Reed.  What/ have  they  led  in?  Penrose,  for  instance — 
what  has  he  led  in  ?  He  has  been  sick  for  a  year. 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Senator,  was  I  called  down  here  to  engage  in  a  discus- 
sion of  politics? 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  you  are  right  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  have  written  this  article,  or  approved  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  we  might  get  it  in  a  few  words  and  that 
you  could  tell  us. 

Senator  Edge.  Perhaps  the  people  of  Maine  might  analyze  it  more 
clearly. 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  think  I  have  said  enough  to  make  myself  clear  on 
the  subject. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  say  that  I  think,  from  an  inside  and  dis- 
interested standpoint,  that  the  talk  about  a  Senate  oligarchy  is  rot. 

The  Chairman.  You  will  have  to  fight  that  out  with  Brother  Cox. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  care  who  makes  the  statement,  whether  he 
is  a  presidential  candidate  or  a  newspaper  writer. 

The  Chairman.  What  we  called  3^ou  here  for  and  what  we  are  try- 
ing to  get  at  is  the  propaganda  that  is  carried  on  by  the  N.  E.  A., 
which  you  have  been  trying  to  describe,  in  the  interest  of  Gov.  Cox. 
I  think  we  have  it  now  that  these  pink  sheets  are  sent  out  and  go  to 
some  million  readers  a  day? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  They  go  out  to  all  of  the  Scripps  papers  and  about 
70  other  newspapers,  which  newspapers  ask  to  have  them  sent  to 
them. 

The  Chairman.  Do  these  go  out  in  this  form  of  pink  sheets  or  as 
typewritten  matter? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  No;  the  pictures  go  in  mats;  the  whole  sheet  does 
not  go  in  mats. 

The  Chairman.  Just  like  this? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Just  like  that;  yes;  and  then  there  is  a  mat  in  the 
package  for  the  picture. 

The  Chairman.  Here  is  one  on  "  Get  the  money,  boys."  This  has 
been  gotten  up  lately,  has  it  not—"  Follies  of  1920  "  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  do  not  know  what  the  date  of  it  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  do  not  mean  to  suggest  to  the  witness  that 
he  or  his  association  invented  that  scheme — "  Get  the  money  " — do 
you? 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  know,  Senator. 
Mr.  Scripps.  That  is  September  14. 

Senator  Reed.  That  phrase  seems  to  have  been  taken  from  the  lit- 
erature of  the  Republican  campaign  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Taken  from  the  investigations  of  this  committee, 
I  suppose.  Now,  you  furnish  this  as  cartoon  to  these  different 
papers  ? 


2458 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  I  asked  you  this.  Can  you  give  us  any 
idea  of  the  circulation  of  the  70  papers? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  No;  I  can  not.  I  have  not  investigated  those  "papers. 
I  can  give  you  a  list  of  the  papers,  if  it  would  be  useful. 

The  Chairman.  I  wish  you  would  give  us  a  general  idea  of  the  cir- 
culation, 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  have  made  no  calculation  along  that  line. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  in  addition  to  the  1,000,000  that  you 
spoke  of? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  That  is  in  addition  to  that.   There  are  TO  papers. 

The  Chairman.  This  will  be  numbered  pink  sheet  No.  2  and  this 
one  pink  sheet  No.  3. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  this  service  gratuitous  which  Senator  Kenyon 
has  gone  over,  to  these  papers  ?  You  simply  sent  it  without  any  ad- 
ditional charge  whatever? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  We  make  no  additional  charge.  Ordinarily  they 
would  get  the  campaign  service.  What  we  have  done  is  to  take  the 
campaign  service  and  print  the  separate  sheets,  and  notify  the 
N.  E.  A.  clients  that  if  they  wanted  the  campaign  service  we  would 
send  them  that  also. 

Senator  Edge.  You  had  the  N.  E.  A.  organized  before  the  cam- 
paign ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  It  has  been  running  for  years,  and  they  paid  so 
much,  each  member  of  the  N.  E.  A.,  for  that  service? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Each  member  paid  so  much  for  that  service. 

The  Chairman.  And  since  the  convention,  as  campaign  matter, 
you  are  furnishing  this  pink  sheet  absolutely  Avithout  any  further 
compensation  to  you  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  iNo,  sir,  Senator.  In  the  first  place,  we  have  the 
members  of  the  N.  E.  A.  charge  the  Scripps  papers  certain  per- 
centage of  their  receipts  to  pay  for  the  service.  We  have  clients 
to  whom  we  sell  the  service,  as  that  is  a  pure  by-product  which  we 
are  putting  out  ourselves  anyway,  and  so  we  sell  it  to  these  outside 
clients. 

The  Chairman.  Sell  it  to  the  outside  clients  ? 
Mr.  jScRipPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  furnish  it  free  to  the  inside  clients? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes;  that  is,  the  members  pay  on  a  pro  rata  basis 
for  their  service. 

The  Chairman.  They  do  not  pay  anything  more  for  this  sheet  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  no  more  than  they  would  pay  without  it. 

The  Chairman.  If  this  sheet  was  not  in  existence,  they  would  pay 
just  the  same? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

Senator  Eeed.  Does  that  apply  to  the  inside  as  well  as  the  outside 
people  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  It  applies  to  all  the  papers  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Sheet  No.  3  says:  "Maine  women  follow  men's 
lead."    Did  you  send  that  out  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  I  did  not  write  it. 


PRESIDENTIAI.  CAMPAIGN^  EXPENSES. 


2459 


The  Chairman,  You  believed  that,  though,  did  you? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  know  that  I  saw  it. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

The  Democrats  lost  the  Irish  vote. 

Is  that  true  in  Maine  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  know;  I  have  not  been  in  Maine,  although 
r  have  had  some  competent  correspondents  in  Maine  for  some  time. 
The  Chairman.  This  is  your  correspondent  who  writes  from  Maine  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Does  he  write  entirely  for  this  sheet? 
Mr.  Scripps.  He  is  a  general  correspondent. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  any  correspondents  who  write  only 
for  this  pink  sheet  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No,  sir ;  I  have  not  any  correspondents  who  write  only 
for  the  pink  sheet.  Some  of  them  are  writing  political  matter  on 
political  assignments,  and  their  matter  appears,  a  great  deal  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  give  us  any  idea  of  the  cost  of  the  paper 
that  goes  into  this  sheet  every  issue  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  No  ;  I  can  not.   That  would  be  trifling,  of  course. 

The  Chairman.  The  paper  would  be  trifling  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes;  there  are  only  about  100  such  sheets  prepared. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  cost  of  setting  this  up  and  printing  it  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  That  matter  would  have  to  be  set  up  anyway  for  the 
Scripps'  papers.  It  is  merely  the  additional  cost  to  the  N.  E.  A.  of 
the  paper  and  ink,  and  is  not  even  postage. 

The  Chairman.  The  cost  of  the  paper  and  ink? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  not  the  labor  cost  figured  in  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Well,  it  would  be  very  small.  The  labor  cost  would 
be  mostly  in  setting  the  type,  and  the  type  has  to  be  set  up  anyway. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  mean  to  say  that  this  would  be  published 
in  this  paper  regardless  of  the  pink  sheet  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Tes. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  taken  from  things  in  your  papers  and 
made  up  into  the  pink  sheet  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Made  up  in  this  form,  first,  and  sent  to  our  papers, 
and  would  be  sent  to  our  papers  regardless  of  whether  any  other 
papers  were  taking  it  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  How  about  the  expense  of  the  cartoons  and  the 
expense  of  the  maps ;  does  that  amount  to  very  much  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  i  do  not  know  how  much  it  amounts  to,  but  it  is  very 
small. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  supposed  to  be  pictures  of  the  different 
Senators  here  in  the  pink  sheet  No.  3?    Is  that  the  "oligarchy"? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  think  they  resemble  some  Senators.  Some  of  them 
are  tagged — I  think  they  are  tagged. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  that  a  picture  of  [indicating  pink  sheet]  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Well,  we  have  Senator  Knox  here  and  Senator 
Harding. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  up  here  in  the  corner,  with  the  whiskers? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Senator,  you  can  read  that.    It  is  Lodge,  and  some 
one  else. 


2460 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Keed.  It  is  a  good  idea  to  always  put  tags  on  the  Senators, 
so  you  will  know  who  it  is. 

The  Cpiairman.  Oh,  that  is  Senator  Smoot ;  supposed  to  be.  This 
is  a  rear  view  here  of  Senator  Penrose,  is  it?  [Laughter.] 

Mr.  ScRipps.  It  must  be.  It  says  "  Penrose." 

Senator  Reed.  What  are  we  hitting  at  anyhow  ? 

The  Chaikman.  These  are  cartoons.  We  have  Col.  Harvey  here 
[indicating].  This  is  not  confined  to  Senators,  apparently — these 
pictures.  Is  Col.  Harvey  one  of  the  oligarchy? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  He  is  not  a  member  of  the  senatorial  oligarchy. 

The  Chairman.  That  [indicating]  is  "  Uncle  Watson,"  who  is  in 
the  sheet,  and  "  Cousin  Brandegee."  Are  they  members  of  the 
oligarchy  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  suppose  they  must  be.  Those  are  the  cartoonist's 
conceptions,  not  mine. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  of  these  sheets  have  gone  out  alto- 
gether, Mr.  Scripps? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Wait  a  minute,  sir.  How  many  issues  or  how  many 
sheets  ? 

The  Chairman.  How  many  issues  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  can  not  tell  you  exactly.   They  were  started  on  the 
1st  of  the  month,  the  1st  of  September,  I  believe. 
The  Chairman.  And  you  expect  to  keep  this  up  until  election  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  carry  all  of  the  cost  of  this  propaganda  your- 
selves ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Your  family  carry  it  without  any  help  from  the 
Democratic  national  committee? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  special  reason  why  you  are  renderino 
this  service  to  Gov.  Cox  and  the  Democratic  Party  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  special  reason  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  We  desire  to  see  him  elected. 
The  Chairman.  You  want  to  see  him  elected  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  any  particular  personal  reason  or  obli- 
gation that  you  feel  you  owe  him  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  None  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  have  anything  to  do  with  securing  an 
exemption  for  you  under  the  draft? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  Or  3^our  brother? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  Don't  you  know  anything  about  it  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  know  nothing  excepting  I  have  seen  the  stor}^  pub- 
lished in  the  New  York  Tribune  recently. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  exempted  from  the  draft? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  also  your  brother? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 
The  Chairman.  When  was  that? 
Mr.  Scripps.  It  was  in  1917,  I  think. 


PRESIDENTIAI^  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2461 


The  Chairman.  Did  Gov.  Cox  have  anything  to  do  with  that  or 
exert  his  influence  in  that  regard? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  seen  this  that  has  been  published,  have 
you  not,  purporting  to  be  the  letter  ? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  have  seen  it. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  the  copy  of  the  letter  is 
correct  or  not? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  do  not ;  I  never  saw  the  Cox  letter ;  I  saw  merely 
the  transcript  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  The  letter  written  to  Mr.  Martin. 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Martin? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Mr.  Martin  is  editor  in  chief  of  the  Scripps-McKae 
League  of  Papers  in  Ohio. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  know  that  Gov.  Cox  wrote  a  letter 
when  he  was  governor  with  reference  to  the  exemption  more  par- 
ticularly of  your  brother,  but  in  a  general  way  referring  to  the  news- 
paper men  being  exempt? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  know  it  now;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  not  known  it  up  until  

Mr.  Scripps  (interposing).  Up  until  the  time  I  saw  it  published  in 
the  Tribune. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  followed  that  up  to  see  whether  the  lettei 
published  is  correct? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  have  not;  no. 

The  Chairman.  I  wish  you  w^ould  look  at  the  letter  and  see  whethei 
it  is  correct. 

Mr.  Scripps  (examining  newspaper).  Senator,  I  can  not  tell,  be- 
cause I  never  saw  the  original  letter. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  be  on  file  with  the  War  Department? 
Mr.  Scripps.  I  imagine  so. 

The  Chairman.  If  this  letter  is  correct — it  was  given  to  us  as  the 
copy  of  the  letter,  and  we  suppose  it  is  correct — I  have  not  seen  it 
denied — that  he  did  use  his  influence  to  secure  your  exemption  from 
the  Army  service,  or  the  exemption  of  your  brother  from  the  Army 
service,  would  that  make  any  difference  with  you  or  add  to  your  en- 
thusiasm in  this  propaganda  to  help  him? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  Would  you  not  feel  under  some  obligation  to 
render  some  quid  pro  quo  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  I  would  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  would  be  for  him  just  as  enthusiastically? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Certainly. 

The  Chairman.  And  that  exemption  has  nothing  to  do,  then,  with 
your  activities  for  the  election  of  Gov.  Cox  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  On  what  ground  were  you  exempted? 
Mr.  Scripps.  On  occupational  grounds. 
The  Chairman.  As  a  newspaper  man  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  As  a  newspaper  publisher. 

The  Chairman.  And  on  what  ground  was  your  brother  exempted  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  believe  on  the  same  ground. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  file  affidavits  for  exemption  ? 


2462 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScRipps.  Pardon  me. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  file  affidavits  for  exemption  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  did  not;  I  filled  out  a  questionnaire. 

The  Chairman.  Did  anyone  file  affidavits  for  the  exemption  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  believe  so. 

The  Chairman.  Who  did? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Just  what  was  your  work  at  that  time? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  was  editorial  director  of  the  Scripps  papers. 
The  Chairman.  The  same  as  you  are  now  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  your  brother's  work? 
Mr.  Scripps.  My  brother  is  chairman  of  the  board  of  all  these 
corporations. 

The  Chairman.  How  old  is  he? 

Mr.  Scripps.  How  old  was  he  or  is  he  ? 

The  Chairman.  Was  he  at  the  time  of  the  exemption  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Thirty-four,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  And  how  old  were  you  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  In  1917? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  think  I  was  21. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  the  only  boys  in  the  family  ? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  How  long  had  you  been  editorial  director  at  that 
time,  when  you  were  21? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Not  for  a  great  length  of  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  granted  the  exemption  from  the  service? 
Was  it  granted  by  the  local  board  or  the  district  board  ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  do  not  know,  sir.  It  was  not  granted  by  a  local 
board,  I  think. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  it  granted  by  the  district  board — that  is  the 
next  step? 

Mr.  Scripps.  I  think  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  who  was  it  granted  by? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Well,  whoever  the  proper  authority  was. 

Senator  Edge.  If  you  are  the  editorial  director  

Mr.  Scripps  (interposing).  I  think  it  was  granted  by  whoever  was 
acting  for  Gen.  Crowder. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  it  granted  by  the  President  of  the  United 
States? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Not  to  my  knowledge. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  system  of  grant- 
ing exemptions? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Not  a  great  deal ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  the  editorial  director  of  21  prominent  news- 
papers ? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  ask  you.  Is  the  fact  that  your  brother  was 
exempted  from  the  draft  having  anything  to  do  with  your  enthusiasm 
for  Gov.  Cox. 

Mr.  Scripps.  No,  sir;  my  w^hole  interest  in  Gov.  Cox  is  a  public 
interest. 


PEESIDENTIAJL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2463 


The  Chairman.  His  letter — you  have  read  it — refers  directly  to 
your  brother's  exemption? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 
The  Chairman.  You  know  that? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Your  brother  was  in  San  Diego  County  ? 
Mr.  SoRipps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  board  found  against  his  exemption,  did 
it  not? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  The  local  board  did. 
The  Chairman.  In  which  they  said : 

We  believe  it  ^YOuld  be  unfair  to  young  men,  wlio  r.re  making  sacrifices  for 
the  defense  of  their  country,  if  both  sons  of  a  very  wealthy  father  were  given 
deferred  classification,  when  it  is  clearly  possible  that  one  of  them  could  go 
without  affecting  the  support  of  their  family  or  impairing  their  family  fortunes. 

That  was  their  finding.  After  the  California  district  board  af- 
firmed that  action,  was  not  the  case  appealed  to  the  President  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  believe  it  was.  I  am  not  very  familiar  with  the 
facts. 

The  Chairman.  Was  not  the  letter  of  Gov.  Cox  forwarded  to  the 
President  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  know  about  this  exemption  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  No;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  not  know  it  as  it  was  going  on  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  No;  I  was  not  familiar  with  it. 

The  Chairman.  Where  were  you? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  was  in  Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  you  not  interested  in  it? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes,  sir;  but  I  did  not  follow  it  closely.  I  was  in 
camp  part  of  the  time — at  Camp  Sherman. 

Senator  Reed.  They  got  you  into  camp,  and  then  got  you  out? 
Mr,  ScRipPS.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  were  you  in  camp? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  Only  about  10  days  or  so. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  the  papers  get  along  during  that  10  days? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  The  papers  are  still  here. 

Senator  Edge.  Take  your  own  case,  then,  if  you  are  not  familiar 
with  your  brother's  case.    You  registered  from  Ohio,  did  you  not? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  the  local  board  do  in  your  case? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  think  that  they  refused  to  grant  exemption. 
Senator  Edge.  What  did  the  district  board  do  in  your  case  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Took  the  same  action. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  remember  this  report  in  your  own  case  that 
was  handed  down,  part  of  it  in  regard  to  Robert — 

We  find  among  those  who  have  been  associated  with  him  that  he  is  not  im- 
peratively needed  at  a  time  like  this  and  might  well  be  spared  ;o  the  public 
service. 

Do  you  remember  such  a  report  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  No,  sir;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pj)Ge.  Was  that  appealed  to  the  President? 
Mr.  ScRTPPS.  I  believe  so :  A^es. 


2464 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Did  he  reverse  the  decision  of  the  local  and  district 
boards  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  do  not  know  that  he  did,  personally.  I  know  that 
the  authorities  of  the  War  Department  did. 

Senator  Edge.  How  long  were  you  back  from  abroad  before  the 
time  came  for  registration? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  What  do  you  mean,  sir? 

Senator  Edge.  I  heard  you  say  you  had  been  out  of  the  country. 
Were  you  not  out  of  the  country  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  No ;  I  had  been  at  Camp  Sherman. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  you  out  of  the  country  previously  to  the 
registration  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  How  long  before  that  time? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  About  a  year  or  more. 
Senator  Edge.  You  had  been  home  a  yer.r? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes,  sir;  about.    I  am  quoting  from  my  memory.  • 
Senator  Edge.  You  are  not  familiar  at  all  with  the  letter  that  has 

been  referred  to,  written  by  Gov.  Cox  directly  in  the  interest  of  your 

brother,  but  are  only  referring  to  yourself? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  am  not. 

The  Chairman.  Before  you  were  editorial  director  of  these  papers, 
what  were  you  doing  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  was  doing  various  things — newspaper  work,  mostly. 
The  Chairman.  What? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  How  far  back  do  you  want  me  to  go  ? 
The  Chairman.  Just  before. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Just  before ;  I  was  with  my  father  in  California. 
The  Chairman.  How  long  had  you  been  there  ? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  had  been  there  several  months. 
The  Chairman.  Had  you  been  in  Australia  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  were  you  in  Australia,  with  reference  to 
that  time? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  was  in  Australia  during  1916. 
The  Chairman.  A  whole  year? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  No,  sir;  I  did  not  spend  a  year  there. 
The  Chairman.  About  how  long  did  you  spend  there  ? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Two  or  three  months. 
The  Chairman.  Before  that  time  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Before  that  time  I  had  been  traveling  in  the  Pacific. 

The  Chairman.  Not  doing  newspaper  work? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes ;  I  was  doing  some  newspaper  work. 

The  Chairman.  Writing  articles? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  was  writing  articles  and  studying  land  laws  at  that 
time. 

The  Chairman.  Studying  land  laws  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  In  Australia ;  not  in  the  South  Sea  Islands. 

The  Chairman.  I  have  forgotten  what  you  said  about  your  age. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  will  be  25  in  October. 

The  Chairman.  When  the  war  began,  in  1917,  you  were  22  years 
old? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  think  so ;  yes. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2465 


The  Chairman.  How  old  were  you  when  you  were  made  editorial 
director  of  these  enterprises? 
Mr,  ScKipPS.  Twenty-two. 
The  Chairman.  Twenty-two  years  old? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Well,  I  was  made  editorial  director  shortly  after  the 
war  began. 

The  Chairman.  AVho  had  been  editorial  director  before  you? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  The  office  had  been  vacant.  It  was  held  by  my 
brother,  who  died. 

The  Chairman.  Hoav  long  after  the  war  commenced  w^ere  you  made 
editorial  director? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Within  a  very  few  weeks. 

The  Chairman.  After  we  got  into  the  war  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Within  a  few  weeks. 

The  Chairman.  Was  the  appointment  dated  back  in  any  way  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Before  that  time  your  experience  as  a  newspaper 
man  had  been  rather  limited  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  would  not  say  it  had ;  no. 
The  Chairman.  How  extensive  was  it? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  In  1912  I  worked  for  a  year  on  a  newspaper  in  Phila- 
delphia. Previous  to  that  

The  Chairman.  You  were  17  years  old  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  was  16. 

Senator  Reed.  What  were  you  doing  ?   Were  you  a  reporter  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  was  a  reporter  and  circulation  solicitor. 

The  Chairman.  What  other  newspaper  experience  had  you  had  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  had  written  a  good  deal  of  matter  for  our  Cali- 
fornia papers,  and  I  had,  of  course,  been  in  and  out  of  our  office  re- 
porting for  my  brother  and  father  a  great  deal. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  was  your  attorney  in  connection  with  the 
filing  of  the  affidavits,  and  so  forth,  in  your  application  for  ex- 
emption ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Mr.  J.  W.  Curts,  of  Cincinnati  assisted  me  in  fill- 
ing out  a  questionnaire.   That  is  all  that  I  can  recollect. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  Mr.  Thomas  Sidlow  have  anvthing  to  do  with  it 
at  all? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

The  Chairman.  Or  with  your  brother  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  do  not  know,  I  am  sure. 

Senator  Edge.  What  firm  is  Mr.  Thomas  Sidlow  connected  with? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  He  is  connected  with  Baker  &  Hostettler. 

The  Chahjman.  Did  you  have  anything  to  do  with  them  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Not  that  I  know  of,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Employed  in  any  Avay? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  the  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer  one  of  the  Scripps- 
McRae  league? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  No;  it  is  not. 

Senator  Edge.  I  show  my  ignorance  of  the  situation,  possibly. 
Did  3^ou  read  in  the  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer  of  October,  1918 — 3^011 
were  then -back  from  camp — a  denial  from  Gov.  Cox  of  having 
written  a  letter  to  the  President,  Secretary  of  War,  or  to  any  draft 
board  in  your  own  and  your  brother's  case  ? 
182774— 2a— PT  18  4 


2466 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  recall  having  read  such  a  denial. 
The  Chairman.  How  did  the  papers  get  along  without  their 
editorial  director  before  the  war  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  You  mean,  how  did  they  get  along  

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  during  that  time. 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  They  got  along  very  well. 

The  Chairman.  For  how  long  a  period  was  it  that  the  office  was 
not  filled? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  The  office  Avas  not  filled — the  title  was  not  in  ex- 
istence for — I  think  my  brother  died  in  1914  

The  Chairman.  He  had  filled  the  office  ? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes,  sir ;  my  brother  J ohn. 

The  Chairman.  Then  it  was  not  filled  until  you  were  appointed? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  It  Avas  not  filled ;  no. 

The  Chairman.  For  some  three  or  four  years  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  the  paper  could  run  even  without  that 
office  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  It  could  run ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  had  gone  to  war  and  had  not  secured  an 
exemption  it  could  have  run  anyhow  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  though,  my  other  brother  really 
doubled  and  was  responsible  as  editor. 

The  Chairman.  \  our  brother  James  ? 

Mr.  ScRiFPs.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  married,  Mr.  Scripps? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  married  at  the  time  of  the  war? 
Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chair3ian.  Was  you  brother  married? 
Mr,  Scripps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  unable  to  give  us  any  estimate  of  the  cost 
entailed  by  this  propaganda? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Senator,  I  do  not  like  to  have  you  call  it  propaganda. 
The  Chairman.  Well,  what  is  it? 

Mr.  Scripps.  Propaganda  implies  something  which  you  try  to  put 
over  on  somebody,  to  convert  some  one. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  trying  to  convert  people,  are  you  not? 

Mr.  Scripps.  We  are  not  trying  to  convert  anyone  that  is  not  con- 
verted already,  in  the  way  of  editors.  We  send  this  out  telling  them 
frankly  what  it  is,  and  asking  if  they  want  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  trying  to  convert  the  people  by  your  ar- 
guments to  the  Cox  standard.   I  am  not  finding  fault  with  that. 

Mr.  Scripps.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  that  is  propaganda,  is  it  not  ?  I  do  not  mean 
it  in  an  offensive  way. 

Mr.  Scripps.  What  I  want  to  say  is  to  differentiate  between  this 
matter  and  the  obvious  propaganda  that  is  put  out  to  newspapers  all 
over  this  country,  concealed  arguments. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  it  is  not  known  who  has  written  it? 

Mr.  Scripps.  So  it  is  not  known  that  it  is  partisan  matter.  This 
matter  is  frankly  partisan. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2467 


The  Chairman.  AYould  you  call  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Kidge,'' 
if  it  is  put  out  and  the  people  do  not  know  who  is  supplying  it  or 
paying  for  it — would  you  call  that  propaganda  ? 

^Ir.  ScRiPPS.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  would  differentiate  it  in  that  way — because 
the  people  here  know  it  is  coming  from  your  papers. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes,  sir ;  and  why  it  is  being  put  out.  They  ask  for 
it  before  they  get  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  that  there  is  nothing  personal  about 
this — nothing  in  the  way  of  returning  any  favors  Gov.  Cox  has  done 
for  you,  but  purely  in  the  public  interest  that  you  are  doing  it? 

Mr.  'iScRipps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  think  it  is  more  in  the  public  interest  to 
do  this  than  it  is  to  shoulder  a  gun  and  go  out  to  fight  for  your 
country  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  it  is  more  important? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  think  it  is  at  this  time.    I  think  it  was  at 
that  time. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  it  was  at  that  time? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  was  when  they  needed  guns  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  They  needed  newspapers,  too,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  We  need  newspapers  yet,  but  we  needed  guns  and 
newspapers  then. 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  We  needed  both.  I  did  not  consult  my  personal 
preference  in  the  matter.  I  can  tell  you  the  whole  story  if  you  want 
to  know^  it. 

When  I  filed  my  personal  application  I  made  no  claim  on  account 
of  dependents.  I  wrote  into  my  questionnaire  that  I  had  a  wife 
and  expected  a  child,  but  that  neither  of  them  was  dependent  upon 
me  for  support,  or  would  be.  At  the  time  I  was  ordered  to  camp, 
at  the  time  the  appeal  on  account  of  the  industrial  or  occupational 
claim  was  pending,  I  Avas  ordered  to  camp  and  went  to  camp,  and 
at  that  time  I  wrote  a  letter  stating  that  I  wished  to  withdraw  all 
my  claims  that  I  had  made.  I  went  down  to  camp  wjth  the  ex- 
pecation  that  I  would  stay  there.  I  was  rather  surprised  when  I 
did  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  carried  it  through  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  You  could  have  repudiated  it  and  have  gone  in  if 
you  had  wanted  to. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  could  have ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Don't  you  know  and  didn't  you  have  an  understand- 
ing that  your  appeal  was  being  prosecuted  by  some  one  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  know,  probably  it  was,  but  I  don't  know  Avhom.  I 
was  not  consulted  in  the  matter  of  the  appeal. 

Senator  Reed.  Didn't  you  understand  who  it  was  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  this  a  pan  of  milk  on  the  top  shelf  for  you 
when  you  got  it?  Didn't  you  expect  it?  You  knew  the  appeal  had 
been  followed  up? 

Mr.  SoRipps.  I  knew  the  appeal  had  been  followed.  I  heard  it 
talked  of. 


2438 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Eeed.  Who  did  you  hear  talk  about  it  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Various  people.  I  think  it  was  printed  in  the  news- 
papers at  the  time. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  way  you  got  it  ?  Didn't  your  father  or 
your  brother  prosecute  the  appeal? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  know  who  signed  the  appeal.  I  don't  know 
anything  about  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Didn't  you  have  an  understanding  that  the  appeal 
was  being  carried  on  by  your  own  family  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  knew  it  was  going  on. 

Senator  Reed.  By  your  own  folks  ? 

Mr.  Sgrtpps.  And  business  associates;  jes. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  business  associates  or  your  relatives? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all  right.  J  am  trying  to  get  at  how  this 
came  on. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  am  merely  trying  to  tell  you  it  is  no  use  to  ask 
me  who  did  it  or  how  it  was  done  because  I  do  not  know  anything 
about  it. 

Senator  Edge.  You  knew  nothing  about  Gov.  Cox's  intervention 
at  all? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  never  saw  Gov.  Cox's  letter. 

Senator  Reed.  I  assumed  you  had  the  same  kind  of  knowledge 
about  this  matter  that  you  had,  for  instance,  about  many  matters  in 
your  business.  You  do  not  actually  see  them,  but  in  the  course  of 
business  you  learn  of  them.  You  learn  who  is  running  your  papers 
and  know  generally  about  the  business  without  being  there  to  count 
the  papers,  or  anything  of  that  kind.  I  assume  that  you  would 
therefore  know  who  it  was  that  prosecuted  the  appeal  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  knew  the  appeal  had  been  taken. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  it  that  was  carrying  it  on? 

Mr.  ScRTPPS.  1  could  not  say  to  you  who  was  carrying  it  on. 

Senator  Reed.  Wasn't  it  your  father  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  believe  my  father  was  interested  in  it. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  about  the  only  man  who  would  have  an  in- 
terest himself,  isn't  he  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  But  I  do  not  know  this  thing.   No ;  I  do  not  think  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Didn't  you  understand  it  as  time  went  along  ?  I  do 
not  want  to  have  to  summon  a  lot  of  witnesses  here.  I  do  not  know 
vfhether  this  is  important  or  not.  I  do  not  know  what  this  has  to  do 
with  campaign  funds. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Neither  do  I. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  call  you  here,  but  since  you  are  here  on 
the  scene  I  thought  perhaps  3^ou  would  clear  that  matter  up  with  me. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  there  not  a  decided  connection  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  You  can  find  all  that  matter.  The  appeals,  I 
imagine,  are  on  file  and  are  public  property. 

Senator  Edge.  And  the  letters? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  The  letters,  and  the  whole  thing. 

Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  deny  the  authenticity  of  those  letters? 

Mr.  ScRipPs.  No ;  not  at  all.  I  do  not  question  the  authenticity  of 
anything. 

The  Chairman.  The  Cincinnati  board  passed  on  your  case  and 
then  it  was  appealed  to  the  President.    You  knew  that? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2469 


Mr.  ScRipPS.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  President  reA^ersed  the  action  of  the 
board,  did  he  not  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  do  not  know  that  the  President  did.  I  know  the 
authorities  in  Washington  did. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  other  authority  in  Washington  than 
the  President? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  believe  there  are  other  men  around  here  drawing 
salaries  in  the  War  Department. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  when  the  decision  of  the  President 
reached  the  draft  board  in  Ohio — about  October  9  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  recall  the  date. 

The  Chairman.  Did  3^011  receive  any  word  from  Gov.  Cox  about 
leaving  Camp  Sherman  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  No.  The  first  word  I  received  was  from  the  captain 
in  charge  of  my  company. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  he  receive  it  direct  from  the  governor  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  was  your  captain  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  forget  his  name. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  papers  are  all  very  earnestly  advocating  the 
League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  ScRTPPS.  They  have  been  since  the  idea  was  proposed. 

Senator  Reed.  Before  that  you  were  adA^ocating  the  doctrine  of 
peace  and  pacifism  as  it  is  commonly  called  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  At  what  time  do  you  mean  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Before  we  got  into  the  war. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  No ;  Ave  were  adA^ocates  of  preparedness. 

Senator  Reed.  When  Avere  you  adA^ocates  of  preparedness? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  During  the  European  war. 

Senator  Reed.  But  before  that,  before  the  war?  I  am  asking  just 
for  information. 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  When  you  speak  of  the  Avar  I  thought  you  meant 
before  we  got  in  the  Avar. 

Senator  Reed.  No;  I  meant  before  the  European  w^ar,  before  Ave 
got  into  the  European  war,  while  the  Avar  was  on,  did  you  advocate 
preparedness  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  If  nobody  went  Ave  would  not  get  very  well  pre- 
pared. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Before  that,  before  this  menace  of  an  actual  war 
occurred,  were  not  your  papers  the  advocates  of  what  is  generally 
termed  pacifism — that  is,  world  disarmament  and  world  peace  and 
the  doctrine  that  a  lot  of  good  men  were  preaching  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  We  were  not  pacifists ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  want  to  use  that  term. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  You  mean  before  the  war  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Before  the  war  began  there  were  a  number  of  gen- 
tlemen, some  of  them  very  fine  gentlemen,  Avho  went  about  over  the 
country  preaching  the  doctrine  that  there  Avere  never  to  be  any  more 
wars  nor  any  more  trouble;  that  it  Avas  the  business  of  the  Avorld  just 
to  disarm,  and  everything  was  going  to  be  all  right.  They  have  been 
generally  termed  pacifists.   I  do  not  use  it  in  any  offensive  sense  at 


2470 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


all  in  asking  you  the  question,  but  were  not  your  papers  inclined  to 
take  that  view  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not  believe  so.  I  know  my  father,  who  is  the  head 
of  the  concern,  or  w^as  when  he  was  active,  has  never  been. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  any  of  your  subscribers  to  the  N.  E.  A.  shown 
any  resentment  at  all  at  having  this  particular  service  sent  to  them  or 
expressed  any  displeasure  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPP.  Not  that  I  know  of.  You  understand  this  is  only  sent 
to  papers  who  ask  to  have  it  sent. 

Senator  Edge.  I  so  understood.  You  have  not  heard  from  any  of 
the  newspapers  who  are  regular  subscribers  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  have  not  heard ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  whether  the  concern  has  heard  ? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  do  not  know ;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  want  to  take  your  time,  but  won't  you  make 
out  and  file  a  list  of  the  Scripps-McRae  papers  and  where  they  are 
located  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  can  do  that. 

The  Chairman.  And  also  the  70  other  papers. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  have  such  a  list  that  I  can  prepare  for  you. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  do  that  and  hand  it  to  us  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  How  soon  do  you  want  it  ? 

The  Chairman.  When  will  it  be  convenient  to  produce  it  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  can  produce  it  to-morrow. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask  a  question  or  two.  The  memo- 
randum from  which  the  chairman  of  the  subcommittee  read  said  that 
the  order  refusing  to  exempt  you  from  the  service  was  reversed  by 
the  President.  Do  you  know  whether  this  matter  ever  came  to  the 
President's  personal  attention  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  remember  there  was  some  statement  in  the 
press,  speaking  of  the  press  generally,  to  the  effect  that  he  knew 
nothing  about  it  and  it  had  not  come  to  his  attention  ? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Do  I  recall  such  a  statement  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  No ;  I  do  not  recall  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  With  regard  to  the  policy  of  your  papers,  let 
me  ask  a  question  or  two.  You  are  now  advocating  the  election  of 
Gov.  Cox.   You  are  receiving  no  money  consideration  for  that? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  None  wha.tever. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are  doing  that  for  what  you  believe  to  be 
for  the  public  interest  as  you  see  it  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  at  the  present  time  no  other  motive 
in  mind  than  to  serve  the  public  as  you  see  it  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  That  is  it  exactly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all  I  care  to  inquire. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  think  I  have  said  that  this  was  frankly  partisan.  I 
would  like  to  correct  the  statement.  I  did  not  mean  it  is  partisan. 
That  is  not  our  theory  of  supporting  Gov.  Cox.  Our  theory  of  sup- 
porting Gov.  Cox  is  the  general  theory  of  progressive  policy  or  prog- 
ress in  politics.  We  supported  with  all  our  resources  a  candidate  for 
the  Republican  national  convention.  We  have  supported  Republican 
Senators  or  senatorial  candidates  in  the  primaries. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2471 


The  Chairman.  Whom  did  you  support  for  President  in  the  pri- 
maries? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  In  the  Republican  primaries  ? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  We  supported  Hoover.  Personally  Mr.  Hoover  was 
my  first  choice  for  nomination  and  Hiram  Johnson  second. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  support  Hoover  as  the  prospective  nominee 
of  the  Republican  or  the  Democratic  Party  ? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Of  the  Republican  Party.  ^  He  left  no  doubt  of  that 
after  a  very  few  days. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  in  the  interest  of  the  Republican  Party? 

Mr.  ScRi  PS.  It  was  in  the  interest  of  the  American  people. 

Senator  Edge.  I  wanted  to  get  your  version  of  it. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  Xo ;  we  are  not  interested  in  either  party. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  really  nonpartisan? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  But  progressive? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  That  is  our  theory;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  I  believe  that  is  all. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  May  I  present  some  information?  I  have  a  letter 
that  came  to  my  attention  before  I  left  Cleveland  late  yesterday.  It 
was  handed  to  me.  It  was  sent  to  the  Press  and  I  think  it  will  inter- 
est you  gentlemen.    Among  other  things  

The  Chairman  (interposing).  Do  you  want  to  present  this  as 
evidence  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  would  like  to  present  it  as  a  lead  and  for  your 
benefit.  It  is  a  very  interesting  letter.  Among  other  things,  it 
states  that  the  Democrats  are  raising  $30,000,000. 

The  Chairman.  The  Democrats  are? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  That  is  what  the  letter  says. 

Senator  Edge.  That  would  be  too  shocking. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  where  they  have  that  mone}^? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  realize  that  just  wild  statements  we  do  not 
want. 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  This  is  a  signed  letter,  and  I  think  it  will  interest 
you. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  by  some  responsible  person? 
Senator  Reed.  We  can  look  at  it. 

The  Chairman.  Submit  it  to  the  committee  for  their  considera- 
tion. 

Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes,  it  bears  a  signature  and  bears  some  responsible 
names  on  it.  Who  the  person  is  I  do  not  know.  I  want  to  state 
before  I  present  this  that  I  have  not  as  yet  located  the  gentleman  who 
signs  the  letter. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  very  prominent  man  ? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  He  is  associated  with  some  prominent  men,  accord- 
ing to  his  own  statements.  [Witness  handed  paper  to  the  chairman.] 
There  are  several  men  named  there  whom  you  could  call  and  find 
out. 

Senator  Edge.  We  have  followed  all  kinds  of  blind-alley  leads; 
we  might  as  well  look  into  that. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  take  this  into  consideration. 
Mr.  S'cRiPPS.  I  am  publishing  the  letter. 


2472 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Without  knowing  who  signs  it  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  I  am  investigating  it.    I  will  publish  it  when  I  find 
out  who  it  is. 

The  Chairman.  You  will  not  publish  it  until  you  know  who 
signs  it? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  Not  until  I  find  out  who  it  is. 
The  Chairman.  Have  you  given  orders  to  publish  it  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  No ;  I  have  given  orders  to  find  out  who  the  man  is. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Your  papers,  I  believe,  supported  Wilson  in 
1912,  did  they  not? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  In  1912  and  in  1916. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  had  charge  of  the  matter  of  reviewing 
the  work  of  the  various  draft  boards  here  in  Washington  ? 
Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  do  not  know  the  man's  name. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Was  it  Gen.  Crowder? 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  imagine  Gen.  Crowder  was  the  responsible  officer. 
Senator  Pomerene.  He  is  a  Republican,  is  he  not  ? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  have  heard  he  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  immediately  under  him  was  Maj.  Warren, 
of  Detroit? 

Mr.  ScRipps.  I  have  heard  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  is  a  Republican? 

Mr.  ScRipPS.  I  believe  he  is  prominent  in  the  Republican  Party. 
Senator  Pomerene.  A  member  of  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee from  Michigan,  or  was? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  So  I  have  heard. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  mean  to  say  that  you  had  information  that 
the  Democratic  national  committee  is  raising  $30,000,000? 

Mr.  ScRTPPS.  No;  I  merely  said  I  had  a  letter  that  stated  among 
other  things  that  the  Democratic  Party  had  $30,000,000,  or  was  rais- 
ing it. 

The  Chairman.  If  3^ou  can  tell  them  where  it  is,  I  am  sure  they  will 
be  obliged  to  you. 

Mr.  ScRiPPS.  I  think  so,  too. 

Senator  Reed.  What  became  of  the  top  part  of  this  letter? 
Mr.  ScRipPS.  It  has  been  clipped  off.    It  was  sent  in  just  in  that 
shape. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  way  you  received  it? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  Yes;  and  I  brought  it  along  for  anything  you  can 
make  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Where  was  it  sent  from  ? 
Mr.  ScRipps.  It  is  dated  Massilon,  Ohio. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  DON  C.  FEES. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Fees,  we  have  asked  to  have  subpoenaed  the 
gentleman  who  had  charge  of  the  vouchers  for  the  months  of  July 
and  August  in  the  Department  of  Justice,  and  I  understand  you 
have  come  in  his  place  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  charge  of  those  vouchers? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2473 


The  Chairman.  We  have  asked  for  vouchers  as  to  certain  men. 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairjian.  Have  you  brought  those  here  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  produce  them  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir  [handing  papers  to  the  chairman]. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  generally  carry  on  the  same  plan  as  the 
Department  of  Agriculture?  Are  the  vouchers  in  the  different  de- 
partments about  the  same?  I  am  asking  that  in  order  to  get 
acquainted  with  your  method. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say  as  to  that.  I  am  not  familiar  with  the 
Department  of  Agriculture  methods  of  handling  these. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  travel  from  your  department  on  Govern- 
ment orders  ?  For  instance,  if  a  man  wants  to  go  to  Chicago,  does  he 
buy  a  ticket  or  does  he  have  a  Government  order  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  In  the  majority  of  cases  they  have  a  Government  order. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Frank  K.  Nebeker? 

Mr.  Fees.  Assistant  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  Located  in  Washington? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  presented  two  vouchers  concerning  his 
expense  account  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  From  those  vouchers  it  appears  that  on  June 
8  he  left  Washington,  went  to  Salt  Lake  City  and  from  Salt  Lake 
City  to  San  Francisco,  arriving  there,  if  these  vouchers  are  correct, 
on  the  20th  of  June.  Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Then  you  present  another  voucher  showing  his 
departure  from  San  Francisco  on  July  7 — an  item  of  25  cents  for 
the  hotel  porter. 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is  the  time  he  left. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  time  of  arrival? 

Mr.  Fees.  The  time  of  arrival  will  be  noted  here  [indicating]. 
He  arrived  there  on  June  20. 

The  Chairman.  And  left  there  on  July  7? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  has  he  been  Assistant  Attorney  Gen- 
eral? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  can  not  say  definitely.  I  should  judge  Avell  on  to  a 
year. 

The  Chairman.  Judging  from  these  vouchers  he  was  in  San  Fran- 
cisco 17  days? 

Mr.  Fees.  About  that. 

The  Chairman.  These  vouchers  do  not  include  his  railroad  fare  ? 

Mr  Fees.  They  are  shown  under  the  memorandum  of  travel  on 
page  3  of  the  voucher. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  yes;  I  see. 

Mr.  Fees.  He  traveled  on  Government  orders. 

The  Chairman.  He  traveled  on  Government  orders  from  Washing- 
ton to  Salt  Lake  City  and  then  from  Salt  Lake  City  to  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Sixty-eight  dollars  to  Salt  Lake  City,  but  there 
does  not  appear  to  be  any  amount  stated  from  there  on. 


2474 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Fees.  Where  the  amounts  are  not  stated,  they  are  checked  up 
on  the  transportation  accounts  when  they  come  in.  The  amounts  are 
verified  from  the  railroad  company's  bill  with  the  transportation 
order. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  some  conference  going  on  in  San  Fran- 
cisco of  the  district  attorneys  or  officers  of  the  Department  of  Justice 
about  that  time? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  there  at  San  Francisco  of  any  particu- 
lar importance  at  that  time  ?  As  a  matter  of  ancient  history,  was  not 
the  Democratic  convention  going  on  there  about  that  time  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  was. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Palmer  was  a  candidate  for  President.  Was 
Mr.  Nebeker  one  of  his  supporters  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  suppose  he  was. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  any  legal  business  that  made  it 
necessary  to  go  to  San  Francisco — for  the  Assistant  Attorney  Gen- 
eral to  go  ?   \  oil  probably  would  not  be  familiar  with  that,  however  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  would  not  be  familiar  unless  it  Avas  shown  on  the 
account. 

The  Chairman.  The  Democratic  convention  being  there  and  Mr. 
Nebeker  being  there  at  Government  expense  was  merely  a  coincident, 
I  suppose  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  never  thought  much  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  These  coincidences  seemed  quite  common  out 
there.  This  voucher  shows  taxicab  to  the  station  at  Washington,  $1 ; 
station  porter,  25  cents ;  Pullman  porter,  25  cents ;  station  porter,  Chi- 
cago, 25  cents.  You  recognize  these  items,  perhaps,  as  I  read  them. 
Cab  to  hotel,  80  cents ;  hotel  porter,  arrival  at  Chicago,  25  cents ;  de- 
parture porter,  25  cents;  cab  to  station,  80  cents;  station  porter  25 
cents;  Pullman  porter.  Salt  Lake  City,  night  of  June  10-11,  50  cents; 
station  porter,  25  cents ;  taxi  to  Alta  Club.  Was  there  a  meeting  at 
the  Alta  Club  of  some  Federal  officials  about  judicial  matters,  do  you 
know? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  Alta  Club? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  $1.  Porter  at  the  Alta  Club  arriving, 
25  cents;  porter,  Alta  Club  departing,  25  cents;  taxi  to  station,  $1; 
station  porter,  25  cents;  Pullman  porter,  San  Francisco,  50  cents; 
station  porter,  San  Francisco,  25  cents ;  taxi  to  hotel,  $1 ;  hotel  porter, 
25  cents;  per  diem  in  lieu  of  subsistence,  June  8  to  June  23,  inclusive, 
15  days,  at  $4,  $60.   Now,  you  know  nothing  about  his  business  there? 

Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Departing  from  San  Francisco,  July  7,  it  seems 
that  the  hotel  porter  secured  another  25  cents;  cab  to  station,  $1; 
station  porter,  25  cents;  Pullman  porter,  Chicago,  75  cents;  and  so 
on  doAvn  to  W^ashington,  arriving  at  Washington  4.30  p.  m.,  July  7, 
What  was  the  date  of  the  Democratic  convention,  do  you  remember? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  can  not  tell  you  definitely. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  date  of  Gov.  Cox's  nomination  out 
there,  do  you  remember  J 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2475 


The  Chairman.  Per  diem  in  lieu  of  subsistence,  first  and  second, 
at  $4,  $8 ;  annual  leave  July  3,  4,  5,  6,  per  diem  July  7,  8,  and  9.  What 
does  that  mean,  "  annual  leave  "  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  means  he  was  not  on  official  business,  but  he  was 
taking  leave. 

The  Chairman.  But  charging  it  up  to  the  Government  when  he 
was  not  on  official  business  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  No  ;  it  means  he  was  not  charging  it  up.  I  do  not  think 
you  will  find  any  expenses  charged  on  those  dates. 

The  Chairman.  July  3,  4,  5,  and  6  annual  leave  when  nothing,  was 
charged. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  think  you  will  find  any  expenses  charged  on 
those  dates. 

The  Chairman.  Per  diem,  July  7,  8,  and  9.  He  was  on  official  duty, 
then? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir ;  and  that  is  what  it  states  there. 

The  Chairman.  Annual  leave  July  10  and  11;  nothing  charged 
there.  Per  diem  July  12  and  13,  two  days.  So  part  of  the  time  he 
was  on  official  duty  and  part  of  the  time  he  was  not,  on  this  trip? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  the  voucher  means? 

Mr.  Fees.  According  to  the  face  of  the  voucher. 

The  Chairman.  Then  there  were  some  annual  leaves.  What  are 
these  annual  leaves  when  a  man  is  not  on  official  duty  ? 

Senator  Reed.  They  are  entitled  under  the  law  to  so  many  days 
each  year. 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir ;  30  days. 

Senator  Reed.  Some  of  them  instead  of  taking  the  whole  30  days 
at  once  may  take  the  30  days  in  broken  intervals  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  if  a  man  wants  to  take  a  trip  to  San  Francisco 
he  can  take  part  of  the  time  part  of  the  way  as  official  business  and 
part  of  the  way  not  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  In  doing  that  the  transportation,  if  any,  was  used  on 
personal  business  and  not  on  official  business,  would  be  paid  by  him 
personally. 

The  Chairman.  Where  will  we  find  out  whether  any  part  of  this 
transportation  was  paid  personally  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  None  of  the  transportation  on  that  trip  was  paid  per- 
sonally. 

The  Chairman.  Although  your  voucher  states  that  part  of  the 
time  he  was  not  on  official  business  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  As  indicated  by  the  voucher,  he  went  there  on  official 
business,  transacted  the  official  business,  and  for  some  reason  or  other 
not  known  to  me  he  took  a  few  days  leave  of  absence,  and  then  it  ap- 
pears he  transacted  official  business  after  he  had  his  leave  of  absence. 

The  Chairman.  The  transaction  of  official  business  you  take  from 
the  statement  on  the  voucher? 

Mr.  Fees.  We  know  nothing  about  it  except  what  the  voucher 
shows. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  at  the  Department  of  Justice  during 
the  Democratic  National  Convention? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Where  were  you? 


2476 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Fees.  I  was  on  vacation. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  any  assistants  were  left  at 
the  Department  of  Justice  during  the  convention? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say ;  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  were  you  on  your  vacation?  Where  did 
you  go? 

Mr.  Fees.  Nebraska. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  get  out  to  San  Francisco  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  it  customary  for  attaches  of  the  department  to 
take  their  vacation  in  this  way — after  the  Government  has  paid  their 
transportation  to  a  distant  point,  to  then  take  the  vacation  at  that 
distant  point? 

Mr.  Fees.  No  ;  I  would  not  say  it  was  customary. 

The  Chairman.  Had  Mr.  Nebeker  been  out  to  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say  until  I  looked  up  the  records. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  what  your  records  may  show? 

Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  any  important  conference  out 
there  at  that  time? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Any  important  litigation  that  the  department  was 

concerned  in? 

Mr.  Fees.  There  is  a  good  deal  of  litigation  on  the  coast.  I  have 
not  kept  close  track  of  it.  The  only  way  I  am  acquainted  with  that 
is  through  the  accounts  or  what  appears  on  the  face  of  the  accounts. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  E.  P.  Stewart? 

Mr.  Fees.  He  is  an  Assistant  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  He  seems  to  have  been  called  West,  too,  about  that 
time. 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  left  Washington  about  June  10,  according  to 
your  voucher? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  A  few  of  the  items  show  that  he  paid  for  baggage 
to  station  at  Washington,  leaving  Washington  at  6.10  p.  m.  June  10. 
He  seems  to  have  gone  to  Seattle,  reaching  Seattle  around  June  20, 
leaving  Seattle  June  20  for  San  Francisco.  Was  that  the  quickest 
way  to  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Fees.  As  I  understand  it,  he  had  official  business  in  Seattle, 
Wash. 

The  Chairman.  He  reached  there  June  20  and  according  to  this 
voucher  left  on  June  20.  Do  you  know  what  business  there  was  at 
Seattle? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  remember,  but  I  think  it  is  stated  in  his  ac- 
count. 

The  Chairman.  It  must  have  been  important  business.  You  think 
he  went  across  the  Continent  to  Seattle  for  the  one  day  at  Seattle? 
Oh,  that  is  not  a  fair  question  to  ask  you.  Then  he  seems  to  have  ar- 
rived at  San  Francisco  on  June  22,  charging  up  these  expenses  to 
the  Government.  What  did  they  need  two  Assistant  Attorneys 
General  out  there  for? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  The  result  shows  they  needed  more  than  that. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN"  EXPENSES. 


2477 


The  Chairman.  Had  you  ever  known  two  Assistant  Attorneys 
General  to  go  out  there  before  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  have  no  idea  Avhy  the  two  of  them  went. 

The  Chairman.  Hotel  Taylor  conference  with  special  assistant 
United  States  attorney  relative  to  Seattle  shipyard  case.  He  was 
there  at  San  Francisco  on  the  shipyard  cases,  evidently.  So  that  this 
Assistant  Attorney  General  has  charged  up  to  the  Government  his 
railroad  fare  to  Seattle  and  San  Francisco  and  back  to  Washington 
and  his  expenses? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Another  coincidence  showing  the  way  the  people's 
money  is  spent.   Who  is  Mr.  Montross? 

Mr.  Fees.  He  is  general  secretary  for  the  Attorney  General. 
The  Chairman.  Just  what  is  his  position? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  think  he  is  listed  as  examiner  of  titles  or  assistant 
examiner  of  titles. 

The  Chairzsian.  In  what  office? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say  now. 

The  Chairman.  Where  did  he  come  from ;  do  you  know  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  State  is  he  from? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  has  he  been  here? 

Mr.  Fees.  Between  two  and  three  years,  as  I  remember  it.  I  could 
not  say  exactly. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  last  year  can  you  tell  us  how  many  new 
employees  have  been  added  to  the  rolls  of  the  Department  of  Justice  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  this  man  connected  with  the  Department  of 
Justice? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  indeed. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  examiner  of  titles  in  the  Department  of 
Justice  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Either  examiner  or  assistant  examiner.  I  think  the 
voucher  shows. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  assistant  examiner  of  titles.  He  seems  to 
have  left  Washington  about  June  20  for  San  Francisco. 

Mr.  Fees.  He  only  traveled  with  the  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  Then  I  notice  "  Harrisburg,  Pa.,  to  San  Francisco, 
Pullman,  $57.70."  Is  that  the  Pullman  fare  from  Harrisburg  to 
San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Fees.,  If  it  is  there  in  the  account,  it  is. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  have  a  special  car  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  mean  to  tell  us  that  is  the  ordinary 
Pullman  charge  from  Harrisburg  to  San  Francisco  ?  He  had  a  com- 
partment, possibly. 

Mr.  Fees.  The  transportation  clerk  handles  those.  I  could  not 
say. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  a  drawing-room? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  suppose  it  was  a  drawing-room  or  compartment. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  important  business  at  San  Fran- 
cisco that  took  this  examiner  of  titles  out  there  riding  in  a  drawing- 
room? 


2478 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Fees.  He  goes  with  the  Attorney  General  and  acts  as  his  secre- 
tary when  the  Attorney  General  is  away  from  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  he  went  with  the  Attorney 
General  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  am  sure  he  did. 

Senator  Reed.  And  did  they  have  this  drawing-room  together  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  He  very  seldom  does  any  traveling  alone. 
The  Chairman.  Did  they  have  the  drawing-room  together? 
Mr-  Fees.  I  could  not  say  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  Does  the  Attorney  General  have  an  account  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  ever  remember  seeing  one  for  him.  There 
might  one  have  been  passed  when  I  was  out  of  the  city. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  traveling  fund  for  the  use  of  the 
Attorney  General  for  which  no  accounting  need  be  made  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Oh,  no.   He  has  to  account. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  pass  through  your  hands? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Montross  seems  to  have  left  San  Francisco  July 
6,  to  New  York  City,  Pullman  $131.  He  must  have  had  more  than 
a  drawing-room  coming  back.  How  do  you  account  for  that?  Did 
you  O.  K.  that,  Mr.  Fees? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  suppose  that  was  a  drawing-room. 

The  Chairman.  Does  a  drawing-room  cost  that  through  to  New 
York  for  one  person  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know  whether  a  drawing-room  cost  the  same 
for  one  person  as  for  two  or  three. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  any  part  of  your  duty  to  investigate  these 
matters  when  they  come  in,  or  do  you  just  pass  them  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Do  you  mean  as  to  the  correctness  of  the  charge  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  for  instance,  a  charge  is  presented  for  $131 
for  Pullman  fare  from  San  Francisco  to  New  York.  Did  you  just 
accept  that,  or  is  that  any  part  of  your  duty? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  charge  was  not  paid  in  that  instance  in  an  expense 
account.  That  was  made  on  Government  order,  and  I  do  not  know 
whether  the  Pullman  Co.  has  billed  that  order  or  not,  but  when  they 
bill  it  it  will  be  audited  and  referred  to  the  auditor  for  final  payment. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  get  the  order  in  your  department  show- 
ing whether  it  is  paid  or  not  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  tell  whether  it  has  been  paid  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  It  has  been  charged. 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is  not  a  charge. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  a  memorandum  of  travel  performed  upon 
transportation  request. 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is  merely  added  to  that  account  to  connect  up  the 
other  items  of  expense. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  as  bearing  on  transportation 
charges,  don't  you  know  a  drawing-room  requires  two  full  tickets  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  never  went  into  that  question. 

Senator  Edge.  Don't  you  think  it  is  your  duty  to  go  into  that  ques- 
tion if  you  are  auditing  charges  of  men  who  present  such  an  item? 

The  Chairman.  The  next  item  mav  touch  on  that.  San  Francisco 
to  Washington,  D.  C,  $109.38.    What  is  that? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is  transportation. 

The  Chairman.  His  personal  transportation? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2479 


Mr.  Fees.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Here  is  an  item — BuiFalo,  N.  Y.,  to  New  York 
City,  $11.89.  What  has  that  to  do  with  the  Democratic  convention  at 
8an  Francisco? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  don't  know  that  it  has  anything  to  do  with  it.  I  don't 
think  it  did  have  anything  to  do  with  it.  This  is  a  memorandum 
simply  to  connect  up  these  other  items,  but  it  is  sworn  to  the  same 
as  the  rest  of  the  voucher. 

The  Chairman.  Has  this  been  SAVorn  to  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Keed.  That  has  been  audited  and  sworn  to,  and  then  what 
is  done  with  the  paper? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  is  an  account,  and  it  is  paid  by  the  disbursing  clerk 
and  referred  to  the  auditor  for  final  audit. 

Senator  Keed.  When  this  is  made  out  it  goes  to  the  disbursing  clerk 
and  the  disbursing  clerk  pays  it? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  is  in  fact  an  order  for  money.  Then,  after 
the  paper  has  passed  and  the  money  has  been  paid,  there  is  an  auditor 
who  checks  it  over? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  he  check  it  to  see  whether  the  items  are  cor- 
rect or  does  he  merely  audit  it  as  a  bill  that  has  been  presented,  duly 
voucherecl,  and  paid  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  He  checks  every  way  he  can  check  it ;  in  any  way. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  that  when  people  travel  in  drawing- 
rooms,  they  have  to  have  t^^o  tickets  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Taking  that  piece  of  paper  before  you  and  taking 
the  charge  of  railroad  fare,  does  that  appear  to  cover  two  tickets  or 
one? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  will  see  what  the  memorandum  states  on  that.  It  does 
not  shoAV  on  the  memorandum,  but  the  original  Government-  order 
that  was  issued  for  this  transportation  Avill  show. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  has  that  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  may  have  been  paid.  If  it  has  been  paid,  it  has  been 
referred  to  the  auditor.  If  it  has  not  been  paid,  the  Pullman  Co. 
still  holds  it. 

Senator  Edge.  This  voucher  is  made  out — correct  me  if  I  am  mis- 
taken— to  George  K.  Montross,  Department  of  Justice,  for  reimburse-  - 
ment  of  traveling  expenses  incurred  and  paid  as  per  itemized  schedule 
annexed  of  account  of  travel  with  Attorney  General  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  tell  us  whether  that  does  not  cover  the 
entire  expense  for  the  drawing-rooms  probably  occupied  by  both 
these  gentlemen? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say  utitil  I  looked  up  the  transportation 
account  which  this  request  has  been  or  will  be  billed. 

Senator  Reed.  Could  you  look  it  up  and  find  out  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  the  complete  total  of  that  voucher  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  $74.91. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  not  the  one ;  the  chairman  was  reading  one 
hundred  and  some  dollars. 


2480 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Fees.  You  understand,  these  requests  are  billed  in  by  the  Pull- 
man Co.  and  are  not  claimed  by  the  person  who  made  the  travel. 

Senator  Eeed.  What  is  the  total,  including  what  the  -Pullman  Co. 
claims,  the  railroad  fare,  and  everything  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Add  it  up  and  give  it  to  us  in  the  record. 

Mr.  Fees.  $324.25. 

Senator  Kenyon.  What  is  that;  just  the  one? 
Mr.  Fees.  That  is  this  one  account. 
The  CHAikMAN.  About  one  $500  Liberty  bond. 
Senator  Edge.  I'hat  covers,  as  1  understand  it,  from  July  1  to 
July  16?   Is  that  correct? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  To  San  Francisco  and  return  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  No  ;  that  would  be  from  San  Francisco  to  Washington — 
from  San  Francisco  to  New  York  City  and  Washington  and  Buffalo 
to  New  York  City. 

Senator  Eeed.  When  did  they  start  ? 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  see  that  [referring  to  voucher].  June  20 
they  arrived  at  San  Francisco. 

Senator  Eeed.  It  shows  down  here  when  they  left— July  6.  This 
is  the  trip  back,  then? 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  trip  back.  What  is  this  item  of  July 
15,  Buffalo  to  New  York  City?  That  is  an  entirely  separate  trip, 
I  take  it  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Well,  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  what  that  is  ?  I  wish  you  would 
check  that  up,  because  if  it  is  from  July  -6  to  July  15  it  would  not 
take  that  much  time  to  come  from  San  Francisco  to  Washington. 

Mr.  Fees.  They  might  have  come  around  that  way,  but  I  would 
have  to  check  that  up. 

The  Chairman.  Look  that  up  and  see  what  that  Buffalo  voucher 
means.  A  man  could  not  have  been  traveling  on  two  trains  at  the 
same  time,  even  if  he  was  coming  from  the  Democratic  convention. 

Mr.  Fees.  You  will  find  that  the  items  in  there  are  correct  as  far 
as  the  charges  are  concerned. 

The  Chairman.  The  charges  are  correct? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  allowance  made  when  men  are  travel- 
ing as  to  their  expenses?  For  instance,  I  notice  here  on  the  25th, 
Mr.  Montrose,  lunch  $1.70,  dinner  $2.  Is  there  any  limit  as  to  what 
a  man  can  spend  for  his  dinner  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  His  actual  expenses,  lodging  and  subsistence,  to  a  maxi- 
mum of  $5  a  day. 

The  Chairman.  That  is,  when  on  official  business  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  regulation  there  as  to  what  they  shall 
be  allowed  when  they  are  attending  Democratic  national  conventions  ? 

Senator  Eeed.  What  is  the  total  of  the  money  spent  by  Mr.  Nebeker 
on  this  trip  to  San  Francisco  and  return  and  the  money  spent  by  Mr. 
Stewart  on  the  trip  to  San  Francisco  and  return  ? 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  just  figure  that  up,  including  the  rail- 
road fare  and  the  Pullman? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2481 


Mr.  Fees.  Well,  I  can  not  give  that  to  you,  because  the  amount  of 
the  transportation  billed  on  transportation  requests  has  not  been  en- 
tered in  the  voucher. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  give  us  everything  but  the  transporta- 
tion ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  look  up  the  transportation  and  get  that 
for  us  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir ;  provided  it  has  been  billed. 
Senator  Reed.  Will  you  look  that  up? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  it  now,  exclusive  of  transportation? 

Mr.  Fees.  $103.15. . 

Senator  Pomekene.  Who  is  that  ? 

Mr.  P^EES.  Frank  K.  Nebeker. 

The  Chairman.  Those  are  his  expenses  outside  of  transportation. 
Senator  Reed.  You  have  Pullman  bills  that  amount  to  more  than 
that. 

The  Chair3ian.  Xot  on  that ;  that  is  Montrose. 

Senator  Reed.  What  I  am  trying  to  get  at  is  all  of  the  expenses  of 
these  parties  that  have  been  mentioned — Montrose,  Nebeker,  and 
Stewart. 

.   Mr.  Fees.  I  can  not  giA  e  those  to  you  now  on  the  data  I  have  here. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  give  them  to  us,  all  except  the  railroad 
fare^ 

Mr.  Fees.  All  except  railroad  and  Pullman. 

Senator  Reed.  You  can  give  us  the  Pullman  on  one  of  them,  can 
you  not? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  can  not  say  it  Avould  be  correct,  because  what  they 
enter  here  on  this  memorandum  might  not  be  the  correct  rate  as 
billed  by  the  company  or  determined  by  the  auditor. 

Senator  Reed.  Give  us  what  they  ask  for;  that  Avill  do  just  as 
well. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  probably  what  they  got,  is  it  not? 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  what  they  individually  take  an  affidavit  to 
as  being  the  amount  due  them  or  due  the  company  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  As  due  them. 

Senator  Edge,  Due  them  if  they  advanced  it? 

^Ir.  Fees.  They  make  an  affidavit  to  the  effect  that  they  used  these 
requests  in  making  this  travel,  but  they  do  not  swear  to  the  amounts 
to  be  charged  against  these  requests.  [After  making  some  calcu- 
lations] The  expenses  of  Mr.  Montrose  from  Washington  to  San 
Francisco  and  return  totaled  $521.07. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  that  clearly.  Does  that  include  railroad 
and  Pullman? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  includes  railroad  and  Pullman,  as  shown  by  this 
memorandum.  That  will  include  some  charges  for  the  Attorney 
General. 

Frank  K.  Nebeker,  $103.15. 

The  Chairman.  That  does  not  include  railroad  and  Pullman? 
Mr.  Fees.  That  is  exclusive  of  railroad  and  Pullman. 
The  Chairman.  You  will  furnish  us  with  that  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  will  furnish  that. 


182774— 20— PT  18  5 


2482 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Now,  the  other  gentleman — Mr.  Stewart  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  R.  P.  Stewart,  $104.25,  which  is  exclusive  of  Pullman 
and  railroad  fare. 

The  Chairman.  Which  you  will  furnish  us?  In  that  connection 
we  will  ask  you  also  to  furnish  the  expense  account  of  the  Attorney 
General  for  June  and  July  of  this  year. 

Mr.  Fees.  If  he  has  submitted  one. 

Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  know  Avhether  he  has  submitted  one  at 
this  time? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know ;  no,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  J.  Edgar  Hoover? 

Mr.  Fees.  Special  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  Located  in  Washington  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  special  assistants  to  the  Attorney 
General  are  there  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  could  not  say. 

The  Chairman.  But  you  have  some  idea  from  the  vouchers  pass- 
ing through  your  hands  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  No ;  I  do  not  believe  I  could  say. 

The  Chairman.  Has  the  number  of  special  assistants  to  the 
Attorney  General  increased  this  spring  and  summer? 

Mr.  Fees.  Well,  I  have  been  aw^ay  most  of  the  spring  and  summer,, 
and  I  would  not  want  to  say.    I  have  been  out  of  touch  with  the 
department. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  business  of  this  Assistant  Attornej^ 
General,  Mr.  Hoover  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  think  he  is  in  charge  of  radical  activities. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  are  there  in  charge  of  radical  activi- 
ties?   How  many  are  there  of  a  similar  kind?    Do  you  know? 

Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not.  I  think  he  has  complete  charge  of  it. 
I  Avould  not  say  definitely,  though. 

The  Chairman.  He  goes  around  the  country  looking  after  the 
radicals.  That  may  excuse  his  trip  out  there.  Now,  it  seems  he  left 
Washington  on  June  20.  Was  there  a  radical  outbreak  in  the  West 
around  that  time  ?  [Laughter.]  Flow  did  these  gentlemen  all  hap- 
pen to  be  going  about  June  20  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  suggest.  Senator,  that  if  you  wdll  subpoena  those  men 
themselves,  they  will  give  you  more  information. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  know  that  they  will,  but  we  will  see. 
He  went  from  Washington  on  June  20  to  San  Francisco  by  the 
Pennsylvania  Railroad — $89.72.    That  is  the  railroad  fare,  is  it  not? 

Senator  Reed.  From  Washington? 

The  Chairman.  Washington  to  San  Francisco. 

Senator  Reed.  How  do  these  other  amounts  for  railroad  fare  come 
to  be  so  much  greater?  We  had  a  fare  here  of  $109.  What  was  Mr. 
Stewart's  fare  from  Washington  to  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  He  has  not  given  it  on  here. 

Senator  Reed.  Take  one  that  has  it. 

Mr.  Fees.  Mr.  Montrose— $109.38. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  back,  from  San  Francisco  to  Washington, 
$109.38.  HoAv  did  they  happen  to  charge  Mr.  Montrose  $20  more  to 
come  home  than  they  charged  Mr.  Hoover  to  go  out  ?   Do  you  know  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2483 


Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know  whether  that  diiference  in  rate  had  gone 
into  effect  then  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  No  ;  the  rates  were  not  changed  until  later. 

Mr.  Fees.  They  may  have  traveled  different  routes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  often  happens.  There  used  to  be  a  differ- 
ent fare  from  Washington  to  Canton  than  from  Canton  to  Wash- 
ington. There  Avas  a  very  small  difference,  but  there  was  a  difference 
nevertheless. 

Mr.  Fees.  These  gentlemen  traveled  different  routes,  too. 
The  Chairman.  Let  us  have  his  fare  going  out,  too. 
Mr.  Fees.  Mr.  Montrose? 

The  Chairman.  Washington  to  San  Francisco,  going  out,  $89.72. 
That  is  right ;  there  must  be  a  difference  going  out  and  coming  back — 
a  little  heavier  coming  back. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Those  rates  probably  take  into  consideration 
the  question  of  competition  between  the  different  roads. 

The  Chairman.  The  Pullman  for  Mr.  Hoover  going  out  seems  to 
have  been  $15.75 ;  for  Mr.  Montrose,  coming  back,  $131.  There  is 
not  quite  that  much  difference  in  the  Pullman  rates  out  and  back. 
And  he  seems  to  have  gone  up  to  Seattle.  That  is  where  the  Red 
oubreak  was,  I  suppose.  He  charged  that  to  the  Government. 
Where  did  he  live  ?   Where  was  his  home  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Whom  are  you  speaking  about  now  ? 

The  Chairman.  I  am  speaking  about  Mr.  Hoover — not  Herbert 
Hoover. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know;  his  headquarters  are  in  Washington. 
I  do  not  know  where  his  home  is. 

The  Chairman.  You  made  some  deductions  on  his  bill,  I  see? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Excessive  charge,  tip  to  waiters,  15  cents  de- 
ducted. June  21,  train  porter,  Pullman,  20  cents  deducted;  riot  due 
until  morning  of  22d  for  services  rendered  the  night  of  the  21st. 
Excess  charge,  upper  berth,  Washington  to  Chicago,  10  cents.  There 
is  another  deduction  of  20  cents  for  the  Pullman.  You  are  cer- 
tainly keeping  track  of  things  over  there  pretty  closely. 

Mr.  Fees.  You  understand,  Senator,  those  accounts  are  all  audited 
in  accordance  with  the  

The  Chairman.  You  have  nothing  to  do  with  the  auditing,  have 

Mr.  Fees.  1  es,  sir;  I  am  in  charge  of  the  auditing.  They  are 
audited  in  accordance  with  the  comptroller's  decisions  and  regula- 
tions. 

Senator  Reed.  W^hat  comptroller  is  that? 
Mr.  Fees.  The  Comptroller  of  the  Treasury. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  he  fix  the  size  of  the  tips  to  the  negro  porters  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  He  decides  whether  or  not  they  are  reasonable. 

Senator  Edge.  Let  me  repeat  the  question  I  asked  some  time  ago 
as  to  whether  you  are  familiar — you  are  apparently  quite  familiar 
with  the  price  for  upper  berths  by  the  fact  that  a  drawing-room 
requires  two  full  tickets.  It  seems  to  me  that  is  quite  an  important 
detail. 

Mr.  Fees.  You  must  understand  I  can  not  undertake  to  keep  track 
of  every  detail  charge  that  comes  in.    I  would  have  to  look  those 


2484 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


things  up  if  I  were  auditing  the  accounts  myself.  The  transporta- 
tion clerks  yvho  are  in  charge  of  those  details  handle  those  accounts. 

'Senator  Eixje.  Did  the  transportation  clerk  take  up  this  10  cents 
for  the  upper  berth  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  There  are  no  charges  for  transportation  in  that  account, 
only  expenses  incident  to  transportation,  such  as  meals  and  tips. 

Senator  Edge.  You  read  there  a  deduction  for  an  upper  berth,  did 
you  not? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  w^s  a  tip  to  the  porter,  was  it  not  ? 
Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  so  understand  it. 

The  Chairman.  Excess  charge,  upper  berth,  Washington  to  Chi- 
cago; 10  cents  deducted;  correct  charge,  $4.40.  Excess  charge,  tip 
to  waiters,  15  cents  deducted. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  are  not  familiar — let  me  get  that  answer 
definitely  in  the  record — with  the  charge  for  drawing  rooms? 

Mr.  Fees.  Why,  no ;  I  could  not  keep  all  those  tariffs  in  mind. 

Senator  Edge.  Whether  it  requires  one  or  two  tickets  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  1  do  not  know;  the  question  has  never  come  up  to  me 
directly. 

The  Chairman.  Excess  charge,  car  porterage,  10  cents.  How  do 
you  know  that? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is  determined  by  regulations  of  the  department. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  regulation  as  to  the  Pullman  rates? 
How  does  that  happen  you  deducted  10  cents  on  car  porterage  and  let 
$131  go  by  on  a  Pullman? 

Mr.  Fees.  For  the  simple  reason  that  the  class  of  service  furnished 
for  that  $131  is  probably  different  from  what  Avas  furnished  for 
$15.75.  Those  drawing-room  charges  in  there  for  their  drawing 
room  are  correct.  I  could  not  say  whether  they  were  for  a  draAving 
room  or  what  they  were  until  I  got  the  transportation  account. 

Senator  Reed.  I  wish  you  would  get  that.  So  that  it  ma}^  appear 
in  the  record.  I  asked  Mr.  Eankin,  Senator  Kenyon's  secretar}^,  to 
telephone  and  get  the  rates  that  Avere  in  force  at  the  time  of  the  con- 
vention. He  informs  me  that  a  draAving  room  from  New  York  to 
San  Francisco  Avas  $95.04  and  a  berth  $22.68;  a  berth  from  Washing- 
ton to  NeAv  York  Avas  $2.70  and  a  draAving  room  $9.72. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  for  one  occupant.  Senator? 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  Avhen  you  ride  in  a  draAving-room  you 
have  got  to  buy  Iayo  tickets,  and  then  the  draAving-room  costs  the  same 
Avhether  you  put  one  or  four  people  in  it ;  but  you  have  to  have  tickets 
for  eA^erybody  that  rides  in  it,  and  if  there  is  only  one  person,  he  has 
to  have  tAvo  tickets. 

The  (^iiAiRMAN.  According  to  your  figures  on  this  voucher,  $155.22 
seems  to  haA  e  been  the  expenses  of  ^Ir.  HooA  er  out  to  San  Francisco. 
Mark  that  doAvn,  Avill  you,  and  look  that  up? 

Mr.  Fees.  Was  all  that  travel  made  in  going  to  San  Francisco? 

The  Chairman.  No  ;  1  belieA  e  there  is  a  trip  to  Ncav  York  in  there, 
but  there  is  nothing  to  differentiate  it.  You  Avould  have  to  take  out 
these  NeAT  York  charges. 

Senator  Reed.  If  the  figures  I  haA^e  just  got  from  Mr.  Rankin  are 
correct,  then  $95.04  for  the  draAving-room  and  $22.68  for  a  berth  each 
from  San  Francisco  to  Ncav  York  aaouKI  aggregate  $127.72.  The 
aggreirate  that  is  given  in  Mr.  ^lontrose's  account  for  his  Pullman  is 
hoAv  much!    Have  you  it  before  you? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2485 


The  Chairmax.  $131. 

Senator  Reed.  It  would,  therefore,  just  about  equal  the  charge  for 
a  drawing-room  and  berth — a  little  bit  more — which  can  be  accounted 
for  by  the  fact  that  they  bought  to  Washington  and  then  on  to  New 
York.    Is  not  that  right? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  might  be  accounted  for  that  way,  but  you  understand 
that  the  charges  extended  against  these  transportation  oi'ders  may  not 
be  correct.  There  is  no  way  of  determining  tliat  they  are  correct. 
^Ve  do  not  audit  tliose  cliarges  there  until  we  get  the  transportation 
account,  because  there  is  no  money  paid  until  we  get  the  transporta- 
tion account. 

The  CiiAiPvivrAN.  How  often  do  you  get  tliose? 

Mr.  Fees.  Most  companies  bill  theirs  monthly. 

Senator  Edge.  This  represents  the  affidavit  of  the  man  who  turned 
in  the  voucher  ? 

Mv.  Fees.  That  is  what  it  is. 

Senator  Edge.  And  it  purports  to  be  for  one  person? 
Mr.  Fees.  No  ;  Mr.  Montrose  has  stated  "  travel  with  the  Attorney 
General." 

Senator  Edge.  Do  3^ou  assume  that  includes  the  Attorney  Gen- 
eral's transportation  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  assume  it  includes  the  charge  for  drawing-room  for 
both  of  them.    I  assume  that ;  I  do  not  know  it. 

Senator  Reed.  See  if  it  did  not  include  a  drawing-room  and  a 
berth,  when  you  look  it  up. 

The  Chaikman.  Mr.  Montrose  has,  going  out,  from  Harrisburg  to 
San  Francisco,  $57.60.  Will  you  also  look  that  up  and  see  whether 
that  is  for  one  or  two  persons? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  Avill  be  impossible  for  you  to  fix  the  expenses 
of  Mr.  Hoover  to  San  Francisco  under  this  voucher  without  taking 
out  the  New  York  trip. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  would  practically  have  to  reauclit  the  voucher  and 
take  out  the  New  York  trip  and  expenses  incident  to  that  trip. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  more  gentlemen  connected  with  the 
Department  of  Justice  w^ent  to  San  Francisco  at  the  time  of  the  con- 
A^ention?    Do  you  know? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know  that  any  Avent. 

The  Chairman.  Have  any  more  A^ouchers  passed  through  j^our 
hands  ? 

^Ir.  Fees.  All  these  vouchers  passed  through  before  I  came  back 
to  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  make  an  examination  of  your  records 
and  find  out  Avhether  there  were  any  more  vouchers  for  expenses  to 
San  Francisco  of  any  of  the  employees  or  any  men  in  the  Department 
of  Justice  in  June  or  July  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  Avill  be  a  very  difficult  proposition. 

The  Chairman.  Why?    So  many  AA^ent? 

Mr.  Fees.  No.  I  do  not  knoAv  just  Avhen  I  could  get  it  for  you. 
There  Avould  be  a  good  deal  of  Avork.  AVe  Avould  haA^e  to  go  through 
each  individual  A^oucher  paid  

The  Chairman.  Who  connected  Avith  the  Department  of  Justice 
Avould  knoAv  just  Avhat  gentlemen  Avent  to  San  Francisco? 


2486 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Fees.  Well,  I  do  not  knoAv,  unless  it  would  be  Mr.  Stewart,  the 
chief  clerk. 

The  Chairman.  He  went  himself  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  No. 

The  Chairman.  What  Stewart  is  this? 

Mr.  Fees.  R.  P.  Stewart,  Assistant  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  Did  the  chief  clerk  go  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  this  chief  clerk's  full  name  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  C.  E.  Stewart. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  ask  a  question  or  two.  Do  all  of  the  ac- 
counts for  salaries  and  expenses  for  all  of  the  employees  of  the  Attor- 
ney General's  office  go  through  your  hands  for  audit  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  All  that  are  paid  from  the  Government  funds  do. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  anybody  Avho  is  not  paid  from  Government 
funds? 

Mr.  Fees.  Not  that  I  knoAv  of. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  are  there,  approximately  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  You  mean  how  many  employees  are  there  in  the  depart- 
ment ? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Fees.  Well,  I  do  not  know.  I  would  have  to  guess  if  I  told 
you. 

Senator  Reed.  Give  us  your  estimate. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  would  say  between  250  and  300  in  Washington. 

Senator  Reed,  Are  there  employees  outside  of  Washington — and 
I  do  not  now  include  district  attorneys  and  other  employees,  but  I 
mean  those  who  work  directly  under  the  Attorney  General — are  there 
some  of  those  outside  of  Washington  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  There  are  a  few,  but  I  would  not  attempt  to  say  how 
many. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  the  secret  service  men  w^ork  under  the  Attorney 
General  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Oh,  they  work  there.  I  thought  you  had  reference  to 
attornej^s.  The  special  agents'  force  of  the  Bureau  of  Investigation 
works  directly  under  the  supervision  of  the  Chief  of  the  Bureau  of 
Investigation,  who  is  responsible  to  the  Attorney  General. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  those  accounts  go  through  your  hands? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  every  expense  that  has 
been  incurred  and  the  bills  rendered  by  any  of  the  employees  under 
the  Attorney  General  go  through  your  hands  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  That  is,  any  that  are  paid  by  the  disbursing  clerk  of 
the  department. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  of  any  that  are  not  paid  by  the  dis- 
bursing clerk  of  the  department? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  About  how  many  of  them  are  there,  then,  whose 
accounts  go  through  your  hands? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  do  not  knoAV. 
Senator  Reed.  Could  you  approximate  it? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  have  not  any  idea.  They  have  made  so  many  changes 
and  reductions  in  the  field  force  that  I  have  not  any  idea  how  many 
men  they  have  in  the  field. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2487 


Senator  Reed.  Is  it  hundreds  or  is  it  scores  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  should  judge  thev  had  two  or  three  hundred  in  the 
field. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  in  addition  to  the  emplo3^ees  that  you  first 
spoke  of  in  the  department  at  Washington? 
Mr.  Fees.  In  the  department  at  AYashington. 

Senator  Reed.  Would  it  take  you  very  long  to  take  the  vouchers 
of  each  of  those  gentlemen,  glance  at  them,  and  see  whether  they  had 
been  out  to  San  Francisco  in  the  last  90  days  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  would  take  considerable  tim^e.  When  would  you 
want  this  information? 

Senator  Reed.  What  do  you  mean  by  a  considerable  time?  You 
could  get  it  by  to-morrow  afternoon,  could  you  not,  easily  enough? 
If  you  think  you  can  not,  we  Avill  haA^e  you  bring  over  all  3^our 
vouchers  and  see  how  quickh^  we  can  find  them.  I  do  not  want  to  put 
any  hardship  on  jou  at  all.  I  thought  that  maybe  you  would  rather 
look  over  them  than  to  tote-  them  over  here.  This  committee  is  going 
to  know. 

Mr.  Fees.  Do  you  want  them  by  to-morrow  afternoon?  It  is 
merely  a  matter  of  time. 

Senator  Reed.  We  Avould  like  to  have  them  by  to-morrow  after- 
noon, but  it  would  do  to  have  them  on  Saturday  morning. 

Mr.  Fees.  I  am  pretty  sure  that  I  can  get  any  accounts  of  any- 
body working  for  the  department  who  traveled  to  San  Francisco. 
Is  that  it  ? 

The  Chairman.  At  the  time  of  the  Democratic  convention. 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Bring  us  the  vouchers  for  those  gentlemen,  and 
bring  us  all  of  them. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  just  one  or  two  questions. 

The  Chairman.  Will  3^011  do  that  by  Saturday"  morning? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  your  OAvn  knowledge,  Mr.  Fees,  do  you  know 
what  particular  governmental  activity  these  men  who  Avere  in  San 
Francisco  were  engaged  in  while  there? 

Mr.  Fees.  Xo,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  When  you  audit  accounts  of  the  attaches  of  the 
department  is  it  or  is  it  not  necessary  for  you  to  have  some  general 
idea  of  the  object  of  the  visit  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  It  is  not  necessaiy.  I  think  the  laAV  and  the  decisions 
of  the  comptroller  require  that  the  account  be  approved  by  some 
administrative  official  in  charge  of  the  Avork  Avho  has  knoAvledge  of 
the  facts,  and  payment  is  made  upon  his  administrative  approval 
and  certification. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  your  audit  is  mosth^  perfunctory? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes;  in  a  manner.  We  do  not  have  knoAvledge  of  the 
facts  in  connection  Avith  cA^eiy  bit  of  traA^el  that  is  made.  Only  once 
in  a  Avhile  some  of  those  facts  

Tlie  Chair^ian.  You  said  a^ou  did  not  knoAv  much  about  it.  You 
do  not  knoAv  Avhether  these  men  Avent  out  there  Avith  the  employees 
of  the  Department  of  Agriculture  AA^ho  happened  to  be  out  there? 

Mr.  Fees.  I  Avould  judge  from  some  of  these  accounts  that  they 
Avent  out  to  confer  Avith  the  Department  of  Justice  officials  on  De- 
partment of  Justice  business. 


2488 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chaikmajs.  Do  you  knoAv  anythin<x  about  employees  of  other 
<lepartments  iroino;  out  there — the  Xavy,  for  instance  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  No,  sir. 

The  CHAiR:NrAN.  You  do  not  know  whether  they  had  their  meet- 
in*>s  on  a  battleship  out  there? 
Mr.  Fees.  I  have  not  any  idea. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Fees,  you  stated  in  answer  to  a  question 
just  asked  a  moment  a<j:o  by  Senator  Edge  that  under  the  statute 
these  claims  have  to  be  audited  or  approved  by  some  administrative 
official  who  has  personal  knowledge  of  the  different  items  of  expense. 
That  was  the  substance  of  your  statement,  I  believe. 

Mr.  Fees.  Personal  knowledge  of  the  facts  in  connection  with  the 
travel. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Personal  knowledge  of  the  facts.  Do  these 
expense  accounts  come  up  for  the  inspection  and  approval  of  the 
Attorney  General  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  They  come  up  for  the  approval  of  the  Assistant  At- 
torney General  and  sometimes  the  Attorney  General. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVere  these  submitted  to  the  Attorney  Gen- 
eral ? 

Mr.  P'ees.  I  could  not  determine  that  unless  I  had  the  orio:inal 
vouchers  of  the  Auditor  for  the  State  and  Other  Departments. 

Senator  Poinierene.  Suppose  you  make  inquiry  on  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  these  vouchers — following  the  question  asked 
by  Senator  Pomerene^ — contain  the  indorsement  of  some  official  in 
addition  to  the  man  making  the  claim  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir;  absolutely. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  these? 

Mr.  Fees.  These  are  memorandum  copies.  That  is  on  the  originals 
of  these  copies.  The  originals  are  with  the  auditor. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Right  there ;  pardon  me.  Do  you  mean  to  say 
that  these  are  made  out  in  duplicate  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  one  goes  to  the  auditor  or  the  Comp- 
troller of  the  Treasury  ? 

Mr.  Fees  The  Auditor  for  the  State  and  Other  Departments. 
Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  other  you  keep  for  your  own  files  ? 
Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  officials  are  included  in  the  class  of  adminis- 
trative officials  who  have  the  power  to  indorse  one  of  these  vouchers  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Any  Assistant  Attorney  General  outside  of  the  Attorney 
General,  and  the  Attorney  General  has  delegated  this  authority,  with 
respect  to  some  appropriations,  to  the  chief  clerk  and  administrative 
assistants  to  the  department.  Just  what  class  those  are  I  would  have 
to  look  up. 

Senator  Edge.  Tlien,  in  the  case  of  an  Assistant  Attorney  General 
not  being  permitted  to  indorse  his  oAvn  voucher,  presumably  he  would 
go  to  another  one  of  the  Assistant  Attorneys  General  or  the  chief 
<']erk.    Is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Fees.  Or  the  Attorney  General ;  possibly  the  chief  clerk. 

Senntor  Edge.  Ail  of  these  vouchers,  as  I  followed  your  testimony, 
are  from  Assistant  Attorneys  General,  with  the  exception  of  the  gen- 
tleman who  is  assistant  recorder  of  titles,  or  something  of  the  kind. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2489 


Mr.  Fees.  Xo,  sir;  Mr.  el.  E.  Hoover,  special  assistant  to  the 
Attorney  General. 

Senator  Edge.  The  special  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General  is  not 
included  in  the  class  of  administrative  officials  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir :  his  accounts  must  be  approved  by  the  Assistant 
Attorney  General  or  the  chief  clerk. 

The  Chaie:max.  Do  you  have  anything  to  do  with  the  expense 
accounts  of  the  Bureau  of  Investigation  ? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir;  we  audit  those  for  payment. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  understand  that  the  inquiry  of  Senator 
Keed  covers  that? 

Mr.  Fees.  Yes,  sir. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  HARRY  LEVY. 

(The  Avitness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Are  you   connected  with  the  Department  of 
Justice  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  connected  wdth  any  department  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  Xo,  sir.   I  received  a  wire  this  morning  to  come  here  re- 
garding "  LTncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge." 
The  Chairman.  AVhere  is  your  home  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  New  York  City. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  business,  Mr.  Levy? 
Mr.  Levy.  Producing  motion  pictures. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  acquainted  w  ith  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom 
Eidge  "  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir ;  I  am  producing  it. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  w^rite  the  story? 
Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir;  I  bought  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  putting  it  on  the  screen,  are  you? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  As  your  own  enterprise? 
Mr.  Levy.  Assisted  by  another  gentleman. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  other  gentleman? 
Mr.  Levy.  Mr.  Bernard  Baruch. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Bernard  Baruch?  We  have  heard  of  him 
before.   What  is  your  arrangement  for  putting  it  on  the  screen? 

^Ir.  Levy.  I  saw  the  possibilities  of  a  motion  picture  in  the  story 
Avhen  it  first  came  out  in  the  Atlantic  Monthly  and  negotiated  for 
the  purchase  of  the  story,  and  found  there  were  any  number  of  other 
producers  after  it  as  well. 

The  Chair3ian.  Active  competition  for  it? 

Mr.  Levy.  Active;  yes.  We  finally  made  an  arrangement  to  pur- 
chase the  story ;  and  having  heard  that  Mr.  Baruch  was  particularly 
interested  in  the  League  of  Nations,  I  Avent  to  him  and  asked  him 
Avould  he  be  interested  in  helping  me  finance  the  picture,  and  he 
said  he  would  under  certain  conditions.  First,  that  I  picturize  the 
story,  just  as  it  Avas  Avritten,  so  that  it  Avould  not  olfend  either  party 
or  offend  any  of  the  Senators  of  either  party;  that  I  keep  close  to 
the  script;  that  in  the  eA^ent  that  I  did  that  he  Avould  assist  me  in 
producing  the  picture.    He  advanced  me  $25,000. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  $25,000  that  he  aclA'anced  a^ou? 


2490 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Levy.  So  far;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  So  far.  What  did  he  agree  to  do  after  while  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  He  agreed  that  he  would  help  me  finance  it— "  fifty- 
fifty  " — w^th  the  understanding  that  he  would  get  his  money  back.*^ 

Senator  Edge.  How  could  you  censor  the  picture  so  that  it  would 
not  offend  Senator  Reed  ? 

The  Chairman.  You  have  gone  ahead  on  that  plan,  have  you  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Don't  you  permit  an  answer? 

The  Chairman.  By  arrangement  with  Mr.  Baruch  he  has  advanced 
you  $25,000? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  put  into  it? 
Mr.  Levy.  About  the  same  amount. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  to  help  you  carry  it  through  financially  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  No  matter  Avhat  it  may  cost  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  Well,  it  can  not  cost  oA^er  $75,000. 
The  Chairman.  $75,000  all  together? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  So  he  limits  himself  to  $75,000  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  He  does  not  limit  himself.  You  can  not  make  the  story 
only  just  so  big.   You  have  got  to  follow  the  script. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  it  about  his  getting  his  money  back? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes.  We  entered  into  an  arrangement  that  he  should 
receive  his  money  back  out  of  the  profits. 

The  Chairman.  If  there  are  no  profits,  Avhat  happens  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Then  we  both  lose. 

The  Chairman.  AVhat  are  you  to  do  with  this  story — spread  it  all 
over  the  country? 

Mr.  Levy.  The  same  as  we  do  with  all  other  pictures — book  it  di- 
rect to  the  exhibitors  on  its  value  as  a  theatrical  production. 

The  Chairman.  And  when  you  give  this  in  a  theater,  I  suppose 
you  have  on  the  picture  "  Paid  for  by  Barney  Baruch  "  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Hardly. 

The  Chairman.  Or  that  "  This  is  a  part  of  the  propaganda  for  the 
League  of  Nations  "  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  It  is  not  intended  as  propaganda  for  the  League  of 
Nations. 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  not  intended  to  help  the  propaganda  for  the 
League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  know\  But  it  can  not  do  otherwise  than  help. 
It  was  not  intended  for  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  not  say  that  was  the  reason  that  Baruch 
w^as  interested? 

Mr.  Levy.  That  is  why  he  Avas  interested. 

The  Chairman.  You  thought  you  could  get  Baruch  on  that  hook? 
Mr.  Levy.  No;  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  you  did  anyhow;  you  landed  him.  You 
are  going  to  show  this  to  all  the  people  of  the  United  States  that  you 
can,  and  charge  them  for  looking  at  it  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  gotten  some  pretty  good  free  advertising 
through  this  committee,  have  you  not? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2491 


The  Chairman.  \  ou  are  to  have  a  private  performance  of  this  in 
a  few  days,  are  you  not  ? 
Mr.  Le"v^.  Sunday  night. 

The  Chairman.  Sir.  Gerard  tokl  us  that  he  had  been  invited.  Has 
the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  anythincr  to  do  with  carrying  this  on? 

Mr.  Levy.  Nothing  whatever,  with  the  exception  that  we  have  sent 
invitations  to  all  the  men  and  women  that  we  could  locate. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  talked  to  Mr.  Houston,  the  president  oi 
the  league,  about  it  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  have  kno\vn  bim  for  many  A  cars.  I  haAC  talked  to  him 
about  it. 

The  Chairman.  Has  he  anything  to  do  Avith  it? 
Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  not  in  on  it.   I  have  been  handed  this : 

Will  you  join  nonpartisan  reception  committee  for  private  presentation  of  film 
version  of  the  Lea.uue  of  Nations  story  "  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge,"  by 
Margaret  Prescott  ^loutagve?  We  wish  use  of  your  name  only.  No  further 
obligation  on  your  part.  Private  showing  at  Selwyn  Theater  September  26. 
Distinguished  group  of  Americans  have  already  accepted. 

Herbert  S.  Houston, 
920  West  32(1  Street,  Xew  York  City. 

He  is  the  treasurer  of  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace,  is  he  not? 
Mr.  Levy.  I  believe  so. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  he  happen  to  have  the  right  to  invite 
distinguished  people  to  this  performance? 

iMr.  Levy.  I  asked  him  to  get  a  reception  committee  together. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  you  happen  to  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Simply  because  I  knew  he  was  interested  in  the  subject. 

The  (yHAiR^MAN.  Who  is  the  reception  committee? 

Mr.  Levy.  The  reception  committee  consists  of  eighteen  or  twenty- 
odd  prominent  people. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  they? 

Mr.  Levy.  The  President  and  Mrs.  Wilson's  names  are  on  it,  the 
author,  and  Mr.  Gerard,  Oscar  Straus  

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  say  the  President's  name  was  on  the  re- 
ception committee? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  expect  him  to  go  to  New  York  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  would  like  to  have  him  go. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  expect  him,  do  3^ou  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  You  know,  don't  3^ou? 

Mr.  Levy.  He  has  not  refused  to  go. 

Senator  Reed.  You  know  he  can  not  go,  don't  you  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  hold  him  out  as  one  of  the  reception  com- 
mittee.  Well,  who  else? 

Mr.  Levy.  That  is  all  I  can  remember. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  Mr.  Taft  on  the  committee  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  He  was  invited. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  invite  people  do  3^ou  put  them  on  as 
members  of  the  committee  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Not  unless  they  accept. 
The  Chairman.  Who  else? 


2492 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Levy.  I  can  not  recall  the  names. 

The  Chairman.  Did  yon  <>et  some  prominent  financial  men  to 
accept  places? 

Mr.  Levy.  Xo;  we  made  no  effort  to  get  any  prominent  financial 
people. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  object  of  the  private  performance? 
Why  do  you  not  let  the  public  see  this  affair?  Why  do  you  confine 
it  to  a  few  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  We  are  not.  We  are  opening  it  at  two  theaters,  in  order 
to  take  care  of  the  crowds.  We  have  sent  out  5,000  invitations  and 
about  5,000  people  have  replied. 

The  Chairman.  They  are  all  coming,  are  they? 

Mr.  Levy.  A  great  big  quantity  of  them. 

Tlie  Chairman.  Is  it  free  that  night? 

Mr.  Levy.  Free. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  going  to  have  it  free  all  over  the  country  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  places  are  you  going  to  have  it  free  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Probably  one  in  Chicago.  It  is  customary  to  have  an 
initial  showing  of  any  good  picture,  and  w^e  think  Ave  have  got  a 
very  good  picture. 

The  Chairman.  That  will  be  free  in  Chicago? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  are  you  going  to  get  started  all  over  the 
country  with  it? 

Mr.  Levy.  Next  week  some  time. 

The  Chairman.  You  expect  to  show  it  right  up  to  election,  I  sup- 
pose? 

Mr.  Levy.  Until  there  is  not  any  further  sale  for  it.  It  usually 
takes  about  a  year. 

The  Chairman.  You  think  this  will  last  a  year? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  think  that  the  material  in  this  picture  has  such  an 
appeal  for  Americanization,  outside  of  the  League  of  Nations,  that  it 
will  be  a  very  popular  picture  for  all  classes  of  people. 

The  Chairi^ian.  Outside  of  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  not  this  a  League  of  Nations  picture? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  w^ould  not  characterize  it  as  absolutely  a  League  of 
Nations  picture.  It  shows  Americanism,  the  way  I  look  at  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  was  wondering  how  it  could  be  for  the  League 
of  Nations,  then. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  see  the  statement  b}^  Marsh  this  morning 
that  we  are -much  more  concerned  about  the  source  of  contribution, 
and  scan  it  much  more  closely,  than  about  the  size?  Did  you  read 
that  statement? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Eixje.  I  Avas  wondering  if  this  Avas  one  of  the  sources  of 
contributions  from  Mr.  Barney  Baruch"$3T,500  does  he  not  guar- 
antee ? 

Mr.  Levy.  There  is  no  guarantee. 

The  Chairman.  You  liaA^e  been  getting  out  literature  on  the  sub- 
ject, I  suppose,  to  present  it? 

Mr.  Lea'y.  That  is  customary  in  the  regular  channels,  in  motion 
picture  papers. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


249a 


The  CijAiRMAN  (reading)  : 

All  the  pathos  and  heart-gripping  interest  of  the  Music  Master.  Uncle  Tom's 
Cabin,  the  Man  Without  a  Country,  Way  Down  East,  and  Abraham  Lincoln 
combined. 

A  distinfruished  list  of  players — George  MacQuarrie,  as  the  post- 
master :  William  S.  Corbett,  as  Uncle  Sam. 
Who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  A  prominent  actor. 

The  Chairman.  Paul  Kelle}',  as  Young  Sam ;  Helen  Flint,  as 
Roma,  the  girl:  Leslie  Hunt,  as  Andy  Mason;  Eugene  Keith,  as 
the  village  fool :  and  Sheridan  Tansey,  as  the  boy  Sam. 

Have  you  also  advertised  it  in  the  papers  in  Xew  York — ''Levy 
produces  Uncle  Sam  of  Freedom  Ridge  "  ?  Did  3^011  insert  this  in 
that  paper  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Xo  ;  that  is  not  an  ad.,  as  far  as  I  can  see. 
The  Chair3l\n.  What  is  it  ?    It  is  the  New  York  Review.  What 
is  that — a  theatrical  paper? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  did  vou  pav  the  author  for  this  story  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  $11,500. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  pay  anybody  a  commission  for  bringing 
you  and  Baruch  together  on  this  matter? 

jNIr.  Levy.  There  was  not  anybod}^  that  brought  us  together. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Gradwell? 

Mr.  Levy.  Gradwell  is  broker  for  the  author. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  bring  you  together  in  any  way  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Xo,  sir;  I  went  to  his  office. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  help  you  interest  Mr.  Baruch  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Xo,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  pay  him  anything? 
]Mr.  Levy.  Xo,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Does  any  part  of  the  profits  on  this  affair  go  to 
the  Democratic  campaign? 

Mr.  Levy,  ^one  Avhatever.  The  Democratic  Party  has  nothing 
Avhatever  to  do  with  this  picture.  I  do  not  know  anybody  connected 
with  the  Democratic  Party. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  you  a  Democrat  or  a  Republican? 

Mr.  Levy.  L^sually  a  Democrat. 

Senator  Edge.  An  ad  interim  Democrat. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  ask  a  question  or  two.  When  was  it  that 
you  conceived  this  notion  about  putting  this  play  on  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  In  June,  I  believe  it  was,  when  the  Atlantic  Monthly 
came  out. 

Senator  Reed.  You  just  read  the  story  there? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  went  to  Baruch  and  spoke  to  him  first  about  it? 
Mr.  Levy.  Xo;  I  did  not  go  to  Baruch  until  after  it  came  out  in 
the  World  and  after  I  had  been  corresponding  with  the  author. 
Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  go  to  Mr.  Baruch? 
Mr.  Levy.  In  the  latter  part  of  August. 
Senator  Reed.  Of  this  year,  of  course? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Baruch  put  in  $25,000  and  vou  paid  the  author 
$11,500? 


2494 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  other  expenses  are  there? 
Mr.  Levy.  About  twenty-five  or  thirty  thousand  dollars  in  the 
production  of  the  picture. 

Senator  Eeed.  Photoo^raphic  work? 

Mr.  Levy.  Photographing  it  and  paying  the  performers,  getting 
out  literature  necessary  to  exploit  motion  pictures. 

Senator  Reed.  And  there  is  not  any  limit  upon  the  amount  that 
Mr.  Baruch  may  be  called  upon  for? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir.  I  told  him  I  thought  the  picture  would  cost 
somewhere  in  the  neighborhood  of  $75,000. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  he  will  probably  be  called  upon  to  produce 
some  more  money  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  got  the  picture  ready  for  production. 
You  know  now  what  it  has  cost  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  It  is  not  quite  ready. 
Senator  Reed.  It  is  very  nearly  ready  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  liability  has  been  incurred  up  to  this 
date? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  have  not  all  the  bills  in  yet. 

Senator  Reed.  Approximate  it  just  as  closely  as  you  can. 

Mr.  Levy.  Around  sixty. 

Senator  Reed.  Around  $60,000? 

Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  agree  with  Mr.  Baruch  that  you  would 
put  it  in  dollar  for  dollar  against  him  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  a  member  of  any  company  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  What  kind  of  company  ? 
Senator  Reed.  That  produces  pictures  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  am  a  producer  myself.  I  am  president  of  the  com- 
pany that  is  producing  this  picture. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  are  3^ou  a  party  to  this  contract,  or  is  the  com- 
pany or  corporation  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  The  company. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  that  company  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Harry  Levy  Service  Corporation. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  have  you  been  producing  pictures  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  This  company  has  been  in  business  about  four  months. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  about  the  time  you  got  hold  of  this  picture  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No ;  I  had  been  in  the  picture  business  for  four  years. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  but  the  company,  I  mean  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  This  company  was  organized  about  four  months  ago. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  Mr.  Baruch  own  any  stock  in  it  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

kjenator  Reed.  Does  he  own  any  bonds  or  securities  in  it  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Any  obligations  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So,  the  amount  of  it  is  that  you  went  to  Mr.  Baruch 
because  of  his  interest  in  the  League  of  Nations  and  laid  this  plan 
before  him.    You  w^ould  not  have  gone  to  him  if  it  had  not  been  for 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2495 


that  fact.  I  take  it  ?    You  had  no  other  business  reh^tions  with  him  in 
the  past  ? 
Mr.  Lm'Y.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  If  the  play  is  a  success,  he  gets  his  money  back? 

Mr.  LE\"5r.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  If  it  is  not  a  success? 

^Ir.  Levt.  He  loses. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  he  has  contribute  that  much  toward  the 
League  of  Xations  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  would  not  say  that.  He  has  contributed  to  a  business 
enterprise. 

Senator  Reed.  To  a  business  enterprise  that  he  entered  on  account 
of  his  interest  in  the  League  of  Xations.  Where  did  you  see  Mr. 
Baruch  about  this? 

Mr.  Levy.  At  his  office  in  Xew  York. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  did  it  take  you  to  conduct  your  negotia- 
tions ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  had  four  or  five  meetings  with  him  before  we  finally 
agreed. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  any  consultation  with  any  other  peo- 
ple than  Mr.  Baruch  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Some  people  whom  he  sent  me  to  for  the  purpose  of 
proving  we  had  ability  to  produce  a  motion  picture  of  this  quality. 

Senator  Reed.  Some  people  that  he  sent  you  to  for  the  purpose 
of  

Mr.  Levy.  He  asked  questions  about  our  abilit}^  to  produce  a  pic- 
ture of  this  kind. 

Senator  Reed.  AVould  he  send  you  to  these  people  to  have  you  ask 
them  whether  you  were  able  to  produce  it? 

Mr.  Levy.  To  have  them  question  me,  possibly. 

Senator  Reed.  To  whom  did  he  send  you? 

^Ir.  Levy.  To  a  gentleman  by  the  name  of  Price,  who  is  president 
of  the  Fairbanks  outfit. 

The  Chairman.  Was  Mr.  Price  formerly  Mr,  McAdoo's  assistant? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  know ;  I  never  met  him.  He  sent  me  to  John 
Golden,  who  is  the  owner  of  Lightning,"  in  New  York,  that  famous 
play  that  had  such  a  long  run. 

Senator  Reed.  You  got  their  opinions,  did  you  ? 

^Ir.  Levy.  Xo.  sir;  they  got  an  idea  of  my  opinion  and  reported 
back  to  Mr.  Baruch. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  see  anybody  else  ? 

^Ir.  Levy.  Xo. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  Mr.  Baruch  have  you  consult  with  other  people? 
Mr.  Levy.  Xo. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  yon  not  know  that  Mr.  Baruch  had  something 
to  do  with  circulating  this  newspaper  story? 

Mr.  LE^^r.  Not  until  I  read  it  in  the  paper  giving  the  testimony 
at  the  committee  meeting  in  Chicago. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  not  tell  you  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Le\^.  Xo,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  bought  the  picture  rights,  or  did  you  buy  the 
story  ? 


2496 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Levy.  I  bought  the  picture  rights  only. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  Mr.  Baruch  got  the  story  rights  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  know  whether  he  has  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  it  was  ever  copyrighted  ? 
Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  knoAv. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  pay  $11,500  for  a  noncopyrighted  story? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  paid  $11,500.  I  do  not  remember  exactly — that  was 
left  to  my  attorney  to  look  out  for  the  validity  of  Avhat  I  Avas  paying 
for. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  Avhether  Mr.  Baruch  paid  the  author 
of  the  story  any  other  sum  of  money  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  do  not  knoAv  anything  about  it. 

Senator  Edgi^.  When  did  you  start  preparing  the  picture  for  pro- 
duction— in  Avhat  month? 

Mr.  Levy.  Immediately  after  our  arrangement — rlie  end  of  August. 

Senator  Edge,.  And  it  Avas  ready  for  production  on  the  screen 
the  next  Aveek? 

Mr.  Levy.  We  Avere  going  to  have  it  ready  by  SundaA^ 

Senator  Edge.  That  has  consumed  just  a  little  OA^er  a  month  in 
preparation  ? 

Mr  Levy.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  the  usual  time  required  to  prepare  a  pic- 
ture of  that  character  for  the  screen? 

Mr.  Levy.  It  depends  on  the  story. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  a  story  of  that  character. 

Mr.  Levy.  It  may  be  done  in  one  AA^eek,  tAvo  Aveeks,  four  months, 
or  a  year. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  does  it  not  re(]uire  from  four 
to  six  months  to  produce  a  dramatic  picture  of  that  character  for 
exhibition  on  the  screen  ? 

Mr.  Levy.  Not  ahvays. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  this  picture  take  vou  OA'er  to  Europe,  to  the 
battlefields? 
Mr.  Levy.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  all  in  this  country  ? 
Mr.  Lea  Y.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  hurried  the  production  of  the  picture  as 
much  as  possible,  have  you  not? 

Mr.  Lea  Y.  We  Avorked  along  in  our  usual  Avay. 

Senator  Edge.  With  the  object  of  getting  it  out  before  election? 

Mr.  Levy.  I  realize  that  while  all  this  controA^ersy  is  going  on  it 
is  good  material  for  a  motion  picture. 

Senator  Edge.  You  Avanted  to  get  this  out  as  far  before  election  as 
possible.   Did  not  that  interest  Mr.  Baruch,  Avhen  he  put  up  $37,000? 

Mr.  Levy.  He  asked  about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  Avant  to  call  Mr.  Baruch  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  you  do  you  better  send  word  to  him,  as  I 
recall  he  Avas  leaving  tonight.  He  said  he  AA^ould  be  glad  to  giA^e  the 
committee  any  information  he  possessed  on  the  subject,  and  you  better 
send  for  him  if  you  Avant  him.  He  is  noAv  at  the  Shoreham  Hotel. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2497 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  LOEEN  C.  TALBOT,  HEADaTJARTERS  DEMO- 
CRATIC NATIONAL  COMMITTEE,  NEW  YORK  CITY. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  connected  with  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Xo,  sir;  I  am  a  letter  writer  for  the  national  Demo- 
cratic committee. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  connected  with  the  Democratic  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  In  what  capacity? 

Mr.  Talbot.  As  a  letter  writer. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  in  Mr.  Jamieson's  department  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  are  located  in  Washington  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  just  now  I  am  in  New  York. 
Senator  Reed.  At  the  Democratic  headquarters  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  charge  of  the  correspondence  of  the 
division  of  finance  under  Mr.  tlamieson  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Wei],  a  portion  of  it ;  yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  And  do  you  ha  ve  noAV  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  how  long  have  you  had  such  charge  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Since  about  the  1st  of  October,  last  year. 
The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  of  the  different  type  of  letters  that 
have  been  sent  out  by  that  department  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir ;  I  think  I  do. 
The  Chairman.  Were  they  form  letters? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  different  forms  of  letters  were  used — 
I  mean  in  soliciting  funds? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  could  not  say.  There  has  been — oh,  probably  seven 
or  eight ;  maybe  more. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  the  forms  with  you  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  No  ;  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  bring  to  us  the  different  forms  of  letters 
used  in  soliciting  funds  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  think  I  have  most  of  them  here;  possibly  not  all 
of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  do  that  in  the  morning  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Over  that  period,  as  I  understand?  . 
The  Chairman.  For  the  entire  time  you  were  there,  from  October 
last  year. 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  particular  form  of  letters  for 
postmasters  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  For  Federal  officials  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  write  postmasters? 


182774— 20— PT  18  6 


2498 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Talbot.  Letters  probably  found  their  way  to  postmasters. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  a  list  of  postmasters? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Not  to  my  knowledge;  no,  sir.  I  w^ould  not  know 
anything  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  So  if  letters  found  their  way  to  postmasters,  it  was 
just  as  they  found  their  way  to  anyone  else? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir;  to  any  other  Democrat. 

The  Chairman.  Hoay  Avere  the  amounts  ascertained  that  you  asked 
people  to  contribute? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  there  were  various  methods  tried  out.  I  am  not 
familiar  with  them,  and  I  do  not  know  how  they  reached  that. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  familiar  with  that  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  I  think  Mr.  Jamieson  is. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  not  sit  in  at  the  council  meetings  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes;  I  did.    I  say,  I  have  a  general  knowledge. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your    general  knoAvledge  "  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  that  we  wrote  and  sent  out  blank  forms  asking 
the  name  and  address  and  the  worth  of  a  Democrat,  with  the  idea  of 
getting  at  about  how  much  to  ask  him  for. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  you  met  around  the  table  and  decided 
what  each  one  should  pay  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Oh,  no. 

The  Chairman.  What  you  thought  they  should  pay,  because  you 
wrote  them  for  specific  sums,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  in  some  instances,  yes ;  generally  we  did,  yes. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  sat  down  and  considered  what  the  Demo- 
crat was  worth  and  what  his  income  was,  which  you  had  ascertained, 
and  you  had  this  on  a  card,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  no — yes,  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  "  no,  yes  " ;  which  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  you  fixed  the  amount  on  the  card,  did 
you  not,  for  that  Democrat  to  pay  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  believe  that  is  correct;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  a  list  of  the  Liberty  loan  subscribers  to 
work  with? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Not  to  my  knowledge ;  no,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Nothing  of  that  kind? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Not  to  my  knowledge. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  had  ascertained  what  you  thought  the 
Democrat  ought  to  pay,  then  you  sent  him  the  letter? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  this  was  the  amount  expected  of  him? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  did  not  write  all  of  those  letters,  understand. 
The  Chairman.  No  ;  but  you  had  form  letters  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Oh,  yes ;  I  Avrote  some  form  letters. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  send  out  special-delivery  letters  to  any  of 
these  people? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  I  think  so,  but  these  letters — the  envelopes  were 
not  addressed  in  my  department,  and  I  do  not  know  how  that  was. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  some  provision  for  sending  the  let- 
ters to  their  homes  as  distinguished  from  the  places  of  business  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes ;  that  is  my  understanding. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  use  that  on  any  but  Federal  officials  ? 


presidp:xtiaj.  campaign  expenses. 


2499 


^Ir.  Talbot.  I  believe  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  rubber  stamps  for  that  purpose  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  But  where  there  was  a  Federal  official  that  you 
were  Avriting  to,  you  used  a  rubber  stamp  so  that  it  would  go  to  his 
home  and  not  to  his  place  of  business? 

Mr.  Talbot.  We  used  this  envelope. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  stamped,  was  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  you  mean  a  minute  ago  when  you  said 
there  was  a  rubber  stamp  used  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  think  I  mentioned  a  rubber  stamp. 

The  Chairman.  Or  that  you  put  special  delivery  stamps  on  letters 
to  their  homes? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes ;  that  is  true.  There  were  special  delivery  letters 
sent  to  their  homes. 

Jine  Chairman.  To  their  homes? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes ;  and  on  this  envelope  was  a  statement — 1  do  not 
know  just  how  it  read — but  to  deliver  at  the  residence  only. 
The  Chairman.  Why  was  that? 

Mr.  Talbot,  i  presume  it  was  to  comply  with  the  postal  regula- 
tions that  contributions  should  not  be  solicited  on  Federal  property. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  separate  files  for  postmasters? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  not  to  my  knowledge;  that  is  outside  of  my 
department. 

The  Chairman.  Who  would  know  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  presume  Mr.  Jamieson  would  know,  and  l  presume 
Mrs.  Parke. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  letters  did  you  send  out  per  day^ 
about  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  That  varied.  I  have  not  any  way  of  estimating  that. 
I  would  not  know  about  that. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  separate  quarters  from  the  Democratic 
national  committee,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes ;  I  had  a  separate  office. 

The  Chairman.  How  was  the  rent  paid  for  those  offices? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  nothing  to  do  Avith  that  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Xo,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  had  the  office  force  before  us  in  an  inves- 
tigation, and  it  is  hardly  necessary  to  go  into  that.  Was  any  list 
kept  of  district  attarneys  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Xot  to  my  knowledge ;  no,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Or  people  employed  by  the  Government  in  any 
way?   Was  any  differentiation  made? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  How  would  you  know  then  when  to  place  upon 
the  envelope  to  be  delivered  at  the  homes  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  say  that  was  done  in  another  department. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  if  you  had  the  system  of  sending  letters  to 
employees  at  their  homes  you  must  have  had  a  list  of  Federal  em- 
ployees. 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  presume  there  was  a  list  along  with  a  good  many 
Democrats. 


2500 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  know  there  Avas  a  list  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  Then  how  could  you  have  distinguished  if  John 
Smith  was  a  Federal  employee,  and  why  did  you  use  a  registered 
letter  to  John  Smith? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  would  not  know  anything  about  that,  because  the 
envelopes  were  not  addressed  in  my  department. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  nothing  to  do  with  that? 

Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  any  special  form  of  letter  to  be  sent  to 
people  to  whom  you  wanted  deliA^ery  made  at  their  homes? 
Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  used  the  same  form,  did  you  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  different  cards  for  the  different  sub- 
scribers ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  different  colored  cards,  some  blue  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  were  the  blue  ones? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 
The  Chairman.  And  some  were  white? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Why  Avere  some  blue  and  Avhy  were  some  white? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  I  can  not  tell  you  that. 

The  Chairman.  Was  not.  one  color  used  for  Federal  emplo^^ees  and 
anotlier  for  those  who  Avere  not? 

Mr.  Talbot.  In  a  general  Avay,  I  think  that  is  correct. 

The  Chairman.  Why  not  tell  us  about  that?  What  is  the  use  of 
saying  "  in  a  general  Avay  "  ?  Is  not  that  a  fact  that  the  blue  cards 
AA^ere  for  Federal  officials? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  about  that ;  I  am  not  positive  about  it, 
because  that  Avas  not  in  my  department. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  you  say  "  in  a  general  Avay  "  that  was 
true  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  say  I  have  that  impression. 
The  Chairman.  It  is  your  impression  noAv? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  That  the  blue  cards  Avere  for  the  officials,  or  the 
Avhite  ones? 

Mr.  Talbot.  The  colored  cards ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  you  could  reach  into  the  place  and  get  a 
colored  card  that  would  mean  an  official,  and  then  you  would  send  the 
request  to  him  by  registered  letter;  Avas  not  that  the  S3^stem? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  did  not  knoAv  about  that,  because  I  had  nothing  to 
do  Avith  the  cards  Avhatever.   I  simply  wrote  the  letters. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  different  system  in  cities  of  over 
50,000  population  and  under  50,000? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  think  so ;  no,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  think  you  did? 

Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  this  work  being  carried  on  now? 
Mr.  Talbot.  In  Ncav  York. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2501 


The  Chairman.  Is  not  this  convention  hall  here  being  used? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Oh,  yes ;  that  is  being  used. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  what  rental  is  being  paid  for  that? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know.  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  large  a  force  is  in  the  convention  hall  doing 
this  work  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  that ;  I  have  not  been  down  there. 
The  Chairman.  And  you  also  have  offices  in  the  Woodward  Build- 
ing? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  spend  part  of  your  time  there? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  have  up  until  the  last  10  days. 

The  Chairman.  How  large  a  force  was  employed  there  up  to  that 
time  ? 

^Ir.  Talbot.  Let  us  see.  Well,  when  I  left,  I  should  think  there 
were  six  or  eight. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  morning  will  you  bring  us  the  form  let- 
ters: that  is,  samples  of  the  different  form  letters  and  samples 
of  the  colored  cards  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  think  I  can  get  those.  I  am  not  positive.  I  think 
I  can  get  them. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  1  guess  you  can  get  them  if  you  try.  You 
will  do  that,  will  you  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  will  try  to  do  so ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  This  activity,  as  I  understand  it,  was  solely  for 
the  purpose  of  raising  money  for  the  Democratic  national  campaign ; 
is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  You  mean  

Senator  Edge  (interposing).  This  activity  of  sending  out  letters 
broadcast  throughout  the  country. 
Mr.  Talbot.  Xot  entirely  so. 
Senator  Edge.  What  was  it  for  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Publicity  and  propaganda. 

Senator  Edge.  But  did  not  every  one  of  those  letters  contain  a 
request  for  funds  ? 

^Ir.  Talbot.  Oh,  no :  I  should  not  think  so ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  You  should  not  think  so,  and  you  are  the  letter 
writer  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  know  some  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  W^ould  you  furnish  us,  then,  to-morrow  morning,  a 
sample  form  of  letter  that  went  out  to  Democrats  without  any  sug- 
gestion of  funds  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir ;  I  think  I  can. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  object  of  that  letter? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Just  to  get  in  the  list  of  names. 

Senator  Edge.  The  original  inquiry  for  names  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  For  names. 

Senator  Edge.  And  after  you  received  that,  then,  were  any  letters 
sent  out  that  did  not  request  funds  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  No  ;  I  think  not. 

Senator  Edge.  That  clears  it  up.  Approximately,  how  many  letters 
did  you  send  out  during  this  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  You  mean  since  October  last  year  ? 


2502 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  since  you  started. 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know ;  I  would  say  about  300,000  letters. 
Senator  Edge.  All  under  first-class  or  special-delivery  postage? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  was  rather  an  expensive  undertaking,  was  it 
not  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  were  a  member  of  the  council,  as  I  understand 
it,  that  discussed  policy.  Did  you  have  any  limit  beyond  which 
you  would  not  have  accepted  funds  as  a  return  for  this  solicitation? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  I  think  not.  The  idea  was  to  get  a  great 
number  of  Democrats  who  were  willing  to  make  small  contributions, 
or  up  to  any  amount  he  did  care  to  make. 

Senator  Edge.  You  did  not  confine  it  to  small  contributions  in  the 
amount  that  you  mentioned  in  some  of  the  forms,  did  you? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  maximum? 

Mr.  Talbot.  The  maximum  

Senator  Edge  (interposing).  Amount  you  asked  for? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  can  not  state  as  to  that.   I  know  what  the  maximum 
I  asked  for  was— $1,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  it  $1,000? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  You  would  not  consider  that  a  small  contribution? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Oh,  no;  I  should  not.  But,  then,  we  have  asked 
others  for  much  smaller  amounts — a  dollar  or  two. 

Senator  Edge.  You  say  jou  sent  out  300,000  letters,  approxi- 
mately ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  That  would  be  my  guess. 

Senator  Edge.  If  the  response  had  been  at  all  satisfactory  and  the 
average  had  been  anything  you  want  to  make  it,  you  would  have 
returned  some  of  the  money  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Well,  that  would  not  be  for  me  to  determine. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  you  do  with  the  money  when  it  came  in ; 
where  was  it  sent  from  your  office  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  it  not  sent  to  the  national  treasurer? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not  know ;  I  presume  so.  I  have  nothing  to  do 
Avith  that  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  But  in  your  conferences  did  there  ever  appear  a 
suggestion  that  there  should  be  any  limit  to  the  amount  of  money 
that  you  should  raise  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  I  think  not ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  If  300,000  letters  were  sent  out,  and  if  the  average 
would  be  $10 — many  of  them  not  responding,  but  some  of  them  giv- 
ing $1,000  and  on  down — it  would  have  amounted  to  $3,000,000, 
would  it  not— ten  times  300,000? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Why,  certainly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  'V^Hiat  did  it  amount  to  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  was  just  going  to  ask  him  that  question.  How 
much  did  you  actually  get  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  As  I  understand  it,  we  were  out  $200,000. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2503 


Senator  Edge.  Then  the  response  from  the  people  all  over  the 
country  was  not  at  all  satisfactory  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  No,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  Was  not  inspiring? 
Mr.  Talbot.  Not  particularly  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Now,  so  far  as  I  understand  it  from  your  testimony, 
your  desire  and  hope  and  intent  was  to  raise  as  large  a  fund  as 
possible  ? 

Mr.  Talbot.  Absolutely;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  keep  on  with  that  system  you  will  be  pretty 
far  behind,  according  to  your  idea  ? 
Mr.  Talbot.  I  should  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  The  committee  w^ill  now  stand  adjourned  until 
10.30  o'clock  to-morrow  morning. 

(Thereupon  at  5.30  o'clock  p.  m.  the  committee  adjourned  to  meet 
to-morrow,  Friday,  September  24,  1920,  at  10.30  o'clock  a.  m.) 

X 


THE  UBHftHT  GF  THE 

DEC  12  1331 
UNIVERSITY  OF  ILLINOI 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGRESS 

SECOND  SESSION 

PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CxVMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  19 


Printed  for  tlie  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 

^  m  UBEART  GF  THE 
W       DEC  12  >331 

UNIVERSITY  OF  ILLINC 


382774 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


COMMrrj'EE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  JR.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware; 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Subcommittee  on  S.  Res.  357. 

WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMES  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


II 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


FRIDAY,  SEPTEMBER  24,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Washington^  D.  C. 
The  subcommittee  met,  pursuant  to  adjournment,  at  10.30  o'clock 
a.  m.,  in  room  426,  Senate  Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C,  Senator 
William  S.  Kenyon  presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman) ,  Edge,  Reed,  and  Pomerene. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  R.  P.  STEWART. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  full  name  for  the  record? 

Mr.  Stewart.  R.  P.  Stewart,  Assistant  Attorney  General, 

I  noticed  that  my  name  was  mentioned  in  connection  with  an  ac- 
count submitted  by  me. 

The  Chairman.  Have  3^011  the  vouchers  that  were  here  yesterday? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes.  Referring  to  voucher  25069,  submitted  by  me, 
that  was  in  connection  with  trips  to  Chicago,  Seattle,  and  San  Fran- 
cisco. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Attorney  General,  before  you  go  into  that 
suppose  you  indicate  in  a  general  way  what  part  of  the  work  of  the 
department  you  have  charge  of. 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  have  charge  of  the  fraud  cases,  the  criminal  work 
generally  throughout  the  United  States. 

In  connection  with  work  some  months  ago  there  was  a  considerable 
investigation  made  in  and  around  the  northern  Pacific  shipyard  dis- 
trict. A  congressional  committee — I  believe  it  was  part  of  the  Walsh 
committee — went  to  Seattle  and  came  back.  We  received  their  re- 
ports. We  had  a  large  number  of  men  investigating  that  condition 
there,  both  in  Seattle,  Portland,  San  Francisco,  and  San  Diego. 
This  work  was  carried  along,  and  finally  it  became  necessary  ta 
appoint  a  special  assistant.  We  appointed  a  man  named  Bird 
Schlessinger,  who  was  recommended  as  a  very  able  trial  lawyer  in. 
San  Francisco,  so  as  to  remove  the  local  influence  that  might  other- 
wise be  urged  in  case  we  had  appointed  a  man  from  Seattle. 

Senator  Reed.  This  man  lived  in  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  This  man  lived  in  San  Francisco — A.  B.  Schles- 
singer, a  well-known  attorney  of  that  city. 

Frequent  requests  were  received  for  some  one  connected  with  the 
department  to  come  to  Seattle.  Lawyers  connected  with  the  defense 
came  to  Washington  and  insisted  that  they  were  improper  cases^ 

2505 


2506 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


cases  that  should  not  have  been  brought,  and  should  be  dismissed. 
The  press  was  quite  active  in  its  denunciation  of  the  cases  that  were 
being  investigated.  That  necessitated  some  one  going  out  there. 
Preliminarily,  Mr.  Pagan,  an  indictment  expert,  was  sent  out.  He 
was  there,  I  think,  about  two  weeks  at  the  time  I  went  out  there. 
But  to  summarize  briefly,  to  go  on,  there  were  indictments  returned 
against  a  large  number  of  defendants  in  Seattle,  and  it  was  desired 
by  the  department,  and  considered  proper,  for  some  one  from  the 
department  to  go  there  who  was  authorized  to  direct  matters. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  a  general  way,  what  was  the  subject  of  these 
indictments  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  They  were  indictments  under  section  37,  indictments 
under  section  35,  the  filing  of  false  claims,  conspiracy  to  file  false 
claims,  and  conspiracy  to  defraud  the  Ignited  States  under  section  37. 
They  were  cases  of  wide-reaching  importance  and  involved  a  good 
deal  of  money.  Then  there  was  some  civil  litigation  at  that  time  in- 
volving about  $3,000,000.  It  was  talked  over  in  the  department,  and 
Judge  Ames  agreed  with  me  that  I  should  go  out  there,  and  some 
other  man  familiar  with  the  vast  amount  of  material. 

I  also  had  a  request  from  Mr.  Joseph  Fleming,  who  was  in  the 
I.  W.  W.  cases — known  as  the  Haywood  cases  in  Chicago — to  come 
out  there  and  see  a  situation  or  confer  with  him  as  to  a  situation  that 
had  developed  there.  He  was  not  satisfied  with  the  briefs  that  had 
been  filed  and  wanted  a  supplemental  brief,  and  I  had  that  also  to 
look  into.  Mr.  Humes,  a  special  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General, 
was  in  charge  of  the  Grunau  cases,  so  called.  I  left  as  soon  as  I  could 
leave  the  work  that  had  accumulated  in  the  department  and  went 
to  Chicago.   I  arrived  there  on  the  11th  

Senator  Eeed.  Of  June? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Of  June.  I  saw  Mr.  Fleming,  Mr.  Caldwell,  and  Mr. 
Clyne  in  the  afternoon,  and  finished  with  them.  Then  I  saw  Humes 
in  the  afternoon  and  made  an  appointment  and  saw  him  in  the  night, 
and  we  finished  up  the  matter  of  policy  that  was  in  question  as  to  the 
Grunau  case,  which  was  that  it  was  not  in  proper  shape  to  present  to 
a  o-rand  iury  at  that  time.  I  left  there  and  went  to  Seattle,  and  was 
on^the  train  the  11th,  12th,  and  13th,  arriving  in  Seattle  on  the  even- 
ing of  the  14th  of  June.  I  stayed  in  Seattle  until  the  20th  of  June; 
left  there  at  5  o'clock.  .  i  -^i 

From  that  time  I  conferred  with  everybody  connected  with  the 
cases  out  there,  and  went  into  the  matter  generally  and  made  arrange- 
ments where  omissions  had  been  made— conducted  such  conferences 
as  a  representative  of  the  department  would  conduct.      ^    ,    ,  ^  ^ 

Mr  Sclilessinger,  the  chief  man,  the  man  to  whom  we  looked  to  try 
the  case,  was  engaged  in  the  trial  of  whatsis  known  as  the  McDpnough 
case  out  in  San  Francisco  at  the  time.  I  decided  that  1  would  go  to 
San  Francisco.  I  went  there  and  arrived  on  the  22d.  I  saw  hchies- 
singer  several  days  with  Ben  Moore,  another  man  m  the  cases, 
and  we  had  a  very  thorough  conference  there.  I  decided  that  it  was 
proper  for  me,  if  I  desired  it,  considering  the  way  I  ^yas  feeling  at 
the  time,  to  take  annual  leave  if  I  desii;ed  I  l^^d  had  no  vacation 
and  I  took  from  the  25th  of  June  until  the  oth  of  July,  1920,  and 
made  no  charge  whatever  for  it.  o  i  i  o 

Referring  to  these  two  vouchers,  after  the  6th  oiMth  I  saw  Schles- 
sino-er.    Some  matter  had  been  forwarded  to  me  from  U  ashmgton, 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2507 


and  I  went  over  that  with  him.  I  left  on  the  8th  and  came  to 
Chicago,  where  Mr.  S.  R.  Rush  had  arranged  for  a  conference  on 
some  matters  he  had  been  engaged  in,  took  up  some  matters  with  Mr. 
Cl3^ne,  came  directly  back  to  Washington,  and  have  been  here  ever 
since. 

Senator  Edge.  When  were  these  congressional  committee  investi- 
gations? 

Mr.  Stewart.  That  was  the  Walsh  committee — I  think  sometime 
about  March,  or  possibly  before  that.  I  am  not  accurate  as  to  the 
time. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  did  not  they  occur  during  July, 
June,  or  August  of  1919? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  would  not  say  they  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  If  that  information  is  correct,  then  your  trip  out 
there  to  consider  some  of  the  conditions  that  arose  through  those  in- 
vestigations was  practically  a  year  later? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  There  was  nothing  in  the  Walsh  files  that  was  of 
material  assistance  to  us.  That  which  I  w^as  concerned  with  was  the 
data  that  our  agents  put  there  compiled. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understood  you  to  say  that  the  congressional  com- 
mittee had  developed  some  things  and  asked  some  representative  of 
your  department  to  go  out  there.   Did  you  not  say  that? 

Mr.  Stewart.  That  may  have  been  so  understood,  but  I  meant  to 
say  that  I  was  referring  to  that  for  the  purpose  of  identification  and 
mentioned  that  as  the  same  subject  matter  which  had  been  the  sub- 
ject of  investigation  by  our  department. 

The  Chairman.  Hoav  long  have  you  been  in  'the  department? 

Mr.  Stewart.  A  year,  July  last. 

The  Chairjian.  Where  was  your  home? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  South  Dakota. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  you  went  to  Chicago  on  this  trip  to  con- 
fer with  District  Attorney  Clyne? 
Mr.  Stewart,  I  did 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  see  him  there? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  did;  and  Mr.  Joseph  Fleming  also. 
The  Chairman.  Was  Mr;  Clyne  a  delegate  to  the  Saii  Francisco 
Convention  ? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  do  not  think  he  was,  but  I  think  lie  was  out  there. 
He  had  a  proxy — so  I  understood  afterwards. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  or  not  he  w^as  there  work- 
ing for  Mr.  Palmer? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Well,  I  did  not  see  him  do  any  work,  but  I  imagine 
he  would  work  for  Palmer  if  he  Avere  there. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  whether  he  was  a  delegate.  He 
had  a  proxy,  did  he  not,  and  he  kept  on  voting  for  Palmer  after 
every  one  else  had  left  him  ? 

Mr.  Steavart.  He  had  a  proxy. 

The  Chairman.  Your  conference  was  entirely  OA^er  department 
matters? 

Mr.  Steavart.  Absolutely;  and  Mr  Fleming,  particularly  

The  Chairman.  Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Steavart.  He  is  a  member  of  the  firm  of  McCormick,  Patter- 
son &  Fleming,  a  firm  of  attorneys  in  the  Tribune  Building. 
The  CHAHi.AiAN.  What  is  his  business? 


2508 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  a  former  assistant  United  States  attorney; 
and  we  had  a  man  in  the  Haywood  cases  for  a  year.  He  was  sud- 
denly stricken,  and  we  had  to  get  Joseph  Fleming  on  the  case.  He 
was  on  that  case. 

The  Chairman.  The  Haywood  case? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  the  matter  that  you  went  to  confer  with 
him  about? 

Mr.  Stewart.  That  was  one  of  the  matters. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  condition  of  the  Haywood  case  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  It  was  submitted  there.  It  was  argued  two  days 
after  I  was  there. 

The  Chairman.  Wliere  was  it  argued? 

Mr.  Stewart.  In  the  Circuit  Court  of  Appeals  of  the  Seventh 
Circuit. 

The  Chairman.  The  briefs  Avere  all  done  when  you  got  there? 
Mr.  Stewart.  The  briefs  had  been  prepared,  and  they  were  unsat- 
isfactory. 

The  Chairman.  A¥hat  changes  did  you  make  in  the  briefs? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Mr.  Fleming  had  the  proofs  of  a  supplementary 
brief.  He  was  dissatisfied  with  the  character  of  the  briefs  that  were 
filed  and  wanted  me  to  pass  on  this  supplemental  brief.  That  brief 
was  not  filed  until  after  the  argument. 

The  Chairman.  What  changes  did  you  make  in  the  brief? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Well,  you  mean  in  treatment  of  the  supplemental 
brief  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Stewart.  It  went  into  the  law  of  the  subject  of  search  and 
seizure. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  make  any  changes  in  it? 
Mr.  Steavart.  I  did  not  make  any  changes  in  the  brief  as  filed,  but 
simply  went  over  the  supplemental  brief. 
The  Chairman,  elust  looked  the  brief  over? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Could  you  not  have  looked  it  over  if  it  had  been 
sent  down  to  Washington? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  I  could,  without  a  doubt. 

The  Chairman.  There  was  no  particular  reason  for  your  going  to 
Chicago.   Who  asked  you  to  go  there  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Both  Clyne  and  Fleming. 

The  Chairman.  Had  they  written  you  letters  to  come? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Either  that,  or  Clyne  had  mentioned  it  personally 
when  he  was  down  there. 

The  Chairman.  When? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  do  not  know  just  when  it  was. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  Mr.  Clyne  had  requested  you  to  come. 
If  you  have  any  letter  from  Mr.  Clyne,  or  any  telegram  requesting 
you  to  come,  we  would  like  to  have  you  produce  it. 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  will  see  if  I  can  find  one. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  you  have  one  or  not? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  haA'^e  not  any  letter,  hoAV  did  you  get  the 
request  to  come? 


PRESIDEN^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2509 


Mr.  Stewart.  It  is  my  impression  that  I  got  it  from  Mr.  Clyne 
when  he  was  in  Washington,  and  there  may  be  a  letter.  It  is  my 
impression  that  there  is  a  letter  from  Mr.  Fleming,  and  I  will  look 
for  it. 

The  Chairmax.  When  was  he  in  Washington? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  has  been  down  a  good  rnam'  times. 
The  Chairman.  This  particular  time  when  he  requested  you  to 
come  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  have  not  recalled  that.  I  could  not  tell  you  that, 
sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  the  only  business  you  had  at  Chicago? 
Mr.  Stewart.  No  ;  I  wanted  to  see  Mr.  Humes. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Steavart.  Mr.  Humes  was  a  special  assistant  in  charge  of  a 
case  invohdng  the  outlaw  switchmen's  strike. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  condition  of  that  case  ? 

Mr.  Stea\  ART.  That  case  had  been  partially  investigated,  but  it 
was  declared  on  his  part  to  know  whether  he  should  go  ahead  with  it 
or  not,  in  view  of  the  testimony  that  he  had. 

The  Chairman.  Was  he  a  special  assistant? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was. 

The  Chairman.  Where  was  he  from? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  from  Pittsburgh. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  had  anything  to  do  with  the  Crucible 
Steel  case? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  think  he  did. 

The  Chairman.  W^as  he  at  Chicago  at  the  time? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  arranged  to  meet  him  there  or  did  you 
just  happen  to  meet  him? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  can  not  say  how  it  was  I  met  him.  I  was  going  to 
meet  him  there,  and  I  do  not  Imow  just  how  it  was  that  I  made 
arrangements ;  but  I  know  he  wanted  to  see  me.  I  think  it  was  by 
reason  of  a  phone  call  from  him  asking  that  I  would  be  there. 

The  Chairman.  Where  was  the  phone  call  from? 

Mr.  Stewart.  From  Chicago. 

The  Chairman.  At  that  time  had  an  injunction  been  issued  or 
applied  for  in  this  outlaw  strike  ?  Were  there  any  legal  proceedings 
started  in  the  outlaw  strike  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  that  the  injunction  had  been  issued. 

The  Chairman.  Had  been  issued? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  In  what  court? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know.  That  was  handled  by  Mr.  Mitchell. 
I  was  consulted  as  to  the  extent  of  the  evidence  which  Mr.  Humxes  had 
and  upon  which  he  expected  to  make  a  presentment  to  the  grand  jury. 

The  Chairman.  You  knew  the  facts:  you  went  over  the  facts,  did 
you  not  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Well,  in  a  general  way  with  him;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  were  the  facts  that  you  went  over? 

Mr.  Stewart.  The  facts  were,  as  he  developed  them,  that  these 
men,  by  virtue  of  an  agreement,  had  agreed  to  enter  into  this  strike 
and  thereby  limit  the  transportation  and  distribution  of  necessaries 
under  the  labor  act. 


2510 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chaikman.  Had  he  gone  ahead  and  gotten  a  decree,  a  tem- 
porary injunction? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No  ;  he  had  nothing  to  do  with  that.  He  had  been 
sent  down  there  

The  Chairman.  To  investigate  it  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Not  to  investigate  it,  but  to  take  the  results  of  the 
Chicago  investigation  and  present  them  to  a  grand  jury. 

The  Chairman.  Just  what  had  you  to  do  with  that? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  really  was  not  handling  that  particular  case,  but 
being  there  and  representing  the  department,  I  told  him  that  I  did 
not  think  that  he  had  sufficient  evidence  to  present  to  a  grand  jury. 

The  Chairman.  You  would  not  have  gone  to  Chicago  just  for  that 
purpose  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  would  not. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  did  not  go  there  just  for  that  purpose? 
Mr.  Stewart.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  real  matter  in  Chicago  was  to  look  over  the- 
supplementary  brief  in  the  Haywood  case  ? 
Mr.  k5TEWART.  It  was. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  a  brief  was  that? 
Mr.  Stewart.  It  was  in  proof  form  when  I  saw  it,  and  I  imagine 
it  had  about  100  pages. 

The  Chairman.  It  was  not  filed  until  the  matter  was  argued? 
Mr.  Stewart.  It  was  not. 

The  Chairman.  Did  the  court  grant  some  extension  of  time  for 
filing? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  it  did. 

The  Chairman.  So  it  could  have  just  as  well  been  sent  down  here 
free  of  postage  and  you  could  have  looked  it  over  here  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Then  just  Avhy  did  you  go  to  Chicago? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  was  on  my  way  to  Seattle,  and  I  stopped  off  and 
saw  these  gentlemen. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  arranged  to  go  to  Seattle  before  you 
decided  to  stop  off  at  Chicago  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  did  you  make  up  your  mind  to  go  to- 
Seattle  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  was  first  requested  to  go  to  Seattle  about  the 
latter  part  of  March  or  April. 
The  Chairman.  March  or  April? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes.  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Who  requested  you? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Mr.  Foster,  the  special  agent  in  charge  there. 
The  Chairman.  In  charge  where? 
Mr.  Stewart.  At  Seattle. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  cases  pending  there  then,  or  what 

was  the  

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Cases  were  pending? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Indictments? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Some  indictments  had  already  been  found. 
The  Chairman.  Had  any  cases  been  tried  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2511 


Mr.  Stewart.  None. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  the  district  attorney  there  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Mr.  Saunders. 

The  Chairman.  A  competent  man? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  assistants  has  he  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Two,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  Had  the  agents  of  the  Department  of  Justice 
been  out  at  Seattle  helping  in  this  case  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  How  many  of  them  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Fourteen  or  fifteen. 
The  Chairman.  How  long  had  they  been  out  there  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Since  about  January. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  district  attorney  and  his  assistants  

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  all  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  special  assistants  appointed  for 
that  work? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Two. 

The  Chairman.  Who  were  they? 

Mr.  Stewart.  One  was  a  Mr.  Ben  L.  Moore,  of  Seattle — first  Mr. 
Schlessinger  was  appointed  at  San  Francisco. 

The  Chairman.  Special  attorneys  in  those  cases? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  special  attorneys  are  there  in  the  De- 
partment of  Justice  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  have  been  appointed  in  the  last  six 
months  ? 

Mr.  Stew  art.  I  do  not  know  that,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Who  will  know  that  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Mr.  C.  E.  Stewart. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  the  chief  clerk  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  were  the  cases  at  Seattle? 

Mr.  Stewart.  There  had  been  a  very  broad  investigation  there,  and 
I  think  the  indictments  that  had  been  returned  at  that  time  were  in 
the  case  of  United  States  against  Blaine,  United  States  against  Ward, 
Schubach,  Rogers,  Shorts  and  some  others,  and  the  Seaborn  Ship- 
yards. 

The  Chairman.  Were  those  returned  in  March? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  it  was  about  the  first  part  of  April,  or  in 
March. 

The  Chairman.  What  were  the  shipyards  indictments? 
Mr.  Stewart.  You  mean  the  character  of  charges? 
The  Chairman.  The  shipyards  were  not  indicted,  were  they  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  The  corporations. 
The  Chairman.  What  were  they  indicted  for? 
Mr.  Stewart.  If  I  had  the  files  I  could  very  readily  give  you  that. 
The  Chairman.  You  know  in  a  general  way,  do  you  not  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  know  in  a  general  way  there  was  a  case  against 
Grays  Harbor  Motor  Corporation,  a  conspiracy  to  present  a  false 


2512 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


claim  for  money  alleged  to  be  due  the  corporation  by  reason  of  the 
bonus  which  they  were  entitled  to,  or  claimed  to  be  entitled  to,  under 
the  contracts  for  building  ships. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  was  the  false  claim? 

Mr.  Stewart.  In  that  case  I  have  forgotten  the  exact  amount;  I 
could  not  tell  you. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  large  or  small? 

Mr.  Stewart.  It  was  large. 

The  Chairman.  That  indictment  had  been  returned  around  the 
1st  of  April? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Around  the  1st  of  April. 

The  Chairman.  Has  that  case  been  tried  yet  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  was  it  tried? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Week  before  last. 

The  Chairman.  What  w^as  the  result  of  it? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  The  defendants  were  acquitted. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  time  did  these  12  or  14  special  agents 
spend  on  that  case? 

Mr.  Stewart.  All  of  their  time. 

The  Chairman.  For  how  long? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know.  You  asked  how  many  went  out 
there.  I  am  afraid  you  meant  about  Mai;ch  or  April.  I  do  not  know 
how  many  were  there  at  that  time.  You  would  have  to  ask  Mr.  Neal, 
of  the  Bureau  of  Investigation.   He  can  tell  you  the  exact  number. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  were  there  how  many  special  agents 
were  there? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Fourteen  or  fifteen,  accountants  and  all.  They  had 
a  number  of  accountants  there. 

The  Chairman.  Were  they  in  your  consultations? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Some  of  them  were. 

The  Chairman.  Did  they  all  go  out  from  here? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No,  sir;  they  went  from  different  parts  of  the 
United  States. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  of  those  special  agents  went  down  to 
San  Francisco  for  the  consultations  ?   Give  us  their  names. 

Mr.  Stewart.  None  went  for  any  other  consultation  at  San  Fran- 
cisco. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  went  to  the  Democratic  convention? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  that  any  went  for  that  purpose. 
The  Chairman.  How  many  were  there  during  the  time  you  w^ere 
there  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Mr.  Foster  

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  first  name? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Walter  C.  Foster. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  his  position? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  is  a  special  agent. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  from  Seattle  to  San  Francisco? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  did. 
The  Chairman.  When? 

Mr.  Stew  art.  We  went  down  in  the  same  train.  He  was  not  with 
me. 

The  Chairman.  His  expenses  were  paid  by  the  Government? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  assume  so. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2513 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  long  he  stayed  in  San  Fran- 
cisco ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not.  I  know  that  he  had  a  number  of  matters 
there. 

The  Chairman.  Oh,  yes ;  but  he  stayed  during  the  convention,  did 
he  not? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  did  he  leave  San  Francisco? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Who  else  went? 

Mr.  Steavart.  Mr.  Neal  went  down. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  Mr.  Neal's  first  name? 

Mr.  Stewart.  W.  J.  Neal. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  special  agent? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  the  Acting  Chief  of  the  Bureau  of  In- 
vestigation. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  gone  from  Washington  to  Seattle? 

Mr.  Stew^\rt.  He  did. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  with  you? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  went  with  me. 

The  Chairman.  Of  course,  at  Government  expense.  Where  is 
his  home — what  State  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  lives  here  in  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  But  what  State  does  he  come  from  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  think  he  is  a  resident  of  the  District. 

The  Chairman.  A  resident  of  Washington  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  did  he  stay  at  San  Francisco? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  stayed  there  as  long  as  I  did. 
The  Chairman.  That  was  until  after  the  convention? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  come  back  with  you  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir;  at  my  request.  He  was  going  on,  but  I 
told  him  I  thought  he  had  better  come  back. 

The  Chairman.  Where  was  he  going?   Where  did  he  want  to  go? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  desirous  of  staying  there  with  Mr.  Foster 
in  connection  with  some  further  investigation  of  the  San  Francisco 
Shipyard. 

Tlie  Chairman.  So  Mr.  Foster  stayed  a  while,  did  he  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  said  I  did  not  know  when  Foster  went  home. 
The  Chairman.  Who  else  went  down  with  you,  at  about  that  time, 
from  Seattle? 

Mr.  Stewart.  There  was  a  man  named  Kelly,  Ralph  Kelly,  special 
agent. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  his  home? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  gone  from  Washington  to  Seattle  with 
you  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No  ;  no  one  went  with  me  but  

The  Chairman.  Neal? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Was  Kelly  there  during  the  whole  convention  ? 
Mr.  Steavart.  Yes ;  I  saw  him  there. 


2514 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Where  did  you  see  him — around  the  Palmer  head- 
quarters ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes ;  on  the  street  and  in  the  hotel. 

The  Chairman.  Where  were  the  Palmer  headquarters? 

Mr.  Stewart.  At  the  St.  Francis  Hotel. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  spend  a  good  deal  of  your  time  there? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  saw  Mr.  Kelly  and  Mr.  Neal  and  Mr.  Foster 
there? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Off  and  on.   I  did  not  see  them  there  very  much. 

The  Chairman.  There  was  not  any  work  there  •  for  the  special 
agents  to  do  around  the  headquarters,  was  there  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  They  did  not  pretent  to  do  anything  except  to  drop 
in  there,  I  suppose? 

The  Chairman.  Who  else  besides  Mr.  Foster,  Mr.  Neal,  and  Mr. 
Kelly? 

Mr.  Stewart.  That  is  all  I  remember. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  of  any  more? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  of  any  more. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  of  the  employees  of  the  Department  of 
Justice  did  you  see  around  San  Francisco — most  all  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Does  that  cover  those  outside  of  the  immediate  de- 
partment in  Washington,  or  do  you  mean  that  I  know  over  the  United 
States  ? 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  start  with  Washington.    How  many  of 
the  employees  of  Washington  did  you  see  there  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  saw  Mr.  Scott,  and  Mr.  Spellisy. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Spellisy — who  is  he? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Assistant  Attorney  General. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Scott — what  is  his  position? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Private  secretary  to  the  Attorney  General. 
The  Chairman.  Who  else? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  saw  Mr.  Laskey. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Laskey? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  is  a  delegate  from  the  District.  He  is  United 
States  Attorney  in  the  District. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  first  name? 

Mr.  Stewart.  John. 

The-  Chairman.  Who  else  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  saw  Judge  Nebeker. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  Assistant  Attorney  General? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  see  Montrose? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  see  Mr.  Creighton? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  J.  T.  Creighton — what  is  his  position? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  just  what  his  position  is.  I  am  not 
familiar  with  his  position. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  he  was  there  at  the  expense 
of  the  Government? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  that,  I  know  he  had  been  away 
before  that  time. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  have  anything  to  do  with  your  business? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2515 


Mr.  Steavakt.  No,  sir;  nothing  to  do  with  my  business  at  all,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  remember  any  more  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  believe  that  I  can  recall  any  from  the 
city,  from  the  district.    I  saw  some  of  the  other  gentlemen. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  district  attorneys  around  the  United 
States  can  you  recall? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Well,  I  remember  seeing  Mr.  Wertz  there,  from 
Cleveland,  Ohio. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  district  attorney? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  delegate  ? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  first  name? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Edward. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Edward  S. 

The  Chairman.  What  others? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  saw  Mr.  Clyne,  of  whom  you  spoke.    I  saw  Mr. 
Murphy.   I  think  he  is  an  assistant  in  Detroit. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  his  first  name  ? 
Mr.  Stew^art.  I  do  not  know — John,  I  believe. 
The  Chairman.  What  others? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  recall  any  others. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  mean  to  say  that  is  all  the  district 
attorneys  there  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  It  is  very  difficult  to  recall  them.  I  had  not  thought 
of  this  matter.  I  did  not  expect  the  breadth  of  cross-examination. 
I  came  up  here  about  my  statement,  and  it  is  difficult  for  me  offhand 
to  recall  the  number  from  the  great  number  I  saw  tliere — the  people 
you  ask  for. 

The  Chairman.  I  appreciate  that.  Can  you  give  us  any  idea  as 
to  the  number  of  United  States  marshals  who  were  out  there?  Do 
you  know  any  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No.   I  believe  I  met  McCarthy,  from  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  the  marshal  of  the  southern  district  ? 

Mr.  Stew^\rt.  Yes,  sir.   I  do  not  know  the  marshals  very  well. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  or  not  all  these  different 
people  paid  their  own  expenses  out  there? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  think  the  delegates  all  paid  their  own  expenses. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  special  trains,  that  you  know  of, 
of  delegates  out  there,  paid  for  by  anybody  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Absolutely  not. 

The  Chairman.  That  is,  that  there  were  not,  or  you  do  not  know  ? 
Mr.  Steavart.  I  do  not  knoAV. 

Senator  Reed.  You  mean,  you  do  not  knoAv  of  anything  of  that 
kind? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  say  there  absolutely  were  not  ? 

Mr.  Steavart.  So  far  as  my  knowledge  would  enable  me  to  make 
any  statement  in  the  premises. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  too  busy  with  these  professional 
matters  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No;  I  did  not  say  that,  Mr.  Kenyon.  I  said  that 
after  the  25th  day  of  elune  I  stayed  in  San  Francisco  for  the  next  11 
days,  at  my  oAvn  expense,  and  took  an  annual  leave,  and  !  was  not 


2516 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


acting  in  connection  with  any  governmental  matter,  but  I  was  paying 
my  own  expenses. 

The  Chairman.  At  San  Francisco,  for  11  days? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  days  were  you  in  San  Francisco  al- 
together ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  arrived  there  the  23d.  I  was  three  days  in  con- 
ference, or  the  greater  part  of  three  days'  conference,  with  Mr. 
Schlessinger. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  this.   The  three  days  you  were  in  con- 
ference you  do  charge  to  the  Government  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  one  thing  that  is  not  clear  about  some- 
thing in  lieu  of  subsistence.  There  was  some  testimony  of  an  allow- 
ance of  $5  a  day;  then  on  the  vouchers  appears  something  in  lieu 
of  subsistence.    Will  you  clear  that  up  for  us  ? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  If  you  spend  $5  a  day  and  keep  receipts  for  the  ex- 
penditures, showing  that  you  have  made  actual  expenditures  of  $5 
per  day,  you  may  turn  in  those  receipts  and  receive  $5 ;  but  where 
you  fail  to  keep  receipts  you  live  on  $4  a  day  and  pay  your  hotel 
bills  and  meals  out  of  that.  It  means  Childs'  restaurants  as  soon  as 
you  get  to  a  city. 

The  Chairman.  You  could  hardly  go  through  a  Childs'  Restau- 
rant at  that,  now. 

Mr.  Stewart.  That  is  what  they  get — $4  a  day. 

The  Chairman.  For  three  days  you  were  in  consultation,  for 
which  you  charge ;  and  the  balance  you  do  not  charge  to  the  Govern- 
ment.  Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  charged  the  Government  for  the  6th  and  7th  of 
July,  you  will  see  in  my  account  there. 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  in  conference  those  days? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  was;  and  if  there  is  any  desire  to  verify  any  of 
these  statements  I  will  give  you  Mr.  Schlessinger's  address. 

The  Chairman.  Final  conference  with  special  assistant  Schlessin- 
ger— he  was  the  special  assistant  in  these  Washington  cases? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  put  in  because  of  the  desire  to  eliminate — — 

The  Chairman.  Those  days  you  make  a  charge  against  the  Gov- 
ernment ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  the  other  days  you  do  not  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  clear.  Where  did  you  have  your  confer- 
ences with  Mr.  Schlessinger? 

Mr.  Stewart.  In  his  office  in  the  Commercial  Bank  Building. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  spend  all  the  time  in  conference  with 
him? 

Mr.  Stewart.  The  major  portion  of  the  day,  in  the  morning  and 
afternoon.    I  was  in  a  great  deal.    I  was  looking  up  some  matters. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  ever  been  out  to  Seattle  or  San  Francisco 
before  to  consult  on  cases  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Had  you  ever  been  anywhere  to  consult  on  cases 
or  had  you  stayed  here  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Oh,  yes ;  I  had  been  around  at  Chicago. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2517 

The  Chairman.  Where  else? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  have  been  over  to  see  Mr.  Caft'ey,  to  New  York, 
several  times. 

The  Chairman.  Had  Mr.  Neal  ever  been  out  in  that  western  coun- 
try before  looking  up  these  cases  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No.  Mr.  Neal  had  a  very  valuable  knowledge  of 
these  cases.    He  had  lived  with  them. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  been  out  there  before? 

Mr.  Steavart.  He  had  not. 

Senator  Keed.  Why  did  he  go  this  time? 

Mr.  Steavart.  He  Avent  wi-th  me,  at  my  request. 

Senator  Reed.  Had  he  been  there  before? 

Mr.  Steaa^art.  He  had  not.  He  has  ample  correspondence  that  he 
would  be  very  glad  to  submit  to  the  committee  showing  the  desires 
for  his  presence  and  my  presence  there,  any  time  you  desire  it  here. 

The  Chairman.  What  Avas  this  Walsh  committee  that  you  speak 
of? 

Mr.  Steavart.  They  investigated  the  shipping  situation  in  the 
northern  Pacific  district,  in  the  first  instance,  I  believe.  Then,  after 
that,  they  were  unable  to  get  the  books  of  the  companies,  and  the 
district  attorney  did  not  turn  over  the  information  he  had  to  them, 
for  the  reason  that  there  Avas  some  little  friction  out  there.  The  re- 
port was  unsatisfactory,  and  then  our  people  got  busy,  at  the  request, 
I  think,  of  the  Shipping  Board.    I  do  not  know  who  handled  it. 

The  Chairman.  The  department  did  not  want  them  to  stir  the 
thing  up.  You  had  evidence  enough,  but  you  did  not  want  this  com- 
mittee to  stir  it  up? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No. 

The  Chairman.  I  remember  there  was  some  friction. 

Mr.  Steavart.  That  Avas  not  it.  It  was  the  idea  of  giving  them 
immunity  if  they  testified,  and  there  seemed  to  be  some  doubt  as  to 
what  the  immunity  status  would  be.  I  had  to  look  that  up  care- 
fully. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  indictments  out  there? 
Mr.  Steavart.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  before  you  went  out  or  after? 

Mr.  Stewart.  They  were  dismissed  recently,  following  the  ac- 
quittal. It  was  necessary  to  acquit  them,  because  they  were  subject 
to  trial,  and  they  did  not  want  to  bring  them  to  trial.  It  was  just 
nolle  prossed. 

The  Chairman.  Before  the  trial  had  any  of  the  indictments  been 
dismissed  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  were  the  ones  afterwards  who  were  dis- 
missed ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Blaine,  Magee,  the  Seaborn  Co.,  and  Ostrander. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  Blaine? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  the  district  manager. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  Ostrander  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  connected  with  the  Seaborn  people. 
The  Chairman.  Have  any  convictions  been  secured  out  of  these 
cases  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  None. 


2518 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES, 


The  Chairman.  Mr.  Blaine  was  a  very  prominent  Democrat,  I 
suppose  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  A  very  active  Republican. 

The  Chairman.  Was  Ostrander  an  active  Republican? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Were  the  indictments  all  against  Republicans? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  what  their  politics  was.  I  happen 
to  know  Blaine  because  of  a  reference  in  a  letter. 

The  Chairman.  These  gentlemen  whom  you  speak  of  as  being  out 
there  from  the  Department  of  Justice  were  around  the  Palmer  head- 
quarters most  of  the  time  working  for  Palmer  for  President  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Not  most  of  the  time ;  some  of  the  time  I  saw  them 
there. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  all  engaged  in  the  Palmer  campaign, 
which  would  be  natural  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know  about  that.  I  know  that  anything  I 
could  do  or  say  for  Mr.  Palmer  I  was  only  too  glad  and  proud  to 
do  it. 

The  Chairman.  They  were  doing  the  same,  were  they  not? 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know.    I  assume  they  were.    I  do  not 
know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  want  to  ask  you  two  or  three  questions,  if 
I  may. 

You  have  been  asked  by  the  chairman  of  the  committee  to  name 
certain  people  connected  with  the  Department  of  Justice  who  were 
out  there,  and  among  other  names  you  mentioned  Edward  S.  Wertz. 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  was  the  United  States  attorney  for  the 
northern  district  of  Ohio,  was  he  not  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  a  member  of  the  Ohio  delegation? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  he  went  out  there  as  a  delegate  for  Gov. 
Cox? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  understood  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Were  any  of  these  other  men  interested  in  the 
nomination  of  Gov.  Cox? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  think  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  being  so,  can  you  explain  what  relevancy 
this  investigation  has  to  the  candidacy  of  Gov.  Cox  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  The  present  investigation? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 
Mr.  Stewart.  I  am  unable  to. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  think.  Senator,  we  are  limited  to 
that? 

Senator  Pomerene.  No;  I  do  not  at  all;  but  I  claim  tlie  right  to 
point  out  the  fact.  It  may  be  that  you  are  entirely  within  the  scope 
of  the  resolution  if  j^ou  wish  to  go  into  these  matters — and  I  have 
not  any  doubt  they  ought  to  be  gone  into,  whether  by  this  committee 
or  by  some  other  committee,  in  view  of  the  charges  that  have  been 
made. 

Some  reference  was  made  to  a  special  train,  and  you  stated  that 
you  knew  nothing  about  any  special  train.   Did  you  know  that  there 


PKESIDEN^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2519 


was  a  special  train  or  two  special  trains  went  out  from  Ohio  in  the 
interest  of  Gov.  Cox? 

Mr.  Steavart.  I  did  not  know  it.    I  saw  quite  a  parade. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  I  am  not  on  the  stand,  but  Mr.  Wertz  was  on 
one  of  those  special  trains,  and  I  think  it  may  be  taken  for  granted 
that  he  paid  his  own  expenses.  I  think  that  much  is  due  to  Mr. 
Wertz. 

Mr.  Stewart.  In  enumerating  those  persons  whom  I  saw  there 
connected  with  the  Department  of  Justice,  in  response  to  the  chair- 
man's inquiry,  I  meant  to  convey  no  implication   * 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understood  that;  but  it  was  because  of  the 
state  of  the  record  that  I  wanted  that  to  be  maftj  perfectly  clear. 

I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  inquire. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  mentioned  one  of  the  men  who  was  there 
from  Ohio  as  a  delegate  for  Gov.  Cox  who  happens  to  be  one  of  the 
district  attorneys.  Were  any  of  these  other  men  that  you  have 
spoken  of,  except  Mr.  Clyne,  who  went  on  a  proxy  in  the  Illinois 
delegation,  delegates  to  the  convention? 

Mr.  Stewwrt.  Call  the  names,  and  then  I  can  tell  you,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  call  the  names  as  we  have  them  here : 

Mr.  Foster? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Neal? 

Mr.  Stew^art.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Kelly? 

Mr.  Stewart.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Laskey  was  a  delegate  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  a  delegate. 
Senator  Reed.  From  the  District  of  Columbia  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  the  district  attorney  here  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  But  he  was  a  regularly  chosen  delegate  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Judge  Nebeker,  who  is  Assistant  Attorney  General, 
was  not  a  delegate? 

Mr.  Stewart. "He  was  not  a  delegate. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Montrose  was  not  a  delegate  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  a  stenographer. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  the  individual  stenographer  for  the  Attorney 
General  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir ;  the  confidential  stenographer. 

Senator  Reed.  He  travels  with  the  Attorney  General  all  the  time  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  does. 

Senator  Reed.  All  the  time,  every  place  he  goes  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir;  and  at  that  particular  time  he  was  keep- 
ing up  for  the  Attorney  General,  through  the  medium  of  his  work, 
the  department  work  that  was  being  forwarded  to  the  Attorney 
General. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  at  that  time  a  number  of  matters  of  im- 
portance, great  importance,  that  the  Attorney  General  had  to  keep 
in  touch  with  ? 


182774— 20— PT  19  2 


2520 


PRESIDENTIAL  CHAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Stewart.  There  certainly  were. 
Senator  Heed.  And  this  man  was  his  clerk? 
Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  kept  track  of  things  for  him  and  helped  him 
in  carrying  on  his  official  work  ? 
Mr.  Stewart.  That  was  his  duty. 

Senator  liEiiD.  Such  as  would  be  necessary  Avhile  at  the  convention ; 
I  mean  such  as  woulct  be  necessary,  although  he  was  at  the  conven- 
tion.  It  was  official  work  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Wherever  he  was,  it  would  be  necessary. 

Senator  Eeed.  Mr.  Creigliton  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  no  delegate. 

Senator  Keed.  I  believe  Senator  Pomerene  asked  you  about  Mr. 
Wertz,  and  we  passed  over  Mr.  Clyne.   There  is  a  Mr.  McCarthy  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  the  New  York  marshal.  I  do  not  know 
whether  he  was  a  delegate  or  not. 

Senator  Reed.  And  Mr.  Murphy  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  think  he  was  a  delegate. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  also  a  Mr.  Spellisy. 

Mr.  Stewart.  He  was  a  delegate. 

Senator  Reed.  From  where? 

Mr,  Stewart.  Connecticut. 

Senator  Reed.  As  far  as  you  know,  he  paid  his  own  expenses? 
Mr.  Stewart.  He  did. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  nothing  unusual  about  the  fact  that  a  man 
who  has  been  prominent  enough  to  be  put  into  the  position  of  United 
States  district  attorney  or  United  States  marshal  still  retains  his 
political  affiliations  and  attends  a  convention  as  a  delegate?  There 
is  nothing  unusual  about  that  in  the  history  of  our  country  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Nothing. 

Senator  Reed.  A  man  does  not  lose  his  citizenship  because  he  hap- 
pens to  be  made  district  attorney  in  this  country. 

Would  you  have  made  this  trip  to  Chicago,  Seattle,  and  San  Fran- 
cisco if  there  had  been  no  Democratic  convention  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  certainly  would.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  when  I  went 
to  Chicago  the  Republican  convention  was  in  session,  and  when  I 
decided  to  stay  I  had  to  wait  for  the  Democratic  contention ;  but  that 
was  on  my  own  expense,  and  I  felt  justified  in  so  doing.  Wlien  I 
got  back  to  Chicago  the  Committee  of  Forty-eight  had  a  national 
convention.  So  it  was  not  a  matter  of  the  convention,  so  far  as  my 
going  was  concerned. 

Senator  Reed.  But  being  out  there  you  thought  that  you  had  the 
right  as  an  American  citizen  to  lay  off  on  your  own  time  and  go  down 
and  see  the  show  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  did,  and  saw  it. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  also  wanted  to  help  Mr.  Palmer,  your 
chief,  if  you  could  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  If  I  could.  I  do  not  think  I  was  able  to  do  much  for 
him,  but  I  was  willing  to  do  my  part. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  been  a  practicing  lawyer  how  long! 

Mr.  Stewart.  Nineteen  years. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  a  Democrat  in  politics  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2521 


Senator  Eeed.  Were  any  of  those  special  agents  Republicans  whose 
names  were  called  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  I  do  not  know.  I  know  Neal  is  a  Democrat,  but  I 
do  not  think  he  has  a  vote. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  from  the  District  of  Columbia  ? 

Mr.  Stewart.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

Mr.  Xebeker.  Mr.  Chairman,  will  the  committee  hear  from  me  ? 
The  Chairman.  I  think  the  committee  will  be  glad  to. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  FRANK  K.  NEBEKER,  ASSISTANT  ATTORNEY 
GENERAL  IN  CHARGE  OF  PUBLIC  LANDS,  DEPARTMENT  OF 
JUSTICE,  WASHINGTON,  D.  C. 

The  witness  Avas  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  State  your  full  name  and  the  position  3^011  occupy. 

Mr.  Nebeker.  My  name  is  Frank  K.  Nebeker,  and  I  am  Assistant 
Attorney  General  in  charge  of  public  lands  in  the  Department  of. 
Justice. 

I  am  here,  Mr.  Chairman  and  gentlemen,  because  of  information 
that  I  received  at  some  account  of  mine  or  a  trip  to  San  Francisco 
about  the  time  that  the  Democratic  convention  was  held  was  intro- 
duced in  evidence  before  the  committee  yesterday,  and  I  take  it  that 
the  inference  might  be  that  the  charge  of  $103.15, 1  think  it  was  which 
my  account  shows,  was  improperly  presented  by  me  and  improperly 
allowed ;  and  I  thought  it  fair  to  the  committee  and  to  myself  to  make 
an  explanation. 

I  want  to  be  as  brief  as  I  can.  In  the  first  place,  let  me  say  that 
the  Public  Lands  Division  at  the  Department  of  Justice  has  the 
supervision — at  least  I  do  that  officially  as  Assistant  Attorney  Gen- 
eral of  the  division — of  all  of  the  oil  litigation  in  the  State  of  Cali- 
fornia— oil-land  litigation;  we  call  it  "oil  litigation.-' 

There  are  pending  there  from  28  to  35  cases,  involving  that  many 
sections  of  land,  upon  which  there  are  producing  oil  wells. 

There  is  in  the  hands  of  receivers  in  the  State  of  California  in 
suits  that  have  been  brought  under  my  supervision  and  largely  under 
my  direction  over  $22 ,()()() ,()()()  in  cash. 

In  addition  to  that  there  is  a  suit  brought  by  the  Government  in 
condemnation  to  condemn  an  island  at  Coronado  Beacli,  owned  by 
the  Spreckels  interests,  or  claimed  by  them,  in  which  a  special  assist- 
ant has  been  busy  for  over  a  year,  but  which  resulted  in  an  extremely 
excessive  verdict,  as  I  felt,  and  that  verdict  was  rendered  by  the  jury 
just  a  short  time — probably  a  week  or  two;  I  would  not  say  now  ex- 
actly as  to  the  date — before  I  went  to  San  Francisco. 

But  these  various  matters  pending  in  California  had  been  pressing 
U|)on  me,  and  had  been  giving  me  a  great  deal  of  concern  for  some 
time,  and  I  did  put  them  oft — and  I  will  be  candid  in  that — not 
until  I  felt  it  to  the  disadvantage  of  the  Government,  but  I  did  delay 
my  trip  so  that  I  could  time  it  to  be  at  the  Democratic  convention. 

Now,  I  started  out  from  here  on  the  8th  "day  of  June.  I  can  not 
give  you  the  dates,  as  Mr.  Stewart  has  done  in  his  testimony,  because 
I  gave  my  data,  what  I  had,  to  my  secretary  when  I  got  back,  and  to 
Mr.  Harris,  the  head  of  the  accounts  division,  in  whicli  I  have  the 


2522 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAR'IPATGN  EXPENSES. 


dates,  and  I  have  dismissed  it  from  my  mind,  and  I  could  not  give 
the  exact  dates,  as  Mr.  Stewart  has  done. 

Senator  Pomekene.  You  can  <:et  them  if  necessary,  can  you? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  I  can  get  them, 

I  left  here  on  the  8th — I  remember  that.  I  traveled  from  here  to 
Chicago  with  the  sj^ecial  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General,  who  was 
on  his  way  to  Oklahoma  and  who  lias  charge — and  who  was  ap- 
pointed by  me,  practically,  or  by  the  Attorney  General  at  m.y  sug- 
gestion— to  tal^e  charge  of  the  boundary-line  suit  between  the  State 
of  Oklahoma  and  the  State  of  Texas,  in  which  the  Government  is 
vitally  interested,  and  which,  perhaps,  is  the  biggest  civil  suit,  the 
largest  am_ount  of  money  and  property  involved,  that  has  ever  been 
brought  in  any  court  in  the  country.  I  traveled  with  him  and  Avas 
in  constant  consultation  with  him  from  here  to  Chicago.  I  went  a 
day  before  I  intended  to  g)  so  as  to  be  with  him  and  go  over  the 
matter  of  getting  the  case  in  shape  for  presentation  at  an  early  date 
in  October  or  November  to  the  Supreme  Court,  it  being  an  original 
case  in  the  Supreme  C  ourt  on  some  preliminary  question. 
•  I  had  been  asked  to  have  a  consultation  with  Mr.  Fleming,  whose 
name  has  been  mentioned  here.  I  prosecuted  the  Haywood  case.  I 
was  then  special  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General.  I  personally  con- 
ducted the  trial  of  that  case,  resulting  in  the  conviction  of  Haywood 
and  100  of  the  leaders  of  the  I.  W,  W.  They  were  in  some  trouble 
as  they  approached  the  argument  of  the  case  on  appeal.  Mr. 
Stewart  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  Who  was  "in  some  trouble"? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  The  attorneys  for  the  Government  were  more  or  less 
perplexed  about  the  situation  as  it  came  up.  The  case  had  been 
briefed,  but  one  of  the  attorneys  who  had  spent  most  of  his  time  in 
briefing  the  case  was  suddenly  taken  ill  and  unable  to  go  on,  and 
Mr.  Stewart  asked  me  to  go  and  see  Mr.  Fleming  and  give  him  the 
benefit  of  my  advice  on  some  questions  which  I  would  know  about, 
because  of  my  long  familiarity  with  that  trial.  The  trial  took  four 
and  one-half  solid  months  of  time  to  try,  and  the  record,  I  suppose, 
about  the  largest  in  size  that  has  ever  been  made  in  court,  went  into 
the  millions  of  words. 

Well,  all  the  time  I  was  in  Chicago  I  was  in  conference  and  contin- 
uous session  with  Mr.  Fleming. 

I  then  left  Chicago  and  I  went  to  Salt  Lake  City.  There  I  spent 
four  or  five  days,  or  perhaps  more. 

Senator  Reed.  On  Government  business? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  On  Government  business;  and  I  will  explain  what 
it  was.  There  were  tw^o  definite  matters:  One  was  a  consultation 
with  the  special  assistant  whose  headquarters  is  in  Denver,  who  has 
charge  of  all  the  oil-land  litigation  in  the  State  of  Wyoming,  and 
also  the  White  Earth  Indian  litigation  in  the  State  of  Minnesota. 
He  came  to  Salt  Lake  City  

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  his  name? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Mr.  Bell — and  his  initials  I  do  not  remember — Mr. 
Bell,  however.  He  came  there,  and  I  went  over  both  matters  with 
him  very  deliberately,  and  they  were  matters  I  needed,  I  assure  you, 
to  give  my  attention  to  and  to  consult  about  across  the  table. 

Many  of  these  things  can  not  be  done  well  by  correspondence. 
W"e  can  not  get  the  atmosphere  of  our  litigation  and  our  troubles  by 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2523 


correspondence  and  reports,  and  it  is  an  extremely  good  thing  for  the 
Assistant  Attorneys  General  to  go  out  more  among  the  special  assist- 
ants and  assmne  a  more  direct  responsibility  for  litigation. 

In  addition  to  that,  in  Salt  Lake  City  I  selected  a  special  assistant 
attorney,  under  a  demand  for  one  to  be  sent  into  Montana  to  take 
care  of  some  very  important  work.  That  took  me  considerable  time. 
In  the  first  place,  it  was  a  line  of  litigation  that  attorneys  did  not 
care  A^ery  much  about  and  at  the  same  time  which  required  an  at- 
torne}^  with  a  good  deal  of  ability  to  do  this  particular  work. 

Well,  I  spent  the  rest  of  my  time  while  I  was  in  Salt  Lake  City  on 
that ;  that  is,  on  those  two  matters  I  was  engaged  all  the  time. 

I  then  went  on  to  San  Francisco,  and  during  the  entire  time  that  I 
was  there  I  doubt  if  there  was  a  day  when  I  was  not  engaged  in  some' 
public  business. 

I  have  one  special  assistant  there  who  has  an  office  and  who  is  in 
charge  of  all  of  this  oil-land  litigation. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Will  you  give  his  name,  please  ? 
Mr.  Nebeker.  His  name  is  Henry  F.  May. 

This  oil-land  litigation,  on  account  of  the  passing  of  the  leasing 
bill,  was  presenting  some  questions  to  the  department  that  were  very 
perplexing  to  me,  and  one  of  my  purposes  in  going  there  was  to  get 
my  bearings  and  get  a  proper  understanding,  so  that  I  could  handle 
the  problems  that  were  coming  up  under  the  leasing  bill  in  regard 
to  applications  for  lease,  it  being  necessary  under  the  act  to  present 
applications  before  the  25th  of  August  of  this  year.  There  was  also 
there  a  special  assistant  under  my  direction  and  supervision,  Mr. 
Williams,  who  has  charge  of  suits  brought  by  the  Government  under 
the  revestiture  act,  as  we  call  it,  of  1916,  to  repossess,  get  back  into 
the  Government,  the  title  to  something  like  2,000,000  acres  of  land 
that  were  granted  by  the  Government  to  the  California  &  Oregon 
Kailroad  Co.  Mr.  Williams  had  been  ill  for  some  time,  quite  seriously 
ill,  and  one  of  the  things  that  I  felt  was  encumbent  upon  me  was  to 
go  there  and  see  just  how  the  situation  was  in  respect  to  the  condition 
of  that  litigation ;  and  I  gave  that  my  attention. 

There  are  two  other  special  assistants  there  in  San  Francisco,  Mr. 
Lacy  and  Mr.  Hammil,  w^ho  are  in  charge  of  extremely  important 
matters  for  the  department,  and  I  was  in  consultation  with  them. 

Then  Mr.  Dineen,  who  has  charge  of  the  Coronado  Beach  condem- 
nation case,  that  I  have  referred  to,  came  over  from  Los  Angeles^ 
and  he  and  I  consulted  together  off  and  on  over  the  question  of  mak- 
ing up  the  proper  kind  of  record  for  appeal  to  the  Supreme .  Court 
of  the  United  States,  it  being  a  case  that  could  be  appealed  directly 
under  the  statute  under  which  the  suit  was  brought. 

As  I  say,  I  think — and  I  say  it  most  sincerely — that  the  burden 
that  was  upon  me  there  and  the  interest  that  was  upon  me  was  these 
very  important  matters. 

Now,  incidentally,  I  attended  the  convention  a  few  days.  I  talked 
favorably  for  Mr.  Palmer.  I  was  interested  in  his  campaign;  I 
would  have  been  glad  to  have  done  a  good  deal  more  than  I  was 
able  to  do.  But  the  trip  was  necessary.  It  was  simply  fortunate, 
as  I  viewed  it,  that  I  could  so  time  it  as  to  perform  that  other  great 
service  for  my  country,  namely,  the  attending  of  the  Democratic 
convention. 


2524 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  So  that,  Mr,  Nebeker,  you  had  matters  to  attend 
to  in  the  West,  and  you  arranged  those  matters  so  you  could  at  the 
same  time  attend  the  Democratic  convention;  that  is  about  the 
substance  of  it? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  That  is  it ;  that  is  what  I  wish  to  be  understood 
to  say. 

The  ChairMx^n.  Had  you  been  West  before  on  any  of  these 
matters  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Yes;  I  was  as  far  as  Denver  on  this  oil-land  litiga- 
tion. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  not  been  to  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Nereker.  No;  and  I  should  have  gone  on.  And  there  are 
several  others;  for  example,  the  Lake  Tahoe  matter,  which  I  con- 
sidered while  I  was  in  San  Francisco. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  been  Assistant  Attorney  Gen- 
eral? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Since  a  year  ago  June. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  the  first  time  you  have  gone  to  San  Fran- 
cisco for  consultation? 
Mr.  Nebeker.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  hear  the  first  of  your  testimony.  Have 
you  been  asked  the  question  as  to  the  number  of  Assistant  Attorneys 
General  or  special  assistants  or  other  attaches  of  the  department  in 
Washington  who  were  in  San  Francisco  at  the  same  time? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  No  ;  I  have  not  been  asked  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  at  all?  Could  you  give  us  general 
information? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  I  could  not  give  you  anything  in  addition  to  what 
Assistant  Attorney  General  Stewart  has  given  you,  and  I  do  not 
have  all  the  information  that  he  had. 

Senator  Edge.  You  could  not  enlarge  on  that? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Yes;  I  can.  I  know  that  Judge  Ames  was  there— 
the  special  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General.  I  think  he  was  not 
mentioned.  I  think  he  was  a  delegate  from  Oklahoma,  and  voted 
for  Senator  Ow^en  all  the  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Could  you  enlighten  the  committee  at  all,  from  your 
own  knowledge,  as  to  reasons,  without  our  sending  for  all  these  other 
men,  being  there  at  this  particular  time?  You  have  given  your 
reasons  very  clearly. 

Mr.  Nebf^ker.  I  am  very  sorry  that  I  have  absolutely  no  informa- 
tion about  that.  My  division  is  rather  occupied  a  little  differently  in 
the  Department  of  Justice  than  any  other  and  I  know  less  about 
routine  matters  outside  of  my  particular  division  than  any  other 
Assistant  Attorney  General,  I  suppose. 

The  Chairman.*^  How  many  special  assistants  have  you? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  How  many  in  my  division  ? 

The  Chairman.  In  your  division. 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Well,  now.  Senator,  I  think  it  would  be  only  a  guess, 
but  I  think  about  12  to  15. 

The  Chairman.  Has  the  number  been  increased  at  all  in  the  last 
five  or  six  months  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Mine  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  give  us  any  idea  of  the  number  of  special 
assistants  in  the  whole  department? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2525 


Mr.  Nebeker.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Who  could  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Why,  the  chief  clerk,  Mr.  C.  E.  Stewart,  undoubt- 
edly could,  if  you  would  give  him  an  opportunity  to  look  it  up.  They 
have  the  roll  there. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  any  more  assistants  in  your  depart- 
ment than  the  duties  of  the  office  require  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  I  am  sure  there  are  no  more  in  my  division.  Now, 
1  speak  only  for  that.  I  am  willing  to  have  my  division  investigated 
so  far  as  that  feature  is  concerned,  because  I  know  I  have  got  efficient 
men,  and  I  have  got  no  one  but  what  is  charged  with  heavy  responsi- 
bility and  is  earning  every  dollar  and  more  than  he  is  getting. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  quite  a  number  of  those  assistants  have 
been  in  your  department  for  many,  many  years? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Oh,  yes;  a  good  many  of  them.  I  made  no  changes 
in  my  division  when  I  came  along.  I  think  I  have  as  many  Repub- 
licans in  my  division  as  there  are  Democrats.  I  do  not  think  there  is 
any  doubt  about  that.  I  have  paid  less  attention,  perhaps,  than  I 
ought  to  have  to  that  matter,  being  in  charge. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  had  pretty  responsible  duties,  judge; 
I  know  that. 

Senator  Edge.  We  understood  from  the  Auditor  of  the  Department 
of  Justice  yesterday  that  the  assistant  O.  K.ing  accounts  is  entirely 
confined  to  what  he  termed,  I  think,  "  members  of  the  administrative 
force."  Is  that  your  understanding  as  to  the  O.  K.ing  and  approving 
of  these  vouchers  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Oh,  I  understand  so;  that  is  called  the  accounting 
division. 

Senator  Edge.  And  if  you  make  a  trip  such  as  you  have  described, 
you  pass  your  voucher  over  to  another  assistant  attorney  general  for 
approval,  or  what  is  the  system  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Well,  I  think  that  is  very  often  done;  yes.  These 
men  who  handle  the  routine  know  there  has  got  to  be  at  least  an 
Assistant  Attorney  General's  approval  of  an  account.  Now,  some- 
times they  bring  them  to  me,  even  if  they  arrive  in  Stewart's  divi- 
sion ;  they  take  mine  to  Stewart. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  rather  a  perfunctory  responsibility  ? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  Yes ;  it  is. 

Senator  Edge.  For  instance,  who  approved  your  voucher? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  I  do  not  know ;  it  will  show  for  itself. 

Senator  Edge.  You  need  not  look  it  up.  We  want  just  to  get  the 
general  system  before  us. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  some  assumption  that  an  Assistant  At- 
torney General  who  turns  in  an  account  is  going  to  turn  in  an  honest 
account,  and  they  probably  are  not  inspected  as  closely  as  they 
would  be  if  they  were  made  by  a  lot  of  petty  larceny  thieves? 

Mr.  Nebeker.  I  should  suppose  that  is  so.  Is  there  anything 
further? 

The  Chairman.  There  is  nothing  further,  Judge. 
Mr.  Nebeker.  I  thank  you. 


2526 


PRESIDENTTAI>  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


TESTIMONY  OF  ME.  JOSEPH  L.  HEFFERNAN,  SECRETAEY-TREAS- 
UEER  STARS  AND  STRIPES  PUBLISHING  CO.,  BOND  BUILDING, 
WASHINGTON,  D.  C. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  What  is  your  name? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  My  name  is  Joseph  L.  Heifernan. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  business? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  am  secretary-treasurer  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes 
Publishing  Co. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  that  a  corporation? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  is  it  located? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  The  main  office,  Washington,  D.  C. 

Senator  Reed.  What  does  it  do? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Publishes  a  weekly  newspaper. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  it  called? 

Mr.  PIeffernan.  The  Stars  and  Stripes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  object  of  this  newspaper? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  To  purvey  the  news  of  special  interest  to  mem- 
bers of  the  former  Army  serving  in  the  A.  E.  F.,  and,  in  a  less  direct 
way,  to  the  general  public. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  has  that  paper  been  printed? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Since  June  15,  1919,  in  Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  "  in  Washington  "  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  it  printed  at  some  other  place  before  that  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Prior  to  that  date  it  was  the  official  organ  of  the 
A.  E.  F.  in  France. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  an  overseas  man  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Y'es,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  print  this  paper  and  you  send  out  new^s  of 
interest  to  the  former  soldiers  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  A  sort  of  an  official  organ  of  former  soldiers,  is  it? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir.  We  declare  that  it  is  an  independent 
organ  representing  the  phase  of  soldier  opinion.  It  is  our  standard ; 
it  is  an  independent  organ  for  all  veterans. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  there  been  any  effort  made  ever  to  take  the 
control  or  get  the  control  out  of  your  hands  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.  We  have  met  constant  opposition  since 
the  time  we  started  in  Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  from? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  From  various  persons,  but  all  seeming  to  center 
around  one  particular  activity.  There  w^as  an  effort,  first  of  all, 
made  to  keep  us  from  using  the  name.  After  that  there  has  been 
constant  effort  to  keep  us  from  getting  advertising. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  made  the  effort  about  the  name  ?  Y^ou  said  it 
all  seemed  to  center  around  one  thing.   Now,  what  is  that  one  thing  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  The  effort  to  keep  us  from,  first,  using  the  name 
emanated  from  New  York,  and  Secretary  of  War  Baker  was  the 
instrument  used.  He  addressed  a  communication  to  Congress  asking 
that  the  name  be  not  used,  but  he  did  it,  as  far  as  I  can  determine, 
at  the  instigation  of  Theodore  Roosevelt,  jr. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2527 


Senator  Reed.  AVell,  is  there  anything  else  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Roosevelt  wanted  to  get  this  paper  himself  and 
use  the  name  as  the  ofHcial  organ  of  the  American  Legion,  and  he 
did  not  succeed  in  taking  over  the  name  prior  to  the  time  that  we 
started  it  here  in  Washington,  and  since  that  time  we  have  had  con- 
stant opposition  from  Roosevelt  and  from  the  American  Legion; 
that  is,  not  the  Legion  as  a  body,  but  from  the  leaders  of  the  Legion. 
The  men  of  the  Legion  are  its  best  supporters.  We  have  representa- 
tives in  nearly  every  post-  in  the  country.  The  men  at  the  head  of 
the  Legion  have  been  constantly  attacking  and  nagging  us  ever  since 
w^e  started. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  there  been  any  effort  made  to  purchase  your 
paper?    That  is  what  I  want  to  get  at. 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  there  has  been. 
Senator  Reed.  Whom  by  ?    Tell  us  about  it. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  There  v>^as  a  man  came  on  from  New  York,  a 
Mr.  Richard  H.  Waldo,  at  that  time  an  employee  of  the  Du  Pont 
powder  interests,  and  he'  had  sessions  with  us  at  the  New  Willard 
Hotel  during  the  past  year  and  advised  us,  very  smilingly,  that  we 
should  sell  to  the  interests  that  he  represented.  He  said  if  we  did 
not  sell  that  he  would  be  bankrupt  within  six  months. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  this  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  It  was  Richard  H.  Waldo. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  were  the  interests  he  said  he  represented  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  He  did  not  state  specifically,  but  at  the  time  he 
was  employed  by  Du  Pont. 

Senator  Reed.  By  the  Du  Pont  Powder  Co.  or  Coleman  Du  Pont  ? 
There  are  two  branches  of  the  Du  Ponts. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  can  not  distinguish  them.  I  never  ascertained 
that;  in  fact,  I  never  specifically  tried  to,  except  I  knew  he  was 
employed  by  the  Du  Pont  interests.  I  do  not  know  just  how  they 
overlap.  I  had  an  idea  it  was  the  powder  interests,  because  at  the  time 
he  was  at  the  head  of  the  Foreign  Language  Newspaper  Service,  a 
string  of  papers  purporting  to  speak  for  the  foreign-language  news- 
papers of  the  country,  but  in  reality  controlled  by  the  Du  Pont  inter- 
ests and  used  by  them  as  a  means  of  propaganda. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAV  whether  that  is  E.  Coleman  Du  Pont, 
the  man  who  was  in  politics,  or  is  it  the  powder  people,  who  may  or 
may  not  be  in  politics,  I  do  not  know  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  can  not  say  that.  That  would  be  assumed,  be- 
because  he  was  at  the  time,  as  we  all  knew,  employed  by  the  Du  Ponts. 
But  I  have  not  any  definite  information  as  to  which  branch  of  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  this  man  undertook  to  buy  you  out.  Did  he 
make  an  offer  of  money — how  much  money  they  would  give? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir ;  his  offer  was  more  in  this  wise :  That  if 
we  did  not  sell  out  we  could  not  get  any  advertising;  that  the  big 
interests  would  not  recognize  us  because  were  were  an  independent 
soldier  paper  and  spoke  what  we  thought.  On  the  other  hand,  if  we 
did  sell  out  to  the  men  he  represented  in  New  York,  he  would  head 
the  paper  and  would  retain  the  ones  at  that  time  actively  engaged 
in  the  paper  in  good  positions. 

The  Chairman.  He  would  "  retain  " — that  is,  this  Waldo  or  the 
du  Ponts? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  This  Waldo. 


2528 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Waldo  himself  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  he  would  retain  you  and  the  other  people 
actively  engaged  on  the  paper  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  \  ou  say  that  this  man  was  connected  with  the 
du  Fonts  and  was  concerned  in  the  foreign-language  newspaper  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  understand  that  they  owned  the  foreign- lan- 
guage newspapers,  or  that  they  owned  an  advertising  agency,  or 
that  they  controlled  an  advertising  agency  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  They  controlled  those  papers. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  whatever  du  Pont  it  was,  it  was  the  one  that 
w^as  concerned  in  the  foreign-language  newspaper  that  this  man 
represented  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  the  matter  boiled  down  to  a  few  words,  as  I 
understand  you,  is  this :  He  made  a  proposition  to  buy,  and  said  that 
if  you  did  sell  that  you  and  your  force  would  be  retained ;  and  that 
if  you  did  not  sell  that  you,  in  less  than  six  months,  would  go  into 
bankruptcy,  and  that  you  would  not  be  permitted  to  have  adver- 
tising. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  see  this  man  more  than  once  yourself  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  He  made  two  or  three  trips  here.  He  came  once, 
and  then  he  said  he  would  have  to  go  back  to  New  York  and  consult 
his  people,  and  then  he  would  come  down  again. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  effect  a  bargain? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir;  w^e  never  did. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  why  not  ?  Did  you  refuse  to  sell,  or  what  was 
the  reason? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  think  the  principal  reason  was  that  we  were 
incorporated  and  that  he  was  trying  to  deal  with  three  of  us  who 
were  on  the  paper,  and  we  never  figured  that  the  others  of  the  stock- 
holders and  members  of  the  corporation  would  consent  to  selling  out 
in  that  particular  Avay,  and  therefore  we  never  could  reach  an  agree- 
ment with  him. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  make  him  an  offer?  Did  you  name  a 
price  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  yon  have  any  interference  with  the  conduct  of 
your  paper  after  that  in  the  matter  of  getting  advertisements,  or 
any  other  way  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir;  for  some  strange  reason,  although  with 
a  bona  fide  circulation  of  over  100,000,  we  can  not  get  advertising. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  anything  else  3^ou  want  to  tell  the  com- 
mittee about  tliis? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  do  not  think  of  anything. 

Senator  Edge.  I  would  like  to  ask  a  question  right  there  on  that 
advertising,  without  interrupting  you.  Senator. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Just  a  minute.    AYho  is  Senator  Edge? 
Senator  Edge.  I  am  Senator  Edge. 

Mr.  Heffer*nan.  If  the  chairman  please,  and  the  members  of  the 
committee,  I  would  like  to  state  that  I  do  not  think  it  is  fair  for 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2529 


Senator  Edge  to  sit  in  on  this  committee  at  this  time,  and  to  take 
m}^  testimony,  and  to  have  any  connection  with  this  testimony  of 
mine,  because  he  is  acting  in  a  dual  capacity,  both  as  prosecutor 
and  judge.  Senator  Edge,  I  have  direct  information,  is  in  direct 
touch  with  the  people  who  are  now  trying  to  wreck  our  paper,  and 
that  this  Aveek  he  has  been  in  consultation  with  men  most  actively 
in  this  scheme,  of  whatever  kind  it  is,  against  us ;  that  he  is  in  direct 
touch  with  Scott  Bone,  the  director  of  publicity  for  the  Republican 
Party,  and  Delancey  Koons,  a  man  whom  we  also  have  information 
has  been  willing  to  buy  our  paper  if  he  could  consolidate  it  with 
the  American  Legion  Weekly,  and  that  the  Washington  correspond- 
ent of  the  American  Legion  Weekly  was  called  to  New  York  Tues- 
da}"  night  to  try  to  get  what  information  he  could  against  us,  and 
that  Herold  Eoss,  the  editor  of  the  American  Legion  Weekly,  was 
also  called  in  on  this,  and  that  Senator  Edge  is  in  this  'scheme, 
whatever  kind  it  is,  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  Just  a  moment,  please.  I  do  not  want  to  inter- 
rupt, but  let  us  get  this  clear.  You  say  that  you  have  information 
of  all  this  terrible  list  of  charges  ? 

Mr.  Hefferxan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  insist  that  you  give  us  that  information  right 
here — not  riunors,  but  names  and  facts  and  all  that  would  justify 
any  such  an  even  suggested  or  implied  charge. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  This  information  came  to  us  in  a  confidential 
way  this  week. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  take  confidential  information  and  come  in 
here  and  make  charges  against  a  member  of  the  com.mittee  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir ;  I  am  not  making  a  charge. 
The  Chairman.  Give  us  your  information. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  am  asking  this  committee,  if  I,  as  a  citizen  and 
the  citizens  of  the  country  represented  through  me,  are  to  be  sub- 
jected to  that  ? 

The  Chairman.  Is  it  fair  for  you  to  make  charges  against  Senator 
Edge,  and  then  refuse  to  give  your  information?  Do  you  think  that 
a  fair  proposition?   Of  course,  we  are  not  trying  Senator  Edge. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  He  is  trying  me,  and  I  am  trying  to  give  you  the 
facts. 

Senator  Edge.  I  may  say,  without  interrupting  the  gentleman,  that 
I  am  quite  ready  to  be  tried,  but  if  it  will  assist  the  gentleman  in  his 
statement  of  rumors  I  personall}^  have  never  even  heard  of  Delancey 
Koons,  or  whatever  the  name  is,  as  I  understood  it.  Mr.  Scott  Bone, 
I  know  quite  well  who  he  is,  but  so  far  as  I  know  I  do  not  think  I 
ever  met  him  personally. 

The  other  men  you  speak  of,  the  names  mentioned,  as  I  find  them 
on  my  memorandum,  I  do  not  think  I  even  knoAv  personally,  directly 
or  indirectly  in  any  Avay.  So,  not  that  it  is  necessary  for  me  to  make 
such  a  statement— far  froirf  it,  but  I  want  to  relieve  your  mind  so 
far  as  any  possible  injury  or  feeling  of  that  kind  is  concerned. 

The  Chairman.  Who  asked  you  to  make  that  statement  as  to 
Senator  Edge? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Nobody.  I  talked  with  nobody  about  it,  Mr. 
Chairman. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  committee  is  not  trying  anybody;  this 
com.mittee  is  appointed  by  the  United  States  Senate  for  the  purpose 


2530 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


of  making  an  investigation  and  making  its  report  later  on  to  the 
Senate. 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  I  think  that  you  could  look  at  the  matter 
in  that  light,  and  even  if  you  have  some  preconceived  prejudices, 
either  for  or  against  any  Senator,  that  ought  not  to  be  taken  into 
consideration  in  presenting  your  case. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  My  idea  in  bringing  up  this  point  is  this,  to  bring 
out  my  status.  I  do  not  know  what  the  province  of  this  committee 
is.  I  came  in  here  as  a  citizen  who  knows  nothing  about  the  powers 
of  this  committee,  and  I  am  willing  to  submit  myself  for  examination. 
But  not  only  this  week  that  report  came  to  me,  and  if  it  is  true — — 

Senator  Edge  (interposing).  Eight  there — pardon  me;  go  on. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  If  it  is  true,  I  think  it  is  taking  advantage  of  us ; 
if  it  is  not,  I  am  perfectly  willing  to  go  ahead. 

Senator  Edge.  The  only  information  I  insist  upon  having  is  the 
name  of  the  party  who  gave  you  the  rumor  or  information  that  you 
consider  warranted  you  in  making  such  a  statement. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.   I  will  get  that  for  you. 

Senator  Edge.  I  want  that  given  purposely. 

The  Chairman.  You  will  give  us  the  name  of  the  party. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  got  the  name? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  have  not. 

Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  know  the  man  who  gave  you  the  in- 
formation ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  How  did  you  get  the  information? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  He  came  to  my  office  in  a  confidential  way. 
Senator  Edge.  He  came  to  your  office  in  a  confidential  way  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  the  man  there  personally? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  a  man  in  my  office,  one  of  my  associates,, 
told  me  about  this. 

Senator  Edge.  Told  you? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  the  man  who  had  the  information  or  some 
one  else  tell  him  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Some  one  told  him,  some  one  concerned  in  the 
publication  of  the  American  Legion  Weekly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Who  is  your  associate  who  gave  you  this  in- 
formation ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Mr.  Jones. 

Senator  Edge.  Subpoena  Mr.  Jones. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  His  name  is  Richard  S.  Jones. 

The  Chairman.  Where  will  he  be  found? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Here  in  Washington. 

The  Chairman.  In  your  office? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Since  this  statement  has  been  made,  I  think  Mr, 
Jones  ought  to  be  brought  here. 

Senator  Edge.  I  would  like  to  have  the  gentleman  brought  here 
as  quickly  as  possible. 

Senator  Reed.  I  know  you  would.    .  '  . 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2531 


Senator  Pomerene.  Where  is  your  office  and  what  is  the  telephone 
number  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Bond  Building,  telephone  Main  5358. 

Senator  Edge.  Let  me  ask  this  question :  Then,  you  personally 
do  not  know  that  name  of  the  man  who  gave  this  information  to  your 
assistant,  who  later  gave  it  to  you? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. . 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  not  think  that  is  rather  a  serious  inference, 
even  for  a  man  on  the  witness  stand  to  make  in  a  hearing  of  this 
character? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  said  I  did  not  make  it  as  a  direct  charge.  That 
is  my  information. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  not  here  to  give  information  unless  you 
can  give  facts. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  was  asking,  before  I  went  ahead  with  my  testi- 
mony, to  straighten  that  out. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  satisfied  to  go  ahead  with  your  testimony 
now  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  Go  ahead. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  given  all  your  testimony  to  Senator  Reed 
before  you  raised  the  question  at  all,  had  you  not? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir;  but  Senator  Edge  started  asking  ques- 
tions and  that  is  what  brought  up  the  matter. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  you  will  find  him  a  rather  agreeable 
gentleman  asking  questions. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  think,  under  the  circumstances,  that  I  care 
to  ask  any  questions. 

The  Chairman.  Is  the  Stars  and  Stripes  a  corporation? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Incorporated  under  what  law? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  The  State  of  Maryland. 

The  Chairman.  When  was  that  corporation  organized  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  October  18,  1919. 

The  Chairman.  1919? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  not  published  during  the  war  across  the 
seas  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  In  France? 
Mr.  Heffernan,  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  it  was  then  published  by  the  soldiers  not  as 
a  corporation,  was  it? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  AVho  were  the  active  leaders  in  that  movement 
before  the  organization  of  the  corporation  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Here  in  Washington  ? 
The  Chairman.  No  ;  across  the  seas. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  It  was  composed  of  the  soldiers,  members  of  the 
Army. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  some  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Well,  there  was  a  Lieut.  Milton  Ayers,  of  New^ 
York,  and  this  Capt.  Waldo,  to  whom  I  have  referred. 


2532  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Did  Col.  Koosevelt  have  anything  to  do  with  it 
over  there  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  soldiers  in  general  carried  on  this  paper* 
It  was  their  paper  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  \es,  sir;  everybody  associated  with  it  was  a 
soldier. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  say  Capt.  Waldo.   Was  that  the  Richard 
H.  Waldo  that  you  mentioned  a  while  ago? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  ine  same  one;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  when  the  war  closed  then,  this  corporation 
took  over  the  publication  of  this  paper  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  were  the  original  incorporators? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  W.  Thomas  Kemp,  as  I  recall,  of  Baltimore; 
John  W.  Tucker,  P.  E.  Kemp,  K.  M.  Parks,  and  myself. 

The  Chairman.  Were  these  men  soldiers ?   Had  they  been  soldiers? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

'Ihe  Chairman.  You  were  the  only  soldier? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  was  the  only  soldier. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  the  corporation  get  possession  of  the 
paper  and  its  name  and  its  assets  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  1  might  illustrate,  to  take  a  civil  example.  If 
the  Washington  Times,  for  instance,  announced  that  it  was  about  to 
discontinue  on  the  13th  of  November,  to  discontinue  publishing  its 
paper,  and  would  not  use  the  name  any  longer,  and  had  no  reason 
to  desire  to  use  the  name;  and  then  some  one  immediately  saw  an 
opportunity  to  put  that  name  into  use  and  take  advantage  of  the 
prestige  of  that  name,  it  would  be  a  similar  proposition  to  what  we 
did  with  the  Stars  and  Stripes. 

The  Chairman.  In  other  words,  the  Stars  and  Stripes  went  out  of 
business  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  thought  it  was  a  good  name  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  organized  this  company  and  adopted  the 
name  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  took  over  nothing  from  the  boys  who  were 
in  the  war  and  carrying  on  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Nothing  except  the  name  of  the  paper. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  take  that  over;  you  appropriated 
that? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  There  has  been  some  controversy  in  the  legion 
about  the  name,  I  take  it,  from  what  you  say  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  the  American  Legion  have  a  paper  of  its 
own  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  they  have  the  American  Legion  Weekly. 
The  Chairman.  And  they  object  to  this  paper  and  are  fighting  it? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  American  Legion  Weekly  is  carried  on  en- 
tirely by  the  boys  who  have  been  across  the  sea,  is  it  not? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2533 


Mr.  Heffernan.  The  American  Legion? 
The  ChairMxVn.  Yes. 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes-,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  the  paper  I  am  proposed  to  be  practically 
aaeociated  with? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  The  weekly;  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  a  great  honor ;  I  am  sorry  I  can  not  qualify. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  what  funds  have  been  raised  for  the 
American  Legion  AVeekly? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  It  failed  at  one  time  for  $300,000,  and  then  wa» 
rehabilitated,  and  no  one  connected  with  the  Weekly  has  ever  volun- 
teered to  tell  where  that  money  came  from. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  your  incorporated  stock? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  That  was  '$200,000. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  all  paid  in? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  it? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  $101,000. 

The  Chairman.  Who  were  the  people  who  took  the  heavy  stock  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  The  way  the  stock  stands — I  do  not  know  just 
what  is  meant  in  law  by  paid-in  stock  and  treasury  stock  and  that 
kind  of  thing;  so,  if  I  may,  I  will  explain  just  how  the  stock  stands. 
We  boys  who  went  with  the  paper  on  this  side — there  are  10  of  us, 
I  think,  that  now  hold  stock  in  the  paper — of  the  boys  who  were 
formerly  over  on  the  other  side  with  the  paper  

The  Chairman.  Men  who  were  connected  with  the  paper  aoross 
the  sea? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir;  10  of  us  are  stockholders,  and  others 
who  have  since  come  to  w^ork  will  be  taken  in.  That  was  our  scheme, 
to  establish  a  sort  of  cooperative  paper,  with  the  boys  on  the  other 
side  on  this  sharing  in  the  stock. 

The  Chairman.  Are  any  of  those  boys  members  of  the  legion? 

Mr,  Heffernan.  I  think  all  of  them  are ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  a  member  of  the  legion? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.  In  order  to  finance  the  paper — we  had 
not  very  much  money.  I  had  just  a  few  thousand  dollars,  and  I 
sank  the  whole  thing  in  the  prelimina^ries.  While  we  were  doing 
that,  trying  to  find  a  way  to  finance  it,  I  got  in  touch  with  E.  M. 
I^arks 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  E.  M.  Parks? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  That  is  Mrs.  E.  M.  Parks. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mrs.  E.  M.  Parks? 

Mi*.  Heffernan.  She  is  an  employee  of  the  Democratic  committee. 
The  Chairman.  Is  she  in  their  office  here  in  Washington  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes;  I  think  she  still  is. 
The  Chairman.  Is  that  Mr.  Jamieson's  office? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  she  not  Mr.  Jamieson's  secretary,  or  was  she  not? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  I  do  not  know  whether  that  was  her  title  or  not, 
but  she  was  with  him. 

The  Chairman.  Give  us  who  Mrs.  Parks  is. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Mrs.  Parks,  whether  or  not  her  title  is  secretary, 
is  acting  in  a  secretarial  capacity  for  Mr.  Jamieson. 
The  Chairman.  How  long  has  she  been  doing  it  ? 


2534 


PRESIDENTIAL  Ci^MPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Heffernan.  I  do  not  know.    I  never  knew  her  at  all  until  I 
got  working  on  the  establishment  of  the  paper. 
The  Chairman.  Tell  us  about  that. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  At  the  outset^  when  this  opposition  developed  to 
the  name,  I  calculated  that  I  should  need  some  influence  of  some  kind 
in  order  to  help  me  protect  the  name.  This  opposition  was  coming 
from  New  York,  and  I  knew  of  it,  and  had  seen  correspondence, 
and  so  on,  in  regard  to  it,  and  also  learned  that  Secretary  Baker 
might  be  opposed  to  it.  And  I  think  he  was,  for  a  sentimental 
reason.  He  thought  the  paper  should  continue  when  the  war  dis- 
continued. My  reason  was  that  of  the  Secretary  of  War,  being  a 
Democrat,  was  opposed  to  the  establishment  of  this  paper,  I  might 
be  able  to  get  some  influence  that  would  help  me  get  the  name.  I 
figured  that  there  was  no  law  on  the  statute  books — I  talked  with 
various  lawyers  about  it — that  would  prevent  my  using  this  name, 
or,  rather,  prevent  the  corporation  which  was  to  be  formed.  The 
Secretary,  for  this  sentimental  reason,  declared  against  it.  I  figured 
that,  there  would  be  a  move  started  in  Congress,  or  in  the  Senate,  to 
pass  a  bill  to  forbid  the  u9e  of  this  name,  and  that  that  was  the  only 
way  it  could  be  done.  Therefore  I  decided  that  I  should  have  to  get 
some  influence  that  would  prevent  the  passage  of  that  bill.  In  order 
to  carry  out  that  plan,  as  I  knew  nobody  in  politics  in  Washington, 
I  went  to  the  Democratic  headquarters. 

The  Chairman.  You  thought  they  could  influence  Congress? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  At  that  time  I  did.  [Laughter.] 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  go  to  the  President  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir.  Mrs.  Parks  was  the  only  one  in  the  office 
when  I  went  there.  I  told  her  that  I  had  this  intention  of  starting 
a  veterans'  paper  and  explained  that  the  Secretary  of  War  appeared 
to  be  opposing  it,  and  that  there  was  direct  opposition  from  New 
York,  and  asked  her  if  she  could  help  me  in  any  way.  She  thought 
it  over  and  asked  me  if  I  would  take  her  in  in  a  business  way — if  I 
had  any  objection  to  having  anyone  but  soldiers  associated  with  the 
paper.  I  said  that  I  would  have  to  get  outside  help  of  some  kind, 
Ijecause  I  had  no  outside  finances,  and  it  would  take  as  high  as 
$200,000  to  establish  a  paper  such  as  I  had  in  mind. 

The  Chairman.  You  could  not  well  object  to  a  lady  being  asso- 
ciated with  you? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Not  such  a  lady.  So  we  talked  the  thing  over 
several  difi^erent  times,  and  finally  she  agreed  to  finance  the  paper  in 
exchange  for  a  certain  block  of  stock. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  did  she  put  into  it  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  think  up  to  date  she  has  put  in  $48,000. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  that  is  her  own  money  or 
money  from  the  Democratic  committee  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No  ;  I  have  no  reason  to  know.  I  put  the  propo- 
sition up  to  her  that  she  would  finance  the  paper  in  exchange  for 
this  stock. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  stock  did  she  take  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  We  divided  101,000  shares  between  us. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Whom  do  you  mean? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Between  Mrs.  Parks  and  the  boys  whom  I  rep- 
resent—$148,000  worth. 

The  Chairman.  She  took  $48,000  worth? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2535 


Mr.  Heffernan.  No  ;  she  put  in  $48,000,  Senator,  in  actual  money. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  stock  did  she  take  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  $51,000.    I  took  $49,000. 

The  Chairman.  So  she  has  a  controlling  interest  in  the  stock  that 
is  issued  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  in  what  is  issued,  and  then  there  is  a 
balance  of  $99,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  makes  just  an  even  $100,000,  and  your 
statement  was  that  it  was  $101,000. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No;  she  has  $51,000;  then  I  must  have  $50,000. 
That  is  it,  because  there  is  $101,000  out  and  $99,000  kept  that  we  were 
to  distribute  or  sell. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  the  secretary  to  the  director  of  finance  of  the 
Democratic  national  committee  controls  the  stock  ownership  of  the 
Stars  and  Stripes?    Is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senaor  Keed.  And  Mr.  Du  Pont,  connected  with  the  Republican 
national  committee,  has  been  over  to  see  you,  through  his  agent, 
threatening  you  and  proposing  to  buy  you  out?  [Laughter.] 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  Stars  and  Stripes  is  sold  throughout  the 
country  at  the  news  stands? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  News  stands  and  direct  subscriptions ;  yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  They  have  been  rather  active,  have  they  not,  for 
the  Democratic  ticket  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Take  this  issue ;  I  think  it  is  the  last  one.  Here  is 
the  one  of  Saturday,  September  18  [reading]  : 

American  homes  for  American  fighters.    Democratic  promises. 

Who  secured  the  insertion  of  that  in  the  paper  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  That  is  advertising;  it  came  through  our  adver- 
tising department. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  it  marked  advertising?  It  is  political 
advertising,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  That  must  be  an  oversight,  because  it  is  purely 
advertising. 

The  Chairman.  Anybody  reading  that  would  not  understand  that 
the  Democratic  national  committee  partly  controlled  it  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Any  newspaper  man,  from  the  makeup  of  that, 
would  know  it  was  advertising. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  other  issues  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.  I  have  one  here  with  a  column  and 
a  half  interview  with  Senator  Harding. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  see  that  one.  Before  you  get  to  that,  this 
article  I  have  called  your  attention  to  in  the  issue  of  September  18 
covers  half  a  page,  does  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  is  an  argument  for  the  election  of  Cox  and 
Eoosevelt  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  speaks  of  the  Democratic  promises  of  deeds  and 
homes,  and  statements  of  Cox  and  Roosevelt? 

182774— 20— PT  19  3 


2536 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  is,  of  course,  Democratic  advertising? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  not  marked  advertising? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir;  but  that  is — I  would  make  that  clear, 
that  that  is  an  oversight  in  the  making  up  of  the  paper. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  but  people  reading  this  would  not  under- 
stand about  the  oversight,  would  they? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  would  have  to  maintain,  too,  that  it  was  un- 
intentional. 

The  Chairman.  Unintentional? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  have  a  paper,  as  I  understand  you,  being 
sold  to  the  soldiers  and  others,  with  the  name  "  The  Stars  and 
Stripes,"  purporting  to  be  a  soldier  paper,  and  the  majority  of  the 
stock  is  controlled  by  an  employee  of  the  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee?   That  is  the  real  situation,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  have  anything  to  do  with  the  opposi- 
tion of  Col.  Roosevelt  which  you  spoke  of,  that  it  is  a  partisan  paper 
parading  as  a  nonpartisan  soldier  paper? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  think  not,  because  every  man  connected  with 
that  paper  is  a  former  soldier — every  man  connected  with  the  pro- 
ducing and  writing  of  that  paper. 

The  Chairman.  Every'  man  connected  with  the  Legion  Weekly 
is  a  former  soldier,  too? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  not  the  boys  of  the  Legion  the  right  to  have 
a  paper  not  controlled  by  either  the  Republican  or  the  Democratic 
national  committee? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  but  the  Legion  Weekly  is,  in  my  mind, 
controlled  by  the  Republican  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  state  that  as  a  matter  of  knowledge,  or  is 
it  just  a  random  thought? 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  ask  you  this.  Is  that  published  by  a  cor- 
poration ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir — I  am  not  sure ;  I  can  not  state  definitely. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  what  the  organization  is  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir;  it  is  just  an  organization  of  which  the 
leaders  have  never  told  us  very  much. 

In  reply  to  the  question  as  to  whether  or  not  the  Republican  com- 
mittee is  in  touch  with  the  American  Legion  Weekly,  I  have  a  letter 
here  from  Mr.  Bone's  publicity  department,  in  which  he  says  

The  Chairman.  Whom  is  the  letter  to  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  It  is  written  to  our  office. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  Mr.  Bone  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Mr.  Bone  is  the  director  of  publicity  for  the  Re- 
publican national  committee  [reading]  : 

Mr.  Bone  tells  nie  that  the  American  Legion  Weekly  is  very  friendly  with  the 
Republican  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  this  letter  is  written  by  Mr.  Bone? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Written  by  a  man  in  Mr.  Bone's  office. 
The  Chairman.  "What  is  it  he  says? 


PRESIDENTIAL,  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2537 


Senator  Pomerene.  Read  the  whole  letter. 
Mr.  Hefferxax  (reading)  : 

Melvin  Ryder. 

Stars  and  Stripes. 

My  Dear  Mel  :  How  can  I  get  the  complete  addresses  of  the  service  men's 
publications  which  you  sent  me? 

Mr.  Bone  tells  me  that  the  American  Legion  Weekly  is  very  friendly  with 
the  Republican  national  connnittee.    He  also  says  that  the  Stars  and  Stripes  is 
a  proadministration  publication.    How  about  it?    Mr.  Bone  says  he  does  not 
think  we  can  expect  very  much  from  service  papers. 
Cordially,  yours. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  your  information  on  which  you  base  the 
statement  that  the  American  Legion  Weekly  is  controlled  by  the 
Republican  national  committee  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir;  I  go  back  further  than  that. 

The  Chairman.  All  right ;  let  us  go  back  further  than  that.  Let 
us  have  something  definite,  or  as  definite  as  that. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.  The  American  Legion  was  founded  in 
Paris  by  a  group  of  Republican  officers.  In  the  list  are :  Lieut.  Col. 
Theodore  Roosevelt,  jr.;  Lieut.  Col.  Fred  Lewellyn;  Lieut.  Col.  D.  J. 
Davies;  Maj.  Franklin  D'Olier;  Maj.  Goodrich,  of  the  rubber  com- 
pany; Maj.  Delancy  Kuntz,  of  whom  we  have  just  spoken;  Lieut.  Col. 
George  White,  of  Oregon;  Lieut.  Col.  Ralph  D.  Cole,  of  Ohio,  re- 
cently candidate  for  governor  on  the  Republican  ticket,  and  de- 
feated; Maj.  Eric  Fisher  Wood,  a  personal  friend  of  Gen.  Wood 
who  wrote  the  life  of  Gen.  Wood  and  is  a  Republican  from  Pennsyl- 
vania and  a  close  friend  of  Theodore  Roosevelt's;  and  Lieut.  Col. 
Bennett  Clark. 

The  Chairiman.  Is  he  a  Republican? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No  ;  Col.  Clark,  I  understand,  is  a  Democrat,  but 
he  is  about  like  a  period  to  a  sentence ;  he  does  not  mean  much  there. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  I  do  not  think  you  are  warranted  in  saying  that. 
He  was  a  gallant  soldier  

Mr.  Heffernan.  Well,  I  will  retract  that.  It  was  just  a  little  per- 
siflage. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  what  has  been  called  "bunk  "  here  a  good 
many  times. 

Senator  Reed.  He  was  the  parliamentary  clerk  of  the  House  of  Rep- 
resentatives. He  quit  that  position,  trained  for  a  soldier,  passed  with 
high  honors,  and  went  to  France.  He  is  not  only  a  Democrat,  but  a 
very  active  and  very  influential  Democrat  in  his  State,  if  not  in  the 
Nation. 

The  Chairman.  And  a  very  active  member  of  the  Legion  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  a  man  of  the  highest  character  and  standing. 
Senator  Edge.  You  made  a  sworn  statement  under  the  post-office 
regulations  as  to  your  ownership  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir;  some  time  ago. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  the  present  ownership  ?  You  say  "  some  time 
ago." 

Mr.  Hefferna*n.  The  ownership  at  that  time ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  amended  it  or  revised  it  to  show  the 
present  ownership? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Those  are  mide  out  periodically,  Senator,  every 
,  six  months, 
i 


2538 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Does  the  statement  show  the  present  ownership  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  At  the  time  we  were  required  to  make  it. 
The  Chairman.  I  am  not  asking  that.    Does  the  statement  show 
the  present  ownership  ?   You  can  answer  that  question. 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir ;  I  think  it  does. 
The  Chairman.  Does  it  show  Mrs.  Parks  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So,  if  we  take  that  statement  as  filed,  we  will  get 
the  stockholders  and  all  the  present  ownership  of  this  paper  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Well,  I  would  like  to  make  myself  clear  on  that. 

The  Chairman.  We  would  like  to  have  you  do  so. 

Mr.  Heffernan.  It  was  filed  several  months  ago,  and  the  stock- 
holders and  officers  as  they  existed  then  must  be  shown.  I  think  they 
were  the  same  as  they  are  now,  and  I  think  Mrs.  Parks  would  be 
shown  there. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  let  us  see  the  copy  that  has  Senator  Hard- 
ing's intervieAv  in  it.  Have  you  all  of  the  copies  here  since  the  con- 
vention ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  No,  sir.  I  have  an  interview  with  Cox  and  the 
interview  Avith  Harding,  and  that  is  about  all. 

The  Chairman.  Your  interview  with  Senator  Harding  is  in  your 
issue  of  September  4? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  is  given  as  an  intervicAv  and  not  as  an  ex- 
pression of  your  paper  at  all  concerning  its  policies  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir.  I  went  to  Marion  myself  and  talked 
with  him. 

The  Chairman.  You  got  the  interview  yourself  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman,  ^ow,  let  us  see  the  one  with  the  Cox  interview 
in  it. 

(The  witness  handed  a  paper  to  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  get  this  also  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Your  paper  is  taking  an  active  part  in  the  fight 
as  to  the  bonus  also  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan. -Yes,  sir;  we  advocate  the  bonus. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  making  fights  against  men  who  are 
supposed  to  be  opposed  to  the  bonus  ? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  I  do  not  recall  that  we  have  made  any  particular 
fight  on  any  individual.  We  probably  advocate  the  election  of  men 
who  favor  the  bonus. 

The  Chairman.  Yes ;  you  are  advocating  the  bonus,  and  ask  your 
subscribers  to  try  and  influence  Members  of  Congress  in  favor  of 
the  bonus? 

Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes ;  I  think  that  would  naturally  follow. 
The  Chairman.  Have  you  other  copies  of  the  paper  here?  I 
would  like  to  look  them  over,  please. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  was  the  first  issue  published  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  June  13,  1919 — on  this  side. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  the  postal  regulations  required  your 
statement  on  April  1  last  ? 
Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  when  you  made  your  last  statement? 


PRESIDENTIAI.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2539 


Mr.  Heffernan.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  yoii  also  publish  the  sttitement  showing  the 
ownership  in  your  paper? 

Mr.  PIeffernan.  We  got  a  form  from  the  post  office  and  (illod 
it  out. 

Senator  Edge.  But  did  you,  as  required  by  the  post-office  regula- 
tions, publish  a  copy  of  the  statement  in  your  paper? 
Hr.  Heffernan.  Oh,  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  wish  you  would  send  us  a  copy  of  the  publication 
containing  that  statement. 

Senator  Po:merexe.  Have  you  it  here? 
Mr.  Heffernax.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  will  give  us  the  information  about  the  stock. 

This  advertising  that  has  been  referred  to  that  has  not  the  paid 
mark  on  it — who  actually  ordered  that  advertising? 

Hr.  Hefferxan.  That  was  ordered  from  New  York,  from  the  head- 
quaiters  of  the  Democratic  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  Has  it  been  paid  for  in  cash  to  the  publication  ? 

Mr.  TIefferxax.  No,  sir;  that  will  be  billed  for  on  the  rirst  of  the 
month  at  our  commercial  rates,  60  cents  a  line. 

The  Chairmax.  AVhom  will  it  be  billed  to? 

Mr.  Hp]FFERXAX.  The  Democratic  national  commitee. 

The  CHArRMAX.  Will  this  be  rim  all  during  the  month? 

Mr.  Hefferxax.  No,  sir;  I  think  that  is  for  one  insertion. 

The  Chairmax.  You  issue  this  paper  Aveekly? 

Mr.  Hefferxan.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairmax.  Have  you  other  cartoons  and  other  orders  for  the 
balance  of  the  time  up  to  election  ? 

Mr.  Hefferxan.  I  understand  from  my  advertising  men  that  we 
have  something  like  five  pages  to  come  during  the  campaign. 

The  Chairmax.  Five  pages  to  come  ? 

Mr.  Hefferxax.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairmax.  Do  you  make  any  reduced  rates  on  this  on  account 
of  the  stock  ownership  vesting  of  the  Democrats  ? 

Mr.  Hefferxax.  No,  sir.  We  had  quite  a  discussion  at  first  as  to 
whether  to  charge  a  higher  rate  for  political  advertising,  but  on  the 
advice  of  our  agents  we  decided  to  keep  it  to  the  usual  commercial 
rate. 

The  Chairmax.  You  have  no  Republican  advertising  in  your 
paper  ? 

Mr.-  Hefferxax.  No,  sir ;  but  we  have  tried  to  get  it. 
The  Chairmax.  And  are  still  trying  ? 
Mr.  Hefferxax.  Still  trying. 
The  Chairmax.  You  would  like  to  publish  it  ? 
Mr.  Hefferxax.  We  would  like  to  have  five  pages  from  them  as 
we  have  from  the  Democrats. 

The  Chairmax.  Have  they  refused  to  do  it  ? 

Mr.  Hefferxax.  Not  specifically. 

The  Chairmax.  That  is  all  I  care  to  ask  you. 

I  wish  to  place  in  the  record  at  this  time  the  matter  submitted  by 
Mr.  Scripps  in  reply  to  our  inquiry  concerning  the  names  of  news- 
papers. 


I 


2540  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

(The  list  referred  to  is  here  printed  in  full,  as  follows :) 

Statement  of  the  Ownership,  Management,  Circulation,  Etc.,  Required  by 
THE  Act  of  Congress  of  August  24,  1912,  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes,  Pub- 
lished Weekly  at  Washington,  D.  C,  for  April  1,  1920. 

District  of  Columbia,  ,y,S'; 

Before  me,  a  notary  public  in  and  for  the  State  and  county  aforesaid,  per- 
sonally appeared  Hardie  Meakin,  who,  having  been  duly  sworn  according  to 
law,  deposes  and  says  that  he  is  the  business  manager  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes 
and  that  the  following  is,  to  the  best  of  his  knowledge  and  belief,  a  true  state- 
ment of  the  ownership,  management  (and,  if  a  daily  paper,  the  circulation), 
etc.,  of  the  aforesaid  publication  for  the  date  shown  in  the  above  caption,  re- 
quired by  the  act  of  August  24,  1912,  embodied  in  section  443,  Postal  Laws  and 
Regulations,  printed  on  the  reverse  of  tliis  form,  to  wit: 

1.  Tliat  the  names  and  addresses  of  the  publisher,  editor,  managing  editor, 
and  business  managers  are: 

Publisher,  Stars  and  Stripes  Publishing  Co.,  Washington,  D.  C. 
Editoi-,  Richard  Seelye  Jones,  Washington,  D.  C. 
Managing  editor,  Joseph  L.  Heffernan,  Washington,  D.  C. 
Business  manager,  Hardie  Meakin,  Washington,  D.  C. 

2.  That  the  owners  are  (give  names  and  addresses  of  individual  owners,  or, 
if  a  corporation,  give  its  name  and  the  nanu  s  and  addresses  of  stockholders 
owning  or  holding  1  per  cent  or  nioi-e  of  the  total  amount  of  stock)  :  Joseph  L. 
Heffernan,  \\'ashington,  D.  C.  ;  iNIelvin  Ryder,  Washington,  D.  C. ;  Richard  Seelye 
Jones,  Washington,  D.  C. ;  E.  M.  Parks,  Washington,  D.  C. 

3.  That  the  known  bondholders,  mortgagees,  and  other  security  holders  own- 
ing or  holding  1  per  cent  or  more  of  total  amount  of  bonds,  mortgages,  or  other 
securities  are  (if  there  are  none,  so  state)  :  None. 

4.  That  the  two  paragraplis  next  above,  giving  the  names  of  the  owners,  stock- 
holders, and  security  holders,  if  any,  contain  not  only  the  list  of  stockholders 
and  security  holders  as  they  a.ppear  up(»n  the  books  of  the  company,  but  also, 
in  cases  where  the  stockholder  or  security  holder  appears  upon  the  books  of  the 
company  as  trustee  or  in  any  other  fiduciary  relation,  the  name  of  the  person 
or  corporation  for  whom  such  trustee  is  acting  is  given;  also  that  the  said  t\vo 
paragraphs  contain  statements  embracing  affiant's  full  knowledge  and  belief 
as  to  the  circumstances  and  conditions  under  which  stockholders  and  security 
holders  who  do  not  appear  upon  the  books  of  the  company  as  trustees  hold 
stock  and  securities  in  a  capacity  other  than  that  of  a  bona  fide  owner ;  and 
this  afiiant  has  no  reason  to  believe  that  any  other  person,  association,  or  cor- 
porati(m  has  any  interest,  direct  or  indirect,  in  the  said  stock,  bonds,  or  other 
securities  than  as  so  stated  by  him. 

5.  That  the  average  number  of  copies  of  each  issue  of  this  publication  sold 
or  distributed,  through  the  mails  or  otherwise,  to  paid  subscribers  during  the 

six  numths  preceding  the  date  shown  above  is    (This  information  is 

required  fi'om  daily  publications  only.) 

Hardie  Meakin. 
Sworn  to  and  subscribed  before  me  this  23d  day  of  March,  1920. 
[seal. J  Wm.  H.  Hugniul. 

My  commission  expires  August  19,  1920. 

Note. — This  statement  must  be  made  in  duplicate  and  both  copies  delivered 
by  the  publisher  to  the  postmaster,  who  shall  send  one  copy  to  the  Third 
Assistant  Postmaster  General  (Division  of  Classification),  Washington,  D.  C, 
and  retain  the  other  in  the  files  of  the  post  office.  The  publisher  must  publish 
a  copy  of  this  statement  in  the  second  issue  printed  next  after  its  filing. 


clients  requesting  presidential  campaign  matter. 


Anniston  Star,  Anniston,  Ala. 
Times    and    Democrat,  Orangeburg, 
S.  C. 

Times-Tribune,  Waterloo,  Iowa. 
Birmingham  News,  Birmingham,  Ala. 
Daily  Press,  Newport  News,  Va. 


AdAance,  Lynchburg,  Va. 
Muskogee  Times-Democrat,  Muskogee, 
OkhL 

Herald  Publishing  Co.,  New^  Britain, 
Conn. 

Copper  Journal,  Hancock,  Mich. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2541 


El  Dorado  Times,  El  Dorado,  Kans. 
Independent,  St.  Petersburg,  Fla. 
Daily  Panhandle,  Amarilla,  Tex. 
Helena  Independent,  Helena,  Mont. 
Times-Recorder,  Americus,  Ga. 
Idaho  Free  Press,  Nampa,  Idaho. 
Milwaukee  Journal,  Milwaukee,  Wis. 
Coller,  Corpus  Christi,  Tex. 
Bee,  Danville,  Va. 
Herald,  Rockhill,  S.  C. 
Salina  Daily  Union,  Salina,  Kans. 
Index-Journal,  Greenwood,  S.  C. 
Quincy  Daily  Herald,  Quincy,  111. 
Kansas  City  Post,  Kansas  City,  Mo. 
Evening  Post,  Salisbury,  N.  C. 
Daily  Piedmont,  Greenville,  S.  C. 
Montgomery     Journal,  Montgomery, 
Ala. 

Tribune,  Lawrence,  Mass. 
Dubuque     Times- Journal,  Dubuque, 
Iowa. 

News-Democrat,  Paducah,  Ky. 
Columbia  Record,  Columbia,  S.  C. 
News,  Rome,  Ga. 
Evening  Post.  Worcester,  Mass. 
Concord  Patriot,  Concord,  N.  H. 
Daily  Press,  Iowa  City,  Iowa. 
Brooklyn  Citizen,  Brooklyn,  N.  Y. 
Hagerstown  Mail,  Hagerstown,  ]\Id. 
Waterbury      Democrat,  Waterbury, 
Conn. 

Press-Guardian,  Paterson,  N.  J. 
Newark  Star-Eagle,  Newark,  N.  J. 
Times-Union,  Rochester,  N.  Y. 
Dispatch,  Wilmington,  N.  C. 


Danville  Press,  Danville,  111. 

Evening  Star,  Poughkeepsie,  N.  Y. 

Rockford  Star,  Rockford  111. 

Racine  Times-Call,  Racine,  W^is. 

Evening  News,  Harrisburg,  Pa. 

World,  Martinsburg,  Pa. 

Decatur  Review,  Decatur,  111. 

.Tournal-G;^zette,  Fort  Wayne,  Ind. 

Times-Leader,  New  Haven,  Conn. 

Aurora  Beacon-Journal,  Aurora,  111. 

Providence  News,  Providence,  R.  I. 

Lowell  Sun,  Lower,  Mass. 

Times,  Shreveport,  La. 

Knoxville  Sentinel,  Knoxville,  Tenn. 

Savannah  Press,  Savannah,  Ga. 

Evening  Republican,  Columbus,  Ind. 

Warren  Evening  Times  (Times  Pub- 
lishing Co. ) ,  W^arren,  Pa. 

Omaha  Daily  News,  Omaha,  Nebr. 

Times  and  Democrat,  Orangeburg,  S.  C. 

Evening  Sun,  Baltimore,  Md. 

Daily  News,  Santa  Barbara,  Calif. 

Palm  Beach  Post,  West  Palm  Beach, 
Fla. 

^r'alifornian,  B;ikersfield,  Calif. 

Sun,  Williamsport,  Pa. 

Southwest  American,  Fort  Smith,  Ark. 

Herald,  An)any,  (hi. 

Arizona  Daily  Star,  Tucson,  Ariz. 

San  Benito  Light,  San  Benito,  Tex. 

Journal,  Pensacola,  Fla. 

p]vening  Times,  Cumberland,  Md. 

Post,  Hartford,  Conn. 

Times-Leader,  Wilkes-Barre,  Pa. 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  RICHARD  SEELYE  JONES,  EDITOR  THE  STARS 
AND  STRIPES,  WASHINGTON,  D.  C. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

Senator  Edge.  Will  you  please  state  your  full  name  for  the  record  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  Richard  Seelye  Jones. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  your  connection  with  the  Stars  and  Stripes 
publication  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  am  the  editor  of  the  paper. 

Senator  Edge.  In  the  absense  of  the  statement  for  which  I  asked, 
perhaps  I  can  proceed,  although  I  do  not  recall  the  names  offhand  that 
were  mentioned.  The  statement  Avas  made,  as  nearly  as  I  can  recall 
it,  that  some  one  told  you,  and  you  told  the  previous  witness,  that 
Senator  Edge  was  in  some  way  connected  with  a  determination,  I 
think,  that  your  paper  should  not  receive  advertising,  or  something 
to  that  effect.' 

Mr.  Jones.  Well,  Mr.  Heffernan  possibly  overstated  the  matter,  but 
I  can  tell  you  his  information,  which  he  got  from  me. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  in  the  first  place,  won't  you  tell  us  the  name  of 
the  man  who  told  you  this,  that  gave  you  sufficient  warrant,  in  your 
judgment,  to  repeat  it? 

Mr.  Jones.  Well,  Senator,  there  was  very  little  information.  Of 
course  I  had  plenty  of  reason  to  repeat  to  Mr.  Heffernan,  because 
we  are  in  business  together.  Back  of  this  there  is  a  long  business 
fight  that  we  have  made  as  ex-service  men  in  establishing  the  paper. 


2542 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


We  have  had  very  bitter  opposition  of  a  business  character ;  whether 
any  of  it  is  political  or  not  I  do  not  know.  I  do  not  know  that  we 
have  any  reason  to  believe  that  it  is,  but  the  fact  that  Mr.  Heffer- 
nan  was  subpoenaed  by  this  committee  immediately  prompted  the 
question  in  my  mind  why  he  was  subpoenaed,  whether  the  same  in- 
fluences  that  had  opposed  us  in  a  business  way  were  responsible  for 
trying  to  injure  our  business  by  bringing  it  before  this  committee. 
I  suggested  to  Mr.  Heffernan  that  if  he  were  called  to  testify,  or 
having  been  called,  he  should  try  to  determine  what  influence  had 
prompted  the  committee  to  bring  the  affairs  of  the  paper  in.  We 
are  not  a  political  paper  

Senator  Edge.  Of  course  you  heard  his  statement.  It  is  quite 
different  from  what  you  are  now  giving  us. 

Mr.  Jones.  I  am  going  ahead  further  to  where  you  are  personally 
mentioned.  That  was  entirely  my  fault,  and  perhaps  was  improper 
in  this  investigation.  I  said  to  Mr.  Heffernan,  "  I  think  you  should 
inquire  of  Senator  Kenyon  and  Senator  Edge  whom  they  have  been 
in  conference  with  " — I  referred  to  you  two  gentlemen  i3ecause  you 
are  Republican  members,  and  I  knew  that  Mrs.  Parks's  stockholding 
interest  would  be  immediately  in  an  investigator's  mind  hooked  up 
with  the  democratic  committee.  I  said  I  thought  he  should  inquire 
if  Senator  Edge  and  Senator  Kenyon  had  been  in  conference  with 
any  of  the  persons  whom  Mr.  Heffernan  has  mentioned.  Now,. Mr. 
Heffernan  stated  it  more  strongly  than  that  

The  Chairman.  I  will  say  I  do  not  know  any  of  the  people,  but  if  I 
wanted  to  confer  with  them  I  would  do  so,  and  it  would  be  nobody's 
business. 

Mr.  Jones.  Well,  Senator,  as  I  say,  we  have  a  very  strong  feeling, 
not  against  the  American  Legion — I  belong  to  the  American  Legion — 
but  against  people  who  have  tried  to  use  the  American  Legion,  just 
as  they  have  tried  to  use  our  paper,  to  turn  it  against  the  bonus  fight, 
primarily  to  use  it  politically  or  use  it  any  other  way. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  you  have  made  your  statement.  Again  I  must 
return  to  the  more  direct  statement.  The  previous  witness  stated 
you  told  him  what  he  said,  or  at  least  warranted  his  saying  it,  and 
that  some  one  else  had  told  you,  and  he  presumed  we  could  get  the 
name  of  that  some  one  else  by  calling  you.  I  am  asking  you  who 
that  some  one  else  is. 

Mr.  Jones.  Why,  I  can  not  say  that  anyone  else  told  me.  I  do 
know,  and  I  was  told  by  some  one  in  our  office,  that  a  representative 
of  the  American  Legion  weekly  had  been  hastily  summoned  to  New 
York  by  telegraph  Monday  night.  I  then  learned  that  Senator  Edge 
himself  was  still  in  New  York  and  that  other  members  of  the  com- 
mittee were  here,  and  I  probably  deduced  from  that  that  if  any  mem- 
ber of  this  committee  were  involved  in  getting  any  information  on 
this  subject  it  would  be  yourself. 

Senator  Edge.  Because  I  may  have  passed  through  the  city  of  New 
Y  ork  on  my  way  to  attend  this  committee  meeting,  you  have  deemed 
it  sufficient  to  infer  that  I  have  been  in  consultation  about  the  Stars 
and  Stripes?    Is  that  the  information? 

Mr.  Jones.  Well,  Senator,  I  wanted  to  know  that.  I  wanted  to 
know  who  it  is  that  is  so  anxious  to  make  any  trouble  they  can  for 
our  publication.   Naturally,  it  is  my  business  to  know.   I  suggested 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2543 


to  Mr.  Heffernan  that  he  try  to  find  out,  and  if  Mr.  Heffernan  made 

that  statement  

Senator  Edge.  You  heard  his  statement. 

Mr.  Jones.  It  was,  perhaps,  his  unpleasant  way  of  stating  it. 
If  you  knew  the  history  of  the  scrap  we  have  been  through  in  estab- 
lishing this  paper,  you  would  know  we  would  feel  rather  strongly 
about  it. 

Senatoi"  Edge.  Then,  Mr.  Jones,  do  I  understand  that  you  have 
absolutely  no  knowledge  of  any  conference,  directly  or  indirectly,  be- 
tween myself  or  any  other  member  of  this  committee  with  any  of 
the  gentlemen  who  have  been  named  here? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  have  no  knowledge  of  any  such  conference  at  all, 
Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  give  us  the  name  of  an}^  man  who  presumes 
to  have  such  knowledge? 
Mr.  Jones.  Not  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  the  statement  was  absolutely  without  justifi- 
cation, was  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  think  in  the  way  it  was  made  it  w^as  pretty  strong. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  it  that  way.  You  can  answer  "  yes  " 
or  "  no."   Either  it  was  justified  or  was  not  justified. 

Mr.  Jones.  I  can  not  pass  judgment  on  somebody  else's  statement. 

Senator  Edge.  You  can  pass  judgment  on  your  own  knowledge. 

Mr.  Jones.  AVell,  I  am  telling  you  what  I  know. 

Senator  Edge.  And  you  say  you  know  absolutely  nothing  of  your 
own  knowledge? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  do  not  know  Avhat  conferences  you  may  have  had 
with  anybody  else. 

Senator  Edge.  The  facts  are  quite  the  contrary.  I  am  sure  it  is 
not  necessary  to  make  the  statement,  but  on  Monday  I  happened  to 
make  a  speech  in  the  city  of  Boston  and  came  through  on  a  night 
train  to  the  city  of  Washington.    I  went  through  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  say  this  for  the  record,  that  I  think  the 
statement  was  absolutely  unjustified,  and  I  think  we  are  dignifying  it 
too  much  when  we  even  discuss  it. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Jones. 

Mr.  Jones.  You  do  not  want  anything  about  the  editorial  matters 
at  all? 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  a  suggestion  of  yours  to  this  committee? 

Mr.  Jones.  Anything  you  want  to  know  that  I  can  tell  you  I  shall 
be  very  glad  to  tell  you.  If  this  paper  is  in  politics  I  am  out  of  it. 
I  have  been  making  a  fight  for  a  year  and  a  half  to  establish  an 
independent  newspaper  and  I  have  seen  the  political  influences  that 
have  tried  to  insinuate  themselves  into  everything  the  ex-soldier  has 
tried  to  do. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  ask  a  question  or  two.  The  question  has 
been  brought  out  here  that  tliere  is  a  lady  who  is  employed  in  Mr. 
Jamieson's  office,  and  the  inference  or  innuendo  is  made  that  in  that 
way  the  national  Democratic  committee  is  influencing  or  controlling 
*this  paper.   What  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  have  had  many  business  dilferences  with  Mrs.  Parks. 
I  have  one  at  the  present  time.  But  I  can  tell  you,  and  as  a  matter 
of  fact  I  have  a  memorandum  six  months  old  to  corroborate,  that  Mrs. 


2544 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Parks  nor  anybody  else  lias  ever  tried  to  use  the  paper  through  that 
connection  for  any  political  reason.  Mrs.  Parks  sent  me  as  editor 
some  months  ago  a  very  definite  instruction  that  the  paper  must  not  be 
involved  in  politics.  The  paper  is  now  at  the  point  of  success,  actually 
earning  a  profit,  and  has  a  very  large  influence  and  very  large  clien- 
tele among  service  men,  and  that  could  not  be  maintained  if  this  paper 
were  in  politics  for  anybody.  There  is  no  one  more  suspicious  of  that 
than  the  ex-soldiers. 

Senator  Keed.  Did  you  understand  Mrs.  Parks  put  her  own  capital 
in  there,  or  that  she  got  this  money  from  some  political  committee  or 
political  connection  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  I  do  not  know  where  she  got  the  money. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  understand  she  got  it  from  any  politi- 
cal source? 

Mr.  Jones.  No,  sir.  My  only  complaint  is  that  she  had  difficulty 
in  getting  enough  to  finance  the  paper.  She  never  got  as  much  as  she 
agreed  to  get. 

Senator  Keed.  As  far  as  you  are  concerned  as  editor  of  this  paper, 
you  have  never  allowed  it  to  be  used  for  political  purposes  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  Absolutely  not.  As  I  say,  it  would  be  fatal,  and  the 
inferences  brought  about  by  this  investigation  are  absolutely  damag- 
ing to  us,  and  I  think  that  is  possibly  what  prompted  Mr.  Heffer- 
nan's  rather  overstatement  of  the  case.  We  are  not  in  politips  and 
do  not  want  to  be  and  can  not  afford  to  be. 

Senator  Reed.  You  absolutely  say  that  this  paper  is  not  controlled 
by  the  Democratic  national  committee?  ^ 

Mr.  Jones.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  "  No."  Do  you  mean  to  say  that  you  do 
say  that  it  is  not  so  controlled  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  It  is  not,  absolutely.  So  far  as  the  conduct  of  the  paper 
is  concerned  

The  Chairman  (interposing).  The  stock  is  controlled  b}^  an  em- 
ployee of  the  Democratic  national  committee ;  that  is  the  difference. 

Mr.  Jones.  I  believe  so.  The  actual  work  and  editing  of  the  paper 
is  done  by  men  who  w^ere  with  the  paper  in  France. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  let  us  see  about  that  suggestion  of  the  chair- 
man. This  lady  happens  to  be  an  employee  of  that  committee,  but 
has  that  anything  to  do  or  any  connection  with  your  paper  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  No  ;  it  has  not. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  any  politics  in  publishing  an  article  like 
that  and  not  marking  it  advertising,  a  half -page  article? 

Mr.  Jones.  That  is  obviously  an  advertisement.  Anybody  who 
reads  knows  the  difference  between  editorial  matter  and  advertising. 

The  Chairman.  Why  is  not  the  advertisement  "  put  on  it?  Does 
not  the  law  require  that  ? 

Mr.  Jones.  That  I  do  not  know  about,  any  legal  requirements. 
The  copy  came  in  from  New  York  and  did  not  carry  what  most 
political  ads  do,  a  statement,  "  Paid  advertisement,''  or  something 
like  that  on  it. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  a  paid  advertisement?  * 
Mr.  Jones.  Absolutely;  obviously  anybody  knows  an  advertise- 
ment from  reading  matter  in  a  newspaper. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2545 


Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  anything  else  you  wanted  to  say  to 
the  committee? 

Mr.  JoxEs.  No;  unless  the  committee  wants  something  further. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  R.  T.  SCOTT. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 

Senator  Reed.  I  may  state  to  the  committee  that  this  gentleman  is 
in  charge  of  the  matter  brought  up  about  the  Attorney  General's 
office  on  yesterday. 

The  Chairman.  Proceed. 

Mr.  Scott.  My  title  is  secretary  and  assistant  to  the  Attorney 
General.  Mr.  Montrose,  whose  accounts  you  had  before  the  com- 
mittee, was  ordered  by  me,  as  is  customary,  to  accompany  the  Attor- 
ney General  on  his  trip  to  San  Francisco.  It  has  always  been  the 
custom,  so  far  as  I  know,  to  have  the  departments  pay — I  think  in  all 
departments — the  expenses  of  one  stenographer,  at  least,  to  a  Cabinet 
officer  when  he  travels  for  the  transaction  of  such  public  business  as 
may  be  necessary.  That  is  the  fact  in  this  instance.  I  happen  to  be 
familiar  with  that  account,  and  will  be  glad  to  explain  any  of  the 
items  that  you  miay  have  in  mind. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  be  glad  to  have  you  explain  this  Pullman 
item,  San  Francisco  to  New  York  City,  $131. 

Mr.  Scoi'T,  Mr.  Palmer,  as  you  gentlemen  may  know,  is  accom- 
panied during  these  times  by  armed  secret  service  guards,  in  y'lew 
of  the  fact  that  his  home  was  bombed  and  that  he  is  a  man  marked 
by  the  radicals  of  this  country,  and  hence  we  have  deemed  it  neces- 
sary to  protect  him.  In  that  stateroom — or  drawing  room,  rather — 
in  which  the  stenographer  traveled  there  also  traveled  one  or  two 
secret  service  men;  I  am  not  sure  as  to  the  number  of  secret  service 
men,  for  whom  no  additional  charge  was  mavie  against  the  Gov- 
ernment. 

The  Chairman.  This  covers  what,  this  charge  of  $131  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  It  covers  a  drawing-room  from  San  Francisco  to  New 
York  used  by  the  stenographer  and  by  one  or  two  secret  service  men. 
I  do  not  know  whether  there  were  two  at  that  time  or  not.  There 
were  two  going  out,  and  whether  there  were  two  coming  back  I  do 
not  know. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  not  throw  much  light  on  it  unless  you 
can  tell  whether  there  were  two  coming  back. 
Mr.  Scott.  I  know  there  was  one. 
The  Chairman.  You  know  there  was  one  ? 
Mr.  Scott.  I  know  that. 

The  Chairman.  You  know  there  were  two  persons  in  the  drawnig- 
room  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Montrose  and  the  secret  service  man? 
Mr.  Scott.  A  secret  service  man  by  the  name  of  Galliher. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  the  price  for  two  in  the  drawing-room? 
Mr.  Scott.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  $109.30  San  Francisco  to  Wash- 
ington ? 


2546 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Scott.  May  I  look  at  the  item? 

The  Cpiairman.  The  Attorney  General  was  on  this  same  trip? 
Mr.  Scott.  He  was  on  this  same  trip. 

The  Chairman.  But  his  expenses  are  not  taxed  against  the  Gov- 
ernment ? 

Mr.  Scott.  No,  sir.  Every  cent  was  paid  by  him.  I  may  add  that 
I  personally  went  to  San  Francisco,  took  my  annual  leave,  paid  my 
own  expenses  ? 

The  Chairman.  You  paid  your  own  expenses  to  San  Francisco  ? 
Mr.  Scott.  I  paid  my  own  expenses  to  San  Francisco ;  yes. 
The  Chairman.  Why  did  you  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  I  will  be  frank  with  you,  Senator.  I  considered  with 
my  relation  to  the  Attorney  General  I  could  have  charged  that 
against  the  Government,  because  I  did  transact  business  on  the  Avay 
out;  but  I  did  not  consider  it  was  of  sufficient  importance  to  charge 
the  whole  expense  to  the  Government,  and  therefore  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  You  ought  to  be  commended. 

Mr.  Scott.  Thank  you,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  this  railroad  item  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  One  of  the  items  is  Pullman  and  one  is  a  ticket. 

The  Chairman.  Ticket  for  one  or  for  two  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  This  is  a  ticket  for  one — wait,  now.  I  think  Montrose 
got  both  the  Pullmans ;  I  am  sure  of  that,  that  he  got  both  the  Pull- 
mans and  the  tickets  on  one  transportation  request.  The  transpor- 
tation request  will  show  it  was  for  two  persons. 

The  Chairman.  Pullman,  from  Harrisburg,  going  out  to  San 
Francisco,  $57.50.  Is  that  a  drawing-room,  too,  and  under  the  same 
circumstances  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  The  special  agents  who  were  guarding  the  At- 
torney General  rode  in  the  drawing-room  ? 
Mr.  Scott.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Where  did  the  Attorney  General  ride  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  In  his  own  private  drawing-room.  They  went  out  in 
a  compartment  car  chartered  by  the  Attorney  General  and  some 
friends  of  his  in  Pennsylvania.  The  Attorney  General  had,  I  think, 
two  compartments,  which  he  and  Mrs.  Palmer  occupied. 

The  Chairman.  It  was  a  private  car? 

Mr.  Scott.  It  was  a  private  car;  yes,  sir;  and  there  was  nothing 
but  drawing-rooms  in  it,  and  for  these  men  to  be  in  it  he  had  to  have 
a  drawing-room  or  they  could  not  have  sit  in  the  car  with  him;  if 
they  had  to  take  berths  in  another  car,  they  could  not  have  been 
with  him.  If  they  had  not  taken  a  drawing-room  they  would  have 
had  to  be  in  another  car. 

The  Chairman.  Who  paid  for  the  private  car  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  The  Attorney  General  and  his  friends,  with  the  ex- 
ception of  this  charge  here. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  simply  a  refund  to  whoever  paid  for  the  car  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  I  do  not  know  how  that  angle  of  it  was  arranged.  I 
think  in  making  the  arrangements  with  the  ticket  agent,  this  amount 
w^as  taken  into  consideration  before  the  cash  payment  was  made  by 
the  Attorney  (leneral  and  his  friends. 

Senator  Eeed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  the  way  these  things  are  done 
is  this,  is  it  not :  Enough  people  ;  ,<  rc  ^  to  take  tickets  so  that  the  rail- 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGI^^  EXPENSES. 


2547 


road  company  will  then  furnish  a  car  for  that  party,  and  then  the 
people  either  pay  for  their  tickets  individually  or  it  may  be  paid  for 
by  some  one  else  ? 
Mr.  Scott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  Do  you  know  whether  in  this  instance  the  people 
in  that  car  did  pay  for  their  tickets  individually  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  I  know  they  did;  yes.  There  was  one  man  who  was 
assigned  to  take  charge  of  the  expenses,  just  for  the  sake  of  conveni- 
ence, and  they  made  their  payments  to  him. 

Senator  Reed.  So  everybody  paid  his  fare  on  that  car,  and  these 
two  Government  agents,  having  gone  out  for  the  purpose  of  protect- 
ing the  Attorney  General,  paid  their  fare  and  it  comes  back  from  the 
Government  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  Yes ;  that  is  correct. 

The  Chaiemax.  The  special  agents  did  not  pay  their  fare  out  of 
their  oAvn  pockets  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  No;  but  it  comes  back  from  the  Government.  This  is 
the  reimbursement. 

Senator  Reed.  But  the  railroad  Avas  paid  ? 

Mr.  Scott.  The  railroad  was  paid ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all ;  thank  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 


Mr.  Cooper.  Mr.  Chairman,  may  I  make  a  statement?    I  was 
referred  to  yesterday  in.  the  testimony. 
±he  Chairman.  All  right. 

(The  Avitness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Go  ahead. 

Mr.  Cooper.  Reference  was  made  before  this  committee  to  two 
vouchers  of  mine  showintj  transportation  and  expenses  to  San  Fran- 


voucher,  which  I  think  you  have  before  you,  a  statement  is  made 
concerning  expenses  incurred  by  me  on  June  15,  16,  IT,  and  18. 
Those  days  I  Avas  in  the  city  of  New  \  ork  in  connection  with  the 
obtaining  of  evidence  upon  a  forgery  Avhich  Avas  alleged  before  the 
Committee  on  Rules  of  the  House  of  Representatives  to  have  been 
committed  

The  Chairman.  We  did  not  take  that  up  at  all. 

Mr.  Cooper.  There  was  some  other  mention  made  about  certain 
disalloAvances  in  my  account  and  that  is  involved  in  that  matter. 
At  that  time  and  at  all  times  I  have  traveled  on  an  allowance  of 
$5  per  day  or  actual  expenses.  I  ha\^e  made  it  a  point  to  always 
put  in  my  vouchers  the  actual  expenses  of  the  trip.  It  is  impossible 
to  bring  those  Avithin  the  $5  a  day  allowance,  and  consequently  the 
disbursing  clerk  of  the  department  and  Division  of  Accounts  dis- 
alloAvs  eA^erything  above  the  $5  item.  That  is  the  reason  for  cer- 
tain items  which  were  disallowed  in  the  vouchers  which  appeared 
before  you  yesterday. 

On  the  20th  of  June,  Sunday,  I  left  the  city  of  Chicago  en  route  to 
San  Francisco.  That  trip  was  paid  for  entirely  by  the  Government. 
The  purpose  of  the  trip  was  to  inquire  into  certain  conditions  existing 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  JOHN  E.  COOPER. 


Cisco  and  return  in  the  months 


On  the  first 


2548 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


in  the  far  West  in  connection  with  radical  matters.  I  might  say 
that  I  am  in  charge  of  the  investigation  of  radical  activities  in  this 
country  and  the  I.  W.  W.  situation  in  the  West,  which  had  been  a 
matter  to  which  we  had  given  considerable  time  and  attention.  The 
new  deportation  act,  which  has  been  recently  passed  by  the  Congress 
on  June  6,  and  the  enforcement  of  certain  provisions  of  that  act 
come  under  the  supervision  of  the  Department  of  Justice. 

I  stopped  off  in  Los  Angeles  to  confer  with  the  agent  of  the  De- 
partment of  Justice  in  that  city  upon  certain  international  relations 
whicli  this  country  has  with  other  nations  and  which  are  pertinent  to 
the  Pacific  coast  alone.  I  was  in  Los  Angeles  one  day  and  arrived  in 
San  Francisco  on  the  Saturday  previous  to  the  opening  of  the  con- 
vention. 

I  had  a  conference  on  Saturday  morning  in  the  bureau  of  investi- 
gation. I  was  in  conference  on  Monday  and  Tuesday  at  the  bureau 
of  investigation  with  agents  of  the  Department  of  Justice,  and  also 
with  individuals  in  San  Francisco  who  were  considered  experts  upon 
the  matters  upon  which  I  was  there.  I  planned  to  leave  on  Wednes- 
day, but  due  to  the  illness  of  my  sister,  who  was  with  me,  I  had  to  de- 
lay that  departure  until  Thursday  morning.  That  was  Thursday  of 
the  first  week  of  the  convention.  I  proceeded  to  Seattle  and  had  three 
days'  conferences  at  that  point.  I  then  proceeded  to  Butte,  and  I  be- 
lieve I  was  somewhere  between  Butte  and  Chicago  when  the  nomi- 
nations  were  finally  decided  upon  at  San  Francisco.  At  no  time  did 
I  participate  in  any  political  activities  in  the  city  of  San  Francisco. 
The  inference  was  apparently  drawn  here  that  it  was  for  some  polit- 
ical purpose,  but  I  did  not  see  or  confer  with  the  Attorney  General. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  visit  his  headquarters? 

Mr.  Cooper.  I  was  there  once  in  the  evening,  on  Monday  night.  I 
was  there  at  no  other  time  during  that  week.  I  was  at  the  convention 
about  three-quarters  of  an  hour  on  Tuesday  afternoon. 

That  is  practically  the  substance  of  the  items  in  my  report. 

Senator  Reed.  That  was  long  enough  to  be  there,  was  it  not? 

Mr.  Cooper.  I  should  say  so,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all.   That  seems  to  have  been  a  very  busy 
time  in  San  Francisco. 
(Witness  excused.) 

(Thereupon,  at  1  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  took  a  recess  until 
2.15  o'clock  p.  m.) 

AFTERNOON  SESSION. 

The  subcommittee  reassembled  at  the  expiration  of  the  recess, 
Senator  William  S.  Kenyon  presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Kenyon  (chairman).  Edge,  Eeed,  and  Pomerene. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WILLIAM  M.  MOONEY. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  your  official  business? 
Mr.  MooNEY.  Disbursing  officer  of  the  Post  Office  Department. 
Senator. 

The  Chairman.  You  were  asked  to  bring  some  vouchers  here. 
Mr.  MooNEY.  No ;  I  was  not  asked  to  bring  any  vouchers. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2549 


The  Chairmax.  Expense  accounts? 

Mr,  ]MooxEY.  If  there  were  any. 

The  Chairmax.  Did  you  find  any? 

JMr.  ^looxEY.  Xot  one. 

The  Chairmax.  Xo  expense  accounts? 

Mr.  MooxEY.  Of  what  nature,  for  instance? 

The  Chairmax.  AVas  there  no  expense  account  of  the  chief  clerk 
for  about  the  time  of  the  San  Francisco  convention  ? 
Mr.  MooxEY.  Xone  whatever. 

The  Chairmax^.  Woukl  the  expense  accounts  be  in  ? 
Mr.  MooxEY.  Oh,  yes. 

The  Chairmax.  He  went  to  San  Francisco,  did  he  not  ? 

Mr.  MooxEY.  So  I  understand  from  hearsay.  That  is  the  only 
knoAvledge  that  I  have. 

The  Chair^iax.  You  have  examined  to  find  whether  there  are  any 
vouchers,  and  you  find  none? 

Mr.  MooxEY.  None  whatever. 

The  Chairman.  All  right,  sir.  We  land  nothing  on  that  lead. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  E.  M.  ALLEN. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman. 
The  Chairmax.  Mr.  Allen,  what  is  your  business  ? 
Mr.  Allex.  I  am  president  of  the  Mathieson  Alkali  Works. 
The  Chairmax.  Your  name  was  given  to  me  by  some  of  the  Sena- 
tors.   Is  that  one  of  Col.  Thompson's  companies  ?    Is  he  a  director  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  No  ;  he  is  not  a  director. 

The  Chairmax.  Have  you  anything  to  do  with  the  ways  and  means 
committee  of  the  Republican  national  committee  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  Yes. 
The  Chairman.  What  position? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  am  on  a  committee  to  solicit  funds  for  the  national 
Republican  committee. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  city  of  Xew  York  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  the  other  members  of  the  committee  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  can  not  remember;  but  there  is  a  Mr.  Pierson,  I 
think;  a  Mr.  Oakes — that  is  about  all  I  can  remember  of  the  com- 
mittee. 

The  Chairman.  Who  appoints  this  committee  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  I  think  that  I  was  asked  to  serve  by,  I  think,  Mr. 
Wright. 

The  Chairmax.  Who  is  Mr.  Wright? 

Mr.  Allex.  He  is  either  the  secretary  or  the  assistant  secretary  of 
the  ways  and  means  committee.  New  York. 

The  Chairmax.  Do  you  have  a  ways  and  means  committee  of  the 
city  of  New  York? 

Mr.  Allex.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairmax.  You  are  a  member  of  that  ways  and  means  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Allex.  Yes. 

The  Chairmax.  How  much  is  that  committee  to  raise? 


2550 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Allen.  The  committee  was  asked  to  raise,  I  think,  about — oh, 
as  a  committee,  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  What  do  you  expect  to  raise  as  a  committee? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  do  not  know  anything  except  that  that  relates  to  the 
chemical  division. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  a  chemical  division  of  this  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  To  raise  money  among  the  chemical  proprietors? 

Mr.  Allen.  The  manufacturers  of  chemicals. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  a  member  of  that  committee? 

Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  are  on  that  committee? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  do  not  remember  exactly ;  I  think  about  five  or  six.  - 
I  can  not  remember. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  are  you  to  raise  among  the  chemical 
manufacturers? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  think  they  asked  us  to  attempt  to  raise  about 
$34,000. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  done  that? 
Mr.  Allen.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  raised? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  think  from  the  last  figures  that  I  heard  or  saw  it 
was  about  $10,000. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  other  subcommittees  to  raise  funds 
among  other  branches  of  industry? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  think  there  are. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  the  way  the  committee  is  divided  up? 
Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  you  collect  this  money — or  do  you  do  thb 
actual  collecting  of  the  money?  Do  you  participate  in  that  your- 
self? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  have  not  collected  anything. 
The  Chairman.  Who  has  done  the  collecting? 
Mr.  Allen.  I  think  it  has  been  sent  in  by  individuals. 
The  Chairman.  You  induce  them  to  send,  and  they  send  it  to 
the  treasurer  of  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  They  send  it  to  Mr.  Upham? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  think  they  send  it  to  Mr.  Blaine. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  the  eastern  treasurer?  ^  . 

Mr.  Allen.  He  is  the  eastern  treasurer. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  name  of  your  company  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  The  Mathieson  Alkali  Works. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  of  these  dilferent  companies  are  there 
whom  you  are  trying  to  have  give  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  suppose  the  list  embraces  about  30  to  35. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  Democrats  in  that  list  as  well  as  Re- 
publicans? 

Mr.  Allen.  We  found  there  were ;  yes. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  soliciting  contributions  from  Democrats 
or  only  from  Republicans? 

Mr.  Allen.  Only  Republicans. 


PKESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2551 


The  Chairmax.  It  is  not  for  the  purpose,  then,  of  the  industry 
itself,  is  it,  or  for  any  tariff,  or  anything  of  that  character? 

Mr.  Allex.  Xo,  sir ;  it  is  just  for  the  Republican  Party,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  do  they  happen  to  be  divided  up  in  this  way? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  suppose  they*^  have  followed  the  methods  that  the 
Red  Cross  system  used. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  done  in  the  Red  Cross  ? 

!Mr.  Allen.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  on  the  committee  of  the  Red  Cross,  too? 

Mr.  Allen.  Xot  in  Xew  York.   I  lived  in  Chicago  at  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  Col.  Thompson  connected  at  all  with  the  com- 
pany? My  impression  was  that  you  were  brought  here  on  that  ac- 
count.  You  said  he  was  not  a  director. 

Mr.  Allen.  He  is  a  stockholder. 

Senator  Edge.  Simply  a  stockholder? 

Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  your  directors  all  Republicans? 

Mr.  Allen.  Xo;  they  are  not. 

Senator  Edge.  ^^Tio  are  your  directors,  offhand? 

Mr.  Allen.  There  is  Mr.  Galen  L.  Stone,  of  Boston:  Mr.  ]Max 
Moran,  of  Xiagara  Falls:  Mr.  C.  J.  Schmidlap,  of  Xew  York:  Mr. 
R.  Thornton  Wilson,  of  Wilson  

Senator  Edge.  Who  is  Mr.  Wilson  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  He  is  a  Democrat,  and  he  is  also  a  member  of  the 
committee  to  raise  money  for  the  Democratic  national  committee. 
Senator  Edge.  You  mean  Mr.  Gerard's  special  committee  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  have  representatives  of  both  parties  on 
the  board  of  that  great  corporation? 

Mr.  Allen.  Yes,  sir.  I  do  not  know  how  many  names  I  have  men- 
tioned there,  but  we  have  nine  directors  in  our  company.  There  is 
Mr.  F.  B.  Richards,  Charles  H.  Xewall,  Mr.  Charles  O.  Reed,  and 
myself.  I  think  that  is  about  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Your  contributions  that  you  solicit — are  they 
solicited  from  corporations  or  individuals  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  Only  from  individuals.  There  are  very  strict  instruc- 
tions about  being  impossible  to  solicit  from  corj^orations. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  sent  out  any  letters  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  Yes.  I  gave  only  a  letter  of  introduction.  I  did  not 
ever  write  any  letter  soliciting  subscriptions.  I  gave  a  letter  of 
introduction  to  a  few  people  in  our  industry. 

Senator  Reed,  Did  you  say  to  these  gentlemen,  in  substance  and  in 
fact,  that  while  a  corporation  could  not  subscribe,  the  way  the  con- 
tribution would  have  to  be  made  was  by  these  officers  or  stockholders 
subscribing  in  their  names? 

Mr.  Allen.  Xo,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  never  had  any  such  talk  as  that? 
Mr.  Allen.  Xo,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  started  out  to  raise  among  the  chemical  manu- 
facturers $34,000? 
Mr.  Allen.  I  think  that  was  the  amount. 


182774— 20— PT  19  A 


2552 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  an  arrangement  has  been 
made  to  or«:anize  among  other  businesses  in  the  same  way  and  raise 
money  through  them  ? 

Mr.  Ai.LEN.  I  do  not  know  directly;  no.  But  I  think  that  they 
have  sort  of  used  the  same  method,  like  shoe  manufacturers  and  other 
industrial  lines — grocers,  lawyers — the  same  sort  of  a  general  plan 
that  the  Red  Cross  pursued. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  the  Red  Cross  pursue  that  plan  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  do  not  know.    I  lived  in  Chicago  at  the  time. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  had  anything  to  do  with  the  expenditures 
of  any  moneys? 

Mr.  Allen.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  does  the  money  go  that  you  collect  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  I  think  it  goes  to  the  eastern  treasurer,  formerly  Mr. 
Schley,  now  Mr.  Blaine. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Chairman,  that  is  all  I  want  to  ask  now.  There 
is  a  matter  that  this  witness  w^as  called  for  of  a  special  nature,  but  it 
has  slipped  my  mind.  We  called  him  here  together  at  the  time  some- 
thing came  up  in  the  testimony  of  one  of  the  witnesses  that  we  wanted 
explained. 

The  Chairman.  We  put  him  on  because  he  had  a  particular  rea- 
son for  getting  away. 

Mr.  Allen.  I  did  not  get  this  notice  until  about  half-past  3  yes- 
terday, and  I  have  got  five  men  in  New  York  now  from  different 
parts  of  the  United  States  who  have  been  held  over  until  to-day. 

The  Chairman.  When  is  your  next  train  ? 

Mr.  Allen.  Four  o'clock. 

Senator  Reed.  We  will  get  you  off  in  time  for  that. 
The  Chairman.  What  time  is  it  now  ? 
Mr.  Allen.  Twenty  minutes  of  3. 

The  Chairman.  Will  that  give  you  time  enough  ?  * 
Mr.  Allen.  All  I  need  to  do  is  to  walk  to  the  station. 
(The  witness  was  temporarily  excused.) 

Senator  Reed.  Since  we  are  on  newspaper  business,  I  would  like  to 
have  the  editor  of  the  Republican. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  arrange  to  finish  with  Mr.  Allen? 
Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  I  will  try  to. 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Lock  wood. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  GEORGE  B.  LOCKWOOD. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Lockwood,  what  is  your  business? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  am  the  publisher  of  the  Muncie  (Ind.)  Evening 
Press  and  the  manager  and  editor  of  the  National  Republican  at 
Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  the  National  Republican  printed  or  owned  by  a 
corporation  or  by  individuals?    ^  j 

Mr.  Lockwood.  By  a  corporation.  ^ 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  the  corporation  organized  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  In  November,  1917.  Prior  to  that  time,  I  may 
say,  it  was  published  as  an  adjunct  of  the  Muncie  Evening  Press  by 
mvself.  . 

'Senator  Reed.  Of  Muncie,  Ind.  ?  I 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2553 


Mr.  LocKwooD.  Of  Mimcie,  Ind. ;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  are  the  stockholders? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  The  stockholders  are  the  estate,  I  presume — Mr. 
Martin  is  dead — of  Alva  Martin,  of  Norfolk,  Va. ;  Mr.  Adam  Beck,  of 
Greencastle,  Ind.;  Mr.  William  Irwin,  of  Columbus,  Ind.:  Mr.  John 
T.  Adams,  of  Dubuque,  Iowa;  Mr.  J.  T.  Carr,  of  Dubuque,  Iowa; 
Mr.  William  B.  McKinley,  of  Illinois;  Mr.  George  W.  Fairchild, 
former  member  of  Congress  from  New  York  (I  believe  his  home  is 
at  Oneonta,  N.  Y.)  ;  former  Senator  Hemenway,  of  Booneville,  Ind.; 
Mr.  Charles  D.  Hilles,  of  New  York;  Mr.  William  Thompson,  of 
New  York ;  Mr.  A.  T.  Hurt,  of  Louisville,  and  myself. 

Senator  Eeed.  Can  you  tell  us  the  total  amount  of  the  capital 
stock  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  The  total  authorized  issue  of  capital  stock  is 
$200,000 

Senator  Eeed.  How  much  has  been  issued? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  About  $60,000  of  the  preferred  stock.  We  have 
$100,000  preferred  and  $100,000  common. 

Senator  Reed.  $60,000  of  the  preferred  stock  has  been  issued.  How 
much  of  the  common? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Well,  with  the  preferred  stock  the  way  it  was 
sold  was  that  with  each  share  of  preferred  stock  a  half  share  of 
common  stock  was  issued.  That  would  be  about  one-half  of  the 
amount^ — the  amount  issued — say,  $30,000  as  the  purchase  price  of 
the  paper.  When  it  w^as  transferred  I  received  a  total  of  $62,500  of 
the  common  stock  and  $25,000  of  the  preferred. 

Senator  Reed.  In  order  to  get  that  a  little  bit  clearer,  Mr.  Lock- 
wood,  the  capital  stock  authorized  is  $200,000? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  One-half  preferred  and  one-half  common? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  received,  as  a  consideration  for  your 
paper  enterprise,  Avhich  you  moved  "here  to  Washington  and  turned 
over  to  this  corporation,  how  much  preferred  stock? 

Mr.  LocinvooD.  $25,000. 

Senator  Reed.  And  how  much  common? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  $62,500. 

Senator  Reed.  $62,500  of  common.   Is  anybody  in  any  way  inter- 
ested with  you  in  these  two  blocks  of  stock  or  either  of  them? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  absolutely  own  them  yourself? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Reed.  Nobody  has  got  any  claims  on  them  of  any  kind  ? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  amount  of  the  other  stock  that  is  out- 
standing ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Approximately,  Senator,  $50,000.  I  failed  to  men- 
tion one  stockholder  here.    His  name  is  John  W.  Weeks,  ex- Senator. 

Sehator  Reed.  I  want  to  know  the  amount,  first,  of  the  common 
stock  that  is  outstanding  that  you  do  not  hold. 
■   Mr.  LocKAvooD.  Approximately,  I  should  judge,  about  $10,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  the  common? 

Mr.  Lockwood!  Yes. 


2554 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Keed.  How  much  of  the  preferred  is  outstanding  that  you 
do  not  hold? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  About  $45,000. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  that  paid  for,  that  $45,000? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  The  method  of  organization  was  this:  I  received 
in  return  for  the  publication  $25,000  of  preferred  stock  and  $62,500 
of  common.  The  preferred  stock  was  sold  to  the  stockholders,  and 
with  each  100  shares  of  preferred  there  were  50  given  as  common, 
just  half  as  many,  as  a  bonus. 

Senator  Reed.  You  sold  $10,000  of  preferred  at  par  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed,  And  you  gave  

Mr.  LocKwooD.  $5,000  of  common  as  a  bonus. 

Senator  Reed.  That  accounts  for  only  $5,000  of  this  $45,000  of 
common.  You  say  there  is  $45,000  of  common  outstanding,  outside 
of  what  you  own.  There  is  only  $10,000  of  preferred.  Am  I  right 
about  that  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  No ;  there  is  $62,500  of  common,  half  the  amount 
of  i^ref erred — I  have  the  exact  figures  here. 

Senator  Reed.  Wait  just  a  moment.   Let  us  get  this  straight. 

Mr.  LocKWWD.  I  could  get  that,  Senator,  of  course. 

Senator  Reed.  We  will  get  it  very  quickly.  I  will  just  go  over  it 
again,  and  you  just  answer  the  questions  directly  on  each  case,  and 
then  we  will  get  it  straight. 

The  total  capital  stock  is  $200,000,  authorized? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  One-half— $100,000— is  preferred,  and  $100,000  is 
common?   That  is  right,  is  it  not? 
Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  the  preferred  stock  there  was  issued  about 
$25,000? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Reed.  And  there  was  issued  to  you  of  the  common  stock 
$62,500? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  both  of  those  blocks  of  stock  you  still  hold  ? 
Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  preferred  stock  has  been  issued  outside 
of  what  you  hold  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Well,  approximately  $55,000;  and  there  would  be 
half  that  much  common  issued  with  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Then,  there  would  be  common,  $27,500.  A  minute 
ago  you  said  $10,000. 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  did  not  mean  that.  I  said  about  ten  thousanc 
left  after  you  add  those  two  together. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh.  There  would  be  about  ten  thousand  left.  Oj 
this  $55,000  preferred  stock  held  by  other  stockholders  than  your- 
self  and  which  carries  with  it  the  common  stock,  I  want  to  know  hoT^ 
much  each  of  these  individuals  whom  you  have  named  as  stockhold- 
ers own. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  If  I  am  to  give  that  with  absolute  accuracy,  I 
would  want  to  consult  the  books.  I  can  give  it  to  the  best  of  my  rec- 
ollection, just  the  approximate  amount. 

Senator  Reed.  Give  it  approximately. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2555 


Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  would  like  to  give  it  from  the  books.  Mr.  Mar- 
tin had  $1,000;  Mr.  Beck,  $3,000  

Senator  Kep:d.  That  is  preferred  that  Ave  are  talking  about? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir;  with  half  that  much  common  stock  in  each 
case.   Mr.  Beck,  $8,000;  Mr.  Irwin,  $2,500;  Mr.  Adams,  $8,000  

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  that  Mr.  Adams  ? 

Mr.  LocKAVOOD.  Mr.  Adams  is  of  Dubuque,  Iowa.  He  is  a  business 
man  there;  membei-  of  the  national  committee  from  Iowa.  Mr.  T. 
J.  Carr,  who  is  his  partner,  $2,000;  Mr.  McKinlev,  $5,000;  Mr.  Fair- 
child,  I  think,  $2,000 ;  Mr.  Hemimvav,  $5,000 ;  Mr.  Thompson,  $15,000 ; 
Mr.  Hilles,  $2,500;  Mr.  Hart,  $1,000;  Mr.  AVeeks,  $5,000. 

Senator  Eeed.  Just  so  that  I  may  get  these  gentlemen's  political 
connections,  the  first  one  is  Martin  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  A  former  member  of  the  national  committee  from 
Virginia.    He  is  deceased. 

Senator  Eeed.  He  was  a  member  ? 

Mr.  LocKAVOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Beck? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Mr.  Beck  has  no  political  connection.    He  is  a 
friend  of  mine,  a  business  man  in  Indiana. 
Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Irwin? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  The  same.  He  is  an  active  Republican  in  In- 
diana. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Adams  ? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  He  is  a  member  of  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee from  Iowa,  and  at  this  time  is  vice  chairman  of  the  committee. 
Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Carr? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Mr.  Carr  is  his  partner.  He  has  no  political 
position. 

.   Senator  Reed.  The  next  one  is  Mr.  McKinley. 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Whom,  of  course,  you  knoAv — Congressman  from 
Illinois. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  a  member  of  the  committee,  is  he  ? 
Mr.  LocKAA'ooD.  No;  he  is  the  Republican  candidate  for  the  Sen- 
ate in  Illinois  at  this  time. 
Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Fairchild? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Mr.  Fairchild  is  a  former  Member  of  Congress. 
Senator  Reed.  Is  he  a  member  of  the  committee  ? 
Mr.  LocKAA^ooD.  No,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  Mr.  HemiuAvay? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Mr.  HemiuAvay  is  a  former  United  States  Senator 
'  Avho  lives  at  Boone ville,  Ind. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  a  member  of -the  committee? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  No,  sir.    He  was  a  member,  hoAvever,  at  the  time 
*  he  became  a  stockholder,  it  is  fair  to  say. 
^     Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Thompson — is  he  chairman  of  the  

Mr.  Lockavood.  Ways  and  means  committee  of  the  Republican  na,- 
s  tional  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Hilles? 
1     Mr.  Lockavood.  Mr.  Hilles  is  a  former  national  chairman  of  the 
->  Republican  national  committee. 
i     Senator  Reed.  Is  he  a  member  now? 
;     Mr.  Lockavood.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  a  committeeman  from  New  York. 


2556 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGl^  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  LocKAVooD.  Recently  elected.  That  is  so.  He  was  elected  at 
the  June  convention. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Hurt? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  He  is  a  member  of  the  committee  from  Louisville, 
Ky. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  Mr.  Weeks  a  member  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir.  He  also  was  elected  in  June.  He  was 
not  a  member  at  the  time  he  became  interested  in  this  company. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  any  contract,  agreement,  or  arrangement 
with  reference  to  the  management  or  the  direction  of  the  manage- 
ment of  this  paper? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  These  men  are  practically  all  politicians  ? 
Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Practically  all  interested  in  politics. 
Senator  Reed.  And  statesmen.   Of  course,  you  had  a  political  pur- 
pose in  establishing  this  paper? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  any  arrangement  made  with  them  or  any 
statement  made  to  them  that  the  paper  would  have  any  particular 
policy  or  do  any  particular  thing? 

Mr.  LocKFooD.  No,  sir ;  it  was  agreed  that  I  should  have — that  was 
the  idea  in  this  stock  arrangement,  that  I  was  to  have  complete  con- 
trol of  the  policy  of  the  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  told  them  what  the  policy  would  be  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  do  not  know  that  I  told  them,  but  they  all  under- 
stood. 

Senator  Reed.  They  all  understood  it  would  be  a  Republican 
organ  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  A  little  bit  broader  than  that.  Senator.  The  paper, 
of  course,  is  political.  It  is  a  Republican  paper,  as  the  name  indi- 
cates.  It  has  a  little  broader  than  a  purely  political  purpose. 

Senator  Edge.  There  is  no  subterfuge  whatever  about  that  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  no  claim  that  there  is. 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  I  will  say  that  one  of  the  ideas  of  the  publication 
from  the  beginning  has  been  to  combat,  I  would  say,  particularly 
socialism.  We  have  a  platform  here  which  describes  in  a  general  way 
what  we  have  in  mind  and  what  we  agree  to  do,  if  you  care  to  have  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  it. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  anything  about  the  League  of  Nations  in 
the  platform? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir — not  specifically,  but  by  anticipation.  It 
was  written  before  

The  Chairman.  There  is  no  difficulty,  when  you  read  this  paper, 
in  understanding  its  policy? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not  believe  there  is.  We  do  not  aim 
to  have  any  difficulty. 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  this  platform  or  declaration  of  principles 
adopted  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  About  two  years  ago.  You  say  "  adopted,"  Sena- 
tor.  I  simply  wrote  it  and  promulgated  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  was  using  the  word  "  adopted  "  in  that  sense. 
The  Chairman.  Your  platform?  j 
Mr.LocKWOOD.  My  platform.  | 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2557 


Senator  Reed.  I  think  we  had  better  print  it  in  the  record. 
The  Chairman.  It  is  a  good  platform,  is  it  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Part  of  it  is  good.  I  do  not  see  how  he  expects  to 
carry  it  all  out  through  the  instrumentality  that  he  has  chosen. 

Mr.  LocKW^ooD.  We  hope  to  work  on  the  party,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  It  may  be  you  can  work  oii  the  party.  You  may 
be  able  to  even  reform  the  Republican  Party ;  I  do  not  know. 

I  do  not  care  to  take  the  time  to  read  it  into  the  record.  I  will  just 
hand  it  to  the  reporter.  The  last  clause  is  this  : 

A  believer  in  the  Republican  Party  as  the  natural  conservator  and  adminis- 
trator of  the  fundamental  traditions  and  doctrines  of  historic  Americanism, 
laboring  as  the  organ  of  no  feud,  faction,  or  individual  for  the  upbuilding  of 
that  party  from  without  and  within  as  an  essential  instrumentality  for  the 
preservation  and  progress  of  the  Republic,  in  whose  history  it  has  written  so 
many  splendid  pages  and,  if  true  to  its  traditions,  will  write  many  more. 

That  last  clause  expresses,  I  suppose,  pretty  well  the  idea  of  the 
support  that  this  paper  is  to  give  to  a  political  party.  You  expect 
to  support  the  Republican  Party  and  you  have  been  supporting  it  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  We  have  been  supporting  the  Republican  Party 
and  expect  to  support  it  as  long  as  it  stands  for  what  we  have  out- 
lined here. 

(The  "  platform  "  referred  to  is  as  follows :) 

The  national  weekly  condensed  review  of  public  affairs,  published  from  the 
center  of  national  events. 

A  mouthpiece  of  traditional,  constructive  principles  and  policies  which  have 
secured  to  this  Republic  economic  independence,  material  wealth,  and  moral 
greatness. 

A  foe  of  that  revolutionary,  unreasoning  radicalism,  which  would  abandon 
the  landmarks  of  representative  government,  and  risk  in  academic  experiment 
the  perpetuity  of  the  great  constitutional  system  under  which  this  Nation  has 
enjoyed  a  century  and  a  third  of  orderly,  progressive  government,  safeguarding 
those  rights  of  person  and  property  for  the  preservation  of  which,  as  essential 
to  human  happiness,  governments  are  instituted  among  men.  It  stands  for 
the  perfecting,  rather  than  the  destruction,  of  that  system. 

An  enemy  of  socialism,  anarchism,  and  bolshevism,  whether  open  or  covert,  in 
public  or  private  life. 

An  advocate  of  industrial  peace,  through  justice  to  all  elements  of  American 
citizenship,  and  the  overthrow  of  demagogism,  with  its  appeals  to  class  preju- 
dice and  hatred,  to  envy  and  cupidity,  to  laziness  and  disloyalty,  to  indifference 
and  inefficiency. 

A  preacher  of  the  duties  as  well  as  the  rights  of  American  citizenship;  its 
obligations,  as  well  as  its  opportunities. 

An  antidote  for  that  vast  volume  of  socialistic  and  anarchistic  agitation  which 
is  flooding  the  country,  polluting  public  sentiment,  undermining  the  faith  of 
the  people  in  the  historic  fundamentals  of  Americanism,  destroying  the  indus- 
trial and  political  efficiency  of  the  American  people,  and  tending  to  establish  in 
this  country,  in  place  of  just  and  judicious  government,  that  irresponsible 
usurpation  of  power  by  class-conscious  groups  w^hich  has  hurled  Russia  from 
the  extreme  of  autocracy  to  that  of  anarchy  and  wiped  it  from  the  map  of  the 
world  as  a  power. 

A  champion  of  a  stalwart,  imwavering  Americanism,  which  at  all  times  and 
everywhere  throughout  the  world  stands  for  the  protection  of  lives  and  rights 
of  American  citizens,  on  sea  or  land,  on  this  and  other  continents;  which  is 
for  America  first,  last,  and  all  the  time,  and  would  sacrifice  no  just  interest 
of  the  American  i>eople  in  behalf  of  any  visionary  scheme  of  internationalism; 
which  will  devote  itself  in  domestic  legislation  and  administration  and  in  its 
diplomacy  to  the  welfare  of  America  and  Americanism,  backing  its  words  with 
deeds,  and  commanding  respect  for  itself  in  both  hemispheres  by  deserving, 
firmly  demanding,  and  promptly  enforcing  that  respect  where  it  is  not  volun- 
tarily yielded. 

A  propagandist  of  preparedness  for  war  in  time  of  peace  and  for  peace  in 
time  of  war,  for  the  protection  of  the  American  people  against  the  invasion  of 


2558 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


arms  and  the  invasion  of  foreign  competitors  armed  with  the  weapon  of  a  cheap- 
ness attained  through  the  sacrifice  of  human  values. 

A  foe  of  sectionalism,  of  political  division  based  upon  class  or  occupational 
self-interest,  of  corruption  and  intimidation,  of  the  use  of  great  Government 
agencies  having  the  power  of  life  and  death  over  industry  for  personal  and  par- 
tisan purposes. 

An  advocate  of  the  doing  by  parties,  party  leaders,  and  individuals  in  all 
matters  affecting  the  public  interest  of  that  which  is  morally  and  intellectually 
safe  and  right  rather  than  the  merely  expedient  thing. 

A  believer  in  the  Republican  Party  as  tlie  natural  conservator  and  admin- 
istrator of  the  fundamental  traditions  and  doctrines  of  historic  Americanism, 
laboring,  as  the  organ  of  no  feud,  faction,  or  individual,  for  the  upbuilding 
of  that  party  from  without  and  within  as  an  essential  instrumentality  for 
the  preservation  and  progress  of  the  Republic,  in  whose  history  it  has  writ- 
ten so  many  splendid  pages,  and,  if  true  to  its  traditions,  will  write  many 
more. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  circulation? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Our  circulation  is  at  this  time  approximately 
240,000. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  has  it  been  at  that  figure? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Well,  it  has  been  up  to  approximately  200,000, 
I  think,  the  greater  part  of  this  year. 
Senator  Reed.  That  is,  1920? 

Mr.  LoGKwooD.  1920.  At  this  time  we  are  putting  out,  in  addi- 
tion to  the  240,000  papers,  100,000  papers  additionally,  which  gives 
the  paper  a  total  circulation  at  this  time  of  340,000  to  350,000. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  that  at  the  beginning  of  this  year  you  had 
approximately  200,000  circulation  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Well,  up  toward  that. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  around  the  month  of  January.  Before 
that  what  was  3^our  circulation  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  It  had  a  gradual  growth  since  we  came  here. 
We  came  to  Washington  in  May,  1918.  That  is,  we  began  to  print 
here.  We  came  here  in  January,  1918,  and  the  paper  had  a  cir- 
culation when  we  came  here  of  about  30,000,  and  it  has  had  a 
gradual  growth  from  that  day  to  this. 

Senator  Reed.  Will  you  follow  that  along  and  tell  me  what  it  was, 
say,  in  the  beginning  of  1919  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  I  would  not  want  to  say,  except  in  the  roundest 
terms.  Senator.  I  have  an  impression  we  had  at  the  beginning  of 
1919  probably  100,000. 

Senator  Reed.  And  then  we  will  say  the  middle  of  1919.  Where 
had  you  gotten  to  then  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Possibly  130,000  or  140,000. 

Senator  Reed.  The  last  of  1919? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Up  toward  200,000,  perhaps  170,000  or  180,000. 

Senator  Reed.  At  that  time  and  for  some  months  prior  to  that  time 
the  Republican  national  committee  had  been  pretty  active  in  sup- 
porting this  paper  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  They  had  supported  the  paper  then.  That  is,  by 
way  of,  to  some  extent,  circulating  papers. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  money  have  you  received  from  the  na- 
tional Republican  committee  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  I  think  a  total  of  about  $35,000. 

The  Chairman.  In  what  period  of  time  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2559 


Mr.  LocKWOOD.  A  period  of  a  year  and  a  half.  I  have  here  the 
j    total  receipts  of  the  publication  on  circulation,  which  is  our  only 

source  of  income. 
\       Senator  Eeed.  What  is  your  subscription  price  per  annum  ? 
'       Mr.  LocKwooD.  At  this  time  it  is  $1.50  a  year.    Up  to  January  1 
j    of  this  year  it  was  $1  a  year. 

(  Senator  Eeed.  When  did  you  get  this  $35,000  from  the  national 
1    committee  ? 

';  Mr.  LocKwooD.  At  various  times  spread  over  the  last  year  and  a 
[  half. 

i  Senator  Eeed.  Tell  us  about  how  it  came  in.  I  do  not  want  to  go 
I    into  detail.  When  did  you  get  the  last? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  We  got  the  last  in  July. 

Senator  Eeed.  Of  this  year? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  This  year. 

Senator  Eeed.  How  much  was  that  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  That  was  in  the  neighborhood  of  $15,000.  It 
represented  an  account,  though,  that  was  in  part  a  year  old. 

Senator  Eeed.  What  do  you  give  the  Eepublican  national  com- 
mittee for  this  money  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Papers. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  furnish  them  extra  papers  ? 
Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Furnish  papers  to  lists  which  they  furnish  us. 
Senator  Eeed.  Exactly.    You  furnish  those,  papers  regularly,  do 
you  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Eegularly. 
1:       Senator  Eeed.  How  large  a  list  of  that  kind  have  you  to-day? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Of  our  total  circulation  of  240,000,  approximately, 
i    about  150,000  to  160,000  is  comprised  of  individual  subscriptions, 
I    persons  who  themselves  take  and  pay  for  the  paper.   The  remainder 
is  composed  of  subscriptions  sent  out  by  party  committees  including 
the  national  committee.  State  committees,  and  anybody  who  is  inter- 
ested in  circulating  the  paper. 

Senator  Eeed.  So  that  of  your  issue  which  now  amounts  to  340,000 
per  annum  

Mr.  LocKwooD.  No.  This  hundred  thousand.  Senator,  is  a  mere 
week  to  week  proposition.  It  is  not  the  permanent  part  of  our 
circulation  of  240,000. 

Senator  Eeed.  Of  your  subscription,  your  permanent  list  of 
:  240,000,  about  150,000  are  individual  subscribers  who  pay  for  their 
,    papers  themselves? 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  Yes;  from  150,000,  I  judge,  to  160,000. 

Senator  Eeed.  And  about  90,000  of  them  

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  From  80  to  90  at  this  time. 

k^^enator  Eeed  (continuing).  Are  not  subscribers  themselves,  but 
L  somebody  else,  some  club  or  some  committee  pays  you  for  the  paper 
i  and  you  send  it  out  to  the  various  people  whose  names  they  give  you  ? 
I       Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  is  correct. 

1  Senator  Eeed.  How  much  of  a  list  have  you  from  the  national 
i    committee  of  that  kind  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  judge  about  at  this  time  probably  half  of  that  is 
I   from  the  national  committee,  of  that  extra  eighty  to  ninety  thousand. 

Senator  Eeed.  So  that  from  forty  to  forty-five  thousand  of  these 
[    papers  are  paid  for  by  the  national  committee? 


i 


2560 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir ;  I  think  it  is  fair  to  say  that  this  100,000 
I  speak  of  which  goes  out  from  week  to  week  during  the  campaign 
are  also  paid  for  by  the  Republican  national  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  do  they  pay  you?  Do  they  pay  you  by 
the  year  or  do  they  pay  you  by  the  paper  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  The  pay  us  by  the  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  they  sent  out  to  the  same  individuals,  or  do 
you  shift  them  from  one  to  another? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  We  have  new  lists  ordinarily  each  week  during  the 
campaign  period. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  sending  out  these  papers  through  the 
mails? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  of  your  entire  circu-  . 
lation  of  340,000  sent  out  through  the  campaign  there  are  only  about 
150,000  that  are  paid  for  by  individuals  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  From  150,000  to  160,000  at  this  time. 

Senator  Reed.  You  said  the  national  committee  furnished  you 
with  lists  of  names,  and  you  have  given  us  the  facts  about  that.  You 
said  there  were  other  political  committees  that  paid  for  papers  and 
furnished  you  with  lists  of  names? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  committees  are  they? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Well,  various  State  committees  and  local  com- 
mittees. For  instance,  even  county  committees  or  a  local  town  com- 
mittee.  There  would  be  hundreds  of  those.  Senator,  in  the  aggregate. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  money  have  you  received  from  State 
committees  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  That  T  would  not  want  to  venture.  Senator,  with- 
out  

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  very  thing  I  want  to  get  at. 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Rep:d.  And  the  county  committees? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  That,  of  course,  can  be  gotten.  It  w^ill  be  quite  a 
task  to  segregate  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  not  your  books  show  when  you  get  money  from 
a  county  committee? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Or  a  State  committee? 

Mr.  LocKW^ooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  it  shows  how  much  money  came? 
Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  by  taking  that  amount  of  money  you  can  easily 
get  at  it? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir.   It  can  be  obtained. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  care  anything  about  the  matter  of  a  sub- 
scription for  three  or  four  papers,  or  something  of  that  sort,  but  I 
do  want  to  get  at,  in  a  general  way,  the  number  of  these  papers  that 
are  paid  for  by  political  committees. 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  I  will  say  one  thing.  Senator,  that  might  enlighten 
you.  You  have  not  asked  it,  bu.t  in  part  some  of  these  papers  sent 
out  by  the  national  committee  are  a  joint  arrangement  between  the 
national  and  the  State  committees;  that  is  to  say,  the  national  com- 
mittee pays  a  certain  portion  and  the  State  committee  a  certain  por- 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2561 


tion.  That  is  true  of  some  of  these  lists  that  I  speak  of  that  are  com- 
posed of  precinct  committeemen  of  the  party  in  various  States.  In 
that  case  it  is  a  joint  arrangement  between  national  and  State  com- 
mittees. That  is  one  little  complication,  of  course.  We  can  get  that 
done. 

Senator  Reed.  Send  the  facts,  whatever  they  are.  For  instance, 
the  State  committee  of  Indiana  takes  jointly  with  the  national  com- 
mittee, let  us  say,  a  thousand  copies,  for  illustration.  You  can  state 
that  fact. 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  can  take  that  off  your  books  and  file  it 
here,  can  you  not? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  not  large  blocks  of  this  subscribed  for  by  cor- 
porations ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  Not  large  blocks ;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  do  not  let  us  haggle  about  terms.  We  do  not 
want  to  do  that.    Are  not  considerable  blocks  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOoD.  We  have  sent  out  some  papers  to  lists  of  employees 
furnished  by  certain  business  concerns. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  it  that  solicits  these  business  concerns  for 
subscriptions  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  We  have  various  field  men  who  do  that  work. 
Senator  Reed.  You  send  them  out  for  the  purpose  of  going  to  a 
corporation  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Not  necessarily. 
Senator  Reed.  Or  an  individual  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  We  send  them  out.  Senator,  to  sell  papers  to  who- 
ever will.  buy. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  men,  though,  who  are  employed  and 
whose  business  it  is  to  go  around  and  not  solicit  individual  subscrip- 
tions, but  to  get  

Mr.  Lockwood.  Bulk  circulation. 

Senator  Reed.  Bulk  circulation. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  That  is  true. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  to  say,  some  individual  or  some  corporation 
subscribes  $100  or  $250  or  some  other  amount  and  furnishes  you  a 
list  of  names  and  you  then  send  the  papers  out  to  that  list  of  names  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  That  is  correct. 

Sejiator  Reed.  Has  Mr.  Hays  ever  had  anything  to  do  with  your 
newspaper  enterprise? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  No,  sir;  except  in  a  general  way  to  give  it  his 
encouragement. 

Mr.  Hays  has  only  been  in  our  building  once,  I  believe.    I  have 
talked  to  him,  of  course,  about  the  paper  on  more  than  one  occasion. 
Senator  Reed.  He  is  still  giving  you  his  encouragement? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  The  Republican  national  committee  is  still  giving 
its  encouragement  and  its  indorsement? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  I  suppose  you  have  kept  from  them  sedulously  the 
fact  that  you  were  getting  money  from  corporations  in  this  way  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  They  have  no  information  about  the  details  of  the 
business. 


2562 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Rej:d.  Do  not  any  of  them  know  these  facts  ? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  If  they  do,  it  has  been  obtained  from  some  other 
source  than  myself.  I  have  never  conferred  with  the  committee 
about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  you  tell  the  number  of  corporations  that  you 
have  gotten  subscriptions  from? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Not  without  reference  to  the  books. 
Senator  Reed.  You  could  if  you  went  to  your  books  ? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  The  books  show  every  subscription. 
Senator  Reed.  Will  you  give  us  such  a  list  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  How  long  do  you  want  it,  for  how  long  a  period? 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  it  back  to  the  first  of  this  year  and  if  you 
are  still  sending  out  papers  under  it  I  want  it  to  go  back  as  far  as  the 
present  circulation  goes.  That  is,  I  want  to  get  at  the  source  of  the 
payment  for  your  present  circulation.  I  do  not  ask  you  to  name  the 
individual  subscribers  who  pay  for  their  own  papers,  but  I  am  trying 
to  get  all  the  papers  that  are  paid  for  by  other  than  the  individual 
himself  who  gets  it. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  recognize  this  paper  that  I  hand  you  as  a 
subscription  blank  such  as  you  use  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  our  order  blank. 

Senator  Reed.  The  Fairbanks  Co.,  which  subscribed  $250  here  is 
a  corporation,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  LocKWOoD.  That  appears  to  be  the  record  on  that  list. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  signed  "  The  Fairbanks  Co."  by  some  Fair- 
banks, vice  president,  $250.  What  is  the  Fairbanks  Co.  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  confess  I  do  not  know.  I  presume  that  is  Mr. 
Newton  Fairbanks,  who  is  a  brother  of  the  former  vice  president. 

Senator  Reed.  Perhaps  you  can  get  the  initial  better  than  I  can. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  think  that  is  N.  H.  Fairbanks. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  their  business  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  do  not  know  what  it  is.  Mr.  Fairbanks  has 
various  interests  there. 

Senator  Reed.  You  got  $250  from  this  corporation,  and  you  got  a 
list  of  names  to  send  the  paper  to,  and  they  were  employees  of  that 
corporation,  were  they  not? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  presume  so.  I  am  not  familiar  with  that  par- 
ticular case. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  those  employees  getting  this 
paper  know  it  is  being  paid  for  by  the  corporation? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  do  not  know  whether  they  do  or  not.  They 
know  some  one  has  paid  for  the  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  this  be  put  in  the  record  as  Lockwood  Exhibit 
No.  1. 

Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  1. 

[The  National  Republioan,  425  Tenth  Street,  Washington,  D.  C] 

We,  the  undersigned,  hereby  agree  to  purchase  the  number  of  subscriptions 
to  the  National  Republican  set  opposite  our  names,  for  circulation  in  this  local- 
ity, to  spread  the  gospel  of  sound  government  and  to  counteract  the  havoc 
wrought  to  industrial  peace  as  well  as  American  patriotism  by  the  propaganda 
of  the  socialists  and  anarchists  and  those  forces  in  general  which  threaten 
to  undermine  the  Republic. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2563 

The  Fairbanks  Co.,  by  N.  H.  Fairbanks,  vice  president  $250 

Edward  A.  Tehan   75 

The  Ansted  &  Biirk  Co   50 


Senator  Eeed.  I  hand  you  another  paper  and  ask  if  you  recognize 
that  as  one  of  j^our  subscription  blanks  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  recognize  that  by  the  caption.  These  lists  are 
those  that  are  held  by  field  men  and  are  not  a  part  of  our  record  here 
at  the  office. 

Senator  Eeed.  But  they  would  be  turned  into  the  office,  would  they 
not? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  The  subscription  would  be  turned  in  ? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  have  those  subscriptions  on  your  books,  have 
.  you  not? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  B.  G.  Davis,  by  H.  M.  Myers,  Ohio  Cities  Gas  Co. 
Is  that  the  subscription  of  the  gas  company  ? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  It  is  whateA^er  is  stated  there. 
The  Chairman.  Is  that  the  one  Procter  is  interested  in  ? 
Mr.  LocKAvooD.  Yes ;  I  think  so. 
Senator  Eeed.  Is  he? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  haA^e  heard  so.  I  do  not  know.  Thaf  was  just 
an  aside  to  Senator  Kenyon. 

Senator  Eeed.  Let  us  keep  down  to  facts.  You  know  there  is  noth- 
ing in  the  world  quite  so  dangerous  as  chasing  rumors,  unless  it  is 
seeing  visions. 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  was  not  intended  as  testimony.  It  was  just 
a  side  remark  to  Senator  Kenyon. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  know  that  it  was.  Let  this  be  placed  in  the  record 
as  LockAvood  Exhibit  No.  2. 

LocKwooD  Exhibit  No.  2. 

(The  printed  portion  of  Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  2  is  the  same  as  that  of  Lock- 
wood  Exliibit  No,  1 ;  the  signatures  are  as  follows : ) 

B.  G.  Davis,  by  H.  M.  Myers,  Ohio  Cities  Gas  Co.,  250  $250 

Senator  Eeed.  Now  look  at  this  paper  which  I  hand  you.  That  is 
another  one  of  the  subscription  blanks,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  is  a  printed  blank  of  ours ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  recognize  those  names  as  among  your  con- 
tributors ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  have  no  doubt  they  are — not  contributors;  pur- 
chasers.  There  is  a  distinction. 

Senator  Eeed.  Dayton  Manufacturing  Co.,  by  its  secretary  and 
various  others.  All  of  these  companies  are  corporations  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  judge  so. 

Senator  Eeed.  Let  that  be  marked  "  Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  3  "  and 
inserted  in  the  record. 


2564 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Lock  WOOD  Exhibit  No.  3. 

(The  printed  portion  of  Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  3  is  the  .same  as  that  of  Lock- 
wood  Exhibit  No,  1 ;  the  signatures  are  as  follows : ) 


The  Dayton  Manufacturing  Co.,  Dayton,  Ohio,  by  H.  D.  Hendricks, 

secretary   $150  Paid. 

Tlie  Dayton  Malleable  Iron  Co.,  by  John  C.  Haswell,  president   100  Paid. 

The  Davis  Sewing  Machine  (Jo.,  F.  T.  Hoffman,  president   200  Paid. 

The  National  Cash  Register  Co.,  J,  H.  Barringer,  tirst  vice  presi- 
dent, per  W.  C.  P   200  Paid. 

Tile  Dayton-Wright  Airplane   250  Paid. 

The  Gi-eer  &  Greer  Co.,  Joseph  W.  Greer   50  Paid. 

John  F.  Hhmer,  Uhmer  Fare  Register  Co   50  Paid. 

Seybold  Machine  Co.,  Chas.  Seybold   50  Paid. 


Senator  Reed.  I  now  hand  you  another  paper.    Do  you  recognize 
that  as  another  one  of  your  subscription  blanks? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  That  is  another  one ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Here  is  another  paper;  three  more,  in  fact.  These 
are  all  your  subscription  blanks  ? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  those  be  marked  "  Lockwood  Exhibits  4,  5,  and 
6,"  and  placed  in  the  record. 

Lockwood  Exhibits  Nos.  4,  5,  and  6. 

(The  printed  portion  of  Locl^wood  Exhibits  Nos.  4,  5,  and  6  is  the  same  as  tliat 
of  Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  1 ;  the  signatures  are  as  follows : ) 

[Exhibit  4.] 

The  American  Rolling  Mill  Co.,  George  Menly,  president,  250  subscriptions-  $250 
The  Gardner  &  Harvey  Co.,  per  E.  T.  Gardner,  president,  50  subscriptions—  50 

[Exliibit5.] 

Edward  L.  Buchwalter,  805  East  High  Street,  Springfield,  Ohio   100 

[Exhibit  6.] 

The  Dayton  Manufacturing  Co.,  .1.  Kirby,  jr.,  president,  150  subscriptions-  225 
The  American  Rolling  Mill  Co.,  George  Menty,  president   250 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  really  making  quite  an  effort  to  get  the 
money  from  corporations,  were  you  not? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Not  specially ;  no,  sir.  ' 

Senator  Reed.- As  a  matter  of  fact  haven't  you  been  making  what 
we  call  a  drive  to  get  money  from  corporations  and  seeking  to  induce 
those  corporations  fo  make  these  subscriptions  to  send  to  their  em- 
ployees ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  They  have  been  making  sales  of  subscriptions  to 
certain  business  concerns  in  that  way. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  recognize  that  [indicating]  as  your  sig- 
nature ?  • ,  . 

Mr.  Lockwood.  That  is  a  multigraph  letter  with  a  facsimile  sig- 
nature. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  a  facsimile  of  your  signature  ? 
Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  multigraphed  them  because  you  were  using 
quite  a  number  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2565 


Senator  Eeed.  You  gave  these  to  .your  agents,  did  you  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  No,  sir;  those  were  sent  out  from  the  office.  I 
recognize  the  circular. 

Senator  Eeed.  Of  course,  if  you  sent  it  out  the  statements  con- 
tained in  it  are  true,  I  suppose? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir;  they  undoubtedly  are.  Let  me  see  it. 
Senator.    [After  examination.]   Yes,  sir ;  that  is  one  of  our  circulars. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  on  the  letterhead  of  "The  National  Repub- 
lican." Let  that  be  inserted  in  the  record  as  Lockwood  Exhibit 
•No.  7. 

Lockwood  Exhibit  No.  7. 

[The  National  Republican.    The  National  Republican  Weekly,  George  B.  Lockwood,  editor, 
425  Tenth  Street  NW.,  Washington  D.  C] 

We  are  sending  these  to  all  persons  whose  names  are  sent  in  from  now  on 
in  industrial  clubs.  We  have  a  legal  opinion  from  a  corporation  tax  expert, 
Which  we  will  send  you,  that  subscriptions  to  the  paper  may  be  charged  to 
expense  by  companies. 

Dear  Sir:  At  the  instance  of  the  Republican  organization  we  are  sending 
you  our  paper,  the  National  Republican.  The  subscription  is  paid  for  for  one 
year,  and  at  the  end  of  that  time  your  name  will  be  taken  from  our  list  unless 
you  have  in  the  meantime  ordered  us  to  continue  it  longer.  In  other  words, 
no  financial  obligation  on  your  part  is  or  will  be  entailed.  The  paper 
represents  the  desire  to  have  you  read  the  Republican  side  of  public  questions. 
It  does  not  represent  an  attempt  to  influence  your  opinion  in  any  way,  but  to 
let  you  know  the  facts  and  arguments  in  behalf  of  Republicanism,  which  you 
will  be  able  to  weigh  and  judge  for  yourself. 

We  believe  you  will  find  the  paper  of  interest  independent  of  the  political 
phase  of  it.  We  print  each  week  a  summary  of  the  proceedings  and  debates  of 
Congress,  and  a  review  of  the  work  of  the  Government  at  Washington,  of  events 
in  this  country  and  abroad  having  a  bearing  upon  politics  and  public  affairs. 
We  also  print  some  miscellaneous  matters  of  general  interest,  with  cartoons  and 
illustrations. 

In  case  of  any  change  or  error  in  your  address  please  advise  us,  and  the 
paper  will  be  sent  to  you  at  the  new  address.    If  you  like  the  paper  we  will  be 
glad  to  have  you  call  the  attention  of  your  friends  to  it. 
Very  truly,  yours, 

George  B.  Lockwood. 

Senator  Reed.  Evidently  that  letter,  multigraphed,  was  written  to 
be  sent  to  the  various  people  to  whom  you  sent  this  paper  when  it 
had  been  paid  for  by  others.   That  is  true,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  said  to  each  of  these  people  in  this  letter, 
"At  the  expense  of  the  Republican  organization,  we  are  sending  you 
our  paper,  the  National  Republican."  That  was  a  true  statement, 
was  it  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  A  letter  of  that  kind  Avas  used  in  connection  with 
the  names  sent  in  by  Republican  organizations,  etc.,  and  it  may 
have  been  used  in  connection  with  other  forms  or  other  sorts  of  cir- 
culation subscribed  by  other  people. 

Senator  Reed.  But  as  a  matter  of  fact  this  is  the  kind  of  letter 
that  you  sent  out  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  In  a  general  way  that  is  the  sort  of  letter  we  sent 
to  persons  whose  names  were  added. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  you  told  these  people  to  whom  the  paper  was 
sent  

Mr.  Lockwood  (interrupting).  That  it  was  a  Republican  party. 


2566 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed  (continuing).  That  it  was  being  sent  at  the  expense 
of  the  Republican  organization? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  We  sent  out  many  such  letters  as  that. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  true ;  it  was  being  sent  at  the  expense  of  the 
Republican  organization,  was  it? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  In  some  cases  it  was,  directly  or  indirectly. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  send  this  out  in  cases  where  the  statement 
was  at  fault?    You  would  not  do  that? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  is  a  circular  letter,  which  went  out  quite 
generally,  and  it  may  have  been  used  in  cases  where  it  was  not 
directly  the  Republican  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  a  man,  for  instance,  who  worked  over  here 
for  the  John  Smith  Manufacturing  Co.,  and  who  got  this  paper 
from  you  and  read  this  letter,  would  not  understand  that  the  John 
Smith  Manufacturing  Co.  had  paid  for  it,  but  he  would  understand 
that  it  was  being  sent  to  him  at  the  instance  of  the  Republican  or- 
ganization ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  If  he  received  that  letter  he  would  so  understand; 
yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And,  of  course,  you  would  not  send  a  letter  of  that 
kind  out  unless  you  had  consulted  with  and  had  an  understanding 
with  the  national  committee  that  had  been  supporting  you  that  you 
were  authorized  to  make  that  statement? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  That  letter  had  nothing  to  do  with  the  national  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  at  all  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Then,  what  Republican  organization  did  it  have  to 
do  with  that  enabled  you  to  send  it  out  generally  to  your  subscribers? 

Mr.  LocKWooD,  That  letter  was  one  that  was  used  in  many  in- 
stances in  connection  with  subscriptions  which  were  sent  out  by 
Republican  organizations  and  by  Republican  individuals. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  also  said  it  was  generally  used  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  Quite  generally.  It  was  a  circular  we  had  in 
stock  to  send  out  for  circulation  of  that  class  where  it  was  free 
circulation. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  see  of  we  can  not  make  that  a  little  more 
definite.  The  first  statement  in  this  letter,  above  the  letter  itself, 
is  that — 

We  are  sefiding  these  to  all  persons  whose  names  are  sent  in  from  now  on  in 
industrial  clubs. 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes ;  I  think  we  did,  probably,  as  I  say. 
Senator  Reed.  It  says  further  that — 

We  have  a  legal  opinion  from  a  corporation-tax  expert  that  we  will  send 
you  that  subscriptions  to  the  paper  may  be  charged  to  expense  by  companies. 

Does  not  that  set  at  rest  the  proposition  that  this  letter  was  gen- 
eral and  that  you  sent  it  out  to  those  

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  I  have  stated  it  was  general. 

Senator  Reed.  And  to  those  you  called  industrial  clubs? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  All  classses  -are  free  circulation,  or  some  letters 
similar  to  that.   We  had  many  changes  in  the  form  of  the  letter. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  is  it  or  not  the  truth  that  these  papers  were 
sent  at  the  instance  of  the  Republican  organization  ? 


|j  PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2567 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  In  some  cases  that  was  an  accurate  strictly  tech- 
'  meal  statement.  It  was  not  strictly  technical  in  others,  probablv,  an 
exact  statement  of  the  fact.  The  effort  and  the  intention  was"' that 
nobody  should  get  his  paper  under  any  misunderstanding.  He  should 
:  understand  it  was  a  party  or  political  publication. 
I  Senator  Keed.  You  have  never  gotten  any  information,  I  suppose, 
I  from  any  one,  Mr.  Loclnvood,  that  the  Republican  national  commit- 
jtee  knew  anything  about  this  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee has  very  little  knowledge  of  our  business  outside  of  their  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  Let  us  see  if  you  ever  got  that  letter 
]  (handing  witness  a  letter). 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Oh,  yes;  certainly.   That  is  Mr.  Fairbanks,  whose 
name  you  read  a  Avhile  ago. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  connection  Avith  the  Republican  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  None  whatever. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  an  actiA^e  Republican  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Seiiator  Reed.  Let  us  see  what  light  we  can  get.  This  is  on  the 
jFairbanks  Co.  letterhead,  and  reads  as  follows  : 

[The  Fairbanks  Co.,  grey  iron  founders,  manufacturers  of  piano  plates.] 

rr      n  T.  T  Springfield,  Ohio,  February  5,  1919.  . 

Hon.  George  B.  Lockwood, 

National  Republican,  Washington,  D.  C. 

Ly.!^""  ^^^^  f""-  LOCKWOOD :  Since  returning  from  Chicago  I  have  been  pressing 
jthe  matter  ot  enlarging  the  circulation  of  the  National  Republican  in  this  State 
f^A  so  snice  that  time  we  have  effected  the  organization  of  a  Stat«  Republican 
ladvisory  committee,  which  will  have  charge  of  propaganda  and  Republican 
jactivities  between  now  and  the  campaign  of  1920. 

,1  We  had  our  first  meeting  of  this  committee  yesterday,  and  I  again  urged  that 
dehnite  action  be  taken  with  respect  to  the  National  Republican  for  thfs  State 
with  the  result  that  such  action  will  be  formulated  as  speedily  as  possible  and 

Ij^Jog^arln  Ohio  important  factor  of';)ur  prepar^ness 

I  betp  aglin  fofi'Siom''^"     ^'^"^  ^^'^^'^  ^'"'^^^'^^^y'  ^^'^^^  the  matter  will 

I ^'"'^^^  8i^^^  J»e  the  definite  proposition  from  your  standpoint, 

lor  this  S  ate,  including  in  the  State  circulation  an  Ohio  page,  WrdingTiich 
'  I  have  written  you  heretofore,  and  the  best  rate  you  can  affoi'd  tS  grant  us  ?n 

committe^^^    '''''^  '^^^'''^'^  proposition  to  present  to  that  meeting  of  tie 

i.il'V'^''^^^  ^IV"^  '''^  ^'''}^  promptly  provide  you  with  circulation  for  the  county 
n  .      ^-omiHit  ee  men  throughout  the  State.   These  number  about  5,8oTand  you 
1 110  doubt  already  have  a  number  of  these  on  your  list,  so  our  first  effort  would 
;  .nc  ude  the  membership  not  already  receivin/the  paper 

'  J^l"^'^  ^'IT^  Riddick  was  here.  I  had  promised  to  write  him  on  this  subiect 
lf^ZZT'  '%'^  not  rounded  up  into  a  probable  certainty  as  to  what  wfwould 
be  able  to  do  before  the  meeting  of  yesterday,  and  there  was  very  little  about 

^^Ztl'^lTou^^^^  "^^'^^  ^^^^  ''''''  ^^^^     ^-^11  answer  the 

Kindly  remember  me  to  Carl,  and  with  best  wishes  I  beg  to  remain 
Cordially,  yours,  ' 

V  N.  H.  Fairbanks. 

Senator  Eeed.  What  did  you  understand  Mr.  Fairbanks  to  refer 
:o  when  he  says.    Since  returning  from  Chicago  "  ?    Was  there  not 
pver  there  a  national  committee  meeting? 
182774— 20— PT  19  5 


2568 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  do  not  knoAv.    What  is  the  date  of  that  letter? 
Senator  Reed.  February  5. 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  What  year? 
Senator  Reed.  February  5,  1919. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  There  was  a  meeting  of  the  national  committee  in 
Chicago  in  January^  I  think,  of  that  year,  and  I  think  I  saw  Mr. 
Fairbanks  at  Chicago  at  that  meeting.  He  is  writing  as  State  chair- 
man now. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  a  Mr.  Carl  Riddick? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  connection  with  your  paper? 

Mr.  LocKWOoD.  At  present  he  has  none. 

Senator  Reed.  What  connection  did  he  have? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  He  assisted  us  in  the  circulation. 

Senator  Reed.  He  was  one  of  your  authorized  agents  ? 

Mr.  Ix)CKw^ooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  his  signature?, 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  that  it  [indicating]  ? 

Mr.  LocKw^ooD.  That  is  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  read  that  letter  to  the  committee  r 

House  of  Representatives, 
WashvMjton,  D.  C,  June  16,  1919.. 

William  H.  Hill,  Esq., 
Buffalo,  N.  Y. 

My  Dear  Fellow  Republican  :  You  want  a  Republican  President  and  Re- 
publican Coniii'ess  elected  at  the  next  election,  and  the  consequent  good  that 
will  come  to  the  country. 

You  indorse  the  efforts  of  Republican  National  Chairman  Will  H.  Hays  and 
of  Congressman  S.  D.  Fess.  chairman  of  the  Republican  congressional  committee 
in  making  a  nation-wide  educational  campaign  at  this  time  for  better  Ameri- 
canism, for  closer  organization  of  Republicanism,  and  against  socialism  and 
the  increasing  drift  toward  lawlessness,  evidences  of  which  are  becoming  more 
and  more  apparent. 

A  nation-wide,  systematic,  educational  campaign  is  being  made  right  now 
with  authority  of  these  and  other  leaders  of  the  party.  Acting  for  these 
leaders  of  our  party  organization,  I  am  asked  to  request  a  small  subscription 
from  you  to  be  used  to  help  make  this  campaign  a  great  success.  The  special 
effort  is  to  increase  the  circulation  of  the  National  Republican  Weekly  over  the- 
million  mark. 

The  National  Republican  is  not  a  commercial  newspaper.  It  is  published  by 
Republicans  for  the  good  of  the  country  and  the  party.  It  is  Republican  Party 
literature  in  its  best  and  most  effective  form.  It  carries  no  advertising.  It 
sells  for  $1  a  year  which  will  pay  costs  with  large  quantity  production.  The 
inclosed  slip  tells  more  about  it. 

All  I  ask  of  you  is  a  $5  or  $10  check,  but  we  want  and  need  and  hoi)e  for 
this,  knowing  your  interest  in  the  effort  being  made,  and  your  conlidence  in 
and  desire  to  cooperate  with  the  official  heads  of  our  party  organization. 

I  have  sent  you  a  sample  copy  of  this  national  party  paper.    Please  give  us 
your  indorsement  in  the  way  of  your  check  by  early  return  mail,  and  know  that 
it  will  be  appreciated  and  will  be  used  wisely  in  a  worthy  cause. 
Cordially,  yours, 

Carl  W.  Riddick. 

Senator  Reed.  With  that  before  you,  Mr.  Lockwood,  do  you  sa}^ 
that  Mr.  Hays  and  the  managers  of  the  Republican  campaign  were 
not  advised  of  your  efforts  to  raise  money  in  order  to  increase  your 
•circulation  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes:  they  certainly  knew.  Senator,  that  we  were 
doing  all  we  could  to  increase  the  circulation  of  the  paper.  The}^  ^vere 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2569 


in  tlioroiigh  sympathy  with  our  efforts  to  do  that.  There  is  no  denial 
of  that  proposition. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  ask  you  whether  or  not  you  kept  secret  from 
them  this  elfort  in  which  they  were  interested,  if  they  knew  of  this 
purpose  to  collect  large  sums  of  money  from  corporations,  and  I 
mean  by  large  sums.  $*200.  $*250,  etc.? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  They  were  never  either  advised  nor  was  any  effort 
made  to  conceal  from  them  any  secret  of  our  business. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Riddick  kneAv,  did  he  not  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  He  undoubtedly  knew  of  the  plans  of  the  organi- 
zation, concerning  which  there  is  no  concealment  and  no  possible 
concealment.  Our  records  are  public  records,  open  to  the  Post  Office 
Department  at  any  minute,  and  it  is  ludicrous  to  suppose  that  we 
would  conceal  what  we  were  doing  or  attempt  to  do  from  anybod3^ 

Senator  Reed.  Then,  if  you  did  not  conceal  it,  did  Mr.  Hays  and 
the  national  committee  know  you  were  attempting  to  get  money  from: 
corporations  to  carr}^  on  this  political  propaganda  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  do  not  know  whether  they  know  it  or  not.  I  had 
no  objection  to  their  knowin^r  it.  There  has  been  nothing  we  had  to 
apologize  for  in  connection  with  it  or  that  we  should  be  ashamed  of. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  asking  you  to  apologize  for  anything.  I 
am  not  casting  any  aspersions  on  you  at  all.  I  am  just  trying  to  get 
at  some  facts. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  All  right.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed  (handing  a  paper  to  the  Avitness).  Well,  do  3^011 
recognize  the  signature  of  Mr.  Hays  to  that  document  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  That  is  another  multigraph  letter.  It  was  issued 
by  us. 

Senator  Reed.  But  that  is  his  signature? 
^Ir.  LocKwooD.  Undoubtedly  it  is,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  a  photographic  copy,  or  whatever  you  calT 
it,  of  Mr.  Hays's  signature,  and  you  had  the  original,  or  you  would 
not  have  used  this  ? 

^Ir.  LocKwooD.  Oh,  certainly  :  we  had  the  original  letter. 

Senator  Reed  (reading)  : 

[Republican  national  committee,  Will  II.  Hays,  chairman,  Woodward  Building.  Washing- 
ton, D.  C] 

To  RepuhUcaus: 

I  am  familiar  with  the  good  which  has  been  done,  and  that  which  it  is  pro- 
jMised  to  accomplish  by  means  of  the  circnlation  of  the  National  Republican. 
I  am  advised  that  funds  are  being  raised  now  with  which  to  increase  the  circula- 
tion of  the  publication  throughout  the  Nation  that  the  party  may  be  strengthened' 
every v.here.  It  is  to  l>e  used  first  in  the  localities  where  the  opposition  is 
strongest,  and  Republican  vutes  are  most  necessary — later,  if  possible,  increasing- 
its  circulation  to  make  it  nation-wide,  that  a  vigorous  tight  may  be  continuouslr 
waged  against  evils  developing  which  can  b?  prevented  by  the  application  of 
the  principles  advocated  by  the  party.  With  a  strong  aggressive  party  paper, 
pleaching  the  party  principles  for  i)atriotism  and  prosperity,  and  harmony  and 
united  action  within  the  party,  editetl  fearlessly  and  ably  as  this  one  is,  im- 
mea.surable  good  can  be  acc-inplished  for  the  party  and  for  the  country. 

Your  support  in  this  effort  financially  and  otherwise  is  urged,  to  the  end 
that  we  n;ay  all  help,  as  far  as  vv-e  are  able,  to  make  certain  the  practice- 
of  our  .*<o\md  ecoi.omic  principles  and  better  government. 
Respectful  Iv. 

Will  H.  Hays, 
Chairman  RepuMican  National  Committee^ 

To  whom  was  this  letter  sent  ? 


2570 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  LocKwooD.  To  Republicans ;  it  is  so  addressed. 

Senator  Reed.  Generally? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  is  a  circular  letter. 

Senator  Reed.  And  given  to  your  agents  who  went  out  to  get  this 
money  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Given  to  me.  I  had  it  multigraphed  and  cir- 
culated. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  gave  it  to  your  agents  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  To  all  our  solicitors — everybody. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  the  gentleman  who  sent  out  and  got  these 
subscriptions  from  these  corporations,  some  of  which  I  had  put  in 
evidence,  probably  had  this  multigraph  letter  in  his  hand,  didn't  he  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  V ery  likely.   Every  man  probably  had  that  letter. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  do  you  still  think  Mr.  Hays  was  not  in  on 
this  matter  of  getting  the  money  from  the  corporations  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  do  not  think  Mr.  Hays  either  knew  or  thought 
anything  about  what  we  were  doing,  except  that  we  were  promoting 
the  circulation  of  this  paper.  I  am  very  certain  he  had  no  knowledge 
of  the  details  of  what  we  w^ere  doing. 

Senator  Reed.  He  says : 

I  am  advised  that  funds  are  beinj?  raised  now  with  which  to  increase  the  cir- 
culation of  the  publication  throughout  the  Nation  that  the  party  may  be  strength- 
ened everywhere. 

Mr.  LocKWOOD,  Yes,  sir;  we  were  sending  out  large  numbers  of 
circulars  such  as  you  have  read  here. 
Senator  Reed.  He  says: 

I  am  familiar  with  the  good  which  has  been  done,  and  that  which  it  is  pro- 
posed to  accomplish  by  means  of  the  circulation  of  the  National  Republican. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir.   I  think  he  meant  it. 
Senator  Reed.  He  says: 

The  paper  is  to  be  used  in  localities  where  the  opposition  is  strongest,  etc. 
Well,  I  won't  comment  on  it. 

Now,  in  the  letter  that  I  first  called  your  attention  to,  it  is  stated, 

among  other  things : 

We  have  a  legal  opinion  from  a  corporation-tax  expert,  which  we  will  send 
you,  that  subscriptions  to  a  paper  may  be  charged  to  expense  by  companies. 

Is  that  the  copy  of  that  opinion  that  you  sent  out?  [Handing  a 
paper  to  the  witness.] 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  That  undoubtedly  is.  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  I  will  read  that : 

60  Wall  Street, 
,  New  York  City,  May  27,  1919. 

Mr.  Richard  I.  Berenson, 

Hotel  Hargrave,  Seventy -second  Street  and  Columhus  Avenue, 

Mew  York  City. 

Dear  Sir  :  With  reference  to  your  inquiry  whether  or  not  a  manufacturer  may 
regard  as  an  expense  to  the  business  subscriptions  to  the  National  Republican 
for  his  employees,  in  my  opinion  this  may  readily  be  done.  The  amount  of  the 
subscriptions  mav,  if  the  employer  desires,  be  apportioned  among  the  several  em- 
plovees  as  additional  salary  or  bonus;  that  is,  that  the  employee,  in  addition 
to  receiving  his  salary,  gets  a  bonus  by  way  of  a  subscription  to  the  National 
Republican.  If,  on  the  ()ther  hand,  it  is  too  cumbersome  to  apportion  the  sub- 
scriptions among  the  employers,  it  may  be  regarded  as  a  miscellaneous  or  sundry 
expense. 

[Laughter.] 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2571 


Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  is  better  than  bayonets,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  is  not  better  than  fraud,  since  you  Avant  to 
comment  on  it. 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  is  written  by  a  A^ery  distinguished  Democratic 
attorney. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  care  AAdiether  he  is  a  Democratic  attorney  or 
not.  A  man  that  AA^ill  set  up  a  job  to  beat  the  GoA^ernment  in  that 
AA^ay  is  not  an  ornament  to  any  party.  I  am  going  to  continue  to  read 
this : 

Manufacturers  \A'ho  employ  s»)cial  service  or  welfare  workers  for  their  em- 
ployees charge  their  salaries  in  as  an  expense,  and  by  the  same  token  subscrip- 
tions to  the  paper  may  be  charged  as  an  expense,  inasnuich  as  it  is  educational, 
and  its  effect  is  to  make  employees  more  intelligent  and  therefore  more  efficient 
in  their  work. 

Yours,  A'ery  sincrely, 

Lawrence  Berenson. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  member  of  a  firm  ? 

Mr.  LocKAA^ooD.  He  is  a  prominent  laAvyer  in  Xcaa^  York  City,  a 
Democrat.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  I  neA^r  saAv  that  opinion  until  you 
handed  it  to  me.  I  do  not  disaA^oAA^  it,  because  I  kncAA^  it  had  been 
obtained  by  one  of  our  field  men,  and  it  AA^as  sent  out  through  our 
office.  I  kncAY  of  its  existence,  but  I  neA^er  saAv  the  text  of  it  before. 

Senator  Edge.  Had*  the  question  eA^er  been  raised,  to  your  knoAvl- 
edge,  that  you  Avere  A^olating  any  statute  in  selling  copies  of  the 
neAvspaper  to  corporations? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  This  Avas  intended.  Senator,  to  meet  this  proposi- 
tion of  hoAv^  this  expenditure  should  be  charged. 
(  Senator  Edge.  Yes;  I  understand  that;  but  had  the  question  eA^er 
been  raised,  to  your  knoA\dedge,  or  haA^e  you  any  knoAAdedge  about  it, 
as  to  its  being  a  violation — selling  ncAvspapers  of  any  character  at  all 
to  corporations  for  distribution  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvoOD.  We  had  some  such  suggestion  at  one  time,  and  A\'e 
took  the  opinion  of  the  attorney  general  of  Ohio  at  that  time  on  the 
proposition. 

Senator  Edge.  What  AA^as  his  opinion  ? 

Mr.  LocKAAWD.  That  aa^c  Avere  entitled  to  do  it  under  the  laAV 
legally. 

The  Chairman.  Hoav  much  does  he  get  for  an  opinion  like  this? 
Senator  Edge.  Speaking  noAv  of  the  attorney  general  of  Ohio. 
Mr.  LocKAAWD.  He  got  nothing. 

The  Chairman.  But  this  man — Iioaa^  much  does  he  get? 

Mr.  LocKAA'ooD.  Nothing  AvhateA^er. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  it  a  campaign  contribution  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  If  he  had  made  a  contribution.  Senator,  it  Avould 
haA^e  been  to  the  Democratic  Party.    He  belongs  to  Tammany  Hall. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  haA^e  taken  this  chapter  of  ethics  from  the 
li  morals  of  Tammany  Hall  and  incorporated  it  into  the  Republican 
:    propaganda  ? 

<  Mr.  LocKAAWD.  Well,  if  the  Democratic  Party  can  take  its  presi- 
dential candidate  from  that  quarter,  I  do  not  see  Avhy  Ave  should  not 
do  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  but  have  they? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  is  the  common  understanding. 


2572 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  And  another  common  understanding — a  man  that 
was  never  any  nearer  Tammany  Hall  than  you  are.  Now,  let  us 
stick  to  the  text  for  a  while.  We  want  to  keep  the  blood  out  of  our 
heads. 

Did  3^ou  get  any  opinion  that  corporations  could  subscribe  to  this 
neAvspaper  in  this  way? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  We  had  such  an  opinion  at  an  early  stage  of  our 
w^ork. 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  fortified  yourselves,  then,  with  two  opinions ; 
one  was  that  corporations  could  subscribe  to  this  neAvspaper,  Avhich 
is  being  sent  out  as  part  of  the  Republican  propaganda,  and  another 
opinion  Avas  that  they  could  charge  that  subscription  as  expenses  and 
of  course  escape  the  tax  in  that  Avay? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  We  did  not — I  did  not  obtain  either  opinion.  In 
both  cases  they  Avere  opinions  that  Avere  voluntarily  procured  by 
field  men.   They  Avere  not  asked  to  do  it  nor  expected  to  do  it. 

Senator  Reed.  But  Avhen  the  field  man  brought  it  in  you  thought  it 
was  a  good  thing,  and  you  multigraphed  it  and  sent  it  out  again  to 
nil  the  rest  of  the  field  men? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  No;  Ave  did  not  multigraph  it,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  What  did  you  do— print  them? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  I  do  not  think  that  opinion  there  or  any  copy  of 
it  Avas  ever  in  my  possession  at  all,  personally.  I  kneAv  of  its  exist- 
ence. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  look  at  it. 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Those  Avere  stolen  from  our  files  and  sold  to  certain 
parties  in  Columbus,  Ohio,  and  I  really  neA^er  saAv  that  opinion  of 
Mr.  Berenson's  at  all. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  sorry  you  say  they  were  stolen  and  sold,  be- 
cause I  do  not  knoAv  Avhere  they  came  from. 

Mr.  Lockavood.  I  could  tell  you  quite  a  story  about  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right;  but  it  does  not  destroy  the  character  of 
the  eAddence,  cA^en  though  they  came  from  foul  hands. 

Mr.  Lockavood.  All  this  could  haA^e  been  obtained  by  Avalking  into 
our  office  and  asking  for  our  material.  It  Avould  not  haA^e  been  neces- 
sary to  buy  any  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  did  say  to  me  that  you  sent  this  letter  out 
which  I  just  shoAved  you  and  Avhich  Avas  signed  "  George  B.  Lock- 
wood,"  and  you  sent  it  out  to  man}^  people  ?  That  letter  contains  the 
statement  that  you  are  sending  out  this  opinion,  does  it  not  ?  Read 
the  top  line.    [Handing  paper  to  Avitness.] 

Mr.  Lockavood.  No,  sir ;  it  does  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  it  says: 

We  have  a  legal  opinion  from  a  corporation-tax  expert  that  Ave  will  send  you. 

Mr.  Lockavood.  Well,  Ave  never  did. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  sure  you  ncA  er  sent  that  out  ? 

Mr.  Lockavood.  I  think  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Hoav  did  you  come  to  have  that  particular  copy  if 
the  original  opinion  had  not  been  copied? 

JMr.  LocKA\'ooD.  That  Avas  obtained  b}^  Mr.  Berenson,  Avhose  name 
appears  at  the  top  there,  and  I  imagine  that  he  had  some  copies  made. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh.  Mr.  Berenson  had  some  copies  made? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2573 


Mr.  LocKwooD.  He  may  have.  I  do  not  recall,  as  I  say,  ever  hav- 
iiio:  seen  that  opinion. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  well,  I  won't  haggle  about  it. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  It  does  not  make  any  difference  whether  I  saw  it 
or  not. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  am  not  making  any  point  that  you  did  not  see  it 
or  that  you  did  not  send  it  out,  because  you  said  you  had  the  opinion 
and  offered  to  send  it  out,  which  is  the  equivalent. 

Mr.  LocKAVOOD.  I  assume  full  responsibility  for  that. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  you  would.  I  do  not  believe  you  are  a 
dodger,  anyhow. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  hope  not.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed  (handing  a  paper  to  the  witness).  Now,  this  paper 
that  I  hand  you  is  your  subscription  blank,  which  was  intended  to 
have  the  names  filled  in  by  the  gentlemen  who  put  up  the  money  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  The  several  papers  shown  to  the  witness  are  offered 
in  evidence. 

(The  documents  referred  to,  except  those  heretofore  copied  in  the 
record,  are  here  printed  in  full,  as  follows:) 

LocKwooD  Exhibit  No.  2. 

Republican  National  Committe, 

WasJiington,  D.  C. 

To  Repiihlicans: 

I  am  familiar  with  the  good  which  has  heen  clone  and  that  which  it  is  pro- 
posed to  accomplish  by  means  of  the  circulation  of  the  National  Repub-ican. 
I  am  advised  that  funds  are  beinj?  raised  now  with  which  to  increase  the  circu- 
lation of  the  publication  throughout  the  Nation  that  the  party  may  be  strength- 
ened everywhere.  It  is  to  be  used  first  in  the  localities  where  the  opposition 
is  strongest  and  Republican  votes  are  most  necessary  ;  later,  if  possible,  increas- 
ing its  circulation  to  make  it  nation  wide,  that  a  vigorous  fight  may  be  con- 
tinuously waged  against  evils  developing  which  can  be  prevented  by  the  appli- 
cation of  the  principles  advocated  by  the  party.  With  a  strong,  aggressive 
party  paper,  preaching  the  party  princip  es  for  patriotism  and  prosperity  and 
harmony  and  united  action  within  the  party,  edited  fearlessly  and  ably  as  this 
one  is,  immeasurable  good  can  be  accomplished  for  the  party  and  for  the 
country. 

Your  support  in  this  effort,  financially  and  otherwise,  is  urged,  to  the  end 
that  we  may  all  help,  as  far  as  we  are  able,  to  make  certain  the  practice  of  our 
:sound  economic  principles  and  better  government. 
Respectfully, 

Will  H.  Hays, 
Chairman  Repuhlican  National  Committee. 


LocKwooD  Exhibit  No.  8. 

A  REPt^BLICAN  DEIVE. 

Our  party  leaders  call  for  a  systematic,  aggressive,  educational  campaign  for 
Republicanism  and  Americanism  to  be  made  right  now  in  every  State  in  the 
Nation. 

Hon.  Will  H.  Hays,  chairman  of  the  Republican  national  committee,  and 
Hon.  S.  D.  Fess,  chairman  of  the  Republican  congressional  coniiiiittee,  have 
asked  me,  as  a  special  party  service,  to  take  charge  of  this  Natioll-^yide  drive. 

The  coo]>eration  of  every  Republican  is  requested  and  expected,  to  make  this 
campaign  a  success,  not  alone  for  the  good  of  the  party,  but  for  the  welfare 
of  the  country. 

More  than  200  socialistic  publi:ations  are  spreading  socialism  and  un-Ameri- 
can propaganda  that  must  not  go  unchallenged. 


2574 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Sni«arting  under  the  Republican  successes  in  the  recent  congressional  elec- 
tions, Democrats  are  right  now  sending  out  more  literature  of  a  s'ocialistic  and 
near-socialistic  and  partisan  nature  than  ever  before. 

The  heads  of  our  Republican  organization  propose  to  efficiently  meet  thisr 
situation  {ind  do  the  necessary  groundwork  for  success  in  the  next  campaign, 
and  you  are  asked  as  a  party  duty,  as  well  as  a  duty  to  your  country,  to  give 
your  personal  cooperation  and  aid  in  the  carrying  out  of  this  timely  and 
patriotic  program. 

It  has  been  decided  that  the  most  effective  and  practical  way  to  offset  the 
effect  of  this  propaganda  is  to  spread  broadcast  over  the  country  the  gospel  of 
sound  Americanism  and  patriotic  republicanism. 

This  our  party  leaders  believe  can  be  done  through  a  tremendously  increased 
circulation  of  the  National  Republican,  the  Republican  national  weekly,  pub- 
lished at  Washington.  This  National  Republican  weekly  is  in  no  sense  a  com- 
mercial publication.  It  is  published  by  Republicans,  not  for  money  gain,  but 
for  the  good  of  the  party  and  the  Nation.  It  now  circulates  in  90  per  cent  of 
all  c<mnties  in  the  United  States,  it  refuses  all  advertising,  using  all  of  its 
space  for  republicanism,  and  sells  for  $1  a  year,  which  scarcely  pays  the  cost 
even  in  large  quantities. 

This  Republican  national  publication  is  the  mouthpiece  of  the  party.  It  con- 
tains every  week  the  utterances  of  party  leaders  and  contains  much  of  interest 
and  real  value  to  Repubicans  found  in  no  other  publication.  No  Republican 
who  expects  to  keep  posted  as  to  party  alfairs  can  do  without  it.  By  experience 
it  is  learned  that  wherever  it  circulates,  there  republicanism  increases.  It  sup- 
plements the  work  of  the  local  Republican  newspapers  and  encourages  their 
increased  circulation. 

Kindly  read  the  letters  from  our  party  heads  on  another  page  of  this  folder 
and  then  give  our  Republican  leaders  your  generous  cooperation  and  help  make 
this  drive  for  a  million  tv  splendid  success  by  sending  to-day  your  dollar  for 
your  own  subscription,  or  for  your  renewal,  and  other  dollars  for  subscriptions 
to  be  used  by  the  national  and  congressional  committees. 

Every  person  who  subscribes  $1  or  more  will  receive  the  National  Republican 
for  one  year  and  other  patriotic  and  Republican  literature  sent  out  under  the 
direction  of  the  national  and  congressional  committees,  and  will  at  the  same 
time  help  in  the  further  distribution  of  this  literature. 

Those  who  subscribe  $5  or  $10  may  indicate  5  or  10  names  to  whom  they  de- 
sire the  National  Republican  and  other  literature  sent,  if  they  desire;  othenvise 
all  funds  will  be  used  under  the  direction  of  the  national  and  congressional 
committees. 

All  remittances  may  be  made  direct  to  the  National  Republican,  425  Tenth 
Street  NW.,  Washington,  D.  C,  or  to 

Gael  W.  Riddick,  jNI.  C, 
House  of  Representatives,  Washington.  D.  C, 
Manager  of  the  National  RepuhUcun  Drive  for  a  Million. 

One  million — A  Republican  drive :  Authorized  by  the  Republican  national 
committee,  Will  H.  Hays,  chairman ;  the  Republican  congressional  committee, 
Congressman  S.  D.  Fess,  chairman. 

National  Republican  Congkessional  Committee, 

RiGGS  Building, 
Washington,  D.  C. 

Neither  the  Republican  national  committee  nor  the  Republican  congressional 
co;nmittee  has  any  financial  interest  in  the  National  Republican,  but  both  com- 
mittees are  convinced  from  the  correspondence  reaching  our  offices  that  the 
publication  is  accomplishing  a  vast  amount  of  good  in  the  promulgation  of 
sound  political  doctrine.  Upon  approval  of  the  committees  our  indorsement  has 
been  permitted  to  be  carried  by  Mr.  Riddick,  who  has  no  financial  interest  what- 
ever, but  who  is  working  in  the  interest  of  the  party,  and  is  therefore  doing 
what  I  regard  a  good  service. 
Yours,  very  truly, 

S.  D.  Fess. 

Chairman  Republican  Congressional  Committee. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2575 


Republican  National  Committee, 

Washington,  D.  C. 

I  am  familiar  witli  tlie  good  which  has  been  done  and  that  whicli  it  is  pro- 
posed to  accomplisli  by  means  of  the  circulation  of  the  National  Republican. 
I  am  advised  that  funds  are  being  raised  now  with  which  to  increase  the  cir- 
culation of  the  publication  throughout .  the  Nation  that  the  party  may  be 
strengthened  everywhere.  With  a  strong  aggressive  party  paper,  preaching 
the  party  principles,  for  patriotism  and  prosperity,  and  harmony  and  united 
action  within  the  party,  edited  fearlessly  and  ably,  as  this  one  is,  immeasurable 
good  can  be  accomplished  for  the  party  and  for  the  country.  Your  support  in 
this  effort,  financially  and  otherwise,  is  urged,  to  the  end  that  we  may  all  help, 
as  far  as  we  are  able,  to  make  certain  the  practice  of  our  sound  economic  prin- 
ciples and  sound  government. 

Will  H.  Hays, 
Chairman  RepuhUcan  National  Committee. 


LocKWOOD  Exhibit  No.  10. 
[Washington  Times  editorial,  Wednesday,  Apr.  24,  1918.] 

GENTLEMEN,  SHAKE  HANDS  WITH  THE  "  NATFONAL  EEPUBLICAN  "  SENATOR  WATSON, 

FROM  INDIANA,  IS  ITS  GODFATHER,  AND,  OH  !  IT  IS  BADLY  NEEDED,  SINCE  DEMOCRATS 
ARE  WICKED, 

Listen  to  this,  you  wicked  Democrats  in  office.  Senator  Watson,  of  Indiana, 
knows  all  about  you  ;  he  is  helping  to  start  a  paper  that  is  to  have  "  millions  of 
circulation,"  to  tell  the  truth,  and  head  you  off. 

Listen  also,  you  faithful  ones,  editors  of  the  Washington  Star,  Post,  and 
Herald.  Senator  Watson  and  the  great  Republican  Party  are  not  satisfied  with 
you.  They  think  that  "  the  party  in  i)ower  controls  your  channels  of  general 
information  to  an  extent  unprecedented." 

There  comes  into  our  possession,  neatly  pi-inted  on  paper  of  the  United  States 
Senate  Committee  on  Interstate  Connnerce — stationery  paid  for  by  the  people — 
the  following  letter  that  trembles  with  excitement  and  ex])resses  a  high,  noble, 
jtartisan  purpose,  first  to  circumvent  wicked  l)emocrats,  and,  second,  to  get  a 
dollar  apiece  from  ardent  Republicans. 

Read  I 

United  States  Senate, 

COMillTTEE  ON  INTERSTATE  COMMERCE, 

April  8,  1918. 

Dear  Fellow  Republican  : 

It  is  evident  that  if  the  existence  of  the  Republican  Party  is  to  be  prolonged 
there  must  soon  go  out  from  Washington,  the  center  of  political  activity  and 
political  thought,  accurate  information  as  to  what  both  the  Republican  and 
Democratic  leadership  and  organization  are  thinking,  saying,  and  doing.  Under 
l)resent  conditions  this  is  well-nigh  impossible,  for  the  party  in  power  seems  to 
control  the  channels  of  general  information  to  an  extent  unprecedented  in  our 
history. 

The  Republican  Party  has  always  been,  is  now,  and  always  will  be  loyal  to 
the  National  Government  in  both  peace  and  war,  but  this  does  not  mean  that  it 
should  surrender  its  traditional  belief  in  fundamental  domestic  policies  affect- 
ing the  welfare  of  the  Nation  in  both  war  and  peace. 

There  is  alnnulant  evidence  on  every  hand  to  satisfy  the  most  credulous  that 
Democratic  leadership  is  taking  advantage  of  the  war  situation  for  political 
purposes,  seeking  thereby  to  entrench  itself  for  the  future. 

Never  before  has  there  been  so  much  use  of  the  machinery  of  the  Government 
for  partisan  purposes ;  never  before  so  much  partisan  activity  on  the  part  of  the 
Democratic  national  committee,  which  is  already  organized  and  sending  out 
unlimited  quantities  of  literature;  never  before  has  there  been  such  a  vast  and 
systematized  propaganda  for  the  purpose  of  aiding  the  Democratic  cause ;  and 
all  this  accompanied  by  the  unreasonable  and  unpatriotic  demand  that  Repub- 
licans must  lie  dormant  in  the  future ;  that  we  must  not  begin  partisan  activity ; 
and  that  we  must  refrain  from  all  efforts  to  control  Congress  or  else  rest  under 
the  charge  of  being  unpatriotic  and  opposed  to  the  war. 


2576  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Never  before  has  it  been  so  important  that  all  the  truth  be  plainly  put 
before  the  public,  and  never  have  our  oppoi tnriities  for  doins  this  been  so  lim- 
ited as  they  are  to-day.  W't^  have  a  loynl  and  effective  local  press,  but  no 
publication  that  reaches  rhe  country  as  a  whole. 

To  meet  this  crying  need  we  have  succeeded  in  convincing  that  brilliant 
and  versatile  editor  and  writer,  Gecu-ge  B.  Lockwood,  to  move  his  paper,  the 
National  Republican,  to  Washington;  where  he  can  be  in  daily  touch  with  the 
whole  political  situation  and  where  he  will  be  far  more  advimtageously  situated 
to  arrive  at  the  real  truth  than  at  the  present  time.  The  object  is  to  im- 
prove and  enlarge  his  papei  and  to  make  it  in  a  sense  the  national  organ  of 
thii  Republican  Party. 

To  this  end  a  building  has  been  leased  and  machinery  is  being  installed,  and 
this  publication  is  to  be  est.iblished  upon  a  basis  that  will  insure  its  future 
usefulness  and  success,  and  through  its  coUnnns  the  thought  and  opinion  of 
the  Republican  Party  of  the  v.hole  country  may  be  standardized  and  rendered 
more  effective. 

With  this  in  view,  a  drive  has  already  begun  to  increase  its  circulation  to  ■ 
two  or  three  million  copies  a  week,  thus  causing  it  to  reach  Republicans  every- 
where througliout  tJie  land,  and  so  bringing  them  int<^  a  closer  politiciil  relation- 
ship.   The  first  publication  will  be  issued  next  month,  and  from  that  time  on 
it  will  spread  the  gospel  of  real  Republicanism  throughout  the  entire  Republic. 

I  assure  you  that  I  have  no  other  interest  in  this  publication  than  a  political 
one,  but  seeing  as  I  do  the  tremendous  importance  of  such  a  paper  at  this 
most  critical  time,  I  am  interesting  myself  to  the  extent  of  asking  a  large 
number  of  my  personal  and  political  friends  in  and  out  of  Indiana  to  at  once 
send  in  their  personal  subscriptions  to  this  paper.  A  similar  appeal  will  be 
made  by  many  other  JVIembers  of  Congress,  with  a  view  to  starting  the  paper 
oft  with  a  big  initial  individual  circulation. 

I  will  greatly  appreciate  it  if  you  will  become  a  charter  mem'ber  of  this  list 
of  subscribers,  and  tlnis  aid  this  latest  movement  for  future  Republican  suc- 
cess by  sending  a  dollar  bill  at  the  risk  of  the  National  Republican  for  one 
year's  subscription  in  the  inclosed  envelope.  I  will  turn  it  over  to  Mr.  Lock- 
wood,  a  receipt  will  be  sent  you  for  the  amount,  and  you  will  receive  this 
genuine  Republican  organ. 

This  publication  will  do  all  in  its  power  to  increase  the  circulation  and  ex- 
tend the  sphere  of  influence  of  the  local  Republican  press,  which  has  always 
been  loyal  to  the  cause,  and  thus  materially  aid  in  a  general  and  effective 
Bepubliean  propaganda. 

Very  truly,  yours,  James  A.  AVatson. 

Was  ever  a  Democratic  plot  more  mercilessly  revealed  by  a  high-spirited 
Republican? 

A\'as  ever  a  simpler  plan  devised  to  circunivent  Democratic  wickedness? 

You  good  Republicans  with  dollars  to  shed,  prepare  to  shed  them  now. 

Send  one,  just  one  little  dollar,  and  the  National  Republican  will  visit  you 
once  a  week  and  tell  you  all  about  the  Democratic  wicked  secrets — unless 
Burleson  arrests  it,  locks  it  up.  and  suppresses  it  for  being  a  spy. 

In  reading  the  other  Washington  papers,  we  had  not  noticed  that  they 
refused  to  give  utterance  to  Republican  complaints.  We  seem  to  have  read 
statements  by  all  kinds  of  great  Republicans,  bitterly  complaining  of  Demo- 
crats and  accusing  them. 

But  Mr.  Watson,  of  Iiuliana,  knows  better.  He  knows  that  "Democratic 
leadershi])  is  taking  advantage  of  the  war  situation  for  political  purposes." 

He,  and  the  National  Republican  will  make  everything  all  light  if  he  will  send 
in  one  little  dollar. 

We  are  going  to  study  this  new  powerful  paper  that  is  to  circulate  millions, 
if  we  can  find  a  copy  of  it. 
Have  you  seen  one? 

And  what  do  you  think  of  this  proposition?  Should  not  letters  appealing 
for  $1  bills,  and  tending  to  build  up  the  circulation  of  a  newspaper  that  will 
presumably  make  money  for  somebody,  be  printed  on  stationery  not  paid  for 
by  the  public? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2577 


LocKwooD  Exhibit  No.  3. 

60  Wall  Street, 
New  York  City,  May  27,  1919. 

Mr.  Richard  I.  Berexsox, 

Hotel  Hargrave.  Serenty-seco7id  Street  and  CoJmnhns  Are^ive, 

New  York  City. 

Dear  Sir  :  AVitli  reference  to  your  inquiry  wliether  or  not  a  manufacturer 
may  reiiard  as  an  expense  to  the  business  subscriptions  to  the  National  Ilepub- 
lican  for  his  employees,  in  my  opinion  this  may  readily  be  done.  The  amount 
of  the  subscriptions  may.  if  the  employer  desires,  be  apportioned  among  the 
several  employees  as  additional  salary  or  bonus:  that  is,  that  the  employee,  in 
addition  to  receiving  his  salary,  gets  a  bonus  by  way  of  a  subscription  to  the 
National  Republican.  If,  on  the  other  hand,  it  is  too  cumbersome  to  apportion 
the  subscriptions  among  tlie  employees,  it  may  be  regarded  as  a  miscellaneous 
or  sundry  expense. 

Manufacturers  who  employ  social  service  or  welfare  workers  for  their  em- 
ployees charge  their  salaries  in  as  an  expense,  and  by  the  same  token  subscrip- 
tions to  the  pai)er  may  be  charged  a  an  expense,  inasmuch  as  it  is  educational 
and  its  effect  is  to  make  employees  more  intelligent,  and  therefore  more  efficient 
in  their  work. 

Yours,  very  sincerely, 

Lav»'rexce  Berensox. 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  have  a  lot  more.  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Of  the  same  stuff  ? 
Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  Simihir  to  those. 

Senator  Reed.  1  will  thank  yon  to  brinp^  over  all  of  it.  [Handing 
a  paper  to  the  witness.]  Do  you  recognize  this  piece  of  paper  that 
I  hand  you  as  some  of  the  literature  you  got  out  for  the  purpose  of 
selling  this  paper  ? 

Mr.  LocKAAdOD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  For  tlie  information  of  the  committee,  I  will  read  it : 

A  REPUKLICAX  DRIVE. 

Onr  party  leaders  call  for  a  systematic,  aggressive,  educational  campaign  for 
Republicanism  and  Americanism  to  be  made  right  now  in  every  State  in  the 
Nation. 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  I  might  save  you  time  right  there,  Senator,  by 
saying  that  that  plan  was  never  carried  out.  That  literattire  was 
prepared  and  a  little  of  it  was  sent  out,  and  that  Avas  dropped. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  the  literature  true  or  false? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  The  literature  Avas  undoubtedly  true  at  that  time, 
so  far  as  the  statements  of  intention  are  concerned. 

Sen^i.tor  Reed.  All  right;  I  Avill  read  it.    [Continuing  reading:] 

Hon.  AVill  H.  Hays,  chairman  of  the  Republican  national  connnittee,  and  Hon. 
S.  D.  Fes>;.  chairman  of  the  Republican  congressional  conmiittee,  have  asked  me, 
as  a  special  pai'ty  service,  to  take  charge  of  this  nation-wide  drive. 

The  cooperation  of  every  Republican  is  requested  and  expected  to  make  this 
campaign  a  success,  not  alone  for  the  good  of  the  party  but  for  the  welfare  of 
the  country. 

More  than  200  socialistic  publications  are  spreading  socialism  and  un-Amer- 
ican propaganda  that  must  not  go  unchallenged. 

Smarting  under  the  Republican  successes  in  the  recent  congressional  elections. 
Democrats  are  right  now  sending  out  more  literature  of  a  socialistic  and  near- 
socialistic  and  partisan  nature  than  ever  before. 

The  heads  of  our  Republican  organization  propose  to  efficiently  meet  this 
situati(»n  and  do  the  n.ecessary  groundwork  for  success  in  the  next  campaign, 
and  you  are  asked  as  a  party  duty,  as  well  as  a  duty  to  your  country,  to  give 
your  personal  cooperation  and  aid  in  the  carrying  out  of  this  timely  and  patri- 
otic program. 


"2578 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


It  Ims  been  decided  tliat  the  most  effective  and  practical  way  to  offset  tlie 
effect  of  this  propaganda  is  to  spread  broadcast  over  the  country  the  gospel  of 
sound  Americanism  and  patriotic  Republicanism. 

This  our  party  leaders  believe  can  be  done  through  a  tremendously  increased 
cii'cuhition  of  the  National  Uepublican,  the  Ivepublican  national  weekly,  pub- 
lished at  Washingtcm.  This  National  Republican  vreekly  is  in  no  sense  a  com- 
mercial publication.  It  is  published  by  Republicans,  not  for  money  gain  but 
for  the  good  of  the  party  and  the  Nation.  It  now  circulates  in  90  per  cent  of 
all  counties  in  the  United  States;  it  refuses  all  advertising,  using  all  of  its 
space  for  Republicanism,  and  sells  for  $1  a  year,  which  scarcely  pays  the  cost, 
even  in  large  quantities. 

This  Republican  national  publication  is  the  mouthpiece  of  the  party.  It  con- 
tains every  week  the  utterances  of  party  leaders,  and  contains  much  of  interest 
and  real  value  to  Republicans  found  in  no  other  publication.  No  Republican 
who  expects  to  keep  posted  as  to  party  affairs  can  do  without  it.  By  experience 
it  is  learned  that  wherever  it  circulates,  there  Republicanism  increases.  It 
supplements  the  work  of  the  local  Republican  newspapers,  and  encourages  their 
increased  circulation. 

Kindly  i  ead  the  letters  from  our  party  heads  on  another  page  of  this  folder, 
and  then  give  our  Republican  leaders  your  generous  cooperation  and  help  make- 
this  drive  for  a  million  a  splendid  success  by  sending  to-day  your  dollar  for  your 
subscription,  or  for  your  renewal,  and  other  dollars  for  subscriptions  to  be  used 
by  the  national  and  congressional  committees. 

Every  person  who  subscribes  $1  or  more  will  receive  the  National  Republican 
for  one  year,  and  other  patriotic  and  Republican  literature  sent  out  under  the 
direction  of  the  national  and  congressi(mal  committees,  and  will  at  the  same 
time  lielp  in  the  further  distribution  of  this  literature. 

Those  who  subscribe  $5  or  $10  may  indicate  5  or  10  names  to  whom  they  desire 
the  Njitional  Republican  and  other  literature  sent,  if  they  desire ;  otherwise  all 
funds  will  be  used  under  the  direction  of  the  national  and  congressional  com- 
mittees. 

All  remittances  may  be  made  direct  to  the  National  Republican,  425  Tenth 
Street  NW.,  Washington,  D.  C,  or  to  House  of  Representatives,  Washington,, 
D.  C. 

Carl  W.  Riddick,  M.  C, 
Manager  of  National  RepvMican  Drive  for  a  Million. 

And  on  the  back  of  it: 

One  million.  A  Republican  drive.  Authorized  by  the  Republican  national 
committee,  Will  H.  Hays,  chairman ;  the  Republican  congressional  committee, 
Congressman  S.  D.  Fess,  chairman. 

On  one  side  of  the  matter  I  have  just  read  is  this : 

National  Republican  Congressional  Committee. 

Riggs  Building,  Washington,  D.  C. 

Neither  the  Republican  national  committee  nor  the  Republican  congressional 
committee  has  any  financial  interest  in  the  National  Republican,  but  both  com- 
mittees are  convinced  from  the  correspondence  reaching  our  offices  that  the 
publication  is  accomplishing  a  vast  amount  of  good  in  the  promulgation  of 
sound  political  doctrine. 

Upon  approval  of  the  committees  our  indorsement  has  been  permitted  to  be 
carried  by  Mr.  Riddick,  who  has  no  financial  interest  whatever,  but  who  is  work- 
ing in  the  interest  of  the  party  and  is  therefore  doing  what  I  regard  a  good 
service. 

Yours,  very  truly,  S.  D.  Fess, 

Chairman  Repuhlican  Congressional  Committee. 

On  the  other  side  is  this : 

Republican  National  Committee. 

Washington.  D.  C. 

I  am  familiar  with  the  good  which  has  been  done  and  that  Avhich  it  is  pro- 
posed to  accomplish  by  means  of  the  circulation  of  the  National  Republican.  I 
am  advised  that  funds  are  being  raised  now  with  which  to  inereiise  the  circula- 
tion of  the  publication  throughout  the  Nation,  that  the  party  may  be  strengthened 
evervwhere.   With  a  strong  aggressive  party  paper,  preaching  tlie  i)ai-ty  princi- 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2579 


pies  for  patriotism  and  prosperity,  and  harmony  and  nnited  action  witliin  the 
party.  edite<l  fearlessly  and  ahly,  as  this  one  is.  immeasurable  good  can  be  ac- 
complished for  the  party  and  for  the  country.  Your  support  in  this  effort,  finan- 
cially and  otherwise,  is  urged,  to  the  end  that  we  may  all  help,  as  far  as  we  are 
able,  to  make  certain  the  practice  of  our  sound  economic  principles  and  sound 
government. 

Will  H.  Hays, 
Chairman  Republican  Xationai  Comniittce. 

You  had  a  subscription  from  the  National  Cash  Register  Co. 
[Handing  another  paper  to  the  witness.]    Do  you  recognize  that  as 
•  a  list  of  the  names  sent  in  to  whom  the  paper  was  to  be  sent  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  do  not  recall  it ;  but  I  have  no  doubt  that  that  is 
what  it  is. 

i  Senator  Reed.  That  is  a  list  of  the  employees  of  the  Xational  Cash 
Register  Co.,  and  they  got  the  paper  because  the  corporation  sub- 
scribed the  money  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Undoubtedly  that  is  true. 

.     Senator  Reed.  I  will  put  that  in  evidence. 

I     (The  list  referred  to  is  here  printed  in  full,  as  follows:) 

NAMES  OF  MEN  FOR  WHOiM  THE  CASH  KEGISTEK  CO.  SUBSCRIBED  FOR  THE  REPUBLICAN. 


.  W.  W.  Bowman,  113  Wellmeier  Street. 
;  George  Bodem,  308  Wyoming  Street. 
jR.  O.  Bloom,  117  Illinois  Street. 
? Walter  Blank,  111  Indiana  Avenue. 
■Joseph  Bisch.  411  Clover  Street. 

R.  Berner,  910  Harman  Avenue. 

H.  Beckner,  Bowman  Avenue,  R.  R. 

No.  16,  Carmonte. 
|R.  Bechtolt,  317  Oak  Street. 
iD.  R.  Ash  worth.  R.  R.  No.  2. 

€.  H.  Arnold,  211  River  Street. 
I  IMrs.  Earl  Albright,  3(XI  Lowes  Street. 

W.  F.  Luneke,  1101  Wyoming  Street. 

W.  B.  Lukens,  800  Harmon  Avenue, 
Oak  wood. 

H.  W.  Lehr,  1520  South  Brown  Street. 
A.  C.  Lampman,  527  Bowen  Street. 
E.    B.    Kline,    308    East  Hermann 
Avenue. 

Walter  Kissinger,  132  Salem  Avenue. 
A.  C.  Kirchner,  823  Ferndale  Avenue. 
William  Kempf,   1924  South  Brown 
Street. 

R.  X.  Kelley,  139  Rookwood  Avenue. 

A.  A.  Keiser,  946  Manhattan  Avenue. 

T.  Karst,  105  Huston  Avenue. 
,  L.  .1.  .Judson,  1818  Wyoming  Street. 

R.  B.  Frazell,  34  Brown  Street. 

J.  E.  Franz,  1003  Superior  Avenue. 
'  W.  Fraine,  507  Grand  Avenue. 

L.  E.  Folz,  221  Hickorv  Street. 

H.  .Torzick,  229  K  Street, 
i  J.  E.  Hydeman,  Forrer  Road,  Park 
I  Hill. 

k  E.  E.  Hummerich,  66  Brandt  Street, 
i  E.  V.  Huesman,  R.  R.  No.  4. 
;  A.  Hohler,  117  South  Terry  Street. 
;  F.  W.  Hoerner,  331  Lexington  Avenue. 

George  Herring,  529  Arbor  Avenue. 
^A.  C.  Herman,  412  Oak  Street. 

iJ.  C.  Hemingway,  Hills  and  Dales. 


E.    E.    Harter,    1506    South  Brown 
Street. 

H.  Hardesty,  First  and  Ludlow  Streets. 
R.  H.  Hagerman,  R.  R.  No.  8.  Belmont. 

B.  S.  Guitteau,  44  Missouri  Avenue. 
L.  M.  Guelich,  104  Delaware  Avenue. 
Louis  Gruber,  25  Laura  Avenue. 

C.  E.  Grove,  219  College  Park  Avenue. 
.J.  C.  Greer,  51  Marathon  Avenue. 

R.  A.  Gongwer,  247  Kenwood  Avenue. 

A.  D.  Gibson,  214  L  Street. 

G.  P.  Geiger,  1511  Alberta  Street. 
J.  F.  Geers,  133  Virginia  Avenue. 

J.  H.  Garwood,  3727  East  Third  Street. 
Alfred  Gardes,  117  Iroquois  Street. 
William  Galbraith,  80  Jones  Street. 
C..L.  Schweitzer,  47  Colorado  Avenue. 
Chai-les  Schwartz,  227  Irving  Avenue. 
George  Schiller,  12  Fairground  Avenue. 

H.  H.  Schaefer,  114  Carlisle  Avenue. 

B.  M.  Shipley,  R.  R.  No.  10. 

M.   E.    Service,   1713    South  Wayne 
Avenue. 

E.   T.    Schneider,   545   West  Fourth 
Street. 

J.  Q.  Salisbury.  107  Marathon  Avenue. 
O.  R.  Rodgers,  238  Delaware  Avenue. 
E.  F.  Primmer,  Chester  and  Grand 
Avenues. 

C.  F.  Meyer,  56  Hudson  Avenue. 
H.  D.  Hussey,  40  Illinois  Avenue. 
William  Hartman,  1615  Wayne  Ave- 
nue.- 

G.  B.  Haig,  316  Hickory  Street. 

H.  T.  Guion,  R.  R.  No.  2. 
C.  A.  Guion,  R.  R.  No.  2. 

M.  M.  Goldberg,  445  Riverside  Aparb- 
ments. 

J.  L.  Swauger,  133  S.  Brown. 

C.  C.  Swartzel,  11  Edgar  Avenue. 

W.  Sturtz,  115  McReynolds  Street. 


2580 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


E.  E.  Storms,  R.  R.  No.  12. 
Harry  Storm,  22  Fairground  Avenue. 
C.  A.  Storck,  327  Hickory  Street. 
C.  E.  Stines,  209  Rockwood  Avenue. 
A.  J.  Stickel,  22  Victor  Avenue. 
C.  L.  Stewjirt,  1617  East  Fourth  Street. 
W.  Stengel,  18  St.  Nicholas  Avenue. 
H.  E.  StaulTer.  552  Superior  Avenue. 
Ed.  M.  Smith,  311  St.  Nicholas  Avenue. 
N.  R.  Sinkhorn,  318  Hughes. 
J.  Shinn,  154  Wyoming  Street. 
Edward  A.  Sheets,  Miamisburg,  Ohio. 
H.  E.  Sheeler,  520  Epworth  Avenue. 
W.  H.  Matthews,  R.  R.  No.  16. 

E.  Mark  wick,  608  Oak  Street. 

A.  G.  Malnistrom,  143  Indiana  Avenue. 

Thomas  Mahlmeister,  R.  R.  No.  1. 

C.  E.  McGregor,  908  Ferndale  Avenue. 

H.  P.  Wilson,  128  St.  Nicholas  Avenue. 
N.  L.  Whitney,  20  Indiana  Avenue. 
George  Whitefort,  1025  Redfern  Ave- 
nue. 

A.  Wecker,  228  Oak  Street. 

P.  O.  AVarren,  35  Stewart  Street. 

C.  L.  Walters,  101  Holt  Street. 

C.  Walteniathe,  825  West  Fifth  Street. 

Robert  S.  B.  Wallace,  57  Helena  Street. 

I.  H.  Vogt,  139  Oxford  Avenue. 

F.  J.  Vocke,  627  Epworth  Avenue. 
E.  D.  Vance,  65  Mary  Avenue. 

J.  I.  Tredtin,  150  Marathon  Avenue. 
A.   W.   Throm,   116   S.  Philadelphia 
Street. 

W.  E.  Thoroman,  R.  R.  No.  2. 
Martin  J.  Thompson,  34  Kratchowell 
.Street. 

William  G.  Theis,  341  Middle. 
O.  G.  Tasch.  440  Kiefaber  Street. 
J.  W.  Tapper,  249  High  Street. 
W.  L.  Wise,  601  Oxford  Avenue. 

E.  J.  Von  Pein,  R.  R.  No.  8. 

Homer  Stoecklein,  929  South  Brown 
Street. 

C.  E.  Steffey,  R.  R.  No.  7. 
M.  Siegel,  435  Oxford  Avenue. 

F.  G.  Welles,  629  Oreighton  Avenue. 
J.  D.  Blocher,  52  Wroe  Avenue. 

W.  P.  Bonner,  1320  South  Brown. 

F.  L.  Batson,  227  Kenwood. 

W.  V.  Burnett,  47  Woodland  Avenue. 

O.  V.  Bell,  124  INIissouri  Avenue. 

William  Baldwin,  338  Park  Street. 

W.  G.  Beyer,  22  Allen  Street. 

W.  D.  Coghill,  405  Grafton  Avenue. 

E.  P.  Corbett,  64  McOwen  Street. 
V.  A.  Dunn,  46  Bond  Street. 

H.  Eagle,  19  South  Miami  Boulevard. 

F.  J.  Gilbert,  418  Oxford  Avenue. 

A.  B.  Gary,  Audubon  Park,  Negley 

Place  and  Williams  Street. 
H.   E.   Herman,   1806   South  Brown 

•Street. 

R.  N.  Heist,  314  North  Sixth  Street. 
H.  V.  Hendrickson,  24  Drake  Avenue. 
J.  G.  Jordon,  1032  Wayne  Avenue. 
J.  G.  Knauer,  128  Goodhue  Avenue. 
W.  H.  Kepler,  R.  .R.  No.  16.  Dayton. 


G.  R.   Lohnes,   1518^    South  Brown 
Street. 

M.  J.  Leen,  25  Bonner  Street. 

D.  0.  Peterson,  R.  R.  No.  1,  Salem 
Aveime. 

W.  C.  Powell,  410  Lowes  Street. 
W.  H.  Rumpf,  130  All)erta  Avenue. 

0.  P\  Rumer,  211  Gunckel  Avenue. 
J.  P.  Roth,  1625  Grand  Avenue. 

C.  H.  Roemer,  215  Caldwell  Street. 
Charles  M.  Rawson,  15  Havnes  Street. 

E.  Raiff.  29  Colorado  Avenue. 

Daniel  S.  Puis,  1554  West  First  Street. 

H.  Piers,  525  Arbor  Avenue. 

J.  B.  Phillips,  1938  North  Main  Street. 
M.  L.  Petticrew,  22  Evanston  Street. 
\Y.  A.  Pearson,  Brown  and  Caldwell - 

Streets. 
T.  E.  Patterson,  214  L  Street. 

F.  J.  Parizek,  25  Lexington  Avenue. 
F.  Oswald,  1325  Alberta  Street. 

L.  C.  Ostendorf,  209  Perrine  Street. 
L.  Mitchell,  36  Virginia  Avenue. 
M.  V.  Michel,  1722  Xenia  Avenue. 
L.  E.  Meyer,  1017  Union  Avenue. 

D.  B.  Mayer.  R.  R.  No.  2. 

^Y.  C.  Hannnaker,  115  West  Miami 

Boulevard. 
C.  E.  Hook,  R.  R.  No.  5,  Dayton ;  stop 

No.  7,  Dayton  and  Troy  traction. 

E.  L.  Kepler,  Hoover  Avenue,  R.  R.  No. 
14. 

F.  A.  Martin,  41  Illinois. 

T.  J.  Mitchell,  R.  R.  No.  13,  Dayton. 
J.  A.  Roberts,  414  Lowes  Street. 
C.  \\.  Rike,  9  Chambers  Street.  ^ 

I.  E.  Seitz,  208  Orchard  Avenue. 

1.  W.  Smith,  35  Cannon  Street. 
C.  R.  Tliomas,  115  Lawnview. 

J.  M.  Foley,  320  Bellview'Avenue. 
C.  Fleischman,  225  Irving  Avenue. 
L.  G.  Fischbach.  2127  Wayne  Avenue. 
Frank  Engler,  24  Frank  Street. 
Paul  Eldredge.  35  Fink  Place. 
B.  Ebbing,  1003  Wyoming  Street.  - 
L.  F.  Dittmar.  36  Crescent  Street. 
J.  L.  Dill,  37  East  Lawn  Street. 
A.  J.  Dickson,  20  George  Street. 
L.  D.  Davis,  413  Oak  Street.  i 
E.  J.  Damuth,  68  Charles  Street. 
AV.  H.  Cook,  30  Wroe  Street. 

G.  V.  Clow,  918  Five  Oaks  Avenue. 
J.  Cassidy,  244  Audobon  Park. 

E.  C.  Carter.  335  St.  Nicholas  Avenue. 

H.  Brusman,  223  Delaware  Avenue. 
O.  A.  Brooks,  112  Lawnview. 

Ira  Brooks,  R.  R.  No.  8. 
W.  C.  Breen,  29  Van  Cleve  Street. 
John  H.  Patterson,  Far  Hills.  Dayton^ 
Ohio. 

H.  G.  Carnell,  129  West  First  Street. 
Robert  Patterson,  Forrer  Road,  Oak-* 
wood. 

O.  Blackmore,  507  Bowen  Street. 

E.  L.  Brown.  4'i  South  Fifth  Street, 

INIiamisburg.  Ohio. 
W.  H.  Cook,  30  Wroe  Avenue. 


PKESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2581 


M.  E.  Fiuiver,  35  South  Irwin  Street.  F.  W.  Knitrlit,  106  East  Dixon  Avenue. 

L.  G.  Fisthbacli,  2127  Wayne  Avenue.  R.  S.  Lutes.  142S  Alberta  Street. 

E.  C.  Grunnne.  14  Lawnview  Avenue.  A.  Blome,  K.  R.  No.  2. 

J.  A.  Hoeflinger,  R.  R.  No.  2.  H.  Lecbleiter,  133  Haynes  Street. 

G.  L.  Hampel,  142  McDonougb  Street.  R.  J.  Needbam,  107  Stewart  Street. 

This  list  of  names  is  made  up  from  employees  of  our  company,  and  tbe 
street  address  only  is  given,  but  all  are  located  in  Dayton,  Ohio. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  familiar  with  a  letter  that  was  sent  out  by 
Senator  Watson  in  behalf  of  your  paper  i 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  It  is  dated  April  8,  1918.  and  addressed  "Dear 
Fellow  Republican"  [handing  a  paper  to  the  witness].  Just  look 
at  tliis  account  in  the  newspaper. 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  recall  that.  It  is  an  editorial  in  the  Washington 
Times. 

Senator  Reed.  And  the  letter  appears  there. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir;  a  copy  of  the  letter.  I  recall  it  states  we 
were  using  Government  stationery. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  care  anything  about  the  article. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  wrote  Mr.  Brisbane  that  he  Avas  mistaken  and 
offered  to  prove  it  to  him.  but  he  made  no  correction.  It  brought  us 
in  quite  a  few  subscribers. 

Senator  Reed.  You  thrive  on  attacks.  I  have  observed  that  all  the 
way  through. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  always  glad  when  anybody  says  amthing 
against  you. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  It  is  a  sign  you  have  been  doing  something. 
Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  virtues  only  are  exposed.  I  want  to  read  just 
a  paragraph  or  two,  and  I  will  put  tlie  letter  in. 

(Senator  Reed  read  excerpts  from  the  letter  referred  to,  which  is 
here  printed  in  full,  as  follows:) 

United  States  Senate, 
Committee  on  Interstate  Commerce. 

April  8,  1918. 

Dear  Fellow  Republican  :  It  is  evident  tliat.  if  tbe  existence  of  tbe  Republi- 
can Party  is  to  be  prolonged,  tbere  nuist  soon  go  out  from  Wasbington,  the 
center  of  political  activity  and  political  tbougbt,  accurate  information  as  to 
wbat  botb  tbe  Repul)lican  and  Democratic  leadership  and  organization  are 
thinking,  saying,  and  doing.  Under  present  conditions  this  is  well-nigh  im- 
possil)le,  for  tbe  party  in  power  seems  to  control  tbe  channels  of  general  infor- 
mation to  an  extent  unprecedented  in  our  history. 

Tbe  ReiHiblican  Party  has  always  been,  is  now.  and  always  will  be  loyal  to 
tbe  National  Government  in  both  peace  and  war,  but  this  does  not  means  that 
it  should  surrender  its  traditional  belief  in  fundamental  domestic  policies 
affecting  tbe  welfare  of  the  Nation  in  both  war  and  peace. 

There  is  abundant  evidence  on  every  hand  to  satisfy  the  most  crcxlulous  that 
Democratic  leadership  is  taking  advantage  of  the  war  situation  for  iK>litical 
purposes,  seeking  thereby  to  entrench  itself  for  the  future. 

Never  Itefore  has  there  been  so  much  use  of  the  machinery  of  the  Government 
tor  jiartisan  purposes:  never  before  so  mufb  partisan  activity  on  tbe  part  of 
tbe  Democratic  nationa-  committee,  which  is  already  tu-ganized  and  sending 
out  unlimited  quantities  of  literature:  never  before  has  there  been  such  a  vast 
and  systematized  propaganda  for  the  purpose  of  aiding  the  Democratic  cause; 
.Mid  all  this  accompanied  by  the  unreasonable  and  unpatriotic  demand  that 
Republicans  must  lie  dormant  in  the  future,  that  we  must  not  begin  partisan 


2582 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


activity,  and  tliat  we  must  refrain  from  all  efforts  to  control  Congress  or  else 
rest  under  the  charge  of  being  unpatriotic  and  opposed  to  the  war. 

Never  before  has  it  been  so  important  that  all  the  truth  be  plainly  put  before 
the  public,  and  never  have  our  opportunities  for  doing  this  been  so  limited  as 
they  are  to-day.  We  have  a  loyal  and  effective  local  press,  but  no  publication 
that  reaches  the  country  as  a  whole. 

To  meet  this  crying  need  we  have  succeeded  in  convincing  that  brilliant  and 
versatile  editor  and  writer,  George  B.  Lockwood,  to  move  his  paper,  the  National 
Republican,  to  Washington,  where  he  can  be  in  daily  touch  with  the  whole 
po  itical  situation  and  where  he  will  be  far  more  advantageously  situated  to 
arrive  at  the  real  truth  than  at  the  present  time.  The  object  is  to  improve 
and  enlarge  his  paper  and  to  make  it  in  a  sense  the  national  organ  of  the 
Republican  Party. 

To  this  end  a  building  has  been  leased  and  machinery  is  being  installed,  and 
this  publication  is  to  be  established  upon  a  basis  that  will  insure  its  future 
usefulness  and  success,  and  through  its  columns  the  thought  and  opinion  of 
the  Republican  Party  of  the  whole  country  may  be  standardized  and  rendered 
more  effective. 

With  this  in  view,  a  drive  has  already  begun  to  increase  its  circulation  to 
two  or  three  million  copies  a  week,  thus  causing  it  to  reach  Republicans  every- 
where throughout  the  land,  and  so  bringing  them  into  a  closer  political  rela- 
tionship. The  tirst  publication  will  be  issued  next  month,  and  from  that  time 
on  it  will  spread  the  gospel  of  real  Republicanism  throughtout  the  entire 
Repub'ic. 

I  assure  you  that  I  have  no  other  interest  in  this  publication  than  a  political 
one,  but,  seeing  as  I  do  the  tremendous  importance  of  such  a  paper  at  this  most 
critical  time,  I  am  interesting  myself  to  the  extent  of  asking  a  large  number  of 
my  personal  and  political  friends  in  and  out  of  Indiana  to  at  once  send  in  their 
personal  subscriptions  to  this  paper.  A  similar  appeal  will  be  made  by  many 
other  Members  of  Congress  with  a  view  to  starting  the  paper  off  with  a  big 
initial  individual  circulation. 

I  will  greatly  appreciate  it  if  you  will  become  a  charter  member  of  this  list 
of  subscribers  and  thus  aid  this  latest  movement  for  future  Republican  success 
by  sending  a  dollar  bill  at  the  risk  of  the  National  Republican  for  one  year's 
subscriiition  in  the  inclosed  envelope.  I  will  turn  it  over  to  Mr.  Lockwood,  a 
receipt  will  be  sent  you  for  the  amount,  and  you  will  receive  this  genuine 
Republican  organ. 

This  publication  will  do  all  in  its  power  to  increase  the  circulation  and 
extend  the  sphere  of  influence  of  the  local  Republican  press,  which  has  always 
been  loyal  to  the  cause,  and  thus  materially  aid  in  a  general  and  effective 
Republican  propaganda. 
Very  truly  yours, 

James  A.  Watscn. 

Senator  1\eed.  Now,  Mr,  Lockwood,  you  vontured  the  statement 
that  you  Avould  bring  in  the  other  correspondence  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir;  and,  Senator,  would  you  like  to  have  a 
statement  of  our  receipts  from  circulation?  That  might  shoAv  some- 
thing of  the  magnitude  of  what  we  are  doing  from  the  beginning.  I 
would  like  to  give  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Certainly.  I  wanted  to  get  it  in  the  other  form,  but 
if  vou  have  a  condensed  statement  we  Avill  let  you  put  it  in. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Our  receipts  in  1918  were  $88,659.74 :  in  1917.  $182,- 
907.48;  from  January  1  to  July  1,  1920,  $113,201.67,  all  from  circula- 
tion, which  is  our  only  source  of  revenue. 

Senator  Edge.  Remuneration  or  pay  of  any  kind  for  editorials  or 
reading  matter  published? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  We  carry  no  advertising  or  paid  matter. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  familiar  with  this  section  of  the  postal 
laws  [reading]  : 

Sec.  448.  *  *  *  2.  All  editorial  or  other  reading  matter  publish.ed  in  any 
such  newspaper,  magazine,  or  periodical  for  the  publication  of  which  money 
or  other  valuable  consideration  is  paid,  accepted,  or  promised  shall  be  plainly 
marked  "Advertisement." 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGJnT  EXPENSES. 


2583 


Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Edge  (reading)  : 

Any  editor  or  publisher  printing  editorial  or  other  reading  matter  for  which 
<2ompensation  is  paid,  accepted,  or  promised  without  so  marking  the  same,  shall, 
upon  conviction  in  any  court  having  jurisdiction,  be  fined  not  less  than  $50  nor 
more  than  $500. 

You  are  familiar  with  that? 
Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  can,  in  no  way,  shape,  form,  or  manner,  have 
violated  that  section? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  No,  sir ;  we  have  never  carried  a  line  of  advertis- 
ing and  never  had  a  cent  of  subsidy  or  any  other  remuneration  of 
any  kind  except  for  the  sale  of  papers. 

The  Chairman.  Just  how  does  this  differ  from  the  circulation  of 
the  Creel  book? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  This  is  paid  for  by  Republicans  and  the  other  is 
paid  for  by  the  taxpa3^ers;  I  mean  the  Creel  literature  sent  out  from 
here. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  referring  now  to  The  War,  the  World,  and 
Wilson.    Have  you  seen  that  book? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  No,  sir ;  I  have  not  seen  that ;  I  have  heard  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  sent  out  "  My  Dear  Coworker." 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Senator,  we  use  every  legitimate  means  to  get  cir- 
culation. Riddick  is  a  good  salesman,  and  naturally  in  his  literature 
he  attempted  to  give  the  paper  as  much  the  color  of  party  backing  as 
he  could. 

^  The  Chairman.  I  notice  in  the  Harrison  letter  with  reference  to 
i  Creel's  book  [reading]  : 

'  Arrangements  have  l)een  made  by  Mr,  Creel,  however,  by  which  private  par- 
ties will  purchase  the  book  in  quantity,  and  send  it  postpaid  at  less  than  the 
retail  price.  We  urge  you,  as  a  Democrat  and  American,  and  particularly  as 
one  who  will  speak  during  the  campaign,  to  fil!  out  the  inclosed  card,  etc. 

So  that  that  seems  to  be  the  same  process,  different  bodies  buying 
the  book  and  sending  it  out.   So  both  parties  seem  to  be  doing  that. 

You  have  had  a  pretty  hard  struggle  Avith  your  paper  up  to  the 
time  you  moved  down  to  Washington? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  We  published  it  as  an  adjunct  to  my  daily  paper 
at  Muncie,  and  we  Avere  able  to  print  it  because  we  had  no  separate 
overhead  for  the  publication. 

The  Chairman.  And  since  that  time  you  have  tried  to  extend  the 
circulation  of  the  paper? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  has  been  our  hope. 

The  Chairman.  In  every  way  yon  could. 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  Our  only  regret  is  that  we  never  got  that  circula- 
tion up  to  the  million  the  Senator  read  about. 

,  The  Chairman.  You  have  been  sending  out  the  best  discussions 
you  could  on  the  League  of  Nations  and  other  subjects? 

Mr.  LoCKWooD.  On  every  subject.  I  might  say  there  has  been  a 
great  deal  of  emphasis  placed  on  the  "  party  paper,"  to  which  I  do 
not  object.  But  in  a  broader  sense  Ave  are  trying  to  do  something 
more  than  that.    That  may  sound  like  a  mere  assertion,  but  Ave  are 

\j  really  trying  to  carry  on  the  propaganda  of  education.  We  haA^e 
been  trying  to  rebuff  the  socialist  agitation  AAdiich  some  400  or  500 


182774— 20— PT  19  6 


2584 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


newspapers  are  spreading  throughout  the  country,  and  the  funda- 
mental basis  of  appeal  to  those  who  have  purchased  this  paper, 
among  them  many  employers,  for  distribution  among  their  em- 
ployees, has  been  that  we  are  endeavoring  to  offset  the  sort  of  propa- 
ganda which  creates  the  feeling  that  every  employer  is  naturally  a 
scoundrel — a  man  Avho  wants  to  wait  until  Mr.  Harding  is  elected 
and  then  stick  bayonets  in  the  wage  earner;  and  we  have  been  try- 
ing to  promulgate  literature  that  is  antogonistic  to  socialism,  radi- 
calism, and  bolshevism,  and  our  effort  has  appealed  to  business  men 
very  generally.  i 
Our  paper  has  a  broader  purpose  than  a  mere  campaign  publica-l 
tion.  It  is  an  all-the-year-around  paper,  runs  in  between  campaigns, 
and  there  is  another  appeal  which  the  paper  has  besides  the  mere 
appeal  of  party. 

The  Chaikman.  But  you  are  doing  everything  you  can  to  elect  the 

Republican  ticket  ?  •  I 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  is,  of  course,  true.  I 
The  Chairman.  And  you  are  picking  out  the  best  speeches  you  I 

can  find  from  Members  of  Congress  and  circulating  those  in  the! 

paper  ?  I 
Mr.  LocKWOoD.  Yes,  sir.  I 
Senator  Edge.  Irrespective  of  party  ?  * 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Irrespective  of  party.    I  find  here  

The  Chairman  (interposing).  I  notice  that  on  October  25  you 

have  a  speech  of  Senator  Reed's  on  the  front  page.  [Laughter.] 
Mr.  LocKWooD.  It  is  a  good  speech. 
The  Chairman.  You  feature  that  as  good  literature? 
Mr.  LocKWooD.  Yes,  sir;  and  we  have  here  on  the  first  page  the 
Oath  of  citizenship,"  by  Grover  Cleveland. 

Senator  Edge,  You  are  putting  that  in  as  a  kind  of  offset  

Mr.  LocKWooD.  That  paper  was  accidentally  picked  up  by  me-  

The  Chairman  (interposing).  Placing  the  speech  in  the  paper  was 

not  an  accident? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Not  at  all ;  it  is  a  good  speech. 

The  Chairman.  Then,  I  notice  you  have  some  things  in  from 
Senator  Underwood  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  We  very  frequentl}^  quote  Democratic  Members  of 
Congress.  We  publish  a  rather  comprehensive  review  of  the  debates 
and  proceedings  of  Congress,  and  we  publish  extracts  from  speeches, 
public  and  private,  by  men  in  public  life,  both  Republicans  and 
Democrats.  Of  course,  I  will  confess  that  the  preponderance  is  on 
the  Republican  side. 

The  Chairman.  But  this  was  the  best  speech  you  could  find  on  the 
League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  That  is  a  very  good  one. 

Senator  Edge.  This  goes  to  120,000  industrial  employees? 

Mr.  Lociovood.  It  goes  to  40,000,  possibly. 

The  Chairman.  I  noticed  something  in  an  editorial  of  yours  a 
fcAV  days  ago  that  I  would  like  to  ask  you  about.  It  seems  rather  a 
severe  criticism  on  this  committee.  The  committee  is  quite  sensitive 
to  criticism. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  do  not  think  it  Avas  a  criticism  of  the  committee. 
The  Chairm'an.  It  did  not  hurt  my  feelings  any. 
Mr.  LocKWOOD.  I  called  attention  


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2585 


The  Chairman  (interposing).  You  called  attention  to  the  com- 
mittee investigating  matters  entirel}^  in  the  North  and  paying  no 
attention  to  matters  in  the  South. 

Mr.  LocKWOOD.  Yes,  sir;  I  think  there  was  such  an  article  in  our 
paper.  It  was  not  a  criticism  of  the  committee ;  it  was  merely  calling 
attention  to  a  fruitful  field  of  investigation. 

The  Chairman.  And  3'OU  called  attention  to  an  interview  of  Sena- 
tor Underwood  in  the  Birmingham  Age-Herald  against  the  com- 
mittee making  any  investigations  of  primaries  in  the  South. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  is  the  statement  that  some  $250,000  had  been 
spent  in  the  primaries  against  him,  and  that  it  would  not  do  to  let 
the  committee  investigate  it,  because  it  would  constitute  a  bad  prece- 
dent in  the  matter  of  southern  primaries  and  elections. 

The  Chairman.  And  that  they  should  not  permit  the  instigating 
of  a  Federal  inquiry  into  a  primary  election. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  you  mean  when  you  said  that  the  com- 
mittee was  remiss  in  its  duties  in  those  southern  matters  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  do  not  find  any  such  suggestion,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  What  do  you  have  in  mind  the  committee  should 
do  as  to  those  southern  elections  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  saw  no  reason  why  if  Michigan  has  proper  sub- 
jects to  be  investigated  that  Alabama  should  not  be  entitled  to  con- 
sideration in  the  matter  of  probing  an  election,  when  it  is  alleged 
by  a  United  States  Senator  through  the  newspapers  that  such  an 
enormous  amount  of  money  has  been  corruptly  spent  in  his  State. 

The  Chairman.  Senator  Underwood  in  this  statement  alleges  that 
$250,000  has  been  spent  against  him  by  one  side  in  Alabama  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chair:man.  You  suggested  that  the  committee  should  in- 
vestigate that? 

Mr.  LocK^^'OOD.  I  thought  that  that  sliould  have  consideration 
along  with  other  southern  conditions. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  your  suggestion  is  a  good  one.  I  am  very 
much  in  favor  of  investigating  that. 

Senator  Reed.  I  vote  aye. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  go  to  Alabama  just  as  soon  as  Ave  can 
get  time. 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  There  is  no  intention  to  criticize.  I  simply  offer 
it  to  this  committee  as  a  general  proposition. 

For  some  reason  or  another,  conditions  in  the  Southern  States — 
in  many  southern  States — are  such  that  there  is  not  even  a  free 
government,  and  apparently  those  conditions  have  escaped  the  atten- 
tion of  Congress  and  the  public.  There  are  conditions  in  which  per- 
haps 2  or  3  per  cent  of  the  people  do  not  even  participate  in  the  elec- 
tions ;  and  in  the  State  of  Virginia,  where  there  are  150,000  eligible 
voters  who  control  the  election,  in  Avhich  tAVO  and  one-quarter  million 
should  participate,  until  fiA^e-sixths  of  those  drafted  in  the  World 
War  AA^ere  disfranchised,  and  a  condition  of  that  kind  constitutes  a 
black  mark  on  the  democracy. 

The  Chairman.  How  disfranchised? 

Mr.  LocKAvooi).  By  a  series  of  legal  devices  in  the  manipulation 
of  registration,  entirely  in  the  control  and  domination  of  one  political 
party. 


2586 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  You  think  the  ills  and  evils  are  not  all  in  the 
Republican  Party? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  I  think  not. 

The  Chairman.  Take  the  State  of  Georgia.  Do  you  have  that  in 
mind  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD..  Yes,  sir.  I  spoke  of  that,  I  think,  where  the  Fed- 
eral administration  Avent  into  the  State  of  Georgia  and  defeated  one 
of  the  ablest  members  on  the  Democratic  side,  Mr.  Hardwick,  merely 
because  he  would  not  subordinate  himself  entirely  to  the  administra- 
tion. Whole  Federal  forces  were  turned  loose  in  that  State,  and  Mr. 
HardAvick  Avas  defeated  for  nomination.  It  seems  to  me  far  more 
sinister  and  far  more  corrupting  than  the  private  efforts  of  citizens 
to  get  facts  before  the  people  in  a  printed  page  in  a  frank  and  open 
manner  is  the  use  of  the  vast  machinery  of  the  GoA'ernment  for  the 
jDurpose  of  intimidating,  coercing,  and  dominating  elections  and 
primaries  in  this  country. 

The  Chairman.  What  "  leads  "  can  you  give  us  on  the  Hardwick 
matter  ? 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  I  think  Senator  HardAvick  could  giA^e  a  great  deal 
of  information. 

The  Chairman.  That  Federal  employees  were  used  against  Sena- 
tor HardAvick? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  That  Federal  employees  Avere  used  with  A^ery  great 
activity  against  Senator  Hardwick. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  only  in  Georgia? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  think  that  prevails  in  every  Statp.  I  think  it 
prevails  in  Oklahoma.  I  think  Senator  Gore  Avas  defeated  by  the 
Federal  machine  in  Oklahoma.  His  party  ncAvspapers  in  Oklahoma 
Avould  not  even  carry  adA^ertisements  Avhen  he  offered  to  pay  for  them. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  made  an  investigation  of  that  ? 

Mr.  LocKAVooD,  I  haA-e  received  numerous  letters  from  Oklahoma. 
We  have  an  immense  correspondence  from  all  OA^er  the  country. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  giA^e  those  letters  to  the  committee? 

Mr.  LocKAA^ooD.  I  Avill  be  glad  to  look  into  that  matter  and  giA^e 
you  the  letters.  I  had  one  only  a  day  or  tAvo  ago  pointing  out  that 
Senator  (xore  Avas  refused  the  opportunity  to  pay  for  advertising  in 
the  neAvspapers  of  Oklahoma  in  his  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  find  out  anything  about  Federal  officials 
Avorking  against  Senator  Gore? 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  The  information  is  that  they  Avere  actiA^e  all  oA^r 
the  State,  and  that  he  Avas  defeated  only  by  that  method. 

The  Chairman.  HaA^e  you  got  any  information  as  to  the  right 
of  free  speech  being  denied  Senator  Gore's  friends  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  I  do  not  knoAV  about  Senator  Gore,  but  I  do  knoAV 
that  in  the  State  of  Oklahoma  there  occurred  a  typical  instance. 
During  the  Avar  there  Avas  circulated  in  Tulsa,  Okla.,  a  petition  call- 
ing for  the  internment  of  Col.  Roosevelt,  Avhich  aa'c  published  on  the 
first  page  of  our  ncAvspaper.  We  suggested  that  he  Avould  be  interred 
before  he  Avas  interned.  We  published  a  very  scathing  denunciation 
on  the  first  page  of  our  paper  of  that,  and  the  paper  Avas  suppressed 
in  the  city  of  Hugo  and  the  agent  threatened  Avith  indictment  for 
circulating  a  denunciation  of  the  Democratic  administration. 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2587 


The  man  was  prohibited  from  soliciting  subscriptions  in  the  city 
of  Hugo,  and  he  in  great  terror  desisted  and  wrote  me  that  he  Avas 
in  danger  of  incarceration. 

Senator  Reed.  There  were  some  acts  of  that  kind  in  every  State  of 
the  Union,  practically. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  do  not  know  of  any  directed  against  a  newspaper, 
Senator,  for  no  greater  provocation  than  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  have  known  of  similar  instances  in  the  State  of 
Iowa,  as  good  a  State  as  there  is  anywhere,  where  a  body  of  patriots 
went  out  to  a  farmer's  granary,  who  had  not  sold  his  wheat  just  when 
they  thought  he  ought  to.  hauled  it  to  town  and  charged  the  expense 
up  to  him.  and  turned  over  the  balance  of  the  money. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  up  near  the  Missouri  line. 

Senator  Reed.  Up  near  Cedar  Rapids.  What  Mr.  Lockwood  said 
about  the  elections  interests  me  very  much.  Now,  do  you  know  of 
moneys — that  is  the  scope  of  this  inquiry — being  used  in  Oklahoma 
to  control  the  last  election  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  have  not  heard.  Senator,  anything  as  to  the  use 
of  money  in  either  Georgia  or  Oklahoma. 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  think  our  inquiry  is  confined  to  money, 
but  it  includes  the  use  of  any  influence.  The  resolution  was  made  to 
cover  the  action  of  Federal  officials  or  any  influences  brought  to  bear 
upon  elections  or  primaries.  But  from  what  you  have  heard  as  to 
Oklahoma,  you  think  that  would  be  a  fair  field  for  investigations  i 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  certainly  think  it  would. 

The  Chairman.  We  would  like  to  have  you  present  those  letters 
to  the  committee,  not  to  be  inserted  in  the  record,  but  the  committee 
would  like  to  have  them. 

Senator  Edge.  In  summin?  up,  Mr.  Lockwood,  you  are  in  the 
recognized  business  of  selling  newspapers  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  We  are  in  business  to  sell  newspapers;  that  is 
our  occupation. 

Senator  Edge.  And  you  are  positive  that  you  have  not  directly 
or  indirectly  violated  the  law  in  the  carrying  out  of  your  business? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  certainly  am.  I  certainly  would  not  do  a  thing 
of  this  kind  if  I  thought  I  was  violating  any  law  or  ethical  con- 
sideration. 

There  was  testimony  here  yesterday  by  the  representative  of  the 
most  powerful  corporation  in  America,  vastly  more  influential  than 
all  the  corporations  and  big  businesses  which  have  been  so  much 
discussed. 

The  C  HAiRMAX.  AVho  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  The  head  of  the  various  Scripps  publications.  He 
testified  that  not  only  did  they  have  this  vast  agency  of  publicity, 
but  that  this  corporation  out  of  money  that  came  from  the  treasury 
of  this  corporation  had  engaged  in  certain  political  activities,  in  pay- 
ing for  the  necessary  paper,  cost  of  setting  up.  for  mats,  for  the  post- 
age used  in  distribution,  whatever  that  cost  might  be.  and  it  seems 
•  to  me  if  there  is  any  corporation  of  that  magnitude  using  its  money 
;   for  the  purpose  of  getting  out  socialism,  radicalism,  and  bolshevism 
propaganda,  the  whole  pa])er  being  controlled  by  Socialists,  the  most 
1   of  which  is  intended  to  educate  the  people  in  socialism  and  to  teach 
-  the  people  radicalism,  that  their  employer  is  naturally  inimical  to 


2588 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


their  interests,  and  that  he  is  seekinjy  to  dominate  them  and  to  take 
away  from  them  their  fair  share  of  the  product  of  industry,  it  occurs 
to  me  it  is  entirely  proper  for  those  employers,  if  necessarj^,  to  use 
whatever  means  of  the  corporation  are  available  for  subscriptions 
to  a  newspaper  Avhich  seeks  to  educate  their  own  employees  in  patriot- 
ism and  in  opposition  to  socialism,  and  in  other  thm^js  those  em- 
ployers believe  Avill  make  their  employees  better  citizens  and  perhaps 
better  employees. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  w^ords,  you  do  not  consider  a  newspaper 
corporation  as  immune? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  Not  at  all.  Would  this  committee  like  any  fur- 
ther leads  on  the  matter  of  corporation  contributions  to  canipaign 
funds  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes,  sir;  we  are  looking  for  all  the  leads  we  can 
find. 

Senator  Edge.  One  gentleman  spent  two  days  giving  us  leads,  and 
we  would  be  glad  to  give  you  an  opportunity,  surely. 
Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  I  heard  him.  Senator. 

I  Avould  like  to  cite  to  the  committee  check  No.  12341  of  the  Day- 
ton Metal  Products  Co.,  of  Dayton,  Ohio,  for  $5,075,  under  date  of 
June  29,  1918.  Ostensibly  this  was  a  payment  by  the  corporation 
referred  to,  which  is  the  holding  corporation  of  the  various  aircraft 
concerns  in  Dayton,  Ohio,  and  that  same  concern  is  mentioned  here 
and  suggested  this  to  me,  to  pay  a  personal  note  of  James  M.  Cox. 
The  effort  Avas  to  make  it  appear  that  this  was  an  obligation  that 
Mr.  Cox  had  entered  into  with  the  City  National  Bank,  of  Dayton, 
some  time  before,  but  it  appears  to  me,  from  all  the  surrounding  cir- 
cumstances, that  it  must  have  been  a  contribution  from  this  corpora- 
tion to  Mr.  Cox's  campaign  fund,  because  I  do  not  believe  that  this 
corporation  w^ould  have  been  permitted  by  Gov.  Cox  to  give  him 
this  gratuity  on  any  other  grounds. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  in  this  campaign? 

Mr.  Lock  WOOD.  1918  is  the  date  of  this. 

The  Chairman.  That  was  in  his  campaign  for  governor? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  It  was  in  the  campaign  of  1918. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  ask,  Mr.  LockAvood,  so  the  matter  will  be 
clear,  are  you  testifying  to  some  matters  that  somebody  told  you 
about  or  something  you  know  about  yourself  ? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  If  you  Avill  call  Mr.  E.  M.  Talbot  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  You  are  testifying  to  somethin 
somebody  told  you  and  are  putting  this  in  as  a  mere  lead  and  not  a 
a  statement  of  facts? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  Yes,  sir;  but  I  Avill  guarantee  the  committee  the 
facts  Avill  be  as  stated,  if  they  Avill  call  the  Avitnesses.  E.  M.  Talboi 
is  the  president  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  and  he  is  also  th 
president  of  the  City  National  Bank  of  Dayton.  The  same  corpora 
tion  in  1916  contributed  a  total  of  $21,000  to  a  fund  raised  by  on€ 
Adam  Schantz,  a  breAver  of  Dayton,  Avhich  Avas  expended  in  the 
southern  tier  of  counties  of  Ohio. 

Senator  Reed.  In  a  political  campaign  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  In  a  political  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  For  Avhom  ? 
'   Mr.  LocKAVooD.  For  James  M.  Cox  and  Woodrow  Wilson. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  Avhat  I  Avant  to  knoAV. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2589 


The  Chairman.  Yovi  mean  Woodrow  Wilson  and  James  M.  Cox? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir.  It  is  claimed  that  this  $21,000  repre- 
sented a  contribution  by  Messrs.  Deeds — Deeds  is  the  man  who  is 
reconmiended  for  court-martial  by  Gov.  Hughes — Mr,  Kettering  and 
Mr.  Talbot,  and  charge  it  to  their  personal  account  by  the  corpora-  • 
tion.  However,  a  corporation  check  was  paying  these  amounts.  But 
this,  I  think,  is  disproven  by  the  fact  that  a  little  later  the  funds  of 
the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission  Avere  looted  by  the  direc- 
tors of  that  organization  and  money  paid  out  to  Democrats  who  were 
■  supposed  to  have  rendered  certain  service,  and  then  this  money  was 
restored  to  the  contributor,  and  this  fund  of  $37,000,  in  the  case  of 
the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission  was  returned  direct  to 
the  treasurer  of  this  corporation,  which  would  indicate  that  it  was 
a  corporation  contribution  and  not  an  individual  contribution  of 
these  stockholders. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  do  you  get  that  information  from  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  This  information  is  contained  in  an  unofficial  re- 
port made  by  Mr.  Meyer  Steinbrink,  who  was  in  Daji^on  and  investi- 
;  gated  this  proposition,  to  the  Frear  congressional  committee,  but  was 
not  made  a  part  of  the  report  of  the  committee  for  the  reason  it  was 
not  discovered  that  these  funds  were  in  any  way  used  for  aircraft 
purposes,  and  therefore  they  did  not  feel  that  it  was  within  the  pur- 
view of  the  committee.  But  Mr.  Steinbrink  proffered  later  the  in- 
formation and  knowledge  as  to  what  this  $5,000  was  paid  for — this 
$5,075 — this  note  was  found  in  the  possession  of  the  Dayton  Metal 
:    Products  Co. — the  canceled  check  and  canceled  note. 

The  Chairman.  Is  there  a  law  in  Ohio  requiring  the  filing  of  a 
statement  of  campaign  expenses? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  Yes,  sir ;  there  is  such  a  law. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  not  appear  in  the  statement  as  filed? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  It  should  appear,  unless  camouflaged  under  the 
pretense  of  paying  a  note.  The  process  resorted  to  Avas  that  Mr. 
Cox  gave  a  note — ^Ir.  Cox  is  a  rich  man  who  does  not  need  to  give 
personal  notes — for  this  $5,000,  and  then  the  corporation  paid  the 
note,  but  without  any  record  or  evidence  or  indication  of  any 
service  performed  by  Cox  to  the  corporation. 

The  Chairman.  You  take  it  from  that  that  it  Avas  a  campaign 
contribution  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  I  think  that  is  the  most  reasonable  interpretation 
of  the  payment. 

Senator  Reed.  It  might  haA^e  been  any  one  of  40  or  50  different 
tilings,  might  it  not  ? 

Mr.  LocKAVooD.  It  appears  to  have  been  a  contribution  by  the 
corporation  personally  to  Mr.  Cox. 

Senator  Reed.  Noav,  let  us  see  

Mr.  LocKAvooD  (continuing).  Because  the  report  of  Mr.  Stein- 
11  brink  

]  Senator  Reed  (interposing).  That  is  necessarily  a  conclusion. 
i   Mr.  Cox's  note  Avas  put  in  the  bank  for  $4,074  

Mr.  LocKAA^ooD  (interposing).  For  $5,000;  the  other  was  interest. 

Senator  Reed.  AfterAvards  you  say  that  a  corporation  sent  $5,000 
\    over  in  payment  of  that  note  ? 

Mr.  LocKAvooD.  The  president  of  the  corporation  being  at  the 
same  time  the  president  of  the  bank ;  yes,  sir. 


2590 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Very  well.  Now,  you  draw  the  inference  that  that 
was  a  campaign  contribution.  But  might  not  it  have  been  an  ordi- 
nary business  deal,  by  which  Mr.  Cox  gave  his  note  for  something 
he  was  purchasing,  and  that  afterwards,  by  arrangement  with  the 
company,  they  took  the  note  up  and,  like  enough,  took  the  property  5 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  No;  because  no  explanation  could  be  offered  by 
the  officers  of  the  company  to  Mr.  Steinbrink  of  any  transaction. 

Senator  Reed.  You  get  that  from  Steinbrink? 

Mr.  LocKWooD.  I  understand.  Senator^  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  I  do  not  knoAv  an3^thing  about  it; 
but  Avhat  1  am  objecting  to  is  that  a  man  finds  the  note  of  an  indi- 
vidual in  a  bank,  and  finds  that  a  corporation  drew  a  check  that 
paid  that  note,  Avhereupon  he  concludes  that  it  was  a  political  con- 
tribution, merely  because  that  man  happens  to  be  in  politics,  when 
it  might  have  been  any  one  of  a  million  business  transactions. 

Mr.  LocK^\'0()D.  It  has  all  the  color.  Senator,  and  appearance  of 
being  a  political  contribution.  There  ought  to  be  some  explanation,, 
and  it  is  fair  to  say.  Senator  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  Maybe  there  ought  to  be  an  explana- 
tion, and  maybe  not.  It  does  not  come  within  the  purview  of  this 
committee's  business,  but  I  am  going  to  insist  now,  if  the  other  mem- 
bers of  the  committee  will  agree  with  me,  that  this  matter  be  imme- 
diately investigated,  whether  it  is  beyond  our  jurisdiction  or  not, 
and  that  we  get  out  of  the  realm  of  deduction  into  that  of  fact. 
I  am  not  criticizing  you,  although  I  think  that  if  I  found  your  note 
in  a  bank  and  learned  that  a  corporation  had  afterwards  paid  your 
note  I  would  not  have  the  right  to  infer  that  you  used  that  money  for 
political  purposes  or  that  there  was  anything  w^rong  about  it. 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  That  deduction,  it  is  fair  to  sny,  is  my  own  and 
not  that  of  Mr.  Steinbrink's.  Mr.  Steinbrink  expresses  mystification 
about  it,  and  says  no  explanation  could  be  forthcoming. 

I  want  to  say  I  would  not  have  brought  this  matter  before  the  com- 
mittee except  for  the  fact  that  it  appears  from  the  production  of  this  ^ 
testimony — these  papers  introduced  here  to-clay,  which,  as  I  say^l 
could  have  been  obtained  by  anybody  from  my  office — that  it  cor- 1 
roborates  a  story  brought  to  me  by  one  of  our  employees  that  he  had  I 
been  offered  a  large  sum  of  money  to  sell  out  certain  material  with 
reference  to  my  business ;  and  he  came  to  me  with  the  proposition  that 
if  I  would  give  him  a  certain  amount  of  money  he  would  not  do  it. 
I  sent  word  to  him  that  he  Avas  a  blackmailer  and  "  to  go  to  hell,  or  to 
go  to  this  committee." 

The  Chairman.  Where  did  he  go  ? 

Mr.  LocKwooD.  He  Avent  to  this  committee.  Senator.  [Great 
laughter.] 

The  Chairman.  He  did  not  go  to  all  the  members  of  the  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  I  can  relieve  your  anxiet}^  about  this.  I  know 
nothing  about  this  matter.  I  know  nothing  about  those  papers  ex- 
cept that  they  Avere  referred  to  by  Mr.  Moore  in  his  so-called  "  leads," 
and  Avho  handed  me  these  papers. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  It  is  perfectlv  proper  that  you  should  investigate 
that. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  are  here  in  evidence ;  I  do  not  know  how 
they  ^Yere  obtained. 

Sir.  Lockavood.  I  am  only  mentioning  that  as  justification. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2591 


Senator  Keed.  But  if  they  were  obtained,  whether  obtained  by 

whomsoever  

Mr.  LocKwooD  (interposing).  Cuts  no  figure. 

Senator  Eeed.  It  has  nothing  to  do  AA'ith  their  truthfulness,  and 
they  speak  for  themseives.  But  that  has  very  little  to  do  with  an 
inference  that  a  man's  note  put  in  a  bank,  a  man  who  is  in  business, 
and  afterwards  discharged  by  the  check  of  the  company,  proves  that 
he  had  been  receiving  campaign  contributions  from  a  corporation. 
I  do  not  think,  Mr.  Lockwood,  when  3^ou  think  it  over,  that  you  will 
see  any  relation  between  the  two  facts.  The  press  of  the  country  Avill 
have  this  for  whatever  injury  it  may  do.  I  hope  they  will  say  that 
this  was  the  inference  and  deduction  of  a  witness. 

Now,  Mr.  Chairman,  I  am  going  to  move  that  this  committee — and 
if  it  can  not  all  go  that  a  subcommittee — -proceed  to  Dayton,  Ohio,, 
not  later  than  Wednesday  of  next  week. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  we  can  proceed  there  Monday. 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well.  I  can  not  be  there  Monday,  but  you  gen- 
tlemen can  be  there.  I  am  willing  to  leave  it  to  any  two  Senators  on 
the  committee,  Iwth  of  them_  Republicans,  if  you  want  it  that  way. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator,  how  can  you  properly  investigate  this  in- 
ference or  lead  without  having  direct  testimony  from  Gov.  Cox? 

Senator  Reed.  You  can  go  down  there  and  find  if  there  was  such  a 
note  and  such  a  check,  and  whether  the  banker  knows  all  about  it. 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  think  Talbot  and  Schantz  know  all  about  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  want  to  say  I  do  not  believe  it  is  within  our 
jurisdiction  under  this  resolution,  as  that  has  nothing  to  do  with 
this  campaign. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  it  should  not  have  been  allowed  to  have  been 
mentioned  here,  but  it  has  been  mentioned  and  I  am  going  to  insist 
on  ofoing  to  the  bottom  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  AA>  are  ready*  to  go  to  the  bottom  of  it,  but  I  do 
not  think  it  is  within  our  jurisdiction.  We  will  have  Talbot  sub- 
pcenaed  for  to-m.orrow  morning. 

Senator  Reed.  I  suggest  that  we  have  Mr.  Talbot  come  and  bring- 
all  his  records  relating  to  this  transaction. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  hardly  fair  to  put  us  in  the  position  of  not 
being  willing  to  do  it.  We  have  engagements  next  week  just  as  well 
as  you  have.   Who  else  beside  Talbot  can  giA^e  us  information? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  The  cashier  of  the  City  National  Bank. 

Senator  Edge.  How  can  Talbot  give  us  information  as  to  what 
Gov.  Cox  did  with  the  $5,000?  It  is  a  banking  transaction,  and  that 
is  all  he  knoAvs  about  it,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Lockwood.  I  think  Mr.  Talbot  would  have  personal  knowledge 
probably  of  the  purpose  of  the  transaction. 

Senator  Reed.  Senator,  the  Avitness's  inference  was  based  upon  the 
fact  that  the  investigation,  whoever  he  Avas — I  have  forgotten  the 
name  

Mr.  LocKAA'OOD.  Steinbrink. 

Senator  Reed  (continuing).  Had  not  received  an  explanation.  If 
Avhat  you  say  is  correct,  that  these  men  Avould  knoAv  nothing  about 
it  from  mere  papers,  then  Ave  could  not  have  obtained  information 
from  them,  and  therefore  the  inference  Avould  be  a  bad  one  to  draAv. 

Senator  Edge.  The  inference  AA^ould  still  remain,  AA-ould  it  not  ? 


2592 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  I  take  it — I  do  not  say  with  certainty,  as  Ave  can  all 
have  our  opinions — that  the  banker  knows  about  this  transaction, 
and,  if  he  does  not,  we  Avill  try  and  find  somebody  who  does. 

Senator  Edge.  Up  to  a  certain  point  he  would  know  the  banking 
transaction,  but  just  whether  he  can  connect  that  with  a  political  con- 
tribution would  seem  to  me  to  come  pretty  near  the  individual. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  have  had  hundreds  of  checks  go  through  a 
bank,  and  so  have  I,  and  some  have  gone  to  corporations  and  some 
have  come  from  corporations,  but  Ave  Avould  resent  very  much  the 
deduction  from  that  that  we  had  received  subscriptions  from  cor- 
porations. 

Senator  Edge.  We  are  perfectly  Avilling  to  hear  any  eA^idence,  so 
far  as  time  permits. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  HERBERT  S.  HOUSTON,  TREASURER  LEAGUE 
TO  ENFORCE  PEACE,  NEW  YORK  CITY. 

(The  Avitness  Avas  duly  sworn  b}^  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Houston,  state  your  name. 

Mr.  Houston.  Herbert  S.  Houston. 

The  Chairman.  Where  do  you  live,  Mr.  Houston  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  New  York  City. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  business  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  am  publisher  and  A^ice  president  of  Doubleday, 
Page  &  Co. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  treasurer  of  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  We  want  to  knoAv  something  about  that  league 
and  its  actiAdties,  its  contributions,  and  disbursements.  Is  it  an 
incorporated  organization? 

Mr.  Houston.  It  is  incorporated  under  the  laAvs  of  XeAv  York. 

The  Chairman.  And  when  Avas  it  incorporated  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  The  league  Avas  incorporated  in  Indepedence  Hall, 
Philadelphia,  June  17,  1915.  Hon.  William  Taft  is  president,  Alton 
B.  Parker  is  vice  president,  and  I  am  treasurer. 

When  the  league  Avas  formed  it  put  in  the  forefront  of  its  four 
proposals  that  the  ITnited  States  should  go  into  a  league  of  nations 
if  one  Avas  formed.  That  Avas  the  first  plan.  Then  there  were  four 
general  proposals  under  that.  The  Avork  of  the  league  has  been 
educational  entirely,  undertaking  to  develop  and  distribute  affirmative 
arguments  in  regard  to  the  League  of  Nations.  Of  course  Mr.  Taft, 
as  the  president  of  the  organization,  has  been  the  most  influential 
member  in  it  and  has  spoken  in  every  Statfe  in  the  L^nion.  Mr. 
HooA  er,  Oscar  Straus,  and  President  LoAA^ell,  of  Haiward,  are  mem- 
bers. We  have  had  a  very  large  group  of  men.  I  do  not  know  how 
far.  Senator,  you  Avant  me  to  go  in  describing  the  Avork  of  the  organi- 
zation.   I  can  make  it  short  or  long. 

The  Chairman.  In  your  own  Avay  go  ahead.  We  Avould  like  to 
knoAv  about  it. 

Mr.  Houston.  When  the  Avar  came  the  league  immediately  took  a 
A^ery  strong  and  patriotic  stand  in  respect  to  the  Avinning  of  the 
Avar,  and  our  activities  Avere  almost  entirely  merged  into  war  actiA^- 
ties,  from  Mr.  Taft  down  to  the  Avhole  membership.  • 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2593 


We  had  a  (rreat  convention  in  Philadelphia  in  1918  during  the  war, 
Avhich  we  called  the     war  convention  for  permanent  peace."  Mr. 
Taft,  of  course,  made  the  principal  address  as  president  of  the  league, 
and  there  were  a  very  large  number  of  addresses  from  leaders  of 
American  thought,  representing  all  shades  of  political  and  religious 
I    opinion :  and  I  have  here  a  report  of  that  convention.    There  was  a 
(    convention  before  that  in  AVashington,  in  1916.    That  was  our  first 
convention,  and  we  have  gone  forward  doing  educational  work  until 
.  the  present  campaign.   In  our  articles  of  incorporation,  article  7  for- 
bids the  league,  as  it  is  wholly  nonpartisan  in  its  make-up,  to  engage 
in  partisan  activities  in  a  political  campaign,  and  since  the  nomina- 
tions of  the  presidential  candidates  we  have  done  nothing  except  un- 
{    dertake  to  give  such  information  as  came  into  our  possession  in  re- 
\    spect  to  the  actual  workings  of  the  League  of  Nations. 

The  Chairman.  How  large  an  organization  have  you,  Mr.  Hous- 
ton? 

,  Mr.  Houston.  Well,  we  have  organizations  in  practically  every 
[  State  in  the  Union.  We  liave  about  400,000  members.  I  have  brought 
here  a  list  of  over  10,000  contributors  to  our  funds,  the  original  book. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  10,000  contributors? 

Mr.  Houston.  There  have  been  over  10,000  contributors. 

The  Chairman.  What  has  been  the  greatest  amount  collected  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  The  greatest  amount  in  the  last  five  years  has  av- 
eraged just  about  $4,000  per  State  per  year,  or  a  total  of  $851,856.09. 

The  Chairman.  Which  you  have  collected  altogether? 

Mr.  Houston.  Which  we  have  collected  altogether  in  that  period. 

The  Chairman.  During  the  last  year  or  two  the  contributors  have 
been  Avhom — I  do  not  think  we  want  to  go  back  five  years,  but  the 
last  two  years? 

Mr.  H(3uston.  The  last  two  years  we  have  had  as  contributors — — 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  list  of  them  here  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  came  on  a  hurried  telegram  from  Chicago,  Sena- 
tor, and  they  are  in  our  books,  which  I  telegraphed  to  New  York  for. 
But  I  think  I  could  tell  you  from  my  memory  of  a  great  many  of 
the  various  people,  if  you  Avish  to  know  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  last  two  years  were  your  contributors 
different  from  those  in  the  last  five  years,  or  do  the  same  people  con- 
tribute every  year? 

Mr.  Houston.  The  same  people  contribute  every  year. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  a  fixed  amount  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Do  the  men  agree  to  contribute  so  much  per  year  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Sometimes.  Let  me  say  that  Mr.  Taft  has  sent  his 
check  for  $500  every  year  since  the  league  was  formed.  President 
Lowell  has  contributed  $2,000  or  $3,000  every  year.  Our  largest  con- 
tribution in  the  last  two  years  was  made  b}^  Charles  M.  Schwab,  who 
sent  a  check  for  $10,000. 

The  Chairman.  $10,000  a  year? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  that  was  one  check  for  $10,000,  about  a  year 
ago.   It  was  within  the  two-year  period. 

Senator  Eeed.  Have  vou  a  list  of  these  subscribers  that  was  called 
for? 

The  Chairman.  He  has  sent  for  the  books. 


2594 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  I  was  just  explainin<T  to  Senator  Kenyon  and  Sena- 
tor Ed^e.  I  have  here  the  books  of  the  10,000  contributors  which  I 
tele^^raphed  to  New  York  to  be  sent,  and  I  have  them  here. 

The  Chairman.  Oh!    You  have  them  here? 

Mr.  HousT(^N.  Oh,  yes.  I  be"-  your  pardon.  I  have  every  contribu- 
tor from  the  be^jinnino:.  AVe  followed  the  plan  of  having  our  ac- 
counts audited  by  Haskins  &  Sells,  certified  accountants,  three  or 
four  times  a  year,  and  I  have  our  certified  accounts. 

The  Chairman.  I  would  like  to  have  you  produce  the  book. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  have  asked  Miss  Handy,  connected  Avith  our  office, 
to  come  doA\  n. 

The  Chairman.  This  shows  the  contributions  to  the  organiza- 
tion  

Mr.  Houston.  All  the  way  down. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  they  show  all  outside  subscriptions? 

Mi\  Houston.  They  show  everything — every  dollar  we  have  had. 
There  is  something  over  10,300  altogether. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  subscriptions  from  people  who  are 
not  members  of  the  league?  Let  us  start  at  July  1,  or  start  at  the 
last  and  go  forward.   Perhaps  that  is  just  as  well. 

Senator  Edge.  Begin  with  1920,  relating  directly  to  this  campaign. 

Mr.  Houston.  There  have  been  practically  no  contributions.  Sen- 
ator Edge,  since  the  end  of  this  year — that  is,  since  tlie  conventions. 
We  have  asked  for  no  contributions,  because  we  had  lessened  down  our 
work  and  practically  had  none. 

Senator  Edge  You  made  the  statement — I  am  repeating  it  for 
Senator  Reed's  benefit,  who  was  not  in  the  room  at  the  time — ^^Uiat 
your  activities  since  the  campaign  or  since  the  conventions  had  been, 
as  1  understand  it,  primarily  directed  to  circulating  information  con- 
cerning the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  Hoi'STON.  The  actual  League  of  Nations,  because  article  7  of 
our  articles  of  incorporation  forbids  our  taking  any  part  in  a  politi- 
cal campaign,  as  we  are  a  nonpartisan  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  I  have  recently  seen  the  statement  somewhere  in 
the  papers,  and  I  think  I  can  find  it,  that  the  League  to  Enforce 
Peace  had  renew^ed  its  activities. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  would  like  to  know  in  what  respect.  Senator.  I 
should  be  very  much  interested.  You  probably  may  have  seen.  Sena- 
tor Reed,  a  reference  to  our  League  of  Nations  news  bureau,  which 
is  simply  a  part  of  our  activities  to  inform  the  American  people  as 
far  as  we  can  as  to  what  the  actual  League  of  Nations  is  doing. 

Here  is  article  7,  if  you  care  to  haA^e  it  read,  of  our  articles  of  incor- 
poration : 

The  league  shall  at  no  time  seek  or  attempt  to  exercise  any  political  power  or 
to  advocate  or  oppose  any  individual  for  any  piihlic  otiice  whatsoever,  or  to  aid 
or  inflnence  the  nomination  or  the  election  or  defeat  of  any  candidate  for 
pnhlic  oftice,  or  to  take  any  measui'es  or  steps  whatsoever  in  connection  with 
any  election,  or  to  aid  or  promote  success  or  defeat  of  any  political  party  or 
pi-inciple  or  proposition  submitted  to  vote  at  any  election.  Nor  shall  it,  either 
by  written  or  oral  argument  and  explanation,  seek  to  influence  the  views  or 
a(  tions  of  any  person  or  persons  whatsoever. 

Here  is  the  auditor's  report.  Senator,  for  the  last  four  months,  up 
until  the  1st  of  September. 

The  Chairman.  When  was  the  Schwab  contribution? 

i 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2595 


Mr.  Houston.  It  was  given  when  the  w^in  the  war  for  permanent 
peace  convention  in  Phihidelphia  was  held  in  June,  1918.  The  sub- 
scription was  made  then.  I  do  not  think  it  was  paid  until  some 
months  later;  but  that  is  when  it  Avas  made. 

The  Chairman.  Altogether,  up  to  May  1,  1920,  you  had  collected 
approximately  $800,000  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  $851,000— oh,  up  until  May  1? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mr.  Houston.  Up  until  September — yes;  that  is  just  about  right. 
The  Chairman.  $851,000.    You  had  a  balance  on  hand  at  that 
time  of  $385.43. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  about  what  we  had.  AYe  have  a  balance 
now  of  about  $600. 

The  Chairman.  Your  balance  now  is  $600  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  it  is  about  $600  to-day. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  spent  $850,000  in  your  work  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir ;  in  four  years — five  years,  rather ;  five  years 
and  three  months. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  of  that  has  been  in  the  last  two  years? 
Can  you  estimate  it  ? 

Mr.-  Houston.  In  round  numbers,  I  should  think  about  half  that, 
Senator.    I  should  think  $400,000. 

The  Chairman.  $425,000? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  just  the  approximate  figure. 

The  Chairman.  Yes;  we  understand  that.  How  has  that  money 
been  spent,  Mr.  Houston  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  It  has  been  spent  in  connection  with  our  national 
conventions.  We  had  two  national  conventions  within  that  period, 
on  which  we  spent  $28,628. 

The  Chairman.  At  both  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  At  both  of  them.   We  had  nine  national  congresses. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  pay  the  expenses  of  delegates  to  those 
conventions  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No,  sir;  not  a  dollar. 

The  Chairman.  You  say  you  have  had  nine  national  congresses? 
Mr.  Houston.  In  all  parts  of  the  United  States. 
The  Chairman.  What  did  they  cost  you? 
Mr.  Houston.  $100,180.15. 

The  Chairman.  These  nine  national  congresses? 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  you  spend  that  at  the  national  con- 
gresses ? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  was  about  $11,000  per  congress.  We  spent 
that  in  a  very  great  deal  of  distribution  of  literature,  in  sending  out 
many  thousands  of  invitations,  in  paying  the  expenses  of  our  field 
men  to  go  into  the  territories  tributary  to  a  particular  congress,  such 
as  Atlanta  or  Minneapolis  or  San  Francisco,  wherever  the  congress 
was  held,  and  for  the  expenses  of  a  train  which  carried  our  national 
officers  to  the  nine  congresses,  which  was  a  very  expensive  thing. 

The  Chairman.  Was  this  a  special  train? 

Miss  Handy.  It  was  only  one  car. 

Mr.  Houston.  Miss  Handy  corrects  me  and  states  that  it  was  only 
one  car.    I  thought  it  was  a  train. 

The  Chairman.  The  officers  went  in  this  car? 


2596 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  Mr.  Taft  and  Dr.  Henry  Van  Dyke,  president  of 
Lowell  (of  Harvard)  ;  Henry  Morgenthau,  Oscar  S.  Strauss.  Then 
we  had  local  speakers  in  each  particular  congress  from  that  terri- 
tory. 

The  Chairman.  Were  the  local  speakers  paid? 
Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  none  of  them. 
The  Chairman.  Were  their  expenses  paid? 
Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  none  of  the  local  speakers. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  any  paid  speakers? 
Mr.  Houston.  None  whatever ;  never  liave  had. 
The  Chairman.  Not  at  any  time  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  Not  at  any  time. 

The  Chairman.  You  paid  the  expenses  of  the  speakers? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir.  In  that  connection.  Senator,  I  would  like 
to  take  this  opportunity  if  it  is  in  order.  It  has  been  stated  many 
times  that  the  league  paid  Mr.  Taft  for  his  lectures  and  speeches. 
We  haA^e  never  paid  him  a  dollar  at  any  time. 

The  Chairman.  You  paid  his  expenses? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  paid  his  expenses. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  ever  deliver  lectures  on  this  subject  and  get 
paid  for  them? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  very  likely.  Senator,  he  may  have  done  so 
as  an  individual. 

Senator  Reed.  Generally  a  man  delivers  a  lecture  as  an  individual. 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes;  but  I  mean  under  our  direction.  He  has 
delivered  hundreds  of  lectures  and  Speeches  for  us,  and  we  never  have 
paid  him  a  dollar. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  list  of  the  speakers  whom  you  had 
out? 

Miss  Handy.  We  carried  about  six  speakers  on  the  whole  tour. 
Mr.  Houston.  That  is  the  group  that  were  at  these  nine  national 
congresses. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Taft,  Mr.  Strauss,  President  Low^ell  

Mr.  Houston.  Henry  Van  Dyke ;  Henry  Morganthau ;  Edward  A. 
Filene,  representing  the  chamber  of  commerce;  John  Walker,  who 
was  president  of  the  Illinois  Federation  of  Labor ;  and  Capt.  Cham- 
berlin,  of  the  A.  E.  F. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  the  Filene  whom  the  newspapers  have  re- 
ported as  being  in  Germany  at  this  time  doing  some  work  there? 

Mr.  Houston.  This  is  Edward  A.  Filene,  who  is  a  Boston  mer- 
chant. 

Mr.  PiERSON.  May  I  correct  the  record  there,  Mr.  Chairman  ?  Mr. 
Filene  did  not  represent  the  Chamber  of  Commerce  of  the  L^nited. 
States.  : 

Mr.  Houston.  Mr.  Pierson,  jou  are  quite  right.  He  was  a  chamber 
of  commerce  Avorker.  In  connection  Avith  the  referendum  of  the 
chamber  of  commerce  he  went  along.  He  did  not  represent  the 
chamber  of  commerce,  however. 

The  CiTAiRaiAN.  Was  this  referendum,  that  you  speak  of,  on  the 
League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Taken  by  the  chamber  of  commerce? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  Avas  on  the  committee  with  Mr.  Filene.    It  wa^ 
referendum  No.  11. 

I 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGi^^  EXPENSES. 


2597 


Senator  Edge.  You  spoke  of  the  contribution  of  Mr.  Charles  M. 
Schwab.  I  see,  on  the  pas^e  before  it,  a  contribution  by  B.  M.  Baruch 
.  (by  W.  G.  McAdoo),  $25,000. 
I      iVIr.  HorsTox.  That  is  a  direct  contribution. 

The  Chairman.  AMiat  is  the  date  of  the  Baruch  contribution  ? 

Senator  Edge.  It  seems  to  be  August  6,  1919. 

The  Chairman.  Then  the  Schwab  contribution  was  not  the  hirgest 
contribution  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  true  enough.    It  was  Avithin  that  period. 
The  Chairman.  Was  that  contribution  by  Mr.  Baruch  or  by  Mr. 
{  McAdoo? 

Senator  Edge.  The  entry  reads.  "  B.  M.  Baruch,"  and  then  in 
parentheses  appears  '*  by  W.  G.  McAdoo,  $25,000." 
Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  correct.    I  will  explain  what  that  particular 
contribution  of  Mr.  Baruch  was  for.    We  had  a  news  bureau  here  in 
,   Washington  for  a  considerable  period  of  time.    Dr.  Talcott  Williams 
and  Mr.  Eickey  and  Mr.  Denny  Meyers  were  here,  but  we  were  under- 
,   taking  to  finance  it.    We  wanted  a  neAvs  bureau  here  to  supplement 
'  the  Associated  Press  and  other  reports,  to  send  out  addresses,  and  so 
forth,  from  Congress. 

Senator  Edge.  How  long  ATas  that  bureau  in  operation,  Mr. 
Houston  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  think  it  started  a  couple  of  months  before  that. 
Mr.  Houston.  It  must  have  been  five  months,  I  should  think. 
Senator. 

j  The  Chairman.  How  many  employees  did  3^011  ha^e  in  that 
I  bureau? 

:      Mr.  Houston.  AVe  had  four. 

Tlie  Chairman.  Tliat  yvere  sending  out  literature? 

Mr.  Houston.  Sending  out  literature  and  sending  out  press  articles 
from  here :  and  vchen  we  found  that  Mr.  Baruch  Avas  AA^lling  to  sup- 
port a  particular  actiA'ity,  aa  e  put  up  to  him  this  particular  thing,  but 
definitely  stated  our  one  condition  on  AAhich  Ave  would  accept  of 
anything  from  him  or  any  one,  that  the  bureau  should  be  entirely 
under  our  direction  and  control,  both  as  to  personnel  and  as  to  its 
conduct. 

The  Chairman..  That  AA'as  the  news  bureau  here  in  Washington  ? 
^Ir.  Houston.  The  ucaa's  bureau  here  in  Washington. 
The  Chairman.  Which  aa^s  carried  on  for  fiA^e  months? 
^fr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  was  the  entire  expense  paid  by  Mr.  Baruch? 
Mr.  Houston.  Xo,  sir;  but  he  paid  a  very  considerable  part  of  it. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  of  it? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  our  total  expense,s  must  haA^e  been  $45,000 
u  or  $50,000. 

The  Chairman.  Hoaa^  miicJi  of  it  did  he  pay? 
,      ^Ir.  Houston.  If  that  contribution  was  $25,000,  he  paid  half  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Do  a^ou  knoAv  whether  he  paid  any  more  than 
$25,000? 

Mr.  Hoi'STON.  I  do  not  think  so. 
j      Senator  Ed(tE.  AVliat  is  the  meaning  of  the  reference  to  W.  G. 
McAdoo  in  that  same  entry? 


2598 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr,  Houston.  At  the  moment  I  do  not  remember  why  that  was, 
Avhether  Mr.  McAdoo  sent  that  money  or  not.  Senator,  I  do  not 
know  the  exact  facts.    I  was  away  for  a  considerable  time. 

The  Chairman.  Can  yovi  ascertain  the  facts  from  any  of  your 
dissociates  here? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  may  be  able  to  ascertain  the  facts,  and  if  I  can 
I  shall  be  glad  to  include  it  in  the  record. 
(After  conference.) 

Mr.  Houston.  Mr.  Mason,  who  is — by  the  way,  I  want  to  correct 
my  statement  there.  There  is  another  member  of  our  committee 
here — of  our  bureau — Mr.  Guy  Mason.  I  said  there  were  three; 
there  were  five. 

The  Chairman.  You  said  five. 

Mr.  Houston.  Did  I  say  five?  Thank  you.  Mr.  Mason  tells  me — 
and  I  am  sure  his  information  is  correct — that  we  were  trying  to 
raise  this  money.  We  knew  it  was  going  to  take  $40,000  or  $50,000, 
as  nearly  as  we  could  figure  it  out,  and  he  went  to  Mr.  McAdoo, 
whom  he  kncAv,  and  asked  him  if  he  could  approach  Mr.  Baruch 
for  this  money  for  this  particular  purpose,  and  Mr.  McAdoo  did  ap- 
proach Mr.  Baruch,  and  Mr.  Baruch  said  he  would  make  the  con- 
tribution for  this  definite  purpose.  That  is  the  reason — and  I  dare^ 
say  it  must  be  the  correct  one — Avhy  Mr.  McAcloo's  name  is  in  that 
entry. 

The  Chairman.  What  year  was  it  that  that  bureau  was  main- 
tained in  Washington? 
Mr.  Houston.  Last  year. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  while  the  debate  was  going  on  in  the 
Senate  over  the  League  of  Nations  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes.  And,  Senator,  I  want  to  just  say  this  for  the 
record,  Avhich  I  think  is  proper  to  put  into  the  record:  We  stipu- 
lated that,  as  I  said  a  moment  ago,  the  bureau  should  be  under  our 
complete  direction  both  as  to  personnel  and  as  to  policy.  The  three 
men  who  w^ere  in  charge  of  it  were  all  Eepublicans.  We  did  not 
select  them  because  they  were  Eepublicans,  but  it  happened  they 
were.  Dr.  Talcott  Williams,  long  editor  of  the  Philadelphia  Press; 
Mr.  Harry  Rickey,  of  Ohio ;  and  Mr.  Denny  P.  Meyers,  of  Boston.  I 
want  to  say  that  Mr.  Baruch,  who  made  this  large  contribution  for 
that  purpose,  never  undertook  to  suggest  or  direct  the  control  in 
any  way  of  the  activities  of  that  bureau. 

Senator  EdCxE.  I  notice  an  item  here,  "  Norman  H.  Davis,  $1,000." 
That  is  about  the  same  time,  August  9.  Is  he  the  Norman  H.  Davis 
connected  with  the  State  Department  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  I  also  notice  here  $5,000  on  August  23  by  Edsill  B. 
Ford.   Is  he  the  son  of  Henry  Ford  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  The  son  of  Henry  Ford. 

Senator  Kenyon,  you  were  asking  about  how  we  spent  our  mone3\ 

The  Chairman.  Yes.  We  had  gotten  away  on  something  else. 
We  will  come  back  to  it. 

I  notice  in  Februarv,  1919,  a  contribution  of  $5,000  from  Jacob  H. 
Schiff.  WhoisMr.  JacobH.  Schiff? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  partner  of  Kuhn,  Loeb  &  Co.  1 

The  Chairman.  A  banker? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2599 


The  Chairman.  I  notice  another  one  on  the  same  date  by  W.  Mor- 
row. $5,000.   Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  partner  of  J.  P.  Morgan.  I  think  you  will 
find  some  place  where  there  is  $5,000  from  J.  P.  Morgan. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  all  he  gave  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  all  he  ever  gave,  and  I  think  that 
is  all  Mr.  Schiff  has  ever  given. 

The  Chairman.  I  notice  one  of  George  Burnham,  $2,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  of  Philadelphia. 

The  Chairman.  What  business? 
i       Mr.  Houston.  He  used  to  be  in  the  Baldwin  Locomotive  Works, 
but  he  has  retired.    He  has  no  interest  in  that,  I  think,  so  far  as 
I  know. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  mean  to  say  he  is  not  a  stockholder  or 
holder  of  securities? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know,  I  am  sure. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see  another  item,  B.  M.  Baruch,  September  19^ 
$7,500. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  did  not  know  there  was  another  contribution. 
[       The  Chairman.  That  is  $32,500. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see  another  one,  September  23,  Bernard  M. 
Baruch  $15,000. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  $47,000. 

Who  is  Mr.  Hurlbutt,  who  has  given  $10,000  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Of  the  Merchants'  Loan  &  Trust  Co.,  Chicago.  That 
was  given,  I  think,  in  connection  with  the  congress  in  Chicago,. 
Senator. 

■       Senator  Edge.  Who  is  Mrs.  Emmons  Blaine,  who  gave  $5,000? 

Mr.  Houston.  She  is  a  daughter  of  Cyrus  McCormick.  Is  that  cor- 
rect, Mr.  Keeley? 

Mr.  Keeley.  She  is  his  sister. 

The  Chairman.  Harvey  S.  Chase,  $16,500.  That  seems  to  be  quite 
a  contribution.    Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  not  Mr.  Chase's  own  contribution.  That 
came  in  connection  with  the  Boston  congress.  We  raised  money  there 
and  Mr.  Chase  was  the  treasurer.  I  do  not  think  he  gave  but  a  little 
bit  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  business? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  manufacturer  of  some  kind,  I  think.  I  da 
not  know,  Senator. 

The  Chairman.  B.  Everett  Macy,  $2,500.  Who  is  Mr.  Macy  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  man  of  means  in  New  York.  He  is  a  very 
charitable  man.   He  gives  a  great  deal  to  the  Red  Cross. 

The  Chairman.  I  notice,  on  the  same  page,  installment  payment^ 
Liberty  loan  bonds.  Had  you  some  of  your  funds  in  those  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir;  we  subscribed  to  every  Liberty  loan  as  it 
j!  came  along.  All  the  surplus  funds  we  had  were  put  into  Liberty 
bonds. 

Senator  Edge.  Joseph  F.  Guffey,  $5,000.  Is  that  the  Pennsylvania 
oil  man? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  A  member  of  the  Democratic  national  committee  ? 
'      Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know. 

182774— 20— PT  19  7 


2600 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  A.  B.  Farquhar,  $500.    Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  Pennsylvania  manufacturer. 

The  Chairman.  Edward  S.  Hartman  and  Mrs.  Stephen  B.  Hart- 
man,  $5,000.    Who  are  they? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  their  wealth  came  from  an  estate  in  the 
Standard  Oil  Co.  I  have  heard  that  they  have  not  been  in  it  for  a 
number  of  years,  but  they  are  very  charitable  and  philanthropic 
people. 

Ihe  Chairman.  Where  do  they  live? 
Mr.  Houston.  In  New  York? 

The  Chairman.  I  notice  again,  E.  D.  Hurlbutt,  $10,000  

Mr.  Houston.  I  want  to  explain  about  Mr.  Hurlbutt.  His  case  is 
the  same  as  that  of  Mr.  Chase.  Hurlbutt  w^as  the  treasurer  of  the 
Chicago  congress.  You  see,  we  were  undertaking  to  raise  funds  in 
connection  with  these  congresses,  and  he  w^as  the  treasurer. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  the  purpose  of  the  congress,  mostly  to 
raise  funds? 

Mr.  Houston.  It  was  a  double  purpose.  We  tried  to  carry  on  edu- 
cational work.  We  tried  to  raise  funds  to  carry  on  further  educa- 
tional work. 

Senator  Edge.  I  notice  an  item  here  under  date  of  October  9,  Great 
Lakes  Engineering  Works,  $1,000.  Was  that  a  collective  sum  from 
the  employees  or  from  the  corporation? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  must  have  been  from  the  corporation. 

The  Chairman.  George  S.  Auerbach.    Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  lawyer  in  New  York. 

The  Chairman.  Felix  M.  Warburg,  $2,000.    Is  that  the  banker? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  banker. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  the  man  that  was  on  the  Federal  Reserve 
Board? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  that  was  Paul.  I  think  you  will  find  Paul 
Warburg's  name  there  for  $2,500. 

The  Chairman.  The  Warburgs  together  gave  $5,000. 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Another  item  from  Cyrus  H.  McCormick,  $2,000. 
Another  one  from  B.  Everett  Macy,  $2,500. 

Mr.  Houston.  Those  are  different  years.  Senator.  That  is,  cover- 
ing a  period  of  five  years.  Naturally  we  went  back  to  people  who 
had  made  contributions  in  soliciting  additional  contributions. 

The  Chairman.  Cleveland  H.  Dodge,  I  notice,  $1,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  a  New  York  man? 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes.   He  gave  more  than  that. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  did  he  give  altogether? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  $5,000. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  banker? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  the  head  of  Phelps,  Dodge  &  Co.  They  are 
interested  in  railroads  and  various  enterprises. 

The  Chairman.  San  Francisco  committee,  $8,000.  Those  were  col- 
lections ? 

Mr.  Houston.  They  were  made  tlie  same  as  the  other  at  the  San 
Francisco  congress. 

The  Chahjman.  Dr.  William  H.  Nichols,  $1,000.  Who  was  he? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2601 


Mr.  HousTOX.  He  is  the  president  of  the  General  Chemical  Co.  of 
New  York,  I  think. 

Senator  Edge.  Xational  Lamp  Works. 
Mr.  Houston.  That  is  the  same  plant. 

The  Chairman.  Hurlbutt  seems  to  have  a  lot  of  different  items. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  treasurer.  He  sent  money  in  as  he  got  it. 
They  came  in  at  different  periods. 

The  Chairman.  Henry  Morganthau,  $1,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  Ambassador  Morganthau. 

Senator  Edge.  Here  is  an  item,  Felix  Warburg,  $5,000,  that  ap- 
pears here. 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Richard  W.  Montague,  $2,500.   Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  treasurer  of  the  Richmond  congress. 

The  Chairman.  Edward  W.  Decker,  $5,000.  Was  he  treasurer  of 
one  of  the  congresses  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  don't  remember  that  name  at  all.  I  think  he  must 
have  been,  because  I  do  not  know  him  as  an  individual. 

Senator  Edge.  January  22,  1920,  W.  L.  Folk,  $50,000  

Mr.  Houston.  $50,000  ? 

Senator  Edge.  No;  it  is  $5,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  thought  if  you  had  found  $50,000,  you  had  found 
i\  lot  of  money  I  did  not  know  anything  about. 
Senator  Edge.  It  is  $5,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  We  did  not  have  any  contribution  as  large  as  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Only  by  adding  up  Mr.  Baruch's  contributions.  I 
think  I  have  already  referred  to  Edward  A.  Filene.  He  is  a  Boston 
merchant? 

Mr.  Houston.  In  our  first  year  he  gave  quite  a  large  contribution; 
I  have  forgotten  hoAv  much.   Some  of  them  you  have  there. 
Senator  Edge.  I  ha^'e  here  October  1,  $22,500. 

Mr.  Houston.  The  first  year  he  did  give  a  very  large  contribution. 
Senator  Edge.  I  also  observe  another  item,  AYorld  Peace  Founda- 
tion, special  contribution  for  speakers'  bulletin,  $2,341.78. 

Mr.  Houston!  That  is  the  World  Peace  Foundation,  of  Boston. 
Senator  Edge.  Who  runs  that  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  has  no  connection  w^ith  us  in  any  way.  We 
have  not  anything  to  do  with  it.  They  simply  made  the  contribu- 
tion. We  have  special  contributions  from  all  the  organizations  that 
we  could  get  them  from,  and  tha,t  was  one.  That  contribution  they 
gave  for  a  specific  purpose. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  Adolph  Lewisohn? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  wealthy  man  in  New- York. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  he  connected  with? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  mining  interests — copper. 

Senator  Reed.  He  gave  $5,000  on  May  1,  1917.  He  appears  very 
frequently  in  your  books. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  he  has  given  something  every  year  of  the 
five  years. 

Senator  Reed.  James  Couzens? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  mayor  of  Detroit. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  business  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  a  partner  at  one  time  of  Henry  Ford,  but 
I  think  they  had  a  quarrel  and  he  retired. 


2602 


PRBSIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  But  he  was  in  there  in  1917? 
Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  that  was  after  he  retired. 
Senator  Reed.  Percy  Rockefeller? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  must  be  William  Rockefeller's  son,  I  think. 

Senator  Reed.  He  gave  $1,000.    George  Burnham,  jr. — who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  used  to  be  with  the  Baldwin  Locomotive  Co. 

Senator  Reed.  I  see  he  is  down  here  again  for  $5,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  the  man  you  asked  about  a  moment  ago.  He 
has  given  something  every  year  of  the  five  years. 

Senator  Reed.  He  seems  to  have  given  a  considerable  amount. 
•   Mr.  Houston.  He  was  in  the  first  year,  I  remember,  and  his  sister 
also  gave  a  contribution. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  find  him  before  this.  I  did  not  know  I  had 
called  attention  to  him. 

Mr.  Houston.  Some  one  did. 

S;enator  Reed.  He  seems  to  be  on  the  record  under  date  of  May  14,. 
1917,  George  Burnham,  jr.,  $5,000. 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Edward  W.  Sheldon  $5,000? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  who  he  is.  I  think  that  is  the  Sheldon 
who  was  formerly  treasurer  of  the  Republican  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Harriet  L.  Hemingway — who  is  she? 

Mr.  Houston.  She  is  a  wealthy  woman  of  Boston. 

Senator  Reed.  I  see  she  is  doAvn  June  16,  1917,  for  $500  and  her 
name  appears  often.  I  will  come  now  to  Mr.  R.  H.  Weber ;  who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  1  do  not  remember  him.  Senator.  What  contribu- 
tion? 

Senator  Reed.  Contribution  of  June  27,  of  $1,250. 
Mr.  Houston.  What  year  is  that? 
Senator  Reed.  1917. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  remember  who  he  was. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  a  little  surprised  at  that,  because  his  name 
appears  very  frequently.  I  will  come  to  it  again  in  a  moment.  AVho 
is  Willard  Straight? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  died  in  Paris  during  the  war.  He  was  a  very 
able  young  man  in  New  York.  I  remember  when  he  gave  $5,000 
very  well. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  his  business  connection? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  interested  in  some  large  export  company, 
and  then  he  was,  or  supposed  have  been,  the  chief  backer  of  the 
New  Republic  and  the  magazine  Asia. 

Senator  Reed.  He  was  engaged  in  international  trade?  ^ 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes;  he  was  an  export  banker  and  export  trader, 
I  think  he  first  went  to  China  in  connection  with  the  original  China 
loan. 

Senator  Reed.  He  was  connected  with  J.  Pierpont  Morgan,  wag 
he  not? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Samuel  Lewisohn.  Isn't  he  in  some  department- 
store  business? 

Mr.  Houston.  Not  that  I  know  of. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  business  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  in  mining  in  Arizona,  I  think,  or  some 
where. 


PRESIDE^s^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2603 


Senator  Reed.  I  notice  on  July  6, 1917,  another  subscription  or  con- 
tribution from  him;  this  time,  $1,000. 
Mr.  HorsTOx.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  in  what  copper  mines  he  was  inter- 
ested ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  much  of  his  stutf  he  sells  abroad? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  much  in  July,  1917,  was  prob- 
ably due  him  from  European  concerns  or  Governments  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  have  not  the  slightest  idea. 
Senator  Reed.  Or  due  his  com.pany  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I '  have  not  the  slightest  idea.  I  do  not  know 
whether  he  was  selling  any  to  them. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  pass  these  smaller  subscriptions. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  there  are  about  10,000  of  them  altogether. 

Senator  Reed.  Mrs.  Malcolm  J.  Forbes;  who  is  she? 

Mr.  Houston.  She  is  a  wealthy  woman  in  Boston. 

Senator  Edge.  While  Senator  Reed  is  looking  at  that  list,  let  me 
inquire  if  you  have  any  copies  of  literature  or  any  propaganda  which 
you  have  issued  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  to  interrupt  Senator  Reed,  but  I  can 
look  these  over  while  he  is  examining  you.  I  w^ant  to  get  copies  of 
the  literature  3^ou  haA^e  issued  during  the  last  three  or  four  months. 

Mr.  Houston.  These  [indicating]  cover  a  considerable  period. 
There  has  not  been  anything  in  the  last  three  or  four  months. 

Senator  Edge.  You  spoke  of  activities  being  conducted  through 
your  news  bureau.    I  want  to  see  that  literature. 

Mr.  Houston.  There  have  only  been  tAvo  things  gotten  out  in  the 
last  three  or  four  months. 

The  Chairman.  On  page  108  I  notice  Cleveland  H.  Dodge,  $5,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  what  I  just  told  the  Senator  I  was  sure  he 
had  given. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  be  $6,000  altogether? 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes ;  if  he  gave  another  $1,000. 

The  Chairman.  He  had  another  item  of  $1,000.  Richard  W.  Mon- 
tague— there  seems  to  be  a  number  of  subscriptions  by  him. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  was  treasurer  of  the  Richmond  congress,  and, 
just  the  same  as  Mr.  Hurlbutt,  he  sent  in  money  from  time  to  time 
as  it  was  collected. 

The  Chairman.  Charles  P.  Taft,  $1,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  brother  of  William  H.  Taft. 

The  Chairman.  Mary  N.  Emery,  $500. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  remember  who  she  is. 

The  Chairman.  Minnesota  Conlmerce.    What  is  that? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  must  have  been  a  contribution  from  the  Min- 
neapolis Chamber  of  Commerce  to  the  Minneapolis  congress. 

The  Chairman.  Mrs.  Caspar  Whitney,  $1,000.  Who  is  she? 

Mr.  Houston.  She  is  the  wife  of  Caspar  Whitney,  the  writer. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  connected  with  banking  interests  in  any 
way? 

Mr.  Houston.  Not  in  any  way  that  I  know  of. 
The  Chairman.  Tracy  Dowes,  $500? 


2604 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  who  he  is. 
The  Chairman.  Robert  S.  Whitehouse,  $1,000? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  he  is  a  lawyer  in  Porthind,  Me.,  if  I  am  not 
mistaken. 

The  Chairman.  Jacob  H.  Schiff,  another  $1,000,  on  pa<^e  118? 
Mr.  Houston.  That  must  have  been  another  year.    What  year  is 
that? 

The  Chairman.  1919.  Did  he  ^ive  $1,000  a  year?  Was  that  the 
idea  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  gave  $5,000  one  year. 
The  Chairman.  $10,000,  was  it  not? 
Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  $5,000. 

The  Chairman.  Francis  B.  Peabody — who  was  that? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  whether  that  is  Dr.  Peabody,  of 
Harvard,  or  not. 

The  Chairman.  It  is  only  $20. 

Mr.  Houston.  Then  that  is  Dr.  Peabody. 

The  Chairman.  George  Burnham,  jr.,  and  Mary  A.  Burnham? 
Mr.  Houston.  That  is  his  sister  with  Mr.  Burnham. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  the  man  at  one  time  interested  in  the  Bald- 
win Locomotive  Works.  He  is  president  of  the  City  Club  and  a 
very  prominent  Republican  of  Philadelphia. 

The  Chairman.  Dr.  Lowell,  $1,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  Dr.  Lowell  of  Harvard. 

The  Chairman.  Robert  F.  Brewster,  $1,000.    Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  who  he  is.  He  is  a  business  man  in 
New  York.  I  do  not  know  his  connection.  I  have  met  him  a  few 
times. 

The  Chairman.  Mrs.  Guggenheim,  $100. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  her.  She  must  be  one  of  the  Gug- 
genheims  of  New  York,  but  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  J.  P.  Morgan,  $5,000. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  the  one  I  spoke  of. 

The  Cpiairman.  That  is,  two  $5,000  contributions? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  only  one  from  Morgan  that  I  haA^e  ever  seen, 
one  from  Morgan  and  one  from  Morrow. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  connected  with  the  Morgan  firm? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  $5,000  is  all  Mr.  Morgan  has  given? 
Mr.  Houston.  As  far  as  I  can  recall. 

The  Chairman.  Have  any  other  members  of  the  Morgan  firm 
contributed  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  of  any  of  them. 

The  Chairman.  Herbert  S.  Houston,  $750.  Who  is  he?  Is  that 
your  only  contribution? 

Mr.  PIousTON.  I  have  given  more  than  that,  I  think. 
The  Chairman.  Henry  W.  Taft,  $270. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  a  brother  of  William  H.,  and  another  brother 
Horace  has  made  a  contribution  every  year. 
The  Chairman.  He  is  a  Connecticut  man? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes.  Every  one  of  the  Tafts  made  a  contribution 
every  year. 

The  Chairman.  W.  M.  Crane. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2605 


Mr.  Houston.  That  is  Murray  Crane,  of  Massachusetts. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  Senator  Crane? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes.   I  think  he  has  given  $1,000  two  or  three  times. 
The  Chairman.  George  W.  Wickersham,  former  Attorney  Gen- 
eral, $500. 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Vance  McCormick,  $500. 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  former  chairman  of  the  Democratic  national 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Sam  A.  Lewisohn. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  the  same  one  Senator  Reed  asked  about. 
Every  year  he  has  made  a  contribution  in  the  five  years. 
The  Chairman.  Arthur  E.  Morgan? 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  the  head  of  the  Dayton  Conservative,  of  Day- 
ton, Ohio. 

The  Chairman.  Richard  A.  Colgate,  $250. 
Mr.  Houston.  That  is  one  of  Senator  Edge's  constituents. 
The  Chairman.  Where  does  he  live? 
Mr.  Houston.  Orange,  N.  J. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  banker  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  No;  he  is  a  soap  manufacturer. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  related  to  William  Procter  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  they  are  friendly  enemies. 
The  Chairman.  William  Church  Osgood,  $500? 
Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  prominent  lawyer  of  New  York. 
The  Chairman.  Percy  S.  Straus,  $200.   Who  is  he? 
Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  merchant  at  Mac}^  &  Co.,  merchants  in  New 
York. 

The  Chairman.  Arthur  Curtis  James,  $4,000.    Who  is  he? 
Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  wealthy  man.    I  do  not  think  he  litis  any 
banking  connection. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  he  has  retired. 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  AVilliam  U.  Mc^idoo,  $50.  Is  Mr.  McAdoo  a 
frequent  contributor? 

Mv.  Houston.  He  has  contributed  several  times,  I  think. 

The  Chairman.  Are  there  any  other  contributions  from  members 
of  the  Cabinet? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  think  any.   I  do  not  recall  any. 

The  Chairman.  W.  J.  Bushnell,  $500.   Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know.    I  think  he  is  an  Ohio  manu- 
facturer. 

The  Chairman.  Of  the  AVarder-Bushnell  famil}^? 
Mr.  Houston.  I  think  so,  in  Ohio. 
The  Chairman.  Richard  W.  Manning.   Who  is  he? 
Mr.  Houston.  That  is  Manning  of  South  Carolina. 
The  Chairman.  Mrs.  William  Church  Osborne,  $1,000.    Who  is 
she? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  the  wife  of  William  Church  Osborne. 
The  Chairman.  You  received  contributions  both  from  Republi- 
cans and  Democrats  ? 


2606 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  Every  party  and  every  creed.  We  sent  out  our 
appeals  openly.  Almost  all  of  the  money  has  been  raised  by  direct 
letter  appeal  to  people,  and  unless  we  happen  to  know  in  some 
personal  way,  we  do  not  know  anything  about  either  the  politics  or 
the  creed  or  anything  else  of  these  people. 

The  Chairman.  Lewis  R.  Cheney,  $500. 

Mr.  Houston.  He  is  a  silk  manufacturer. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  his  home? 

Mr.  Houston.  Some  place  in  Connecticut. 

The  Chairman.  Senator  Reed  has  been  called  out  of  the  room  for 
a  few  moments,  and  wanted  us  to  wait  for  him.  I  believe  I  am  about 
through. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  have  here  some  of  our  matter  that  we  sent  out,  if 
you  want  to  know  about  that.  Here  is  a  very  interesting  address 
by  Senator  Lodge  that  we  gave  very  wide  distribution  to. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  date  of  that  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Before  the  reservations  were  presented. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  the  address  referred  to  in  the  Democratic 
national  platform  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  This  is  the  address  Senator  Lodge  delivered  in 
Washington  on  May  27,  1916,  at  our  big  convention  here.  I  should 
like  to  incorporate  it  in  the  records  of  this  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  look  it  over.  We  are  a  little  suspicious  of 
senatorial  addresses. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  am  surprised  to  hear  that.  Of  course,  I  need  not 
tell  you  that  the  things  we  have  probably  given  widest  distribution  to 
are  Mr.  Taft's  papers.  Here  is  one,  "America  can't  quit,"  and  an- 
other one  on  the  Paris  covenant  and  the  League  of  Nations. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  print  those  in  very  large  quantities  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Hundreds  of  thousands.  Here  is  another  one, 
"  Senator  Knox  ansAvered  by  William  H.  Taft." 

The  Chairman.  Were  those  sent  all  over  the  country? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes.  Here  is  another  one,  "  Menace  of  a  premature 
peace."  They  have  been  the  most  widely  circulated  of  any  we  got 
out. 

The  Chairman.  These  documents  you  speak  of  and  now  hand  to 
the  committee  were  gotten  out  during  the  discussion  on  the  League 
of  Nations  in  the  Senate  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir;  when  it  was  before  the  Senate.  One  of 
them  may  have  been  before  the  war  was  over.  I  think  this  one  of 
Herbert  Hoover's,  "  We  can  not  fiddle  while  Rome  burns,"  has  been 
the  most  successful  of  any  we  have  sent  out.  We  have  had  more 
comment  and  it  has  been  more  Avidely  copied  than  anything  we  ever 
issued. 

The  Chairman.  The  date  of  that  is  October  2,  1919  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir;  that  is  11  months  ago.  It  was  while  the 
treaty  was  before  the  Senate. 

The  Chairman.  Was  Mr.  Hoover  delivering  addresses  under  the 
auspices  of  your  association? 

Mr.  Houston.  Not  directly. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  how? 

Mr.  Houston.  This  was  an  address  delivered  in  California  before 
the  students  of  Stanford  University.  We  always  had  advance  copies 
.of  his  addresses  and  used  them  in  many  ways.    Here  is  an  editorial 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2607 


,  that  we  circulated  almost  more  widely  than  anything  else,  "  America 
and  ArticleX."  That  was  a  leader  in  the  St.  Louis  Globe-Democrat, 
and  here  is  one  by  President  Van  Heiss,  of  the  University  of  Wiscon- 
I  sin.  written  shortly  before  he  died. 

The  Chairman.  In  order  that  the  record  may  show  it,  tell  us 
jibout  how  many  hundred  thousand  in  each  year  you  got  out? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  should  say  of  each  one  on  an  average  of  200,000 
or  300,000. 

The  Chairman.  Of  each  one  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes ;  and  sometimes  more. 

The  Chairman.  How  w^ere  those  mailed  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  To  all  sorts  of  lists,  depending  on  various  circum- 
j  stances.    Sometimes  these  lists  would  be  sent  to  us  by  our  branches 
i  in  various  cities ;  sometimes  our  own  lists  in  New  York  would  be 
I  iised :  sometimes  we  have  taken,  if  we  Avanted  to  make  an  intensive 
distribution  to  any  particular  territory,  telephone  directories,  etc. 
The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  lawyers'  lists  and  doctors'  lists? 
^Ir.  Houston.  Yes.   We  have  had  a  great  deal  of  material  which 
we  sent  to  clergymen. 

The  Chairman.  Just  Avhat  have  you  sent  to  clergymen  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  These  things  of  Mr.  Taft — Ave  have  sent  many  of 
i  those  and  things  of  this  kind, The  A  B  C  of  the  Paris  coA^enant,"  and 
i  HooA^er's  addresses  Ave  have  ahvays  sent  to  clergymen. 

The  Chairman.  You  had  a  list  of  all  the  clergymen  in  the  country? 
L     Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir ;  all  OA^er  the  country.   Here  is  one  by  George 
j  W.  Wickersham,  "Attention,  Kepublicans."    That  is  another  one  of 
tlie  most  Avidely  circulated  Ave  eA^er  got  out.    Here  is  one  by  Oscar 
Straus,  on  **  Mr.  Root  and  Article  X."    Here  is  another  one,  "  The 
Covenanter."   That  is,  of  course,  Avell  knoAA^n. 
J     The  Chairman.  That  Avas  published  in  the  neAvspapers,  Avas  it  not  ? 
!     Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  ever  have  it  published  in  the  ncAA-spapers 
by  paying  for  it? 

Mr.  Houston.  No.  We  syndicated  it  Avithout  charge,  but  we  sup- 
plied the  material. 

The  Chairman.  You  supplied  the  material  to  the  ncAA^spapers  ? 
Mr.  Houston.  Yes.    Then  the  World  Peace  Foundation  issued  a 
very  great  edition  which  Ave  distributed,  and  my  house,  Doubleday, 
Page  &  Co.,  made  a  book  Avhich  Ave  sold  at  $1.50  and  AAdiich  we  sold 
to  the  trade  in  the  regular  way. 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  furnished  by  your  company  or  Avere 
they  paid  for  it  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  took  it  in  the  regular  Avay  and  paid  a  royalty 
of  10  per  cent  to  each  of  the  authors. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  thousand  of  those  are  in  circulation? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  should  say  about  7,000  of  that  cloth-bound  book. 
Of  course,  Ave  Avere  in  competition  with  this  free  distribution. 

The  Chairman.  Those  Avere  paid  for  by  your  organization? 

Mr.  Houston.  No.   We  had  nothing  to\lo  Avith  it. 

The  Chairman.  The  people  who  bought  them  paid  for  them? 

Mr.  Houston.  They  were  sent  to  book  stores  throughout  the 
country  in  the  regular  way,  as  any  book  would  be  that  we  published. 

Senator  Edge.  More  particularly  relating  to  your  literature  this 
year,  I  Avant  to  ask  a  question  or  two.    That  is'  an  activity  of  the 


2608 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


league  as  it  mifrht  be  related  to  the  present  campaign  which  we  ardfl 
investigating.  I  notice  you  have  three  publications  Avhich  have  been 
issued  recently,  one  dated  May  15,  1920,  entitled  "  The  League  of 
Nations  at  work,  although  not  fully  developed;  advantages  of  mem- 
bership already  apparent."  That  is  an  official  document  of  your 
organization  ?  H 

Mr.  Houston.  Oh,  3^es ;  that  is  our  regular  bulletin. 

Senator  Edoe.  Then,  there  is  another  one,  dated  August  23,  1920^ 
being  a  report  of  yourself  on  your  trip  to  Europe.  Was  that  gener- 
ally distributed? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  About  how  many  copies? 
Mr.  Houston.  About  30,000  copies  of  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  gone  through  it  rather  hastily  and  I  do  not 
see  any  reference  to  the  reservations  suggested.  Did  this  report,  in 
speaking  of  the  league,  refer  to  membership  in  the  league  as  the 
covenant  was  originally  presented  to  us  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  never  had  that  in  mind  one  w^ay  or  the  other  in 
talking  with  men  abroad  this  summer.  I  just  discussed  the  matter 
of  our  coming  into  the  League  of  Nations ;  in  fact,  that  question  was 
asked  by  a  great  many  people.  I  simply  gave  my  own  personal  opin- 
ion, and  this  was  more  with  reference,  as  the  report  show^s,  to  the 
general  situation  that  I  thought  I  found,  and  I  reported  in  just  thft 
newspaper  language.  m 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  go  abroad  on  this  work  this  summer? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  I  was  abroad  for  other  purposes,  but  I  bore 
letters  from  Mr.  Taft  to  important  League  of  Nations  people  in 
all  countries,  and  I  saw  them. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  some  kind  of  conference  with  them? 

Mr.  Houston.  Only  in  an  informal  way;  not  in  any  formal  way. 
I  saw  the  Bourgeoise,  the  German  chancellor,  and  Lorcl  Robert  Cecil. 
I  had  letters  to  all  of  them.  I  was  not  over  in  any  official  way  in  any 
sense.   I  Avas  over  there  on  a  publishing  mission  for  my  own  house. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  consider  this  circulation  of  literature,  such 
as  this  particular  one,  since  the  conventions  have  been  held,  candi- 
dates nominated,  and  platforms  adopted  is  not  a  direct  influence  in 
connection  with  the  selection  of  a  President? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  think  so. 

Senator  Edge.  You  think  it  does  not  bear  an  influence?  * 

Mr.  Houston.  It  had  to  do  entirely  with  our  conditions  abroad 
and  with  their  attitude  toward  us;  and  I  confess  in  making  that 
report,  as  chairman  of  that  committee,  I  did  not  have  any  thought  of 
any  such  connection,  and  I  do  not  think  we  had  it  at  issue.  ai 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  not  questioning  your  thought — far  from  it— f ' 
but  I  am  tr^dng  to  get  your  opinion  as  to  what  influence  a  bulletin 
of  that  character,  speaking  as  it  does  in  terms  of  praise  of  the 
league  and  trusting  that  America  will  shortly  enter  the  league, 
whether  you  do  or  do  not  consider  that  influencing  the  electorate 
of  America  in  the  present  presidential  campaign? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  whether  it  would  or  not.  So  far 
as  the  league  is  concerned,  Ave  are  standing  squarely  for  the  League 
of  Nations,  as  Ave  have  all  along,  wdth  Mr.  Taft  and  Lowell  and 
HooA^er  and  all  the  rest. 

The  Chairman.  Standing  for  it  .as  presented? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2609 


Mr.  HorsTox.  Oh,  no.  We  have  alwaj^s  been,  as  you  may  re- 
call— the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  officially  acquiesced  and  under- 
took to  secure  the  ratification  with  reservations  rather  than  not  to 
have  us  go  into  it. 

Senator  Edge,  But  this  bulletin,  reading  it  hastily,  refers  in  no  way 
to  reservations  so  far  as  I  can  see. 

Mr.  HorsTOX.  I  was  not  trying  to  discuss  that  question  at  all. 
This  was  just  a  report  of  the  conditions  in  Europe,  and  that  is  all  I 
was  undertaking  to  cover. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  a  report  of  your  trip  to  Europe? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  were  you  in  Europe  on  that  trip  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  was  there  three  and  one-half  months. 

The  Chairman.  Did  3^011  talk  with  Lloyd-George  at  that  time  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  I  did  not  see  him.  It  was  right  after  the 
Hague  conference,  and  I  was  only  in  London  two  weeks. 

The  Chairman.  Did  3^011  see  Kobert  Cecil  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes;  I  did;  and  I  saw  Clemenceau  also. 

Senator  Edge.  I  might  sa\%  to  make  my  question  understood,  that 
I  understood  you  to  sa}^  originally  that  article  T  of  the  constitution 
of  your  league  prohibited  the  league  entering  into  a  political  cam- 
paign in  the  interest  of  any  candidate,  and  I  was  tr^dng  to  get  your 
opinion  on  the  issuance  of  this  report  in  August  of  this  year — whether 
\^ou  thought  that  did  or  did  not  indorse  or  assist  the  candidacy  of 
either  party. 

Mr.  Houston.  It  was  not  in  m}^  mind  in  any  way  in  preparing  it, 
and  I  do  not  think  that  it  did  or  would,  and  I  do  not  think  it  in  any 
way  contravened  our  article  7  any  more  than  the  Avork  that  Ave  are 
now  undertaking  to  do,  namelv,  to  spread  abroad  information  as  to 
what  the  actual  League  of  Nations  is  doing,  and  that  is  what  my 
report  has  to  do  with  very  largely. 

The  Chairman.  Have  there  been  am^  contributions  from  foreign- 
ers to  3"our  society  or  organization  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Never  a  dollar. 

The  Chairman.  From  any  concern  doing  business  abroad  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  should  think  there  has  been  from  concerns  doing 
business  abroad,  probabW. 

The  Chairman.  From  what  are  termed  international  bankers. 

Mr.  Houston.  Very  few.  We  have  had  a  yery  small  fraction  of  1 
per  cent  that  we  have  had  from  so-called  international  bankers. 
They  onl}^  represent  a  very  few  dollars  of  our  $850,000  over  a  period 
of  five  years. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  see  that  circular  gotten  out  by  your 
organization  in  Avhich  the  specific  statement  is  made  that  more  than 
three-quarters  of  all  the  money  that  has  been  subscribed  has  been 
furnished  by  international  bankers  and  financiers,  men  who  have 
vision  enough  to  see  across  the  Atlantic  ?   Did  you  see  that  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  should  like  to  see  it.   I  never  heard  of  it  before. 

Senator  Reed.  There  was  one  very  much  like  it  put  in  the  Congres- 
sional Record,  and  I  never  heard  its  authenticity  disputed. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  never  heard  of  it.    I  should  like  to  see  if. 

Senator  Reed.  I  say  it  was  put  in  the  Record — I  think  it  was. 


2610 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  We  have  all  our  records  and  minutes,  and  I  never 
heard  of  it.  I  am  sure  it  never  came  from  the  League  to  Enforce 
Peace. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  tell  us  about  the  expense  accounts  of 
your  speakers  and  what  they  amounted  to  durinir  the  last  two  yenrs, 
approximately  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  The  only  way  I  could  have  it  itemized  here  would 
be  in  these  two  national  conventions  and  these  national  congresses, 
and  that  covers  so  many  things  that  I  would  not  be  able  to  say  just 
how  much  the  actual  expenses  of  the  speakers  would  be.  I  *^know 
we  never  paid  a  dollar  to  any  of  them  other  than  actual  expenses 
and  traveling  expenses. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  have  representatives  at  both  of  the 
national  conventions? 

JMr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know.  I  was  abroad,  and  I  do  not  know 
whether  we  did  or  not.   I  do  not  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  You  made  no  effort  to  secure  any  planks? 

Mr.  Houston.  Miss  Handy  makes  a  good  point  to  me  just  now. 
We  did  not  have  money  enough  for  anything  of  that  sort.  We  have 
not  had  more  than  four  or  five  hundred  dollars  balance  since  the 
convention. 

The  Chairman.  Contributions  have  gone  down  since  the  conven- 
tion? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  have  not  sought  any,  because  under  article  7 
we  feel  that  we  are  not  taking  any  part  in  the  campaign  and  the  only 
thing  we  are  undertaking  to  do,  as  I  have  said  two  or  three  times,  is 
to  spread  such  information  as  we  can  about  the  actual  League  of 
^s^ations  and  its  work. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  feel  if  you  should  continue  after  the  con- 
vention to  do  the  work  that  you  did  before  the  convention,  it  would 
have  a  political  aspect? 

Mr.  Houston.  It  would  l)e  so  interpreted. 

Senator  Edge.  Don't  you  feel  right  there  that  the  publication  of 
any  matter  indorsing  the  League  of  Nations  has  a  direct  influence  on 
the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  You  mean  about  what  the  actual  League  of  jSTations 
is  doing? 

Senator  Edge.  Indorsing  it  from  unsf  angle? 

Mr.  HoiTSTON.  I  do  not  indorse  it.  I  am  talking  about  facts,  news, 
reports.  I  had  a  very  definite  letter  from  Mr.  Taft  approving  our 
]:ilan  to  do  it,  and  the  executive  committee,  made  up  of  all  Kepublicans 
and  Democrats,  last  Saturday,  in  New  York,  unanimously  sup- 
ported the  report  of  the  committee  to  do  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Understand,  I  am  not  criticizing  your  viewpoint  as 
to  the  League  of  Nations.   It  is  just  a  question  of  its  influence  as  an 
association  on  the  political  campaign.   I  am  trying  to  get  you  to  give 
your  view  whether  you  feel  that  the  influence  is  potent  through  thej 
distribution  of  such  matter  as  you  have  presented  here?  } 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not.  I  do  not  think  that  this  news  that  we^ 
shall  gy^e  out  through  the  news  bureaus,  which  comes  from  thej 
Secretariat — we  have  quite  a  great  deal  of  information,  and  we  are| 
trying  to  give  out  such  of  it  as  seems  of  public  interest  through  ther 
press.  1 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2611 


Senator  Edge.  I  think  the  press  should  print  it.  I  think  that  is 
what  the  press  is  for;  but  I  am  discussing  the  question  of  your 
organization  under  article  7  that  you  have  called  attention  to.  We 
are  discussing  your  association,  not  the  question  of  whether  the  news 
should  be  su23pressed  or  not. 

Mr.  Houston.  The  point  is  the  news  is  not — no  one  is  interested 
enough  to  bring  it  to  the  attention  of  the  newspapers,  I  regret  to 
say.  It  has  not  been  done  in  any  particular  way  except  a  few  big 
things.  There  is  a  lot  of  material  that  we  think  we  may  send  out, 
and  we  follow  it  up  by  putting  it  in  form  to  send  out  to  the  news- 
papers, that  it  may  inform  the  public  as  to  what  the  actual  League  of 
Nations  is  doing.  Of  course,  when  the  campaign  is  over  the  League 
to  Enforce  Peace  will  go  right  forward  and  function,  and  it  will 
undertake  to  do  everything  in  its  power  to  secure  the  ratification  of 
the  treaty  and  the  adoption  of  the  League  of  Nations. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  not  questioning  the  policy  of  the  association 
at  all.  I  am  trying  to  put  my  question  so  that  you  will  thoroughly 
understand  it.  I  am  simply  trying  to  get  your  view  as  to  the  rela- 
tionship between  the  present  activity  and  the  political  campaign, 
where  one  party  has  made  one  declaration  concerning  the  League  of 
Nations  and  the  other  party  another  declaration — whether  under  the 
terms  of  article  7  of  your  organization,  or  a  fair  interpretation  of  it, 
would  you  feel  that  your  association  should  continue  to  publish  argu- 
ments manifestly  in  favor  of  America  entering  the  present  League 
of  Nations? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  I  do  not  know  just  what  to  say.  I  confess  I 
have  not  known  and  Mr.  Taft  does  not  know  and  Mr.  Wickersham 
does  not  know  and  Mr.  Hoover  does  not  know  that  the  Republican 
Party  and  the  Republican  candidate  are  against  the  League  of 
Nations. 

Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  say  they  were. 

Mr.  Houston.  Then  how  could  it  have  any  party  bearing? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  asking  you.  With  the  present  debate  going 
on  throughout  the  country  and  your  one  statement  that  I  read  that 
does  not  refer  at  all  to  reservations,  but  refers  to  the  League  of 
Nations  pure  and  simple  and  entering  the  league  as  existing.  You 
speak  very  clearly  there  of  the  hope  that  America  shall  enter  the 
league.  We  must  assume,  and  anyone  reading  that  report  must  as- 
sume, and  I  think  I  am  correct  in  assuming  that  you  are  referring 
to  the  present  league,  because  there  is  only  the  one  league.  That 
issue  I  think  is  clearly  defined  between  the  platforms  of  the  two 
parties. 

Mr.  Houston.  Senator  Edge,  of  course  our  league  has  gone  on 
record  expressing  its  entire  willingness  to  accept  reservations,  and 
I  was  not  undertaking  to  cover  within  the  compass  of  four  pages 
and  record  in  a  continuing  way  our  positon.  I  was  having  in  mind 
our  going  into  the  League  of  Nations  on  the  basis  we  have  latterly 
discussed,  and  our  people  should  know  the  position  of  the  league. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  to  continue  the  argument.  Our  duty, 
as  I  understand  it,  is  to  investigate  all  allied  interests  that  are  con- 
tributing, directly  or  indirectly,  to  the  campaign  of  either  party,  and 
when  you  refer  here  to  becoming  a  member  of  the  league,  of  course, 
I  do  not  see  how  anyone  can  interpret  it  to  mean  anything  else  but 
the  league  now  functioning  abroad. 


2612 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  Precisely;  but  it  is  on  the  conditions  that  America 
may  elect  to  establish  when  she  goes  in,  and  that  is  a  point  on  which 
the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  has  gone  on  record  a  number  of  times. 
I  do  not  undertake  to  discuss  that  question  at  all.  I  was  only  re- 
ferring to  conditions  as  I  found  them  and  to  the  point  that  we  ought 
to  go  in. 

The  Chaieman.  You  Avent  on  record  as  favoring  the  ratification  of 
the  treaty  with  the  Lodge  reservations  '^ 
Mr.  Houston.  We  did. 

Senator  Reed.  You  also  went  on  record  as  favoring  it  without  any 
reservations,  did  you  not? 
Mr.  Houston.  We  did. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  position  now  is  any  way  to  get  us  in? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  would  rather  have  a  half  loaf.  Senator,  than 
what  we  think  would  be  two-thirds  of  a  loaf. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  would  really  prefer  to  put  us  in  just  as  the 
league  covenant  was  ratified  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  think  so.  Senator.  I  think  the  illuminat- 
ing debate  in  the  Senate  and  all  the  discussions  since — frankly,  my 
opinion  is  that  that  has  brought  about  a  change  of  opinion  and  view 
in  the  membership  of  the  league. 

Senator  Reed.  Even  the  members  of  the  league  are  beginning  to 
understand  now  

Mr.  Houston.  Some  members. 

Senator  Reed.  Some  members  of  the  league  are  beginning  to  un- 
derstand— not  all  of  them — that  there  were  dangers  in  this  instru- 
ment that  we  ought  to  avoid.  Do  you  not  feel  like  apologizing  to 
the  American  people  for  trying  to  put  it  down  their  throats  with 
those  dangers  in  it  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  not  think  you  ought  to  look  a  little  further 
now  and  see  if  you  are  not  making  some  more  mistakes  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  are  looking  ahead  all  the  time  with  the  best 
lights  we  have. 

Senator  Reed.  I  ought  not  to  have  asked  that  question.  It  interests 
me  to  find  that  you  people  who  tried  to  get  this  adopted  without  the 
dotting  of  an  "  i  "  or  the  crossing  of  a  "  t  "  have  not  reached  the  poini 
where  you  are  willing  to  admit  that  that  position  was  a  mistake.  ' 

Mr.  Houston.  I  would  not  put  it  that  strong. 

Senator  Reed.  If  that  continues  a  while  longer  Ave  may  be  able 
to  convert  you  a  little  more.  When  a  fellow  gets  half  way  from 
the  back  of  the  church  up  to  the  mourners'  bench  there  is  always 
hope  for  him. 

Mr.  Houston.  Do  not  get  the  impression  that  we  think  we  have 
made  a  real  mistake.  Our  position  is  that  we  would  be  perfectly 
willing,  as  we  went  on  record,  to  have  this  country  go  into  the 
league  with  the  Lodge  reservations. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course  you  do  not  mean  to  say  that  the  Lodge] 
reservations  necessarily  embrace  all  that  ought  to  be  done,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  There  might  be  other  things.  My  own  personal 
opinion  is  that  they  go  altogether  too  far.  ^ 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  see  what  you  take  back. 

Mr,  Houston.  I  do  not  think  my  personal  opinions  are  of  any  par- 
ticular value. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2613 


Senator  Reed.  I  think  they  are.  You  are  engaged  in  handling 
a  fund  of  $800,000  to  form  public  opinion. 

Mr.  Houston.  That  has  already  been  explained. 
Senator  Reed.  You  are  still  raising  more  money.    I  think  it  is  of 
interest  in  this  matter  and  pertinent  to  the  inquiry  to  know  where 
you  are  driving.    You  think  the  Lodge  reservations  go  too  far. 


Mr.  Houston.  I  have  not  them  before  me  right  now. 

Senator  Reed.  We  will  have  to  start  with  the  one  that  provides,  in 
substance  and  effect,  that  there  shall  be  an  equality  of  voting.  Do 
you  take  that  back? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  don't  know  whether  I  would  or  not. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  quite  made  up  your  mind  yet  whether 
you  want  the  United  States  to  have  as  much  of  a  vote  as  Great 
Eritain  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  she  has. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  you  don't  mean  that ! 
\    Mr.  Houston.  I  do  mean  that.    I  think  she  has. 
:    Senator  Reed.  Do  you  think  that  the  single  vote  of  the  United 
States  is  equal  to  the  vote  of  Australia,  New  Zealand,  Canada,  South 
Africa,  India,  and  Great  Britain? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  in  the  assembly.  In  the  council,  which  is 
fthe  governing  body,  we  have  the  same  authority. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  not  discovered  yet  that  every  controversy 
can  be  removed  to  the  assembly  by  a  simple  request  between  nations  ? 
j    Mr.  Houston.  It  goes  to  the  council  first. 

(  Senator  Reed.  And  can  be  removed  by  either  party  on  simply 
filing  a  request?  Have  you  overlooked  the  fact  by  the  express  lan- 
guage of  article  3  or  4 — 1  haae  forgotten  which — it  is  provided  that 
the  assembly  shall  have  jurisdiction  of  every  question  that  is  cog- 
nizable by  the  league?  That  is  not  the  exact  language,  but  that  is 
the  exact  meaning. 

Well,  I  do  not  think  Ave  will  gain  anything  by  prolonging  the  dis- 
^jussion  on  that. 

I    I  want  to  ask  you  some  questions  in  regard  to  these  subscribers. 
'     Is  it  the  understanding  that  we  are  going  to  adjourn  at  6  o'clock, 
Mr.  Chairman  ? 

The  CHAiiniAN.  I  think  we  will  have  to  hold  a  night  session. 
(After  informal  discussion:) 

Mr.  Houston.  It  is  very  difficult  for  me  to  stay  over.   What  more 
lis  there  that  I  can  tell  you?    I  have  all  my  books  here  that  I  will 
turn  over  to  you.    I  was  on  a  ver}^  important  business  trip  in  the 
West,  that  I  had  to  give  up  and  come  back  here  on  a  telegram,  which 
[I  was  very  glad  to  do. 

I    Senator  Reed.  Could  you  leave  your  books  here  ? 

'  Mr.  Houston.  Yes.  I  should  be  glad  to  leave  them  with  Mr.  Ma- 
son, who  is  our  representative  here,  so  that  the  committee  can  go 
through  them. 

Senator  Reed.  The  only  thing  is  that  I  thought  you  could  identify 
'  some  of  these  subscribers  for  me. 

1  Mr.  Houston.  I  have  gone  tliTough  them  as  to  every  one  I  knew. 
'r-   Senator  Edge.  Can  Mr.  Mason  remain  here  ? 

!  Mr.  Houston.  Mr.  Mason  is  right  here,  Senator.  I  am  going  to 
»Xew  York,  and  then  go  back  West  to  take  up  this  trip  that  I  was 


2614 


PEaSIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


interrupted  on.  I  was  to  have  been  in  St.  Louis  to-day  at  12  o'cloc  k. 
I  shall  be  glad  to  leave  everything  with  you. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  you  intend  to  keep  up  the  activities  of  the 
league '( 

Mr.  Houston.  Oh,  no.   I  said  after  the  election,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Houston.  After  the  election  we  shall  undoubtedly  go  on.  That 
is  the  general  understanding,  but  I  do  not  know  just  in  what  way. 

Senator  Reed.  You  still  have  this  list  of  contributors,  a  number  of 
whom  have  been  w^ith  you  for  five  years  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Five  years,  since  we  have  been  formed. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  expect  they  will  continue  to  support  this 
league  generously? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  hope  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  your  connection  w^ith  this  League  to  Enforce 
Peace  your  first  connection  with  any  similar  movement  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir ;  entirely.  I  am  a  publisher  and  I  have  not 
been  in  anything  like  this  before. 

Senator  Reed.  There  was  an  American  Peace  Society.  Were  you  a 
member  of  that  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  There  were  several  other  societies  under  different 
names,  all  of  them  in  a  general  w^ay  working  toward  world  peace. 
You  were  not  a  member  of  any  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No,  sir;  I  was  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  connected  with  the  Carnegie  Peace  Founda- 
tion? 

Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  not  in  any  way ;  never  have  been. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  anything  about  that  institution? 

Mr.  Houston.  Very  little. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  I  will  not  ask  you. 

How  did  you  come  to  be  gotten  into  this  movement?  Who  in- 
duced you? 

Mr.  Houston.  Nobody  did.  In  the  Chamber  of  Commerce  of  the 
United  States,  of  which  I  was  a  member,  I  introduced  a  resolution  in 
the  convention  here  in  Washington  several  years  ago  in  favor  of 
using  economic  pressure  behind  The  Hague  Court  of  Arbitral  Jus- 
tice, and  I  had  been  reading  along  those  international  lines — that  is, 
in  a  general  way — for  a  number  of  years.  When  this  movement  took 
form  for  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  I  attended  the  first  meet- 
ing at  Independence  Hall,  in  Philadelphia,  and,  quite  to  my  astonish- 
ment, I  was  made  treasurer.  I  am  not  a  financial  man  at  all,  but 
just  a  publisher,  as  Senator  Edge  knows,  for  a  good  many  years. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  got  up  the  organization  ?    Who  started  it  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  I  think,  Senator  Reed,  that  Mr.  Taft  and  Dr. 
Lowell  and  Hamilton  Holt  and  those  men  were  the  first  men  that  I 
knew  of  in  connection  with  it.  They  were  the  men,  when  the  meet- 
ing was  held  at  Independence  Hall,  that  seemed  to  be  in  the  fore- 
front. Then  there  had  been  a  number  of  meetings  held  at  the  Cen- 
tury Club,  it  appeared,  in  which  the  general  subject  had  been  dis- 
cussed, and  then  this  meeting  was  held  in  Independence  Hall. 

Senator  Reed.  The  idea  that  impressed  you  and  led  3^ou  to  affiliate 
with  it  was  that  it  was  proposed  that  some  element  of  force  should 
be  put  back  in  any  kind  of  an  international  decision  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2615 


Mr.  Houston.  That  was  my  first  point  of  contact  with  it. 
Senator  Reed.  You  had  in  mind  at  that  time  especially  economic 
pressure  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Yes,  sir.  I  wrote  a  poor  book  about  it. 
Senator  Reed.  Oh,  did  you  ?  I  would  like  to  see  it. 
Mr.  Houston.  I  shall  send  you  an  autograph  copy.  Senator,  with 
pleasure. 

Senator  Reed.  What  kind  of  force  did  you  propose  to  use  ?  The 
same  kind  the  Irishman  did  who  proposed  to  have  peace  if  he  had  to 
fight  for  it  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  was  strong  for  economic  pressure. 
Senator  Reed,  What  do  you  mean  by  that  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  mean  what  is  in  article  16  of  the  covenant,  which 
states  it  very  well.  I  think  it  is  article  16. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  perfectly  familiar  with  it.  If  you  have  the 
wrong  article  we  know^  what  you  mean.  That  is  to  say  that  a  nation 
that  does  not  obey  these  orders  that  may  be  issued  can  have  economic 
pressure  visited  upon  it. 

Are  you  opposed  to  any  other  force  than  just  that  of  economic 
pressure  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Am  I  opposed  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Yes. 

Mr.  Houston.  Not  in  the  last  analysis.  I  think  if  economic  pres- 
sure does  not  suffice,  some  plan  must  be  worked  out  to  use  in  the  last 
analysis — military  power. 

Senator  Reed.  But  the  thing  that  particularly  appeals  to  you  is 
this :  "  That  any  member  of  the  league  that  resorts  to  war  in  disre- 
gard of  its  covenant  under  articles  12,  13,  or  15  shall  ipso  facto  be 
deemed  to  have  committed  an  act  of  war  against  all  the  other  members 
of  the  league."  If  it  has  committed  an  act  of  war,  of  course  the 
other  members  have  a  right  immediately  to  go  to  war,  do  they  not? 
That  is  what  that  means,  doesn't  it  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  What  it  is  proposed  to  do  in  article  16  is  what  I 
am  in  favor  of. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  in  favor  of  that  part  of  it  ?  If  one  nation 
committed  an  act  of  war  against  another  nation,  you  do  not  deny  the 
right  of  that  nation  to  immediately  respond  by  going  to  war? 

Mr.  Houston.  It  could  

Senator  Reed.  I  am  just  asking  if  it  could? 

Mr.  Houston.  But  it  could  not  under  the  league  covenant. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  so.  Then,  what  you  positively  agree  to  is 
stated  in  this  way,  "  which  hereby  undertakes  immediately  to  subject 
it "  to  a  severance  of  all  trade  or  financial  relations  and  prohibiting 
any  and  all  intercourse  between  their  nationals  and  the  nationals  of 
.  the  covenant-breaking  State,  and  preventing  all  financial,  commercial, 
and  other  intercourse  between  the  nationals  of  the  covenant-breaking 
State  and  any  other  State,  whether  a  member  of  the  league  or  not. 
In  other  words,  you  are  going  to  apply  to  this  nation  exactly  what 
the  Allies  undertook  to  apply  to  Germany — reduce  them  by  starva- 
tion. Do  you  think  that  is  more  humane  than  war — to  starve  the 
babies  and  children  at  home  than  to  kill  men  on  the  battle  front  who 
have  arms  in  their  hands? 

182774— 20— PT  19  8 


2616 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  I  think  it  is  much  more  humane,  and  for  this  rea- 
son, that  if  that  economic  pressure  is  instantly  applied,  the  public 
opinion  within  the  nation  against  which  it  is  applied  will  assert  itself 
and  will  see  to  it  that  the  pledge  which  was  broken  is  redeemed. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.   You  assume  that  the  public  will  lie  down  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No  ;  I  do  not.   I  assume  they  will  stand  up. 

Senator  Reed.  You  assume  that  the  public,  if  they  see  they  are 
going  to  be  starved  to  death,  will  demand  that  their  Government 
yield  more  quickly  than  if  they  merely  know  they  are  going  to  be 
attacked  by  armies.   Is  that  the  assumption? 

Mr.  Houston.  They  will  demand  that  their  Government  keep  their 
plighted  pledge  to  other  nations,  which  is  a  matter  of  honor. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  think  they  will  do  it  more  quickly  from 
economic  pressure  than  if  the  armies  of  the  other  nation  bear  down 
on  them? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  they  will  do  it  quicker,  and  there  will  not 
be  the  loss  of  life  that  war  brings. 

Senator  Reed,  In  other  words,  you  think  that  this  is  so  much  more 
terrible  than  war  that  the  mere  threat  of  it  will  cause  a  nation  to 
demand  that  their  Government  yield  to  what  is  claimed  by  the 
league  is  a  just  demand  under  their  arrangements? 

Mr.  Houston.  They  have  broken  their  pledge,  their  word.  ' 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  somebody  said  they  had  broken  it ;  somebody 
decided  that. 

Mr.  Houston.  Nobody  decides  it  at  all.    It  is  a  fact,  not  an  opinion. 

Senator  Reed.  Some  tribunal  said  that  the  Nation  had  gone  to  war 
in  disregard  of  an  obligation.  Let  us  assume  that  it  is  us,  and  that 
a  situation  has  arisen.  I  just  want  to  say  if  I  can  not  convince  you 
a  little  more.    I  do  not  hope  to  fully  convince  you. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  will  come  down  some  day  and  spend  the  day  with 
you ;  it  will  be  a  great  pleasure. 

Senator  Reed.  Let  us  assume  we  are  in  this  league  and  let  us  assume 
a  condition  has  arisen  which  has  led  us  to  attack  some  nation,  let 
us  say  Mexico,  whereupon  seven  foreign  gentlemen,  sitting  at  Geneva 
proceed  to  declare  that  we  have  gone  to  war  in  violation  of  our  pact. 
We  say  that  we  have  not  done  so.  They  say  we  have.  Thereupon 
you  apply  your  economic  pressure.  The  American  boats  leaving 
American  harbors  are  seized.  Boats  entering  American  harbors  are 
seized.  Just  about  how  many  minutes  do  you  think  it  would  be  until 
the  fighting  began  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  you  are  assuming  an  impossible  situation  be- 
cause you  are  assuming  this  country  w^ould  break  its  word,  which  I 
do  not  believe  it  would  do. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  assuming  it  breaks  its  word  at  all.  I  am 
assuming  seven  foreign  gentlemen,  representatives  of  seven  foreign 
governments,  say  it  has  broken  its  word. 

Mr.  Houston.  It  is  a  matter  we  ourselves  would  know  if  we  had 
not  gone  to  arbitration,  as  we  would  have  pledged  ourselves  to  do. 
That  would  be  a  matter  that  this  country  would  perfect^  know  

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  no  ! 

Mr.  Houston.  And  if  we  undertook  to  do  it  I  think  this  country 
would  be  tremendously  stirred  up. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2617 


Senator  Keed.  No;  we  agree  that  we  will  go  to  arbitration — all 
right.  The  other  gentleman  will  not  agree  on  fair  arbitrators — not 
arbitrators  whom  we  think  are  fair. 

Mr.  Houston.  We  are  parties  to  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Accordingly  the  question  is  thrown  into  the  council. 
In  the  meantime  the  Mexicans  have  been  invading  us,  we  claim, 
and  we  have  had,  in  our  own  defense  and  in  defense  ox  our  women 
<ind  children,  to  follow  them  and  punish  them.  War  ensues,  and  the 
question  in  dispute  is  w^hether  we  have  made  a  war  or  whether  one 
has  been  made  on  us.  That  is  a  question  of  dispute  between  the 
nations  in  nearly  every  war  that  begins.  Now,  you  say  economic 
pressure  being  threatened,  that  the  people  would  demand  that  their 
Governments  withhold.  Do  you  think  the  people  of  the  United 
States,  if  they  felt  that  they  had  a  just  cause,  would  yield  because 
they  were  threatened  with  economic  pressure? 

Mr.  Houston.  If  we  had  just  cause,  or  whether  we  had  or  not, 
if  we  pledged  our  word  to  go  to  arbitration  we  would  go  to  arbitra- 
tion, and  we  would  not  wait  for  the  economic  pressure  to  be  applied. 
•  This  country  would  be  stirred  up  by  such  a  situation. 
I     Senator  Keed.  Suppose  the  other  gentleman,  to  wit,  Mexico,  re- 
fuses to  agree  on  its  arbiters;  suppose  it  refuses  to  arbitrate  at  all 
and  continues  to  invade  vis,  and  seven  gentlemen  over  tliere  repre- 
■■  sentatives  of  scA  en  foreign  countries  say,  "  We  are  going  to  apply 
economic  pressure  to  the  United  States,"  do  you  think  the  people 
of  the  United  States  would  say  to  their  (government,     Now  you 
I  have  to  yield  in  the  face  of  this  terrible  disaster,"  or  do  you  think 
I  they  would  stand  up  and  say  to  all  the  world,  ''Come  on,  we  will 
i  defend  ourselves  "  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  They  would  stand  up  upon  their  honor  and  say, 
iWe  will  do  what  we  agreed  to  do. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly;  but  the  question  always  will  be  whether 
these  seven  foreign  gentlemen,  representing  seven  foreign  Govern- 
ments, have  decided  the  question  as  we  think  is  just.  Do  you  think 
t"we  v.'oulcl  ever  submit  to  an  unjust  decision? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  if  the  country  was  completely  stirred  up  that 
it  was  an  unjust  decision  we  might  possibly  go  to  war,  but  I  think 
we  would  keep  our  word. 

Senator  Reed.  I  just  want  to  impress  on  your  mind  that  economic 
pressure,  that  is  more  terrible  than  war  

•  Mr.  Houston  (interposing).  It  is  not  more  terrible  than  war. 
Senator  Reed.  Then  if  it  is  not  more  terrible  to  war,  we  would  not 
(yield  to  it  any  more  than  to  war. 

/  Mr.  Houston.  War  is  the  most  terrible  of  all,  because  it  includes 
^economic  pressure. 

I  Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  Economic  pressure  is  the  last  word  in 
war.  The  economic  pressure  that  you  propose  here  is  the  economic 
pressure  that  has  been  applied  by  every  Government,  barbarous  and 

^civilized,  in  order  to  break  the  spirit  of  its  enemies. 

j    Mr.  Houston.  As  a  part  of  war.  Senator. 

j  Senator  Reed.  They  starve  the  women  and  children  at  home,  and 
I  they  prevent  food  getting  to  them  by  their  armed  forces.  And  now, 
[.in  this  year  of  grace  1920,  you  propose  to  apply  that  by  a  combina- 

:ion  of  all  nations  against  some  nation  that  may  think  it  is  fighting 

ibsolutely  to  save  itself,  including  this  country. 


2618 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Houston.  Simply  against  that  nation  to  have  it  keep  its  word. 

Senator  Reed.  In  other  words,  you  are  Avilling  to  have  seven  for- 
eign gentlemen  render  a  decision  that  will  put  the  united  force  of 
the  world  against  this  country  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  We  would  not  wait  for  them  to  do  that,  because  we 
can.  keep  our  word  in  the  first  place,  which  would  prevent  it.  You 
are  talking  about  an  impossible  situation  and  one  which  I  would  not 
concede.  I  think,  Senator,  we  could  go  ahead  and  talk  this  way  for  a 
week.  I  can  not  convince  you,  and  I  do  not  believe  you  can  convince 
me. 

Senator  Reed,  Is  it  impossible  that  the  United  States  would  say 
that  a  decision  rendered  by  these  seven  foreign  gentlemen  was  an 
unjust  decision  and  one  that  they  wt)uld  not  endure?  Is  that  im- 
possible ? 

Mr.  Houston.  No;  that  is  not  impossible.  There  is  a  condition 
where  we  might  have  war. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  willing  to  submit  the  vital  interests  of  your 
country  to  the  decision  of  seven  foreigners  in  any  case  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  vve  could  talk  about  vital  interests  for  a  long 
time. 

Senator  Reed.  When  I  say  "  vital  interests  "  I  mean  an  interest 
which  affects  the  very  life  of  the  Republic.  Are  you  willing  to  sub- 
mit that  to  the  decision  of  any  tribunal  on  earth  except  the  American 
people  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  if  it  is  a  just  

Senator  Reed.  The  life  of  your  country — do  not  let  us  haggle  about 
it.  The  life  of  your  country.  Are  you  willing  to  submit  it  to  the 
decision  of  seven  foreigners  ? 

Mr.  Houston.  That  is  an  issue  that  never  could  come  up. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  it  could  come  up.  And  one  of  the  things 
you  people  resisted  was  a  reservation  which  said  we  would  not  submit 
our  vital  interests  to  such  a  decision. 

Mr.  Houston.  Then  we  said  we  were  willing  to  acquiesce  in  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Certainly;  you  were  willing  to  have  the  interests 
of  your  country  submitted  

Mr.  Houston.  No;  I  said  we  were  willing  to  acquiesce  in  these 
reservations.  . 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  were  not  willing,  and  had  the  entire  forcdf 
of  your  whole  crowd  against  a  reservation  which  said  that  the 
United  States  reserved  full  liberty  of  action  as  to  whether  or  not  it 
would  ever  submit  a  question  involving  the  national  honor  or  the 
vital  interests  of  the  United  States. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  remember  that. 

Senator  Reed.  You  appeared  here  to  defeat — not  you  personally^ 
but  your  influences. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  do  not  know  they  did. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  will  you  tell  me  what  has  ever  been  proposecl 
by  Eugene  Debs  or  any  other  man  more  subversive  of  the  liberties 
of  the  American  people  than  to  submit  the  vital  interest  of  this  coun- 
try to  the  decision  of  the  representatives  of  seven  foreign  Govern- 
ments ? 

Mr.  Houston.  Well,  I  do  not  think  we  would  submit. 
Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  think  we  would. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2619 


Mr.  Houston.  I  think  you  are  stating  an  impossible  case  that 
would  not  come  up. 

Senator  Keed.  I  three  times  submitted  that  amendment  in  the 
Senate,  three  times  it  was  defeated,  and  the  whole  force  of  your 
league  was  against  it. 

Mr.  Houston.  Do  3"ou  mean  to  say  that  your  compatriots  of  the 
Senate  challenged  such  a  proposal  ? 

Senator  Reed.  It  was  challenged,  and  it  was  challenged  by  the 
force  ot  your  league,  and  the  force  of  the  White  House  on  that 
proposition,  and  the  record  will  show  it. 

Mr.  Houston.  I  think  the  record  must  have  been  that  they  thought 
the  vital  issue  might  have  been  made  so  vital  and  elastic  that  it  would 
take  us  out  of  the  operation  of  the  league. 

Senator  Reed.  Could  we  not  trust  our  ow^n  Government  to  decide 
whether  it  was  a  vital  interest  or  not  better  than  somebody  else? 
Well,  I  thank  you.  I  will  look  these  books  over.  I  know  you  would 
not  do  it  when  the  time  came ;  you  would  get  a  gun  yourself,  as  old 
as  you  are. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  LEWIS  E.  PIERSON,  NEW  YORK  STATE  CHAIR- 
MAN OF  REPUBLICAN  WAYS  AND  MEANS  COMMITTEE,  NEW 
YORK  CITY. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Pierson,  you  are  connected  in  some  way  with 
this  work  of  raising  funds  in  New  York? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  am  New  York  State  chairman  of  the  ways  and 
means  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Does  the  New  York  State  chairman  cover  New 
York  City  also? 

Mr.  Pierson.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  separate  organization  from  New  York 
City? 

Mr.  Pierson.  Y"es;  Mr.  Stevens  is  in  charge  of  Manhattan. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  Greater  New  York? 

Mr.  Pierson.  There  are  four  boroughs ;  it  is  one  of  the  boroughs. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  organized  your  committee  for  the  State 
outside  of  Manhattan  ? 

Mr.  Pierson.  Through  Mr.  Stevens  in  Manhattan,  and  through 
other  gentlemen  in  the  other  boroughs,  and  through  the  man  up 
State. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  you  trying  to  raise  in  the  entire  State  of 
New  York? 

Mr.  Pierson.  Whatever  these  various  groups  can  obtain  by  this 
Campaign. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  the  quota  for  New  York  State?  Do  you 
know? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  have  never  had  any  quota  given  to  me. 

The  Chairman.  Y^ou  have  just  gone  to  work  to  raise  all  you  can? 

Mr.  Pierson.  All  we  can. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  have  you  raised  already? 
Mr.  Pierson.  To  September  23,  the  treasurer  advised  us  last  night, 
$376,716.50. 


2620 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Does  that  include  the  State  of  NeAv  York? 
Mr.  PiERSON.  That  includes  the  State. 
The  Chairman.  The  whole  State? 
Mr.  Pierson.  The  whole  State. 

The  Chairman.  Can  you  furnish  us  a  list  of  the  contributions  in 
New  York  State? 

Mr.  Pierson.  You  will  have  to  get  it  from  the  treasurer,  in  Chi- 
cago. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  Ave  have  most  of  those  already. 

Mr.  Pierson.  We  are  simply  a  volunteer  group  of  men  who  do  not 
keep  records.  The  checks  go  to  the  treasurer,  or  the  eastern  treasurer. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  you  have  no  quota.  Has  there  been  any 
suggestion  made  to  you  as  to  how  much  money  was  expected  of  you  ? 

Mr.  Pierson.  No,  sir ;  there  has  not. 

Senator  Reed.  I  did  not  hear  the  last  part  of  your  examination. 
The  Chairman.  He  said  he  was  going  to  raise  all  he  could. 
Mr.  Pierson.  We  are  raising  whatever  we  can  through  those 
means. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  operating  in  the  State  of  New  York? 

Mr.  Pierson.  And  the  city. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  divided  the  State  up  ? 

Mr.  Pierson.  Let  me  amplify  that.  New  York  City  is  made  up  of 
four  boroughs.  Mr.  Stevens  has  charge  of  Manhattan,  which,  of 
course,  is  the  most  important  borough.  Then  we  have  a  man  for 
Brooklyn,  which  is  Kings  County ;  one  for  Queens,  and  one  for  Rich- 
mond, and  a  man  for  up  the  State,  and  a  woman  for  each  of  them 
also. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  not  you  gentlemen,  when  you  met,  talked 
about  the  amounts  of  money  that  you  ought  to  get  ? 
Mr.  Pierson.  No  ;  we  have  not. 

Senator  Reed.  And  nobody  has  made  any  suggestion  to  you  ? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  have  never  seen  any  quota.  We  have  never  made 
any  for  our  own  workers. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  made  a  list  of  prospects,  or  men  who  are 
likely  to  contribute? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  have  not  personally.  I  presume  the  groups  do  as 
they  go  down,  and  the  various  chairmen.  , 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  anything  about  that? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  have  attended  luncheons  which  these  groups  have 
had,  and  have  seen  men  present  that  they  have  invited  at  those 
luncheons. 

Senator  Reed.  And  do  you  know  of  their  having  lists  which  have 
been  passed  around  to  the  various  groups? 

Mr.  Pierson.  I  believe  they  have  lists.  ; 

Senator  Reed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  you  have  luncheons,  and  you^ 
have  teams  that  have  tables  at  the  luncheons? 

Mr.  Pierson.  No;  it  is  not  as  large  as  that,  Senator.  It  is  just  a' 
luncheon  where  an  industry  might  meet  with  half  a  dozen  men,  and 
I  have  simply  been  invited  there  by  the  chairman  to  meet  them  and 
tell  them  what  we  are  trying  to  do. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  point.  But  I  know  you  want  to  get 
away  and  you  are  somewhat  distressed,  I  understand,  about  som^ 
sickness,  so  I  want  to  let  you  go.  i 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  sort  of  general  organizers? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2621 


Mr.  PiEKSON.  Exactly. 

Senator  Reed.  What  I  can  not  understand  is  how  you  can  carry 
this  on  without  indicating  to  these  gentlemen  in  some  way  the  amount 
of  money  you  want  them  to  get. 

Mr.  PiERSON.  We  have  left  it  to  each  group  to  work  out  them- 
selves. Most  of  these  men  have  been  connected  with  the  Liberty  loan 
or  the  Red  Cross  drives. 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  have  not  got  any  limit  on  what  you  are 
going  to  raise  ?    You  will  raise  all  you  can  ? 

Mr.  Pierson.  We  have  not  any  amount  set. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  care  to  ask  any  more  questions. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  J.  P.  STEVENS,  OF  D.  B.  STEVENS  &  CO.,  NEW 

YORK  CITY. 

(The  witness  was  duly  SAvorn  by  Senator  Edge.) 
Mr.  Stevens.  Senator,  I  simply  assist  in  the  organization  of  the 
committees.   We  work  exactly  on  the  Liberty  loan  lines. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  business? 
Mr.  Stevens.  I  am  in  the  dry-goods  business. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  firm? 
Mr.  Stevens.  D.  B.  Stevens  &  Co. 
Senator  Reed.  That  is  a  large  concern,  is  it? 
Mr.  Stevens.  Moderate  size. 
Senator  Reed.  A  corporation? 
Mr.  Stevens.  No;  a  partnership. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  what  are  you  doing  there?  Tell  us  how  you 
got  into  this  thing  and  what  you  have  been  doing  ever  since. 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  got  into  it  for  the  reason  that  I  was  associated  with 
the  Red  Cross  and  Liberty  loan  drives. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  how  you  connect  any  charitable  or  eleemosynary 
activities  with  this  Republican  campaign  is  what  I  can  not  under- 
stand.   But  go  ahead. 

Mr.  Stevens.  Simply  the  idea  of  organization  similar  to  the  Lib- 
erty loan  arrangements  for  soliciting  the  funds  for  political  parties. 

Senator  Reed.  You  had  been  pretty  successful  in  selling  bonds,  and 
they  picked  on  you  to  raise  this  fund  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  They  picked  on  me  to  get  the  organization  together. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  organization? 

Mr.  Stevens.  Our  organization  is — we  have  various  chairmen  of 
the  various  groups.    We  have  perhaps  thirty-odd  groups  of  indus- 
I  tries. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  to  say,  in  New  York  instead  of  getting  pros- 
pects, as  we  have  been  told  they  do  in  other  places,  and  then  dividing 
those  names  up  among  the  workers,  you  in  New  York  have  adopted 
the  plan  of  groups?  That  is,  you  take  a  business,  the  dry  goods  busi- 
ness, for  instance,  and  you  turn  that  over  to  somebody? 

Mr.  Stevens.  To  a  chairman,  who  presumably  knows  the  men  in 
the  district,  and  makes  out  his  own  prospects. 

Senator  Reed.  And  he  gathers  the  men  around  him  to  help  him? 

Mr.  Stevens.  He  gathers  the  men  around  him  to  help  him. 
ij  )  Senator  Reed.  How  many  men  have  you  got  altogether  engaged  in 
this  work? 


2622 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Stevens.  It  is  very  hard  for  me  to  say,  Senator,  because  I 
really  do  not  know  the  men  in  the  various  groups.  There  was  a  gen- 
tleman testified  before  you  to-day — I  do  not  recall  ever  having  seen 
him  before.  He  is  in  one  of  the  groups  in  New  York — in  the  chemical 
group.   I  do  not  recall  having  seen  him  before. 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  have  got  some  thirty  groups,  and  they  em- 
hrdce  the  business  interests  in  New  York.  How  much  money  did 
you  start  out  to  raise  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  We  never  have  suggested  in  any  way,  shape,  or 
manner  to  any  man  what  he  should  get,  but  that  he  should  not  take 
a  subscription  of  over  $1,000.  . 

Senator  Reed.  No  ;  but  how  much  money  are  you  trying  to  raise  in 
the  aggregate? 

Mr.  Stevens.  It  has  never  been  suggested  to  me  even. 

Senator  Reed.  There  is  no  limit  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  No  limit.  I  know  that  we  will  never  be  able  to  get 
as  much  as  they  require. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  do  they  require  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  do  not  know— $30,000,000,  don't  they? 

The  Chairman.  You  have  to  get  all  you  can? 

Mr.  Stevens.  All  we  can. 

Senator  Reed.  What  do  you  do  when  you  go  to  a  large  concern 
that  is  a  corporation  ?  How  do  you  fix  it  there  about  the  way  that 
they  are  to  make  their  subscriptions  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  personally  have  not  solicited  any  subscriptions, 
Senator ;  it  is  all  done  through  the  men. 

Senator  Reed.  What  do  you  instruct  your  men  to  say?  To  make 
these  subscriptions  in  the  names  of  the  stockholders  or  the  officers  ? 

Mr.  Stevens.  We  give  them  no  instructions  at  all.  They  know  the 
law  in  connection  with  it. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  men  have  you  got  at  work  now  in  New 
York  City? 

Mr.  Stevens.  They  all  work  spasmodically.  Some  men  give  an 
hour  a  day  to  it — once  in  a  while.  We  have  no  men  in  these  indus- 
tries that  are  devoting  all  their  time  to  it,  or  even  several  days  to  it. 

Senator  Reed.  When  I  speak  of  men  working  I  mean  men  giving 
part  of  their  time  or  all  of  their  time. 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  should  say  we  might  have  possibly  120  to  125 
men. 

Senator  Reed.  They  are  pretty  much  important  business  men,  are 
they?  .  i 

Mr.  Stevens.  Some  of  them  are.  1 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  got  some  heavy  bankers  in  there?  j 
Mr.  Ste\^ns.  No  ;  no  bankers  to  amount  to  anything.  ] 
Senator  Reed.  You  have  a  bankers'  group,  have  you  not  ?  | 
Mr.  Stevens.  Yes;  we  have  a  bankers'  group.  I 
Senator  Reed.  Who  has  charge  of  the  bankers'  group  ?  M 
Mr.  Ste\t:ns.  The  bankers'  group  is  under  Mr.  Bliss.  |M 
Senator  Reed.  What  Bliss  is  that? 

Mr.  Stevens.  Formerly  the  treasurer  of  the  Republican  Party— | 
treasurer  of  the  national  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  group  that  embraces  the  men  engaged 
in  international  trade? 

Mr.  Stii:vens.  No  ;  not  in  the  bankers'  group ;  no. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2623 


Senator  Eeed.  That  is  all  you  can  tell  us  about  it,  is  it  ? 
Mr.  Stevens.  I  have  no  knowledge  of  the  machinery;  I  have  not 
sent  a  check  to  anybody. 

Senator  Eeed.  But  you  get  reports,  -and  you  Imow  generally  what 
i  you  are  doing.   You  said  you  had  organized  on  the  lines  of  the  Lib- 
j  erty  loan.   Now,  the  principle  of  the  Liberty  loan  drive  was  that  they 
!  would  get  all  the  money  they  could  from  the  people  and  then  the 
banks  had  to  take  up  the  balance  of  it.   Was  not  that  it  ? 
Mr.  Stevens.  Presumably  so;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  what  you  propose  to  do  this  time  ? 
Mr.  Stevens.  I  know  nothing  about  the  finances.  Senator,  in  the 
organization. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  propose  to  do  that  or  not?  Are  the  banks 
going  to  underwrite  it? 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  have  no  knowledge  of  that. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  the  banks  particularly,  but  large  in- 
fluential gentlemen. 

Mr.  Stevens.  I  have  no  knowledge  of  anything  beyond  the  organi- 
zation in  New  York  City. 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  hear  this  gentleman  from  Maryland  now. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  ALBERT  G.  TOWERS,  STATE  CHAIRMAN  RE- 
PUBLICAN WAYS  AND  MEANS  COMMITTEE,  BALTIMORE,  MD. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  jchairman. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Towers,  you  are  chairman  of  the  ways  and 
means  committee  of  Maryland,  are  you? 
Mr.  Towers.  Yes,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  What  are  you  doing? 
Mr.  Towers.  Almost  nothing. 
The  Chairman.  Why? 

Mr.  Towers.  Well,  we  have  collected  in  Maryland  about  $9,055. 
The  Chairman.  Have  you  an  organization? 
Mr.  Towers.  We  have  a  paper  committee  in  the  whole  State. 
The  Chairman.  In  every  county? 

Mr.  Towers.  We  have  a  man  selected  in  all  but  three  or  four 
counties  who  is  requested  to  raise  funds  in  that  particular  county, 
and  we  have  a  committee  in  Baltimore  City  with  a  request  that  they 
raise  funds  in  Baltimore  City. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  a  quota  for  the  different  counties  ? 

Mr.  Towers.  My  idea  is  to  raise  $25,000  for  the  State. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  your  quota  ? 

Mr.  Towers.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Where  do  you  get  that  ? 

Mr.  Towers.  I  got  that  from  the  secretary,  or  Mr.  William  Boyce 
'  Thompson. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  have  raised  what  ? 
Mr.  Towers.  $9,055. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  expect  to  raise  the  $25,000  ? 
Mr.  Towers.  I  hope  to ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  any  part  of  that  money  come  back  to  the  State 
"  organization? 


2624 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  TowEiiS.  I  do  not  know.  The  checks  are  made  out  in  the  name 
of  the  eastern  treasurer.  It  was  Reeves  Schley  at  first;  now  it  is 
James  G.  Blaine,  jr. 

Senator  Reed.  I  thought  you  might  know  of  some  arrangement. 

Mr.  Towers.  No ;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  the  State  organization  raises  its  own  money? 

Mr.  Towers.  I  am  only  running  the  national  end  of  it,  sir.    I  sa-^ 
in  the  paper  some  time  ago  where  they  w^ould  send  either  $5,000  or  g 
$10,000  to  Maryland.  The  national  treasurer  testified  to  that  when  he 
was  here. 

Senator  Reed.  The  question  I  am  asking  is  this.  So  far  as  you 
know,  the  State  committee  of  Maryland,  the  ordinary  State  com- 
mittee  

Mr.  Towers.  The  ordinary  State  committee  in  Maryland,  I  am 
sure,  is  raising  what  money  it  can  get. 
Senator  Reed.  For  its  own  uses? 
Mr.  Towers.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  nothing  to  do  with  that  ?  ■ 
Mr.  Towers.  No;  just  the  national  end. 
The  Chairman.  That  is  all.    Thank  you  very  much. 
(Thereupon,  at  6.40  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  adjourned,  to 
meet  at  10  o'clock  a.  m.  to-morrow,  Saturday,  September  25,  1920.) 


m  LIBRARY  OF  THE 
DEC  12  1331 

UNIVERSITY  OF  ILLINOIS. 


X 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PKIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGRESS 

SECOND  SESSION 
PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  20 


Printed  for  the  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 


v..  {mm  Of 

U^VBSITV  OF  iLUro'.S 


182774 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICE 
1920 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX,  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM  H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb.  Cleric. 


StJBCOMMITTEE  ON  S.  ReS.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.    ■  JAMES  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


• 

PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


SATURDAY,  SEPTEMBER  25,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 

Washington^  D.  C. 
The  subcommittee  met  at  10.30  o'clock  a.  m.  in  room  426,  Senate 
Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C,  Senator  William  S.  Kenyon 
presiding. 

Present:  Sena;tors  Kenyon  (chairman).  Edge,  and  Reed. 
TESTIMONY  OF  MRS.  ETHEL  M.  PARKS. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  We  are  putting  you  on  a  little  out  of  order,  Mrs. 
Parks,  because  you  have  informed  me  that  you  have  "been  here  a 
couple  of  days  and  want  to  get  away. 

Will  you  please  state  your  name  for  the  record  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Mrs.  Ethel  M.  Parks. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home? 

Mrs.  Parks.  1801  Irving  Street,  Washington,  D.  C. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  have  you  lived  in  Washington? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Four  years. 

The  Chairman.  Where  did  you  live  before  that? 
Mrs.  Parks.  In  New  York  and  Boston. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  your  work  in  New  York  and  Boston  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  was  with  the  Democratic  National  Committee  since 
1916. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  a  married  woman  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  am. 

The  Chairman.  Is  your  husband  living? 
Mrs.  Parks.  He  is. 
The  Chairman.  Where? 

Mrs.  Parks.  AYashington.  I  have  been  married  13  years. 

The  Chairman.  Is  he  connected  with  the  Democratic  committee? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  is. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  his  position? 

Mrs.  Parks.  In  1917  and  1918  he  was  a  special  representative  on 
the  national  committee  and  he  has  had  charge  of  the  names  depart- 
ment, the  securing  of  the  names  of  Democrats  all  over  the  country. 

The  Chairman.  Has  he  traveled  over  the  country  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Some. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  what  salary  he  has  received  ? 
.    Mrs.  Parks.  I  do. 

2625 


2626 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  What  salary  do  you  receive? 

Mrs.  Paeks.  $5,200  a  year. 

The  Chairman.  For  how  many  years? 

Mrs.  Parks.  For  the  past — I  imagine  about  two  years.  I  would 
have  to  look*that  up  from  the  national  committee,  because  I  received 
$80  a  week.  My  salary  has  gone  up  from  time  to  time. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  anything  to  do  with  the  publication 
known  as  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have. 

The  Chairman.  Let  me  ask  you,  first :  You  are  in  Mr.  Jamieson'g 
office  here  now  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  am. 

The  Chair:man.  What  is  your  Avork  there  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  am  Mr.  Jamieson's  assistant  and  secretary.  I  have 
always  done  that. 

The  Chairman.  Since  this  work  started? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Since  the  work  started;  and  in  1916  I  had  charge  oi 
all  the  correspondence. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  hear  the  testimony  of  the  young  man  yes- 
terday as  to  the  ownership  of  the  stock  by  you  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  did. 

The  Chairman.  When  did  you  buy  that  stock  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  May  I  state — I  was  in  it  right  from  the  very  begin- 
ning. May  I  state  the  circumstances  as  to  that? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Heffernan  testified  that  he  saw  me  in  June,  1919, 
which  was  correct.  I  would  like  to  have  it  known  how  he  came  to 
come  in  contact  with  me.  If  you  will  remember,  Homer  Cummings 
was  then  the  chairman  of  the  national  committee.  Homer  Cummings 
and  Mr.  Jamieson  and  Mr.  Hollister  and  Mr.  Cochran  and  other 
officers  of  the  committee  were  at  that  time  on  a  trip  to  the  coast,  a 
speaking  trip,  and  they  did  not  return  until  some  time  late  in  August, 
1919.  So  that  in  their  absence  I  had  charge  of  the  office.  That  was 
why  he  came  in  contact  with  me  there. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say  to  3^011  when  he  came  to  see  you 
about  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  told  me,  why — first  he  Avas  not  going  to  tell  me 
what  he  came  for.  Sometimes  people  don't,  and  later  they  do  when 
they  find  out  I  am  in  charge.  He  said  there  were  a  number  of  boys 
that  Avere  on  the  original  Stars  and  Stripes  Avho  Avanted  to  start  in 
business  over  here  Avhen  they  got  back.  He  Avas  the  first  one  back, 
and  they  had  asked  him  to  see  what  arrangements  he  could  make  to 
do  so.  He  shoAved  me  letters  from  a  number  of  boys,  in  which  they 
stated  that  any  arrangements  that  he  could  make  would  be  satis- 
factory to  them. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  Avant  financial  aid? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  From  Avhom  did  he  come  to  see  you  ?  He  did  not 
come  direct  to  see  you  for  financial  aid  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  did  not  state  that  he  came  to  see  anyone.  He  ap- 
parently did  not  know  any  of  the  members  of  the  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  What  arrangements  did  you  make  about  the  stock? 

Mrs.  Parks.  We  talked  the  matter  over  there.    I  Avas  in  the  same 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2627 


•    frame  of  mind  at  that  time  that  practically  every  man  and  women  in 
the  country  was  in,  that  they  had  an  intense  desire  to  do  anything  they 
could  to  assist  the  soldiers  who  had  been  across  and  had  given  up  their 
positions,  to  become  reestablished  in  business.  It  seemed  to  me  at  that 
!   time  that  I  would  be  doing  a  real  service  if  I  could  assist  those  boys 
j   to  get  back  into  business.    That  was  one  reason  why.    The  other 
I   reason  was  that  it  looked  to  me  like  an  extremely  good  business  ven- 
ture, and  I  had  a  little  money  and  I  thought  I  was  willing  to  go  in  with 
the  boys. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  money  did  you  furnish? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Now^,  let  me  state  here  that  all  of  the  money  that  I 
^   have  put  into  the  Stars  and  Stripes  was  not  put  in  at  any  one  time. 
;   It  has  been  put  in  in  small  amounts  over  a  period  of  a  year  and 
1  three  months,  since  the  day  the  paper  was  started. 
I      The  Chairman.  You  put  in  $48,000? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  put  in  $48,000. 

The  Chairman.  In  a  year  and  three  months  ? 
\      Mrs.  Parks.  Some  of  it  my  own  money,  some  of  it  money  I  have 
I  borrowed,  some  of  it  

t      The  Chx^irman.  How  much  of  it  was  your  own  money  ? 

Senator  Reed.  Let  her  finish. 

The  Chairman.  Borrowed,  she  said, 
j      Senator  Keed.  Tlien  she  started  to  say  something  more.    You  said 
i  you  put  in  some  of  your  own  money,  some  of  it  you  borrowed,  and 
then  you  said  "  some  of  it "  

Mrs.  Parks.  Well,  I  think  I  was  through. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right. 

The  Chairman.  How  much  did  you  put  in  of  your  own  money  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  around  $10,000. 

The  Chairman.  Whom  did  you  borrow  the  balance  from  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  From  personal  friends  of  mine. 
The  Chairman.  Whom? 

Mrs.  Parks.  May  I  state  here  that  the  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee, as  such,  nor  any  individual  member  of  the  national  commit- 
tee, has  ever  contributed  a  dollar  to  the  support  of  the  Stars  and 
Stripes,  nor  has  the  Democratic  national  committee,  as  such,  or  any 
member  of  it,  ever  loaned  a  dollar  to  the  

The  Chairman.  We  are  not  asking  joii  what  they  did  as  such. 

Mrs.  Parks.  There  has  been  an  implication  or  a  direct  statement ; 
in  fact,  Senator  Kenyon,  that  the  Stars  and  Stripes  was  owned  by 
the  Democratic  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  No.  I  asked  the  Avitness  as  to  the  Stars  and 
Stripes  under  the  evidence  that  he  produced,  a  majority  of  the  stock 
being  controlled  by  an  employee  of  the  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee, and  he  stated  yes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  The  statement  appeared  in  the  Star  that  we  have  the 
situation  of  this  paper  being  controlled  by  the  Democratic  national 
►  committee. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  if  you  will  see  the  record,  it  w^as  by  an 
•j  employee  of  the  Democratic  national  committee. 

\  Mrs.  Parks.  It  was  not  so  in  the  paper;  and  there  have  been  so 
j  many  misrepresentations — — 

The  Chairman.  Naturally  people  would  be  suspicious  of  it. 


2628 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mrs.  Paeks.  It  is  a  personal  business.  I  have  everything  I  have 
in  it,  and  I  do  not  want  any  misrepresentations. 

The  Cpiairman.  From  whom  did  you  borrow  the  money  that  you 
put  into  it  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  borrowed  it  from  several  different  people,  personal 
friends  of  mine. 

The  Chairman.  Who  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  think  I  ought  to  answer  that  question. 

The  Chairiman.  I  think  you  ought.  It  is  up  to  the  committee 
whether  you  shall  answer  it  or  not. 

Mrs.  Parks.  There  is  this  about  it:  I  ])resume  that  no  member  of 
the  Democratic  national  or  the  Republican  national  committees  but 
have  outside  business  on  which  they  probably  have  borrowed  money. 
I  do  not  assume  that  it  is  o^yned  b}^  the  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee or  any  other  committee. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  not  asking  you  for  an  argument.  I  am 
asking  you  whom  you  borroAved  the  money  from  that  you  put  into 
the  Stars  and  Stripes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  stated  that  they  are  personal  friends  of  mine, 
and  I  do  not  care  to  answer,  Senator  Kenyon. 

The  Chairman.  You  refuse  to  answer? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  care  to  give  the  names.  I  do  not  care  to 
drag  the  names  of  my  friends  into  a  personal  venture  who  loaned  me 
money.    Some  of  the  money  I  borrowed  from  banks. 

The  Chairman.  What  banks? 

Senator  Reed.  Let  me  make  a  suggestion  about  this. 

There  sometimes  are  business  reasons  why  a  man's  connection  with 
any  institution  or  investment  in  any  institution  ought  not  to  be  told. 
I  make  the  suggestion  that  Mrs.  Parks  be  permitted  to  write  these 
names  on  a  piece  of  paper  and  hand  them  to  the  committee,  and  the 
committee  can  treat  it  as  confidential  unless  the  names  are  the  names 
of  men  Avho  are  so  connected  with  the  Democratic  organization  as  to 
cause  an  implication  that  this  paper  is  controlled  in  that  way.  If 
these  are  purely  business  acquaintances  and  no  political  significance 
attaches  to  them,  I  think  that  

The  Chairman.  Of  course,  if  there  is  no  connection  in  any  way. 
I  did  not  mean  the  Democratic  committee,  but  prominent  Demo- 
crats. 

Senator  Reed.  If  there  are  Democrats  so  close  to  it  as  to  amount 
to  a  control. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  give  any  notes  when  you  borrowed 
money  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  did.  I  gave  notes  for  every  dollar  that  was  bor- 
rowed. 

The  Chx^irman.  AVho  signed  the  notes  Avith  you? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  signed  the  notes  to  the  company  as  president,  and 
the  notes  that  I  borroAA^ed  personall}^  I  signed,  and  they  are  indorsed 
by  my  husband  and  myself. 
'  The  Chairman.  What  company  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  The  Stars  and  Stripes  Publishing  Co.^ 

The  Chairman.  You  signed.  Hoav  many  notes  did  you  giA^e  to 
the  Stars  and  Stripes  Publishing  Co.? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2629 


Mrs.  Parks.  1  could  not  give  you  the  exact  number.  They  are 
for  different  small  amounts  that  I  borroAved  from  time  to  time,  as 
they  needed  it. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  asking  you  about  the  money  that  you  put 
into  the  stock.  Did  you  give  notes  to  the  Stars  and  Stripes  Publish- 
ing Co.  for  the  money  you  put  in  to  buy  the  stock  of  the  Stars  and 
Stripes  Publishing  Co.? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  did  not  put  in  any  money  to  buy  stock  of  the  Stars 
and  Stripes  Publishing  Co. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  OAvn  some  of  the  stock? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do. 

The  Chairman.  You  did  not  put  in  any  mone}^  to  get  it? 
Mrs.  Parks.  No. 

The  Chairman.  How  did  you  get  it  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  That  was  given  to  me,  and  a  certain  issue  of  the  stock 
was  given  to  the  13  or  14  boys.  The  stock  of  the  compan}?-  that  was 
given  to  me  was  for  the  promise  that  I  made  to  finance  the  paper. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  that.  They  issued  stock  and  gave  stock 
to  you? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes;  for  financing  the  paper,  for  the  purpose  of 
financing  the  paper. 

The  Chairman,  You  did  not  pay  any  money? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  put  in  my  own  monej^ 

The  Chairman.  Then  you  put  in  your  mone}'  to  the  carrying  on  of 
the  paper;  is  that  it?  And  you  borrowed  money  to  put  in  to  carr}?- 
on  the  paper? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir ;  to  carry  on  the  paper. 

Senator  Reed.  And  in  that  Avay  paid  for  your  stock  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  In  that  way  I  have  the  stock. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  tlie  stock? 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  quite  different.  That  is  not  the  inference 
that  the  witness  has  given-  that  she  got  the  stock  for  nothing.  She 
got  the  stock  for  agreeing  to  finance  the  paper  apparently  without 
cost.    Is  that  true  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  That  is  true. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  from  time  to  time,  you  advanced  your  own 
money  and  money  you  borrowed  from  friends  simply  to  run  the 
paper? 

Mrs.  Parks.  To  run  the  paper. 

Senator  Edge.  And  in  no  way  paying  for  the  stock.  Is  that  cor- 
rect? 

Mrs.  Parks.  That  is  correct. 

The  Chairman.  So  there  has  been  nothing  paid  on  the  stock  that 
you  own? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No. 

The  Chairman.  You  liold  the  stock  as  a  gratuity  from  the  Stars 
and  Stripes  Publishing  Co.  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  hold  it  for  my  services  in  trying  to  finance  the 
paper. 

The  Chairman.  You  took  that  much  

Mrs.  Parks.  We  took  the  stock  of  the  different  boys  because  they 
were  holders  with  me. 

The  Chairman.  You  took  51  per  cent  of  the  stock  for  your  efforts 
in  financing  the  paper,  in  order  to  help  the  boys? 


2630 


PRESIDENT fAL  (JAxMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir.    And  there  is  a  reason  why  I  took  the  51 
per  cent  of  the  stock. 

The  Chairman.  To  control  itj  was  it  not  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir ;  to  control  it ;  and  that  is  the  reason  why  I 
wished  to  control  it,  because  when  I  went  into  this  with  Mr.  Heffer- 
nan  I  stated  to  him  that  the  only  reason  that  I  Avould  go  into  it 
with  him  was  on  condition  that  it  should  not,  in  any  way,  shape,  or 
manner,  be  handled  as  a  political  paper,  because  I  had  business  sense 
enough  to  know  that  if  it  were  a  partisan  political  paper  it  would 
never  succeed;  and  he  agreed  with  me,  and  so  did  all  of  the  boys.  . 
There  has  not  been  any  question  as  to  that. 

The  Chairman.  What  books  will  show  the  amount  of  money  that 
you  have  put  into  this  paper  for  the  running  of  it  ?  That  is  all  you 
claim  you  have  done. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  notes — memoranda. 

riie  Chairman.  So  they  are  notes:  not  books  of  the  company? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Ihere  are  books  of  the  company,  and  I  am  ready  to 
furnish  them. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  bookkeeper? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Hardy  Meakin. 

Senator  Edge.  It  seems  to  me  the  Avhole  interest  in  this  discussion, 
as  far  as  our  committee  in  concerned,  revolves  itself  around  who  has 
advanced  money  to  carry  on  this  publication.  I  do  not  see  that 
there  is  anything  else  in  the  whole  case.  If  the  witness  refuses  to 
answer,  we  can  simpl}^  take  our  own  inferences. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  notes  have  you  given  to  borrow  money 
on  this  paper  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  To  borrow  money? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  Personally,  you  mean? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mrs.  Paijks.  I  should  sa}^  that — I  can  not  make  this  as  an  absolute 
statement  without  looking  it  up,  but  two  or  three. 
The  Chairman.  Two  or  three  notes? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  What  were  the  amounts  of  the  notes? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Different  amounts:  usually  $1,000,  some  of  $2,500; 
one  or  two  of  $5,000— — 

The  Chairman.  That  would  make  more  than  three  notes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  mean  that  is  the  amount  that  the  money  was  bor- 
rowed in. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  asking  you  how  many  notes  you  have  given 
to  borrow  money  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  stated  that  I  would  have  to  look  that  up.  I  do 
not  know. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  it  is  6  or  20  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No  ;  it  is  not  six. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  as  many  as  four  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  imagine  it  was  two  or  three. 

The  Chairman.  Some  of  the  sum  of  $5,000  ? 

Mrs,  Parks.  One  is  in  the  sum  of  $5,000. 

The  Chairman.  Who  signed  that  note  with  you? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Parks. 

The  Chairiman.  Have  you  any  property  of  your  own? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2631 


Mrs.  Parks.  Well,  you  mean,  when  you  say  "  my  own,"  you  mean 
my  husband  and  I  ? 

The  Chairman,  i^eal  estate  or  personal  property  of  your  own. 
Mrs.  Parks.  In  my  ow^n  name? 


Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  some  jointly  in  the  name  of  Mr.  Parks. 
The  Chairman.  What  property? 

Mrs.  Parks.  The  house  we  live  in,  valued  at  about  $25,000. 
The  Chairman.  Anything  else? 
Mrs.  Parks.  We  have  some  stocks. 

The  Chairman.  You  can  go  to  the  bank  and  borrow  sums  as  you 
want  them? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  borrowed  it  at  that  time  and  I  gave  my  Liberty 
bonds  as  security. 

The  Chairman.  You  borrowed  from  the  banks  this  $5,000? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  bank? 

Mrs.  Parks.  The  Commercial  National  Bank  of  Washington. 
The  Chairman.  Did  an3^one  else  sign  the  note  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Parks. 

The  Chairman.  You  and  Mr.  Parks  signed  a  note  to  the  Com- 
mercial National  Bank  of  AVashing-ton  for  $5,000.  What  was  the 
date  of  the  note? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  can  not  tell  you  the  date  exactly.  It  was  some  time 
in  June ;  I  should  say  in  the  early  part  of  June. 

The  Chairman.  Has  that  note  ever  been  paid  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir ;  it  has  been  renewed. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  two  sign  it  again  when  it  was  renewed? 
Did  you  sign  the  renewal  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chair:man.  Have  you  any  arrangement  with  Mr.  Jam.ieson 
to  take  care  of  that  note  out  of  Democratic  funds  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir.  Mr.  Jamieson  does  not  know  that  I  bor- 
rowed that  money,  so  far  as  I  know. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  know  that  you  Avere  interested  in  the  Stars 
and  Stripes? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  talk  it  over  with  him  some? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  advance  any  money? 
Mrs.  Parks.  He  advanced  some;  yes. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  did  he  advance? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Four  thousand  dollars. 

The  Chairman.  He  is  the  financial  treasurer  of  the  Democratic 
national  committee  

Mrs.  Parks.  Let  me  say  that  was  personal  to  me. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  that? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  advanced  it  personally  to  me. 
;     The  Chairman.  Was  there  any  note  given  to  him  for  it? 
'    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  give  a  note  to  him  for  it  ? 
1^    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  was  the  date  of  the  note? 


2632 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mrs.  Parks.  I  will  have  to  look  those  things  up.  I  can  not  carry- 
dates  in  my  mind. 

The  Chairman.  When  is  that  note  due  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  knoAv  that.  Some  time  in  the  fall  or  spring. 
The  Chairman.  Has  it  heen  renewed? 
Mrs.  Parks.  It  has  not  become  due. 
The  Chairman.  It  is  not  due? 
Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  really  expect  to  pay  that  note  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  expect  to  pay  every  note  I  have  given.  I  have  built 
my  business  reputation  on  my  word,  and  I  believe  I  have  always 
taken  care  of  my  obligations. 

The  Chairman.  Has  Mr.  Jamieson  advanced  anv  more  money  than 
the  $4,000? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  any  of  the  other  gentlemen  connected  with 
the  Democratic  national  organization  in  any  way  advanced  any 
money  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Have  any  prominent  Democrats  advanced  any 
money  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  know  what  you  call  prominent. 

The  Chairman.  Well,  those  that  are  not  prominent,  then.  It  is 
hard  to  tell  

Mrs.  Parks.  Most  all  of  my  friends  are  Democrats. 

The  Chairman.  Who  are  the  others  that  have  advanced  money 
besides  Mr.  Jamieson? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  care  to  state. 

The  Chairman.  Why  do  you  object  to  stating  their  names,  when 
you  do  not  object  to  stating  Mr.  Jamieson's  name? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Because  these  people  did  this  as  a  personal  favor 
to  me. 

The  Chairman.  They  were  Democrats,  all  of  them,  were  the3\  who 
advanced  money? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir;  I  have  very  few  friends  who  are  Kepubli- 
cans,  I  presume. 

The  Chairman.  This  is  a  nonpartisan  paper,  the  Stars  and 
Stripes  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely.  Some  of  the  men  in  it  are  Republicans 
and  some  are  Democrats. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.  Jones  was  on  the  stand  yesterda}?-  and  claimed 
that  it  was  entirely  nonpartisan. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  that  an  examination  of  the  paper  will  prove 
that. 

The  CiiAiRiMAN.  Was  Mr.  Jones  himself  a  delegate  to  tlie  national 
convention  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  he  was. 

The  Chx\irman.  Were  any  of  the  others  on  the  paper  delegates  to 
that  convention  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir.  Mr.  Jones  is  an  Oregon  man  and  was  put 
on  by  the  Oregon  delegation,  and  we  had  nothing  whatever  to  do 
with  that. 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2633 


The  Chairmax.  I  ask  you  again  to  give  the  names  of  the  men,  who 
you  say  are  Democrats,  who  have  advanced  you  money  for  the  carry- 
ing on  of  this  paper. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  that  that  is  a  personal  matter,  and  I  do  not 
think,  in  view^  of  the  attacks  that  have  been  made,  that  I  ought  to 
have  to  do  it. 

The  Chairman.  Then  let  us  get  it  clearly,    lou  refuse  to  do  it? 

Senator  Edge.  The  attacks  have  apparently  been  made  from  the 
other  side,  as  near  as  I  can  recall. 

The  Chairman.  You  refuse,  then,  Mrs.  Parks,  to  answer  the 
question  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  prefer  not  to. 

The  Chairman.  Do  3^ou  refuse  to  answer  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  care  to  state. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  care  to  say  Avhether  you  refuse  to 
answer  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  say,  I  do  not  care  to  state. 

The  Chairman.  'So  that  you  do  refuse  to  answer  that  question? 
Mrs.  Parks.  You  can  put  it  that  way. 

The  Chairmax.  How  many  of  these  Democrats  have  advanced 
money  for  carrying  on  the  paper? 
M^'s.  Parks.  You  mean,  in  all? 
The  Chairman.  Yes. 
Mrs.  Parks.  Three. 
The  Chairman.  Where  do  they  live? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Senator  Kenyon,'  I  think  this  is  a  transaction  in  a 

personal  business  of  my  own.   I  went  into  this  

The  Chairman.  You  can  refuse  to  answer. 

Mrs.  Parks.  It  does  not  seem  to  me,  when  I  went  into  this  thing — 
probably  I  would  not  have  gone  into  it  so  bravely  if  I  had  realized 
that  there  would  be  any  trouble  or  the  worry  I  have  had  over  it.  I 
consulted  a  lawyer  as  to  whether  or  not  my  connection  with  the 
national  committee  would  hurt  me.  He  thought  it  would,  and 
advised  me  along  in  the  fall  that  it  probably  would  hurt.  In  the 
latter  part  of  February  or  the  first  of  March  I  handed  my  written 
resignation  to  Mr.  Jamieson,  which  I  presume  he  has  now. 

The  Chairman.  Resignation  as  what? 

Mrs.  Parks.  As  secretary  and  as  an  employee  of  the  Democratic 
national  committee.  Mr.  Jamieson  did  not  want  to  accept  it  and 
asked  me  if  I  would  not  stay  until  after  the  campaign  was  over.  He 
knew  my  reasons  for  Avanting  to  get  out,  because  I  wanted  to  give 
my  time  to  the  paper  because  I  had  all  my  money  in  it;  and  I  think 
it  is  a  persecution  to  ask  me  any  question  about  it  when  there  is  no 
connection  Avith  the  campaign  funds  or  Avith  the  funds  of  the  Demo- 

!  cratic  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  I  am  not  going  to  argue  it  AA^ith  you.  It  is  a  mat- 
ter of  record  Avhether  there  is  any  connection  or  not.   People  haA^e  to 

.  judge  from  the  record.  I  am  not  going  to  keep  at  you  if  you  refuse 
to  answer  who  these  men  are. 

;     Mrs.  Parks.  There  haA^e  been  numerous  implications  made  that 
I  the  paper  is  owned  by  the  national  committee.    There  haA^e  been 
L  statements  made  in  evidence  of  the  fact  that  simply  because  I  am  con- 
nected Avith  the  national  committee — tliey  are  Avholly  untrue.  There 


2634 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


have  been  persecutions  from,  I  may  say,  Republicans,  where  they 
have  come  and  threatened  that  if  I  did  not  give  up  the  paper  or  if 
the  paper  was  not  put  out  of  business  they  would  put  it  out  of  busi- 
ness. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  get  at  that.  What  Republicans  have  threat- 
ened that? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Richard  Waldo. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  he? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  is  a  man  that  was  formerly  on  the  New  York  Trib- 
une and,  I  think,  on  the  New  York  Sun,  and  he  is  the  man  whose 
name  was  given  here  yesterday. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  threaten  that  to  you  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  did. 

The  Chairman.  What  did  he  say  to  you  about  it  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Waldo  came  down  here  one  Sunday  morning  and 
asked  for  a  conference  with  me.  I  Avent  down  to  the  office,  and  Mr. 
Waldo  began — I  presume  because  I  was  a  woman — in  a  threatening 
way,  stating  that  the  paper  could  not  possibly  run,  that  it  should 
be  put  out  of  business :  and  1  stated  to  Mr.  Waldo  that  if  he  had  <:ome 
there  to  make  threats  it  did  not  frighten  me,  and  that  we  would  ter- 
minate our  conference  at  once.  Then  Mr.  Waldo  stated  that  he  did 
not  intend  that.  He  said  he  was  foot-loose,  that  he  had  coimections^ 
and  gave  me  reasons  Avhy  he  was  disconnected  with  various  news- 
papers  

The  Chairman.  Whom  did  he  claim  to  represent  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Himself  and  some  other  interests. 
The  Chairman.  What  other  interests? 

Mrs.  Parks.  He  did  not  say.  He  said  that  he  had  twenty-five  or 
thirty  thousand  dollars  that  he  wanted  to  invest  in  the  Stars  and 
Stripes ;  that  he  knew  its  possibilities  and  that  he  knew  that  it  could 
be  made  a  success;  that  he  would  like  to  take  a  sort  of  managerial 
position ;  that  I  could  never  get  any  advertising  from  the  Big  Four. 
That  evidently  is  the  designation  of* the  four  big  agencies;  I  do  not 
know. 

The  Chairman.  What  are  they? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  knoAv.  They  are  advertising  agencies  that 
are  in  the  trade  called  the  Big  Four.  He  said  that  he  Avas  Aery 
friendly  Avith  all  of  the  Big  Four,  and  if  he  Avere  connected  Avith  the 
paper  he  could  get  it ;  that  I  could  ncA^er  get  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  refused  to  let  him  have  anything  to  do  with 
the  paper? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  did.  His  excuse  for  coming  was  not  only  that  he 
wanted  to  be  connected  with  the  paper,  but  he  stated — he  talked  for 
three  hours,  and  among  the  things  he  stated  Avas  this,  that  it  would 
be  a  good  thing  for  the  paper  if  we  Avould  take  a  stand  against  bonus 
legislation,  if  we  would  come  out  in  full  for  extreme  generosity  to 
the  wounded  and  disabled  soldiers. 

Senator  Reed.  And  repudiate  the  bonus  plan? 

Mrs.  Parks.  And  repudiate  the  bonus  plan.  We  do  not  come 
out  for  anything  in  particular,  as  I  understand  it.  The  paper  is  the 
medium  of  the  boys,  and  we  give  the  boys'  opinions  as  Avritten  to  us 
on  a  poll  that  we  have  taken  of  them,  and  we  have  their  own  written 
opinions  of  the  four  or  five  different  classes  of  legislation  that  are 
supposed  to  be  for  the  benefit  of  tlie  soldiers. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2635 


The  Chairman.  How  many  stockholders  have  you  in  the  paper? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  about  16. 

The  Chairman.  Is  the  list  filed  anywhere,  under  the  law? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  think  only  the  stockholders  owning  over  1  per  cent. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  filed,  is  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes;  I  think  so.  I  jotted  down  a  number  of  the  boys 
that  I  had  in  mind.    I  think  I  have  it  here  somewhere. 

The  Chairman.  If  you  jotted  down  the  names  of  these  gentlemen 
that  advanced  money  it  would  be  more  interesting. 

Mrs.  Parks.  No  ;  I  have  not.  Here  are  11.  I  could  not  remember 
the  names  of  the  others.  I  have  not  had  time  to  look  it  up.  These 
boys  Avere  on  the  original  staff  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes.  The  infer- 
ence was  made  yesterday  that  there  was  no  one  connected  with  it  ex- 
cept some  woman  who  had  nothing  to  do  with  the  war.  I  had  some 
little  to  do  with  it. 

Do  you  want  these  names  ? 

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  care  to  follow  the  inquiry  unless  you  are 
willing  to  give  us  all  the  information,  which  includes  the  names  of 
those  gentlemen  who  advanced  money.   That  is  all  I  care  to  ask. 

Mrs.  Parks.  Did  you  wish  to  inquire  on  the  national  committee 
business  ? 

The  Chairman.  What  about  it  ?  < 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  know ;  but  you  called  me  on  that  also. 
The  Chairman.  We  want  to  find  out  the  sources  contributing  to 
the  Stars  and  Stripes.  You  refused  to  give  it;  therefore,  as  far  as 
I  am  concerned,  I  do  not  care  to  ask  you  anything  further.  Whether 
you  answer  the  question  or  not  will  have  to  be  determined  by  the 
committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Mrs.  Parks,  you  borrowed  $5,000  from  a  bank  and 
you  have  given  its  name.  ♦  You  borrowed  $4,000  from  Mr.  J amieson 
and  you  have  given  his  name.  You  put  in  $10,000  of  your  own  money. 
That  would  make  a  total  of  $19,000.  It  was  testified  yesterday  that 
you  had  put  in  $48,000,  all  told.  Is  that  right  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  It  is  about  that. 

Senator  Eeed.  Approximately  that? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Approximately  that. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  there  is,  then,  $27,000  or  $28,000  that  you 
,  have  borrowed  from  other  sources  than  those  named  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 
^    Senator  Reed.  Was  any  part  of  that  money  loaned  or  advanced 
to  you  by  the  National  Democratic  Committee? 
I    Mrs.  Parks.  Not  a  dollar. 

^    Senator  Reed.  Was  any  part  of  it  advanced  to  you  by  any  Demo- 
^cratic  committee  or  Democratic  organization? 
J    Mrs.  Parks.  Not  a  dollar. 

j    Senator  Reed.  Was  any  part  of  it  advanced  to  you  or  loaned  to 
you  by  any  member  of  the  national  Democratic  committee? 
,    Mrs.  Parks.  Not  a  dollar. 

s  Senator  Reed.  Did  you  borrow  this  money  merely  as  a  commercial 
'  loan  or  business  transaction  from  the  parties  from  whom  you  bor- 
>.  rowed  it  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely ;  just  the  same  as  I  have  borrowed  money 
[^in  previous  years  for  different  lines  of  business. 


2636 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Is  your  reason  for  declining  to  answer  merely  that 
you  do  not  want  to  make  public  the  names  of  men  or  people  who 
have  loaned  you  the  money  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely ;  because  it  was  wholly  a  personal  matter. 
They  came  into  it  and  gave  me  the  money  because  I  wanted  it  per- 
sonally. 

Senator  Reed.  Would  you  object  to  furnishing  the  chairman  of 
the  committee  those  names,  provided  they  are  treated  as  confidential, 
with  the  understanding,  of  course,  that  if  he  finds  they  have  political 
significance  he  should  use  them? 

Mrs.  Parks.  You  mean  political  significance?  I  do  not  under- 
stand you. 

Senator  Reed.  Would  you  object  to  furnishing  the  names  to  the 
chairman  of  the  committee  to  be  treated  as  confidential  unless  he  finds 
that  these  names  indicate  that  the  paper  is  under  political  control  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  wonder  if  I  get  you  just  right.  Would  you  mind 
repeating  that  again? 

Senator  Reed.  My  suggestion  is  that  you  furnish  Senator  Kenyon 
these  names  with  the  understanding  that  he  will  not  make  them  public 
unless,  when  you  furnish  them,  it  appears  that  they  have  a  political 
significance ;  that  is,  that  they  mean  a  political  control,  by  the  Demo- 
cratic Party  or  Democratic  agencies,  of  this  paper. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  prefer  not  to. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  say  that  as  far  as  I  am  concerned  I  do  not 
want  them  in  any  confidential  way.  We  have  had  nothing  confiden- 
tial yet  that  I  know  of. 

Mrs.  Parks.  There  is  no  possible  control;  there  never  has  been  a 
suggestion  by  anybody  outside  of  myself  as  to  the  control  of  the 
paper,  and  my  chief  object  was  to  protect  my  own  money  

The  Chairman.  I  do  not  see  any  use  ih  taking  any  more  time. 
The  witness  refuses  to  give  the  information. 

Senator  Reed.  I  was  not  taking  much  time.  I  thought  perhaps 
I  could  get  the  names  in  that  way. 

The  Chairman.  You  evidently  can  not  get  them;  and  the  public 
can  judge. 

Senator.  Reed.  There  is  ahvays  a  chance  that  there  may  be  personal 
reasons  why  a  business  transaction  should  not  be  made  public.  I 
have  examined  books  with  that  understanding,  always  reserving  the 
right,  if  the  book  should  prove  some  particular  fact  that  was  at  issue^ 
that  the  information  might  be  used. 

Now,  Mrs.  Parks,  has  this  publication — the  Stars  and  Stripes — ta 
your  knowledge,  ever  made  any  attacks  upon  the  Republican  Party? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  it  in  any  way,  to  your  knowledge,  undertaken 
to  defend  or  benefit  the  Democratic  Party  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir.  I  understand — this  is  only  an  understand- 
ing; it  was  not  stated  to  me — I  understand  that  the  treasurer  of  the 
Democratic  National  Committee  has  made  the  statement  that  he 
considered  it  unfriendly  to  the  Democratic  administration  or  the 
Democratic  Party. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  the  reason  they  are  giving  you  those  half- 
page  advertisements  we  saw  yesterday? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir;  when  we  received  it  from  the  Democratic 
national  committee  we  immediately  wired  our  Chicago  representatives 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGls^  EXPEIvTSES.  2637 

to  say  to  the  Republicans  that  we  had  it  and  ask  them  if  thev  wished 
the  same  space.  • 

yourself f^^^^"^^'  "^^  ^^^^  ^^^^^"^  ^^^^^  ^^^^  ^"'^^^  ^^i^^^" 

Mrs.  Parks.  What  is  it? 

The  Chairman  Do  you  spend  any  time  in  work  on  this  paper? 
-  Mrs.  Parks.  What  time  I  can  give  outside  of  my  office  hours. 

.''''^  ^'"^V^  entirely  taken  up  with  the  national 
committee  work,  is  it  not,  as  Mr.  Jamieson's  secretary « 
Mrs.  Parks.  Yes;  a  great  deal  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  So  that  you  spend  no  time  on  this  paper « 
:  my^'iSe^^^^^^^^^^^  '  '''''''  ''''  ^^^^^  ^^on,  because 

^  The  Chairman.  You  say  you  put  $10,000  in  it.  Did  you  put  that 
m  in  one  sum  ?  j  r 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 
tirLY  ^^^'^^  ^^^g^s^  sum  you  ever  put  into  it  at  one 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  believe,  $2,500.  • 

The  Chairman.  Was  that  your  own  money « 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes.  ' 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  put  that  in  by  check  to  somebody 

Mrs.  Parks.  A  check  to  somebody? 
r .  The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Was  it  in  cash  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Cash. 

The  Chairman.  Bills? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Bills. 

a}^^  Chairman.  To  whom  did  you  give  the  bills  ^ 
and  Striptr^'     '^^P''^'*^'^         ^^'^  ^^'^^^      the  credit  of  the  Stars 
The  Chairman.  What  bank? 
Mrs.  Parks.  The  District  National  Bank. 
The  Chairman.  What  was  the  date  of  that? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Different  dates. 

The  Chairman.  I  asked  you  as  to  one  time,  and  you  said  $2,500. 
.     Mrs.  Tarks.  Ion  asked  me  at  any  one  time  what  was  the  amount. 
K  'i  f  i  asked  you  the  largest  amount  you  had  ever  con- 

t  tributed  at  one  time. 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  say  I  think  it  was  $2,500. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  I  asked  you  whether  you  gave  a  check 
tor  It,  and  you  sad  no  ;  but,  as  I  understand  you  now,  you  meant  by 
.that  you  deposited  the  money  in  bills  in  a  bank. 
:    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir;  and  the  deposit  book  will  show. 

\    1      V^^^^^^^N-  That  you  deposited  it  to  the  credit  of  the  Stars 
^and  htripes? 

^    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

i    The  Chairman.  Just  when  was  that? 

'  oook^^*  ^  ^^^^^  ^^^^     ^^^^  ^t       ^^t^s  ^^^^  get  the  deposit 

I  The  Chairman.  Where  did  you  get  that  $2,500  that  you  deposited 
iit  that  time? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Where  did  I  get  it  ? 


2638 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Yes. 

Mrs.  Parks.  Money  we  had  saved. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  been  saving  it  right  along  and  had 
it  in  the  house  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Where  did  you  have  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  In  my  safety- deposit  box.  We  have  been  married 
for  13  years,  and  I  have  been  in  business  a  great  portion  of  that 
time. 

The  Chairman.  That  does  not  represent  the  savings  of  13  years, 
does  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  It  represents  the  result  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  How  long  had  you  been  saving  that  $2,500  that 
you  had  in  the  safety-deposit  box? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  can  not  state. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  you  not  deposit  it  in  the  bank  instead  of 
having  it  in  the  safety-deposit  box? 

Mrs.  Parks.  One  of  the  reasons  was  that  during  the  time  of  the 
war  there  was  a  very  strong  statement  made  that  the  banks  would 
withhold  money,  and  we  had  what  we  could  in  cash  and  kept  it  that 
way. 

The  Chairman.  In  the  safety-deposit  box? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  And  you  finally,  being  reassured  about  it,  de- 
posited it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  deposited  it  in  the  Stars  and  Stripes. 
The  Chairman.  What  have  you  in  the  Stars  and  Stripes  to  show 
the  advancement  of  the  money  to  them  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Notes. 

The  Chairman.  When  was  the  note  given  with  reference  to  the 
time  you  made  the  deposit  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  At  the  same  time. 
The  Chairman.  Was  that  note  ever  paid  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  By  whom  is  that  note  signed  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  It  is  signed  by  Mr.  Heffernan  as  secretary-treasurer. 
The  Chairman.  Then  you  expect  that  money  back? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  certainly  do,  when  the  paper  is  on  its  feet. 
The  Chairman.  So  that  is  not  reallv  an  investment  in  the  paper, 
is  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  the  way  all  the  other  advancements  were 
made  to  the  paper,  you  taking  notes  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  notes. 

The  Chairman.  For  everything  you  have  advanced  them,  so  that 
you  expect  the  money  all  back  from  the  paper  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Some  time. 

The  Chairman.  About  when  do  you  expect  it :  do  you  know  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  When  the  paper  is  able  to  pay  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  tell  us,  now,  that  you  really  expect  those  notes 
to  be  paid  by  that  paper.  Have  you  not  an  understanding  that  they 
are  to  be  paid  by  some  one  else  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2639 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  not,  Senator  Kenyon.  That  is  a' wrong  infer- 
ence. I  have  no  such  understanding,  and  I  expect  to  be  paid  by  the 
paper. 

The  Chair3ian.  By  the  paper  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely— if  they  are  ever  paid. 
The  Chairman.  So  the  fact  is  that  vou  have  invested  nothins:  in 
the  paper? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  advanced  money. 

The  Chairman.  The  money  that  vou  speak  of  as  advancing  vou 
^  have  notes  for  to  be  paid  back  to  you  ? 
i    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  •  What  pays  for  the  stock  vou  have  ?  The  maioritv 
^ot  the  stock— how  is  that  to  be  paid  for  ?  ' 

I  Mrs.  P ARKS.  The  stock  was  issued  to  me  the  same  as  stock  is  issued 
-jm  any  company,  for  the  promised  financing  of  the  paper. 

The  Chairman.  So  the  stock  is  issued  to  you  for  your  promise  to 

linance  the  paper,  and  m  doing  that  vou  give  the  paper  money  and 

take  notes  back  for  the  money  ? 
k    Mrs.  Parks.  Yes. 

j  ^he  Chairman.  You  get  the  stock  merely,  then,  for  loaning  your 
jcredit  to  the  paper ;  is  that  it  ?  ^  ^ 

\    Mrs.  Parks.  No  ;  not  for  loaning  my  credit. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  going  to  pay  a  cent  for  the  stock? 

Mrs  Parks.  I  do  not  know.  I  may  take  my  notes  out  in  the  stock. 
1  may  have  to  do  that. 

The  Chairman.  Who  signed  the  notes  ? 
:   Mrs.  Parks.  Mr.  Heffernan,  secretary-treasurer? 

The  Chairman.  Anyone  else? 
.    Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  know. 
[    The  Chairman.  Have  you  these  notes  here? 
!    Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Where  are  the  notes? 

Mrs.  Parks.  In  my  possession. 
•   The  Chairman.  At  the  Democratic  committee? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  paper  has  not  taken,  you  say,  any  stand 
politically  ?  ■  -  .  ^  J 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 
i   Senator  Reed.  It  has  been  devoted  to  the  soldiers  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Yes,  sir. 
^    Senator  Reed.  It  has  had  a  good  deal  to  say  about  the  League  of 
Nations,  has  it  not? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  know  that  it  has,  unless  it  is  in  personal 

'    Senator  Reed.  Has  it  not  been  a  pretty  strong  advocate  of  the 
i  League  of  Nations? 

F    Mrs.  Parks.  I  do  not  think  so.  Senator  Reed? 
[    Senator  Reed.  I  may  be  in  error.   Did  you  get  any  of  this  money 
that  you  borrowed,  and  which  you  have  not  told  us  about,  from  the 
I  League  to  Enforce  Peace  or  from  any  of  its  members? 
I    Mrs.  Parks.  I  have  never  gotten  a  dollar  of  it  from  the  League  to 
Lti-ntorce  Peace,  and  I  do  not  know  who  its  members  are. 

1  182774— 20— PT  20  2 


2640 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Have  you  <>otten  it  from  anybody  that  you  have 
understood  Avas  prominent  in  that  organization? 

Mrs,  Parks.  No.  sir.  There  has  been  no  political  influence  of  any 
sort  ever  connected  Avith  the  paper  at  any  time,  and  there  is  none 
to-day. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  loans,  then,  were  purely  personal  loans^ 
Avithout  any  kind  of  political  strings  or  any  other  kind  of  control? 
Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  expect  to  sever  your  connection  Avith  the 
national  committee  Avhen  the  campaign  is  oA^er? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  do. 

Senator  Reed.  You  said  you  had  had  somethiAg  to  do  Avith  the 
Avar.   What  Avas  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  By  that  I  meant  I  had  done  AA^hat  everybody  else  has 
done,  in  my  small  Avay  to  assist. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  interest  in  establishing  this  paper  Avas  to 
benefit  the  former  service  men,  and  you  also  thought  it  a  good  busi- 
ness venture  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  did ;  and  I  still  think  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  Mr.  Jamieson  ever  exercised  any  control  OA^er 
it,  or  tried  to? 

Mrs.  Parks.  Absolutely  none. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  giA^e  Mr.  Jamieson  any  collateral  or  se- 
curity for  this  $4,000,  or  did  you  just  borroAv  it  on  your  personal 
note? 

^  Mrs.  Parks.  On  my  personal  note. 

Senator  Reed.  You  expect  to  pay  it  back  to  him  ? 
Mrs.  Parks.  I  do. 

Senator  Reed.  You  [ire  pretty  sure,  noAV,  that  this  paper  has 
never  taken  any  sides  politically  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  I  am  absolutely  sure  of  it:  and  the  paper  is  there  to 
shoAV  for  itself. 

Senator  Reed.  So  if  it  has  been  serving  the  Democratic  Party  it 
has  not  done  much  for  it? 

Mrs.  Parks.  It  has  not  been  serving  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  say  assuming  that.  Starting  Avith  that  assump- 
tion, that  it  Avas  created  by  the  Democratic  Party  or  as  a  Democratic 
influence,  it  has  utterly  failed  to  function  in  that  Avay  ? 

Mrs.  Parks.  If  that  Avas  the  purpose,  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  borroAv  any  money  from  Mr.  Cochran, 
of  the  Democratic  national  committee? 
Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  None  at  all? 

Mrs.  Parks.  No,  sir.  I  stated  none  of  the  officers — well,  he  is  not 
an  officer. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all. 
(Witness  excused.) 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2641 


TESTIMONY  OF  MISS  BESSIE  V.  HANDY  AND  MR.  GUY  MASON. 

(The  Avitnesses  were  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairmax.  Let  me  put  into  the  record,  before  I  get  to  your 
1  testimony,  some  telegrams  that  we  have  received  about  witnesses! 
I    With  relation  to  the  attempt  to  secure  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  I  desire 
'to  place  in  the  record  a  telegram  from  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr.,  to 
David  S.  Barry,  as  follows  : 

i  A737C  37  XL 

Dayton,  Ohio,  ^eijtemher  25,  1920. 

^  Davis  S.  Baery, 

i       Seargent  at  Anns.  United  States  Senate,  Wasliignton,  J).  C: 

!    Telegram  received  after  my  talk  with  yoii  on  phone.    Col.  H.  E.  Talbott,  who 

was  president  of  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  is  on  hunting  trip  in  North 
jDakota.    Kindly  wire  if  you  wish  me  to  do  anything  further. 
I  H.  E.  Talbott,  Jr. 

;  That  makes  it  impossible  to  have  Mr.  Talbott  here  to<Uy,  at  least. 
^  I  place  in  the  record  also  a  telegram  from  Mr.  Hans  Rieg,  who 
[was  notified  to  be  present.    The  telegram  is  as  follows  : 

1  Chicago,  Scptemher  23. 

[David  S.  Barry, 

Sergeant  at  Arms.  United  States  Senate,  Wasttingto)!,  I).  C: 
Your  wire  September  22  addressed  to  me  care  of  Rosen])aum  Grain  Corpora- 
-  tion  by  Postal  Telegraph  received.   Will  accept  service  of  subpnena  ;  impossible 
to  reach  Washington  before  Saturday  night;  will  be  pleased  to  offer  satisfac- 
'itory  explanation  for  delay. 

i  Hans  Rieg. 

As  Mr.  Ames's  name  was  mentioned  yesterday,  one  of  the  Assist-' 
ant  Attorneys  Oeneral,  by  some  one  in  evidence,  !  think  his  tele^rram 
ishould  go  into  the  record.   It  is  as  follows : 

Ohlahoma  CrTY,  Okla..  Sei,ieniher  25,  1920. 

ilHon.  William  S.  Kexyox, 

:       Chairman  Senate  Committee,  Washington,  D.  C: 

J  The  afternoon  papers  report  testimony  before  your  connnittee  that  I  attended 
(  Democratic  convention  while  assistant  to  the  Attorney  General,  and  inference 
f  may  be  di-awn  that  I  traveled  at  (Tovernment  expense.  I  did  attend  the  conven- 
jtion  as  delegate  from  Oklahoma  and  had  perfect  right  to  do  so.  I  desire  to 
Emphatically  state  that  I  paid  every  cent  of  the  expense  of  mj  trip. 

C.  B.  Ames. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  going  to  try  to  shorten  this  examination  so  as 
;to  let  both  of  you  interesting  people  away.  I  want  to  ask  a  few 
questions  by  way  of  preliminary.  Then  I  am  going  to  ask  you  if 
^voii  will  not  give  me  a  transcript  of  these  books,  showing  all  sub- 
jScriptions  from  $250  up. 

Mr.  Mason.  You  may  keep  those  books  here  indefinitely,  if  you 
[  want  them. 

I[  Senator  Reed.  We  are  going  to  adjourn  to-dav,  and  I  am  willing 
Hto  leave  it  to  you  or  this  lady. 

[    Mr.  Mason.  I  am  here  in  the  city.    Miss  Handv  will  take  them 
''back  to  New  York. 

i    Senator  Reed.  It  will  not  be  a  great  task,  Avill  it  ? 

Miss  Handy.  You  say,  $250  and  up  ^ 
I    Senator  Reed.  Yes.    Let  us  say  $200,  because  there  are  a  good 
['naany  of  that  kind. 

I      irst.  I  want  to  get  your  name  and  place  of  residence,  sir. 


2642 


pPvp:sil)EXTIal  (^AiMPaign  expenses. 


Mr.  Mason.  Cniy  Mason,  attorney  at  law,  Washington,  D.  C. 

Senator  Heed.  Are  you  following  your  profession  now,  or  devoting 
your  time  to  the  League  to  P^nf orce  Peace  ?  •    .  r 

Mr.  Mason.  I  am  following  my  profession  exclusively.  L  am  con- 
tributing my  service  to  the  league  as  they  need  it.  I  Avas  formerly  a 
newspaper  man  for  about  15  years,  serving  about  12  of  it  here  on 
the  New  York  World,  the  St.  Louis  Post-Dispatch,  St.  Louis  Globe- 
Democrat,  Kansas  Oity  Star,  Cleveland  Plain  Dealer,  Baltimore 
Sun,  New  York  Sun,  Washington  Post— 

Senator  Keed.  AVhat  is  your  connection  with  the  League  to  Ln- 
force  l^eace  i 

Mr.  Mason,  i'urely  as  a  follower  of  the  league.  I  call  myself  a 
leaguer. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  have  some  

Mr.  Mason.  Financial  arrangements^    Al)solutely  none. 
Senator  Reed.  No  ;  1  do  not  mean  that.    What  is  your  position  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  Washington  representative. 

Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  become  connected  with  the  League  to 
Enforce  Peace  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  First,  Senator,  in  1916. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  help  in  the  preliminary  organization  i 
Mr.  Mason.  I  attended  the  convention  held  at  the  Belasco  Theater 
and  the  meetings  held  at  the  AVillard  Hotel. 
Senator  Reed.  Were  those  the  first  meetings  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  first  got  in  touch  Avith  them.  I  Avent  to  cover  them 
as  a  newspaper  man. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  those  the  first  meetings? 
Mr.  Mason.  Those  were  the  first  meetings. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  called  those  metings  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  My  recollection  is  that  Mr.  Taft  called  them.  1 
would  have  to  refer  to  the  minutes  to  make  sure  of  that. 

They  were  Lyman  Abbott,  editor,  The  Outlook;  Edwm  A.  Aler- 
man,  president.  University  of  Virginia;  James  B.  Angell,  educator 
and  diplomatist;  Thomas  Willing  Balch,  lawyer;  John  Barrett,  Di- 
rector General,  Pan  American  Union;  James  M.  Beck,  former  As- 
sistant Attorney  General ;  Alexander  Graham  Bell,  scientist  and  in- 
ventor; Perry  Belmont,  former  chairman  Committee  on  Foreign  Af- 
fairs: George  H.  Blakeslee,  professor  of  history,  Clark  University; 
Rudolph  Blankenburg,  mayor  of  Philadelphia;  Gutzon  Borglum, 
sculptor;  Samuel  P.  Brooks,  president  Baylor  University;  Charles  K. 
Brown,  dean,  Yale  Divinity  School;  Elmer  E.  BroAvn,  chancellor. 
NeAV  York  University;  Henrv  A.  Buchtel,  ex-governor  of  Colorado; 
George  Burnham,  jr.,  publicist;  Winston  Churchill,  tlie  author: 
Francis  E.  Clark,  founder  of  the  Christian  Endeavor  

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  long  list  of  the  names  there? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  just  file  it. 

(The  list  referred  to  is  as  folloAVS :) 

NATION  AL  PnOVlSlONAI.  COM  :M  n TKK   KOK  A   LEAGUE  OF  PEACE. 

Lyman  Abbott,  editor  the  ()ntl(K>k. 

Edwin  A.  Alderman,  President  University  of  Viruinia. 
James  B.  Angell.  educator  and  di))lomatist. 
Tliomas  Willin.u-  Balch,  Uiwyer. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2643 


Joliii  Barrett,  Director  General  Pan-American  Union. 
James  M.  Becl^,  former  Assistant  Attorney- General. 
Alexander  Graham  Bell,  scientist  and  inventor. 
Perry  Belmont,  former  chairman  Committee  on  Foreign  Affairs. 
George  H.  Blakeslee,  professor  history,  Clark  University. 
Rudolph  Blankenburg,  mayor  of  Philadelphia. 
Gutzon  Borglum,  sculptor. 

Samuel  P.  Brooks,  President  Baylor  University. 
Charles  R.  Brown,  Dean  Yale  divinity  school. 
Elmer  E.  Brown,  chancellor  New  York  University. 
Henry  A.  Buchtel,  ex-governor  of  Colorado. 
George  Burnham,  jr.,  publicist. 
Winston  Churchill,  author. 

Francis  E.  Clark,  founder  Christian  Endeavor. 
John  Bates  Clark,  political  economist. 

Philander  P.  Claxton.  United  States  Connnissioner  of  Education. 
A.  T.  Clearwater,  jurist. 
Frederic  R.  Coudert,  lawyer. 

Frank  Crane,  editorial  writter  Associated  Newspapers. 
R.  Fulton  Cuting,  financier. 

B William  C.  Dennis,  formerly  of  State  Department. 
Jacob  M.  Dickinson,  ex-Secretary  of  War. 
Henry  Sturgis  Drinker,  president  Lehigh  Universitv. 
Samuel  T.  Dutton,  educator. 

William  H.  P.  Faunce,  President  Brown  Universitv. 
Woodbridge  N.  Ferris,  Governor  of  Michigan. 
^    John  H.  Finley,  New  l^ork  Commissioner  of  Education. 
]    Irving  Fisher,  political  economist,  Yale  University. 

4  William  Dudley  Foulke,  former  member  United  States  (Mvil  Service  Commis- 
(Sion. 

Howard  B.  French,  manufacturer. 
James  Cardinal  Gibbons, 
j    Franklin  H.  Giddings,  sociologist. 
»    Washington  Gladden,  author,  clergyman. 
1    WiUiam  E.  Glasscock,  ex-governor  of  West  Virginia 
Caspar  F.  Goodrich,  Rear  Admiral,  U.  S.  Navy 
George  Gray,  member  of  Hague  Court. 
Herbert  S.  Hadley,  ex-governor  of  Missouri. 
John  Hays  Hannnond,  mining  engineer. 
Albert  Bushnell  Hart,  historian.  " 

William  O.  Hart,  President  Louisiana  Historical  Association 
Rowland  G.  Hazard,  manufacturer. 
Bayard  Henry,  lawyer. 
Myron  T.  Herrick,  diplomatist. 

John  Grier  Hibben,  President  Princeton  Universitv 
Emil  G.  Hirsch,  rabbi. 

George  C.  Holt,  United  States  District  Judge 
Hamilton  Holt,  editor  the  Independent. 
H.  J.  Howland,  associate  editor  the  Independent 
Wm.  B.  Howland,  president  the  Independent 

Charfes  CbSr^i^\'7'  "^^'^"f      American  Peace  and  Arbitration  League. 
Charles  Cheney  Hyde,  professor  of  international  law,  Northwestern  Univer- 

J.  E.  lugraham,  railway  official. 

Jeremiah  W.  Jenks,  political  economist  New  York  Universitv 

Homer  H.  Johnson,  lawyer.  ivt-iMcy. 

David  Starr  Jordan,  scientist  and  educator 
I   Federick  N.  Judson,  lawyer. 

Darwin  P  Kingsley,  president  New  York  Life  Insurance  Co. 
i   J.  Leonard  Levy,  rabbi. 

Edgar  Odell  Lovett,  president  Rice  Institute 

A.  Lawrence  Lowell,  president  Harvard  University. 

Frederick  Lynch,  secretary  Church  Peace  Union. 

r^vl  1  ^- Macfarland,  secretary  Federal  Council  of  Churches 
i  Theodore  Marburg,  economist.  v.  uncnes. 

■  Samuel  W.  McCall,  Member  of  Congress. 


2644 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


James  B.  McCreary,  governor  of  Kentucky. 
Victor  H.  Metcalf,  ex-Secretary  of  Navy. 

John  Mitchell,  chairman  New  York  State  Industrial  Commission. 
Samuel  C.  Mitchell,  president  Delaware  College. 

John  Bassett  Moore,  professor  international  law  and  diplomacy,  Columbia 
University. 

Henry  C.  Morris,  president  Chicago  Peace  Society. 

Cyrus  Northrop,  president  emeritus.  University  Minnesota. 

Alton  B.  Parker,  jurist. 

George  A.  Plimpton,  publisher. 

George  H.  Prouty,  ex-governor  of  Vermont. 

Odin  Roberts,  lawyer. 

Victor  Rosewater,  editor  Omaha  Bee. 

Leo  S.  Rowe,  president  American  Academy  Political  and  Social  Science. 

Nath.  C.  Schaeffer,  State  Superintendent  Public  Instruction. 

Jacob  H.  Schiff,  banker. 

Isaac  N.  Seligman,  banker. 

John  C.  Shaffer,  newspaper  publisher. 

William  A.  Shauklin,  president  Wesleyan  University. 

Robert  Sharp,  president  Tulane  University. 

Albert  Shaw,  editor  Review  of  Reviews. 

William  H.  Short,  secretary  the  New  York  Peace  Society. 

James  L.  Slayden,  Member  of  Congress. 

Edgar  F.  Smith,  Provost  University  of  Pennsylvania. 

John  A.  Stewart,  chairman  Peace  Cent.  Commission. 

Oscar  S.  Straus,  member  of  Hague  Court. 

Frank  S.  Streeter,  lawyer. 

Joseph  Swain,  president  Swarthmore  College. 

William  H.  Taft,  ex-President  United  States. 

Charles  T.  Tatman,  lawyer. 

John  M.  Thomas,  president  Middlebury  College. 
William  Hale  Thompson,  mayor  of  Chicago. 
Charles  F.  Thwing,  president  Western  Res.  University. 
James  L.  Tryon,  director  American  Peace  Society. 
Henry  St.  George  Tucker,  lawyer. 

Charles  R.  Van  Hise,  president  University  of  Wisconsin. 

W.  H.  Vary,  master  New  York  State  Grange. 

Anton  C.  Weiss,  editor  Duluth  Herald. 

Benjamin  Ide  Wheeler,  president  University  of  California. 

Everett  P.  Wheeler,  lawyer. 

Harry  A.  Wheeler,  banker. 

Andrew  D.  White,  educator  and  diplomatist. 

Thomas  Raeburn  White,  lawyer. 

William  Allen  White,  publicist. 

John  M.  Whitehead,  lawyer. 

John  Sharp  Williams,  United  States  Senator. 

Talcott  Williams,  journalist. 

Wardner  Williams,  president  Colorado  State  Board  of  Peace  Commissioners. 
George  G.  Wilson,  Professor  of  International  Law,  Harvard  University. 
Luther  B.  Wilson,  bishop  M.  E.  Church. 
Oliver  Wilson,  master  National  Grange. 
Stephen  S.  Wise,  rabbi. 

Theodore  S.  Woolsey,  international  law,  Y^ale  University. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  the  prime  movers  were  Mr.  Taft ;  Mr.  Lowell, 
of  Harvard  University;  Mr.  Willinm  H.  Short,  who  afterwards 
became  secretary  of  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace.  He  was  a  retired 
Congregational  clergyman.  Mr.  Oscar  Strauss,  Mr.  Herbert  S.i 
Houston,  Mr.  Edward  A.  Eilene,  Mr.  Marburg,  formerly  minister  to 
Belgium  

Senator  Eeed.  The  whole  list  is  here,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  MasC'X.  Yes;  but  these  are  in  addition.  I  think  the  names  I 
am  now  giving  you  are  the  names  of  those  who  instigated  this  call 
which  resulted  in  this  answer. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2645 

Senator  Reed.  Very  well.   When  was  that  meeting  held  ? 
Mr.  Masox.  It  was  in  1915— June,  1915. 

Senator  Reed.  I  notice  that  the  first  entry  of  cash  in  your  first 
book  is  on  June  28,  1915. 

Mr.  Masox.  That  was  during  that  meeting  or  toward  the  close  of  it. 
Senator  Reed.  That  probably  indicates  the  time  of  the  meeting. 
Mr.  Masox.  They  raised  money  at  that  meeting  to  inaugurate  the 
League  to  Enforce  Peace  as  an  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  spoken  of  Mr.  Beck — James  M.  Beck, 
i  Who  was  he  ? 

Mr.  ^L\sox.  Former  Assistant  Attorney  General,  an  attorney  in 
iJ^ew  \ork. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  this  James  M.  Beck  the  attorney  in  New  York 
who  is  now  opposed  to  the  league  ? 
Mr.  Masox.  Yes,  sir. 

^  Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  at  the  time  you  had  this  first  meeting  you 
did  not  have  the  document  which  we  know  as  the  League  of  Nations 
before  3^ou  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Masox.  No,  sir ;  we  adopted  a  platform  then  which,  in  the 
mam,  is  embodied  in  a  little  different  language  in  the  present  cove- 
nant. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  that  platform  ? 

Mr.  Masox.  Yes,  sir.^  It  is  in  the  proceedings  there  [indicating] . 
Senator  Reed.  You  will  file  the  proceedings  with  us  ? 
Mr.  Masox.  Yes.   We  call  it  our  declaration  of  principles. 
Senator  Reed.  You  spoke  of  Mr.  Filene.    He  has  been  one  of  the 
j  heaviest  contributors  ? 

I    Mr.  Masox.  One  of  the  prime  movers  from  the  beginning, 
j    Senator  Reed.  Where  is  he  now  ? 

I    Mr.  Mason.  I  imagine  he  is  in  Germany ;  at  least  he  started  for 
there. 

Senator  Reed.  He  is  over  there  trying  to  get  Germany  admitted 
to  the  league? 

Mr.  Masox.  I  do  not  know  that  that  is  his  mission,  althou^rh  it 
may  be. 

Senator  Reed.  You  know  that  he  has  been  pretty  active  in  that 
effort,  do  you  not  ?         .  * 

Mr.  Masox.  I  knew  that  he  had  harbored  a  desire  to  see  Germany 
a  member  of  the  League  of  Nations ;  yes,  sir. 

^  Senator  Reed.  He  wants  to  get  Germany  into  the  League  of  Na- 
itions  where  it  will  have  a  vote  that  concerns  the  interests  of  the 
United  States,  even  before  we  are  at  peace  with  Germany 
;    Mr.  Masox.  I  do  not  admit  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  he  got  into  Germany  when  we 
were  at  war  with  Germany  

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know. 
I:    Senator  Reed.  That  is,  the  President  says  we  are. 

Mr.  Masox.  I  do  not  know  how  he  got  in  or  when  he  got  in.  I 
was  not  acquainted  with  those  facts,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  the  financial  interests  of  Mr 
liFiIene  are? 

1    Mr.  Masox.  In  a  general  way;  yes,  sir. 
V   Senator  Reed.  What  are  they  ? 


2646 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mason.  Largely  a  department  store  in  Boston.  That  is  the 
main  source  of  his  wealth  and  the  bulk  of  it.  He  and  his  brother 
are  in  business  together. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  a  man  named  Fels,  who  was  a  heavy 
subscriber  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Mr.  Samuel  Fels,  of  Philadelphia,  manufacturer  of 
Fels  Naphtha  soap  "  ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  he  the  Mr.  Fels  that  was  an  advocate  of  the  single 
tax? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir ;  that  was  his  brother,  and  that  brother  is  now 
deceased,  and  his  widoAv  is  carrying  on  that  work  herself. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  this  Mr.  Fels  you  speak  of  interested  in  the 
movement  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Not  to  my  knowledge;  no,  sir.  This  Mr.  Fels  that 
I  speak  of  is  a  Republican  and  a  member,  as  I  understand  it,  of  the 
Union  League  Club  of  Philadelphia. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  he  is  a  natural-born  citizen  of 
the  United  States  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  A  natural-born  citizen  of  the  United  States  I  under- 
stand. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  of  any  more  of  your  representatives 
that  are  over  in  Europe  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I,  personally,  do  not  know  of  any;  no,  sir.  I  do  not 
think  there  are  any  others  over  there,  or  I  would  have  learned  of  it. 
The  office  usually  advises  me  of  wdiat  is  going  on. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  w^hat  connections  in  Germany  Mr. 
Filene  has  been  able  to  establish  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  He  has  not  reported  any. 

Senator  Reed.  That  he  went  over  to  establish  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  he  went  over  on  his  own  volition.  He  did  not 
go  as  a  representative  of  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace.  As  an  organi- 
zation, the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  is  not  sponsoring  any  movement 
to  admit  Germany,  Austria,  or  any  of  the  nations  leagued  or  allied 
against  the  so-called  entente  allies  in  the  recent  war,  or  the  present 
war,  Avhichever  Avay  you  want  to  look  at  it. 

Senator  Reed.  But  Mr.  Filene  has  been  one  of  the  leading  spirits 
and  leading  contributors,  has  he  not? 

Mr.  Mason.  Mr.  Filene,  I  believe,  has  contributed  something  like 
$22,000.  Mr.  Filene  has  been  a  leading  spirit  and  an  enthusiastic 
worker  in  behalf  of  the  League  of  Nations. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  think  $22,000  will  cover  his  contributions? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  am  not  certain.  I  think  it  may  be  more.  That  is 
simply  my  recollection  without  having  examined  the  books  at  all.  I 
knew  at  the  time  contributions  were  made,  but  I  have  forgotten,  be- 
cause I  made  no  Avritten  memorandum  of  them.  Personally  I  advo- 
cated seeking  contributions  everywhere  and  anywhere  in  any  amount 
and  spending  it  in  most  any  way  that  was  legitimate. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  yourself  solicited  some  subscriptions? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir;  I  am  not  a  mone}^  raiser,  as  a  rule.  I  have 
difficulty  in  keeping  myself  in  money. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  Avrite  some  letters  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  never  wrote  a  letter  or  never  sought  a  subscription 
except  in  this  way,  but  I  was  responsible  in  a  large  way  for  Mr. 


PRESIDE^s^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2647 


Bariich  making  his  contribution — at  least,  I  laid  what  might  be 
called  the  foundation  for  his  making  that  contribution. 
Senator  Keed.  How  much  has  Baruch  given  ? 

Mr.  Masox.  My  impression  is  that  it  is  about  $47,000.  It  may  be 
$50,000.  I  would  have  to  check  up.  Perhaps  I  can  tell  you.  |  After 
referring  to  papers.]  I  Avanted  to  get  $75,000.  I  tried  to  get  that 
much — at  least,  I  suggested  getting — an  effort  was  made  to  get 
$200,000  out  of  Henry  Ford,  but  w^e  did  not  get  a  nickel.  That  was 
when  the  Senate  w'as  considering  the  treaty.  I  wanted  to  have  a 
large  staff  here  disseminating  all  the  information  possible.  I  made 
that  recommendation  to  the  league. 

Senator  Eeed.  Henry  didn't  come  across? 

Mr.  Mason.  He  did  not,  I  am  sorry  to  say. 

Senator  Eeed.  That  is  one  thing  to  Henry's  credit. 

Mr.  Mason.  It  depends  entirely  upon  your  point  of  view^,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes.    Whether  it  is  national  or  international. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  the  international  is  largely  a  dream.  I  do  not 
know  what  caused  it,  whether  it  is  Welsh  rarebit  or  not,  but  it  is 
largely  a  dream.  Firty-seven  thousand  and  five  hundred  dollars  w^as 
Mr.  Baruch's  contribution,  as  I  have  it  here. 

I  might  say  for  your  interest.  Senator,  if  you  will  permit  me,  that 
in  1915  and  1916  w^e  made  very  strenuous  efforts  to  induce  the 
British  to  be  interested  in  this  subject  and  they  turned  a  deaf  ear  on 
us.  We  took  it  up  with  Lord  Bryce  and  Sir  Cecil  Spring-Rice  and 
with  Lloyd-George.  I  personally  interviewed  Sir  Cecil  Spring-Rice 
and  Lord  Bryce.  Lord  Bryce  w^as  sort  of  hike  warm  tow^ard  such 
a  project  and  w-ould  not  advocate  it  to  his  Government,  and  Lloyd- 
George  was  absolutely  opposed  to  it  in  the  beginning.  That  was  in 
1916  before  the  war,  before  Germany  declared  Avar  and  before 
Britain  entered  the  w^ar,  and  before  we  had  any  idea  that  we  Avould 
enter  into  the  war. 

Senator  Reed.  And,  of  course,  it  w^as  before  Gen.  Smuts  Avrote  this 
particular  document  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Before  Gen.  Smuts  wrote  one  document  and  before 
President  Wilson  Avrote  a  document.  In  the  meantime  the  League  of 
Nations  had  made  several  suggestions  Avith  regard  to  the  platforms. 

Senator  Rej:d.  AVas  there  before  this  organization  Avas  formed,  the 
organization  called  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace,  the  American  Peace 
Society  that  had  existed  many  years? 

Mr.  Mason.  It  AA^as  founded  by  Robert  Ginn.  It  functions  largely, 
I  think,  through  the  churches,  by  way  of  publications  and  articles 
which  are  prepared  by  lawyers,  publishers,  and  statesmen.  Ihe 
American  Peace  Society  I  knoAv  absolutely  nothing  of.  I  could  not 
very  Avell  knoAv  much  about  it  inasmuch  as  right  along  throughout  - 
that  period  and  to-<lay  I  have  been  a  A^ery  strong  advocate  of  uni- 
,  versa!  military  training,  having  served  five  years  myself  in  the  Regu- 
lar Army  in  Cuba  and  the  Philippines,  and  I  could  not  reconcile  the 
two. 

Senator  Reed.  So  your  theory  is  that  Ave  Avill  have  universal  peace 
and  the  uniA^ersal  military  training? 

Mr.  Mason.  My  theory  is  that  we  wall  not  haA^e  universal  peace  any 
more  than  we  will  have  uniA^ersal  order  in  a  city  Avhere  Ave  have  a 
•  police  force. 
1 


2648 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  So  you  think  it  would  be  necessary  to  haA^e  universal 
military  training? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  am  absolutely  a  firm  believer,  for  economic,  discipli- 
nary, and  physical  reasons. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  you  would  not  expect  to  have  universal 
military  training  in  our  country  unless  they  had  it  in  other  countries? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  had  hopes  we  would  have  it  as  long  as  the  condi- 
tion of  the  world  is  as  it  is  to-day  and  as  long  as  two  men,  Avhether 
they  be  Americans,  Irishmen,  Frenchmen,  or  Germans,  are  willing 
to  go  oat  on  the  street  and  fight  it  out  with  their  fists  whenever  they 
get  into  an  argument. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  an  advocate  of  it,  even  under  the  League 
to  Enforce  Peace? 

Mr.  Mason.  Until  we  can  bring  it  about  where  there  is  a  combined 
universal  reduction  of  armament  and  armies.  Until  then  I  think 
we  should  prepare  to  the  limit ;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  if  we  prepare,  every  other  nation  will 
prepare. 

Mr.  Mason.  They  are  doing  it,  anyway;  and  we  had  better  do  it, 
in  my  judgment. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  are  going  to  do  it  after  you  get  your 
league  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  It  depends  entirely  on  how  the  league  functions. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly.  You  have  not  enough  confidence  in  it  to 
put  away  your  gun  yet  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  have  all  the  confidence  in  the  world  that  we  Avill 
ultimately  be  able  to  put  away  our  guns.  I  have  not  confidence 
enough  in  the  police  force  to  leave  my  pocketbook  on  the  street  car 
or  on  the  sidewalk. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  expect  ever  to  be  able  to  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  hope  to  reduce  the  chances  of  its  being  stolen,  and 
that  is  the  hope  with  the  League  of  Nations. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  confidence  is  so  faint  that  you  want  to  train 
every  boy  in  the  United  States  to  carry  arms  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir;  my  hope  is  very  strong  that  when  we  begin 
universal  military  training  very  likely  the  world  will  agree  to  dis- 
armament, knowing  the  strength  of  the  United  States. 

Senator  Reed.  The  first  step  toward  disarmament  is  to  arm  every- 
body? 

Mr.  Mason.  Universal  military  training  is  not  to  arm  everybody, 
Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  want  to  argue." 

Mr.  Mason.  I  am  not  arguing;  I  am  answering  your  questions. 
Universal  military  training  is  not  arming  everybody.  That  is  the 
answer  your  question. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  But  the  reason  you  could  not  agree  with 
the  American  Peace  Society,  or  this  other  society  that  you  name — 
whnt  was  it? 

Mr.  Mason.  You  mean  agree, personally  ?  I  did  not  say  I  did  not 
agree  with  them ;  I  said  I  possibly  could  not  agree  with  them.  I  did 
not  know  they  were  in  existence. 

Senator  Reed.  You  did  say  something  to  this  effect — and  that  is  all 
I  am  interested  in — that  you  did  not  agree  with  these  other  plans 
because  you  regarded  it  as  necessary  to  have  universal  military  train- 
ing and  you  could  not  reconcile  that  with  the  other  scheme. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2649 


Mr.  Mason.  I  regarded  most  of  those  organizations  that  I  knew 
about  as  pacifists. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  not  a  pacifist  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir ;  I  am  a  belligerent  leaguer. 

Senator  Reed.  You  belong  to  the  Irish  branch  that  proposes  to 
have  peace  if  they  have  to  lick  everybody  to  do  it. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  am  not  Irish. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  to  reflect  on  you  and  touch  your  sen- 
sibilities. I  think  if  there  are  many  men  as  belligerent  as  you  appear 
to  be  this  morning  the  whole  world  would  be  fighting  by  to-morrow 
afternoon. 

Mr.  Mason.  Xot  at  all.  I  am  not  belligerent.  I  do  not  want  to 
appear  to  be,  if  I  have.    I  very  respectful!}^  beg  the  Senators'  pardon. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  think  you  meant  to  be,  so  we  will  get  along 
pleasantly.  I  am  Irish,  and  I  do  not  want  anybody  to  stir  me  up 
too  much. 

The  thing,  then,  that  differentiated  this  organization  from  the 
other  organization  was,  in  j^our  mind,  that  this  organization  proposes 
to  go  at  this  thing  by  creating  a  force  of  some  kind  which  would  be 
•capable  of  preserving  the  world's  peace.  That  is  where  you  got  the 
name  "  The  League  to  Enforce  Peace  "  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  No  ;  that  is  not  quite  exactly  it.  Senator.  The  origi- 
nal idea  was  that  we  would  possibly  have  to  have  a  sort  of  supreme 
;  tribunal  backed  up  by  the  navies  of  the  nations  which  are  signatories 
to  the  league.   In  that  sense  your  question  is  correct. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  you  propose  to  back  the  Navy  arrange- 
ment by  universal  military  training,  at  least  in  this  country? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir;  that  was  merely  a  personal  remark  and  had 
nothing  to  do  with  the  league.  I  had  personal  ideas  that  the  league 
would  not  let  me  foist  on  them. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you,  at  least,  as  one  of  the  active  men,  have 
that  idea? 

Mr.  Mas(3N.  Not  to  the  extent  that  I  could  advocate  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Having  been  a  soldier  you  of  course  know  that, 
generally,  for  a  navy  to  be  effective  you  have  to  got  to  have  some 
soldiers,  too? 

Mr.  Mason.  Quite  right. 

Senator  Reed.  So  your  idea  was  that  you  would  have  an  inter- 
national force  composed  of  naval  vessels  and  you  would  have  uni- 
,  versal  military  training  and  you  would  supplement  the  force  of  the 
vessels  with  the  force  of  men? 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  not  true. 

Senator  Reed.  What? 

Mr.  Mason.  Not  at  all.  If  I  ever  got  to  that  point  of  reasoning 
I  do  not  recall  it. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  your  idea  ?  I  have  tried  to  follow  you. 
^1  I  may  be  a  little  dull. 

H     Mr.  Mason.  My  personal  idea  was  that  we  would  have  to  have  at 

!  least  as  strong  a  Navy  as  we  then  possessed  

Senator  Reed.  How  about  this  international  tribunal?    That  is 
what  I  am  trying  to  get  at.    I  did  not  mean  to  interrupt  you;  but 
-  how  was  this  international  tribunal  to  enforce  its  orders  and  give 
'  them  effect? 


2650 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mason.  Through  a  council  which  would  make  a  recommenda- 
tion, first,  of  an  economic  boycott  to  be  followed  by  a  joint  maneuver 
or  operation  of  the  navies  of  the  nations  signatory  to  the  pact. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  use  the  term  "  joint  maneuver  of  the  navies  "  

Mr.  Mason.  Combined  operation. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  use  the  term  "  combined  operation." 
Mr.  Mason.  I  used  that  in  its  generic  sense. 

Senator  Reed.  You  mean  by  that,  not  just  to  sail  around,  but  to  ao. 
some  business? 

Mr.  Mason.  Put  plenty  of  ammunition  aboard,  clean  the  guns  and 
stand  by  them. 

Senator  Reed.  And  shoot  them? 
Mr.  Mason.  If  necessary. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  we  are  getting  down  to  business.  That  is  what 
I  have  been  trying  to  get  somebody  to  say  about  a  year  and  a  half — 
that  what  you  intend  is  to  create  a  great  international  force  under 
the  League  of  Nations  capable  of  coercing  another  nation  and,  if 
necessary,  licking  it? 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  not  a  true  deduction,  conclusion,  or  inference. 
I  said  that  was  my  personal  idea.  That  is  not  the  program  of  the 
league,  and  never  has  been  the  program  of  the  league.  It  has  not 
been  the  plan  of  the  President  jind  is  not  the  plan  of  the  President 
and  never  has  been  the  plan  of  the  President  

Senator  Reed.  You  talk  a  good  deal  and  you  talk  pretty  reck- 
lessly, Mr.  Witness.  You  have  Avritten  it  into  article  16,  and  you 
know  it  is  there. 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  not  true. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right. 

Mr.  Mason.  It  is  not  in  article  16  or  any  other  article  of  the  cove- 
nant. 

Senator  Rj:ed.  There  is  no  use  in  denying  the  plain  English  used. 

Mr.  Mason.  There  is  only  one  interpretation  to  be  put  on  plain 
English,  and  that  is  the  dictionary  interpretation,  which,  in  most 
cases,  has  been  upheld  by  the  Supreme  Court  decisions  as  to  what 
words  and  phrases  mean. 

Senator  Reed.  I  see.  I  can  readily  see  why  you  helped  organize 
this,  and  why  you  are  interested  in  it. 

Are  you  pretty  Avell  acquainted  witli  these  subscribers? 

Mr.  Mason.  In  a  general  Avay. 

Senator  Reed.  You  did  go  to  Mr.  Ford  for  monev,  and  wanted 
$200,000,  and  you  did  go  to  Mr.  Baruch  and  got  $40,000? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  suggested  that  they  go  to  Mr.  Ford — suggested  it  to 
Mr.  William  H.  Short — and  ask  Mr.  Ford  for  money.  He  turned 
him  down.  I  suggested  $200,000.  He  asked  for  a  hundred  thousand 
dollars. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  Avrite  some  letters  out  to  California  about 
some  money  out  in  California  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  did  not ;  and  I  do  not  know  of  any  that  were  written. 
They  may  have  been  written,  however. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  be  sure  that  I  understand  3'OU.  You 
have  not  in  any  way  suggested  that  California  ought  to  raise  a  par- 
ticular sum  of  money? 
•  Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Or  any  sum  of  money  ? 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2651 


Mr.  Masox.  Xo,  sir.  There  are  only  one  or  two  instances  in  which 
I  made  suggestions  at  all  in  regard  to  money — three  instances :  Those 
two.  and  then  the  general  proposition  to  get  all  the  money  they  could 
and  come  down  here  and  work. 

Senator  Keed.  Did  you  ever  have  any  communication  with  Mr. 
Jacobs,  the  president  of  the  California  Canners'  Association? 

Mr.  Masox.  Mr.  Isadore  Jacobs? 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Isadore  Jacobs. 

Mr.  Masox.  Mr.  Isadore  Jacobs,  of  the  California  Canners'  Asso- 
ciation, is  a  legal  client  of  mine. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  3^ou  CA'er  have  any  communication  with  him? 

Mr.  Masox.  I  have  never  mentioned  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace 
to  him. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  have  any  communication  with- him 
with  reference  to  the  fact  that  California  ought  to  contribute? 

Mr.  Masox^.  I  of  my  own  personal  knowledge  know  of  no  such 
•communication.    If  the  financial  department  m  Xew  York  wrote 
,  such  a  letter,  1  have  no  knowledge  of  it.   I  personally  would  not  have 
;  any  hesitancy  in  asking  Mr.  Jacobs  to  raise  all  the  money  he  could. 
I  think  he  would  do  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  have  any  talk  with  Charles  R.  (xreen? 
I  Mr.  Masox^.  Personally  I  have  not  had  any  talk  Avith  Mr.  (xreen. 
!  I  w^ould  have  done  so  had  it  been  my  province. 

Senator  Reed,  Did  you  undertake,  through  Mr.  Baruch.  or  in  any 
i  other  way,  to  get  Mr.  Green  to  contribute  ? 

!  Mr.  Masox.  I.  personally,  no.  sir.  I  know  of  no  one  else  that  did. 
[  They  may  have  done  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  James  Couzens? 

Mr.  Masox.  He  is  a  former  partner  of  Henry  Ford;  recently 
i  -mayor  of  Detroit.  I  think  he  still  is :  I  am  not  sure. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  going  to  put  the  amount  of  these  ,  sub- 
i  scriptions  in  ? 

Mr.  Masox-.  We  will  give  you  that  list.  Senator,  complete  and 
classified. 

Senator  Reed.  George  Burnham.  jr.   Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Masox.  He  classes  himself  as  a  publicist.  He  is  a  retired 
business  man.  I  think  he  was  connected  with  the  Baldwin  Loco- 
motive Works  at  one  time  and  may  possibly  own  some  stock  or  bonds 
in  it  now. 

Senator  Reed.  Harriet  M.  Heminway.    Who  is  she? 

Mr.  Masox.  She  is  a  wiealthy  Boston  woman. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  are  her  investments ;  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Masox.  I  do  not  know,  sir.  I  might  state,  sir,  that  we  never 
made  inquiry  of  a  person  who  was  asked  for  a  contribution  what 
their  source  of  income  Avas. 

.  Senator  Reed.  I  am  onlv  asking  vou  for  Avhat  vou  do  know.  R.  H. 
f  Webber.    Who  is  he? 

Mr.  ]Masox.  I  do  not  knoAv  Mr.  Webber. 

Senator  Reed.  I  recognize  him  as  a  frequent  contributor, 
j     Mr.  Masox.  I  think  he  was  an  annual  contributor.    He  may  pos- 
I  sibly  have  contributed  more  than  that.    I*  do  not  knoAv  of  my  OAvn 
[^knowledge. 

Senator  Reed.  Willard  Straight.    Who  is  he? 


2652 


PRESIDENTIAL  (CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mason.  He  is  now  deceased.  I  think  at  one  time  he  was  con- 
nected with  J.  P.  Morgan  &  Co.,  and  afterwards  connected  with  a 
group  of  banks,  representing  their  interests  abroad. 

Senator  Reed.  Samuel  A.  Lewisohn.  We  asked  about  him  yester- 
day. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  is  in  copper  mining. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  company  he  is  connected  with? 
Mr.  Mason.  I  think  it  is  one  of  Mr.  John  D.  Ryan's,  but  I  am  not 
sure. 

Senator  Reed.  Herbert  Brooks.    Who  is  he? 
Mr.  Mason.  Brooks,  I  think,  is  a  publicist ;  I  am  not  sure. 
Senator  Reed.  He  had  charge  of  the  collection  of  money  or  did 
collect  money  for  a  branch  that  was  organized  in  Montana  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  Is  Brooks  from  out  there? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  him. 

Senator  Reed.  He  subscribed  $23.25 — Montana  branch. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  was  an  organizer  in  Montana,  then,  apparently. 

Senator  Reed.  Bastian  Aresege.   Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  The  World's  Peace  Foundation.  They  contributed 
on  October  4. 

Mr.  Mason.  They  contribute  considerable  sums.  I  think  they  con- 
tribute to  the  Covenanter.   It  is  the  Ginn  Peace  Foundation. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  much  money  they  gave  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know,  sir.  It  Avill  reflect  itself,  however,  in 
the  books. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  to  you,  but  do  you  know  Avhether 
they  have  also  been  engaged  in  carrying  on  a  campaign  for  the 
League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  Mason.  They  have  gotten  out  publications;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  how  extensive  their  own  organiza- 
tion is  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  it  is  largely  in  publication. 
Miss  Handy.  They  print  bills. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  think  they  do  any  general  propaganda  work 
otherwise.   It  is  an  endowed  corporation. 

Senator  Reed.  Miss  Handy,  what  is  your  connection  with  this 
matter  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  am  Mr.  Short's  assistant. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  Mr.  Short? 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  secretary  of  the  league. 

Mr.  Mason.  General  secretary  and  assistant  treasurer. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  why  is  it  that  we  do  not  have  you  tell  us 
about  these  things?    You  know  about  them. 

Miss  Handy.  I  probably  do  not  knoAv  anything  more  about  them 
than  Mr.  Mason  does. 

Mr.  Mason.  Miss  Handy  is  perfectly  willing  to  testify  if  you  Avish 
her  to. 

Miss  Handy.  I  will  be  glad  to. 

Senator  Reed.  I  will  just  go  on  with  you.    I  notice  here  on  Oc- 
tober 8,  1917,  Mr.  Filene  gave  $22,500  in  one  bulk. 
Miss  Handy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  He  made  numerous  other  subscriptions  besides  that? 
Miss  Handy.  Not  so  many  since  then. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2653 


Senator  Keed.  Do  you  know  how  he  came  to  give  that  large  sum 
at  that  time? 

Miss  Handy.  He  was  particularly  interested  in  the  league,  and  he 
thought  we  needed  money,  particularly  at  that  time. 

Senator  Eeed.  You  do  not  remember  any  special  circumstances? 
Miss  Handy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  Do  3^ou  know  the  name  of  the  Mr.  Fels  who  is  dead  ? 
Do  you  know  his  first  name? 
Miss  Handy.  No,  sir;  I  do  not. 
Mr.  Mason.  Joseph. 

Senator  Keed.  Henry  M.  Leland.    Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  he  Avas  formerly  president  of  the  Cadillac 
Motor  Car  Co..  now  president  of  the  Lincoln  Motors,  at  Detroit, 
Mich. 

Senator  Eeed.  Leon  Falk.   AVho  is  he  ? 
Miss  Handy.  A  Pittsburgh  man. 
Senator  Eeed.  What  is  his  business? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  wliat  his  business  is.  Do  you,  Mr. 
Mason  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  see  the  McCormick  estate,  William  Jenkins  and 
Judson  F.  Stone,  trustees,  $500.   Do  you  know  what  estate  that  is? 
Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  It  is  designated  merely  as  the  McCormick  estate. 
Is  it  the  Hnrvester  people? 

Mr.  Mason.  The  same  branch,  the  same  family.  I  think  it  is  the 
[International  Harvester  Co. 

1  Senator  Eeld.  Do  the  trustees  of  ;ni  estate  take  money  from  the 
estate  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Lhey  sometimes  have  permission  to  make  donations. 
Mr.  Mason.  Tliere  are  sometimes  provisions  in  wills  where  trustees 
may  do  those  things. 

•    Senator  Eeed.  I  would  like  to  see  such  a  will. 

:    Mr.  Mason.  I  think  Mr.  Pulitzer's  will,  filed  in  Missouri,  provided 
that  certain  donations  be  made  by  the  trustees  or  executors. 
:    Senator  Eeed.  J.  P.  Morgan,  $100.    Is  that  J.  Pierpont  Morgan? 
!    Mr.  Mason.  Yes,  sir.    There  is  $5,000  more  there  from  another 
member  of  that  firm. 

The  Chairman.  There  is  another  one  from  Mr.  Morgan? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  $10,000  as  a  total  over  five  years. 
(    The  Chairman.  $10,100. 

t  Mr.  Mason.  Whatever  the  total  amount  is  of  the  two  contribu- 
.tions. 

j   Senator  Eeed.  George  A.  Plimpton.    Who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know,  sir. 
\  Miss  Handy.  He  is  connected  with  Ginn,  the  publishers  in  New 
Jork. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  notice  again,  on  page  32,  $664.80  paid  by  the 
World  Peace  Foundation. 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  for  some  publications.  Under  their  endow- 
l^nent  I  think  they  are  only  permitted  to  do  Avork  of  that  charac- 
ter— the  issuance  of  publications.  They  can  not  pay  any  salaries 
I  )r  things  of  that  kind. 


2654 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAKJN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Mrs.  Daniel  Simmons.    Who  is  she? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 
Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know,  either. 
Senator  Eeed.  Theodore  Marburg.    Who  is  he? 
Mr.  Mason.  Formerly  minister  to  Belgium,  with  a  residence  in 
Baltimore. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  business? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  think  he  has  any.  Since  he  was  relieved  as 
Minister  to  Belgium  b}^  Mr.  Whitlock  he  has  been  devoting  all  of  his 
time,  without  pay,  to  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  he  a  capitalist? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  The  stenographer  can  not  get  both  of  you  talking  at 
once.    I  am  examining  the  lady. 
Jacob  H.  Schiff.    Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  He  is  a  banker. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  banking  firm ? 
Miss  Handy.  I  think  it  is  Kuhn,  Loeb  &  Co. 
Senator  Reed.  That  was  a  contribiition  of  $500. 
Edward  Bok.    Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 
Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  wliere  he  llA^es? 
Miss  Handy.  No,  sir. 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  not  a  publisher? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  R.  F.  Flinterman,  $600.   Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know.  • 

Senator  Reed.  J.  H.  Wade.  Do  you  know  who  he  is? 
Miss  Handy.  Just  merely  by  name.    I  do  not  know  what  his  busi- 
ness is. 

Senator  Reed.  W.  L.  Douglas.  Who  is  he?  He  contributed  a 
thousand  dollars. 

Miss  Handy.  A  shoe  man. 

Mr.  Mason.  Formerly  governor  of  Massachusetts. 
Senator  Reed.  R.  Fulton  Cutting.   Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  just  what  his  business  is.    He  is  a 
banker  in  New  York,  I  think. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  Imow  what  bank  he  is  connected  with  ? 
Miss  Handy.  No,  sir;  I  do  not. 
Mr.  Mason.  A  private  bank? 

Miss  Handy.  They  are  big  bankers  in  New  York ;  I  do  not  know 
any  specific  bank. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  they  are  private  bankers.    I  am  not  certain. 

Senator  Reed.  Charles  F.  Avery.   Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  Dare  H.  Morris? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  Imow. 

Senator  Reed.  W.  Harry  Brown,  who  gave  a  thousand  dollars. 
Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Charles  E.  Riplev,  who  gave  a  thousand  dollars. 
Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know,  Mr.  Mason? 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2655 


Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Edward  B.  Calkins.   Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  He  has  some  interests  out  West;  I  do  not  know  just 
what  they  are;  but  I  think  he  is  a  member  of  the  executive  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  he  in  the  copper  business,  too  ? 
Miss  Handy.  Not  that  I  know  of.    I  think  he  has  something  to 
do  with  automobiles,  if  I  am  not  mistaken. 

Senator  Reed.  Sal3in  W.  Colton,  jr.    Do  you  know  who  he  is? 
Miss  Handy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Hon.  John  J.  White.   Who  is  he  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know.  They  were  probably  subscriptions 
taken  at  one  of  the  congresses.  They  would  be  local  subscriptions, 
and  I  would  not  know  anything  about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Cleveland  PI.  Dodge — who  is  he?  He  contributed 
$1,000. 

Miss  Handy.  Phelps,  Dodge  &  Co.,  New  York. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  is  interested  in  mining  and  banking. 

Senator  Reed.  A.  F.  Houston,  $500. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  comes  from  Texas. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  his  business  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  his  business. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  not  the  Houston  who  was  on  the  stand  yes- 
terday ? 

Miss  Handy.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Charles  F.  Dietz. 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  a  man  with  lumber  interests  in  Ohio. 

Senator  Reed.  National  Paper  Trade  Association.  In  that  con- 
nection there  is  another  subscription  bracketed,  E.  T.  Wilson  $100, 
National  Paper  Trade  Association  $500,  carried  out  as  $600.  I  call 
attention  to  the  whole  item.  Can  you  tell  me  anything  about  that 
concern  ? 

Miss  Handy.  No;  I  do  not  know  anything  about  the  concern.  I 
know  the  concern  as  such  did  make  a  contribution. 
Senator  Reed.  Mrs,  Malcolm  Forbes. 

Miss  Handy.  She  is  of  Boston,  a  wealthy  woman.  I  do  not  know 
where  she  gets  her  money. 

Senator  Reed.  What  does  Malcolm  Forbes  do? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  whether  there  is  a  Mr.  Malcolm 
Forbes. 

Senator  Reed.  M.  Carrie  Thomas. 

Miss  Handy.  President  of  Brvn  Mawr. 

Senator  Reed.  George  C.  F.  Williams,  $1,000.  Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Robert  J.  Schwarzenbach,  $500.  Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 
■  Senator  Reed.  Howard  B.  Tuttle,  $1,000.  Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  H.  J.  Heinze.   Is  that  the  57  varieties  Heinze? 
Miss  Handy.  It  might  be.  Senator  Reed ;  but  I  can  not  say. 
Senator  Reed.  He  was  mentioned  in  the  Taft  ciroular  as  one  of  the 
men  who  had  great  vision.  A.  W.  Mellen,  $500.  Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  him. 

182774— 20— PT  20  3 


2656 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  Is  that  the  Mr.  Mellen  the  railroad  man  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  No;  that  is  not  the  same  man. 
Miss  Handy.  Probably  not. 

Senator  Reed.  George  F.  Rand.  Do  you  know  who  he  is? 
Miss  Handy.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  George  B.  Pratt,  $500.    Who  is  he? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  he  connected  with  the  Standard  Oil  ? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  I  have  asked  who  George  Burnham,  jr.,  is, 
but  I  am  going  to  ask  again. 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  the  man  who  is  interested  in  the  Baldwin  Loco- 
motive Works. 

Senator  Reed.  Mrs.  A.  J.  Cassett. 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  her. 

Mr.  Mason.  She  is  a  widow  of  the  former  president  of  the  Penn- 
sylvania Railroad. 

Senator  Reed.  D.  Everett  Macy,  $5,000.   Who  is  he? 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  a  very  wealthy  man  of  Westchester  County,' 
N.  y.,  a  man  interested  in  ail  public  movements  and  who  gives  to 
everything.   I  do  not  know  the  source  of  his  income. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  his  financial  connections? 

Miss  Handy.  No.  I  know  he  has  been  a  Democrat  and  lives  in 
Westchester  County. 

Senator  Reed.  Francis  Lynde  Stetson. 

Miss  FIandy.  He  is  a  capitalist  of  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  that  the  Stetson  hat  man  ? 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  a  lawyer  in  New  York. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  is  a  big  corporation  lawyer. 

Senator  Reed.  Mrs.  Stephen  B.  Harkner  and  Edward  S.  Hark- 
ner.  i 
Miss  Handy.  No  ;  I  do  not  know  them. 
Senator  Reed.  A.  R.  Kimball. 

Miss  Handy.  He  is  a  member  of  the  executive  committee,  I 
think;  I  do  not  know,  however. 

Senator  Reed-  A.  B.  Farquhar.   Do  you  know  who  he  is? 
Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  know  who  he  is. 

Mr.  Mason.  He  is  president  of  a  small  harvester  machinery  manu- 
facturing plant  at  York,  Pa.  He  is  a  personal  admirer  of  President 
Wilson.  I  think  that  more  than  anything  else  is  what  actuated  him 
to  make  that  contribution.   In  fact,  he  told  me  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Cyrus  H.  K.  Curtis.   Who  is  he  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  He  is  a  publisher  in  Philadelphia  of  the  Post. 

Senator  Reed.  I  understand  these  other  books  have  been  gone  over 
by  the  other  members  of  the  committee  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  get  a  word  now  about  the  character  of 
the  organization.   You  have,  of  course,  a  central  organization  here? 

Miss  Handy.  No;  we  have  no  central  organization  here,  Senator 
Reed.   That  is  at  headquarters.  New  York  City. 

Senator  Reed.  Central  headquarters  are  in  New  York  City? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  are  they  located? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2657 


Miss  Handy.  At  present  No.  22  West  Nineteenth  Street. 
Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  have  any  Washington  headquarters  ? 
Miss  Handy.  We  had  a  Washington  office  that  ran  that  newspaper 
work  last  year. 

Senator"^  Eeed.  In  addition  to  that,  yon  undertook  to  organize 
branches  in  the  various  States,  did  you  not? 
Miss  Handy.  We  hoped  to. 
Senator  Eeed.  You  did  try  that,  did  you  not? 
Miss  Handy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  succeed  in  the  organization  of  these  branches 
in  many  of  the  States  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes;  the  majority  of  the  States. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  the  business  of  the  branch  in  the  State? 
What  was  it  to  do  ? 

Miss  Handy.  It  was  to  get  members  in  the  State,  and  when  the 
people  in  the  State  asked  to  whom  they  coukl  apply  for  information 
in  Washington  to  help  out  at  meetings  in  regard  to  the  league,  they 
were  referred  to  the  State  secretary  or  State  chairman. 

Senator  Reed.  And  when  you  assigned  and  sent  out  speakers  you 
had  the  State  organization  to  cooperate  with? 

Miss  Handy.  We  did  not  use  the  State  organizations,  because  they 
were  not  very  well  formed. 

Senator  Reed.  You  used  it  as  far  as  you  could,  did  you  not? 

Miss  Handy.  If  the  State  wanted  to  do  anything,  they  did  it  mostly 
themselves.   If  we  wanted  to  do  anything  in  a  State  

Senator  Reed  (interposing).  Did  you  not  have  men  that  went  over 
the  country  organizing  these  State  branches  ? 

Miss  Handy.  We  had  one  field  man. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  he  ? 

Miss  Handy.  His  name  Avas  W.  R.  Boyd,  jr. 

Senator  Reed.  Just  one  field  man  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes,  sir. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  Mr.  Boyd  used  to  be  private  secretary  to  Sen- 
ator Culberson. 

Miss  Handy.  Yes ;  he  was. 

Senator  Reed.  There  was  a  special  train  sent  across  the  country 
at  one  time,  I  believe. 

Miss  Handy.  Not  a  special  train  but  a  special  car  just  attached  to 
any  train  that  it  made  connection  with. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  people  were  in  that  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  think  there  were  in  all  about  26. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  the  purpose  of  sending  this  special  car 
out? 

Miss  Handy.  That  tour  took  place  just  about  the  time  the  covenant 
came  back  from  Paris,  and  the  object  of  the  tour  was  to  create  senti- 
ment throughout  the  country  for  the  league. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  Mr.  Morgenthau  go  on  that  tour? 

Miss  Handy.  He  was  one  of  the  speakers  on  that  tour. 

Senator  Reed.  Had  he  never  made  any  subscriptions  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Certain  amounts ;  I  do  not  know^  how  great  they  were. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  they  in  the  book? 

Miss  Handy.  Oh,  ye^. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  any  attempt  made  to  raise  money  on  that 
trip  ? 


2658 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Handy.  We  had  to  finance  the  congresses  as  we  went  along. 
Senator  Reed.  But  was  there  an  attempt  made  to  raise  money  on 
that  trip  ? 

Miss  Handy.  At  each  congress  they  raised  money  to  finance  the 
congress  and  to  finance  the  work  of  the  national  office. 

(Senator  Eeed.  Was  there  considerable  money  raised? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes ;  I  think  we  did  raise  quite  a  good  deal  of  money 
on  that  trip. 

Senator  Eeed.  How  much? 

Miss  Handy.  I  think  it  was  around  probably  $125,000,  or  some- 
thing like  that. 

Senator  Keed.  Then  you  had  a  Washington  headquarters  ? 

The  Chairman.  Just  before  you  leave  that  let  me  ask  what  did 
that  car  cost? 

Miss  Handy.  I  can  not  tell  just  what  the  car  cost,  but  I  can  tell 
what  the  congress  cost. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  have  it  here.  The  trip  and  the  congresses  cost 
$100,180.15. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  mean  the  car  cost  that  ? 

Miss  Handy.  No;  that  was  our  hotel  expenses  and  everything. 

The  Chairman.  Then  the  car  with  the  26  people  on  there,  the 
whole  thing,  cost  $100,000  ? 

Miss  Handy.  No;  that  was  not  the  only  item.  We  had  to  have 
headquarters  to  work  up  our  meetings,  and  all  those  expenses  went 
into  it.  We  had  to  send  out  calls  and  literature. 

Mr.  Mason.  May  I  enlarge  on  that  a  little  ?    The  idea  of  these  con- 
gresses was  this.    We  made  out  the  scheme  of  a  general  campaign  at 
that  time  to  hold  what  we  called  conferences  or  general  meetings  in 
certain  communities.    I  think  we  had  11  locations  scattered  over  the 
Nation.    We  were  to  carry  men  sufficiently  prominent  to  command 
considerable  publicity  and  attention  and  to  draw  attention  when 
scheduled  to  make  speeches  and  addresses.    We  had  men  in  these 
particular  locations  arrange  in  advance  for  the  meeting,  announcing 
just  as  you  would  a  campaign  meeting  that  it  would  occur  on  such  a 
date  and  the  local  organization  would  cooperate  in  order  to  get  a  good  I 
attendance.    Following  the  speeches  there  was  some  organizing  of  | 
the  local  work  to  greater  ramification,  and  the  collecting  of  funds  to  i 
aid  in  advancing  that  congress  or  to  finance  the  whole  field  possibly, 
with  an  effort  to  leave  a  surplus  for  the  general  treasury  for  general  ii 
publicity,  issuance  of  pamphlets,  documents,  etc.  I 

Senator  Reed.  Did  these  State  organizations  raise  money  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  In  that  way,  and  they  raised  some  money  themselves  to  i| 
finance  themselves.  j 

Senator  Reed.  Afterwards?  i 

Mr.  Mason.  Afterwards  and  before.  j 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAV  how  much  they  raised  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  one  in  nearly  every  State  in  the  Union  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  should  say  about  65  per  cent.  ! 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  you  do  not  know  how  much  money  they  i 
raised  ?  | 

Mr.  Mason.  No.  Some  of  them  probably  raised  considerable  and  ji 
some  raised  virtually  none. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2659 


Senator  Reed.  Have  you  your  cash  book  here  or  your  book  that 
shows  what  you  paid  this  money  out  for  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  have  not  the  items  now  of  that  tour. 

Senator  Reed.  I  mean  your  general  book  where  you  show  what  you 
paid  your  money  out  for  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  have  the  auditor's  report. 

Senator  Reed.  But  that  does  not  give  the  details. 

Mr.  Mason.  We  have  this  statement  which  I  think  the  Senator  saw 
yesterday.  Expenditures  were  made  on  vouchers,  and  the  vouchers 
are  on  file  in  the  headquarters  at  New  York.  There  are  no  expendi- 
tures made,  I  think,  without  any  voucher. 

Senator  Reed.  What  do  you  mean  by  the  item  "  Home  extension  "? 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  part  of  the  financing  of  the  expenses ;  speakers 
would  come  under  that  and  the  getting  out  of  a  certain  character  of 
literature. 

Senator  Reed.  How  many  speakers  did  you  have  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  That  is  hard  to  tell.  At  that  time  we  had  probably, 
of  the  26  people  on  that  train,  15  speakers  among  them. 

Miss  Handy.  AVe  picked  speakers  up  and  dropped  them  as  we 
went  along.   There  were  about  seven  who  went  on  the  whole  tour. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  speaking  of  the  trip  particularly.  How 
many  speakers  have  you  had  who  have  been  out  under  the  auspices 
of  this  organization  ? 

.  Mr.  Mason.  That  is  quite  impossible  to  tell. 

Senator  Reed.  Would  they  run  into  the  hundreds  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  Yes ;  several  hundred. 
Senator  Reed.  A  thousand  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  Possibly. 

Miss  Handy.  They  were  not  sent  out  from  the  New  York  office. 
Mr.  Mason.  From  local  State  headquarters. 
Senator  Reed.  But  under  your  auspices? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes,  sir;  those  would  probably  run  into  several  thou- 
sand. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  your  home  extension.  I  notice  it  cost,  ac- 
cording to  this  statement,  $58,967.14.  Then  I  notice  an  item,  ''For- 
eign extension."    What  Avas  that  ? 

Miss  Handy.  That  is  the  committee  of  which  Mr.  Theodore  Mar- 
burg is  chairman,  and  he  communicates  with  foreign  countries  about 
the  situation  with  regard  to  tlieir  connection  with  the  league.  That 
committee  never  did  very  much  of  anything. 

Mr.  Mason.  Their  work  was  largely  a  study  of  economic  and  social 
conditions  abroad. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  they  have  communications  with  people  of  for- 
eign countries? 

Mr.  Mason.  They  had  communications  with  people  of  foreign 
countries,  and  I  think  Mr.  Marburg  made  a  trip.  I  am  not  sure 
about  that,  but  they  took  it  up  with  most  of  the  foreign  countries. 

Senator  Reed.  I  see  you  have  charged  up  financial  campaign  ex- 
penses, $28,289.25.    You  spent  that  much  money  collecting  money? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes.  The  league,  like  many  other  organizntions,  fell 
a  victim  to  the  necessity  of  employing  a  professional  at  one  time  to 
raise  money,  and  part  of  that  item  is  his. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  was  that  professional  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Harvey  Hill. 


2660 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  How  much  did  you  pay  him  ? 
Miss  Handy.  I  don't  remember. 
Mr.  Mason.  It  is  the  same  type. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  his  phm  of  collection?  How  did  he  go 
about  it  ? 

Miss  Handy.  He  would  have  men  in  each  city  particularly  inter- 
ested in  the  league  movement  become  chairmen  of  the  finance  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  he  would  go  about  and  through  these  organ- 
izations in  the  State  they  would  solicit  subscriptions  ? 

Miss  Handy.  He  traveled  with  us  on  that  tour,  and  that  is  the 
only  work  he  ever  did  for  the  league. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  he  get  $28,000  of  that  money? 

Miss  Handy.  Not  he  alone.    He  had  to  have  a  corps  of  Avorkers. 

Senator  Reed.  With  him  on  that  trip  ? 

Miss  Handy.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  of  a  percentage  were  you  pajdng  them? 
Miss  Handy.  We  did  not  pay  them  a  percentage.    We  paid  them 
salaries. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  of  a  salary  did  this  head  man  get? 

Miss  Handy.  I  don't  know ;  I  think  it  was  a  couple  thousand  dol- 
lars for  a  period  of  six  months,  or  something  like  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Hov/  did  you  run  up  to  $28,000? 

Miss  Handy.  He  had  to*  have  the  traveling  expenses  and  he  had 
two  or  three  men  associated  with  him,  and  they  got  their  salaries  and 
expenses. 

Senator  Reed.  Didn't  they  all  generally  go  over  the  United  States? 
Miss  Handy.  Just  on  that  tour. 
Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  just  this  car. 
Miss  Handy.  That  was  the  only  time  he  was  with  us. 
Senator  Reed.  Did  they  make  trips  and  go  out  to  solicit  subscrip- 
tions? 

Miss  Handy.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Were  there  not  men  sent  to  the  city  of  Kansas  City, 
Avhere  I  live,  who  had  to  do  with  this  business  ? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  think  there  were  men  sent  to  Kansas  City. 
I  think  we  had  a  congress  in  St.  Louis,  and  the  man  might  have  gone 
from  the  congress  to  Kansas  City  to  do  some  work. 

Mr.  Mason.  My  impression  is  that  he  tried  to  raise  funds  in  Kan- 
sas City,  and  did  raise  some. 

Senator  Reed.  One  of  the  means  emplo3^ed  was  to  have  the  gov- 
ernor of  the  State  designate  men  as  delegates  to  these  conferences. 
That  is  one  of  the  plans,  is  it  not  ? 

Miss  Handy.  The  governor  would  be  invited  and  he  could  appoint 
representatives,  if  he  wanted  to,  or  not. 

Senator  Reed.  You  authorized  him  to  do  it  and  asked  him  to  do  it? 

Miss  Handy.  We  did  not  authorize  him ;  we  invited  him. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  an  authorization.  If  I  invite  3^ou  to  come 
into  my  house  I  authorize  you  to  come,  of  course. 

Miss  Handy.  No;  I  do  not  think  it  is  the  same  thing. 
^  Senator  Reed.  You  may  see  a  difference;  I  do  not;  but  it  is  all 
right.    When  these  delegates  came  to  this  convention  were  their 
expenses  paid? 

Miss  Handy.  Absolutely  not. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2661 


Senator  Reed.  Who  was  the  directing  mind  of  this  whole  scheme 
j    and  plan  ? 

'  :     Miss  Handy.  The  executive  committee  of  the  league,  as  a  whole. 

Senator  Reed.  What  I  read  you  a  moment  ago  in  these  figures 
which  I  gave  covers  a  period  only  from  Jul}^  1,  1919,  to  August  31, 
.1919,  just  two  months.  There  is  a  charge  for  executive  direction  of 
$22,680. 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  think  that  is  for  two  months. 

Senator  Rei']d.  I  do  not  think  I  am  in  error.  I  am  reading  from  the 

lower  part  of  the  page. 
1       Miss  Handy  (examining  the  paper).  This  is  a  mistake.  This 
^    should  be  1920  instead  of  August  31,  1919.   We  made  a  statement  to 

the  Senate  last  October,  and  that  statement  was  up  to  June  1,  1919, 
;    and  this  statement  brings  it  up  from  that  time  to  August  31,  1920. 
I       Senator  Reed.  AVill  you  look  at  this  again  and  see  if  the  other 
I  •  part  of  the  sheet  docs  not  carry  you  over  the  very  period  you  have 
(  mentioned? 

i       Miss  Handy.  The  upper  part  is  from  the  time  of  the  beginning 
i    of  the  league  up  to  August  31,  1920.    This  [indicating]  is  for  all 
j  ;the  time  the  league  has  been  in  existence,  and  the  other  is  for  a 
period  of  a  year  and  three  months. 

Senator  Reed.  It  appears  you  expended  for  the  organizing  of 
j  .  branches  $152,017.54. 

I  :     Miss  Handy.  During  the  whole  five  years. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  that  ought  to  have  resulted  in  the  or- 
ganization of  a  good  many  branches,  ought  it  not? 

Miss  Handy.  In  pro]:>aganda  Avork  you  have  to  spend  a  great  deal 
of  money  to  get  a  little  result.    The  result  I  think  was  mostly  in 
the  legislatures  of  the  States  adopting  resolutions  favoring  the 
i    league.   That  w^as  probably  the  biggest  result. 

I       S^enator  Reed.  Did  you  send  people  out  to  see  these  State  legis- 
I   latures?  ♦ 
^       Miss  Handy.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  How  did  you  reach  the  State  legislatures? 

Miss  Handy.  Throu.o'h  corres]:)ondence  nnd  sending  literature. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  the  only  way? 

Miss  Handy.  That  was  the  main  way.  Of  course,  our  field  man, 
Boyd,  went  from  State  to  State,  when  he  organized  and  created 
sentiment  in  that  way. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  not  have  delegations  go  to  the  State  legis- 
5. latures? 

1      Miss  Handy.  Not  that  I  know  of. 

ri  Senator  Reed.  Was  it  not  done  through  your  State  organizations; 
done  not  only  once  but  many  times? 

Miss  Handy.  They  probalDly  fostered  that  effort. 

Senator  Reed.  They  went  doAvn  and  lobbied ;  that  is  what  we  say 
!|.::"when  the  other  people  do  it.    Did  they  not  do  that? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  think  to  a  very  great  extent. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  to  what  extent?  We  might  differ  as  to  what 
a  very  great  extent  is. 

Miss  Handy.  I  never  knew  of  any  delegation,  and  it  never  came 
j  to  my  knowledge  that  they  went  to  a  legislature  to  offer  a  resolution, 
i  Senator  Reed.  When  I  use  the  term  "lobbying,"  I  mean  asking 
I  people  to  do  it. 


2662 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Miss  Handy.  I  understand  what  you  mean. 

Mr.  Mason.  That  term  has  ceased  to  be  odious,  I  think. 

Senator  Eeed.  It  depends  on  who  does  it.  The  Anti-Saloon 
League  does  it  and  it  is  all  right,  but  if  the  Saloon  League  does  it 
it  is  wicked. 

Mr.  Mason.  That  also  depends. 

Senator  Reed.  If  the  League  to  Enforce  Peace  does  it,  I  suppose, 
from  their  viewpoint,  it  is  all  right ;  and  if  the  other  side  did  it,  it 
would  be  very  wicked. 

What  is  the  committee  on  information  that  spent  $33,659.79? 

Miss  Handy.  That  is  the  committee  that  puts  out  publications  of 
the  league. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  just  the  salaries  of  the  committee?  That 
does  not  include  the  publications  themselves? 
Miss  Handy.  Not  the  printing;  no. 

Senator  Reed.  This  Washington  bureau  that  you  maintained  here 
at  the  time  the  debates  were  going  on  in  Congress  appears  to  have 
cost  you  $68,024.89. 

Mr.  Mason.  I  can  answer  that;  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  That  was  to  send  out  literature? 

Mr.  Mason.  No  ;  we  used  a  great  deal  of  that.  Senator — I  should 
say  at  least  50  per  cent  of  it  or  more — in  payment  of  bills  to  the  tele- 
graph companies  to  pay  for  telegraphic  stories  sent  out  each  day. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  a  good  many  telegraphic  stories  that 
were  sent  to  the  press? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  sent  a  great  many  stories.  Nearly  every  day, 
certainly  three  times  a  week,  stories  were  sent  to  a  great  many  news- 
papers, rates  prepaid,  night  press  rates.  We  usually  sent  them  at 
night  press  rates  prepaid. 

Senator  Reed.  So  you  would  get  such  statements  as  you  desired 
printed  in  that  way  by  paying  the  rates  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes.  Those  statements  consisted  of  either  interviews 
or  actual  happenings  on  the  floor  of  the  Senate  which  were  favor- 
able to  our  cause. 

Senator  Reed.  And  sometimes  comments? 

Mr.  Mason.  Whenever  we  could  get  it ;  yes,  sir.* 

Senator  Reed.  I  suppose  they  were  entirely  impartial  and  that  you 
sent  out  both  sides? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  did  not;  no,  sir.  We  sent  out  only  that  which 
would  help  us. 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  then  engaged  in  spending  this  money  in 
propaganda  to  influence  public  opinion  with  a  view  to  influencing 
legislation  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  hoped  to  do  that  very  thing. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  an  arrangement  made  by  which  let- 
ters and  telegrams  should  be  sent  to  Members  of  the  Senate  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  personally  delivered  two  or  three  kinds  of  books  to 
every  Member  of  the  House  and  Senate.  One  I  remember  was  Gold- 
smith's League  of  Nations,  and  then  The  Covenanter  I  personally 
delivered  to  every  Member  of  the  House  and  Senate.  If  you  did  not 
get  a  copy  I  am  sorry.  I  left  it  in  your  office.  We  sent  to  Members 
of  the  Senate  letters,  and  Mr.  Oscar  Straus  and  Mr.  William  Howard 
Taft  and  Mr.  Lowell,  of  Harvard,  came  here  and  personally  inter- 
viewed Members  of  the  Senate. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2663 


Senator  Eeed.  I  am  asking  now  about  an  arrangement  for  the 
sending  of-  telegrams  or  letters  to  Members  of  Congress. 

Mr.  Mason.  To  their  offices  here?  We  did  send  them  some  letters; 
yes. 

Senator  Reed.  You  had  a  great  many  sent  that  you  promoted,  did 
.  you  not? 

Mr.  Mason.  Oh,  you  mean  from  individuals? 
Senator  Eeed.  Yes. 
Mr.  Mason.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  were  your  telegraphic  charges  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  I  can  not  tell  offhand.    I  can  furnish  it  to  you. 
Senator  Reed.  They  were  very  much,  were  they  not  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  I  should  think  they  would  run  pretty  close  to  50  per 
t  cent  of  that  item  of  $68,000. 

'     Senator  Reed.  What  were  you  spending  $34,000  worth  of  telegrams 
for? 

Mr.  Mason.  About  98  per  cent  of  that  telegraphic  bill,  or  approxi- 
^  mately  those  figures,  were  for  articles  sent  to  newspapers,  interviews, 
■  report  of  the  proceedings  in  the  Senate  where  it  was  particularly 
favorable;  or  sometimes  we  did  send,  I  think,  material  that  was 
unfavorable,  but  Ave  did  not  send  it  with  a  desire  of  being  impartial 
in  the  matter.  We  send  it  for  the  purpose  of  influencing  public 
opinion  for  or  against  that  particular  Senator  from  that  particular 
section. 

Senator  Reed.  So  that  if  a  man  opi^sed  your  views  you  sent  out 
news  into  his  State  for  the  purpose  of  building  a  backfire  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  sent  out  the  actual  happenings  on  the  floor  of  the 
United  States  Senate  and  interviews  with  Members  of  th-e  United 
States  Senate  or  any  public  official  that  we  could  get. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  copies  of  this  matter  that  was  sent  out? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  Ave  have  a  file  of  CA^er^'^thing  Ave  sent. 

Senator  Reed.  I  would  like  to  have  it. 

Mr.  Mason.  All  right,  sir ;  you  shall  haA'^e  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Can  3^ou  get  it  down  here  in  Washington? 

Mr.  Mason.  No  ;  we  will  have  to  send  to  Ncav  York  for  it. 
,  Senator  Reed.  Will  you  send  it  to  me  at  Kansas  City,  Mo.? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  Avill  do  so. 
^  Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  undertake  to  haA^e  the  State  organiza- 
tions or  the  me*mbers  of  the  State  organizations  cooperate  Avith  you 
in  this  work 'that  you  Imxe  just  described  of  creating  a  local  senti- 
ment ? 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  eA^er  undertake  to  have  them  cooperate  in 
the  matter  of  writing  to  their  Senators  in  order  to  influence  their 
action  ? 

Mr.  Mason,  Yes,  sir.  This  is  the  character  of  that  [handing  Sena- 
tor Reed  a  x^aper] .  This  is  the  way  that  was  gotten  out.  That,  for 
instance,  went  to  Senator  Wadsworth  and  Senator  Calder. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  handed  me  a  paper  here  Avhich  you  say 
is  a  sample  of  the  work  done  in  various  States. 

Mr.  Mason.  No,  sir.  That  Avas  an  answer  to  your  direct  question 
-if  we  had  State  organizations  or  anyone  to  get  in  touch  with  their  in- 
dividual members  of  the  Senate,  and  that  was  the  manner  in  which 
we  did  so. 


2664 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  This  was  done  in  New  York  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  This  was  done  in  New  York. 
Senator  Reed.  In  the  form  indicated? 
Mr.  Mason.  In  that  form. 

Senator  Reed,  And  it  was  done  in  other  States  in  substantially 
the  same  way? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes;  but  not  quite  so  prominent. 

Miss  Handy.  I  think  tliat  was  the  best-organized  State. 

Mr.  Mason.  New  York  was  the  best-organized  State  organization 
to  begin  with.  It  was  not  as  efficiently  done  in  other  States  as  it 
w^as  done  in  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  Then  you  had  copies  of  this  not  only  sent  to  Sen- 
ator Wads  worth  and  Senator  Calder  but  to  otlier  members  of  the 
Senate,  did  you  not? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  think  we  had.  I  am  not  sure.  Then  we  gave  that 
out  to  the  press. 

Senator  Reed.  You  tried  to  carrj^  this  same  plan  out  in  all  the 
other  States? 

Mr.  Mason.  Not  in  all  the  States;  only  in  those  States  where  we 
had  a  fairly  good  organization. 

Senator  Reed.  You  had  a  pretty  good  organization  in  05  per  cent 
of  the  States? 

Mr.  Mason.  I  should  say  so. 

Senator  Reed.  So  it  now  begins  to  dawn  upon  me  Avhy  I  got  so 
many  letters  and  petitions.   You  people  were  promoting  them. 
Mr.  Mason.  We  helped  to  do  it. 

Senator  Reed.  I  knew  it,  and  that  is  the  reason  I  did  not  pay  any 
attention  to  them.  I  knew  it  was  not  any  spontaneous  uprising,  but 
that  it  was  being  promoted.  I  want  to  put  this  in  the  record  as  a 
sample  of  your  work.  ^  j 

(The  document  lef erred  to  is  as  follows:)  '  f  I 

To  Hon.  .Tames  W.  Wauswokth,  Jr., 
Hon.  William  M.  Calder, 

United  States  Senators. 

Gentlemen  :  The  undersigned,  regularly  enrolled  Republicans  of  the  State  of  i 
New  York,  respectfully  urge  that  political  partisanship  should  have  no  place  in  ! 
the  consideration  on  its  merits  of  the  constitution  of  the  proposed  League  of 
Nations.    The  Republican  Party,  which  has  done  so  much  to  promote  the  prin- 
ciple of  the  peaceful  settlement  of  international  disputes,  can  not  justly  be 
placed  in  an  attitude  of  hostility  to  the  project  adop?d  by  the  conference 
Paris  for  the  extension  of  that  principle  to  all  the  associated  nations  for  the 
purpose  of  averting  all  preventable  wars. 

The  undersigned  urge  that  the  treaty  containing  the  peace  covenant  be 
promptly  ratified  by  the  Senate  without  attempting  to  embarrass  it  by  amend- 
ment, thus  (l(-laying  the  conclusion  of  peace,  and  the  establishment  of  a  great 
agency  for  its  future  preservation. 

May  26,  1919. 

Henry  W.  Taft,  Herbert  Parsons,  Charles  H.  Strong,  Alford  E. 
Marling,  Edward  W.  Harris,  Charles  Whitman,  Paul  D.  Hernott, 
William  C.  Breed,  Lauren  Carroll,  Win.  L.  Ransom,  Sam  A. 
Lewesohn,  William  Chievers,  Adolph  Lewesohn,  Charles  D.  Hilles, 
Charles  D.  Norton.  Arthur  Curtiss  James,  Theodore  E.  Burton, 
H.  G.  Ward.  ^Ym.  H.  Wadhams,  Mary  G.  Hay,  Thos.  Feld,  Lewis 
H.  Pounds,  Wm.  Jay  Schieffelin  (per  W.  J.  S.,  jr.),  Wm.  Fel- 
lows Morgan,  Darwin  P.  Kingsley,  Wul  D.  Baldwin,  Oscar  S. 
Straus. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  want  to  get  from  you  in  some  way  if  I  can  the 
book  that  shows  who  3^ou  paid  these  moneys  to. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2665 


Miss  Handy.  Do  you  want  the  salaries  or  all  the  items  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  That  is  rather  a  huge  task  to  undertake.   We  will  be 
glad  to  give  you  anything  we  have,  of  course. 

Senator  Reed.  Haven't  you  a  book  that  shows  the  entries  ? 
Mr.  Mason.  We  have  ledgers  and  all  the  vouchers. 
Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  journal  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  If  you  will  indicate  just  what  you  want,  we  will  fur- 
nish it. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  a  journal? 

Miss  Handy.  I  do  not  Imow  anything  about  bookkeeping,  but  we 
have  a  ledger. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  but  a  ledger  is  a  book  into  which  has 
been  transposed  the  condensed  accounts  from  the  journal. 

Mr.  JNIason.  I  think  they  Avere  made  largely  from  the  vouchers. 
Everybody  that  got  a  dollar  had  to  sign  a  voucher  to  get  it,  and  it 
had  to  be  O.  K'd  by  two  people. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  spend  any  money  for  advertising? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes. 

Senator  Reed.  I  mean  outside  of  advertising  the  fact  that  there 

♦  was  going  to  be  a  meeting.   Did  you  ever  spend  any  money  for  put- 

•  ting  any  propaganda  articles  out  in  favor  of  the  league? 

Mr.  Mason.  We  printed  what  we  called  appeals  for  public  support 
of  the  movement. 

Senator  Reed.  When  I  say  "  printed  "  I  mean  you  printed  them  in 
papers  ? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes;  in  newspapers. 
Senator  Reed.  And  paid  for  it? 

Mr.  Mason.  Yes,  sir.   That  comes  under  these  items  of  publicity. 

Senator  Reed.  I  want  a  list  of  the  articles  that  you  paid  for ;  I  want 
the  articles  you  paid  for,  and  I  Avant  the  papers  in  which  they  were 
inserted  and  the  amount  of  money  paid  in  each  instance. 

Mr.  Mason.  We  have  those  original  vouchers. 

Senator  Reed.  If  you  have  a  journal,  by  which  I  mean  a  book  of 
,  original  entries  showing  these  disbursements,  with  the  names  of  the 
people,  and  I  could  look  at  that  I  could  save  you  probably  a  great  deal 
of  work. 

Miss  Handy.  We  will  be  glad  to  send  it  to  you. 
i  Senator  Reed.  If  you  have  not  that,  then  I  desire  particularly  this 
{3  information  I  have  just  asked  for  as  to  the  advertising  or  the  paid 
!  articles  you  put  in  the  newspapers  and  all  other  things  that  could 
be  embraced  under  the  term  of  advertising  or  propaganda.  I  would 
'  like  to  have  the  copies  or  the  privilege  of  inspecting  the  original  of  the 
letters  and  telegrams  that  you  have  sent  out. 

Miss  Handy.  What  kind  of  letters  and  telegrams? 
Mr.  Mason.  That  is  quite  a  voluminous  proposition. 
Senator  Reed.  Connected  with  the  business  in  any  way  of  carrying 
(   on  the  propaganda,  and  by  the  propaganda  I  mean  all  these  means 
'  used  to  influence  public  opinion. 

Miss  Handy.  It  would,  take  a  wagon  to  bring  that  stuff  down. 
Senator  Reed.  I  want  all  communications  with  foreign  govern- 
ments or  foreign  agencies  or  foreign  individuals  with  reference  to 
this  

^      Mr.  Mason  (interrupting).  Foreign  extension? 
Senator  Reed.  The  League  to  Enforce  Peace. 


2666 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Mason.  Senator,  you  are  asking  us  to  bring  down  the  whole 
office.  Is  there  any  way  the  committee  can  go  up  there  and  examine 
these  records  ?   It  would  take  a  van  to  bring  that  stuff  down  here. 

Senator  Reed.  With  the  understanding  that  these  matters  will  be 
turned  over  to  any  member  of  the  committee  or  representative  of  the 
committee  

Mr.  Mason.  Any  representative  of  the  committee  that  the  com- 
mittee wants  may  go  into  the  office  at  any  time  and  examine  anything 
we  have. 

Senator  Reed.  We  may  want  to  send  a  man  instead  of  going  our- 
selves. 

Mr.  Mason.  That  will  be  perfectly  all  right,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  With  that  understanding,  I  will  not  ask  to  have 
them  brought  here. 

Mr.  Mason.  Miss  Handy  is  there  all  the  time. 

Miss  Handy.  I  would  like  to  know  before  the  man  is  coming,  be- 
cause there  is  a  great  deal  of  material  in  storage  and  we  will  have  to 
get  it  out  and  bring  it  into  the  office. 

Mr.  Mason.  Since  the  political  conventions  we  have  given  up  the 
big  office  and  are  only  using  a  small  office,  because  we  are  doing  no  . 
work  at  this  time. 

Senator  Reed.  Miss  Handy,  you  are  in  charge  of  the  New  York 
office? 

Miss  Handy.  I  am  Mr.  Short's  assistant. 

Senator  Reed.  If  we  give  you  three  or  four  days'  notice,  will  that 
be  sufficient? 

Miss  Handy.  I  think  so,  if  I  can  hire  a  floor  to  put  it  on.  We  have 
very  small  quarters,  and  I  do  not  know  whether  I  can  get  it  out  of 
storage  quickly  because  of  the  movers'  strike.  I  have  been  trying  to 
get  some  things  moved  recently,  but  could  not  do  it.  If  the  moving 
situation  has  cleared  up  in  New  York  so  that  I  can  get  these  things 
out  of  storage,  I  will  be  glad  to  do  it  on  three  or  four  daj^s'  notice. 

Mr.  Mason.  We  will  get  them  out  for  you  any  time  the  committee 
wants  them. 

Senator  Reed.  With  that  understanding,  we  will  let  Miss  Handy 
go  to  catch  her  train. 

Miss  Handy.  Thank  you. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  W.  H.  FOLWELL. 

(The  witness  was  dul}^  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 

The  Chairman.  Give  me  your  name,  please,  for  the  record. 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  W.  H.  Folwell. 

The  Chairman.  Where  is  your  home? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Marion,  Pa. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  business? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Manufacturer  of  dress  goods — women's  dress  goods. 
The  Chairman.  Are  you  connected  with  the  ways  and  means  com- 
mittee for  Pennsylvania  of  the  Republican  national  committee? 
Mr.  FoLAVELL.  I  am  chairman. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  organization?    Go  ahead  and  de- 
scribe it  to  us  in  3^our  own  way. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2667 


Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  we  have  just  begun,  Senator.  I  was  not  ap- 
pointed until  the  12th  of  August,  and  I  have  just  finished  getting 
a  committee  in  Philadelphia. 

The  Chairman.  How  large  a  committee  do  you  have  in  Philadel- 
phia ? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  About  25  men  and  the  same  number  of  women. 
The  CiiAiRMAN.  Have  you  a  list  of  names  of  those  people? 
Mr.  FoLw^ELL.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  you  now  hand  the  reporter  is  a  list  of  the 
committee  in  Philadelphia? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes;  and  the  names  in  pencil  are  the  committees 
so  far  formed  in  the  city. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  on  the  same  sheet? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  On  the  same  sheet ;  yes,  sir. 

(The  two  lists  refefred  to  are  here  printed  in  full,  as  follows:) 

Ways  and  Means  Committee  of  the  Republican  National  Committee  for 

Pennsylvania. 

W.  H.  Folwell,  chairman  and  treasurer. 
Mrs.  George  Horace  Lorimer,  vice  chairman. 
Chester  W.  Hill,  secretary, 

committee. 


Mrs.  Dobson  Altemus. 
Mrs.  George  Fales  Baker. 
Mrs.  Edward  Biddle. 
^Edward  W.  Bok. 
.-Charles  Bower, 
Millard  D.  Brown. 
Alfred  E.  Burk. 
Percy  M.  Chandler. 
Mrs.  Herbert  L.  Clark. 
J.  Howell  Ciimmings. 
Mrs,  Cyrus  H,  K.  Curtis. 
Thomas  Develon. 
James  Dobson. 
Mrs.  George  A.  Dunning. 
Charles  J.  Eisenlohr. 
Countess  de  Santa  Eulalia. 
Mrs.  Stanley  G.  Flagg. 
Miss  Helen  Fleischer. 
Nathan  T.  Folwell. 
Charles  L,  Gilliland. 
Mrs.  John  Giibbel. 
Walter  J.  Hallahan. 
Mrs,  Charles  C,  Harrison,  jr. 
Ilol)ert  P,  Hooper. 
Charles  Jacobs. 
Thomas  J,  Jeffries. 
Mrs.  C.  Hartman  Kuhn. 


Mrs.  William  E,  Lingelbach. 
Mrs,  J,  Bertram  Lippincott. 
Mrs,  William  L.  McLean. 
Mrs,  J,  Willis  Martin. 
E,  Clarence  Miller. 
Allen  R,  Mitchell,  jr. 
W.  Park  Moore. 
Mrs.  H.  S.  Prentiss  Nichols. 
Mrs,  John  C,  Norris. 
Mrs,  I,  H.  O'Hai  a. 
Mrs,  Giftbrd  Pinchot. 
Mr?  Thomas  Robins. 
WaUer  R,  Rossniassler. 
William  H.  Richardson. 
William  F,  Sauter. 
Philip  T.  Sharpies. 
Joseph  N.  Snellenburg. 
Mrs.  Robert  E.  Strawbridge. 
Mrs.  Charlemagne  Tower. 
Mrs.  Walter  S.  Thomson. 
AVilliam  L.  Turner. 
Samuel  M,  Vauclain. 
Charles  P,  Vaughan. 
Mrs,  Barclay  H.  Warburton. 
Mrs.  William  G,  Warden. 
Charles  J.  Webb. 
Alan  D.  Wood. 


PHILADELPHIA  COMMITTEE. 


Harvey  O,  Scott. 
C.  F,  Armstrong. 
Ira  W.  Shotton. 
R.  P.  M,  Davis. 


J.  H.  Myer. 
W.  C,  Washburn. 
J.  G,  Atlee. 
L.  A.  Howell. 


The  (yHAiRMAN.  Have  you  organizations  in  each  county 
Mr.  Folwell.  We  have  not  as  yet ;  we  hope  to  have. 


2668 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Have  you  a  quota  for  the  State  of  Pennsylvania  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  have  not. 

The  Chairman.  Received  from  Mr.  Upham  or  anyone? 
Mr.  FoLAVELL.  They  never  talked  quota  to  me  at  all. 
The  Chairman.  How  much  are  you  trying  to  raise? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  I  have  not  arrived  at  any  figure.  That  is  most 
difficult. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  raise  all  you  can  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  All  we  can. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  from  what  sources  are  you  trying  to  get 
contributions  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  We  are  trying  to  get  contributions  from  everyone 
who  is  interested  in  the  success  of  the  Kepublican  Party. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  limiting  the  contributions  to  any  sum? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  there  seems  to  be  a  general  understanding 
that  they  are  not  to  exceed  a  thousand  dollars. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  had  any  contributions  of  over  a  thou- 
sand dollars? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Mow  many  of  a  thousand  dollars  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  You  see,  we  have  only  got  started.    I  am  rather- 
ashamed  of  this  report,  but  there  are  only  three. 
Senator  Edge,  what  is  your  total? 
'i  he  Chairman.  \  es ;  what  have  you  collected  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  $8,561. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  come  through  your  hands  in  any  way, 
or  does  it  go  to  the  treasurer  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELE.  Comes  to  me. 

The  Chairman.  And  then  do  you  send  it  on  to  the  national 
treasurer? 

Mr.  1^  OLWELL.  I  have  not  sent  any  on  as  yet. 
The  Chairman.  But  you  have  that  money  to  send  ? 
Senator  Reed.  You  are  going  to  send  it  on  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  That  is  my  understanding. 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  have  any  arrangement  for  division  of 
the  money  you  raise  in  smj  proportion  between  the  State  and  the 
national  committees? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No;  no  arrangement. 

The  Chairman.  The  State  raises  its  own  money? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No;  I  understand  I  am  making  this  campaign  for 
the  national  committee,  the  senatorial  committee,  and  the  congres- 
sional committee,  and  the  State  committee;  but  how  it  is  to  be  di- 
Added,  I  do  not  know  anything  about  that.  I  understand  that  is 
up  to  the  finance  committee  of  the  national  committee. 

The  Chairman.  Have  you  no  idea  what  you  expect  to  raise  in 
Philadelphia,  or  in  the  whole  State  of  Pennsylvania?  Have  you 
no  budget? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  Absolutely. 

The  Chairman.  And  no  quotas? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  We  can  not  get  at  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  seen  the  neAvspaper  accounts,  at  least, 
of  the  testimony  taken  before  this  committee  in  relation  to  quotas? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  saw  some  of  it. 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN-  EXPENSES.  2669 

The  Chairman.  You  have  nothino:  of  that  kind  in  Pennsylvania  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  They  have  not  mentioned  a  word  about  quotas 
to  me. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  organize  different  branches  of  industry 

such  as  the  chemical  

Mr.  FoLWELL.  That  is  what  I  have  been  endeavoring  to  do 
The  Chairman.  After  the  Red  Cross  plan? 

Mr.  P'oLWELL.  It  is  a  sort  of  popular  idea — yes:  as  nearly  as 
possible.  ^    '  J 

The  Chairman.  How  do  you  do  that?  Take  the  woolen  manu- 
I  j  facturers'  names  ? 

I    Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  I  have  asked  a  prominent  wool  man  to  take 
I  the  chairmanship  of  that  subcommittee. 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  that  ? 

Mr.  Foi.WELL.  Mr.  Charles  J.  Webb,  I  think,  in  Philadelphia.  - 
The  Chairman.  Is  he  a  wool  man  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  A  wool  man. 

The  Chairman.  Take  steel;  do  you  have  any  organization  to  col- 
|!  [  lect  money  among  the  steel  industry  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  that  is  not  perfected  as  yet. 
The  Chairman.  But  you  intend  to  do  that  ? 
t    Mr.  FoLWELL.  Wa  hope  to. 

The  Chairman.  Who  is  to  be  your  chairman  of  that? 
Mr.  FoLAVELL.  Mr.  Vauclain. 
-!    The  Chairman.  Who  is  he  ? 

I    Mr.  FoLAVELL.  President  of  the  Baldwin  Locomotive  AVorks. 
I  ^  The  Chairman.  Among  the  railroads  do  you  have  an  organiza- 
Uion?    What  other  organizations  have  you 'among  other  Imes  of 
industry  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Mr.  Bower  for  chemicals,  Mr.  Millard  D.  Brown 
for  woolen  yarns,  Mr.  Burk  for  leather,  Mr.  Cummins  for  hats 
James  Dobson  for  textile^,  Charles  Eisenlohr  for  the  tobacco  in- 
dustry, and  Mr.  Hallahan  for  the  shoe  industry,  Mr.  Moore  for 
hosiery,  Mr.  Rossmassler  for  the  silk  industry,  Mr.  Richardson  for 
the  worsted  yarns,  Mr.  Sauter— he  is  on  the  metal  subcommittee 
Mr.  Turner  for  the  lace  industry,  and  Mr.  Webb  for  the  wool.  That 
is  about  the  list. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Folwell,  what  do  you  think  it  is  possible  to 
raise,  from  your  past  experience  in  Pennsylvania? 
.    Mr.  Folwell.  Well,  I  have  had  no  past  experience  in  Pennsyl- 
vania. 

!    The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  what  was  raised  four  years  ao-o  in 
Pennsylvania?  ^ 

Mr.  Folwell.  No,  sir. 
h  Chairman.  But  you  have  no  limit  on  the  amount  to  be  raised? 

j    Mr.  Folwell.  No. 

*  The  Chairman.  You  are  going  to  raise  all  you  can  in  these  dif- 
ferent ways  ? 

*  Mr.  Folwell.  Yes. 

}    The  Chairman.  You  have  not  set  any  figure? 
J.  Mr.  Folwell.  No. 

i  Senator  Reed.  Haven't  you  had  some  talk  about  figures? 

r  Mr.  Folwell.  Well,  I  have  had  some  talk  with  some  of  the  com- 

imittee,  and  they  have  said,  "  Well,  I  don't  think  we  will  get  $100,000," 


2670  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

and  some  have  said,  "AVe  will  get  $150,000,"  and  something  like 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  think  that  in  any  possible  way  you  could 
raise  a  half  million  dollars  in  Pennsylyania?  hard 
Mr  FoLWELL.  From  present  indications  it  would  be  very  hard. 
The  Chairman.  Is  there  a  lack  of  enthusiasm  in  Pennsylvania? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  No :  I  do  not  think  so.  ,  „„„t^„ 

The  Chairman.  It  is  considered  of  no  use  in  any  State  contro- 

'''^Mr.'  FoLWELL.  There  may  be  some  overconfidence  on  the  part  of 

^The'^CHAiRMAN.  What  are  the  Democrats  doing  in  Pennsylvania 

toward  raising  money  ? 

Mr  FoLWELL.  I  really  do  not  know.  .  . 

Senator  Reed.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  Pennsylyania  is  pretty  nearly 
broke,  is  it  not?    Particularly  these  industries? 

Mr.  FoLWELK  Some  of  them  are  m  a  fair  way  to  be  broke 

Senator  Reed.  Are  they  in  a  fair  way  to  go  broke,  because  the  elec- 
tion mav  iro  wron^:  from  their  standpoint  ?  ,      .       iS?  • 

Mr  FOLWELL,.  No;  they  are  suffering,  as  the  country  is  suffering, 
from  war  inflation,  you  know.    They  want  to  get  down  to  a  business 

^lenato^REED.  Then,  they  would  be  interested,  would  they  not,  in 
helping  to  bring  that  about  ? 

Mr.  FoLw^ELL.  Yes,  sir.  ,     /.       i  • 

Senator  Reed.  These  industries  that  you  speak  of  are  large  indus- 
tries in  your  great  State,  are  they  not  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  They  are.    '  ,  i  t.. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  intend  to  go  to  the  people,  of  course,  who 
are  interested  in  order  to  get  this  money? 

Mr  FoLWELL.  I  expect  my  committee  to  see  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  you  have  named  a  number  of  men  here,  onr 
of  them  representing  chemicals,  another  one  wool,  and  ditteren. 
branches  of  industry.    These  men  are  nearly  all  men  of  affairs  and 

money,  are  they?  ^  ^    n        i^i.        „  t 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Some  of  them;  they  are  not  all  wealthy  men.  1 

would  not  say  so.  ,0 
Senator  Reed.  They  are  men  that  have  money  i 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  They  are  well  to  do. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  I  do  not  know  what  you  call  ^^i-tO; 
do  "  in  Pennsylvania.  It  might  be  what  we  call  rich  out  m  the  W  est. 
Now  you  have  all  these  industries  represented.  Who  represents  the 
plain  common  people  to  net  money  out  of  them?  Y  ou  have  no  com- 
mittee to  go  out  and  get  small  subscriptions,  have  yo^. 

Mr  FoLWELL.  We  are  circulating  a  lot  of  books  like  this  [exhibit - 
ino-  a'book  of  blank  subscription  forms]— the  women  are  circulating 
them.   That  is  the  part  the  women  are  taking  on  the  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  Describe  that  book  for  the  record;  say  what  it  is. 

Mr  FoLWELL.  It  is  for  small  contribuations. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  are  organizing  the  women  to  present 
those  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  That  is  their  intention.  ^ 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  quite  a  woman's  organization,  have  you^ 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes ;  the  names  are  all  there,  Senator. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2671 


Senator  Reed.  You  really  do  not  expect  the  ladies  to  raise  much 
money,  do  you  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  They  will  raise  all  they  can. 

Senator  Reed.  And  the  money  is  going  to  be  gotten  from  these 
industries,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr,  Folwell.  The  money  comes,  of  course,  from  individuals, 
Senator. 

t  Senator  Reed.  Certainly,  but  it  comes  from  individuals  who  are 
i  connected  with  these  businesses?    You  get  a  man  in  the  chemical 

business  to  go  out  and  see  men  who  are  manufacturing  or  dealing 

in  chemicals? 
Mr.  Folwell.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  a  man  from  the  wool  business  to  see  the  w^ool 
men  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  know,  of  course,  that  you  do  not  allow  a 
corporation  to  subscribe,  because  that  is  illegal,  but  you  go  to  the  men 
who  own  the  corporation  to  get  the  money.    That  is  the  way  it  is 
'  done?    I  am  not  saying  that  there  is  anything  wrong  about  it,  but 

that  is  the  way  it  is  done,  is  it  not  ? 
;     Mr.  FoLAVELL.  Oh,  we  go  to  these  men  who  are  in  business,  whether 
!  they  are  interested  in  corporations  or  in  partnerships. 

I^^enator  Edge.  Will  you  kindly  state  again  how  much  you  have 
I  raised  to  date  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  $8,561. 

Senator  Edge.  Your  committeemen  are  all  organized  now? 

Mr.  Folwell.  No  ;  they  are  not  all  organized. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  reall}^  started  to  work  yet? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  would  hardly  say  so;  just  got  together. 

Senator  Edge.  Would  you  be  satisfied  if  you  raised  $150,000? 
'  Would  you,  as  chairman  of  the  committee? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Well,  it  would  seem  rather  small  for  the  great  State 
of  Pennsylvania,  but  I  would  be  satisfied,  because  we  are  all  work- 
ing as  hard  as  we  can. 

Senator  Edge.  Approximate!}^,  what  is  the  population  of  Penn- 
sylvania ? 

Mr.  FoLW^ELL.  r  am  sorry  I  can  not  answer  that,  Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  I  can  not  myself  at  the  moment. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  it  is  about  six  and  a  half  million.  Senator. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  about  one  fifteenth  of  the  population  of  the 
country.  On  that  basis  you  could,  from  the  standpoint  of  popula- 
tion, raise  pretty  nearly  a  million  dollars  before  you  got  to  the  total 
of  that  $15,000,000  that  we  have  heard  so  much  about,  could  you  not? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  imagine  so. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  figures,  that  is  correct,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  suppose  so.  I  would  want  to  figure  it  out  first; 
but  that  part  of  it  never  interested  me. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  it  interests  this  committee,  and  inasmuch  as 
you  do  not  have  a  maximum  I  am  trying  to  help  you  out  a  little  bit. 

Mr.  FoLW^ELL.  That  is  very  considerate,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  any  doubt  at  all  of  your  ability  to 
raise  a  very  larger  sum  than  $100,000  when  you  get  all  these  com- 
mittees to  work,  have  you  ? 

182774— 20— PT  20  i 


2672 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  lam  rather  a  little  doubtful  about  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Wouldn't  you  like  to  take  the  contract  to  raise  that 
if  you  were  to  get  all  there  was  over  it  ? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  It  would  depend  on  what  the  other  side  of  the  con- 
tract was. 

Senator  Eeed.  Have  you  ever  had  any  talk  with  Mr.  Hays?  When 
did  you  see  Mr.  Hays? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  saw  him  at  an  organization  meeting  we  had  about 
two  weeks  ago. 

Senator  Keed.  Where  was  that? 

Mr.  FoLWEEL.  In  the  Manufacturers'  Club  of  Philadelphia. 
Senator  Eeed.  Who  was  present?    I  do  not  mean  just  to  name  the 

individuals  

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Mr.  Hays,  ex-Senator  Weeks,  and  Mr.  Blaine. 
Senator  Reed.  Anybody  else  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  From  the  national  committee?  Oh,  yes;  I  had  the 
men  that  I  had  asked  to  become  members  of  the  Philadelphia  com- 
mittee there — a  sort  of  reception. 

Senator  Reed.  How  large  a  crowd  did  you  have  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  There  Avere  about  146  people  present,  I  believe. 

Senator  Reed.  They  were  capitalists  principally  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No ;  I  think  mostly  business  men. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  large  business  men? 

Mr.  Folw^ell.  Not  the  majority. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  know  where  you  draw  the  line  betw^een  a 
capitalist  and  a  business  man. 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  think  there  is  a  distinction. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  maybe  there  is.  I  do  not  mean  to  cavil  with 
you. 

Senator  Edge.  Betw^een  New  York  and  Philadelphia,  Senator. 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  think  that  is  about  it.  [Laughter.] 
Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  some  bankers  there  ? 
Mr.  FoLW^ELL.  There  were  two  bankers,  I  believe. 
Senator  Reed.  Some  manufacturers  there  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  In  a  word,  you  had  a  pretty  representative  crowd 
of  the  prominent  wealthy  Republicans  of  the  city.  That  is  right, 
is  it  not? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  And  they  came  there  to  meet  Mr.  Hays,  ex-Senator 
Weeks,  and  Mr.  Blaine? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  I  know  Senator  Weeks.  He  talked  about  money, 
didn't  he? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  all  talking  about  money? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  How  much  money  did  Mr.  Hays  say  the  great 
State  of  Pennsylvania,  with  all  its  vast  interests,  ought  to  raise? 
Mr.  Folwell.  His  remarks  did  not  bear  on  that  point. 
Senator  Reed.  How  much  did  Weeks  say? 
Mr.  Folwell.  He  said  nothing  of  the  kind. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  did  say  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  No  one.  /  = 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGlSr  EXPENSES. 


2673 


Senator  Reed.  What  did  you  talk  about  ? 

Mr.  P'oLWELL.  We  talked  about  the  necessity  for  electing  a  Re- 
publican Congress  and  Senate  and  President  and  Vice  President. 

Senator  Reed.  And  raising  the  money,  didn't  you  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  We  talked  about  the  necessity  of  raising  money  for 
legitimate  campaign  expenses. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right.  I  am  not  saying  anything  is  legitimate 
or  illegitimate ;  I  am  just  talking  now  about — you  were  there  to  dis- 
cuss money,  were  you  not? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Surely. 

Senator  Reed.  And  you  said  something  about  amounts? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Well,  there  was  nothing  said  about  amounts. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  a  single  word  whispered  or  breathed  about  how 
much  the  great  State  of  Pennsylvania  ought  to  raise?  What  were 
you  doing  down  there?  Sucking  your  thumbs,  or  were  you  down 
there  to  do  business  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  We  were  down  there  to  get  a  little  pep  into  this 
Philadelphia  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  To  do  what  ? 

Mr.  Folavell.  To  get  them  started  to  work. 

Senator  Reed.  To  do  what  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  To  get  money. 

Senator  Reed.  Hoav  much? 

Mr.  Folwell.  There  was  nothing  said  about  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  it  indicated  that  it  was  to  be  a  little  petty 
larceny  amount,  or  was  it  going  to  be  a  substantial  amount?  I  do 
not  want  to  cavil  with  you.  • 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  do  not  want  to  cavil  with  you.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  But  it  is  impossible  to  me  that  that  sort  of  meeting 
should  be  held  and  you  talk  about  raising  money,  and  that  nobody 
suggested  that  you  ought  to  raise  this  much  or  that  much. 

Mr.  Folwell.  There  Avas  nothing  said  about  amounts. 

Senator  Reed.  You  absolutely  kept  silent  on  that? 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  meeting  held  since  we  have  held  sessions 
of  this  committee  in  Chicago? 
i    Mr.  Folwell.  It  was. 

'    Senator  Reed.  I  can  understand  it  now.    Haven't  you  got  any  let- 
ters from  anybody  about  it?    Have  you  talked  to  Senator  Penrose 
about  it  ? 
Mr.  Folwell.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  When  did  you  see  Penrose? 
Mr.  Folwell.  I  saw  him,  I  think,  about  three  weeks  ago. 
Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  Penrose  did  not  say  anything  about 
,  money  to  you,  did  he? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  came  to  consult  him.    I  have  known  him  for  very 
many  years,  and  I  wanted  to  get  a  little  advice  as  to  whether  he 
thought  I  ought  to  do  this  thing  or  not.    He  told  me  they  wanted 
^  new  blood  in  the  proposition  and  it  was  m^^  duty  to  do  it. 
;    Senator  Edge.  Have  you  ever  held  a  political  office  yourself  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  No,  sir. 
!     Senator  Edge.  You  are  just  taking  this  up,  then,  from  the  stand- 
point of  the  general  citizen  interested  in  Republican  success  ?  Is 
that  it? 

I    Mr.  Folwell.  Correct. 


2374 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Eeed.  When  you  talked  to  Penrose  did  either  of  you  say 
anything  about  amounts  of  money? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  In  the  way  of  quotas? 

Senator  Keed.  No  ;  about  amounts  of  money.  I  want  to  make  this 
question  wide  open. 

Mr.  FoEWELL.  It  makes  it  difficult  to  answer. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  talk  about  amounts  of  money  for  campaign 
purposes  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  We  talked  about  money,  but  w^e  did  not  have  any 
definite  fixed  amounts  to  talk  about. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  definite  fixed  amounts.  Were  any 
amounts  mentioned? 

Mr.  FOLWEEL.  No. 

Senator  Reed.  Not  any  amount  at  all? 

Mr.  P'oLWELL.  Well,  now,  in  the  way  of  what  we  should  raise,  no. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  talkins:  about  in  the  way  of  what  you 
should  raise ;  I  want  it  without  limitation.  Was  there  any  amount  of 
money  named  there  at  that  meeting? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  The  only  amount  that  w^as  mentioned  or  discussed 
was  this  $1,000  maximum. 

Senator  Reed.  What  did  Penrose  think  of  that,  anyhow? 

Mr.  Folw^ell.  Well,  he  seemed  to  think  it  was  a  new  idea,  and  as 
these  Red  Cross  drives  had  been  successful,  if  we  could  put  it  across 
it  would  be  very  valuable  to  the  party. 

Senator  Reed.  If  you  could  put  it  across?  He  didn't  thmk  you 
could  put  it  across,  did  he?  i  -j 

Mr.  FoLw^ELL.  Well,  he  did  not  want  to  discourage  me,  so  he  said 
nothing  of  the  kind.  , 

Senator  Reed.  You  talked  about  the  $1,000  hmitation,  but  was 
there  not  anything  said  about  "  AVe  ought  to  be  able  to  raise  so  much 
jnoney" — not  as  a  quota,  but  as  mere  discussion? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Nothing  whatever  was  said  about  what  had  been 
raised  in  past  campaigns  and  what  could  be  done? 
Mr,  FoLWELL.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Nothing  was  said  about  these  great  mterests  you 
represented  here  being  interested  in  the  result  of  the  campaign  ? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Those  interests  Avere  mentioned,  naturally. 
Senator  Reed.  As  being  interested? 
Mr.  FoLAVELL.  As  being  interested? 

Senator  Reed.  Noav,  there  have  been  a  number  of  other  promi- 
nent Republicans  down  there  in  Pennsylvania,  have  there  not,  from 

outside?  .        1  Q 

Mr.  Folaveel.  You  mean  to  come  into  the  State  ? 

Senator  Reed.  They  came  into  the  State  on  political  pilgrimages. 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  I  do  not  knoAv  that  there  have  been. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  about  some  of  the  other  men  coming 
to  visit  Senator  Penrose?  .     -n  i 

Mr.  FoLAVELE.  No,  sir.  You  see,  the  Senator  was  quite  ill,  and  our 
intervieAvs  Avere  very  short.  i      o  i. 

Senator  Reed.  I  knoAV.  But  do  you  knoAv  about  other  Senators 
coming  there  to  visit  him  ?  Do  you  knoAv  about  it  ?  HaA^e  you  heard 
about  it? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  knoAV  nothing  about  it. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2675 


Senator  Eeed.  So  in  all  these  talks  Avith  all  these  men  nobody  has 
ever  said  once,  "  AVe  ought  to  raise  this  much  money  or  that  much 
money  "  ? 

Mr^  FoLWELL.  The:  e  has  been  no  definite  amount. 
Senator  Eeed.  Was  there  an  indefinite  amount? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  the  whole  thing  has  been  indefinite. 
Senator  Reed.  But  did  somebody  say, We  ought  to  raise  about  so 
much  "  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No ;  I  do  not  remember  of  that  having  been  said.  I 
myself  have  not  said  it;  I  tell  you  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  there  any  particular  reason  for  your  steering 
clear  of  that  question  and  all  of  you  avoiding  it  as  a  dangerous  thing? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  It  would  be  rather  undesirable,  I  imagine,  in  view 
of  the  publicity  that  has  been  given  to  the  so-called  slush  fund. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh  !  AVas  it  suggested,  then,  that  in  view  of  the 
publicity  you  had  better  not  mention  amounts  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  may  have  suggested  that  myself.  [Laughter.] 
But  it  did  not  come  from  anyone  else. 

Senator  Reed.  You  had  that  in  mind,  then  ? 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  matter  of  fact,  is  it  not  true  you  were  quite 
positive  3^ou  could  not  raise  an  amount  that  in  any  way  could  be 
justifiably  criticized  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Certainly  ;  I  have  always  felt  that. 
.     Senator  Reed.  If  you  raised  a  million  dollars  you  Avould  not  think 
i  that  could  be  justifiably  criticized  if  it  were  spent  for  legitimate  cam- 
paign purposes? 

Mr.  FoLWFLL.  That  is  pretty  far  out  of  the  range  of  possibilities, 
'  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Oh,  I  don't  know ;  not  in  view  of  the  past.  That  is 
all. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Folwell. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  JOHN  L.  GRAYOT. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Will  you  please  state  your  full  name  for  the 
record,  Mr.  Grayot? 
Mr.  Grayot.  John  L.  Grayot.  ' 
The  Chairman.  And  where  is  your  home,  Mr.  Grayot? 
Mr.  Grayot.  Madisonville,  Ky. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  chairman  of  the  Democratic  State  central 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  ^^o,  sir;  I  am  chairman  of  the  State  campaign  com- 
mittee of  Kentucky. 

The  Chairman.  How  does  that  differ  from  the  Democratic  State 
central  committee? 

I  Mr.  Grayot.  We  have  a  little  different  way  of  conducting  the  cam- 
paigns in  Kentucl^y  than  in  other  States.  We  have  a  State  central 
committee  and  an  executive  committee,  and  then  we  have  in  each 
county  a  chairman  of  an  executive  committee  and  a  county  committee, 
but  when  the  campaign  comes  on  for  the  past  several  years  the  State 
central  and  executive  committees  appoint  a  chairman  of  a  State  cam- 
paign committee,  and  he  forms  a  campaign  committee.  They  au- 
thorize him  to  do  that. 


2676 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  And  you  are  chairman  of  that  committee? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir.  He  then  has  to  form  in  each  county  a  cam- 
paign committee,  and  the  chairman  of  that  is  distinct  from  the  county 
executive  committee.   It  is  a  new  committee  entirely. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  committee  entirely  for  the  purpose  of  rais- 
ing funds? 

Mr.  Grayot.  It  is  for  the  purpose  of  conducting  the  campaign  in 
the  State.  The  State  central  and  State  executive  committee  then  just 
retire  and  have  nothing  to  do  except  to  take  an  interest.  They  have 
nothing  to  do  with  the  actual  conduct  of  the  campaign. 

The  Chairman.  You  are  practically  the  head  of  the  committee 
that  is  conducting  the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  What  system  have  you  for  raising  funds  in  Ken- 
tucky? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Well,  I  want  to  have  a  system — the  head  of  the 
finance  division  planned  to  have  county  chairmen  and  precinct  chair- 
men, men  and  women,  take  contributions,  along  the  line  of  a  dollar 
contribution  plan. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  a  State  chairman,  then,  of  a  finance 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  No,  sir;  the  gentleman  I  appointed  is  the  chairman 
of  the  finance  division. 

The  Chairman.  And  his  duty  is  to  raise  funds  in  each  county  ? 
Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  do  that  yourself  ? 
Mr.  Grayot.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  send  out  the  literature,  Mr.  Grayot? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  send  out  some  literature,  and  some  he  sends  out. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  have  any  list  of  Federal  employees  as 
distinguished  from  other  Democrats  from  Avhom  you  solicit  funds  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Personally  I  do  not  know  anything  about  that.  Sen- 
ator. As  I  stated  to  you,  they  have  had  a  permanent  organization 
there  with  permanent  headquarters  for  the  last  three  or  four  years 
My  information  is  that  they  have  lists  of  all  kinds — physicians,  min- 
isters of  the  gospel,  lawyers,  and  I  imagine  Federal  emploj^ees  also. 
I  do  not  know  whether  they  are  classified  as  that,  but  I  imagine  they 
are  in  some  of  the  lists.  » 

The  Chairman.  Are  the  letters  that  are  sent  out  soliciting  funds 
signed  by  you? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  have  signed  some. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  really  the  reason  we  have  called  you  here. 
A  letter  was  presented — a  copy  of  a  letter  or  a  picture  of  a  letter.  I 
will  submit  it  to  you  [handing  paper  to  witness]. 

Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  a  letter  that  I  sent  out — that  I  au- 
thorized to  be  sent  out. 

The  Chairman.  Was  this  letter  a  form  of  letter  that  was  sent  to 
Federal  officials? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Well,  I  take  it  from  one  paragraph  there  that  it  was 
sent  there. 

The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

The  fire  of  the  Republican  organization  is  being  directed  daily  on  the  Demo- 
cratic administration  during  the  past  eight  years. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2677 


You  have  been  a  part  of  that  organization  ? 
Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Now,  you  say,  "  I  would  appreciate  it  if  you  can 
send  me  check  or  money  order  for  $40,  to  be  divided  into  install- 
ments, etc." 

How  did  you  arrive  at  the  amount  that  you  sought  to  collect  from 
the  Federal  officials? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  did  not  fix  the  amount,  except  just  the  general  in- 
struction to  make  it  a  low,  reasonable  amount. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  anything  in  any  way  assessed  on  sal- 
aries ?  For  instance,  did  you  have  sluj  s^^stem  of  taking  a  postmaster's 
salary  and  assessing  a  certain  per  cent? 

Mr.  Grayot.  No,  sir;  not  to  my  knowledge.  This  is  no  assessment, 
Senator.  I  notice  that  that  is  asked  just  as  a  contribution;  I  would 
have  no  authorit}^  to  make  an  assessment.  I  specify  the  amount,  be- 
cause I  wanted  it  Ioav  and  reasonable. 

The  Chairman.  The  letter  seems  to  have  been  prepared  with  a 
blank  place  for  the  amount  and  the  amount  filled  in. 

Mr.  Grayot.  That  is  my  recollection  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  have  those  form  letters  for  officials,  with 
the  space  for  the  amount  left  blank,  and  that  is  filled  in  by  some- 
body.   By  whom  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  think  by  the  secretary;  I  am  not  positive  of  that. 
I  approved  this  letter.  I  authorized  it  to  be  sent  out,  as  I  stated, 
with  this  blank.  Of  course,  just  one  copy  of  it  was  presented  to  me. 
1  think  the  list  of  names  was  gotten  from  the  permanent  headquarters 
list,  which  I  have  never  seen,  and  the  amounts  placed,  as  I  understand 
it,  at  a  reasonable  amount.  My  impression  is  there  was  no  percentage 
or  anything  of  that  kind. 

The  Chairman.  You  felt  there  was  no  reason  why  those  who  were 
holding  offices  should  not  contribute  to  the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  No,  sir;  I  did  not  think  that  because  a  man  is  a  Fed- 
eral employee  that  he  loses  his  interest  in  public  affars,  but  that 
he  should  feel  as  much  interest  in  the  result  of  the  campaigTi  as 
,  anybody  else. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  that  is  true.  The  point  I  was  trying  to 
get  at  is  whether  you  had  this  system  of  certain  amounts  being  col- 
lected from  different  Federal  employees.  You  seem  to  have  had  a 
form  letter  that  was  used  for  employees,  and  that  seems  to  have 
been  left  blank  and  then  filled  in  as  to  the  amount. 
,  Mr.  (jRAYOT.  I  do  not  think  there  was  any  definite  percentage  or 
anything  of  that  kind,  nor  do  I  know  whether  these  gentlemen  who 
filled  that  out — whether  that  was  filled  out  from  the  headquarters — 
whether  they  knew  the  salaries.  I  did  not,  and  I  do  not  Imow 
whether  they  knew  them  or  whether  they  just  fixed  the  amounts 
along  that  line. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  ask  to  have  this  placed  in  the  record. 
(The  letter  referred  to  is  here  printed  in  full,  as  follows :) 

Democratic  State  Campaign  Co^r puttee, 

Louisville,  Ky.,  August  SO,  1920. 
My  Dear  Sir:  As  you  have  probably  noticed  from  the  public  press,  the 
'Uepublicun  canipaiji:n  couiiniU'  e  is  atteuiptinc;  to  raise  an  enormous  sum  of 
money  to  carry  the  country  for  the  Republican  Party  in  November. 


2678  PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

The  fire  of  the  Kepiihlican  organizatH)n  is  heing  directed  daily  on  the  Demo-  ' 
cratic  adiiiinistratioii  during  the  past  eight  years. 

The  Democrats  can  point  with  pride  to  the  competency  of  each  department 
of  the  Government  under  their  control  during  the  eight  years  they  have  been 

'"You  have  heen  a  part  of  that  organization  and  have  helped  to  contribute  to 
the  success  of  the  party  in  the  administration  of  the  governmental  functions^ 
in  the  department  to  which  you  belong.  , 

Till  Deinocrats  do  not  hope  or  desire  to  raise  the  millions  that  their  opponents 
are  attempting  to  raise,  but  there  are  many  necessary  expenses  in  connection 
with  the  c(m(luct  of  the  campaign  that  must  be  met.  ^ 

I  am  endeavoring  to  obtain  funds  to  finance  this  campaign  from  a  laige  nuiiu 
hpr  of  contributions  in  small  sums. 

It  is  a  little  more  than  60  days  until  the  election,  and  it  is  necessary  that  the 
campaign  organization  know  as  early  as  possible  the  amount  of  funds  avail- 
able to  pay  the  legitimate  expenses  of  the  campaign.  I  am  depending  on  you 
to  help  in  having  the  present  Democratic  administration  indorsed  by  making 

a  small  contribution.  ^  i     -p     cin  fr. 

I  would  appreciate  it  if  you  can  send  me  check  or  money  order  foi  S)?40,  to 
be  divided  into  installments  during  the  months  of  September  and  October,  m 
such  proportions  as  you  see  fit. 

Yours,  respectfully,  ^^^^  ^ 

CamiKiign  Cha irma n. 
P.  S.— Make  all  checks  payable  to  John  L.  Grayot,  chairman. 
Mr  Grayot.  I  just  want  to  say  to  you  that  the  amounts  collected 
from  that  have  been— in  fact,  the  total  contributions  we  have  re- 
ceived from  any  source  now  are  less  than  $11,000. 
The  Chairman.  For  the  whole  State? 
Mr.  Grayot.  For  the  entire  State. 

The  Chairman.  Does  that  go  to  the  national  committee  or  to  the 

^^Mr  'grayot.  No,  sir;  that  goes  to  the  State.  We  have  less  than 
$10,000  to  run  the  campaign  on  in  a  State  the  size  of  Kentucky,  and 
the  fight  we  have  on  there  now  is  what  made  some  ot  these  .gray 
hairs  in  my  head.  ^        .  ^ ...  . 

Senator 'Edge.  Do  we  understand  there  is  an  additional  solicita- 
tion made  by  the  national  committee?  .,,1  X 

Mr  Grayot  So  far  as  I  know,  the  national  committee  has  not 
solicited  a  thing  in  my  State.    I  have  no  information  of  that  kind 

^*^The  Chairman.  What  you  are  trying  to  do  is  to  raise  a  sufficient 

fund  to  carry  on  an  activ'e  campaign  in  Kentucky? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Yes.  ^    n    i     p  i  -f 

The  Chairman.  That  requires  a  good  deal  of  money,  does  it 

^^Mr  Grayot.  To  put  on  a  campaign  to  be  very  effective,  in  this 
day  of  automobiles  and  good  roads  and  with  the  women  voting 
would  require  a  right  nice  sum  of  money  for  the  legitimate  expense 
of  o-etting  the  vote  to  the  polls.  i 

The  Chairman.  And  the  cost  of  publication  m  newspapers  and 
the  cost  of  everything  has  gone  up?     .   ,  .  ,  , 

Mr  GRAYOT.jThe  cost  of  everything  is  high  there. 

The  Chairman.  What  would  you  figure— you  seem  to  be  a  very 
fair  man— would  be  a  reasonable  sum  to  carry  on  your  campaign  in 
the  State  of  Kentucky— a  legitimate  campaign  such  as  you  would 
like  to  carry  on  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2679 


Mr.  Grayot.  That  is  a  little  hard,  because  if  we  attempted  to 
finance  all  the  counties  it  would  require  more  than  if  we  did  not. 
Eaising  money  in  Kentucky  among  the  Democrats  is  an  entirely 
I  different  proposition  from  Avhat  it  is  in  a  great  many  other  States. 
{  It  is  very  hard  to  do.  The  moneyed  interests  in  the  main  are  against 
j  us  in  the  State,  and  we  have  to  depend  largely  on  the  $1,  $2,  $5,  $25, 
;   $30,  $40,  and  $50  men. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  recall  what  you  raised  four  years  ago? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  had  no  connection  with  the  campaign. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  wdiat  it  was  two  years  ago? 

Mr.  Grayot.  No. 

The  Chairman.  What  is  your  business  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  am  an  attorney  at  law.    I  would  say,  I  would  be 
=f   delighted  if  we  could  raise  forty  or  fifty  or  sixty  thousand  dollars. 
'   I  think  it  would  take  that  to  put  on  the  kind  of  campaign  I  would 
like  to  put  on. 

The  Chairman.  I  suppose  you  could  use  $100,000  legitimately  in 
the  campaign  ? 

Mr.  Grayot.  Legitimately?    Yes,  sir;  I  think  we  could. 
The  Chairman.  And  if  you  could  raise  that  much  money  you 
would  be  glad  to  raise  it  and  use  it? 
Mr.  Grayot.  Yes,  sir.    I  could  use  it,  but  I  have  not  the  faintest 
(  hope  of  being  able  to  do  it. 

■      Senator  Edge.  Are  you  in  touch  more  or  less  with  the  efforts  of 
the  Republican  committee  there  in  raising  their  fund? 

Mr.  Grayot.  I  have  some  information  from  reliable  people  regard- 
(  ing  the  raising  of  campaign  funds  by  the  Republicans  in  the  city  of 
Louisville.    I  understand  that  they  have  some  400  policemen  that 
t  they  assess  $25  apiece. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  course,  unless  you  know  these  things  

Mr.  Grayot.  No  ;  I  do  not  know  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Chairman,  Mr.  Folvvell  has  been  kind  enough 
to  come  back,  and  as  he  wants  to  catch  his  train  I  would  like  to  ask 
him  a  feAV  questions  now. 

The  Chairman.  Very  well.   We  are  through  with  Mr.  Grayot. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  W.  H.  FOLWELL— Recalled. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Folwell,  do  you  know  of  an  association  of  man- 
ufacturers in  Philadelphia? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  There  is  a  Pennsylvania  manufacturers'  association, 
and  we  have  a  number  of  trade  associations  in  Philadelphia. 

Senator  Reed.  Is  there  a  man  named  Grundy  connected  with  it? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  Yes  sir ;  he  is  president,  I  believe. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  a  member  of  that  association  ? 
(      Mr.  Folwell.  I  believe  our  firm  is. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  whether  that  association  is  raising 
'  some  money? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Well,  I  think  not. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  heard  anything  of  that  kind  ? 
Mr.  FoLAVELL.  I  haA^e  heard  of  no  association  effort  to  raise  money. 
Senator  Reed.  HaA^e  you  heard  of  any  effort  outside  of  the  one 
you  are  making? 


2680 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  FoLAVELL.  Well,  there  is  the  Harding  and  Coolidge  committee. 
Senator  Reed.  There  is  a  Harding  and  Coolidge  committee  in 
Pennsylvania  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Eeed.  Raising  money? 

Mr.  FoLAVELL.  I  believe  that  is  what  they  are  formed  for. 
Senator  Reed.  Who  is  at  the  head  of  the  Harding  and  Coolidge 
committee  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Mr.  George  W.  Coles. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  does  he  live? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  In  Philadelphia,  I  believe. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  anything  about  the  composition  of 
this  committee? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  they  have  a  list  of  names,  and  they  asked  me 
to  accept  membership  on  it,  and  I  told  them  I  would. 

Senator  Reed.  When  was  it  they  asked  you  to  do  that? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  About  three  or  four  days  ago. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  large  a  list  of  names  they  have? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  think,  as  I  remember  it,  about  50,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Are  they  prominent  men  there — men  of  influence 
and  money? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  believe  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Some  of  them  engaged  in  manufacturing? 
Mr.  Folwell.  I  believe  so. 

Senator  Reed.  You  were  asked  to  take  a  membership  on  it.  What 
were  they  going  to  do?   Raise  money  for  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  just  got  an  invitation. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  understand  they  were  going  to  raise  money 
for  the  national  committee? 
Mr.  FoLWELL.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  it  occur  to  you  that  you  would  be  called  upon  to 
undertake  the  organization  of  a  committee  to  raise  money  for  the 
national  committee,  and  at  the  same  time  there  would  be  a  Harding 
and  Coolidge  committee  to  do  exactly  the  same  sort  of  thing  in  the 
same  territory? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  Well,  I  do  not  know  about  that.  I  thousfht  that  this 
was  a  sort  of  local — I  do  not  know  anything  about  the  Harding  and 
Coolidge  committee. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  is  it  local  or  does  it  cover  the  State  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  do  not  really  know  how  large  its  scope  is. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  how  much  money  they  have  raised  ? 

Mr.  Folwell.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  their  plan  of  organization  is? 
Mr.  Folwell.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  What  was  said  to  you  when  they  asked  you  to 
affiliate  yourself  with  it? 

Mr.  Folwell.  Just  an  engraved  invitation. 

Senator  Reed.  HaA^e  you  that  invitation? 

Mr.  Folwell.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  they  have  a  meeting? 

Mr.  Folavell.  I  am  not  sure ;  I  was  not  iuAdted  to  it. 

Senator  Reed.  When  AA^ere  the}^  to  meet  ? 

Mr.  Folavell.  I  do  not  knoAV,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  Avere  they  to  meet? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2681 


Mr.  FoLWELL.  I  do  not  know  that. 

Senator  Reed.  AVhat  was  on  this  engraved  invitation  ? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  You  are  respectfully  invited,  or  cordially  invited, 
to  become  a  member  of  the  Harding  and  Coolidge  committee,"  or 
something  to  that  effect,  and  tlien  followed  a  list  of  names.  Just  a 
formal  invitation. 

Senator  Reed.  Who  is  the  treasurer  of  that?    Do  you  know? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  No ;  I  do  not  really  remember. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  it  is  a  committee  to  raise  money? 

Mr.  FoLWELL.  That  is  my  belief,  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  of  any  other  committees  down  there 
to  raise  mone}^? 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  This  invitation  you  received  only  three  or  four  days 
ago.    Has  the  meeting  been  held  yet?  * 

Mr.  Folwell.  I  think  they  had"  a  meeting  some  time  ago,  before  I 
was  invited. 

Senator  Reed.  Probably  there  was  a  meeting,  and  you  and  others, 
perhaps,  were  invited  at  the  same  time? 
Mr.  Folwell.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Coles  is  the  president.    Do  you  know  who  else 
is  in  it? 
Mr.  Folwell.  JNo,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  the  secretary? 
Mr.  Folwell.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  Mr.  Coles's  business? 
Mr.  Folwell.  I  really  do  not  know.  ^ 
Senator  Reed.  Is  he  a  prominent  man  there  ? 
Mr.  Lolwell.  I  could  not  answer  that.  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  It  is  a  large  city,  and  this  individual  you  do  not 
know? 

Mr.  Folwell.  That  is  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  that  is  what  I  wanted  to  find  out.  Thank 
you. 

The  Chairman.  We  will  hear  Mr.  Du  Pont. 

TESTIMONY  OF  ME.  T.  COLEMAN  DU  PONT. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
Senator  Reed.  Mr.  Du  Pont,  are  you  in  any  way  connected  with 
the  Republican  national  committee? 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes ;  I  am  one  of  them. 
Senator  Reed.  You  are  a  member  from  what  State  ? 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  Delaware. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  engaged  now  in  what  lines  of  activity? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Well,  practically  none,  sir.  I  have  not  been  in  busi- 
^!  ness  for  six  or  eight  years. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  have  investments? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes. 
I      Senator  Reed.  Do  you  have  any  investments  outside  of  these  large 
!'  hotels  that  you  are  interested  in? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Reed.  What  companies? 


2682 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Dij  Pont.  There  is  a  street  raihvay,  and  motors  

Senator  Reed.  What  motors? 

Mr.  Du  I*0NT.  General  Motors — and  steel  

Senator  Reed.  What  is  the  name? 
•   Mr.  Du  Pont.  United  States  Steel,  Replogle  Steel,  and  Vana- 
dium Steel.   I  happen  to  have  three.    I  used  to  be  in  the  steel  busi- 
ness, and  know  something  about  it.    I  have  some  railroad  stock. 

Senator  Reed.  Any  steamship  lines? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No,  sir — I  say  none ;  practically  none. 

Senator  Reed.  How  long  have  you  been  connected  with  the  Repub- 
lican national  committee? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Since  1904  or  1908. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  you  connected  in  any  way  Avith  advertising  in 
foreign-language  newspapers? 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Reed.  W^hat  is  that  connection? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  If  it  won't  bore  you,  I  can  give  you  the  whole  story. 
Senator  Reed.  Well,  briefly. 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  can  only  give  it  to  you  generally,  because  I  do 
not  know  the  details. 

A  little  over  two  years  ago  the  question  was  brought  up  one  day, 
"  What  can  you  do  in  an  effort  to  abate  the  unrest  among  many  of 
our  foreign  born  ?  "  I  reported  that  to  a  lady  by  the  name  of  Miss 
Keller.  She  came  in  a  day  or  two  later  ancl  said,  "Are  you  inter- 
ested?"  I  said,  "Very  much." 

Out  of  that  grew  an  organization  known  as  the  Interracial  Coun- 
cil. That  Interracial  Council  was  formulated  to  increase  interest  in 
America  among  our  foreign  born  and  to  do  what  we  could  by  music 
and  moving  pictures  and  things  of  that  kind  to  make  our  foreign 
born  know  and  like  America  better.  After  going  along  a  few 
months  it  was  thought  desirable  that  a  connection  be  made  with 
foreign-language  newspapers,  through  which  channel  we  might  get 
at  these  foreign-born  citizens,  or  aliens,  in  their  language  and  more 
quickly. 

About  that  time  an  organization  called  the  American  Association 
of  Foreign  Language  Newspapers — that  is  nearly  right — was  offered 
for  sale,  and  it  w^as  thought  by  those  interested  in  the  Interracial 
Council  that  that  would  be  a  way  of  getting  in  with  the  papers  to 
spread  the  propaganda  for  Americanism.  I  did  not  feel  at  that  time 
that  the  Interracial  Council  could  afford  to  take  it  over.  It'  was 
young.  We  had  underwritings  of  $100,000  to  start  the  Interracial 
Council,  with  the  understanding  that  it  would  be  and  Avas  capable  of 
being  put  on  a  business  basis,  at  which  time  the  $100,000  was  to  be 
returned. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  the  Interracial  Council  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  That  is  the  Interracial  Council.  Knowing  that  we 
were  skating  on  not  very  thick  ice,  I  said,  therefore,  "  The  Inter- 
racial Council  can  not  buy  this."  So  a  number  of  gentlemen  put  up 
the  necessary  money — two  or  three  of  them  connected  with  the  Inter- 
racial Council — and  did  this  as  a  business  proposition. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  they  bought  the  Association  of  Foreign 
Language  Newspapers? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Was  that  a  corporation? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2683 


Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Eeed.  Did  it  own  neAvspapers? 
Mr.  Du  PcxT.  No ;  it  is  an  advertising  agency. 
Senator  Reed.  Wlio  were  the  two  or  three  gentlemen  that  put  up 
that  money  ? 

Mr.  Di-  Pont.  The,  Interracial  Council  put  up  $25,000,  Avhich  I 
loaned  it.  I  put  up  some.  Mr.  Thompson  put  up  some.  Two  men 
who  are  connected  with  Louis  Hammerling  put  up  some.  Miss 
Keller  put  up  some,  representing  some  down-toAvn  interests. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  what  the  down-town  interests  are  that 
she  represented? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No  ;  I  am  not  sure.   I  suspect,  but  I  do  not  know. 
[     Senator  Reed.  I  want  to  go  back  for  a  moment  to  the  Interracial 
:  Council.    Is  that  a  corporation? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  think  it  is  an  association. 

Senator  Reed.  You  say  it  Avas  underwritten  to  the  extent  of 
:  $100,000? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes ;  that  is,  it  was  estimated  that  the  expenses  for 
the  year  would  be  $100,000,  and  Avhen  we  got  started  our  plan  was 
to  go  to  your  factory,  say,  and  for  every  foreign-born  person  in  it 
you  would  put  in  as  a  member  50  cents  a  year,  for  which  you  would 
get  service  in  the  way  of  lectures,  and  so  on.  Those  payments  were 
supposed  to  be  enough  at  the  end  of  the  year  to  pay  back  the 
$100,000. 

Senator  Reed.  That  Avas  the  Avay  you  thought  you  could  put  it 
upon  a  business  basis? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes ;  I  did.  Then,  coming  along  farther,  we  thought 
it  Avould  be  very  good  to  haA^e  these  foreign  laiiguage  newspapers 
through  Avhich  to  get  anything  Ave  thought  should  be  printed,  in  Yid- 
dish or  any  of  the  other  languages,  before  the  public. 

Senator  Reed.  Hoav  can  you  get  this  printed  matter  before  the 
public  by  virtue  of  controlling  an  advertising  agency  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  By  becoming  more  closely  associated  Avith  the  own- 
ers of  the  papers. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  this  advertising  agency,  the  American  For- 
eign Language  NeAvspaper  Association,  controlled  a  very  large  body 
of  the  advertising  that  would  go  into  these  papers? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No  :  not  much  of  it.   Just  as  the  neAvs  agencies  do, 
:  they  offer  it,  and  for  that  they  get  a  commission. 
■  ;  iSenator  Reed.  They  collect  a  large  body  of  advertising—; — 
j  -  Mr.  Du  Pont.  And  giA^e  it  to  the  various  newspapers. 
,     Senator  Reed.  And  then  they  allocate  it,  or  make  arrangements 

!  with  the  papers  to  print  it  

'     Mr.  Du  Pont.  To  print  it. 

Senator  Reed.  And  so,  a  neAvspaper  desiring  that  patronage,  that 

custom  

j:   ;  Mr.  Du  Pont.  Or  trade. 

,  '  Senator  Reed.  Or  trade — could  be  influenced  to  put  in  matter  that 
*  you  desiretl  to  haA^e  put  in  tending  to  educate  these  foreign-born 
people  to  patriotic  ideals? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  They  Avould  be  asked  to  put  it  in. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  and  you  thought  that  by  getting  this — that  Avas 
'  your  object  in  getting  it— you  Avould  put  yourselves  in  such  touch 


2684 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


with  them  that  you  could  induce  them,  then,  to  help  you  carry  on  this 
propaganda  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No  ;  I  would  not  say  "  induce,"  but  by  reason  of  com- 
ing in  contact  with  them  and  knowing  them  and  having  relationships 
with  them  you  could  practically  say  to  them,  "  Now,  here  is  a  piece 
that  I  wish  you  would  translate  into  German,  or  some  other  language, 
and  print  in  your  paper,  if  you  have  no  objection." 

Senator  Reed.  So  the  real  object  in  getting  hold  of  the  Foreign 
Language  Newspaper  Association  was  to  be  in  a  position  where  you 
could  

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Spread  Americanism. 

Senator  Reed.  To  put  yourself  in  a  position  where  3^ou  could  exer- 
case  this  influence  or  persuasion  

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Let  us  put  it  this  way — that  the  feeling  between  us 
would  be  better. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes;  and  therefore  you  could  get  in  these  articles? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Of  course  we  took  a  chance  on  that. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  I  understand.  You  could  get  in  these  articles 
favorable  to  the  ideas  you  were  promulgating.  And  I  suppose,  of 
course,  you  recognized  this,  if  I  understand  you,  that  if  a  man  came  to 
you  and  asked  for  business,  and  you  had  control  of  the  letting  of  that 
business,  out  of  which  he  would  make  some  money,  naturally,  when 
in  turn  you  said  to  him,  "  Here  is  an  article  we  would  like  to  have  put 
in  this  paper,"  and  it  was  a  good  and  proper  article,  you  felt  you 
would  be  pretty  likely  to  get  it  in  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  AVell,  I  can  not  go  that  far.   I  Avish  that  were  true. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  can  at  least  go  some  distance  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No.  I  felt  this.  I  thought  our  relationship  would 
be  so  much  closer  tliat  we  would  have  an  advantage  by  reason  of  that 
relationshi])  that  we  v/ould  not  otherwise  have. 

Senator  Reed.  And,  of  course,  if  3^ou  did  not  give  them  the  adver- 
tising  

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Oh,  we  had  to.  I  mean,  if  you  came  to  me  and  told 
me  to  put  this  in  that  paper  I  would  have  to  do  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Yes ;  if  I  said,  ^'  Put  this  in  that  particular  paper." 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  They  usually  say  what  paper  they  shall  go  in,  be- 
cause an  Italian  does  not  like  to  have  his  matter  put  into  a  Jewish 
paper. 

Senator  Reed.  But  there  are  different  Italian  papers,  of  course. 

Now,  you  were  not  in  a  chimerical  thing;  you  were  in  something 
that  while  it  was  not  hard  and  fast  you  expected  to  function  and 
bring  you  some  results  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  think  3'our  deduction  is  not  only  reasonable  but 
logical,  that  by  reason  of  our  association  with  these  people  Ave  felt 
that  our  scheme  to — let  me  say  Americanize  the  foreign — would  be 
helped. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  when  you  got  hold  of  this  Association  of  For- 
eign Language  Newspapers — I  want  to  identify  it ;  that  is  the  same 
association  that  Mr.  Ilammerling  had  been  connected  with? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes ;  it  was  one  he  had  owned  and  controlled  before 
that  time. 

Senator  Reed.  And  he  had  left  the  countr}^,  I  think  ? 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  do  not  know  about  that.  ^  He  did  not  immediately, 
because  I  saw  him  two  or  three  months  after. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2685 

i 

Senator  Keed.  Well,  there  has  been  some  effort  made  to  ^et  the 
foreign-language  ne^Yspapers  to  help  the  Republican  Party  in  this 
campaign,  has  there  not  ? 

Mr.  DiT  Pont.  Xot  that  I  know  of.  And  I  would  know  about  it,  I 
feel  sure. 

Senator  Reed.  Does  this  association  supply  most  of  the  advertis- 
ing to  the  foreign-language  newspapers? 

Mr.  Du  PoxT.  Why  it  is  one  of  the  largest. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  knoAv  of  any  other  of  any  size  at  all  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  know  there  are  two  others,  but  I  do  not  know  what 
they  are.  There  are  two  other  large  ones  and  a  number  of  small 
ones.    There  are  three  large  ones,  and  this  is  one  of  the  three. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  of  any  articles  being  inserted  in  the 
foreign-language  newspapers  of  an}^  political  character  in  the  last 
few  months? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  You  have  had  nothing  to  do  with  it. 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  do  not  know  either  way ;  I  do  not  know"  that  they 
are  or  are  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  anything  to  do  with  the  raising  of  money 
in  this  campaign  ? 
Mr.  Du  Pont.  Xo. 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  not  a  member  of  any  committee  that  has 
anything  to  do  with  that  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  Yes;  I  was  a  member  of  the  ways  and  means  com- 
mittee, and  met  with  them  their  first  two  or  three  meetings.  Maybe 
six  months  ago — I  don't  know;  last  winter — I  was  made  chairman 
of  the  finance  committee.  The  finance  committee  has  never  had  a 
meeting,  and  I  never  performed  any  duties  as  chairman.  I  met  with 
the  ways  and  means  committee  their  first  two  or  three  meetings,  at 
the  time  this  $1,000  limit  was  to  be  tried  out,  and  I  strongly  recom- 
mended it.   Since  that  time  I  have  not  met  with  them. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  ever  had  any  agent  or  representative  or 
any  man  connected  with  you  to  undertake  to  acquire  an  interest  in 
the  Stars  and  Stripes  ? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No.  I  saw  that  in  the  papers  this  morning — the 
first  I  heard  of  it. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  remember  the  gentleman's  name  ?  You  saw 
it  in  the  paper. 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No  ;  I  do  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Waldo ;  he  is  here  ready  to  testify. 

Senator  Reed.  This  is  Mr.  Waldo  [indicating]  sitting  here. 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  I  know  liim;  but  the  name  in  the  paper  was  Heffer- 
.  nan,  was  it  not  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Heffernan  was  the  jrentleman  who  testified. 

Senator  Reed.  You  do  not  know  Mr.  Waldo  at  all  ? 
^    Mr.  Du  Pont.  Oh,  yes.  He  worked  for  the  Interracial  Council  and 
for  foreign-language  newspapers  for  three  or  four  months,  I  think. 

Senator  Reed.  But  you  had  no  talk  with  him  about  acquiring  an 
interest  in  the  Stars  and  Stripes? 

Mr.  Du  Pont.  No  ;  I  had  not. 

Senator  Reed.  All  right;  that  is  all  I  wanted  to  ask,  Mr.  Du  Pont. 
There  is  a  gentleman  here  from  North  Carolina. 


2686 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CLARENCE  R.  PUGH. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
Senator  Reed.  Please  give  your  full  name  and  address. 
Mr.  Pfgh.  Clarence  R.  Pugh,  Elizabeth  City,  N.  C. 
Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  occupation? 
Mr.  PuGH.  A  lawyer. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  your  political  connection? 
Mr.  PuGH.  Connection? 

Senator  Reed.  You  are  a  Republican  in  politics? 
Mr.  PuGH.  I  am  a  Republican;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Are  3^ou  connected  with  any  committee  of  the  Re- 
publican Party? 

Mr.  PuGH.  AYell,  I  am  vice  chairman  of  our  State  executive  com- 
mittee. 

Senator  Reed.  How  lono-  have  you  held  that  position? 
Mr.  ir'uGir.  Since  last  January  or  P^ebruary,  Senator. 
Senator  Reed.  Do  you  know  Mr.  Hays? 
Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  ever  meet  him  in  Chicago  ? 

Mr.  1  UGH.  No ;  T  did  not. 

Senator  Reed.  Where  did  3^ou  meet  him? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Well,  I  have  met  him  on  more  than  one  occasion;  one 
time  in  Greensborough,  in  our  State,  one  time  in  New  York,  and 
several  times  here  in  Washington. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  referrinc:  to  a  meeting  that  occurred  within 
the  last  six  or  seven  months.  Where  have  you  seen  him  during  that 
time? 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  have  seen  him  in  Chicago  and  1  have  seen  him  here 
and  I  have  seen  him  in  New  York  in  the  last  six  or  seven  months. 

■Senator  Reed.  Do  you  remember  having  met  Mr.  Hays  and  then 
havincf  a  political  conference  in  your  own  city  after  that  conference 
with  Mr.  Hays  ? 

Mr.  PxiGH.  I  have  neA^er  met  Mr.  Hays  in  my  own  city;  he  was 
never  there. 

Senator  Reed.  I  do  not  mean  that.  Did  you  ever  m.eet  Mr.  Hays 
and  then  afterwards  have  a  conference  in  your  own  city  with  the 
Republicans  of  North  Carolina? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Never  in  my  life. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  have  a  meeting  down  there — your  county 
is  Pasquotank? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Pasquotank  Count}^;  yes,  sir.  Yes,  sir;  we  have  had 
political  meetings  down  there. 

Senator  Reed.  On  the  21st  day  of  February,  1920,  did  you  have  a 
meeting  there  ? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir.  Senator;  about  that  time — of  Republicans. 
Senator  Edge.  Did  you  have  enough  Republicans  there  to  have  a 
real  meeting? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir.  We  voted  120,000  of  them  the  last  election 
for  governor  in  that  State. 

Senator  Reed.  What  Avas  this  meeting  that  you  had  down  there? 

Mr.  PuGH.  This  was  a  county  convention.  Senator  Reed,  for  the 
purpose  of  electing  delegates  to  the  congressional  and  State  con- 
ventions. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2687 


Senator  Reed.  How  long  before  that  meeting  had  you  last  seen 
Mr.  Hays? 

Mr.  PuGH.  About  a  week  or  two  weeks ;  I  would  not  say  specifically. 
The  time  you  are  having  reference  to,  February  6. 
^^enator  Reed.  Where  did  you  meet  him  ? 
Mr.  PuGH.  In  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  How  did  you  come  to  be  there  to  see  him? 

Mr.  PuGH.  A  conference  was  arranged  with  Mr.  Plays  between  our  • 
national  committeeman  and  myself. 

Senator  Reed.  Your  national  committeeman  was  who  ? 

Mr.  PuGH.  John  M.  Moorehead.  Mr.  Moorehead  was  sick  and  did 
not  go.  I  did  not  know  that  until  I  got  there  and  found  he  was  not 
there. 

Senator  Reed.  At  this  county  meeting  in  North  Carolina  was  Col. 
I.  M.  Meakins  there? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  William  H.  Keaton  ? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  J.  W.  Johnston? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir. 
'   Senator  Reed.  They  are  all  reputable  citizens  down  there  ? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  make  a  report  or  statement  there  at  that 
meeting,  whether  it  was  a  county  convention  or  whatever  it  was,  at 
a  meeting  where  these  gentlemen  were  present,  of  a  conference  you 
had  with  Mr.  Hays? 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  alluded  to  having  had  a  conference  with  Mr.  Haj^s. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  tell  them  in  substance  and  effect  that  yon 
had  informed  Mr.  Hays  that  there  was  a  large  number  of  unorgan- 
ized textile  workers  in  North  Carolina?  Do  you  remember  discuss- 
ing that  ?   Did  you  tell  them  about  that  ? 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  don't  know  that  I  said  that  specifically.  I  was  mak- 
ing a  speech,  or,  rather,  talking  to  these  32,  to  be  specific — that  is 
what  they  were  in  number — Republicans  at  that  convention.  I  was 
called  down  to  make  a  little  talk,  and  I  was  j^iving  them  some  of  the 
figures  with  which  we  had  to  deal  in  the  North  Carolina  political 
field. 

Senator  Reed.  Had  you  discussed  this  question  of  the  unorgan- 
ized or  the  desirability  of  organizing  the  textile  workers  in  your 
State  with  Mr.  Hays?  ' 
^     Mr.  PuGH.  I  don't  think  I  ever  mentioned  textile  workers  to  Mr. 
ij  Hays  in  my  life. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  you  discuss  with  Mr.  Hays  the  question  of  or- 
.  ganizing  in  your  State  at  all? 
I     Mr.  PuGii.  No,  sir;  I  should  say  not. 

j     Senator  Reed.  Did  you  go  with  Mr.  Hays  anywhere  in  an  auto- 

mobile  in  New  York  on  the  occasion  of  your  visit  there  ? 
^     Mr.  PuGH.  I  did  not,  never  did  in  my  life,  and  never  said  I  did. 
j     Senator  Reed.  Did  you  accompany  Mr.  Hays  where  you  visited 
1  some  New  York  gentlemen  ? 

\     Mr.  PuGH.  The  only  man  I  met  while  in  conference  with  Mr. 
i  Ha  ys  was  Lieut.  Col.  Roosevelt,  and  he  came  in  the  office  and  Mr. 
'  Hays  introduced  me  to  him. 
i  182774— 20— PT  20  5 


2688 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Reed.  I  am  referring- 


Mr.  PuGH.  I  know  what  you  are  referring  to  all  the  way  along. 
Senator  Reed.  How  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  PuGir.  Because  I  know  who  is  responsible  for  having  me  called 
up  here,  and  I  have  the  newspaper  file  right  here  that  I  want  to  lodge 
with  this  committee,  to  show  that  all  this  has  been  thrashed  out  in  my 
State.  It  is  just  fomenting  a  row  between  two  Republicans,  and  that 
is  all  there  is  in  it.   I  suppose  I  should  not  have  added  all  of  that. 

Senator  Reed.  That  is  all  right.  This  is  a  kind  of  free-for-all 
place,  and  you  were  kind  of  nice  to' me  when  I  was  down  there. 

Well,  you  agree  with  me  on  one  question  

Mr.  PuGH.  A  good  many  questions.  Senator. 

Senator  Reed.  Which  shows,  at  least,  that  every  man  has  his 
virtues. 

Now,  this  statement  was  made  to  me,  and  I  am  gomg  to  read  it  to 
you  and  ask  you  whether  it  is  true  or  not,  or  any  part  of  it : 

At  a  convention  of  the  Republicans  of  Pasquotank  County,  N.  C,  held  on 
February  21,  1920,  Mr.  C.  R.  Pugh,  at  that  time  Republican  campaign  manager 
in  North  Carolina,  made  a  statement  substantially  as  follows: 

"  The  chances  for  a  Republican  victory  in  North  Carolina  are  fine  if  the  plans 
which  have  been  outlined  are  carried  out. 

"  I  was  in  conference  with  Mr.  Will  Hays  at  his  office  in  New  York  City  on 
February  6,  at  which  time  I  went  into  details  with  him  in  regard  to  our  plans 
for  North  Carolina.  I  told  Mr.  Hays  that  there  are  probably  40,000  unorganized 
textile  workers  in  North  Carolina,  and  that  these  textile  workers  could  be  or- 
ganized in  the  interest  of  Republican  success. 

"  Mr.  Hays  declared  that  my  idea  was  fine,  and  he  took  me  in  his  automobile 
to  the  office  of  a  wealthy  New  Yorker  who  owns  a  chain  of  cotton  mills  in  North 
Carolina,  whose  name  I  will  not  call.  We  explained  our  plan  and  the  manu- 
facturer was  elated.  He  drew  his  check  for  $50,000  and  gave  it  to  Mr.  Hays, 
together  with  a  list  of  his  mill  superintendents  in  North  Carolina,  and  told  us 
to  get  busy." 

Mr.  Pugh's  statement  was  made  in  the  presence  of  probably  25  or  30  men. 
Among  those  who  heard  him  and  have  recalled  his  statement  are  Col.  I.  M. 
Meekins,  William  H.  Keaton,  and  J.  W.  Johnson,  all  reputable  citizens  of  Eliza- 
beth City,  N.  C. 

What  have  you  got  to  say  about  that? 

Mr.  Pugh.  I  never  made  a  statement  like  that  m  my  life. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  are  any  of  the  statements  contamed  m  the 
declaration  which  I  have  read  true? 

Mr.  Pugh.  Yes,  sir;  some  of  the  facts. 

Senator  Reed.  Tell  us  what  are  facts  and  Avhat  are  not; 

Mr  Pugh.  I  will  be  right  frank  with  you,  without  quibbling.  I 
had  had  a  conference  with  Mr.  Hays  on  February  6  with  respect  to 
the  political  situation  in  North  Carolina.  It  was  planned  that  our 
national  committeeman  should  have  been  there  with  me.  Pie  was  sick 
and  could  not  be  there,  but  I  did  not  know  that  until  I  got  there. 
Being  there,  naturally  I  met  Mr.  Hays  and  we  talked  over  North 
Carolina  possibilities.    The  question  of  the  organization  was  not 

"^Tn^my^own  way  I  began  to  give  him  some  figures  which  I  had 
privately  collected  in  North  Carolina.  Among  those  figures  I  began 
to  show  how  many  Republican  seats  we  had  in  the  legislature,  how 
many  doubtful  counties  we  have  in  the  State,  and  the  possibility  ot 
carrying  those  doubtful  counties,  and  the  utter  lack  of  organization 
along  all  lines  in  our  State. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2689 


And  then — I  don't  say  I  admit  I  did  and  I  don't  say  I  didn't, 
but  I  may  have  alhided  to  some  30,000  unorganized  workers  in  the 
factories  of  our  State.  That  is  a  fact,  and  I  had  those  figures.  I 
may  have  alluded — I  don't  say  I  did  and  I  don't  say  I  didn't,  but 
these  were  figures  which  I  had  and  still  have  about  the  fact  that  there 
were  a  great  number  of  negroes,  always  a  bugaboo  in  the  South,  that 
were  coming  in  under  suffrage,  and  that  was  one  of  the  problems 
both  parties  had  to  deal  with,  and  that  the  Democrats  had  been  re- 
sponsible for  getting  the  negro  out  of  politics,  and  the  few  that 
voted  in  North  Carolina  voted  the  Democratic  ticket,  and  it  looked 
to  me  like  the  thing  to  do  was  to  leave  the  negro  problem  to  the 
Democrats,  who  were  voting  them. 

That  is  about  all  I  could  have  said  to  Mr.  Hays  that  mentioned 
textile  workers  unorganized  or  that  mentioned  negroes.  I  did  not 
meet  any  wealthy  gentlemen.  I  saw  no  check.  No  check  was  men- 
tioned. I  did  not  solicit  funds.  No  amount  with  respect  to  carry- 
ing on  the  campaign  in  North  Carolina  was  mentioned  either  by  me 
or  Mr.  Hays. 

Senator  Keed.  And  no  money  or  checks  or  drafts  were  turned  over 
to  you? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Nor  mentioned. 
Senator  Eeed.  Nor  even  mentioned? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Not  even  mentioned.  Senator.  That  is  the  Hays  con- 
ference of  February  6. 

Senator  Eeed.  And  when  you  went  back  to  this  convention  you  did 
not  say  anything  about  having— — 

Mr.  PuGH.  When  I  went  back  to  our  convention  I  dealt  in  a 
speech  with  the  figures  in  the  State,  and  recounted  these  figures.  I 
know  I  mentioned  these  figures  in  my  talk  at  home  and,  as  I  say, 
I  may  have  recounted  them  to  Mr.  Hays.  But  I  did  not  say  I  had  so 
told  Mr.  Hays.  I  did  not  refer  to  $50,000  being  given  or  even  men- 
tioned. 

Senator  Reed.  Nor  any  other  sum  of  money? 

Mr.  PuGH.  Nor  any  other  sum  of  money.  Now,  Senator,  here  is 
how  this  came  about. 

Senator  Reed.  Go  ahead. 

Mr.  PuGH.  It  is  just  fair  to  the  other  fellow,  and  I  have  spent  my 
life  excusing  other  folks.  Col.  Meekins  is  a  Republican  in  my  dis- 
trict, 12  years  older  than  I  am.  I  have  never  received  nor  solicited 
one  cent  of  money  from  Mr.  Hays  or  anyone  for  myself  or  for  the 
Republican  Party  to  be  used  for  campaign  purposes.  Furthermore, 
I  have  never  had  any  money  promised  me  by  any  one  for  such  pur- 
pose. Furthermore,  I  have  never  said  that  money  was  either  prom- 
ised or  given  me  for  such  purpose. 

There  is  a  Republican  in  my  town  who  seems  to  object  to  the 
recognition  I  have  received  in  party  councils  and  by  party  leaders. 
This  "  rot,"  the  subject  matter  of  this  inquiry,  was  started  at  the 
time  that  this  gentleman  and  I  were  contesting  for  election  to  the 
district  delegate's  place  in  the  national  convention.  This  party  seems 
to  use  a  certain  newspaper,  called  the  Independent,  of  which  W.  O. 
Saunders  is  editor,  printed  in  my  town,  at  his  will  and  pleasure, 
although  this  paper — and  I  have  them  here  with  me — will  show  also 
the  at'tack  that  both  the  newspaper  and  my  fellow  Republican  made 
upon  me.    They  licked  me  by  four  votes  as  a  delegate.    In  turn  the 


2690 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


State  convention  made  me  an  alternate  at  large,  and  it  worked  around 
so  that  I  cast  a  vote  for  Senator  Harding  on  the  last  two  ballots. 

Nothing  further  was  said  of  this  negro  stuff  and  textile  slush  until 
last  week  it  was  learned  that  I  had  been  urgently  called  to  State  head- 
quarters, to  remain  there  through  the  remainder  of  the  campaign. 
Then  this  Independent  editor,  W.  O,  Saunders,  was  hurried  off  to 
Washington,  D.  C,  to  tell  this  committee  a  wonderful  story  of  a  slush 
fund  being  used,  for  no  other  purpose,  in  my  opinion,  than  to  tr}^  to 
intimidate  me  and  shake  the  faith  which  the  party  leaders  imposed 
in  me.    We  shall  see  whether  they  succeed. 

Now,  gentlemen  of  the  committee,  there  is  nothing  to  this  but  a 
little  row,  which  happens  quadrennially  in  certain  sections  of  the 
South  by  old  referee-system  politicians,  who  seek  to  keep  the  party 
from  growing  under  the  leadership  of  young  men,  simply  to  hold  the 
organization  in  their  grasp  and  use  it  for  appointive  power.  This 
applies  to  both  parties  in  the  South.  It  is  a  sad  comment  on  the 
politics  of  the  South.    That  is  all  I  Imow. 

The  Chairman.  Let  us  see  some  of  those  papers.  This  is  very 
interesting. 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  happen  to  own  a  newspaper,  which  I  had  to  buy  in 
self-defense,  and  this  newspaper  answers  those,  and  so  we  have  nice 
reading  material  down  in  that  neck  of  the  woods.  Incidentally,  all 
of  the  Democratic  lawyers  of  my  town  carry  legal  advertisements 
in  the  Eepublican  newspaper  and  do  not  give  a  dollar's  worth  to  the 
Independent  Democrat. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  paper  for  the  League  of  Nations? 

Mr.  PuGH.  No,  sir.  He  is  against  Mr.  Wilson.  He  has  attacked 
Mr.  Wilson.  Senator  Eeed  knows  something  about  our  hopes  down 
there. 

Senator  Reed.  I  don't  see  why  you  bring  me  into  this  thing. 
Mr.  PuGH.  You  dragged  me  up  here. 

Senator  Reed.  Well,  I  will  say  to  you,  Mr.  Pugh,  that  under  these 
circumstances  I  am  very  sorry  that  you  were  dragged  up  here.  The 
statement  was  made  positively  that  these  matters  were  facts. 

Mr.  Pugh.  I  have  the  name  here  of  every  man  who  was  present  at 
that  famous  negro  and  textile  speech  that  I  made.  The  affidavit 
which  you  have  is  signed  by  seven  of  Col.  Meekins's  

Senator  Reed.  No;  you  are  mistaken.  Let  me  put  you  right. 
This  is  not  an  affidavit. 

Mr.  Pugh.  Well,  it  is  in  this  paper  an3^way ;  I  assumed  you  had  it. 
It  is  signed  by  Col.  Meekins,  and  then  one  of  his  brothers  signed  it. 
That  is  No.  2.  Three  others  are  members  of  his  Sunday  school  class. 
That  is  five.  No.  6  is  the  manager  of  his  farm.  The  other  man  he 
has  promised  a  janitor's  place  in  the  post  office,  so  I  am  informed. 

The  Chairman.  How  large  a  Sunday  school  class  does  he  have? 

Mr.  Pugh.  i  don't  know,  sir.  I  am  a  Methodist  and  don't  go  to 
his  church.  That  is  7  out  of  32.  I  have  an  affidavit  signed  by  20  of 
the  32  who  say  I  didn't  say  what  the  5  say  I  said. 

Senator  Reed.  Have  you  the  affidavit  with  you? 

Mr.  Pugh.  I  think  I  have  it  here.  [Producing  various  papers.] 
Now,  there  is  a  suit  filed  against  me  in  the  colonel's  libel  proceed- 
ings, which  he  seemed  to  withdraw  before  this  situation  got  very 
far  along — all  about  this  negro  and  textile  stuff. 


PRESIDENTIAL.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2691 


No,  I  don't  have  that  affidavit  here;  but  I  have  the  affidavit,  and, 
it  is  proper  you  should  have  it,  sir. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  thought  you  said  it  was  in  the  newspaper. 

Mr.  PuGH.  Not  my  reply.  They  tried  to  smoke  out  my  reply  in 
the  newspaper,  but  I  have  got  it. 

The  Chairman.  You  do  not  seem  to  be  worried  about  this  libel 
suit. 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  am  not  worried  about  any  of  it ;  only  I  hate  to  see  this 
committtee  of  United  States  Senators  recognizing  a  little  fight  in  the 
first  district  of  North  Carolina  between  two  very  small  and  humble 
Republicans  when  it  is  fostered  by  the  editor  of  an  independent  news- 
paper who  advocates  his  democracy  on  a  trash  can,  printed  on  the 
side  of  it,  W'hich  trash  can  is  located  in  front  of  the  Federal  Building 
in  my  town. 

I  have  not  that  affidavit  here,  but  I  shall  send  it  to  you.  Senator 
Eeed.    I  wrnt  you  to  have  that,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  Of  course,  the  committee  is  not  interested  in  this 
local  quarrel.    I  did  not  know  you  had  one. 

Mr.  PuGH.  That  is  all  it  is,  and  we  are  getting  along  with  it  fine. 

The  Ciiair:\l\x.  What  is  this  in  The  Independent  ?  "  Citizens' 
committee  heads  have  a  stormy  affair.  Recrudescence  of  old-time 
feeling." 

Mr.  PuGH.  The  citizens  waited  upon  both  Col.  Meekins  and  myself 
to  stop  this  fight  in  the  newspapers;  just  after  I  had  bought  my 
newspaper  to  defend  myself,  they  decided  it  was  time  to  quit.  Of 
course,  I  signed  it  after  he  did.  But  I  am  still  vice  chairman,  and 
I  am  going  to  take  charge  next  Sunday  morning  and  go  to  work  in 
a  good  cause  on  a  holy  day. 

Senator  Reed.  I  think  that  is  all. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  it  is  unfortunate  you  were  brought  here. 

Mr.  PuGH.  I  would  like  to  apologize  to  the  committee  for  coming, 
but  the  word  "  subpoena  "  was  mentioned  in  the  telegram,  so  I  thought 
I  had  better  come  on. 

Senator  Reed.  I  have  placed  that  statement  in  the  record  and  will 
let  it  stand,  not  as  an  assertion  of  truth  but  as  the  reason  why  the 
committee  subpoenaed  Mr.  Pugh. 

That  is  all,  Mr.  Pugh. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MK.  EDWAED  E.  BEITTON. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Mr.  Britton,  what  is  your  business  ? 
Mr.  Britton.  Private  secretary  to  the  Secretary  of  the  Navy. 
The  Chairman.  We  have  been  informed  you  desire  to  make  some 
statement. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do.    My  reason  is  this :  I  found  in  the  Baltimore 
I  Sun  yesterday  morning,  and  also  the  papers  in  my  State  of  North 
Carolina,  that  I  had  been  connected  with  using  Government  funds  in 
my  trip  to  San  Francisco.    It  was  also  stated  in  the  Baltimore  paper 
that  I  had  accompanied  Secretary  Daniels  on  a  battleship;  that  we 
had  gone  on  a  battleship  to  the  convention.    I  heard  that  I  was  to  be 
r  subp(Bnaed  to  the  com.mittee,  but  I  have  received  no  subpoena.  I 
-  learned  the  committee  was  to  adjourn  to-day,  and  I  just  wanted  to 


2692 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


be  heard  by  the  committee  to  say  that  my  expenses  to  San  Francisco 
were  paid  absolutely  by  myself.  Neither  the  Navy  Department  nor 
the  United  States  Government  had  anything  to  do  with  it. 

I  Avas  the  social  secretary  of  the  Democratic  convention  in  Chicago, 
the  social  secretary  in  1916  in  St.  Louis,  and  in  1912  in  Baltimore, 
and  I  have  ahvays  been  active  in  Democratic  councils  ever  since  I 
became  of  age. 

I  want  to  say  for  Secretary  Daniels  that  he  did  not  go  to  the  na- 
tional convention  on  a  battleship;  that  he  went  on  a  railroad,  the 
Baltimore  &  Ohio ;  that  his  ticket,  including  his  Pullman,  and  so  on, 
from  Washington,  cost  $233,  paid  for  by  his  private  check ;  that  from 
there  on  he  continued  his  trip  on  official  business,  and  I  really  thought 
that  the  whole  expenses  might  have  been  charged  to  the  Government, 
because  he  was  going  to  Alaska  on  a  coal  inquiry-  for  the  Govern- 
ment. But  he  held  differently,  and  paid  his  entire  expenses  to  San 
Francisco.  Neither  one  of  us  used  Government  money  in  that 
manner. 

I  only  want  to  make  that  statement  because  of  the  statement  in 
my  home  papers.  I  did  not  find  it  in  the  Washington  papers, 
though. 

The  Chairman.  There  has  been  no  statement  before  the  committee 
that  you  went  to  San  Francisco  at  Government  expense. 

Mr.  Britton.  It  was  so  stated  in  the  Baltimore  Sun. 

The  Chairman.  I  think  there  has  been  no  such  statement  before 
the  committee. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  just  wanted  to  make  that  clear.  There  is  with 
Mr.  F.  S.  Curtis,  of  the  Navy  Department.  I  would  like  him  to  be 
heard  next. 

The  Chairman.  Is  that  all  you  care  to  say  ?  If  so,  we  would  like 
to  ask  you  a  question  or  two.  How  many  of  the  employees  of  the 
Navy  Department,  if  you  can  tell  us,  went  to  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  The  only  other  employee  of  the  Navy  Department  I 
saw  at  San  Francisco  was  Mr.  Camalier.  He  is  secretary  to  Assist- 
ant Secretary  Roosevelt. 

The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  at  Government  expense? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not  know. 

The  Chairman.  We  have  heard  a  good  deal  about  the  battleships. 
Since  you  have  brought  it  up,  we  would  like  to  know  about  them. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  saw  it  in  the  paper  that  you  subpoenaed  me  for 
that  purpose. 

The  Chairman.  We  did  not  subpoena  you  for  that. 

Mr.  Britton.  You  said  you  would  subpoena  us — the  Baltimore 
Sun  said  so. 

The  Chairman.  The  Baltimore  Sun  shed  more  light  on  it  than 
we  did.    There  were  a  number  of  battleships  out  there? 
Mr.  Britton.  A  number. 
The  Chairman.  How  many? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  went  on  board  one  of  them  at  San  Diego— just 
went  out  and  went  on  one  of  the  ships.  They  were  open  to  visitors. 
They  were  in  the  harbor.  I  just  went  on  board  with  a  party  of 
friends. 

The  Chairman.  Secretary  Daniels  went  right  through  to  San 
Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  He  went  through  to  San  Francisco. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2693 


The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  from  San  Diego  to  San  Francisco  on  a 
battleship  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  so  understood.  His  ticket  was  purchased  here  to 
San  Francisco  via  San  Diego  and  Los  Angeles. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  many  went  up  on  the  battle- 
ship from  San  Diego  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  have  no  idea.  I  was  at  San  Francisco  at  the  time. 
I  reached  there  on  the  morning  of  the  24th  of  June. 

The  Chairman.  Was  there  a  battleship  there  then? 

Mr.  Britton.  The  New  M exico^  I  believe. 

The  Chairman.  After  the  convention  they  went  on  the  battleship 
to  Alaska  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  after  the  convention 
about  where  the  party  went.  I  heard  that  Secretary  Daniels  had  left 
and  gone  into  Alaska  with  Secretary  of  the  Interior  Payne  to  look 
over  the  matter  of  coal. 

The  Chairman.  Did  they  not  go  from  San  Francisco  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not  know.  I  do  not  know  when  he  left.  I  was 
not  attached  to  the  staff  of  Secretary  Daniels  at  all.  At  the  time  I 
was  on  my  leave  of  absence. 

The  Chairman.  I  understood  you  to  say  that  they  went  on  from 
San  Francisco  to  Alaska  on  official  business. 

The  Britton.  That  is  my  understanding  only  from  the  papers,  be- 
cause I  had  a  vacation  period  then. 

The  Chairman.  The  Providence  Journal  had  a  report  on  that. 
Did  you  see  that  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  did  not. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  read  the  headline  : 

Secretary  Daniels's  vacation  trip  costs  Public  Treasury  .$65,000. 
Use  of  wMrsbips  to  transport  party  along  Pacific  coast  on  Alaska  tour  makes 
heavy,  expense. 

It  costs  the  Government  $7,414  to  get  Mr.  Daniels  and  his  guests  from  San 
Francisco  to  Seattle,  $57,457  from  Seattle  to' Alaska  and  return.  No  Govern- 
ment projects  under  way  call  for  Secretary's  personal  presence  in  Pacific  waters. 

What  have  you  to  say  to  that  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  Nothing  at  all,  because  I  know  nothing  of  it. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  not  linow  whetlier  the  party  went  from 
San  Fiancisco  to  Seattle? 

Mr.  Britton.  Only  from  what  I  have  seen  in  the  newspapers; 
because,  as  I  say,  I  was  on  my  vacation  period,  and  I  left  Washington 
10  days  before  the  Secretary. 

The  Chairman.  But  3^  have  been  back  and  heard  talk  about  it 
since? 

^Ir.  Britton.  Not  in  the  Navy  Department ;  only  what  I  have  seen 
in  the  newspapers. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  told  us  about  buying  a  ticket — getting  a 
ticket  back  to  San  Francisco.  How  do  you  know  that  if  you  do  not 
know  anything  about  this  other? 

Mr.  Britton.  Because  in  the  office  of  the  Secretary  we  keep  his 
check  book,  and  all  checks  are  made  in  the  office  and  attended  to  by 
the  men  in  the  office. 

The  Chairman.  Were  there  any  checks  to  cover  the  trip  to 
Alaska  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  No. 


2694 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  Was  that  official  business  in  Alaska? 
Mr.  BiiiTTON.  I  suppose  that  he  went  up  to  Alaska  with  Secretary 
Payne. 

The  Chairman.  You  understand  it  to  be  a  fact  that  they  went  up 
to  Alaska  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  understand  it  from  reading  it  in  the  newspapers, 
Senator. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  understand  how  many  went  on  the  ship  ? 
Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not. 

The  Chairman.  Or  the  purpose  of  the  trip? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not,  except  such  as  I  read  in  the  papers. 

The  Chairman.  I  thought  you  said  it  was  about  some  coal  matter. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  heard  that  it  was.  I  heard  the  Secretary  give  an 
interview  to  newspaper  correspondents,  as  he  generally  does  in  the 
morning,  telling  about  his  visit  and  Secretary  Pajaie's  visit,  on  his 
return  to  Washington.  He  returned  to  Washington  on  the  night  of 
August  2,  and  on  the  morning  of  August  3  he  gave  an  interview, 
and  it  is  in  the  papers  of  August  4. 

The  Chairman.  Does  it  state  anything  about  the  boat  he  went  on? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not  knoAv. 

The  Chairman.  The  New  Mexico  did  not  go  up  to  Alaska? 
Mr.  Britton.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  It  could  not  go  in  those  waters  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  So,  it  was  a  cruiser  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  I  suppose  it  was  a  torpedo-boat  destroyer,  or  some- 
thing of  that  kind.    It  was  a  small  boat. 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  the  Neio  Mexico  took  the 
party  from  San  Francisco  to  Seattle  ?    This  paper  says  it  did. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  am  absolutely  ignorant  on  that.  I  do  not  know  of 
that  trip  at  all. 

The  Chairman  (reading  from  newspaper  article)  : 

T]B6  of  dreadnanglit  Idalw,  11  days,  in  proceeding  from  Seattle  to  Cook  Inlet, 
Alaska,  to  meet  tlie  Secretary  and  his  party  and  return  them  to  Seattle,  at 
$37.37  a  day— $41,107. 

Mr.  Britton.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  that. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

Use  of  six  destroyers,  five  days,  transporting  Secretary  Daniels  and  his  party 
from  Seattle  to  Seward,  Alaska,  at  an  expense  of  $545  i)er  day  per  destroyer — 
$16,350. 

What  need  would  there  be  of  five  or  six  destroyers  going  up  there  ? 

Mr.  Britton.  That  is  a  matter  for  the  Office  of  Operations  of  the 
Navy,  sir.  The  private  secretary  has  nothing  to  do  with  that. 

The  Chairman.  Who  could  tell  us  about  that? 

Mr.  Britton.  The  Office  of  Operations.  i 

The  Chairman.  If  it  came  to  be  an  important  matter   j 

Mr.  Britton.  I  suppose  the  Auditor  for  the  Navy  Department  orj 
chief  clerk  could  give  vou  that. 

The  Chairman.  Mr.^^Curtis? 

Mr.  Britton.  The  Office  of  Operations  would  have  those  matters. 
The  Chairivian.  You  have  told  us  all  you  know  ? 
Mr.  Britton.  Yes,  sir. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2695 


,  The  Chairman.  That  is  alL  There  is  nothing  here  to  reflect  on 
I-  you  in  any  way. 

Mr.  Britton.  Will  you  hear  Mr.  Curtis  now  ? 

The  Chairman.  Yes. 

,  TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  FRANK  S.  CURTIS. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
j  .  The  Chairman.  What  is  your  position  ? 
.    Mr.  Curtis.  Chief  clerk  of  the  Navy  Department. 

The  Chairman.  Who  was  Mr.  Roosevelt's  secretary? 
.  Mr.  Curtis.  Camalier. 
,     The  Chairman.  Did  he  go  to  San  Francisco  at  the  time  of  the 
convention? 

j    Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

'     The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  or  not  he  went  at  Govern- 
J  ment  expense  ?    Have  you  any  vouchers  there  to  show  ? 
i    Mr.  Curtis.  He  has  an  order  that  would  entitle  him  to  go  at  Gov- 
l  eminent  expense.   He  has  made  no  claim  for  it  as  yet. 
'j    The  CHAiRr.iAN.  He  would  not  go  at  Government  expense  without 
Ian  order  of  this  kind? 
'j    Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir. 
:  The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Griffin? 

■  Mr.  Curtis.  Admiral  Griffin,  the  acting  Secretary  on  the  date  that 
was  signed. 

>    The  Chairman.  Is  he  an  admiral  ? 
Mr.  Curtis.  Yes. 

.  The  Chairman-  This  is  a  direction  to  accompany  the  Assistant 
jSecretary  of  the  Navy  to  San  Francisco  and  other  points  on  the  west 
jcoast  as  may  be  directed : 

Upon  completion  of  this  toniporary  duty  yon  will  return  to  V\^asbin?ton  D  C 
;and  resume  your  regular  duties. 

^  The  Bureau  of  Navi.f.-atiofi  v/ill  furnish  you  the  necesrary  railroad  transporta- 
[ition,  including  Pullnjan  accommodations,  and  will  note  the  same  hereon, 

■  You  will  be  allowed  traveling  expenses  under  schedule  A  of  article  122  Naval 
iRegulations,  1913. 

^fter  settlement *of  your  claim  for  traveling  expenses  the  inclosed  form  will 
ibe  filled  out  and  forwarded  to  the  department. 

.    You  know  that  he  went  to  San  Francisco,  do  you  ? 
i   Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

,|   The  Chairman.  When  would  his  expense  account  come  in  ? 

1^  Mr.  CuRTis.  He  has  had  time  to  do  it  already,  but  he  has  not  sub- 

Jmitted  it. 

;   The  Chairman.  You  have  made  an  examination  to  see? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir;  I  made  an  examination  this  morning  to  find 
out. 

The  Chairman.  And  having  the  order  to  go,  it  is  fair  to  presume 
Ithat  he  went  at  Government  expense? 

i  since  resigned  from  the  department. 

,    The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  whether  he  had  any  business  there 

jwith  a  number  of  Assistant  Attorneys  General  who  were  startino-  for 

I  there  at  that  time? 

'    Mr.  Curtis.  I  do  not  know. 


2696 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chaikman.  Or  with  Mr.  Harrison,  of  the  Department  of  Agri- 
culture ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Is  this  one  of  those  coincidences  we  have  heard  so 
much  about  here? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  do  not  think  so. 

The  Chairman.  How  many  other  men  in  the  department  of  the 
Navy  went  to  San  Francisco  at  that  time? 

Mr.  Curtis.  In  June  and  July?  I  went  over  the  records  this  morn- 
ing and  found  five  orders. 

The  Chairman.  Who  were  they? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Including  Mr.  Camalier,  Dr.  L.  W.  Austin,  W.  C. 
Dean,  W.  D.  Bergman,  and  R.  M.  Wills. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  look  for  their  expense  accounts? 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir;  I  do  not  think  all  of  their  expense  accounts 
have  come  in. 

The  Chairman.  Maybe  they  will  not  come  in  now. 

Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  they  will ;  they  will  undoubtedly. 

The  Chairman.  When  do  you  expect  them  in,  Mr.  Curtis;  in  the 
natural  order,  any  day? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Yes.    Here  is  Dr.  L.  W.  Austin's  letter  

The  Chairman.  Who  is  Dr.  Austin? 

Mr.  Curtis.  He  is  an  expert  in  connection  with  the  Naval  Radio 
Research  Laboratory. 

The  Chairman.  What  date  did  he  leave  ? 
Mr.  Curtis.  The  order  was  dated  June  10. 

The  Chairman.  The  same  as  the  order  of  Roosevelt's  secretary? 
Mr.  Curtis.  I  would  like  to  read  the  last  paragraph  of  Dr.  Austin's 
request. 

The  Chairman.  Very  well.  By  the  way,  where  is  he  from,  what 
State? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  do  not  know  what  State.  He  has  been  connected 
with  the  Bureau  of  Standards  here.  He  says — this  is  just  one  para- 
graph in  asking  for  this — "  If  funds  are  not  at  present  available 
for  such  a  trip,  I  am  willing  to  pay  my  own  expenses  as  I  did  on 
the  recent  Porto  Rico  trip." 

That  trip  was  in  connection  with  studying  static  conditions  on 
the  west  coast  of  the  United  States. 

The  Chairiman.  Were  the  static  conditions  there  pretty  bad  at  the 
time  of  the  Democratic  convention?  When  had  he  been  out  there 
before  to  study  static  conditions? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  think  this  was  his  first  trip. 

The  Chairman.  Why  did  so  many  of  these  employees  of  the  de- 
partments make  their  first  trip  to  San  Francisco  at  that  time  ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Well,  I  do  not  think  you  can  call  this  a  very  large 
number — five. 

The  ChairjMan.  Five  at  that  particular  time.  Did  they  all  start 
on  the  10th,  or  did  they  all  get  their  orders  on  the  10th? 

Mr.  Curtis.  One  order  is  dated  June  2,  one  June  15,  two  June  10, 
and  one  June  19. 

The  Chairman.  Will  you  take  up  the  different  ones  and  tell  u& 
who  the  people  are. 

Mr.  Curtis.  The  first  one  is  this  Dr.  Austin. 

The  Chairman.  You  have  covered  him. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2697 


Mr.  Curtis.  He  is  employed  on  scientific  matters  with  regard  to 
'  the  wireless.  ^ 

The  Chairman.  Do  you  know  how  long  he  was  there  ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not  think  he  has  come  back  yet.  Admiral 
Griffin  says,  "  Dr.  Austin  expects  to  be  engaged  in  this  work  for  a 
period  not  exceeding  six  weeks." 

i  The  Chairman.  That  apparently  has  nothing  to  do  with  the  con- 
I  vention. 

I    Who  is  the  next  one? 

Mr.  Curtis.  W.  D.  Bergman,  June  19,  1920,  travel  orders  to  pro- 
;  ceed  to  the  navy  yard,  Mare  Island,  Calif.,  for  special  temporary 
duty,  and  to  such  other  points  on  route  to  and  from  that  point  as 
may  be  necessary. 

I'he  Chairman.  Who  is  he? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Appointment  clerk  of  the  Navy  Department. 
The  Chairman.  Where  is  he  from  ? 
Mr.  Curtis.  I  think  he  is  a  District  of  Columbia  man. 
The  Chairman.  What  is  the  date  of  his  order  ? 
^    Mr.  Curtis.  The  date  of  his  order  is  June  19.    His  duty  was  in 
connection  Avith  charges  of  infractions  of  the  civil-service  regula- 
tions by  the  civil-service  secretary  in  San  Francisco.    The  matter 
had  been  investigated  by  a  special  board.    Reports  had  come  in  to 
J  the  department,  and  Mr.  Bergman  and  Mr.  Fisher,  representing  the 
Civil  Service  Commission,  had  gone  over  these  reports.   There  had 
been  a  discussion  of  the  whole  thing  by  the  three  Commissioners  of 
i  the  Civil  Service  Commission  and  the  Secretary  and  Assistant  Sec- 
retary  of  the  Navy,  and  it  was  decided  to  send  Mr.  Bergman  and 
plr.  Fisher  out  there  to  make  a  further  investigation  of  these  charges. 

^  The  Chairman.  It  was  necessary  to  look  into  those  charges  at  that 
>time  ? 

'  ^  Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir;  and  it  was  desirable  that  it  should  be  at  a 
l;time  that  the  Secretary  and  the  Assistant  Secretary  were  at  the  yard 
out  there. 

'    The  Chairman.  You  do  not  know  how  long  he  stayed  there  ? 

r    Mr.  Curtis.  Mr.  Fisher  and  Mr.  Bergman  were  there  for  10  or 

15  days  after  the  convention,  working  night  and  day  and  putting  in 

a  great  deal  of  overtime. 

.  The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  next  one  ? 
,  .  Mr.  Curtis.  The  next  one  is  R.  M.  Wills. 
i  .  The  Chairman.  Who  is  Mr.  Wills  ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  He  is  a  draftsman— Naval  Gun  Factory.   His  request 

reads : 

The  bureau  requests  that  orders  be  given  to  Mr.  R.  M.  Wills  chargeman 
draftsman,  Naval  Gun  Factory,  Washington,  D.  C,  to  proceed  to  San  Francisco 
•Calif.,  and  on  June  24,  1920,  report  to  the  commander  in  chief  of  the  Pacific 
Fleet  on  temporary  duty  for  the  purpose  of  securing  necessary  data  to  enable 
,  the  Naval  Gun  Factory  to  proceed  with  the  design  of  the  tun-et  installation  -of 
"•dn-ector  firing  gear  for  the  Neiv  York,  New  Mexico,  and  Idaho,  and  upon  com- 
'  pletion  to  proceed  to  Bremerton,  Wash.,  and  report  to  the  commandant  of  the 
»Puget  Sound  Navy  Yard  for  the  purpose  of  obttiining  the  same  information 
;  regardmg  the  Mississippi  and  Texas,  and  upon  completion  to  return  to  Wash- 
ington, D.  C,  and  resume  his  present  duties. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  ever  been  out  there  before  ? 
i  Mr.  Curtis.  Not  that  I  know  of.  " 
The  Chairman.  Who  is  the  next  one? 


2698 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Curtis.  W.  C.  Dean,  electrical  aid. 
The  Chairman.  Where  is  he, from? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  do  not  know  his  legal  residence.  He  is  electrical  aid, 
Bureau  of  Construction  and  Repair.    The  request  in  his  case  says : 

It  is  requested  that  orders  be  issued  Mr.  W.  C.  Dean,  electrical  aid,  Bureau 
of  Construction  and  Repair,  to  proceed  on  or  about  July  1,  1920,  from  Portland, 
Oreg.,  to  the  Mare  Island  Navy  Yard,  at  San  Francisco,  Calif.,  and  thence  to 
the  Puget  Sound  Navy  Yard,  at  Brementon,  Vv^ash.,  reporting  to  the  commandant 
at  each  yard,  and  conf(M-ring  v.'ith  the  respective  construction  officers  on  the 
matter  of  hydraulic  steering  gears  being  installed  on  new  vessels  and  on  vessels 
in  commission ;  also  to  make  investigjition  relative  to  the  installation  of  new 
shop  tools,  and  particularly  ;is  to  the  extent  to  v/liich  electric  arc  welding  is  used, 
apparatus  for  the  process  having  been  adopted  at  east  coast  navy  yards  witli 
attendant  economies. 

Mr.  Dean  will  be  in  Portland  between  the  dates  of  June  24  to  July  10  while 
on  annual  leave.  It  is  considered  that  an  excellent  opportunity  at  compara- 
tively small  expense  to  the  department  will  thus  be  afforded  him  to  familiarize 
himself  with  conditions  involving  installation  and  maintenance  of  Construction 
and  Repair  electric  auxiliaries  on  ships  and  electrically  operated  machiiie  tools 
at  the  west  coast  yards,  which  especially  concerns  Mr.  Dean's  work  at  the 
bureau  and  about  which  it  is  desirable  that  he  be  informed. 

The  Chairman.  Had  he  been  out  there  before? 
Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir ;  1  do  not  think  he  had. 
The  Chairman.  That  was  his  first  trip  ? 
Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Those  are  all,  are  they,  Mr.  Curtis  ? 
Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  The  gentleman  who  was  just  on  the  stand  s-iid 
that  he  thought  you  could  clear  up  a  matter  that  had  been  men- 
tioned, referring  to  statements  that  nave  been  made  about  Secretary 
Daniels  being  out  there  on  a  battleship.  I  would  like  to  have  joii 
clear  that  up. 

Mr.  Curtis.  In  the  Pacific  Fleet  the  battleships  are  on  the  coast, 
and  of  course  there  were  three  or  four  of  them  at  San  Francisco 
during  the  convention. 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  there  yourself? 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir ;  1  was  not. 

The  Chairman.  After  the  convention  did  any  party  go  on  the 
battleships  to  Seattle  ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  am  not  familiar  with  that.  I  knoAV  absolutely  that 
there  was  a  trip  from  Seattle  to  ^^laska  by  Secretary  i)aniels  and 
Secretary  Payne  in  connection  with  coal. 

The  Chairman.  On  what  boat  did  they  go ;  do  you  know  ? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  do  not  know.  It  must  have  been  a  destroyer,  be 
cause  they  went  up  fost  and  came  back  fast.   They  made  a  record. 

The  Chairman.  This  article  that  was  brought  to  the  attention  of 
the  committee,  to  which  I  called  Mr.  Britton's  attention,  is  from  the 
Providence  Journal: 

Secretary  Daniels's  vncntion  trip  costs  Public  Treasury  $65,000. 
Use  of  warships  to  transport  party  along  Pacific  coast  on  Alaska  tour  makes 
heavy  expense. 

It  cost  the  Government  $7,414  to  get  Mr.  Daniels  and  his  guests  from  San 
Francisco  to  Seattle,,  $57,457  from  Seattle  to  Alaska  and  return.  No  Govern- 
ment projects  under  way  call  for  Secretary's  personal  presence  in  Pacific 
waters. 

Do  you  know  how  they  got  from  San  Francisco  to  Seattle? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2699 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir ;  I  do  not. 
^    The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

From  Seattle  to  Alaska  $57,457  and  return.    No  Government  projects  under 
way  call  for  Secretary's  personal  presence  in  Pacific  waters. 

1^    You  do  not  know  anything  about  that  ? 
I    Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir.*" 

'    The  Chairman.  You  simply  do  know  that  Secretary  Payne  and 
Secretary  Daniels  went  on  to  Alaska? 
Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  This  says  that  there  were  six  destroyers. 
■  Mr.  Curtis.  It  does  not  take  six  destroyers. 
The  Chairman  (reading)  : 

To  trjinsport  Secretary  Daniels  and  his  party  from  Seattle  to  Seward,  Alaska 
at  an  expense  of  $545  per  day  per  destroyer.  ' 

;    I  was  wondering  why  they  would  need  six. 

L,^^^-.^^^^™-  They  would  not  need  six.  Of  course,  the  Pacific 
ll<^leet^  IS  on  the  coast  there  and  it  costs  money  to  maintain  the  fleet 
Ine  tact  they  were  used  for  this  trip  does  not  add  to  the  cost. 

The  Chairman.  It  woidd  not  add  anything  to  the  cost  whether 
the  vessel  is  moving  or  whether  it  is  still? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Oh,  yes;  but  we  are  supposed  to  keep  our  vessels 
jmoving. 

;  .The  Chairman.  So  that  there  would  be  no  additional  expense  to 
,!the  (Tovernment  if  the  ships  had  been  used  to  go  to  Alaska. 
.   Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir. 

H   The  Chairman.  How  are  the  expenses  of  these  trips  paid?  Are 
^Ithey  paid  m  advance?    If  you  ha^  e  a  battleship  and  want  to  enter- 
tain some  newspaper  men,  would  that  entertainment  be  paid  for  by 
.the  Government? 

3  *  Mr.  CuRTTS.  Conjrress  will  not  give  us  any  funds  of  that  kind, 
i  ^he  Chatrm.an.  No  funds  to  entertain  newspaper  men? 
i  Mr.  CuRT  S.  Not  to  2-0  that  far. 

Mr  Br  TTTON.  The  officers  of  a  ship  pay  for  their  own  me'=^s.  The 
enlisfed  men  are  paid  by  the  Government.  The  officers  on  the  A'^ew 
merico  invited  me  t^^ere. 

,  The  Chairman.  Where  guests  are  invited  the  officers  pay  for  it? 

Mr.  Br^tton,  Yes,  sir ;  it  is  not  paid  by  the  Government'  at  all. 
I    .Senator  Reed.  Let  me  get  that  right.    Is  not  this  a  fact,  that  an 
;3fTi-er  provides  his  own  uniform  out  of  his  own  pocket? 

Mr.  Curtis.  He  does. 

^  Senator  Eeed.  He  provides  his  own  subsistence  out  of  his  own 
oocket  ? 

!    jVfr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Reed.  If  he  invites  a  man  to  eat  with  him  on  a  battleship 
ine  pays  for  that  meal,  just  the  same  as  if  he  invited  him  to  eat  in  his 
'^lome? 

;   iVIr.  Curtis.  In  his  home  or  his  hotel. 

,   Senator  Reed.  So  that  when  vou  no  on  a  battleship  and  dine  with 
Jtn  officer  the  off.cer  gets  "  stuck  "  fr)r  the  meal? 
;   Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  right.   Officers  get  "  stuck  "  in  for- 
i^ign  waters  very  frequently.    They  have  to  entertain  out  of  their 
"•wn  pockets. 


2700 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  If  a  party  goes  on  a  battleship  the  officer  is  re- 
sponsible for  the  entertainment? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Unless  it  is  some  official  party.  If  Congressmen 
should  go  on  board  battleship  I  think  there  is  an  official  fund  to  cover 

The  Chairman.  Do  they  entertain  Senators  on  battleships? 

Senator  Reed.  Officially,  in  conducting  an  investigation. 

The  Chairman.  When  they  are  on  official  business.  That  is  the 
distinction.  I  do  not  think  there  is  anything  further,  unless  you 
have  something  further  to  present. 

Mr.  Curtis.  No  ;  I  have  nothing  further. 

The  Chairman.  I  will  ask  you  this  question,  because  I  saw  . it  in  the 
newspaper.  Did  Secretary  Roosevelt  go  on  a  cruiser  to  his  Maine 
home  after  he  was  nominated  at  San  Francisco,  as  published  in  the 
Washington  Times? 

Mr.  Curtis.  I  only  know  from  the  newspaper  report. 

The  Chairman.  That  is  all  you  know? 

Mr.  Curtis.  That  is  all  I  know. 

The  Chairman.  That  would  not  have  cost  any  more  money,  even  if 

it  is  so?  ^  n        ,^  . 

Mr.  Curtis.  Our  ships  are  going  along  the  coast  from  (juantanamo 
up  to  Maine  constantly,  every  year,  all  the  time.  On  the  Pacific 
coast  the  same  way.    They  get  their  training  that  way. 

The  Chairman.  You  plan  to  keep  the  ships  moving? 

Mr.  Curtis.  Yes,  sir.  . 

Senator  Reed.  You  could  not  train  the  crew  of  a  ship  to  efficiency 
if  you  stood  the  boat  out  in  the  harbor  and  let  it  remain  there? 

Mr.  Curtis.  No,  sir ;  and  if  you  put  a  battleship  in  the  harbor  and 
let  it  stay  there  six  months  it  deteriorates  very  rapidly. 

The  Chairman.  The  ship  itself  needs  the  movement. 

Mr.  Curtis.  As  much  as  the  men. 

The  Chairman.  We  are  very  much  obliged  to  you. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MRS.  L.  J.  LLEWELLYN. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
The  Chairman.  Mrs.  Llewellyn,  are  you  connected  with  the  Stars 
and  Stripes  in  any  way  ? 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  I  am. 
The  Chairman.  What  position? 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Treasurer. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  connected  in  any  way  with  Mr.  Jamie- 
son's  committee? 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  No,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  When  did  you  cease  to  be  so  connected? 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Since  February,  the  latter  part  of  February.^ 
The  Chairman.  Up  to  that  time  you  were  holding  what  position 
with  the  Democratic  national  committee  ? 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  The  head  of  the  letter-opening  department. 
The  Chairman.  Is  that  a  pretty  busy  department? 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Yes.  sir;  sometimes. 

The  Chairman.  You  opened  the  letters  containing  the  drafts? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2701 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Usually,  yes,  sir;  that  was  my  duty  to  handle 
tne  money.  *^ 

The  Chairman.  Were  you  cashier  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes  at  one 
when?  ^^'^^       ^'""^'^  position  with  Mr.  Jamieson's  committee 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  The  latter  part  of  February. 
The  Chairman.  And  immediately  became  cashier  of  the  Stars  and 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Who  recommended  that  change « 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  In  the  latter  part  of  February  the  Democratic 
national  committee,  you  might  say,  closed  down.  They  let  go  over 
one  hundred  employees.  When  they  let  us  go  Mrs.  Parks  tried  to 
place  everybody  m  some  kind  of  a  position  with  the  Government  or 
somewhere  and  at  that  time  she  was  interested  and  she  took  up  her 
interest  in  the  Stars  and  Stripes  and  asked  me  if  I  would  like  to  have 
a  position  down  there,  and  I  accepted  it. 

;  wh^Il  you  "werrtherl?"  bookkeeper  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes 

Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Kidwiler. 
-  The  Chairman.  Who  is  bookkeeper  now« 
Mrs.  Llewellyn.  Hardy  Meakin. 

exS'sed^''^'''''^''*  ^  '^'^  '"''^  ^^'""^  anything  further.   You  are 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  RICHARD  H.  WALDO. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  the  chairman.) 
ine  Chairman. Your  name  has  been  used  here.  I 


xiie  ^.MAiRMAN.  I  our  name  has  been  used  here.   I  understand  vou 
want  to  make  some  statement  ?  unaeistana  you 

f;    Mr.  Waldo.  Yes,  sir. 

It  wf"^'^"^-  P'^lKl^^i^r  ^""^^  ^^^^  and  business. 
Mr.  Waldo.  Eichard  H.  Waldo. 

!  Chairman.  What  is  your  business  ? 

^e^."*'  ^  publishers;  running  my  own  busi- 

i    Jr^®  Chairman.  You  have  a  business  of  your  own« 
j;   Mr.  Waldq.  Yes,  sir. 
[    The  Chairman.  Where? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Located  in  New  York. 
V         f  H^iR^iAN.  Adviser  to  publishers? 

K  /l^^^l?-  ^-xf '  f ^^^^^^  war  I  was  manairer  and  secre- 
tary of  the  New  York  Tribune.  I  went  into  the  servicf  and  was  two 
years  overseas.  During  that  time,  among  other  duties,  I  was  assi^nld 

,  to  the  organization  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes.  cibbi^nea 

f       ®  Chairman.  Across  the  sea? 

Wqf^^'^n*  ^''''''^l  .y^"'  ^nd^^       direction  of  the  Gen- 

^ral  Staff.   On  my  return  to  this  country  I  accepted  a  proposition  to 
ecome  general  manager  of  the  American  Association  o^f  For^^^^ 
Language  Newspapers  and  the  Interracial  Council  of  New  York 

rSral  llpnirr'^^^  ^^^'"'^  ^^"'^  organizations  I  met 
[jreneral  DuPont  on  two  or  three  occasions;  but  quite  apart  from 


2702  PRESIDENTIAT.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

that  I  took  a  great  interest  in  various  soldier  movements  and  am  my- . 
self  president  of  an  American  Legion  post. 

I  was  several  times  approached  by  certain  ex-menabers  of  my  over- 
seas oro-anization  who  had  interested  themselves  in  the  American, 
edition  "of  the  Stars  and  Stripes  with  the  request  that  I  either  buy 
the  paper  or  become  interested  in  it.  I  was  interested  m  the  young 
men,  because  there  were  very  able  young  men  overseas,  and  I  made 
careful  inquiry  as  to  how  the  thing  stood.  Through  Washington  in- 
formation I  had  every  reason  to  believe  that  it  was  being  operated  as 
a  part  of  the  Democratic  national  committee  ultimate  propaganda 
machinery.  I  say  "  ultimate  "  because  it  appeared  to  be  m  process 
of  building  for  future  use.  ...  .  .x. 

I  was  advised  that  Mr.  Jamieson,  the  assistant  treasurer  ot  the 
Democratic  national  committee,  was  the  backer,  although  he  pre- 
ferred not  to  appear;  that  a  Mrs.— the  lady  who  has  testified  here; 
her  name  I  do  not  recall  

The  Chairman.  Parks? 

Mr  Waldo.  Yes— was  the  figurehead  through  whom  the  operation 
was  conducted;  and  because  of  the  political  slant  I  did  not  feel  that 
I  wanted  to  become  connected  with  the  paper  m  any  way.  but 
when  the  bonus  agitation  was  carried  on  it  appeared  to  me  and  to 
many  of  us  in  the  Legion  that  the  necessary  attention  to  the  wounded 
men  would  be  seriously  impaired  if  the  proposed  bonus  of  a  blanket 
nature  were  put  through.  -,  ,  o 

The  Chairman.  You  were  opposed  to  the  bonus «  , 
Mr  W\LDO.  Very  much  opposed  to  it,  sir.    I  was  instrumental  m 
forming  a  committee  which  fought  the  bonus  throughout  tne  country. 
The  Chairman.  That  was  a  committee  withm  the  Legion  ?  ^ 
Mr  Waldo.  Within  and  without.    It  was  not  an  official  Legion 
committee  at  all.   I  was  fighting  the  Legion  executives  m  that  con- 
nection, and  I  got  a  great  many  Legion  men  to  jom  with  us;  and 
in  order  to  carrv  forward  the  work  of  that  committee  and  make 
known  to  the  ex-soldiers  of  the  country  what  the  extrordinary  needs 
are  and  will  be  in  the  matter  of  taking  care  of  the  wounded  and  dis- 
abled and  the  dependents  of  the  dead,  it  appeared  advisable  to  have 
a  paper  that  could  get  the  word  out.  .  .1     a  • 

I  had  been  called  in  as  one  of  the  reorganizers  of  the  American 
Legion  Weekly— reorganization  of  publications  being  my  business— 
and  when  the  American  Legion  officially  decided  to  t;ike  a  bonus, 
I  withdrew  from  participation  and  discussed  with  some  members 
of  this  committee  the  advisability  of  securing  a  paper  which  could 
do  the  things  we  thought  the  American  Legion  Weeklv  ought  to  do 
but  refused  to  do  because  of  the  decision  of  the  executives. 

I  came  to  Washington  at  the  invitation  of  Mr.  Jones  /^nd  Mr 
Eider,  respectively  the  editor  and  business  manager  of  the  btars 
and  Stripes.   I  met  Mr.  Heffernan.   They  all  came  to  my  hotel  and 
talked  the  matter  over  with  me,  but  nothing  came  of  the  ^hsc™^^ 
But  upon  returning  to  New  York  and  viewing  the  si  nation  furthei, 
it  seemed  advisable  to  go  further    I  came  ^o  Washington  a^^^^^ 
Mr.  Jamieson  and  Mrs.  Parks.    I  talked  perfectly  frankly  to  them 
and  told  them  exactly  what  it  was  that  T  had  m  mind.   They  aske 
me  if  Gen.  Du  Pont  had  any  connection  with  it  whatever,  i 
explained  to  them  that  he  had  none.    He  had  never  heard  of  my 
connection  with  the  Legion  work;  and  we  discussed  the  matter  ot 


H  PEESIDEKTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2703 

the  sale  of  the  paper.  They  were  not  prepared  to  sell  the  paper,  but 
they  were  prepared  to  raise  some  additional  money,  and  explained 
to  me  that  the  money  was  very  much  needed. 

I  adjourned  the  hearing,  to  be  taken  up  at  a  later  time,  meantime 
making  all  diligent  inquiries  possible  to  verify  the  deepening  con- 
viction that  I  had  that  the  thing  was  being  conducted  as  a  political 
adjunct,  Avliich  seemed  a  great  pity  to  those  who  were  familiar  with 
the  overseas  work  on  the  paper. 

I  found  that  prominent  Democrats  had  been  assessed  by  Mr. 
Jamieson — I  say  "assessed"  advisedl}^  They  had  been  told  they 
were  expected  to  put  up  certain  amounts  of  monev — one  to  put  up 
$7,000  and  the  other  to  put  up  $2,500. 

The  Chairman.  Who  Avere  they? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Mr.  Bernard  Baruch  to  put  up  $7,000.  Mr.  Secretary 
Meredith  was  assessed  $2,500. 

The  Chairman.  When  vou  say  "  assessed."  what  do  you  mean  bv 
that? 

Mr.  Waldo.  They  were  informed  that  it  Avould  be  very  helpful 
and  very  much  appreciated  if  they  would  "  come  through."  Fur- 
ther inquiry  developed  the  fact  to  my  own  satisfaction  only — you 
understand,  this  is  entirely  a  personal  presentation — that  Mr.  Jamie- 
son  appeared  to  be  using  his  official  position  to  raise  funds  for  this 
paper,  which  Avould  be  possibly  useful  to  the  Democratic  committee, 
but  would  certainly  provide,  according  to  Mr.  Jamieson's  hopes,  a 
safe  place  for  him  to  fall  on  in  the  event  of  certain  contingencies 
;  which  we  may  all  look  forward  to.  The  thing  did  not  have  any 
elements  of  business  about  it,  and  upon  consultation  with  the  others 
'  who  were  willing  to  go  in  with  me  in  order  to  take  this  paper  out  of 
the  political  atmosphere  and  use  it  in  education  of  the  soldiers,  and 
what  the  war-risk  insurance,  the  rehabilitation  service — in  fact,  the 
full  congressional  appropriations  have  done  and  are  doing  and  must 
continue  to  do — even  with  the  desire  to  get  the  paper  for  that  pur- 
,  pose,  the  surrounding  atmosphere  was  of  a  kind  that  we  all  decided 
we  did  not  want  to  be  mixed  up  with  in  any  way. 

The  Chairman.  Before  you  leave  that,  I  wish  you  would  tell  us 
how  you  came  to  the  conclusion  that  these  prominent  Democrats 
were  furnishing  this  money  that  you  speak  of. 
Mr.  Waldo.  Mr.  Heffernan  told  me  that  they  had. 
The  Chairman.  The  gentleman  who  testified  here  ? 
Mr.  Waldo.  I  do  not  know  as  to  that. 
I     The  Chairman.  Of  the  Stars  and  Stripes  ? 

I  Mr.  Waldo.  Mr.  Heffernan  is  the  young  lawyer  who,  if  I  may  use 
the  word,  grabbed  the  nanie  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes. 

The  Chairman.  He  testified  here  yesterday. 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  see.    He  is  supposed  to  have  got  backing  for  it. 

The  Chairman.  He  told  you  these  two  gentlemen  contributed  this 
J?  money  ? 

I     Mr.  Waldo.  Yes,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Did  you  hear  Mrs.  Parks's  testimony  this  morning 
fJ  in  which  she  refused  to  divulge  the  names  of  certain  Democrats  who 
r  gave  money? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  got  here  after  she  testified. 


182774— 20— PT  20  6 


2704 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  Chairman.  She  declined  to  give  us  the  names. 

Senator  Reed.  Did  Mr.  Heffernan  tell  you  that  Baruch  and  Mere- 
dith had  been  assessed? 

Mr.  Waldo.  It  is  a  matter  of  recollection,  Senator;  but  the  very- 
strong  impression  was  given  to  me  that  they  had  not  been  wholly 
pleased  with  the  investment  and  that  neither  of  them  regarded  it  as 
a  business  matter  and  neither  of  them  expected  ever  to  get  any  money 
back  on  it. 

Senator  Reed.  You  got  that  from  your  conversation  with  Mr. 
Heffernan  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  The  point  was,  sir,  that  it  was  not  

Senator  Edge.  Did  they  have  stock  for  it? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  do  not  know  as  to  Mr.  Baruch.  I  was  informed  in 
the  other  case.   That  I  Imow  was  given. 

The  Chairman.  So  you  came  to  the  conclusion  that  here  was  a 
paper  parading  as  a  soldier  paper  that  was  really  controlled  and 
operated  in  the  interests  of  the  Democratic  Party? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Reed.  Now,  sir,  can  you  put  your  finger  on  a  single  article 
in  that  paper  of  a  political  character? 

Mr.  Waldo.  No,  sir  5  because,  as  I  used  the  phrase  previously,  it 
was  for  ultimate  purposes.  d 

Senator  Reed.  That  is,  you  conceived  the  paper  in  your  own  mincJ 
to  be  one  that  while  it  had  not  been  in  politics  it  might  be  hereafter  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  It  was  being  built  so  that  it  would  be  potentially  use- 
ful when  the  time  came. 

Senator  Reed.  And  your  reason  for  believing  that  is  because  Mr. 
Jamieson  was  a  prominent  Democrat  connected  with  the  Democratic 
committee  and  because  of  these  contributions  that  came  or  were  pur- 
chased, whichever  you  call  them,  from  Mr.  Baruch  and  Mr.  Meredith 
and  others? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Because  in  all  my  inquiries  I  found  they  had  come 
only  from  Democratic  sources. 

Senator  Reed.  You  spoke  of  some  men  who  were  going  in  with 
you  or  that  had  talked  about  going  in  with  you.    Who  were  they  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Personal  friends  in  New  York,  who  believed  that  they 
had  contacts  among  friends  who  could  raise  the  money,  although  our 
principal  plan  was  to  have  the  soldiers  finance  it  themselves. 

Senator  Reed.  These  gentlemen  were  Republicans  or  Democrats? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Nonpartisan  members  of  the  City  Club  of  New  York. 

Senator  Reed.  You  mean  they  were  really  nonpartisan,  that  they 
had  no  party? 

Mr.  Waldo.  As  far  as  I  know,  sir,  the  legion  is  a  nonpartisan 
organization. 

Senator  Reed.  I  am  not  talking  about  that.  Plenty  of  men  belong 
to  legions  that  are  Democrats  and  plenty  that  are  Republicans.  The 
organization  itself  is  nonpartisan.  I  want  to  know  whether  these 
gentlemen  who  were  going  in  with  you  were  Republicans. 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  have  no  means  of  knowing. 

Senator  Reed.  What  are  you? 

Mr.  Waldo.  A  Democrat,'  an  independent  Democrat. 
Senator  Reed.  You  wanted  to  prevent  this  paper  from  going  into 
Democratic  hands? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGl^^  EXPENSES. 


2705 


Mr.  AValdo.  I  wanted  to  prevent  it  from  going  into  any  party. 
Senator  Eeed.  You  say  yon  are  a  nonpartisan  Democrat? 
Mr.  A¥aldo.  I  hope  so. 

Senator  Reed.  What  is  a  nonpartisan  party  man  ? 
The  Chairman.  A  Democrat  who  will  vote  for  Harding. 
Mr.  Waldo.  That  answers  it  in  my  case,  exactly. 
The  Chairman.  You  are  not  alone,  I  guess. 

Senator  Reed.  If  we  have  plenty  of  that  kind,  we  will  not  go 
far  

Mr.  Waldo.  I  voted  for  Mr.  Wilson  both  times. 
Senator  Reed.  You  have  not  increased  my  respect  for  you  politi- 
cally, even  by  that  last  statement. 
Mr.  A¥aldo.  I  am  sure  of  it,  sir. 

The  Chairman.  Senator  Reed  asked  you  about  putting  your 
linger  on  anything  of  a  partisan  nature.  Have  you  seen  the  last  or 
next  to  the  last  issue,  with  a  half-page  ad,  but  not  marked  as  an  ad^ 
for  Cox  and  Roosevelt? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  have  not  seen  the  Stars  and  Stripes  for  some  Aveeks. 
I  have  been  in  the  AVest,  and  just  happened  to  get  in  town  last  night 
on  the  night  train. 

The  CiiATKMAN.  We  are  glad  you  happened  in. 

Senator  Reed.  I  understand  the  law  does  not  co^  er  that. 

Mr.  AValdo.  It  does  not,  sir,  I  understand. 

Under  date  of  July  28  I  received  a  letter  signed  by  the  business 
manager  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes,  in  which  he  says : 

I  believe  it  would  be  possible  to  put  through  a  proposition  such  as  you  out- 
lined some  time  ago,  within  the  next  10  days.  If  there  is  anything  to  be  done 
or  you  wish  to  go  into  the  matter,  will  you  write  or  wire  me  at  Washington, 
D.  C?  The  status  is  very  interesting  and  the  time  opportune. 

Senator  Edge.  AATio  is  that  signed  by  ? 

Mr.  AValdo.  By  the  business  manager  of  the  Stars  and  Stripes. 
Senator  Edge.  AA^hat  is  his  name? 

Mr.  AA^ALDo.  Melvin  Rider.  My  understanding,  in  conversation 
with  Messrs.  Heffernan,  Jones,  and  Rider,  Avas  veiy  clearl}^  to  the 
effect  that  Messrs.  Jones  and  Rider  had  no  knowledge  at  all,  but  very 
shrewd  suspicions,  as  to  the  political  trend  of  the  paper,  and  because 
of  that  they  were  ver}^  eager  to  have  other  hands  come  in  and  build 
it  up  along  the  lines  that  they  thought  an  ex-soldiers'  paper  should 
be  conducted  upon — entirely  nonpartisan. 

The  Chairman.  Are  you  through? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  have  nothing  further  to  offer. 

Senator  Edge.  I  recall  this  morning  a  statement  made  by  Mrs. 
Tarks,  I  think,  that  you  threatened  that  if  you  could  not  purchase  the 
paper,  or  Avords  to  that  effect,  they  could  not  get  advertising  from 
the  large  associations.  Did  any  conversation  of  that  character  take 
place  ? 

-  The  Chairman.  The  "  Big  Four." 

Mr.  AValdo.  My  advice  was  asked,  as  it  is  professionally  asked 
and  paid  for  on  frequent  occasions  as  to  hoAV  the  advertising  could 
be  obtained  whicli  they  said  they  had  been  unable  to  get,  and  I  ex- 
pressed the  oi^inion  that  if  the  paper  was  conducted  as  a  political 
machine,  or  even  remotely  so,  it  did  not  have  the  gliost  of  a  show; 
that  it  had  to  clean  itself  from  politics  in  every  way  or  it  would 


2706 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


never  ^-et  anywhere,  and  that  every  dollar  put  into  it  would  be  like 
poimdrng  sand  in  a  rat  hole. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  with  a  knowledge  of  the  business, 
the  large  advertising  organizations  or  agencies  in  placing  their  ad- 
vertising in  the  various  general  and  national  advertisers,  so  called, 
seldom  use  what  aie  known  as  political  newspapers  or  publications? 

Mr.  AValdc).  The  political  newspaper  is  the  least  useful  of  medi- 
ums of  anything  you  choose  to  mention.  Theater  programs  or  any- 
thing else  pay  better;  and  a  strong  political  taint,  if  it  is  strong 
enough,  is  one  of  the  heaviest  handicaps  that  a  newspaper  has  to 
bear,  particularly  a  ncAv  one  that  is  just  starting  out. 

Senator  Kled.  It  is  true  that  nearly  every  great  newspaper  in  the 
United  States  takes  a  pretty  active  hand  in  politics,  and  they  all 
carry  advertising? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  am  speaking,  now,  not  of  the  daity  newspaper;  I 
am  speaking  of  the  periodical  press.   This  is  a  weekly. 

Senator  Eeed.  Well,  is  it  not  true  that  the  weekly  periodicals  of 
the  country  all  carry  advertising;  all  classes,  apparently? 

Mr.  Waldo.  My  point  is  best  understood  in  reference  to  the  Sat- 
urday Evening  Post,  the  greatest  of  advertising  mediums,  which  is 
very  careful  indeed  in  its  partisan  attitude. 

Senator  Reed.  This  paper  bears  A^ery  little  relation  to  the  Satur- 
day Evening  Post. 

Mr.  Waldo.  Mrs.  Parks  expressed  to  me  the  belief  that  she  could 
make  it  as  great  as  or  greater  than  the  Saturday  Evening  Post. 

Senator  Reed.  Do  you  think  it  could  be? 

Mr.  Waldo.  Not  under  Mrs.  Parks's  direction. 

Senator  Reed.  If  you  had  gotten  hold  of  it,  perhaps? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  question  it  very  much,  indeed. 

Senator  Reed.  The  real  fact  is  that  you  wanted  to  get  hold  of 
this  newspaper  because  you  thought  it  might  sometime  become  useful 
to  the  Democratic  Party  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  No.  I  think  we  will  not  put  it  that  way,  Senator 
Reed.  We  will  put  it  that  it  was  potentially  an  organ  that  might 
be  of  great  service  to  the  American  soldier,  and  it  was  being  of  no 
service  at  the  present  time. 

Senator  Reed.  Exactly  so.  Your  interest  was  not  because  it  was 
not  of  any  service  to  the  soldier.  You  had  a  double  interest,  to  be 
entirely  frank  about  it.  You  were  against  the  bonus  plan  and  this 
paper  was  for  it.  If  you  could  acquire  the  newspaper  you  would 
take  out  of  the  field  of  bonus  advocacy  this  sheet,  and  you  would  do 
a  thing  that  you  thought  was  a  good  thing  to  do  for  the  soldiers. 

Mr.  Waldo.  Very  necessary  to  do. 

Senator  Reed.  And  the  other  was  that  you  thought  that  a  lot  of 
Democrats  had  hold  of  this  sheet,  and  some  time  they  might  use  it 
for  Democratic  purposes,  and  you  w^anted  to  get  hold  of  it  for  that 
reason  ? 

Mr.  AValdo.  I  will  agree  to  that.  I  will  accept  the  first  just  as  you 
have  stated  it  so  very  ably ;  but  the  second  one  was  that  I  feared  the 
ultimate  eifect  upon  the  whole  soldier  organization  work  of  having  a 
soldier  ncAvspaper  that  was  actually  a  political  sheet. 

Senator  Reed.  Has  not  the  other  soldier  newspaper  been  taking 
sides  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  think  not.   I  should  be  amazed  if  it  had. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2707 


Senator  Reed.  It  has  been  discussing  questions  relating  to  the 
League  of  Nations  and  things  of  that  sort,  has  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Waldo.  I  have  not  seen  the  latest  copies,  but  the  whole  policy 
is  to  keep  away  from  politics. 

Senator  Eeed.  I  do  not  say  they  did.  This  paper  has. been  advocat- 
ing the  League  of  Nations  

The  Chairman.  That  is,  the  Stars  and  Stripes  ? 

Senator  Eeed.  Yes.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Waldo,  as  far  as  I  am  con- 
cerned. 

(A  telegram  from  the  national  commander  of  the  American  Legion 
to  the  chairman  of  the  committee  follows :) 

Cleveland,  Ohio,  September  25,  1920. 

Senator  William  S.  Kenyon, 

Chairman  Senate  Committee  on  Campaign  Expenditures, 

Washington,  D.  C: 

It  is  reported  that  a  statement  was  made  yesterday  before  your  committee 
that  the  American  Legion  Weekly  is  controlled  by  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee. This  statement  being  wholly  untrue  and  without  foundation  may  work 
a  serious  harm  to  the  American  Legion  Weekly  and  to  the  organization  and 
seriously  hamper  the  work  it  is  doing  for  the  organization  of  which  it  is  the 
official  publication  unless  the  truth  is  made  known.  In  view  of  this  I  request 
that  officials  of  the  American  Legion  and  employees  of  the  American  Legion 
Weekly  be  given  an  opportunity  to  testify  before  your  committee  on  all  matters 
pertaining  to  the  ownership  and  control  and  all  other  matters  relating  to  the 
magazine  immediately  after  the  adjournment  of  the  convention  of  the  Ameri- 
can Legion  on  the  29th  of  September. 

Frank  D'Olier, 
National  Commander. 

The  Chairman.  The  other  witnesses  who  have  been  subpoenaed 
here  will  be  excused.   There  will  be  no  more  witnesses  heard  to-day. 

(The  subcommittee  then  went  into  executive  session,  after  which 
the  following  proceedings  took  place:) 

The  Chairman.  The  committee  has  received  this  telegram,  which 
will  be  placed  in  the  record. 

(The  telegram  referred  to  is  as  follows:) 

Oentralta.  III.,  September  2Jf,  1920. 

David  S.  Barry, 

Sergeant  at  Arms  United  States  Senate. 

Washington,  D.  C: 

Telegram  September  23  just  received.  Can  not  possibly  reach  Washington 
by  to-morrow  morning.  Will  accept  telegram  as  service  and  appear  any  day 
next  week  if  desired. 

Edgae  F.  Fyke. 

The  Chairman.  Senators  Edge  and  Pomerene  are  appointed  a 
subcommittee  to  investigate  the  charge  made  by  Mr.  Lockwood  on 
yesterday,  and  will  meet  in  Dayton,  Ohio,  on  or  about  Thursday, 
October  7.  The  other  members  of  the  committee  being  unable  by 
'reason  of  their  engagements  to  participate,  these  two  members  will 
^make  the  report  to  the  committee. 

This  subcommittee  will  adjourn  to  meet  in  St.  Louis  on  October 
,18  to  finish  the  iuA^estigation  begun  in  Missouri,  and  will  take  up 
only  those  Missouri  affairs  the  investigation  of  which  has  already 
been  begun  by  the  committee.   That  adjournment  now  takes  place. 

(Whereupon,  at  3.10  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  adjourned  to 
[^meet  at  St.  Louis,  Mo.,  on  October  18,  1920.) 


X 


m  LlBRARt  Gr  m 
DEC  12  1331 

UNIVERSITY  OF  ILLINOIS, 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES 


HEARING 

BEFORE  A 

SUBCOMMITTEE  OF  THE 
COMMITTEE  ON  PKIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS 
UNITED  STATES  SENATE 

SIXTY-SIXTH  CONGKESS 

SECOND  SESSION 
PURSUANT  TO 

S.  RES.  357 

A  RESOLUTION  DIRECTING  THE  COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES^ 
AND  ELECTIONS  TO  INVESTIGATE  THE  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSE^S 
OF  VARIOUS  PRESIDENTIAL  CANDIDATES 
IN  ALL  POLITICAL  PARTIES 


PART  21 


Printed  for  the  use  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections 


m  LiBBAHY  Of  THE 
DEC  12  1931 


UNiVERSlTY  OF  ILLINOIS. 


182774 


WASHINGTON 
GOVERNMENT  PRINTING  OFFICIO 
1920 


COMMITTEE  ON  PRIVILEGES  AND  ELECTIONS. 


WILLIAM  P.  DILLINGHAM,  Vermont,  Chairman. 


WILLIAM  S,  KENYON,  Iowa. 
LAWRENCE  Y.  SHERMAN,  Illinois. 
ALBERT  B.  FALL,  New  Mexico. 
PHILANDER  C.  KNOX^  Pennsylvania. 
SELDEN  P.  SPENCER,  Missouri. 
JAMES  W.  WADSWORTH,  Jr.,  New  York. 
JAMES  E.  WATSON,  Indiana. 
WALTER  E.  EDGE,  New  Jersey. 


ATLEE  POMERENE,  Ohio. 
JAMES  A.  REED,  Missouri. 
THOMAS  J.  WALSH,  Montana. 
WILLIAM. H.  KING,  Utah. 
JOSIAH  O.  WOLCOTT,  Delaware. 
HENRY  F.  ASHURST,  Arizona. 


Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


Subcommittee  on  S.  Res.  357. 
WILLIAM  S.  KENYON,  Chairman. 

SELDEN  P.  SPENCER.  JAMES  A.  REED. 

WALTER  E.  EDGE.  ATLEE  POMERENE. 

/  Charles  A.  Webb,  Clerk. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


W  THURSDAY,  OCTOBER  7,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Si  bc()m:uittee  on  Privileges  and  P^lections, 

Day  ton,  Ohio. 

The  subcommittee  met,  pursiumt  to  adjournment,  at  11  o'clock 
a.  m.,  in  the  Federal  court  room.  Federal  Buildin<r,  Dayton.  Ohio, 
Senator  Walter  E.  Edge  presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Edge  and  Pomerene. 

Senator  Edge.  The  hearing  ^Yill  come  to  order.  AVe  Avill  call  Mr. 
Meier  Steinbrink. 

STATEMENT  OF  MR.  MEIER  STEINBRINK. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge.) 

Senator  Edge.  AVill  Vou  give  your  name  and  address  i 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Meier  Steinbrink;  home  address.  18  Fuller  Place. 
Brooklyn;  office,  1^15  Montague  Street,  Brooklyn. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Steinbrink,  you  were  connected,  were  you  not, 
with  the  Hughes  aircraft  investigation  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  was:  as  associate  to  Judge  Hughes  and  as  a 
deputy  attorney  general  under  Attorney  (jeneral  Gregory. 

Senator  Edge.  Following  that,  did  you  serve  with  the  so-called 
Frear  committee  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Yes,  sir;  I  was  counsel  to  Subcommittee  Xo.  1 
on  Aviation,  which  was  selected  to  investigate  the  expenditures  of 
the  Air  Department,  and  of  which  sLil)C()mmittee  Congressman  J'rear 
was  chairman. 

Senator  Edge.  In  that  service  which  you  rendered  with  either  the 
Hughes  aircraft  investigation  or  the  Freer  subcommittee  did  you 
become  familiar  with  any  conditions  that  would  directly  relate  to  the 
investigation  that  we  are  now  making? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  I  might  supplement  that  (juestion  by  asking  if  you 
are  familiar  with  the  investigation  this  subcommittee  is  making  into 
alleged  charges  of  a,  $5,000  note  having  been  discounted  by  Gov.  Cox 
and  a  $37,000  campaign  fund  raised  from  citizens  of  Dayton. 

^    Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  am  generally  familiar  with  the  scope  of  your 

^investigation. 

•  Senator  Edge.  Then,  will  you  tell  us  in  what  way  you  located  or 
!  discovered  anything  that  would  give  us  information  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  think.  Senator,!  should  answer  that  by  first  saying 
:hat  the  matter  first  came  to  my  attention  through  my  connection  with 
he  investigation  conducted  by  Judge  Hughes  at  the  request  of  the  Pres- 

2709 


2710 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


ident.  Subsequently  those  facts  were  examined  into  with  greater  detail 
to  ascertain  whether  or  not  they  had  any  relation  to  aviation  expendi- 
tures. There  was,  to  my  mind,  a  most  remarkable  coincidence  of 
dates  which  centered  about  August  15,  1917,  and  it  came  about  in  this 
way :  Col.  Deeds  had  gone  down  to  Washington  along  in  the  middle 
or  latter  part  of  March,  1917,  and  served  first,  I  believe,  on  the  muni- 
tion board.  Thereafter  there  was  organized  at  Da3^ton  the  Dayton- 
Wright  Aeroplane  Co.,  and  from  the  testimony  taken  in  the  Hughes 
investigation  it  appeared  that  negotiations  between  that  company  and 
the  GoA-ernment  for  a  contract  for  aeroplanes  began  on  June  12, 1917. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Pardon  me;  I  missed  that.  What  began  on 
June  12? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Negotiations  for  a  Government  contract.  That 
was  referred  to  in  the  Hughes  report  at  page  29.  The  coincidence 
of  dates  to  which  I  referred  a  moment  ago  was  that  Col.  Deeds  was 
commissioned  as  a  colonel  on  August  15,  1917;  the  Cox  note  Avas 
discounted  at  the  bank  on  August  15,  1917,  and  the  first  contract  for 
aeroplanes  was  executed  on  August  l7,  1917. 

Senator  Edge.  The  first  contract? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Yes;  the  first  contract.  Now,  the  contract  was 
dated  August  1,  1917,  and  on  that  same  day  the  salaries  of  the  officers 
of  the  Dayton  Wright  Aeroplane  Co.,  Mr.  Talbot,  sr.,  Mr.  Talbott, 
jr.,  and  Mr.  Kettering,  were  fixed  in  the  minutes  of  the  company. 
On  August  2, 1917,  Col.  Deeds,  then  being  the  head  of  the  Equipment 
Division,  to  his  division  was  referred,  Avith  full  poAver,  the  matter  of 
aircraft  production.  Taa^o  days  later,  on  August  4,  1917,  there  was 
an  exchange  of  confidential  telegrams  between  Col.  Deeds,  Mr.  Ket- 
tering, ancl  Mr.  Talbott,  referred  to  in  the  Hughes  report  at  page  32. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  that  report  Avith  you  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Yes,  sir ;  I  haA^e. 

Senator  Edge.  Without  interrupting  your  testimony,  Ave  Avill  mark 
that  "  Exhibit  No.  1."  I  Avould  like  to  haA^e  that  part  go  in  the 
record,  not  the  entire  testimony. 

(The  telegrams  referred  to  are  as  folloAvs :) 

[Telegram,  Kettering  to  Deeds,  Aug.  4,  1917.] 

Dayton,  Ohio.  August  1911. 

E.  A.  Deeds, 

Room  527,  Munsey  Building,  Washington,  D.  C: 
AA'e  believe  all  confidential  telegrams  should  be  sent  to  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr.. 
City  National  Bank  Building,  or  George  B.  Smith,  instead  of  the  Daj^ton  Wright 
Airplane  Co. 

C.  F.  Kettering. 


[Telegram,  Deeds  to  Kettering,  Aug.  4,  1917.] 


Mr.  C.  F.  Kettering, 

Citi/  National  Bank  Building,  Dayton,  Ohio: 
Hereafter  all  confidential  telegrams  will  be  sent  to  H.  E. 
of  to  the  Dayton  AV right  Airplane  Co. 


August  4.  1917 


Talbott,  sr.,  instead 
E.  A.  Deeds. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2711 


[Telegram,  Deeds  to  Talbott,  Sept.  16,  1917.] 

Old  Point,  Va.,  Septemher  16.  1!)J7. 

H.  E.  Talbott, 

Dayton,  Ohio: 

For  your  personal  information,  as  coming  from  your  local  attorney,  Jud.^ti 
.  Advocate  General  lias  ruled  it  legal  for  Government  to  beleat  one,  contractor 
j  one,  and  the  two  a  third,  as  appraisers  of  market  value  of  plaut  at -expiration 
'  of  contract.    If  you  care  to  raise  the  question,  the  above  ^Till  be  found  to  be 
the  final  ruling, 

E.  A,  Deeds. 

Senator  Pomekexe.  Xow,  let  me  make  an  observation  for  the  bene- 
fit of  this  record.    This  subcommittee  is  supposed  to  be  sitting  here 
for  the  purpose  of  investigating  the  finances  of  the  presidential  and 
;  senatorial  campaigns.    If  this  matter  has  any  reference  to  those  cam- 
{  paigns,  I  have  no  objection  to  it.    If  they  have  no  relation  to  those 
■  campaigns,  I  take  it  that  you  as  a  lav^-yer  understand  that  the  facts, 
i  whatever  they  may  be,  are  totally  irrelevant.    I  simply  want  to  make 
]  that  observation.    I  am  not  objecting  to  going  into  this  matter  so 
;  far  as  it  may  or  may  not  be  thought  to  reflect  upon  Gov.  Cox. 
j     Mr.  Steixbrink.  Senator  Pomerene,  may  I  say  this:  That  per- 
i  sonally  I  have  no  interest  in  this  either  one  wav  or  the  other?  My 
attention  was  called  to  a  statement  made  by  benator  Reed  at  the 
hearing  before  your  subcommittee,  and  reported  in  part  19,  at  page 
.  2591.  where  Senator  Reed  insisted  that  your  committee  go  into  the 
whole  matter  and  go  to  Dayton.    That  was  called  to  m}^  attention, 
I  and,  based  on  that,  and  on  that  alone,  I  gathered  together  the  papers 
j  that  Avere  still  in  my  possession  from  the  investigation.    I  have  them 
(  here,  ready  to  give  you  such  facts  as  you  wish  and  ready  to  desist  at 
any  moment  that  you  sa}^ 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  am  not  objecting  now,  but  it  has  been  sug- 
gested by  Senator  Edge  that  the  hearings  and  findings  of  Mr,  Ex- 
Justice  Hughes  should  be  incorporated  as  a  part  of  the  record  in 
'  this  matter  which  is  the  subject  of  inquiry  now,    I  have  not  seen 
that  and  I  do  not  noAv  know  whether  it  has  any  pertinency  or  not, 
Mr,  Steixbrink,  I  don't  know,  either. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene,  if  I  may  observe,  I  have  no  de- 
sire to  clog  the  records.  I  think  it  can  be  established  by  the  wit- 
nesses subpoenaed  that  this  fund  was  for  campaign  purposes,  paid 
by  a  corporation  and  through  various  and  devious  routes  re- 
turned to  the  corporation.  I  have  no  desire  to  have  any  part 
of  the  Hughes  report  in  the  record  excepting  as  it  relates  di- 
j  rectlv  to  the  evidence  that  Mr,  Steinbrink  is  now  irivino^  us,  and  I 
asked  him  the  question  upon  Avhat  he  based  some  of  this  information. 
He  replied,  as  nearly  as  I  can  recall,  referring  to  certain  specific  parts 
of  the  evidence,  and  I  asked  for  these  to  go  in.  I  really  don't  care 
either  way. 

[  Senator  Pomerexe.  I  do  not  know  what  it  is  intended  to  show. 
'  If  it  is  intended  to  show  somethin<?  that  Mr.  Justice  Huolies  miffht 

have  found  or  might  have  discovered,  it  might  be  very  interesting, 

if  I  had  an  opportunity  to  ask  Mr.  Justice  Hughes  a  few  questions. 

But  this  is  all  I  have  to  say  now. 

Senator  Edge,  If  the  witness  will  continue  his  explanation  of 
•  those  facts  that  directly  bear  upon  these  two  allegations,  I  am  quite 

sure  it  will  be  all  the  information  we  need. 


2712 


PEESIDENTIAL  (\\MPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomekene.  Very  well. 

Mr.  Stkinbrink.  On  August  4,  1917,  there  was  the  exchange  of 
the  confidential  telegrams;  on  August  15,  1917  

Senator  Pomei?ene.  What  confidential  telegrams? 

Mr.  Steinijbink.  The  ones  to  which  I  have  just  referred  as  the 
ones  whieli  Senator  Edge  asked  to  go  into  the  record.  You  will  find 
that  at  page  32  of  the  Hughes  report. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Te]e«:'rams  between  whom? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Mr.  Kettering  and  Col.  Deeds',  then  head  of  the 
Equipment  Division.  On  August  15,  1917,  Col.  Deeds  was  commis- 
sioned. On  August  1(),  1917,  the  note  spoken  of  as  the  Cox  note  of 
$5,()()()  was  discounted. 

Senator  P()?>ierexe.  August  Avhat? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  August  16,  1917.  On  August  17,  1917,  the  first 
contract  with  the  Dayton-Wright  Aeroplane  Co.  was  executed.  Sub- 
sequently, and  in  I^lay,  1918,  the  Dayton-Wright  Co.  received  its  first 
voucher  or  payment  for  experimental  Avork  done  by  it,  and  the  fol- 
lowing month,  in  June,  1918,  we  find  the  Cox  note  paid  bv  a  check 
of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  No.  12841. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  What  date  Avas  that? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  June  29,  1918.  Now,  with  these  facts  before  me 
as  counsel  for  the  Frear  committee,  I  discussed  this  with  Congress- 
man Frear,  the  chairman  of  the  subcommittee,  and  after  conference 
with  him  directed  the  accountant  who  had  been  employed  by  the 
Frear  committee  to  come  to  Dayton  to  make  a  more  detailed  investi- 
gation. 

Senator  Po:^[erexe.  What  was  the  accountant's  name? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Marvyn  Scudder,  of  New  York.  He  was  the 
same  accountant  who  had  been  employed  by  the  Department  of 
ffustice  in  the  Hughes  investigation  and  because  of  his  knowledge  of 
the  details  obtained  there  was  again  emj^loyed  by  Congressman 
Frear's  committee.  I  communicated  with  Mr.  Scudder  by  letter  on 
August  26,  1919,  and  having  discussed  with  him  the  peculiar  coin- 
cidences of  dates  to  which  I  have  just  referred,  requested  him  to 
come  to  Dayton  and  make  a  detailed  investigation  to  ascertain 
whether  or  not  it  had  any  relation  to  aviation  or  aviation  expendi- 
tures. His  report  to  me,  known  as  report  No.  7,  dated  September  3, 
1919,  furnished  the  detail  on  which  I  wrote  a  complete  report,  under 
date  of  November  5,  1919,  to  Congressman  Frear,  the  chairman  of 
Subcommittee  No.  1.  This  letter  and  the  report  are,  I  take  it,  a  part 
of  the  records  of  the  congressional  committee.  I  have  copies  of  both 
here  if  you  desire  them. 

Senator  Edge.  If  there  is  no  objection,  I  think  that  they  should  go 
in  the  record.    They  seem  to  relate  directly  to  this  matter. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  think  Ave  had  better  determine  that  later.  Is 
Mr.  Scudder  here? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  going  to  call  Mr.  Scudder  after  this  Avitness. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  shall  AVflnt  to  ask  him  a  feAv  questions  before 
we  proceed  Avith  that  matter. 

Senator  Edge.  We  Avill  hold  it  in  abeyance.  Continue,  Mr.  Stein- 
brink. 

Mr.  Steix'brixk.  The  report  Avas  made,  as  I  said  a  moment  ago, 
to  Congressman  Frear,  Avith  the  observation  that  if  it  Avas  the  desire 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2713 


of  the  congressional  committee  to  move  on  to  Dayton  and  go  further 
into  the  detail  of  this,  that  as  its  counsel  I  was  subject  to  its  order  and 
direction  and  was  ready  to  go  to  Dayton.  I  subsequently  received 
from  Congressman  Frear  a  reply  saying  that  for  reasons  which  he 
1  made  clear  in  his  letter  to  me.  which  original  I  have  here,  they  would 
f  not  go  into  the  matter  at  that  time.  That  terminated  my  connection 
with  it. 

Senator  Pomekene.  AYhen  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Congressman  Frear's  letter  to  me  acknowledg- 
ing my  letter  of  Xovember  5  is  dated  November  6,  1919. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  that  cover  your  personal  connection  with  the 
previous  investigation,  so  far  as  information  was  secured  from  that 
i   bears  on  this  particular  investigation? 

I  Mr.  Steixbrixk.  There  were  other  reasons.  Senator  Edge,  which 
I  prompted  the  congressional  committee  to  request  me  to  go  into  it.  but 
i  it  was  based  on  common  gossip  and  rumor  around  Washington,  and 
unless  you  gentlemen  desire  it.  I  shall  not  repeat  it. 

Senator  Edge.  We  do  not  want  common  gossip  and  rumor.  We 
.  only  want  facts.  I  have  nothing  else  to  ask  at  this  time.  Let  that 
!   letter  be  inserted  in  the  record. 

(The  letter  referred  to  is  as  follows:) 

November  5,  1919. 

My  Dear  Congressman  Frear  :  Since  the  teruiinatioii  of  hearings  in  New 
York  on  Friday  hist  I  have  given  further  thought  and  consideration  to  the 
Dayton  situation,  regarding  which  I  had  previously  spoI%:en  with  you.    In  the 
latter  part  of  August.  1919.  the  accountant,  at  my  request,  went  to  Dayton,  so 
that  I  might  know  whether  or  not  the  matter,  even  indirectly,  related  to  aviation 
■    War  Department  expenditures.    At  Dayton  the  accountant  found  two  separate 
funds  that  were  raised  in  Dayton,  with  regard  to  which  I  desired  the  detail, 
j    and,  while  I  write  it  frankly  to  you,  Messrs.  Adam  Schantz  and  B.  F.  McCann, 
j    his  connsel.  both  of  Dayton,  earnestly  refiuested  the  accountant  that  nothing  be 
brought  out  in  connection  with  these  two  funds  unless  it  was  clearly  shown  that 
they  had  a  connection  in  some  way  with  the  aviation  progi'am. 
j       The  funds  wore:  (1)  Cash  in  the  amount  of  $5,000  received  by  Gov.  .Tames  C. 
J    Cox,  of  Ohio,  during  his  term  of  office  at  the  City  National  Bank  of  Dayton, 
f    Ohio,  in  August.  1917 :  this  was  while  the  aviation  program  was  being  devel- 
*    oped  and  we  were  already  in  the  war.    (2)  A  contrilnition  fund  in  the  amount 
of  $37,000,  disbursed  by  Mr.  Adam  Schantz,. 

The  story  of  No.  1.  in  brief,  is  as  follows :  An  officer  of  the  City  National 
Bank  of  Dayton,  Ohio — Kiefer  by  name — states  that  he  paid  in  cash  $5,000  to 
Gov.  Cox,  who  placed  the  cash  in  a  bag  that  he  carried  and  gave  his — Cox's — 
own  note,  drawn  to  the  City  National  Bank,  for  equal  amount.  In  the  files  of 
the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  is  a  canceled  note  of  Gov.  Cox's,  which  the  ac- 
'  countant  saw.  in  the  amount  of  $5,000,  and  it  was  acquired  by  that  company 
on  June  29.  1918,  by  the  payment  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.'s  check 
t  No.  12341,  in  the  amount  of  .$5,075.  which  represents  the  amount  of  the  note  plus 
90  days'  interest. 

The  facts  are  that  while  on  the  face  of  the  note  it  would  appear  that  Cox  bor- 
rowed this  money  on  August  16,  1917.  against  his  own  obligations,  it  was  not 
paid  un.til  June  29,  1918,  when  the  check  which  paid  it  included  90  days'  inter- 

'    est.    This  would  at  least  indicate  that  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ap- 

'  parently,  by  paying  principal  and  interest,  considered  it  an  obligation  of  its 
own.    The  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  during  this  period  was  engaged  in  some 

'  aviation  work.  Tliey  had  contracts  or  subcontracts  for  the  manufacture  of 
metal  parts  which  were  used  on  planes.  The  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  owned 
all  of  the  stock  of  the  Dayton-Wright  Airplane  Co. 

From  these  facts  I  conclude  that  while  this  places  Gov.  Cox  in  a  very  unfavor- 
able light,  where  an  examination  of^iim  might  prove  most  embarrassing,  still  it 

d  would  add  nothing  to  the  investigation  which  we  are  conducting,  and  therefore 
we  would  not  be  justified  in  going  into  it. 

As  to  fund  No.  2.  of  $37,000,  the  facts  are :  This  fund  was  raised  by  six  gentle- 
men in  the  fall  of  1916,  and  prior  to  election  day  in  the  following  amounts: 


2714 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


(May  I  interpolate  liere  that  while  that  was  the  election  at  which  Mr.  Wilson 
was  chosen  to  the  Presidency,  and,  while  it  is  currently  reported  that  Secretary 
of  War  Baker  was  most  active  in  Ohio  at  this  time,  still  I  can  find  no  connection 
at  this  time  which  would  warrant  us  in  going  into  it.) 


Contributions : 

H.  E.  Talbot  .  $7,  000 

Col.  E.  A.  Deeds-   7,  000 

C.  F.  Kettering___^   7,  000 

Adam  Schantz  ^   7,  000 


Contributions — Continuued. 

Walter  Kidder  $7,  000 

F.  M.  Tait   2, 000 


Total   37,000 


While  the  books  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  show  in  regard  to  the  first 
three  named  that  their  accounts  were  charged  and  the  amounts  were  contributed 
directly  by  checks  drawn  on  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  as  far  as  Mr. 
Schantz  was  concerned,  he  considered  that  the  first  three  gentlemen  named 
directly  contributed  their  amounts.  The  checks  on  the  Dayton  Metal  Products 
Co.  were  cashed  and  Mr.  Schantz  became  the  custodian  of  these  funds,  placing 
the  moneys  in  his  vault.  These  funds,  which  undoubtedly  constituted  a  slush 
fund,  were  handled  to  various  political  workers  by  Mr.  Schantz  and  balances 
that  were  not  used  were  later  returned  to  Mr.  Schantz  and  such  balances  found 
their  way,  either  directly  or  indirectly  into  his  personal  account  at  the  Teutonia 
National  Bank.  As  to  whether  any  of  these  moneys  were  used  for  United  States 
aviation  purposes,  there  is  this  to  be  said :  That  without  question  no  one  could 
naturally  conceive  that  in  any  way  the  raising  of  this  fund  was  for  United  States 
aviation  purposes,  as  we  did  not  enter  the  war  until  April,  1917.  The  only 
respect  in  which  it  might  be  said  that  these  moneys  were  used  in  any  way  for 
United  States  aviation  purposes  would  be  in  case  there  were  any  of  those 
funds  on  hand  that  had  not  been  disbursed  prior  to  April,  1917,  and  were  dis- 
bursed later  in  that  connection. 

Now,  Mr.  Adam  Schantz  did  spend  money  in  purchasing  land  for  the  Govern- 
ment's aviation  field  known  as  the  Wilbur  Wright  Field,  and  he  did  draw 
checks  on  his  Teutonia  National  Bank  account,  which  account  received  some  of 
the  balances  from  the  political  woi-kei'S  who  had  been  supplied  with  part  of  the 
fund  described  above.  Mr.  Schantz  later  paid  back  to  the  gentlemen  who  con- 
tributed to  the  fund,  including  himself,  not  only  the  amount  of  these  balances 
paid  back  by  the  political  workers  but  the  difference  between  that  and  the  whole 
fund,  in  the  following  manner:  In  1918  certain  men,  employees  of  one  kind  or 
another,  were  required  to  submit  fictitious  charges  for  services,  which  charges 
w^ere  paid  by  the  flood  prevention  committee  of  Dayton  specifically  on  February 
3,  1918.  These  payments  were  later  given  to  Adam  Schantz  and  by  him  returned 
to  the  original  subscribers.  At  this  time  Deeds  was  chairman  and  actually 
presided  at  the  meeting  of  the  flood  prevention  committee  where  the  vote  with 
respect  to  these  funds  was  taken. 

The  details  of  all  these  circumstances  were  fully  reported  to  me  on  behalf  of 
the  committee  by  the  accountant's  report  No.  7,  of  which  I  inclose  for  your 
attention  and  files  a  carbon  copy. 

You  will  find  in  the  report  a  reference  to  the  fact  that  the  accountant  had 
made  certain  reports  in  the  Hughes  investigation,  which  alluded  to  the  facts  now 
presented  to  you.  I  am  satisfied  that  Judge  Hughes  did  not  deal  with  any  of 
the  subject  matter  of  these  two  funds,  because  the  investigation  conducted  by 
him  dealt  with  aircraft  production,  and,  though  the  scope  of  the  present  investi- 
gation is  broader  than  the  one  which  Judge  Hughes  conducted,  still  I  do  not 
see  how  this  matter  could  be  gone  into  at  this  time  without  it  first  appearing 
that  it  was  germaine  to  your  inquiry.  Had  we  in  the  course  of  the  investigation 
you  are  now  conducting  stumbled  across  this — and  without  previous  knowledge 
of  it — we  might  have  been  justified  in  then  and  there  following  it  to  its  conclu- 
sion. It  is  my  opinion  that  we  should  not  go  into  it  now  as  an  original  propo- 
sition. 

I  am  making  this  report  to  your  entire  committee,  I  hope  you  will  take  it 
up  with  both  Congressman  Lea  and  Congressman  Magee,  and  if  after  conferring 
with  them  you  conclude  it  is  still  our  duty  to  go  into  it,  I  shall  be  very  glad, 
indeed,  to  serve  you  in  any  way,  in  which  event  I  would  ask  for  word  as  early 
as  possible,  in  order  that  I  might  make  my  arrangements  accordingly. 
Yery  sincerely, 

Meiee  Steinbrixk. 

Hon.  James  A.  Freae, 

Congressional  Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C. 


r 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES.  2715 


Senator  Po^ierexe.  AVhen  did  you  l^egin  your  connection  with  this 
committee  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  With  the  Frear  committee,  do  you  mean  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Or  the  Hughes  i 

Senator  Pomerexe.  The  Hughes  committee  appointment  was  first, 
was  it  ? 
Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Yes.  sir. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  When  did  that  begin? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  The  hitter  part  of  Mav :  the  very  hist  part  of  Ma  v. 
1918. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  when  did  it  end  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Our  report  was  submitted  to  the  Attorney  Gen- 
eral and  the  President  on  October  25,  1918. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  October  25.  1918  ? 
,    Mr.  Steixbrixk.  October  25.  1918. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  When  did  your  employment  by  the  Frear  com- 
mittee begin? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  In  June,  1919. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  When  did  it  end?  You  gave  that  date,  Xo- 
yember  6,  I  belieye. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Xo.  That  was  the  date  of  my  report  on  this  par- 
ticular matter :  but  I  continued  rendering  service  to  the  congressional 
committee  

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  do  not  care  anything  about  that. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk  (continuing).  Until  the  very  last  part  of  1919. 
♦    Senator  Pomerexe.  Have  you  given  us,  as  3^011  understand  it.  a 
complete  resume  of  the  facts  Avhich  to  your  mind  indicate  Gov.  Cox's 
connection  with  some  ulterior  deeds? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  I  have  not.  I  have  purposel}',  Senator  Pomerene, 
excluded  all  gossip  around  Washington  on  which  basis  this  investi- 
gation was  made. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  My  question,  I  believe,  stated  the  facts.  I  did 
not  refer  to  gossip  or  rumors. 

^Ir.  Steixbrixk.  I  have  generally  given  you.  Senator,  the  facts. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Let  me  see  if  I  undei'stancl  your  position  cor- 
rectly. You  have  said  that  you  discovered  that  Gov.  Cox  gave  a  note 
to  a  certain  bank  for  S5.000  some  time  in  1917:  that  about  that  time 
Col.  Deeds,  who  was  a  manufacturer  here  in  the  city  of  Dayton  and 
who  was  interested  in  the  subject  of  aviation,  went  to  Washington 
and  he  secured  or  Avas  given  a  position  in  the  War  Department :  that 
a  little  later  he  received  a  commission  as  colonel;  and  you  feel  that 
because  of  the  coincidence  in  the  date  when  he  gave  a  note  and  the 
late  when  he  became  connected  with  the  War  Department  and  re- 
•eived  this  commission  cast  a  sort  of  suspicion  upon  the  bona  fides  of 
;his  transaction.   Is  that  your  position? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  That  is  not.  Xo:  Senator,  that  is  not  my  posi- 
'  ion. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Is  that  a  part  of  it? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  It  is  a  part  of  it;  but  you  have  embodied  in  your 
iuestion  something  that  I  did  not  testify  to  and  as  though  I  did 
estify  to. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  What  was  that  ? 


2716 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  STEiNr.RiNK.  That  I  discovered  a  note  of  Gov.  Cox.  I  never 
claimed  to  have  discovered  that  note,  Senator  Pomerene. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  perhaps  I  shouki  modify  that.  You 
were  made  a('(|iuiinted  with  that  fact.    Let  me  put  it  that  wa3^ 

Mr.  Steinbkink.  Linked  up  with  another  fact. 

Senator  Pomekene.  What  was  the  other  fact  ^ 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Mr.  Scudder,  the  accountant,  reported  having 
found  on  tlie  l)ooks  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  an  amount 
totalino;  $2('),0()().    The  $5,000  was  embodied  in  that  $26,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  well.  Now,  did  you  discover  any  um- 
bilical cord  between  these  different  facts  which  made  one  the  cause 
of  the  other  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  To  use  your  own  expression,  the  umbilical  cord 
is  found  in  the  gossip  which  was  going  around  in  Washington. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  in  the  gossip  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  And  in  that  gossip;  it  was  because  of  that  that, 
as  counsel  of  this  committee,  it  was  my  duty,  if  I  was  to  render  a 
proper  service,  to  ascertain  whether  there  was  foundation  for  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  1  am  not  finding  any  fault  with  the  fact  that 
an  investigation  Avas  made. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Oh,  no;  I  understand  that.  Senator. 

Senator  Po.merene.  If  there  is  any  fault  to  attach  to  this,  it  is  to 
some  of  the  conclusions  which  were  drawn  from  very  much  mooted 
premises. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  May  I  ask  a  question.  Senator  ? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  "Whether  you  mean  bv  that  that  I  dreAV  an  incor- 
rect conclusion,  because  I  am  quite  ready  to  give  you  every  fact. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  have  not  said  that.  I  used  it  in  an  imper- 
sonal sense. 

Mr.  S^PEiNBRiNK.  I  am  c{uite  ready  to  give  you  every  fact,  and  then 
permit  the  Senate  committee  or  the  public  to  draAV  its  oAvn  con- 
clusion. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  will  be  very  glad  to  get  the  facts,  if  Ave  can, 
and  Avill  be  A-ery  glad  to  have  the  public  draw  its  conclusions.  Xow, 
then,  later  on,  when  Deeds  and  the  Wrights  here  became  engaged  in 
the  development  of  the  aeroplane,  certain  payments  were  made  by 
the  Government  to  their  company.  That,  I  believe,  you  stated  Avas  a 
fact. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  The  first  payments  were  made  in  May,  1918. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  it  turns  out  that  some  time  in  June,  1918, 
this  note  Avas  paid. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  In  June,  1918,  the  note  Avas  paid  by  the  check 
of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understand  that.  Do  you  mean  to  say  that 
there  Avas  any  connection  betAveen  these  payments  by  the  Govern- 
ment to  this  company  and  the  payment  of  the  Cox  note  by  the  com- 
pany? Do  you  mean  to  say  that  there  is  any  plausible  connection 
betAveen  those  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  am  not  saying  aUA- thing  of 'the  kind.  I  am  giv- 
ing you  a  fact,  and  I  Avill  callVour  attention  further  to  a  letter  re- 
ceived by  the  cono'ressional  committee  under  date  of  August  1-1.  1919. 
from  Mr.  Talbott,  jr.,  as  president  of  the  Dayton- Wright  Aeroplane 
Co.:  under  the  same  date  to  the  same  committee  from  Mr.  Talbott, 


i  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES.  2717 

jr,  as  vke  president  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  CV).,  settin-  forth 
the  s  ockholders,  and  from  that  it  appears  that  Gov.  Cox  was  not  -i 
stockholder  or  interested  in  either  company 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Yes:  but  you  don't 'know,  do  you,  what  rela^ 
tions  there  may  have  be^en  or  what  the  facts  may  have  been  which 
promi.ted  the  payment  of  this  note  bv  the  Metal  Products  Co  >  You 
do  not  know  the  reason  for  that,  do  you  ^  • . 

for  k'  ^  ^^n^>^^^        I  ^an  not  conceive  tlie  reason 

Senator  PoMERENE  And  the  mere  fact  that  you  can  not  conceive 
what  was  the  reason  for  it  would  not  justify  you,  as  a  lawyer,  in 

3!^;  woX^lTf ^^^^  ^'"'^'''^  ^^^^-1-  -  '^-^ 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  The  answer  to  that  question.  Senator  Pomerene 
depends  upon  tlie  moral  point  of  view,  and  I  am  quite  ready  to  criyj 
you  my  inference  or  deduction  from  the  facts  ' 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  are  trying  to  get  the  facts  and  not  the 
interences  or  moral  speculntions  upon  the  sii])jcct 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Excepting  that  very  often  you  can  not  prove  a 
conclusion,  but  it  must  be  drawn  from  the  facts 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  know  that.  We  all,  of  course,  understand 
what  circumstantial  evidence  is  and  we  know  of  very  oreat  mistakes 
that  juries  and  courts  and  lawyers  make  wlien  they  are  deaiin<r  with 
circumstantial  evidence  Xow,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  you  do  not'know 
that  tnis  note  of  Gov.  Cox  was  paid  because  of  any  business  obliga- 
tion or  political  obligation  that  Deeds  or  his  company  may  have 
been  under  to  Gov.  Cox. 

Mr  Steixbrink.  I  do  not  know  whether  that  was  a  payment  of 
an  obligation  or  a  gift. 

^^^Senator  Edge.  May  I  ask  one  question  right  there  on  that  same 
Senator  Pomerene.  Certainly. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  yourself  in^-estigate  the  books  of  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  showing  any  entry  covering  the  item  dis- 
charging the  note  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Only  in  a  most  general  way  at  the  offices  of  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  but  the  details  of  it  I  have  not  The 
accountant  undoubtedly  has  the  workings  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  From  your  investigation  you  do  not  mean  to 
say  that  those  books  show  anything  improper  in  the  payment  of  this 
Cox  note  by  the  Deeds  company  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Senator,  having  in  mind  your  corrupt-practices 
act  m  Ohio,  I  would  say  "  yes  "  to  that  question,  since  you  press  me 
tor  an  answer  to  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  would  perhaps  be  better  able  to 
come  to  a  conclusion  if  you  knew  what  the  facts  were  instead  of 
speculating  as  to  Avhat  the  facts  are. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  You  have  asked  me  for  an  answer  to  the  ques- 
tion, and  I  can  only  base  it  on  the  facts  disclosed. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  asking  the  question  now. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  If  you  tell  me  that  there  are  a  great  many  facts 
1  do  not  know,  then  I  can  only  answer  your  question  by  saying  "  I 
can  not  answer  it."  I  can  answer  the  question  only  upon  the  facts 
before  me. 


^.718 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  yes;  I  know  that — on  facts  as  colored 
by  some  idle  gossip. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Xo;  on  facts  alone. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  you  have  said  you  were  induced  to  go 
into  this  because  of  the  gossip. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  But  I  have  never  said  I  drew  a  conclusion  based  on 
gossip;  my  conclusions  are  from  facts  and  not  from  gossip. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  conclusion,  let  us  say,  is  based  largely 
upon  the  report  that  was  made  to  you  by  a  certified  accountant  named 
Scudder  

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Plus  all  the  sworn  testimony. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  If  Mr.  Scudder  has  not  got  the  facts 
here  with  regard  to  this  transaction — assuming  that  for  the  sake  of 
the  question — then  you  would  not  be  quite  so  certain  of  your  con- 
clusion, would  you  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Xo  conclusion  is  correct  if  the  facts  on  which  it 
is  based  are  not  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Why,  most  assuredly.  Now,  you  say  prelimi- 
narily here  that  you  were  struck  with  the  coincidence  of  these  dates  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  do  not  regard  that  as  very  persuasive 
evidence,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  No:  as  some  evidence. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  us  see  hoAv  weighty  that  evidence  is.  At 
the  time  this  note  was  paid  there  was  great  fighting  in  Europe. 
Now,  there  is  a  coincidence  of  dates.  Did  the  one  fact  have  any- 
thing to  do  with  the  other  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Not  that  I  know^  of. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No;  I  think  not.  Have  you  any  knowledge 
of  the  disposition  Avhich  was  made  of  the  proceeds  of  the  $5,000'  note 
when  it  was  given  to  the  bank  by  Gov.  Cox  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  You  do  not  mean  that.  Senator  Pomerene? 

Seator  Pomerene.  Just  read  the  question  

Mr.  Steinbrink.  The  proceeds  were  not  given  by  Gov.  Cox  to  the 
bank;  the  proceeds  were  received  hy  Gov.  Cox  from  the  bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  read  the  question. 

(The  pending  question  was  read  by  the  official  recorder,  as  above 
recorded. ) 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  It  Avas  not  given  to  the  bank  by  Gov.  Cox.  Gov. 
Cox  gave  his  note  and  received  the  cash ;  Gov.  Cox  received  the 
proceeds. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  asked  you  whether  you  had  any  knowledge 
of  the  disposition  of  the  proceeds  of  that  note  when  it  was  dis- 
counted ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Why,  yes;  from  the  word  of  Clarence  Kiefer,  at 
the  bank,  who  said  he  had  paid  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  asked  you  whether  you  had  any  knowledge 
of  it.  As  a  lawyer  you  know  what  I  mean;  I  mean  as  to  the  facts. 
Have  you  any  personal  knowledge  of  the  facts  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Do  you  mean  did  Mr.  Kiefer  tell  it  to  me  or  was 
I  present? 

Senator  Pomerene.  No.  Have  you  any  knowledge  of  the  facts 
themselves  to  which  you  can  testify? 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


2719 


?»lr.  Steixbrixk.  I  was  not  present  in  the  bank  when  the  trans- 
action too  place. 

Senator  Po3ierexe.  Xow.  you  say  that  Gov.  Cox  got  the  cash  from 
the  bank.   Do  you  know  that  as  a  fact  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  That  was  reported  to  me  by  the  

Senator  Pomerexe.  Oh.  it  was  reported? 
Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Yes :  it  is  in  the  report. 

Senator  Po^ierexe.  So  that  when  you  say  that,  you  are  simply 
speaking  of  certain  representations  that  were  made  to  you? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Of  reports  made  to  me,  first  as  a  deputy  attor- 
ney general  by  one  in  the  employ  of  the  Government. 

Senator  Pomerex'e.  Yes. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  And  secondly,  made  to  me  as  counsel  for  the 
Frear  congressional  committee. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes ;  and  to  put  the  question  in  another  way. 
jou  haA'e  no  personal  knowledge  of  the  truth  or  falsity  of  any  of 
these  facts,  have  you  ? 

Mr.  Steix'brixk.  Excepting  in  so  far  as  the  word  is  corroborated 
by  the  records. 

Senator  Pomerex'e.  AYell,  that  is  record  evidence,  but  have  you  an}^ 
personal  knowledge  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Why,  Senator  Pomerene,  I  at  one  time  saw  the 
entries.  I  told  you  a  moment  ago  that  I  was  at  the  office  of  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  "We  will  probably  have  the  benefit  of  those  rec- 
ords here :  I  hope  so.  Xow,  you  do  not  know  what  the  reason  was  for 
the  payment  of  the  Gov.  Cox  note  by  the  Metal  Products  Co.,  do  you  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Xo.  sir. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  if  you  have  any  knowledge  upon  that  sub- 
ject at  all  it  is  purely  hearsay,  so  far  as  you  are  concerned  ? 
Mr.  Steix'brix'k.  Xecessarily  so. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  When  you  were  making  this  investigation  Mr. 
Deeds  was  here  in  Dayton,  was  he  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrix'k.  Do  you  mean  the  congressional  investigation  or 
the  Hughes  investigation? 

Senator  Pomerex'e.  Either  one  or  both  of  them. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  In  the  Hughes  investigation  Col.  Deeds  was  sta- 
tioned in  Washington  and  came  to  Dayton  occasionally,  we  were  told. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Did  you  have  him  before  your  committee  i 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Before  the  Hughes  committee  i 

Senator  Po:\[erex'e.  Yes. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Two  days. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Was  this  matter  gone  into  with  him  ? 
Mr.  Steix'brixk.  We  never  knew  that  Col.  Deeds  knew  anything 
about  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  After  you  learned  of  this  transaction  did  you 
<?all  Col.  Deeds  before  the  committee? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Of  course  not.    Col.  Deeds  had  severed  his  con- 
nection—at least  he  testified  that  he  severed  his  connection  with  the 
>  Dayton-Wright  Aeroplane  Co.  and  stripped  himself  of  all  stock 
ownership  before  those  companies  in  which  he  was  interested  under- 
,  took  work  for  the  Government.    He  had  to  do  that  under  the 
statute. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Was  that  before  or  after  this  note  was  paid? 


2720 


pep:sii)Extial  campaign  expensp:s. 


^Ir.  Steinbrink.  AVhy,  that  was  before. 

Senator  Pomerenj].  A^ery  well.  Then  Mr.  Kettering  was  in  this 
company  at  the  time  you  made  this  discovery  that  the  $5,000  note 
Avas  paid  by  the  Metal  Products  Co.,  was  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrtnk.  Yes;  Kettering  was  connected. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  call  him  before  the  committee  to  in- 
terrogate him  about  this  $5,000  note? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Why,  no.  Senator  Pomerene.  I  told  you  at  the 
outset  that  my  sole  object  as  counsel  was  to  ascertain  whether  it  had 
any  relation  to  aircraft  production  or  to  the  expenditures  of  the  War 
Department ;  and  I  Avill  say  to  you  now  that  not  being  able  to  prove 
that  it  had  such  a  connection,  I  did  not  believe  that  in  the  Hughes 
report,  so  far  as  my  advice  was  asked,  or  as  counsel  for  the  committee 
we  would  be  justified  in  going  into  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Suffice  it  to  say  you  did  not  go  into  it,  and  you 
did  not  interrogate  anybody  connected  Avith  the  Metal  Products  Co. 
Avith  respect  to  this  $5,000  transaction,  did  you? 

Mr.  Steinbrtnk.  I  did  not,  because  it  Avas  not  connected  Avith 
aviation. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  let  us  go  further.  Gov.  Cox  Avas  in  the 
State  here  at  that  time? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Not  at  the  time  I  sent  the  accountant  out  here^ 
for  I  particularly  told  him  to  see  Goa^  Cox,  and  he  reported  to  me 
that  Gov.  Cox  Avas  absent  on  a  fishing  trip. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Goa^  Cox  does,  I  believe,  occasionally  go 
on  a  fishing  trip,  but  he  usually  gets  back.  Did  you  at  any  time  seek 
to  get  GoA^  Cox's  Aversion  of  this  matter  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  did  not,  because,  I  repeat,  I  could  not  find  that 
it  Avas  connected  with  the  subject  matter  of  our  investigation.  Had 
I  done  so  at  the  time,  it  Avould  have  been  charged  probably  that  it  was 
political. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  noAV  it  seems  that,  having  satisfied  your- 
self that  it  had  no  connection  Avith  the  War  Department  and  no  con- 
nection Avith  Government  expenditures  of  money,  you  still  think,  do 
you,  that  it  had  some  connection  Avith  Gov.  Cox's  campaigns.  Is 
that  the  idea? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Noav,  Senator,  if  you  ask  me  Avhat  I  think.  I  am 
ready  to  ansAver  you,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  you  liave  any  facts  upon  which  you  base  it. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  Senator,  I  think  it  calls  for  an  explanation  from 
some  one.  That  is  Avhat  I  think.  I  thought  so  then,  and  I  am  more 
convinced  of  it  to-day. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Ave  Avill  get  the  explanation  before  we 
get  through. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  That  is  another  thing.  You  asked  me  what  I 
think,  and  I  have  ansAvered  your  (question. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  Avant  to  knoAv  upon  AAhat  a^ou  base  your 
conclusions  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  On  the  peculiar  coincidence  in  dates  and  in  the 
CA^ents  transpiring  on  those  dates. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  because  there  is  a  coincidence  in  certain 
dates  you  come  to  the  conclusion  that  there  has  been  some  sort  of 
skull-duggery  about  this  thing? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2721 


Mr  Steinbeink.  I  have  not  come  to  that  conckision.  I  have  a 
thought,  and  if  you  want  to  know  what  I  think,  I  will  tell  vou  wliat 
I  think. 

Senator  Pomekexe.  If  you  will  just  tell  me  wliat  vou  think  we 
will  be  content  with  that,  but  we  do  not  care  for  your  vaporino-s  and 
imaginings.  ^ 

Mr.  Steixbrink.  1  am  not  in  the  habit  of  vaporing  when  I  am 
under  oath  before  a  congressional  or  senatorial  committee 

Senator  Pomerexe.  The  record  will  show  before  we  get  throu^rh 
perhaps.  ^  ^  ' 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Undoubtedly. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  So  that  so  far  as  the  Hughes  committee  was 
concerned  and  so  far  as  the  Freer  committee  was  concerned  you  made 
no  investigation  of  this  $5,000  transaction  except  to  see  that  it  had 
^^TiJ^^S^^^^^^^  ^^^^^  aircraft  or  War  Department  expenditures^ 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  You  can  best  find  out  what  I  thought  about  it 
:  and  said  about  it  if  you  will  read  niv  report  to  the  concessional 
committee. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Well,  I  have  seen  reports  of  that  kind. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  You  did  not  see  this  one,  evidently. 
^  Senator  Pomerexe.  I  am  glad  to  say  that  I  did  not.    I  think  that 
IS  all  I  care  to  inquire  now. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  ask  only  tAvo  or  three  questions,  to  establish 
connections  for  future  witnesses. 

.    In  your  investigation,  Mr.  Steinbrink,  did  you  find  any  definite 
connection,  stockholding  connection,  between  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  and  the  Dayton- Wright  Aeroplane  Co.  ?  ' 
Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Briefly,  what  Avas  that  connection  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Let  me  get  that  question  again. 

Senator  Edge.  I  asked  if  in  his  previous  investigation— which  of 
course,  he  did  make  and  has  now  testified  that  he  did  make— he 
found  any  direct  business  connection  between  the  Davton  Metal 
.Products  Co.  and  the  Dayton- Wright  Aircraft  Co. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  AVith  the  exception  of  five  qualifving  shares,  all 
ot  the  stock  of  the  Dayton-Wright  Aeroj^lane  Co.  'was  owned  bv 
the^  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  Col.  Deeds  formerly  connected  with  either  of 
those  companies;  and  if  so,  in  what  capacity? 

I  Mr.  Steixbrixk.  As  I  recall  it.  Col.  Deeds  was  one  of  the  original 
'incorporators  of  the  Dayton-Wright  Aeroplane  Co.,  but  never  com- 
pleted his  connection  with  it.  He  severed  his  stockholding  connec- 
tion before  he  acce])te(I  the  governmental  service. 
^  Senator  Edge.  Who  was  the  president  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Prod- 
ucts Co^  at  that  time — at  the  time  of  the  Frear  investigation? 
,    Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr.,  I  am  pretty  sure. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  Avas  president  of  the  Dayton-Wright  Aero- 
plane Co.? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr. 
^  Senator  Edge.  Who  Avas  the  president  of  the  City  National  Bank 
3f  Dayton,  Avhere  this  note  is  alleged  to  have  been  discounted? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  At  the  date  of  its  discount,  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  alL 


2722 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  discover  that  Gov.  Cox  had  any  finan- 
cial connection  with  either  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  or  with 
the  aeroplane  company? 

Mr.  Steinbrink,  None;  he  was  not  a  stockholder,  so  far  as  the 
record  disclosed,  in  either  company. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  no  respect,  so  far  as  you  know,  did  he 
have  any  financial  interest  in  either  of  these  companies  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrtnk.  None. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  none  so  far  as  your  investigation  went  ? 
Mr.  Steinbrink.  None. 
Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  You  testified,  I  think,  that  you  had  personally  in- 
vestigated the  facts  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  in  connection 
with  the  payment  of  the  $5,000  note ;  is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  No.  I  said  I  made  no  detailed  investigation.  I 
did  go  to  the  office  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  on  one  occa- 
sion after  these  facts  were  called  to  my  attention,  and  by,  I  think. 
Mr.  Scherer  Avas  shown  such  books  as  I  called  for  and  such  records. 
The  principal  call  at  that  time  had  to  do  with  reference  to  contracts 
for  aviation  w^ork. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  3^ou  personally  ever  investigate  the  books  of 
the  Citv  National  Bank  of  Davton  in  connection  ^vith  the  same  trans- 
action-^-the  $5,000  check? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  No,  sir ;  but  I  sent  for  certain  officers  of  the  City 
National  Bank  when  I  first  came  to  Dayton  in  my  capacity  as  deputy 
attorney  general,  at  the  request  of  Attorney  General  Gregory  and 
Judge  Hughes,  and  made  my  headquarters  in  the  Federal  judge's 
office  here  and  had  the  representatives  of  the  bank  come  to  my  room, 
and  there  I  had  my  preliminary  conversation  with  them  preparatory 
to  Judge  Hughes  and  the  Attorney  General  coming  on  to  take  the 
testimonj^ 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  testify  directly  what  they  told  you  ? 
Senator  Pomerene.  What  who  told  him? 

Senator  Edge.  The  men  he  referred  to.  I  will  ask  him  the  names 
as  soon  as  I  can  reach  that  point. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  I  would  not  undertake  to.  Senator  Edge,  with- 
out having  before  me  the  stenographic  report. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  legal  evidence,  may  I  inquire? 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  is  not.  If  you  want  any  information  that 
those  Avitnesses  may  have,  it  would  be  better  to  get  the  witnesses. 

Senator  Edge.  I  presume  so. 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  The  stenographic  record  is  on  file. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all,  Mr.  Steinbrink. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  another  question.  When  you  were  here 
did  you  have  some  secret-service  men  here  ? 


Senator  Pomerene.  At  no  time  ? 

Mr.  Steinbrink.  At  no  time.  On  my  first  visit.  Senator  Pom- 
erene, I  used  people  who  were  found  here  in  the  Federal  employ 
Avhom  I  had  neA'er  met  before  and  never  knew.  They  were  at  that 
time,  I  believe,  connected  with  the  American  Legion,  I  think  was 
the  name  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  avail  yourself  of  their  services  ii) 
this  investigation? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2723 


Mr.  Steinbrixk.  Certainly.  AVe  availed  ourselves.  Senator,  of 
any  one  who  was  willing  to  assist. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  know  Judge  McCann,  of  this  city? 

Mr.  Steixbrink.  Xo  :  I  met  him  in  the  course  of  the  investigation. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Did  you  meet  his  secretary  or  clerk? 

Mr.  SteixbriVk.  If  I  heard  the  name  I  coukl  tell  you  better;  I 
do  not  identify  him  by  that. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  can  not  give  you  his  name. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  If  I  did,  I  do  not  know  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Do  you  know  of  any  of  these  men  getting  any 
documents  belonging  to  Judge  McCann,  or  Avhich  were  in  his  care, 
through  this  secretary  or  clerk  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  I  never  heard  of  it  until  this  moment. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Did  you  have  any  knowledge  that  some  one 
of  these  men  had  forged  Judge  McCann's  name  to  an  order  on  the 
clerk  to  furnish  certain  documents  and  give  them  an  insight  into 
them  i 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  I  never  heard  of  it. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  You  never  did? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  Please  keep  in  mind.  Senator  Pomerene,  that  the 
Attorney  General  of  the  United  States  had  at  his  disposal  the  Mili- 
tary Intelligence  Bureau  and  Secret  Service,  which  Avas  under  Mr. 
Bielaski.  and  he  might  have  been  doing  some  independent  investi- 
gating that  neither  Judge  Hughes  nor  myself  kncAv  anything  about. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  am  simply  asking  you  for  Avhat  information 
you  have  on  this  subject.  Of  course,  while  you  were  here  as  assist- 
ant attorney  general  you  vceve  representing  the  attorney  general  ? 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  I  assume  so;  because  what  I  did.  Senator,  I  do 
not  hesitate  to  tell  you,  or  when  I  sent  for  any  of  these  people,  no 
matter  who  it  was,  I  made  no  secret  of  my  mission. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Certainly  not. 

Mr.  Steixbrixk.  I  disclosed  to  them  my  authority,  over  the  signa- 
ture of  the  Attorney  General,  and  then  I  spoke  Avith  them  quite 
frankly. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  am  finding  no  fault  Avith  the  investigation 
having  been  made. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  MARVYN  SCUDDER,  EXPERT  ACCOUNTANT, 

NEW  YORK  CITY. 

The  Avitness  was  duly  sAvorn  by  Senator  Edge. 

Senator  Edge.  GiA^e  your  name  and  business  address  to  the  com- 
mittee. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  ^larvyn  Scudder.  177  BroadAvay,  XeAv  York. 
Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Scudder,  hoAv  long  liaAe  a^ou  been  an  expert 
accountant  ( 
Mr.  Scudder.  Eor  20  years. 
Senator  Edge.  What  is  your  firm's  name  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  Marvyn  Scudder  &  Co. 


182774— 20— PT  21  2 


2224 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPEISTSES. 


Senator  Edge.  AVere  yon  ever  associated  with  any  Government 
work  previons  to  yonr  retention  by  the  Hughes  invekigating  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr,  ScuDDER.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Briefly  recite  that. 

Mr.  ScuDDEK.  My  first  employment  was  by  the  so-called  Arm- 
strong investigation  of  insurance  companies  in  1905,  for  which 
Judge  Hughes  was  counsel.  Subsequent  to  that  I  was  accountant ' 
for  the  Public  Service  Commission  of  New  York  State  for  a  mat- 
ter running  over  a  year,  in  the  investigation  and  report  on  the  trac- 
tion situation  in  New  York  City  and  Brooklyn.  I  was  also  em- 
ployed b}^  the  attorney  general  of  New  York  State  in  the  ice  trust 
investigation,  of  1908,  I  think.  I  was  employed  by  the  banking  de- 
partment as  accountant  in  the  Knickerbocker  Trust  Co.  failure  and 
resuscitation,  of  about  that  date. 

I  was  employed  by  Comptroller  Metz,  of  the  city  of  New  York,  for 
two  years — about  1909  and  1910 — in  the  reorganization  of  the  finance 
department  of  New  York  City.  I  was  employed  b}^  the  city  of  Chi- 
cago, under  Mayor  Harrison,  in  1912  in  a  thorough  investigation  and 
report  on  the  ordinance  provisions  as  they  referred  to  accounting  in 
the  Chicago  surface  lines.  I  was  employed  by  the  Government  at 
Washington  on  several  occasions  by  the  old  Bureau  or  Corporations 
on  audits  in  connection  with  the  Standard  Oil,  United  States  Steel, 
and  matters  that  they  had  under  their  jurisdiction. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  directly  under  the  jurisdiction  of  the  De- 
partment of  Justice  in  Washington? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  think  that  was  under  Garfield ;  and  I  am  not  certain 
whether  that  had  any  relation  to  the  Attorney  General's  Office. 

I  have  been  employed  previous  to  the  recent  employment  by  the 
Attorney  General's  Office.  Mr.  McReynolds  employed  me  in  connec- 
tion with  his  Tobacco  Trust  work;  that  3^ou  may  have  heard  of. 
That  lasted  over  some  period. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  sufficient  to  establish  your  qualifi- 
cations as  an  expert  accountant. 

Mr.  Scudder.  During  the  aircraft  investigation  I  was  employed 
by  the  Attorney  General's  Office,  under  Judge  Hughes  as  counsel  and 
Mr.  Steinbrink  as  deputy. 

Senator  Edge.  In  that  investigation  were  you  directly  under  the 
Department  of  Justice  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  The  Attorney  (jeneral's  Department  in  Wash- 
ington ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes ;  directly  under  the  Department  of  Justice :  they 
employed  me. 

Senator  Edge.  In  connection  with  that  investigation,  Avere  you 
directed  by  the  associate  counsel,  Mr.  Steinbrink,  to  make  certain 
investigations  of  the  activities  and  finances  of  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Not  directly  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co..  but 
i  was  directed  to  proceed  to  Dayton  and  make  an  investigation  of  all 
matters  that  pertained  to  aircraft  transactions  with  the  Govern- 
ment. 

Senator  EnciE.  Mr.  Scudder.  without  asking  you  detailed  ques- 
tions, will  you  tell  this  committee  what  facts  you  discovered  in  the 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2725 


course  of  that  investigation  that  woukl  directly  relate  to  the  in\'esti- 
gation  that  we  are  making  ?  1  understand  that  you  are  familiar  yyith 
the  investigation  with  which  we  are  proceeding. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  The  only  thing  that  would  directly  relate  to  the 
mvestigation  that  you  are  undertaking,  as  I  understand  it,  is  the  con- 
tribution of  $42,000  in  cash  that  has  to  do,  as  I  was  informed,  with 
campaign  expenses.  ' 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  your  understanding  of  the  subiect 
mutter  of  this  investigation  ? 

Mr.  ScTJDDER.  My  understanding  of  the  subject  matter  of  this 
investigation  is  that  it  is  in  regard  to  campaign  contributions.  I 
know  little  about  it,  Senator. 

Senator  Pozvierene.  What  campaign  contributions  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  A  contribution  that  is  paid,  either  directly  or  indi- 
rectly, in  connection  with  a  political  campaign. 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  the  fact  is  that  we  have  to  do  only  with 
tlie  investigation  of  the  receipts  and  expenditures  in  the  presidential 
campaign  and  in  Senatorial  campaigns,  would  you  still  understand 
that  these  funds  had  to  do  with  those  two  classes  of  campaign  funds? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  would  understand  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  we  will  see. 

Senator  Edge.  Proceed,  Mr.  Scudder,  Avith  vour  discoveries  with 
relation  to  campaign  contributions  and  of  the  $42,000  that  you  have 
referred  to. 

May  I  observe  there,  Senator  Pomerene,  without  any  contention, 
so  that  it  will  be  clearly  understood  that  I  agree  with  you,  if  I  am 
getting  your  inference  correctly  from  your  last  remark  or  question, 
that  it  IS  a  well-known  fact  that  this  subcommittee  has  no  jurisdic- 

'  tion,  so  far  as  my  view^  is  concerned,  over  contributions  or  expendi- 
tures in  campaigns  previous  to  the  present  campaign  for  President 

•  and  Senators.  There  can  not  be  any  question  in  anybody's  mind  as 
to  that. 

But  this  particular  hearing  has  been  called  by  a  member  of  the 
committee,  on  his  motion,  to  go  back  in  all  matters  relating  to  this 
Cox  check  and  the  contributions  of  the  corporation  that  have  been 
I  brought  up  in  connection  ^vith  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  not  going  to  make  any  objection  to  vour 
I  going  fully  into  the  facts  with  regard  to  the  Cox  note ;  and  when  I 
/  use  the  word    facts  "  I  use  it  advisedly. 

[     Senator  Edge.  AVell,  with  that  understanding,  which  I  have  made 
clear  for  the  benefit  of  the  witness  as  well  as  to  make  plain  my  own 
.  position,  it  is  clear  to  you  what  we  want  from  you,  is  it  not  ?  '  Will 
'  you  proceed  ? 

.  Mr.  Scudder.  I  tliink  so ;  if  I  am  not  right  about  it,  please  correct 
^  me :  Twenty-six  thousand  dollars,  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. ;  $7,000, 
j Adam  Schantz ;  $7,000,  Walter  Kidder;  $2,000,  F.  M.  Tait. 

Senator  Edge.  Let  us  see  if  I  have  them  all.    Twentv-six  thousand 

dollars.  Metal  Products  Co.;  $7,000,  Schantz;  $7,000,  Kidder;  $2,000 

Tait. 

Mr.  Scudder.  Does  that  foot  up  $42,000? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 
^    Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  it  does. 
^    Mr.  ScDDDER.  I  think  that  is  right. 

Senator  Edge.  You  may  proceed. 


2726 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScuDDEK.  I  do  not  know  

Senator  Pomerenp:  (interposing).  May  I  ask  3^011  just  a  prelim- 
inary question  there Did  I  understand  you  to  say  that  this  $42,000 
has  to  do  with  the  presidential  or  senatorial  campaign? 

Mr.  ScuDDEE.  Why,  I  understand  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  will  you  state  the  facts  which  justify  you 
in  coming  to  the  conclusion  that  these  relate  to  a  senatorial  or  presi- 
dential campaign? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  W^hy,  I  am  relying  on  Mr.  Schantz's  statement  to  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  were  these  funds  contributed? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  At  different  times. 

Senator  Poivierene.  What  year? 

Mr.  ScroDER.  Do  you  want  to  know  the  exact  dates? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Why,  if  you  can  give  them;  yes. 

M.r.  ScuDDER.  [Referring  to  paper.]    October  24^  1916,  $6,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  not  this  presidential  campaign,  is  it? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  That  is  the  1916  campaign. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  yes.  AVhat  relation  has  that  to  this  presi- 
dential campaign? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Xo  relation  to  this  campaign. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  thought  so. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  the  witness  misunderstood  your  question,  as 
a  matter  of  fact.  Senator.  I  do  not  want  to  interfere  with  your  ex- 
amination, but  it  is  so  obvious  it  could  not  have  

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  statement  was — and  I  tried  to  make  the 
matter  perfectly  clear  to  you — that  you  were  investigating  the  presi- 
dential and  senatorial  cami)aign  expenditures  and  receipts,  meaning 
this  campaign's  receipts  and  expenditures. 

Mr.  Sci  DDER.  I  did  not  so  understand  the  question. 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  you  did  not,  why,  of  course,  we  all  know  we 
misunderstand  each  other  once  in  a  while,  and  that  is  all  right. 

Senator  Edge.  Suppose  I  ask  you,  Mr.  Scudder,  a  few  questions 
and  try  to  at  least  get  the  information  we  are  seeking:  You  have  tes- 
tified that  in  the  course  of  this  investigation  you  discovered  items 
totaling  $42,000  which,  from  your  investigation,  you  assume  were 
contributions  to  a  political  campaign? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Precisely. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  us,  in  your  own  language,  what  has  brought 
about  that  conclusion  on  your  part.  Tell  us  how  the  items  are  en- 
tered in  the  ledger,  the  disbursements,  and  the  information  that  you 
have  leading  to  the  subscribing  of  those  items  and  paying  of  those 
items,  until  their  return,  that  would  warrant  you  in  believing  that 
they  are  cam])aign  contributions? 

Mr.  Sci  DDER.  I  think  tlie  simplest  way.  Senator,  to  give  you  that 
information  is  to  inform  you  that  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott  and  Mr.  Schantz 
together  told  me  that  this  $42,000  did  represent  campaign  con- 
tributions. 

Senator  Edge.  They  told  you  that  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  They  told  me  that ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Talbott  and  Mr.  Schantz.  All  right ;  tell  the 
story. 

Senator  Pcoierene.  Let  me  ask  a  ])reliminary  question  there,  so 
tliat  we  may  be  j^erfectly  clear  about  this— campaign  contributions  to 
what  campaign? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2727 


Mr.  ScuDDEK.  AVell,  it  is  rather  hard  for  me  to  tell  what  particular 
campaigns,  because  I  do  not  knoAv  the  campaigns  that  you  had  here, 
but  I  assume  that  they  were  campaigns  of  different  years,  and  the 
most  of  it  was  1916.  I  assume  that  was  a  presidential  campaign, 
naturally :  that  is  Avhen  the  bulk  of  the  payments  AA^ere  made. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  you  are  not  familiar  AA^ith  it,  but  I 
think  you  can  also  assume  that  in  the  State  of  Ohio  in  1916  AA^e  AA^ere 
not  conducting  a  campaign  for  1920? 

Mr.  ScroDER.  Precisely.    Shall  I  proceed? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes:  proceed. 

Mr.  Sci  ODER.  October  24,  to  repeat.  1916,  $6,000;  the  same  date, 
$6,000:  Xovember  2,  1916,  $5,000;  November  6.  1916,  $5,000;  October 
7,  1916,  $6,000,  $7,000,  and  $2,000. 

Senator  Edge.  To  AAdiom  AA^re  those  A'arious  checks  made  payable, 
and  by  whom  ? 

Mr.  ScT'DDER.  The  first  three  checks — the  first  four  checks  AA^ere 
made  payable  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  to  H.  E.  Talbott, 
and  the  fourth  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr. 

Senator  Edge.  What  Avas  the  fourth  item? 

Mr.  Sci  DDER.  $5,000.  The  hrst  one  of  October  7,  1916,  Avas  a  check 
of  H.  E.  Talbott,  special,  draAA^n  to  self;  the  $7,000  item  AA^as  a  check 
drawn — I  Avill  correct  that — that  AA^as  a  book  entry  by  Mr.  Schantz, 
who  receiA'ed  these  contributions,  against  himself;  he  charged  his 
OAA'n  account  Avith  $7,000.  The  check  of  $2,000  Avas  draAvn  by  Mr. 
F.  M.  Tait,  and  the  check  of  $5,000  Avas  draAvn  by  the  Dayton 'Metal 
Products  Co.  on  June  29,  1918. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  last  item  the  check  that  discharged  the  note 
discounted  by  Goa-.  Cox? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  How  do  you  know  that? 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  check  was  that? 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  check  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  what  date? 

Mr.  Scudder.  That  AA^as  draAvn  on  June  29,  1918,  and  the  reason  I 
knoAA'  it  AA^as  for  that  Avas  that  I  AA^as  slioAvn  the  cancelled  note  at  the 
office  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  for  Avhich  that  check  paid — 
that  is,  GoA^  Cox's  note. 

Senator  Edge.  What  AA^as  the  date  of  the  entry,  if  any,  in  the  books 
of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  covering  the  disbursement? 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  entry  Avas  under  date  of  June  29,  1918,  in  the 
cash  book.  Cox  note. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  entry  is  the  best  evidence  of  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  Avish  to  bring  it  out  so  I  can  call  for  the  books  and 
refer  to  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  All  right. 

Mr.  Scudder.  It  said,  "  Cox  note  to  the  City  National  Bank. 
$5,075,''  as  I  recall  it,  to  be  exact. 
Senator  Edge.  What  Avas  the  $75  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  Interest. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  there  any  other  item  in  the  books  of  the  Day- 
ton Metal  Products  Co.  referring  to  this  disbursement  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  think  it  Avas  charged  to  administration  expense,  as 
T  recall  it. 


2728 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Charged  on  the  other  side  to  admmistration  ex- 
pense ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  In  your  investigation  of  the  books  was  there  any 
direct  account  with  James  M.  Cox,  jr.? 

Mr.  ScUDDER.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  there  any  evidence  of  any  kind  of  any  services 
rendered  by  James  M.  Cox,  jr.? 

Mr.  Scubder.  I  did  not  see  any ;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  You  audited  the  books,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  did  not.  I  examined  the  books,  but  I  did  not  find 
anywhere  anything  in  regard  to  Gov.  Cox  except  that  one  item,  and 
I  went  into  that  very  thoroughly. 

Senator  Edge.  You  did  what? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  went  into  that  very  thoroughly. 

Senator  Edge.  That  item  appeared  alone  in  the  cash  book  as  a  dis- 
bursement and  a  charge  against  that  to  administration  expense ;  is 
that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  That  is  correct ;  the  books  will  show  that. 
Senator  Edge.  If  not  correct,  please  say  so. 

Mr.  Scudder.  But  the  cash  book  entry,  I  state  that  as  correct. 
Senator  Edge.  Now,  these  other  items. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are  going  to  have  those  books  here,  are 
you? 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  subpoenaed  a  witness  to  bring  all  those 
books.  There  are  other  items  of  various  checks,  $6,000,  $5,000,  and 
three  checks,  as  I  understand  it,  direct  from  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  each  for  $6,000;  is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  From  j^our  investigation  as  to  the  course  of  that 
disbursement,  Avhat  information  can  you  give  us  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  They  were  apparently  cashed. 
Senator  Edge.  How  is  that? 

Mr.  Scudder.  They  were  apparently  cashed  at  the  bank. 
Senator  Edge.  They  were  cashed  at  the  bank? 
Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir.    The  first  item  was  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Tal- 
bott." 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  do  you  mean  by  "  item  "  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  I  beg  pardon. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  you  speak  of  "  item  "  being  indorsed, 
Avhat  do  you  mean  by  that  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  By  one  of  these  items,  of  course,  I  am  referring  to 
the  check. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  those  checks  here  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  just  asked  him  a  question  about  the  three  checks, 
and  he  said  the  first  item — meaning  the  first  check,  I  presume  

Mr.  Scudder.  The  first  check  was  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Talbott." 

Senator  Pomerene.  Where  are  these  checks?  They  are  the  best 
evidence  of  this  matter. 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  can  only  say  that  when  I  saw  them  they  w^ere  at 
the  office  of  the  Da^^ton  Metal  Products  Co.,  and  were  handed  to 
me  by  

Senator  Pomerene.  And  Avhat  is  this  memorandum  that  you  are 
using  to  refresh  your  memory  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2729 


Mr.  SciDDEif.  This  is  a  memorandum  that  I  made  from  my  in- 
vestigation in  the  aircraft  matter. 

Senator  Po31erene.  I  do  not  want  to  be  technical  about  this,  l)ut 
it  must  appear  that  the  books  and  the  checks  are  the  primary  evi- 
dence of  the  matter.   I  think  I  will  let  you  go  on,  though. 

Mr.  ScFDDER.  May  I  make  an  explanation? 

> Senator  Edge.  Certainly. 
^Ir.  Sci'DDER.  In  regard  to  these  items,  I  was  asked  by  the  Frear 
committee  to  produce  my  evidence,  and  I  refused  to  do  it.  They  got 
from  me  or  from  the  Attorney  General's  Office,  my  report,  which 
contained  the  information,  and  my  report  to  Judge  Hughes,  that 
contained  this  information,  and  on  the  basis  of  those  reports  and 
after  they  had  gotten  them  I  was  pressed  and  gave  this  information. 
But  I  did  not  give  it,  and  refused  to  give  it,  until  I  was  ordered  to 
do  so  after  they  had  gotten  the  report  from  the  Attorney  General. 
H  Senator  Po:merexe.  Why  did  you  refuse  to  give  it  ? 
W  Mr.  Sci'DDER.  Becau.^e  T  did  not  think  that  I  ought  to  give  them 
the  information  that  I  had  gotten  for  the  Attorney  General.  I  am 
not  a  lawyer;  I  am  an  accountant. 

Senator  P(j.\rERENE.  Your  thought  was  that  you  got  this  in  a  sort 
of  confidential  way  as  representing  the  Attorney  General? 
Mr.  ScT  DDER.  I  tried  to  be  careful ;  yes. 
Senator  Pomerene.  All  right. 

Senatod  Edge.  Mr.  Scudder,  you  are  starting  to  explain  the  course 
of  these  checks,  and  I  think  you  answered  that  the  checks  were 
cashed  at  the  bank.    Is  that  correct? 

^Ir.  ScTDDER.  Yes,  sir;  and  I  can  tell  you  Avhich  bank  they  Avere 
cashed  at.  The  first  check  was  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Talbott,"  and 
^'  Adam  Schantz  by  J.  C.  Hocliwalt,"  and  was  cashed  at  the  Dayton 
Savings  &  Trust. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  you  going  to  have  these  checks  all  here? 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  asked  for  all  the  books  and  papers  concern- 
ing this.  Senator.   If  they  are  still  in  existence,  we  will  have  them. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  if  you  have  them  here  I  would  like  to 
see  them,  and  perhaps  we  might  shorten  this  investigation.  The  wit- 
i  ness  here  is  wholly  testifying  from,  his  memory,  and  his  statements 
are  secondary  evidence,  of  course. 

Senator  Edge.  Secondary  evidence,  but  it  is  necessary,  in  my 
\  judgment — pardon  my  lack  of  legal  knowledge,  which  I  apologize 
:  for  many  times — to  secure  his  information  as  he  has  to  some  extent 
,  continued  this  investigation  where  the  officers  of  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  could,  of  course,  onl}^  show  the  bare  instrument.  I  am 
trying  to  get  the  whole  thing  weaved  together. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  instrument  ought  to  be  here. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  Mr.  Scherer  in  the  room  ? 

^fr.  Scherer.  I  am. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  the  paid  checks,  canceled  paid  checks? 
Mr.  Scherer.  Yes,  sir;  I  have  the  checks  of  the  Dayton  Metal 
^  Products  Co.  here. 

Senator  Edge.  They  are  all  here  ? 
Mr.  Scherer.  I  have  them  here. 

Senator  Edge.  If  there  is  no  objection,  why  not  have  them  turned 
o\er  to  the  witness? 


2730 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  I^ojmekene.  I  think  I  will  let  the  witness  o-o  on  with  the 
matter  now. 

Senator  Edge.  We  can  ask  the  witness  with  the  checks  in  hand,  but 
Mr.  Scherer  is  probably  the  more  direct  witness. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  The  first  check  Avas  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Talbott  '*  and 
"Adam  Schantz,  by  J.  C  Hochwalt,"  and  cashed  at  the  Dayton  Sav- 
ings &  Trust  October  24, 1916. 

Senator  Edge.  That  was  $6,000. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes;  the  second  check  w^as  indorsed  by  H.  E.  Talbott 
and  Adam  Schantz  by  J.  C.  L.  Hochwalt,  October '26,  1916.  The 
third  check  was  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Talbot  "  and  ''Adam  Schants.'' 
November  3,  1916.  The  next  check  was  indorsed  "  H.  E.  Talbot,  jr.,'^ 
and  "  Adam  Schantz,"  November  T,  1917. 

Senator  Ed(;e.  What  was  the  amount  of  that  check  ? 
.  Mr.  ScuDDER.  $5,000.    The  Dayton  National  and  Dayton  Savings 
&  Trust  stamp  was  on  it. 

Senator  Edge,  (live  us  the  amount  of  each  check.  I  am  trying  to 
check  them  up  here. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  The  next  check  was  $6,()()0,  indorsed,  "  H.  E.  Talbot," 
"Adam  Schantz,"  "  Martin  E.  Viehl."  Of  course  the  entry  of  $7,000 
in  Mr.  Schantz's  book  did  not  represent  a  check.  It  was  simply  a 
credit. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  that  represent  ?  Was  it  a  direct  cashing  of 
one  of  his  OAvn  checks  ?   Is  that  what  jow  mean  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  No;  that  simply  represented  charging  himself  with 
the  $7,000  for  the  contribution  that  he  was  to  make  of  $7,000,  as  he 
handled  this  whole  fund. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  charging  himself,  how  did  he  get  the  cash? 

Mr.  Scudder.  He  got  the  cash  in  this  way,  that  he  cashed  these 
other  checks,  and  I  am  now  testifying  as  to  what  Mr.  Schantz  said 
as  to  cashing  these  checks,  plus  the  indorsements. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  not  necessary. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  object  to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  We  will  call  Mr.  Schantz  for  that  information. 
You  were  referring  to  the  $7,000  Schantz  check.  You  are  down  now 
to  the  $6,000  check. 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  have  given  you  six,  six,  five,  five,  six,  seven,  and  the 
two  thousand  of  Mr.  Tait  was  a  check  given  by  him  to  Mr.  Schantz^ 
and  the  $5,075  that  we  know  about. 

Senator  Edge.  As  I  have  folloAved  you  in  this  somewhat  intricate 
matter,  all  of  these  checks — correct  me  if  I  am  wrong — were  cashed 
at  the  bank,  indorsed,  as  you  have  outlined,  Avith  the  personal  in- 
dorsement of  Mr.  Schantz.  Then  Mr.  Schantz  must  have  received  the 
actual  cash  for  this  total  of  $35,000? 

Mr.  Scudder.  It  is  $37,000,  as  a  matter  of  fact.  There  was  $2,000 
of  Tait's. 

Senator  Edge.  Perhaps  I  have  made  a  mistake  in  the  total. 
Mr.  Scudder.  You  will  find  it  is  $37,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz  has  received  in  this  way  the  actual 
cash  for  these  various  checks? 

Mr.  SciTDDER.  There  is  no  question  about  it — $37,000. 
Senator  Edge.  That  totals  $37,000. 
Mr.  Scudder.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  go  any  further  in  this  investigation? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2731 


Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes.  I  asked  Mr.  Schantz  as  to  what  disposition 
he  made  of  the  $37,000.  ^ 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  only  know  from  the  statement  he  made? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Only  know  from  the  statement  he  made. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  you  better  get  that  from  Mr.  Schantz. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  ask  Mr.  Schantz  about  that.  In  your  direct 
investigation  did  you  find  any  return  of  any  of  this  money  made 
out  to  the  order  of  Mr.  Talbott  that  had  come  directly  from  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  us  that  information. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  found  two  items  direct  to  Mr.  Talbott,  April  4, 
1918,  from  Mr.  Schantz  special,  on  the  Davton  Savings  &  Trust, 
$12,679.38  and  $6,574.50. 

Senator  Pomerene.  To  Mr.  Talbott? 

Mr.  Scudder.  H.  E.  Talbott,  $12,679.38  and  $6,574.50. 

Senator  Edge.  These  amounts  were  in  what  form  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Checks  from  Mr.  Schantz. 

Senator  Edge.  To  whom  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Mr.  Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  And  then  what  happened  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  He  indorsed  them  over  to  the  Dayton  Metal  Prod- 
ucts Co. 

Senator  Edge.  You  speak  of  them  being  on  Talbott's  special  ac- 
count. Was  that  the  same  account  chaged  with  the  original  dis- 
bursement ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  It  was  charged  with  something  like  $19,000  of  the 
original  disbursement,  but  the  original  charge  w^as  in  a  little  dif- 
ferent "form.  The  original  charge  of  these  mone^^s  was  to  the  indi- 
vidual accounts  of  E.  A.  Deeds,  Mr.  Kettering,  and  Mr.  Talbott  on 
the  books  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  important. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  was  it  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  charge  was  originall}^  to  E.  A.  Deeds,  Mr.  Ket- 
tering, and  to  Mr.  Talbott,  in  equal  thirds,  on  the  books  of  the  Day- 
ton Metal  Products  Co.;  but,  in  March,  1917,  the  entries  were  re- 
versed, and  Mr.  Talbott's  special  account,  as  I  recall  it,  was  charged. 
The  books,  as  Senator  Pomerene  says,  are  the  best  evidence  of  that, 
but  I  am  certain  as  to  the  fact  that  they  were  charged  originally  to 
those  three  gentlemen  in  that  way. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  ])ositive  that  those  checks  returned  from 
Mr.  Schantz  to  Mr.  Talbott  were  indorsed  by  Mr.  Talbott  and  went 
into  the  treasury  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  anything  further  about  the  transac- 
tion of  your  own  knoAvledge? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  know  that  Mr.  Kidder  was  paid  back,  and  Mr. 
Schantz  was  paid  back,  and  Mr.  Tait  was  ]:>aid  back. 

Senator  Edge.  By  Avhoni  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  By  Mr.  Schantz. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  now,  develop  that.  Tet  us  get  that  clear. 
How  could  Mr.  Schantz  pay  himself  back? 

Mr.  Scudder.  By  an  entry  in  liis  books  which  credits  himself. 
Senator  Edge.  Where  did  the  money  come  from  ? 


2732 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScuDDEK.  The  money  came  from  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  Do  you  know? 
Mr.  ScTJDDER.  Do  I  know  ?   Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Of  your  own  knowledge? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes;  I  know  of  my  own  knowledge.  The  money 
came  from  the  five  or  six  men. 

Senator  Edge.  Five  or  six  men.  Tell  us  what  you  know  about  this, 
Mr.  Scudder.   I  want  to  try  to  get  the  facts  all  out  somehow. 

Mr.  Scuixder.  $26,242.50  of  this  came  from  Mr.  Gale  M.  Hartley. 
Edward  T.  Hall,  John  Lloyd,  and  some  attorneys  by  the  name  of 
Goeke  &  Anderson. 

Senator  Edge.  How  much  by  each  of  those  gentlemen  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  see  if  I  understood  that  correctly. 
You  say  26,000  plus  came  from  those  men  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Twenty-six  thousand  plus  came  from  those  men. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Came  from  them  to  whom  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Mr.  Schantz. 

Senator  Edge.  Now  we  are  up  to  this  point.  Let  me  see  if  I  have 
this  correct.  This  money  Avas  paid  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products 
Co.  to  Mr.  Talbott.  Some  was  paid  direct,  as  vou  testify.  It  all  was 
indorsed  over  to  Mr.  Schantz  and  he  cashed  the  various  checks,  total- 
ing $37,000,  including  his  own? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  cease  knoAving  what  happens  until  we 
ask  you  Avhether  the  money  has  been  returned,  that  part  that 
was  disbursed  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  and  you  have 
answered  that,  as  to  its  return.  Now,  you  state  that  certain  men. 
whose  names  you  gave,  of  this  presumably,  you  understand,  $87,000. 
returned  to  Mr.  Schantz  twenty-six  thousand  and  odd  dollars*? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  your  investigation  develop  as  to  the 
source  of  that  $26,000,  or  whv  it  should  be  connected  with  this  orio-i- 
nal  $37,000? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  mean  information  that  came  to  him 
from  his  investigation  of  the  books  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  mean  any  information  to  which  he  can  directlv 
testify. 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  examined  the  books. 

Senator  Edge.  I  asked  him  to  confine  it  to  his  own  knowledge. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  these  are  deductions  from  the  books.  Of 
course,  I  have  no  objection  to  his  stating  that,  but  if  your  information 
is  partly  gossip  and  partly  statements  made  by  some  of  the  gentle- 
men to  you,  it  must  occur  to  you  that  they  should  be  called  to  testify 
to  those  facts;  otherwise  we  will  get  ourselves  into  difficultv. 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  am  only  testifying  to  what  I  actuallv  know. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all  I  want  you  to  testify  to. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  can  only  know  these  things  from  your  in- 
vestigation of  the  books  and  docun'ients  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir.  That  is  the  onlv  thino-  I  can  testifv  to. 
I  do  know  that  Mr.  E.  T.  Hall  gave  Mv.  Schantz  a  check  for 
€ighty-four  hundred  dollars,  which  was  placed  in  Mr.  Schantz's  spe- 
cial account  at  the  Dayton  Savings  c^-  Trust. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  amount  of  that  was  what  ? 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIG^^  EXPENSES. 


2733 


:Mr.  ScuDDER.  Eighty-four  lumdred  dollars;  and  I  got  this  from 
Mr.  Schantz's  ledger,  which  he  very  freely  opened  to  me  and  showed 
to  me. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  us  the  date  of  that  check,  so  that  we  can  keep 
the  transactions  together. 

]Mr.  ScuDDER.  March  8,  1918.  These  were  all  on  March  8  :  $4,357.50 
from  EdAvard  T.  Hall,  $4,346  50  from  Gale  Hartley,  $4,346.50  from 
T.  (xarry,  $6,949.50  from  John  Lloyd,  and  $2,000  from  Goeke  &  An- 
derson. On  the  opposite  side  of  the  account  are  the  disbursements, 
which  I  have  stated,  as  i)aid  back  to  Mr.  Kidder,  Mr.  Tait,  and  Mr. 
Talbott,  against  it. 

Senator  Edge.  AVhere  did  you  see  these  items  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  saw  these  items  in  Mr.  Schantz's  special  account  in 
his  ledger. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz  opened  his  ledger  and  permitted  you  to 
see  those  accounts  ? 
•    Mr.  Scudder.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Edge.  What  happened  after  that.  This  $26,000  being  re- 
turned bv  these  gentlemen  that  you  have  mentioned,  what  was  the 
next  ?    What  happened  next  in  the  use  of  this  $26,000? 

^Ir.  Scudder.  He  referred  me  to  the  source  of  that,  to  the  Dayton 
flood-prevention  committee,  and  I  went  over  there  and  examined 
their  books. 

Senator  Edge.  You  examined  their  books  yourself? 
Mr.  Scudder.  I  examined  their  minute  book. 
Senator  Edge.  What  did  you  find  there  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  found  that  the  Dayton  flood-prevention  com- 
mittee had  ordered  the  following  bills  paid:  Edward  T.  Hall,  for 

;  services  as  per  agreement,  $8,400  for  1915,  1916,  and  1917,  at  $2,800 
XI  year;  Gale  M.  Hartley  and  Ed.  Garey,  for  publicity  services  and 
expenses  incidental  thereto  for  1915,  1916,  and  1917,  as  per  agree- 
ment, $8,693;  John  Lloyd,  for  services  from  January  1,  1915,  to 
December  31,  1915,  $1,800,  1916,  $1,800,  1917,  $1,800;  hotel  bills,  as 

I  <agroed  to,  at  $400  per  year,  $1,200 ;  incidental  expenses,  $349.50 ;  Goeke 

i  &  Anderson,  attorneys'  fees  as  per  bill,  $2,000 ;  and  G.  W.  Ozias, 

:  legal  services,  1917,  $200 ;  total,  $26,242.50. 

;  Senator  Pomerene.  Just  let  me  ask  you  a  question,  then.  Here 
I  was  $26,200  which  came  out  of  this  Dayton  flood  prevention  fund  in 
payment  as  services,  etc.,  to  these  several  gentlemen.  I  will  not 
'  take  the  time  to  name  them.  Will  you  point  out  what  connection 
j  that  fact  has  Avith  the  present  senatorial  and  presidential  campaign? 
.  Mr.  Scudder.  It  has  not  an^^thing  to  do  with  the  present  senatorial 
j  -campaign. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or  with  the  present  presidential  campaign? 
Mr.  Scudder.  It  has  nothing  to  do  with  that,  naturally. 
Senator  Edge.  Now,  Mr.  Scudder,  after  consulting  the  minutes  of 
the  meeting  of — what  do  you  call  it,  the  society  or  association? 
Mr.  Scudder.  The  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission. 
Senator  Edge.  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission?    What  was 
fi  the  date  of  that  meeting  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  February  3,  1918. 

Senator  Edge.  What  day  of  the  week  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Sunday. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  were  present  at  the  meeting? 


2734 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScuDDER.  Mr.  Deeds  in  the  chair;  Mr.  Schantz,  Mr.  Huffman 
and  Mr.  Kidder. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Deeds,  Mr.  Schantz,  and  Mr.  Kidder— correct 
me  if  I  am  wrong— as  I  recall  3^onr  testimony,  were  three  of  the  men 
who  had  given  these  checks  to  Mr.  Schantz*!    Is  that  correct  i 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Well,  Mr.  Deeds  had  been  charged  with  the  amount; 
he  had  not  given  a  personal  check.  Mr.  Schantz  had  originalh^  used 
his  own  money ; 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Mr.  Kidder  had  given  a  check. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Deeds's  check  was  a  charge? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  That  was  a  charge. 

Senator  Edge.  A  charge  covering  tlie  three  cliecks,  as  I  under- 
stand it,  of  Mr.  Talbott  and  Mr.  Kidder  and  Mr.  Schantz? 

Mr.  Scudder.  You  have  it  right  in  substance.  Those  were  con- 
tributors to  that  fund. 

Senator  Edge.  After  authority  to  make  these  disbursements  was 
arrived  at  at  this  meeting  held  on  Sunday  with  these  four  gentle- 
men present,  what  did  your  investigation  disclose  as  to  how  the 
money  was  paid  them  and  what  they  did  with  it? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  have  already  testified  as  to  the  fact  that  these 
gentlemen  that  are  recited  here,  Mr.  Hall,  Mr.  Hartley,  Mr.  Lloyd, 
(loeke  &  Anderson  and  Ozias,  paid  in  to  Mr.  Schantz  the  respective 
amounts  shown  here  in  total  of  the  amounts  that  they  had  received, 
and  the  total  of  the  whole  thing  was  equal. 

Senator  Edge.  The  total  of  the  amounts  voted  to  be  disbursed  from 
a  civic  association  known  as  the  Da3^ton  Flood  Prevention  Com- 
mission, A^oted  to  these  gentlemen,  Avas  then  reindorsed,  if  I  follow 
you.  to  Mr.  Schantz,  and  then  Avhat  did  he  do  Avith  it  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  He  paid  it  over  to  the  original  subscribers,  Mr.  Tal- 
bott, Mr.  Kidder,  Tait,  and  himself. 

Senator  Edge.  Paid  the  entire  $26,242.50? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  has  happened  in  the  meantime  Avith  the 
balance  of  the  37,000? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  Avill  have  to  be  corrected  on  that.  He  did  not  pay 
the  Avhole  thing  oA^er.  He  kept  out  an  item  of  $3,276.50. 

Senator  Edge.  You  got  all  this  information  directly  from  his  books 
or  the  minutes  of  the  Flood  PreA^ention  Commission,  did  you  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  this  item  represent  of  three  thousand-odJ 
dollars  that  he  kept  out  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  It  represented  credits  to  Gale  Hartley.  T.  Garrs'. 
etc.,  and  I  asked  him  AAdiat  that  Avas,  and  he  said  they  had  to  pay 
income  taxes  on  those  amounts. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  us  get  that  from  these  other  men. 

Mr.  Scudder.  That  is  hearsay. 

Senator  Edge.  AVhat  item  appeared  in  his  books  coA-ering  the 
$3,276.50?   In  order  to  make  his  books  balance,  Avhat  item  appeared 

Mr.  Scudder.  John  S.  Goecke,  $300;  Gale  M.  Hartley.  $504.40: 
T.  Garry,  $545.44;  E.  S.  Hall,  $1,230.48;  John  Llovd.  $696.18;  total. 
$3,276.50  short  of  the  $37,000. 


■  •  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2735 

^Senator  Edge.  Are  those  the  same  names  you  have  on  your  memo- 
randum there  of  the  men  that  received  originally  the  disbursements 
from  the  flood-jDrevention  commission  ? 
Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  now,  we  have  gotten  up  to  Mr.  Schantz  get- 
ting twenty-six  thousand  and  odd  dollars  of  this  money  back,  and 
his  books  shoAv  that  he  paid  that,  as  I  followed  your  testimony,  to 
those  same  gentlemen  who  originally  paid  him  the  thirty-seven  thou- 
sand. How  do  you  know  that?  Does  that  appear  in  his  books  as 
disbursements  to  those  gentlemen  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  have  already  testified  that  they  did. 

Senator  Edge.  I  wanted  to  get  this  in  order.  It  is  sort  of  conflict- 
ing. It  is  sort  of  mixed.  The  original  sum  is  $37,000.  You  have 
accounted  for  $2G,242.50  with  the  payments  to  these  men  and  the 
payments  to  the  men  who  received  the  money  from  the  Dayton 
Flood  Prevention  Commission.  AVhat  ab'out  the  other  $10,000?  Did 
jou  find  anything  about  that  ( 

Mr.  ScrDDER.  I  testified  in  regard  to  part  of  it  awhile  ago,  in  say- 
ing that  there  was  a  check  of  $6,574.50  that  went  into  Mr.  Talbott's 
special  account;  but  on  the  $10,957.50.  you  jumped  to  the  last  first. 
Originally  there  was  paid  back,  of  the  $37,000.  $10,957.50  in  this 
way  

Senator  Edge.  Paid  back  by  whom  i 
Mr.  Scudder.  Mr.  Schantz. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  To  whom? 

Mr.  Scudder.  To  Adam  Schantz.  $2,191.50:  W.  Kidder,  $2,191.50; 
H.  E.  Talbott,  $6,574.50;  making  the  $10,957.50,  to  which,  if  you  add 
$26,242.50  that  I  have  already  testified  to,  you  have  the  whole  of  the 
$37,000,  from  which  you  will  have  to  deduct  $200  for  a  mistake  that 
was  made  in  connection  with  Ozias  check  in  the  book. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  if  I  understand,  and  you  will  correct  me  if  I 
am  Avrong,  the  unused  part,  or  at  least  the  part  that  Avas  not  voted  to 
be  expended  by  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission,  was  pre- 
viously returned  to  the  original  subscribers.    Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  AA^ould  not  put  it  that  way.  I  Avould  say  that  that 
which  was  not  used  by  Mr.  Schantz  was  first  turned  back  to  the  orig- 
inal subscribers,  but  that  which  had  been  spent  was  reimbursed  b}" 
the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission.  This  is  a  short  way  of 
putting  it. 

Senator  Edge,  That  amounted  to  ten  thousand  and  how  much  ? 
:    Mr.  Scudder.  $10,957.50. 

Senator  Edge.  $10,957.50.  What  Avas  the  amount  of  the  refimd, 
or  Avhatever  you  may  term  it,  to  the  men  who  received  the  original 
payment  from  the  flood-pre\^ention  commission? 

Mr.  Scudder.  $26,242.50',  which  amount  found  its  Avay  to  Mr. 
Schantz  for  the  reimbursing,  which,  added  to  the  $10,957.50,  is  just 
$200  over  the  $37,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Adding  to  that  the  original  $22,000 — will  you  do 
that  so  that  the  records  will  have  it — as  I  haA^e  it  here,  makes  an  eA^en 
'$37.^)00.    Is  that  correct? 

^fr.  Scudder.  It  should.    (Figuring.)    What  is  your  question? 

Senator  Edge.  You  haA^e  given  these  items  at  odd  times.  Kindly 
now  read  the  three  items  making  up,  from  vour  investigation,  the 
return  of  the  $37,000. 


2736 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScuDDER.  On  April  4,  1918,  Adam  Schantz  special  on  the 
Dayton  Savings  &  Trust  to  Walter  Kidder,  $4,226.46;  same  date,  t( 
Adam  Schantz,  $4,226.46;  the  same  date,  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  $12,679.38 : 
the  same  date,  to  Tait— F.  M.  Tait— $1,833.70.  Before  that,  to  Adam 
Schantz,  $2,191.50;  Walter  Kidder,  $2,191.50;  H.  E.  Talbott 
$6,574.50;  total,  $33,923.50,  \yhich,  with  the  $3,276.50  reserved  for  the 
five  men  for  their  income  taxes,  makes  $37,200. 

Senator  Edoe.  What  do  you  say  for  their  income  tax?  How  do 
you  know  that  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Because  the  items  appeared  on  the  credit  side  of  the 
books  of  Adam  Schantz  special,  and  by  that  amount  made  the  checks 
paid  to  the  original  subscribers  less,' and  I  asked  why  those  items 
appeared  there,  and  Mr.  Schantz  said  to  me  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  We  had  better  get  that  from 
the  other  party. 

Senator  Edge.  You  can  answer  this  question  from  direct  investiga- 
tion :  Do  Mr.  Schantz's  books  show  any  original  disbursement  of  the 
$37,000  fund?  That  is  his  disbursement  of  the  fund  after  he  cashed 
the  checks  

Mr.  ScuDDER.  No.  He  received  that  in  cash.  He  accounted  for  it 
on  his  books  in  full. 

Senator  Edge.  How  do  you  mean  "  He  accounted  for  it  *'  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  He  accounted  for  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  do  you  mean,    He  accounted  for  it "  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  He  made  entries  in  his  books  showing  what  he  had 
received  in  cash. 

Senator  Edge.  From  these  men  you  have  alread}^  testified  about  i 
Mr.  Scudder.  Precisely. 

Senator  Edge.  Hoav  about  the  disbursement?  Do  I  understand 
the  only  entry  of  disbursement  was  the  repayment  to  those  same  men  ^ 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  only  entry  of  disbursement  was  the  repayment 
to  those-  same  men.  Mr.  Schantz's  account  is  properh^  charged  with 
what  he  received  in  cash;  the  cash  is  an  entry  there;  it  is  journalized, 
"  and  then  it  is  properly  credited  when  he  drew  checks  and  paid  these 
men. 

Senator  Edge.  Paid  Messrs.  Talbott,  Kidder,  and  so  forth? 
Mr.  Scudder.  Precisely. 

Senator  Edge.  There  is  no  other  evidence  of  any  other  disburse- 
ment ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  do  not  knovr.  It  was  not  shown  me.  That  is  all 
I  saw. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is,  you  can  not  testify  of  your  own  knowledge 
of  any  other  use  of  the  fund  except  what  you  have  told  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  No;  but  to  follow  out  Senator  Pomerene's  question, 
te  oni}^  evidence  I  have,  and  the  reason  for  testifying  as  I  do.  is  that 
I  was  told  they  were  for  campaign  expenses. 

Senator  Edge.  We  will  get  that  from  some  one  else.  Now,  just  so 
that  I  will  have  it  entirely  clear  in  my  own  mind— and  I  think  that 
will  about  complete  what  I  want  to  get  from*  you  now — after  follow- 
ing the  course  of  these  payments  from  the  time  that  you  have  ex- 
plained to  their  return  to  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  will  you 
make  it  a  little  clearer?  It  may  be  clear  to  others,  but  it  is  not  en- 
tirely clear  to  me,  how  you  are  positive  as  an  accountant  that  this 
money  went  back  to  the  "^Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  from  these  va- 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIG^^  EXPENSES. 


2737 


rious  men  who  got  it  from  Mr.  Sliantz,  and  represented  the  orioinal 
contribution  of  S3T,000. 

Mr.  Sci  DDER.  I  think  I  can  do  that  by  making  a  concise  statement 
I  of  the  payments  and  the  return. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  And  this  sums  up  what  I  have  tried  to  testify  to  in 
.rather  a  bimgling  way. 

I  will  now  account  for  the  payment  to  Mr.  Schantz  of  the  $37,000 : 
October  24.  1916,  $6,000.  from  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  Same 
date,  from  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  $6,000.  Noyember  2, 
1916,  from  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.;  $5,000.  November  6, 
1916,  from  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  $5,000.  October  7,  1916, 
H.  E.  Talbott's  special  check.  $6,000.  Adam  Schantz,  book  entry  to 
himself,  $7,000.  F.  M.  TaiCs  check  to  Adam  Schantz.  $2,000.  Total. 
$37,000. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  is  from  Adam  Schantz's  books  that  you 
[are  speaking  about  ?- 

;  Mr.  ScroDER.  Yes:  from  the  Dayton  ^letal  Products  and  Schantz's 
(books. 

j    Senator  Pomerene.  Both  ? 

[    Mr.  Scudder.  Both.   It  is  all  from  books.   Xoav  this  is  from  Adam 

'Schantz's  books.   This  all  went  to  hifn. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  what  you  are  going  to  tell  us  novr? 
:\Ir.  Scudder.  That  $37,000  all  went  to  ^Slr.  Schantz.  This  is  the 
way  Mr.  Schantz  paid  it  bjick — directly  from  his  books:  April  4. 
19i8',  his  check  to  Walter  Kidder,  $4,226.46.  Same  date,  his  check 
to  Adam  Schantz,  $4,226.46.  That  was  to  himself :  that  Avas  a  check. 
Same  date,  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  $12,679.38.  Same  date,  to  F.  M.  Tait, 
$1,833.70.  And  before  these  dates:  to  Adam  Schantz,  $2,191.50;  to 
Walter  Kidder,  $2,191.50:  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  $6,674.50.  That  is  to 
those  five  men  in  repayment  of  $32,076.50. 

{    Senator  Pomerene.  Each? 

i    Mr.  Scudder.  That  totals  up  the  items  that  I  read  before,  sir. 

j    Senator  Pomerene.  Speaking  of  the  item  of  $32,076-  

Mr.  Scudder.  May  I  just  give  the  total?  Total,  $37,200:  and  for  a 
mistake,  Ozias,  $200  off. 

Xow,  we  have  accounted  for  the  $37,000  going  out  and  the  $37,000 
coming  back,  because  the  list  I  have  read  is  $37,000  going  back  to  him 
and  the  first  I  read  was  $37,000  going  out. 

'    Senator  Edge.  And  in  betAveen — I  believe  your  testimony  is  clear 

without  repeating  it — is  the  payment  from  

.    Mr.  Scudder.  I  am  coming  to  that  again  to  make  that  clear. 

Senator  Edge.  I  would  like  to  haA'e  that  all  together. 
I    Mr.  Scudder.  Now,  as  to  the  way  that  Mr.  Schantz  got  tlie  $37,000 

back,  he  did  not  take  it  from  his  cash  in  the  vaults,  because  that  had 
'  been  spent  to  the  extent  of  $26,242.50,  but  he  did  not  have  $10,947.50 

there,  which  he  disbursed  in  checks  back  to  these  people  in  the  three 

checks  I  have  given  among  the  $37,000  paid  back  namely,  the  $2,191.50 
,  and  $2,191.50  

f   Senator  Edge.  To  whom  in  each  case? 

i;  Mr.  Scudder.  To  Adam  Schantz,  $2,191.50,  Walter  Kidder 
.  $2,191.50,  and  H.  E.  Talbott  $6,574.50. 

.  NoAv,  the  first  four  items  I  read  among  the  disbursements  were 
('actual  checks,  totaling  $26,242.50,  which  he  got  from  five  men,  who 


2738 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


in  turn  got  those  amounts  of  $26,2412.50  from  the  Dayton  flood  [)re- 
A^ention  committee's  orders;  the  $3,276.50  bahmce  being  items  that 
Mr.  Schantz  had  to  pay  back  to  these  men,  he  said,  for  income  tax 
purposes.   Have  I  made  it  clear? 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  it  is  quite  clear. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  am  trying  to  make  it  as  clear  as  I  can. 

Senator  Edop:.  Could  you  giA^e  us  any  further  explanaion  as  to  the 
items  in  the  Dayton  Metal  Co.'s  books  shoAving  the  return?  Do  you 
think  you  haA^e  giA^en  that  completely? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  have,  but  I  Avill  giA^e  it  again. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  trying  to  establish  as  definitely  as  possible, 
and  to  establish,  if  true,  that  this  money  actually  Avas  paid  back  to 
the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  and,  of  course,  your  explanation  of 
the  entries  is  the  information  Ave  are  after. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  As  far  as  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  is  con- 
cerned, A^ou  Avill  find  aboA^e  in  the  checks  paid  back  by  Adam  Schantz 
tAvo  items  to  Mr.  Talbott  of  $12,679.38  and  an  item  of  $6,574.50,  and 
they  are  both  entered  in  H.  E.  Talbott's  special  account  of  the  Davton 
Metal  Products  Co.  on  May  3,  1918,  as  a  credit. 

Senator  Edge.  As  a  credit :  yes.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Mr.  Scudder.  There  is  a  charge  against  that  of  $19,253.88,  AA^hich 
Avent  into  profit  and  loss. 

Senator  Edgp:.  That  Avas  charged  to  profit  and  loss? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  So  that  in  no  Avay  is  there  a  charge  against  Mr. 
Talbott  personally? 

Mr.  Scudder.  In  no  Avay  a  charge  against  Mr.  Talbott  personally 
nor  Mr.  Deeds  nor  Mr.  Kettering. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Scudder,  3^ou  haA^e  testified  that  you  found 
Gov.  Cox's  $5,000  note  among  the  papers  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Prod- 
ucts Co.,  canceled,  Avith  the  company's  check  attached  thereto.  -Do 
you  remember  the  date  of  that  note  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  As  I  recall  it,  it  Avas  August  6,  1917.  -  Shall  I  look! 
it  up  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Yes;  you  may  look  it  up.  Has  anyone  else 
got  that  note  here  ? 

Mr.  Clarence  Sherer.  Yes,  sir.  [Handing  papers  to  Senator 
Pomerene.] 

Senator  PoivrERENE.  Let  me  haAe  that  note  for  the  purpose  of  this 
inquiry. 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  Avould  haAe  to  look  through  all  these  papers, 
Senator. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Perhaps  Ave  can  expedite  matters  if  Ave  have 
that  note  and  the  check.  [Handing  a  paper  to  the  official  reporter.  | 
Mark  this  for  identification,  "Marvin  Scudder,  Exhibit  1.'^  I  also 
hand  the  reporter  the  check  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  pay- 
able to  the  order  of  the  City  National  Bank,  for  $5,075,  to  be  marked 
for  identification    Scudder  Exhibit  2."  ^ 

NoAV,  this  note,  Exihibit  1,  seems  to  bear  the  date  August  16,  191  <. 
That  is  the  note  about  Avhich  you  haA^e  been  testifying? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  although  I  do  not  remember  its  being  torn  at 
the  time.    But  that  is  the  note:  yes. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2739 


Senator  Pomerene.  No  matter;  that  is  the  note.  And  Exhibit  2 
iis  the  check  which  you  have  testified  you  found  attached  to  this  note  ? 
'  .  Mr.  ScuDDER.  That  is  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  see  that  this  note  bears  on  the  back  thereof 
this  indorsement :  ''Interest  paid  to  Oct.  1,  1917,  $37.50.  Paid." 
Also  the  indorsement:  "Interest  paid  to  Jan.  1,  '18."    I  guess  that 
jis    Cr.  Dec.  31,  '17 ;  $76  and  some  cents."    It  is  torn  off. 
'   Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

^    Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  the  $5,075  represented  the  principal  of 
the  note,  together  with  the  accrued  interest  thereon? 
Mr.  Scudder.  I  assume  so;  yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Or  unpaid  interest  thereon? 
^Ir.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  no  knowledge  as  to  what  was  done 
with  the  proceeds  of  this  note? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Nothing  except  what  was  told  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  will  get  that  later  on,  perhaps.    And  you 
have  no  knowledge  of  the  reason  why  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 
,iissued  their  check  in  payment  of  this  note  ? 
?   Mr.  Scudder.  No,  sir. 

'j  Senator  Pomerene.  When  you  were  making  this  investigation  did 
'.you  call  upon  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott  to  make  any  explanation  concerning 
;iit,  as  to  Avhat  was  tlie  purpose  of  the  original  transaction? 
-  Mr.  Scudder.  I  remember  talking  with  Mr.  Talbott  about  it.  My 
impression  is  I  asked — I  have  forgotten  his  name,  but  the  treasurer 
or  assistant  treasurer  of  the  company.  He  is  under  Mr.  Clarence 
Sherer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  call  Mr.  Talbott  before  you? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  I  spoke  to  Mr.  Talbott  about  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  he  explain  the  reason  for  the  giving  of  the 
,;note  and  the  reason  for  the  method  of  its  payment? 
[(  'Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  yes. 

I  Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  reason  why  the  Metal  Products  Co. 
'paid  it? 

I    Mr.  Scudder.  Absolutely. 

I    Senator  PoisrERENE.  Did  you  call  Mr.  Kettering  before  you  ? 

1    Mr.  Scudder.  No;  I  do  not  know  Mr.  Kettering  at  all. 

r    Senator  Pomerene.  Did  he  make  any  explanation  about  it  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  I  know  him,  but  very  slightly. 
1,   Senator  Po^eerene.  Did  you  have  Mr.  Kidder  before  you  with 
regard  to  this  ? 

.  Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  I  did  not  speak  to  Mr.  Kidder  about  it;  no,  sir. 
'    Senator  Pomerene.  Or  Mr.  Schantz? 

I'  Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  no :  I  did  not  speak  to  Mr.  Schantz  about  it. 
J   Senator  Pomerene.  Or  Mr.  Deeds  ? 

[  Mr.  Scudder.  I  did  not  speak  to  Mr.  Deeds  about  it ;  no,  sir. 

:    Senator  Pomerene.  This  note  was  given  in  August,  1917.   Do  you 

moAv  whether  there  was  any  campaign  on  here  in  the  city  of  Dayton 

it  that  time  ? 

'   Mr.  Scudder.  Only  what  I  was  told. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  There  was  not  any  campaign  for  governor  on 
it  that  time  was  there? 


182774— 20— i-r  21— — 3 


2740 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScuDDER.  Well,  I  do  not  know  whether  there  was  or  not;  I 
tliink  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  gubernatorial  elections  occur  in  the  even 
years— 1916  and  1918. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  do  not  know  the  laws  here,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  was  a  local  campaign  on  here  

Mr.  ScuDDER.  So  I  was  told. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Relating  to  the  municipal  affairs  of  the  city 
of  Dayton.  Now,  you  know,  do  you  not,  that  there  was  a  good  deal 
of  a  contest  here  between  the  Socialists  on  the  one  hand  and  the 
Republicans  and  Democrats  on  the  other  with  respect  to  the  election 
of  commissioners? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  did  not  know  that ;  no,  sir.  I  do  not  know  much 
about  the  politics  here. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course  you  would  not  want  to  have  it 
inferred  from  your  testimony  that  this  note  related  to  expenditures 
for  the  campaign  of  1918,  which  was  subsequent  to  the  year  1917, 
when  the  note  was  given  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  no ;  absolutely  not ;  absolutely  not,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  do  not  mean  to  even  suggest  that 
either  the  note  or  the  check  has  any  connection  with  the  present 
senatorial  or  presidential  campaign? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  so  far  as  the  records  sliow  or  the  books 
show  they  indicate  that  a  note  for  $5,000  was  given  by  James  M.  Cox 
to  the  City  National  Bank  on  August  16,  1917 ;  that  the  interest  was 
paid  on  October  1,  1917,  and  again  January  1,  1918 ;  and  that  the  note 
was  finally  redeemed  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  on  June 
29,1918? 

Mr.  Scldder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  as  far  as  the  record  shows  anything  on 
this  subject,  is  it  not?  • 
Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir;  absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  let  me  go  to  another  matter,  prelimi- 
narily  

Senator  Edge.  Before  you  go  to  the  $37,000,  Senator  Pomerene. 
would  you  mind  my  asking  a  question  on  this  check  and  note  ? 
Senator  Pomerene.  All  right;  go  ahead. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene  asked  you  questions  as  to  whether 
you  know  about  the  local  election  in  1917,  so  I  will  follow  that  up  foi 
just  a  moment.  He  also  asked  you  whether  you  had  asked  Mr.  Tal- 
bott  to  assijzn  any  reason  for  paying  this  note.  I  understood  you  tc 
say  you  had  talked  to  Mr.  Talbott.   Did  he  assign  any  reason? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  reason? 

Mr.  Scudder.  He  said  it  was  for  campaign  expenses. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene  has  suggested  

Senator  Pomerene,  I  am  not  going  to  object.  Did  he  say  whai 
campaign  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  no.    I  would  not  know  about  that.    I  supposf 

for  the  legislature  or  something  of  the  kind. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  let  us  see,  Mr.  Scudder.  You  do  no 
mean  to  suo-gest  that  this  was  for  the  legislature,  when  there  was  no 
any  election  for  members  of  the  legislature  in  1917? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2741 

Senator  Edge.  Tell  us  what  Mr.  Talbott  said? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  do  not  remember  him  sayinp-  anvthin^r  >^hnui  ifc 

Senator  Edge.  My  only  reason  for  asking  the  question,  Senator, 
was  that  jou  had  led  up  to  the  point  of  asking  if  lie  had  made  in- 
quiry about  the  note,  but  did  not  ask  the  question  as  to  whether  he 
had  received  an  answer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No;  I  thought  you  were  going  to  call  these 
oth^er  men.   I  will  withhold  any  objections  I  might  make  to  the  ques- 

Senator  Edge.  When  you  asked  Mr.  Talbott-if  I  may  repeat  the 
question— as  to  what  reason  he  assigned  for  the  Metal  Products  Co 
paying  the  note,  what  was  his  reply? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  did  not  put  the  question  to  him  in  that  way. 
-  benator  Edge.  What  did  you  ask  him? 

^^Tt^'^'^t^  ^  ^'"^  anything  to  do  with  the  air- 

craft and  Mr  Deeds  appointment,  and  he  said  absolutely  not,  that  it 
was  entirely  for  the  campaign,  and  my  impression  is  that  he  said  it 
had  something  to  do  with  the  legislature. 
Senator  Edge.  That  you  are  not  sure  of « 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Well,  I  am  pretty  sure  that  he  mentioned  the  legis- 
y  lature  m  connection  with  passing  some  bill,  in  connection  with  It 
IS  rather  hard  for  me  to  recollect  exactly  what  that  conversation 
was,  but  I  am  almost  sure  he  referred  to  it  in  that  way 

with^it^'L^fTV^f''^'^'''  Pomerene  asked  you  if  you  were  familiar 

with  the  tact  that  it  was  a  local  election  goino-  on« 
n    Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  would  not  know  about  that. 

Senator  Edge.  A  local  election  going  on  in  the  fall  of  1917  Do 

the^'datef  ^^'^  ''""^^        actually  paid-what  was 

1,    Mr.  ScuDDER.  June  29,  1918. 

L    Senator  Edge.  That  then  the  gubernatorial  election  was  on?  Are 
n  you  familiar  with  that  ? 

,^    Mr  ScuDDER.  Well,  only  in  the  way  that  Senator  Pomerene  has 
sai^d,  that  It  was  every  two  years.    It  must  have  been,  if  it  was  in 

j.    Senator  Edge.  In  your  discussion  here  with  Mr.  Schantz,  or  Mr 
)^  lalbott,  or  others  were  you  informed  that  it  was  a  part  of  the  Ohio 
.  primary  law  that  a  candidate  for  governor  must  file  his  petition  60 
clays  before  the  second  Tuesday  in  August « 

'        ;i  ^l^'iT''''^  T^''  ^'^^^^^^^      that  that  I  remember 

was  that  Mr.  Schantz  said  it  was  necessary  to  file  in  this  State  a 
i  statement  of  all  expenditures  for  any  political  purpose. 
;     fenator  Edge.  No;  I  was  not  referring  to  that.    Well,  you  are 
^inot  familiar  with  the  fact?  ,  j  ciie 

|i  Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  am  not  familiar  with  the  law ;  I  am  not  a  lawyer 
!  Senator  Edge.  That  to  be  a  candidate  for  governor  it  would  be 
1  'necessary  to  file  a  petition  before  June  29,  1918  ? 

^    Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  did  not  know  that ;  no,  sir.  All  I  am  doing  is  to  o-ive 
^,you  what  I  do  know.  ^ 
.    Senator  Pomerene.  Since  we  have  had  this  discussion,  ere  you 
•quit-  s^ure  he  said  this  note  was  given  for  the  purpose  of  raisino- 
|,ltunds  for  a  legislative  campaign? 


2742  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  still  say  I  think  that  is  what  he  said,  but  I  may  be 
mistaken.  I  know  it  had  to  do  with  some  campaign. 

Senator  Pomekene.  Are  you  quite  as  sure  of  that  tact  as  you  are 
of  the  other  statements  youliave  been  making?       ^  . 

Mr  ScuDDEK.  I  am  not  as  sure  of  that,  as  to  whether  it  was  tor 
the  legislature  or  campaign,  as  I  am  in  regard  to  the  other  statements 

I  have  been  making.  -c    4.  4-1,  + 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  not  recall  you  did  learn  the  tact  that 
in  1917  they  had  a  very  bitter  campaign  here  with  respect  to  the 
election  of  commissioners?  .  ,   .  t 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Keally,  I  am  not  confident  of  that.  I  do  not  remem- 
ber distinctly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  the  contest  at  that  time  was  rather 
between  the  Socialists  candidates  on  the  one  hand  

Mr  Scudder.  I  do  not  remember  that;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  Republican  and  Democratic  candi- 
dates on  the  other  hand?  ^  ^  n    -j.  t  i  ;i 

Mr.  Scudder.  No,  sir.  I  would  tell  you  truthfully  if  I  remembered 
it,  but  I  do  not  remember  that  distinctly.  .       ^  ivr  , 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  learned  also,  did  you  not,  that  Mr.  lal- 
bott  and  Mr.  Kittering  and  Mr.  Deeds  and  Mr.  Kidder  were  Repub- 
licans ?  ,  T    1  • 

Mr.  Scudder.  Oh,  yes ;  I  was  told  that.    1  es,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  Mr.  Schantz  was  a  Democrat  i 

Mr.  Scudder.  Mr.  Schantz,  yes;  and  I  think  Mr.  Kidder  was  a 

Democrat,  they  said.  t.-     •  • 

Senator  Edge.  They  have  a  right  to  change  their  politics  m  Ohio. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  yes;  they  perhaps  do       ^  , 
Mr.  Scudder.  But  I  remember  distinctly  that  Mr.  Talbott  and  Mr. 

Deeds  were  Republicans.  .       .  . 

(Thereupon,  at  1.10  o'clock  p  m.,  the  subcommittee  took  a  recess 

until  2.30  p  m.  same  day.) 

after  recess. 
TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  MAUVYN  SCUDDER— Resumed. 

PcnaU^r  Pomerene.  Now,  Mr.  Scudder,  just  another  question  or 
two  with  reference  to  this  $5,000  note.    You  never  talked  with  Crov. 

Cox  about  that  ?  n  ^ 

Mr  SruDDER.  I  never  saw  him,  no:  I  have  never  seen  (roy.  Cox. 

Senator  Pomerene.  All  vou  know  about  it  is  that  you  have  seen 
the  entries  on  the  books  of  the  bank  and  the  book  entries  m  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.'s  books  and  the  little  talk  that  you  had 
with  Mr.  Talbott  about  the  purposes  of  it    That  is  about  it 

Mr  Scudder.  The  talk  I  had  with  Mr.  Talbott  and  the  talk  I  had 
with  ivir.  Kiefer  and  Mr.  Davidson  at  the  bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  let  us  go  to  the  next  proposition  here. 
You  speak  of  $42,000.   I  am  not  going  into  the^  details  of  the  smalle 
ficrures  that  vou  found  were  turned  over  to  Mr.  Schantz,  ^  Pf  ^ 
td^^cT^i  ^pall  himself  and  the  balance  of  which  was  contributed 
by  these  other  men  whom  you  have  named,  and  this  was  apparently 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2748 


U  used  in  some  campaign  of  1918,  and  that  afterwards  it  was  refunded 

^  out  of  moneys  which  were  

.  Mr.  ScuDDER.  1916,  I  think. 
Senator  Pomekene,  Yes:  I  thank  you  very. much  for  the  correc- 
1  tion — 1916,  which  were  paid  out  of  the  Dayton  flood  prevention  com- 
mittee.   Mr.  Schantz  did  not  hesitate  about  showing  you  his  books, 
|  .  did  he? 

j  Mr.  ScuDDER.  Oh.  no,  no:  he  just  shoAved  them.  He  hesitated, 
'  may  be,  at  first  

Senator  Po?,ierene..  Well,  I  know  

Mr.  ScuDDER.  But  he  showed  me  everything, 
j     Senator  Pomerene.  And  he  was  perfectly  frank  about  his  whole 
statement  ? 

j  Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes:  he  opened  it  all  up  to  me,  and  before  I  got 
^  through  I  had  the  whole  thing. 

[     Senator  Po.aierexe.  And  these  other  gentlemen  opened  up  the 
matter  and  told  you  about  the  situation,  did  they  ? 
Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  There  was  not  any  attempt  to  conceal  it  after 
ij  they  found  that  you  wanted  to  get  it,  was  there? 
I     Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  do  not  know  of  any. 

,1  Senator  Po^ierexe.  Except  that  the  only  hesitation  they  had 
j  ^as  

I     Mr.  ScuDDER.  In  having  it  made  public  :  that  is  all. 
I     Senator  Pomerexe.  In  having  it  made  public.    And  Judge  13.  F. 
I  McCann  represented  Mr.  Schantz  and  these  other  gentlemen  at  the 
'  time,  did  he? 

^Ir.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir. 
L.,     Senator  Pomerexe.  I  think  they  sort  of  exacted  a  promise  from 
I  you  that  you  would  make  no  disclosures  except  as  these  various  items 
j]  might  affect  the  War  Department  or  the  airplane  manufacture? 
j      Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir.    They  asked  me,  and  I  told  them  I  would 
1  have  to  report  to  Judge  Hughes,  but  that  I  would  see  to  it  that  the 
word  was  deliAered  to  him  that  it  was  important  from  their  stand- 
point that  it  should  not  be  made  public. 
,      Senator  Pomerexe.  Your  jurisdiction  was  to  look  into  matters 
li  which  related  to  the  War  Department  and  the  airplane  business  as 
'  connected  with  the  War  Department  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  understood  that;  yes. 
|!     Senator  Pomerexe.  And  as  a  public  accountant  you  realized  fidly 
M  that  you  might  get  into  some  of  their  own  affairs  which  did  not  per- 
\  tain  to  you,  and  which  they  might  have  a  delicacy  about  making 
f>j  public  ?  " 
|fi|     Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir :  I  tried  to  be  very  careful. 
h     Senator  Pomerexe.  And  so  you  learned,  did  you  not,  during  the 
w  time  that  you  were  here,  of  the  great  flood  of  1913  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir;  I  was  told  about  that. 

Sonator  Po:\rEREXE.  And  you.  I  take  it,  got  some  idea  of  the  devas- 
,  tating  Avork  of  that  flood  throughout  this  city  and  all  through  this 
•  Miami  Valley? 

Mr.  ScT  DUER.  Xearly  everyone  talked  to  me  about  it. 
V     Senator  Pomerexe.' The  fact  of  the  matter  was  that  that  was  a 
subject  that  was  uppermost  in  the  minds  of  most  of  the  people? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  It  seemed  to  be. 


2744 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


^Senator  Pomekene.  It  was  a  matter  of  great  loss  to  this  section 
of  the  State,  amounting  perhaps  to  hundreds  of  millions  of  dollars. 

Mr.  ScT  DDEK.  I  don't  know  what  the  figure  was,  but  it  evidently 
was  a  very  great  catastrophe. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  learned  also,  did  you  not,  that  very 
early  after  this  flood  these  good  citizens  down  here  began  to  counsel 
together  with  a  view  of  reestablishing  themselves  and  reestablishing 
this  community? 

Mr.  Scudder.  les. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  they  contemplated  at  that  time  some 
conservancy  legislation,  in  order  to  provide  against  a  repetition  of 
this  flood  destruction? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  learned  all  of  that? 
Mr.  Sci^ER.  I  did ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  PoisrERENE.  And  you  found  also,  did  you  not,  that  men  like 
Schantz  and  Talbott  and  Deeds,  Kettering  and  Kidder  and  Tait  and 
Col.  Patterson  and  other  gentlemen  here  were  most  active  in  helping 
along  that  work  ? 

Mr.  Sci  DDER.  Well,  I  don't  know  just  about  Kettering  and  Col. 
Patterson,  but  I  do  know  that  Mr.  Schantz  did  a  great  deal  of  work 
in  that  connection,  and  Mr.  Talbott. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  one  of  the  first  things  they  did  was 
to  raise  a  large  sum  here,  amounting,, perhaps,  to  a  couple  of  millions 
of  dollars,  as  a  preliminary  step  to  the  final  development  of  a  con- 
servancy system  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  think  th^y  did  that  to  relieve  the  sufferers  and 
tried  to  help  them  along. 

Senator  Pomerene.  During  the  campaign  of  1916,  you  knew,  did 
you  not,  that  there  was  a  good  deal  of  a  contest  on  here  between  those 
people  who  had  been  the  sufferers  in  this  flood  and  other  people  who 
perhaps  had  not  been  victims  of  the  flood,  and  that  to  some  extent 
entered  into  the  campaign  of  1916?    You  knew  that,  did  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Well,  I  didn't  think  that  entered  into  the  campaign 
in  1916. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  if  you  do  not  know  about  it,  we  will 
perhaps  call  out  that  fact  later  on.  Now,  whatever  funds  were 
raised  in  connection  with  this  campaign,  you  found  that  they  passed 
through  Mr.  Schantz's  hands,  did  you  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  1916  campaign? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Sci^DDER.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  speak  of  some  money  taken  from  the 
flood-prevention  fund  and  that  was  turned  back  to  this  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  these  men,  Talbott  and  Kettering,  and 
some  one  else  here  were  interested  in  both  the  conservancy  proposi- 
tion, and  they  were  also  interested  in  the  business  of  the  Davton 
Metal  Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  think  that  is  true,  with  the  exception  of  Kettering. 
I  don't  think  that  Kettering,  to  my  recollection,  was  an  inventor. 
I  think  he  attended  to  the  business  of  the  company. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  Well,  you  named  three  of  these  gentlemen. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2745 


Mr.  ScuDDER.  Col.  Deeds  was  active  and  Col.  Talbott  in  the  con- 
servancy. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  who  was  the  third  ? 
Mr.  SouDDER.  You  spoke  of  Mr.  Kettering. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  yes. 

Mr.  vScuDDER.  He  was  the  third.  I  don't  think  he  had  much  to  do 
with  it.    I  may  have  been  wrong. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Xow,  the  testimony  you  have  given  here  with 
regard  to  the  amount  which  was  raised  and  the  disposition  of  that 
money  and  the  repayment  to  this  fund  you  have  taken  from  the  books 
of  the  company,  have  you  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes,  sir:  absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  do  not  mean  to  suggest  that  any 
part  of  that  fund — I  used  the  figures  a  moment  ago,  $37,000,  but  you 
spoke  of  the  total  amounting  to  about  S42,000,  I  ]3elieve — you  do  not 
know  that  any  part  of  that  fund  Avas  used  either  directly  or  indirectly 
in  connection  with  the  present  presidential  campaign  or  the  present 
senatorial  campaign  ? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  have  no  thought  that  it  was. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Xo,  of  course  not ;  and  you  never  talked  with 
Gov.  Cox  about  that  fund,  did  you? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  never  met  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  inquire. 

Senator  Edge.  There  are  just  two  or  three  more  questions  I  want 
to  ask  vou  to  make  the  record  clear.  Did  vou  ever  trv  to  see  Gov.» 
Cox? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  In  connection  with  this  $5,000  note? 
Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  What  effort  did  you  make? 

Mr.  ScroDER.  I  asked  where  he  was.  and  the}^  said  he  was  away. 
Senator  Edge.  Did  you  make  any  other  effort  at  a  later  time  when 
you  were  here? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  Yes;  he  was  here  at  no  time  that  I  was  here  that  I 
could  find. 

Senator  Edge.  In  investigating  the  books  or  the  minutes  of  tlie 
flood  prevention  commission,  what  did  you  ascertain  was  the  scope 
of  that  organization,  and  what  was  it  organized  for? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  That  was  the  original  committee  that  collected  from 
the  citizens  of  Dayton  funds  to  relieve  the  sufferers  and  work  toward 
a  preA^ention  of  the  recurrence  of  the  flood,  as  I  understand  it,  just 
after  the  flood  had  occurred. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  they  obtain  their  money  through  voluntary 
I  public  subscription  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Public  subscription,  as  I  understand  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  relation  did  this  disbursement  that  you  testi- 
fied to  this  morning,  authorized  by  the  meeting  held  on  February  3, 
have  with  the  original  subscription  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products 
Co.  further  than  you  have  described  ?  Do  you  know  of  any  further 
relation  through  the  various  

Mr.  Scudder.  No;  other  than  that  it  went  to  these  men  that  we 
spoke  about  and  then  to  Mr.  Schantz  and  then  to  the  Dayton  Metal 
j  Products. 


2476  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Then  did  you  understand  from  your  investigatioi' 
of  the  books  of  Mr.  Schantz"  and  the  books  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prs 
vention  Commission  and  the  books  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Product 
Co.  that  in  reality  the  money  appropriated  by' the  flood  preventiorj 
^  commission  was  eventually  paid  back  to  the  Dayton  Metal  Product^^ 
Co.,  those  orifjinal  subscriptions? 

Mr.  8cudi)i:r.  There  is  no  question  about  that. 

Senator  P^dge.  And  that  money  gathered  by  the  Dayton  Flood 
Prevention  Commission,  or  committee,  was  all  voluntary  subscrip- 
tions from  citizens? 

Mr.  ScuDDEPv.  Yes,  sir ;  as  I  understand  it. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  you  testified  this  morning  that  Mr.   

what  is  the  name  of  the  ])resident  of  the  company? 
Mr.  ScuDDER.  Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  That  Mr.  Talbott  told  you  when  you  inquired  as  to 
the  use  of  this  money  that  it  was  for  campaign  purposes,  did  you  not? 
Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  money  do  you  refer  to  ? 
Senator  Edge.  The  income  from  the  $5,000  note.  What  is  your 
ansAver  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  familiar  Avith  the  fact  that  the  corrupt 
practices  act  of  Ohio  make  it  illegal  for  a  corporation  to  contribute 
for  campaign  purposes? 

0   Senator  Pomerene.  The  Ohio  statute  governs  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that. 

Mr.  Scudder.  Well,  I  do  not  know  about  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  want  to  bring  the  fact  out.  Senator.  AVere  you 
familiar  with  the  investigation  of  the  flood-prevention  finances,  with 
the  fact  that  they  had  a  rather  large  balance  of  over  $100,000  after 
these  disbursements  were  made? 

Mr.  Scudder.  ¥\^ell,  I  did  not  look  at  their  ledger.  I  looked  at  the 
minute  book.    I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  We  will  get  that  from  somebody  else.  That  is  all : 
thank  you,  Mr.  Scudder. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  ADAM  SCHANTZ. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  P^dge. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  your  name  and  business  address  to  the  re- 
porter. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Adam  Schantz,  executor  and  trustee  of  the  Adam 
Schantz  estate. 

Senator  Edge.  Residence,  Dayton  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Oakwood,  Dayton,  Ohio.  I  also  have  other  interests. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that  3^our  interests  are  rather  general. 
Mr.  Schantz,  speaking  of  interests,  what  has  been  your  business  when 
you  were  in  active  business? 

Mr.  Schantz.  As  executor  and  trustee  of  the  estate. 

Senator  Edge.  Wliat  was  the  business  of  the  estate? 

Mr.  Schantz.  General  real  estate. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  they  in  any  other  business  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Oh,  they  had  holdings  in  various  corporations. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2747 


Senator  Edge.  Have  you  ever  been  interested,  or  Avas  tlie  estate  in- 
terested, in  the  breAving  business  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes ;  we  were  at  a  time ;  not  noAv. 

Senat<)r  Edge.  It  is  not  a  particularly  prosperous  business  now  ^ 

Mr.  ScHAXTz,  There  formerly  Avere  six  breAveries  here,  and  now 
there  are  20,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz,  you  seem  to  haA^e  been  the  disbursino- 
agent  of  a  large  fund,  or  a  fund  of  $37,000,  raised  bv  subscriptions 
which  I  assume  that  you  have  heard  mentioned  in  the  evidence  this 
morning  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  This  may  be  a  little  unusual,  but  i  am  trvino-  to 
save  time.  Senator  Pomerene.  Without  my  taking  the  time  to^isk 
the  same  questions  corroborating  the  statement  ^reneraliv  by  Mr. 
Scudder— though  I  will  if  necessary— do  you  agree  Avith  the  statement 
as  made  by  Mr.  Scudder,  so  far  as  it  relates  to  the  pa3^ments  by  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  of  various  sums  to  A^arious*^ officers  of  the 
company,  afterAvards  indorsed  to  you  and  cashed  by  you  ^ 

Mr.  S(  HAXTz.  Pretty  much. 

Senator  P^dge.  You  have  no  specific  correction  to  make  to  that  testi- 
mony ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Xo.  My  memorandums  of  191G,  Avhen  this  disburse- 
ment Avas  made,  were  after  the  distribution  destroyed,  and  I  speak  of 
it  only  in  a  general  Avay. 

Senator  P:d(;e.  I  had  not  reached  that,  but  A^our  memoranda  of  tiie 
distribution  of  this  $37,000,  or  such  part  of  it  as  vou  made  distribution 
of,  are  not  noAv  in  existence? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Those  memorandums  are  not  in  existence,  only  as 
the  records  Avill  shoAv  at  the  office  of  the  secretary  of  state,  Avhere^  the 
reports  Avere  filed  by  the  activities  in  connection  Avith  flood  i^rotec- 
tion  only. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  as  I  understand  it,  this  sum  Avas  expended  by 
you  for  political  purposes? 

Mr.  ScHAXTZ.  Elood-protection  purposes,  T  Avould  put  it;  that  is 
what  Ave  had  in  mind,  and  these  gentlemen  on  this  flood-prevention 
committee  had  nothing  else  in  mind  but  the  protection  of  this  citv  and 
valley. 

Senator  Eikje.  I  am  going  to  permit  you  to  make  any  statement  you 
want  to  make,  but  I  Avould  like  to  get  my  questions  ansAvered  in  se- 
quence, so  far  as  possible.  I  do  not  Avant  to  stop  vou  making  any 
statement  m  the  Avorld  you  Avish  to  make.  You  sav  that  Avas  for 
flood-preA'ention  purposes? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  But  the  expenditure  of  moneys  for  purely  flood-pre- 
vention purposes,  as  I  Avould  infer  your  meaning,  Avould  not  require 
filing  a  statement  at  Columbus,  unless  they  Avere  campaign  expendi- 
tures, Avould  they? 

Mr.  Sc  'HAX'Tz.  It  AA^as  an  expenditure  to  protect  the  law,  and  the 
campaign  entered  into  it. 

Sentaor  Edge.  In  other  words,  you  considered  it  within  the  pur- 
vicAv  of  the  corrupt  practices  act,  or  you  would  not  have  filed  a 
statement  of  these  expenses  at  Columbus,  would  you? 


2748 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScHANTZ.  It  was  considered  best  to  file  the  accounts,  so  these 
various  organizations  did. 

Senator  Edge.  Therefore,  you  as  the  disbursing  agent,  considered 
that  you  were  spending  this  money  for  campaign  purposes  ? 

Mr.  SciiANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Or  you  would  not  have  filed  it  otherwise,  would 
you? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well,  it  was  a  matter  of  protection. 

Senator  Edge.  Yes,  I  see.  Can  you  tell  us,  from  memory,  how 
these  amounts  were  disbursed  as  afterAvards  filed  at  Columbus? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Ma}^  I,  in  n>y  own  way,  relate  to  you  how  this  fund 
was  created? 

Senator  Edge.  How  it  was  created  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes;  and  how  it  was  disbursed. 

Senator  Edge.  As  I  said  before,  Mr.  Schantz,  you  may  tell  us  in 
your  own  way  anything  you  w^ant  to  tell  us,  but  1  would  like  to  get 
my  questions  answered  and  then  perhaps  you  could  tell  us  that  better 
afterwards. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  yes.  Now,  if  you  will  examine  the  records  as 
filed  Avith  the  Secretary  of  State  by  the  Forward  Looking  Associa- 
tion of  Ohio,  the  Workmen's  Compensation  League  and  the  Inde- 
pendent Voters'  League  of  Cuyahoga  County  

Senator  Edge.  All  right.  There  are  three  of  these  societies  that 
you  contributed  money  to  that  you  afterwards  filed  the  expense  ac- 
count at  Columbus  to  cover  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir.  I  did  not  file  them ;  these  various  or- 
ganizations filed  them. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  as  I  understand  it,  you  paid  the  cash  direct 
to  the  organizations? 

Mr.  Schantz.  To  the  various  members  of  the  organizations. 

Senator  Edge.  To  the  various  members  of  the  organizations? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes.  There  Avere  three  different  organizations  and 
there  had  to  be  different  members. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  give  this  mone}^  to  more  than  one  man  rep- 
resenting each  of  the  organizations? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes;  in  several  instances. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  for  instance,  the  Forward  Looking  Associa- 
tion of  Ohio;  you  can  remember,  can  you  not,  to  whom  you  gave  the 
money  as  representing  that  association  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Why,  one  I  remember  as  being  Mr.  Mason,  of 
Hamilton,  Ohio. 

Senator  Edge.  Any  others? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  do  not  know  whether  I  ought  to  mention  the  gen- 
tleman's name.    He  is  not  here  to  defend  himself. 

Senator  Edge.  Well.  I  do  not  think  that  is  necessary. 

Mr.  Schantz.  The  gentleman  died  just  recently. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  there  any  others  that  you  do  remember? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  gave  to  Mr.  Hartley :  I  gave  to  Mr.  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  What  organization  did  Mr 
Hartley  represent? 

Mr.  'Schantz.  The  Independent  Voters'  League,  of  Cuyahoga 
County. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2749 


Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  remember  any  others  that  you  gave  in 
the  Forward  Looking  Association  excepting  Mr.  Mason  and  the  other 
gentleman  you  have  mentioned? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  As  I  said,  the  one  gentleman  has  passed  away. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  there  any  others? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  To  the  Forward  Looking  Association?  I  think 
there  were  several  contributions  made  around  to  friends  who  sub- 
scribed. 

Senator  Edge.  Directly  by  you? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  you  gave  to  several  indi- 
viduals representing  the  Forward  Looking  Association  ? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  But  the  names  you  are  not  positive  of.   Is  that  it  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  am  not  positive  of  the  names  only  this  one  name 
that  I  do  not  care  to  disclose.   The  gentleman  died  only  recently. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  not  asked  you  that.  What  is  the  Forward 
Looking  Association  of  Ohio;  Avhat  is  their  object? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  There  was  a  condition  here  in  1916  when  the  flood - 
prevention  law  was  being  attacked,  and  we  felt  it  our  duty  to  take 
an  interest  to  have  some  one  there  to  guard  that  law.  At  that  time 
Gov.  Cox  was  a  candidae  against  Mr.  Willis.  There  Avere  those  in 
the  northern  part  of  the  State  

Senator  Edge.  Against  Mr.  who? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Willis. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Willis.  In  the  northern  part  of  the  State — Miami, 
Shelby,  Auglaize,  Hardin  County — there  were  those  that  wei-e  oppos- 
ing us.    Fearing  that  if  this  flood-prevention  work  went  on  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  Will  you  allow  me  to  correct 
you?    You  do  not  quite  mean  the  northern  part  of  the  State? 

Mr.  SciiANTz.  North  of  us. 
I    Senator  Pomerene.  The  northern  part  of  the  district? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Of  the  district;  yes.  They  were  opposing  us.  We 
felt  that  inasmuch  as  Gov.  Cox  lived  in  the  city  that  he  would  stand 
by  the  law.  He  had  interests  here ;  he  had  passed  through  this  flood ; 
he  knew  what  it  was;  and  it  was  evident  to  us  that  in  the  northern 
part  of  the  district  an  effort  was  being  made  in  behalf  of  Mr.  Willis. 
So  we  concbided  to  make  an  effort  in  behalf  of  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  this  money  was  contributed,  if  I  understand 
>vou  correctly,  to  the  Forward  Looking  Association  in  the  interest  of 
Gov.  Cox? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  In  the  interest  of  flood  protection  in  that  manner. 
Senator  Edge.  You  have  just  stated,  I  think,  and  your  own  ex- 

/planation  is  that  you  were  backing  Gov.  Cox's  campaign  against  Mr. 
Willis.    I  think  I  could  properly  take  that  inference. 

•  Mr.  SciiANTz.  I  suppose  that  is  the  construction  that  you  miglit 
put  on  it;  yes,  sir.  But  what  we  had  uppermost  in  mind  was  this: 
Mind  you,  this  flood  prevention  committee  was  composed  of  Re- 
publicans and  Democrjits  alike;  that  made  no  difference.    What  we 

.had  uppermost  in  mind  Avas  flood  protection,  to  preserve  the  law. 

I    Senator  Pomerene.  In  other  words,  as  I  understand  you,  you  were 

;  interested  in  the  campaign  for  the  benefit  of  flood  protection  and  of 

j^property  here  as  against  those  who  were  fighting,  and  it  Avas  in  no 

i  ■ 


2750 


PRESIDENTIAL  (^AMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


sense  a  political  proposition  in  the  ordinary  acceptation  of  that 
term  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  That  was  the  thought  entirely. 

Senator  Ed(je.  Had  you  any  reason  to  believe  that  Goa^  Willis,  if 
he  had  been  elected,  would  have  opposed  the  protection  of  the  lives 
and  property  of  your  city? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Gov.  Willis,  had  he  lived  in  Dayton,  might  have 
taken  the  same  interest,  but  we  doubt  very  much  if  he  would  have 
been  interested  in  it. 

Senator  Edge.  I  asked  you  the  question  a  few  moments  ago  what 
the  objects  of  the  Forward  Looking  Association  might  be  as  an  as- 
sociation beyond  the  fact  that  they  were  interested  in  the  election  of 
Gov.  Cox  and  your  protection?  What  is  the  association?  What 
was  it  formed  of? 

Mr.  SciiANTz.  I  don't  know  anything  about  that.  I  don't  know.  I 
did  not  form  the  association. 

Senator  Edge.  If  you  did  not  know  anything  about  the  asso:-ia- 
tion  

Mr.  ScHANTz  (interrupting).  I  did  not  form  the  association. 

Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  ask  you  that,  Mr.  Schantz.  If  you  did  not 
know  anything  about  the  association,  do  you  not  think  it  was  rather 
unusual  to  give  them  sums  aggregating  $12,000,  unless  you  knew  what 
the  association  or  its  representatives  would  do  with  the  money  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes ;  it  was  to  assist  us  when  the  time  came  to  pro- 
tect the  law — the  flood-prevention  law. 

Senator  Edge.  AVhat  influence  particularly  could  tiiis  association 
have  in  protecting  that  law? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Why,  I  suppose,  perhaps,  in  the  working  out  of  it 
Gov.  Cox  would  have  obtained  the  benefit  of  it,  and  we  relied  upon 
him. 

Senator  Edge.  You  relied  upon  him,  but  we  are  now  dealing  with 
the  Forward  Looking  Association  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  To  whom  you  gave  a  large  sum  of  money? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Surely  3^ou  know  what  the  Forward  Looking  Asso- 
ciation meant  politically.   What  did  it  mean  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  You  can  tell  by  looking  at  the  report  at  Columbus, 
filed  with  the  secretary  of  state,  just  what  it  Avas  for.  I  have  asked 
Mr.  Scudder  to  go  to  Columbus  and  get  this  report  from  the  secretary 
of  state,  but  it  seems  he  was  not  gracious  enough  to  do  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Mr.  Schantz,  I  have  here  wdiat  purports  to  be 
a  certified  copy  of  the  statement  of  the  Forward  Looking  Association, 
of  Ohio,  filed  w^ith  the  secretary  of  state.  I  will,  in  as  much  as  it  re- 
lates directly  to  the  statement  that  this  money  w^as  spent  in  the  inter- 
est of  the  election  of  Mr.  Cox,  offer  it  as  an  exhibit.  [The  document 
referred  to  is  filed  with  the  committee  as  "  Schantz  Exhibit  No.  1."] 
A^arious  amounts  appear  upon  this  statement  under  the  head  of 
statement  of  receipts,"  and  following  that  the  names  of  numerous 
men,  which  mean  nothing  to  me  beyond  the  names  and  the  amounts. 
I  will  read  some  of  them. 

George  Ozias,  Davton,  Ohio,  $750 ;  E.  E.  Burkhart,  Dayton,  Ohio, 
$250;  M.  J.  Schwab,  Davton,  Ohio,  $500;  George  F.  Burba,  Dayton, 
Ohio,  $100;  E.  Musselman,  Dayton,  Ohio,  $250;  C.  M.  Grosser,  Day- 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2751 


ton,  Ohio,  $200 ;  B.  Shaman,  Dayton,  Ohio,  $250,  and  so  on,  a  lar<ie 
number  of  names,  with  the  amounts  ranging  from  those  sums  I  have 
mentioned  to  as  hiirh  as  one  thousand;  and  I  see  your  name,  Adam 
Schantz,  Dayton,  t)hio,  $1,000,  making  a  total  of  $12,G00.  That 
seems  to  be  an  itemized  statement  of  the  ForAvard  Looking  Associa- 
tion filed  with  the  secretary  of  state.  Is  that,  as  far  as  you  know, 
a  correct  statement?  [Handing  paper  to  witness.] 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  As  far  as  I  know,  it  is. 

Senator  Edoe.  You  have  made  contributions  in  one  lump  sum  or 
seA'eral  payments — jow  have  not  cleai^ed  that  up  entirely — to  the 
Forward  Looking  Association  amounting  to  the  sum  of  $12,600,  and 
presumably  that  is  Avhat  they  disbursed  them  for,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  Avould  imagine  so.    I  do  not  knoAv. 

Senator  Po^iekene.  Have  you  any  knoAvledge  of  AA'hat  these  dis- 
bursements AA^ere — any  personal  knoAvledge  of  it  ? 

Mr.  Sciiaxtz.  No;  I  have  no  personal  knoAvledge. 

Senator  Edge.  LIoav  about  the  $1,000  paid  to  you  personally  ?  Is 
that  correct  ? 

Senator  Pomerexe.  These  are  receipts.  There  are  not  disburs^^- 
ments. 

Senator  Edge.  Tliat  is  true.  I  Avill  AA-ithdraw  that  question.  They 
are  receipts. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  The  disbursements  are  on  the  other  side. 

Senator  I^dge.  T  had  tliis  thing  rather  confused.  You  testified  a 
feAA'  moments  ago  that  you  gaA^e  to  the  Forward  Looking  Association 
$12,600,  and.  for  the  moment  assuming  your  statement  to  be  the  dis- 
position of  it,  I  assumed  that  these  amounts  that  I  read  Avere  the  dis- 
bursements, but  as  a  matter  of  fact,  as  Senator  Pomerene  has  pointed 
out  to  me,  these  items  form  a  statement  of  receipts. 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  AVell,  then,  Avhere  is  the  $12,600  that  you  paid? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  The  $12,600  that  I  paid  Avas  paid  to  representatives 
of  the  organization.    I  knoAA'  nothing  about  those  peoi)le. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  Avere  they?    That  becomes  very  important. 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  told  you  Mr.  Mason  Avas  one  of  them,  and  I  dis- 
tributed to  this  gentleman  that  has  passed  away  just  recently,  and 
others,  and  they  made  the  distribution  to  these  various  persons,  as 
I  understand,  Avith  the  understanding  that  they  subscribe  to  this 
fund. 

Senator  Edge.  Am  I  to  understand  from  you  that  you  assumed 
that  Avhen  you  gave  the  $12,600  to  these  two  or  three  gentlemicn  that 
they  afterwards  distributed  it  among  these  other  gentlemen  and 

'  that  they  paid  it  back  to  the  society,  and  thus  it  appears  on  the 

'  record  here  ? 

'     Mr.  ScHAXTz.  That  is  the  Avay  I  think  it  Avas  done. 

'  Senator  Edge.  Well,  of  course,  Mr.  Schantz,  that  is  hardly  pos- 
sible, is  it?    I  want  to  leave  your  ansAvers  entirely  to  yourself. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  submit,  Senator  Edge,  with  all  due  respect, 
it  does  not  appear  that  Mr.  Schantz  prepared  this  report  or  is  in 

*  anvAvise  responsible  for  the  way  in  Avhich  it  appears.    At  least,  it 

!  SO  seems  to  me  under  the  facts  as  disclosed  here. 

f  Senator  Edge.  Can  you  pick  out  from  this  report  any  record  at 
all  of  the  contributions  that  you  made  representing  this  $37,000 
fund  ?    [Handing  paper  to  Avitness. ] 


2752 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  subscribed  $1,000  myself. 

Senator  Edge.  In  addition  to  the  $12,600  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTS.  No :  that  Avas  a  part  of  the  $12,600. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  that  accounts  for  all  but  $11,600? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  This  money  was  turned  over  to  these  representatives 
and  how  they  distributed  it  I  do  not  knoAv,  or  how  they  came  to  make 
this  report.   That  was  up  to  them. 

Senator  Edge.  You  will  agree  with  me  that  the  report,  in  view  of 
your  method  of  handling  it,  is  quite  confusing,  is  it  not? 
'    Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  turned  that  money  over,  and  it  was  distributed, 
I  believe,  to  people  with  the  understanding  that  if  they  would  sub- 
scribe to  this  proposition  they  could  have  this  money. 

Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  but  Mr.  Schantz,  you  do  not  seem  to  recognize 
that  they  have  paid  it  in. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes;  and  I  have  paid  it  to  these  people  that  repre- 
sented the  associations. 

Senator  Edge.  The  statement  does  not  show  that ;  but  Ave  Avill  pass 
on.  Then  you  can  not  gi\^e  me  any  further  information  as  to  just 
Avhat  the  ForAvard  Looking  Association  represents? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Nothing  only  Avhat  might  be  on  file  Avith  the  sec- 
retary of  state. 

Senator  Edge.  I  haA^e  already  shoAvn  you  Avhat  is  on  file  there.  That 
does  not  giA-e  us  any  information  as  to  the  activities  of  the  association. 
Mr.  Schantz.  That  is  all  I  knoAv. 

Senator  Edge.  You  Avere  not  familiar,  as  a  citizen  of  Dayton,  with 
Avhat  activities  the  ForAvard  Looking  Association  had  been  en- 
gaged in? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Only  that  they  Avere  Avorking  in  the  interest  of  flood 
protection,  and  they  belicA^ed  that  in  supporting  Gov.  Cox  they  Avould 
haA^e  some  one  that  Avould  guard  the  hiAv. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  are  the  headquarters  of  the  ForAvard  Looking 
Association  of  Ohio? 

Mr.  Schantz.  It  was  a  temporary  organization  for  that  campaign. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  is  Hamilton,  Ohio  ?   I  confess  my  ignorance. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Right  over  here  in  Butler  County.  It  is  in  this 
same  congressional  district.  Montgomery,  Butler,  and  Preble  Coun- 
ties are  the  three  counties  in  this  district. 

Senator  Edge.  It  appears  from  these  same  records  that  you  gave  to 
the  Workmen's  Compensation  League  a  sum  totaling  $10,400.  Is  that 
correct  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes ;  something  like  that. 
Senator  Edge.  What  Avas  the  object  of  that  subscription? 
Mr.  Schantz.  The  same.  All  three  organizations  Avere  for  the  same 
purpose. 

Senator  Edge.  What  Avas  that  purpose  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  For  flood  protection  through  the  agency  of  Gov. 
Cox,  hoping  that  he  might  be  there  to  protect  this  laAv,  rather  than 
to  have  some  one  there  that  might  be  against  us  and  Avho  we  Avere 
told  was  against  us. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  the  Workmen's  Compensation  League  a  State 
organization  or  a  private  activity? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  knoAv  nothing  hoAv  it  Avas  formed. 

Senator  Edge.  What? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2753 


Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  know  nothing  more  about  it  than  I  know  about 
the  Forward  Looking  Association. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  who  the  officers  are  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTZ.  The  gentlemen  that  represented  it  was  Morris  Slo- 
man  and  Robert  Hays. 

Senator  Edge.  AVho  is  Morris  Sloman  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTZ.  Morris  Sloman  was  an  advertising  man.  He  was  in 
the  advertising  busine^-s. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  told  you  to  give  such  large  sums  as  these  to  an 
association  you  knew  absolutely  nothing  about  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Oh,  I  had  confidence  in  Mr.  Hays,  and  had  more  con- 
fidence m  Mr.  Sloman,  and  I  had  confidence  in  Mr.  Burba. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  did  know  these  gentlemen? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  did  know  them;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  kind  of  a  campaign  did  they  carry  out  in  the 
interest  of  Gov.  Cox  and  flood  prevention  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Their  report  to  the  secretary  of  state  ought  to  show 
the  expenditures. 

Senator  Edge.  There  are  about  40  pages  of  it. 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Well,  that  will  tell  you  what  it  Avas  for. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  point  out  from  this  statement,  that  pur- 
l  ports  to  be  a  certified  copy  of  the  statement  of  the  Workmen's  Com- 
pensation League,  filed  at  Columbus,  any  of  the  payments  that  you 
made  representing  the  funds  you  were  distributing? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  would  say  I  made,  if  not  all,  about  all  of  the  pay- 
ments to  Mr.  Hays  and  Mr.  Sloman  and  Mr.  Burba. 

Senator  Edge.  See  if  they  are  on  there.  Have  you  looked  hur- 
riedly through  that? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  this  the  original  or  a  certified  copy,  or 
what  ? 

Senator  Edge.  A  certified  copy.    Here  is  the  other  one.  [Hand- 
ing paper  to  Senator  Pomerene.] 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  These  are  the  disbursements. 

Senator  Edge.  The  receipts  are  also  there.  They  are  at  the  end, 
I  think. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  do  not  see  any  of  the  receipts  here,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  If  they  are  there,  they  are  there  in  small  amounts. 
■  I  did  not  find  them  in  looking  over  it  hurriedly.   You  are  a  business 
man  administering  a  large  estate? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  A  large  business? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  not  know  that  is  a  subterfuge — when  you 
rgave  $10,400  to  two  or  three  men  and  file  at  the  secretary  of  state's 

office  certain  voluminous  documents  like  this  without  their  names 
,  appearing,  or  if  so,  in  very  small  amounts?    You  gave  the  money; 

they  did  not  give  the  money  ? 
J.    Mr.  ScHAXTz.  They  gave  the  money  with  the  understanding  that 
ithey  file  that  report. 

I    Senator  Edge.  That  is  contrary  to  the  law,  is  it  not? 
I    Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  didn't  think  so. 

'  Senator  Edge.  Not  contrary  to  law  for  you  to  give  directly  an 
i  amount  for  an  acknowledged  campaign  purpose  and  other  men  file 
:the  accounts  with  the  secretary  of  state? 


2754 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Are  you  asking  that  question? 
Senator  Edge.  I  ask  it  as  a  question. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask  3^ou  a  question :  Are  you  asking 
that  question  of  this  witness  as  an  expert  in  the  law  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  not.  I  am  asking  him  that  question  as  a  mat- 
ter of  ordinary  common  sense. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well ! 

Senator  Edge.  If  the  law  requires  the  actual  contributor,  which  it 
does  or  it  would  not  require  an3^thing,  and  the  amount  you  have  testi- 
fied to  is  totaled,  but  yet  the  man  you  oave  it  to  did  not  appear  on 
the  list,  what  would  be  your  opinion  of  that  as  carrying  out  the  law? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  object  to  that. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  How  can  I  answer?  I  am  not  an  attorney.  I  d'j 
not  know  the  law  as  an  attorney  should  know  it  or  would  know  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  not  think,  handling  and  disbursing  $3T,00C 
admittedly  for  campaign  purposes,  that  you  should  have  insisted 
that  the  law  be  obeyed  or  that  you  should  to  some  extent  investigate 
the  law  so  you  would  not  be  in  this  embarrassing  position? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  suppo^sed  it  was  obeyed. 

Senator  Edge.  Here  is  the  certified  copy  of  the  return. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  supposed  it  was  obeyed. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Allow^  me  to  suggest,  with  all  due  respect,  this 
is  an  account  which  is  filed  by  another  committee,  or  somebody  who 
received  these  funds,  and  distributed  them.  How  can  you  hold  Mr. 
Schantz  responsible,  legally  or  otherwise,  for  the  work  that  another 
association  performed,  whether  that  was  right  or  wrong? 

Senator  Ed(je.  For  the  totals  of  the  amounts  filed  he  has  referred 
me  to  tlie  secretary  of  state's  records,  for  that  purpose.  We  have  the 
list  here.  They  agree  with  his  figures,  excepting  as  to  the  people  to 
whom  he  gave  it.  So  1  do  not  think  there  can  be  any  reasonable 
tioiibt  as  to  the  authenticit}^  of  it. 

You  speak  of  Mr.  Hays.  You  said  you  had  confidence  in  Mr.  Hays, 
as  tlie  reason  ;/ou  turned  it  over  to  him,  or  partially  to  him.  Who  is 
Mr.  Hays?   What  is  his  business ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  At  the  time  he  was  connected — he  had  some  office 
or  held  some  position  at  Columbus.  Just  what  it  was  I  do  not 
recall. 

Senator  Edge.  Has  he  ever  acted  as  secretary  to  (tov.  Cox,  or  to 
Congressman  Cox? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  think  at  one  time  he  was  secretary  to  him. 

Senator  Ed(;e.  Then  he.  it  could  be  assumed,  would  be  interested 
in  Gov.  Cox's  huccess? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  would  take  it  so. 

Senator  Edge.  We  have  one  other  of  these  associations  known  as 
tile  Inde])enderit  Yoters'  Leagu.e,  Cuyahoga  County.  The  amount 
given  to  that  association  seems  to  be  $8,000.  Is  that  correct  as  near 
as  you  can  recall  ? 

Sir.  ScpiANTz.  That  is  the  amount  I  paid  to  Mr.  Hartley. 

Senator  Edge.  You  paid  that  all  to  Mr.  Hartley,  did  you? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Will  you  look  at  this  document,  purporting  to  be  a 
certified  copy  of  the  amounts  filed  by  the  Independent  Yoters'  League 
for  the  campaign  of  1916,  with  tlie  statement  of  receipts,  totaling 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAISIPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2755 


$8,200.  and  see  if  you  can  find  Mr.  Hartley's  name  or  your  own  name 
on  it  ?    [Handing  paper  to  witness.] 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Now,  Mr.  Schantz,  this  money,  you  have  already 
testified — not  all  of  the  money,  but  certain  parts  of  it,  as  testified  to 
by  Mr.  Scudder,  which,  it  seemed,  you  corroborated — certain  portions 
of  the  $37,000 — came  from  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  Is  that 
correct  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  did  it  come  from? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  received  the  money,  as  I  understood  it,  from  three 
individuals.  There  were  five  of  us  to  given  $7,000  each  and  one  to 
give  $2,000.  That  made  $37,000.  Seven  thousand  was  to  come  from 
Mr.  Talbott,  seven  thousand  from  Deeds,  seven  thousand  from  Ket- 
tering, seven  thousand  from  Kidder,  two  thousand  from  Tait,  and 
five  thousand  from  myself.  That  is  the  way  I  understood  where  it 
was  to  come  from. 

Senator  Edge.  Consider  for  a  moment  the  return  of  this  money. 
Without  taking  time  to  lead  up  to  it,  when  you  returned  the  dividend, 
or  whatever  3^ou  may  term  it,  through  the  appropriation  made  by 
the  Dayton  flood-prevention  committee,  did  you  return  it  direct  to 
these  gentlemen? 

Mr.  Schantz.    I  think  I  turned  it  back  to  Mr.  Talbott;  ves. 

Senator  Edge.  All  to  Mr.  Talbott  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  l^es. 

Senator  Edge.  Wliy  did  you  not  return  it  to  each  one  of  them  as 
you  received  it  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  I  left  him  to  distribute  it. 
I '  Senator  Edge.  You  left  him  to  distribute  it  ? 
i    Mr.  Schantz.  Yes;  sure. 

Senator  Edge.  What  he  did  with  it  you  do  not  of  your  own  knowl- 
edge know,  then? 

Mr.  Schantz.  No  ;  I  do  not  know.  I  left  the  entire  sum  with  him 
to  distribute  it  equally  in  three  parts. 

Senator  Edge.  But  you  gave  him  the  one  check  for  the  total  of  the 
three  representing  the  officers  of  this  company  who  had  given  you 
their  checks? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Which  checks  were  originally  from  the  Dayton 
Metal  Products  Co.,  were  they  not? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Just  notice  some  of  the  disbursements  of  this  money 
spent  by  the  Independent  Yoters-  League.  I  notice  some  unpro- 
nounceable names  here  for  advertising:  Szabadsag;  Juprzenlm; 
Gwiazda  Zjednoczenia,  the  same  again;  LaVoce  Del  Popolo  ital- 
iano:  Hlas,  Slovak  paper;  Naroclowiec,  Polish  paper;  Polish  Daily 
News;  Jewis  World;  Amerikai  Magj^ar  Nepszava;  Poldnia  W. 
Ameryce.  Was  advertising  in  these  papers  of  particular  benefit  to 
the  protection  of  Dayton  in  the  matter  of  flood  prevention? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  would  say  yes.  They  had  in  mind  to  have  a  man 
•;here  to  guard  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  One  of  these  I  see  is  published  in  New  York  City. 
»Has  it  circulation  here? 


182774— 20— PT  21- 


2756 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Those,  Senator,  are  citizens  of  Cleveland,  not 
of  Patterson,  N.  J. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  it  not  look  to  you  a  little'  bit  more  like  irriga- 
tion than  flood  prevention  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Sir? 

Senator  Edge.  You  need  not  answer  that  if  3^ou  do  not  want  to. 

Mr.  Sghantz.  Why,  how  absurd !  If  you  only  knew  how  deeply 
interested  we  are  in  the  protection  of  this  valley  you  would  have 
done  just  as  we  did. 

Senator  Edge.  Now,  Mr.  Schantz,  I  have  all  the  sympathy  in  the 
world  for  you  in  the  protection  of  this  valley  and  I  think  that  every 
movement  in  that  direction  is  to  be  commended,  but  we  are  trying  to 
find  out  just  why  it  was  necessary  in  pursuing  that  campaign  to  pay 
certain  money  from  that  flood  prevention  civic  association  to  certain 
men  rather  than  direct,  and  various  things  that  have  occurred  in 
connection  with  this,  and  that,  of  course,  is  the  line  of  questions  I  am 
asking  you. 

I  have  here  a  copy  of  an  advertisement  which  it  is  alleged  was  in- 
serted by  the  Forward  Looking  Association  of  Ohio,  signed  by  them, 
in  the  Cincinnati  Enquirer,  on  Thursday,  November  2,  1916.  See  if 
you  can  find  any  word  or  suggestion  of  any  kind  about  the  flood  pre- 
vention in  Dayton  or  Miami  Valley  [handing  paper  to  witness] . 

Mr.  Schantz.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  Don't  you  think,  if  that  was  the  main  object  of  your 
campaign  

Mr.  Schantz  (interrupting).  I  did  not  have  charge  of  the  For- 
ward Looking  Association  of  Ohio. 

Senator  Edge.  But  you  were  the  custodian  of  the  people's  money 
and  you  distributed  it  to  these  associations  for  that  purpose,  did  you 
not? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely,  for  flood  prevention  and  to  get,  if  pos- 
sible, Mr.  Cox  there  to  guard  the  law^  for  us. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  insert  that  advertisement  in  the  hearings. 
(The  advertisement  is  as  follows :) 

LET  rS  REDEEM  OHIO. 

Grave  matters  are  at  issue  in  tlie  approaching  election.  The  prevalencf 
and  nearness  of  war  and  the  stress  of  conditions  it  creates  makes  this  a  linit 
in  national  affairs  fraught  with  danger  and  big  in  consequence.  There  are, 
however,  in  Ohio  definite  issues  which  demand  attention. 

The  business  which  does  not  advance  moves  backward.  The  business  whicl 
intrusts  its  affairs  to  those  who  deal  lightly  with  the  truth  faces  disaster.  Th( 
government  of  Ohio  is  a  big  business.  It  is  the  biggest  business  in  the  State 
Its  conduct  requires  ability,  vision,  and  human  treatment.  It  needs,  first  of  all 
honesty. 

The  importance  of  Ohio  government  has  been  growing  constantly.  In  th< 
last  10  vears  its  progress  has  been  marked.  During  the  last  two  years  ther< 
has  been  reaction.  Of  the  contrast  here  presented  and  of  the  possibilities  o: 
danger  in  the  future  there  should  be  earnest  consideration. 

This  is  a  plain  business  proposition.    Let  us  reason  it  out  together. 

The  advancement  in  Ohio  already  under  way  gained  impetus  in  1912  witl 
the  adoption  of  the  new  constitution,  fitted  to  new  needs.  The  thought  of  socia 
justice  and  human  development  stood  over  all.  James  M.  Cox,  who  supporte( 
the  amendirjents,  was  chosen  governor  to  enact  and  administer  laws  to  pu 
the  amendments  into  effect.    This  he  did.    We  enacted  other  progressive  law 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2757 


tbat  a^jsisted  in  the  efficient  conduct  of  State  ^rovernment,  and  carried  all  the 
benefits  of  a  progressive  State  to  all  the  people. 

Under  the  Cox  administration  came  the  compulsory  workmen's  compensation 
law,  which  was  so  efficiently  administered  that  in  two  years  it  had  gained 
the  support  not  only  of  employees  but  of  employers  as  well.  Under  this  ad- 
ministration all  destructive  attempts  against  the  law  were  successfully  resisted 
and  overcome. 

.  A  modern  educational  system  was  established,  which  gave  to  the  boys  and 
girls  of  the  farm  opportunitief?  they  deserved. 

There  was  written  the  mother's  pension  law,  with  the  absolute  guarantee 
to  every  mother  in  Ohio  that  no  matter  what  circumstances  may  befall  her 
in  the  tender  youth  of  her  children,  she  will  not  come  to  poverty  nor  will  her 
little  ones  be  separated  from  her. 

The  door  was  closed  on  dark  days  of  old  prison  methods  in  Ohio,  and  tliere 
was  purchased  the  new  penitentiary  farm,  on  which  thtre  has  not  been  a 
single  activity  for  two  years. 

There  was  given  the  first  budget  financial  system  adopted  by  any  State  in 
America. 

Eleven  agricultural  bills  for  the  promotion  of  farm  life  were  written  into 
law  and  efficiently  and  economically  administered. 

A  modern  highway  system  built  on  cooi>eration  between  county.  State,  and 
Federal  Government  was  established. 

There  came  also  under  the. Cox  adiuinistration  the  reform  of  the  jury  system, 
the  simplification  of  judicial  procedure,  the  half  holiday  at  election  time,  the 
law  for  at  least  two  pay  days  a  month,  the  standard  caboose  law,  the  purchase 
of  life-saving  equipment  for  mines,  the  survey  for  occupational  diseases,  the 
bill  providing  for  removal  of  ofhcials.  the  primary  election,  home  rule  for 
cities,  the  ci^'il-service  law,  the  initiative  jiiid  veferondrim.  strengthening  of  the 
public  utilities  law.  a  law  tc  protect  innocent  investors  from  fraudulcnr  spc>cu- 
lators,  an  act  purifying  elections,  the  law  providing  defense  against  tul)erciilosis, 
and  the  liquor-license  law,  under  constituticmal  mandate,  which  regulates  the 
trafBc. 

■  The  efficient  and  benevolent  plan  for  the  care  of  the  State's  unfortunates 
*  under  the  board  of  administration,  wliich  continued  free  from  the  liand  (»f  the 

spoilsman,  with  sympatlietic  treatment  from  the  executive  and  legishitive  de- 
partments.   Every  thought  was  given  to  helpful  human  activity. 

Two  years  ago  api)eal  was  made  by  misrepresentation  of  facts  and  th?  liold- 
ing  out  of  promises  which  v\ere  not  meant  to  be  kept.  Candidate  Willi^-  said 
there  was  a  deficit  in  tlie  State  treasury  of  $4,800,000.  As  governor  lie  re- 
ceipted for  $11,670,491.30  in  cash.  With  his  "little  red  l)ook  "  he  in;ide  charge 
of  useless  offices  and  commissions  created  by  Gov.  Cox  when  most  of  them 
had  come  into  affairs  before  Cox  was  elected.  He  said  he  would  restoi'C'  lli? 
outside  offices  to  the  statehouse,  and  he  has  purchased  an  11-story  olfice  l)uild- 
ing,  not  large  enough  for  all  the  offices,  and  paid  for  it  with  intert^st  on  tlie 
cash  he  said  was  not  in  the  treasury.  He  promised  elimination  of  olfices  and 
increased  the  pay  roll  for  officers  $575,000  yearly.  He  promised  increase  under 
the  compensation  law,  which  he  has  not  given,  but  he  has  by  inattention  and 

,  reaction  lent  assistance  to  those  who  would  destroy  the  law.  Willis  confic  iiried 
an  alleged  political  machine,  and  as  governor  proceeded  by  si)oils  distrilnUion 
to  build  tip  a.  machine  of  liis  own  uneqiialed  iri  the  history  of  St;ite  politics, 
lie  promised  economy  in  State  government,  and  in  his  first  fiscal  year  he  ex- 

,  pended  $19,695,902.33,  which  was  a  million  and  a  quarter  more  than  was  spent 
in  any  year  preceding  him  and  wiiich  was  $519,801.89  more  than  the  receipts 
of  all  sources  (auditor  of  state  report).    He  stood  over  the  State  treasury  with 

■  $11,670,491.30  in  it,  and  on  June  30,  1916,  had  reduced  this  surplus  to  $6,870,- 
,  423.92  (auditor  of  state  report).  He  pledged  the  election  of  assessors,  and  then 
,  passed  a  l.sw  which  gave  to  boards  of  i  evision  arbitrary  powers,  under  which 

taxes  were  raised  without  reason  and  without  notice.  His  decentralization  of 
I  the  license  law,  with  effort  to  evade  his  own  responsibility  for  law  enforcement, 
:  was  rejected  by  112,000  votes. 

I  Efficiency  has  given  way  to  politics.  Ohio's  only  advance  has  been  in  the 
heost  of  government. 

With  this  demonstration,  does  it  not  appeal  to  you  that  Ohio  deserves  better 
^treatment  and  that  it  is  about  time  to  begin  the  forward  move? 
»    The  Cox  ji(lministrati(m  has  now  been  in  review  long  enough  to  be  known  and 
(Understood.    Its  progress  is  in  comparison  with  the  reaction  of  its  successor. 


2758 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


The  people  of  Ohio  have  a  right  to  expect  real  service.  Let  us  consider  wliat 
we  will  gain  by  again  electing  James  M.  Cox  to  administer  our  State  govern- 
ment. 

Gov.  Cox  is  pledged  to  protection  and  preservation  of  the  compulsory  work- 
man's compensation  law,  which  he  had  enacted  and  which  he  did  protect  whilp 
governor. 

The  Democratic  platform  pledges  the  Democratic  legislature  when  elected  to 
repeal  of  the  arbitrary  features  of  the  present  taxation  law  and  the  continua- 
tion of  the  right  of  local  subdivisions  to  elect  their  own  assessors. 

There  is  promised  the  enactment  of  laws  that  will  continue  the  far-seeing 
policy  of  good  laws  development  which  will  enable  the  State  to  secure  the 
fullest  benefits  afforded  by  national  legislation  and  national  appropriations. 

As  the  creator  of  the  school  code,  which  will  be  his  lasting  monument.  Gov. 
Cox  may  be  depended  upon  to  perfect  that  law  wherever  it  may  need  change, 
and  to  continue  Ohio  in  the  front  rank  of  the  sisterhood  of  States  in  educa- 
cional  matters. 

The  day  of  Gov.  Cox's  inauguration  will  see  activities  renewed  on  the  new 
penitentiary  farm,  and  an  honest  effort  made  to  do  something  for  the  1,800 
men  now  confined  in  the  idle  house  of  the  penitentiary,  where  recently  was 
enacted  the  tragedy  of  spoils. 

The  State's  resources  will  be  conserved,  and  proper  attention  to  the  canals 
and  reservoirs  constituting  the  public  park  system  will  be  continued  by  Gov. 
Cox  as  it  was  begun  under  his  former  administration. 

The  dark  shadow  of  the  spoilsman  will  be  removed  from  the  board  of  ad- 
ministration and  the  blind,  the  insane,  the  helpless,  and  the  deficient  will  be 
given  human  care  by  human  hands.  A  policy  will  be  adopted  toward  the  wards 
of  the  State  and  their  welfare  with  efficient  appropriations,  which  will  provide 
those  things  for  which  there  is  now  urgent  need. 

Gov.  Cox  is  a  natural  executive.  He  is  a  business  success,  and  a  leader. 
He  stands  square  on  all  things.  When  he  gives  a  pledge  he  keeps  it.  He  takes 
the  governorship  of  the  State  of  Ohio  as  a  serious  matter  and  will  never  permit 
it  to  become  a  joke.  He  will  take  the  laws  as  he  finds  them  and  enforce  them 
to  the  letter.  He  will  see  that  they  are  changed  where  he  has  given  his  pledu> 
so  to  do,  and  otherwise  act  where  needs  develop. 

The  election  of  Gov.  Cox  means  restoration  of  honesty,  efficiency,  humanity 
and  progress  in  ,the  government  of  Ohio.  WIku  the  people  again  choose  hiu 
they  may  once  more  lift  their  heads  in  pride,  knowing  full  well  that  Ohio  wii 
rank  first  among  all  the  States  in  the  Union. 

At  the  forthcoming  election  the  voters  will  choose  between  the  progress  o: 
Gov.  Cox  and  the  reaction  and  lack  of  vision  of  Gov.  Willis.    Their  ability  t(. 
serve  the  people  and  their  records  of  service  are  the  issue.    The  decision 
up  to  all  of  us  who  have  to  live  and  do  business  in  the  State.   We  will  redeem 
Ohio. 

The  Forward  Looking  Association  of  Ohio, 
M.  H.  Mathews,  Chairman, 
M.  H.  Sloman,  Secretary, 

The  Schicind  Building,  Dayton,  Ohio. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  admit.  Avithoiit  my  asking  the  number  ol 
questions  necessary  to  establish  it,  that  this  meeting  Avas  held  of  tlv 
responsible  men  of  the  flood  prevention  committee  on  Sunday,  Fel  - 
ruary  3,  at  which  time  upon  vote  of  this  assembly,  of  the  four  namt  - 
discussed  this  morning  and  given  in  evidence  this  morning,  a  siuu 
aggregating  $26,000  was  voted  from  that  association  to  certain  md 
viduals  wdiose  names  I  w  ill  refer  to  ^ 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  All  members  were  present:  T  do  not  recall  wh:  t 
four  you  refer  to. 

Senator  Edge.  All  members  were  present  ? 

Mr.  Sc;hantz.  All  members  were  present  with  the  exception  (  i 

Mr.  Stoddard,  wdio  was  

Senator  Edge.  What  do  you  mean  by  all  meinl)ers?    How  mai  ^ 

were  there?  t--  i  i 

Mr.  Sciiaxtz.  That  meant  Col.  Deeds,  Mr.  Talbott,  Mr.  Kiddi  ' 
Mr.  Huffman,  myself,  and  Judge  Brown  as  secretary. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2759 


Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  those  gentlemen  constituted  the 
board  of  directors  or  board  of  trustees? 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes,  sir ;  the  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  The  committee  in  charge  of  the  receipts  and  dis- 
bursements ?  * 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  agree  that  at  that  meeting  a  motion  was 
regularly  passed  to  pay  to  Mr.  Hall,  Mr.  Hartley,  Mr.  (xarry,  Mr. 
Lloyd.  Groecke  &  Anderson,  and  Mr.  Ozias  a  sum  total  of  $26,24'2.50  ? 
AVas  that  voted  at  that  meeting  to  be  paid  to  those  gentlemen  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTZ.  They  discussed  the  proposition  and  decided  that  in- 
asmuch as  they  had  expended  their  funds  for  flood  protection  that 
they  should  be  reimbursed  to  the  extent  of  $26,000.  The  question 
then  arose  as  to  the  manner  in  which  it  should  be  done,  and  this  man- 
ner was  suggested,  and  to  be  ascertained  if  that  would  be  proper 
under  the  circumstances ;  and  if  so,  to  proceed  to  collect  it  and  have  it 
turned  over  to  me  for  distribution. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  it  your  usual  custom,  when  you  returned  this 
money  to  the  original  subscribers,  to  do  it  through  the  agency  of  a 
third  party  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTZ.  Usual? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes.  You  distributed  other  sums,  did  you  not,  back 
to  the  original  subscribers? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  No ;  86.4  per  cent  of  the  money  subscribed  by  the 
people  has  been  returned  to  them. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  exactly  what  I  asked  you.  Was  that  re- 
turned to  them  direct  or  through  some  one  else  indorsing  it  to  them  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  It  was  returned  to  them  direct. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  why  was  it  necessary  to  adopt  this  new  policy 
in  the  case  of  this  particular  sum  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTZ.  That  question  was  taken  up  to  ascertain  whether 
that  would  be  a  satisfactory  way,  and  it  was  said  that  it  would  be, 
and,  therefore,  we  decided  to  do  it  that  way. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask  you  a  question.  Senator  Edge, 
iire  these  questions  asked  of  Mr.  Scliantz  on  the  theory  that  he  is  a 
candidate  for  President? 

Senator  Edge.  No,  indeed.  They  are  asked  on  the  theory,  my  dear 
Senator,  that  it  is  our  duty  to  investigate  these  funds,  which  it  has 
been  admitted  were  for  the  purpose  of  electing  Gov.  Cox,  and  which 
we  are  here  to  investigate,  and  to  ascertain  all  of  the  ramifications  that 
entered  into  the  disbursement  of  the  flood  money  in  the  city  of  Day- 
ton. I  can  not  find  it  out  in  any  other  way  except  by  asking. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  did  not  know  that  we  were  here  for  the  pur- 
pose of  investigating  the  Ohio  campaign  of  1916.  I  might  want  to 
make  some  investigation  if  we  are  going  to  go  into  that. 

Senator  Edge.  My  understanding  is  that  we  are  clearly  here  for 
that  purpose,  upon  request  of  Senator  Reed  that  we  take  up  and  con- 
sider the  two  charges  or  leads  as  we  have  termed  them,  that  were 
iriven  to  us  by  Mr.  Lockwood,  one  the  $37,000  matter  and  the  other 
the  $5,000  note  and  check,  both  of  which  are  so  apparently  inter- 
twined. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  quite  understand,  do  you  not,  that  this 
las  no  relation  whatever  either  to  this  presidential  campaign  or  to 
he  senatorial  campaign? 


2760 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAiMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Absolutely,  Senator. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Undoubtedly  so;  and  because  Mr.  Lockwood 
was  there  Avith  a  bluff  and  Senator  Reed  called  it,  you  think  we 
ought  to  spend  all  this  time  to  go  into  it.  If  you  do,  I  am  not  going 
to  object. 

Senator  Edge.  Let  me  put  it  the  other  way.  I  tried  to  make  it 
clear  this  morning,  and  I  think  I  did.  T  thoroughly  appreciate  that 
every  particle  of  this  investigation  is  absolutely  outside  of  the  juris- 
diction of  our  committee  as  originally  formed.  There  is  no  question 
about  it.  I  am  only  here,  and  I  am  sure  you  likewise,  because  we 
were  appointed  a  subcommittee  to  take  up  these  specific  things.  If 
you  do  not  want  to  take  them  up,  I  am  ready  to  stop  this  minute.  i 

Senator  Pomekene.  I  am  simply  calling  attention  to  the  fact  that 
we  are  doing  something  now  that  is  wholly  without  the  jurisdiction 
of  this  subcommittee.  More  than  that,  there  is  not  any  one  Senator 
a  member  of  this  committee  that  has  any  j)ower  to  give  jurisdiction 
on  this  subject.  Jurisdiction  can  only  be  given  by  the  United  States 
Senate.   Now,  if  vou  still  want  to  go  into  it,  you  can. 

The  fact  of  the  matter  is,  I  am  free  to  say,  I  do  not  charge  yow 
Y/ith  bad  faith  in  this  matter;  but  the  men  who  have  presented  this 
are  not  exercising  good  faith.  If  any  of  those  o-entlemen  are  here, 
thev  understand  the  English  language  when  T  use  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator,  I  am  only  aoing  to  answer  that  with  this 
one  thought.  There  is,  in  my  judgment^  a  connecting  link  in  tht 
demand  on  the  part  of  Senator  Reed.  We  have  been  and  are  entirely 
within  our  jurisdiction,  investigating  charges  made  by  Gov.  Cox 
of  sinister  influences,  etc.,  in  connection  with  this  campaign.  It 
does  to  some  extent,  in  my  judgment,  and  that  of  the  American  peo- 
ple, enter  into  it  whether  Gov.  Cox,  in  previous  campaigns,  has 
been  to  some  extent  associated,  either  directly  or  indirectly,  with 
corporation  contribution  to  campaigns.  It  makes  some  difference 
as  to  the  sincerity  of  his  charges  now. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  no;  it  has  nothing  Avhatever  to  do  Avith  it. 
You  have  not  connected  him  Avith  any  of  these  contributions  except 
the  one  of  the  $5,000,  and  that  is  aAvay  back  and  in  another  local 
matter.  The  truth  of  the  matter  is  that  these  suggestions  are  ap- 
parently made  by  some  one  Avho  is  a  reincarnation  of  the  harpies 
that  befouled  the  "^f easts  of  the  ancients. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  Avant  us  to  continue  the  investigation  ^ 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  just  as  you  choose— Avith  that  observation. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  entirely  ready  to  cease  at  any  mom.ent  myself. 
It  is  not  at  all  pleasant,  and  it  is  not  my  particular  interest  in  public 
life. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  true. 

Senator  Edge.  Thank  vou.    Will  you  go  back,  Mr.  Reporter,  tc 
your  last  notes  before  the  Senator  and  I  started  this  discussion. 
(The  official  reporter  read  as  foUoAVS :) 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  ^^•lly  was  it  necessary  to  adopt  this  new  policy  in  th< 
case  of  this  particnh-ir  sumV  ...  ,.1, 

Mr  ScHANTz.  That  particular  question  was  taken  up,  to  ascertain  wnetnei 
that  would  he  a  satisfactory  way,  and  it  wa>s  said  it  would  he,  and  therefor* 
we  decided  to  do  it  that  way. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz,  I  have  no  desire  to  embarrass  yoi 
further  to  get  the  facts.    You  apparently— correct  me  if  I  an 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2761 


wrong — adopted  that  rule  simply  to  apply  in  this  one  particular 
case? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes:  I  felt  that  they  were  entitled  to  have  their 
money  returned  because  these  gentlemen  have  all  Avorked  faithfully, 
and  in  that  manner  it  was  decided  in  this  case  to  do  it  that  way. 

Senator  Edge.  The  return  through  the  third  party  is  what  I  mean  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Now,  approximately  what  balance  did  you  have, 
or  have  you  now,  in  the  funds  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Asso- 
ciation ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  would  say  $150,000 — one  hundred  and  fifty-two 
or  three  thousand  dollars.  We  have  already  distributed  86.4  per 
cent,  which  will  give  back,  as  soon  as  the  engineer  says  we  are  out  of 
difficulty,  nearly  every  dollar  that  they  originally  put  into  it,  less 
some  interest. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  if  you  had  this  rather  comfortable  balance, 
why  w^as  it  necessary  for  these  seven  gentlemen  or  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.,  or  both,  to  "  chip  in  "  this  particular  specific  sum  of 
$37,000? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well,  that  was  the  course  that  vv^as  decided  upon, 
and  that  was  the  reason  it  was  done.  We  met  and  decided  to  take 
an  interest,  and  that  is  the  way  it  started. 

Senator  Edge.  Had  you  not  previously  as  citizens  made  contribu- 
tions to  the  fund  outside  of  this  $37,000? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  To  the  flood  prevention? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  to  the  flood  fund. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Oh,  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  All  of  you  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  All  of  us ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  was  not  this  particular  $37,000  for  a  special 
purpose  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  It  w^as  for  the  protection  of  the  law. 
Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  special  purpose,  beyond  the  purpose 
of  all  the  money  that  was  subscribed  for  flood  prevention  ? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  AYhat  was  the  purpose  

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  special  purpose  of  this  specific  sum, 
requiring  an  extra  appropriation  from  you  prominent  gentlemen? 
What  was  the  special  necessity  of  this  fund  outside  of  the  regular 
fund?  ^You  had  $150,000  left? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Out  of  the  goodness  of  our  hearts  we  thought  we 
would  go  along  and  see  whether  or  not  we  could  protect  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  What  do  you  mean  by  "  protecting  the  law  "  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Whether  we  could  not  bring  about  a  condition  that 
would  protect  the  law.  You  understand,  they  were  trying  to  amend 
'i  and  distort  and  torture  and  do  everything  to  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  AVho  was? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Why,  the  enemies  on  the  north  of  the  district. 
Senator  Edge.  Had  there  been  any  actual  legislation  introduced 
'  that  would  have  been  fatal  to  your  project? 
Mr.  ScHANTZ.  We  felt  so. 
Senator  Edge.  What  was  it? 
j    Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  do  not  just  recall  any  more  what  the  attempts 


2762 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Was  there  any  effort  made  on  the  part  of  members 
of  the  legishiture  or  any  member  of  the  legislature  to  have  an  audit 
of  the  funds  of  the  prevention  committee  or  association? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Of  the  flood-protection  fund  ? 

Senator  EdcxE.  Yes. 

Mr.  Shantz.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  There  never  had  been  any? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  No ;  not  of  the  flood-prevention  fund. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  is  the  statement  incorrect  which  I  read  in  the 
newspaper  here,  which  says  you  made  such  a  statement?  It  reads  as 
follows : 

There  were  various  amendments.    I  asked  Mr.  Schantz — 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  are  you  reading  from? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  reading  from  a  proof,  which  was  afterwards 
printed,  of  an  article  in  the  Brooklyn  Standard  Union,  by  Mr. 
Charles  P.  Clark,  who  is  subpoenaed  here  as  a  witness.  I  thought  I 
would  save  time  by  asking  Mr.  Schantz  if  this  statement  that  Mr. 
Clark  made  was  correct.    The  statement  says : 

And  a  motion  to  liave  an  audit  of  the  books  of  the  flood-prevention  com- 
mittee— 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  you  are  laying  a  foundation  for  a  contradic- 
tion, give  us  the  date  of  when  this  alleged  statement  was  made  anc 
the  place  where  it  was  made. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  lead  up  to  that.  Were  you  approached  by 
Mr.  Charles  P.  Clark,  an  editor  of  the  Brooklyn  Standard  Union  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir.  , 

Senator  Edge.  About  when  was  that  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Several  weeks  ago. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  give  him  an  interview  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  He  spoke  to  me  about  various  matters.  He  asked 
me  a  number  of  questions. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  this  particular  statement  that  I  read  a  correct 
presentation  of  Mr.  Clark's  question  and  your  answer :  "  What  was 
the  terrible  danger  that  threatened  the  flood-prevention  law  ? " 
"  There  were  various  amendments,"  he  [meaning  you]  answered. 
''And  a  motion  to  have  an  audit  of  the  books  of  the  flood-prevention 
committee  and  the  Miami  conservanc}^  district,"  Mr.  Clark  suggested. 
"  Just  so." 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely  wrong  about  the  

Senator  Edge.  Let  me  continue. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  him  finish  his  answer. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely  wrong  Mr.  Clark  is  when  he  makes  that 
statement.  He  did  ask  me  about  amendments,  but  the  question  of 
auditing  the  books  of  the  conservancy  district  was  not  spoken  of 
at  all.  '  * 

Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  reach  that,  really.  The  next  question 
was:  "And  the  man  who  proposed  the  audit  in  the  legislature  was 
defeated,"  said  I  [meaning  Mr.  Clark].  "Exactly,"  said  Mr. 
Schantz.    Is  that  incorrect? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely  wrong;  absolutely. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  your  testimony  is  that  there  was  no  effort 
made  to  audit  the  books  of  the  flood-prevention  commission  by  any 
member  of  the  legislature  ? 


PKESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2763 


^     Mr.  SciiANTz.  Of  the  flood-prevention  fund? 

\     Senator  E4  ge.  Or  of  the  Miami  conservancy  district  ? 

5     Mr.  Scha^nTZ.  You  asked  me  whether  or  not  1  said  that  to  Mr. 

I  Clark. 

Senator  Edge.  I  read  the  article  to  you,  Mr.  Schantz. 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes :  and  I  told  you  absolutely  no. 
Senator  Edge.  Yes.    Xow  I  am  folloAving  it  up  by  asking  you  to 
•  say  if  there  was  something  else  meant  by  this  and  that  this  might  be 
a  wrong  impression. 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Has  there  been  any  effort  made  to  have  an  audit  of 
i  the  books  of  the  Miami  conservancy  district  ? 

t     Mr.  Schantz.  I  am  not  familiar  with  the  Miami  conservancv  dis- 
trict matters,  only  to  the  extent  that  when  I  am  asked  to  acquire  a 
property  or  to  take  an  interest  in  the  adjustment  of  cases,  I  do  not 
follow  up  those  things.   I  attend  the  meeting  of  the  flood-prevention 
.  committee.    I  am  not  a  member  of  the  conservancy  board.    I  have 
j  no  knowledge  of  those  things. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  you  say  you  have  not  any  knowledge.  Then 
i  you  could  be  mistaken  as  to  there  being  an  effort  to  audit  the  books 
of  the  Miami  conservancy  district,  could  you?    You  could  be  mis- 
taken as  to  there  having  been  an  effort  to  audit  the  books? 
Mr.  Schantz.  I  did  hear  that  there  Avas  an  effort  made. 
Senator  Edge.  Oh.  there  was  an  effort? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes, 

Senator  Edge.  Oh,  I  understood  you  to  say  there  was  not.  There 
i  was  an  effort  made  to  audit  those  books  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  So  I  am  told :  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  \Vas  the  man  who  made  that  effort  defeated  for 
reelection  to  the  legislature  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Well.  I  did  not  speak  about  that  to  Mr.  Clark  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Well.  I  have  dropped  that:  I  am  just  asking  you 
whether  you  recall  that  he  was  defeated? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  think  Mr.  Barnes  was  defeated. 

Senator  Edge.  What  district  did  he  represent  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  He  was  a  local  representative. 

Senator  Edge.  From  this  county? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  consider  tl\e  activity  of  a  legislator  to  have 
,  the  accounts  audited  as  being  opposed  to  the  development  of  your 
general  protective  scheme? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  had  no  interest  in  that  matter  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Apparently,  from  the  results  the  people  of  the 
county  did  not  appreciate  his  activity  in  having  them  audited  ?  Is 
not  that  apparent  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  however  it  appears  to  you. 

Senator  Edge.  He  was  defeated  anyhow? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes:  so  I  understand. 

Mr.  McMahon.  He  was  defeated  for  renomination  in  the  Re- 
1  publican  convention. 

Mr.  Schantz.  He  was  defeated  in  the  Republican  primaries. 
Senator  Edge,  I  have  not  any  interest  in  this  particular  proposi- 
tion as  a  matter  of  politics,    I  understand  most  of  these  gentlemen 


2764 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


are  Kepublicans.  I  am  glad  they  are  using  most  of  that  good  judg- 
ment. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  know  most  of  these  men  by  reputation,  and 
judging  from  that  reputation  they  are  quite  as  good  citizens  as  you 
have  in  any  State  of  the  Union,  even  New  Jersey,  and  I  am  quite  sure 
that  no  one  that  knows  any  of  them  would  charge  them  with  pilfer- 
ing funds. 

Senator  Edoe.  That  question  seems  to  center  mainly  on  the  meth- 
ods pursued.   I  do  not  think  there  is  any  other  thought  about  it. 

Now,  Mr.  Schantz,  let  us  see  who  these  men  were  to  whom  you  paid, 
or  ordered  payments  drawn,  who  were  the  dummies  between  the 
flood-prevention  committee  and  the  gentlemen  to  whom  they  after- 
w^ards  indorsed  their  checks.  Mr.  Edward  T.  Hall  seems  to  be  the 
first  item — for  services  as  per  agreement ;  three  years,  1915,  1916,  and 
1917,  at  $2,800  per  year,  a  total  of  $8,400.  What  were  Mr.  Hall's 
services  for  which  he  should  be  paid  $2,800  per  year? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Could  I  explain  that  in  this  manner  

Senator  Edge.  In  any  manner,  so  I  can  get  an  answer  to  m}^  ques- 
tion. 

Mr.  Schantz.  1  hope  it  will  be  satisfactory  to  you.  At  this  meet- 
ing, at  which  all  members  were  present  and  voted  for  the  return  of 
this  money,  it  was  suggested  that  men  that  had  been  identified  wdth 
this  flood  prevention  work  be  called  into  a  conference,  and  they  asked 
me  whether  I  would  have  a  talk  with  them.  I  sent  for  these  gentle- 
men and  told  them  what  we  had  done  for  flood  protection  and  the 
protection  of  the  law,  and  that  we  felt  these  gentlemen  were  entitled 
to  be  reimbursed,  and  would  they  make  out  their  bills. 

Senator  Edge.  Would  which  gentleman  make  out  their  bills? 

Mr.  Schantz.  These  gentlemen  that  you  referred  to. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Hall,  for  instance? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir.  And  they  said  they  would  be  glad  to  do  so. 
Senator  Edge.  Well,  what  had  been  Mr.  Hall's  services? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  he  had  a  general  interest  in  the  flood  protection 
law. 

Senator  Edge.  A  general  interest? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes ;  like  every  one  of  us  would  have. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  do  you  think  that  would  be  a  substantial 
reason  for  voting  him  $2,800  a  year  for  three  years,  because  he  was  in- 
terested in  the  law  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  You  will  thoroughly  understand  that  the  bill  was 
made  out  to  reimburse  us. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz,  that  is  just  precisely  what  I  wanted  to 
find  out.  May  I  repeat  that  it  is  not  pleasant  at  all  for  me  to  try  to 
bring  this  out  by  continued  questions  ? 

Is  it  not  a  fact  that  these  men— Edward  T.  Hall,  Gale  M.  Hartley, 
D.  Gara,  John  Lloyd,  and  so  on — were  simply  dummies  to  whom  pay- 
ments were  made  to  equal  the  sum  of  $26,000  for  the  sole  purpose  of 
having  it  go  through  the  books  that  way,  and  indorsed  from  them 
over  to  vou  to  reimburse  Talbott,  Kittering,  etc.  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Eor  the  moneys  that  they  expended  for  the  protec- 
tion of  the  law  ;  ves. 

Senator  Edge.'  All  right.  Then  why  did  you  not  vote  that  money 
direct  to  these  seven  men  ? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2765 


Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  mean  the  whole  committee.  This  matter  was  taken 
up  with  the  secretary  to  ascertain  whether  it  would  be  satisfactory  in 
this  manner.  It  was  re])orted  that  it  would  be.  and  that  is  the  reason 
it  came  there.   I  am  but  one  member. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  it  meet  your  approval  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  It  met  Avith  the  approval  of  all. 

Senator  Edge.  AVell.  I  admire  that  answer.   As  a  matter  of  fact,  I 
.  would  not  have  asked  you  the  question  if  I  had  ^iven  it  a  second 
thought.   I  mean.  I  admire  it  because  I  did  not  ask  you  to  make  any 
discrimination. 

Then,  summing  it  all  up,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  this  $37,000  campaign 

fund,  or  at  least  the  part  that  was  expended — $26,000  and  odd  

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  $26,000  was  what  we  received. 

Senator  Edge.  It  was  really  paid  by  the  taxpayers  of  this  vicinity  ? 
Mr.  ScHAXTZ.  Absolutely  not. 
Senator  Edge.  Why  not? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  It  was  paid  out  of  the  fund  that  Avas  created  by  peo- 
ple that  gave  it  and  never  expected  it  back. 

Senator  Edge.  They  are  taxpayers,  are  they  not,  most  of  them? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  They  have  already  received  86.4  per  cent,  and  will 
receive  $150,()()()  and  more  as  soon  as  the  engineer  Avill  say  Ave  are 
I  out  of  trouble. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  you  are  going  to  issue  bonds,  as  I  understand 
it,  under  the  ncAv  plan  of  the  Miami  conservancy  commission? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  am  not  a  member  of  the  board  and  knoAv  nothing 
of  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  as  a  matter  of  business  judgment,  if  your 
commission  is  going  to  go  on  they  must  issue  bonds,  must  they  not? 
'  Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  imagine  it  Avill  become  necessary  because  of  the 
tremendous  costs  that  have  come  up  Avith  material  and  labor. 

Senator  Edge.  A  perfectly  simple  business  proposition — to  issue 
bonds  for  a  public  improvement  of  that  character? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Absolutely;  A^es,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I^ltimately  the  taxpayers  of  this  district,  or  what- 
ever the  financial  arrangement  is,  must  pay  interest  on  the  l^onds 
and  pay  off  the  bonds,  must  they  not  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Well,  I  suppose  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Indirectly  if  not  directly? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  It  has  nothing  to  do  Avith  the  conservancy  matter. 

This  Avas  a  fund  that  Avas  put  up  by  these  people  that  gave  it  and 
\  neyer  expected  it  back.    This  is  a  flood-protection  fund. 
)     Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that,  but  the  fact  remains  that  this 
1  part  of  it — this  $26,000  fund  which  you  have  testified  Avas  spent  for 

various  political  propaganda  and  actiA^ty — has  been  paid  for  from 
t  those  subscriptions  that  came  in  in  various  Avays,  but  was  not  paid 
h  directly  by  these  gentlemen  ? 

^  Mr.  ScHAXTz.  WhA^  my  dear  man,  that  may  have  meant  to  them 
1  the  saving  of  $100,006,000^for  all  you  knoAv. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  not  questioning  that  at  all,  Mr.  Schantz. 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  All  right. 

Senator  Edge.  Xow,  there  is  just  one  other  matter  I  Avant  to  get 
jl  cleared  up,  Mr.  Schantz,  and  I  will  be  through.    I  notice  in  going 
over  these  figures  that  Mr.  Scudder  testified  to  this  morning  there 
:  was  an  item  deducted  from  this  $26,242.50,  the  amount  voted  back  by 


2766 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


the  flood-protection  committee,  of  $3,276.50.  Why  was  that  de- 
ducted?^ 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Because  these  various  gentlemen  received  these  va- 
rious amounts,  and  under  the  law  the}^  would  be  required  to  pay  an 
income  tax,  and  so  we  told  them  we  Avould  pay  that  income  tax  for 
them. 

Senator  Edgp:.  As  I  understand  you,  then,  you  only  declared  a 
dividend  from  this  $26,000  of  the  balance  of  $22,966  and  actually  paid 
these  men  the  $22,036.50,  so  that  they  could  pay  their  increased 
income  tax  caused  by  these  receipts ;  is  that  it  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well,  we  were  out  in  the  transaction  to  the  extent 
that  we  paid  their  income  tax. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  the  same  thing.   You  paid  their  income  tax? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir.  In  other  words,  we  were  not  fully  reim- 
bursed for  the  advances  that  we  had  made. 

Senator  Edge.  Does  it  not  occur  to  you  as  a  business  man  that  by 
adopting  this  subterfuge — and  I  think  T  am  fair  in  using  that  term — 
you  were  costing  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Society  that  particu- 
lar sum,  provided  you  ultimately  turned  back  100  per  cent  to  all  of 
the  subscribers,  including  these  gentlemen  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  think  what  we  did  was  to  further  the  best  inter- 
ests of  all  the  taxpayers  of  the  community.  Just  last  spring  when 
the  waters  began  to  rise  there  was  a  going  to  the  hills.  If  that  law 
had  been  disturbed,  see  the  condition  of  this  community  and  this  en- 
tire valley.  We  did  it,  and  we  believe  we  saved  the  law  when  it  might 
have  been  destroyed. 

Senator  Edge.  You  think  you  saved  the  laAv  by  the  expenditure  of 
this  $26,000? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  A  great  deal  toward  it ;  I  think  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  not  think  it  would  have  been  a  little  better 
if  it  had  been  handled  in  the  direct  way  than  in  this  indirect  way  we 
have  discussed? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well,  that  perhaps  would  have  been  better :  though 
understand,  we  do  not  apologize  for  receiving  the  money  that  Ave  had 
t^xpended,  because  we  were  not  fully  reimbursed. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr,  Schantz,  I  did  not  intend  to  go  back  to  this, 
but  you  have  made  that  statement  so  forcefully.  You  only  invite 
me  to  bring  this  to  your  attention  again  after  I  had  disposed  of  it. 
Do  you  not  think,  if  that  was  your  sole  object,  that  it  would  have 
been  very  much  more  regular  if  your  advertising,  for  which  the 
large  proportion  of  this  money  was  apparently  spent,  had  at  least 
mentioned  flood  prevention  rather  than  alone  the  election  of  Mr. 
Cox? 

Mr.  Schantz.  That  was  done  by  word  of  mouth. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  give  this  committee  any  literature  for 
which  any  portion  of  this  sum  was  expended  which  mentions  flood 
prevention  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Only  the  instructions  that  the  various  ones  had. 
Senator  P]dge.  Only  the  instructions? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes.  "  We  Avant  flood  protection  here,  and  we  be- 
lieve we  are  safer  in  the  hands  of  Gov.  Cox." 

Senator  Edge.  Then  am  I  to  understand  that  your  idea  of  flood 
prevention  was  entirely  confined  to  the  election  of  Goa- .  Cox  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  So  far  as  I  am  personally  concerned:  A^es. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2767 


Senator  Edge.  Then  have  readied  the  situation  that  thi^5 
money  was  absolutely  and  entirely  spent  in  the  interest  of  the  elec- 
tion of  Gov.  Cox  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  would  put  it  this  way — for  the  preservation  of 
the  law  through  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Schantz,  following  up  that  question  a 
little  further,  the  State  legislature  did  pass  the  conservancy  act  under 
which  these  improvements  are  being  made  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  at  the  time  that  bill  was  pending  in  the 
legislature  there  was  very  bitter  opposition  to  it  in  both  houses 
among  some  of  the  people  who  were  in  the  district,  was  there  not  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  There  was  a  great  deal ;  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  there  was  talk  about  having  it  repealed, 
was  there  not  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Amended. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Or  modified  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  ways  that,  it  was  believed  by  you  gentlemen 
who  were  interested  in  and  familiar  with  the  subject,  would  cripple 
the  law  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  And  take  away  from  it  its  functioning  powers. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  they  were  not  only  making  attacks  u})on 
it  in  the  legislature  during  the  Willis  term  as  governor,  but  were 
making  attacks  in  the  courts  as  well? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  correct,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely;  continuously. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  I  wish  you  would  tell  for  the  benefit  of 
the  record,  in  a  very  brief  way,  what  this  flood  was  and  what  it  did 
in  this  valley. 

Mr.  vScHANTz  (producing  a  printed  pamphlet).  I  have  before  me 
a  pictorial  history  of  the  great  Dayton  flood,  March  25.  26,  27,  1918. 
It  gives  you  in  a  manner  a  somewhat  detailed  account  of  what  that 
flood  was. 

Xow,  the  flood  was  on — I  will  make  it  as  brief  as  possible — for 
three  days  and  three  nights.  My  attention  Avas  first  called  to  it 
because  of  my  sister  and  brother-in-law  living  in  the  flooded  zone. 
We  endeavored  to  get  them  out.  We  tried  for  several  hours  and 
finally  succeeded,  and  we  no  more  than  had  them  out  than  there 
was  an  explosion  next  door  that  destroyed  the  house  we  had  taken 
them  out  of.  There  were  seven  in  the  familv.  You  might  know  how 
I  felt. 

There  were  thousands  of  cases,  thousands  of  cases.  Many  lives 
were  lost.  Lives  are  being  lost  to-day  on  account  of  the  flood  be- 
cause of  the  condition  that  surrounded  them.  This  vjilley  to-day, 
if  we  did  not  have  flood  protection — the  city  of  Dayton  is  doing  fine 
now,  but  in  1916  we  were  not  sure.  We  needed  flood  protection, 
because  we  could  not  borrow  capital,  we  could  not  build  homes,  unless 
we  had  protection. 

I  did  not  go  to  sleep  for  three  days  and  three  nights — I  am  speak- 
'  ing  of  myself  now — and  thousands  of  others  did  likewise.  Sixty 
thousand  people  were  marooned  in  the  flood,  and  60,000  on  the  outside 


2768 


PKESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


were  enduring  just  as  much  anguish  as  those  on  the  inside,  becaustj 
they  did  not  know  what  had  become  of  their  dear  ones. 

The  matter  was  forcibh^  brought  to  my  attention.  I  was  passing 
doAvn  the  street — just  to  give  you  an  idea — when  a  Avoman  stopped 
me  and  says,  "  Mister,  won't  you  please  take  me  and  help  find  my 
baby?-"  1  says,  "Where  do  you  live?"  She  told  me,  On  Burn\- 
Avenue."  She  says,  "  Take  me  out  to  the  N.  C.  R.  Let  us  see  the 
morgue,  whether  the  baby  is  there."  We  went  out  there,  the  pooi- 
Avoman  and  I.  I  asked  her  Avhere  her  husband  Avas,  and  she  failed 
to  answer.  We  went  to  the  morgue.  The  baby  Avasn't  there.  I  met 
her  several  days  afterAvards  and  she  says,  "  Mr.  Schantz,  in  the  muck 
and  the  mire  of  that  monster  on  Burns  AA^enue  Ave  found  our  little 
baby."  A  Avoman  Avho  Avould  refuse  to  ansAver  who  or  Avhere  her 
husband  Avas,  but  had  that  love  for  that  child,  is  only  one  instance 
of  the  thousands  of  cases  of  distress  that  Avere  entered  into.  I  made 
up  m}^  mind  then  that  much  of  my  time  Avould  be  devoted  to  the  pro- 
tection of  the  city  and  this  valley.  Hamilton  to-day  would  be  noth- 
ing, MiddletoAvn  Avould  not  be  much,  and  Dayton  Avould  be  doAvn  and 
out  unless  it  Avas  for  this  protection.  Fires  on  all  sides.  You  men 
Avho  Avere  not  here  to  witness  it  have  no  idea,  nor  do  you  haA^e  any 
idea  the  interest  that  you  Avould  take  in  it  if  you  were  here  Avhen 
the  spring  freshets  come  along  and  threaten  to  destroy  this  com- 
munity. 

NoAv,  then,  Avhat  are  Ave  to  do?  I  Avas  called  into  a  conference 
and  here  Ave  Avere,  a  group  of  men  struggling  Avith  the  question  of 
Ava3^s  and  means  to  prevent  a  recurrence.  I  heard  them  argue 
$20,000.  I  was  asked,  although  not  a  committee,  to  come  into  this 
conference  and  to  give  my  vieAvs.    I  said : 

Gentlemen,  this  monster  must  be  strangled  and  we  must  go  to  the  limit  to 
give  us  protection.    I  say  to  you,  make  that  fund  $2,000,000. 

It  took  them  a  lon^g  Avhile  to  see  it.  It  took  them  a  long  while. 
Finally,  I  was  called  upon  at  the  meeting.  It  seemed  we  couldn't 
arouse  the  enthusiasm,  but  gradually  after  several  meetings,  -and 
when  I  was  called  upon  I  said : 

Gentlemen,  this  tlood-protection  fund  shall  be  $2,000,000.  Let's  give  it. 
What  will  our  property  be  worth  if  we  do  not  have  this  flood  protection? 
We  must  have  it.  I  have  gone  to  my  mother  and  sisters  and  brothers,  and  a>^ 
executor  and  trustee  of  the  estate,  and  there  are  50  in  the  family,  and  I  am 
proud  to  say  that  I  am  on  good  terms  with  all  of  them.  They  said,  "Adam,  do 
what  you  think  is  right."  I  will  subscribe  then  $120,000  to  start  this  fund— 
$60,000  for  the  estate  and  $60,000  for  myself. 

That  statement  was  made  and  immediately  there  Avas  an  enthusi- 
asm and  it  Avas  taken  up  and  with  a  result  that  the  $2,000,000 
mark  was  reached  and  exceeded,  because  of  the  final  efforts  of  such 
men  as  Col.  Deeds,  Mr.  Kettering,  Mr.  Patterson,  and  the  Talbotts 
and  the  Kidders,  and  so  on. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Tait  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Mr.  Tait  also. 

Senator  Edge.  May  I  ask  you  a  question  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  your  84  per  cent  has  been  returned? 
Mr.  Schantz.  86.4  per  cent. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2769 


Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  think  I  orot  it  clear  from  your  testimony. 
;  From  what  source  has  the  money  come  to  reimburse  these  ori<rinal 
!  subscribers  ? 

j    Mr.  ScHAXTZ.  To  the  original  subscribers  it  comes  as  money  tliat 

1  has  been  paid  out  by  the  flood-protection  committee. 

[  Senator  Edge.  Yes ;  but  I  mean  from  what  source  have  you  gotten 
the  money  to  reimburse  them  to  the  extent  of  the  8G  i^er  cent  yon 
speak  of  ?    You  say  you  have  declared  dividends  reimbursing  them 

i  86  per  cent  ?  ' 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  has  the  money  come  from  to  pay  them  back  ? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well  

Mr.  John  A.  McMahox.  I  suspect  a  large  part  of  it,  Adam,  was 
not  spent  at  all. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  I  do  not  know  how  much  of  it  Avas  spent.  I  liave 
\  not  those  figures  here. 

•    Senator  Edge.  I  am  just  quoting  your  own  statement,  Mr.  Schantz, 
i  that  it  had  been  paid  out.    You  said  it  with  considerable  pride  a  mo- 
\  ment  ago,  and  it  occurred  to  me  we  had  not  had  testimony  as  to  how 
it  was  paid. 
Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  I  don't  just  know. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Go  ahead,  Mr.  Schantz. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Now,  then,  on  this  memorable  day  this  fund  was 
i  raised.  That  laAv  has  been  in  jeopardy  and  was  in  jeopardy  in  1916. 
( We  took  an  interest  in  it  because  of  that  and  because  of  that  alone. 
i  So  far  as  I  am  personally  concerned,  and  I  think  the  other  members 
i  will  stand  by  it,  they  will  go  a  great  ways  to  stay  the  hands  of  the 
i  enemy  of  that  law  until  we  are  safe  and  have  protection. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Schantz,  if  I  may  interrupt  you,  was  there 
not  at  that  time  a  great  deal  of  opposition  to  the  law  up  in  other 
sections  of  the  State  here? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir;  there  was  opposition  in  Shelby  County 
and  Miami  County  and  Auglaize  County. 

;  Senator  Pomerene.  And  opposition  among  a  good  many  candi- 
I  dates  for  the  legislature  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes;  there  were. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  were  interested  not  only  in  having 
some  one  in  the  governor's  office  but  interested  in  having  some  mem- 
bers of  the  legislature  who  would  be  friendly  to  this  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  proceed  with  your  statement. 
Mr.  Schantz.  Well,  I  don't  know  that  I  have  anything  further  to 
say. 

^    Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  now,  if  there  is  anything  else  you  desire 
fito  say  along  that  line,  let  us  have  it?    Let  me  ask  you  two  or  three 
'  further  questions  along  that  line.    Other  cities  and  towns  like  Troy 
and  Piqua  were  considerably  deluged,  too? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  As  well  as  many  of  the  towns  and  smaller  cities 
uup  in  my  section  of  the  State — Canton,  Massillon,  Coshocton,  and 
I i other  places  of  that  kind? 
^    Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

[  Senator  Pomerene.  Recurring  again  to  Dayton;  what  was  your 
'population  at  that  time,  in  1916? 


2770 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  ScHANTz.  In  1916  I  suppose  something  like  120,000  people. 
Senator  Pomerene.  And  what  portion  of  your  city  was  under 
water  ? 

Mr,  ScHANTz.  The  central  portion  of  the  city  as  is  outlined  here 
[Referring  to  pamphlet.] 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  speak  in  a  general  way  about  it. 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Well,  I  would  say  more  than  50  per  cent. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  large  part  of  that  was  the  business 
part  of  your  city? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  The  business  part  entirely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is,  the  entire  business  part  was  sub 
merged  ? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  a  large  part  of  your  residence  district? 
Mr..  ScHANTz.  A  great  deal  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  many  families  in  the  city  of  Dayton  alone 
A^^ere  driven  out  of  their  homes  by  the  flood? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Sixty  thousand  people. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  Avould  be  in  round  numbers  12,000 
families,  estimating  that  there  are  five  to  a  family? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  are  here  holding  these  meetings  in  the 
Federal  building.    Was  this  flooded? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  No ;  I  don't  think  this  building  was  put  up  in  1913. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  was  the  ground  here  where  it  is,  flooded? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Oh,  yes;  yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  Hotel  Gibbons  right  next  to  it  was 
flooded? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes;  everything  doAA-n  tpwn,  8,  9,  10,  12,  and  13 
feet  of  water. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Up  to  the  second  floor? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes ;  people  living  out  on  the  roofs. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And,  of  course,  necessarily  you  in  company 
with  other  gentlemen  and  ladies  here  Avere  very  much  interested  in 
this  proposition? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  gaA^e  more  attention  to  caring  for 
the  laAv  than  you  did  to  possible  criticisms  that  might  be  raised  in  the 
future  for  political  purposes? 

Mr.  ScHANTz,  Yes,  sir;  sure. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Schantz,  can  you  explain  to  this  commit- 
tee Avhat,  if  any,  connection  this  inquiry  has  Avith  the  presidential 
election  or  the  pending  senatorial  election  in  Ohio  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  I  haA^en't  any  idea. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  you  and  these  other  gentlemen  did  rep- 
resented the  unanimous^  vieAvs  of  the  committee  Avith  respect  to  the 
disbursement  of  these  funds  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  named  a  committee  here  of,  I  think, 
six  or  seA^en  Avho  did  this.    Will  vou  name  them  again  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Col.  Deeds,  Mr.*  Talbott,  F.  D.  Huffman,  Mr.  Tait, 
Adam  Schantz,  and  Judge  O.  B.  Brown,  secretary. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Hoav  manv  of  those  gentlemen  were  Demo- 
crats? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2771 


Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Mr.  Kidder  and  myself,  independents,  and  Mr.  Huff- 
man :  three  independents. 
Senator  Pomerene.  And  what  were  the  other  gentlemen? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Kepublicans. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  mean  by  the  other  gentlemen  whom  ? 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Mr.  Talbott,  Mr.  Deeds,  Mr.  Kettering,  Mr.  Tait, 
Judge  Brown. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Your  primary  purpose  in  raising  this  fund 
and  in  expending  it  was  to  place  in  authority  in  this  State  men  that 
you  felt  would  have  a  friendly  feeling  toward  the  city  of  Dayton  ? 

Mr.  ScHAX^Tz.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Po3ierexe.  And  because  of  your  desire  to  protect  the  law  ? 
Mr.  ScHAXTZ.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Did  you  make  out  any  of  these  accounts  which 
were  filed  with  the  Secretary  of  State  under  the  corrupt-practices  act  ? 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Poaierexe.  Did  you  have  in  mind  the  fact  or  did  you 
understand  that  these  funds  that  were  contributed  by  Mr.  Kettering 
and  the  other  gentlemen  who  Avere  connected  with  the  Dayton  Metal 
Products  Co.  were  being  contributed  by  their  corporation  or  by  them 
as  individuals  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Individuals  absolutely.  It  shows  on  the  face  of  it. 
beven  times  five  is  thirty-five  and  two  is  thirty-seven. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  These  funds,  as  I  understand  the  fact  to  be, 
and  you  will  correct  me  if  I  am  wrong  about  it,  were  charged  to  each 
of  these  gentlemen  on  the  books,  were  they  not  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  That  is  my  understanding  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Schantz,  to  follow  up  that  last  question,  you 
do  not  agree  Avith  the  sworn  testimony  of  Mr.  Scudder,  who  examined 
the  books  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  that  these  funds  when 
paid  back  to  these  individuals  were  paid  into  the  treasury  of  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ?   The  books  will  show  that. 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  I  made  the  statement  that  it  was  returned  to  Mr. 
Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  So  far  as  you  were  concerned,  they  were  returned 
to  the  individuals? 
Mr.  ScHAXTz.  Absolutel3\ 

Senator  Edge.  There  has  been  so  much  said  about  this  law  I  am 
a  little  curious  to  know  what  is  the  law  that  you  are  speaking  about 
so  frequently,  that  you  Avisli  to  preserve.  Just  in  a  ie^\  Avords,  what 
does  the  laAv  provide  i 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Senator,  there  is  the  father  of  the  laAv.  [In- 
dicating Hon.  John  A.  McMahon.]  I  suggest  a^ou  ask  Judge 
McMahon. 

Senator  Edge.  I  thought  Mr.  Schantz  could  tell. 
Mr.  McMahox.  He  could  not  tell. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  suggest  that  you  ask  Mr.  McMahon  to  tell 
for  the  benefit  of  the  record. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  this  particular  hnv,  as  briefly  as  possible? 

Mr.  McMahox.  The  first  idea  of  raising  the  $2,000,000  was  so  that 
they  could  make  the  protection  in  Dayton. 

182774— 20— PT  21  5 


2772 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Yes;  I  understand  that.  1  would  like  to  know  just 
the  law. 

Mr.  McMahon.  They  employed  engineers  and  when  they  came 
here  they  found  that  this  territory  was  susceptible  of  a  new  style  of 
improvement,  to  wit,  dams,  and  that  has  not  been  illustrated  or 
shown  here ;  so  that  the  question  Avas  then  put  up  to  me  as  the  attor- 
ney about  a  new  law.  There  was  no  law  on  the  statute  books  that 
was  comprehensive  enough  or  drastic  enough  to  form  new  districts, 
condemn  property,  etc.  So  the  engineers  and  Judge  Brown  and  my- 
self went  to  work  and  drew  this  law  of  about  65  sections,  called  the 
conservancy  act,  drafted  it  after  three  or  four  months'  close  investiga- 
tion, in  which  we  examined  the  laws  and  decisions  in  20  States  where 
there  were  similar  situations.  The  law  contemplated  very  drastic 
powers  of  condemnation.  We  could  even  condemn  or  we  were  given 
permission  to  condemn  the  property  of  the  State  of  Ohio  if  we 
wished.  We  were  given  the  right  to  assess  cities  and  we  were  given 
the  right  to  remove  railroads.  We  have  just  finished  moving  three. 
We  have  built  probably  30  or  40  miles  of  new  railroad. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  the  operation  of  the  act  confined  to  3^our 
particular  district? 

Mr.  McMahon.  No;  it  was  a  general  law,  but  it  was  understood 
that  it  was  a  law  that  would  only  be  practicable  probably  in  this 
district  of  nine  counties  running  from  Shelby  County  down  to  Cin- 
cinnati. Now,  here  is  where  the  trouble  arose;  it  contemplated  five 
dams  which  meant  the  corralling  of  the  water  at  periods  of*  high 
flood  and  it  would  flood  the  neighborhood  above  us.  There  is  where 
our  trouble  came.  The  counties  above  us  made  all  the  trouble  in  the 
world,  I  don't  know  how  many  lawsuits  I  have  had,  but  it  is  what 
we  call  the  dam  detention  system. 

Senator  Edge.  What  year  Avas  it  passed? 

Mr.  McMahon.  1914. 

Senator  Edge.  1914? 

Mr.  McMahon.  Yes.  We  didn't  get  the  district  established,  on 
account  of  the  litigation,  until  about  the  29tli  of  June,  1915. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  w^as  governor  in  1914  Avhen  the  law  was  passed  ? 

Mr.  McMahon.  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  He  Avas  goA'ernor  in  1914? 

Mr.  McMahon.  Yes,  sir;  and  he  assisted  us.  Mr.  Schantz  Avas  not 
right  in  stating  there  Avas  much  opposition  in  the  legislature  to  its 
passing.  It  passed  by  almost  a  tAvo-thirds  A^ote.  There  was  such  a 
demand  you  know,  that  it  passed,  but  the  opposition  came  after- 
Avards,  Senators. 

Senator  Edge.  I  Avill  ask  you  right  there  if  there  has  been  any 
effort  to  repeal  the  laAv  ? 

Mr.  McMahon.  Well,  I  am  not  able  to  say,  but  there  Avere  efforts 
in  the  legislature  to  amend  it  in  vital  Avays,  to  enibarrass  us  in  every 
way;  indeed  the  feeling  w^as  so  high  in  the  counties  north  of  us  that 
they  threatened  to  dynamite  our  works,  and  our  business  men  could 
hardly  go  there.  Senator,  you  ought  to  understand  the  matter  fairly 
Avell.  The  thing  that  troubled  the  people  in  Dayton  Avas  this,  that 
when  Gov.  Willis  took  the  nomination  in  1914  for  governor  he  opened 
his  campaign  up  in  this  flood  district  and  at  once  the  thing  Avas 
thrown  into  politics,  that  all  these  people  that  Avere  against  the  flood 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2773 


protection  matter  were  for  Willis  and  we  had  to  get  busy,  and  we  did 
get  busy. 

Senator  Edge.  Xow,  just  there,  Mr.  McMahon:  Gov.  Cox  has  not 
been  governor,  has  he,  continuously  since  1914  to  date  ? 

Mr.  McMahox.  No.  In  1916  he  became  governor  the  second  time; 
in  1916. 

Senator  Edge.  From  1914  to  1916  who  was  governor? 
Mr.  McMahox.  Gov.  Willis. 
Senator  Edge.  Gov.  Willis? 
Mr.  McMahon.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  This,  I  understand  you,  was  passed  in  1914? 
Mr.  McMahon.  Yes,  sir;  February.  1914. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  when  Gov.  Willis  was  governor  for  the  two 
'  succeeding  years  the  bill  was  not  in  an}^  way  impaired,  w^as  it  ? 

Mr.  McMapiox.  Well,  I  guess  Judge  Brown  can  answer  you  better 
than  I  can  on  that  subject. 

Senator  Edge.  The  bill  was  not  repealed,  was  it  i 
Mr.  McMahon.  No  ;  the  bill  was  not  repealed. 
Senator  Edge.  Was  it  amended? 

Mr.  McMahon.  No;  it  was  not  amended.  We  were  too  much  for 
them  in  the  courts,  and  we  Avere  too  much  for  them  in  the  legislature, 
and  we  were  too  much  for  them  in  the  elections. 

Senator  Edge.  I  did  not  mean  to  put  you  on  cross-examination.  I 
thank  -you  very  much  for  the  explanation. 

Mr.  McMahox.  Understand,  this  is  a  question.  This  gentleman 
[Mr.  Scliantz]  owns  $2,000,000  worth  of  property. 

Senator  Po^ierexe.  1  just  Avanted  to  ask  Mr.  McMahon  whether 
the  financial  provisions  of  this  law  were  made  broad  enough  so  as  to 
take  care  of  any  expenditures  which  may  have  been  incurred  in  this 
behalf  prior  to  the  enactment  of  the  law. 

Mr.  McMahox.  As  I  said,  that  fund  was  raised,  as  I  understood  it, 
with  the  expectation  that  it  would  be  devoted  to  flood  protection,  at 
the  beginning.  But  when  the  engineers  surveyed  the  ground  they 
found  a  situation  that  would  not  permit  of  the  flood  protection  by  a 
single  county.  Then  we  needed  the  law,  as  I  explained,  to  make 
a  district,  and  we  took  in  at  first  10  counties.  Then  we  had  to 
throw  out  one  county  and  made  it  nine  counties.  Then  we  adopted  a 
plan  by  which  the  district  was  to  be  taxed  according  to  benefits. 
We  taxed  the  cities.  The  citv  of  Davton  is  taxed.  I  think,  about 
$9,000,000  out  of  the  $23,000,000.  The*^  city  of  Hamilton  below  and 
the  city  of  Middletown  below  suffered  really  worse  than  v^e  did  in 
proportion — all  prosperous  cities — and  we  had  the  devil's  own  time 
with  a  good  many  cranks  and  a  good  many  good  men  in  protecting 
the  law,  but  we  had  it  so  buttressed  that  it  withstood  attacks  in  the 
Supreme  Court  of  Ohio  and  the  Circuit  Court  of  Appeals  of  Ohio 
,  and  the  Supreme  Court  of  the  United  States ;  and  we  are  still  fight- 
;  ing.  I  have  four  cases  on  my  hands  still. 

I  Senator  Pomekexe.  It  goes  without  saying  that  if  you  prepared  the 
law  it  was  properly  buttressed. 

Mr.  McMahox.  You  are  very  kind  to  say  so.  But  no  lawyer  coidd 
have  drawn  a  law  by  himself:  it  required  an  engineer;  and  no  engi- 
neer could  have  drawn  the  law ;  it  required  a  lawyer  as  well. 

Senator  Edge.  Thank  you  very  much  for  the  information,  Mr. 
McMahon. 


2774 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Schantz,  you  have  heard  Mr.  McMahon's  exphmation.  It  ap- 
pears Gov.  AA'illis  was  governor  during  the  two  years  following  adop- 
tion of  tliis  law  b}^  the  legishiture. 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Nothing  occurred  during  that  time  to  amend  the 
laAv  in  the  legislature?  • 

Mr.  Schantz.  No;  it  took  a  great  effort  on  the  part  of  the  citizens 
of  the  communities  affected.  They  were  obliged  to  journey  there; 
they  were  obliged  to  send  out  petitions — send  them  out  by  thou- 
sands   to  preserve  it. 

Senator  P^dge.  The  fact  remains,  however,  that  the  law  was  in  no 
way  changed? 

Mr.  Schantz.  It  was — — 

Senator  Edge.  During  that  period? 

Mr.  Schantz.  It  was  not  changed,  but  not  because,  in  my  own 
opinion,  of  Mr.  Willis.  It  was  because  of  the  great  difficulties  and 
the  interest  the  peo])le  took  in  it  in  journeying  there  and  petitioning. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  think  Mr.  Willis  w^ould  have  approved  a 
law  that  would  have  put  your  

Mr.  Schantz.  I  do  not  think  Mr.  Willis,  Senator,  can  appreciate 
or  could  have  ap])reciated  our  position. 

Senator  Edge.  But  let  me  formulate  my  question.  Do  you  think 
Gov.  Willis  would  have  ai)i)roved  of  a  law  repealing  this  law  or  so 
amending  this  law  that  it  would  put  this  district  in  jeopardy  after 
the  law  had  been  passed  and  became  a  part  of  the  statute  laws  of  your 
State? 

Mr.  Schantz.  So  far  as  1  was  concerned,  I  was  afraid  of  it. 
Senator  Edge.  You  were  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  fact  is  he  was  supported  by  all  those 
who  were  opposed  to  the  law  ? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  But  the  fact  remains  that  he  was  governor  for  the 
two  years  after  the  law  was  on  the  statute  books  and  it  was  not 
changed  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  And  we  maintained  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  ITnder  this  law  you  Avere  permitted,  as  I  thmk 
Judge  McMahon  said,  to  issue  bonds,  and  have  issued  bonds? 
Mr.  Schantz.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  When  did  you  secure  your  subscription  for  the 
local  association,  the  flood-prevention  association— the  voluntary  sub- 
scriptions?   During  Avhat  vears,  just  approximately? 

Mr.  Schantz.  1913. 

Senator  Edge.  You  started  at  that  time  ? 
Mr  Schantz.  Yes ;  right  after  the  flood. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  you  continued,  apparently,  from  the  evidence 
already  at  hand,  to  accept  subscriptions  to  that  fund  even  during 

1916?'  ^  , 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes ;  they  were  extended. 
Senator  Edge.  Continuously  ? 

Mr.  Schantz.  Yes,  sir.  ^      .    .         p  xu 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Avhen  you  received  subscriptions  alter  tne 
passage  of  this  act  in  1914,  of  course  it  was  apparent,  was  it  not,  to 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2775 


the  subscribers  that  they  would  be  reimbursed  by  the  returns  from 
the  sale  of  these  bonds  ? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  correct,  is  it  not? 
Mr.  ScHANTz.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  And  you  have  been  returning  the  subscriptions 
from  the  money  secured  by  the  sale  of  these  bonds  ? 

Mr.  ScHAXTz.  For  work  performed  by  the  engineers  and  preserv- 
ing of  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  And,  as  you  have  testified,  for  political  propaganda 
as  well? 

Mr.  ScHANTz.  As  I  say,  preserving  of  the  law. 
Senator  Edge.  Yes.   Thank  you. 

Mr.  McMahox.  Senator,  one  moment.  In  tliat  connection  you 
ought  to  know  this  bill  provided  that  the  conservancy  board  might 
take  over  and  pay  for  any  work  of  a  similar  character  that  would 
carry  out  the  enterprise ;  and  under  that  some  mone}^  was  refunded — 
I  do  not  know  how  much:  Mr.  Brown  has  all  those  figures. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WALTER  DAVIDSON,  VICE  PRESIDENT  CITY 
NATIONAL  BANK,  DAYTON,  OHIO. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge. 
Senator  Edge.  Give  your  full  name  and  j'Our  position. 
Mr.  Davidson.  Walter  Davidson,  vice  president  Citv  National 
Bank. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Davidson,  are  you  directly  familiar  Avith  the 
negotiation  of  a  note  on  the  part  of  Mr.  Cox  discounted  by  vour.bnnk 
in  August,  1917? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Only  by  the  record. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  the  records  with  you  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Will  you  turn  to  those  records? 

(At  this  point  Mr.  Davidson  produced  a  book  of  records.) 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  before  you  get  to  that,  let  me  help  you 
out.    AVhat  is  the  record  to  vdiich  you  are  now  referring? 

Mr.  Davidson.  This  is  the  discount  note  record. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right.  Just  read  the  item  or  Avhate\  er  refers  to 
it  there. 

Mr.  Daa'idson.  It  says,  on  Friday,  August  17,  1917.  a  note  was 
discounted. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Eeacl  the  entry  just  as  it  is  here,  and  then  you 
can  explain  anything  that  you  wish  afterwards. 

Mr.  Davidson  (reading).  "No.  3715,  demand.  James  M.  Cox, 
$5,000."    That  is  all  there  is  to  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  this  note  indorsed  by  any  other  party  or  cor- 
poration ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  I  do  not  thmk  so. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  here  is  the  note.  [Handing  paper  to  Mr. 
Davidson.]    Do  you  recognize  the  note? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  I  have  seen  the  note  in  the  bank;  it  is  the 
same  note. 


2776 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Do  your  records  show  hoAV  the  proceeds  from  that 
note  were  paid  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  The  records  ought  to  show  if  James  M.  Cox  got 
credit  on  it  to  his  account  on  that  date.  There  are  only  two  transac- 
tions on  a  note.  There  are  only  tw^o  ways  you  can  give  a  man  credit, 
and  that  is  by  crediting  his  account  or  cash. 

Senator  Edge.  Or  what? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Or  cash. 

Senator  Edge.  And  your  records  show  that  the  proceeds  of  this 
note  were  credited  to  his  account ;  is  that  correct  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  No  ;  it  does  not  show  that. 
Senator  Edge.  Then,  I  misunderstood  you. 
Mr.  Davidson.  As  I  say,  there  are  only  two  ways  it  could  be. 
Senator  Edge.  What  do  your  records  show? 

Mr.  Davidson.  If  the  record  does  not  show  it  is  credited  to  the  ac- 
count, then  it  must  be  that  he  got  cash  for  it,  although  I  can  not  show 
those  records,  because  the  cash  records  are  not  kept  longer  than  six 
months  on  an}^  cash  transaction. 

Senator  Edge.  When  you  pay  the  cash  upon  the  discount  of  a  note, 
do  you  not  require  a  check  from  the  man? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No;  we  do  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  had  the  note  discounted?    You  have  no  evi- 
dence of  a  check  in  a  case  of  that  kind? 
Mr.  Davidson.  No;  we  have  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  is  it  your  understanding  that  the  proceeds  of 
this  note  must  have  been  paid  to  Gov.  Cox  in  cash  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  That  must  have  been  the  case. 

Senator  Edge.  Has  Gov.  Cox,  or  did  he  have  at  that  time,  what 
is  known  in  banking  circles  as  an  active  account  in  your  bank? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  he  make  frequent  deposits? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes;  pretty  frequently. 

Senator  Edge.  Can.3^ou  give  us  from  the  deposit  record  just  a 
little  idea  of  his  deposits  for  the  three  or  four  weeks  surrounding 
that  period? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Surrounding  1917? 

Senator  Edge.  August,  1917. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  3^011  want  to  go  into  all  of  his  personal 
matters  here? 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  to  knoAV  who  the  checks  are  to,  but 
I  want  to  establish  the  particular  use  of  the  proceeds  of  this  note. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Wh}^  of  course,  if  you  are  following  that  par- 
ticular item  I  have  not  any  objection  to  your  going  into  it  just  as 
fully  as  you  want  to;  but  if  you  are  going  to  disclose  some  of  his 
personal  transactions  I  take  it  that  you  as  a  man  of  affairs  would 
feel  that  was  quite  an  improper  thing  to  do,  and  I  do  not  believe 
you  want  to  do  it. 

Senator  Ed(}e.  I  have  no  intention  of  doing  that  be^^ond  establish- 
ing the  fact,  if  it  be  a  fact,  that  this  particular  transaction  for  com- 
paign  purposes  was  contrary  to  his  usual  procedure.  I  think  that  is 
quite  a  necessary  question.  We  are  trying  to  decide  what  this  note 
was  used  for.  1  do  not  care  even  for  the  item,  if  there  is  any  ques- 
tion, if  you  can  just  give  me  approximately  the  number  of  deposits 
during  the  month  of  August. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2777 


Mr.  Davidsox.  1917?  He  had  about  a  dozen  deposits  in  that 
onth. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  joii  ever  discounted  an}^  other  notes  for  him  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes ;  Ave  have. 

Senator  Edge.  And  do  your  records  shoAV  that  they  have  been 
shed  in  the  same  way,  or  have  they  all  been  credited  to  his  account  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  WeW^  noAv,  that  is  something  I  could  not  tell  vou 
fFhand. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  give  us  the  record  for  a  month  or  two  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  It  does  not  show,  you  see,  on  these  statements;  it 
*ust  simply  shows  the  total  deposited  on  that  date;  it  does  not  state 
hether  it  is  a  note  or  what  it  is. 
Senator  Pomerene.  The  total  deposit  on  that  day  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes;  that  day;  just  one  item,  just  one  transaction. 
Senator  Pomekene.  What  date  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  August  17,  1917. 

Senator  Edge.  As  an  officer  of  the  bank,  Mr.  Davidson,  acquainted 
with  the  procedure  of  leading  depositors,  do  you  recall  yourself  any 
other  note  discounted  by  Gov.  Cox  that  the  cash  was  paid  him  rather 
than  crediting  his  account  in  the  usual  way  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No;  I  do  not  recall  anything  like  that;  in  fact,  at 
that  time  I  had  nothing  to  do  with  the  notes  of  the  bank. 

Senator  Edge.  Would  Mr.  Kief er  be  able  to  answer  those  questions  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Mr.  Kiefer  was  the  active  head  of  the  bank  at  that 
time. 

Senator  Edge.  When  Avas  this  note,  according  to  your  records, 
discharged  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  June  29,  1918. 
Senator  Edge.  Eead  the  entry  there. 

Mr.  Davidson  (reading).  "No.  3715;  J.  M.  Cox,  $5,000,  demand." 
Senator  Edge.  Does  your  record  show  who  paid  the  check  to  dis- 
charge the  note? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No  ;  we  do  not  keep  records  like  that ;  simply  keep 
the  payment  of  the  note,  that  is  all.  We  have  no  record  of  how  it 
is  paid. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  all  your  records  disclose  is  the  fact  of  the  note 
being  discounted  and  the  fact  that  it  is  not  credited  to  his  account, 
meaning  that  it  was  paid  in  cash,  and  then,  finally,  Avhen  it  was  paid 
off,  Avithout  any  record  as  to  Avho  paid  it ;  is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir ;  that  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  Avho  paid  it? 

Mr.  Davidson.  I  can  not  answer  that.   No,  sir ;  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  you  in  the  bank  at  the  time  this  note  was  dis- 
counted— in  the  banking  room  where  3^011  could  have  seen  the  trans- 
action ? 

Mr.  Daa^idson.  No;  I  did  not  know  a  thing  about  the  note  until 
after  it  got  in  the  files  and  I  happened  to  see  it. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all  for  the  present. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Davidson,  if  I  understood  you  correctly, 
in  ansAver  to  Senator  Edge  you  made  the  statement  that  when  that 
note  was  discounted  there  Avas  just  one  of  two  ways  of  disposing  of 
it,  either  to  pay  the  proceeds  in  cash  or  to  credit  his  account  with  it. 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 


2778 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Is  that  the  way  you  want  to  be  understood  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  those  are  the  two  general  ways.  Now,  once 
in  a  while  there  might  be  a  rare  case  where  they  would  get  it  in 
some  other  way. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  you  did  not  give  that,  and  that  is  what 
I  am  directing  my  questions  to. 
Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  he  may  

Mr.  Pomerene  (interposing).  Just  a  moment.  Let  me  put  the 
question  and  I  will  draw  it  out.  Suppose  I  were  to  go  to  3^our  bank 
and  discount  a  note,  and  I  would  say  to  3^011,  "  I  do  not  want  to 
open  an  account  here  and  I  do  not  want  cash ;  but  I  wish  you  would 
give  me  a  certificate  of  deposit  for  it."  Would  you  not  do  that  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  That  is  done  once  in  a  great  while. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes.  Could  that  have  been  done  in  this  in- 
stance ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  It  could  have  been  done. 

Senator  Edge.  Would  there  have  been  no  record  then? 

Mr.  Davidson.  We  would  have  a  record  showing  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  would  give  a  certificate  of  deposit  in  the 
way  I  have  indicated,  and  that  would  be  a  usual  way  in  banking 
circles,  would  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  It  is  done ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  so,  before  you  could  say  positively  that 
that  Avas  paid  in  cash,  in  fact,  you  would  want  to  investigate  your 
other  records  and  see  whether  or  not  a  certificate  of  deposit  or  some 
other  evidence  of  that  loan  was  not  there,  would  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  It  should  be  done  to  be  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  should  be  done,  and  that  might  have  been 
done,  might  it  not? 

Mr.  Davidson.  It  might  have  been  done. 

Mr.  Pomerene.  You  did  not  see  this  cash  paid  out? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No  ;  I  was  not  there  at  the  time. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  Senator  Edge  might  be  led  astray  if 
he  w^ere  to  conclude  that  because  it  was  not  credited  to  his  account, 
therefore  it  was  paid  out  to  him  in  currency  or  cash ;  is  not  that  true? 

Mr.  Davidson.  That  may  be  true ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Weil,  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  ask. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Davidson,  since  that  question  has  been  raised, 
your  subpcena  required  you  to  bring  to  this  hearing  any  records  of 
your  bank  that  would  show  the  disposition  of  the  proceeds  frorn  this 
note.  If  this  possibility  that  has  been  suggested  is  a  probability,  I 
would  like  you  to  hold  yourself  ready  to  come  back  to-morrow  and 
bring  any  records  of  certificates  of  deposit,  so  that  we  can  completely 
clear  up  that  question  that  has  been  raised. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  let  me  suggest  this,  too,  that  if  Senator 
Edge  was  to  go  to  3^our  bank  to  get  his  note  for  $5,000  discounted, 
he  might  tell  you  to  issue  that  certificate  of  deposit  to  me,  and  under 
those  circumstances  you  Avould  do  it,  would  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes ;  that  has  been  done. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Davidson,  were  you  present  in  the  banking 
house  when  Mr.  Scudder,  a  previous  witness,  called  and  discussed 
with  Mr.  Kief er  the  disposition  of  the  proceeds  of  this  note  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  I  do  not  believe  the  subject  was  brought  up  when 
I  was  there. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2779 


Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  believe  it  was? 
Mr.  Davidson.  That  subject;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  what  was  brought  up  when  you  were  there  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Oh,  it  was  some  other  transaction  involving  differ- 
ent funds  between  the  Talbotts  and  Kitterings,  but  it  was  not  this 
$5,000.    It  had  nothing  to  do  with  the  case  at  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Is  Mr.  Kiefer  associated  with  the  bank? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No  ;  he  is  not. 

Senator  Edge.  You  will  bring  the  certificate  of  deposit  to-morrow  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  May  I  ask  you  just  another  question  along 
that  line?  Have  you  not  some  savings  bank  connected  with  vour 
City  National  Bank? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes;  we  have  a  State  bank  that  is  a  part  of  our 
bank ;  that  is,  the  savings  department  of  our  bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Could  a  portion  of  this  transaction  appear  on 
the  books  of  your  bank  and  another  part  of  it  in  the  savings  bank? 

Mr.  Davidson.  It  is  a  separate  bank  entirely,  a  separate  incorpora- 
tion; and  they  keep  the  books  separately.  I  do  not  see  how  that 
could  have  appeared  part  in  one  bank  and  part  in  another. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  where  Mr.  Kiefer  is  employed  at  the 
present  time? 

Mr.  Davidson.  With  the  American  Finance  Co. 

Senator  Edge.  In  Dayton? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Daj^ton. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  know  whether  he  is  in  the  cit}^  or  not  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  I  think  he  has  been  away  all  week,  from  what  I 
understand. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Kiefer  seems  to  be  an  important  witness  in  this 
hearing.  The  question  has  been  raised  whether  cash  can  be  paid  out 
without  our  knowing  it.  The  hearing  will  stand  adjourned  until 
9.30  to-morrow  morning. 

(Thereupon,  at  4.45  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  adjourned  until 
to-morrow,  Friday,  October  8, 1920,  at  9.30  o'clock  a.  m.) 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


FRIDAY,  OCTOBER  8,  1920. 

United  States  Senate, 
Subcommittee  on  Privileges  and  Elections. 
The  subcommittee  met  pursuant  to  adjournment  at  9.30  o'clock 
a.  m.  in  the  Federal  courtroom,  Federal  Building,  Dayton,  Ohio, 
Senator  Walter  E.  Edge  presiding. 

Present :  Senators  Edge  and  Pomerene. 
Senator  Edge.  Is  Mr.  Davidson  here? 
Mv.  Davidson.  Here. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WALTER  D.  DAVIDSON— Resumed. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Davidson,  yesterday  in  giving  3^our  testimony 
the  question  was  raised  by  my  distinguished  colleague  that  perhaps 
there  might  be  a  third  method  where  a  note  was  discounted  and  a 
request  made  that  a  certificate  of  deposit  would  be  given  covering 
the  proceeds  of  the  note  rather  than  the  note  be  credited  to  the  man's 
account  or  be  paid  him  in  cash.  Can  you  advise  the  committee  as 
to  whether  this  possible  disposition  was  or  Avas  not  made  of  the  note 
discounted  by  Mr.  Cox  in  August,  1917? 

Mr.  Davidson.  That  was  August  10,  wasn't  it  ? 

Senator  Edge.  I  tliink  August  17. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  17th;  that  is  riglit. 

^Ir.  Davidson.  I  have  the  certificate  of  deposit  register  here  of 
that  month,  and  I  fin(]  notliing  issued  for  that  amount  to  that  name 
on  August  17. 

Senator  Edge.  That  leaves  tlie  matter,  as  I  understand  your  meth- 
i  ods  of  bookkeeping  in  the  City  National  Bank,  from  the  testimony 
you  have  already  given,  that  on  the  note  discounted  by  Gov.  Cox  in 
August,  1917,  tlie  jU'oceeds  in  cash  must  have  been  paid  to  (tov.  Cox; 
is  that  not  correct '( 

Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  that  is  the  way  it  Avould  seem  to  me. 

Senator  Eixje.  Well,  is  there  any  other  possible  disposition  of  the 
transaction  ( 

Mr.  Davidson.  I  have  brought  the  draft  register  showing  the 
drafts — the  drafts  issued  on  our  correspondent  of  New  York — and 
I  find  nothing  during  August  of  that  nature. 

Sena.toi'  Edc;]:.  Very  well.    Now,  I  want  to  ask  you  again,  not  for 
the  purpose  of  in  any  way  proving  Gov.  Cox's  personal  bank  transac- 
■  tion— I  am  not  in  the  slightest  degree  intere-ted  in  that— but  for  the 
ijPurpose  of  trying  to  ascertain  to  what  (lass  this  transaction  belongs: 


2782  PRESIDEXTIAL  CHAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

During  August,  without  asking  you  to  go  over  a  long  period  of  19 IT, 
did  Gov.  Cox  have  any  other  notes  discounted? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Xot  that  I  know  of. 

Senator  Edge.  As  far  as  your  knowledge  goes,  without  looking 
over  Gov,  Cox's  account,  do  you  recall  Gov.  Cox  ever,  when  notes 
were  discounted,  taking  the  cash  rather  than  having  them  credited  to 
his  account? 

Mr.  DAvn)soN.  Well,  the  usual  custom  was  to  have  it  credited  to 
his  account. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Pomekene.  Mr.  Davidson,  you  were  asked  by  my  col- 
league whether  or  not  this  money  was  not  paid  to  Gov.  Cox  in  cash; 
you  do  not  know  as  a  matter  of  fact  to  whom  it  was  paid,  do  you? 

Mr.  DAvn)S0N.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  do  not  know  how  it  was  paid? 
Mr.  DAvn)SON.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Assuming  for  the  sake  of  the  argument  that 
it  was  paid  in  cash,  would  that  not  appear  upon  your  books  in  any 

Vs^'dJ  ? 

Mr.  Da\'idson.  It  would  appear  upon  the  teller's  record  at  the  time 
that  he  ])aid  the  money  out  in  cash,  but  those  records  were  never  kept 
longer  than  six  months. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  if  it  were  paid  in  actual  currency  or 
cash,  the  only  record  that  would  appear  of  it  would  be  in  the  teller's 
record  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Po:viERENE.  And  that  teller's  record  has  been  destroyed? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  any  duplicate  or  copy  of  it? 
Mr.  Davidson.  "We  could  not  furnish  you  one. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Would  there  be  any  transfer  of  these  items 
from  the  teller's  record  to  any  otlier  record  in  the  bank? 
Mr.  Davidson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Which  would  enable  you  to  trace  it? 
Mr.  Davidson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  at  any  time  examine  the  teller's  rec- 
ord, so  as  to  permit  you  to  testify  as  to  Avhat  it  showed,  if  anything,, 
in  that  behalf  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  AVe  liave  no  record  other  than  teller's  record:  we 
have  no  record  of  teller's  cash  transaction  longer  than  six  months 
from  the  time  it  has  taken  place. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  had  nothing  whatsoever  to  do  with, 
this  transaction? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Wlio  was  president  of  the  bank  at  the  time 
that  this  occurred  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  H.  E.  Talbott,  inactive. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Sir? 

Mr.  Davidson.  He  was  inactive,  I  say. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  he  about  the  bank  a  good  deal? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No:  not  very  much. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  he  was  a  member  of  the  board 
of  directors? 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  that  wa}^  gave  some  attention  to  it. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2783 


Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  he  a  member  of  the  discount  committee, 
or  somethino-  akin  to  that? 

Mr.  Davidson.  We  have  a  discount  committee. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  Was  he  a  member  of  that  discount  committee  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  He  has  never  served  as  such. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  ask. 

Mr.  McMahon.  May  I  suggest  a  question? 

(At  this  point  Mr.  "McMahon  consulted  with  Senator  Pomerene.) 
Senator  Pomerene.  What  is  the  title  of  your  bank  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  City  National  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  these  are  the  books  of  the  City  National 
Bank? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Have  you  a  savings  bank  in  connection  with 
that? 

Mr.  Davidson.  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank  is  the  name  of  it. 
Senator  Pomerene.  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  they  occupying  substantially  the  same 
building? 

Mr.  Davidson.  A  se])arate  building,  but  the  doors  adjoin. 
Senator  Pomerene.  So  in  effect  it  is  one  and  the  same  building? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Practically  so,  except  that  it  is  under  a  separate 
corporation. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  stockholders  in  the  two  banks  are  the 
same  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  The  same. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  are  the  oflicers  the  same? 
Mr.  Davidson.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  are  the  directors  the  same  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  The  directors  are  the  same. 

Senator  Pomerene.  But  the  executive  officers  are  different  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  The  president  of  one  bank  is  the  president  of  the 
other,  but  I  am  not  vice  president  of  the  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  there  different  cashiers  or  treasurers  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  The  secretary  and  treasurer  are  different. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  relations  between  these  two  banks 
have  always  been  very  intimate,  have  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Very  close;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  a  stockholder  in  the  one  bank  is  neces- 
sarily a  stockholder  in  the  other? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  by  the  arrangement  you  have  ? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  long  has  that  condition  existed? 
Mr.  Davidson.  Since  about  1909  or  1910,  when  I  think  that  bank 
was  formed. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Many  of  the  customers  in  the  one  bank  or 
clients  of  one  bank  are  clients  of  the  other  bank. 
Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  some  of  them ;  yes. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Davidson,  I  don't  want  your  testimony  to  be 
confusing,  and  I  am  sure  you  don't.    Did  you  not  just  testify  in 


2784 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


answer  to  a  question  from  me  that  according  to  your  bookkeeping- 
system  the  proceeds  of  this  note  must  have  been  paid  in  cash,  oi:  your 
bookkeeping  S3^stem  woidd  have  demonstrated  otherwise? 
Mr.  Davidsox.  That  is  what  I  said ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  after  that,  in  answer  to  a  query  from  Senator 
Pomerene,  if  I  foUoAved  your  reply,  you  suggested  the  thought  that 
because  the  teller's  cash  record,  or  whatever  you  term  it,  was  destroyed 
every  six  months;  that  there  might  have  been,  in  some  way  that  I 
couldn't  folloAv,  something  on  that  record  that  would  imply  other- 
wise; did  3^ou  mean  to  give  such  an  impression  as  that? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No;  I  don't  believe  I  said  it  just  that  way. 

Senator  Edge.  I  don't  think  you  did,  but  the  inference  was  some- 
what uncertain.    You  didn't  mean  that? 

Mr.  Davidson.  No  ;  not  in  that  sense ;  no. 

Senator  Edge.  So  there  was  nothing  that  could  have  appeared 
on  the  teller's  cash  record  that  would  have  in  any  way  changed  the 
fact  established  by  your  bookkeeping  system  that  the  proceeds  of  this 
note  must  have  been  paid  to  Mr.  Cox  in  cash ;  is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Well,  if  we  can't  find  it  on  our  books  in  any  shape, 
manner,  or  form,  there  really  is  onty  one  other  way  it  can  be  paid,  and 
that  is  in  cash.  That  is  the  way  I  should  see  it. 

Senator  Edge.  You  said  that  Mr.  Talbott  was  the  president  of  the 
bank,  but  w\as  not  active.  Who  is  the  active  head,  or  who  was  the 
active  head  of  the  bank  at  that  time? 

Mr.  Davidson.  Mr.  Kiefer  at  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Kiefer  ?   .  • 

Mr.  Davidson.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  GAEL  J.  SHERER,  SECRETARY  AND  TREAS- 
URER OF  THE  DAYTON-WRIGHT  CO.,  DAYTON,  OHIO. 

The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  your  full  name  and  business  connection  to  the 
committee. 

Mr.  Sherek.  Carl  J.  Sherer,  secretarv  and  treasurer  of  the  Davton- 
Wright  Co.,  Dayton,  Ohio. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  treasurer  at  the  present  time  of  the  Davton 
Metal  Products  Co.? 

Mr.  Sheree.  No;  at  the  present  time  the  Daj^ton  Metal  Products 
Co.  stands  dissolved.   It  has  surrendered  its  charter. 

Senator  Edge.  The  company  has  gone  out  of  business,  then  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  You  were  the  treasurer  of  the  companv  during  191T 
and  1918? 

Mr.  Sherer.  During  the  early  part  of  1917 — I  think  it  was  about 
April  or  so  when  I  went  into  that  office. 

Senator  Edge.  1917;  and  did  you  remain  in  that  office  during  the 
summer  or  during  June,  1918? 

Mr.  Sherer.  I  did. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Sherer,  have  you  the  books  of  the  company 
with  you? 

Mr.  Sherer.  I  have. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2785 


Senator  Edge.  Will  you  put  them  in  evidence? 
Mr.  Sherer.  There  are  a  whole  lot  of  them. 

Senator  Edge.  Bring  them  here  and  we  will  see  what  we  want  after 
you  get  them  here. 

(The  books  referred  to  ^^ere  thereupon  submitted  by  Mr.  Sherer.) 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Scudder,  will  3^ou  take  your  position  near  the 
stand?  You  have  already  been  sworn.  I  may  have  to  corroborate 
some  of  this  information  I  want  to  get. 

Mr.  Sherer,  will  you  turn  to  the  item  or  any  entry  in  those  books 
showing  pavment  of  $7,000  to  Messrs.  Talbott,  Deeds,  and  Kettering 
in  October,  "^1917  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  There  are  no  entries  showing  payment  of  $7,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  turn  to  whatever  represents  that  particular 
transaction. 

(Mr.  Sherer  thereupon  produced  certain  papers.) 

Senator  Edge.  Turn  to  their  account  showing  allowances  charged 
to  them,  which  will  ansAver  the  same  purpose. 

Mr.  Sherer.  On  October  6,  1916,  check  payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott, 
amount  $6,500,  charged  to  E.  A.  Deeds  in  the  amount  of  $2,000,  C.  F. 
Kettering  $2,000;  and  H.  E.  Talbott  $2,500. 
,   Senator  Edge.  Are  there  any  fiu'ther  items  ? 
:   Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  What  is  the  date  of  that? 

Mr.  Sherer.  October  6. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Of  1916? 

Mr.  Sherer.  October  6,  1916. 
;   Senator  Edge.  October  6,  1916? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Follow  that  along  and  give  the  record  any  addi- 
tional items  that  were  credited  to  those  accounts. 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  were  charged  to  those  accounts  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Charged  to  those  accounts.  I  see  the  name  Tal- 
bott; does  that  mean  anj^thing? 

Mr.  Sherer.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  October  24,  1916,  seems  to  be  the  next  item  charged 
to  this  particular  account.    See  if  that  is  entered  there. 

Mr.  Sherer.  October  24,  1916,  we  have  check  to  H.  E.  Talbott  for 
56,000,  charged  in  equal  amounts  of  $2,000. 

Senator  Edge.  To  whom? 

Mr.  Sherer.  In  equal  amount  to  E.  A.  Deeds,  C.  F.  Kettering,  and 
H.E.  Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  the  next  item  similarly  entered. 

Mr.  Sherer.  Another  of  the  same  date,  October  24,  payable  to 
H.  E.  Talbott,  E.  A.  Deeds— or  payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott  for  the 
imount  of  $6,000. 

Senator  Edge.  Yes. 

Mr.  Sherer.  Charged  in  equal  amounts  to  E.  A.  Deeds,  C.  F.  Tal- 
30tt,  and  H.  E.  Talbott,  all  for  the  amount  of  $2,000  apiece. 
Senator  Edge.  You  have  accounted  now  for  $18,000,  have  you  not? 
Mr.  Sherer.  We  have. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  the  next  entry  similarly  charged;  Novem- 
)er  2,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  November  2,  check  No.  5052,  payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott, 
for  the  amount  of  $5,000,  charged  to  the  account  of  H.  E.  Talbott 
ipecial. 


2786  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  these  other  items  of  $6,000  each,  so  far  as 
they  relate  to  Mr.  Talbott,  charged  to  the  account  of  H.  E.  Talbott 
special  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  part  that  relates  to  Talbott  was  charged  to  H.  E. 
Talbott  special. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  what  I  meant.    Now,  the  next  item? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Was  November  6,  payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr.,  the 
amount  $5,000  charged  to  the  account  of  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  that  the  same  Mr.  Talbott  you  have  just 
given  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  the  son. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  does  that  appear  in  the  ledger  to  the  account 
of  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr.,  or  is  it  in  any  way  transferred  to  the  account 
of  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr. 

Mr.  Sherer.  It  at  that  time  appeared  charged  to  the  account  oi 
H.  E.  Talbott,  jr. 

Senator  Edge.  And  was  afterwards  transferred  to  the  special  ac 
count  of  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr. 

Mr.  Sherer.  No:  it  was  never  transferred  to  the  special  accouni 
of  H.  E.  Talbott,  sr. 

Senator  Edge.  That  covers  the  payment  of  these  checks  from  th( 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  to  Mr.  Talbott  for  these  amounts  as  yoi 
lia^  e  stated  ? 

'Mr.  Sherer.  To  Mr.  Talbott  and  Mr.  Talbott,  jr. 

Senator  Edge.  To  apply  and  to  be  charged  to  these  three  account: 
and  Mr.  Talbott,  jr.,  as  you  have  testified? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  right. 

Senator  Edge.  What  entries  have  you  showing  the  return  of  thesi 
accounts  in  order  to  balance  them  ?  '  Have  you  any  entries  in  you: 
ledger  that  balance  these  accounts? 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  mean  tlie  money,  do  you  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Yes;  the  return  of  this  money? 

^^Ir.  Sherer.  On  May  3,  1918,  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Cc 
received  a  check  

Senator  Pomerene  (interposing).  Will  you  excuse  me  just  a  mm 
ute  for  the  purpose  of  identification?  What  is  this  record  to  whic^ 
vou  have  been  referring  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  This  is  what  we  call  the  check  register. 

Senator  Edge.  Proceed,  Mr.  Sherer. 

Mr.  Sherer.  On  May  3,  1918,  we  received  a  check  in  the  amoun 
of  $12,679.38,  which  was  stated  April  4, 1918. 

Senator  Edge.  The  check  was  dated  April  4,  1918,  but  was  turne 
into  the  treasury  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  on  May  what? 

Mr.  Sherer.  May  3,  1918. 

Senator  Edge.  May  3,  1918? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Or  at  least  entered  in  their  cash  book  on  tliat  date? 
Senator  Edge.  And  the  amount  was  what? 
Mr.  Sherer.  $12,679.38. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  there  any  other  cash  returned  to  apply  to  tin 

account?  .     ^      ,    ^  ji  <un 

Mr.  Sherer.  On  May  3,  1918,  we  received  a  check  tor  $6,o(4.ol 

this  check,  however,  dated  September  8,  1917. 

Senator  Edge.  The  check  so  dated  September  8, 191  < ,  was  paid  int 

the  treasury  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  May  3, 1918? 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2787 


Mr.  Sherer.  Or  at  least  credited  by  them  on  that  date. 
Senator  Edge.  Any  other  checks  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  On  September  20,  1918,  a  check  in  the  amount  of 
I  $1,32-1.33,  dated  September  19,  1918. 
'     Senator  Edge.  Any  others? 

Mr.  Sherer.  On  October  11,  1918,  a  check  in  the  amount  of 
j  $1,324.33,  dated  September  24,  1918. 
•     Senator  Edge.  Any  others  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  all  at  that  time — the  balances  having  been 
transferred  and  paid  in  another  manner — the  balances  on  the  origi- 
nal advances. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  That  is,  you  mean  the  balances  on  these  ad- 
vances about  which  you  testified  a  moment  ago  ? 
Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  as  I  total  the  amounts  paid  out  by  the  cor- 
poration to  Mr.  Talbott  to  be  charged  to  these  separate  accounts  it 
totals  $28,500 ;  is  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  And  the  amounts  that  you  have  testified  as  reim- 
^  bursing.that  same  account  amount  to  $21,902.54;  is  that  correct? 
Mr.  Sherer.  That,  too,  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  That  leaves  a  balance  of  $6,597.46  required  to 
i  balance  that  special  account.   Is  that  correct? 
Mr.  Sherer.  That  balance  is  correct. 
Senator  Edge.  How  was  that  discharged? 

Mr.  Sherer.  There  w^ere  journal  entries  made  on  December  7,  1918, 
I  charging  the  following  amounts  against  the  following  individuals: 
Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott,  $2,451.40;  C.  F.  Kettering,  $2,073.03;  and  the 
I  balance  of  $2,073.03  was  permitted  to  stand  in  an  account  called 
Sundry  stockholders  and  others." 

Senator  Edge.  What  does  that  mean  ?   Profit  and  loss  ? 
Mr.  Sherer.  It  does  not.    It  means  that  certain  stockholders  and 
others  ^yere  concerned  with  that  account.    I  might  explain  that  this 
1  balance  that  Ave  spoke  of,  $6,597.46,  rested  in  that  same  account  of 
sundry  stockholders  and  others  "  prior  to  the  charge  to  the  indi- 
viduals. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  that  is  a  pending  account  ? 
Mr.  Sherer.  It  is  a  pending  account  for  later  distribution.   I  men- 
,  tioned  tliat  the  balance  of  $2,073.03  remained  in  that  account  of 
;  *'  sundry  stockholders  and  others  "  until  September  15,  1919,  at  whicii 
time  there  was  a  merger  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  with  the 
.  General  Motors  Corporation,  and  at  the  time  of  the  merger  the 
liquid  assets  of  the  company  were  transferred  to  the  Dayton  Securi- 
'  ties  Co.,  and  in  that  transfer  this  balance  against  "  sundry  stock- 
t  holders  and  others  "  was  transferred  to  the  Dayton  Securities  Co. 
Senator  Edge.  As  an  asset  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  As  an  asset,  and  they  received  payment  in  the  form 
J  of  ii  check  from  E.  A.  Deeds  on  January  27,  1920,  represented  in  a 
]  check  amounting  to  $3,764.69. 

k  Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  in  that  check  was  included  the  bal- 
n  ance  due  the  company,  or  transferred  to  the  securities  company, 
y  amounting  to  $2,073.03  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  right. 

182774— 20— PT  21  G 


2788 


PRESIDENTIAL  CHAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Eixje.  Can  you  give  us  any  information  as  to  the  form  of 
these  checks?  First,  th^^  check  paid  to  Mr.  Talbott  to  be  charged 
to  these  accounts  was  what  kind  of  a  check,  signed  in  what  way  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  first  check  of  $6,500  was  payable  to  H.  E.'  Tal- 
bott, signed  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  P^dge.  By  an3^one  as  an  officer? 

Mr.  Sherer.  By  H.  E.  Talbott  as  president  and  A.  O.  Davidson  as 
auditor. 

Senator  Edge.  When  these  various  amounts  Avere  returned  to  the 
treasury  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  what  was  the  form  of 
the  remittance? 

Mr.  Sherer.  In  the  first  place,  the  check  for  $12,679.38.  credited 
on  May  3,  1918,  was  on  the  Dayton  Savings  &  Trust  Co.,  signed  by 
Adam  Schantz,  special,  payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott,  indorsed  by  H.  E. 
Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  check  afterwards  deposited? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  see  if  I  get  that.  You  say  that  was  a 
check  payable  to  whom  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Payable  to  H.  E.  Talbott. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Signed  by  whom  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Indorsed  by  H.  E.  Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  And  signed  by  whom  ? 

Mr.  ScHERER.  Signed  by  Adam  Schantz,  special.  . 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  check  later  deposited  in  the  account  of  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  as  a  remittance  to  the  company  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  It  was  deposited  in  the  regular  manner  along  with 
their  other  receipts. 

Senator  Edge.  Indorsed  necessarily  "  Dayton  Metal  Products 
Co.?" 

Mr.  Sherer.  Necessarily. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  in  other  Avords,  the  money  paid  to  Mr.  Tal- 
bott to  be  charged  to  the  personal  accounts  of  three  officers  or  attaches 
of  the  company,  came  back  to  the  company  in  the  form  of  a  check  or 
checks  signed  by  "Adam  Schantz,  special,"  receiA^ed  by  the  officers 
of  the  company  and  deposited  in  the  account  of  the  company.  That 
is  correct,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct,  Avith  the  one  exception  that  all  the 
checks  Avere  not  signed  in  the  same  manner. 

Senator  Edge,  t  Avill  not  bother  to  get  the  details  of  that.  That 
does  seem  to  enter  into  it  particularly.  Let  me  see  those  checks,  Avill 
you,  please  ?  [Witness  hands  checks  to  Senator  Edge.]  I  see  one  of 
these  checks,  the  one  dated  October  24,  1916,  to  the  order  of  H.  E. 
Talbott,  signed  by  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  by  H.  E.  Talbott, 
president,  is  draAvn  on  the  American  Exchange  National  Bank,  of 
New  York. 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Has  your  company  kept  an  account  there  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  We  had  two  principal  accounts  at  that  time,  one  at 
the  City  National,  of  Da3^ton,  and  the  other  in  New  York. 

Senator  Edge.  In  August,  1917,  I  think  you  testified,  Mr.  Talbott 
Avas  president  of  the  company,  AAdiich  is  CAddenced  by  the  checks. 
What  connection  did  Mr.  Deeds  have  Avith  the  compan}'  at  that  time? 

Mr.  Sherer.  In  August,  1917  ? 


PEESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES.  2789 

1^  Senator  Edge.  Or  at  the  time  of  these  checks — October.  i9iG.  I 
!  mean. 

.Mr.  SiiEiiER.  In  1916  Mr.  Deeds  was  a  stockhohler  of  the  Dayton 
i  Metal  Products  Co. 

Senator  Edoe.  Was  he  an  officer  ( 

Mr.  Sherer.  I  think  that  Mr.  Deeds  was  one  of  the  vice  presidents. 
Senator  Edge.  What  Avas  Mr.  Kettering's  connection  i 
Mr.  Sherer.  Mr.  Kettering  was  a  vice  president. 
Senator  Edge.  How  many  vice  presidents  did  you  have  ( 
Mr.  Sherer.  I  think  we  had  those  two. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  the  president  and  two  vice  presidents  were 
j  the  gentlemen  who  carried  out  this  transaction  i 

•     ^Ir.  Sherer.  Yes:  but  I  am  not  absolutely  sure  about  Col.  Deeds 
j  having  been  a  vice  president  of  the  company  at  that  time. 
■     Senator  Edge.  What  connection  did  the  Dayton  ^.letal  Products 
I  Co.  have  with  the  Dayton-Wright  Aeroplane  Co.  ( 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  owned  the  stock  of 
i  the  Dayton- Wright  Aeroplane  Co..  with  the  exception  of  certain 
f  qualifying  shares. 
'     Senator  Edge.  How  many  shares  ( 

Mr.  Sherer.  Eive  shares. 

Senator  Edge.  Qualifying  for  the  purpose  of  being  directors? 
Mr.  Sherer.  Yes.  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Mr.  Sherer.  how  many  stockholders  were  there 
in  this  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ( 

Mr.  Sherer.  There  were  three  chief  stockholders. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  That  is  all  I  care  about. 

Mr.  Sherer.  Four  chief  stockholders.  I  would  say. 

vSenator  Pomerexe.  And  they  were  Mr.  Tall^ott.  Mr.  Kettering,  and 
Mr.  Deeds. 

.  Mr.  Sherer.  And  Mr.  Talbott.  jr. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  And  Mr.  Talbott.  jr.  ^ 
Mr.  Sherer.  But  he  of  lesser  amount. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  Talbott.  jr..  was  of  lesser  amount  i 
Mr.  Sherer.  Yes.  sir. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Each  one  of  these  principal  stockholders  re- 
ceived checks  from  time  to  time  for  substantial  amounts,  did  they  not  ^ 
Mr.  Sherer.  They  did. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  as  they  received  these  checks  they  were 
charged  to  their  several  accounts  ( 
Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Each  of  these  men  that  you  have  named — I  am 
speaking  now  of  these  principal  stockholders — was  very  largely  inter- 
ested in  the  conservancy  proposition  here,  was  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  They  were. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  they  were  aiding  the  cause  of  conservancy 
not  only  with  their  personal  services,  but  with  their  finances  as  well  ? 
Mr.  Sherer.  It  is  a  matter  of  public  knowledge  in  the  community. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  a  matter  of  public  knowledge  { 
Mr.  Sherer.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  These  checks  that  you  speak  of  as  having  been 
drawn  j^ayable  to  the  order  of  H.  E.  Talbott  were  given  to  him, 
and  at  the  time  they  were  given  to  him  they  were  not  charged  to  his 


2790 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


account  only,  but  they  were  divided  and  charged  to  these  three  sev- 
eral principal  stockholders? 
Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  So  that,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  it  was  a  pay- 
ment to  each  of  the  three  stockholders  and  not  a  payment  to  the  in- 
dividual, Talbott,  alone? 

Mr.  Sherer.  In  effect  it  Avas. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  was  as  if  separate  checks  had  been  drawn 
payable  to  each  of  those  several  stockholders? 
Mr.  Sherer.  Exactly  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  the  mone}^  wdiich  came  primarily  out 
of  the  treasury  of  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  went  to  these  in- 
dividual stockholders  and  they  disposed  of  it  as  individuals  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  charges  Avere  made  to  them  as  indi- 
viduals ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  charges  in  the  first  place  were  made  to  them  as 
individuals. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  effect,  it  simply  saved  the  manual 
labor  of  drawing  the  three  separate  checks  ? 
Mr.  Sherer.  In  effect,  that  is  what  was  done. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  testified,  in  answer  to  Senator 
Edge's  question,  that  certain  sums  w^ere  returned  later  on  to  the  com- 
pany by  different  checks.  Was  that  return  made  to  the  company  or 
to  the  individuals? 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  return  was  made — the  $12,679.38  check  was  re- 
turned to  Mr.  Talbott  and  by  him  indorsed  to  the  company. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  went  into  the  company's  cash? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  went  into  the  company's  cash. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What,  if  any,  entry  was  made  on  the  indi- 
vidual account  of  each  of  these  principal  stockholders? 

Mr.  Sherer.  At  that  time  the  money  was  credited  to  the  profit  and 
loss  account. 

Senator  Pomerene.  To  the  profit  and  loss  account  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  At  that  time  the  mone}^  was  credited  to  H.  E.  Talbott. 
I  stand  corrected  on  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Then  what  was  done  with  it  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  And  later  it  was  transferred  to  profit  and  loss.  Do 
you  want  these  otlier  later  entries  ? 

Senator  ^*omerene.  That  was  disposed  of  later  on  in  the  final  dis- 
tribution of  the  profits  of  the  company,  was  it  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  was  later  taken  out  of  profit  and  loss  and 
charged  to  sundry  stockholders  and  others. 

Senator  Edge.  Give  the  date  of  that. 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  was  on  December  7.  1918,  there  was  an  entry 
made  crediting  surplus  and  charging  sundry  stockholders  and  others. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  a  portion  of  that  go  to  each  of  these  sev- 
eral principal  stockholders? 

Mr.  Sherer.  The  remainder,  after  crediting  the  cash  or  after 
transferring  the  cash  to  this  "  sundry  stockholders  and  others  "  ac- 
count, was  distributed  in  equal  parts  or  in  the  proportions  previously 
testified  to. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So,  as  a  matter  of  fact,  then,  Avhile  this  money 
did  go  into  the  companj^s  treasury  it  later  Avas  distributed  among 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2791 


the  stockholders,  I  take  it,  in  proportion  to  their  several  holdings — 
that  is,  taking  into  account  those  advances  Avhich  had  theretofore 
been  made  to  the  principal  stockholders  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Yes;  that  is  it.  It  is  almost  in  one-third  portion, 
Mr.  Talbott's  being  just  a  little  in  excess  of  one-third. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  mean  when  the  company  was  dissolved  it 
was  returned? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  not  testify  that  this  money  went  directly 
into  the  treasury  of  the  company  and  was  not  transferred  back  to 
these  accounts  after  that  time? 

Mr.  Sherer.  No  ;  I  did  not  testify  that  it  was  not  later  transferred. 
I  did  not  intend  to  if  I  did.  Senator  Edge. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  ask  a  question  later  about  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  company  at  this  time  was,  I  take  it,  doing 
a  business  very  large  in  amount? 

Mr.  Sherer.  This  company  was  doing  very  extensive  contracting. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  stated,  I  believe,  that  each  of  these  three 
stockholders  were  taking  a  very  active  interest  in  the  aiding  of  the 
conservancy  cause  here? 

Mr.  Sherer.  I  did  mention  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  interest  was  active  from  the  date  of 
the  flood,  or  immediately  after  the  flood,  down  to  even  the  present 
time? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  is  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all  I  Avant  to  inquire. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Sherer,  you  developed  a  new  situation  there,  in 
answer  to  one  of  Senator  Pomerene's  questions,  about  which  I  Avould 
like  to  have  a  little  enlightenment.  I  understood  you  to  say  that 
when  this  check  for  $12,000  and  odd  was  received  it  was  put  in  the 
profit  and  loss  account?   Is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Sherer.  When  the  $12,000  check  was  received,  it  was  credited, 
in  the  first  place,  to  Mr.  H.  E.  Talbott. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  Avhat  happened? 

Mr.  Sherer.  Together  with  that  $674.50  check  that  was  also  men- 
tioned in  the  testimony.  Then  there  was  an  entry  transferring  that 
from  the  account  of  H.  E.  Talbott  to  profit  and  loss. 

Senator  Edge.  AVhy  was  that  done? 

Mr.  Sherer.  That  was  done  because  it  happened  during  the  year 
1918,  and  the  original  amount  had  been  closed  off  to  expense  prior 
to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  The  original  amount  had  been  closed  off  to  expense 
prior  to  that? 
Mr.  Sherer.  Prior  to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  these  gentlemen  were  practically  relieved 
from  the  charge,  if  it  was  charged  off  to  expense,  Avere  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  They  were  relieved  for  the  time  being  of  the  charge. 

Senator  Edge.  And  when  it  was  discovered  that  this  money  could 
be  paid  back  in  this  circuitous  manner  it  was  brought  back  as  a  live 
account?    Is  that  what  we  are  to  understand? 

Mr.  Sherer.  I  do  not  know  for  what  reason  it  was  brought  back, 
but  it  w^as  brought  back  by  a  charge  to  the  "  sundry  stockholders  and 
others"  account. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  sufficient. 


2792 


prestdp:ntial  c^ampatgn  expenses. 


Senator  P()mp:rexe.  Let  me  ask  you  this:  Can  you  state  how  much 
money  Mr.  Talbott  contributed  to  this  cause  of  conservancy  ? 
Mr,  SiiEKER.  I  coukl  not  state  that. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Or  Mr.  Kettering? 
Mr.  ShepvER.  I  couhl  not  state. 

Senator  Po:merene.  Or  Mr.  Deeds?    You  have  no  knowledge? 
Mr.  Sherer.  Only  general  knowledge  that  they  were  large  con- 
tributors. 

Senator  Pomerene.  They  were  among  the  largest  contributors  in 
the  city  of  Dayton,  were  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Sherer.  It  is  generally  understood  so. 
Senator  P2dge.  Are  you  a  lawyer,  Mr.  Sherer? 
Mr.  SnERp]R.  I  am  not. 

Senator  Edge.  I  shall  not  ask  you  any  legal  questions,  then. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all  i  care  to  inquire. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CLARENCE  KEIFER. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge.) 
Senator  Edge.  Give  your  full  name,  please. 
Mr.  Keieer.  Clarence  Keifer. 
Senator  Edge.  Your  present  business  connection. 
Mr.  Keifer.  American  Einance  &  Investment  Co.    I  am  the  treas- 
urer of  that  company. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  Dayton? 

Mr.  Keifer.  Of  Da3^ton ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  position  were  you  occupying  in  August,  1917  ? 
Mr.  KiEFER.  I  believe  I  was  vice  president  of  the  Citj^  National  at 
that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Vice  president  of  the  City  National  Bank? 
Mr.  Keifer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  As  vice  president,  what  were  your  general  duties? 

Mr.  Keifer.  Practically  in  charge  of  the  bank.  I  was  the  execu- 
tive officer  of  the  bank. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  personally  acquainted  with  James  M. 
Cox? 

Mr.  Keifer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  Gov.  Cox  a  depositor  during  that  time  ? 
Mr.  Keifer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  familiar  with  the  transaction  which  con- 
sisted of  Gov.  Cox's  discounting  a  note  for  $5,000  in  August,  1917. 
in  your  bank? 

Mr.  Keifer.  I  remember  Ave  had  such  a  note;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  Gov.  Cox  come  to  the  bank  after  the  note  had 
been  discounted  for  the  purpose  of  cashing  the  note,  to  your  knowl- 
edge ? 

Mr.  Keifer.  I  am  not  sure  exactly  what  became  of  that. 
Senator  Edge.  You  are  not  sure? 

Mr.  Keifer.  The  money  was  either  paid  out  in  the  shape  of  cash 
or  a  certificate  or  something  of  that  kind.    I  do  not  remember. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Mr.  Keifer,  we  had  sufficient  evidence  as  to 
the  bank's  method  of  keeping  books.  Did  vou  or  did  you  not  see 
Gov.  Cox  


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2793 


Mr.  Keifer.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Wait  a  minute.    You  did  not  see  Gov.  Cbx? 
Mr.  Keifer.  I  did  not  see  Gov.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  When  am  I  assuming  you  did  not  see  Gov.  Cox  ? 
Mr.  Keifer.  On  this  note  transaction.   That  is  what  we  are  talking 
about. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  think  the  witness  had  the  right  to  assume 
that  is  what  you  were  talking  about.  You  were  speaking  about  the 
note. 

Senator  Edge.  You  did  not  see  Gov.  Cox  in  your  banking  house 
receiving  currency  in  exchange  for  the  discount  of  that  $5,000  note? 

]Mr.  Keifer.  I  am  pretty  sick.  I  think  you  had  better  let  me  get 
out  and  get  a  little  fresh  air. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  to  interfere  with  your  physical  con- 
dition, but  this  is  a  very  important  matter. 

Mr.  Keifer.  Mr.  Cox'  did  not  come  into  the  bank  and  get  the  money 
on  the  note. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  did  come  into  the  bank  and  get  the  money  on 
the  note  i   The  evidence  is  the  money  Avas  paid  on  the  note. 
^Ir.  Keifer.  I  think  it  was  Mr.  Greer. 
Senator  Er;GE.  Who  is  Mr.  Greer  ? 

Mr.  Keifer.  I  think  you  had  better  let  up  on  me;  my  heart  is 
pumping  too  hard. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  we  will  take  a  recess  for  a  few  moments ;  I  do 
not  want  to  cause  you  an}^  physical  discomfort.  Under  the  circum- 
stances I  will  excuse  you,  of  course.   I  will  recall  Mr.  Scudder. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  MARVYN  SCUDDER— Recalled. 

Senator  Ed(;e.  You  have  already  been  sworn,  Mr.  Scudder.  You 
have  heard  the  evidence  just  adduced  from  the  last  witness.  Did  you 
have  anv  direct  conversation  with  Mr.  Keifer  concerning  the  cashing 
of  this  $5,000  note? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  did. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  Mr.  Keifer  tell  you  

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  Avait  one  moment,  now.  I  have  been 
inoi-e  than  liberal  in  allowing  questions  to  be  asked  here  without 
adhering  to  the  rules  of  evidence.  I  think  anybody  would  state  to 
3'ou  very  frankly  that  that  is  not  quite  a  fair  way  to  go  about  this. 
If  you  want  to  interrogate  Mr.  Keifer  and  put  these  questions,  if  you 
claim  that  he  has  told  a  different  story  about  this  to  some  one  else, 
he  has  got  a  right  to  be  interrogated  about  that  and  have  the  matter 
called  directly  to  his  attention,  and  then  if  he  denies  it  3^011  can  go  on 
further  about  it.  But  I  do  not  think  that  this  is  treating  Mr. 
Keifer  fairly.  I  do  no  know  anything  about  him,  and  never  saw  him 
until  ])e  came  in  here,  but  I  do  not  think  it  is  quite  the  right  thing 
to  do. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator,  I  do  not  claim  any  particular  inside  knowl- 
edge or  even  superficial  knowledge  of  the  rules  of  evidence ;  but  this 
investigating  committee,  as  I  have  generally  understood  it,  is  here  to 
try  to  get  the  facts.    We  have  had  Mr.  Keifer  on  the  stand—  — 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are  not  through  with  Mr.  Keifer;  he  may 
come  back  hei'e.    This  may  be  only  a  temporary  matter. 


2794 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  Is  it  not  within  the  rules  of  evidence — I  must  leaA  e 
it  to  you'  and  1  know  you  are  entirely  fair — to  liave  Mr.  Scuddei 
here  in  rebuttal  when  a  Avitness  has  just  left  the  stand  who  did  get 
so  far  as  to  state  under  oath  that  what  Mr.  Scudder  had  previously 
testified  to  was  untrue  ?    Why,  then,  can  not  I  call  Mr.  Scudder  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  has  not  gone  to  that  extent.  He  has  not 
been  asked  anything  about  what  he  said  to  Mr.  Scudder. 

Senator  Edge.  He  was  asked  whether  he  had  seen  Gov.  Cox  get 
the  cash,  and  Mr.  Scudder  testified  that  he  told  him  he  had. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  Avent  to  the  extent  of  saying  that  Gov.  Cox 
had  not  been  there,  etc. 

Senator  Edge.  But  Mr.  Scudder  previously  

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  call  your  attention  to  this:  This  is 
for  the  sole  purpose  of  reflecting  on  the  honor  and  integrity  of  Gov. 
Cox,  and  GTov.  Cox  is  not  here  at  this  particular  time. 

Senator  Edge.  I  Avish  he  were. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  wish  he  Avere,  too.  He  Avould  help  to  clear 
up  some  of  this  stuff. 

Senator  Edge.  He  was  here  day  before  yesterday,  and  under  the 
circumstances  I  think  it  Avould  liaA^e  been  Avell  for  him  to  haA^e  re- 
mained oA^er. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Just  wait  one  moment. 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  let  you  have  the  floor  as  long  as  you  Avant  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  have  not  got  the  record  of  this  testimony 
before  me.  I  think  he  Avent  on  to  try  to  say  something  about  what 
Mr.  Keifer  had  said  to  him,  to  Avhich  I  objected,  and,  as  I  recall,  you 
then  desisted  from  that  examination.  I  am  not  trying  to  take  any 
advantage  of  you  because  you  are  not  a  laAvyer,  but  there  are  certain 
principles  that  must  be  adhered  to  in  this  effort,  not  on  your  part,  but 
on  the  part  of  some  of  these  other  gentlemen  here  as  your  counsel,  to 
throAv  mud.  That  is  the  point  about  this  whole  proposition.  Noav, 
wait  just  one  moment. 

Then  the  question  comes  up  here  that  under  our  jurisdiction  Ave 
are  to  go  into  the  present  presidential  and  senatorial  campaign.  I 
have  let  all  of  this  in,  too.  It  is  true  that  some  alleged  lead  Avas 
sent  out,  and  so  forth,  based  upon  some  testimony  Avhich  Avas  before 
the  Hughes  committee  or  the  Frear  committee,  Avith  Gov.  Cox  not 
having  an  opportunity  to  appear.  He  Avas  here  in  the  State  and 
could  have  been  called  at  any  time  if  it  Avas  an  important  thing.  But 
right  noAV,  in  the  midst  of  this  campaign,  I  AVOuld  not  allow  this 
business  to  go  on  as  against  Senator  Harding.  I  think  there  is  some- 
thing due  to  each  of  these  candidates  Avhen  it  comes  to  a  proposition 
of  this  kind,  and  if  you  are  going  to  go  into  this  I  shall  not  object 
to  your  going  into  it,  but  it  has  got  to  go  on  under  the  rules  of  evi- 
dence, if  I  have  anything  to  say  about  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  through.  Senator? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene,  you  certainly  recognize  that  Sen- 
ator Harding  has  made  no  charges. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  knoAv  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Senator  Harding  has  in  no  Avay  appeared  in  this 
investigation.  We  have  been  listening  to  charges  and  allegations 
made  directly  to  the  American  i^eojfle  by  (tov.  Cox  time  after  time. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPEls^SES. 


2795 


,  V^  hy  Senator  Harding  should  even  be  discussed  in  the  matter  is,  I 
*  think,  entirely  beyond  consideration. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  thought  you  entirely  luiderstood  my  position. 

I  think  there  is  something  due  each  of  these  candidates.  If  one  of 
j  the  candidates  is  saying  something  about  the  other  candidate,  that 
^  is  his  affair,  but  I  am  not  going  to  go  into  that,  and  neither  is  this 

committee  going  to  go  into  it. 
Senator  Edge.  I  should  think.  Senator,  that  Gov.  Cox  would  have 
I  been  insistent  that  this  oft-repeated  story,  with  the  various  ramifica- 
I  tions  and  charges  and  allegations,  should  be  thoroughly  investigated^ 
I  whether  it  is  within  or  without  the  rules  of  evidence.  1  have  tried 
j  to  get  a  witness  to  tell  what  he  knew.    You  see  the  result.    I  have 

\  called  a  witness  in  rebuttal  

Senator  Pomerene.  I  do  not  know  anything  about  this  and  never 

saw  that  witness  Keifer  until  this  minute,  so  far  as  I  know.  He  may 
I  be  refreshed ;  I  do  not  know  what  his  condition  is.  I  have  seen  many 
;  a  witness  have  physical  trouble  when  he  was  on  the  stand.  If  you 
i  want  to  wait  and  call  him  later  on,  w^ell  and  good,  but  I  am  going  to 
j  insist  that  that  shall  be  done  in  the  first  instance. 

[  Senator  Edge.  Then  you  object  to  my  asking  Mr.  Scudder  ques- 
I  tions  as  to  his  conversation  with  Mr.  Keifer  ? 

j  '  Senator  Pomerene.  At  this  particular  time,  until  you  lay  that 
j  foundation. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right.  [To  the  witness  :]  You  are  excused  for 
I  the  present.    I  will  call  Mr.  Talbott. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  H.  E.  TALBOTT. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge.) 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Talbott,  give  your  name  and  business  connec- 
tion to  the  reporter. 

Mr.  Talbott.  H.  E.  Talbott.  My  principal  business  now  is  presi- 
dent of  the  Dayton  Securities  Co. 

Senator  Edge.  What  position  did  you  occup}'-  in  1916  in  connection 
with  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  President  of  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  position  did  you  occupy  in  1917  in  connection 
'  with  the  Dayton  City  National  Bank? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  am  not  sure  about  the  dates,  but  I  believe  I  was 
president  at  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  What  position  did  you  occupy  in  connection  with 
the  Dayton- Wright  Aeroplane  Co.  during  1917  and  1918? 
'i     Mr.  Talbott.  I  was  a  director,  and  I  think  I  acted  as  chairman 
l'  of  the  board. 

Senator  Edge.  Chairman  of  the  board? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Board  of  directors. 

Senator  Edge.  Who  was  president  of  the  corporation? 

Mr.  Talbott.  H.  E.  Talbott,  jr. 

Senator  Edge.  What  relation  is  he  to  you  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Son. 

Senator  Edge.  Have  you  any  business  associations  with  Gov.  Cox  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  None. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  heard  the  testimony,  without  my  repeat- 
ing any  more  than  necessary  to  get  the  answers  from  you,  to  the 


2796 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


elfect  that  the  Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.,  on  June  29,  1918,  paid  a 
note  negotiated  by  Gov.  Cox  in  August,  1917,  amounting  to  $5,000; 
is  that  correct? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  reason  that  you  can  assign  that  the 
Dayton  Metal  Products  Co.  assumed  that  obligation? 

Mr.  Talbott.  In  the  summer  of  1917  there  was  an  election  coming 
on  for  the  board  of  city  commissioners,  and  a  number  of  Dayton 
gentlemen  thought  it  would  be  best,  for  the  best  interests  of  the  citv 
and  the  city  government,  if  the  Republicans  and  the  Democrats  could 
get  together  and  agree  upon  a  bipartisan  bunch  of  men. 

Senator  Pomerene.  For  the  commission? 

Mr.  Talbott.  For  the  office  of  commissioners,  under  the  city  form 
of  government. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  there  any  members  of  the  legislature  being 
elected  at  that  time,  in  1917  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No.  They  had  conferences  on  this  subject  at  whicli 
I  Avas  not  present,  being  very  busy  in  my  other  affairs,  and  I  was  re- 
quested to  ask  Gov.  Cox  if  he  w^ould  consult  with  the  Democratic 
Party  here  and  see  if  they  would  go  into  a  conference  as  citizens  of 
Dayton  and,  if  possible,  make  a  selection  of  candidates  that  were 
satisfactory  to  all  parties.  I  saw  Gov.  Cox  and  explained  the  wishes 
of  this  committee  to  him. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Can  you  fix  about  the  date  of  that,  Mr.  Tal- 
bott? 

Mr.  Talbott.  1  tried  to.   I  think  it  was  in  July,  rather  early,  but  I 
can't  fix  the  date  exactly. 
Senator  Pomerene.  1917? 

Mr.  Talbott.  1917.  The  governor  saw  these  people,  so  he  reported, 
and  further  said  that  they  were  willing  to  discuss  the  matter  with 
this  committee.  The  matter  was  in  conference  for  some  weeks  be- 
fore the  election.  I  don't  recall  the  time  of  the  election,  but  it  was 
shortly  after  the  middle  of  August,  1917. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  to  make  the  record  clear  here,  do  you 
mean  the  general  election  or  the  primary  election,  when  you  speak  of 
the  election? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Well,  I  don't  know  whether  that  was  the  primary  or 
not;  that  can  be  developed;  I  knoAv  so  little  about  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Is  not  this  true,  that  your  election  of  commis- 
sioners is  in  November? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  don't  know.   I  never  paid  much  attention  to  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  don't  know  anything  about  3^our  charter  here. 

Senator  Edge.  Proceed,  Mr.  Talbott. 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  conference  between  the  two  parties,  according 
to  my  information,  was  continued  down  to  practicallv  the  time  of  the 
candidates  named  and  petitions  being  filed  so  they  could  properly  be 
candidates. 

Senator  Edge.  For  commissioners? 

Mr.  Talbott.  For  commissioners;  and  my  I'ecoUection  is  that  the 
conferences  failed  to  agree,  and  each  party  went  about  its  own  way. 
I  was  not  in  Dayton  at  the  time  of  the  election,  but  returned  shortly 
after  and  met  Gov.  Cox  accidentally  on  the  road,  and  Gov.  Cox  said 
that  there  had  been  no  method  provided  on  the  part  of  this  committee 
or  any  committee  that  I  knew  anything  about  to  help  any  of  the  elec- 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2797 


tion  finances  for  these  commissioners,  and  that  at  the  hist  moment  it 
was  necessary  for  him  on  account  of  his  askintj  his  party  to  liohl  off. 
in  the  hope  and  expectation  that  those  conferences  woukl  agree — that 
he  had  discounted  a  note  at  the  City  National  Bank  for  $5/)()0,  which 
was  the  first  I  knew  of  it. 

Senator  Pomekene.  When  was  that? 

Mr.  Talp.ott.  That  AAas  after  the  election. 

Senator  Edge.  (toy.  Cox  told  you  that  ? 

Air.  Talhott.  Yes;  and  he  said  he  would  expect  our  committee  to 
take  care  of  it.  I  told  him  I  would  see  what  could  be  done.  The 
matter  drifted  along,  and  I  discussed  the  matter  with  Col.  Deeds  and 
Mr.  Kettering,  and  the  result  was  that  we  decided  to  take  it  up  our- 
selves, and  I  instructed  our  treasurer  at  the  Dayton  Metal  Products, 
inasmuch  as  that  was  a  company  that  had  some  cash  that  Avas  not 
needed  for  the  moment,  to  take  up  that  note. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Mr.  Talbott,  you  took  up  that  note  in  June, 
1918? 

tMr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Edcje.  Ten  months  after  it  had  been  negotiated^ 
Mr.  Talrott   Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  it  recjuire  all  that  length  of  time  to  decide 
tliat  you  had  any  obligation  in  the  matter? 

Mr.  TALBcrrr.  AVe  felt  that  we  had  an  oblifration  in  the  matter  be- 
cause we  had  been  the  instrument  in*  the  matter  of  requesting  Mr. 
Cox  to  see  that  his  party  would  line  up  and  enter  this  discussion, 
and  I  was  in  hopes  during  the  interval  that  some  development  would 
occur,  or  some  circumstance  would  occur,  so  that  a  number  of  peo- 
ple would  join  together  and  take  this  burden  from  Mr.  Cox. 

Senator  Edge.  You,  of  coui'se.  jue  aware,  as  a  business  man  of 
large  experience  and  interested,  as  you  have  explained,  in  public 
matters,  that  (xov.  Cox.  under  the  law,  had  in  early  June,  1918,  filed 
his  petition  as  a  candidate  foi'  reelection  as  governor,  were  you  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No,  sir ;  I  don;t  recall  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Air.  Cox.  l)eing  a  resident  of  Dayton,  and 

you  all  

Mr.  Talbott.  I  probably  knew  it  at  the  time. 

Senator  Edge.  And  when  3^ou  actually  discharged  this  note  of  June 
'  29,  1918,  you  knew  that  he  was  a  candidate  officially  for  gOA^ernor? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  have  no  recollection  about  it.    I  probably  knew  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  you  are  sufficiently  familiar  with  the  corrupt- 
practices  act  sureW  to  knoAV — every  corporation  president  has  to 
know  it — that  a  corporation  violates  the  law  if  it  contributes  for 
campaign  purposes,  whether  it  is  a  local  election  or  gubernatorial 
election,  are  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  didn't  consider  this  a  corporate  contribution. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  not  the  ])avment  made  bv  the  corporation 
check? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  Avas. 

Senator  Edge.  Has  not  the  evidence  been  brought  out  preA^ously 
here  that  that,  added  to  A^arious  other  sums,  making  a  total  of  $42,000 
in  its  entirety,  Avas  paid  back  to  the  corporation  in  various  amounts? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Then,  hoAV  could  you  as  a  business  man  assume  it  to 
be  anything  else  but  a  direct  corporation  disbursement  ? 


2798 


PRESIDENTIAL  ('AMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Talbott.  Because  it  was  merely  advanced  by  the  corporatioiii 
on  behalf  of  myself  and  others. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  you  surely  know  that  advancing  and  after- 
wards being  reimbursed  constitutes  a  payment  by  the  corporation? 

Mr.  Talrott.  I  did  not. 

kSenator  Eikje.  Do  you  not  realize  it  as  a  business  man  now,  after 
we  are  discussing  it  ? 

Mr.  Talkott.  I  don't  see  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  is  your  explanation  Avhereby  it  can  be  any- 
thing else  but  a  corporation  disbursement  when  the  corporation  has. 
been  reimbursed? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Well,  if  the  corporation  is  reimbursed,  they  are  not 
out  any  money. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Talbott,  you  do  not  want  that  to  go  in  the- 
record,  I  think  ?  That  certainly  does  not  change  the  violation  of  the^ 
law  that  they  contributed  the  money. 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  didn't  contribute  the  money  for  themselves. 

Senator  Edge.  Ihey  contributed  it,  under  your  testimony,  as  a. 
corporation,  did  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  don't  consider  that  a  corporate  contribution. 

Senator  Edge.  But  it  Avas  paid  by  a  corporate  check,  was  it  not?: 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  Avas. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  for^the  district  attorney  of  Hamilton  or 
Cuyahoga  County.    I  can't  go  any  further  than  that. 

Senator  Pomekene.  Well,  I  sus'pect  so.  It  looks  as  if  Ave  are  croino:' 
to  try  CA^erybody  here  for  all  the  alleged  misdemeanors  that  might 
have  been  committed.  1  suppose  we  Avill  get  after  some  bootleggers, 
here  after  a  while. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  think  they  Avould  haA'e  an}i:]ung  like  that 
out  here. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  they  may  bring  it  from  NeAv  Jersey. 

Senator  Edge.  When  your  corporation  paid  off  or  discharged  this 
note,  Avhat  did  you  charge  it  to  on  the  booi?:s  of  the  corporation? 

Mr.  Talbott.  As  soon  as  the  matter  Avas  called  to  my  attention  I 
told  them  to  charge  it  to  me  individually. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVhen  Avas  that,  Mr.  Talbott? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  can't  identify  the  date. 

Senator  Edge.  And  then,  as  your  testimony  has  already  adduced,, 
it  Avas  finally  paid  back  to  the  corporation  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  There  is  another  side  to  this  Avhole  transaction,  the 
$37,000  contribution  to  the  Cox  campaign  in  1916. 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  Avas  not  a  contribution  to  the  Cox  campaign  of 
1916. 

Senator  Edge.  It  Avas  not? 
Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  noAv,  that  just  leads  up  to  Avhat  I  intended  to- 
ask  you.   What  Avas  it? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  was  a  contribution  for  the  purpose  of  flood  protec- 
tion preservation. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  if  that  is  the  case,  Mr.  Talbott,  why  Avas  this 
campaign — as  you  must  be  familiar  Avith  it,  being  one  of  the  heaA^y 
contributors — entirely  carried  out  ahme  in  the  interest  of  (xov.  Cox's; 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2799 


reelection,  and  no  reference  in  any  public  document  that  we  have 
(   "been  able  to  discover  referring  to  your  flood  prevention  problem  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  I  know  nothing  about  that. 

Senator  Pomekexe.  Let  me  make  an  observation  here.    I  did  not 
[    have  time  to  read  these  exhibits.    I  glanced  over  one  of  them  and  I 
•    did  see  something  in  it  about  Cox  standing  for  conservancy.   So  I  do 
not  want  to  allow  your  general  question  to  go  by  unchallenged  so  far 
iis  the  fact  is  concerned, 
i       Senator  Edge.  You  sav  you  had  no  direct  control  of  the  expendi- 
ture of  the  $37,000  fund? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Xeither  direct  or  indirect. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  a  member  of  the  board  of  directors  or  an 
(officer  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission,  are  3"ou  not  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  I  am  a  member  of  the  committee. 
Senator  Edge.  Well,  whatever  it  is  termed? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  P^dge.  You  were  a  member  of  the  committee  having  power 
^  ±0  make  disbursements  during  the  year  1918,  were  you  not? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  You  attended  a  meeting  of  the  board  held  on  Sun- 
,  -day,  Februar}^  3,  1918,  at  which  meeting  a  sum  aggregating  $26,000 
!  ^as  voted  to  certain  men  who  afterwards  turned  it  over  to  you  and 
;   others  through  Mr.  Schantz,  were  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  was  present  at  a  meeting — at  that  meeting. 
[      Senator  Edge.  That  was  done  at  that  meeting,  was  it  not,  in  effect 
what  I  have  stated? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  results  that  that  is  the  effect;  yes. 
Senator  Edge.  What  do  vou  mean  by  "  results  that  that  is  the 
effect"? 

Mr.  Talbott.  The  committee  at  that  time  felt  that  these  expendi- 
tures should  be  reimbursed  and  the  committee  agreed  that  they  should 
be  reimbursed  and  it  was  left,  as  Mr.  Schantz  testified,  for  the  secre- 
tary and  Mr.  Scluintz  to  arrange  a  method  that  was  satisfactory  and 
to  secure  therefor  the  approval  of  the  finance  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  When  you  contributed  that  money*  for  the  special 
campaign  purpose,  as  has  been  testified  to  by  Mr.  Schantz  and  your- 
self, did  3^ou  anticipate  being  reimbursed  for  it? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Xo,  sir :  I  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  what  developed  that  you  suddenly  decided 
that  the  fund  of  the  civic  association  could  reimburse  you? 

^Ir.  Talbott.  The  fund  of  the  civic  association  had  spent  a  great 
deal  of  money  in  surveys  and  engineering  services  and  preliminary 
!  development  in  securing  the  best  method  for  flood  prevention  accord- 
I  ing  to  the  law. 

Senator  Edge.  Yes. 

Mr.-'  Talbott.  Before  the  conser\'{incy  district  was  organized  they 
had  loaned  out  of  this  fund  to  the  conservancy  district  before  they 
were  financed,  before  they  sold  any  securities. 

Senator  P>>ge.  When  did  they  sell  their  first  securities? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  can't  say. 

Senator  P^dge.  Approximately  1916  or  1915? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  can't  give  you  the  date. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right;  that  is  not  important.  If  you  did  not 
'  expect  to  be  reimbursed  for  this  si)ecial  fund  that  came  from  the 


2800 


PEESIDENTIAI.  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Dayton  MeUxl  Products  Co.,  a  certain  portion  of  it,  and  was  after- 
wards returned  to  them,  as  testified  to  b}^  the  treasurer  of  that  com- 
pany, then  the  sudden  decision  that  you  woukl  hold  this  meeting  and 
reimburse  yourselves  was  entirely  an  afterthouglit,  was  it? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Entirel}^ 

Senator  P^dge.  The  original  contribution  was  made  purely  and. 
simply  for  campaign  purposes? 
Mr.  Talhott.  No,  sir. 

Senator  E^doe.  Well,  has  not  that  been  testified  to? 
Mr.  Talbott.  It  has. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  it  made  for,  if  not  for  campaign  pur- 
poses ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  was  paid  in  order  to  preserve  our  flood  prevention, 
situation. 

Senator  Ei)(je.  You  say  you  are  not  familiar  Avith  the  details,  but 
you  make  that  positive  statement,  and  you  must  be  familiar,  then,, 
with  the  fact  that  tAventy-odd  thousand  dollars,  almost  thirty  thou- 
sand, as  I  recall  it,  of  this  money  Avas  paid  directly  to  three  asso- 
ciations. 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  knoAv  nothing  about  that. 

Senator  Edge.  But  you  make  the  statement  that  it  Avas  for  flood^ 
prevention.  The  fact  that  it  was  contributed  to  these  seA^eral  asso- 
ciations has  been  clearly  established  here. 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  kneAv  nothing  about  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  your  corporation  checks  did  go  for  that  pur- 
pose, did  they  not  ?  * 

Mr.  Talbott.  So  far  as  I  knoAV,  our  checks  Avent  to  Mr.  Schantz,. 
in  whom  Ave  had  confidence;  and  Mr.  Schantz  Avas  the  originator 
of  this  flood-prevention  fimd,  a  lieavy  contributor  to  it  and  very 
active  in  raising  it,  ancl  it  Avas  his  original  idea.  Under  discus- 
sion of  Avays  and  means  to  maintain  our  position  in  flood  protection 
for  this  A^alley  Ave  men  indiAddually  agreed  to  giA^e  Mr.  Schantz  a 
certain  amount  of  money,  and  Ave  did  it;  and  further  than  that,  we 
trusted  Mr.  Schantz  to  properly  disburse  it  in  our  interests. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  approve  of  the  method  he  emploj^ed? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  knoAv  the  method,  except  Avhat  I  heard 
yesterday. 

Senator  ED(iE.  Do  you  knoAv  that  it  is  a  A'iolation  of  the  corrupt- 
practices  act  to  give  money  to  associations  for  political  purposes — 
and  they  must  haA^e  considered  it  to  be  for  political  purposes,  be- 
cause they  filed  their  accounts  in  Columbus,  and  then  did  not  recite 
these  contributions  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Noav,  let  me  ask  a^ou.  are  vou  reallv  going  to 
try  Mr.  Talbott? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  going  to  try  to  get  some  facts  out  of  him. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  I  think  he  is  giving  you  facts.  ^ 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  he  is  doing  A^ery  Avell. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Even  if  you  find  they  are  not  Avhat  you  antici- 
pated, he  might  do,  under  your  advice. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  Ave  are  doing  very  Avell. 

Senator  Po:vrERENE.  But,  of  course,  if  you  are  going  to  try  Mr. 
Talbott  Iiere  for  the  violation  of  some  Ohio  statutes  some  question 
might  be  raised  as  to  my  jurisdiction  as  a  sitting  member  of  this 
subcommittee. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2801 


Senator  Edge.  You  know.  Senator  Pomerene,  I  have  associated  so 
\oniX  Avith  you.  Senator  Reed,  and  other  brilliant  laAvyers  that  I  find 
it  sometimes  is  in  the  interest  of  the  general  public  to  bring  out 
facts  even  by  asking  questions  so  the  citizens  of  the  community  may 
he  acquainted  with  them. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  all  right.  These  men  are  all  men  of 
good  standing  here. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  not  the  slightest  doubt  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  the  people  of  Dayton  and  vicinity  have 
the  greatest  confidence  in  them,  even  if  some  of  the  employees  of  the 
Eepublican  national  committee  have  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  now,  if  I  were  you,  I  would  not  sa}^  that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  mean  that  to  be  stated  just  as  it  is. 

Senator  Edge.  If  you  did,  I  could,  of  course,  go  into  the  acts  of  the 
Democratic  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Undoubtedly  so. 

Senator  Edge.  But  I  am  not  going  to  go  into  the  acts  of  the  Demo- 
cratic committee. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  I  know  in  some  instances  both  of  them  are  go- 
ing too  far. 

Senator  Edge.  We  are  now  all  even,  so  w^e  Avill  square  off  at  that.' 

Mr.  Talbott,  the  conservancy  act  was  passed,  as  I  recall  the  evi- 
dence, in  1914;  that  is  correct,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Taebott.  I  can  not  testify  to  that,  but  I  think  that  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  We  have  had  that  testimony,  and  I  assume  it  is  cor- 
rect, from  what  Judge  McMahon  has  said.  The  fund  raised  by  the 
local  Flood  Prevention  Association  stretched  over  a  period  of  years, 
as  I  understand  it,  but  this  particular  sum  that  you  gentlemen  con- 
tributed in  the  interest  of  flood  prevention,  for  whatever  purpose  it 
may  have  been  afterwards  used,  was  in  1916,  was  it  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  The  conservancy  act  passed  by  the  Ohio  Legislature 
provided  for  the  issuing  of  bonds,  certainly  to  raise  the  money  to 
carry  out  your  project,  did  it  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  There  have  been  bonds  issued.  I  have  not  read  the 
law. 

Senator  Edge.  Some  act  provided  for  that,  as  I  understood  from 
Judge  McMahon  yesterday.  There  has  been  considerable  testimony 
here  to  the  effect  that  the  people  of  Dayton  Avere  in  great  fear— you 
are  a  very  prominent  business  man  of  Dayton,  and  I  think  this  is 
important — of  the  amendment  or  repeal  of  this  act  of  1914  providing 
for  this  protection ;  is  that  true  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  We  felt  in  danger. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  of  course,  you  know  that  in  1915  or  1916 — I 
think  the  years  are  correct,  and  you  may  correct  me  if  I  am  wrong — 
Gov.  Willis  was  governor  of  Ohio  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Nothing  happened  to  the  act  then  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Nothing  happened  finally. 
'     Senator  Edge.  Nothing  passed  the  legislature  amending  or  repeal- 
theact? 
Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  You  issued  bonds  or  arranged  to  issue  bonds  under 
the  act  after  it  became  a  law,  of  course ;  did  you  not? 


2802 


PRESIDEXTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Talbott.  I  did  not. 

Senator  Edge.  I  mean  your  conservancy  board? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  am  not  a  member  of  the  conservancy  board. 

Senator  Edge.  This  question  is  simply  leading-  up  to  another  one 
I  think  you  can  answer.  I  would  assume  if  you  paid  off,  as  the  report 
shows,  86  per  cent  of  the  money  that  had  been  contributed  by  citi- 
zens you  must  have  paid  it  off  from  receipts  of  the  sale  of  bonds ;  is 
not  that  a  matter  of  common  information  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  What  did  you  pa}^  it  off  with  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  We  paid  it  off  by  the  repayment  to  us  by  the  con- 
servancy board  of  the  money  advanced  to  them  and  loaned  to  them. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  did  the  conservancy  board  get  the  money  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  borrowed  it  from  this  committee. 

Senator  Edge.  From  which  committee — the  flood  prevention  com- 
mittee ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  borrowed  it  from  this  fund  that  was  raised  by 
the  citizens  of  Dayton. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  think  you  get  my  question.  The  evidence 
is  that  the  flood  prevention  commission  that  had  raised  something 
less  than  $2,000,000  then,  had  been  reimbursed  b}^  various  subscribers 
to  the  extent  of  86  per  cent,  as  I  recall  it? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Of  course,  that  money  had  to  be  raised  from  some 
source,  not  from  themselves.  They  had  contributed  the  money,  and 
it  had  been  spent  in  various  ways,  leaving  a  balance  of  something 
over  $100,000.  Now%  that  had  been  repaid.  Certainly  that  must 
have  come  from  the  sale  of  some  issues  provided  by  the  legislature, 
must  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  Avas  a  return  by  the  conservancy  district  of 
money  which  had  been  loaned  to  them  and  advanced  for  them  by  this 
committee. 

Senator  Edge.  I  understand  that;  but  there  must  have  been  a 
method  to  get  the  money. 

Mr.  Talbott.  The  conservancy  district— — 

Senator  Edge  (interposing).  Did  they  borrow  the  money? 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  borrowed  the  money. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  di^l  they  borrow  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  borrowed  it  on  the  issue  of  bonds. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  exactly  what  I  am  trying  to  get  the  answer 
to.  They  issued  bonds  and  got  cash,  and  then  paid  off  to  the  extent 
of  86  per  cen^  the  contributors  to  your  local  fund ;  is  not  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Not  exactly. 

Senator  Fdge.  Correct  me,  then. 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  paid  back  the  money  that  they  borroAved  from 
us. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  not  questioning  that  they  borrowed  it  from 
3^ou  and  I  am  not  questioning  that  they  did  not  have  a  perfect  right 
to  pay  it  back.  I  am  simply  trying  to  establish  the  fact  that  they 
hai^  been  paying  it  back  through  the  sale  of  bonds ;  is  not  that 
correct  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  suppose  they  raised  the  money  from  bond  sales. 
Senator  Edge.  Now,  I  am  coming  to  the  main  point.    Much  evi- 
dence has  been  adduced  here,  and  I  want  to  get  your  opinion  as  a 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2803 


leading  business  man  of  fear  for  the  retention  of  this  conservancy 
act — a  very  important  act,  as  I  understand  it,  to  the  health  and 
safety  of  your  people.  You  have  already  issued  bonds  under  that 
act  to  a  very  large  extent,  which  must  be  true  as  the  evidence  has 
developed  i 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  How  in  the  name  of  Heaven  is  it  possible  for  a 
legislature  to  pass  any  act  that  would  provide  for  the  repudiation  of 
'  legal  instruments  or  bonds  sold  to  your  people  or  to  the  banks  or 
to  investors?    What  did  you  have  to  fear  as  a  business  man? 

Mr.  Talbott.  We  had  to  fear  changes  and  amendments  in  the  hnv 
which  we  thought  would  emasculate  it. 

Senator  EIdge.  You  knew  the  legislature  could  not  pass  a  law  to 
repudiate  those  obligations,  did  you  not  ? 


Mr.  Talbott.  Well,  I  am  not  a  lawyer;  I  do  not  know. 
Senator  Edge.  Well,  that  is  enough. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Mr.  Talbott,  I  take  it  that  your  conservancy 
act,  which  I  have  not  read,  did  provide  for  the  issuance  of  bonds  and 
it  did  provide,  among  other  things,  for  the  acquisition  of  the  title  to 
property  that  might  be  involved  and  for  the  building  of  the  dams  and 
making  such  improv  ements  as  might  be  recommended  by  joiiv  engi- 
neers.   It  provided  for  all  that,  did  it  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Po3ierexe.  It  provided  for  the  maintenance  of  it  and  pro- 
Aided  for  methods  of  taxation  for  the  payment  of  these  bonds;  and 
even  though  the  legislature  might  not  have  been  able  to  defeat  the 
validity  of  these  bonds,  it  might  have  crippled  your  project  very 
materially:  is  not  that  true? 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  was  our  fear. 

Senator  Po^ierexe.  And  it  is  true  that  during  the  time  subsequent 
to  the  enactment  of  the  original  conservancy  bill  into  a  law  there 
Avere  re])eated  attem.pts  made  to  amend  the  law,  were  there  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  There  were. 

Senator  Pomerex^e.  And  there  were  other  movements  afoot  look- 
ing to  the  repeal  or  the  modification  of  that  law  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  So  Ave  Avere  athdsed. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  Avhile  your  people  here  in  Dayton,  in 
Hamilton,  MiddletoAvn,  and  the  other  communities  in  this  district, 
Avere  very  much  interested  in  the  carr^dng  out  of  this  conservancy 
project  for  the  protection  of  the  valley  and  its  people,  there  were 
other  people  who  were  A^ery  much  opposed  to  it,  were  there  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  There  Avere  . 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  you,  I  belieA^e,  and  Mr.  Kettering  and  Mr. 
Deeds  and  Mr.  Schantz  had  all  been  very  much  interested  in  the  sub- 
ject of  flood  protection  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Naturally  Ave  Avere. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Your  interest  Avas  brought  about  by  the  A^ery 
great  suffering  caused  in  this  community  by  the  flood  of  March,  1913? 
Mr.  Talbott.  It  Avas. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  You  and  these  other  gentlemen  Avhom  I  have 
named  are  men  of  substantial  means,  are  you  not? 
Mr.  Talbott.  We  are. 

1X2774— 20— PT  21  7 


2804 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGX  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomehene.  You  have  always  been  interested  in  public 
affairs  here  in  Dayton  and  vicinity? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  have  that  interest  now  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Whatever  you  did  in  this  matter  in  the  way 
of  personal  service  or  in  the  way  of  financing  this  proposition  was 
because  of  your  interest  as  citizens  of  this  community  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Entirely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  said  that  you  had  some  conversation 
with  Gov.  Cox  about  this  $5,000  note.  The  fact  is  that  your  people 
here,  Democrats  and  Republicans  alike,  were  very  much  interested  in 
your  local  city  conditions,  were  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  We  wanted  the  best  men  on  the  commission. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  was  some  serious  contest  on  here  be- 
tween your  citizens'  committee  and  the  Socialist  Party  with  respect 
to  the  nomination  and  election  of  candidates  for  commissioners? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  believe  there  was  a  contest.  I  do  not  know  any- 
thing about  the  Socialist  end  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  suffice  it  to  say  that  even  before  the 
primary  there  was  a  disposition  on  the  part  of  many  of  your  Repub- 
licans and  Democrats  to  agree  upon  a  municipal  program? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Exactly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  understood  that  this  note  of  $5,000  had 
been  given  in  connection  with  this  campaign  for  the  selection  of 
commissioners  of  the  city  of  Dayton ;  that  is  correct,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  understood  that  the  money  was  used  for  that 
purpose. 

Senator  Poinierene.  Whether  rightly  or  wrongly,  you  and  your 
business  associates  felt  that  there  was  some  moral  obligation  on  your 
part  to  assist  in  the  taking  care  of  that  note ;  is  that  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  is  it  exactly,  just  as  I  have  testified. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  this  money  was  furnished  and  charged 
to  your  account,  was  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  in  fact  you  furnished  the  money,  and 
not  the  Metal  Products  Co.  ?  ' 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  is  my  understanding  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Although  the  check  was  issued  by  the  Metal 
Products  Co.  and  later  on  the  amount  was  charged  to  your  account, 
was  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  believe,  without  going  into  the  details  of 
your  business — and  I  do  not  want  to  do  that — there  were  three  prin- 
cipal stockholders  in  your  company,  were  there  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  They  were  yourself.  Mr.  Kettering,  and  who 
■was  the  third  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Col.  Deeds  in  the  early  part. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  he  later  disposed  of  his  interest,  did  he? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes;  and  Mr.  Kettering  and  my  son  and  myself 
^)ought  his  interest. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2805 


Senator  Pomerene.  Did  the  furnishing  of  that  money  or  the  pay- 
ment of  that  note — I  am  sjDeaking  of  the  $5,000  note  now — have  any- 
thing to  do  directly  with  Gov.  Cox's  campaign  for  govwnor? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  it  have  anything  to  do  directly  or  indi- 
rectly with  the  present  presidential  or  senatorial  campaign  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  there  any  election  in  1917  of  governor  or 
of  members  of  the  legislature? 
Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  only  election  that  occurred  in  1917  was 
your  municipal  election? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Then  your  attention  was  called  to  some  funds 
which  were  advanced  by  your  company  in  1916  and  which  were 
charged  to  yourself  and  Mr.  Kettering,  and  who  was  the  third 
name — I  have  forgotten  that — in  1916? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Deeds. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Deeds;  yes.    Mr.  Sherer  was  here  and 
testified  to  that  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  heard  him  testify,  did  you  ? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes;  it  is  all  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Without  going  into  the  details  of  that,  the 
statement  that  he  made  with  regard  to  the  issuance  of  these  checks 
and  the  charges  to  each  of  the  three  principal  stockholders,  and  so 
forth,  and  the  reimbursement  and  the  disposition  of  that  fund,  was 
in  substance  correct,  was  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  was. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Prior  to  1916  and  during  the  early  part  of 
1916,  is  it  true  that  people  who  were  opposed  to  this  conservancy 
legislation  and  what  was  being  done  under  it  were  taking  an  active 
part  against  Gov.  Cox  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  do  not  know  about  that  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  AVell,  in  any  event,  did  you  feel  at  the  time  that 
it  was  arranged  between  yourself  and  other  business  associates  and 
others  of  your  prominent  citizens  here,  that  your  conservancy  project 
was  involved  in  the  election  in  the  fall  of  1916? 

Mr.  Talbott.  We  did. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  you  say  that,  am  I  right  in  assuming 
that  you  had  not  only  an  interest  in  the  election  of  a  governor  who 
might  be  friendly  to  it,  but  also  in  the  election  of  members  of  the 
legislature  who  might  be  friendly  to  it. 

'  Mr.  Talbott.  That  was  a  matter  that  was  left  to  Mr.  Schantz.  We 
simply  subscribed  this  money  in  order  to  protect  ourselves  in  this 
flood-prevention  matter  and  the  conservancy  law. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Then  am  I  right  in  inferring  from  your  state- 
ment that  the  primary  subject  before  you  was  the  conservancy  law 
and  the  project  which  it  involved  for  the  protection  of  the  flood- 
stricken  district,  and  you  left  all  the  details  to  other  men? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Exactly  so.  It  was  not  only  primary,  but  it  was  the 
whole  thing. 


2806 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  May  I  ask  a  question  right  there,  if  it  will  not  be 
interrupting-  you  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Talbott,  you  knew  that  Adam  Schantz  was  a 
well-known  Democrat,  active  in  the  support  of  the  Democratic  cam- 
paign in  this  particular  year,  191G,  Avhen  you  were  electing  both 
a  President  and  a  governor,  and  particularly  interested  in  Gov. 
Cox,  which  is  a  well-knoAvn  fact?  Why,  then,  did  you  turn  such  a 
large  sum  of  money  as  $37,000  over  to  him  without  in  any  way  taking 
an  interest  in  how  he  spent  it  ? 

Mr.  Talrott.  "Well,  we  were  very  bus}^  I  knoAv  nothing  about 
such  matters,  and  we  expected  it  would  be  properly  administered 
and  legally  administered  for  this  purpose. 

Senator  Edge.  You  heard  ^^esterday  how  it  was  administered? 

Mr.  Talbott.  For  tlie  first  time. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  Is  that  all  ? 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  have  known  Mr.  Schantz  here  for  a  good 
many  years  ? 

Mr.  Talrott.  I  have. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  he  is  a  man  of  the  very  highest  standing 
financially  and  as  a  citizen,  is  he  not? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  have  always  considered  him  so,  and  do  now. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  You  have  always  regarded  him  as  a  level- 
headed man,  who  exercised  good  judgment  in  what  he  was  doing? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  always  have. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  matters  of  this  kind  you  would  have  as 
much  confidence  in  his  judgment  as  you  would  in  your  own? 

Mr.  Talbott.  A  great  deal  more  on  these  matters — political  mat- 
ters. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  and  your  associates  were  very  busily  oc- 
cupied at  that  time  ? 
Mr.  Talrott.  We  were. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  and  your  business  associates  were  en- 
gaged in  large  business  transactions  at  that  time  which  engrossed 
your  every  activity  ? 

Mr.  Talrott.  Exactly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Your  attention  was  called  to  the  refunding  of 
these  sums  of  money  to  3^our  company? 
Mr.  Talrott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  that  refund  was  made  out  of  these  sums 
of  money  that  have  been  collected  for  flood  protection,  was  it? 
Mr.  Talrott.  It  w^as. 

Senator  Po^^eerene.  You  had  a  committee  at  that  time  to  audit  anc 
approve  these  various  claims  as  they  might  be  presented? 
Sir.  Talrott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  did  you  call  that  committee  ? 
Mr.  Talrott.  The  flood  prevention  committee. 
Senator  Pomerene.  It  had  charge  of  the  finances  generally? 
Mr.  Talrott.  Well,  there  was  a  financial  committee  that  had  charge 
of  the  finances. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  recall  who  that  financial  committee 
was  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  No ;  I  do  not. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2807 


Senator  Pomerene.  Would  you  remember  the  names  if  you  were 
to  hear  them?    Who  was  the  chairman  of  it? 
Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomp:rene.  ^V^ho  was  the  chairman  of  it? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Edward  Phillips? 

Mr.  Talbott.  My  recollection  is  he  was  a  member  of  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  W.  F.  Bevis  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  C.  J.  McKee  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  T.  Huffman? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  J.  W.  Aull? 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Georo-e  Marshall? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  know  all  those  men,  and,  to  the  best  of  my  knowl- 
I  edge,  they  are  members  of  that  committee, 
f     Senator  Pomerene.  Was  E.  E.  Burkhardt? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Whether  you  are  certain  or  not  about  these 
\  gentlemen  hem<r  on  this  committee,  you  are  certain  that  some  of  them 

were  on  that  committee,  are  you? 
I     Mr.  Talbott.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  greater  portion  of  them  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  think  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  they  are  all  men  with  whom  you  are  per- 
sonally acquainted? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  they  are  good,  substantial  citizens  here? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Public-spirited  citizens? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Can  you  now  say  whether  or  not  the  repay- 
ment of  these  moneys  to  you  and  your  business  associates  had  the 
approval  of  the  finance  committee,  whoever  they  were  ? 

Sir.  Talbott.  I  understand  so. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Are  you  sufficiently  familiar  with  your  rules 
and  methods  of  procedure  to  say  whether  or  not  this  bill  could  have 
been  paid  in  this  w^ay  without  their  approval? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  could  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  you  mean  without  their  approval  or  without 
their  knowledge? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  mean  without  their  knowledge. 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  think  it  could  be  paid  Avithout  their  ap- 
proval. 

Senator  Pomerene.  There  is  one  other  matter  that  developed  yes- 
terday that  I  wanted  to  ask  a  question  or  two  about.  Something 
was  said  about  some  offer  to  provide  through  the  legislature  for  an 
audit  of  the  books  and  affairs  of  your  conservancy  people  or  com- 
mittee. 

Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  did  not  keep  in  mind  the  exact  name  of  your 
association. 


2808 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Talbott.  The  Miami  Valley  Conservancy  District. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Very  well.  That  legislation,  I  believe,  was 
not  passed,  Avas  it  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  My  only  recollection  of  that  is  vague,  that  there  was 
a  bill  introduced  in  connection  with  that.  I  do  not  know  what  it  was. 
I  never  saw  the  bill. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  That  w^as  only  leading  up  

Mr.  Talbott.  I  understand  it  was  defeated. 

Senator  Pomerene.  My  question  was  only  preliminary  and  lead- 
ing up  to  the  direct  question  which  I  want  to  ask. 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  want  to  correct  that.  My  understanding  is  that 
it  did  not  pass. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Were  your  books  audited  here  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  think  so,  regularly. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  will  ask  you  whether  you  did  not  have  here 
certified  accountants  or  some  auditing  company  from  Chicago  to 
make  an  audit  of  the  receipts  and  expenditures  in  behalf  of  flood 
prevention  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  That  was  the  case. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  was  their  report  published  in  your  local 
city  papers  here? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  rather  think  so,  or  circulars  sent  around  to  the 
subscribers. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Anyone  who  Avas  interested  could  have  had 
access  to  that  report  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  At  any  time. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  ask  if  the  report  of  the  payments  by  the 
flood  prevention  w^ere  published  for  the  conservancy  board? 

Senator  Pomerene.  My  question,  I  think,  was  broad  enough  to 
include  the  entire  proposition  of  conservancy.  I  so  intended  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  answer,  Mr.  Talbott?  Were  they 
published  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  know  whether  they  were  published,  but  my 
best  recollection  is  that  they  AA^ere. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Somebody  told  me  that  fact  yesterday.  I  do 
not  know  whether  they  Avere  or  not. 

Senator  Edge.  Including  the  payment  to  the  various  third  parties 
in  that  February  3  meeting  ?  Was  that  ever  published  in  Dayton  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  I  do  not  knoAv. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  recall  now  when  your  primarA^  was 
held  in  1917? 

Mr.  Talbot.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  the  raising  of  this  sum  of  $37,000,  as  it  ap- 
pears in  a  part  of  the  record  of  this  case — and  I  think  the  account- 
ant referred  to  it  as  $42,000 — which  was  raised  in  1916,  haA'e  any 
relation  directly  or  indirectlv  to  the  presidential  or  senatorial  cam- 
paign of  1920? 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  did  not.  in  our  minds,  at  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  There  is  one  matter  I  want  to  clear  up,  Mr.  Talbott. 
You  replied  to  a  question  of  Senator  Pomerene  in  reference  to  the 
fiA^e  thousand  dollar  Cox  note,  that  you  furnished  the  money,  or  it 
Avas  charged  to  your  account  to  pay  it  off.  Is  it  not  a  fact  that  the 
evidence  giA^en  by  Mr.  Sherer — if  necessary,  I  will  call  Mr.  Sherer 


preside?:tial  campaign  expe^ntses.  2809 

iB^ck — clearly  establishes  the  fact  that  this  ultimately  was  paid  by  the 
Da}i:on  Metal  Products  Co.?  Certainly  his  testimony  clearly  indi- 
cated that  to  my  understanding. 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  was  all  paid  back  to  the  Dayton  Metal  Prod- 
ucts Co. 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all  I  wanted  to  know. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  But  you  later  said  it  was  charged  to  your 
account  ? 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  now,  Senator,  let  us  have  that  correct.  I  want 
it  right ;  that  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  You  jump  to  a  conclusion  when  we  have  got  a 
half  truth. 

Mr.  Talbott.  It  was  first  charged  to  my  account. 
Senator  Edge.  It  was  first  charged  to  your  account? 
Mr.  Talbott.  Yes,  sir;  and  then  ultimately  paid  by  the  three 
people. 

Senator  Edge.  And  then  went  back  to  the  treasurv  of  the  Daj^ton 
f  Metal  Products  Co.  ? 

Mr.  Talbott.  They  got  the  $5,000  back. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all  I  wanted  to  know. 
(Witness  excused.) 

Senator  Edge.  I  will  state  for  the  record  that  I  am  just  in  receipt 
of  the  following  note  : 

Daytox,  Ohio,  October  7,  1920. 

j    Senator  Edge. 

f       My  Deae  Sir  :  'Mv.  Clarence  Keifer  is  physically  disqnalified  for  further  ap- 
pea  ranee  on  this  witness  stand  for  at  least  60  days. 
He  presented  himself  this  morning  contrary  to  my  advice. 
Am  willing  to  appear  before  your  committee  and  explain  in  detail  my  reasons 
for  above. 

Respectfully. 

C.  H.  Bretdenrach,  M.  D. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  informed  by  Judge  Brown  that  Dr. 
Breidenbach  is  a  reputable  physician  living  in  Dayton. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CHARLES  P.  CLARK. 

(The  witness,  being  first  duly  sworn,  testified  as  follows:) 
Senator  Edge.  Give  your  name,  Mr.  Clark,  and  business  to  the 
committee. 

Mr.  Clark.  Charles  P.  Clark,  business  address  294  Washington 
Street.  Brooklyn. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  one  of  the  editors  of  the  Brooklyn  Stan- 
dard Union? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  am. 

Senator  Edge.  In  the  course  of  your  professional  work  as  an  editor 
or  correspondent,  did  you  visit  Dayton  during  the  last  three  or  four 
months  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  did. 

Senator  Edge.  When  did  you  visit  Dayton  ? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  was  here  on  the  23d  of  September. 
Senator  Edge.  Did  you  see  Mr.  Schantz  on  that  occasion? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  did. 

Senator  Edge.  You  heard  Mr.  Schantz's  testimony  yesterday,  did 
you? 


2810 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Clark.  I  did. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  mean  the  23d  of  September  of  this  year^ 
Mr.  Clark.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  The  only  question  I  care  to  ask  you  in  that  connec- 
tion is  this :  Mr.  Schantz,  as  nearly  as  I  can  recall  without  consultin<i- 
the  transcript,  stated  that  he  had  not  told  you  that  some  one,  pre- 
sumably a  member  of  the  le^rislature,  who  had  sufrgested  an  audit  of 
the  books  of  the  Dayton  flood-prevention  commission,  or  the  conserv- 
ancy commission,  had  been  defeated  for  reelection.  What  did  Mr, 
Schantz  tell  you  at  that  time  in  that  re^^ard? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  will  waive  the  irregularity  of  the  question. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  want  3^ou  to  Avaive  it  if  I  am  wron^r. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are  getting  at  the  matter  not  quite  in  the 
right  way,  but  I  am  going  to  waive  it. 

Senator  Edge.  The  previous  witness  made  a  denial. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  Avas  very  emphatic  in  his  statement. 

Senator  Ed(je.  I  am  getting  at  what  this  witness  has  to  say  about  it 
in  rebuttal  of  that  testimony.  (To  the  witness:)  What  did  Mr. 
Schantz  tell  you  on  that  occasion  in  this  regard  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  do  not  believe  that  Mr.  Schantz  stated  to  me  that 
anyone  had  been  defeated  for  reelection  for  that  reason.  I  do  not 
think  I  so  stated  in  whatever  I  Avrote  at  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  I  Avill  read  you  what  you  said.  Of  course,  I  am 
only  asking  these  questions  from  memory,  as  a  matter  of  fact.  I  read 
this  from  your  article:  This  article  was  written  by  you? 

Mr.  Clark.  It  was. 

Senator  Edge.  It  appeared  in  the  Brooklyn  Standard  Union  on 
September — or  dated  September  30,  1920. 

Mr.  Clark.  At  or  about  that  time.  I  do  not  recollect  whether  it 
w^as  the  30th  of  September  or  the  1st  of  October. 

Senator  Edge.  Reading  from  your  interview,  '  What  was  the  ter- 
rible danger  that  threatened  the  flood-prcA^ention  law,'  I  asked  " — 
meaning  you. 

Mr.  Clark.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  " '  These  Avere  A^arious  amendments,'  he  answered." 
Mr.  Clark.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  "  'And  a  motion  to  haA^e  an  audit  of  the  books  of  the 
flood-prevention  committee  and  the  Miami  conservancy  district,'  I 
suggested." 

Mr.  Clark.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  "'Just  so.'  It  Avas  this  time  Mr.  Schantz  AA^ho 
agreed.  'And  the  man  Avho  proposed  the  audit  in  the  legislature  Avas 
defeated,'  says  I  " — meaning  you  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Edge.  "'Exactly,'  said  Mr.  Schantz." 

Mr.  Clark.  That  is  right. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  that  occur  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  It  did. 

Senator  Edge.  HaA^e  you  any  further  explanation  to  make  about 
the  apparent  vieAv  that  Mr.  Schantz  expressed  himself  on  here? 

Mr.  Clark.  Mr.  Schantz  told  me  the  same  story  that  he  told  you 
gentlemen  here  in  regard  to  the  whole  matter,  and  the  election  to 
which  that  refers,  I  belicA^e,  Avas  not  in  1916,  but  in  1918. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  nothing  else  to  ask  Mr.  Clark. 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPEIs'SES. 


2811 


Senator  Po:nlerene.  You  say  this  refers  to  the  election  of  1918? 

Mr.  Ci^vRK.  I  believe  the  man  who  was  defeated  was  defeated 
later — some  time  later  than  1916. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Perhaps  I  did  not  pay  close  attention  to  the 
testimony  of  Mr.  Schantz  or  to  your  question,  but  it  lingers  with  me 
that  you  were  inquiring  about  the  election  of  1916. 

Mr.  Clark.  I  was  not  asking  about  the  election. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  mean  Senator  Edge. 

Senator  Edge.  I  really  did  not  have  in  my  mind  what  year  it  was. 
I  was  simply  reading  from  this  interview. 

Senator  I^omerexe.  It  is  not  a  very  material  matter.  j\Ir.  Clark, 
Avere  you  out  here  as  a  political  writer? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  was. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  representing  what  paper? 
Mr.  Clark.  The  Brooklyn  Standard  I^nion. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Interested  in  the  Republican  campaign,  I  take 
it,  were  you? 

^Ir.  Clark.  Somewhat. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  am  not  finding  any  objection  to  that,  sir. 
What  was  your  object  in  talking  with  Mr.  Schantz  about  this? 

Mr.  Clark.  We  had  prior  to  that  time  published  in  the  Standard 
Union  a  story  by  our  political  reporter,  Mr.  Early,  which  recited 
most  of  the  facts  witli  regard  to  the  $5,000  note  that  has  come  into 
this  case  here  and  the  $37,000  fund. 

Senator  Po3[erexe.  And  you  were  out  here  making  some  investiga- 
tion of  this  subject  for  your  newspaper,  were  you  ? 

^Ir.  Clark.  Piecisely. 

Senator  Po:merexe.  Did  you  learn  during  that  investigation  that 
the  books  relating  to  this  flood-prevention  fund  had  been  audited 
by  some  public  accountants  or  auditing  committee? 

^Ir.  Clark.  Xo;  I  vlifl  not. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Have  you  learned  of  that  fact  since? 
Mr.  Clark.  Only  from  testimony  given  here  this  morning. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  Had  you  learned  of  the  fact  that  these  reports 
had  been  printed  here  in  the  local  newspapers? 
Mr.  Clark.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerexe,  Apparently  al)Out  the  only  difference  of  opin- 
ion which  seems  to  exist  as  between  3^ou  and  Mr.  Schantz  is  that  you 
gathered  the  idea  that  some  member  of  the  legislature  was  defeated 
because  he  wanted  some  resolution  or  measure  passed  by  the  legis- 
lature which  would  authorize  an  investigation  by  the  legislature  of 
this  fund.   That  is  about  the  only  thing,  is  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  had  learned  that  a  member  of  the  legislature  had 
introduced  a  resolution  to  provide  for  an  audit  of  the  books  of  the 
Miami  conservancy  district.  I  understand  that  he  failed  of  reelec- 
tion on  that  issue. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  that  bill  passed  in  the  legislature  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  That  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Well,  this  witness,  I  take  it,  would  not  know 
what  our  legislature  had  done. 
Mr.  Clark.  Xo. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  He  probably  has  enough  trouble  to  keep  track 
of  the  Xew  York  Legislature,  I  suppose.  If  it  should  turn  out  that 
audits  were  made,  assuming,  of  coui-se,  the  good  faith  of  the  audits. 


2812 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


that  ought  to  be  a  pretty  good  protection  to  the  people  here,  ought 
it  not  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  You  are  asking  for  my  opinion  as  to  that? 
Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 

Mr.  Clark.  Referring  to  the  audit  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention 
Committee's  books  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Assuming  that  there  was  an  audit  in  good 
faith.  If  that  Avas  done,  it  would  reduce  to  a  minimum  the  necessity 
for  an  investigation  by  the  State  legislature  ? 

Mr.  Clark,  I  am  not  an  accountant,  Senator  Pomerene,  but  I  do 
not  see  how  an  auditor  could  discover  the  fact  that  moneys  were  paid 
out  of  that  fund  to  dummies,  which  has  been  related  here  in  evidence. 
In  other  words,  I  do  not  see  how  they  could  l)e  expected  to  discover 
that. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  other  words,  5^ou  might  have  some  ques- 
tion as  to  the  wisdom  or  unwisdom  of  the  methods  which  were 
adopted  by  this  committee?  That  is  about  all  it  amounts  to,  is  it 
not? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  do  not  see  I  should  question  their  wisdom.  You 
asked  me  if  an  audit  would  establish  the  good  faith  of  the  matter. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  would  depend  upon  the  extent  of  the 
audit,  of  course,  and  the  authority  given.  It  is  purely  an  outside 
matter,  and  I  care  nothing  about  it. 

Senator  Edge.  What  was  the  name  of  this  member  of  the  legisla- 
ture who  was  defeated  for  reelection? 

Mr.  Clark.  His  name  Avas  Barnes,  I  believe. 

Senator  Edge.  What  district  did  he  represent? 

Mr.  Clark.  My  recollection  is  that  he  Avas  a  Dayton  man  at  that 
time. 

Senator  Edge.  LiA^ed  in  Da3i:on  ? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  think  so.       '  ♦ 
Senator  Edge.  And  he  Avas  defeated  for  reelection? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  believe  so. 

Senator  Edge.  He  introduced  a  resolution  or  bill  proA'iding  for  an 
audit? 

Mr.  Clark.  For  an  audit. 

Senator  Pomerene.  He  was  a  Republican,  was  he  not? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  do  not  know. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  defeated  at  the  primaries  by  his  own 
party  ?    Do  you  know  that  ? 
Mr.  Clark.  I  do  not. 

Senator  Poimerene.  I  do  not  care  to  ask  any  further  questions. 

Senator  Edge.  There  seems  to  be  considerable  confusion  betAveen 
the  auditing  of  the  books  of  the  conservancy  commission  and  the 
books  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission.  In  asking  this 
question  of  Mr.  Schantz  did  you  haA'e  in  mind  either  of  those,  or 
both,  or  did  you  know  in  your  investigation  whether  the  books  of 
the  prevention  commission  were  or  were  not  audited  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  I  was  speaking,-  in  my  conA^ersation  with  him  with 
respect  to  that  matter,  about  the  Miami  conservancy  district,  because 
it  Avas  the  laAv  on  Avhich  that  district  was  established  that  Avas  a 
matter  of  discussion  during  that  intervieAv. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES.  2813 

Senator  Edge.  In  that  conversation  about  the  defeat  of  this  legis- 
lator, was  he  requesting  an  audit  of  the  conservancy  commission  or 
of  the  Dayton  Flood  Prevention  Commission  ? 

Mr.  Clark.  Of  the  conservancy  district,  is  my  understanding. 
!      Senator  Edge.  Then  you  know  nothing  of  your  own  knowledge 
about  whether  an  audit  has  been  made  of  the  Dayton  Flood  Pre- 
vention Commission? 

Mr.  Clark.  No. 

(Witness  excused.) 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Senator  Pomerene,  I  have  not  anything  more 
to  say  that  I  know  of.  I  think  that  about  concludes  the  story.  Have 
you  any  other  witness? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  I  will  call  Mr,  Clarence  Greer. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  CLARENCE  N.  GREER. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sAvorn  b}^  Senator  Edge.) 
Senator  Pomerene.  Your  name  is  Clarence  N.  Greer? 
Mr.  Greer.  Clarence  N.  Greer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  live  here  in  the  city  of  Dayton  ? 
Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  have  lived  here  for  how  long? 
Mr.  Greer.  Fifty  years. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  are,  I  believe,  the  president  of  the  Gem 
City  Democratic  Club? 

Mr.  Greer.  Xo.  sir;  I  am  treasurer  of  the  Gem  Citv  Democratic 
(;iub. 

Senator  Po:\tERENE.  Well,  you  are  connected  with  the  Democratic 
organization  here  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  am  chairman  of  the  Democratic  county  committee. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  relation  did  you  sustain  to  the  Demo- 
cratic committee  and  organization  or  club  in  the  j^ear  1917? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  was  chairman. 

Senator  Pomerene.  During  that  year  were  you  interested  in  the 
political  campaign  for  the  nomination  and  election  of  candidates 
for  the  city  commission  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  J^y  the  wa3%  you  have  had  the  commission 
,   form  of  government  here  for  how  long? 

Mr.  Greer.  Since  1913,  I  think — right  after  the  flood. 
'      Senator  Pomerene.  You  know  Gov.  Cox,  of  course? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  you  know  these  gentlemen  who  testified 
here— Mr.  Talbott? 
<      Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  know  him,  do  you? 
Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  a-ou  during  that  campaign  receive  a  sum 
of  $5,000? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  did  you  receive  that  ? 
Mr.  Greer.  The  bank  tells  me  that  I  received  it  on  the  18th  of 
August. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  bank? 


2814  PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Mr.  GiiEEK.  The  Merchants'  National  Bank.    I  deposited  this 
check  there  on  that  date. 

Senator  Pomeeene.  Is  that  where  you  deposited  it  ? 
Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomere.  You  say  it  was  a  check.  Have  you  seen  that 
check  since  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  No,  sir. 

Senator  P():\rERENE.  Who  gave  you  that  clieck? 
Mr.  Greer.  Mr.  Keifer. 

Senator  Poivierene.  Is  that  the  Mr.  Keifer  avIio  was  here  a  moment 
ago  and  was  taken  sick  while  on  the  stand  ? 
Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  bank  was  he  connected  with  at  that 
time  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  The  City  National. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  what  was  his  official  position  at  that  time, 

if  you  know? 

Mr.  Greer.  Well,  I  do  not  know  that — cashier  or  something.  I  do 
not  know  what  his  position  w^as. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  any  event,  you  received  that  check  from 
him? 

Mr.  Greer.  From  him ;  yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  it  a  check  or  a  certificate  of  deposit? 

Mr.  Greer.  That  I  could  not  answer.  I  do  not  know.  It  may 
have  been  a  certificate  of  deposit  or  something.  I  do  not  know.  I 
indorsed  it ;  that  would  show  for  itself  if  you  can  get  that  check. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  is  the  check? 

Mr.  Greer.  The  City  National  must  have  it;  I  do  not  know. 
Senator  Pomerene.  'Did  you  receive  it  in  currency? 
Mr.  Greer.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or  in  cash  of  an}-  kind? 

Mr.  (jREER.  No,  sir.  I  received  a  check,  and  ni}'  indorsement  is  on 
the  back  of  it.    It  was  made  payable  to  me. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  may  state  whether  or  not  that  money, 
the  proceeds  of  that  check,  was  used  in  connection  with  the  campaign 
of  the  election  of  city  commissioners. 

Mr.  Greer.  It  was  used  in  the  primary  which  was  held  on  the 
second  Tuesday  in  August.    I  do  not  know  the  date. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  that  have  any  connection  with  Gov.  Cox's 
campaign  for  governor  in  1016? 

Mr.  Greer.  None  whatever. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  it  have  any  connection  with  the  present 
presidential  or  senatorial  campaign? 
Mr.  Greer.  Absolutely  not,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Do  you  know  at  whose  suggestion  that  check 
was  turned  over  to  you  ? 

Mr.  (treer.  AVhy."  no ;  I  do  not.  I  only  know  that  Mr.  Keifer  or 
some  one  at  the  bank  telephoned  me  to  come  there,  that  there  was  a 
check  there  for  me,  and  I  went  there  and  got  the  clieck.  I  did  not 
know  where  the  money  came  from,  and  did  not  ask.  I  supposed  it 
came  from  Mr.  Talbott  and  a  bunch  of  men  here  who  Avere  interested 
in  that  election. 

Senator  Po:^[erene.  ^Yelh  I  think  that  is  all  I  care  to  inquire  now. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2815 


Senator  Edge.  Well,  Mr.  Cireer,  that  is  rather  interesting.  Do  I 
understand  you  received  a  check  or  a  certificate  of  deposit  from  the 
City  National  Bank — on  what  date  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  The  18th  of  August. 

Senator  Edge.  You  received  such  an  instrument  on  the  18th  of 
August,  did  you  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir ;  so  the  bank  informs  me.  I  do  not  remember 
the  date,  but  I  called  them  up  and  asked  them  the  date,  and  they  gave 
it  to  me.  I  do  not  deposit  $5,000  very  often,  you  know,  and  it  was 
not  any  trouble  finding  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Just  a  moment;  just  ansAver  my  question,  please. 
Did  you  hear  Mr.  Davidson,  the  ^ice  president  of  the  bank,  testify 
this  morning  that  under  the  system  of  bookkeeping  of  the 'bank  there 
could  be  but  tAvo  dispositions  of  the  receipts  from  a  discounted  note  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes:  I  heard  his  testimony. 

Senator  P]dge.  Did  you  hear  him  further  testify  that  there  Avas  no 
record  of  any  certificates  of  deposit  having  been  paid  out  repre- 
senting the  so-termed  Cox  note? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  did  not  hear  him  testify  to  that;  no,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  Mr.  Reporter,  just  read  the  testimony  of  Mr. 
DaA'idson— oh,  neA^er  mind. 

Senator  Pomerene.  What  are  you  trying  to  do? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  trying  to  shoAv  it  could  not  possibly  be. 

Senator  Pomerene.  This  Avitness  is  not  bound  by  anything  the 
other  Avitness  may  say. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right;  but  I  am  trying  to  shoAV,  and  haA^e  estab- 
lished clearl}^,  I  think,  that  the  receipts  under  the  Cox  note,  under 
the  testimony  of  Mr.  Davidson,  an  officer  of  the  bank,  could  not  be 
lepresented  by  the  certificate  of  dei)osit  that  Mr.  Greer  says  he  got 
from  the  bank  the  day  folloAving.  That  is  Avhat  I  am  trying  to  estab- 
{   lish,  and  I  think  I  have  clearly. 

Air.  Greer.  Well,  I  can  shoAv  you  that  it  Avas. 

Senator  Edge.  Hoav  can  you  shoAV  that  it  was? 

Mr.  Greer.  If  I  tell  you  the  story  that  led  up  to  that.  I  am  not  a 
very  good  story  teller,  but  if  I  can  remember  I  can  tell  you  some  of 
]   the  details  of  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Well,  go  ahead.  We  Avill  get  the  bank  records  in 
a  moment. 

Mr.  Greer.  Well,  that  Avill  proA^e  my  statement.  In  1915  at  the 
election  the  Socialist  candidate  Avas  defeated  by  2  votes.  The 
Democratic  candidate  Avas  elected  by  2,000  or  3,000;  I  do  not  remem- 
l)er  Avhich.  After  that  election — in  order  to  explain  this  properly, 
Ave  have  a  primary  here  before  the  election,  Avhere  anybody  can  be  a 
candidate  for  city  commissioner  under  this  charter,  and  if  there  are 
to  be  tAvo  elected,  if  there  are  two  vacancies,  under  this  charter  the 
four  highest  at  the  primaries  

Senator  Edge.  Just  come  doAvn  to  the  note  matter  as  quickly  as 
possible,  Avon't  you? 

Mr.  Greer.  That  is  what  I  am  trying  to  do.  I  Avant  to  explain  to 
you  Avhy  Gov.  Cox  is  interested  in  this  thing. 

Senator  Edge.  We  are  not  questioning  that  at  all;  Ave  are  just 
trying  to  get  the  bank  transaction. 

Mr.  Greer.  Well,  that  Avill  prove  it,  if  you  Avill  get  that  check. 
(tov.  Cox  asked  me  if  I  Avould  meet  Avith  some  gentlemen  represent- 
ing the  Republican  organization  or  the  city  commission  and  try  to 


2816 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


make  some  sort  of  an  arrangement,  because  they  were  fearful  that 
the  Socialists  would  beat  the  citizens'  candidate.  And  I  did.  I  had 
a  number  of  conferences  with  them  during  the  months  of  June  and 
July,  I  think  it  was,  or  June,  1917.  They  could  not  get  together, 
because  Mr.  Burkam  wanted  some  impossible  things  and  I  would 
not  agree  to  it.  Finally,  after  a  good  many  conferences,  we  agreed 
on  Mr.  Oswald,  George  Hoffman,  and  Mr.  Kem — three  Democrats. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  chairman  of  the  Democratic  committee? 

Mr.  Gkeer.  Yes,  sir.  The  Eepublican  committee  did  not  agree  to 
it,  or  these  men  who  were  interceding  between  the  two  committees. 
I  finally  had  our  committee  indorse  these  three  men  and  presented 
their  names  to  them.  Now,  then,  at  this  primary  the  supposition 
was  these  men  were  going  to  finance  our  end  of  it  if  Ave  got  together, 
or  if  we  did  not  get  together. 

Senator  Edge.  In  eitlier  event  the}^  were  going  to  finance  your  end 
-of  it? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  supposed  they  were.  I  could  not  get  any  action  out 
of  them,  and  finally  complained  to  Gov.  Cox  about  it,  and  he  then 
put  that  note  in  the  bank  and  got  that  money  for  us. 

Senator  Edge.  He  got  that  money? 

Mr.  Greer.  That  is  why  he  put  that  note  in  the  bank,  I  suppose. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see.  Mr.  Greer,  I  do  not  think  you  understood 
my  previous  question  to  you.  There  is  no  question  at  all  about  Gov. 
Cox  putting  the  note  in  the  bank  and  having  it  discounted ;  the  ques- 
tion comes  as  to  the  check  you  allege  to  have  received,  or  the  certifi- 
cate of  deposit,  from  the  bank,  representing  the  proceeds  of  this  note. 
That  is  the  whole  issue.  How  can  you  prove  that  as  against  the  testi- 
mony of  the  bank  officials? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  can  not  prove  that  as  against  the  testimom^  of  the 
bank  officials,  but  if  you  will  examine  where  this  $5,000  came  from 
that  I  got,  that  ought  to  prove  that. 

Senator  Edge.  We  have  the  bank  records.  AVe  have  them  in  evi- 
dence completelv. 

Mr.  Greer.  Where  did  this  $5,000  come  from  that  I  got? 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  sure  I  do  not  know.  I  never  heard  of  that 
before. 

Mr.  Greer.  That  is  the  thing  to  examine  into.  That  will  prove 
my  statement. 

Senator  Edge.  It  could  not  have  come  from  Gov.  Cox,  could  it  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  It  absolutely  did  come  from  him. 

Senator  Edge.  Oh,  it  did? 

Mr.  Greer.  From  the  proceeds  of  this  note. 

Senator  Edge.  I  see,  but  it  could  not  have  come  from  Gov.  Cox 
in  cash  to  you  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Oh,  no ;  I  got  a  check. 
Senator  Edge.  Where  is  that  check? 

Mr.  Greer.  Well,  the  City  National  Bank  must  have  it.  I  do  not 
know. 

Senator  Edge.  I  guess,  Senator  Pomerene,  it  will  be  necessary  to 
bring  back  the  cashier  of  the  City  National  Bank  and  trace  that 
check  up.   This  is  a  different  transaction  entirely. 

Senator  Pomerene.  It  is  not  a  different  transaction. 

Mr.  Greer.  That  will  answer  your  whole  question. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES* 


2817 


Senator  Edge.  Under  the  evidence  on  our  record,  it  certainly  is. 
By  the  way,  Mr.  Greer,  Avere  you  an  officer  of  the  Forward  Looking 
Association  

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  make  a  suggestion.  I  understand  that 
check  is  Avith  the  City  Savings  &  Trust  Co.  Their  executive  officer, 
or  secretar}^  and  treasurer,  is  Walter  W.  Bishop.  Have  him  come 
here  with  the  books  and  papers  relative  to  a  check  or  certificate  of 
deposit  which  was  issued  to  Mr.  Clarence  N.  Greer  on  or  about 
August  IT  or  18. 

Senator  Edge.  I  also  want  Mr.  Davidson  back  and  the  books  of 
the  City  National  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  All  right. 

Senator  Edge.  Now,  Mr.  Greer,  you  stated,  if  I  understood  you 
correctly,  that  the  proceeds  of  this  check  which  you  received  on  Au- 
gust IT,  191T,  were  used  in  the  primary  for  city  commissioner.  Is 
that  correct? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  When  did  the  primary  occur? 

Mr.  Greer.  The  primary  was  the  second  Tuesday  in  August.  I 
got  this  money  after  the  primary. 

Senator  Edge.  Oh,  how  could  you  use  it  in  the  primaries  if  you 
got  it  after  the  primaries? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  used  it  in  paying  the  obligations  that  I  had  made. 

Senator  Edge.  Oh  !    Then  you  "made  various  promises  of  payment 
;  in  the  primaries,  which  occurred  August  12,  did  they  not  ? 
\    Mr.  Greer.  I  do  not  know  that.    I  do  not  remember  the  date. 

Senator  Edge.  But  it  occurred  previous  to  August  18,  did  it  not  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  And  you  made  various  promises  of  payment  and 
paid  them  from  the  proceeds  of  this  check  after  August  18 ;  is  that  it  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes,  sir. 
•    Senator  Edge.  Are  3^ou  an  officer  or  in  any  way  connected  with  the 
Forward  Looking  Association  of  Ohio  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Never  heard  of  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  an  officer  or  in  any  way  connected  with  the 
Independent  Voters'  League  of  Ohio  ? 
Mr.  Greer.  No,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  Have  you  ever  been  ? 

Mr.  (treer.  No,  sir ;  I  am  a  Democrat.   I  could  not  belong  to  that. 

Senator  Edge.  Were  you  in  any  way  connected  with  the  disburse- 
ment of  the  various  funds  that  Mr.  Schantz  contributed  in  the  cam- 
paign of  1916? 

Mr.  Greer.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  Had  nothing  to  do  with  the  disbursement  of  any  of 
those  funds? 
,    Mr.  Greer.  No,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  I  have  a  certified  copy  of  the  expenses  that  were 
filed  at  Columbus,  under  the  law  of  the  State  of  Ohio,  representing 
the  receipts  of  the  Forivard  Looking  Association  and  other  disburse- 
ments. Under  the  head  of  "  Keceipts "  there  appears  this  item  : 
"  C.  N.  Greer,  Dayton,  Ohio,  $200."    Is  that  you  ? 

^Ir.  Greer.  That  is  me ;  yes,  sir. 


2818  PRESIDENTIAL  CAAtPAIGN  EXPENSES. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  ever  contribute  $200  to  the  Forward  Look- 
m<r  Association  of  Ohio  ? 

Mr.  Greek.  I  expect  I  did.  I  don't  remember  the  name  of  that 
association. 

Senator  Edge.  You  said  a  few  moments  ago  3'OU  never  heard  of 
the  association. 

Mr.  Greer.  I  never  did  that  I  can  recall  now,  but  if  my  name  is 
there  I  did  certainly  contribute  that  $200. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  in  the  habit  of  contributing  money  to  as- 
sociations you  never  heard  of? 

Mr.  Greer.  I  am  in  the  habit  of  contributing  to  associations  that 
will  help  somebody  get  elected  on  the  Democratic  ticket  once  in 
awhile.   That  is  what  they  must  have  been  doing. 

Senator  Edge.  So  that  a  simple  approach  to  you  makes  it  possible 
to  have  a  contribution  of  $200  made  without  your  having  the  slight- 
est idea  where  it  is  going  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Senator,  he  talks  something  like  a  New  Jersey 
Republican. 

Senator  Edge.  Do  not  divert  me,  Senator.  This  is  the  most  in- 
teresting part  of  the  investigation.  I  am  glad  you  cliscoA^ered  Mr. 
Greer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  we  wanted  to  give  you  some  informa- 
tion ;  you  did  not  have  it  before. 

Senator  Edge.  Where  did  you  get  this  $200  you  contributed  to  the 
Forward  Looking  Association  in  the  campaign  of  1916  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Why,  I  expect  I  earned  it ;  I  get  a  salary  here. 

Senator  Edge.  It  was  contributed  from  your  own  personal  re- 
sources, was  it  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  But  you  do  not  remember  anything  about  it  at  that, 
you  say  ? 

Mr.  Greer.  No  ;  I  had  forgotten  all  about  it. 
Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  sufficient. 
Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all. 
(Witness  excused.) 

TESTIMONY  OF  ME.  WALTER  W.  BISHOP. 

(The  witness  was  duly  sworn  by  Senator  Edge.) 

Senator  Edge.  Give  your  name  and  business  connection. 

Mr.  Bishop.  Walter  W.  Bishop,  secretarv  and  treasurer  of  the 
City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Bishop,  what  official  position  have  yon 
with  the  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Secretary  and  treasurer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  lon,g  have  you  been  secretary  and  treas- 
urer of  the  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Since  September.  1911. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Of  course,  you  were  connected  in  that  capacity 
during  the  year  1917  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  I  was. 


PEESTDENTIAL  GAMPAIGIT  EXPENSES. 


2819 


Senator  Pomerexe.  Xow,  Avhat  relation,  if  any,  does  the  City  Trust 
i  &  Saving  Bank  sustain  to  the  City  National  Bank  of  Dayton  ? 
;     Mr.  Bishop.  The  Cit^^  National  Bank  organized  the  City  Trust  &■ 
i  Savings  Bank.    We  have  the  same  board  of  directors,  the  same  presi- 
J  dent,  and  the  same  stockholders  throughout. 

Senator  Po^ierexe.  So  that  under  your  arrangement,  etc.,  the  list 
.  of  stockholders  in  each  of  the  banks  is  the  same  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Absolutely. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Have  the  banking  or  business  relations  be- 
.  tween  these  two  banks  been  pretty  intimate  during  these  3^ears  ? 
I    Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

[  Mr.  McMahox.  Senator,  pardon  me,  I  am  a  small  stockholder. 
\  Ask  him  if  the  sale  of  a  share  of  stock  in  the  City  Bank  can  be  made 
!  without  selling  a  corresponding  share  in  the  City  Savings  &  Trust. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Well,  I  will  adopt  that  question  as  my  own, 

Mr.  McMahox^.  A  suggestion — I  wouldn't  think  of  putting  it. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  adopt  it  as  my  own.  T  Avill  put  the  question 
I  to  3^ou,  can  a  share  of  stock  in  the  City  Trust  &  Savin^gs  Bank  under 
your  scheme  be  sold  or  transferred  without  a  corresponding  sale  or 
transfer  of  a  share  of  stock  in  the  City  National  Bank? 

Mr.  Bishop.  No;  it  can  not. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Now,  do  you  know  C.  N.  Greer? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerex'e.  I  hand  to  you  now  what  purports  to  be  a  cer- 
:  tificate  of  deposit  issued  to  C.  N.  Greer  on  August  18,  1917,  for 
$5,000.    Did  3^ou  issue  that  on  the  date  that  it  bears?    [Showing  to 
witness.] 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  will  you  explain,  so  far  as  you  now 
recall,  the  circumstances  of  its  issuance  and  final  redemption  by 
your  bank  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  have  no  recollection  of  anything  in  regard  to  it. 
The  check  or  the  certificate  of  deposit  was  issued  of  the  date  men- 
tioned to  that  amount  to  C.  N.  Greer,  and  it  is  indorsed  by  him,  which 
I  believe  to  be  his  signature,  and  deposited  in  the  Merchants'  Na- 
tional Bank.  Dayton,  on  August  20. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  And  it  bears  on  the  back  thereof  the  indorse- 
i  ment  of — that  is,  the  Merchants'  National  Bank?  [Showing  to 
'  witness.] 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes;  that  is  the  date  they  sent  it  through  the  clear- 
ing house  back  to  us. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  That  is  the  Merchants'  National  Bank  of  this 
city,  is  it  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes.   I  want  the  original  back. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Oh,  yes ;  we  will  have  to  see  that  that  is  given 
hack.  I  am  going  to  read  this  into  the  record,  and  Ave  will  make 
sure  about  it :  The  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank,"  with  the  figures 
"56-38"  immediately  following  the  name.  "August  20,  1917."  Just 
let  me,  for  the  purpose  of  the  record,  what  does  this  date.  August 
^20,  1917,  mean?  . 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  would  mean  that  that  is  the  date  that  we  re- 
ceived it,  so  as  to  keep  our  record  right — that  it  came  back;  that  it 
was  returned  to  the  bank. 

]  82774— 20— PT  21  8 


2820 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene  (reading)  : 

The  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank — 56-38. 

Dayton,  Ohio,  Aug.  18,  1917— No.  2396. 
C.  N.  Greer  has  deposited  in  this  bank  $5,000.00.    Pay  $5,000  and  00  cts. 
dollars,  payable  to  the  order  of  himself  on  return  of  this  certificate  properly 
endorsed. 

W.  W.  Bishop, 

Secy.  &  Treas. 

(Indorsed  on  back:)  C.  N.  Greer. 

(By  stamp:)  The  Merchant  National  Bank,  Dayton,  Ohio.  Paid  through 
clearing  house  Aug.  20,  1917.  6. 

(Indorsed  on  face  by  rubber  stamp:)  Paid  Aug.  20,  1917.  The  City  Tru.st  ^ 
Savings  Bank,  Dayton,  Oluo. 

Senator  Poisierene.  I  think  that  is  all  just  now. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Bishop,  Avhat  did  3^011  receive  that  justified  the 
issuing  of  this  certificate  of  deposit  in  the  amount  of  $5,000  to  Mr 
Greer  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  don't  know. 

Senator  Edge.  Your  books  must  show  Avhat  Mr.  Greer  deposited  01 
what  the  equivalent  was  for  you  to  give  him  a  certificate  of  deposit 
do  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Not  necessarily. 

Senator  Edge.  Are  you  in  the  habit  of  giving  certificates  of  de 
posit  for  $5,000  to  people  without  having  a  record  of  Avhat  they  have 
deposited  in  bank,  check,  or  cash  in  order  to  secure  one  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  If  Mr.  Greer  brought  cash  in  and  deposited  that,  01 
anybody  else,  and  deposited  it  in  his  name  we  would  have  on  oui 
cash  book  $5,000  received.  If  it  was  a  check  there  w^ouldn't  be  an} 
other  record,  possibly ;  I  don't  believe  there  would  be  any  other  rec- 
ord than  simply  to  show  in  the  afternoon  at  the  close  of  business  thai 
day,  or  possibly  the  next  morning,  a  deposit  was  made  in  the  Cit} 
National  Bank,  with  a  list  of  other  checks,  may  be  a  very  long  list 
may  be  a  shorter  list,  with  simply  the  figures  "  $5,000."  If  it  Avaj 
three  or  four  checks,  of  course  it  would  be  pretty  hard  to  tell. 

Senator  Edge.  Now^,  Mr.  Bishop,  certainly  you  would  not  issue  f 
certificate  of  deposit  unless  you  had  received  the  equivalent,  wouk 
you  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  And  it  must  have  either  been  deposited  in  cash  oi 
its  equivalent,  a  check  on  some  other  bank  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 
Senator  Edge.  Is  that  correct  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  It  will  be  necessary  unless  I  can  establish  it  with 
out — I  know  something  of  the  banking  business ;  not  much,  perhaps— 
to  bring  your  books  here  showing  the  receipts  of  that  day,  and  the;^ 
must  establish  the  receipt  from  Mr.  Greer  of  $5,000  in  some  form,  o: 
your  books  will  not  balance. 

Senator  Pomerene.  No;  that  isn't  necessarily  so.  That  $5.00{ 
could  have  been  taken  there  by  Tom,  Dick,  or  Harry  and  presentee 
there  and  sim])ly  asked  that  a  certificate  of  deposit  be  made  out  in  th» 
name  of  Mr.  Greer,  or  anybody  else ;  is  not  that  correct  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes;  that  is  right. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2821 


Mr.  McMahox.  Senator,  suppose  the  City  National  arranged  it 
with  him? 

Senator  Edge.  Is  this  equivalent  of  the  amount  of  money  made 
payable  to  Mr.  Cox  by  the  discount  of  his  note  in  the  City  National 
Bank  of  Dayton  the  day  previous  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  don't  know  anything  about  that  note. 

Senator  Edge.  Could  in  any  way  a  transfer  be  made  of  that  trans- 
action from  the  City  National  Bank  to  the  City  Savings  &  Trust  Co.? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  How? 

^Ir.  Bishop.  They  could  give  us  credit  on  our  account  over  there  for 
$5,000  and  request  us  to  draw  a  certificate. 
Mr.  McMahon.  That  is  it. 
Senator  Edge.  Did  that  occur? 
Mr.  Bishop.  I  don't  know. 

Senator  Edge.  It  will  be  absolutely  necessary  to  have  the  books 
here  in  order  to  establish  it. 
Mr.  Bishop.  All  right. 

Senator  Edge.  Both  your  books  and  the  books  of  the  other  bank, 
for  it  seems  to  me  the  entire  matter  surrounds  that. 

If  this  is  supposed  to  be  the  fact  or  if  the  contention  is  that  Mr. 
Greer  secured  from  one  bank  the  $5,000  from  the  discount  of  Gov. 
Cox's  note  in  another  bank,  then  certainly  no  system  of  bookkeeping 
would  fail  to  demonstrate  the  transfer  of  the  credit  of  that  note 
from  one  bank  to  the  other  bank,  and  that  I  must  know.  Otherwise 
we  must  assume  that  the  cash  gotten  on  this  check  is  a  separate  trans- 
action. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  that  is  a  very  violate  assumption.  Let  me 
ask  a  question  or  two. 

,    Mr.  McMahon.  I  guess  the}^  are  not  all  crooks. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  no. 

Senator  Edge.  If  it  is  a  straight  transaction  the  books  will  show  it. 
McMahox.  It  is  a  perfectly  straight  transaction. 
■  Senator  Pomerene.  It  will  be  straight.  I  am  sorry  Mr.  Kiefer 
■is  not  here.  Let  me  ask  you  a  question  or  t^vo.  Your  two  banks  that 
sustain  this  intimate  relation  while  in  separate  buildings  are  con- 
nected so  that  you  have  passageways  between  them,  are  they  not? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes;  they  have  been  right  along,  and  were  at  that 
time. 

Senator  Pomerene.  While  the  one  bank  is  organized  under  the 
national  banking  laws,  the  other  one  is  oro^anized  under  the  State 
law? 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  is  correct. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  assume  in  a  general  way  that  the  purpose  of 
that  at  that  time  was  in  part  this :  That  as  the  City  Trust  &  Savings 
Bank  you  could  do  certain  things  which  you  could  not  do  as  a  na- 
tional bank.    That  is  right? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes;  we  felt  that  we  were  losing  some  business  that 
j  we  ought  to  get. 

1^  Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  a  common  occurrence  in  the  smaller 
j-as  well  as  in  the  larger  cities  of  the  country,  is  it  not  ? 
1    Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

i;  Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  they  are  sort  of  twin  institutions? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 


2822 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Pomerene.  Now,  let  us  see  if  we  can  demonstrate  hov, 
this  might  have  been.  Assume  that  Gov.  Cox,  or  some  one  else, 
went  into  the  City  National  Bank  and  discounted  his  note.  Now, 
the  proceeds  of  that  note,  of  course,  could  be  turned  over  to  somebody 
in  cash,  and  that  cash  might  be  taken  over  to  your  bank,  might  it 
not? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  this  certificate  of  deposit  issued  there- 
for? 

Mr.  jiisHOP.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Might  not  tliat  be  ?  • 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Would  not  you  have  an  entry  of  the  receipt  for  that 
cash? 

Mr.  Bishop,  i  es ;  on  the  cash  book  we  would. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  what  i  thought. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  also  it  might  have  happened  that  Mr. 
Kiefer,  who  was  the  vice  president  of  the  City  National  Bank, 
might  have  made  an  entry  on  your  bank's  account  charging  your 
bank  with  that  amount? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Mr.  McMahon.  The  City  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  City  Bank,  yes.' 

Senator  Edge.  That  Avould  appear  on  the  books,  would  it  not? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes ;  it  Avould  show  a  credit. 
Senator  Edge.  And  it  would  appear  on  the  books? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Mr.  Keifer  might  have  taken  $5,000  out  of 
his  cash  and  taken  it  over  bodily  into  your  bank  and  given  it  to  you 
and  told  you  to  issue  this,  might  he  not  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes ;  but  I  want  you  to  understand  I  did  not  write  the 
certificate.    I  signed  the  certificate. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  understand  that. 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  do  not  imagine  he  did  that,  since  I  did  not  write 
the  certificate.  He  did  not  bring  it  to  me,  but  he  may  have  taken  it 
to  the  bank  himself. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  fact,  I  said  he  could  have  taken  it  to  you. 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  wanted  to  be  sure  Avhat  you  meant. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Oh,  well,  we  want  to  be  entirel}^  exact.  Let  me 
modify  that  question.  When  the  $5,000  note  was  discounted,  Mr. 
Keifer,  representing  the  City  National  Bank,  could  have  taken  that 
$5,000  over  to  3^011,  or  to  some  one  else  in  your  bank? 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  is  what  I  wanted  to  know  if  you  meant. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  asked  you  to  issue  a  certificate  of  deposit 
to  Mr.  C.  N.  Greer? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  would  not  have  been  an  uncommon  occur- 
rence, would  it? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Not  at  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or  he  might  have  given  it  to  some  other  mes- 
senger to  be  taken  over  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  in  consideration  of  that  this  certificate  be 
issued  ? 


PEESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2823 


Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Or  even  Gov.  Cox  may  have  taken  it  over 
there  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Anybody  could  do  it. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Anybody  could  have  done  it,  so  that  it  does 
not  necessarily  follow  that  either  your  bank  or  the  City  National 
Bank  would  have  every  detail  of  this  transaction  on  its  books? 

Mr.  Bishop.  No  ;  it  would  not. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  You  say  these  various  possibilities,  particularly  the 
latter  one  that  Senator  Pomerene  suo^gested,  could  have  happened. 
I  presume  that  is  possibly  true.  But  do  you  mean  to  advise  the  com- 
mittee or  to  testify  that  it  is  a  custom  to  discount  a  note  in  one  bank 
and  take  the  cash  over  to  another  and  issue  a  certificate  of  deposit 
from  the  other;  have  you  known  of  that  to  happen  as  a  matter  of 
your  own  knowledge? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  don't  remember  any  individual  cases  of  that  sort. 
It  could  happen. 

Senator  Edge.  Oh,  yes ;  I  presume  so.  Althoufjh  your  banks  have, 
as  has  been  emphasized,  close  connection  because  of  an  interlocking* 
directorate,  etc.,  and  a  passageway  between,  you  keep,  absolutely  nec- 
essarily, a  complete  and  separate  set  of  books,  do  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Oh,  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  You  are  one,  as  very  well  brought  out  by  my  friend, 
Senator  Pomerene — organized  under  the  laws  of  the  State? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge,  And  the  other  under  the  Federal  Reserve  act? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Under  the  national  law. 

Senator  Edge.  It  is  necessary  under  the  regulations  of  those  two 
}K'ts  to  make  absolutely  distinct  and  separate  reports  to  the  Gov- 
ernment and  State,  is  it  not? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Most  assuredly;  yes. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  your  tw^o  banking  institutions,  with  the  ex- 
ce])tion  of  an  ordinary  development  of  having  a  trust  company  as- 
sociated with  the  bank,  are  separate  and  distinct,  are  they  not  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  is  the  idea. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right.  Therefore  there  must  be,  must  there 
not,  some  unusual  reason  to  discount  a  note  in  one  bank  and  take 
the  cash  to  another  and  issue  a  certificate  of  deposit  on  it  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  There  was  certainly  some  reason;  I  don't  know  that 
it  would  be  unusual,  particularly. 

Senator  Edge.  You  do  not  know  it  would  be  unusual?  Did  you 
not  say  it  was,  to  your  personal  knowledge  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  AYe  pa}^  interest  over  there,  but  that  was  not  put  in 
on  interest. 

Senator  Edge.  Frankly,  Senator,  I  do  not  think  I  will  take  the 
time  to  send  for  the  books,  and  I  am  perfectl}^  willing  to  allow  the 
matter  to  rest  just  as  it  is. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Well,  Senator,  the  whole  business  has  been  a 
little  tempest  in  a  little  teapot. 

Mr.  McMahon.  And  the  bottom  is  out  of  the  teapot  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  Yes. 


2824 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  I  think  we  have  sufficient  information,  and  I  am 
perfectly  willing  to  leave  it  to  the  public  to  make  their  own  deduc- 
tion and  give  their  own  verdict.   Are  you  through  ? 

Senator  Pomekene.  Well,  let  me  suggest  that  we  recess  here  until 
1.30.  I  may  have  another  witness  or  two  to  call.  I  am  not  sure 
about  it,  but  I  will  know  by  that  time. 

Senator  Edge.  All  right. 

Senator  Pomerene.  And  we  can  determine  it  then.  If  we  call 
them,  I  think  they  Avill  be  very  short  witnesses. 

(Thereupon,  at  12.45  o'clock  p.  m.,  a  recess  was  taken  until  1.45 
p.  m.) 

after  recess. 

TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  WALTER  W.  BISHOP— Recalled. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Since  our  recess  adjournment  for  luncheon 
have  you  made  examination  to  ascertain  whether  there  were  any  fur- 
ther entries  on  your  book  which  would  enable  you  to  particulaiize 
this  a  little  more  closely  than  you  have  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir.  I  had  several  clerks  helping  me,  and  I 
looked  where  I  thought  I  could  find  anything,  but  w^e  could  not  find 
anything.  I  am  positive  of  only  one  thing.  I  am  sure  that  the  City 
National  Bank  did  not  simply  give  us  credit  for  that  amount  of 
mone}^  on  that  date.   So  it  must  have  been  either  in  cash  or  by  check. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Cash  or  by  check?   Whose  check? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  do  not  know.   By  anybody's  check. 

Senator  Pomerene.  In  any  event,  some  consideration  went  to  your 
bank? 

Mr.  Bishop.  To  our  bank  from  some  place. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Which  was  the  basis  for  the  issuance  of  this 
certificate  of  deposit? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How^  long  have  you  been  in  the  banking  busi- 
ness? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Since  I  was  17  years  old— a  good  many  years. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Fifteen  or  twenty  years  or  more? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  During  that  time  you  have  been  required  to 
familiarize  yourself  with  people's  handwriting? 
Mr.  Bishop.  I  was  teller  most  of  my  life. 

Senator  Pomerene.  So  that  you  would  have  to  pass  upon  the  bona 
fides  of  checks  and  other  signatures  that  came  in? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Pomerene.  How  long  have  you  known  Clarence  Keif  er  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Since  I  was  13  years  old. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Was  he  the  vice  president  of  the  City  Trust  & 
Savings  as  well  as  of  the  City  National  Bank  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  He  w^as  elected  vice  president,  but  I  do  not  remem- 
ber the  year — just  about  that  time,  possibly  after  that. 

Senator  Poinierene.  Are  you  familiar  with  Mr.  Keifer's  handwrit- 
ing? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  call  your  attention  specially  to  the  name 
"  C.  N.  Greer  "  as  written  in  the  body  of  this  certificate  of  deposit, 


PEESIDEIS^TIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2825 


and  also  to  the  Avord  "  himself  as  written  in  the  blank.  Are  you 
able  to  tell  us  in  whose  handwriting  that  is — that  is,  the  name  as  well 
as  the  word  "  himself."? 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  is  written  by  Mr.  Keifer  himself. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Let  me  ask  you  further.  Of  course,  you  keep 
cash  accounts  in  your  bank? 

Mr.  Bishop.  For  our  daily  balance. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  In  what  form  was  that  cash  account  kept  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Well,  just  in  a  very  cheap  book,  or  in  sheet  form. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  Do  you  keep  those  cash  accounts  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Not  any  great  length  of  time.  That  is  what  I  hope 
to  find,  but  I  could  not  find  anything  that  far  back. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  take  it  after  j^our  books  have  been  audited 
by  the  bank  examiner,  and  after  a  certain  time  those  books  and  ac- 
counts are  of  little  or  no  value  to  your  bank  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes ;  that  is  so. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  In  that  Avay  you  dispose  of  them  after  a  cer- 
tain time,  do  you  ? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Pomerexe.  I  think  that  is  all. 

Senator  Edge.  Can  you  assign  any  reason,  Mr.  Bishop,  why  Mr. 
Keifer,  the  vice  president  of  the  City  National  Bank,  Avould  make 
out  a  certificate  of  deposit  on  your  trust  company  for  you  to  sign? 

Mr.  Bishop.  AYell,  ^Ir.  Keifer  was  very  much  interested  in  the 
City  Trust  and  Savings  Bank.  He  helped  to  organize  it  and  had 
freedom  and  access  to  the  bank.  He  advised  us  and  helped  us  build 
up  its  departments. 

Senator  Edge.  Was  he  in  the  habit  of  making  out  the  certificates  of 
deposit  that  have  to  go  through  your  books — not  his  books — and  hand 
them  to  you  as  cashier  to  sign? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  do  not  believe  he  very  often  did  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  would  assume  not.  You  have  stated  that  from 
your  investigation  during  the  lunch  hour  the  money,  or  the  equiva- 
lent, which  justified  the  issuing  of  a  certificate  of  deposit  must  have 
been  in  cash  or  by  check. 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  And  not  a  passage  of  money  from  one  bank  to  the 
i  other? 

Mr.  Bishop.  No. 

Senator  Edge.  In  other  words,  in  cash  delivered  over  your  counter  ? 
]Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  By  an  individual  from  the  outside? 
Mr.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 
Senator  Edge.  Or  by  check  ? 
^Ir.  Bishop.  Yes,  sir. 

Senator  Edge.  If  you  have  been  examining  the  entries  on  that  day, 
August  18,  1917,  did  you  see  any  entry  of  the  receipt  of  a  $5,000 
■■  check  ?    Certainly  it  must  have  been  in  your  entries. 

Mr.  Bishop.  No  ;  I  could  not  find  any.  I  could  not  find  the  records, 
j  I  mean. 

\  Senator  Edge.  Then,  by  the  process  of  deduction  you  assume  that  it 
I  was  cash  over  the  counter — I  speak  of  cash  or  check. 

Mr.  Bishop.  One  way  or  the  other. 

Senator  Edge.  Cash  or  check? 


2826 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Mr.  Bishop.  Cash  or  check.  We  have  not  any  record  of  either  cash 
or  check. 

Senator  Edge.  You  have  not  any  record  in  your  book? 

Mr.  Bishop.  No.  The  only  record  would  be  on  a  deposit  ticket  and 
those  are  not  kept. 

Senator  Edge.  It  would  not  be  on  a  deposit  ticket,  would  it,  if  it 
was  a  check  passed  over  your  counter  . in  order  to  have  a  certificate  of 
deposit  exchanfred  for  it  ?   That  is  not  a  deposit  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  If  somebody  brought  a  check  to  the  counter  for  $5,000 
and  asked  us  to  draw  a  certificate  of  deposit  we  would  

Senator  Edge  (interrupting).  What  record  would  you  have? 

Mr.  Bishop.  We  would  take  that  check  and  lay  it  in  the  cash 
drawer.  We  would  draw  the  certificate  and  register  it  on  our  certifi- 
cate register. 

Senator  Edge.  What  record  of  that  transaction  would  you  have 
on  your  books? 

Mr.  Bishop.  That  check  Avould  then  be  taken  with  a  bunch  of  other 
checks — and  there  may  be  few  and  there  may  be  a  great  many — and 
deposited  in  the  City  National,  which  was  the  only  account  we  had  at 
that  time,  and  the  only  record  would  be  a  typewritten  figure,  or 
adding-machine  figure,  on  the  deposit  ticket. 

Senator  Edge.  I  asked  you  anci  I  understood  you  to  answer  that  in 
looking  during  the  lunch  hour  at  the  items  of  August  18  you  did  not 
find  the  $5,000  entry. 

Mr.  Bishop.  Let  me  make  that  clear;  maybe  you  did  not  under- 
stand me.  It  does  happen  sometimes  that  one  bank  will  transfer 
funds  to  the  other  bank.  It  is  not  necessary  to  draw  a  check  or  give 
the  cash.  The  only  thing  that  is  necessary  to  make  is  a  credit  to  the 
City  Tust  &  Savings  Bank  and  the  City  Trust  &  Savings  Bank 
would  make  a  debit  of  $5,000. 

Senator  Edge.  It  could  be  passed  over  in  that  way,  could  it  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Yes. 

Senator  Edge.  If  this  represents  the  proceeds  from  the  Cox  note, 
the  discount  of  Avhich  has  been  clearly  established  in  the  other  bank, 
can  you  assign  any  reason  wdiy  the  certificate  of  deposit  would  not 
be  issued  by  that  bank,  rather  than  be  passed  over  to  you  and  asking 
the  Savings  &  Trust  Co.  to  issue  it  ? 

Mr.  Bishop.  Frankly,  I  do  not  know  why  it  Avas  done.  I  have  not 
any  idea. 

Senator  Edge.  Did  you  hear  Mr.  Greer  testify  this  morning  that 
he  deposited  the  check  that  somebody  gave  him  in  the  Merchants" 
National  Bank? 

Mr.  Bishop.  I  did  not  hear  anybody  testify. 

Senator  Edge.  You  were  not  here?    I  think  you  will  find  in  the 
transcript  that  Mr.  Greer  so  testified. 
Senator  Pomekene.  Testified  to  what  ? 

Senator  Edge.  That  the  check  for  $5,000  was  deposited  in  the  Mer- 
chants' National  Bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  indorsement  shows  that. 

Mr.  Bishop.  The  indorsement  on  our  certificate  shoAVS  that. 

Senator  Edge.  I  think  that  is  all. 

(Witness  excused.) 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2827 


TESTIMONY  OF  MR.  MARVYN  SCUDDER— Recalled. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Sciidder,  you  have  already  been  sworn.  I  do 
not  want  to  get  into  an  argument  with  my  good  friend  Senator 
Pomerene,  but  I  have  made  some  investigation  from  the  standpoint 
I  of  legal  consideration  of  the  competency  of  evidence.  Mr.  Keifer 
;  this  morning  on  the  stand  testified  that  he  thought  he  made  payment 
j  of  the  proceeds  from  the  Cox  note  to  Mr.  Greer.  That  appears  in 
(  the  testimony.  Xow,  I  think  it  is  competent  evidence,  in  view  of 
j  your  statement  to  the  contrary,  for  me  to  ask  you  what  Mr.  Keifer 
j  told  you  in  that  regard? 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  shall  object  to  that  unless  you  lay  the  foun- 
dation for  it.  The  foundation  is  not  laid  for  that.  You  are  seeking 
to  impeach  another  witness,  and  you  are  not  giving  him  an  oppor- 
tunity to  say  whether  he  made  a  certain  statement  or  not. 

Senator  Edge.  The  testimony  already  taken  shows  that.  Will 
you  be  satisfied  if  I  have  that  testimony  read  ? 

Senator  Pomerene.  The  testimony  shows  he  thought  he  paid  it  to 
Mr.  Greer. 

Senator  Edge.  I  am  asking  this  witness  what  he  told  him,  in  re- 
l)uttal  of  that  direct  statement. 

Senator  Pomerene.  That  is  where  the  difference  occurs  between 
j  3^ou  and  me,  on  the  competency  of  this  question  without  laying  the 
foundation  for  it.    That  is  a  plain  a,  b,  c,  of  the  law  of  evidence. 

Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  know  what  you  consider  a  proper  founda- 
tion. If  a  witness  makes  the  statement  under  oath  that  he  thought 
he  made  a  certain  payment  to  Mr.  Greer,  and  Mr.  Scudder,  the  wit- 
1  ness  now  on  the  stand,  will  testify  otherwise,  why  can  I  not  call  Mr. 
'  Scudder  and  ask  what  the  other  witness  said  to  him?  That  is  cer- 
tainly in  answer  to  the  other  witness'  statement  and  in  direct  re- 
futation of  his  statement. 

Senator  Po^ierene.  If  you  were  a  lawyer  3^ou  would  understand  it. 

Senator  Edge.  Then  I  desire  to  register  in  the  record  my  objection 
to  not  being  permitted  to  ask  Mr.  Scudder  what  Mr.  Keifer  said  to 
him,  in  view  of  the  fact  that  Mr.  Keifer  said  here  under  oath  that  he 
gave  this  money  to  Mr.  Greer.  I  believe  I  have  a  right  under  the 
rules  of  evidence  to  have  Mr.  Scudder  tell  the  committee  Avhat  Mr. 
Keifer  told  him,  in  spite  of  the  objection. 

Mr.  Scudder,  during  that  period  in  which  you  were  making  this 
investigation  you  were  a  direct  attache  of  the  Department  of  Justice 
of  the  United  States  Government,  were  you  not  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  was. 

vSenator  Edge.  Senator  Pomerene,  under  the  rules  of  evidence,  as 
I  understand  them,  I  can  certainly  take  the  answer  of  the  witness 
:  and  the  record  may  show  it  is  taken  over  your  objection  and  protest. 
That,  however,  is  a  legal  question.  You  have  protested  and  I  have 
made  my  reply  to  your  protest,  and  I  certainly  think  it  fair  that 
Mr.  Scudder,  considering  the  position  he  is  in,  should  give  his 
nnswer. 

Senator  Pomerene.  If  you  want  to  put  yourself  on  record  as  being 
absolutely  unfair  to  your  own  Avitness,  Mr.  Keifer,  and  as  absolutely 
unfair  to  Mr.  Cox,  I  have  registered  my  protest,  and  do  not  propose 
to  recede  from  it. 


2828 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


Senator  Edge.  I  do  not  propose  to  put  myself  in  the  position  of 
being  unfair  to  anybody,  but  Mr.  Scudder  has  started  to  testify  on 
yesterday  in  regard  to  this  matter,  proceeded  so  far,  and  then  was 
stopped  because  of  objection  from  you  that  we  would  get  that  testi- 
mony direct  and  then  he  could  come  back.  We  got  as  much  as  we 
could  direct  from  Mr.  Keifer,  and  only  in  relation  to  that  point  am  I 
asking  Mr.  Scudder  the  question,  and  I  would  like  him  to  answer  my 
question. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  absolutely  enter  my  protest  against  any  such 
procedure  as  that. 

Senator  EdCxE.  Mr.  Scudder,  what  did  Mr.  Keifer  tell  you  in  con- 
nection with  the  payment  of  that  money? 

Mr.  Scudder.  "  I  paid  the  money  to  Gov.  Cox,  and  he  put  it  in  a 
bag  and  went  away  with  it." 

Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  never  saw  Gov.  Cox,  did  you? 
Mr.  Scudder.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  never  made  any  inquiry  of  him  either  by 
letter  or  otherwise"? 

Mr.  Scudder.  No  ;  but  I  tried  to. 

Senator  Pomerene.  You  knew  at  the  time  you  were  making  this 
investio-ation  that  he  was  then  the  governor  of  this  State,  did  you  not  ? 
Mr.  Scudder.  I  do  not  think  he  was. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  were  you  making  this  investigation? 
Mr.  Scudder.  In  1918. 

Senator  Pomerene.  We  in  Ohio  know  that  he  has  been  the  gover- 
nor since  1916 — continuously  as  governor.  Notwithstanding  the 
fact  that  you  have  not  seen  him  and  have  not  got  his  version  of  this, 
you,  as  an  expert  accountant,  are  trying  to  besmirch  him  b}^  a  mere 
statement  which  comes  to  you  in  an  irregular  kind  of  way? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Senator,  I  protest  against  that  statement. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  insist  upon  it.  That  is  exactly  w^hat  you  are 
doing. 

Mr.  Scudder,  I  am  a  very  mild  man,  but  I  protest  against  that 
statement. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  am  very  mild,  too,  except  Avhen  I  see  a  sort 
of  conspiracy  to  besmirch  honorable  gentlemen. 

Mr.  Scudder.  That  is  the  most  extraordinary  statement  I  ever 
heard  of. 

Senator  Pomerene.  I  want  that  to  go  into  the  record. 

Senator  Edge.  Mr.  Scudder,  you  have  only  repeated  as  I  under- 
stand it.  the  statement  made  to  you  by  the  vice  president  of  a  national 
bank  in  the  city  of  Dayton  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  Absolutely. 

Mr.  McMahon.  Please  ask  him  whether  that  was  under  oath. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Was  that  statement  of  Mr.  Kiefers  under 
oath  ? 

Mr.  Scudder.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Where  did  you  see  him? 

Mr.  Scudder.  I  saw  him  in  the  bank. 

Senator  Pomerene.  When  did  you  see  him? 

Mr.  Scudder.  The  latter  part  of  the  investigation  in  1918. 


PRESIDENTIAL  CAMPAIGN  EXPENSES. 


2829 


Senator  Pomerene.  Was  there  anybody  else  present  ? 
Mr.  ScuDDER.  Mr.  Davidson. 
Senator  Pomerene.  Anyone  else? 

Mr.  ScUDDER.  No. 

Senator  Pomerene.  Did  you  have  any  of  these  records  with  you 
at  the  time?    Did  you  have  that  certificate  of  deposit? 

Mr.  ScuDDER.  I  had  the  record  of  the  bank  there  which  Mr.  David- 
son and  I  had  been  going  over  and  found  there  was  no  check  paid  at 
that  time. 

Senator  Pomerexe.  I  do  not  think  I  care  to  go  any  further. 
Senator  Edge.  That  is  all. 

(Thereupon,  at  2  o'clock  p.  m.,  the  subcommittee  adjourned.) 


X 


DEC  12  1331 

UNIVERSITY  OF  ilUNOiS, 


(8EHATE  BEPOET  HO.  823,  SIXTY-SIXTH  CONOEESS,  THIED  SES- 

SIOH.) 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


Fbbbuabt  24  (calendar  day,  March  1),  1921.— Ordered  to  be  prmted. 


Mr.  Kenton,  from  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections,  sub- 
mitted the  following 


REPORT. 

[Pursuant  to  S.  Res.  357.] 


The  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections,  which  was  directed  by 
a  resolution  adopted  on  May  20,  1920,  to  investigate  and  report  the 
campaign  expenditures  of  the  various  presidential  candidates  of  all 
parties,  have  completed  their  investigation  and  submit  herewith  a 
report  in  relation  thereto. 

On  the  20th  day  of  May,  1920,  the  Senate  passed  the  following 
resolution  : 

(8.  Res.  357,  Sixty-sixth  Congress,  second  session.] 

Resolved,  That  the  Committee  on  Privilejjes  and  Elections,  or  any  subcommittee 
thereof,  is  instructed  to  investisate  forthwith  and  report  to  the  Senate  as  soon  as  pos- 
sible the  carapaitrn  expenditures  of  the  various  presidential  candidates  in  both  parties, 
the  names  of  the  persons,  firms,  or  corporations  subscribing,  the  amount  contributed, 
the  method  of  expenditure  of  eaid  sums,  and  all  facts  in  relation  thereto,  not  only  as 
to  the  subscriptions  of  money  and  expenditures  thereof,  but  as  to  the  use  of  any  other 
means  or  influence,  including  the  promise  or  use  of  patronage  and  the  providing  of 
funds  for  setting  up  contesting  delegations,  and  all  other  facts  in  relation  thereto  tliat 
would  not  only  be  of  public  interest  but  would  aid  the  Congress  in  any  necessary 
remedial  l^slation. 

'!  hat  said  Committee  on  Trivilegee  and  P^lections,  or  any  subcommittee  thereof,  is 
hereby  empowered  to  sit  and  act  at  such  time  and  plac.'e  as  it  may  deem  necessary; 
to  require  by  subpoena,  or  otherwise,  the  attendance  of  witnesses,  the  production  of 
books,  papers,  and  documents;  to  employ  stenographers  at  a  cost  of  not  exceeding^ 
$1  per  printed  page.  The  chairman  of  the  committee  or  subcommittee,  or  any  mem- 
ber thereof,  uiay  administer  oaths  to  witnesses.  Su  bpfrnas  for  witnesses  shall  be  issued 
under  the  signature  of  the  chairman  of  the  committee  or  subcommittee  thereof.  Every 
person  who,  having  been  summoned  as  a  witness  by  authority  of  said  committee,  or 
any  subcorandttee  thereof,  willfully  makes  default,  or  who,  having  appeared,  refuses 
to  answer  any  question  pertinent  to  the  investigation  heretofore  authorized,  shall  be 
held  to  the  penalties  provided  by  section  102  of  the  Revised  Statutes  of  the  United 
States. 

1  he  expense  thereof  shall  be  paid  from  the  contingent  fund  of  the  Senate  on  vouchers 
ordered  by  sai.l  committee,  siirned  by  tbv^  chairman  thereof,  and  approved  by  the 
Committee  to  Audit  and  Control  the  Contingent  Expeuses  of  the  Senate. 


182774—21 


2941 


2942 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


On  the  21st  day  of  May,  1920,  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and 
Elections  passed  the  following  resolution: 

Resolved,  That  a  subcommittee  of  five  members,  of  which  three  shall  constitute  a 
quotum,  be  appointed  by  the  chairman  to  conduct  the  invesligfation  with  vliicli  tie 

committee  is  charged  by  Senate  resohitiou  357,  and  ihat  it  proceed  at  once  to  prose- 
cute the  same;  that  the  managers  of  the  campaigns  of  the  various  candidates  or  per- 
sons reputed  to  be  candidates  be  requested  bv  telegraph  to  attend  before  the  sub- 
committee on  Monday,  May  24.  1920;  that  the  hearings  before  the  said  subcommittee 
be  public  and  that  it  be  directed  to  proceed  in  the  work  with  which  it  is  charged 
with  all  dispatch.  The  subcommittee  may  appoint  one  or  more  of  its  members  to 
investigate  any  particular  queation  or  questions.  The  subcommittee  shall  report 
to  the  full  committee. 

The  chairman  of  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections, 
Senator  Dilhngham,  on  the  21st  day  of  May,  1920,  appointed  the 
following  subcommittee:  Senator  William  S.  Kenyon  (chairman), 
Senator  Atlce  Pomercne,  Senator  James  A.  Reed,  Senator  Walter 
E.  Ed^e,  and  Senator  Selden  P.  Spencer. 

On  June  5,  1920,  the  Senate  also  passed  the  following  resolution: 

|S.  Res.  383,  Sixty-sixth  Congress,  second  session.] 

Hesolved,  That  the  powers  conferred  upon  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elec- 
tions and  the  subcommittee  heretofore  appointed  by  it  under  Senate  Resolution  357 
be,,  and  they  are  hereby,  extended  so  as  to  authorize  and  require  the  Committee  on 
Privileges  and  Elections,  or  the  subcommittee  thereof  now  acting  under  Senate  Reso- 
lution 357,  to  investigate,  after  the  adjournment  of  the  Democratic  national  conven- 
tion, and  before  the  Novem)ier  elections,  1920,  the  receipts  and  expenditures  of  the 
several  political  comniittefs,  and  the  receipts  and  expenditures  of  the  campaigns 
conducted  by  and  on  behalf  of,  or  ai^ainst,  the  election  of  the  several  candidates  for 
President  and  Vice  President,  and  the  United  States  Senate,  and  for  said  purposes 
the  said  (,'ommittee  on  Pri^^ leges  and  Elections,  or  the  said  subcommittee,  and  the 
members  thereof,  are  hereby  clothed  with  the  same  powers  conferred  on  said  commit- 
tee and  said  subcommittee,  and  the  members  thereof,  by  said  resolution  numbered 
357;  and  they  are  further  directed  to  make  report  of  their  proceedings  to  the  Senate 
not  later  than  the  first  Monday  in  December,  1920. 

On  the  7th  day  of  Deccmhor,  1920,  the  Senate  extended  the  time 
in  which  the  committee  should  make  report. 

These  three  resolutions  constitute  the  authority  under  which  the 
Subcommittee  of  Privileges  and  Elections  conducted  its  investigation. 
The  report  will  deal  with  the  subjects  as  follows: 

I.  The  campaign  funds  of  the  various  candidates  for  the  nomina- 
tion of  President  in  both  the  Repubhcan  and  Democratic  conventions, 
gathered  from  both  receipts  and  expenditures. 

II.  The  amounts  expended  by  the  various  national  committees  of 
the  respective  parties  during  the  campaign,  these  committees  being 
as  follows:  (a)  Republican  national  committee,  (6)  Democratic 
national  committee,  (c)  Republican  congressional  committee,  {d) 
Democratic  congressional  conmiittee,  (e)  Republican  senatorial  com- 
mittee, (/)  Bureau  of  senatorial  elections,  Democratic  national  com- 
mittee. 

III.  The  amounts  received  by  State  committees  in  the  various 
States  outside  of  the  sums  received  from  the  national  committee. 

I. 

The  committee  investigated  the  receipts  and  expenditures  of 
money  in  connection  with  the  candidacies  of  17  persons,  including 
avowed  candidates  in  both  the  Repubhcan  and  Democratic  Parties 
and  those  not  formally  candidates  but  in  whose  interests  activities 
were  apparent. 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


2943 


In  certain  instances  the  financial  interlocking  arrangements  of 
the  various  organizations  in  the  interest  of  a  candidate  were  of  such 
a  nature  that  it  is  difficult  to  arrive  at  a  specified  sum  as  representing 
the  total  funds  use<l.  The  following  compilation,  however,  based 
both  upon  the  testimon}^  taken  and  an  examination  of  the  financial 
statements  of  receipts  and  expenditures,  as  furnished  the  committee 
is,  in  our  judgment,  a  fair  statement  of  the  approximate  amounts 
of  the  campaign  funds  used  in  the  interest  of  eacn  candidate  as  found 
by  the  committee.    The  list  is  alphabetically  arranged. 

Dr.  Nicholas  Murray  Butler,  Republican  

Gov.  Calvin  Coolidge,  Republican  

Gov.  James  M.  Cox,  Democrat  

Gov.  Edward  I.  Edwards,  Democrat  

Senator  Joseph  Irwin  France,  Republican  

James  W.  Gerard,  Democrat  

Senator  Warren  G .  Harding,  Republican. . .... 

Senator  Gilbert  M.  Hitchcock,  Democrat  

Herbert  Hoover,  Republican  

Senator  Hiram  W.  Johnson,  Republican  

Gov.  Prank  O.  Ix)wden,  Republican..  

William  G.  McAdoo,  Democrat  

Senator  Robert  L.  Owen,  Democrat  

A.  Mitchell  Palmer,  Democrat  

Senator  Miles  Poindexter,  Republican. . . . . . , 

Senator  Howard  Sutherland,  Repub,lican  ' 

Gen.  Leonard  Wood,  Republican   ... 

Total   2,  980, 033 

Some  explanation  of  the  above  may  be  in  order.  For  instance 
as  to  the  Wood  campaign: 

Mr.  Spraijue  who  is  the  national  treasurer  of  the  Wood  campaign  com- 
mittee testified  to  receipts  of  (dee  hearings,  S.  Res.  357,  pt.  1,  p.  518)..  $1, 180,043 

Mr.  Stebbins,  who  had  to  do  with  liandling  funds  in  the  East  for 
two  Wood  organizations,  received  at  one  time  $156,  271 

At  anotlier  time   280,  213 

^^aking  a  total  of  (pt.  5,  p.  779)   436, 484 

In  addition  to  these  were  the  funds  received  from  Indiana  not 
included  in  tlie  Sprague  or  Stebbins  accounts  amounting  to 
(Dt.  1,  p.  523)   21,000 

In  Afichiffan  there  was  money  collected  and  expended  not  ac- 
counted for  in  these  otlier  matters,  of  (pt.  1,  p.  236). . ;   54,  266 

And  (pt.  2,  p.  621)   23,000 

Making  a  total  of  .'   77,  266 

In  addition  to  tliis,  Mr.  Loeb  testified  to  receiving  (pt.  6,  p.  864)   406, 000 

Making  a  total  of   2, 120,  793 

In  this  there  are  some  duplications;  in  the  Stebbins  totals  there 

is  duplication  of  (pt.  5,  p.  777)   77, 490 

In  the  Stebbins  account  tliere  is  accounted  for  by  Loeb  (pt.  5,  p. 

777)  :   130,000 

In  the  Loeb  account  there  is  accounted  for  by  Sprague  (pt.  1,  p. 

509;  pt.  6,  p.  864).,   225,000 

Making  a  total  duplication  of   432,  490 

Deducting  tliis  from  the  $2, 120,793  leaves  a  balance  of   1,  688,  303 

There  should  be  added  to  this  the  amounts  collected  by  Mr.  King  (pt.  1, 

p.  286)  91,000 

Making  a  total  of   1,  779,  303 

And  there  should  be  deducted  from  tliis  the  amount  Mr.  Loeb  testified  was 
returned  to  Col.  Procter  (pt.  0,  p.  864)   6,000 

Which  leaves  a  balance  of   1,  773,  303 


$40.  550 
68.  375 
22.000 
12.  900 
None. 
14.  040 
113, 109 
3,337 
173,  542 
194.393 
414,  984 
None. 
8.595 
59,610 
77. 150 
4,145 
1,773,  303 


2944 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


Campaign,  Senator  Hiram  W.  Johnson: 

Amount  raised  and  disbursed  by  the  eastern  manager  (pt.  1,  p  37) 

Amount  raised  in  California  (pt.  3,  p.  723).  ,,,,, 

Amount  raised  in  Michigan  (pt.  1,  pp.  203,  204,  205)  .  . 

Amount  raised  in  Nebraska  (pt.  1,  p.  369)  

Making  a  total  of   194  3^ 

Campaign,  Herbert  Hoover:  ~^ 

The  Hoover  National  Republican  Club  collected  (pt.  1,  p.  98)   66, 332 

The  Pennsylvania  Hoover  Club  collected  (pt.  1,  p.  115)   20  000 

The  Hoover  Republican  Club  of  California  collected  (pt.  5,  p.  796) . .  87^  210 

Making  a  total  of   173,  542 

The  last  two  items  are  independent  of  any  funds  received  from 
California. 

We  insert  these  illustrations  merely  to  show  how  we  reach  the  sum 
totals  expended  by  the  various  campaign  conunittees  in  the  precon- 
vention  campaign.  It  has  been  difficult  to  arrive  at  entirely  accurate 
totals,  but  we  believe  our  figures  show  the  situation  fairly  and  as 
accurately  as  it  is  possible  to  do.  Undoubtedly  as  to  some  of  the 
candidates  more  was  spent  than  is  here  indicated. 

.........     _ 


$72,  230 
113,000 
7,  2.50 
1.913 


In  this  connection  we  set  forth  the  disbursements  of  the  national 
organizations  of  both  the  Republican  and  Democratic  Parties  from 
the  time  of  the  national  conventions  up  to  the  end  of  the  periods  of 
disbursements  in  connection  with  the  presidential  election  of  Novem- 
ber 2,  1920.  Both  of  the  great  political  parties  claim  they  closed  the 
campaign  with  a  deficit.  Consequently  we  do  not  set  out  the  re- 
ceipts but  the  disbursements,  as  they  will  more  clearly  show  the 
amounts  expended  in  the  campaign,  it  being  reasonable  to  suppose 
that  the  deficits  will  be  eliminated  by  subsequent  contributions. 

We  have  not  ascertained  the  disbursements  of  the  Socialist  Party 
or  the  Farm  Labor  Party.  Re|>orts  were  requested  from  the  Socialist 
Party,  but  they  were  not  furnished,  and  as  the  real  contest  was  between 
the  two  great  parties  the  committee  believe  it  sufficient  to  set  forth 
their  expenditures.  In  this  connection  we  desire  to  call  attention  to 
the  fact  that  there  are  many  organizations  in  the  country  of  a  semi- 
political  nature,  active  in  political  matters,  which  organizations,  how- 
ever, had  no  candidates  for  the  Presidency,  but  did  exert  their  influ- 
ence in  various  ways  in  the  election.  As  they  were  not  conducting 
campaigns  for  the  Presidency  the  committee  did  not  feel  warrantea 
in  entering  into  an  investigation  of  their  activities.  If  the  Senate 
should  desire  that  their  receipts  and  expenditures  and  general  method 
of  operation  be  investigated,  the  committee  is  quite  willing  to  do  so. 
It  would,  we  think,  require  further  authorization  from  the  Senate  and 
an  extension  of  time  in  which  the  committee  should  make  its  final 
report.  We  believe  the  activities  of  the  various  quasi-political  or- 
ganizations should  be  investigated  and  a  statement  given  to  the 
Congress  and  to  the  public  as  to  what  their  activities  and  objects  are. 

Pollowing  is  a  statement  of  the  disbursements  of  the  national 
organizations  of  both  Republican  and  Democratic  Parties  from  the 
time  of  the  national  conventions  up  to  the  close  of  the  campaign  in 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


2646 


connection  with  the  {>residentiai  election  of  November  2,  1920, 
including  the  post-election  financial  statements: 


Republican  national  committee  '$5,  319,  729.  32 

Democratic  national  committee   1,  318, 274. 02 


Total  : 

Republican  congressional  committee  

Democratic  congressional  committee  

Total  

Republican  senatorial  committee    

Bureau  of  senatorial  elections,  Democratic  national 
committee  

Total  


375, 969. 05 
24,  498.05 


326, 980.  29 
6,  675.00 


$6,  638,  003.  34, 


400,  467. 10 


333,  655.  29 


Making  a  grand  total  of   7, 372, 125.  73 

We  do  not  deem  it  essential  to  set  forth  in  this  report  all  the  par- 
ticulars involved  in  these  various  disbursements.  The  figures  fur- 
nished us  do  not  go  at  all  into  minute  detail,  but  we  have  been 
furnished  with  lists  of  contributors  of  $100  or  more.  We  file  these 
lists  with  the  report  and  they  will  be  subject  to  inspection  in  the 
office  of  the  Secretary  of  the  Senate.  The  expense  of  printing  the 
same  would  be  enormous  and  we  do  not  believe  the  situation  demands 
it.  Anyone  desiring  specific  information  on  these  matters  may  ex- 
amine these  lists  in  the  office  of  the  Secretary  of  the  Senate. 

We  group  the  amounts  sent  by  the  Republican  senatorial  committee 
into  the  respective  States  as  shown  by  figures  presented  and  it  is  as 
follows : 


Arizona.  

California  

Colorado  , 

Idaho  , 

Indiana  

Iowa  

Kansas  

Kentucky  

Maine  

Mar>'land  , 

Missouri  

Nevada  


$23,  000 

6,500 
13,000 
]3,000 
10,000 
5,000 
3,000 
3.000 
1,000 
8,000 
10,000 
17.000 


New  Hampshire. 

New  York  

North  Carolina. . 

Ohio  

Oklahoma  , 

Oregon  

South  Dakota.... 

Utah  , 

Virginia  

Washington  , 

Wisconsin  


$5,500 
4,000 
2,500 
8,000 

15,500 

15,  450 
5,000 

12,000 
500 
7,  725 

10,000 


The  expenditures  of  the  national  committees  do  not  show  the  entire 
amounts  used  in  the  campaign,  but,  of  course,  it  is  practically  im- 
possible to  show  such  amounts.  It  would  necessitate,  not  only  getting 
the  State  expenditures,  but  the  county  and  township  expencutures; 
likewise  the  expenditures  of  independent  groups  and  individuals. 
This  the  committee  did  not  feel  warranted  in  undertaking.  We 
have,  however,  endeavored  to  secure  from  the  respective  political 
committees  of  the  various  States  the  amounts  collected  by  them  out- 
side of  the  amounts  received  from  the  national  committees. 

•  Docs  not  Include  a  loan  of  $306,233.50  to  the  Republican  congressional  committee,  a  major  portion  of 
which  the  records  show  was  paid  back,  or  the  loan  of  $100,000  to  the  senatorial  committee  which  the  records 
show  was  repaid  in  full. 


2946 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


It  was  developed  in  the  hearings  that  the  Republican  national  com- 
mittee had  a  joint  collection  arrangement  with  the  Republican  State 
committees  in  various  States  whereby  funds  were  collected  by  the 
national  committee  and  returned  to  the  State  committee.  The 
figures  we  have  heretofore  shown  as  to  the  national  committees  would 
cover  these  items,  but  the  report  would  not  be  complete  without 
showing  the  receipts  by  the  State  committees  of  contributions  sepa- 
rate and  distinct  from  the  contribution  of  the  national  committee. 
Your  committee  therefore  made  an  effort  to  secure  from  the  various 
Slate  committees  a  statement  of  the  aggregate  receipts  of  the  State 
party  organizations  independent  of  the  funds  raised  by  the  national 
committees. 

In  the  early  part  of  January,  1921,  the  chairman  of  the  committee 
addressed  a  letter  to  the  chairman  of  the  Republican  State  committee, 
and  to  the  chairman  of  the  Democratic  State  central  committee  in 
each  State  in  the  Union,  including  the  District  of  Columbia,  asking 
him  to  furnish  the  committee  with  a  sworn  statement  of  the  aggregate 
receipts  and  expenditures  of  his  State  party  organization  for  any  pur- 
pose in  connection  with  the  presidential  campaign  of  1920,  inde- 
pendent of  any  funds  collcted  by  or  for,  or  received  from  the  national 
party  organization  or  any  agency  or  branch  of  the  same.  In  in- 
stances where  the  replies  were  not  forthcoming  after  a  reasonable 
time  the  letters  were  followed  up  by  urgent  telegrams. 

The  response  to  this  request  for  information  was  quite  general, 
and  as  a  result  the  committee  is  able  to  attach  a  table  showing  the 
receipts  by  States  of  such  contributions  with  but  two  Republican 
and  three  Democratic  committee  reports  missing.  The  statements 
returned  were  of  varied  character.  A  great  many  indicated  that  the 
funds  collected  were  used  in  part  in  connection  with  the  campaigns 
for  State  and  other  local  officers,  for  United  States  Senator,  -Con- 
gressmen, etc.  Many  furnished  certified  copies  of  statements  filed 
m  compliance  with  State  law,  and  in  these  instances  it  was  neces- 
sary to  deduct  the  apparent  contributions  by  the  national  party 
organizations  for  the  purposes  of  this  compilation  which,  in  so  far 
as  possible,  contains  only  information  responsive  to  the  purpose  of 
the  inquiry.  Owing  to  varied  systems  of  keeping  accounts  oy  the 
committees  of  the  different  States,  it  soon  became  apparent  from  an 
examination  of  the  statements  returned  that  it  would  be  impracti- 
cable to  attempt  to  tabulate  the  disbursements  without  duplication 
of  funds  accounted  for  by  the  national  party  organizations.  Many 
of  the  committees  apparently  were  able  to  determine  with  some 
degree  of  accuracy  the  amounts  received  from  sources  other  than 
the  national  organizations,  but  their  records  were  such  that  they 
could  give  only  the  disbursements  of  funds  collected  from  all  sources. 
Inasmuch  as  it  can  reasonably  be  assumed  that  the  amount  of  the 
funds  collected  outside  of  the  contributions  of  the  national  party 
organizations  were  expended  in  connection  with  the  presidential  and 
local  political  campaigns  of  1920,  the  tabulation  of  the  receipts  fur- 
nishes also  the  most  accurate  figures  of  the  disbursements  for  the  pur- 
pose of  this  inquiry  that  can  be  supplied  from  the  statements  fur- 
nished by  the  various  State  conamittees.  We  include  herewith  such 
tfibulation: 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


2947 


Afjrrc  ate  receipts  of  the  Republican  and  Democratic  State  committees,  resperdrehf,  in 
connection  with  the  presulential  campaign  of  19?0,  exclusive  of  funds  received  from  the 
national  orranizations  of  the  two  respective  partis. 

[In  many  instances  these  funds  were  used  in  nart  in  connection  with  the  local  campaigns  (or  State 

o'slcers,  etc.) 


Republican. 


i  Republican. 


Alabama  

Anzoiia  

Arkansas  

Califorr'ia  

Colora<lo  

Conrcrtkut  

Delaware  

Pi-^trict  of  Columbia  

Florida  

Cew^:a.  

Idaho  

Illinois  

Indiana  

Iowa  

Kan.sas  , 

Kentucky  

Louisiana  

Maine  

Maryland  

Massachusetts  

Michipan  

Minnes'ita  

Mississippi  

Missouri  

Montana  

Nebraska  


$115.00 

W.  75 
"Ji.  00().  00 
99.02(3.99 
>''Kj.o'.l6.58 
»4ti,2.5S.65 
8, 804.00 
2,m.50 
None. 
25,970.95 
42, 6  M.  07 
215,9;iK  15 
13, 138.  54 

""59,"i82.'45' 
1.022.50 
15.0:)5.36 
50.577,00 
133,65.S.;U 
4,  848.  50 
9,99.5.26 
700.00 
23, 884.  80 
35,  m.  27 
11. 155. 19 


$.1,000.00 
15, 4.^2.  .50 
None. 

if).' .moo 

39.690.40 
17, 964.  .54 
7, 81  i.  S2 
None. 
None. 
4,260.00 
9,92.5.00 
74,692.66 
14, 174.  99 
13. 5S7.  64 
62,9.m23 
None. 
6,5:^7.  76 
57,889.63 
25. 335.  21 
24, 478.  79 
6,7.36.08 
None. 
56,901.69 
6,50.H.50 
10,752.92 


Nevada  

New  Harapshire. 

New  Jersey  

New  Mexico  

New  York  

North  Carolina.. 
North  Dakota... 

Ohio  

Oklahoma  

Oregon  

Pennsylvania  

Rhode' Island.... 
South  Carolina.. 
South  Dakota... 

Teniie.>scc  

Texas  

Utah  

Vermont  

Virginia  

Washington  

\Ve.st  Virginia... 

Wisconsin  

Wyoming  


13,753.45 

24,65.3.66 
None 
23, 189.  32 
479,699.19 
»  4,  880. 18 
i       3, 835.  43 
74,:573.90 
55,661. 68 
8,205.24 
139,61.3.25 
25,000.00 
706.00 
8,948.51 

■■■25,i48.'95* 
10, 475.  00 
2, 192.  00 
925.00 
<  116, 5;?7.  45 
84, 872.  31 
None. 
45,237.93 

2.078.060.55 


fll.485.00 
11,121.41 
10,74.5.00 
15.  858.  73 
6.3,37.3.00 
16,41S.95 

2,000.00 
58,81.5.00 
63,575.  45 
12,6;i3.28 
58,512.08 

9,552.00 
500.00 

6,706.00 
17,932. 16 

2,668.75 

""6S6.'4i 
2, 596.  00 
18,476.00 
25,803.06 
7,818.00 


>  This  amount  includes  $61,185  received  from  the  National  and  State  ways  and  means  committee  w  hich 
had  recpipts  of  $84,148  46  of  whirh  $15,000  went  to  the  national  committee.   (See  letter  of  J.  H.  Roraback.) 

»  Amount  received  and  distributed  by  Delaware  Republican  finance  committee.  Of  this  amount  the 
Republican  State  committee  received  $8,653.79  and  distributed  $6,097.89.  (See  letter  of  Chas.  Warner, 
chairman,  for  details. ) 

3  This  amount  is  arrived  at  by  subtracting  from  the  total  disbursements  of  the  Republican  State  executive 
committee  $12,744,  the  amount  contributed  by  the  national  committee  $7,863.82,  as  shown  by  Mr.  Upham's 
Exhibit  4,  page  12,56  of  the  camjiaign  comniitteo  hearings.   (See  letter  of  Gilliam  Orissom,  .secretary.) 

<  From  Nov.  1,  1918.  Considerable  expenditure  prior  to  national  convention  including  the  expen.ses  ot 
an  educational  campaign  to  counteract  activities  of  Non-Partisau  League,  (See  letter  of  Charles  Hebberd, 
chairman.) 


These  letters  we  also  insert  at  this  point. 

Delaware  Republican  Finance  Committee, 

Wilmington,  Del.,  January  SI,  19S1, 

Hon.  William  S.  Kenyon,  Chairman. 

Senate  Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C. 
My  Dear  Senator:  Further  answering"  recent  communications  on  aggregate 
receipts  and  disbursements  for  local  use  in  Delaware  by  our  Republican  committees, 
will  advise: 

The  Delaware  Republican  finance  committee  received  and  disbursed...  $46,258.65 

The  Republican  Stite  committee- 
Received   8,653,79 

Disbursed   6,097.89 

I  explained  in  my  former  correspondence  that  the  finance  committee  was  the 
the  clearing  house  for  all  receipts  and  disbursements,  and  on  approved  budget  requests 
the  finance  committee  disbursed  directly  to  the  five  operating  committees,  viz,  the 
State  committee,  the  Wilmington  city  committee,  and  the  three  county  committees. 
Hence  the  report  above  of  the  receipts  of  the  State  committee  is  a  part  of  the  total 
disbursements  also  reported  above  for  the  finance  committee. 

Trust  this  answers  your  purposes. 
Very  truly,  vourd, 

Chables  Wabnbb,  Chairman. 


2948 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


Republican  State  Executivb  CoiCMrrrEB, 
„      „  „   „  Greensboro,  N.  C,  January  SI,  1921. 

lion.  William  S.  Kenyon, 

Washin'Jton. 

Dear  Senator:  Your  letter  addressed  to  Chairman  Frank  A.  Linney,  of  Boone, 
N.  C,  liaa  been  referred  to  this  office  for  answer. 

Accordingly,  the  sworn  statements  as  filed  with  the  secretary  of  state  of  North 
Carolina  are  copied  and  inclosed  to  you. 

Let  me  say  that  tlie  money  expended  in  the  late  campaign  in  this  State  has  no 
doubt  been  shown  in  t]ie  statements  of  the  Republican  national  committee. 

This  committee,  by  our  request,  sent  to  our  State  a  collector  who  received  con- 
tributions and  turned  same  over  to  tJie  national  committee,  who  in  turn  returned 
the  funds  for  use  here  wliere  collected. 

Let  me  suggest  that  very  aptly  this  office  will  be  able  to  give  any  desired  informa- 
tion as  to  our  committee's  expenses, 
^lost  respectfully, 

GiLUAM  Grissom,  Secretary. 


Republican  State  Executive  Committee, 

Grtenshoro,  N.  C,  October  25,  1920. 

The  Secretary  of  State, 

Rakiffh,  N.  C. 

Dear  Sir:  The  following  is  a  statement  of  the  expenses  of  the  Republican  State 
executive  committee  from  the  beginning  of  active  campaign  to  the  time  for  preelection 
report: 

Postage,  printing,  stationery  $3,  576 

Clerical  help,  typewriting,  addressing,  folding   8,  290 

Furniture,  neat,  light,  rent,  water   432 

Traveling  expenses,  speakers,  organizers   847 

Telephone,  telegraph,  messenger   240 

Literature,  advertising   1, 358 

Total   9,  743 

The  above  received  from  J.  J.  Jenkins,  treasurer. 

Personally  appeared  before  me  Gilliam  Grissom,  to  me  well  known,  who  being  first 
duly  sworn  deposes  and  says  that  the  foregoing  statement  is  true  to  the  best  of  hia 
knowledge  and  belief. 
Subscribed  and  sworn  to  before  me  this  23d  day  of  October,  1920. 

S.  S.  Mitchell, 

Notary  Pxihlic, 


Republican  State  Executive  Committee, 

Greensboro,  N.  C,  November  11,  1920, 

The  Secretary  of  State, 

Raleigh,  N.  C. 

Dear  Sir:  The  following  is  a  statement  of  expenditures  of  the  Republican  State 
executive  committee,  as  required  to  be  reported  within  10  days  after  election: 

Postage,  stationery  $1, 354 

Advertising,  printing   717 

Clerk  hire  -   487 

Telephone,  telegraph   163 

Traveling  expenses,  speakings   280 

Total   3,001 

There  appeared  before  me  Gilliam  Grissom,  known  to  me,  and  swears  the  above 
statement  is  true  to  the  best  of  his  knowledge  and  belief,  this  11th  day  of  November, 
1920. 

S.  S.  Mitchell, 

Notary  Public 


CAMPAIGN  EXPBNDITtTKES. 


2949 


.RKPUBUCA.N  State  Executivb  CommittsBp 

Greemboro,  N,  C,  November  tO,  1920. 

The  Sbcrktart  of  State, 

RaUigh,  N.  C. 

Dear  Sir:  The  following  is  a  statement  of  expenditures  of  the  Republican  State 
executive  committee,  as  required  to  be  reported  within  20  days  after  election: 

Postage,  stationery  $1,354 

Advertising,  printing   717 

Clerk  hire   487 

Telephone,  telegraph   163 

Traveling  expenses,  speakings   280 

ToUl   3,001 

There  appeared  before  me  Gilliam  Grissom,  known  to  me,  and  swears  the  above 
statement  is  true  to  the  best  of  his  knowledge  and  belief. 

S.  S.  Mitchell,  Notary  Public. 

Connecticut  Repubucan  State  Central  Committee, 

Hartford,  Conn.,  February  1921. 

Hon.  W.  S.  Kenyon, 

United  States  SenaU,  Washington,  D.  C. 

Dear  Sir:  On  my  return  to  Hartford  this  week  I  found  your  telegram  of  January  27. 
asking  for  statement  of  contributions  and  expenditures  of  National  and  State  ways  ana 
means  committee  in  the  last  campaign. 

This  request,  I  assume,  also  includes  a  statement  of  the  receipts  and  expenditures 
of  the  State  committee. 

I  am  inclosing  herewith  a  synopsis  of  the  receipts  and  expenditures  of  both  the 
State  committee  and  National  and  State  waj's  and  means  committee  for  the  last  com- 
paign,  which  I  think  answers  your  requirements. 

Both  of  these  statements  are  on  file  in  the  office  of  the  secretary  of  state  and  are 
public  documents.    I  can  obtain  and  send  to  you  certified  copies  should  you  desire  it. 

The  statement  of  the  National  and  State  way»  and  means  committee  is  very  volu- 
minous, as  the  receipts  of  $84,000  are  made  up  of  contributions  ranging  from  25  cents 
to  $1,000. 

Very  truly,  youre, 

•  J.  H.  RORABACK. 


Connecticut  Republican  State  central  committee — Campaign  of  1920. 

Receipts: 

Balance  on  hand  last  campaign   $2, 201.  42 

Charles  L.  Spencer,  treasurer  (National  and  State  ways  and  means 

committee)   64, 185.  00 

John  A.  Macdonald,  assistant  treasurer.   ,   210. 16 

Total   66,596.58 

Expenses  of  campaign.   64,  268.  42 

Balance  on  hand   2,  328. 16 

National  and  State  ways  and  m^ans  committee  for  Connecticut — Campaign  of  1920. 

Receipts   $84,148.46 

Disbursements  •   81,  715. 11 

Principal  items  of  disbursements: 

State  committee   64, 185.  00 

National  conmiittee   15, 000.  00 

Spokane,  Wash.,  January  SI,  1921. 

Hon.  William  S.  Kenton, 

Senate  Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C. 
Dear  Sir:  Replving  to  your  letter  of  January  7,  to  Mr.  S.  A.  Walker,  former  chair- 
man of  the  Republican  State  central  committee,  I  inclose  herewith  a  statement  of 
the  aggregate  receipts  and  expenditures  by  the  Republican  State  central  committee 
of  Washington,  from  November  1,  1918,  to  November  15,  1920. 


2960 


CAMPAIGN  BXP£NDITVfi£S»! 


You  will  please  note  that  the  aggregate  expenditures  include  considerable  expen- 
diture prior  to  the.  Republican  national  convention,  including  the  expenses  of  a 

f reconvention  educational  campaign  to  counteract  the  activities  of  the  Nonpartisan 
eague  in  State  politics,  and  this  should  not  be  considered  a  part  of  the  expenditures 
of  the  national  campaign.  1  regret  that  I  have  not  the  data  available  for  segregating 
these  expenditures. 

Also,  I  beg  to  call  your  attention  to  the  item  of  $36,059.82,  allotments  to  county 
central  committees  as  per  Schedule  I.  These  funds  were  collected  by  the  ways  and 
means  cf)mmittee  of  the  State  central  committee,  but  were  turned  over  to  the  various 
county  central  committees  for  expenditure  by  them. 

Also,  it  should  be  noted  that  the  balance  of  the  expenditures  of  the  State  com- 
mittee, viz,  $73,820.57,  included  the  expenses  of  the  campaign  for  the  election  of 
State  officers  as  well  as  the  national,  senatorial,  and  congressional  campaigns  within 
the  State.  It  is,  however,  impossible  to  segregate  these  State  campaign  expendi- 
tures from  the  others.  I  may  say,  however,  that  the  expenditures  for  the  State 
campaign  probably  exceeded  those  for  the  national,  congressional,  and  senatorial  cam- 
paigns, as  we  had  in  tliis  State  a  very  strong  farmer  labor  party  (including  the  Non- 
partisan League)  whose  especial  interest  was  to  capture  the  State  government,  and 
whifh  had,  we  thought,  a  rather  formidable  condidate  for  governor. 

There  have  been  a  few  expenditures,  aggregating  several  hundred  dollars,  made 
since  November  15,  1920,  which  are  not  included  in  the  inclosed  report.  I  have 
written  my  Seattle  office  for  an  itemized  statement  of  these  subsequent  expenditures, 
and  shall  forward  it  to  you  as  a  supplemental  report  upon  receipt. 

I  trust  that  this  will  give  you  the  desired  information. 

Chars.  Hebberd, 
Chairman  Republican  State  Central  Committee. 


Washington  Republican  State  central  committee,  Seattle,  Wash. — Statement  of  cash 
receipts  and  disbursements,  Nov.  1,  1918,  to  Nov.  15,  1920. 

Receipts  $116,537.45 

Disbursements: 

Allotments  to   county   central   committees  as  per 

Schedule!  $36,059.82 

State  campaign  expenditures — 

Speakers'  and  organizers'  salaries  and 

expenses   $34,660.40 

Printing  and  stationery,  campaign  litera- 
ture, and  express   9, 704.  03 

Office  salaries   7, 127.  01 

Stenographers' salaries   3,565.82 

Telephone  and  telegraph   2, 879.  58 

Advertising  :   2,  766. 16 

Office  rent   2,175.00 

Office  supplies  and  expense   1,734.98 

Finance  committee  expense   1, 404. 10 

Banquets,  etc   1,397.95 

Publicity   1,539.56 

King  County  Repul)lican  Club   1, 100.  00 

Postage.   950.70 

Sundry  hall  rentals   650.00 

Miscellaneous  expenses   605.  81 

Clipping  service   266.  47 

Refund   200.00 

Radicalism   500.00 

Furniture  and  equipment   593.  00 

  73,820.57 

  109,880.39 

Balance  on  deposit  Nov.  15,  1920   6, 657. 06 

Chas.  Hebberd, 
Chairman  Republican  State  Central  Committee. 


Sworn  and  subscribed  to  before  me  this  3l8t  day  of  January,  1921. 

fsEAL.j  G.  S.  Hebberd, 

Notary  Public,  County  of  Spokane,  StaU  of  Washington. 


CAMPAIGN  EXPENWTUfiES. 


2961 


SCHEDULB  I. 


Analysis  of  statement  of  cash  receipts  and  dishvrsements. 


Allotments  

King  County   $17,921.00 

Spokane  County   4,  500.  00 

Pierc  e  County   4, 100.  00 

King  Countv  Republican  Club     1, 758.  34 

f^kagit  Conntv...   841.18 

Walla  VValla  bounty   800. 00 

Women's  Republican  Club. .  784.  40 

Adams  Countv   685.  00 

Le\*is  County   550.35 

Stevens  County   545.  00 

Pad fic  Countv   515.83 

Whitman  County   500. 00 

Pend  Oreille  County   301. 00 


Kitfiap  County  

Thurston  County  

Klickitat  County  

Kittitas  County  

Chelan  County  

Grant  County  

Columbia  County  

Franklin  County  

Snoliomish  County .  . 

Clarke  Countv  

Wahkiakum  (:ounty. 

Benton  County  

Garfield  County  


$36.  059.  82 

...  $300.00 

. . .  250. 00 

. . .  250. 00 

...  212.50 

...  200.25 

. . .  200.  00 

...  171.87 

...  150.00 

...  150.00 

...  100.00 

. . .  90.  00 

...  78.60 

...  32.50 


Spokane,  Wash.,  February  5,  19tl. 

Hon.  William  S.  Kenyon, 

Senate  Office  Building,  Washington,  D.  C. 
Dear  Sir:  I  inclose  herewith  supplemental  statement  of  expenditures  of  the 
Republican  State  central  committee  of  Washington,  from  November  16,  1920,  to  Feb- 
ruary 1,  1921. 

This  is  the  supplemental  statement  which  I  stated  in  my  letter  of  January  31  I 
would  forward  to  you  as  soon  as  the  items  were  available. 
Very  truly,  yours, 

Charles  Hebberd. 


Svpnlemental  stntement  of  Washington  EepnhUran  State  Central  Committee,  Seattle 
Wash.—StalemeiU  oj  cash  receipts  nr*d  disbursements  Nov.  16,  19i0.to  Feb.  1,  mi. 


Allotment  to  county  central  committees,  Mason  County  

Speakers'  and  organizers'  salaries  and  expenses   $112.  90 

Telephone  and  telegraph   129.  16 

Office  rent  ^   90.00 

Miscellaneous  expenses   143.  25 

Postage  -  15.00 

Stenographers '  salaries   133.  85 

Printing  and  stationery   419.  00 


$250.  00 


1,043. 16 


Total   1,293.16 

Chas.  Hebberd, 

Chairman  Republican  State  Cerdral  Committee. 

Sworn  and  subscribed  to  before  me  this  5th  day  of  February,  1921. 

[siiAL.]  G.  S.  Hebberd, 

Notary  Public 

The  two  Republican  reports  missing  in  the  above  tabulation  are 
Tennessee  and  Kansas.  Correspondence  on  file  indicates  that  the 
first  mentioned  will  be  forthcommg. 

The  three  Democratic  reports  missing  are  California,  Utah,  and 
Wyoming  Correspondence  indicates  that  the  first  two  mentioned 
will  be  forthcoming.  We  do  not  feel  warranted,  however,  in  further 
delaying  this  report. 

From  the  figures  gathered,  as  we  have  herein  set  out,  it  appears 
that  the  two  great  political  parties,  through  their  various  national 
organizations,  including  expenditures  of  State  committees,  spent 


J 

2952  CAMPAIGN  EXPENDITURES. 


in  the  presidential  campaign  of  1920,  a  sum  in  excess  of  ten  and  a 
quarter  million  dollars: 

Or,  to  be  more  exact   $10, 338,  509.  92 

Of  which  the  expenditures  of  the  Republican  Party  were   8, 100,  739.  21 

And  the  expenditures  of  the  Democratic  Party  were   2,  237, 770. 71 

These  figures  do  not  by  any  means  represent  the  entire  amount  of 
raonev  expended  in  the  campaign,  as  we  have  heretofore  explained. 
The  funds  collected,  of  course,  were  not  used  exclusively  in  the 
presidential  campaign.  They  were  used  likewise  in  the  election 
of  Senators  and  Congressmen  and  State  officials. 

The  resolutions  under  which  the  committee  has  acted  do  not  pro- 
vide for  recommendations  to  the  Senate  on  the  part  of  the  committee. 
Naturalh  the  conmiittee  has  discussed  remedies  to  limit  the  amount 
of  campaign  expenditures,  for  they  feel  that  the  expenditure  of  these 
vast  sums  is  a  present  and  growing  menace  to  the  Nation.  We  rec- 
ognize there  are  constitutional  difficulties  involved  in  the  passage  of 
laws  to  regulate  expenditures  in  presidential  campaigns,  but  are  of 
the  opinion  that  the  Committee  on  Privileges  and  Elections  of  the 
Senate  should  in  the  next  Congress  take  up  the  question  of  remedial 
legislation,  and  if  a  constitutional  amendment  should  be  necessary 
that  the  proper  steps  be  taken  to  submit  the  same,  as  provided  by 
the  Constitution.  The  subject  is  of  such  importance  that  the  next 
Congress  should  give  early  attention  thereto. 

We  have  made  this  report  as  brief  as  possible.  The  evidence  taken 
h\  the  committee  is  voluminous  and  comprises  22  volumes. 

'  Since  the  above  report  was  prepared,  the  return  from  the  Demo- 
cratic State  committee  of  Utah  has  been  received  and  we  attach  the 
same  hereto: 

State  op  Utah, 

County  of  Salt  Lake,  M.- 
George G.  Smith,  being  first  duly  sworn,  upon  oath  deposes  and  says:  That  he  is  a 
citizen  of  the  United  States  over  the  age  of  21  years,  a  resident  of  the  city  and  county 
of  Salt  Lake,  State  of  Utah,  and  treasurer  of  the  Utah  Democratic  State  central  com- 
mittee; that  the  total  aggregate  receipts  and  expenditures  of  the  Democratic  State 
central  committee  of  Utah  for  all  purposes  in  connection  with  the  presidential  and 
State  campaign  of  1920,  independent  of  any  funds  collected  by  or  for  or  received  from 
the  Democratic  national  committee  or  any  agency  or  branch  thereof  is  as  follows: 

Keceipts   $11,210.55 

Disbursements   10,  987.  57 

Geo.  G.  Smith. 

Subscribed  and  sworn  to  before  me  this  27th  day  of  January,  A.  D.  1921. 
[seal.]  Henry  D.  Moyle, 

Notary  Public. 

My  commission  expires  September  12,  1923. 


INDEX  OF  WITNESSES. 


Albus,  John  

Alexander,  E.  B  

Alger,  Frederick  M  

Allen,  E.  M  

Armstrong,  William__ 


Babler,  J.  L  

Barber,  Frederick  C  

Barchard,  Miss  Jessie- 
Barnes,  William  

Baruch,  Bernard  M-__. 

Baur.  Bertha  D  

Beller,  James  W  

Bishop,  Walter  W____. 

Black,  Joseph  

Blair,  Harry  M  

Blossom,  Dudley  S  

Boeschenstein,  Charles. 
Bonniwell,  Eugene  C— . 

Brainerd,  C.  O  

Bridge,  Norman  

Britton,  Edward  E  

Britton,  Fred  A  

Brueggeman,  Olivia  

Bryson,  John  G  

Burtt,  W.  B  


Carlin,  C.  C  — 

Carroll,  George  T  

Christensen,  P.  P  

Clark,  Charles  P  

Claxton,  P.  P  

Cole.  W.  LI  

Cooper,  John  E  

Covington,  Harry  J___ 

Coyne,  Eunice  

Cramton,  Louis  C  

Cummings,  Homer  S— 
Curtis,  Frank  S  


Darst,  J.  S  

Daugherty,  H.  M  

Davidson,  Walter  

Davies,  John  R  

Davis,  Arthur  G  

Davis,  Joseph  T  

Dickey,  Walter  S  

Duell,  Charles  H  

Du  Pont,  T.  Coleman— 


A. 

Page. 

  891 

  10G3 

 .   619 

  2549 

  819 

B. 

  647,842,932 

  2279,2310 

  2303 

 :   2389.2419,2441,2451 

  131 

  2037 

  79 

  2818 

  921 

  1838,1919,1992 

_-- ,  1   1758 

  2108 

 -   687,717 

  1816 

  686 

  2691 

  1313 

  1022,1058 

  2097 

  731,753 

C. 

  137 

  2401 

 -   1437 

  2809 

 J  •   2428 

  762 

  2547 

  325 

  2292 

  202 

  1153 

  2095 

D. 

   253 

  267,  362 


  590 

  2874 

____   1659 

  743 

 ■_   2681 


2953* 


2954 


INDEX  OF  WITNESSES. 


Eiumerson,  Louis  L  

Enix,  Caleb  


Farlow,  William  O  

Fees,  Don.  C  

Fess,  S.  D  

Fitzsimnious,  J.  J  

Flood,  Henry  D  

Folwell,  W.  H  

France,  Senator  Joseph  I. 

Fritsche,  G.  B  

Funk,  Mrs.  Antoinette— 


1913 
2472 
1300 
1018 
1180 
260(>,  2679 

109 
2063 

673 


Garrett,  H.  G  .   1745 

Gerard,  James  W   2321 

Goldstein,  Nat  610,919 

Goltra,  Edward  F   2841 

Grayot,  John  L   2675 

Green,  E.  H.  R   811 

Greer,  Clarence  N   2813 

Gregory,  Warren   788 


Handy,  Bessie   2641 

Harris,  Edwin  S   406 

Harrison,  Frank   367 

Hays.  Charles  A   ____  933 

Hays,  Will  H   1080,1378 

Heffernan,  J.  L   2526 

Henke,  Herman  E   1620 

Hepburn.  Charles  J  ^   114 

Hersey,  R.  J   27 

Hill,  J.  K  -   2833 

Hitchcock,  F.  H   2 

Hitchcock,  Senator  G.  M_   449 

HoUiday,  John  H  .    2881 

Houston,  H.  S    2592 

Hukriede,  T.  W    885 


Jamieson,  W.  D_,  

Jenkins,  Burrus  

Johnson,  Henry  Lincoln- 
Jones,  I.  T  

Jones,  Richard  S  

Joss,  Frederick  A  


Karnes,  M.  H   542 

Kavanaujih,  J.  W^    914 

Keating,  Edw   057 

Keifer,  Clarence    2792 

Kelley,  John  A  .   2010 

Kesters(m.  Ben  F   898 

King,  John  T   285 

Kinney,  Garrett,  Def   191)1.  2007 


995 
381 


INDEX  OF  WITNESSES. 


2955 


Lee,  Clarence  W  

Weighty.  John  R__  

lievy,  Harry  

Llewellyn,  Mrs.  L.  J  

Look  wood,  Geo.  B  

Loeb,  William  

I>ong,  Breckinridge  

Liicey,  J.  F  


McCabe,  Alexander  1 

McChesney,  Nathan  W  

McClure,  Chas.  W_-_.___- 

McDonald,  Chas.  F  

McGee,  M.  J  

McLean,  Angus  W  

^McMillan,  Miles  H  

McNider,  C.  H  

McSween,  Angus  


Marsh,  AVilbur  W  

Martin,  Mrs.  W.  W  

Mason,  Guy  

Mavity,  Chas.  K  

Meehan,  Annie  L  

]Miles,  James  P  

Miller,  Thos.  W  

Mooiiey,  Wm.  M  

Moore,  Edmund  H  

Moore,  Robt.  E.  

Morgan,  Edward  

Morse,  E.  L  

Moses,  Senator  Geo.  H  

Mowrey,  Mrs.  J.  A  


Nebeker,  Frank  K  

New,  Senator  Harry  S_ 
Newman,  Oliver  P  


O'Neill,  Patrick  P  

Owen,  Henry  E  

Owens,  John  W  


Palmer,  A.  Mitchell  

Parker,  John  C  

Parks,  Mrs.  Ethel  M  

Paxton,  A.  B  

Pierson,  L.  E  !_ 

Pike.  Eugene  R  

Poindexter,  Senator  Miles 

Proctor.  Wm.  Cooper  

Pugh,  Clarence  R  


Reynolds,  James  B 
Rhinock,  Jos.  L  


Page. 

  2240,2266 

  1048 

  2489 

   ,   27(X) 

 _^   2552 

  863 

  2831 

 03. 128 


Mc. 



 ,   522 

 -   1802 

 1   2380 

  1000 

 -   353 

  1324 

 -   1700 

 -   33 

M. 

—  :)'2S  143i) 

  2832 

— —  ^   2641 

 -   2233 

 -   1060 

 -   1006 

  483 

  2548 

  68.  1635, 1700. 1713.  2217.  2261 

 -—^   592,020 

  213 

  631.024 

  454 

  1059 


N. 

  2521 

 _•   1380 

  171 


O. 

 1  _   967 

  2042 

_____   316 

P. 

  711 

  769 

  2625 

  1691 

  2619 

  307 

  1599 

  174 

  2686 

R. 

  322 

  1184 


2956 


INDEX  OF  WITNESSES. 


Rice,  Howard  M  

Rolf es;  John  R  

Rosseter,  John  Henry. 


Schantz,  Adam  _   2476 

Scott,  Gut  T   1421, 1543 

Scott,  Mary  Temple   1040 

Scott,  R.  T   2545 

Scripps,  Robt.  P   2452 

Scudder,  Marvyn   2723,  2793,  2827 

Seibold,  Louis   47 

Sherer,  Carl  J   2784 

Sinclair,  H.  F   685 

Sprague,  Albert  A  _   507,  860 

Stebbins,  Horace  C   773 

Steinbrink,  Meier   2709 

Stevens,  J.  P    2621 

Stewart,  R.  P   2505 

Stokes,  Edw.  C   2384 

Streutker,  Henry  .  981, 1057 


Talbot,  Loren  C   2497 

Talbott,  H,  E   2795 

Thompson,  M.  W   110,  123 

Thompson,  Wm.  Boyce   2344 

Thomson,  Robt.  K    2050 

Towers,  Albert  G   2623 


Upham,  Fred  W  ^   1187,  1337,  2125 

V. 

Vick,  Walter  W   86 


Waldo,  Richard  H   2i01 

Weissert,  Chas.  A  — -  230 

White,  Geo   1334,  1387 


Wile,  Frederick  W__. 


899 


Willson,  L.  — -  ^2LL 


Wolfe,  Robt  F  


559 


Woodworth,  Frank   478 


Zappone,  Almerico___   2441 


o 


